**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jan 25 02:59:58 2019
Jan 25 07:22:03 <brolin_empey> War of mind?
Jan 25 07:23:09 <brolin_empey> Reportely the LCD used by the N900 is from Sony, I do not remember the model name.
Jan 25 08:23:51 <brolin_empey> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-xhbX3bJSpcg/XErHD9VpOHI/AAAAAAAABK0/6AiSb198GD4RumbIMm17FLVqoI2FMg2BACL0BGAYYCw/h139/2019-01-25.png
Jan 25 20:41:14 <Wikiwide> While new LCD for Nokia N900 is possible to purchase, just costly... Digitizer isn't being made any more, going by replies of aliexpress sellers.
Jan 25 20:42:27 <Wikiwide> I managed to get four of them (the last of stock) for about 16EUR from a random .uk website. Will see when they arrive.
Jan 25 20:42:53 <Wikiwide> In short, screen protectors are essential. 
Jan 25 23:02:54 <Enrico_Menotti> Hello, today I gathered logs of the bluetooth connection between my N900 and my BMW. Nothing relevant from hcidump, but I found the following in /var/log/syslog:
Jan 25 23:02:54 <Enrico_Menotti> https://pastebin.com/v3fDiFen
Jan 25 23:05:33 <sicelo> i wonder if you could try pairing your linux laptop with the bmw
Jan 25 23:05:51 <Enrico_Menotti> May it be that the 4 lines saying "Badly format(t)ed (sic, typo?) or unrecognized command" are responsible for the BMW system to hang? I think it should not hang just for this, but you know...
Jan 25 23:07:41 <Enrico_Menotti> sicelo No linux laptop here... I have my Mac. I was using Devuan (and Debian) on an old laptop, but recently this old guy destroyed a USB stick (ruined the file allocation table), so it's going to rest in peace in the future.
Jan 25 23:07:42 <sicelo> i doubt. the way i see it, it's your car that's sending those things to the n900, and the n900 doesn't like them. so at worst, it is the n900 that should reboot
Jan 25 23:07:45 <sicelo> my guess
Jan 25 23:08:28 <Enrico_Menotti> I have an intention to buy a tower computer for playing with Linux, but in the last month I've being doing other things.
Jan 25 23:09:23 <Enrico_Menotti> Yes, it's the car sending, but I was wondering whether it could be that the car sits waiting for an answer that never comes.
Jan 25 23:10:46 <Enrico_Menotti> I investigated a bit about those AT commands, and found that they are (if I'm right) GSM-related. The second (AT+CPBS), in particular, is related to exchange of the phone book.
Jan 25 23:11:00 <sicelo> why reboot then .. rather disconnect the 'incompatible' device :)
Jan 25 23:11:21 <Enrico_Menotti> I found the following wiki page in this respect:
Jan 25 23:11:22 <Enrico_Menotti> https://wiki.maemo.org/Bluetooth_PBAP
Jan 25 23:11:31 <sicelo> yes, you're correct about the AT commands, and N900 does not support CPBS out of the box via BT
Jan 25 23:13:09 <Enrico_Menotti> I agree, should not reboot. Also, from the setting screen (on the car's display) I believe that the car understands that the N900 exposes only phone services, not data transfer. If this is true, why the car asks for the phone book anyway, at the end of the call?
Jan 25 23:14:29 <sicelo> 08:04 < sicelo> i was going to add, but i see it's hinted in the last comment of that bug, that while N900 definitely has issues, it doesn't  mean the BMW software is 'innocent' either << this
Jan 25 23:14:49 <sicelo> 09:31 < freemangordon> no, it is BMW (or rather the company that made multimedia part) to blame  <<
Jan 25 23:14:51 <Enrico_Menotti> And while I agree that the BMW software seems to be quite fragile, there's no option for me to correct any bug on the car (at least for now): no update on the BMW site for my car.
Jan 25 23:15:00 <sicelo> trust me on that one, BT in BMW multimedia is buggy
Jan 25 23:15:08 <sicelo> >> 
Jan 25 23:16:03 <Enrico_Menotti> Yes, I agree, but since my gf's smartphone works, I'd like to understand what's the big difference between the Wiko Jerry and the N900, that induces the BMW multimedia reboot.
Jan 25 23:16:05 <sicelo> have you tried the phonebook tweaks?
Jan 25 23:16:24 <Enrico_Menotti> You mean the packages on https://wiki.maemo.org/Bluetooth_PBAP?
Jan 25 23:16:30 <sicelo> yes
Jan 25 23:17:17 <Enrico_Menotti> Not yet, I decided to write here first to see whether anybody may shred some light on the problem.
Jan 25 23:17:57 <Enrico_Menotti> In particular, on that wiki page there's a sentence that is not clear to me.
Jan 25 23:18:16 <Enrico_Menotti> There is a TODO to write support for AT commands but don't hold your breath.
Jan 25 23:18:27 <Enrico_Menotti> (See the Disclaimer, italics.)
Jan 25 23:18:42 <sicelo> :)
Jan 25 23:19:39 <Enrico_Menotti> I mean, does this mean that the packages reported in the wiki page don't do anything good for AT commands?
Jan 25 23:20:00 <Enrico_Menotti> So I should not expect to remove the errors found in the logs just with those packages?
Jan 25 23:20:06 <sicelo> yes
Jan 25 23:21:23 <Enrico_Menotti> And so I was right, probably those tweaks won't solve anything.
Jan 25 23:21:32 <sicelo> i was about to write that -  when i think about your problme, i don't see that diagnosing from N900 side will help much, since it has no way to know wha the BMW is doing. If you had a way to debug from BMW side
Jan 25 23:21:47 <sicelo> my 2 cents
Jan 25 23:22:26 <Enrico_Menotti> That's a big problem.
Jan 25 23:23:08 <Enrico_Menotti> At the moment I can't do more than listening to what the BMW has to say. No way to get inside its brain to know also what it thinks.
Jan 25 23:24:00 <Enrico_Menotti> Or better, I know how to start getting inside, but it promises to be a very long journey, and I don't want to run the risk to brick my car...
Jan 25 23:25:08 <Enrico_Menotti> I've been reading a lot about the BMW electronics a few months ago.
Jan 25 23:26:31 <Enrico_Menotti> My car is exposing a Ethernet connection, which is accessible from the OBD2 socket below the steering wheel, on the left.
Jan 25 23:28:27 <Enrico_Menotti> I also bought the cable for bringing out the connection to a standard Ethernet plug (RJ45, right?); inside the OBD2 plug there's also a resistor shorting two pins, which is needed for activating the Ethernet connection.
Jan 25 23:29:28 <Enrico_Menotti> But never used the cable yet. The standard way to proceed would be to use the original BMW coding program (which I also found over the net), which runs on Windows.
Jan 25 23:29:56 <sicelo> CAN bus, i think?
Jan 25 23:30:07 <Enrico_Menotti> But this does not provide any console access to the system, in order to be able to debug.
Jan 25 23:30:46 <Enrico_Menotti> Don't know right now. I remember it's not a standard bus in mobile electronics.
Jan 25 23:31:11 <sicelo> i have no idea about those kinds of things myself - my car is not fancy at ll
Jan 25 23:35:31 <Enrico_Menotti> Ok, I found the document about the general vehicle electronics. Internal buses are CAN, various versions. There's also a D-CAN exposed at the OBD interface, but if I recall right this is only used for vehicle diagnostics. The only way to get really inside is to go through the Ethernet connection.
Jan 25 23:38:19 <sicelo> i feel your pain :(
Jan 25 23:42:50 <Enrico_Menotti> I also found some slides from some workshop by BMW. The protocol used for the communication is SOME/IP-SD.
Jan 25 23:43:29 <Enrico_Menotti> I stopped here, maybe in the future I'll investigate more about my car.
Jan 25 23:44:47 <Enrico_Menotti> For now I was just hoping to understand what the N900 is not doing properly, compared to my gf's smartphone, and try to correct the N900 behavior to avoid triggering the BMW multimedia hang and reboot (which seems to me clearly a bug.)
Jan 25 23:45:06 <Enrico_Menotti> In other words, leaving the bug there but getting around it.
Jan 25 23:48:39 <Enrico_Menotti> By reading around, I see the nickname of the guy who wrote the wiki page: luf. From the wiki, I tried #maemo-ssu, but he's not there. Do you know who he is? On the thread about the subject, he speaks about a git repository, but I haven't been able to find it.
Jan 25 23:50:12 <sicelo> please report bac on your eventual findings. no, i never got to know him either
Jan 25 23:50:19 <sicelo> *back
Jan 25 23:50:58 <sicelo> how about looking in the pacake's details? there'll usually be at least an email address ...
Jan 25 23:51:04 <Enrico_Menotti> Another guy I found in relation to bluetooth on the N900 (but it seems he worked on mainstreaming the driver, not on Maemo, while I'm not sure of this) is Pavel Machek. I found his website and there's an email address, does it make sense to contact him?
Jan 25 23:51:07 <sicelo> *package
Jan 25 23:51:31 <Enrico_Menotti> Oh yes, good idea.
Jan 25 23:51:58 <sicelo> i doubt Pavel will help you with that
Jan 26 00:00:43 <Enrico_Menotti> In the obexd-0.46 package source there is a text file with a list of authors, but I don't understand whether they are related to N900. Also no idea about whoever could be luf.
Jan 26 00:04:45 <Enrico_Menotti> In conclusion, I have this nice (although old) N900, and I'd like to use it for something useful, besides playing and learning Linux embedded (which indeed is very useful, I have to say). But: the modem only works on the old Maemo platform, so Maemo is the only way to use my phone as a phone (!). However, bluetooth doesn't work on Maemo. Other useful things only run on Android (or iOS). What a pity, nice object, but I
Jan 26 00:04:45 <Enrico_Menotti>  don't find a way to use it in my daily life yet!
Jan 26 00:06:29 <Enrico_Menotti> I'll go to bed with bitter sadness. :(. No, I'm joking, let the night pass by and I'll see tomorrow what comes out from my mind.
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Jan 26 02:59:57 2019