**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Dec 10 03:00:00 2016
Dec 10 10:15:35 <Vajb> oh there seems to be new omp version in devel. I wonder will i be stable? Also i wonder will "not played" list remain intact if i upgrade to new version.
Dec 10 10:15:53 <Vajb> will it* who is eating my letters?
Dec 10 10:15:54 <Wizzup_> omp is stable for me
Dec 10 10:45:33 * DocScrutinizer05 eats letters for breakfast :-)
Dec 10 10:48:51 <gry> DocScrutinizer51, hi
Dec 10 10:49:01 <DocScrutinizer05> hi
Dec 10 10:49:24 <gry> DocScrutinizer51, I didn't quite follow our previous conversation about osso-xterm, there are two things to it. one, it's supposed to be in the repos, and if it isn't, it means there is a long list of things missing
Dec 10 10:49:56 <DocScrutinizer05> hmm
Dec 10 10:50:02 <DocScrutinizer05> ~pkg
Dec 10 10:50:03 <infobot> i heard pkg is http://maemo.org/packages/
Dec 10 10:50:07 <gry> two, I would like to use it because I don't know how else to develop a new hildon app, if not in terminal. not familiar with the process. I want to have a code, a compiler, and an ability to run an app in one place somewhere
Dec 10 10:50:22 <DocScrutinizer05> http://maemo.org/packages/view/osso-xterm/
Dec 10 10:51:02 <gry> I can probably download .deb from that page, but I would ideally like the package manager to know of the package by itself
Dec 10 10:51:10 <DocScrutinizer05> two: you want to use sb for that
Dec 10 10:51:37 <gry> sb = scratchbox?
Dec 10 10:51:42 <DocScrutinizer05> yep
Dec 10 10:52:27 <gry> if I make it in scratchbox, will I then be able to install it in the maemo itself and see what it looks like?
Dec 10 10:52:37 <DocScrutinizer05> sure
Dec 10 10:52:48 <KotCzarny> that's the point of sb
Dec 10 10:52:48 <KotCzarny> :)
Dec 10 10:52:59 <KotCzarny> to build software for n900
Dec 10 10:53:05 <KotCzarny> (or any configured target)
Dec 10 10:53:13 <gry> ok
Dec 10 10:53:20 <KotCzarny> it also has a scripts to run that software on device
Dec 10 10:53:32 <gry> is there a hello world scratchbox tutorial for dummies? :)
Dec 10 10:53:33 <KotCzarny> so you dont have to copy yourself
Dec 10 10:53:36 <KotCzarny> ~sb
Dec 10 10:53:37 <infobot> it has been said that scratchbox is a cross-compiling system that uses binfmt_misc, rpc calls, and an nfs mount to make a cross-build appear to be 100% native, and is found at http://www.scratchbox.org/, hosted by maemo now. Also at http://maemo.merlin1991.at/files/SB
Dec 10 10:53:42 <KotCzarny> hrm
Dec 10 10:53:44 <Oksanaa> 1) is scratchbox already packaged in whatever virtual image Gry found and uses; 2) will sb-packaged app be installable on virtual machine (to avoid hassle of emailing it to real device)?
Dec 10 10:53:49 <KotCzarny> ~devel
Dec 10 10:54:30 <KotCzarny> ~scratchbox
Dec 10 10:54:30 <infobot> it has been said that scratchbox is a cross-compiling system that uses binfmt_misc, rpc calls, and an nfs mount to make a cross-build appear to be 100% native, and is found at http://www.scratchbox.org/, hosted by maemo now. Also at http://maemo.merlin1991.at/files/SB
Dec 10 10:54:42 <Oksanaa> ~dev
Dec 10 10:54:43 <DocScrutinizer05> Oksanaa: sb bouilds for two targets: x86 for virtual device aka emu, and armel for N900
Dec 10 10:55:30 <gry> Oksanaa, a 'sbhome' launcher on the desktop of the vm looks promising
Dec 10 10:55:36 <DocScrutinizer05> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation
Dec 10 10:56:17 <gry> not that I know how to use it, but maybe sb is available in that 'thing'
Dec 10 10:56:30 <Oksanaa> Nice :-)  Especially if sb builds deb files for both targets at the same time... Should be easy to specify, either way
Dec 10 10:56:54 <KotCzarny> btw. https://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_SDK
Dec 10 10:57:00 <KotCzarny> nice step by step
Dec 10 10:57:20 <DocScrutinizer05> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide
Dec 10 11:00:06 <gry> thank you both :-)
Dec 10 11:00:39 <KotCzarny> there was an instruction how to run package on the device automatically, cant find it
Dec 10 11:01:03 <DocScrutinizer05> http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_SDK#Hardware_architectures
Dec 10 11:01:27 <gry> oh architectures should go to hell hopefully, I'm running this in a vm and not on device yet
Dec 10 11:01:44 <DocScrutinizer05> please READ that!
Dec 10 11:01:49 <KotCzarny> you can still run armel binaries in sb
Dec 10 11:01:51 <gry> but I've put a note of all these URLs in a file, so I'll at least attempt to have a go at them
Dec 10 11:01:55 <KotCzarny> but it might be slow
Dec 10 11:02:09 <gry> oh you mean please read about architectures, or about everything else...?
Dec 10 11:02:14 <KotCzarny> x86 target was invented to develop quickly
Dec 10 11:02:27 <DocScrutinizer05> >>The Maemo SDK supports two architectures, X86 and ARMEL, and provides development environment for both. In Fremantle, the X86 environment is used for active development and has better tool support through native execution without the need for emulation. The ARMEL target is used only for cross-compilation of applications to work on the actual device. <<
Dec 10 11:02:35 <KotCzarny> s/develop/develop and test/
Dec 10 11:02:35 <infobot> KotCzarny meant: x86 target was invented to develop and test quickly
Dec 10 11:03:05 <gry> ahh
Dec 10 11:03:08 <DocScrutinizer05> >>The emulation however is not complete, so the actual testing must be performed on the device.<<
Dec 10 11:03:18 <KotCzarny> if you run armel binaries in sb they will run through qemu
Dec 10 11:03:25 <gry> so if I have a choice I should start to play with x86 at first
Dec 10 11:03:36 <DocScrutinizer05> yes
Dec 10 11:03:43 <KotCzarny> theoretically both targets are equal during devel
Dec 10 11:04:17 <Oksanaa> Yes, and once you get x86 working well, feel free to feed deb-src to auto-builder
Dec 10 11:04:22 <gry> O
Dec 10 11:04:25 <KotCzarny> but 1/ x86 is faster to test, 2/ there might be bugs in app related to diff. arch, so final testing on device is required
Dec 10 11:05:23 <DocScrutinizer05> Oksanaa: ack, though you should first switch sb target to ARMEL and build for and test on N900
Dec 10 11:05:32 <gry> that helloworld thing linked above looks like a heaven piece of art, I'll start from there
Dec 10 11:05:39 <KotCzarny> :)
Dec 10 11:05:45 <Oksanaa> /me cheers
Dec 10 11:05:47 <KotCzarny> yay for hello worlds!
Dec 10 11:06:19 <DocScrutinizer05> again, please read the http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Development_Environment/Maemo_SDK#Hardware_architectures ff
Dec 10 11:06:23 <gry> that's when keeping notes on a wiki, and using pretty faces next to links on that, helps, right Oksanaa? :)
Dec 10 11:06:57 <KotCzarny> and yeah, you might even keep notes on wiki's user page
Dec 10 11:07:11 <KotCzarny> which might help other users
Dec 10 11:07:34 <KotCzarny> for example: http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Wikiwide
Dec 10 11:07:51 <Oksanaa> /me notes that gry runs her own ikiwiki, but yes, information should be kept well-linked and easy to find
Dec 10 11:07:52 <KotCzarny> now go add something to http://wiki.maemo.org/User:Gry
Dec 10 11:08:06 <gry> I'm keeping on a personal wiki off-side so far, which includes an ambitious wishlist and some URLs to existing maemo wiki pages, but I'll copy it over to the maemo wiki userpage once it's got anything meaningful
Dec 10 11:08:25 <KotCzarny> it doesnt have to be meaningful, its your scratch pad
Dec 10 11:08:34 <KotCzarny> which helps other maemo users
Dec 10 11:08:39 <gry> yeah
Dec 10 11:09:12 <gry> sleep time for now, I'll copy it over any time I'm awake enough without other tasks taking priority
Dec 10 11:09:13 <Oksanaa> /me links https://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide/Using_Data_Sharing/Sharing_Plug-in#Writing_Sharing_Plug-in_for_.22Send_via_Service.22
Dec 10 11:09:48 <gry> for what is this again? for a plugin to share things on a wiki? :)
Dec 10 11:10:41 <Oksanaa> Yes, I would like to be able to post photo's on ikiwiki's blog _without_ having to jump through the hoops of web-browser and markdown
Dec 10 11:10:49 <Oksanaa> Photos*
Dec 10 11:11:09 <gry> does the thing already have other sharing plugins for, say, mediawiki or mediagoblin?
Dec 10 11:11:09 <DocScrutinizer05> ooh and just in case: NEVER EVER do a "rm -rf /scratchbox"! at least not before you shut down all the bindmounts
Dec 10 11:11:33 <gry> sure, but I can do that in a vm I think . the worst it would do is damage the guest OS :)
Dec 10 11:11:42 <gry> which I would also of course try to avoid
Dec 10 11:11:53 <Oksanaa> Rm -rf is usually a bad idea, yes.
Dec 10 11:12:40 <KotCzarny> oksanaa: have you seen? http://www.wtfcomics.com/archive.html?485_1
Dec 10 11:12:46 <Oksanaa> Gry: mediagoblin? Mediawiki? Can bet: no, no sharing plugins for either, yet.
Dec 10 11:12:51 <KotCzarny> beware if you have work to do ;)
Dec 10 11:13:27 <gry> Oksanaa, what 'sane' sharing plugins do we have?
Dec 10 11:13:46 <gry> like, not twitter-bird, not facedesk, etc
Dec 10 11:16:02 <Oksanaa> Gry: ftp is the sanest. Actually, neat, if it truly works. Cannot recall last time I used an ftp, though...
Dec 10 11:16:24 <DocScrutinizer05> hm?
Dec 10 11:16:47 <DocScrutinizer05> I'm using sftp to my own shareservice
Dec 10 11:17:13 <KotCzarny> scp?
Dec 10 11:17:14 <KotCzarny> sshfs?
Dec 10 11:17:16 <KotCzarny> rsync?
Dec 10 11:17:20 <Oksanaa> Does sharing-service-ftp work with sftp?
Dec 10 11:17:26 <DocScrutinizer05> http://maemo.cloud-7.de/share-service/
Dec 10 11:17:37 <DocScrutinizer05> it's ... lemme check...
Dec 10 11:18:04 <Oksanaa> /me uses winscp routinely, for sftp I think if I recall correctly
Dec 10 11:19:29 <DocScrutinizer05> http://maemo.org/packages/view/sharing-cli/
Dec 10 11:21:21 <DocScrutinizer05> great lil thing
Dec 10 11:23:48 <Oksanaa> Great :-)  but: command-line, not "Click and Go"
Dec 10 11:24:15 <DocScrutinizer05> no
Dec 10 11:24:16 <KotCzarny> well, you have an idea for a great maemo app
Dec 10 11:24:17 <KotCzarny> right?
Dec 10 11:24:18 <KotCzarny> ;)
Dec 10 11:24:19 <Oksanaa> Ooh, sorry...
Dec 10 11:24:37 <DocScrutinizer05> it *executes* a cmdline
Dec 10 11:24:42 <DocScrutinizer05> on click
Dec 10 11:25:18 <DocScrutinizer05> you configure the cmdline in GUI
Dec 10 11:25:33 <DocScrutinizer05> then it gets executed when you share anything
Dec 10 11:25:37 <Oksanaa> Okay, then should just see which command lines can send file to ikiwiki
Dec 10 11:25:46 <DocScrutinizer05> %s is the file handle iirc
Dec 10 11:30:34 <DocScrutinizer05> settings -> share-accounts  -> share-cli
Dec 10 12:00:17 <Vajb> Wizzup: which version u have?  apt-cache policy openmediaplayer  
Dec 10 12:00:17 <Vajb> openmediaplayer:
Dec 10 12:00:17 <Vajb>   Installed: 20150829-1
Dec 10 12:00:17 <Vajb>   Candidate: 20161108-1
Dec 10 12:00:59 <KotCzarny> 2015 seems old
Dec 10 12:00:59 <Vajb> yup but it works
Dec 10 12:01:00 <Vajb> and besides i noticed update only yesterday
Dec 10 12:01:27 <Vajb> i believe the idea "don't fixit if it aint broken"
Dec 10 12:01:32 <Vajb> :)
Dec 10 12:02:02 <Wizzup> does that apply to security bugs as well?
Dec 10 12:02:03 <KotCzarny> well, you say it's unstable
Dec 10 12:06:31 <Vajb> no i didn't or at least i wanted to ask if new version is stable
Dec 10 12:06:31 <KotCzarny> ah, ok
Dec 10 12:06:31 <Vajb> Wizzup: well if something has a hole it's broken
Dec 10 12:07:33 <KotCzarny> uh oh
Dec 10 12:07:36 <KotCzarny> not entirely true
Dec 10 12:08:02 <KotCzarny> actually having holes in toliet paper makes it tear at the right spot
Dec 10 12:08:21 <KotCzarny> not to mention hole in the a**
Dec 10 12:08:25 <Vajb> yes, but it is designed hole
Dec 10 12:08:41 <Vajb> maybe i should have included word security
Dec 10 12:08:44 <KotCzarny> :)
Dec 10 12:09:04 <Vajb> but if u think of it. Emergency exit is kindof security hole
Dec 10 12:09:43 <Vajb> but that doesn't answer my question about newest omp being stable or not ;)
Dec 10 12:10:19 <Vajb> nor it answers my question if my "not yet played" list will remain intact in upgrade process
Dec 10 12:11:07 <KotCzarny> maybe i should add system wide queuing to oscp
Dec 10 12:11:26 <KotCzarny> though i dont use it in this way, and no one requested such feature
Dec 10 12:12:38 <KotCzarny> freemangordon, pali: would it be possible to backport zram to 2.6.28 ?
Dec 10 12:13:01 <Vajb> what ever happened to k.i.s.s method with oscp ;)
Dec 10 12:13:16 <Pali> KotCzarny: no idea... I'm not going to do it as 2.6.28 is really old
Dec 10 12:13:40 <Wizzup> yeah, please focus efforts on being able to use new sw
Dec 10 12:13:56 <Wizzup> not work on bringing cool new stuff to old/unmaintained stuff
Dec 10 12:14:43 <KotCzarny> mainline on n900 is still months away, while zram could benefit all users quick
Dec 10 12:15:09 <Wizzup> haha
Dec 10 12:15:56 <Wizzup> well, I guess nobody is stopping you
Dec 10 12:21:50 <KotCzarny> http://bigbob.fun.free.fr/for-freemangordon/adding-ramzswap-driver.diff
Dec 10 12:21:52 <KotCzarny> rriiiiight.
Dec 10 12:22:37 <KotCzarny> google is nice sometimes
Dec 10 22:59:48 <pkill9> I'm using the repos from wiki.maemo.org/repositories but apt-get says the keys have expired
Dec 10 23:00:07 <pkill9> anyone know how to update the gpg-keys?
Dec 10 23:07:54 <Pali> which one?
Dec 10 23:08:02 <Pali> pkill9: ^
Dec 10 23:23:48 <pkill9> Pali: sorry not sure, i ended up upgrading anyway, but i have another issue with maemoagent
Dec 10 23:24:51 <pkill9> Pali: it was the maemo.muarf.org repositories
Dec 10 23:25:13 <Pali> pkill9: that is not official maemo repository
Dec 10 23:25:23 <Pali> so problems about it report to owner
Dec 10 23:25:30 <pkill9> which ones are official?
Dec 10 23:25:36 <Pali> maemo.org
Dec 10 23:25:39 <Pali> domain
Dec 10 23:26:09 <pkill9> do you have a list of official repositories i can put in sources.list?
Dec 10 23:26:35 <Pali> you should use Hildon Application Manager for setting repositories
Dec 10 23:26:56 <Pali> there is only Maemo Extras, Maemo Extras-testing (and -devel)
Dec 10 23:27:08 <Pali> all other are not official part of maemo.org...
Dec 10 23:27:29 <Pali> and there is CSSU... but that is not "Extras" repository
Dec 10 23:27:33 <pkill9> I used the ones listed here: https://wiki.maemo.org/Repository#fremantle_repos_.28copy.26paste_sources.list.29
Dec 10 23:28:06 <pkill9> i thought they were official as it is part of wiki.maemo.org
Dec 10 23:29:03 <Pali> if you see problem with expired key for downloads.maemo.nokia.com clone, then it is nokia's problem
Dec 10 23:29:13 <Pali> their gpg key expired
Dec 10 23:29:23 <pkill9> ok
Dec 10 23:34:07 <pkill9> Pali: do you know what maemoagent is used for?
Dec 10 23:34:25 <Pali> maemoagent? never heard about it
Dec 10 23:34:44 <Pali> and google too
Dec 10 23:55:09 <pkill9> Pali: this is the error i get when trying to upgrade maemoagent: https://gist.github.com/sfgasdfsafggfgg/771d0e72004b40762a6a37fc2d05d8f5
Dec 10 23:55:19 <pkill9> any idea what the problem could be?
Dec 10 23:55:49 <Pali> broken package
Dec 10 23:56:04 <pkill9> ah
Dec 10 23:56:14 <pkill9> how do i force it to redownload?
Dec 10 23:56:37 <Pali> it is unknown for maemo.org too! http://maemo.org/packages/view/maemoagent/
Dec 10 23:57:03 <Pali> apt-get install --reinstall package_name
Dec 10 23:57:08 <pkill9> hmm
Dec 10 23:57:09 <Pali> this will reinstall package
Dec 11 00:31:39 <DocScrutinizer05> pkill9: ignore "key expired" it's only a "W:"arning
Dec 11 00:32:24 <DocScrutinizer05> pkill9: also see:
Dec 11 00:32:28 <DocScrutinizer05> ~jrrepos
Dec 11 00:32:28 <infobot> methinks jrrepos is http://maemo.cloud-7.de/maemo5/et_al/HAM-catalogs/
Dec 11 00:39:15 <DocScrutinizer05> and indeed nobody seems to ever have heard of maemo-agent before
Dec 11 00:40:38 <DocScrutinizer05> muarf is considered a snae and clean mirror of the orphaned/dead nokia base repos
Dec 11 00:40:46 <DocScrutinizer05> sane*
Dec 11 00:44:13 <DocScrutinizer05> actually I'd think CSSU should deploy those muarf et al nokia replacements
Dec 11 00:44:59 <DocScrutinizer05> and disable the dead nokia repos
Dec 11 00:52:28 <L29Ah> facilitate it plz
Dec 11 02:14:23 <merlin1991> DocScrutinizer05: we disable dead repos
Dec 11 02:14:34 <merlin1991> and don't depend on anything in said dead repos
Dec 11 02:15:02 <merlin1991> at least when I added the disable stuff to cssu I could install cssu straight from a freshly flashed pr1.3 emmc image
Dec 11 02:27:33 <Mike1235235>  !help    I had 'SMScon' (n900) working well & had tied it to an object, which apparently made the screen stay on (screen should have timed out. Pressure on the screen (bottom horizontal)?). The phone would respond to all my commands. To turn the screen off, I got the n900 to call me (where I expected the screen to turn off after hanging up). Now it wont respond to any commands I have tried (Power, Call, Location, Lock, Restart, Re
Dec 11 02:27:41 <Mike1235235> The n900 is still on with plenty of battery & can recieve calls. Any way I can get 'SMScon' to respond remotely?
Dec 11 02:33:29 <DocScrutinizer05> merlin1991: sounds good
Dec 11 02:35:11 <DocScrutinizer05> Mike1235235: I admit you completely lost me
Dec 11 02:38:23 <Mike1235235> For some reason the screen was still on after an hour. Would pressure on the screen, keep it on?   ......   Tunring off the screen remotely, may have worked after a call was connected & disconnected.   .........   Now no respnse when trying SMScon commands.
Dec 11 02:40:02 <Mike1235235> http://wiki.maemo.org/SMSCON
Dec 11 02:41:08 <Mike1235235> * no response when sending SMS commands. The n900 is out of reach.
Dec 11 02:42:34 <DocScrutinizer05> *I* would use WLAN-ssh terminal to check
Dec 11 02:42:58 <DocScrutinizer05> SMScon is a last resort
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Dec 11 03:00:00 2016