**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Nov 18 02:59:58 2010
Nov 18 03:42:07 <Dorfmeister> Hi. I just installed Meego on my N900 (to a microSD card) and now want to add NITDroid as well, but even though I find many threads there doesn't seem to be a good tutorial for this. Could anybody help with this? I know it's not a direct topic of this channel, but maybe somebody here could help - I already tried #n900 and the Nokia forum. Thanks in advance.
Nov 18 03:54:48 <Dorfmeister> I started the thread http://discussion.forum.nokia.com/forum/showthread.php?213768-Yet-another-N900-Maemo-Meego-NITDroid-Thread If anybody should later on have an idea, please post it there. Thank you.
Nov 18 04:49:10 <philipp64|laptop> hmmm.... didn't see a response, so I'm guessing the chances are 'slim' to 'none'.
Nov 18 04:49:32 <mgoddard|nok> philipp64|laptop: probably wrong time of day
Nov 18 04:51:27 <philipp64|laptop> ah.
Nov 18 08:03:03 <dm8tbr> good moarning
Nov 18 08:05:10 <stephg> ohai!
Nov 18 08:05:26 <stephg> is v. quiet this morning, I suppose lots of folks are on their way home
Nov 18 08:05:56 <dm8tbr> yup, and still only day1 videos :-/
Nov 18 08:07:08 <Myrtti> wohey, I've awaken! first hurdle of the day conquered
Nov 18 08:08:15 <Jucato> waking up is nothing. actually getting up to even a semi-conscious state is the real hurdle :)
Nov 18 08:08:58 <dm8tbr> which calls for: moaaarrrr caffeine
Nov 18 08:09:32 <hhurtta> oooh, coffee, i almost forgot!
Nov 18 08:09:52 <hhurtta> i just wondered what kept me slow
Nov 18 08:10:29 * dm8tbr caffeinates
Nov 18 08:10:47 * stephg doesn't drink coffee, tea for me
Nov 18 08:11:11 <dm8tbr> earl grey is for later in the day
Nov 18 08:12:47 <Myrtti> Jucato: I can get up without waking up
Nov 18 08:13:51 <Myrtti> I can even look astoundingly awake while actually not having a thought in my head
Nov 18 08:14:06 <Jucato> Myrtti: I did say "semi-conscious", so sleep walking doesn't count :)
Nov 18 08:16:07 <Myrtti> right now the situation calls for Boston - More Than A Feeling
Nov 18 08:18:20 <Bostik> do the locomotion
Nov 18 08:18:39 <Bostik> and hope trains keep on schedule
Nov 18 08:19:02 <Myrtti> Bostik: I don't really care, not going anywhere from home :-D
Nov 18 08:19:37 <Bostik> I had no choice :/
Nov 18 08:20:06 <Bostik> but on the positive side I didn't need to wake up at 0500
Nov 18 08:20:17 <Myrtti> life is hard, pays out to be the lowly developer
Nov 18 08:21:07 <mece> haha
Nov 18 08:21:11 <Bostik> ..architect, but otherwise correct
Nov 18 08:21:12 <mece> truth!
Nov 18 08:21:34 <mece> are we talking about the weather or hangovers?
Nov 18 08:21:58 <Bostik> weather - so far
Nov 18 08:22:09 <Bostik> want to expand the scope?
Nov 18 08:22:17 <mece> lovely skidding weather today. Unfortunately I'm stuck with my van today :(
Nov 18 08:38:19 <dm8tbr> ooh, instead of video slides appeared for some talks :D
Nov 18 08:38:23 * dm8tbr is happy
Nov 18 09:13:19 <thiago> dm8tbr: we'll upload them in the coming days
Nov 18 09:13:25 * thiago got two emails to upload his slides
Nov 18 09:15:55 <dm8tbr> thiago: people from one of the talks I'm very interested in uploaded already. helps me prepare for a meeting later today. I'm happy.
Nov 18 09:19:20 * thiago has uploaded his slides for the bof session
Nov 18 09:19:39 <thiago> I sent mine for the roadmap update to my boss to give a quick check before I upload
Nov 18 09:24:30 <timeless_mbp> people still around?
Nov 18 09:26:40 <thiago> timeless_mbp: nope :-)
Nov 18 09:27:13 <timeless_mbp> so you're back in the land of trolls? :)
Nov 18 09:27:38 <thiago> not yet
Nov 18 09:27:42 <thiago> but I'm leaving right now
Nov 18 09:27:49 <thiago> teeth brushed, stuff packed
Nov 18 09:27:52 <thiago> only missing the laptop
Nov 18 09:35:54 <sub7lime> So what hardware do I need to develop touch based app for Meego
Nov 18 09:36:42 <Myrtti> depends a bit on what UX you're planning to aim at
Nov 18 09:38:18 <sub7lime> which netbooks or tablets are new?
Nov 18 09:45:09 <zinit> morning
Nov 18 10:37:05 <niala> morning
Nov 18 10:38:25 <zinit> how was the game last night?
Nov 18 10:39:46 <niala> norway win I think zinit
Nov 18 10:39:52 <auke> 2:1 yes
Nov 18 10:40:08 <auke> was a good game to watch :)
Nov 18 10:40:17 <niala> hello auke happy  conference ?
Nov 18 10:40:27 <auke> it's over
Nov 18 10:40:35 <auke> now I'm stuck in meetings all day
Nov 18 10:41:50 <niala> a lot of people from everywhere ? or just europeen and us/intel ? you believe more now in meego?
Nov 18 10:41:58 <Stskeeps> auke: was good meeting you in person :)
Nov 18 10:42:10 <Stskeeps> niala: a lot of different companies and individuals
Nov 18 10:42:14 <auke> number #1 purpose of conference :)
Nov 18 10:42:54 <auke> it'll be a major boost going forward for meego
Nov 18 10:43:23 <auke> I was surprised by the amount of people
Nov 18 10:43:58 <Stskeeps> well, it really shows we're on the right track and have the right idea, i guess
Nov 18 10:45:18 <niala> so we can continue work for meego, sometimes i have no hope in meego because  of the competition, no real handset, etc
Nov 18 10:45:37 <auke> that's our biggest hurdle
Nov 18 10:45:49 <zinit> it been a few news artickles about meego the last few days. even in norwegian newspapers....
Nov 18 10:45:51 <niala> and f... girl but that is another personal story :)
Nov 18 10:46:37 <auke> well the AMD thing popped up everywhere
Nov 18 10:46:42 <auke> which is great
Nov 18 10:46:55 <auke> I don't think the press has actually picked up on the implication of that yet
Nov 18 10:46:58 <Stskeeps> and they'll have ssse3, which is nice
Nov 18 10:47:02 <zinit> saw something about nokia planning to drop out a product with meego this year... (an artickle in a newspaper, not an official release, sÃo dont know if tis real or not)
Nov 18 10:47:06 <niala> question about amd will sse3 specification lost ?
Nov 18 10:47:11 <zinit> the press is great
Nov 18 10:47:20 <Stskeeps> no, amd bobcat comes with ssse3 it seems like
Nov 18 10:47:27 <auke> think about it - now 100% of CPU suppliers for windows 7 is working on a different OS themselves....
Nov 18 10:47:29 <zinit> helps spread the word that there is something new out there
Nov 18 10:48:33 <Stskeeps> auke: on arm side we're really starting to be close to have every big arm vendor as well
Nov 18 10:48:54 <auke> http://fastflip.googlelabs.com/search?q=meego&type=search
Nov 18 10:48:58 <auke> Stskeeps: nice
Nov 18 10:49:05 <auke> I totally welcome that
Nov 18 10:49:15 <niala> auke: true but now windows have a windowphne to
Nov 18 10:49:41 <auke> yes but winphone doesn't offer something that fills a gap for vendors
Nov 18 10:49:45 <auke> meego does fill that gap
Nov 18 10:49:57 * niala remember when last century his friend laught when they see redhat 4
Nov 18 10:51:12 <zinit> I posted a thread on the forum for meego on the palm T|X. havent a clue if meego ARM will run on it, but it would be cool
Nov 18 10:51:28 <niala> now they use "linux" and they even not know
Nov 18 10:51:41 <Stskeeps> seems like arm baseline will be armv7 at least
Nov 18 10:53:12 <zinit> http://www.palm.com/europe/en/products/handhelds/tx/specs.html
Nov 18 10:53:28 <zinit> thats the specs if someone wants to see if it can run meego in one for or another
Nov 18 10:57:40 <auke> nice
Nov 18 10:57:51 <zinit> what arcitecture is it windows mobile runs on anyway? ARM or some obscure x86?
Nov 18 10:58:24 <zinit> if windows runs on soemthing it should be possible to stick linux on it...
Nov 18 10:58:48 <auke> http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2372740,00.asp
Nov 18 10:59:36 <zinit> btw. te touchpad on the netbooks... lenovo uses 2 touchplad suppliers there.. one has the synaptics driver and one is some other thing I never heard about before...
Nov 18 10:59:52 <zinit> might ahve to use ndiswrapper to get the rightclick to work properly...
Nov 18 10:59:59 <zinit> the driver is on the lenovo website
Nov 18 11:00:14 <zinit> sitting at work now so havent been able to test it yet.
Nov 18 11:00:17 <niala> auke: we can say that is the real begin of meego? before the press has not a lot of reviews. In france a least
Nov 18 11:00:30 <zinit> same everywhere I think
Nov 18 11:00:59 <auke> zinit: trunk has the bits to enable left/right click for the lenovo touchpad part
Nov 18 11:02:00 <niala> now wait blabla@amd.com email in meego-devel
Nov 18 11:02:41 <zinit> auke: is it listed on the forum so I can find it when I get home today?
Nov 18 11:02:56 <auke> probably not
Nov 18 11:03:04 <auke> it's just a package in Trunk
Nov 18 11:03:08 <zinit> ok
Nov 18 11:03:13 <auke> but trunk has a new xorg version as well
Nov 18 11:03:27 <zinit> so a system update should do the trick?
Nov 18 11:04:12 <zinit> have the exact same problem in the linux'es I have tested. meego, ubuntu, linux mint (debian version) and fedora
Nov 18 11:04:22 <niala> maybe that can enable right clic for touchscreen asus t101 to ?
Nov 18 11:05:37 <zinit> there is also a fw update that takes care of the response on the screen. (the inacuracy)
Nov 18 11:05:48 <niala> I mean I can't easily upgrade from 1.1 to trunk?
Nov 18 11:05:53 <zinit> was reading on it earlier today.
Nov 18 11:06:34 <zinit> (ofcourse... you have to have windows runnign on the machine to do any kind of fw update... (go figure)
Nov 18 11:07:26 <auke> niala: there's no application to automate the changes needed on your system
Nov 18 11:07:35 <auke> niala: but it's techically a very simple procedure
Nov 18 11:07:54 <auke> (1) get new repo files, (2) get release pacakge with new keys, (3) zypper dup
Nov 18 11:08:06 <auke> this method will allow you to dist-upgrade to any release
Nov 18 11:08:16 <auke> you could even fall back to 1.0 from trunk, etc.
Nov 18 11:09:50 <niala> when i have tried this in 1.0 to trunk  this summer I failed, too many errors. But ok I ll try again :)
Nov 18 11:12:17 <auke> did you zypper update or zypper dup?
Nov 18 11:13:18 <niala> zypper update
Nov 18 11:14:12 <niala> sorry ux restart alone...
Nov 18 11:14:50 <niala> and no id respawn to fast ... that is a progress :)
Nov 18 11:22:44 <evdaemonia> hi, anyone there?
Nov 18 11:23:27 <Stskeeps> evdaemonia: just ask away :)
Nov 18 11:24:04 <evdaemonia> oh
Nov 18 11:24:14 <evdaemonia> i am looking to DL meego for netbook
Nov 18 11:24:19 <evdaemonia> but all the sites are SO dang slow
Nov 18 11:24:28 <evdaemonia> 3k/s?
Nov 18 11:24:34 <evdaemonia> 8k?
Nov 18 11:24:36 <evdaemonia> what gives? :(
Nov 18 11:24:40 <niala> no luck... ouch!
Nov 18 11:24:42 <evdaemonia> eta 1 day
Nov 18 11:24:46 <evdaemonia> wtf lol
Nov 18 11:24:52 <evdaemonia> this is from meego.com
Nov 18 11:25:21 <Stskeeps> evdaemonia: mirrors.kernel.org/meego/ might be faste
Nov 18 11:26:15 <evdaemonia> thanks, trying
Nov 18 11:26:22 <evdaemonia> others, anyone know a good torrent?
Nov 18 11:26:28 <evdaemonia> isonhunt kinda scared me off
Nov 18 11:27:45 <niala> evdaemonia: maybe it's you connection because for me it's take 20minutes
Nov 18 11:27:55 <evdaemonia> i am in australia :P
Nov 18 11:28:29 <evdaemonia> Thanks Stkeeps... this mirror is great..... getting 320KB now
Nov 18 11:28:35 <evdaemonia> eta 42 mins
Nov 18 11:28:37 <evdaemonia> life-saver :)
Nov 18 11:28:43 <niala> evdaemonia: well maybe a shark cut the connection :)
Nov 18 11:29:00 <evdaemonia> i am planning to install it dual boot with win xp on the MSI Wind
Nov 18 11:29:06 <evdaemonia> i am a linux novice though
Nov 18 11:30:05 <niala> evdaemonia:  welcome
Nov 18 11:30:12 <evdaemonia> thanks
Nov 18 11:30:18 <evdaemonia> i recently made my main pc dual boot
Nov 18 11:30:23 <evdaemonia> almost all on my own
Nov 18 11:30:28 <evdaemonia> but my friend had to come help
Nov 18 11:30:33 <evdaemonia> coz GRUB went all messy
Nov 18 11:30:34 <evdaemonia> haha
Nov 18 11:31:05 <zinit> http://mirrors4.kernel.org/meego/releases/1.1/netbook/images/meego-netbook-ia32/meego-netbook-ia32-1.1.img
Nov 18 11:31:09 <zinit> that one is fast
Nov 18 11:31:20 <evdaemonia> thanks but i am 7% done already
Nov 18 11:31:30 <evdaemonia> is anyone at meego.com aware of the slow DL you reckon?
Nov 18 11:31:33 <zinit> downloading at 2Mbit/s
Nov 18 11:31:37 <evdaemonia> or is it just for me :(?
Nov 18 11:32:00 <zinit> err.. 2MB/s
Nov 18 11:32:24 <zinit> eta 10 min's it sais here now
Nov 18 11:33:46 <evdaemonia> thanks
Nov 18 11:33:52 <evdaemonia> r u also DL meego??
Nov 18 11:34:38 <zinit> gonna stick it in a VM here
Nov 18 11:34:57 <zinit> dumping it to my server now. I can make it availeable there
Nov 18 11:35:24 <zinit> 100Mbit dedicated link so it should give descent speeds
Nov 18 11:35:37 <evdaemonia> you're so generous :)
Nov 18 11:35:48 <zinit> no. I'm bored:P
Nov 18 11:36:07 <Myrtti> of course, the problem might just be that the internets in .au is crap.
Nov 18 11:36:15 <zinit> could be
Nov 18 11:36:17 <evdaemonia> well yeah
Nov 18 11:36:18 <evdaemonia> it is
Nov 18 11:36:23 <evdaemonia> we have a massive debate about it
Nov 18 11:36:34 <evdaemonia> whether or not to spend $43 billion on fibre
Nov 18 11:36:45 <zinit> and if you are at the D4 hotel you got more packets lost than recieved:P
Nov 18 11:36:54 <zinit> as someone made me aware of last nigt
Nov 18 11:37:13 <evdaemonia> so has anyone here put meego on msi wind?
Nov 18 11:37:18 <Twoot> Hi, ca comeone help me? I flashed meego on N900, connect to it through ssh, but when I try to execute 'zypper refresh' it could not download needed xml file. Looks like something wrong with dns resolving, but when I try to ping something, ping resolves ip address successfully
Nov 18 11:37:21 <evdaemonia> i just hope the wi-fi works
Nov 18 11:37:45 <zinit> wind has an atheros chip doesnt it?
Nov 18 11:37:51 <zinit> then it should work out of the box
Nov 18 11:38:51 <evdaemonia> oh good :)
Nov 18 11:41:09 <zinit> got linux on it now?
Nov 18 11:41:17 <zinit> lspci will show you what you got
Nov 18 11:42:16 <zinit> if its windows, check the hardware list. you never know... could be they put something weird in yours.. like broadcom or their own..
Nov 18 11:43:06 <zinit> best to doublecheck. vendors use various wlan chils on the same model
Nov 18 11:43:11 <zinit> chips
Nov 18 11:49:13 <zinit> http://zinit.servebeer.com/div/meego-netbook-ia32-1.1.img
Nov 18 11:49:16 <zinit> there you go
Nov 18 11:49:16 <mortenmj> zinit: how was the party after the game yesterday?
Nov 18 11:49:40 <zinit> mortenmj: didnt go. I left about 30 minutes after the game started
Nov 18 11:49:50 <zinit> was falling asleep:P
Nov 18 11:49:55 <mortenmj> right. caught a plane at 5pm myself
Nov 18 11:50:09 <zinit> then you missed the fun before the game started
Nov 18 11:50:15 <mortenmj> yeah
Nov 18 11:50:32 <zinit> was a nice party before the game and heard the half'time was nice too
Nov 18 11:52:33 <evdaemonia> i am 44% there
Nov 18 11:52:56 <zinit> :)
Nov 18 12:01:46 <zinit> evdaemonia: whats the speeds you are getting?
Nov 18 12:02:50 * CosmoHill  got given a Intel Q6600 :o
Nov 18 12:17:59 <mortenmj> har du lagt inn debian p
Nov 18 12:18:07 <mortenmj> oops. wrong chan
Nov 18 12:19:30 <CosmoHill> indeed
Nov 18 12:38:03 <araujo> Stskeeps, what exactly is that licensing? o_O
Nov 18 12:49:49 <royaflash> hello
Nov 18 12:49:54 <zinit> evening
Nov 18 12:50:16 <royaflash> did everyone this �ላቸ
Nov 18 13:08:06 <zinit> wonder how long it will be before symbian will be 100% buried and cremated....
Nov 18 13:08:27 <zinit> would be fun to be able to stick meego on symbian phones....
Nov 18 13:08:48 <zinit> bringing life to old phones...
Nov 18 13:08:52 <CosmoHill> :)
Nov 18 13:09:02 <zinit> maybe I could find some use gfor my E63
Nov 18 13:11:01 <zinit> there are several symbian phones that got a bit of power in them. imagine being able to use it for something useful after they get "retired" as phones...
Nov 18 13:20:36 <CosmoHill> realitygaps: I read your name as "realitygays" :/
Nov 18 13:22:03 <Bryce> There was talk at the meego conference about how best to handle shared libraries that are not in the core repository and I was wondering if anyone had started a discuss thread anywhere about this as it seemed undecided.
Nov 18 13:30:03 <Jaffa> Af'noon
Nov 18 13:40:23 <smoku> Bryce, what's wrong in keeping the same repository as the app that requires them?
Nov 18 13:40:35 <smoku> keeping in*
Nov 18 13:43:10 <Bryce> If my application requires libpythonX that is not in core and I add it to my package, and then your application requires libpythonX.Y and you do the same thing then we start to have redundancies. And if we're dynamically linking our libraries then your newer library could break my application.
Nov 18 13:51:49 <Bryce> Bad connection
Nov 18 13:52:54 <pupnik_> correct explanation Bryce
Nov 18 13:54:38 <pupnik_> and the dynamics of a small distro are different than the major linux ones
Nov 18 13:55:16 <pupnik_> most of the issues around this aren't so much technical as social ... human-networking related
Nov 18 13:58:31 <Bryce> sorry, my connection went in and out for a few minutes, did I miss something?
Nov 18 13:59:42 <CosmoHill> hmm, car insurance is £1750 on a £1800 car
Nov 18 13:59:43 <Stskeeps> Bryce: this would be a good mailing list topic :)
Nov 18 13:59:56 <CosmoHill> it's like they're expecting me to write it off yearly
Nov 18 14:01:16 <Bryce> Stskeeps, I wasn't sure if there was already a thread similar to this, or if it belongs in community or dev or packaging as it seems related to all.
Nov 18 14:01:42 <Stskeeps> there was one but it was very entangled with the compliance work
Nov 18 14:01:55 <Stskeeps> i think a proper discussion how to get it done would be useful, ie, a constructive one..
Nov 18 14:03:56 <Bryce> any suggestions for which mailing list? I think that its a big enough issue that we need plenty of people to be aware of it to figure out what will work best.
Nov 18 14:17:10 <nandersson> Hi, what graphics engine does Meego use? X Window System?
Nov 18 14:17:30 <nandersson> or is it some framebuffer thing?
Nov 18 14:19:54 <CosmoHill> Intel :)
Nov 18 14:20:03 <Stskeeps> CosmoHill: that's wildly inaccurate
Nov 18 14:20:04 <CosmoHill> apart from the GMA500
Nov 18 14:20:13 <CosmoHill> oh sorry, I misread the question
Nov 18 14:20:35 <CosmoHill> xorg but I think someone is playing with wayland for the tablet
Nov 18 14:21:25 <nandersson> Ok, it sounds reasonable. I think Wayland would make more sense
Nov 18 14:33:31 <CosmoHill> there's been a lot of things going on recently around wayland
Nov 18 14:33:46 <CosmoHill> ubuntu and fedora are giving it a go / making it aviable
Nov 18 14:36:43 <smoku> at last
Nov 18 14:37:30 <CosmoHill> I've been meaning to try it for ...forever
Nov 18 14:37:54 <smoku> having all graphics related stuff abstracted from XOrg already, this is the next logical step
Nov 18 14:38:38 <CosmoHill> I read xorg wanted to merge their drivers back into it
Nov 18 14:39:09 <smoku> well... graphics drivers are not related to X11 anyway
Nov 18 14:39:27 <smoku> the XServer should have only X11 related stuff and nothing more
Nov 18 14:39:28 <CosmoHill> I agree, they should be seperate
Nov 18 14:39:40 <smoku> and work as an userspace app
Nov 18 14:39:56 * pupnik votes for smoku
Nov 18 14:40:21 <pupnik> smoku: don't forget to think about arbitrating one card between multiple operating systems
Nov 18 14:41:16 <smoku> is there a use case for this?
Nov 18 14:41:49 <pupnik> switching via a hypervisor between multiple OS's on one machine
Nov 18 14:42:22 <pupnik> that is detaching your 'console' from one os and reattaching to another
Nov 18 14:42:29 <pupnik> stuff that was trivial in 1988
Nov 18 14:42:44 <pupnik> well microsoft ensured that this is broken
Nov 18 14:42:48 <pupnik> today
Nov 18 14:43:26 <smoku> well, that's the job of the kernel driver anyway
Nov 18 14:43:48 <smoku> to be able to bring up the graphisc hardware to an usable state from any arbitrary state
Nov 18 14:43:53 <pupnik> it's a non-trivial problem
Nov 18 14:44:01 <smoku> it's being fixed already due to the hibernation requirements
Nov 18 14:44:02 <pupnik> yes
Nov 18 14:44:22 <smoku> not only in graphics driver
Nov 18 14:44:36 <pupnik> smoku: so where's the global push to make this work?
Nov 18 14:44:48 <smoku> linux kernel folks finally realized that if they want a working hibernation, the "mac way" is the only way
Nov 18 14:45:02 <smoku> there is
Nov 18 14:45:05 <pupnik> let me switch on the fly between linux/bsd/windows/meego with native gpu access?
Nov 18 14:45:20 <rauli> any flaming posts from linus on the subject ? :)
Nov 18 14:45:42 <pupnik> ty for the comments smoku
Nov 18 14:46:02 <smoku> all new driver interfaces in kernel are created this way - you are not given a clue about the current state of the hardware when you get the init instruction
Nov 18 14:46:44 <pupnik> good, then i wasn't just imagining this
Nov 18 14:46:51 <pupnik> well i was, but others were too
Nov 18 14:46:57 <smoku> and you cannot assume that the init is called only once during the boot or module initialization
Nov 18 14:47:10 <pupnik> precisely
Nov 18 14:47:57 <smoku> but that required fixing the base infrastructure behind this. the usb subsystem, creating udev and its events etc.
Nov 18 14:48:17 <smoku> now, the drivers are being converted. slowly
Nov 18 14:51:14 <smoku> rauli, AFAIK Linus is all for. he opposed including all the nasty hacks required to make hibernation kind of work. but this is really cleanup of the driver interfaces, and gives working hibernation as a free bonus :)
Nov 18 14:53:17 <zinit> found some nice artickles about what 3G card the s10-3t supports
Nov 18 14:53:51 <zinit> listed them on the forum. (the ones that doesnt require you to hack the bios)
Nov 18 14:54:49 <zinit> would be nice to be able to use 3G directly on the machine instead of being stuck with a mobile deciding to charge from the netbook when you are sitting at a pub somewhere with no electrical outlet:P
Nov 18 15:03:57 <thebootroo_> does meego supports the Atom N270 and the GMA950 ?
Nov 18 15:04:20 * CosmoHill checks
Nov 18 15:04:35 <dm8tbr> gma950 sounds like what's in the Archos9
Nov 18 15:04:53 <CosmoHill> yes
Nov 18 15:05:13 <dm8tbr> the answer is: that driver is a mess and there is currently no repository with packages for it
Nov 18 15:05:24 <thebootroo_> arf
Nov 18 15:05:26 <dm8tbr> or was that for the touchscreen?
Nov 18 15:05:43 <CosmoHill> dm8tbr: I thought that was the GMA500
Nov 18 15:05:51 <dm8tbr> there was a lengthy discussion on forums
Nov 18 15:06:11 <Stskeeps> dm8tbr: i think you're thiknking about gma500
Nov 18 15:06:22 <dm8tbr> oooooh
Nov 18 15:06:26 <thebootroo_> so the 950 is ok ?
Nov 18 15:06:29 <CosmoHill> the GMA950 is designed by Intel
Nov 18 15:07:02 <dm8tbr> gma500 was just labeled by intel
Nov 18 15:08:09 <odin_> afternoon everyone nice to meet with those I did
Nov 18 15:08:23 <Stskeeps> afternoon - you made it home safely?
Nov 18 15:09:00 <odin_> thanks ah yes indeed, had a long sleep to catch up tho :)
Nov 18 15:09:41 <odin_> I read you had a 3am start to the airport yourself :(
Nov 18 15:10:02 <Stskeeps> i'm overtired at 4pm, can't be good..
Nov 18 15:13:55 <CosmoHill> Stskeeps: your UTC+1 right?
Nov 18 15:14:17 <CosmoHill> oh wait, a 3am flight? anyone would be tired then
Nov 18 16:08:48 <Mat_Matan> hi
Nov 18 16:22:17 <whoodat> I used unetbootin to create a live usb stick, when I try to boot from it I get an error saying it can't find the filesystem, and to create a symlink to /dev/root/ and exit the terminal to continue boot. I tried 2 different usb drives and checked the md5. any thoughts? Acer aspire one d150.
Nov 18 16:23:33 <fcrozat> just use dd
Nov 18 16:23:42 <fcrozat> the iso are dumpable without anything else needed
Nov 18 16:25:33 <whoodat> that's kind of what i figured. Will try dd when I get home tonight.
Nov 18 16:44:28 <thp> where do i submit feed urls for inclusion into planet meego (meego.com/aggregator)?
Nov 18 17:00:20 * Debolaz wishes for meego on an ubuntu base. :/
Nov 18 17:05:26 <auke> debolaz: never gonna happen, get over it :)
Nov 18 17:08:23 <Debolaz> auke: Hehe. But it would be so convinient... MeeGo has such a sexy user interface, but really lags behind everywhere else, leveraging the Ubuntu platform that problem would magically go away.
Nov 18 17:08:39 <auke> nope, that's a false assumption
Nov 18 17:08:42 <Debolaz> And I could get the only thing that really stops me from adopting MeeGo, full disk encryption.
Nov 18 17:09:00 <auke> if that's the feature that is missing for you, then just wait until it gets enabled
Nov 18 17:09:05 <auke> besides
Nov 18 17:09:07 <Stskeeps> Debolaz: where does it lag behind?
Nov 18 17:09:13 <auke> there already is ecryptfs support
Nov 18 17:09:27 <auke> so you can encrypt your entire /home already
Nov 18 17:09:40 <fcrozat> and meego is way better than ubuntu on boot time
Nov 18 17:09:52 <fcrozat> (and will be even better soon ;)
Nov 18 17:09:57 <jacekowski> ~seen ali1234
Nov 18 17:10:02 <infobot> ali1234 <~ajb@robotfuzz.co.uk> was last seen on IRC in channel #meego, 7d 2h 53m 56s ago, saying: 'Qt mobility is supposed to get rolled into Qt eventually anyway'.
Nov 18 17:10:13 <Debolaz> Stskeeps: I gave a specific example.
Nov 18 17:10:15 <auke> Debolaz: if you have time, go ahead and try the ecryptfs support in e.g. the 1.1 netbook image
Nov 18 17:10:40 <Debolaz> auke: /home-only encryption is something that should generally be avoided, it is enormously more complex in terms of security than the full disk encryption approach.
Nov 18 17:11:05 <jacekowski> transparent file level encryption
Nov 18 17:11:08 <jacekowski> ntfs style
Nov 18 17:11:08 <auke> perhaps, perhaps not. are you an expert on encryption?
Nov 18 17:11:10 <Debolaz> For instance, the swap partition must also be encrypted.
Nov 18 17:11:27 <auke> heh, on meego systems you shouldn't use swap :)
Nov 18 17:11:43 <auke> (I realize there's still swap by default, and I hate that fact)
Nov 18 17:11:44 <Debolaz> Imagine opening that secret file, and some other program decides to grab all the memory. Your secret file gets written out to swap.
Nov 18 17:12:00 <auke> so? disable swap and be happy?
Nov 18 17:12:11 <dm8tbr> and put /tmp in tmpfs
Nov 18 17:12:19 <auke> that's easy
Nov 18 17:12:57 <Debolaz> auke: That's only one of the many possible ways it can fail. Basically, it requires a very deep level of understanding to attain the same level of security as with full disk encryption and has a lot less tolerance for mistakes.
Nov 18 17:13:16 * Myrtti dons on the tinfoil
Nov 18 17:13:47 <Debolaz> Myrtti: Saying that complexity makes things more difficult isn't really very paranoid. I
Nov 18 17:14:10 <Debolaz> I'm just stating that ecryptfs is for most people a useless feature because it requires too much knowledge than what is realistic to expect people to have.
Nov 18 17:15:24 <Debolaz> Myrtti: And it's not about the possibility of someone spying on you or protecting yourself from the government or anything weird like that; The fact is that corporate information must often be protected, that's a perfectly reasonable demand for a company to make for whatever distribution they chose to use on their laptops.
Nov 18 17:15:27 * Myrtti has all her partitions and external hard drives encrypted due to a requirement at work, just loves tinfoil
Nov 18 17:15:57 <Myrtti> meow
Nov 18 17:15:58 <RST38h> Moo all, heya Myrtti
Nov 18 17:16:58 * RST38h wonders if directing the crowd-dispersing microwave beam at people in tinfoil hats will boil and blow their brains
Nov 18 17:17:28 <dm8tbr> mars-attacks style?
Nov 18 17:17:30 <auke> I'm about to rip the wifi base station from the ceiling of this hotel and throw it out of the window :(
Nov 18 17:17:51 <RST38h> auke: Will this restore connectivity?
Nov 18 17:17:57 <auke> it will restore sanity
Nov 18 17:18:06 <Myrtti> I approve this plan
Nov 18 17:18:39 * Debolaz just tried Ubuntu Netbook 10.10 for evaluation. Verdict: My netbook wasn't beefy enough to run it. :(
Nov 18 17:19:52 * auke waits for RST
Nov 18 17:20:40 <Debolaz> I can certainly understand why Mark would want to move away from Xorg.
Nov 18 17:24:38 <lbt> hey auke
Nov 18 17:24:53 <lbt> I guess you found how messed up the image is by now...
Nov 18 17:34:03 <ali1234> jacekowski: hi, what's up?
Nov 18 17:37:50 <daisy21> Hey can anyone tell me if it is possible to boot meego from a USB key...I've installed it fine but I'm getting a kernel panic warning
Nov 18 17:39:06 <Aard> daisy21: yes, it is
Nov 18 17:39:48 <daisy21> I've read that you have to put in rootdelay=8 when booting kernel but this doesn't work
Nov 18 17:40:56 <daisy21> Aard: any ideas?
Nov 18 17:41:32 * Aard has next to no idea about the meego netbook stuff
Nov 18 17:42:01 <ali1234> i saw a kernel panic when someone was trying to install it yesterday at the conf
Nov 18 17:42:05 <jacekowski> ali1234: finally
Nov 18 17:42:17 <jacekowski> ali1234: how did you knew i was looking for you?
Nov 18 17:42:32 <ali1234> had to start over
Nov 18 17:42:50 <daisy21> ali1234: I've installed it twice
Nov 18 17:43:00 <jacekowski> ali1234: anywas, as far as i know you managed to port u-boot to n900
Nov 18 17:43:05 <jacekowski> anyways*
Nov 18 17:43:09 <ali1234> i think he pulled the usb key out too soon
Nov 18 17:43:18 <ali1234> yes, sort of
Nov 18 17:43:36 <ali1234> it is chainloaded from the nokia bootloader
Nov 18 17:43:37 <jacekowski> i know how to replace nolo with something else
Nov 18 17:43:44 <jacekowski> for example uboot
Nov 18 17:43:49 <ali1234> well, ok, it should work
Nov 18 17:44:07 <jacekowski> i just have a size problem
Nov 18 17:44:30 <jacekowski> because uboot would have to fit into same space as nolo
Nov 18 17:44:38 <ali1234> yes
Nov 18 17:44:49 <daisy21> ali1234: ok thanks I'll try it again :-(
Nov 18 17:45:04 <ali1234> and also no, because the flash partition layout is set up by nolo and u-boot doesn't support it
Nov 18 17:45:18 <ali1234> u-boot also does not support generating the correct atags, those are taken from nolo
Nov 18 17:45:45 <jacekowski> yep
Nov 18 17:46:02 <ali1234> or in other words, if you install u-boot you will also have to repartition the flash and recompile the kernel to support the new partitioning system and so on
Nov 18 17:46:11 <ali1234> it really isn't worth it just to get rid of nolo
Nov 18 17:46:26 <ali1234> also u-boot can't write to the flash so you need nolo to reflash easily
Nov 18 17:46:36 <jacekowski> well, or uboot can be changed to support it
Nov 18 17:46:40 <ali1234> unless you fix it of course
Nov 18 17:46:44 <ali1234> yes
Nov 18 17:47:37 <jacekowski> a was expecting little bit more enthusiasm
Nov 18 17:48:04 <ali1234> i already figured out all this was possible but i didn't see a point in doing it
Nov 18 17:48:18 <ali1234> i mean why replace nolo?
Nov 18 17:48:47 <jacekowski> why port uboot?
Nov 18 17:48:59 <ali1234> for dual booting meego development images
Nov 18 17:49:30 <jacekowski> you can do it with kexec
Nov 18 17:49:30 <ali1234> and/or android/ubuntu... etc
Nov 18 17:49:33 * timeless_n900 is delayed @CDG
Nov 18 17:49:39 <ali1234> actually you can't
Nov 18 17:49:43 <thiago_home> timeless_n900: where to?
Nov 18 17:49:46 <ali1234> not in a reasonable way
Nov 18 17:50:13 <ali1234> kexec doesnot put hardware in the same state as a cold boot
Nov 18 17:50:27 <timeless_n900> HEL (home)
Nov 18 17:50:29 <ali1234> therefore it is not much goood for testing
Nov 18 17:51:22 <ali1234> kexec booting is also hella slow since it has to boot up twice, if you're trying to track down a kernel panic that's really annoying
Nov 18 17:51:30 <thiago_home> timeless_n900: I heard there were problems for HEL today
Nov 18 17:54:57 <jacekowski> ali1234: then you save even more time
Nov 18 17:55:11 <jacekowski> ali1234: if you get rid of nolo
Nov 18 17:55:15 <maclaver> thiago_home: HEL was OK, but I heard that traffic this morning was chaotic.
Nov 18 17:55:21 <ali1234> about 0.01 seconds, sure :)
Nov 18 17:55:27 <jacekowski> nope
Nov 18 17:55:35 <jacekowski> it takes 1.2+ seconds to boot nolo
Nov 18 17:55:45 <ali1234> i don't believe that
Nov 18 17:56:17 <jacekowski> 0.5s
Nov 18 17:56:17 <jacekowski> http://wiki.maemo.org/N900_Hardware_Hacking/serial_dump
Nov 18 17:57:18 <ali1234> well, ok, but a lot of that code would need to be put in u-boot
Nov 18 17:57:44 <ali1234> and there's a big difference between 0.5 seconds, and 15 seconds, then press some buttons, then wait another 15 seconds
Nov 18 17:57:47 <jacekowski> not uber-cool backlight fade in for sure
Nov 18 17:58:19 <jacekowski> and just that is 9ms
Nov 18 17:58:38 <ali1234> kexec method also requires you to mess with maemo filesystem, which i do not like
Nov 18 17:59:23 <ali1234> and removing nolo will require a lot better understanding of the hardware than what i have
Nov 18 18:00:07 <ali1234> if you wanted you could make u-boot a lot faster just by removing the graphics, keyboard, and boot timeout stuff
Nov 18 18:00:13 <ali1234> 99% of users don't need that
Nov 18 18:02:22 <ali1234> actually none of those would work without nolo to set up the hardware
Nov 18 18:02:45 <ali1234> unless you put all the code in u-boot
Nov 18 18:03:27 <ali1234> there is also some magic that nolo does with power saving / sleep modes
Nov 18 18:04:11 <ali1234> it would be quite a lot of work to reverse all that stuff, for very very little benefit if any at all, imo
Nov 18 18:04:59 <thiago_home> maclaver: snow?
Nov 18 18:05:17 <jacekowski> ali1234: work that is already done
Nov 18 18:08:28 <ali1234> well, ok, but what's the benefit?
Nov 18 18:09:30 <jacekowski> preventing global warming by booting phone faster
Nov 18 18:09:34 <mortenmj> X-Fade: you around?
Nov 18 18:09:38 <jacekowski> and therefore using less energy
Nov 18 18:33:28 <ali1234> hmm ok, the menu has gone and i can't alt-tab. cos of the whole "zones" thing, this is now the only window i can get to. what do?
Nov 18 18:40:58 <Jartza> http://opendotdotdot.blogspot.com/2010/11/microsoft-linux-at-end-of-its-life.html
Nov 18 18:41:18 <Jartza> all your efforts are useless!
Nov 18 18:42:46 <berndhs> yeah, MS is close to the end, we all know it :)
Nov 18 18:48:35 <Mece_> Jartza, O.o
Nov 18 19:34:38 <Stskeeps> evening slaine
Nov 18 19:35:11 <slaine> Hey Stskeeps, you're home safe and sound I hope
Nov 18 19:35:21 <Stskeeps> safe, sound, hmm.. need sleep
Nov 18 19:35:21 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 18 19:35:36 <slaine> Yeah, me too, and I'd the least amount of traveling ;)
Nov 18 19:35:53 <slaine> Was great to meet up
Nov 18 19:35:53 * thiago_home had a blast
Nov 18 19:36:02 <thiago_home> yeah
Nov 18 19:36:07 * slaine waves to thiago_home 
Nov 18 19:36:34 <slaine> everybody really seemed to have a great time
Nov 18 19:36:48 <slaine> felt great to be a part of it
Nov 18 19:37:56 * slaine looks at the mountain of email from work and sighes
Nov 18 19:39:07 * Stskeeps is installing meego sdk for fun and profit
Nov 18 19:43:26 <slaine> thiago_home: Qt apps on MeeGo, what am I doing wrong, they look terrible
Nov 18 19:44:54 <thiago_home> nothing. There's a limit to what a style can do for QWidget...
Nov 18 19:45:57 <slaine> there doesn't appear to be any style though, the fonts aren't anti-aliased
Nov 18 19:46:20 <slaine> it looks like something is missing from a setup perspective, but I can't figure out what as I'm a Qt newb
Nov 18 19:51:06 <Bostik> have to interview our guys who were there for their feelings :/
Nov 18 19:51:30 <Stskeeps> they're probably too busy playing with their ideapads
Nov 18 19:51:30 <Stskeeps> :P
Nov 18 19:51:44 <Bostik> well obviously next week
Nov 18 19:52:07 <Bostik> day off tomorrow for an inhuming
Nov 18 19:52:37 * Stskeeps ponders if to go for handset ux based desktop for his tv machine, kitchen tablet (joggler) and other smaller tablets like old nokia internet tablets..
Nov 18 19:53:10 <RST38h> Stskeeps: Use Windows on the TV machine.
Nov 18 19:53:13 <ali1234> i just installed the handset image on the ideapad
Nov 18 19:53:20 <Stskeeps> RST38h: why, though?
Nov 18 19:53:28 <RST38h> Stskeeps: Way more games for Windows.
Nov 18 19:53:32 <ali1234> it needs a lot of work but it does at least ... support a touchscreen
Nov 18 19:53:40 <RST38h> Stskeeps: Otherwise, it would not matter
Nov 18 19:53:56 <Stskeeps> RST38h: that's true, but then again i'm the civ3/red alert2 type of person
Nov 18 19:54:09 <RST38h> Stskeeps: But you never really know
Nov 18 19:54:37 <RST38h> Stskeeps: If the machine is underpowered though, Linux will do fine asnone of the games will run anyway
Nov 18 19:54:53 <slaine> ali1234: I plan on doing the same once the tide of returned to work stuff dies down and I've got time to play
Nov 18 19:55:02 <slaine> I'll also setup my n900 dev unit
Nov 18 19:59:46 <Stskeeps> RST38h: well, tv is more about media for me
Nov 18 20:00:10 <GAN900> US soil again.
Nov 18 20:03:16 <RST38h> Stskeeps: Assuming that you are not watching broadcast TV, anyhing with Bittorren client and MPlayer will do =)
Nov 18 20:03:55 <Stskeeps> hehe :P
Nov 18 20:04:46 <GAN900> Stskeeps, by the way. Seeing you on stage on Monday was the only highlight of the keynotes. *g*
Nov 18 20:09:22 <dm8tbr> ah, better
Nov 18 20:09:33 <dm8tbr> _MeeGoBot_: botsnack
Nov 18 20:09:34 <_MeeGoBot_> yay
Nov 18 20:09:36 <RST38h> GAN:flattery! =)
Nov 18 20:09:48 <Stskeeps> GAN900: hehe - not even the giveaway announcement? ;)
Nov 18 20:24:56 <GAN900> Stskeeps, meh, Lenovo. :P
Nov 18 20:25:09 <javispedro> what a choice of a laptop for netbook ux
Nov 18 20:25:22 <javispedro> though I wonder if it's not part of a master plan
Nov 18 20:25:37 <GAN900> Stskeeps, seeing as how you're the only real example of meritocracy in action so far.
Nov 18 20:25:48 <javispedro> thousands of geeks trying to fix the "slightly broken" ACPI implementation on it?
Nov 18 20:25:52 <GAN900> javispedro, remote detonators?!
Nov 18 20:26:13 <javispedro> GAN900: or that!
Nov 18 20:26:41 * GAN900 wonders if qole ever made it out of the airport.
Nov 18 20:26:56 <Stskeeps> GAN900: well, jeremiah too
Nov 18 20:26:59 <GAN900> We kept running into him at each step in the process all morning.
Nov 18 20:28:12 <javispedro> btw, a pleasure to talk to all of you guys
Nov 18 20:28:30 <GAN900> Everybody see the shaming picture on sjgadsby's flickr?
Nov 18 20:28:36 <GAN900> javispedro, always.
Nov 18 20:28:44 <GAN900> Incredible group of people.
Nov 18 20:30:17 <GAN900> http://www.flickr.com/photos/sjgadsby/5184641401/
Nov 18 20:30:23 <javispedro> quite interesting experience
Nov 18 20:30:33 * javispedro should try to find time and write a review blog post or sth
Nov 18 20:30:55 <GAN900> You're all bastards for missing my unconf, though!
Nov 18 20:32:25 <javispedro> :) maybe that means there was preexisting consensus!
Nov 18 20:32:47 <javispedro> ... or that giving out the lenovos minutes after the sessions was a bad idea ;)
Nov 18 20:33:06 <GAN900> Hehe
Nov 18 20:33:15 <GAN900> Well, they were supposed to be day 1.
Nov 18 20:33:17 <javispedro> *before ;P
Nov 18 20:33:29 <RST38h> javispedro: they have done it before, with n900s
Nov 18 20:33:38 <GAN900> It's OK, we formed a Shadow Council.
Nov 18 20:34:02 <RST38h> Has it got....errrm...more power than the real council?
Nov 18 20:34:25 <GAN900> RST38h, good question.
Nov 18 20:34:38 * GAN900 sends a hit squad to RST38h's house.
Nov 18 20:35:49 * RST38h powers up the vacuum tubes in his doomsday weapon
Nov 18 20:37:12 * javispedro finds no way to task switch on the lenovo in tablet mode
Nov 18 20:37:52 <javispedro> hum.. of the front buttons, the first one doesn't seem to send anything via ps2 (so acpi? wmi?), the second does but should be mapped to rotation, and the third one... well.
Nov 18 20:40:28 <javispedro> so, need a onscreen button for taskswitching. that or keep the top bar always visible.
Nov 18 20:44:33 <GAN900> Need a Tablet/Netbook franken UX.
Nov 18 20:44:43 * GAN900 boards
Nov 18 20:44:49 <GAN900> See you from Florida.
Nov 18 20:44:57 <javispedro> bon voyage
Nov 18 20:45:08 <andre41> olla
Nov 18 20:54:42 <MeeGoExperts> Just wanted to say it was BRILLIANT seeing some of you at #MeeGoConf ….
Nov 18 20:55:54 <slaine> +1
Nov 18 20:57:31 <thiago_home> +1099 technically :-)
Nov 18 20:57:36 <thiago_home> we were 1100 people there
Nov 18 20:57:39 <MeeGoExperts> @slaine: I don't think I met you in person
Nov 18 20:58:51 <slaine> MeeGoExperts: probably not, there was a ton of people around and it was hard to catch up with everyone
Nov 18 20:59:04 <thiago_home> MeeGoExperts: what is your name?
Nov 18 20:59:25 <MeeGoExperts> True. Well you were one of the people I wanted to track down.
Nov 18 20:59:34 <MeeGoExperts> Thiago: Hashiq (Ash)
Nov 18 21:00:33 <slaine> MeeGoExperts: perhaps at the next one ;)
Nov 18 21:00:56 <MeeGoExperts> Slaine: Would be good :-)
Nov 18 21:01:29 <slaine> I only bumped into lbt at the end and then seeing some photo's online, I recognise people but didn't realize who they where and wish I'd gone over
Nov 18 21:02:05 <MeeGoExperts> It was the best conference i have ever been too
Nov 18 21:02:34 <tripzero> what was the best session?
Nov 18 21:02:34 <slaine> It's been too long since my last one to have a valid comparison, but it was amazing
Nov 18 21:02:44 * tripzero needs something to listen to while at work
Nov 18 21:03:05 <slaine> I need some coffee if I'm going to continue working ;)
Nov 18 21:03:10 <slaine> bbs
Nov 18 21:03:18 <tripzero> hehe
Nov 18 21:03:28 <MeeGoExperts> Most of mine recent ones have been of the *corporate* flavour …
Nov 18 21:03:37 <niala> what i m doing wrong ? http://pastebin.com/dL6fAjPF
Nov 18 21:03:49 <Chani> blaa!
Nov 18 21:04:28 <thiago_home> this was definitively in the Top 2 of conferences for me
Nov 18 21:04:31 <tripzero> niala, why is MaPage a QWidget?
Nov 18 21:04:39 <Chani> thiago_home: indeed :)
Nov 18 21:04:48 <thiago_home> niala: what's the error?
Nov 18 21:05:23 <Chani> now, i ought to finnd out when i'm expected to be at the mobile sprint tomorrow..
Nov 18 21:05:27 <tripzero> MaPage should propbably either be an MApplicationPage or the MApplication window or just a c++ class
Nov 18 21:05:47 <niala> in constructor MaPage::MaPage
Nov 18 21:05:49 <thiago_home> Chani: made it to berlin?
Nov 18 21:05:58 <Chani> thiago_home: yep :)
Nov 18 21:06:10 <thiago_home> Chani: I have another favour to ask...
Nov 18 21:06:34 <niala> s/QWidget/MApplication
Nov 18 21:06:39 <thiago_home> Chani: get the KDE people to write a report on the conference :-)
Nov 18 21:06:46 <Chani> oh boy
Nov 18 21:06:47 <thiago_home> Chani: from KDE's perspective
Nov 18 21:06:52 <thiago_home> and do it too
Nov 18 21:06:53 <tripzero> mmm
Nov 18 21:06:56 <Chani> report as in dot article?
Nov 18 21:06:58 <thiago_home> no
Nov 18 21:07:03 <tripzero> lul
Nov 18 21:07:06 <thiago_home> though now that you mention it...
Nov 18 21:07:29 <thiago_home> I meant for our own use in KDE, send to the e.V.
Nov 18 21:07:40 <thiago_home> your impressions, your ideas on how to improve collaboration
Nov 18 21:07:58 <tripzero> :nod:
Nov 18 21:08:05 <Chani> the ovi report is still stalled around 80% i think :/ those of us who write have been stupid busy
Nov 18 21:08:28 <Chani> but, freeze is over, so i guess i need something new don't i? ;)
Nov 18 21:08:29 <thiago_home> everyone writes
Nov 18 21:08:45 <Mek> Chani: I think we decided to be in the office around 9am...
Nov 18 21:08:48 <thiago_home> I just want the impressions, opportunities for collaboration, etc.
Nov 18 21:08:52 <niala> same error: In constructor MaPage:MaPage  ...... MaPage.o Error 1
Nov 18 21:08:57 <CosmoHill> hey th0br0
Nov 18 21:09:00 <Chani> Mek: ah, thanks :)
Nov 18 21:09:20 <thiago_home> niala: that's not the error
Nov 18 21:09:28 <thiago_home> niala: the actual error is between those lines
Nov 18 21:09:34 <thiago_home> niala: it has "error:" in the line
Nov 18 21:10:39 <Chani> thiago_home: ok, it's on my todolist for tomorrow, i'll spread the word then
Nov 18 21:11:50 * thiago_home is watching Dexter and sees that he's using a prototype for an N8
Nov 18 21:12:01 <thiago_home> it's clearly the N8, but it says "C0"
Nov 18 21:12:15 <Chani> haha
Nov 18 21:12:22 <CosmoHill> thiago_home: lol
Nov 18 21:12:55 <thiago_home> we have several C0 in the office
Nov 18 21:13:04 * Chani yawns
Nov 18 21:13:30 <niala> you mean that ?  :   main.cpp: In function ‘int main(int, char**)’: main.cpp:21:8: erreur: ‘class MaPage’ has no member named ‘show’ make: *** [main.o] Erreur 1
Nov 18 21:13:32 <tripzero> thiago_home, i thought you had an n9?
Nov 18 21:13:39 <CosmoHill> thiago_home: can I have one? :)
Nov 18 21:13:53 <thiago_home> niala: that
Nov 18 21:14:05 <thiago_home> niala: it says that the class MaPage doesn't have a member called show()
Nov 18 21:14:12 * Chani hopes ervin will be online tomorrow
Nov 18 21:14:19 <thiago_home> tripzero: there's no such thing as an N9, you know it
Nov 18 21:14:43 <tripzero> sadly... :(
Nov 18 21:14:54 <thiago_home> all prototypes have "C0" stamped, so even I don't know what the actual commercial designation will be
Nov 18 21:15:50 <tripzero> nokia didn't make any cool announcements at the conference?
Nov 18 21:16:24 <thiago_home> it announced that the announcement will be in 2011
Nov 18 21:16:35 <tripzero> lemme rephrase: did anyone make any cool announcements?
Nov 18 21:16:58 <tripzero> yay for reentrant announcements!
Nov 18 21:17:33 <thiago_home> yes, there was one cool announcement
Nov 18 21:17:35 <thiago_home> from AMD
Nov 18 21:17:43 <tripzero> was AMD actually there?
Nov 18 21:17:47 <thiago_home> yes
Nov 18 21:17:49 <tripzero> that's kinda cool
Nov 18 21:18:01 <tripzero> was nvidia there too?
Nov 18 21:18:04 <thiago_home> I had a nice chat with the AMD guy
Nov 18 21:18:16 <thiago_home> and we could catch up on a lot of things, since he's a friend too :-)
Nov 18 21:18:23 <tripzero> nice
Nov 18 21:18:29 <tripzero> is the the AMD linux guy?
Nov 18 21:18:36 <thiago_home> chris schläger, formerly of SUSE (he was CEO, not sure)
Nov 18 21:19:07 <thiago_home> no nvidia around that I saw
Nov 18 21:19:13 <CosmoHill> who was it who asked about wayland eariler?
Nov 18 21:19:16 <thiago_home> but this is not about AMD graphics, it's about AMD processors
Nov 18 21:19:40 <tripzero> thiago_home, bummer.  hopefully their support would include both cpu and gpu
Nov 18 21:19:58 <thiago_home> yes
Nov 18 21:20:05 <tripzero> but if their gpu is in their cpu...
Nov 18 21:20:05 <CosmoHill> you support what you have, so hopefully they will support both
Nov 18 21:20:06 <tripzero> hmm
Nov 18 21:20:55 <tripzero> mmm, wayland...
Nov 18 21:21:12 <Chani> mrr
Nov 18 21:21:40 <Chani> Mek: so has the sprint already begun? how's it going over there?
Nov 18 21:21:43 <thiago_home> we'll have wayland
Nov 18 21:21:44 <CosmoHill> not to long ago nvidia said they won't be supporting wayland
Nov 18 21:22:14 <tripzero> nvidia is really starting to fail in the linux area
Nov 18 21:22:17 <tripzero> no kms
Nov 18 21:22:19 <tripzero> no wayland
Nov 18 21:22:27 <Mek> Chani: we didn't do much yet, just some getting set up and stuff like that; and then after dinner everybody went back to their hotel (and I think the hostel most people are in doesn't have free internet)
Nov 18 21:22:28 <tripzero> they are falling behind in a huge way
Nov 18 21:22:32 <erani> i have high hopes for amd
Nov 18 21:22:41 <thiago_home> nvidia has nothing to do with wayland
Nov 18 21:22:46 <CosmoHill> I thought it was a pit premature to say they won't support wayland
Nov 18 21:22:48 <thiago_home> wayland can do EGL and NVidia has that
Nov 18 21:22:49 <CosmoHill> bit*
Nov 18 21:22:53 <Chani> Mek: ah, cool. good for people to get a proper night's sleep :)
Nov 18 21:23:06 <tripzero> thiago_home, what about the driver?
Nov 18 21:23:20 <thiago_home> tripzero: they have EGL drivers
Nov 18 21:23:22 <tripzero> isn't nvidias driver X specific or does wayland support X drivers?
Nov 18 21:23:32 * Chani spent the afternoon watching tv n'stuff. finally beginning to feel unzombified. 
Nov 18 21:23:33 <thiago_home> yes, it is
Nov 18 21:23:37 <thiago_home> but they have non-X versions
Nov 18 21:23:55 <thiago_home> I know because we have customers using NVidia chips without X
Nov 18 21:24:24 <thiago_home> directfb on NVidia Tegra II
Nov 18 21:24:26 <tripzero> so they won't be doing a driver specific to wayland? is that what they mean by no support?
Nov 18 21:25:02 <tripzero> or is this a "here's our driver, you make it work" kinda thing?
Nov 18 21:25:16 <thiago_home> neither
Nov 18 21:25:23 <thiago_home> we'll have to convince them to make a wayland driver
Nov 18 21:25:32 <thiago_home> what I'm saying is that they have the pieces already
Nov 18 21:25:36 <tripzero> thiago_home, btw, who are the qt-ivi guys?
Nov 18 21:25:44 <berndhs> ah well, i'm on the no-surf list, or meego.com is down
Nov 18 21:25:53 <thiago_home> EGL is already there
Nov 18 21:26:23 <Chani> speaking of drivers, anyone working on getting the lenovos in better shape yet: :)
Nov 18 21:26:37 <tripzero> define "better shape"?
Nov 18 21:26:42 <tripzero> getting wifi working?
Nov 18 21:26:48 <thiago_home> tripzero: should be our RWC people
Nov 18 21:27:07 <niala> I'll hang myself, I can not make a simple button that loads a url. need a pause and a new brain :/
Nov 18 21:27:21 <Chani> tripzero: having mouse buttons would be nice. and the corner of my screen that has the battery icon doesn't always work.
Nov 18 21:27:44 <tripzero> hmmm
Nov 18 21:27:49 <Chani> i hear there's someone working on a fix for the mousepad though
Nov 18 21:27:56 <tripzero> yeh, i use the TS and not the mousepad
Nov 18 21:28:01 <tripzero> the mousepad sux
Nov 18 21:28:07 <thiago_home> Chani: it's been broken for months
Nov 18 21:28:18 <tripzero> the battery has been broken?
Nov 18 21:28:21 <Chani> i can't get enough accuracy with the screen a lot
Nov 18 21:29:13 <Chani> oh, and so far weird random things have happened when i cclose the lid.
Nov 18 21:29:42 <tripzero> running 1.1.80.x?
Nov 18 21:30:30 <Chani> eh?
Nov 18 21:30:36 <Chani> one time it was closed for a minute, then spent about 5 minutes unresponsive as i tried everything short of yanking the battery - just after i tried sysrq keys it magically presented an unlock dialog.
Nov 18 21:30:41 <tripzero> what are your running on it/
Nov 18 21:30:47 <tripzero> ?\
Nov 18 21:30:56 <Chani> tripzero: whatever we got at the conf.
Nov 18 21:31:04 <tripzero> windows7?
Nov 18 21:31:11 <Chani> no, meego
Nov 18 21:31:16 * tripzero didn't go to the conf
Nov 18 21:31:16 <thiago_home> should be 1.1.0
Nov 18 21:31:19 <Chani> ah
Nov 18 21:31:23 <tripzero> hmm
Nov 18 21:31:39 <tripzero> wonder why battery isn't working all the time...
Nov 18 21:31:53 <thiago_home> I have one of those lenovos and the battery isn't charging
Nov 18 21:32:08 <Chani> the whole footballl game it was turned on in my backpack :/ it seems to have survived that just fine though
Nov 18 21:32:22 <DawnFoster> the lenovo systems are actually running the latest 1.2 trunk build, I think. instead of 1.1
Nov 18 21:32:35 <Chani> thiago_home: oh dear. i haven't tried to charge mine yet
Nov 18 21:32:39 <thiago_home> DawnFoster: oh, you're here
Nov 18 21:32:44 <thiago_home> DawnFoster: already home?
Nov 18 21:32:53 <DawnFoster> thiago_home: I wish!
Nov 18 21:32:57 <Chani> anyways, gnight :)
Nov 18 21:32:59 <DawnFoster> I'm in JFK
Nov 18 21:33:00 <tripzero> 1.2 trunk would make sense why there would be some breakage
Nov 18 21:33:18 <DawnFoster> anyone here have admin / shell access to the meego webservers?
Nov 18 21:33:32 <DawnFoster> I keep getting 502 bad gateway errors
Nov 18 21:33:43 <DawnFoster> and everyone who can fix it is offline in Dublin
Nov 18 21:34:01 <DawnFoster> probably drinking a Guiness in a pub somewhere :)
Nov 18 21:34:55 * thiago_home has had enough Guinness for a while
Nov 18 21:35:54 <DawnFoster> *is just looking forward to having time to sleep* :)
Nov 18 21:36:39 * niala mean maybe with a guiness qt his more easy :-/
Nov 18 21:36:44 <mikhas> interestingly enough, I dont feel like I had enough guiness - it really did taste better there than elsewhere
Nov 18 21:38:52 <thiago_home> mikhas: I thought the same of the taste
Nov 18 21:38:58 <thiago_home> usually I can't drink more than one of it per night
Nov 18 21:39:14 <thiago_home> the usual, "it's a meal" thing, it feels heavy
Nov 18 21:39:23 <thiago_home> didn't happen this time
Nov 18 21:39:46 <mikhas> yup
Nov 18 21:45:00 <tripzero> thiago_home, is there an irc channel where the qml guys hang out?
Nov 18 21:45:11 <thiago_home> #qt-qml and #qt-components
Nov 18 21:45:40 <tripzero> w00t
Nov 18 21:45:43 <tripzero> thx
Nov 18 21:49:11 <niala> I am condemned to click install to the rest of my days. lol. I'll never make my program  shame on me :)
Nov 18 21:58:47 <wazd> I'm home!
Nov 18 21:59:44 * timeless_n900 arrived @hel
Nov 18 21:59:54 <CosmoHill> you're in hell?
Nov 18 21:59:59 <CosmoHill> what did you do this time?
Nov 18 22:00:04 <timeless_n900> ... and i was paged to customer services
Nov 18 22:00:31 <timeless_n900> they didn't include my luggage on my flight
Nov 18 22:03:00 <thiago_home> CosmoHill: HEL, not hell
Nov 18 22:03:08 <CosmoHill> that was the joke
Nov 18 22:03:29 <tripzero> niala, you can make your application
Nov 18 22:03:32 <wazd> timeless_n900: heyhey :)
Nov 18 22:03:38 <tripzero> just be sure to look at the docs and the examples in there
Nov 18 22:03:57 <tripzero> you can't mix and match QWidgets with MTF like you are doing currently
Nov 18 22:04:13 <tripzero> also knowing c++ is going to help you a lot
Nov 18 22:04:26 <tripzero> ie, how inheritance works, etc
Nov 18 22:04:47 <CosmoHill> I was thinking of maybe doing some C++ lessons for newies
Nov 18 22:04:49 * CosmoHill pokes w00t
Nov 18 22:05:17 <niala> you're right
Nov 18 22:08:29 <niala> tripzero: if i use libmeegotouch what must i use for doing my own slot? MApplication ?
Nov 18 22:09:35 <tripzero> niala: i would make MaPage inherit from MApplicationPage
Nov 18 22:10:06 <tripzero> you pretty much need to inherit from something that has a show() member function or you need to declare and implement a show() on your own
Nov 18 22:10:43 <tripzero> niala, but realistically, MaPage really doesn't need to inherit from anything
Nov 18 22:10:58 <tripzero> since you seem to be creating a window and page inside MaPage's constructor
Nov 18 22:11:11 <tripzero> in that case, you don't need to call "show()" on MaPage
Nov 18 22:11:20 <tripzero> so you can delete that line entirely
Nov 18 22:12:04 <niala> ok
Nov 18 22:17:45 <CosmoHill> niala: qui est "RTÉ International"?
Nov 18 22:23:16 <niala> CosmoHill: i don't understand do you have an url ?
Nov 18 22:23:33 <CosmoHill> non
Nov 18 22:23:52 <CosmoHill> I really should have just googled it
Nov 18 22:24:39 <CosmoHill> oh okay, I thought it was french because of the name but it's ireish
Nov 18 22:25:34 <niala> CosmoHill: http://www.dzsat.org/forum/f40/rte-international-pour-bientot-27059.html irish tv that is ?
Nov 18 22:25:59 <CosmoHill> think it might be
Nov 18 22:33:20 <slaine> it is
Nov 18 22:34:20 <slaine> I'm bunched, am off to bed
Nov 18 22:34:25 <slaine> catch you all tomorrow
Nov 18 22:41:37 <niala> CosmoHill: if my simple meegotouch button don't work tomorrow night i ll never come back and i buy apple
Nov 18 22:45:16 <CosmoHill> :o
Nov 18 22:45:28 <CosmoHill> niala: you won't...not when you see the price :p
Nov 18 22:47:28 <niala> CosmoHill:  i'll sell my bike my pc my netbook my underpants
Nov 18 22:50:58 <Termana> morning
Nov 18 22:55:08 <niala> Termana:  morning
Nov 18 23:13:49 * timoph is finally at Finland
Nov 18 23:14:35 <timoph> only tool 11h
Nov 18 23:14:53 <timoph> s/tool/took/
Nov 18 23:14:53 <infobot> timoph meant: only took 11h
Nov 18 23:17:44 <timoph> and my battery is dead..
Nov 18 23:18:15 <CosmoHill> bye timoph
Nov 18 23:41:18 * CosmoHill ponders
Nov 18 23:41:36 <CosmoHill> I've only ever had one high end computer and I'm still typing on it five years after I got it
Nov 18 23:45:13 <Darkmagister> hi, can i put the interface home interface of meego on my debian home pc ??? i like the myzone screen with appointments and task but i love my desktop computer can i add the myzone or the whole UI ??? i can find the source somewhere ??
Nov 18 23:45:42 <CosmoHill> the sources are in src.rpm format at repo.meego.com
Nov 18 23:47:14 <Darkmagister> ok ... but the ui it's a new desktop manager or ... what ? :D
Nov 18 23:47:27 <CosmoHill> no idea
Nov 18 23:49:52 <niala> not a trivial task
Nov 18 23:50:32 <Darkmagister> ok thanks
Nov 18 23:54:39 <apol> does anybody know if i can find kde packages for the netbook version?
Nov 18 23:55:00 <CosmoHill> nope, there is xfce tho
Nov 19 00:18:50 <mortenmj> how is writing an application in qt for meego different from writing that same application for e.g. ubuntu?
Nov 19 00:19:35 <mortenmj> will i have to port my app if i want it to work on both?
Nov 19 00:22:34 <tripzero> mortenmj, first, you need to consider which UX you want to have your qt app run in
Nov 19 00:23:07 <tripzero> you can code a straight up qwidget based app for ubuntu, but it may not perform or look as desired when run in handset for example
Nov 19 00:24:33 <tripzero> in other words, there are many considerations to take when doing a desktop vs handset or desktop vs automotive application
Nov 19 00:24:42 <tripzero> lesser with desktop vs netbook
Nov 19 00:25:25 <mortenmj> right
Nov 19 00:26:03 <mortenmj> i intend to use qml and qt. that allows me to use the same logic, and only swap out the qml when i move between meego for netbook and meego for handset, right?
Nov 19 00:28:31 <tripzero> right.  the best think I've found to do is to any backend logic in c++ and keep the UI separate
Nov 19 00:28:45 <tripzero> with QML, the frontend logic become much easier to manage
Nov 19 00:28:52 <tripzero> s/become/becomes/
Nov 19 00:28:53 <infobot> tripzero meant: with QML, the frontend logic becomes much easier to manage
Nov 19 00:28:54 <mortenmj> yeah, that's what i had in mind
Nov 19 00:29:03 <mortenmj> front end in qml, and back end in qt
Nov 19 00:29:11 <tripzero> excellent! :)
Nov 19 00:29:39 <mortenmj> i mean, worst case, there is some back end logic that i simply don't use in the handheld version (which might be more minimalistic)
Nov 19 00:30:41 <chriadam> mortenmj: well, if you're doing MeeGo handset UX application development, you have to consider things like power usage far more than on desktop Ubuntu for example
Nov 19 00:30:48 <mortenmj> tripzero: so, are there special libraries or other things that are specific to meego, that i need to know about?
Nov 19 00:31:35 <tripzero> qt, qt-mobility are the big ones
Nov 19 00:31:41 <tripzero> but they aren't specific only to meego
Nov 19 00:32:00 <mortenmj> splendid
Nov 19 00:32:07 <mortenmj> then i believe i'm on top of things
Nov 19 00:32:23 <mortenmj> qml is new to me, but it doesn't look hard
Nov 19 00:32:36 <apol> is there any possibility to use any other distro rpm's with meego? (i want kde)
Nov 19 00:32:51 <mortenmj> it certainly was the buzzword du jour at the conference ^^
Nov 19 00:33:05 <tripzero> it is possible that your app may need to do other things that are kinda specific to meego (alarms comes to mine).  But that depends on what your app needs to do
Nov 19 00:33:18 <tripzero> qml is quite yummy.  I've been having fun with it
Nov 19 00:33:26 <tripzero> apol, no, that's a bad idea
Nov 19 00:33:39 <mortenmj> tripzero: did you have to build qt 4.7.1 or did you find binaries somewhere?
Nov 19 00:33:45 <tripzero> it may be possible, but it's bound to cause issues at some point
Nov 19 00:34:01 <apol> tripzero: hm... -.-
Nov 19 00:34:12 <apol> is there any easy tutorial on how to create packages?
Nov 19 00:34:38 <tripzero> mortenmj, i develop with what my distro provides (iirc, ubuntu 10.10 has qt 4.7.1)
Nov 19 00:34:52 <mortenmj> it doesn't
Nov 19 00:35:02 <tripzero> if you live on meego trunk, you will also have the latest
Nov 19 00:35:16 <tripzero> then 10.10 has 4.7.0, which is okay
Nov 19 00:35:24 <mortenmj> it has 4.7.0, yeah
Nov 19 00:35:45 <tripzero> the .1 is just a bugfix version. and I haven't had the need for those fixes as of yet
Nov 19 00:35:50 <mortenmj> which is okay, but there are some neat things in 4.7.1
Nov 19 00:35:55 <tripzero> oh?
Nov 19 00:36:03 <mortenmj> very minor i suppose
Nov 19 00:36:14 <tripzero> maybe i'm missing out...
Nov 19 00:36:17 <mortenmj> most tutorials ask you to "import QtQuick 1.0", which only works in 4.7.1
Nov 19 00:36:22 <mortenmj> but i don't think it really matters
Nov 19 00:36:29 <tripzero> oh, hrm
Nov 19 00:36:41 <tripzero> i've always considered those examples to be out of date
Nov 19 00:36:42 <mortenmj> just "import Qt 4.7" seems to do the same, as far as i've noticed
Nov 19 00:36:47 <tripzero> :nod:
Nov 19 00:36:50 <mortenmj> the tutorials are kinda crap to be honest
Nov 19 00:37:03 <tripzero> needs improvement, that's for sure
Nov 19 00:38:12 <mortenmj> tripzero: were you at the conf?
Nov 19 00:38:42 <tripzero> negative.  I had too much to do here to go :(
Nov 19 00:44:22 <mortenmj> tripzero: too bad :(
Nov 19 00:44:25 <chriadam> actually, a couple of good tutorials for Qt QUICK is probably a prime contribution candidate, if someone is willing to write one and contribute it back to Qt :-)
Nov 19 00:44:44 <mortenmj> anyway, thanks for your help. time to grab the sdk, set up creator and get to work
Nov 19 00:45:34 <mortenmj> did i mention that i love the new fiber uplink i've got at home? 200mb toolchain took all of 90 seconds to download
Nov 19 00:46:14 <mortenmj> stupid wifi limiting my download speed
Nov 19 00:48:36 <tripzero> lol
Nov 19 00:55:35 <mortenmj> tripzero: at http://wiki.meego.com/SDK/Docs/1.1/Configuring_QEMU_runtimes it says to install one of the ia32 runtimes. how does that make sense given that the n900 runs arm?
Nov 19 00:59:30 <WIIman> app depentancies can be like that
Nov 19 00:59:45 <WIIman> it may work with out it
Nov 19 00:59:46 <tripzero> mortenmj, i think you can just replace the "ia32" with whatever arch you are running
Nov 19 01:01:06 <tripzero> for example, use qemu-n900-pr12 as your runtime instead of meego-handset-ia32-qemu-1.1.20101031.2201-sda-runtime
Nov 19 01:01:56 <tripzero> i haven't tried the sdk yet so i'm unsure
Nov 19 01:02:47 <tripzero> my development currently consists of: develop on desktop, build package, test on target device
Nov 19 01:02:48 <mortenmj> i tried, but it failed
Nov 19 01:02:57 <mortenmj> only worked for the ia32 archs
Nov 19 01:03:01 <tripzero> hmm
Nov 19 01:03:06 <mortenmj> normally that's my style as well, but i figured i'd try this
Nov 19 01:03:11 <mortenmj> qt creator is allegedly awesome
Nov 19 01:03:16 <tripzero> yeah, i want to give it a try
Nov 19 01:03:21 <mortenmj> according to the prople in #qt, who aren't biased at all
Nov 19 01:03:26 <tripzero> lol
Nov 19 01:03:31 <tripzero> i use qt creator on my desktop
Nov 19 01:03:42 <tripzero> it is quite the awesome
Nov 19 01:04:03 <tripzero> but the sdk has "extra features" that i wouldn't mind trying
Nov 19 01:04:14 <mortenmj> such as?
Nov 19 01:04:57 <tripzero> such as the maemo and meego device configurations
Nov 19 01:05:10 <tripzero> those aren't in my distro's qt creator
Nov 19 01:05:42 <mortenmj> neat
Nov 19 01:07:38 <CosmoHill> cyas
Nov 19 01:07:47 <kapr> Where can I find out meego source code?
Nov 19 01:08:05 <CosmoHill> repo.meego.com in src.rpm format
Nov 19 01:08:24 <kapr> but what I get is user libraries
Nov 19 01:08:41 <kapr> I want the middle layer stuff like opengl and mesa
Nov 19 01:09:57 <CosmoHill> http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/releases/1.1/netbook/repos/source/
Nov 19 01:10:08 <CosmoHill> it's somewhere in there
Nov 19 01:10:41 <chriadam> there's also the gitorious repos like http://meego.gitorious.org/meego-middleware etc
Nov 19 01:11:15 <kapr> <Cosmo Hill> i have downloaded all of these but ...i dnt get middleware in it
Nov 19 01:11:19 <kapr> thats all user libs
Nov 19 01:14:44 <kapr> @chieadam : can you point me to the place where I can find the OpenGL libs
Nov 19 01:14:51 <kapr> for meegfo
Nov 19 01:15:18 <mortenmj> hi, i'm the qt creator options window. i can't be fullscreened, and i'm too big for your monitor. good luck finding my apply and okay buttons, teehee!
Nov 19 01:17:47 <chriadam> kapr: not really, not sure where they are I'm sorry
Nov 19 01:17:49 <mgoddard|nok> mortenmj: running it on device? :)
Nov 19 01:17:58 <mortenmj> mgoddard|nok: netbook, yeah
Nov 19 01:18:12 <kapr> yes
Nov 19 01:18:16 <mortenmj> it can't be fullscreened, has no scrollbar, and the lower row of buttons is *just* outside the screen
Nov 19 01:18:40 <kapr> bye
Nov 19 01:20:15 <mortenmj> mgoddard|nok: what exactly can i do in that situation?
Nov 19 01:20:39 <mgoddard|nok> ooh, pain.  hmm, what platform? sometimes keyboard shortcuts for moving the window
Nov 19 01:20:52 <mgoddard|nok> or shortcuts for the buttons I guess
Nov 19 01:21:12 <mortenmj> funny thing is i can move it down out of the screen, but not up
Nov 19 01:21:18 <mortenmj> so the bottom part can be outside, but not the top
Nov 19 01:21:30 <mgoddard|nok> urf.  alt+o (for ok) might work (on linux)
Nov 19 01:21:44 <mortenmj> ah, with alt click it can be!
Nov 19 02:10:40 <thebootroo> tripzero: ping !
Nov 19 02:11:39 <lolloo> what does that do?
Nov 19 02:11:51 <thebootroo> wut ?
Nov 19 02:12:18 <lolloo> ping !
Nov 19 02:12:29 <lolloo> is it irc command?
Nov 19 02:12:48 <thebootroo> hum
Nov 19 02:12:52 <ali1234> no, irc commands all begin with /
Nov 19 02:12:59 <lolloo> awesome thanks
Nov 19 02:13:08 <lolloo> \ping
Nov 19 02:13:09 <thebootroo> with the syntax 'user: ' you just wizz a man
Nov 19 02:13:11 <lolloo> oops
Nov 19 02:13:13 <lolloo> hehehe
Nov 19 02:13:15 <lolloo> fail
Nov 19 02:13:31 <thebootroo> lolloo: if a do this, your irc client must ring
Nov 19 02:13:40 <lolloo> awesome
Nov 19 02:13:56 <lolloo> uthebootroo: pig
Nov 19 02:13:59 <lolloo> ooops
Nov 19 02:14:04 <lolloo> hehehe sorry
Nov 19 02:14:15 <thebootroo> but basically its a geek way to say   a_man: hello are you there
Nov 19 02:14:21 <lolloo> ahaaa
Nov 19 02:14:36 <lolloo> thebootroo: ping
Nov 19 02:14:41 <lolloo> thebootroo: /ping
Nov 19 02:15:01 <thebootroo> the username must start at the first char and being followed by ':' without space and then whatever you xant
Nov 19 02:15:06 <thebootroo> *want
Nov 19 02:15:18 <thebootroo> lolloo: this ping you too
Nov 19 02:15:34 <lolloo> nice!
Nov 19 02:15:39 <thebootroo> and that too :
Nov 19 02:15:43 <thebootroo> lolloo:
Nov 19 02:15:46 <lolloo> thebootroo: hello
Nov 19 02:15:58 <ali1234> actually most clients will alert user if anyone mentions their exact nick
Nov 19 02:16:16 <lolloo> am using xcht
Nov 19 02:16:19 <lolloo> xchat*
Nov 19 02:16:35 <lolloo> awesome
Nov 19 02:16:38 * thebootroo uses Empathy
Nov 19 02:16:51 * lolloo happy
Nov 19 02:16:54 <lolloo> hehehe
Nov 19 02:16:56 * thebootroo developping its own full qt multiprotocol client too
Nov 19 02:17:01 <lolloo> wow
Nov 19 02:17:11 <ali1234> empathy still sucks for irc :(
Nov 19 02:17:16 <lolloo> I would like to see it
Nov 19 02:17:18 <thebootroo> yes somtimes
Nov 19 02:17:50 <thebootroo> lolloo: not finished at the moment, doesnt support IRC, just XMPP (so Gtalk, jabber and facebook chat)
Nov 19 02:18:28 <thebootroo> it's plugin based (using Qt Plugins framework)
Nov 19 02:18:30 <lolloo> does it support file transfer?
Nov 19 02:18:37 <thebootroo> not yet
Nov 19 02:18:37 <lolloo> Qt is awesome
Nov 19 02:18:53 <lolloo> will it work on Meego?
Nov 19 02:19:11 <lolloo> that would be awesome
Nov 19 02:19:26 <thebootroo> maybe but interface will not fit at all since its heavily customized for my own desktop
Nov 19 02:20:28 <lolloo> wow I would like to learn how to program using Qt, is there any books or reference yo would like to provide for me thebootroo
Nov 19 02:20:47 <lolloo> I like C++
Nov 19 02:20:55 <thebootroo> no need books, but what is your mother's language ?
Nov 19 02:21:07 <thebootroo> are you english speaker or other ?
Nov 19 02:21:14 <ali1234> qt comes with loads of examples
Nov 19 02:21:14 <lolloo> arabic but am good with english
Nov 19 02:21:19 <thebootroo> ok
Nov 19 02:21:54 <ali1234> as long as you know C, just get qt creator (eg nokia sdk) and just start trying to build something
Nov 19 02:21:54 <lolloo> yes I downloaded the SDK for MeeGo but it's pain in the butt to install
Nov 19 02:22:05 <ali1234> dont get meego sdk, get nokia qt sdk
Nov 19 02:22:16 <ali1234> it'smuch much easier to use
Nov 19 02:22:16 <lolloo> wow never knew they had one
Nov 19 02:22:23 <thebootroo> so download the qt nokia sdk on qt website then launch the first tutorial (adress book if i remember) and if you know C++ you must not have hard times
Nov 19 02:22:39 <lolloo> awesome,
Nov 19 02:23:00 <ali1234> the only downside is you can't target meego with nokia sdk yet
Nov 19 02:23:02 <lolloo> one question I dont mean to bother you guys, but will it run on MeeGo?
Nov 19 02:23:09 <ali1234> but learn one thing at a time :)
Nov 19 02:23:10 <lolloo> oops
Nov 19 02:23:11 <thebootroo> ali1234: u r tru 4 meego sdk : i can't even use it coz of my non-KVM pc
Nov 19 02:23:43 <lolloo> alright, fair enough
Nov 19 02:23:53 <ali1234> you can build stuff for the simulators and for your local desktop machine using the nokia sdk
Nov 19 02:24:00 <thebootroo> lolloo: u must learn plain Qt before MTF, cause it uses same principles
Nov 19 02:24:43 <thebootroo> ali1234: no, cause the emulator uses Qemu, which need KVM processor support, which i don't have on my C2D T5800
Nov 19 02:24:44 <lolloo> awesome info
Nov 19 02:25:21 <ali1234> the device emulator in the nokia qt sdk doesn't need qemu, it uses just themeing. it's less accurate of course
Nov 19 02:25:45 <thebootroo> ali1234: exuz me i though u were speakin of running meego sdk bootstraps
Nov 19 02:26:04 <thebootroo> yes if you speak of simulator (which suxx) its ok
Nov 19 02:26:05 <ali1234> no no, i'm saying if you just want to learn qt, use the nokia sdk, cos it's way easier to set up
Nov 19 02:26:20 <ali1234> once you learned qt, then try the meego stuff
Nov 19 02:26:26 <lolloo> alright,
Nov 19 02:26:38 <lolloo> Meego supports Qt
Nov 19 02:27:07 <ali1234> yes, so anything you develop using the nokia sdk can be easily ported... that's kind of the point of meego
Nov 19 02:27:17 <lolloo> wow awesome
Nov 19 02:27:34 <ali1234> some day soon the nokia sdk should have meego as a target
Nov 19 02:27:41 <ali1234> it just isn't quite ready yet
Nov 19 02:27:52 <thebootroo> yes but in practice the plain Qt apps are fucked off, at least on handset ux, hopin this will be fixed soon
Nov 19 02:27:52 <ali1234> i dare say by the time you have learned qt, it will be ready
Nov 19 02:28:04 <ali1234> yeah that's a good point
Nov 19 02:28:18 <ali1234> but... the alternatives are still up in the air too
Nov 19 02:28:28 <ali1234> and the basic ideas are the same
Nov 19 02:28:45 <thebootroo> yup
Nov 19 02:28:53 <zr0> has qt mobility made its way to the handset ux?
Nov 19 02:29:08 <thebootroo> AFAIK yes at least in part
Nov 19 02:30:26 <lolloo> I hope it supports windows 7 64
Nov 19 02:30:40 <thebootroo> who uses W764 for linux dev ?
Nov 19 02:30:48 <lolloo> that's me
Nov 19 02:30:51 <thebootroo> you know meego is linux ?
Nov 19 02:30:56 <ljp> qt mobility won't fully support meego unti; mobility version 1.2 is released
Nov 19 02:31:11 <lolloo> yes I do unfortunately
Nov 19 02:31:32 <thebootroo> so dev on it is so easy using tools like Qemu, Chroot, SSH, GCC (all linux tools, without windows possibility)
Nov 19 02:31:46 <lolloo> I had hard time using virtual machine
Nov 19 02:32:02 <lolloo> I Installed Ubuntu 10
Nov 19 02:32:14 <lolloo> but still I have problems to solve
Nov 19 02:32:36 <thebootroo> lolloo: i suggest you dual booting an easy linux version like ubuntu beside your windoz and use it for (Qt) (MeeGo) Dev
Nov 19 02:32:47 <ali1234> if your goal is just to learn qt you dont need any special tools, just llearn qt for desktop first
Nov 19 02:32:48 <thebootroo> dont use virtual machine
Nov 19 02:33:05 <lolloo> alright.
Nov 19 02:33:07 <ali1234> you can even klearn qt desktop style using windows since nokia sdk runs there
Nov 19 02:33:08 <thebootroo> use plain dual boot install
Nov 19 02:33:33 <Moult> hey all, completely new to meego- just a few vague questions: i know meego is immature, but is there an expected "good for commercial shipping" release date for the mobile version? and i know meego is linux, but is it based on a specific distro?
Nov 19 02:33:43 <thebootroo> april 2011
Nov 19 02:33:48 <thebootroo> meego 1.2
Nov 19 02:33:52 <ali1234> Moult: meego is not based on any distro
Nov 19 02:34:25 <thebootroo> technically meego is near of fedora (same components) but meego is build from scratch
Nov 19 02:34:37 <lolloo> wow
Nov 19 02:34:40 <thebootroo> that mandatory to get a fully optimized thing
Nov 19 02:34:41 <Moult> ah, so fresh package management tools as well?
Nov 19 02:34:51 <ali1234> it uses RPM i that's what you mean
Nov 19 02:34:57 <Moult> oh, so not fresh :)
Nov 19 02:35:01 <lolloo> wow Meego is GGRRRREAT
Nov 19 02:35:03 <niala> about qt why my slot don't work? noo error on compil  but :   Object::connect: No such slot QApplication::monSlot() in ../learn00/MaFenetre.cpp:12 Object::connect:  (receiver name: 'sans_titre3')   http://pastebin.com/KKtuYk88
Nov 19 02:35:06 <ali1234> but it's not going to by synced to any particular distro
Nov 19 02:35:06 <thebootroo> no afaik it uses Zypper, with rpm packages
Nov 19 02:35:14 <Moult> ali1234: yeah
Nov 19 02:35:32 <thebootroo> niala: i'm lookin
Nov 19 02:35:39 <ali1234> unlike eg ubuntu which syncs to debian for each release
Nov 19 02:35:42 <Moult> how transparent is meego in terms of its "linuxness"? will it try to hide it or will it remain open?
Nov 19 02:35:55 <ali1234> meego is supposed to be 100% open
Nov 19 02:36:06 <ali1234> what ends up on manufacturer's devices is a different question
Nov 19 02:36:19 <ali1234> supposedly they can add, but not take away from, meego core functionality
Nov 19 02:36:20 <Moult> niice. is it possible for me to demo both the netbook and mobile versions on any old laptop?
Nov 19 02:36:21 <lolloo> Linux rulez
Nov 19 02:36:48 <ali1234> you can run both the netbook and handset image on various atom netbooks, yes
Nov 19 02:36:49 <thebootroo> niala: you must not use qApp for connecting a slot
Nov 19 02:36:56 <niala> thebootroo: hello, how are you, and your project
Nov 19 02:36:57 <ali1234> you can't install them both at once, at least not easily
Nov 19 02:37:12 <ali1234> but you can make two boootable usb drives
Nov 19 02:37:16 <niala> i ve try ' this ' to
Nov 19 02:37:17 <thebootroo> cause you're not sure the current QApplication have it and ever more, qt doesnt know it at compling time
Nov 19 02:37:23 <ali1234> but handset is still very very far from usable
Nov 19 02:37:54 <thebootroo> niala: my project is going on, like alway, slower but it goe
Nov 19 02:38:50 <Moult> ali1234: no, i don't want to overwrite the current os on it, just perhaps run it as an emulator? (and i've not got any atom netbooks)
Nov 19 02:39:09 <ali1234> you can boot it from a usb flashdrive
Nov 19 02:39:10 <thebootroo> Moult: you can't demos meego from OLD laptop since it needs a processors that supports SSSE3 (with 3 's')  so only recent Pentium E, CD2 and Atoms
Nov 19 02:39:26 <Moult> i've got and x64, will that work?
Nov 19 02:39:39 <thebootroo> no matters, just need SSSE3
Nov 19 02:39:47 <thebootroo> and you can't emulate it
Nov 19 02:39:55 <ali1234> if it's intel and newer then core 2 then it will work
Nov 19 02:40:03 <ali1234> no amd has ssse3 unfortunately
Nov 19 02:40:13 <ali1234> however given recent events, maybe that will change
Nov 19 02:40:16 <thebootroo> its a processor instruction from intel very recent
Nov 19 02:40:24 <niala> thebootroo: lol i cannot do a simple button wich load an url :) but if i suppr my Slot and replace by quit that works
Nov 19 02:40:26 <thebootroo> ali1234: hope you r tru about that
Nov 19 02:40:45 <lolloo> ali1234: yeah AMD is going for MeeGo
Nov 19 02:40:54 <thebootroo> niala: cause all QApplication isntace HAVE the quit qlot
Nov 19 02:40:56 <WIIman> wouldn't developing on a netbook be more sutable since it is usualy full intel suported hardware ?
Nov 19 02:40:57 <ali1234> yeah hopefully amd will put some resources to a generic and/or amd optimised version of meego
Nov 19 02:40:57 <thebootroo> *slot
Nov 19 02:41:24 <ali1234> WIIman: yeah... but developing on a netbook is not fun
Nov 19 02:41:31 <thebootroo>  niala: but all QApplication instance doesn't have your custom slot
Nov 19 02:41:45 <Termana> ali1234, AMD's newer processors will support SSSE3
Nov 19 02:41:45 <ali1234> i'd rather be debugging on a 4 core 3 ghz machine with 16 gb of rm, than some netbook
Nov 19 02:41:53 <niala> Moult: http://blogs.amd.com/press/2010/11/15/amd-joins-meego-linux-open-source-linux-project-for-next-generation-mobile-embedded-platforms/
Nov 19 02:42:06 <ali1234> Termana: damn. tht's not much help to me, since i have a current amd processor
Nov 19 02:42:23 <thebootroo> niala: and if you have custom slot, your QApp is a subclass of QApplication, but qApp cast to QApplication so losin you custon slot
Nov 19 02:42:34 <WIIman> i realise netbooks are not best suted for dev but at the same time they have the nessisarry hardware for the dev to in synk with the distro
Nov 19 02:42:53 <thebootroo> niala: use a trick with this->parent instead
Nov 19 02:42:58 <WIIman> since more powerfull box arnt suported yet
Nov 19 02:43:09 <ali1234> WIIman: yeah you basically need your target hardware and also a nice fast workstation, to do serious dev. unfortunately at the moment they *both* have too be recent intel
Nov 19 02:43:15 <thebootroo> niala: assuming you have you app in parent
Nov 19 02:43:50 <thebootroo> niala: fuck i'm a big nnoob too : missed that
Nov 19 02:44:01 <thebootroo> niala: your slot is not in the app
Nov 19 02:44:25 <WIIman> i have sucsessfuly build a standard linux kernel on my dell mini 10 1012 wich gives me the impression it would work for dev
Nov 19 02:44:28 <thebootroo> niala: it's in your maFenetre (tiens t'es français aussi ?)
Nov 19 02:44:46 <ali1234> sure you can do everything on a netbook if you are patient :)
Nov 19 02:44:48 <thebootroo> niala: so just use 'this' instead of 'qApp'
Nov 19 02:45:44 <WIIman> i just wish i knew qt i would love to get more apps to meego its so nice for netbooks
Nov 19 02:46:05 <ali1234> qt is a really nice sdk for just about everything
Nov 19 02:46:09 <niala> thebootroo: i have begin by that
Nov 19 02:46:18 <thebootroo> niala: and ?
Nov 19 02:46:19 <ali1234> just learn qt for whatever you have first
Nov 19 02:46:51 <ali1234> the techniques do not really change between platforms
Nov 19 02:46:58 <niala> nothing
Nov 19 02:47:04 <WIIman> i see meego going far . so much talk on the net about it and high hopes for its future
Nov 19 02:47:15 <thebootroo> niala: it doesn't compile ?
Nov 19 02:48:43 <vicarious-> Hi, I'm a bit confused about Meego...can some kind person field a few basic questions about meego?
Nov 19 02:48:46 <niala> thebootroo:  output compil: make: quittant le répertoire « /home/niala/qt/learn00-build-desktop » Le processus "/usr/bin/make" s'est terminé normalement.
Nov 19 02:49:01 <thebootroo> niala: ben alor c'est bon
Nov 19 02:49:21 <vicarious-> Since the advent of Android, I have to ask regarding Meego: why?
Nov 19 02:49:39 <vicarious-> isn't it just reinventing the wheel?
Nov 19 02:49:46 <ali1234> android is not meant for tablets, STBs, fridges, etc
Nov 19 02:49:47 <thebootroo> vicarious-: no
Nov 19 02:49:51 <ljp> isnt android just reinventing the wheel?
Nov 19 02:50:03 <thebootroo> vicarious-: android doesn't use C++ Qt  but Java
Nov 19 02:50:06 <ali1234> android is just for phones... meego has a MUCh wider scope
Nov 19 02:50:08 <WIIman> i dont think so the ui is amasing
Nov 19 02:50:13 <thebootroo> vicarious-: so really heavier
Nov 19 02:50:33 <WIIman> and the suport from intell n okia amd so on helps to
Nov 19 02:50:34 <vicarious-> pardon: but android has already moved to the tablet platform
Nov 19 02:50:41 <niala> thebootroo: the button is here but he does nothing
Nov 19 02:50:48 <ali1234> vicarious-: no by google's choice
Nov 19 02:51:02 <vicarious-> ok, so let me back up...how is Meego different than Android?
Nov 19 02:51:05 <thebootroo> vicarious-: google himself said in its actual version android is not meant for tablet even if its works
Nov 19 02:52:00 <thebootroo> niala: après ce le code de ton slot qui est pourri, je te le corrige et je le renvoie ok
Nov 19 02:52:06 <WIIman> meego is more flexable than android runs on mmore devices by desine
Nov 19 02:52:11 <ali1234> all the android tablets and netbooks out there suck
Nov 19 02:52:21 <ali1234> and none of them have the app store cos they are all nasty hacks
Nov 19 02:52:23 * lolloo agrees
Nov 19 02:52:25 <ali1234> afaik
Nov 19 02:52:49 <niala> thebootroo: si je le met pas en slot ca fonctionne et ca eteind bien la freebox. mais en fonction/slot ca marche plus
Nov 19 02:53:19 <thebootroo> niala: ton code est inexact donc il ne peut marcher qu'une fois à la rigueur
Nov 19 02:53:35 <lolloo> oh oh
Nov 19 02:55:23 <thebootroo> niala: corrigé : http://pastebin.com/6LKAi8sD
Nov 19 02:56:44 <WIIman> the interface for meego and bfore moblin is outstanding maks useing my netbook so fun and functionable , that ui and the fact it still linux wiith official drivers for the targeted hardware makes meego greaqt
Nov 19 02:57:41 <vicarious-> Okay, so you seem to be saying that the main difference between Meego and Android is that Meego is designed to run on more platforms than just phones, correct?
Nov 19 02:57:59 <lolloo> www.Meego.com
Nov 19 02:58:04 <WIIman> there is that
Nov 19 02:58:33 <WIIman> and it has actual hadware vender s behind it
Nov 19 02:58:47 <nhg> anyone attended the meego conference this week?
Nov 19 02:58:52 <thebootroo> vicarious-: and MeeGo is REALLY fully open, based on linux standard, instead of a whole home made java machine
Nov 19 02:59:01 <WIIman> so it will work on their hardware by desine
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