**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Dec 04 03:00:01 2016 Dec 04 03:07:42 arrrgh, maemo server backup time, lags like mad Dec 04 03:09:39 LOL >>The server is too busy at the moment. Please try again later.<< Dec 04 04:21:01 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=500662 Dec 04 04:30:10 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=593405 Dec 04 04:36:01 http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=593592 Dec 04 04:38:33 and here to the roots: http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?p=659580 Dec 04 04:43:40 http://maemo.org/packages/view/headset-control/ Dec 04 08:53:53 hi Dec 04 09:09:34 Hello. It seems to me that targets FREMANTLE_ARMEL_GCC472 and FREMANTLE_ARMEL are not "aligned"... for instance I have not found debhelper7 package Dec 04 09:12:16 I tried to build it from sources but then: maemo-optify: Command not found Dec 04 09:15:59 interesting Dec 04 09:16:22 do we have debhelper7 in FREMANTLE_ARMEL? Dec 04 09:17:20 I guess the real issue is "maemo-optify: Command not found" Dec 04 09:18:01 this one just mean you should add maemo-optify to builddeps and install it :) Dec 04 09:18:04 +s Dec 04 09:18:25 ~optification Dec 04 09:18:26 optification is a inventive duct tape workaround to reclaim space in fs root, done due to the fact the systeminit *and* partitioning is FUBAR, http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Packaging,_Deploying_and_Distributing/Installing_under_opt_and_MyDocs, or ""OMG - I wish they looked into FHS and moved /usr to eMMC"", http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE2 bullet1,2 and fhs-2.3.html#PURPOSE16 dot3" Dec 04 09:18:29 ;-) Dec 04 09:19:21 no idea here about that whole autobuilder stuff Dec 04 09:19:30 neither about scratchbox Dec 04 09:19:44 neither about debian packaging Dec 04 09:24:30 ~pkg Dec 04 09:24:30 well, pkg is http://maemo.org/packages/ Dec 04 09:24:41 I forgot to configure "extras-*" repositories in GCC472 target... Dec 04 09:24:54 http://maemo.org/packages/search/?org_maemo_packages_search%5B1%5D%5Bproperty%5D=name&org_maemo_packages_search%5B1%5D%5Bconstraint%5D=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search%5B1%5D%5Bvalue%5D=debhelper&org_maemo_packages_search%5B2%5D%5Bproperty%5D=title&org_maemo_packages_search%5B2%5D%5Bconstraint%5D=LIKE&org_maemo_packages_search%5B2%5D%5Bvalue%5D=same Dec 04 09:25:23 http://maemo.org/packages/view/debhelper7/ Dec 04 09:25:50 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_extras_free_armel/debhelper7/7.4.11-maemo6/ Dec 04 09:27:14 hey, niiice: http://maemo.org/packages/repository/ Dec 04 09:27:27 DocScrutinizer05: thank you. I do not install debhelper7 because it conflicts with debhelper (upgraded to 7.0.15-maemo2) Dec 04 09:30:48 LOL http://maemo.org/packages/view/A/ Dec 04 09:31:16 :] Dec 04 09:32:59 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Application/ Dec 04 09:33:58 try http://maemo.org/packages/view/o/ Dec 04 09:34:04 lots of goodies at http://maemo.org/packages/repository/list/fremantle_root_pr1-2_armel/ Dec 04 09:36:32 who was asking about eink phone? http://www.cnx-software.com/2016/12/04/hisense-a2-android-smartphone-coming-soon-with-amoled-and-e-ink-displays/ Dec 04 09:37:59 it really looks great apart from the snapdragon430 :/ Dec 04 09:38:05 http://maemo.org/packages/view/and/ Dec 04 09:38:37 yeah. but good thing eink in more mobile format is catching up Dec 04 09:38:45 yeah Dec 04 09:39:07 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Architecture:/ Dec 04 09:39:10 well the n9 had quite a killer feature as well with its amoled Dec 04 09:39:27 but os sucked, didnt it? Dec 04 09:39:55 n9 os? at least the UX seemed kinda great (as a phone, not commparable to n900) Dec 04 09:40:07 dev wise Dec 04 09:40:08 (n900 UX sucks a bit to be honest ;p) Dec 04 09:40:16 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Conffiles:/ Dec 04 09:40:37 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Conflicts:/ Dec 04 09:41:06 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Depends:/ Dec 04 09:41:07 I still think the N900 has the best keyboard of any mobile device ever made. Dec 04 09:41:20 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Description:/ Dec 04 09:41:22 nokia 5510 had better kb Dec 04 09:41:51 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Enables/ Dec 04 09:42:19 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Exempi/ Dec 04 09:42:52 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Git-Id:/ Dec 04 09:43:57 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Installed-Size:/ Dec 04 09:44:32 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Language/ Dec 04 09:46:57 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Maintainer:/ Dec 04 09:51:22 http://maemo.org/packages/view/prototype/ Dec 04 09:51:50 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Provides:/ Dec 04 09:52:10 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Replaces:/ Dec 04 09:52:54 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Section:/ Dec 04 09:53:37 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Source:/ Dec 04 09:53:39 http://maemo.org/packages/view/specification./ Dec 04 09:53:51 http://maemo.org/packages/view/Status:/ Dec 04 09:54:10 http://maemo.org/packages/view/This/ ;-P Dec 04 09:54:26 http://maemo.org/packages/view/to/ Dec 04 09:54:36 seriously .... Dec 04 09:55:04 this is one package probably Dec 04 09:55:21 all dates are the same Dec 04 09:58:55 CBA to log in and clean out that crap, particularly since - thanks midgard - the fallout of the cure is prolly much worse than the problem Dec 04 10:00:53 Exempi sounds specific Dec 04 10:03:05 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_root_pr1-2_armel/Exempi/is/ Dec 04 10:04:13 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_root_pr1-2_armel/A/library/ Dec 04 10:04:49 http://maemo.org/packages/package_instance/view/fremantle_root_pr1-2_armel/to/ensure/ Dec 04 10:07:52 http://maemo.org/packages/view/libexempi3/ ;-D Dec 04 10:11:30 >>No results found for "Exempi is a library to ensure".<< :-/ Dec 04 10:19:38 freemangordon: jonwil: https://git.merproject.org/mer-core/telepathy-ring Dec 04 10:20:35 whats special about that vs the MeeGo implementation? Dec 04 10:21:47 nothing I guess Dec 04 10:21:53 IroN900:~# cat /var/lib/telepathy-ring/memlock Dec 04 10:21:54 32M Dec 04 10:22:12 it just looks like a convenient level for interfacing to new modems Dec 04 10:23:36 https://telepathy.freedesktop.org/doc/telepathy-glib/ Dec 04 10:28:50 https://blogs.gnome.org/wjjt/2010/07/15/sending-smses-with-empathy-and-telepathy-ring/ Dec 04 10:33:46 >>The version used on the N900 talks to a proprietary daemon to drive the cellular hardware<< but we don't have such proprietary hardware and thus don't need any proprietary driver, when we use modems that talk AT Dec 04 10:35:34 DocScrutinizer05: I can't take yet another task, thus I am trying to find who is going to do it for me Dec 04 10:36:06 why would "we" need OBS? Dec 04 10:36:34 bencoh: because it makes no sense to build the packages by hand every tim Dec 04 10:37:22 right but ... don't we already have autobuilder? Dec 04 10:37:38 bencoh: which is based on scratchbox Dec 04 10:38:05 and h-d port has nothing in common with SB Dec 04 10:38:11 hmm Dec 04 10:38:37 what do you mean by "nothing in common"? Dec 04 10:39:06 aren't you guys trying to bringup a hildon environment on a modern debian/debian-like? Dec 04 10:39:09 h-d is build natively in a distro by your choice Dec 04 10:39:14 sure Dec 04 10:39:18 yes, and this is unrealted to SB Dec 04 10:39:28 *unrelated Dec 04 10:39:35 right, but it doesn't conflict with SB either Dec 04 10:39:52 I mean, one could bringup a SB/autobuilder env for modern debians Dec 04 10:40:10 sorry for the noob question, but... are you aware that Suse offers a generic OBS service? Dec 04 10:40:51 it seems to 'just work' Dec 04 10:41:02 and free to everybody Dec 04 10:41:04 I just don't really see the point of "moving" to OBS since the rest of the maemo community/projects are "stuck" on "debian" Dec 04 10:41:24 I could be totally wrong Dec 04 10:41:39 OBS is orthogonal to RPM/DEB Dec 04 10:41:45 aiui Dec 04 10:42:37 I think the same Dec 04 10:43:02 I kinda remember it was supposed to be "open"/distro-agnostic Dec 04 10:43:07 https://build.opensuse.org/ Dec 04 10:43:08 I'm not sure it eventually was Dec 04 10:43:18 DocScrutinizer05: Yes, I am aware, but I really want to see some participation from the "community", be it maemo or devuan Dec 04 10:43:21 as for rpm/deb, sure, you can build .deb packages Dec 04 10:43:47 freemangordon: ooh sure, good point Dec 04 10:44:05 however /me is going to find something for lunch, bbl Dec 04 10:44:26 https://build.opensuse.org/monitor Dec 04 10:48:11 this might still work actually https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Build_Service_Debian_builds Dec 04 10:49:49 bencoh: this is not the point, what we're trying to achieve is not some pet project Dec 04 10:50:24 then what are you trying to do? have hildon included in devuan? Dec 04 10:50:37 hmm I'm not all sure suse OBS actually builds (or can build) for other "distros" too Dec 04 10:50:42 bencoh: yes Dec 04 10:50:55 ooh bencoh beat me to it Dec 04 10:51:07 DocScrutinizer05: see my point now? ;p Dec 04 10:51:39 err nope Dec 04 10:51:47 12:50 < DocScrutinizer05> hmm I'm not all sure suse OBS actually builds (or can build) for other "distros" too Dec 04 10:51:58 [2016-12-04 Sun 11:48:11] this might still work actually https://en.opensuse.org/openSUSE:Build_Service_Debian_builds Dec 04 10:52:16 DocScrutinizer05: this document is quite all, I dunno if it's still supposed to work Dec 04 10:52:22 and if it does what you want Dec 04 10:52:26 s/all/old/ Dec 04 10:52:31 (wtf brain?!) Dec 04 10:53:21 why would OBS disable/discard that feature? Dec 04 10:55:26 anyway, this is academic since fmg has a point in asking devuan for support and a builder home Dec 04 11:02:13 I don't know how hard it is to set up an OBS service, hm Dec 04 11:02:25 parazyd: around? Dec 04 11:05:29 freemangordon: would you like the builds to be for arm and intel? I guess so Dec 04 11:05:45 when fmg wants devuan to host this, then he will want to use what devuan has. No idea if that's OBS or something else Dec 04 11:05:47 p.s. https://www.collabora.com/news-and-blog/blog/2016/10/24/open-build-service-in-debian/ Dec 04 11:05:57 DocScrutinizer05: yes, that is why I poked parazyd Dec 04 11:06:16 I have some (semi) fast arm machines that we can use for building Dec 04 11:06:24 poke how900 ;-) aka hellekin Dec 04 11:08:40 devuan uses jenkins Dec 04 11:08:47 whatever that is Dec 04 11:09:19 https://git.devuan.org/devuan-infrastructure Dec 04 11:09:42 jenkins is a CI system Dec 04 11:10:02 That seems mostly for the server architecture, not necessarily for builds, but we'll see Dec 04 11:11:38 hi! Do you know if it is possible on Maemo to check which GSM encryption is in used? (e.g. to verify that A5/0 or A5/2 is not used) Dec 04 11:12:14 old Nokia phone show some open lock icon on display when A5/0 or A5/2 was chosen Dec 04 11:14:55 NetMon has zilch Dec 04 11:15:24 no idea if that's since BB5-ISI doesn't support it or NetMon simply doesn't show it Dec 04 11:16:01 I use Jenkins on another unrelated project and its great for producing builds in that case (although in that case what we produce are just zip files, not full package files) Dec 04 11:16:28 Pali: ^^^ + http://maemo.org/packages/view/netmon/ Dec 04 11:16:35 I have netmon installed Dec 04 11:16:49 and do not see cipher in it Dec 04 11:17:04 jonwil: do you have idea? Dec 04 11:17:27 I have no idea about encryption on the N900 Dec 04 11:20:25 you collected lot of dbus files around csd/sscd/... so I though you could know something.. Dec 04 11:20:56 nope, I dont know of any things related to encryption Dec 04 11:21:03 no interfaces for it Dec 04 11:21:22 No references to it in any of the ISI headers I have either Dec 04 11:26:24 dbus_object = bus.get_object('com.nokia.phone.net', '/com/nokia/phone/net', introspect=False) Dec 04 11:26:26 self.cellinfo = dbus.Interface(dbus_object, 'Phone.Net') Dec 04 11:26:36 def signal_strength(self): Dec 04 11:26:37 return self.cellinfo.get_signal_strength() Dec 04 11:26:49 def selected_radio_rechnology(self): Dec 04 11:26:50 return self.cellinfo.get_selected_radio_access_technology() Dec 04 11:27:48 you might be lucky to find something in /com/nokia/phone/*/* Dec 04 11:29:33 (^^^ from cellinfo.py in NetMon) Dec 04 11:30:57 note that NetMon is terribly segfaulty (or whatever it does when it dies) Dec 04 11:33:53 I know all the dbus interfaces related to the cellular modem (thanks to dbus introspection etc) although I dont know what they all do Dec 04 11:34:05 and none of them look like they would relate to encryption. Dec 04 11:34:19 encryption has no interface Dec 04 11:34:23 or rather to GSM encryption Dec 04 11:34:26 it's a 2char result Dec 04 11:34:42 or 4char Dec 04 11:34:43 no interface or signals or calls Dec 04 11:35:08 nothing in com.nokia.* for cellmo that might be related to GSM crypto at all Dec 04 11:35:34 might look like get_BCI_data Dec 04 11:35:38 or whatever Dec 04 11:36:05 again, crypto is no part of GSM interface Dec 04 11:36:17 it's a property of the connection Dec 04 11:36:35 I know what GSM crypto is Dec 04 11:37:00 my point is that there is nothing in the dbus stuff related to any of the cellular daemons that in any way could be related to GSM crypto Dec 04 11:37:45 again, "crypto" is not even a terminus used in GSM when querying the connection properties Dec 04 11:38:08 nothing for BCI either Dec 04 11:38:33 well, that's no surprise since that's zhe Base Control Channel iirc Dec 04 11:40:01 I doubt Nokia would have any reason to expose any of that information from the cellular services daemon to userspace. Dec 04 11:40:12 I mean from the cellular radio Dec 04 11:40:12 it might come embedded into whatever name, like *monitor*" or "*status*" or "*connection*" whatever Dec 04 11:40:58 what reason would Nokia have to expose the CellID? yet it's shown in NetMon Dec 04 11:41:50 but yeah, it's very likely that this isn't implemented in the ISI lib Dec 04 11:42:56 Other phones that expose this stuff (e.g. various Android devices) only seem to expose it via various undocumented low-level debugging interfaces that were clearly not intended for public consumption Dec 04 11:43:13 and the N900 has none of that kind of stuff (Nokia isn't stupid enough to leave it in there) Dec 04 11:43:18 hmmm, not exactly Dec 04 11:44:33 https://android.googlesource.com/kernel/msm/+/f632ea92329bc9197daf02ea4baceddceb89a6be/drivers/char/diag/Kconfig#10 Dec 04 11:45:15 DIAG isn't a forgotten stub Dec 04 11:45:48 neither "various undocumented low-level debugging interfaces" Dec 04 11:46:28 maybe I am thinking of another different interface Dec 04 11:46:56 dunno, anyway DIAG is what snoopsnitch uses Dec 04 11:47:01 hmmm ok Dec 04 11:47:30 and yes it's not available for *all* possible modems that android supports Dec 04 11:48:20 Unless I miss-read something, diag isn't documented (at least in terms of what info you get and how you get it). Or so says some post I read related to snoopsnitch Dec 04 11:48:54 possible Dec 04 11:49:03 the SS guys had to reverse engineer it all I believe Dec 04 11:49:17 in any case the N900 has no such interfaces Dec 04 11:49:53 unless there is something in the cellular modem that is not documented anywhere in the isi headers I have Dec 04 11:50:27 you can bet there is a lot Dec 04 11:51:28 BUT... I haven't heard of monitor mode in any other (nokia) BB5 based phones either Dec 04 11:51:47 ~nobbi Dec 04 11:51:50 meh! Dec 04 11:52:24 http://nobbi.com/ Dec 04 11:53:01 ~nobbi is http://nobbi.com/monitor/indexen.html Dec 04 11:53:01 okay, DocScrutinizer05 Dec 04 11:54:27 http://nobbi.com/monitor/nokwen.html *ancient* but... Dec 04 11:57:18 ~nobbi is also http://nobbi.com/download/nmmanual.pdf Dec 04 11:57:18 DocScrutinizer05: okay Dec 04 11:58:55 http://wstaw.org/m/2016/12/04/plasma-desktopMw2244.png Dec 04 12:01:21 Used Information Sources : Dec 04 12:01:22 [ 1 ] Netmonitor description (RD843.txt) from Nokia Mobile Phones Dec 04 12:01:24 [ 2 ] Marcin Wiaceks homepage (http://marcin-wiacek.topnet.pl/) Dec 04 12:01:25 [ 3 ] Researches from Nobbi & various other people Dec 04 12:04:41 http://www.electronics-lab.info/Files/Others/netmonitor.pdf Dec 04 12:08:52 sorry to interrupt a productive discussion .. Dec 04 12:09:00 am i the only one getting this spam? Dec 04 12:09:01 09:07 THIS IRC HAS MOVED TO irc.gangste.rs #tclmafia $t:/D\vM Dec 04 12:09:04 09:08 THIS IRC HAS MOVED TO irc.gangste.rs #tclmafia PU4cK1$o~RLKvb Dec 04 12:09:21 mantion to freenode staff Dec 04 12:09:33 *mention Dec 04 12:09:46 meaning you're not getting it yourself for example? Dec 04 12:09:50 nope Dec 04 12:09:57 thanks Dec 04 12:10:03 probably you are on some channel that sucked your nick Dec 04 12:11:14 #freenode - A botnet is PM spamming freenode users. Consider setting user mode +R, which will block PMs from unidentified users (/mode yournickhere +R, or /umode +R) Dec 04 12:11:27 sicelo: please don't usually repost spam. In #freenode you might even get banned for that Dec 04 12:11:42 sicelo, but that would also bblock legitimate prvs Dec 04 12:12:00 well it seems to be the only solution they recommed for now Dec 04 12:12:16 it is the only solution Dec 04 12:12:40 and no, I've not seen that yet Dec 04 12:12:44 you can also setup your client's /ignore list Dec 04 12:13:02 assuming its from predictable address Dec 04 12:13:36 nope .. multiple addresses, idents, and nicks Dec 04 12:13:41 sure Dec 04 12:13:53 that's why +R is the only solution Dec 04 12:16:04 sicelo: /ignore -regex ? Dec 04 12:16:36 bencoh: my client doesn't seem to support that Dec 04 12:16:59 DocScrutinizer05: no offense, but I've never thought you were using a good client anyway ;) Dec 04 12:17:10 I'm fully aware Dec 04 12:17:17 :) Dec 04 12:17:41 bencoh: it doesn't only send the previous text .. has other random stuff. Dec 04 12:17:54 will keep the +R .. :) Dec 04 12:18:05 maybe revert after a few days Dec 04 12:18:10 :) Dec 04 12:19:49 if you wanna do sth about it, join a DDoS attack to the URL of that other irc network Dec 04 12:21:31 irc-gangsters really now? Dec 04 12:44:43 bencoh: see PM Dec 04 16:17:03 freemangordon: you had some questions re: tiny? Dec 04 16:20:14 Android_808: hi! Dec 04 16:20:26 well, as a start -0 any idea what it does? Dec 04 16:20:39 s-0/-/ Dec 04 16:21:22 what package? Dec 04 16:21:47 not a package, but src/tiny in hildon-desktop Dec 04 16:22:48 TidyActor etc Dec 04 16:23:14 haven't got source hand. do you mean src/tidy? Dec 04 16:23:20 yes Dec 04 16:23:30 yeah, sorry, typo Dec 04 16:24:35 tidy is the Clutter based UI toolkit. In Cordia-based versions it was replaced by libmx Dec 04 16:25:16 hmm, what to use to replace it then? Dec 04 16:25:43 We have a choice. We can either: Dec 04 16:26:03 1) replace tidy with mx as done previously Dec 04 16:27:04 2) take a look at libchamplain and use it to update tidy to clutter 1.x Dec 04 16:27:22 https://github.com/GNOME/libchamplain Dec 04 16:28:02 3) come up with something else. Dec 04 16:28:15 I think there's a 4), which is considered mad Dec 04 16:28:20 use GNOME Shell's toolkit Dec 04 16:28:31 I did look at that :p Dec 04 16:28:40 https://github.com/GNOME/gnome-shell/tree/master/src/st Dec 04 16:29:02 ok, I have no say here, as I have NFC fhat this thing does Dec 04 16:29:08 *what Dec 04 16:29:13 St requires mutter IIRC Dec 04 16:29:58 do we lose something if we choose 1)? Dec 04 16:30:07 It is responsible for drawing the desktop components. The menu, task switcher button and the window bars. Dec 04 16:30:37 Is the menu drawed by Hildon, not the application? Dec 04 16:31:04 tidy_blur_whatever_its_called() isn't implemented in mx. Dec 04 16:31:17 (I know nothing to the Hildon architecture Dec 04 16:31:23 12 mins battery :( Dec 04 16:31:35 what? Dec 04 16:31:43 Laptop dying Dec 04 16:31:48 Android_808: well, I think I have some idea what is going on Dec 04 16:32:24 will look at that champlain thingie Dec 04 16:32:36 thanks Dec 04 16:32:58 The window menus use a special _NET_WM_* atom to tell matchbox what they are. From there it knows how to handle them Dec 04 16:33:35 champlain did go to mx breifly and then switched back to tidy, then created there own version of it. Dec 04 16:34:38 Theres a few classes they've merged together so it isn't 100% the same. Plus they have clutter fixes. Dec 04 16:35:06 And it seems that the status-menu is currently broken? Dec 04 16:36:29 I can't see any reference to tidy though Dec 04 16:36:37 it worked in my cordia based version, but it is lacking applets. Having started to install the hildon init components it messed up dbus so my test applet, profiles, stopped working Dec 04 16:37:27 seems it was removed in 0-10 Dec 04 16:38:14 libchamplain seems to be not a professional toolkit... Dec 04 16:38:21 it's aimed on map drawing Dec 04 16:39:52 battery died. Dec 04 16:40:07 yeah Dec 04 16:40:24 I suggest a Thinkpad X ;-) Dec 04 16:40:31 :) Dec 04 16:41:18 anyway, in champlain repo is a folder called champlain. originally that was a copy of tidy but everything is now renamed as they've essentially forked it Dec 04 16:41:30 yeah Dec 04 16:42:00 one thing though - it seems maemo clutter uses fixed point arithmetics Dec 04 16:42:18 I wonder what will be the performance fit going to float Dec 04 16:42:23 *hit Dec 04 16:43:12 so, I can try to migrate maemo tidy to clutter 1. Dec 04 16:43:13 maybe maemo clutter considered the old OMAP2 devices Dec 04 16:43:18 sure Dec 04 16:43:32 but on our ARMv7+ devices we have VFPv3/4 and NEON Dec 04 16:43:51 n900 has them too Dec 04 16:43:52 something to mention: add INSTALL file to .gitignore Dec 04 16:43:53 having NEON is not exactly the same as using it ;) Dec 04 16:44:07 as it's shipped with automake Dec 04 16:44:13 and will be changed by autoreconf Dec 04 16:44:35 yep, I saw I pushed some INSTALL file yesterday :) Dec 04 16:45:10 if its a real issue, can we feasibly depend on a clutter_maemo package thats fixed. Or you could go full Mutter and include a custom clutter in h-d source Dec 04 16:46:02 maybe... Dec 04 16:46:31 Android_808: lets first try to migrate to clutter 1.0, I don;t see many FxP arithmetics done in tidy Dec 04 16:47:30 and with updating to clutter 1.0 we can share the advances by GNOME Dec 04 16:48:19 just beware that even gnome code still seems to use deprecated clutter apis. finding up to date examples of animation/effects is like looking for a needle in a haystack. Dec 04 16:48:40 or we may make hildon-desktop a drop-in replacement of gnome-shell? Dec 04 16:48:45 I think I actually find Dec 04 16:48:57 and then hildonize generic gtk+-3? Dec 04 16:49:13 but it is still to be tested ofc, once I have everything compiled Dec 04 16:49:54 and how to properly build a mce? Dec 04 16:51:10 pull the source :) Dec 04 16:51:33 from where? Dec 04 16:51:34 what problems do you have with it? Dec 04 16:51:37 aah Dec 04 16:51:49 I tried Android_808's mce Dec 04 16:52:02 and I faulted with missing libngf0 Dec 04 16:52:04 here https://github.com/fremantle-gtk3/mce Dec 04 16:52:06 MoeIcenowy: i do eventually want to try to replace some components to slim down hildon. Dec 04 16:52:31 yeah, thats one's mer based from earlier effort Dec 04 16:52:56 In fact, what I want is to replace these by gnome-settings-daemon Dec 04 16:52:57 MoeIcenowy: but prepare that you'll have to build a pile of dependencies as well Dec 04 16:53:24 and makes hildon really gnome-mobile again Dec 04 16:53:32 oh this guy has more dependencies :-( Dec 04 16:53:48 times more Dec 04 16:54:07 but all of the needed stuff is on https://github.com/fremantle-gtk3 Dec 04 16:54:19 are they all gtk3-ized? Dec 04 16:54:22 yes Dec 04 16:54:40 oh you did so much ;-) Dec 04 16:54:45 well, there might be problems, but in general they should at least compile Dec 04 16:56:03 what at all is mce... Dec 04 16:56:27 while i remember. h-d should depend on upstart-dev (uses dh_ scrip). I haven't worked out last bit of patch for upstart-dev yet to rename installed file from filename to filename.conf. Dec 04 16:56:59 no problem as I'm totally not on debian ;-) Dec 04 16:57:10 Android_808: anyway I am using your upstart-dev, so whatever is fixed will be pulled Dec 04 16:57:31 MoeIcenowy: mission control entity iirc Dec 04 16:57:39 or somesuch Dec 04 16:57:59 freemangordon: ? Dec 04 16:58:14 mce Dec 04 16:58:29 (18,56,01) MoeIcenowy: what at all is mce... Dec 04 16:58:35 ok it's a mysterious Dec 04 16:58:39 mysterious name Dec 04 16:59:02 nbo, this is how nokia used to name their daemons, iiuc Dec 04 16:59:04 anyway, got to drive home. i'll check irc logs later Dec 04 16:59:11 ok, bye Dec 04 16:59:47 mce, dsme... all seems advanced but difficult to understand Dec 04 17:00:00 I can only understand "ngf" is "non-graphical feedback" Dec 04 17:00:34 dsme is Device State Management Entity afaik Dec 04 17:00:50 nokia technology mostly? Dec 04 17:01:07 maybe killing mce is a good choice ;-) Dec 04 17:01:12 no Dec 04 17:02:53 why would you kill it? Dec 04 17:03:11 (at least it's opensource :) Dec 04 17:03:15 because of the weird name :p Dec 04 17:03:20 haha Dec 04 17:08:05 I think most things in MCE do have fd.o replacements... Dec 04 17:51:50 GNOME-Shell has also historically used tidy... Dec 04 18:07:11 The "ClutterFixed" issue seems so easy to solve that it only needs a sed Dec 04 18:09:39 oh not so easy... Dec 04 18:09:55 not easy at all Dec 04 18:10:09 MoeIcenowy: any experience with cogl/clutter? Dec 04 18:10:20 nope Dec 04 18:10:36 only build experiences ;-) Dec 04 18:11:09 anyone? I am trying to replace cogl_blend_func with clutter 1.0 equivalent. I guess it is some blend string, but can;t find an example. Dec 04 18:13:10 maybe cogl_pipeline_set_blend Dec 04 18:15:16 I checkout two GNOME projects which used to use tidy Dec 04 18:15:22 gnome-shell and libchamplain Dec 04 18:15:29 they all didn't have the file before... Dec 04 18:26:46 As the git history of libchamplain said, mx is the successor of tidy Dec 04 18:27:39 Replace the outdated tidy library with its successor - mx. This will help us to use fixes and updates from the mainline. -- git commit dcd152746c36e1be8141cb30231d406b280bae63 Dec 04 19:55:07 Wizzup: hey. sorry i tend to be offline mostly on weekends Dec 04 19:55:15 Wizzup: what is it you needed? Dec 04 19:59:16 parazyd: yo! Dec 04 19:59:56 parazyd: we were wondering if you can provide some info on how you build packages for devuan, and if we could either use your (Devuan) buils system/help, or if you could tell us how to set up our own Dec 04 20:00:15 yeah, they are built on the gitlab afaik Dec 04 20:00:22 by what service, and how, automatically? Dec 04 20:00:27 (got a page on it) Dec 04 20:00:30 We saw some jenkins service Dec 04 20:00:39 yes jenkins builds all of it Dec 04 20:00:50 you'd be best to ping nextime at #devuan to find out more Dec 04 20:01:17 jenkins is at https://ci.devuan.org fwiw Dec 04 20:24:43 parazyd: I see Dec 04 20:24:59