**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jun 14 02:59:59 2016
Jun 14 05:14:43 <KotCzarny> vectis: keep in mind software support is work in progress, ie. for android you have to swap image to something working, and for linux you still have to use legacy kernel on h3 based boards (which means chroots not working as expected, but that will change with mainline)
Jun 14 08:40:08 <Sicelo> pgp question (i probably should be asking elsewhere, but i guess you can help too) - i'm attending debconf, and there is apparently a key-signing party. i've never used PGP before, but would like to take advantage of this opportunity. is GnuPG the best way to go? what are the common gotchas i need to be aware of?
Jun 14 08:51:23 <Sicelo> ah, deadline is not as soon as i thought it was .. still have a full week to read about this :)
Jun 14 10:06:18 <ginggs> hi Sicelo - do you already have a key?
Jun 14 10:07:55 <Sicelo> not yet. will go throught the links on Anibal's mail. For some reason I thought the deadline was today, but have now realized it's next week
Jun 14 10:08:05 <Sicelo> *through
Jun 14 10:10:57 <ginggs> i *think* anibal's mail assumes you already have a key and want to participate in the key signing party
Jun 14 10:11:18 <ginggs> do you have a debian or ubuntu computer to work from?
Jun 14 10:11:23 <Sicelo> ah 
Jun 14 10:11:37 <Sicelo> yes, i use debian on my main pc
Jun 14 10:12:19 <ginggs> that is the correct answer ;)
Jun 14 10:12:38 <ginggs> https://keyring.debian.org/creating-key.html
Jun 14 10:15:46 <Sicelo> yes, been looking at that. seems easy enough
Jun 14 10:16:05 <Sicelo> is it of any use though for a non-dev? :-)
Jun 14 10:17:00 <ginggs> you can put 'keyserver hkp://keyserver.leg.uct.ac.za' in ~/.gnupg/gpg.conf or specify 'keyserver.leg.uct.ac.za' when you upload your key - it will replicate to the rest of the world eventually
Jun 14 10:17:33 <Sicelo> nice. will use that one ;)
Jun 14 10:17:44 <ginggs> remember to bring a passport or some kind of identity document with you
Jun 14 10:18:31 <Sicelo> will do.
Jun 14 10:19:35 <ginggs> Sicelo: even non-devs need keys to sign or encrypt mail if they want
Jun 14 10:20:45 <ginggs> you could generate a key and use it without ever being signed by other people
Jun 14 10:21:29 <ginggs> but it's better if your key has been signed by other people (and the more the merrier)
Jun 14 10:22:59 <azkay> Does the fremantle repo have fremantle1.2 in it? or do they have different stuff in them? I'm tring to mirror them to a local server, trying to figure out what I can get rid of to save space (just want n900 repos, ovi, community, extras, devel, testing)
Jun 14 10:24:18 <KotCzarny> azkay, different stuff
Jun 14 10:24:41 <KotCzarny> in the sense that deps are different, so its not good idea to mix them
Jun 14 10:25:03 <KotCzarny> you only want fremantle not older things
Jun 14 10:26:37 <Sicelo> ginggs: i'll participate. i may never get a similar opportunity ever (carpe diem) ;)
Jun 14 10:27:42 <ginggs> Sicelo: \o/
Jun 14 10:28:26 <azkay> Thanks :)
Jun 14 10:31:14 <KotCzarny> also, bpi-m3 power req of only 2A is looking unrealistic
Jun 14 10:33:18 <KotCzarny> i think tkaiser is biased because they didnt answer his bug reports
Jun 14 10:33:46 <KotCzarny> and requests for schematics/info
Jun 14 11:39:49 <Sicelo> ginggs: does that keyserver support hkps:// ?
Jun 14 13:12:46 <Vajb> Sicelo: ur comment reminded me of seeing a boat named "carpe diem 2" at weekend. and i thought what happened to first one :)
Jun 14 13:13:04 <KotCzarny> lol
Jun 14 13:13:13 <KotCzarny> 'wife took it'
Jun 14 13:13:14 <KotCzarny> ;)
Jun 14 13:14:04 <Vajb> hehe that or some quote from titanic "but this ship can't sink"
Jun 14 13:14:32 <Sicelo> :)
Jun 14 14:23:14 <ginggs> Sicelo: no, i don't think it does hkps
Jun 14 14:42:32 <DocScrutinizer05> hkps is overrated
Jun 14 14:43:23 <DocScrutinizer05> even way more than https is overrated for public websites
Jun 14 14:45:10 <DocScrutinizer05> when some MITM spy can sniff your traffic to the hktp server, they also can sniff all your pop/imap/smtp traffic and thus already know which mails and from whom you received
Jun 14 14:46:21 <DocScrutinizer05> they however invariably can _not_ fake signatures or decrypt mails
Jun 14 14:47:50 <DocScrutinizer05> or rather, they can fake signatures just like they could by uploading them to the hktp key server
Jun 14 14:48:19 <DocScrutinizer05> unless you verify the signature, it's worth nothing
Jun 14 14:48:46 <DocScrutinizer05> that's what keysigning parties are all about
Jun 14 14:48:59 <DocScrutinizer05> and fingerprints, published out of band
Jun 14 14:50:22 <DocScrutinizer05> and signatures on a bazillion of emails on public ML that all should be identical to the one you just evaluate
Jun 14 14:52:06 <DocScrutinizer05> I consider the latter one a stronger "verification" that a keysigning party where somebody allegedly checked your identity by looking at a random possibly fake document
Jun 14 14:52:18 <DocScrutinizer05> ML posts are historic evidence
Jun 14 15:00:10 <Sicelo> okay
Jun 14 15:13:08 <Sicelo> ginggs: it's done, and uploaded to that keyserver :)
Jun 14 15:19:25 <DocScrutinizer05> send me a signed mail
Jun 14 15:21:53 <Sicelo> what's your email address? :)
Jun 14 15:22:57 <DocScrutinizer05> /ns info DocScrutinizer05
Jun 14 15:23:15 <DocScrutinizer05> also share your fingerprint in here
Jun 14 15:24:11 <DocScrutinizer05> you're logged in so I consider that as sufficent authentication to believe you are Sicelo
Jun 14 15:25:24 <Sicelo> let me see how encrypted mail works for mutt (first time)
Jun 14 15:26:00 <DocScrutinizer05> only sign, not encrypt, please
Jun 14 15:27:17 <DocScrutinizer05> btw your key is already public
Jun 14 15:27:55 <Sicelo> that was quick
Jun 14 15:27:58 <DocScrutinizer05> also  gmail really now?
Jun 14 15:28:33 <Sicelo> it sets the standards :p
Jun 14 15:29:00 <DocScrutinizer05> it has the failtards
Jun 14 15:29:36 <DocScrutinizer05> nevermind, I don't care
Jun 14 15:30:03 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway with gmail I'd also want to receive and send only encrypted mail ;-P
Jun 14 15:30:23 <Sicelo> :)
Jun 14 15:32:54 <DocScrutinizer05> share your fingerürint!
Jun 14 15:32:59 <DocScrutinizer05> print even
Jun 14 15:33:10 <Sicelo> C47E979291E3357710767378C91D0E98B18C7117
Jun 14 15:33:13 <DocScrutinizer05> ta
Jun 14 15:33:36 * Sicelo is new to this mumbo-jumbo
Jun 14 15:34:48 <Sicelo> and mutt has lots of stuff to set, it seems
Jun 14 15:37:03 <DocScrutinizer05> yeah, configuring email clients for PGP is a mess
Jun 14 15:39:25 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway mit.edu hkp has a signed version of your key, according to my kgpg
Jun 14 15:39:58 <DocScrutinizer05> I verified correctness of the key by comparing fingerprint out of band
Jun 14 15:40:33 <DocScrutinizer05> I can't verify identity
Jun 14 15:40:52 <DocScrutinizer05> for that please join a signing party
Jun 14 15:42:03 <Sicelo> hence, ginggs ... signing party as part of DebConf16
Jun 14 15:43:23 <Sicelo> it's quite likely this is the only signing party i'll ever be in, so trying to use the opportunity to the ful
Jun 14 15:43:29 <KotCzarny> :)
Jun 14 15:43:36 <KotCzarny> dont forget party hat
Jun 14 15:43:57 <ginggs> Sicelo: aren't you planning to going to  debconf17 in canada? :)
Jun 14 15:43:57 <KotCzarny> and bassblaster connected to your n900
Jun 14 15:44:00 <DocScrutinizer05> sure
Jun 14 15:44:26 <DocScrutinizer05> I never got around to it, then otoh I never needed that sort of verification either
Jun 14 15:45:42 <DocScrutinizer05> the whole "bring your key so we can sign it" was too much hassle for every event I ever met, had other more important things to pack ;-)
Jun 14 15:46:17 <DocScrutinizer05> and other more interesting talks to join on the event
Jun 14 15:46:29 <Sicelo> canada is enticing yes, haha .. will see i'f i'm rich enough by then ;)
Jun 14 15:47:26 <DocScrutinizer05> canada?=
Jun 14 15:48:09 <DocScrutinizer05> did you already re-download your own key?
Jun 14 15:49:05 <DocScrutinizer05> I'm no expert on that stuff either, but it should have a signature by me
Jun 14 15:50:08 <Sicelo> i see that there's extra signature. thanks
Jun 14 15:50:26 <DocScrutinizer05> nb you technically don't need to download your own pubkey, the signatures are relevant for everybody but you
Jun 14 15:51:53 <Sicelo> i sent you a gmail .. did i sign correctly at least?
Jun 14 15:54:57 <DocScrutinizer05> I don't know, kmail sucks at inline signatures
Jun 14 15:58:23 <Sicelo> okay. anyway,  got to get some RL stuff done here in the meantime
Jun 14 16:02:59 <DocScrutinizer05> https://userbase.kde.org/KMail/PGP_MIME  >>KMail no longer does in-line signatures. OpenGPG has to be used instead.<< whatever that means
Jun 14 16:06:05 <ginggs> fwiw, i sign mail with gpg and then copy-paste into gmail web interface
Jun 14 19:37:35 <vectis3> My phone stays in headset mode after unpugging them, any way to fix this other than a restart?
Jun 14 19:39:30 <Sicelo> N900?
Jun 14 19:45:36 <vectis3> Sicelo: Yes, N900
Jun 14 19:47:59 <Sicelo> maybe the more knowledgeable will chime in .. but headphone switching on N900 is through software afaict .. am sure there's some /sys node somewhere which detects the HP
Jun 14 20:04:20 <DocScrutinizer05> yes indeed
Jun 14 20:05:06 <DocScrutinizer05> the problem isn't unheard of, and the easy fix is to plug and unplug again the headphones
Jun 14 20:06:38 <DocScrutinizer05> there are however lockups cause by fancy sequences like "plug wired hp, connect BT HP, unplug wired HP, plug wired HP again" or the like, which need a reboot for all I know
Jun 14 20:08:28 <DocScrutinizer05> also keeping hold button pressed while connecting the headset will result in faulty detection of headset type and you can't recover from that with other means than a re-mating
Jun 14 20:12:18 <vectis3> plug/unplug isn't fixing it unfortunately. These are standard earphones btw, not bluetooth.
Jun 14 20:14:00 <Sicelo> when plugged in, do you get audio through them?
Jun 14 20:15:04 <sixwheeledbeast> I recall an issue where my headset /sys value increased on every mate cycle leaving the device stuck in headset mode. I believe a reboot and cleaning the jack with isoproyl fixed it.
Jun 14 20:17:02 <vectis3> Yes, sounds working headphones.
Jun 14 20:17:43 <vectis3> working *through* headphones
Jun 14 20:18:51 <Sicelo> reboot is likely quickest 'fix' :)
Jun 14 20:20:00 <vectis3> Ok, thanks.
Jun 14 20:20:27 <Sicelo> i don't know the daemo that keeps track of hp
Jun 14 20:21:06 <Sicelo> and my N900 is currently switched off .. can't even check
Jun 14 20:21:43 <vectis3> thats ok, it's not a big problem.
Jun 14 22:16:17 <DocScrutinizer05> Sicelo: kernel stuff to start with
Jun 14 22:16:44 <DocScrutinizer05> nokia_av.ko or somesuch
Jun 14 22:19:25 <DocScrutinizer05> watch -d -n1 'for f in /sys/devices/platform/nokia-av/type /sys/devices/platform/nokia-av/detect /sys/devices/platform/nokia-av/autodetect /sys/devices/platform/nokia-av/eci* /sys/devices/platform/soc-audio/eci_mode /sys/devices/platform/nokia-av/madc; do echo "$f: `cat $f`"; done'
Jun 14 22:37:49 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway dbus system bus is your best friend here, I guess (whoever is sender 1.9)  http://paste.opensuse.org/36168680
Jun 14 22:38:33 <DocScrutinizer05> I'd almost bet 1.9 is HAL
Jun 14 22:39:56 <DocScrutinizer05> 1.19 prolly PED
Jun 14 22:42:01 <DocScrutinizer05> a slightly more comprehensive log of a plug event:  http://paste.opensuse.org/95991905
Jun 15 00:53:18 <Oksana> Is there a way to ask sysklogd to log slightly less? Like, I am worrying about RootFS space, so either log at home, or log less? | And is there something better for debian packaging than debhelper? Like, I want to pack not-binary package, smilies theme, to create an alternative to user/default of rtcom-messaging-ui and chat_smiley_* of osso-icons-default
Jun 15 00:54:59 <Oksana> Seriously, the default-Nokia's-smilies should have been in their own package, it's atrocious how many pictures are pushed into osso-icons-default, and the configs referring to these pictures are in entirely different package(s)
Jun 15 01:30:18 <DocScrutinizer05> Oksana: rsyslog config allows arbitrary log destinations for arbitrary (sub)sets of logline types
Jun 15 01:31:52 <DocScrutinizer05> Oksana: see /etc/syslog.conf  the line >>*.*;auth,authpriv.none          -/var/log/syslog<<
Jun 15 01:32:57 <DocScrutinizer05> *.* means "log all to..." - you could reduce the amount that gets logged by excluding stuff you don't want to get logged
Jun 15 01:34:04 <DocScrutinizer05> or you change the file spec (-/var/log/syslog) to e.g. -/home/user/syslog
Jun 15 01:34:20 <Oksana> Yes, have seen it. Could probably tell it to use different location. Does it need to be restarted to know the changes in config? And, I would mostly want to know how-why it shutdowns and reboots. And why the filesystem is called BCM2048B0 Initialization Configuration, instead of Nokia N900
Jun 15 01:35:01 <DocScrutinizer05> err prolly kill sighup rsyslogd or somesuch, but reboot is simpler I guess
Jun 15 01:48:07 <DocScrutinizer05> man syslog.conf is an insult
Jun 15 01:48:22 <DocScrutinizer05> typos and blabla
Jun 15 01:50:42 <DocScrutinizer05> anyway nota bene: >> You may prefix each entry with the minus ‘‘-’’ sign to omit syncing the file after every logging.  Note that you might lose information if the system crashes  right        behind a write attempt.  Nevertheless this might give you back some performance, especially if you run programs that use logging in a very verbose manner.<<
Jun 15 01:52:30 <DocScrutinizer05> you probably might want to define a generic logging rule with "-" and a special logging rule for e.g. .err etc, or just for kernel crashes etc, without "-" for the same destination file
Jun 15 01:55:48 <DocScrutinizer05> but honestly, what a manpage is that, stating stuff like >> Don’t think a mail would be sent, that might        be too late.<<
Jun 15 01:57:36 <DocScrutinizer05> (( "-" syncing))  *.=crit;kern.none  /var/log/syslog
Jun 15 01:58:11 <DocScrutinizer05> *.*  -/var/log/syslog
Jun 15 01:59:48 <DocScrutinizer05> oops
Jun 15 02:00:10 <DocScrutinizer05> (( "-" syncing))  *.crit  /var/log/syslog
Jun 15 02:17:16 <DocScrutinizer05> also see this abomination that systemd gives you nowadays: http://paste.opensuse.org/87343490
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jun 15 02:59:58 2016