**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Oct 20 02:59:56 2010 Oct 20 04:02:07 hi all, which file should be changed if I want to change the resolution on the meego-handset system, I ever find the /etc/meegotouch/devices.conf could do it, but now it has been removed. Oct 20 05:09:17 hey ja Oct 20 05:09:22 err Oct 20 06:18:23 hi, any mic specialists here this morning? Oct 20 06:32:08 nicolai_: what do you need to know? Oct 20 06:32:21 not sure about my specialist status, though. "I've used it" Oct 20 06:34:13 Mirv: I am struggling forth and back with trying to create images with mic, yet it seems that my installation of the tool is some sort of faulty or so Oct 20 06:34:34 I get "no such file or directory" at different places Oct 20 06:35:07 fabo helped me along yesterday about this over at #meego-sdk yet I am still not there Oct 20 06:36:43 In the meantime I have come across the statement in the wiki that mic has a hard requirement for SSSE3 support (which I had overlooked so far), which I currently don't fullfill Oct 20 06:37:02 nicolai_: for what it's worth, I seem to be using 0.19, on Ubuntu 10.04 LTS, and at least creating loop images works Oct 20 06:37:57 run_mode=1, use_comps=1 Oct 20 06:38:20 I will try to get myself a core2duo ASAP, yet I was wondering whether I should try to investigate my "no such file or directory"-issues further until I get there or not (as I cannot imagine that this issue is related to that requirement) Oct 20 06:38:36 did you have some pastebin logs? Oct 20 06:39:08 mic is a bit bad in its error description.... I've had my share of troubles with it Oct 20 06:41:24 I started off with "no such file or directory /var/chache/meego-bootstrap/usr/lib/python2.6/site-packages/mic" when I was using mic verson is 0.21.1 on ubuntu 10.04 Oct 20 06:42:25 After I had installed 0.22.0 as suggested by fabo, this became "No such file or directory : '/usr/local/bin/mic' " Oct 20 06:43:34 I worked around this by symlinking /usr/local/bin/mic to /usr/bin/mic (which seemed to work in some way, though I am not quite sure whether this is really somthing I should do) Oct 20 06:44:34 But now I end up with "No such file or directory" without saying anything about which path is missing Oct 20 06:45:58 when I look up the Traceback a bit, I see that the exception is thrown in the method "run_in_bootstrap", so I assume that the bootstrap has not been created correctly Oct 20 06:47:35 DO you happen to know whether this has to be done manually before starting mic-image-creator? I had assumed that this would be done more or less automatically as part of the process and one only has to do this by hand if one has special requirements about this Oct 20 06:50:34 well, one thing is certain, mic is often broken :) Oct 20 06:50:44 did you install the mic from http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/tools/repos/ubuntu/10.04/all/ ? Oct 20 06:51:24 I did have those bootstrap problems as well, but I'm not certain how I fixed it... now that it works for me, I'm not touching anything if I don't have to... Oct 20 06:51:58 complaint about /usr/local/bin/mic sounds like a leftover from eg. manual installation of mic Oct 20 06:52:21 Mirv: the initial version I had (0.21.1), yes.. 0.22.0 came from debian sid Oct 20 06:53:28 sorry, have to prepare for a telco now. but at least you're most certainly not alone with mic problems. I've learned not to touch or upgrade it if not absolutely necessary Oct 20 06:54:27 thanks for having had the chance to discuss this... it is good to know that someone else had similar problems and that there are ways to overcome them Oct 20 06:54:44 this makes me more confident that I will find a way around it. Oct 20 06:55:27 Will try to get myself a new machine now anyway and then I can start from a clean platform again.. maybe that helps Oct 20 06:56:41 one more thing: do not only test creating eg. livecd images, experiment with also loop option - some problems only occur when building certain kind of images Oct 20 06:57:20 Cool, thanks for the hint, I will have a look at this... Oct 20 07:29:43 *yawn* Oct 20 07:29:44 moin Oct 20 07:37:05 guten morgen Oct 20 07:43:40 moin Oct 20 07:46:34 Hi, I am trying to run OBS and it says source update is running in the build status. Oct 20 07:46:47 How I cancel the build? Oct 20 07:48:33 Morning, all Oct 20 08:05:07 morning \o Oct 20 08:06:08 lcuk2: pingmorningo/ Oct 20 08:06:30 morn lbt Oct 20 08:07:02 Priyankaa: osc abortbuild --help Oct 20 08:07:05 morning Stskeeps Oct 20 08:07:11 how's stuff? Oct 20 08:07:12 Priyankaa: also.... osc --help Oct 20 08:07:22 Stskeeps: really good Oct 20 08:08:12 Stskeeps: internal OBS automation is looking very good... I want a fully automated end-2-end QA'ed build this sprint Oct 20 08:08:19 cool :) Oct 20 08:08:26 yes... Oct 20 08:08:33 and community obs? Oct 20 08:08:35 and we have it ready for meego.com too Oct 20 08:08:46 yeah... that's more... irritating Oct 20 08:08:50 * lcuk smiles :) Oct 20 08:08:52 hey X-Fade Oct 20 08:09:02 hi, didn't see the activity here ;) Oct 20 08:09:05 community OBS is ready Oct 20 08:09:09 but Oct 20 08:09:13 Has been for a while ;) Oct 20 08:09:35 Although I guess we should put it on 2.1 final? Oct 20 08:09:38 we're waiting on a 1hr task to setup a sql/scp/cron of user data Oct 20 08:09:57 so kick mrshaver when you see him Oct 20 08:11:21 to be fair we're also (re)deploying a load of network infra Oct 20 08:11:46 well, release coming up :P Oct 20 08:11:55 yup Oct 20 08:12:27 how is it going on your side Stskeeps? Oct 20 08:12:29 That reminds me, lbt: should I add the 1.2 pre releases too? Oct 20 08:12:39 lbt: usual release panic(TM) Oct 20 08:12:50 but we're quite well along Oct 20 08:13:03 X-Fade: yes... I wanted to get ramez involvedf to match up to nokia internal mirroring process Oct 20 08:13:28 lbt: Should we setup a meeting or so? Oct 20 08:13:30 Stskeeps: cool... when the dust settles I'd like to talk to you about automation too Oct 20 08:13:46 X-Fade: when he wakes up we can grab him here Oct 20 08:13:51 lbt: automation in what area? Oct 20 08:14:07 lbt: Well, I'm not there, but yeah ;) Oct 20 08:14:44 Stskeeps: maintainer validation, QA etc... the process of promoting packages Oct 20 08:14:47 :nod: Oct 20 08:15:44 X-Fade: so... tasks? Oct 20 08:16:30 I have time to work on stuff. Oct 20 08:16:39 Whatever stuff may be. Oct 20 08:17:06 I think we could do with reviewing the import process and naming Oct 20 08:17:22 it works but is blunt Oct 20 08:17:38 Yeah, and how to validate a weekly. Oct 20 08:17:52 As I tried the 1015 one and it didn't have repos. Oct 20 08:18:02 yes... we have had issues when the sync results in 0 byte imports Oct 20 08:18:06 That obviously should not impored. Oct 20 08:18:58 the 2.1 uprade too Oct 20 08:19:45 although my LDAP group patch was 1 patch too late Oct 20 08:20:14 Well, we can slap that on top of it. ;) Oct 20 08:20:33 One patch can be managed :) Oct 20 08:21:14 we could also do with sorting out how we do vcs'ed config management Oct 20 08:21:25 what are your thoughts on puppet? Oct 20 08:21:50 I think won't work in our env. Oct 20 08:21:59 *phew* :) Oct 20 08:22:01 Too many different admin rights/levels. Oct 20 08:22:19 I proposed : http://www.heiho.net/synctool/ ? Oct 20 08:22:28 Yeah, I like that proposal more Oct 20 08:22:29 essentially rsync Oct 20 08:22:58 OK ... I've been wondering if I'm being short-sighted... nice to know I'm not alone :) Oct 20 08:23:15 I have installed it on Oct 20 08:23:17 ... Oct 20 08:23:28 If there is only one admin level, then it works fine. Oct 20 08:23:38 But that is not the case for us. Oct 20 08:23:54 Or you would need to have a lot of puppet instances, separating out the admin areas. Oct 20 08:23:59 zathras Oct 20 08:24:24 I thought so... there is a proposal to use a local gitosis instance to manage that ... Oct 20 08:24:31 I'm feeling it's a bit OTT Oct 20 08:25:05 I'd be happy saying that we want a solution to do "system admin"... at the per-system level. Oct 20 08:25:44 To me that's a git tree of a sparse-root which is overlayed onto a 'apt-get install' Oct 20 08:26:36 no messing about with users who only have rights to apache config Oct 20 08:27:09 if you want to... break that out and get your apache system's admin to deal with it Oct 20 08:27:13 I think machine/vm level admin should be enough. Oct 20 08:28:25 so... I think setting up synctool on zathras would be another useful task... see if we can identify which config files have changed and getting them into vcs Oct 20 08:28:36 So you give someone access to a VM and give them the ability to mess that up. As long as there are backups ;) Oct 20 08:28:41 yes Oct 20 08:29:21 The hosts themselves would probably need to be managed differently though. Oct 20 08:29:51 agreed ... hosts are superadmin only (apart from rare exceptions... OBS workers) Oct 20 08:30:35 but honestly, they should be bare-bones minimal config with no activity other than LVM and iptables Oct 20 08:31:11 we're having hosts running Suse and VMs running squeeze Oct 20 08:31:31 I think you were around for that decision though? Oct 20 08:31:42 Yes, I was. Oct 20 08:31:58 I'll tell you... I'm glad you're back :) Oct 20 08:33:57 Hehe. Well let's see if we can get this into a higher gear. Oct 20 08:34:29 Adam is going to OSU so we may have outage later Oct 20 08:34:45 I didn't see anything... but I think he's doing network stuff Oct 20 08:35:06 Yeah, but I think it is better to have an outage for a few hours than having nothing to show for months ;) Oct 20 08:41:51 Problem with trying newer firmware is that your modem gets updated. Oct 20 08:42:14 -EWINDOW ;) Oct 20 09:03:01 whats the task switcher technical component called for handset? Oct 20 09:09:46 MeeGo 1.2 is coming out next Wednesday right? Oct 20 09:09:51 1.1 Oct 20 09:10:15 well that would explain my recent confusion Oct 20 09:11:01 * lcuk gets CosmoHill a coffee Oct 20 09:11:19 * CosmoHill turns it into tea and drinks it Oct 20 09:15:32 How does tea drink itself? Oct 20 09:15:43 Or did the tea drink the coffee Oct 20 09:15:47 I'm confused. Oct 20 09:16:27 I have a wand that only works on drinks that I used to turn the coffee into tea, which I then drank Oct 20 09:17:08 the closest to a magic drinking wand I have is a bendy straw Oct 20 09:17:47 * lcuk is not feeling very technical this morning incase you haven't guessed ;) Oct 20 09:19:12 I'\m just noticed someone's got the same printer as me and they've printed out good A4 colour pictures Oct 20 09:19:33 this gives me hope that my printer might still be of some good for photos Oct 20 09:19:40 heh Oct 20 09:20:05 I fixed it with a screw driver by removing a stupid chip from a caterage Oct 20 09:21:53 dammit my tea is cold already Oct 20 09:25:16 I've setup madde and can build mtf based apps and run them under meego handset, but when I try to create a class that inherits an mtf component I get "mmoc: Command not found" anyone know what I've missed? Oct 20 09:26:49 type "which mmoc" Oct 20 09:27:24 In madde or just plain terminal? :) Oct 20 09:27:32 plain terminal Oct 20 09:27:39 Nothing Oct 20 09:28:00 mmoc is part of madde correct? Oct 20 09:28:12 alterego, missing: http://qt.gitorious.org/maemo-6-ui-framework/n900-mmoc-fix/ ?? Oct 20 09:28:17 No, I'm guessing mmoc is the meego touch frameworks meego thing. Oct 20 09:28:30 meego qt moc thing Oct 20 09:29:20 Oh crap, I'm gonna have to build it from scratch? :P Oct 20 10:18:58 multipoint-touch seems to work nicely in latest meego image with lenovo S10-3t Oct 20 10:20:10 build number? Oct 20 10:21:15 1.0.99 Oct 20 10:22:02 nice Oct 20 10:25:19 shame downloading from meego.com is horribly slow :( Oct 20 10:26:18 was testing transformaction widget so event Qt Wrt is receiving the javascript multipoint events Oct 20 10:26:19 i'm gettin ok speeds Oct 20 10:26:45 never managed to get over ~250KB/sec Oct 20 10:27:06 i get about 750 all the time Oct 20 10:27:59 i hate you Oct 20 10:29:21 frals: mirrors.kernel.org/meego/ Oct 20 10:29:33 Stskeeps: thanks, will try that :) Oct 20 10:30:02 the best I got was 300KB/s on my home connection and 35MB/s on my uni one Oct 20 10:31:44 uu, kernel.org has a mirror Oct 20 10:32:01 what file are you downloading? Oct 20 10:32:12 Strangely, i found repo.meego.org to be faster the other day Oct 20 10:34:06 frals: can you give me a link to the file you are downloading? Oct 20 10:34:32 http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1.0.99/1.0.99.2.20101019.1/netbook/images/meego-netbook-ia32/meego-netbook-ia32-1.0.99.2.20101019.1.img Oct 20 10:34:38 not mirrored on kernel.org yet :< Oct 20 10:34:50 which netbook are you installing it onto? Oct 20 10:35:02 frals: give me a few mins Oct 20 10:37:55 this'll be interesting Oct 20 10:38:12 lcuk: uh, it varies depending on what i can scavage ;) Oct 20 10:38:43 someone has finished downloading cos my download speed just went up Oct 20 10:40:02 frals: that's for the url, was going to go looking for that today :) Oct 20 10:40:41 slaine: if you wait 5 mins I can give you a mirrror Oct 20 10:40:50 yeah, cool Oct 20 10:40:52 thanks Oct 20 10:41:03 see if I can get my broadcom rpm in shape for the 1.1 release Oct 20 10:41:28 is meego 1.1 out? Oct 20 10:41:37 loufoque: next wednesday Oct 20 10:42:08 CosmoHill: nice, thanks for the info Oct 20 10:42:33 if you'd like the latest image I'll have a mirror ready in a few minutes Oct 20 10:43:14 watching this download is like watching a yoyo Oct 20 10:43:30 i'm mostly interested in decent support of the N900 Oct 20 10:43:50 frals, good good Oct 20 10:44:00 * lcuk installs meego on a trout Oct 20 10:44:55 this better not copy limewire, it gets to 99% downloaded and then goes to 2KB/s Oct 20 10:45:49 http://cross-lfs.org/~cosmo/meego/meego-netbook-ia32-1.0.99.2.20101019.1.img Oct 20 10:45:51 http://cross-lfs.org/~cosmo/meego/meego-netbook-ia32-1.0.99.2.20101019.1.img.md5 Oct 20 10:48:48 slaine: mirror's ready Oct 20 10:49:00 CosmoHill: cool, on it's way down now, thanks Oct 20 10:49:10 does anyone have some side by side comparisons of maemo in meego? Oct 20 10:49:13 I mean screenshots Oct 20 10:49:26 of maemo vs meego Oct 20 10:50:56 that's kind of a meaningless comparison Oct 20 10:52:07 google image search screenshot+maemo Oct 20 10:52:10 google image search screenshot+meego Oct 20 10:52:32 then use the new windows 7 feature to view them side by side Oct 20 10:52:48 lcuk, be careful what you say Oct 20 10:53:10 lcuk, trout is the codename for an actual handset, people might get the wrong idea :p Oct 20 10:53:36 so if someone hits me with a trout they may have just thrown a phone at me? Oct 20 10:53:45 TermanaN900, hmmm Oct 20 10:53:51 theres something fishy with that proposal Oct 20 10:54:12 hehe :p Oct 20 10:59:18 world isn't fair. Why does it take over an hour to encode a 27 minute video? Oct 20 10:59:34 you're short on cpu power? :) Oct 20 10:59:43 partypooper Oct 20 11:00:07 :-( Oct 20 11:00:13 that's one way to say it Surfa ;) Oct 20 11:00:42 I'll stick with my original theory of world not being fair Oct 20 11:01:20 Myrtti: I blame that too Oct 20 11:02:42 Myrtti: because the laws of thermo dynamics say "no" Oct 20 11:02:56 hah, http://meego.org Oct 20 11:03:05 I know, my cpu is at 85C Oct 20 11:03:33 sorry, 87C Oct 20 11:04:00 hena: their hacking skills are far greater than their html skills Oct 20 11:04:28 didn't even bother to look at the code Oct 20 11:05:51 that reminds me, I need to update my AV Oct 20 11:08:34 slaine: why is it meaningless? Oct 20 11:08:42 slaine: I wonder how much the UI changes Oct 20 11:08:55 It's completely different Oct 20 11:09:43 hi, i am having some trouble installing qt creator with madde on my Ubuntu 10.04 LTS system Oct 20 11:10:16 ./install-meego-dev-env-0.7.25-linux-i686.sh Can not install on 'x86_64' Requires i686 system Oct 20 11:11:01 pretty obvious, you're trying to install x86-32 software on x86-64 system Oct 20 11:11:18 kt_: you're ubuntu system is 64bit, you have the 32bit script Oct 20 11:11:18 at least the installer is kind enough to actually tell you up front that it won't work Oct 20 11:12:23 CosmoHill, yes but is there a 64 bit version script? Oct 20 11:12:45 I'd look in the same place you got the 32bit one Oct 20 11:13:36 CosmoHill, on http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_SDK_with_QEMU only the 32bit one is shown Oct 20 11:15:38 you may have to install MADDE yourself Oct 20 11:15:59 loufoque: sorry, was on a call and couldn't elaborate. Oct 20 11:17:36 The MeeGo Handset UX is a completely new design in comparison with the MID style UX from the n900 maemo release is what I meant. So a direct comparison doesn't really mean much. You can get a fee for the handset ux by looking here, http://meego.com/devices/handset/handset-screenshots Oct 20 11:17:56 No joke! There is a lot of peopl ein here. Oct 20 11:18:16 Well, MID style was probably more applicable to the earlier nXX0 hardware Oct 20 11:19:46 anyone got screen shots of meego on a phone ? Oct 20 11:20:32 Hello All , I Was successfull in installing qt by naming qt-devel in ks file and then using mic-image creator for repo http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/daily/core/repos/armv7l/packages/armv7l/ . Then I pull all rpms to my local repository and change repo url to that local repo in ks file , But I am not able to install qt-devel now ... anyone have the pointers ?? Oct 20 11:20:35 CosmoHill, i am trying to install MADDE myself now. I only need to create a simple application so maybe i could do the development on the meego pc Oct 20 11:21:25 CosmoHill, is it possible to install QT Creator on meego? Oct 20 11:21:59 you probably could Oct 20 11:22:01 its presinstalled in the meego sdk chroot afaik Oct 20 11:22:21 it's not the Qt creator that is giving you problems tho, it's MADDE Oct 20 11:23:04 ok, so i would still need that on the meego pc Oct 20 11:23:42 I wouldn't know Oct 20 11:24:45 the madde installation seemed to run smooth when using http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/MADDE.php?f=install-madde-0.6.72-linux-x86_64.sh Oct 20 11:25:46 hi all .. can anyone direct mee to the meego codedrop images' path?? their paths seem to be changed and what the repos show now are chromium images. are these two different?? Oct 20 11:25:53 sunder: repo.meego.com :) Oct 20 11:26:04 do you have experience with configuring Qt Creator to work with real devices? Is the ip address of the real device alle that is needed? Oct 20 11:27:13 hi stskeeps. I followed the http://wiki.meego.com/Developing_in_a_Meego_Environment#Setting_up_your_development_environment. it talks of some http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/devel/n900/images/meego-codedrop-ia32-developer-201003311106.img.bz2, but these are nowhere to be found .. :( Oct 20 11:27:42 that image looks like it's dated for March Oct 20 11:29:32 has anyone tried the chromium images?? Oct 20 11:32:06 has anyone tried these images http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/releases/1.0/netbook/images/meego-netbook-chromium-ia32/meego-netbook-chromium-ia32-1.0-20100524.1.img .. ?? Oct 20 11:34:13 http://cross-lfs.org/~cosmo/meego/meego-netbook-ia32-1.0.99.2.20101019.1.img << Newest Oct 20 11:35:10 the only difference between the chrome and chromium images is the EULA and brower Oct 20 11:55:16 A pure Qt program will run on meego ? Oct 20 11:55:32 should Oct 20 12:38:45 Has anyone heard anything back about the meego conference? Oct 20 12:38:57 It's less than a month away :/ Oct 20 12:38:59 hmm? Oct 20 12:39:15 should have been a lot of people getting accept/reject on their talks and sponsorship Oct 20 12:39:31 Oh, I've heard nothing about my sponsorship. Oct 20 12:39:44 when did you sign up? Oct 20 12:40:06 About 2 days after they announced that website. Oct 20 12:40:10 hrm Oct 20 12:40:14 dunno - check with Jaffa Oct 20 12:40:32 Then I edited my submission about a week afterwards ^.^ Oct 20 12:40:47 If it qwent into my spam I'm going to be so pissed. Oct 20 12:43:32 alterego: what email address is your submission under Oct 20 12:44:22 we (the committee) wrapped up last week Oct 20 12:44:36 That, is a good question. Oct 20 12:45:09 I can check the spreadsheet and see if you're there Oct 20 12:45:18 Thanks Oct 20 12:45:23 * Jaffa leaves it to slaine Oct 20 12:45:31 I've never been to a meetup yet :( Oct 20 12:45:32 hey jaffa Oct 20 12:45:41 And I'm jobless :D Oct 20 12:52:49 I have a general qn about meego Oct 20 12:53:32 go ahead and ask... Oct 20 12:54:12 which layer is respinsible to use gstreamer and all other upstream compnents in meego Oct 20 12:54:19 damn. gst-plugins-base from gitorious has problems Oct 20 12:57:40 gstxmptag.c:830: error: 'GST_TAG_APPLICATION_NAME' undeclared (first use in this function) Oct 20 12:57:49 sigh Oct 20 13:02:35 howdo i get an understanding of how the variou components like gstreamer , ofono, connman bluez etc work together as a system in meego? Oct 20 13:06:00 dell: They're not all completeling integrated Oct 20 13:06:08 ~completely .. Oct 20 13:07:20 alterego i assume there should be a layer above the components am i right ? Oct 20 13:07:23 I'd look at the documentation for ofono on meego, and connman. I think Bluez is seperate Oct 20 13:07:58 Well, as far as gstreamer is concerned, I think the dialer app that integrates with ofono actually uses pulseaudio Oct 20 13:08:08 So it doesn't talking to gstreamer directly at all I don't think. Oct 20 13:08:10 dell: I think http://meego.com/developers/meego-architecture is the best place to start from.. Oct 20 13:08:11 yes i have gone through them, they can be used by applications Oct 20 13:08:46 they all run as service inside linux exposing various APIs so that there services could be used Oct 20 13:10:19 http://meego.org/ Oct 20 13:10:31 haxxors Oct 20 13:11:59 silly chinese ;> Oct 20 13:12:44 how is power management done in meego? Oct 20 13:13:03 with button? :) dunno Oct 20 13:13:03 depends on the hardware Oct 20 13:13:16 dell: on the N900 we're a slave to bme Oct 20 13:13:33 Power management? Who needs that. I have 100 chinese kids that use a mechanical winder to keep my battery running all day Oct 20 13:13:45 I'd imagine on netbook it's the same as an ordinary PC with GNU/Linux installed Oct 20 13:13:51 Termana, Power slaves? Oct 20 13:13:51 Heh Oct 20 13:14:13 so where in software will this differentialtion bw netbook and handset be done Oct 20 13:14:29 alterego, well... REALLY that's not power management Oct 20 13:14:37 That's battery charging Oct 20 13:14:46 Okay, I've been running around the Qt docs like crazy for the past hour, how can I stick a QDeclarativeView inside an MApplicationPage? Oct 20 13:15:45 so which code should i refer if i want to understand how overall system power management is handled in meego? Oct 20 13:15:54 The real answer is that you should be using CPUIdle and Dynamic PM on Handsets, and use the normal suspend/hibernate/CPUIdle and Dynamic PM on netbooks Oct 20 13:16:33 so different kernels? Oct 20 13:16:36 dell, just look into normal linux power management. Oct 20 13:16:58 dell, no. Handset manufactures can do suspending and resuming for handsets as well Oct 20 13:17:12 dell, there was some discussion on power management relating to over clocking. Oct 20 13:17:31 in the driver level or application level ? i mean for meego case Oct 20 13:17:55 dell, rephrase? Oct 20 13:18:22 Termana: Alienware Oct 20 13:18:29 intel uses ACPI and apm stuff Oct 20 13:18:37 so will the same be used in meego? Oct 20 13:18:47 dell, yes, like I said, look into normal linux power management Oct 20 13:19:01 http://wiki.maemo.org/Kernel_Power Oct 20 13:19:06 CosmoHill, what? :p Oct 20 13:19:16 dell rephrased = alienware Oct 20 13:19:26 heh :p Oct 20 13:20:00 sx0n, what does that have ANYTHING to do with what we are talking about? :p Oct 20 13:20:18 Termana, power consumption? Oct 20 13:21:32 i thought that consumption would something to do with management, but then maybe not. Oct 20 13:21:55 sx0n, well, technically yes. But that's not really what he was looking for :p Oct 20 13:22:15 ah ok. acpi.. Oct 20 13:25:33 i refereed the meego architecture and also the meego glitorious i was not able to find a single component for handset UI framework inside the MeeGo Handset UX. is there such a framework ? Oct 20 13:27:54 dell: meego touch framework Oct 20 13:27:58 is what you're looking for Oct 20 13:28:15 dell: http://apidocs.meego.com/mtf/ Oct 20 13:28:34 You're lucking I've been staring at that api ref for the past day :) Oct 20 13:33:45 thanks alterego and Termana Oct 20 13:33:54 np Oct 20 13:42:41 I use Ubuntu 10.04 LTS X86_64 and want to do development for Meego. I have installed Qt Creator and want to integrate MADDE (MeeGo Application Development & Debug Environment) into it. I have installed http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/MADDE.php?f=install-madde-0.6.72-linux-x86_64.sh but i now only have support for MAEMO. I am confused. If i choose to develop an app for maemo will it then also work in meego? Oct 20 13:43:53 As mentioned earlier i can not just follow this guide: http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_SDK_with_QEMU as i do not have a 32 bit Ubuntu version Oct 20 13:44:35 furthermore i do not need an emulator. I have an actual netbook running meego that i want to debug the application on Oct 20 13:51:31 kt_: this is the simplest and fastest way to develop for netbook on Linux at the moment: http://wiki.meego.com/SDK/Docs/1.1/MeeGo_SDK_with_Xephyr; providing you're not using Fedora Core 13 (Xephyr doesn't work properly on it, but the reason hasn't been tracked down yet - bug here: http://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8666) Oct 20 13:52:46 kt_: I install Qt Creator into the chroot and run it from there; and use chroot to compile before putting the application on a real netbook Oct 20 13:52:52 Xephyr need an intel video card Oct 20 13:53:11 niala: that's true Oct 20 13:53:17 i have a nvidia graphics card - will that do? Oct 20 13:53:33 and kt_, I didn't notice the 64bit thing, which will make life difficult I expect Oct 20 13:54:03 yes, if just i did not run 64 bit i assume it would not be a problem Oct 20 13:54:25 kt_ Xephyr won't work on non-Intel graphics either Oct 20 13:54:44 kt_ more accurately, netbook UX won't run inside Xephyr on non-Intel graphics Oct 20 13:54:57 i just installed the standard ubuntu desktop edition a long time ago and apparently it is 64 bit Oct 20 13:57:53 kt_: look at http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_SDK_Development_Options Oct 20 13:58:33 niala, i have done that Oct 20 13:58:51 niala, is there something you think i have overlooked? Oct 20 13:59:38 I use meego on netbook and qemu on fedora64x and ati Oct 20 14:00:20 niala, how did you install install-meego-dev-env-0.7.25-linux-i686.sh Oct 20 14:00:21 ? Oct 20 14:00:39 assuming that you just followed the guide Oct 20 14:01:32 it's a script? I don't remember . Oct 20 14:02:13 sh install-meego-dev-env-0.7.25-linux-i686.sh Oct 20 14:02:34 niala, it is a 225Mb binary file. I get the error: Can not install on 'x86_64' Requires i686 system Oct 20 14:04:04 niala, is there someway i can force installation anyway? And the find missing libraries perhaps? Oct 20 14:05:46 http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_SDK_with_QEMU they explain Installing qemugl on 64 bit ubuntu 10.04 Oct 20 14:07:23 oh sorry I confused with MADDE Oct 20 14:08:30 yes, the funny thing is that they explain how to install qemugl on 64 bit but not Qt Creator with MADDE Oct 20 14:18:02 salut niala Oct 20 14:18:25 bug lol I've downoad a 700Mb file on a live disk. yes that a little stupi :) Oct 20 14:18:34 hello CosmoHill Oct 20 14:21:40 Is there like a virtualized or emulator of meego for develpment ? Oct 20 14:21:57 CosmoHill: cold and wet day but nice http://meteopetitefrance.fr/ Oct 20 14:22:59 Linex: http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_SDK_Development_Options Oct 20 14:23:07 niala: thanks Oct 20 14:24:13 just curious, qt apps ( modified or not) runs on android ? Oct 20 14:25:00 android is java no? lol I don't know nothing about android Oct 20 14:25:24 I mean if library are here why not? Oct 20 14:25:30 would be nice to have qt on android, then our apps will run on meego and android. Oct 20 14:26:28 mmm Oct 20 14:26:49 Linex, yes, i would really like that too Oct 20 14:28:00 the worst thing about android is (as far as i know) that only android specific java classes are supported (correct me if i am wrong) Oct 20 14:28:31 there is no java virtual machine underneath Oct 20 14:28:42 and licence Oct 20 14:29:17 hmm... the virtual machine is named "Dalvik" Oct 20 14:29:18 license ..... english is really not my language :) Oct 20 14:30:13 niala: Qemu is the best method to go I guess Oct 20 14:31:42 yep Oct 20 14:31:56 it's depend of your hardware Oct 20 14:31:57 Why would you need Java to begin with? Oct 20 14:32:35 niala: I got VT Oct 20 14:33:09 niala: I have no idea what I want to develop yet. Just playing around. Oct 20 14:33:29 RST38h, it would be nice if you could use the same applications on different platforms. If Android uses non-standard classes that is not so. But I do not know much about it Oct 20 14:34:36 the netbook image is a lot more bigger than the phone image Oct 20 14:34:43 of course Oct 20 14:34:43 :P Oct 20 14:35:10 try holding your netbook to your ear :p Oct 20 14:35:17 hehe Oct 20 14:35:22 Linex: each meego is different than the other Oct 20 14:36:00 so the phone version are missing many classes I guess Oct 20 14:36:15 phone version on meego? no, most stuff is in core Oct 20 14:36:20 lcuk: I do this sometines in a spip way :) Oct 20 14:36:22 kt: Compile some kind of MIDP emulator and use MIDP apps Oct 20 14:36:23 full qt Oct 20 14:36:49 Stskeeps: both have the same qt core libraries ? Oct 20 14:36:51 yeah Oct 20 14:36:53 Having said that, MIDP is rather primitive and inherently slow Oct 20 14:37:07 Stskeeps: ok, so its the environment Oct 20 14:37:12 yeah Oct 20 14:37:18 Stskeeps: the whole OS thingy Oct 20 14:37:22 Stskeeps: ok thanks Oct 20 14:37:30 niala, then you are odd :P Oct 20 14:38:46 RST38h, i did not know the MIDP Oct 20 14:39:04 ok can someone remind me why I would want to develop on meego platform ? Oct 20 14:39:10 kt: MIDP is "smartphone java" as you know it Oct 20 14:39:26 Also known as JavaME and PhoneME Oct 20 14:39:33 RST38h, ok Oct 20 14:40:14 RST38h, i was not really thinking in that way because i run these OS (meego and android) on x86 hardware Oct 20 14:41:04 lcuk: euh well yes true! I wrote spip but I think sip :) Oct 20 14:41:21 RST38h, i just need to make a few demo-apps that will run on small netbooks running meego and android Oct 20 14:41:42 so far i have run into lots of trouble Oct 20 14:42:03 not being a linux expert certainly does not make things better Oct 20 14:43:16 kt_, so, same source for each OS? Oct 20 14:43:26 the interest of vendor is not to be compatible, but to sell is phone and control her customer Oct 20 14:43:30 or just different implementations Oct 20 14:45:03 lcuk, no, that is not possible (unfortunately). I also am going to make something for Google Chrome OS Oct 20 14:45:18 if i ever get there Oct 20 14:45:56 kt_, oh, i thought android was based on linux and allowed you to dev same stuff :) isn't there an sdl implementaiton for instance? Oct 20 14:48:43 lcuk, i don't know if there is an sdl implementation, thank for the tip Oct 20 14:49:47 sdl does not seem to support android yet Oct 20 14:49:55 but i will look more into it Oct 20 16:03:31 oooohhh Oct 20 16:03:33 bright light Oct 20 16:12:56 Myrtti: don't walk into it Oct 20 16:14:09 Has anyone successfully run the IVI ISO under qemu or another emulator? I've run various netbook images but get the impression that unless you have a copy of the proprietary bootloader and qflasher, you're out of luck on the handset and IVI images. If I were to put MeeGo on my Android phone, would the install replace the Android bootloader? (Just about has to be so, I guess.) Is anybody running MeeGo on another device, sa Oct 20 16:14:10 y a Chumby or a Linksys or somesuch? Oct 20 16:16:53 I'm on gentoo. Can I just use the qemu provided by gentoo ? Oct 20 16:18:14 Alison_Chaiken: it's not -quite- that easy to put MeeGo on Android devices just yet. At this point, I don't think it's replacing the android bootloader, but you'd have to get details from the people who are trying. Oct 20 16:19:19 wmarone, thanks for the response. Is there any hardware available now that an ordinary Sal can run the IVI image on? Oct 20 16:19:42 Linex, what version qemu? I've had problems with older ones (0.11). As long as the version is fairly recent it should be ok Oct 20 16:20:05 csdb: 0.12.5-r1 Oct 20 16:20:16 csdb: is that ok ? Oct 20 16:20:21 Alison_Chaiken: if it's x86 then any current Intel-based system should run it Oct 20 16:20:29 * wmarone looks Oct 20 16:20:44 yeah, ia32 Oct 20 16:21:21 Linex, I'm using a 0.13git version. You can give it a try. Oct 20 16:21:27 might be ok. Oct 20 16:21:40 csdb, I've been running the netbook image under QEMU PC emulator version 0.12.5 (qemu-kvm-0.12.5) on Fedora 13. Details are here: http://www.exerciseforthereader.org/PCBSD/PCBSD8_under_qemu-kvm.html Oct 20 16:21:52 if you see qemu coredumping, then its time to upgrade :-) Oct 20 16:22:19 csdb: the meego-qemu-start script looks for /usr/bin/qemugl . What should I replace it with ? Oct 20 16:22:42 csdb: I got a bunch of qemu-xxx Oct 20 16:22:46 So wmarone, the IVI can be run as long as one has a copy of qflasher and the bootloader? That's the sticking point AFAIK. Once you have those components, you can create an image with MIC and you're ready to go. Oct 20 16:23:18 Linex, ahhh sorry. I just logged in and caught the end of your questions. I thought you were asking about qemu for building. If you're running Meego under it then I can't help you, haven't done that yet Oct 20 16:23:20 csdb, you may be missing some package dependencies for GL or libvirt. Oct 20 16:23:47 oh ok Oct 20 16:23:56 csdb: no worries Oct 20 16:24:09 Alison_Chaiken: believe so, I suspect it's probably virtually identical to the netbook image with some interface changes Oct 20 16:24:27 * wmarone hasn't paid much attention to IVI Oct 20 16:25:13 hello. does anybody run last build of meego on n900? Oct 20 16:25:14 the virtual image needs kvm ? Oct 20 16:25:24 acab_: 1.0.99 or 1.1.80 ? Oct 20 16:25:35 Stskeeps, 1.1.80 Oct 20 16:25:58 if you don't have to use 1.1.80 for anything like work, i'd recommend 1.0.99 for now Oct 20 16:26:21 Stskeeps, but . in 1.0.99 can i use for example. cellular? Oct 20 16:26:25 or somebody Oct 20 16:26:36 yes Oct 20 16:26:43 1.0.99 is what becomes meego 1.1 Oct 20 16:26:58 what about video acceleration? Oct 20 16:27:01 http://cross-lfs.org/~cosmo/meego/meego-netbook-ia32-1.0.99.2.20101019.1.img Oct 20 16:27:27 acab_: no DSP usage, but 3d is there, though old drivers Oct 20 16:27:49 Stskeeps, its very slow when rotate screen Oct 20 16:29:56 acab_: yeah, we are putting in fast 3d drivers in 1.2 Oct 20 16:30:04 in fact, i'm debugging them right now.. Oct 20 16:30:20 but why last builds are broken? Oct 20 16:30:43 1.1.80? Oct 20 16:30:55 yep Oct 20 16:30:58 because 1.1.80 is 1.2 alpha :) Oct 20 16:31:24 Stskeeps, i understand, but when load, my phone didnt see anything on sd card Oct 20 16:31:49 you might have hit an image with the broken kernel on it Oct 20 16:32:11 nooo Oct 20 16:32:15 i download last Oct 20 16:32:26 http://forum.meego.com/showpost.php?p=11211&postcount=214 Oct 20 16:32:34 i get exacly that situation Oct 20 16:33:01 yes, and 1.1.80 had a kernel problem Oct 20 16:33:08 it should be fixed but probably first in next week's weekly Oct 20 16:33:15 =( Oct 20 16:33:30 is it real to load with another kernel? Oct 20 16:34:23 just grab 1.0.99 Oct 20 16:34:26 Is there a planned upgrade path from 1.0 to 1.1 ? Oct 20 16:34:27 that's likely what you would want to track Oct 20 16:34:35 slaine: upgrades, what's that? :P Oct 20 16:34:42 That answers that Oct 20 16:34:58 no idea about netbook Oct 20 16:35:04 Stskeeps, 1.0.99 its so slooooow Oct 20 16:35:18 acab_: yes, and that's because we haven't integrated new SGX drivers yet Oct 20 16:35:31 acab_: that's what i'm working on getting prepared for 1.2 right now, we have a bug where it crashes Oct 20 16:35:43 how you test 1.1.80 if you cant load it =)? Oct 20 16:36:02 slaine: no there isn't at this time Oct 20 16:36:08 Grand Oct 20 16:36:20 I'll backup and install 1.0.99.1 so Oct 20 16:36:34 acab_: we don't, if you went to look at the QA reports, they say unable to test :) Oct 20 16:36:45 acab_: it's fixed in the daily image from today so next weeks.. Oct 20 16:36:46 ahahahah ^))) Oct 20 16:36:58 slaine: http://cross-lfs.org/~cosmo/meego/faq.txt second question on there Oct 20 16:42:20 Stskeeps, when you wanna show good build? Oct 20 16:42:29 want to see a video? Oct 20 16:42:29 :P Oct 20 16:42:58 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWtMLs3j09U&feature=player_embedded Oct 20 16:43:15 i just wanna see what work =) Oct 20 16:43:26 sweet Oct 20 16:43:42 build 1.1.80.0.20101001.1 Oct 20 16:43:45 its good? Oct 20 16:43:48 not broken? Oct 20 16:43:56 acab_: probably wasn't Oct 20 16:44:19 driver not included though Oct 20 16:45:02 Stskeeps: Presumably that's thp's MTF version of gPodder, rather than the Gtk+/Hildon one Oct 20 16:45:09 1.1.80.0.20101005.1 Oct 20 16:45:12 what about that? Oct 20 16:45:14 Stskeeps: now i wish i had an n900, too ! Oct 20 16:45:14 Jaffa: who says we don't have a working hildon? Oct 20 16:45:15 :P Oct 20 16:47:25 guys. I'm having a problem I can't figure out Oct 20 16:47:45 trying to mount /dev/sdb1 on the live usb but it's giving me an error that it's already mounted or busy Oct 20 16:47:54 check 'mount'? Oct 20 16:48:21 yeah, done all that, lsof, fuser too Oct 20 16:48:30 nothing that I can see has it mounted or open Oct 20 16:49:21 well, not lsof as it's not there Oct 20 16:49:54 wondering if device mapper is holding it or something Oct 20 16:50:21 (the live os is an image that's hosted on /dev/sdb1, I should still be able to mount the fat32 on /dev/sdb1 though) Oct 20 17:17:57 irc://irc.opensuse.org/opensuse-buildservice Oct 20 17:18:05 thiago: hi, I'm still waiting for the SF code.sprints contact - Knut didn't answer either :( Oct 20 17:18:05 doh Oct 20 17:22:18 i wonder what kind of job it would be to hack curses with touch sensitivy... Oct 20 17:26:01 Stskeeps: A working Hildon with themeing matching the Qt/MTF theme? I'd be surprised ;-) Oct 20 17:26:13 hena: wrong hack, you need framebuffer console touch input implemented Oct 20 17:26:48 I think gpm already works Oct 20 17:27:56 auke, is it possible to mount the vfat partition on the liveOS (netbook) via the command line ? Oct 20 17:28:32 slaine: don't see why that wouldn't work...? Oct 20 17:29:08 get an error from nautilus when booting the latest image and then in the shell it just doesn't want to do it either Oct 20 17:29:15 basically device or resource busy Oct 20 17:29:30 mount -t vfat /dev/.... /mnt ? Oct 20 17:31:48 yeah Oct 20 17:32:08 "mount: /dev/sdb1 already mounted or /mnt busy" Oct 20 17:32:15 but mount doesn't show it mounted Oct 20 17:32:44 nore does fuser show anyone using the device Oct 20 17:33:11 cat /proc/mounts ? Oct 20 17:33:34 Hey, I asked this on the forums a while ago but I did not get any answer :P http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=1600 any help is welcome Oct 20 17:34:01 yeah, nothing there Oct 20 17:34:45 bef0rd: look at nokia-n900-configs, we ignore an accelerometer Oct 20 17:35:03 bef0rd: doesn't sound like a MeeGo-specific issue, have you looked outside MeeGo resources for clues? Oct 20 17:36:07 Stskeeps, thanks will check. auke, yes I tried adding a configuration file to make it ignore con /etc/xorg.conf.d/ but it made my touchpad and keyboard stop working too not sure what was wrong with it Oct 20 17:36:39 Stskeeps: ah, hehe yeah that would be in the way Oct 20 17:37:26 bef0rd: you might need a catch all evdev config in the xorg.conf.d Oct 20 17:46:59 I found a completely superior oliveoil in the supermarkt Stskeeps http://www.supermarktcheck.de/product/40797-livio-natives-olivenoel-extra Oct 20 17:53:13 lol Oct 20 18:01:59 Hi Oct 20 18:02:13 slaine, How're tricks in dubberlin town? Oct 20 18:02:26 dneary: dirty Oct 20 18:02:47 You're spending too much time by the gasworks walls Oct 20 18:03:37 It's where I met my love Oct 20 18:03:55 You can also find me dreaming by the old canal Oct 20 18:04:39 The Royal? Oct 20 18:04:55 Where the oul triangle went jingle jangle? Oct 20 18:11:34 dneary: lol Oct 20 18:51:06 * qgil just created http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_vs_Android - contributions welcome! Oct 20 18:51:37 MeeGo rules! Oct 20 18:52:21 anything about Finnish boys in Winter? Oct 20 18:52:32 actually better URL is http://wiki.meego.com/Community_Office/Marketing/MeeGo_vs_Android Oct 20 18:53:16 thiago_home: who should I contact for code.sprints in SF? Knut didn't answer, time is running... Oct 20 18:54:17 qgil: +1 for hitting the main points of why meego is cool :) Oct 20 18:54:37 Stskeeps: a lot of work is still needed, in that page and in the MeeGo project ;) Oct 20 18:54:40 qgil: the one leading to Dev Days? Oct 20 18:54:44 or do you mean in general? Oct 20 18:54:53 qgil: rome wasn't built in a day ;) Oct 20 18:55:03 Stskeeps: by the way, my instinct tells me that OBS is a big asset but if you & the OBS fans can help explaining why... Oct 20 18:55:26 thiago_home: that Pumpkin Dinner Oct 20 18:55:34 on Saturday 1ç Oct 20 18:56:36 qgil: i usually explain it like this.. Qt creator -> packaging step -> OBS -> repositories I can add straight to my image description (kickstart) -> create image -> deploy to device Oct 20 18:57:03 Stskeeps: but is this much better to whatever steps you follow with Android? Oct 20 18:57:27 qgil: i must admit i haven't tried android dev env :P Oct 20 18:57:33 qgil: and then there's of course the whole potential of business logic around OBS Oct 20 18:57:37 Stskeeps: for instance, what about targeting different MeeGo releases/devices with OBS vs Android SDK? Oct 20 18:57:46 qgil: 'just add another build target' Oct 20 18:58:00 (two clicks) Oct 20 18:58:09 Stskeeps: we need good Android developers willing to explain why MeeGo does better ;) Oct 20 18:58:20 yeah Oct 20 18:59:00 i think we have a pretty good ODM story, though Oct 20 18:59:00 qgil: Alex Spehr. She's organising it. Oct 20 18:59:35 Stskeeps: isn't that describing a full image? Oct 20 19:00:14 thiago_home: mm? Oct 20 19:01:06 20:53 < Stskeeps> qgil: i usually explain it like this.. Qt creator -> packaging step -> OBS -> repositories I can add straight to my image description (kickstart) -> create image -> deploy to device Oct 20 19:01:15 right Oct 20 19:01:15 isn't that describing a full image build? Oct 20 19:01:34 you can also do "add repo to your existing running image and instal" Oct 20 19:01:45 most people shouldn't be flashing their devices Oct 20 19:01:55 agreed Oct 20 19:01:58 they should be able to click a button in Creator (the Run or the Debug button) and have it installed and run Oct 20 19:02:26 that too Oct 20 19:02:43 it works for symbian devices and Maemo5 Oct 20 19:02:48 it has to work for MeeGo :-) Oct 20 19:02:57 i think it does/should :) Oct 20 19:03:04 it was in the OBS context though Oct 20 19:04:05 but yeah, OBS needs to be better explained.. Oct 20 19:05:25 i'm thinking examples of how to extend a meego release etc.. Oct 20 19:05:56 OBS is useful for device creators and platform developers Oct 20 19:06:22 platform developers include people who need to maintain a package in the OBS Oct 20 19:11:59 thiago_home: hehe re: finnish boys in winter Oct 20 19:12:29 :-) Oct 20 19:36:26 which qt modules are installed on meego by default ? Oct 20 19:37:47 all of them except for qt3support Oct 20 19:38:56 is all of them really needed ? Oct 20 19:39:01 for a minimal system ? Oct 20 19:41:44 How much can I truncate, drop them ? Oct 20 19:41:48 for a minimal working system ? Oct 20 19:42:23 hi, anyone here on libsocialweb development? Oct 20 19:42:36 s/on/working on Oct 20 19:42:41 etrunko: ocs ? Oct 20 19:43:52 lbt: sorry? Oct 20 19:44:02 open collaboration system ? Oct 20 19:44:06 lbt :) Oct 20 19:44:22 did you write on the mailing list ? Oct 20 19:44:25 yeah... send an email ... I know ;) Oct 20 19:44:28 :P Oct 20 19:44:35 yeah, why not. Oct 20 19:44:55 scroll down to the bottom of this page http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenNetworking Oct 20 19:45:23 I need to set that up tonight Oct 20 19:45:49 if I don't, the community OBS gets delayed some more.... Oct 20 19:46:05 mmh Oct 20 19:46:06 hence the sporadic delegation and recruitment attempts... Oct 20 19:46:34 * Stskeeps passes lbt a cloning device Oct 20 19:46:49 * lbt *lbt jumps out Oct 20 19:47:02 * lbt *lbt *lbt *lbt jumps out Oct 20 19:47:07 wee Oct 20 19:47:56 * CosmoHill jumps on lbt Oct 20 19:48:57 Myrtti Video Productions presents: Nexus One Fail -teaser. http://flic.kr/p/8LDLhk Oct 20 19:49:03 thiago_home: tell me if you have got idea about Qt module truncation, dropping matter :) Oct 20 19:49:07 CosmoHill: which one of me Oct 20 19:49:16 I have a choice? Oct 20 19:49:25 djszapi: truncation? Oct 20 19:49:50 I mean I would like to use as few Qt modules as I can. Oct 20 19:50:09 I am just thinking of whether I can write my meego application safely with Qt modules. Oct 20 19:50:25 but if that can be dropped it is not that safe decision. Oct 20 19:50:29 djszapi: don't use the modules you don't want to use Oct 20 19:50:31 that's it Oct 20 19:50:36 erm... Oct 20 19:50:41 the matter is distinct a bit. Oct 20 19:50:46 I don't see how Oct 20 19:50:53 well, I must parse an XML file, k ? Oct 20 19:50:58 ok Oct 20 19:51:04 I do not know whether I can count for QtXML module. Oct 20 19:51:13 if the user can live with no that, I would not like to use it. Oct 20 19:51:22 because it is an unneccesary dependency for him. Oct 20 19:51:23 what does the user have to do with anything? Oct 20 19:51:33 if the user installs your app, QtXml gets installed Oct 20 19:51:51 that is what I am asking, whether it is needed or not. Oct 20 19:52:00 what is needed? Oct 20 19:52:18 all modules are available. Qt is part of the MeeGo API and will be available in all devices. Oct 20 19:52:24 all modules except for qt3support. Maybe phonon. Oct 20 19:52:24 the problem is more like that I would not like to cause extra dependencies for the user. Oct 20 19:52:51 yes, but I am not sure for example: QtXml is needed by the user for anything Oct 20 19:53:05 you can use anything in the MeeGo API Oct 20 19:53:06 if not, my application would force him to install it. Oct 20 19:53:27 the user would barely notice Oct 20 19:53:42 Yesterday I was asking around about the "Android fragmentation" and the risks for MeeGo - I have tried to reflect all that at http://wiki.meego.com/Community_Office/Marketing/MeeGo_vs_Android#Will_MeeGo_have_the_same_fragmentation_problems_Android_has.3F Oct 20 19:53:50 details and relaity check welcome Oct 20 19:54:11 thiago_home: it does not matter. Oct 20 19:54:28 normal users do not about dependencies on linux, at least the newbies :) Oct 20 19:54:50 but an advanced hardcore hacker geek can require that to remove QtXML. Oct 20 19:55:00 users don't care about dependencies Oct 20 19:55:01 if that is not needed by the system by default. Oct 20 19:55:07 it gets installed, that's it Oct 20 19:55:08 I care about. Oct 20 19:55:41 you're not a typical user Oct 20 19:55:48 typical users won't know those extra dependencies even got installed Oct 20 19:56:06 it is not a reason to say for my team leader for instance :P Oct 20 19:56:18 I feel that. Oct 20 19:56:52 tell me the last time you installed an app on MeeGo and gave up because it required other dependencies you didn't want to install Oct 20 19:56:55 there are still people using tile window managers and so on. Oct 20 19:57:19 completely irrelevant Oct 20 19:57:24 why are you changing the subject? Oct 20 19:57:39 when a user tries to install an app, the package manager will simply install the dependencies Oct 20 19:57:48 the user won't even know that dependencies got installed Oct 20 19:57:50 I am not sure it is distinct, the point is here the lightweight thing. Oct 20 19:57:59 what lightweight thing? Oct 20 19:58:27 lightweight solutions. Oct 20 19:58:28 how to sacrifice a package to the meego's repo? Oct 20 19:58:42 what lightweight solutions? Oct 20 19:58:47 rittk: huh? Oct 20 19:58:59 thiago_home: I do not see the point of your question. Oct 20 19:59:04 rittk: you need 3 herrings, 2 sticks of incense and a penguin feather Oct 20 19:59:06 I don't see the point of your argument Oct 20 19:59:24 there are people liking lightweight solutions... Oct 20 19:59:30 what is the question about this ? Oct 20 19:59:30 irrelevant Oct 20 19:59:32 this is #meego Oct 20 19:59:38 all MeeGo devices will have all Qt modules (except for Qt3Support) Oct 20 19:59:49 and there are people who like building heavyweight solutions Oct 20 19:59:50 Ubuntu has got gnome installation Oct 20 19:59:55 irrelevant Oct 20 20:00:00 guess which ones prevail here Oct 20 20:00:00 Ubuntu is not MeeGo Oct 20 20:00:02 but there are a couple of users using ratpoison Oct 20 20:00:10 so they drop, remove gnome Oct 20 20:00:15 thiago_home: I've built the Midnight Commander and ntfs-3g since I mess them on meego Oct 20 20:00:19 and I am thinking of about the same on meego Oct 20 20:00:24 * CosmoHill offers popcorn Oct 20 20:00:33 whether an advanced user can drop qt modules. Oct 20 20:00:35 thiago_home: now, I'd prefer to contribute them to official repo Oct 20 20:00:36 djszapi: all MeeGo devices will have all Qt modules, plus Qt Mobility modules working, plus some more Oct 20 20:00:38 that was my first question :) Oct 20 20:00:39 djszapi: you can replace the user interface, sure, but if you swap out Qt you aren't using MeeGo anymore Oct 20 20:00:42 djszapi: the user cannot Oct 20 20:00:53 any device with any Qt module missing is not MeeGo Oct 20 20:00:54 wmarone: this is not about the interface at all Oct 20 20:00:58 QtXML is not interface Oct 20 20:01:05 the use of the brand "MeeGo" requires having all Qt modules installed Oct 20 20:01:07 djszapi: that's what it sounds like to me, what with all your offtopic examples Oct 20 20:01:09 or available, at least Oct 20 20:01:19 * RST38h hehes at that Oct 20 20:01:27 RST38h: if there are heavyweight people, it does not mean there are no lightweight people. Oct 20 20:01:30 djszapi: yes, a user can install Android on their devices. So what? Oct 20 20:01:31 the people are different. Oct 20 20:01:39 if people install a different OS, it's their problem Oct 20 20:01:47 you're targeting MeeGo. MeeGo has Qt. Oct 20 20:01:49 problem solved. Oct 20 20:02:08 djszapi: heavweight people have got bigger impulse :) Oct 20 20:02:13 Ubuntu has got Gnome. Oct 20 20:02:19 MeeGo doesn't Oct 20 20:02:21 nor KDE for that matter Oct 20 20:02:26 couple of people do not use that. Oct 20 20:02:31 Anyway, I do not see your insistence to have Qtless Meego Oct 20 20:02:45 * thiago_home gives up Oct 20 20:02:49 Qt is the whole point of MeeGo, isn't it? Oct 20 20:02:52 Meego is simply a Linux distro. You can use any Linux distro you like. Oct 20 20:02:56 I've explained this more than once Oct 20 20:03:09 wmarone: Not really, but don't tell that to thiago :) Oct 20 20:03:09 wmarone: well, not the whole point, but a good portion of the point Oct 20 20:03:13 wmarone: there are other points :-) Oct 20 20:03:15 right Oct 20 20:03:18 RST38h: you still did not understand the point :) Oct 20 20:03:22 it is not a distribution question Oct 20 20:03:26 djszapi: it is Oct 20 20:03:31 MeeGo is a distribuion. MeeGo has Qt. Oct 20 20:03:32 it is more like whether I can safely use qt modules Oct 20 20:03:36 all devices called "MeeGo" have Qt. Oct 20 20:03:37 whether I can tell that to my boss Oct 20 20:03:43 we should use QtXML for parsing Oct 20 20:03:43 djszapi: YOu can Oct 20 20:03:48 whether it is safe solution Oct 20 20:03:50 and you shouldn't use QtXml for parsing Oct 20 20:03:54 or we should write our own parser. Oct 20 20:03:57 djszapi: Is that all you wanted to know? Oct 20 20:04:18 thiago_home: ubuntu is a distribution Oct 20 20:04:20 ubuntu has gnome. Oct 20 20:04:24 djszapi: ubuntu is not meego Oct 20 20:04:27 this is the #meego channel Oct 20 20:04:30 we're talking about meego Oct 20 20:04:35 pink floyd has this song lost for words and the lyrics at the end go "you know you just can't win" Oct 20 20:04:38 ubuntu is off-topic Oct 20 20:05:02 off-topic in that way you think of that. Oct 20 20:05:17 off topic in that this is not Ubuntu Oct 20 20:05:19 but it is a good example for the people who would like to create a minimal Meego environment on their devices Oct 20 20:05:24 so I tested MMC installation of Meego on N900 but app startup times were like 30-60 seconds, is it just MMC generally being really slow causing it? Oct 20 20:05:30 plz stop Oct 20 20:05:31 djszapi: what is you question? shortly Oct 20 20:05:35 djszapi: minimal MeeGo environment CONTAINS Qt Oct 20 20:05:35 if someone screws up their os it's their own choice Oct 20 20:05:37 djszapi: all of Qt Oct 20 20:05:41 they can remove libc as well Oct 20 20:05:45 djszapi: the most minimal MeeGo (MeeGo Core) contains Qt Oct 20 20:05:54 djszapi: you cannot remove ANY module from MeeGo Oct 20 20:06:02 what will happen ? Oct 20 20:06:10 if you do, it's not MeeGo anymore Oct 20 20:06:11 you aren't meego anymore Oct 20 20:06:18 if I remove qtxml for example. Oct 20 20:06:23 then you don't have meego Oct 20 20:06:25 and then we don't care Oct 20 20:06:26 wmarone: you still did not get the point Oct 20 20:06:30 you done broked it Oct 20 20:06:34 it is not that question whether it is meego Oct 20 20:06:34 I think thiago_home's point if the Legal definition of MeeGo Oct 20 20:06:35 this is #meego. We're talking about MeeGo. MeeGo has all of Qt modules. Oct 20 20:06:47 it is the question whether is lightweight meego. Oct 20 20:06:51 this is #meego. We're talking about MeeGo. MeeGo has all of Qt modules. Oct 20 20:06:55 do you need me to repeat a third time? Oct 20 20:07:05 thiago_home: go away and have a cup of tea or something Oct 20 20:07:07 djszapi: the lighest meego gets is exactly what thiago_home just said Oct 20 20:07:12 lightest* Oct 20 20:07:13 * RST38h finds this course of discussion disturbing Oct 20 20:07:27 yay it's DawnFoster to save the day Oct 20 20:07:47 CosmoHill: yeah, I'm just gonna go away for a while Oct 20 20:07:54 uh oh. I'm afraid to ask what you guys have been up to :) Oct 20 20:08:21 thiago_home is going to have a cup of tea or something AFK Oct 20 20:08:25 DawnFoster: I still haven't found dark chocolate for you Oct 20 20:08:30 and djszapi is going to stop asking about meego and qt modules Oct 20 20:08:32 :) Oct 20 20:08:48 thiago_home: that's OK, you can buy me a drink in Dublin :) Oct 20 20:09:02 i think chocolate might be cheaper Oct 20 20:09:43 DawnFoster: oh, I'll be in Portland next week. That's why I was thinking of bringing chocolate to you. To thank for all the help here and in the Conference organisation. Oct 20 20:10:30 thiago_home: why should not I use qt for xml handling ? Oct 20 20:10:43 thiago_home: oh cool - what are you doing in Portland? Visiting us at Intel? Oct 20 20:10:54 I have already done it several times, nifty :) Oct 20 20:11:07 djszapi: i think his point is that definition of meego is that is has all the Qt modules Oct 20 20:11:26 CosmoHill: it is already another question ... Oct 20 20:11:31 like the definition of a convertable is that the roof folds down Oct 20 20:11:48 djszapi: you shouldn't but you ca :) Oct 20 20:11:54 DawnFoster: yep, that plus another company in Portland Oct 20 20:11:55 *can Oct 20 20:12:02 from a software point of view bugger all will happen if you remove one Qt module Oct 20 20:12:06 rittk: should not ? Oct 20 20:12:12 I'll be in the US for almost 2 weeks this time. Record for me. Oct 20 20:12:19 longest since I went to Disney when I was 13 Oct 20 20:12:19 CosmoHill: you said me to stop and you continue ... Oct 20 20:12:29 I'm trying to end it Oct 20 20:12:33 thiago_home: nice - when do you get into Portland? (We have a BarCamp on Saturday you might be interested in attending) Oct 20 20:12:36 thank you. Oct 20 20:12:45 http://barcampportland.org/ Oct 20 20:12:47 DawnFoster: I arrive on Wednesday 27 and leave on the 29 Oct 20 20:13:02 so..everyone ready for the snow? Oct 20 20:13:06 thiago_home: did you mean the core module is enough for that ? Or what did you mean with this xml handling ? Oct 20 20:13:11 CosmoHill: it's already -4°C here Oct 20 20:13:21 djszapi: QtCore has QXmlStreamReader and you should use that Oct 20 20:13:27 thiago_home: sounds like the right temperature to me ;) Oct 20 20:13:27 yes, of course Oct 20 20:13:38 but I need feature from QtXML :P Oct 20 20:13:40 w00t_: dropping to -7 until tomorrow morning Oct 20 20:13:48 djszapi: QXmlStreamReader is all you need :-) Oct 20 20:13:55 :) k then. Oct 20 20:14:03 thiago_home: let me know when you are going to be at Intel (I work from home a lot, but can come in the office) Oct 20 20:14:16 DawnFoster: Thursday 28 afternoon and Friday 29 Oct 20 20:14:26 DawnFoster: but I'll send you an email closer to that Oct 20 20:14:58 thiago_home: I'll probably be in the office both of those days for other meetings. Oct 20 20:15:03 * thiago_home ponders that this stay which is his longest since he want to Disney also starts with Orlando Oct 20 20:15:06 so I'll see you then! Oct 20 20:15:17 DawnFoster: yup Oct 20 20:15:23 DawnFoster: any Qt goodies or freebies you'd like? Oct 20 20:15:37 * thiago_home can bring stickers, pens, reflectors Oct 20 20:15:58 can someone give me a list about the installed packages on MeeGo by default ? Oct 20 20:15:58 thiago_home: stickers are always good :) Oct 20 20:16:05 DawnFoster: I'll bring a bunch then Oct 20 20:16:10 just to make sure what I can use safely :P Oct 20 20:16:26 moo jebba Oct 20 20:16:29 heya Oct 20 20:16:30 :) Oct 20 20:16:57 so how is it a file like repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/daily/core/repos/source/binutils-2.20.51.0.2-12.44.src.rpm gets added to trunk today, but the last %changelog is from like May? odd. Oct 20 20:17:08 jebba: *.changes file? Oct 20 20:17:19 djszapi, though still draft, you might like to check http://wiki.meego.com/Quality/Compliance#Specification Oct 20 20:17:20 or a rebuild only? Oct 20 20:17:37 jebba: that's a 404 for me though Oct 20 20:17:51 well, like *.changes, but i mean: rpm -qp --changelog repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/daily/core/repos/source/binutils-2.20.51.0.2-12.44.src.rpm Oct 20 20:17:52 Stskeeps: didn't for me Oct 20 20:18:08 i'm rsyncing from mirrors.kernel.org fwiw Oct 20 20:18:10 ah, the rpm file did 404 Oct 20 20:18:30 araujo: ty Oct 20 20:18:32 lbt: may I PM you? Oct 20 20:18:35 jebba: checking Oct 20 20:19:05 http://mirrors.kernel.org/meego/builds/trunk/daily/core/repos/source/binutils-2.20.51.0.2-12.46.src.rpm Oct 20 20:20:02 * jebba notes may have looked at old file 1 sec Oct 20 20:21:10 ya, above i did -12-44, not -12-46, but it's still the same ;) Oct 20 20:22:18 for clarity, this file was added today, but no %changelog; repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/daily/core/repos/source/binutils-2.20.51.0.2-12.46.src.rpm Oct 20 20:22:56 jebba: 12.46 is commitid (in obs).rebuildid - http://pastie.org/1236420 Oct 20 20:23:13 the srcrpm version follows the binary version Oct 20 20:23:19 as it's generated in same run Oct 20 20:24:17 so you'll see it as a 'new rpm' but it's in fact the same old Oct 20 20:24:32 * CosmoHill pokes thiago_home and arjan Oct 20 20:24:52 ah, just bumped. In fedora when they do mass rebuilds/bumping, they note it in the changelog Oct 20 20:25:18 wow, I just now see that- Oct 20 20:25:23 http://meego.com/community/blogs/harrihakulinen/2010/meego-calling-n900 Oct 20 20:25:35 1.3 with dual booting to meego?? Stskeeps you have been busy! Oct 20 20:25:44 the problem with bumps in the clog Oct 20 20:25:45 like this, for example: Oct 20 20:25:47 * Tue Feb 19 2008 Fedora Release Engineering - 0.18-2 Oct 20 20:25:47 - Autorebuild for GCC 4.3 Oct 20 20:25:53 is that the OBS rebuilds far too much Oct 20 20:26:01 (for that purpose) Oct 20 20:28:17 " I am proud to announce that we will propose Carsten as the official N900 maintainer for MeeGo in the next TSG meeting. I am fully confident that he is the best single person on this planet to handle that position" < no kidding on that Oct 20 20:30:43 anyone who hasn't voted on the community OBS sub-domain please vote now here: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=1671 Oct 20 20:30:52 you have about 10 ~ 30 minutes Oct 20 20:31:05 i seriously dislike the cobs and pub :S Oct 20 20:31:09 * araujo goes for it Oct 20 20:31:18 but gonna vote Oct 20 20:31:21 vote for cobs Oct 20 20:31:24 vote what what you want Oct 20 20:31:31 you can make suggestions Oct 20 20:31:33 no, given the limited time ... Oct 20 20:31:41 huh why 10-30 min? it's open until 11-09-10 ! Oct 20 20:31:53 so far nobody has given a suggestion AND selected *other* Oct 20 20:31:54 not anymore :) Oct 20 20:32:09 th0br0: yeah, it turns out you can't edit a poll once you've made one Oct 20 20:32:11 is com.meego.com in use? Oct 20 20:33:00 the poll is a guide for the the sub-domain, the winning vote might not be used Oct 20 20:33:07 oh Oct 20 20:33:19 well, pub it is for me. although that reminds me of an ftp dir :( Oct 20 20:33:35 or rather that there is a *.priv.meego.com Oct 20 20:33:41 for example "dev" which I'm sure someone has just voted for probably won't be used since developer.meego.com exsits Oct 20 20:34:00 hey lets name it after the competition Oct 20 20:34:22 we've had "extra" and "contib" or something like that suggestede Oct 20 20:34:25 or something completely non-sensical Oct 20 20:34:33 like auki ? :D Oct 20 20:34:38 build.xkcd.meego.com ? Oct 20 20:37:57 lbt, I liked that one ... Oct 20 20:38:24 looks like pub. Oct 20 20:38:42 though it seems there is another favorite one :P Oct 20 20:39:07 dev is a no-no Oct 20 20:39:12 so don't bother :) Oct 20 20:39:15 definitely Oct 20 20:39:36 actually I didn't like the rest .... Oct 20 20:40:14 cobs seems straight and with a reasonable meaning .... anyway, let the community to decide :P Oct 20 20:40:36 yes, please don't vote for dev Oct 20 21:13:10 * CosmoHill clears his throat Oct 20 21:14:01 I'm Cosmo Hill and i've been running a poll for the selection of the Community OBS sub-domain name for just over 2 weeks Oct 20 21:14:22 this is a short-list of sub-domains that where suggested on the forum and on IRC Oct 20 21:15:03 28 votes overall were placed Oct 20 21:15:33 6 of which are for "dev" which will be ignored since "dev" is no longer available Oct 20 21:16:00 1st with 9 votes: "pub" Oct 20 21:16:10 2nd with 7 votes: "cobs" Oct 20 21:16:31 joint 3rd with 3 votes each: "community" and "apps" Oct 20 21:16:49 none of the other suggestions received any votes Oct 20 21:17:51 that is all Oct 20 21:19:13 auki Oct 20 21:19:38 it's auke, not auki Oct 20 21:19:42 auki received no votes Oct 20 21:19:50 no one wanted auki ;) Oct 20 21:19:54 poor auki Oct 20 21:19:55 * thiago_home wants auki Oct 20 21:19:55 they all want auke Oct 20 21:20:01 actually I like it but I've not voted Oct 20 21:20:35 auki is Finnish for "open" Oct 20 21:20:50 no it's not, we had this discussion, it means "on" Oct 20 21:20:58 * csdb thinks of bread everytime cobs is mentioned Oct 20 21:21:18 ok, it means "on" Oct 20 21:21:19 what Oct 20 21:21:50 oh crap it acutally does mean "open" Oct 20 21:22:08 sorry thiago_home Oct 20 21:22:45 how you came up with it meaning "on"? Oct 20 21:22:51 yes. Oct 20 21:23:14 well, my water tap says "Auki On / Kiini Off" Oct 20 21:23:15 ovi on auki == door is open :) Oct 20 21:23:42 thiago_home: yes. wrongly translated :) Oct 20 21:23:50 open / closed Oct 20 21:23:52 Jartza: well, not a literal translation :-) Oct 20 21:24:00 that would be correct Oct 20 21:24:56 if we're going for random finnish phrases, there's "Ei saa peitää" Oct 20 21:24:58 finnish is nice :) Oct 20 21:25:12 thiago_home: do not cover Oct 20 21:25:24 peittää, you mean? Oct 20 21:25:30 yes Oct 20 21:25:46 * araujo likes finnish pronunciation Oct 20 21:25:50 my preferred is "Käyhän että tuon kannettavani saunaan" Oct 20 21:25:50 auki means open, but not like open source :) Oct 20 21:26:09 ovi store perse auki Oct 20 21:26:18 * araujo managed to order food in finnish in subway when he was there Oct 20 21:26:23 it means some THING is open. open source = avoin lähdekoodi :) Oct 20 21:26:39 Jartza: so it's probably a good thing nobody voted for it Oct 20 21:26:49 thiago_home: :D Oct 20 21:27:08 CosmoHill: yeah. I don't know why anyone would want that. Oct 20 21:27:22 I could've understood "avoin" Oct 20 21:27:44 they're thoses annoying home sales people Oct 20 21:28:09 yeah. "ovi auki!" == open the door! Oct 20 21:28:11 :D Oct 20 21:28:47 if I'm honest, after my little presentation bit I was expected the community OBS sub-domain to be selected Oct 20 21:29:02 how about persaukinen for subdomain name Oct 20 21:29:23 I'm not even going to try and read that Oct 20 21:30:55 and I'm not even trying to translate it Oct 20 21:31:02 "flat broke" ? Oct 20 21:31:33 flat broke sounds accurate Oct 20 21:33:53 Stskeeps: please could you update the IRC stats? Oct 20 21:34:49 hm, any plans to replace banshee with something other? Oct 20 21:35:20 why? Oct 20 21:35:26 is it not working? Oct 20 21:35:35 because of mono/sharp :) Oct 20 21:35:51 too many dependencies for a single package) Oct 20 21:36:29 * auke spams irc some more Oct 20 21:36:52 and yes, its buggy Oct 20 21:37:20 closing banshee while it plays movie doesn't stops it Oct 20 21:37:57 so, you're looking at the empty desktop and listen some voices Oct 20 21:38:14 yup Oct 20 21:38:32 cool, ghost voices Oct 20 21:38:40 known issue, yeah, but it sux anyways Oct 20 21:59:37 http://slashdot.org/story/10/10/20/1958209/UK-To-Track-All-Browsing-Email-and-Phone-Calls "The UK government plans to introduce legislation that will allow the police to track every phone call, email, text message and website visit made by the public. The information will include who is contacting whom, when and where and which websites are visited, but not the content of the conversations or messages. Every communications provider will be req Oct 20 22:01:02 pupnik: there's an easy solution to that: make everyone's computer randomly crawl the entire internet Oct 20 22:01:43 ssh tunnel to a US server you say? Oct 20 22:01:46 auke: that thought crossed my mind as well Oct 20 22:31:13 * qgil had no clue NTFS was yet another "Finnish thing"! http://www.tuxera.com/about-us/ Oct 20 22:31:47 good morning qgil :) Oct 20 22:31:53 qgil: this is the linux implementation - not the MS one :) Oct 20 22:32:22 Robot101: clearly he chose the superior solution Oct 20 22:32:32 .... the one with no write option ;) Oct 20 22:33:01 lbt good "morning" - are you in Australia or...? Oct 20 22:33:24 no... but I thought you were clearly pre-coffee :P Oct 20 22:33:40 lbt I'm post-ignorance :) Oct 20 22:33:46 isn't it dawn over there... Oct 20 22:33:58 15:29 lbt Oct 20 22:34:10 mmm ... I guess it's late here Oct 20 22:34:14 but! Oct 20 22:34:19 late and a bit cold Oct 20 22:34:24 we have progress on the community OBS Oct 20 22:34:34 CosmoHill has chosen a name for it ;) Oct 20 22:34:57 (oh, and we're moving ahead on the LDAP thing... you probably see the emails on those) Oct 20 22:35:14 CosmoHill: so what's in a name? Oct 20 22:35:18 is it open? i havent been following everything. Oct 20 22:35:18 "pub" Oct 20 22:35:30 jebba: working hard on it Oct 20 22:35:37 jebba: you're up to date Oct 20 22:35:46 this is the latest stuff now Oct 20 22:35:55 "cobs" came in second Oct 20 22:35:59 jebba: I just setup http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/XenNetworking ... the bottom diagram Oct 20 22:36:38 with xen though? hmm. Oct 20 22:37:23 CosmoHill: will we see the "pub" in Dublin? B) Oct 20 22:37:41 qgil: seems like a good place to announce it Oct 20 22:37:48 an Irish pub Oct 20 22:37:50 you will see many pubs, the winner is the person who remembers the most the following day Oct 20 22:38:07 jebba: yes... xen... the leading virtualisation solution. Oct 20 22:38:18 that sounded like a slogan Oct 20 22:38:35 "virtualises your VMs with a brighter virtualisation you can really feel" Oct 20 22:38:56 (and it sucks less than kvm) Oct 20 22:39:30 the last part sounds like getting burnt by a desk light Oct 20 22:40:41 except if you want to use a normal kernel or anything. is a bit dated seems to me. But ec2 is nice... Oct 20 22:41:05 jebba: but you don't want a normal kernel... paravirt rulez Oct 20 22:41:29 for server deployed VMs at least Oct 20 22:41:59 you can do all that with kvm too (virtio etc) Oct 20 22:42:11 yes, they are catching up ;) Oct 20 22:42:53 I tried VMware Oct 20 22:42:59 * lbt sighs Oct 20 22:42:59 it was painful Oct 20 22:43:18 that computer just sits there now unplugged and unused Oct 20 22:44:11 lbt: xen is still patched in, no? Perhaps i'm a bit dated here.... Oct 20 22:45:00 jebba: tbh, it could be... but I'm running debian Xen domU on Suse Dom0 and it's good Oct 20 22:45:12 I really have no worries about either one Oct 20 22:45:33 it just happens to be all setup and scripted with xen Oct 20 22:45:40 so go with it Oct 20 22:47:55 ah. I have xen instances on amazon and i dont even see how to cleanly/easily update the kernel. kvm is brainless. Oct 20 22:48:41 xen kernels (usually) live outside the VM Oct 20 22:48:58 saves messing around faking bootloaders Oct 20 22:49:29 again, for a server this is cool... to do a desktop emulator that's indistinguishable from raw metal... not so much Oct 20 22:53:40 cyas Oct 20 22:56:06 question for yah experts... on branding packages for ivi (from 1.0.99) install directory is /usr/share/themes/meego/meegotouch/meego*/images while the app install is to /usr/share/themes/base/meegotouch/meego*/ is this intended? Oct 20 23:20:21 smithna, it is Oct 20 23:20:49 think of /usr/share/themes/meego as an overlay for /usr/share/themes/base Oct 20 23:44:25 * smithna wonders why the apps couldn't find thier respective theme pictures Oct 21 00:48:02 i just got http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_SDK_with_Xephyr under F12 x86_64... do i always run as "root" on the meego, or can I login as a regular user? Oct 21 00:49:45 apparently, this counts as "Intel Graphics" despite no mention of intel: "http://wiki.meego.com/MeeGo_SDK_with_Xephyr" Oct 21 00:49:53 oops 01:05.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc Radeon HD 3300 Graphics **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Oct 21 02:59:57 2010