**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Nov 06 02:59:57 2010
Nov 06 03:36:40 <GAN900> lcuk, Sunday morning around 9 AM.
Nov 06 03:44:25 <hvenus> Hello, MeeGo.
Nov 06 07:07:04 <IanWizard> I'm new to meego, and looking into a project based on it.  Does it support CDMA out of the box?  Is that a stupid question?
Nov 06 07:17:26 <Bostik> IanWizard: not a stupid question, but isn't CDMA a radio frequency technique?
Nov 06 07:18:25 <IanWizard> Yes, it's what Sprint uses, I'd like to develop (or rather test) this project on my Evo, which uses CDMA.  I wanted to know if MeeGo handset supported CDMA.
Nov 06 07:18:58 <IanWizard> If it had the software support for it, since it's more than just a driver.
Nov 06 07:19:12 <Bostik> that goes to hardware and drivers, and if history is any guide, the cellular drivers will be binary-only modules
Nov 06 07:19:24 <dm8tbr> IanWizard: the question is rather, will meego support the modem/phone hardware in particular
Nov 06 07:19:43 <dm8tbr> what Bostik said!
Nov 06 07:20:25 <IanWizard> well, not exactly, because there is the networking layer for CDMA, which is different than GSM, or just TCP/IP.  There's all of the negotiation with the tower.
Nov 06 07:20:47 <dm8tbr> which is never done by the OS
Nov 06 07:21:49 <dm8tbr> that's most likely some blob that runs either directly on that chipset or in your userspace and you know nothing about it
Nov 06 07:22:05 <IanWizard> it's done by a middleware layer usually, which is part of the software that would be with the OS.  like freesmartphone.org
Nov 06 07:22:39 <IanWizard> it's not a big deal, it's not like it needs the cellular support immediatly anyway
Nov 06 07:24:03 <dm8tbr> IanWizard: the page you linked then shows that all it does is talk AT to the GSM stack
Nov 06 07:25:27 <Bostik> CDMA for radio frequency is on the same level as ethernet is for wired and wlan for wireless
Nov 06 07:26:07 <IanWizard> yes
Nov 06 07:26:27 <IanWizard> It's ok, Thank you for your support guys.
Nov 06 07:28:03 <dm8tbr> in other words if there is a reasonable way to talk to the 'cdma' stack it is possible
Nov 06 07:29:34 <Bostik> a quick look at wikipedia actually gave a hint; the generic name "CDMA" is sometimes applied to cmdaOne and CDMA2000 access technologies
Nov 06 07:30:13 <Bostik> "[...] should not be confused with the mobile phone standards called cdmaOne and CDMA2000 (which are often referred to as simply CDMA), which use CDMA as an underlying channel access method."
Nov 06 07:31:12 <Bostik> since the network in question was Sprint, we're probably talking about US -> whether the operator rolls out meego devices is up to them
Nov 06 07:31:30 <IanWizard> that's interesting, I thought that cdma2000 was the version of cdma
Nov 06 07:32:04 <IanWizard> yes, but I was kind of trying to port MeeGo over to it (my Evo)
Nov 06 07:32:17 <IanWizard> and then I was going to start building on that
Nov 06 07:33:38 <IanWizard> while I'm here, I'm on a netbook with Nvidia Ion, and no VT.  Is there any way I can emulate properly?
Nov 06 07:33:41 <Bostik> you probably could get meego (core) up and running but I somehow doubt that you could get full cellular access yet
Nov 06 07:34:45 <IanWizard> I don't want to try and get it to run in a VM by forcing it somehow. (though I doubt that I could)
Nov 06 07:39:21 <Bostik> I'd guess you won't get the qemu systems running on that but you can at least port your software to meego on a virtualbox instance, with the netbook image as your starting point
Nov 06 07:40:32 <IanWizard> Bostik: yeah, I've had netbook running, but I was trying to get handset;  guess there's no big difference anyway, except for UI
Nov 06 07:41:05 <Bostik> yup
Nov 06 07:46:19 <dm8tbr> IanWizard: evo. I think that runs android. you'd then have to take the phone RIL and reverse that to create support for that hardware in meego
Nov 06 07:47:00 <IanWizard> RIL?
Nov 06 07:47:08 <IanWizard> yes, it's android
Nov 06 07:47:24 <IanWizard> And 4g, but I'm not even touching that
Nov 06 07:47:40 <dm8tbr> there is no 4G hardware
Nov 06 07:49:16 <IanWizard> ???  you mean in meego?  'cause it is a 4g phone, and I'm pretty sure that it's its own radio
Nov 06 07:49:56 <dm8tbr> no, there is the marketing term 4G, but there are no devices conforming to fourth generation mobile networks as specified by the ITU
Nov 06 07:51:31 <IanWizard> umm.... Ok, I'll take your word for that, but it is real (the phone), and it is much faster.
Nov 06 07:51:54 <dm8tbr> yes, go complain to marketing. they mislabeled it
Nov 06 07:52:04 <dm8tbr> oh you are in the US. just go sue their pants off
Nov 06 07:52:22 <dm8tbr> yes, but it's just HSPA or something like that
Nov 06 07:52:39 <dm8tbr> which is part of the third generation networks family
Nov 06 07:53:29 <IanWizard> OH,
Nov 06 07:53:34 <IanWizard> I had no idea,
Nov 06 07:53:39 <IanWizard> I've been scammed
Nov 06 07:53:43 <IanWizard> ;)
Nov 06 07:53:51 <dm8tbr> yes, gogogo get a lawyer ;)
Nov 06 07:54:10 <dm8tbr> it's a texbook marketing screwup
Nov 06 07:54:15 <IanWizard> I don't think I'd win
Nov 06 07:54:25 <IanWizard> they probably disclosed it somewhere
Nov 06 07:54:35 <IanWizard> and said that I couldn't sue them
Nov 06 07:54:36 <dm8tbr> /. just ran an article
Nov 06 07:55:11 <dm8tbr> there might be a chance they'll all get into trouble for false advertizing
Nov 06 07:55:43 <IanWizard> I just found the article
Nov 06 07:56:05 * IanWizard says as he hits his Chrome to  Phone button
Nov 06 07:56:30 <IanWizard> I cant believe this
Nov 06 07:56:44 <IanWizard> so all of this network hype was all just a scam
Nov 06 07:57:04 <IanWizard> I should dig up those papers that I signed
Nov 06 07:57:22 <IanWizard> maybe I can get a class action in there
Nov 06 07:57:49 <IanWizard> dm8tbr: btw, if you're not US, then where are you?
Nov 06 08:02:07 <dm8tbr> IanWizard: old europe
Nov 06 08:17:53 <erani> does there exist any logs for the deb/rpm choosing process when it was still active with meego? I'd like to read those if there are any :I
Nov 06 08:19:39 <erani> just my curiosity...
Nov 06 08:25:24 <Stskeeps> there's been plenty discussions over time
Nov 06 08:26:58 <erani> Stskeeps: yes, I believe that. I just wondered if there's any kind of official statement why rpm was picked over deb. Not that it really matters, but I'm just curious to know :)
Nov 06 08:40:19 <Stskeeps> erani: if you promise just to say 'ok' and not discuss rpm vs deb or rpm vs apt, i'll explain quickly :)
Nov 06 08:42:28 <erani> :D ok
Nov 06 08:44:37 <Stskeeps> erani: so, it starts with the merger of moblin and maemo. maemo's base system was debian based and not because of that, it was crap and ancient. moblin had a quite lean and mean base system, based upon rpm. in addition to that, there was a set of tools tailored towards RPM, such as OBS, the image creator, QA tools as well as other things that already existed and was made for rpm. as well as the existence of zypper, which's quite fast ...
Nov 06 08:44:44 <Stskeeps> ... for package retrivial. while many would say that debian has all those, they tend to forget those tools are fairly tied to debian.org infrastructure and when used outside the debian project, they have to be heavily modded.. so it basically was a choice between technological ability
Nov 06 08:45:35 <Stskeeps> personal story: i used debian tools for similar purpose as meego targets for over a year in the Mer project, and frankly.. i actually like rpms and the toolset around it better now :)
Nov 06 08:46:42 <Stskeeps> so, that's why meego is rpm and not deb
Nov 06 08:46:42 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 06 08:52:07 <jarkkom> I saw some meego being mentioned as well in news about ubuntu unity/wayland, is that some kind of official plan or just bloggers taking things out of context?
Nov 06 09:01:57 <Stskeeps> jarkkom: well, wayland's mostly a intel project i think
Nov 06 09:02:13 <Stskeeps> i think there's going to be a small unconference session on the topic on conference
Nov 06 09:11:03 <shinta42> is N900 considered a good device to use MEEGO?
Nov 06 09:17:09 <erani> Stskeeps: thanks! :)
Nov 06 09:17:15 <Stskeeps> np
Nov 06 09:42:46 <tolbrino> hi there, I'm trying to install MeeGo 1.1 on a asus eeepc, but the installation process crashes with the following error "ISOFS: Unable to identify CD-ROM format." Any hint what I could have done wrong?
Nov 06 09:49:07 <tolbrino> I've written the img file to a usb stick on a mac 10.6
Nov 06 10:08:02 <Stskeeps> lbt: my lone 512mb OBS machine is able to churn 300 ARM packages in a day :)
Nov 06 10:08:08 <Stskeeps> down at 150 scheduled packages, starting from 1000
Nov 06 10:08:43 <lbt> X-Fade was working on the i/o
Nov 06 10:08:54 <lbt> I've not had chance to catch up this week - real work
Nov 06 10:08:56 <Stskeeps> :nod:
Nov 06 10:09:24 <Stskeeps> i've been bootstrapping meego hardfp packages so the armv6+vfp run was a alpha test to see how much it can handle
Nov 06 10:09:26 <lbt> can/will you use the community one
Nov 06 10:09:36 <lbt> your account is up
Nov 06 10:09:40 <Stskeeps> for armv6+vfp? possibly
Nov 06 10:10:17 <Stskeeps> but let's see..
Nov 06 10:12:28 <Stskeeps> we do need to experiment with some OBS changes and bootstrap somewhere else than build.meego.com (too rigid - we need to keep that one stable)
Nov 06 10:12:46 <Stskeeps> so it's either internal obs or community obs :P
Nov 06 14:44:52 <shinta42> how is the N900 for meego?
Nov 06 14:55:08 <dneary> hi
Nov 06 15:54:02 <RST38h> moo?
Nov 06 15:55:18 <CosmoHill> burger?
Nov 06 16:09:57 * lbt prods the OBS more ... looking alive
Nov 06 16:10:12 <lbt> any developers care?
Nov 06 16:10:37 * Stskeeps passes lbt a good cider
Nov 06 16:10:38 <CosmoHill> wasn't it walk like a zombie day recently?
Nov 06 16:10:56 <lbt> Stskeeps: not when I'm doing remote iptables
Nov 06 16:11:02 <lbt> :D
Nov 06 16:11:41 <lbt> although I bought a new blend of Drambuie last week... so later...
Nov 06 16:12:55 <lcuk> CosmoHill, thats called halloween, it happens every year :P
Nov 06 16:42:15 <gass> hello there
Nov 06 16:42:28 <recklesswaltz> hello
Nov 06 16:42:32 <gass> i am not able to run meego live cd on qemu
Nov 06 16:42:40 <gass> is there any help on this?
Nov 06 16:43:02 <recklesswaltz> Have you searched the forums?
Nov 06 16:43:04 <lcuk> gass, you could tell us hat actually happens
Nov 06 16:43:15 * lcuk tried to take a photo of a cd and get it to run once
Nov 06 16:43:53 <gass> lcuk, i am trying to produce a screenshot
Nov 06 16:46:06 <gass> recklesswaltz, yea
Nov 06 16:46:12 <gass> lcuk, recklesswaltz http://otiliamatos.ath.cx/~gass/meego_boot.png
Nov 06 16:46:27 * pixelgeek poking at meego 1.1 on virtualbox - not quite there yet
Nov 06 16:47:12 <gass> this is running live cd, but instalation only does the same
Nov 06 16:47:27 <gass> pixelgeek, what image are you using?
Nov 06 16:47:40 <pixelgeek> the netbook 1.1 one
Nov 06 16:49:01 <gass> i get an error
Nov 06 16:49:03 <gass> in qemu
Nov 06 16:49:20 <gass> about the graphics board i think ... i915
Nov 06 16:50:00 <ferringb> fabo_: poke
Nov 06 16:50:51 <lcuk> gass, hmm that looks a bit odd
Nov 06 16:51:13 <gass> lcuk, humm ... it is booting ... sorry ... slow qemu
Nov 06 16:51:50 <pixelgeek> from irc logs - "Oct 09 01:09:05 <philipp64|laptop> ok, so the nightly builds require the i915/drm drivers and intel_agp to run, but the SDK 1.0.8 image doesn't? how are they build differently?"
Nov 06 16:52:10 <gass> pixelgeek, humm
Nov 06 16:53:11 <pixelgeek> still googling - Im sure Ive seen this discussed on the forum or irc before
Nov 06 16:53:29 * pixelgeek must fix his ' key
Nov 06 16:56:51 <gass> pixelgeek, maybe it needs accelerated graphics?
Nov 06 16:58:12 <pixelgeek> maybe - I don't know how the virtual environment handles that.
Nov 06 17:01:27 <gass> brb
Nov 06 17:02:13 <tybollt> hmm
Nov 06 17:02:20 <tybollt> so latest meeg is?
Nov 06 17:02:29 <CosmoHill> Meego does require 3D acceleration
Nov 06 17:02:48 <tybollt> CosmoHill: good thing n900 has a 3d chip then
Nov 06 17:02:51 <gass> CosmoHill, that's my problem as it seems
Nov 06 17:19:16 <CosmoHill> isn't there someone here who works for collabora?
Nov 06 17:19:24 <lcuk> \o
Nov 06 17:19:34 <lcuk> and many more
Nov 06 17:19:35 <gass> humm ... my problm is the lack of system support for kvm and then, the lack of support of accelerated graphics in qemu
Nov 06 17:20:37 <CosmoHill> just looking through my logs I've seen about 5 people so car
Nov 06 17:20:39 <CosmoHill> far*
Nov 06 17:20:41 <CosmoHill> lcuk, cool
Nov 06 17:21:31 <Myrtti> lcuk: have you peeps moved yet?
Nov 06 17:21:45 <lcuk> yes
Nov 06 17:22:02 <Myrtti> aw
Nov 06 17:30:02 <CosmoHill> lol I just saw this bug that someone filed: "Switch to SGHotKeysLib, since PTHotKey crashes like a mofo on 64-bit"
Nov 06 17:34:00 <lcuk> Myrtti, revdkathy spends a lot of time knitting things, are the pattersn you would use for your embroidery be compatible
Nov 06 17:39:37 <Myrtti> lcuk: I knit more than I embroider
Nov 06 17:40:09 <lcuk> Myrtti, :)
Nov 06 17:40:28 <lcuk> are you going to the conf?
Nov 06 17:40:54 <Myrtti> lcuk: nope
Nov 06 17:41:01 <lcuk> :(
Nov 06 18:26:53 <matgnt> hello. can i somehow get the meego UX working without 3D libs? i want to forward the UI from my beagleboard since i have no monitor to connect to it.
Nov 06 18:27:24 <CosmoHill> Meego requires 3D acceleration
Nov 06 18:27:45 <CosmoHill> could you not try X over ssh?
Nov 06 18:28:56 <javispedro> 3D acceleration over X... uh.
Nov 06 18:29:02 <javispedro> s/X/ssh
Nov 06 18:33:01 <matgnt> that's the reason i'm asking. so it seems there is no way to get the typical meego UI without a directly connected screen, right?
Nov 06 18:37:29 <CosmoHill> cyas, fireworks time :)
Nov 06 18:51:22 <pixelgeek> bit late for that, isn't it?
Nov 06 19:04:48 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer, will hostmode work on meego?
Nov 06 19:05:47 <alterego> lcuk: it will, but like maemo we have to supply a custom kernel as meego releases rely on upstream kernel.org accepted patches
Nov 06 19:06:38 <lcuk> alterego, so if this were wanted properly, the HEN hackers will have to polish the patch and make it fit in with existing proper procedures?
Nov 06 19:07:10 <alterego> lcuk: exactly.
Nov 06 19:07:53 <lcuk> sounds fair to me
Nov 06 19:07:59 <DocScrutinizer> lcuk: why not?
Nov 06 19:08:30 <lcuk> DocScrutinizer, just raising the question
Nov 06 19:08:57 <alterego> Probably better to ask in #meego-arm though ;)
Nov 06 19:09:02 <alterego> As it's N900 specific.
Nov 06 19:09:23 <DocScrutinizer> the hack will never go upstream, as it's too much working around braindamaged bugs specific for N900
Nov 06 19:09:25 <lcuk> alterego, really?
Nov 06 19:09:41 <alterego> DocScrutinizer: I think Stskeeps agrees with you there.
Nov 06 19:09:55 <lcuk> so in the netbook
Nov 06 19:09:56 <alterego> We're likely going to have to have a modded kernel image.
Nov 06 19:10:00 <lcuk> hostmode is normal?
Nov 06 19:10:07 * lcuk does not know how things like that work
Nov 06 19:10:20 <alterego> netbook is just like a normal computer
Nov 06 19:10:21 * DocScrutinizer neither
Nov 06 19:10:34 <alterego> So it works in the same way as a desktop would.
Nov 06 19:10:41 <alterego> N900 is just screwed.
Nov 06 19:10:55 <DocScrutinizer> honestly I don't see meego-arm get anywhere with this strict upstream-only policy
Nov 06 19:11:00 <alterego> I imagine the N8x0 adaptation, if it ever takes off properly, could have official host support
Nov 06 19:11:04 <alterego> or is it otg?
Nov 06 19:18:25 <Stskeeps> alterego: well, n8x0 is piece of cake..
Nov 06 19:18:30 <DocScrutinizer> alterego: N8x0 should work with standard OTG and its hostmode
Nov 06 19:18:53 <alterego> Yeah, exactly :)
Nov 06 19:19:11 <alterego> It's beyond me how they decided to drop that functionality in the N900.
Nov 06 19:19:29 <DocScrutinizer> they simply messed it up
Nov 06 19:19:37 <alterego> It would have been a massive edge against competition.
Nov 06 19:19:41 <alterego> And it has massive geek appeal.
Nov 06 19:19:46 <alterego> Indeed,
Nov 06 19:20:05 <GAN900> Creeping incompetence
Nov 06 19:20:28 <DocScrutinizer> alterego: N8x0 has AB receptacle, and no need to do proper USB-charging
Nov 06 19:20:38 <DocScrutinizer> GAN900: too hard
Nov 06 19:20:38 <alterego> Ah yes, good point.
Nov 06 19:20:44 <alterego> I forgot about the charging part.
Nov 06 19:21:08 <DocScrutinizer> GAN900: actually I have to admit I appreciate what they did
Nov 06 19:23:45 <DocScrutinizer> given the complexity and the blockheads at USBcert, they did a bitter and yet stout-hearted move do get N900 to the people
Nov 06 19:24:12 <alterego> bbl
Nov 06 19:24:35 <DocScrutinizer> they had to rush it, so the change was implemented in a suboptimal way
Nov 06 19:26:33 <DocScrutinizer> yet it gave us working USB2.0, emergency recovery charging, proper charger detection according to specs
Nov 06 19:27:34 <DocScrutinizer> tbh if I had been part of the team back when, I couldn't have changed much I guess
Nov 06 19:28:27 <DocScrutinizer> maybe 1 or 2 minimal things (which still would have saved us lots and lots of headaches)
Nov 06 19:29:50 <DocScrutinizer> (e.g route ID to both 1707 AND twl4030, maybe even to a GPIO in parallel)
Nov 06 19:30:22 <DocScrutinizer> no bom changes, but proper hostmode still, much like in N8x0
Nov 06 19:38:45 <DocScrutinizer> @Nokia: Manpower to hire, email joerg AT openmoko.org
Nov 06 20:19:20 <lcuk> who has a meego irc client?
Nov 06 20:20:11 <niala> pidgin ?
Nov 06 20:20:20 <lcuk> idk, thats why i am asking
Nov 06 20:20:37 <niala> idk ?
Nov 06 20:20:49 <lcuk> I don't know
Nov 06 20:21:12 <niala> ok I m on meego and midgin ish in repo
Nov 06 20:21:39 <lcuk> are you on the netbook build?
Nov 06 20:21:47 <lcuk> and how is it going for you other than irc
Nov 06 20:21:48 <niala> or empathy is better integrated
Nov 06 20:21:52 <niala> yes
Nov 06 20:23:02 <niala> I don't understand your question ? pidgin is nice no too much bug ?
Nov 06 20:25:31 <niala> lcuk you mean other 'social' web app ?
Nov 06 20:25:54 <niala> you make stats ?
Nov 06 20:28:51 <lcuk> niala, i have never used pidgin for irc
Nov 06 20:29:35 <niala> ah ok well he is very stable,
Nov 06 20:30:15 <niala> and permit to have irc msn and other in same screen with tab
Nov 06 20:30:35 <lcuk> cool :)
Nov 06 20:31:17 <niala> empathy is  less stable but since 6month maybe I can try again
Nov 06 20:32:26 <lcuk> hm
Nov 06 20:32:45 <niala> lcuk but empathy is very nice in meego-panel and he bug has you can see on meego-forum
Nov 06 20:34:06 <lcuk> do you have a link to the thread?
Nov 06 20:37:17 <niala> http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=516 http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=277 http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=452 lcuk
Nov 06 20:38:23 <lcuk> ta
Nov 06 20:42:48 <niala> well I just try to import account from pidgin to empathy and meego ux crash
Nov 06 20:43:41 <niala> need a reboot :(
Nov 06 20:44:12 * niala ask if 1.0 was more stable than 1.1
Nov 06 21:22:36 <lcuk> hmm api.meego.com went under a login wall.  any idea why?
Nov 06 21:23:26 <ferringb> obs was upgraded earlier this morn
Nov 06 21:23:54 <lcuk> rog, ta
Nov 06 21:24:55 <Stskeeps> lcuk: always been under login wall, but it was down for upgrades
Nov 06 21:25:27 <lcuk> hmm then i am thinking of a different url then!
Nov 06 21:28:26 * lcuk wonders which link he is thinking of then
Nov 06 21:29:51 <lcuk> ahhh apidocs.
Nov 06 21:29:58 <lcuk> but its missing a nice front end
Nov 06 21:30:09 <lcuk> http://apidocs.meego.com/1.1/core/html/index.html
Nov 06 22:21:46 <madde55> hi, should the meego-sdk version of qemu work with 64 bit system by default, or should I build it from the scratch as instructed in dev wiki?
Nov 06 22:22:38 <madde55> because now I'm using the sdk version which seems to be installed ok, but the qemu boot fails
Nov 06 22:23:17 <madde55> I was attempting this: mad remote -r meego-handset-ia32-qemu-1.1.20101031.2201-sda-runtime poweron
Nov 06 22:24:11 <chemfy> madde55, what operation system are you running ?
Nov 06 22:24:21 <madde55> ubuntu, 10.10 64bit
Nov 06 22:25:00 <chemfy> There seems to be something wrong between qemu and ubuntu 10.10 which makes it fail at boot. http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=1856
Nov 06 22:26:21 <madde55> punch.. I knew I was looking for trouble when I installed the 10.10 instead of 10.4, now it realized :D
Nov 06 22:27:04 <chemfy> :)
Nov 06 22:27:25 <madde55> I guess the problem resolving work is ongoing in Meego side and the 10.10 should be supported hopefully soon?
Nov 06 22:28:52 <chemfy> donno
Nov 06 22:32:09 <madde55> ok, thanks for the info anyway..
Nov 06 22:44:40 <CosmoHill> Fireworks go boom :)
Nov 06 22:50:16 <timeless_mbp> anyone know anything about room size for talks @meego conf?
Nov 06 22:50:52 <Stskeeps> yours is in what room?
Nov 06 22:51:03 <timeless_mbp> "how would i know?" :)
Nov 06 22:51:46 <Stskeeps> http://conference2010.meego.com/program/schedule
Nov 06 22:51:47 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 06 22:52:01 <timeless_mbp> sure, i'll take anything you give me :)
Nov 06 22:52:13 * Stskeeps finds size
Nov 06 22:52:15 <timeless_mbp> hrm, including a pointer to my talk name ;-)
Nov 06 22:52:29 <timeless_mbp> oh wow, it lists speakers
Nov 06 22:52:33 <timeless_mbp> nice, *click*
Nov 06 22:52:51 <Stskeeps> 120 'cab', whatever it means..
Nov 06 22:53:08 <timeless_mbp> we talked about CAB w/ sp3000 and DawnFoster earlier iirc
Nov 06 22:53:16 <timeless_mbp> it's caberet style seating
Nov 06 22:53:40 <timeless_mbp> http://www.lmc.ac.uk/home/images/business/cabaret.jpg
Nov 06 22:54:10 * timeless_mbp ponders
Nov 06 22:54:19 <Stskeeps> bbl sleep
Nov 06 22:54:30 <timeless_mbp> hrm, sounds good
Nov 06 22:54:35 <timeless_mbp> i have a flight in <20hrs
Nov 06 22:54:39 <timeless_mbp> (not sure when)
Nov 06 22:54:43 <timeless_mbp> (actually, two flights)
Nov 06 22:55:37 <geysi> hello everyone
Nov 06 22:56:35 <geysi> I've got a question about Meego install
Nov 06 22:56:50 <geysi> I've a Samsung N220 with Win7 pre-installed
Nov 06 22:57:17 <geysi> I've deleted the D: partition (extended one) and install there a "default layout" during Meego installation
Nov 06 22:57:37 <geysi> all install went fine. But when reboot I get this:
Nov 06 22:57:45 <geysi> Going to rescue mode
Nov 06 22:57:50 <geysi> grub rescue>
Nov 06 22:58:18 <geysi> is it because the /bott (ext3) partition is in the extended partition?
Nov 06 22:59:02 <CosmoHill> it won't be because it's an extended partitijon
Nov 06 22:59:18 <CosmoHill> also are you saying D drive or is that a shocked smiley?
Nov 06 22:59:37 <geysi> I was stating D drive ;)
Nov 06 23:00:49 <geysi> hmm I don't know how to solve, I've already 3 prime partition: Recovery, System (200MB don't know what it is?) and Win7, all created by default Samsung install
Nov 06 23:01:21 <geysi> so I can't have /boot as prime, or do you have a good idea?
Nov 06 23:01:33 <geysi> (thanks for helping me by the way!)
Nov 06 23:05:02 <CosmoHill> Windows 7 creates a small partition for it's needs
Nov 06 23:05:30 <CosmoHill> you don't need /boot as primary
Nov 06 23:05:43 <CosmoHill> at least I'm pretty sure you don't
Nov 06 23:07:03 <geysi> ok, then do you have a clue why grub fails?
Nov 06 23:08:26 <geysi> oh yeah, I'm using Meego 1.1 (in case this is useful)
Nov 06 23:09:46 <geysi> perhaps is there a solution that I boot with a live USB and install a new grub configuration
Nov 06 23:10:08 <geysi> do you know of any tutorial? A search didn't help me :-(
Nov 06 23:10:27 <CosmoHill> can you type "root (" and then tab
Nov 06 23:11:38 <geysi> tab doesn't do anything, but my '/boot' partition should be hd0,5 (it's sda6)
Nov 06 23:12:26 <geysi> if I do 'root (hd0,5)' it replis - oddly - (hd0,5): Filesystem is fat.
Nov 06 23:12:50 <CosmoHill> hmm
Nov 06 23:12:54 <geysi> which puzzle me, esp. since ls (hd0,5) shows one dir named grub....
Nov 06 23:12:57 <CosmoHill> try hd0,6
Nov 06 23:13:22 <geysi> filesystem unknown for hd0,6
Nov 06 23:13:54 <geysi> (same for 7 and 8)
Nov 06 23:14:07 <CosmoHill> hmm
Nov 06 23:14:19 * CosmoHill grabs his notes
Nov 06 23:14:44 <CosmoHill> geysi: try "lnsmod ext2"
Nov 06 23:15:03 <CosmoHill> that might be an "i" instead of an "L"
Nov 06 23:15:58 <geysi> got unknown filesystem
Nov 06 23:16:50 <CosmoHill> that should have loaded the ext2 module for grub
Nov 06 23:16:56 <geysi> when I do 'root (hd0,5)' and then ls I see 'grub/' if I ls there, I see lots of files (device.map, normal.mod, etc.)
Nov 06 23:17:09 <CosmoHill> ah okay
Nov 06 23:17:21 <CosmoHill> you have that as root
Nov 06 23:17:27 <CosmoHill> now type
Nov 06 23:17:59 <CosmoHill> linux /kernel-1.2.3-vmlinuz (you'll have to search for your run)
Nov 06 23:18:30 <CosmoHill> then initrd /initrd_file (you'll have to search for that too, pretty sure meego doesn't have one)
Nov 06 23:19:41 <bambule> hi guys, i am just starting out with meego. one thing that surprised me is that meego is using swap.
Nov 06 23:20:17 <CosmoHill> how much RAM do you have?
Nov 06 23:20:41 <bambule> none, i am just playing with the emulator/reading up on meego
Nov 06 23:20:54 <bambule> its more that i am wondering what planed there in general.
Nov 06 23:21:10 <bambule> swaping tends to cost battery for example
Nov 06 23:21:19 <CosmoHill> ah okay I thought you had a computer with little RAM
Nov 06 23:21:42 <CosmoHill> it's better to use swap on a slow device than to have your computer freeze
Nov 06 23:22:16 <bambule> well it wont freeze the OOM killer will step in at some point   ;-)
Nov 06 23:22:19 <geysi> hmm I don't see any kernel file... nor initrd one
Nov 06 23:22:38 <CosmoHill> can you type "ls /" and pastebin the output
Nov 06 23:22:52 <bambule> i am just wondering in general. if you compare this for example with android its quite different
Nov 06 23:23:37 <geysi> 'ls /' only displays 'grub/' I guess something went wrong during installation (though no error was displayed)
Nov 06 23:24:13 <bambule> android apps have a life cycle and can in case of memory pressure by asked to prepare for being destroyed and later on restored (when access again by the user)
Nov 06 23:26:15 <berndhs> bambule: seems like an awkward way to swap
Nov 06 23:27:15 <CosmoHill> geysi: oh that's not good
Nov 06 23:27:48 <bambule> berndhs: yes, in some way it is. on the other way you have quite a bit of control over it.
Nov 06 23:28:25 <berndhs> bambule: yes but you need the app to cooperate in its own swapping, that doesn't seem good
Nov 06 23:28:38 <geysi_> sorry got disconnected
Nov 06 23:28:51 <CosmoHill> geysi: oh that's not good
Nov 06 23:29:44 <bambule> berndhs: well, its more then swapping, it goes through a number of states like, created, backgroud, foreground, aboutToBeDestroyed, etc
Nov 06 23:30:07 <bambule> berndhs: also you don't really need to store all the internal state of you app
Nov 06 23:30:30 <geysi_> I've been reinstalling Meego a few times now, and actually I end up in the same configuration each time ... I guess it does not work on this particular netbook
Nov 06 23:30:35 <bambule> berndhs: as an extrem example a webbrowser might just wont to remember its tabs and the urls
Nov 06 23:31:13 <bambule> berndhs: i am advocating one over the other. i just want to figure out the meego way
Nov 06 23:31:13 <berndhs> bambule: its non-preemptive swapping, sort of
Nov 06 23:32:11 <geysi_> ok anyway, I think I'm stuck... going to try to restore my MBR and try Meego 1.2 when it'll be out
Nov 06 23:32:15 <berndhs> bambule: it looks like they are putting a lot of the complexity in teh app, and if (rather when) the app is not well behaved ...
Nov 06 23:32:16 <bambule> berndhs: btw. does this mean the a meego device always needs a flash memory for swap? swapping the a harddrive isn't fun when running on battery
Nov 06 23:33:01 <berndhs> bambule: I'm not sure how meego does that, was just surprised to hear about android doing something like that
Nov 06 23:33:23 <geysi_> thanks a lot CosmoHill
Nov 06 23:33:31 <CosmoHill> geysi_: if you want to try MeeGo 1.1 you can run it from USB
Nov 06 23:33:32 <CosmoHill> or DVD
Nov 06 23:34:07 <bambule> http://developer.android.com/reference/android/app/Activity.html#ActivityLifecycle
Nov 06 23:34:37 <berndhs> berndhs: you would get all kinds of management issues - how do you know how an app would behave, what does it cost to toss it out and bring it back,...
Nov 06 23:35:33 <berndhs> bambule: that last one was for you obviously :)
Nov 06 23:35:48 <bambule> berndhs: thought so   :-)
Nov 06 23:40:12 <niala> CosmoHill: hello Reading win this WE?
Nov 06 23:40:25 <CosmoHill> non :(
Nov 06 23:41:30 <niala> arf, now you are 7e 8e ?
Nov 06 23:43:34 <CosmoHill> 10th :(
Nov 06 23:43:58 <CosmoHill> we lost 3 - 1 to the current leaders
Nov 06 23:44:24 <niala> ah leaders that is not too bad
Nov 07 00:39:31 <Macer> where is the site that shows current hw status for the n900 and meego?
Nov 07 00:55:13 <piratephlox> @Macer wiki.meego.com is probably best for good infos about that. twitter is probably best to keep on the newest things, but if you want stable solutions try the wiki or the forum at meego.com
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Nov 07 02:59:57 2010