**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Mar 12 02:59:58 2016 Mar 12 11:38:01 Welcome. I have a question about blocking an access to maemo.org from 5.172.247.128-255 IP address pool. Mar 12 11:38:35 They are assigned to the Polish network Aero2 offering free Internet access. Mar 12 11:38:59 and being free it also means bad people abusing it for spam Mar 12 11:39:50 Unfortunately I have to agree. Mar 12 11:40:14 I am considering selling my N900. Does anyone know any recommendation price and a good place to sell such an old device? It is in working condition, no malfunctions or screen scratches, pen included. Mar 12 11:41:02 ebay.com Mar 12 11:41:13 But is there really so much amount of abuse from those IP addresses? Mar 12 11:41:54 yeah so much abuse that you can't even get a readonly access ;) Mar 12 11:42:31 * L29Ah actually has to get to maemo.org thru tor as it looks less abusive by its admins it seems Mar 12 11:44:18 tor is also regularly blocked, at least by TMO Mar 12 11:44:38 quite ironic for this community, you could at least allow GET requests. Mar 12 11:45:20 But are those blockages temporary or constant? Mar 12 11:45:33 I am sure they are constant. Mar 12 11:47:05 * freddd pokes ceene "hey little boy, want to buy some candy?" * swings N900 at him * Mar 12 11:47:50 pass it to your children Mar 12 11:48:05 I would have to put an Apple sticker on it for that to happen. Mar 12 11:48:09 Even then ... Mar 12 11:48:21 If it is not <1mm in thickness they will start raising questions. Mar 12 11:52:05 I usually pay 40-80 euro for second hand n900s Mar 12 11:56:40 freddd: how much do you ak for it? Mar 12 11:56:53 shipping costs will be high, though Mar 12 11:57:50 latest one i bought was 30 euro Mar 12 12:14:38 found a thread about changing imei on tmo Mar 12 12:14:48 16 pages worth of moralfags and not a byte to send Mar 12 12:26:38 ceene most likely not much. Mar 12 12:26:42 What else would you expect? Instructions on actually changing the IMEI? Mar 12 12:26:50 I am thinking 30 - 50 euros. Mar 12 12:26:57 I think that is not much? Mar 12 12:27:08 Everything still works. Screen has no scratches. Mar 12 12:27:16 Recently put a new battery in it. Mar 12 12:28:46 Maxdamantus: sure Mar 12 12:30:07 i've recently got an lte modem and needed to change its imei so i could buy a cheaper mobile phone-aiming unlimited internet plan, googled it in a few seconds on some russian forum Mar 12 12:30:43 now i have an iphone 5 :3 Mar 12 12:31:07 freddd: why don't you keep it? Mar 12 12:31:19 you could help me code yappari :P Mar 12 12:31:46 or help with the kernel so we get to run modern glibc and all that Mar 12 12:32:47 i'm quite tired lately to d anything fun, works drains all my coding energy Mar 12 12:33:07 freddd: you can post on talk.maemo.org in buy/sell section Mar 12 12:37:36 ceene, software compatibility is the only thing. :( Mar 12 12:38:15 which software are you missing? Mar 12 12:38:19 Authenticators. Mar 12 12:38:36 whats's that? Mar 12 12:38:48 Steam recently enforced a trading limit (15 day item hold on market) unless you use their authenticator (built-in into Steam Mobile, not available seperate). Mar 12 12:39:01 freddd, vnc? Mar 12 12:39:05 VNC? Mar 12 12:39:08 and android emulator on pc Mar 12 12:39:19 KotCzarny I am looking for convenient and modern solutions. Mar 12 12:39:36 Not the hacky way. Mar 12 12:39:38 write to steam for a linux client? Mar 12 12:39:58 It was an example, one of many. Mar 12 12:40:11 I enjoy the game Clash of Clan as well. Mar 12 12:40:11 i wonder how poking a bazillion of devices to make a trade considered convenient Mar 12 12:40:17 someone reposted all files for running nitdroid Mar 12 12:40:21 modern maybe (: Mar 12 12:40:27 then as i said, on pc run virtualbox with vnc enabled, inside run linux with android emulator Mar 12 12:40:35 L29Ah blame the scammers and people who fall for the scams. Mar 12 12:40:40 then just connect n900 with vnc to that virtual Mar 12 12:40:56 That is a hacker's solution. Mar 12 12:40:57 nah i'll just blame steam users Mar 12 12:41:05 and i bet it would work better than having client for everything Mar 12 12:41:06 I use N900 as a convenience (right now all it runs is Yappari). Mar 12 12:41:20 when you can use ssh and vnc to get access to gigs of mem/storage Mar 12 12:41:53 also, n900 IS a hacker's device Mar 12 12:42:01 I never used it as such. Mar 12 12:42:07 I do not code on it. Mar 12 12:42:12 I do not terminal on it (I tried, too inconvenient). Mar 12 12:42:21 you can be a hacker without coding too Mar 12 12:42:29 The way I SSH on desktop is not as pleasant as on N900. Mar 12 12:42:36 I can not imagine anyone doing mainstream server management SSH on it. Mar 12 12:42:41 Maybe here and there check upon something. Mar 12 12:43:11 a full on keyboard is better, of course Mar 12 12:43:26 but i use n900 a lot to ssh into things Mar 12 12:43:46 For? Mar 12 12:43:48 Updating? Mar 12 12:44:09 lots of things Mar 12 12:44:15 c coding Mar 12 12:44:24 system administraton things Mar 12 12:44:49 sometimes i'm to lazy to go for the laptop Mar 12 12:45:02 I move to my desktop for that. Or laptop. I get too annoyed by how slow it would be on phone. Mar 12 12:45:06 Even using IRC on phone annoyed me. Mar 12 12:45:23 The messaging has been utmost wonderful on this device since I had it. Mar 12 12:45:59 i use n900 as a phone/audio player mostly, with occasional ssh/shell things/www Mar 12 12:46:29 and toilet gaming device too, last but not least Mar 12 12:46:30 ;) Mar 12 12:46:59 So which one is least? Mar 12 12:47:11 gaming Mar 12 12:47:16 erm Mar 12 12:47:25 least is email Mar 12 12:47:28 never used it Mar 12 12:47:37 * Maxdamantus uses email over ssh. Mar 12 12:47:45 modest is depressively bad Mar 12 12:48:06 SO CEENE HOW MUCH YOU WANT IT FOR HUH? Mar 12 12:48:21 freddd: i don't think i want another one yet Mar 12 12:48:26 >:C Mar 12 12:48:27 i got two Mar 12 12:48:36 unless it's almost free Mar 12 12:48:42 but that wouldn't be fair Mar 12 12:48:45 * freddd ssh's into ceene's N900 and executes self-destroy.sh Mar 12 12:48:59 :) Mar 12 12:49:12 Uhm ceene so there is this cool app in the store that involves throwing your N900 in the air as high as you can Mar 12 12:49:26 You should try it out. Mar 12 12:49:50 it works, as long you are a good catcher Mar 12 12:49:57 how is it named? Mar 12 12:50:02 flyn900 Mar 12 12:50:04 or something Mar 12 12:50:10 i'm not a good catcher, nor a good thower either Mar 12 12:50:17 It has been on there since pretty early on N900 release. Mar 12 12:50:30 http://my-maemo.com/software/applications.php?fldAuto=1043&faq=47 Mar 12 12:50:38 Pretty sure secrelty Nokia endorsed (or manufactured). Mar 12 12:52:58 I am curious how that app has been debugged/developed etc. Mar 12 12:53:16 on a trampoline? Mar 12 12:53:18 trampoline park? Mar 12 12:53:25 maybe beach Mar 12 12:53:38 > i hope you have Insurance :D my n900 broke but i get new from Insurance Mar 12 12:53:42 can i haz that thing? Mar 12 12:54:18 slightly offtopic: https://mosh.mit.edu/ Mar 12 12:54:39 Stop hijacking my ceene N900 sale thread! Mar 12 12:54:43 can it do vi-like editing? Mar 12 12:54:46 ceene how high did you get yours to fly? Mar 12 12:54:57 l29ah: sure, you just have to run vi Mar 12 12:55:20 I tried to learn vi, I cried, and nano hugged me better. Mar 12 12:55:29 freddd: i offer 5 euro plus shipping Mar 12 12:55:42 http://maemo.org/packages/view/n900fly/ Mar 12 12:55:42 shipping is like 6 euros insured id be at a loss here :( Mar 12 12:56:05 15 euros total max, then Mar 12 12:56:13 freddd: imaging it a donation for open source Mar 12 12:56:16 I think I rather try to get world record flyn900 instead. Mar 12 12:56:18 *imagine Mar 12 12:56:27 there should be an online high score board Mar 12 12:56:42 l29ah: pics or it didnt happen Mar 12 12:56:59 yeah it should take pics every second Mar 12 12:57:01 also, i bet there would be cheaters using mechanical aids Mar 12 12:57:22 throw it off the eifel tower, have a catcher at the bottom Mar 12 12:57:31 Parachute? Mar 12 12:57:31 get the catcher killed Mar 12 12:57:36 freddd: it measures both times, ascending+descending Mar 12 12:57:42 oh Mar 12 12:58:12 gravity says both times are equal Mar 12 12:58:26 ceene: parachute? Mar 12 12:58:40 air friction? Mar 12 12:58:44 * freddd puts on an evil smirk, knowing what he has started here ... Mar 12 12:59:02 I announce official n900fly championship. Mar 12 12:59:14 freddd: no worries, n900 is quite resilient device Mar 12 12:59:23 Presumably it works on the difference in deceleration due to air resistance. Mar 12 12:59:28 Imagine N900 on ISS... Mar 12 12:59:28 I know it flung many directions many times over the years. Mar 12 12:59:29 as long it doesnt land on screen Mar 12 12:59:37 Having it on my bed and flinging open the bed sheets. Mar 12 12:59:40 Woosh. Mar 12 12:59:43 >> when the phone lands, the time of flight and respective distance, considering the phone travelled the same distance going up and down, are shown.<< you can half the value for one way travels, you also can keep the phone in your pocket and see how high or how deep you jumped Mar 12 12:59:44 Disregarding the air resistance, there isn't any force exerted on the device. Mar 12 12:59:45 To the floor it goes. Mar 12 12:59:47 No harm done. Mar 12 13:00:03 Guys, too much science, just throw it in the air already. Mar 12 13:00:19 I guess it could just be based on the initial and final acceleration too, as you throw and catch it. Mar 12 13:01:09 This app has been made 2009. So the guy who bought his N900 must have had the first thought of wanting to throw it in the air of joy. Mar 12 13:01:12 And measure his joy. Mar 12 13:01:15 maxd: what about landing with side bump? Mar 12 13:01:30 side bump? Mar 12 13:01:43 kind of bad catch Mar 12 13:01:43 as already mentioned you can carry the phone in your pocket Mar 12 13:02:15 which probably is rather interesting for e.g. parcours Mar 12 13:02:19 i wonder if i can fuck the system by rotating it on a rope Mar 12 13:02:23 then it will slow only partially Mar 12 13:02:32 huh? Mar 12 13:02:35 L29Ah: rotating it? Mar 12 13:02:40 yeah Mar 12 13:02:43 l29ah: go for it, freddd waits for a new customer Mar 12 13:02:44 L29Ah: using centrifugal force? Mar 12 13:02:45 rotation = acceleration Mar 12 13:02:47 yep Mar 12 13:02:53 so what? Mar 12 13:02:54 L29Ah: but it should be in freefall. Mar 12 13:02:59 L29Ah: freefall = no acceleration Mar 12 13:03:07 when it's flying through the air, it's not accelerating. Mar 12 13:03:16 sure it's accelerating Mar 12 13:03:22 ??? Mar 12 13:03:34 It's following a geodesic. Mar 12 13:03:43 when device is flying, it has 0g Mar 12 13:04:02 N900fly measures duration of 0g Mar 12 13:04:09 wat Mar 12 13:04:15 L29Ah: put your N900 on a flat surface and look at the accelerometer. Mar 12 13:04:19 L29Ah: it should show 1 g. Mar 12 13:04:30 if it doesn't follow a rectilinear trajectory, then it's accelerating Mar 12 13:04:31 maxd: - friction Mar 12 13:04:36 L29Ah: because that surface, if attached to the Earth, is accelerating upwards at 1 g. Mar 12 13:04:44 ceene: please! Mar 12 13:05:06 ceene: it is following a rectilinear trajectory. Mar 12 13:05:12 maxd: you are forgetting air resistance Mar 12 13:05:12 (or decelerating) Mar 12 13:05:24 ceene: a rectilinear trajectory in special relativity is a geodesic. Mar 12 13:05:32 every item has its own final speed Mar 12 13:05:33 ceene: the accelerometer measures force to the case, simply spoken Mar 12 13:05:39 then air just stop the acceleration Mar 12 13:05:42 not if you attach it to a rope Mar 12 13:05:42 ceene: spacetime is curved. Mar 12 13:05:43 *stops Mar 12 13:05:56 as long as no force to case, the whole device is an inertial system Mar 12 13:06:24 constant speed == no accel Mar 12 13:06:45 ok so accelerometer doesn't measure acceleration, but a force on a spring-suspended object Mar 12 13:06:54 exactly Mar 12 13:07:13 No. That's not right. Mar 12 13:07:21 Gravity doesn't directly cause acceleration. Mar 12 13:07:32 maxd: lol Mar 12 13:07:40 that spring suspended object is a tiny mass inside the accelerometer Mar 12 13:07:45 When a meteor is flying towards the Earth, it's not accelerating. Mar 12 13:07:50 gravity == force, accel == force vector != 0 Mar 12 13:08:06 It accelerates when it hits the Earth and the structure of the Earth pushes it back. Mar 12 13:08:22 maxd: you know gravity is not limited? Mar 12 13:08:23 -144 -234 -1062 Mar 12 13:08:27 calibration looks sucky Mar 12 13:08:29 near zero but not zero? Mar 12 13:08:31 just as the structure of the Earth pushes us up, because it's preventing itself from collapsing, as it would do if it didn't accelerate. Mar 12 13:08:42 L29Ah: no, you don't hold it 'flat' Mar 12 13:08:43 as it's just lying tilted on a table Mar 12 13:08:50 which means earth's gravity does things on every thing in the universe Mar 12 13:08:59 unmeasurable but it's there Mar 12 13:09:22 we can now measure gravitational waves Mar 12 13:09:30 as an engineer you can always put near zero as zero Mar 12 13:09:33 not with N900 Mar 12 13:09:54 unless they get waaaaaaaaay stronger than what we seen so far Mar 12 13:10:25 so let's use a cluster of n900 :) Mar 12 13:10:33 it doesnt work that way Mar 12 13:10:48 ceene: yes. We can also measure tides. Mar 12 13:11:06 DocScrutinizer05: sure but it can't be more than 1000 Mar 12 13:11:12 “Einstein proposed that spacetime is curved by matter, and that free-falling objects are moving along locally straight paths in curved spacetime. These straight paths are called geodesics.” Mar 12 13:12:02 they are curved beyond any recognition Mar 12 13:12:06 spacetime has curved my n900 during n900fly Mar 12 13:12:26 fucking einstein Mar 12 13:13:07 it also curved you Mar 12 13:23:10 https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=815006 Mar 12 13:23:18 so firefox is back on debian Mar 12 13:23:49 icewasel in jessie is ~37 Mar 12 13:23:56 which is weird Mar 12 13:45:23 Hm. So far reading the thread below, it seems unclear that it's going to happen. Mar 12 13:46:19 “I still think we are approaching something dangerous. Sure, we might have the ability to make these patches which Mozilla doesn't think misuse their trademark, but what about users who want to make a heavier modification and redistribute?” Mar 12 13:46:36 I was always under the impression that was the exact reason for the rebranding. Mar 12 13:46:56 Of course Mozilla is going to be okay with the changes Debian themselves make. Mar 12 13:47:34 but Debian wants to enable pretty much any changes of their software to be used. Mar 12 13:48:08 i run firefox unmodified, what changes one could want? Mar 12 13:49:12 If you run it unmodified you probably either compiled it yourself (in which case you're not distributing binaries, so there aren't any TM issues there), or you're using the binaries provided by Mozilla. Mar 12 13:49:32 s/not/probably not/ Mar 12 13:49:33 Maxdamantus meant: If you run it unmodified you probably either compiled it yourself (in which case you're probably not distributing binaries, so there aren't any TM issues there), or you're using the binaries provided by Mozilla. Mar 12 13:50:07 yes, but i ask what changes they are talking about Mar 12 13:50:16 Who? Mar 12 13:51:16 'users who want to make a heavier modification' Mar 12 13:51:34 So the person I quoted. Mar 12 13:52:28 Changing it so it's full of ads. Mar 12 13:52:46 ads? Mar 12 13:52:49 wtf? Mar 12 13:52:53 Advertisements. Mar 12 13:53:00 For some political cause or something. Mar 12 13:53:42 Mozilla probably wouldn't want people distributing debian packages called "Firefox" with ads everywhere. Mar 12 13:54:09 but people should be able to make such derivations of Debian packages. Mar 12 14:04:11 I guess the argument is that once you make those modifications you just have to rebrand your package. Mar 12 14:04:36 * Maxdamantus sleeps. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Mar 13 02:59:58 2016