**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed May 11 02:59:58 2016
May 11 04:54:24 <KotCzarny> sunshavi: hmm?
May 11 13:58:03 <openbot> not able to acces maemo talk wiki lately
May 11 13:58:17 <openbot> very annoying blacklist
May 11 13:58:35 <openbot> spammers should be hanged
May 11 13:59:23 <openbot> request to moderateors pls fix this
May 11 13:59:58 * Sicelo prepares to tie a noose over openbot's head
May 11 14:00:19 <openbot> why ?
May 11 14:00:35 <openbot> i did not do anything
May 11 14:01:12 <Sicelo> you're in a blacklist, so you did a lot!
May 11 14:01:22 <openbot> lol
May 11 14:01:34 <openbot> blacklist is awsome
May 11 14:01:42 <openbot> red redington
May 11 14:01:53 <openbot> wrong spell
May 11 14:02:20 <Sicelo> :D
May 11 14:05:23 <KotCzarny> maybe we shall create simple t.m.o proxy that would be read only
May 11 14:05:55 <KotCzarny> i wonder what bandwidth it would eat
May 11 14:06:01 <KotCzarny> (/me has unused 30/30)
May 11 14:09:46 <Sicelo> ceene: am sure you read this, https://whispersystems.org/blog/the-ecosystem-is-moving/
May 11 14:09:53 <Sicelo> crazy
May 11 14:11:14 <KotCzarny> pah. irc.
May 11 14:13:28 <KotCzarny> being innovative is one thing, banning users for worng user agent is the whole new circle of hell
May 11 14:13:55 <openbot> the earth is gonna spin on the wrong axis soon too
May 11 14:16:32 <Sicelo> they defend it by saying you'll compromise the security of the network
May 11 14:17:48 <KotCzarny> riiiight.
May 11 14:33:09 <Sicelo> not saying i agree or
May 11 14:49:30 <ceene> Sicelo: thanks, i'll read that later
May 11 14:49:33 <ceene> i'm quite busy today at work :(
May 11 15:32:20 <DocScrutinizer05> blacklists at tmo finally need a decent fixing, for good!
May 11 15:32:50 <DocScrutinizer05> it's insane to try to keep up the internet by basically shutting it down
May 11 15:33:29 <DocScrutinizer05> that's like fsck for virginity or suicide in fear of death
May 11 15:52:31 <openbot> humm
May 11 15:52:45 <openbot> i hope its done soon
May 11 15:53:18 <openbot> as it acts as a good deterrant against using tmo
May 11 15:53:52 <openbot> i mean if one is using random computers to acess tmo
May 11 15:56:40 <DocScrutinizer05> we've seen the biweekly weekend downtime at tmo, a 5 years ago, and it was almost good and normal and everybody knew to cope with it. Now no more weekend downtimes from dunno DDoS or whatever, but instead an unknown but rather significant percentage of users simply get kicked off by blacklists. I know I prefer the old behavior
May 11 16:00:38 <DocScrutinizer05> I have a very hard time explaining privacy aware customers/users who use tor as suggested by all major FOSS-internet-best-practice-entities why they can't even *READ* tmo >:-(
May 11 16:01:28 <DocScrutinizer05> and honestly I don't see council having any better rationale to give, than I do: none
May 11 16:03:47 <DocScrutinizer05> when blacklisting turns into global nuklear extinction, it's prolly time to comletely drop it and rather go to graylisting or even whitelisting instead
May 11 16:04:31 <openbot> how to cope with this problem
May 11 16:04:49 <DocScrutinizer05> you, as a user? no way
May 11 16:05:09 <openbot> what do you mean ?
May 11 16:05:16 <openbot> how do i acess
May 11 16:05:29 <DocScrutinizer05> I mean this problem can only get fixed by admins and sysops
May 11 16:05:33 <openbot> my brain demands maemo updates
May 11 16:06:03 <openbot> tor not working nither proxies
May 11 16:06:22 <openbot> one thing i have yet to try is vpn
May 11 16:06:27 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, exactly. since those are exactly the IPs listed on blacklists
May 11 16:06:52 <openbot> can you give me some pointers to start with vpn
May 11 16:06:59 <DocScrutinizer05> ugh
May 11 16:07:03 <openbot> i am extremely new
May 11 16:07:06 <DocScrutinizer05> I wish I could
May 11 16:07:20 <kerio> just put cloudflare in front of it
May 11 16:07:23 <kerio> OH WAIT they block tor by default
May 11 16:07:39 <DocScrutinizer05> try plain IP as you received from your interbnet provider, odds are this still works best with tmo
May 11 16:07:53 <openbot> cloudflare for sure will eat the internet
May 11 16:08:06 <openbot> its everywhere
May 11 16:08:30 <openbot> n900 cries everytime it has to deal with
May 11 16:08:30 <DocScrutinizer05> kerio: can you explain to me how anybody could exploit TOR with its shitty bandwidth to run a DDoS?
May 11 16:08:48 <kerio> their rationale is "TOR is 99.9% attacks"
May 11 16:08:55 <DocScrutinizer05> so what?
May 11 16:08:56 <kerio> ...and to be fair, i believe them
May 11 16:09:07 <kerio> so they default on requiring some pretty angsty captcha for tor users
May 11 16:09:22 <kerio> and if you don't have javascript enabled, you get captchas on like every 3 pages or something like that
May 11 16:09:26 <DocScrutinizer05> err, for READING???
May 11 16:09:31 <kerio> for accessing a site
May 11 16:09:53 <DocScrutinizer05> FSCK! FIX DAT SHITE!
May 11 16:09:54 <kerio> so it's up to the site owner to disable that
May 11 16:11:17 <DocScrutinizer05> I can see the rationale why users might face a "you can't log in to tmo, sorry" but DEFINITELY NOT for "you cannot READ tmo"
May 11 16:14:16 <nokiabot> windows rebooted without a warning donknow what for
May 11 16:14:21 <nokiabot> i hate this
May 11 16:14:25 <DocScrutinizer05> heck, we dodged a half a legion CDS-servers trying to sync to maemo.org when maemo.org was some flimsy VM on Nemein's infra. We dang sure should shrug away any "DDoS" to tmo now that we have a decens iron on a fat backbone
May 11 16:15:24 * DocScrutinizer05 frowns
May 11 16:16:06 <kerio> DocScrutinizer05: or just shove cloudflare in front of it
May 11 16:16:10 <nokiabot> forget it cloud flare is everywhere even in my bathroom
May 11 16:16:12 <kerio> (maybe while disabling the tor blocking)
May 11 16:16:22 <kerio> and just literally shrug away the DDoSes
May 11 16:16:38 <DocScrutinizer05> why mess with shit like cloudflare?
May 11 16:16:39 <kerio> who the fuck would DDoS tmo anyway
May 11 16:16:45 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, exactly
May 11 16:16:51 <kerio> it's got like 3 active users
May 11 16:16:54 <Sicelo> microsoft :p
May 11 16:16:56 <DocScrutinizer05> and even when they do, so what?
May 11 16:17:09 <DocScrutinizer05> they eventually will stop again
May 11 16:17:56 <DocScrutinizer05> see above comparison between times where we had no blacklists vs now. The relative availability of services was way bteer bacj when
May 11 16:18:20 <DocScrutinizer05> better back when*
May 11 16:18:48 <nokiabot> best solution is nuke n900 get a alternativee that can give you the orgasm but i have yet to find any
May 11 16:18:59 <DocScrutinizer05> huh?
May 11 16:19:23 <nokiabot> best solution is nuke n900 get a alternative that can give you the same orgasm but i have yet to find any
May 11 16:19:29 <DocScrutinizer05> nokiabot: please stop spreading nonsense, that's not related at all to availability of maemo.org website
May 11 16:19:31 <nokiabot> correction
May 11 16:19:58 <nokiabot> one hand typing is difficult
May 11 16:20:53 <nokiabot> DocScrutinizer05: no nonsence spreading i am just trying to find something like n900 and that needs to be a 90% clone
May 11 16:21:21 <DocScrutinizer05> how the heck is this relevant for talk.maemo.org blacklisting?
May 11 16:21:33 <nokiabot> for gods shake i bought 4 n900s
May 11 16:22:16 <nokiabot> no n900s no tmo :)
May 11 16:22:31 <DocScrutinizer05> gaaawwwd shut up please
May 11 16:22:41 <nokiabot> so i would not need visit tmo again
May 11 16:22:51 <nokiabot> he he
May 11 16:24:00 <nokiabot> for now any idea how to visit tmo
May 11 16:24:56 <nokiabot> also i am not using proxies or anything 
May 11 16:24:58 <DocScrutinizer05> yes, do listen budy, I told you already
May 11 16:25:36 <nokiabot> yes i did that if you mean the ip provided by my operator
May 11 16:25:43 <DocScrutinizer05> [2016-05-11 Wed 18:07:39] <DocScrutinizer05> try plain IP as you received from your interbnet provider, odds are this still works best with tmo
May 11 16:26:12 <DocScrutinizer05> if this doesn't work, pester chem|st
May 11 16:26:31 <DocScrutinizer05> tmo admin
May 11 16:26:32 <nokiabot> or if you know anything else configuring a windows 7 com it could work
May 11 16:27:54 <nokiabot> chem|st: hi i am (ip)blacklisted on tmo i need help to acess tmo
May 11 16:28:07 <DocScrutinizer05> or ask warfare to put the whole friggin tmo VM behind a http proxy
May 11 16:28:18 <nokiabot> haha
May 11 16:28:57 <kerio> like cloudflare! :3
May 11 16:29:50 <nokiabot> what is the most efficent way of compiling java programs on n900
May 11 16:30:37 <nokiabot> or more can i actually run a java program with a gui on n900
May 11 16:37:07 <nokiabot> DocScrutinizer05: i bet uou know how use remote computing on n900 like ssh vnc etc but what i want to know is how do you reliably do it i mean the configurations on the remote side as how to deal with disconnetions like server gone offline it rebooted etc
May 11 16:38:57 <nokiabot> also i am using fedora as a server as i am not quite useful on a terminal interface only server
May 11 16:42:06 <nokiabot> chem|st: hi i am (ip)blacklisted on tmo i need help to acess tmo (reposting for better visiblity)
May 11 16:44:21 <DocScrutinizer05> nokiabot: tbh I don't worry much so far, I'm using ZNC to buffer away the reconnects from public IRC. Apart from that I have rarely any persistent connections that I want to stay up. Nevertheless I looked into a few VPN solutions to my server but never really managed to finalize any, mostly because of innertia and lack of time to set them up when I *really* could use them
May 11 16:44:49 <nokiabot> oh
May 11 16:45:04 <nokiabot> kind of chiken and egg problem
May 11 16:45:11 <DocScrutinizer05> indeed
May 11 16:46:03 <nokiabot> my problem is i know of remote as simple tv remote one uses it hasssele free
May 11 16:46:27 <nokiabot> but remote over the internet is whole diffrent deal
May 11 16:47:44 <KotCzarny> for the above, setting openvpn takes ~10-20 minutes
May 11 16:47:54 <KotCzarny> no explanation other than lazy
May 11 16:48:26 <KotCzarny> unless you generate big dh size on slow machine. which can take ~8h (did it on my banana pi)
May 11 16:48:31 <KotCzarny> 4096 bits
May 11 16:49:06 <nokiabot> KotCzarny: is it ment for me
May 11 16:49:17 <KotCzarny> nope
May 11 16:49:23 <nokiabot> ok
May 11 16:49:54 <nokiabot> KotCzarny: can you suggest some decent vpn providers 
May 11 16:50:15 <KotCzarny> nope, im just using my home connection (30/30mbit with static ip)
May 11 16:50:34 <KotCzarny> easy to make some order between all my devices
May 11 16:50:52 <nokiabot> KotCzarny: mbit = megabytes ?
May 11 16:50:57 <NIN101> ssh can also be used for VPN and shouldn't take long to setup, but TCP over TCP has its drawbacks of course.
May 11 16:51:24 <KotCzarny> nin101: openvpn has one nice feature, autoreconnect
May 11 16:51:35 <KotCzarny> and im using udp, works fine enough
May 11 16:51:51 <KotCzarny> nokiabot: 30mbit/s == ~3.5MB/s
May 11 16:52:22 <nokiabot> KotCzarny: thats very bad speed indeed 
May 11 16:52:34 <KotCzarny> o.O
May 11 16:52:39 <nokiabot> proud to say mine is better
May 11 16:52:53 <KotCzarny> im not torrentfreak
May 11 16:52:57 <KotCzarny> 30mbit is more than enough
May 11 16:53:06 <KotCzarny> especially for uplink
May 11 16:53:23 <nokiabot> for the first time somebody on the internet has worse internet than mine
May 11 16:54:18 <nokiabot> KotCzarny: humm i am torrenting a lil but i guess its just the craze that is wearing off
May 11 16:54:25 <KotCzarny> yup
May 11 16:54:40 <KotCzarny> once you run out of disk space/time you will see its pointless
May 11 16:55:42 <nokiabot> i reacher speeeds of 45 mbps and i wasent breathing the coffe burnt my tounge actually
May 11 16:59:44 <nokiabot> KotCzarny: whats your down and up speeds
May 11 17:00:03 <KotCzarny> 30/30
May 11 17:00:32 <nokiabot> what ?
May 11 17:00:50 <KotCzarny> 30mbit down + 30mbit up, symmetrical link
May 11 17:01:12 <nokiabot> do you get that for real
May 11 17:01:19 <KotCzarny> yes
May 11 17:01:47 <nokiabot> humm
May 11 17:01:52 <nokiabot> thats good
May 11 17:02:22 <nokiabot> ok then my torrenting speed is better :(
May 11 18:15:25 <kerio> KotCzarny: openvpn still doesn't do ecdh? :|
May 11 18:16:35 <KotCzarny> oh well
May 11 18:17:42 <kerio> NIN101: ssh with the whole tap/tun thing is maybe kinda bad
May 11 18:17:50 <kerio> but ssh in socks proxy mode is data over tcp, not tcp over tcp
May 11 18:26:19 <NIN101> yes
May 11 18:27:16 <kerio> but, i mean
May 11 18:27:23 <kerio> you're basically only ever guaranteed https
May 11 18:27:28 <kerio> and nothing else
May 11 18:31:52 <chem|st> ~unbanip
May 11 18:31:53 <infobot> it has been said that unbanip is please contact techstaff <at> maemo <dot> org with your request, or see ~techstaff, or see https://www.stopforumspam.com/removal
May 11 23:39:35 <jonwil> hi
May 12 00:33:29 <sunshavi> KotCzarny: r u there?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu May 12 02:59:58 2016