**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Nov 21 02:59:58 2010 Nov 21 03:35:46 so... Nov 21 03:35:50 i finally posted pictures Nov 21 03:35:56 http://konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/fingerable%20clock/ shows how to get a fingerable clock right Nov 21 03:36:08 anyone designing a clock some other way is almost certainly an idiot Nov 21 03:36:15 (i know some of those idiots) Nov 21 03:41:20 http://konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/comicchat%20meego.png Nov 21 03:42:40 lcuk: http://konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/control%20panel%20easier%20to%20use.png is how windows handles Cursor stuff fwiw Nov 21 03:42:55 the fourth section Nov 21 03:46:05 Eureka!!! my slot is working!!!!! sorry for the inconvenience Nov 21 03:52:05 anybody available that can help me figure out why the OBS does not like me? Nov 21 03:52:15 timeless_mbp: you post screenshot to inspire meego ? Nov 21 03:53:17 help...please.... can't even get the $prep to work and can't figure out why.... https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=i586&package=macuco&project=home%3Afcrochik&repository=meego_1.1_extras_Netbook Nov 21 03:53:32 niala: well... Nov 21 03:53:50 in the case of calendar i drew this ui on a napkin months ago Nov 21 03:54:02 and some clever people elected not to implement it Nov 21 03:54:17 i discovered @meego conf that microsoft basically did what i described Nov 21 03:54:51 in general there's no reason *not* to take good ideas from others Nov 21 03:55:00 nice i m agree Nov 21 03:55:13 although it is also quite important to learn from the mistakes of others Nov 21 03:55:36 good idea is an good idea even if the devil have the idea Nov 21 04:22:27 ok, i've now played w/ the ideapad's ebook reader Nov 21 04:22:29 it's actually nice Nov 21 04:23:01 the only problems i have w/ it are that it doesn't do content discovery and doesn't support epub ... Nov 21 04:23:19 but from a ux/ui perspective, it's worth a look Nov 21 04:36:47 First round of conference photos: http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/sets/72157625434963604/with/5194006720/ Nov 21 04:58:56 hey thanks GeneralAntilles Nov 21 04:59:04 much appreciated Nov 21 05:07:20 i opened a twitter acount with meego related topics and plan on using it to provide my experiances with meego and possable advice Nov 21 05:16:07 search papatwilight tryed to get it under my irc nick but it was taken Nov 21 05:16:31 just started it so only one update Nov 21 05:17:13 its not much but any thing done to promote is good Nov 21 05:26:53 awesome Nov 21 05:27:21 whats best twitter app for N900 on maemo WIIman Nov 21 05:28:32 not sure i dont have an N900 and have yet to research it but it might have social networking built in MeeGo netbook does Nov 21 05:29:13 though the meego app need facebook added Nov 21 05:29:38 atm it hast last.fm and twitter Nov 21 05:29:57 last.fm reminds me of itunes Nov 21 05:30:39 let me check google Nov 21 05:32:55 lolloo: have you tryed Witter Nov 21 05:33:10 not yet my friend Nov 21 05:33:41 its mentioned on a nokia site might want to try it Nov 21 05:34:01 may be avalible in OVI Nov 21 05:34:25 should be free Nov 21 05:35:25 yeah I see, Nov 21 05:35:32 downloading right now Nov 21 05:35:43 I will follow you on twitter Nov 21 05:35:45 hope it works for you Nov 21 05:35:49 much appreciated Nov 21 05:36:20 * WIIman is no expert lol but i help when i can Nov 21 05:37:01 my twitter username is papatwilight Nov 21 05:37:18 only one post though ill fix that now Nov 21 05:38:21 updated my page with the info i found you Nov 21 08:19:34 hi Nov 21 08:29:25 hey Nov 21 10:29:21 * CosmoHill wishes Valgrid worked on ppc mac Nov 21 10:30:19 shit I'm an idiot, the buffer overflowed because of my magic numbers Nov 21 10:30:40 ran out of pixie dust to go with those? Nov 21 10:31:28 I increased the number of iterations without increasing the array Nov 21 10:31:48 that's why you usually create a constant for those things Nov 21 10:31:50 ah, yeah, solution: add more pixi dust :) Nov 21 10:32:24 normally I would but for "lets see if this even works" things I just code quickly Nov 21 10:34:18 nuts, printf only works locally on mpi. maybe I was thinking of PVM Nov 21 10:34:22 * Chani once spent over an hour debugging what turned out to be a bad printf :) Nov 21 10:34:32 I've done that Nov 21 10:34:34 ha Nov 21 10:34:53 I needed to read 20 lines so I had a loop of 20 Nov 21 10:34:57 erp Nov 21 10:35:02 of course the loop did readline twice Nov 21 10:35:13 the zoom button on my n900 is pushing itslef Nov 21 10:35:17 an hour or two later I decreased the loop to 10 >.< Nov 21 10:35:37 Chani: I accidently tapped my zoom button on my 6220c Nov 21 10:36:50 Talk about programming accidents, I currently have this like 20 line piece that somehow is detecting and printing the result of something twice Nov 21 10:37:40 But I swear the code flow doesn't allow that :p Nov 21 10:41:23 one of my assignments is running slower than everyone else's and I have no idea why Nov 21 10:43:19 nice, I have race conditions now Nov 21 10:44:27 looking at the output I can tell what numbers the slower computer did Nov 21 10:44:59 bonjour niala, comment ça va Nov 21 10:45:01 ? Nov 21 10:46:12 hello CosmoHill i"m happy this morning/night (going to sleep a 6h) I ve done my first c++/qt Nov 21 10:46:22 yay Nov 21 10:46:35 I m sure reading fc winthis we :) Nov 21 10:46:36 congrats Nov 21 10:46:50 it was 1 -1 against Watford Nov 21 10:47:19 I was pretty ingrosed in my programming at the time of the match Nov 21 10:48:13 reading fc are the best in equality score Nov 21 10:48:54 we've been best at late scoring Nov 21 10:50:40 dammit, I was told an efficent way to do prime numbers to do something with the last found prime Nov 21 10:52:33 myyh Nov 21 11:12:24 hmm, my program fails at 15+ processes Nov 21 11:13:32 notmart: how's it going over there? Nov 21 11:14:44 Chani: trying to make sense of specs... Nov 21 11:15:02 Chani: ah, and there is still your laptop turned on there :p Nov 21 11:15:22 notmart: the rpm spec files? Nov 21 11:15:52 CosmoHill: yeah Nov 21 11:23:07 morning lcuk_idea Nov 21 11:23:25 notmart: huh.. i asked mek to put my stuff in my bag.. could you do it? Nov 21 11:23:38 Chani: ok Nov 21 11:23:54 morning CosmoHill Chani and everyone \o Nov 21 11:23:58 * Chani is staying in bed today :/ damn cold.. Nov 21 11:24:05 oooh :/ Nov 21 11:24:10 * CosmoHill gives Chani some hot black current Nov 21 11:24:14 * lcuk_idea is also in bed with ideapad Nov 21 11:24:17 ooh. yum :) Nov 21 11:24:34 so we are 3 in bed with netbook Nov 21 11:24:41 lcuk_idea, s10e here Nov 21 11:24:42 :D Nov 21 11:24:42 hahaha Nov 21 11:24:46 * notmart will go away tomorrow morning, so, remote hugs :( Nov 21 11:24:49 niala: sounds hot Nov 21 11:24:57 just to make this more annoying there's hardly any food in the house 'cause we thought we'd be out all day Nov 21 11:25:03 * Chani hugs notmart Nov 21 11:25:10 actually netbooks shouldn't make that much heat Nov 21 11:25:21 * notmart hugs Chani Nov 21 11:25:24 CosmoHill: need a lunch Nov 21 11:25:28 this is a big bed! Nov 21 11:25:35 if i feel better this evening maybe i can come say goodbye... otoh maybe i should keep my germs to myself ;P Nov 21 11:25:40 niala: well you would, you're an hour ahead of me Nov 21 11:25:53 Chani: the laptop is on (and locked) soo, if i fold it in the bag it won't last that much before dying i think? Nov 21 11:25:55 I need to figure out why my program isn't working like it should Nov 21 11:26:23 which program? Nov 21 11:26:35 my MPI Goldbach program Nov 21 11:26:37 notmart: i put a battery plasmoid on the screensaver just yesterday :) put it to sleep please Nov 21 11:26:47 * lcuk_idea went to sleep thinking of marnanel's vkb :) Nov 21 11:26:48 I got the MPI working about an hour ago Nov 21 11:27:04 CosmoHill: try your prog in bed apparently it's a bed day Nov 21 11:27:11 Chani: okie Nov 21 11:27:20 notmart: and my lenovo is turned off on the other desk.. the one with the ninja sticker Nov 21 11:27:32 I'm running it single core on each node to see if it's the nodes going funky Nov 21 11:27:53 Chani: :D lots of collabora ninjas around Nov 21 11:28:09 yay for plasma on screensaver :) Nov 21 11:28:19 damn the bottle of orange juice is just too far away to reach Nov 21 11:28:37 * Mek has a bottle of orange juice next to him... Nov 21 11:28:48 are you in bed with us also mek? Nov 21 11:28:57 no Nov 21 11:29:00 lcuk_idea: you need to hack your chroot-bed Nov 21 11:29:03 * CosmoHill wonders why iTunes is using 10% load Nov 21 11:29:07 I'm sitting next to chani's netbook Nov 21 11:29:11 then that doesnt count, whilst you are up, could you pass me the bottle :P Nov 21 11:29:39 mek but I thought chani was in bed :P Nov 21 11:29:51 I can do quiet a lot from my bed, I can just about reach the DVD player without falling out Nov 21 11:29:55 did the netbook really just tell me theres updates available? :D Nov 21 11:30:17 thats a good idea I might stretch across the room keeping leg inside the bed Nov 21 11:30:18 lcuk, do you have win7 on that ideapad? Nov 21 11:30:23 lcuk, is it running smoothely? Nov 21 11:30:25 nope, meego Nov 21 11:30:28 ah, i c Nov 21 11:30:42 i will need windows soon, and can't decide which to choose Nov 21 11:30:47 steinex: its running very smoothly, theres some niggles I mentioned on my wiki talk page Nov 21 11:30:58 yes meego-panel-status update Nov 21 11:31:04 * lcuk_idea would rather get meego running well enough Nov 21 11:31:11 don't plan to switch to meego, i'm happy with ubuntu here ;-) Nov 21 11:31:31 and I am not dual booting this, though I will find a way to run netbook/handset from same system :) Nov 21 11:33:55 the aava, is it possible to run the same binary built for the netbook edition? Nov 21 11:34:58 lcuk_idea: is linux...; if you have libs... Nov 21 11:35:17 niala: i mean from a cpu perspective Nov 21 11:35:33 and i couldnt attempt that across netbook -> n900 build for instance Nov 21 11:35:33 ah ok Nov 21 11:36:24 dammit, I keep modulating by "1" and not "i" Nov 21 11:36:53 question to 'ideapad' when your netbook enter in sleep mode, on wake up touchscreen wake up to ? Nov 21 11:37:33 meegoip seems to be the name people are banging around Nov 21 11:38:52 meegopad? Nov 21 11:39:54 Stskeeps: ? Nov 21 11:40:37 sivang: ping Nov 21 11:42:31 what do you guys think of this? http://linuxfromscratch.pastebin.com/egutT7m7 Nov 21 11:42:45 I think it's a nice little test of performace of the two algorithems Nov 21 11:43:38 of course it would be better if it worked... Nov 21 11:43:59 hmmm i added a bunch of tasks to the task list Nov 21 11:44:08 it screwed up the order and wont let me adjust it Nov 21 11:46:54 CosmoHill: there is to much fog here to help you sorry Nov 21 11:47:25 ok i saw the updates available popup, now IDK where to go to actually do the update Nov 21 11:54:01 marnanel: do you happen to have a link to spyros IVI hack building attempts, i cant see him in the chan to ask him and my credentials for elsewhere are on the laptop wayyyy over there Nov 21 11:55:20 Stskeeps did you mention you got a pandaboard too? Nov 21 11:56:30 lcuk_meegoip: no, i got offered one but i have too many devices at home, would divert my focus on meego n900 Nov 21 11:57:00 sure, spyro won one and he has been building a digital dashboard so comes at ideal time Nov 21 11:57:21 i just cant find the link Nov 21 11:57:33 i have a joggler sys to finish first and then moving on to the ideapad Nov 21 11:57:37 and my n8x0s Nov 21 11:59:46 Stskeeps: yeah Nov 21 12:00:04 leinir: did you happen to take note of the url for his project notes? Nov 21 12:00:23 i wonder if armv6 hardfloat is any good Nov 21 12:00:57 http://www.mnementh.co.uk/home/projects/golf/making_a_bezel Nov 21 12:00:59 ahhhahhh found it Nov 21 12:01:56 Morning, all Nov 21 12:02:04 morning jaffa w00t Nov 21 12:02:35 morn Nov 21 12:04:30 the fan on this ip smells of new Nov 21 12:07:17 * Jaffa goes to download the Qt Creator 2.1 beta after achipa showed off its cool QML stuff Nov 21 12:08:00 jaffa direct on your ideapad? Nov 21 12:08:11 lcuk_meegoip: Heh, no. A proper computer ;-) Nov 21 12:08:32 lcuk_meegoip: Although with the semi-translucent VKB and one of the Chrome scrollers, it's not half bad. Nov 21 12:08:46 btw. is there driver support for multi-touch on the mideapad in linux already? Nov 21 12:09:14 lcuk_meegoip: If the VKB did proper 'enter', was a better layout for the 1024x600 screen and a way of switching apps/bringing up the bar when in tablet mode, it'd be even more cool. Nov 21 12:09:33 thp: TuxPaint from Garage (*stupid* name, still, IMHO) shows multitouch capability when erasing. Nov 21 12:10:20 Jaffa: yes, but that is fake multitouch, right? (quickly alternating between the two touch points) Nov 21 12:10:51 thp: If it can detect two touch points, isn't that multitouch? Nov 21 12:10:52 i'd love to have it right down to the toolkit level, so I can experiment with Qt's MT gestures Nov 21 12:11:21 and yes, if it can detect the touch points, then that's multitouch ;) Nov 21 12:12:13 what order are the pixels on the ideapad lcd (for font hinting option) RGB BGR VRGB VBGR ? Nov 21 12:14:12 If I wanted to add support for full disk encryption to MeeGo netbook, how likely is it this would get included in the official dist? Nov 21 12:15:09 merely possible, but at least I'd like to see it happen Nov 21 12:15:20 Debolaz: file a feature bug, thats usually first indicator.. basically you need to maintain the feature and someone else qa it Nov 21 12:15:32 Debolaz: ie, when bugs come in, you handle it Nov 21 12:15:37 and submit patches Nov 21 12:16:16 i suppose the enterprise builds would like it Nov 21 12:16:35 or anyone dealing with ndaed material Nov 21 12:16:47 Im curious about the development culture around MeeGo. I can implement stuff, but I dont want to deal with paperwork. Nov 21 12:18:30 well. its a quality platform so features can't bitrot.. ie, you take responsbility for a feature like people take responsibility for a driver or a subsystem in kernel Nov 21 12:19:15 if it isnt maintained, feature gets removed Nov 21 12:20:27 lcuk: no, sorry Nov 21 12:20:35 no contracts or ndas to sign, just a bugzilla process Nov 21 12:21:55 * CosmoHill swears Nov 21 12:23:49 I forgot to change the incremeant based on last nights research, that would explain the missing numbers Nov 21 12:26:01 VDVsx: are you also lay in bed with your ideapad Nov 21 12:26:15 it seems theres a lot of people this morning enjoying it lol Nov 21 12:26:49 Stskeeps: Its an important feature for enterprise yes. Nov 21 12:27:32 one day there will be a meego meeting in bed Nov 21 12:27:50 lcuk_meegoip, nah, just got out of bed,long night :P Nov 21 12:28:13 indeed, hope you are well Nov 21 12:28:34 i am seeing snow pictures emerge on flickr, do I gather there was a frosting last night? Nov 21 12:28:41 on twitter ^ Nov 21 12:29:28 Stskeeps: Despite me not being a big fan of RPM and considering it a mistake to base the platform on it, the only thing that actually blocks me from giving MeeGo a serious try is the lack of disk encryption. Nov 21 12:30:20 Debolaz: :nod: hmm. could you be motivated to ask on meego-dev@ 'i'd like to implement full disk encryption and submit it for inclusion in meego. how do i do this in practice?" Nov 21 12:30:21 lcuk_meegoip, yes, completely white already, here in the south Nov 21 12:30:22 Debolaz, whats so bad about RPM? Nov 21 12:30:22 Debolaz: on the installer there was the option to encrypt wasnt there? Nov 21 12:30:23 ? Nov 21 12:30:36 lcuk_meegoip: only /home which is not good Nov 21 12:30:37 VDVsx: :) Nov 21 12:31:05 ahh ok, what stuff gets written outside home that concerns? Nov 21 12:31:37 full disk encryption as in sans boot partition and then LUKS for the rest? Nov 21 12:32:07 "i've noticed your battery is running a little low" awesome and friendly message :) Nov 21 12:32:10 Lcuk: /home encryption is in many cases pointless. It requires a fairly advanced understanding about your system to do it right. Nov 21 12:32:35 Its kind of like the story of the emperors new clothes. :) Nov 21 12:32:59 Debolaz: *nod* and so how would you go about it properly? Nov 21 12:33:34 test34: Too many painful memories to sum up here. But like I said, its not a blocking issue for me. Nov 21 12:34:29 lcuk: Full disk encryption. Its conceptually a lot simpler which means less chance of information leaking out unintentionally. Nov 21 12:34:54 how does it effect battery life for disk intensive activities? Nov 21 12:35:17 or is there a chip to help take the load? Nov 21 12:35:24 I can answer that one: very little, if the encryption is done with special hardware Nov 21 12:35:31 *nod* Nov 21 12:35:35 It does have disadvantages with performance for instance, but in some situations this is acceptable. Nov 21 12:35:39 and sensible embedded hardware these days have that Nov 21 12:36:12 Ie, where protecting data is more important than 3 seconds less boot time. :) Nov 21 12:36:59 its much more than 3 seconds though, since having to open the lid, flip the keyboard round and type in a password ;) Nov 21 12:37:14 True. :) Nov 21 12:37:15 from where I look at it, the hardest part would be the UI as it needs to be easy to input the passphrase Nov 21 12:37:50 preboot environment, can we run qt apps there? ;) Nov 21 12:38:28 lcuk_meegoip: I was actually thinking of devices *without* a keyboard... Nov 21 12:38:42 Bostik: so was I :) Nov 21 12:39:07 if you get a few bad sectors on an encrypted disk, does the full disk automatically go bad? Nov 21 12:39:09 we'd have to use inird approach Nov 21 12:39:13 (I mean the data) Nov 21 12:39:18 we were discussing a predictive vkb last night http://wiki.meego.com/Predictive_virtual_keyboard Nov 21 12:39:41 test34: only for the sectors involved (and usually at most one subsequent block beyond) Nov 21 12:40:05 ok Bostik Nov 21 12:40:12 that one block might be the most important one tho! Nov 21 12:40:26 morning Ash! Nov 21 12:41:03 lcuk_meegoip: there are 10 kinds of people, those who make backups and those who will start making backups in the future... Nov 21 12:41:41 extremely true. Nov 21 12:42:33 * lcuk_meegoip must link n900 to ideapad asap, i cant make notes on the screen on this Nov 21 12:42:44 but I know for a fact that at least OMAP's hw-AES has a driver in mainline kernel tree Nov 21 12:43:05 (and coworker wrote the 3DES one last week out of boredom) Nov 21 12:46:37 how many ideapads did they give out?! Nov 21 12:47:03 NooBmonk3y: count(conf_attendees) - count(nokia_sponsored) - count(intel_sponsored) Nov 21 12:47:18 trust me to get a geeky answer Nov 21 12:47:47 it should have been >500 iiuc Nov 21 12:47:53 and probably <1000 Nov 21 12:47:55 intel is slowly phasing in their AES instruction set, but for the time being it's restricted to their top-of-the-line chips only :/ Nov 21 12:48:02 s/_sponsored/_employed/g Nov 21 12:48:07 lbt: no Nov 21 12:48:09 i got one Nov 21 12:48:15 because i was LF sponsored Nov 21 12:48:21 awww i want one! lol Nov 21 12:48:30 NooBmonk3y: you'll need a time machine then Nov 21 12:48:38 (or you could buy one) Nov 21 12:48:40 I got one too ... because I wasn't employed (external) Nov 21 12:48:45 strange thing happened to me Nov 21 12:48:58 i went to work friday and saw one on a coworker's desk (right next to my desk) Nov 21 12:49:09 i asked him how he got one, because he's a nokia employee Nov 21 12:49:28 it didn't occur to me that someone could actually buy one w/ his/her own money :o Nov 21 12:49:36 but ... it turns out you can :) Nov 21 12:49:40 timeless_mbp: after the main rush of devices to participants were over a number of devices were given to employees also Nov 21 12:49:40 :P Nov 21 12:49:48 especially those who had a need for them Nov 21 12:49:54 yay, my program now produces the same output on 1, 4 and 32 cores :D Nov 21 12:50:09 lcuk_meegoip: yeah i heard a rumor to that effect Nov 21 12:50:12 but i wasn't in that Nov 21 12:50:21 you had already gotten one earlier Nov 21 12:50:24 yep Nov 21 12:50:24 so had no need to Nov 21 12:50:47 i guess the answer is probably 800 or 900 Nov 21 12:50:57 it's possible someone will blog about the actual number Nov 21 12:51:58 "lots" Nov 21 12:52:03 about 1100 attendees, at least Nov 21 12:53:10 * lcuk_meegoip recharges batteries Nov 21 12:53:54 what's the "ip" in your nick? Nov 21 12:53:59 ideapad Nov 21 12:54:41 hrm, what happened to timeless_ideapad ? Nov 21 12:54:48 on twitter they were making a hash tag and after a few variations, it was mentioned meego should be the principle part of the key Nov 21 12:55:00 it went to sleep most likely Nov 21 12:55:06 yep Nov 21 12:55:49 so should i be timeless_w7ip ? Nov 21 12:57:08 the screen on this machine is very bright and clear :) Nov 21 12:57:32 fingerprint smudges make the bright ui and light colors look ugly :P Nov 21 12:57:58 ok, now i conform, kinda :) Nov 21 12:58:13 you will never conform :) Nov 21 12:58:45 did you get your slides/photos uploaded? Nov 21 12:59:18 hi everyone, what's the cheapest OS to try meego? Nov 21 12:59:28 cheapest hardware... Nov 21 13:00:03 what have you already got# Nov 21 13:00:05 i was looking for a tablet Nov 21 13:00:15 i just have 2 laptops Nov 21 13:00:18 see a doctor Nov 21 13:00:23 there is no meego for tablet yet Nov 21 13:00:55 http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/ Nov 21 13:01:00 j #qt-fr Nov 21 13:01:15 lcuk_meegoip: ^ kinda Nov 21 13:01:21 i need to get a tool to let me do mass crops Nov 21 13:01:39 smoku it does support touch screen right? Nov 21 13:01:44 hmm you mean the same crop window across all the photos? Nov 21 13:01:57 lcuk_meegoip: i think http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/control%20panel%20easier%20to%20use.png Nov 21 13:02:00 lcuk_meegoip: yeah Nov 21 13:02:03 superh: yes we have meego netbook edition on our shiny lenovo ideapads Nov 21 13:02:16 basically http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/fingerable%20clock/mht120.png and friends should mostly be cropped to the same position Nov 21 13:02:19 (where the clock is...) Nov 21 13:02:28 superh, yes, you can move the mouse pointer using the touch screen. is that "support"? Nov 21 13:02:49 timeless_mbp: wth Nov 21 13:02:53 problem steps recorder? Nov 21 13:02:59 lcuk_meegoip: you've never met psr? Nov 21 13:03:02 it's my best friend Nov 21 13:03:11 (especially since w7starter doesn't have snipping tool :( ) Nov 21 13:03:12 is that visual screenshots or using tdriver for qt apps? Nov 21 13:03:18 that sucks Nov 21 13:03:23 lcuk_meegoip: psr does this Nov 21 13:03:29 it does more too Nov 21 13:03:33 hmmm how can i make a qcomboboxes' icon larger? :| Nov 21 13:03:40 it takes notes about what you clicked, what you typed, lets you add comments and draw boxes Nov 21 13:03:44 NooBmonk3y: move closer to the screen Nov 21 13:03:47 then it generates a web page that you can view as a slide show Nov 21 13:03:53 lol lcuk Nov 21 13:03:55 hm Nov 21 13:03:59 "on our" well i don't have a ideapad ;) Nov 21 13:04:02 packaged for meego? Nov 21 13:04:14 the icons are just too tiny to see, and if i put a large icon in it just resizes it Nov 21 13:04:18 lcuk_meegoip: ... [w7 psr.exe from microsoft...] Nov 21 13:04:33 well that sucks donkey balls Nov 21 13:04:35 lcuk_meegoip: there's actually something nowhere near as cool being developed @nokia Nov 21 13:04:37 will they open source it? Nov 21 13:04:40 * timeless_mbp chuckles Nov 21 13:04:51 i need to get the nokia folks to spend more time looking at the windows impl Nov 21 13:05:01 the nokia impl was developed for maemo Nov 21 13:05:07 w/ the same general goals as the ms app Nov 21 13:05:12 just w/o the design knowledge Nov 21 13:05:20 well for the testrunner type apps using tdriver, it should work cross platform for qt apps at least Nov 21 13:05:27 i have an ideapad brother i guess :) but ithink it doesn't support meego because it runs on a Penryn core Nov 21 13:05:40 superh: download a usb stick image and find out? Nov 21 13:05:51 lcuk_meegoip: anyway, got a tool that can crop for me? :) Nov 21 13:06:09 isn't meego only for atom cpu? Nov 21 13:06:22 is the mideapad accelerometer easily accessible through sysfs or somesuch? Nov 21 13:06:37 thp: i tried to get someone to look for it in /sys and friends Nov 21 13:06:43 he didn't indicate finding it Nov 21 13:06:54 timeless_mbp: nope, i had trouble finding a tool to convert pdf to png Nov 21 13:06:59 thp: look in /dev/input Nov 21 13:07:07 lcuk_meegoip: heh Nov 21 13:07:07 same problem, in amiga days arexx would allow this kind of scripting# Nov 21 13:07:25 * lcuk_meegoip cant remember the name of the paint package used for that tho :P Nov 21 13:07:28 http://www.imagemagick.org/script/convert.php Nov 21 13:07:55 * lolloo facepalm Nov 21 13:08:14 ahh yes kotzcarny uses that for some things with his osci Nov 21 13:08:36 another question by any chance does nokia provide tool to boot old phones with meego? Nov 21 13:08:38 timeless-mbp:mozilla-central timeless$ sudo port install ImageMagick Nov 21 13:08:46 well, that'll do both Nov 21 13:08:55 for example e63, e71 e7? Nov 21 13:08:58 superh: snowball's chance? Nov 21 13:09:13 superh: the symbian phones are highly unlikely to see alternative firmware loaders Nov 21 13:09:17 they generally require signed binaries Nov 21 13:09:29 no one hacked that? Nov 21 13:09:31 dunno, the chances for snowballs look pretty good outside Nov 21 13:09:34 superh lrn2research, many older phones had extremely different chipsets to do the work and emulating that hardware is a tough problem Nov 21 13:09:38 sp3000: ooh, true Nov 21 13:09:41 snowballs in HEL! Nov 21 13:09:42 * lcuk_meegoip wants virtual 3210 Nov 21 13:09:55 is the arm v supported by meego? Nov 21 13:10:04 superh: probably not Nov 21 13:10:10 * lcuk_meegoip pokes RST38h Nov 21 13:10:11 most people don't want to remember arm v6 Nov 21 13:10:15 let alone arm v5 Nov 21 13:10:25 Stskeeps: tried all of /dev/input/event*, but no luck :/ Nov 21 13:10:37 morning thp \p Nov 21 13:10:40 \o Nov 21 13:10:45 miss the 6 Nov 21 13:10:48 thp: you can look through /sys for the files that mozilla looks through (see logs from yesterday?) Nov 21 13:10:49 \r\n Nov 21 13:10:54 it's not that bad Nov 21 13:11:04 superh: are you a dev or a user? Nov 21 13:11:17 sp3000 am I right that you and timeless_mbp are normally in the same building Nov 21 13:11:20 lcuk_meegoip: hey ho Nov 21 13:11:24 dev Nov 21 13:11:28 timeless_mbp: mozilla reads the accelerometer? Nov 21 13:11:28 lcuk_meegoip: we usually share a desk during weekdays Nov 21 13:11:35 i work at microelectronic company for ip Nov 21 13:11:36 thp: uhuh Nov 21 13:11:36 thought so :) Nov 21 13:11:42 lcuk_meegoip: today's a sunday though... Nov 21 13:11:47 i know Nov 21 13:11:49 and i like OS's Nov 21 13:11:57 * timeless_mbp likes pony's Nov 21 13:12:03 i think i can make an exception for snowballs Nov 21 13:12:09 timeless_mbp: what for? ;) Nov 21 13:12:17 * lcuk_meegoip likes guinness Nov 21 13:12:27 i like Super Bock Nov 21 13:12:31 thp: the paths mozilla uses to find the accelerometer Nov 21 13:12:37 it can be a useful hint in a basic search Nov 21 13:12:50 * timeless_mbp grumbles Nov 21 13:13:00 port installs way too much junk just to give me imagemagick Nov 21 13:13:30 timeless_mbp: nice, didn't know mozilla had an accelerometer API - just googled it after you said so :p Nov 21 13:13:54 thp: i was going to say "coming soon to a device near you" Nov 21 13:14:03 but um... it's probably already *available* on a device near you :) Nov 21 13:14:24 (it supports the n900 among a handful of other devices, including mbp's) Nov 21 13:15:41 * timeless_mbp goes to try bzr uncommit Nov 21 13:16:02 bry Nov 21 13:16:05 *hi Nov 21 13:16:17 ~ping Nov 21 13:16:18 ~pong Nov 21 13:16:21 siema Nov 21 13:17:01 dm8tbr: o, polak :D Nov 21 13:17:53 crap. the internet on my n900 is cutting out every minute or so Nov 21 13:18:05 i was googling arroud for info regarding the scmp that the E63, or the E71 used Nov 21 13:18:29 oh well, i should be offline anyways Nov 21 13:18:38 chani try rebooting and are you on pr1.3? Nov 21 13:18:42 ..hmm. sure, *now* it stays up.. Nov 21 13:18:47 heh Nov 21 13:18:47 does anyone knows a good source of info for that? Nov 21 13:18:53 lcuk_meegoip: 1.2 and tried that Nov 21 13:19:12 altohugh. it might have sometihng to do with pete's torrenting... heh Nov 21 13:19:12 Mat_Matan: nooo :) Nov 21 13:19:22 what are you doing on 1.2 o_O you should be on 1.3 and making full use of the nicer qt onboard :P Nov 21 13:19:36 is it a FreeScale MXC300-30 ? Nov 21 13:19:39 are you still in bed? :D Nov 21 13:19:42 * lcuk_meegoip is Nov 21 13:19:47 what are you w.... er Nov 21 13:19:49 lcuk_meegoip: heard scary things about upgrades gone wrong, decided to wait Nov 21 13:19:58 aanyways Nov 21 13:20:01 reasonable enough Nov 21 13:20:04 i'm going afk Nov 21 13:20:28 * Mek hasn't even upgraded to 1.1 yet :P Nov 21 13:20:29 its a shame theres no clock on the screen on this ip, i would know how lazy i am being Nov 21 13:22:18 ehlolcuk, what "ip" are you talking about? Nov 21 13:22:31 ideapad Nov 21 13:22:55 let's call it IPv5 ;) Nov 21 13:23:03 Ah that one... Nov 21 13:23:15 You still have original software on it? Nov 21 13:23:23 niala: pong Nov 21 13:23:25 HI all! Nov 21 13:23:27 RST38h: yeah its got meego netbook :P Nov 21 13:23:32 timeless_mbp: uncommit, yes :) Nov 21 13:23:44 sivang: why didn't i think of that Nov 21 13:24:33 timeless_mbp: I wanted to suggest it, but then it felt just as unintuitive as the rest of stuff we discussed last night about bzr, and I thought there has to be better way Nov 21 13:24:48 sivang: the output is awesome... Nov 21 13:24:49 timeless_mbp: uncommit just add comment or stuff seems un-natural workflow Nov 21 13:25:04 timeless_mbp: ? Nov 21 13:25:12 yes Nov 21 13:25:12 bzr pull . -r revid:timeless@gmail.com-20101121005543-mev1lvesv3x3fybs Nov 21 13:25:29 now... question of the day: where the heck did it hide this? Nov 21 13:25:38 because it doesn't seem to be a file in my working directory Nov 21 13:25:48 lcuk: oh lenovo actually went ahead with meego netbook as their consumer UI? Nov 21 13:25:55 unbelievable =) Nov 21 13:26:11 timeless_mbp: I've ever seen such revid in my life, and I've been working for a while with bzr Nov 21 13:26:37 Chani: 1.3 has been out for ages Nov 21 13:26:41 how do i do strikethro on the wiki? Nov 21 13:27:03 ? =) Nov 21 13:27:10 Chani: i convinced sivang to upgrade a week ago Nov 21 13:28:10 * sivang wonders if there were any fixes to 1.3 since it was unofficially released Nov 21 13:29:19 hmm wiki.meego.com help pages have an error on the header template of every page about cannot create thumbnail Nov 21 13:29:33 http://wiki.meego.com/Help:Formatting Nov 21 13:29:49 meego uses X server? :/ Nov 21 13:29:58 * lcuk_meegoip shakes head at thumbnailing being a universal problem ;) Nov 21 13:30:42 sivang: there are packages which were fixed after 1.3 was shipped Nov 21 13:30:55 timeless_mbp: nice, so I can now actually upgrade Nov 21 13:30:56 but the one i know of (security whatever) wasn't integrated anywhere Nov 21 13:32:25 morning Nov 21 13:32:34 timeless_mbp: oh, I just read some reports about regression with it and never got to upgrade, although some noted it just worked. Nov 21 13:34:08 how was it you kill pm window's in irssi? completely forgot:P Nov 21 13:34:13 RST38h: i did not see any other OS on my ideapad, there were instructions on the board and usb key which were followed by practically all Nov 21 13:34:33 zinit: switch to something else and forget about it? :) Nov 21 13:34:50 zinit: /q or /window close Nov 21 13:34:54 sp3000: hehe. running irc in a screen on a remote server Nov 21 13:35:07 still, that's what I do :) Nov 21 13:35:16 then again I never switch to anything but "active" and 1 Nov 21 13:35:22 :P Nov 21 13:35:58 havent got xchat working in meego yet, so using irssi from a debian machine I got at the gandi.net system Nov 21 13:36:44 timoph: do you have the links,notes to your repository with xchat and stuff in it? Nov 21 13:37:11 if anyone need to get the meego isntall image I got it on my server there (alot faster than the meego.com site) Nov 21 13:37:26 zinit: which image? Nov 21 13:37:48 lcuk_meegoip: the install image to install meego Nov 21 13:38:15 upped it there a few days ago Nov 21 13:38:19 yeah, which variant/build Nov 21 13:38:26 1.2 Nov 21 13:38:30 sec, and I Nov 21 13:38:48 http://zinit.servebeer.com/div Nov 21 13:38:50 its there Nov 21 13:39:03 should say the buildnumber there Nov 21 13:40:00 1.1 it sais Nov 21 13:40:06 1.2 isnt out yet is it? Nov 21 13:40:27 theres no sources/release notes/information about contents. thats a massive binary blob on non official servers.. Nov 21 13:41:01 damn i lost my ciggy lighter Nov 21 13:41:21 a survey for MeeGo contributors has been released. More information can be found here: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=2022 Nov 21 13:41:57 sorry if that was considered spamming.... Nov 21 13:42:12 wget doesnt seem to work though.. Nov 21 13:43:20 the image on my server is the one that was on the official site on thursday. dont know if ther ehas been released a new one since thursday afternoon Nov 21 13:43:26 kyb3R: it says the results will be released, since we are all open, how about also releasing the anonymised data itself rather than just conclusions? Nov 21 13:44:04 lcuk_meegoip: http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/fingerable%20clock/ Nov 21 13:44:08 now with cropped images! Nov 21 13:44:17 ls *.png|xargs -I {} convert {} -crop '424x260+620+340' x/{} Nov 21 13:44:51 neat timeless :) Nov 21 13:45:05 kyb3R: um Nov 21 13:45:13 90-95% of your respondents will be Male Nov 21 13:45:28 defaulting to Female is asking for bad data Nov 21 13:45:46 unless you're testing to see what portion of the male population is capable of filling out a form Nov 21 13:45:49 timeless_mbp: defaultinh to male is better? Nov 21 13:45:57 defaulting to --- and mandatory is best Nov 21 13:46:07 ok Nov 21 13:46:25 but yes, picking Male for a 2 state is better than using a 2 state and defaulting to female Nov 21 13:46:49 kyb3R: since i'm picking through this... Nov 21 13:46:53 lcuk_meegoip: could be an option too to release the data too Nov 21 13:47:05 your questions are in typical en-FI Nov 21 13:47:20 > 3.What is your gender? Nov 21 13:47:23 * lcuk_meegoip ponders the breakpoint for educational studies and how to get some more certificates :P Nov 21 13:47:25 you're missing a space after <.> Nov 21 13:47:36 you should use
    +
  • and let the browser do that for you :) Nov 21 13:47:37 :) Nov 21 13:47:45 > What is the year of your birth? Nov 21 13:47:48 it's an automated system Nov 21 13:47:55 Ask "what year were you born in?" Nov 21 13:48:00 it isn't automated Nov 21 13:48:01 i dont write the HTML Nov 21 13:48:07 the others aren't missing the space Nov 21 13:48:29 > What is your work situation? Nov 21 13:48:33 there are bigger bias issues than strict html, just complete the survey :) Nov 21 13:48:33 referring to your comment: 15:43 < timeless_mbp> you should use
      +
    • and let the browser do that for you :) Nov 21 13:48:34 What is your employment status? Nov 21 13:48:52 lol pexi Nov 21 13:49:15 ... and the answers should be "employed (full-time)", "employed (part-time)", ... Nov 21 13:49:20 don't use "I ..." for answers Nov 21 13:49:30 > Is the job... Nov 21 13:49:34 don't use that form Nov 21 13:49:41 kyb3R: since i am taking part in this, i would very kindly request you are proactive in ensuring the data collected is also made available. i will then be happy to fill in the survey on a schedule :) Nov 21 13:49:56 and try to avoid mixing "in" and "on" prepositions Nov 21 13:50:00 ie more than the vague thing you said :P Nov 21 13:50:06 (best to avoid them entirely by fixing the question to not need them) Nov 21 13:50:07 lcuk_meegoip: if it's needed, then it will be released :) Nov 21 13:50:20 in en- you do not work the private sector Nov 21 13:50:28 the sector is a container, and you're said to work it Nov 21 13:50:39 (unless you're a government agent working to "fix" the private sector) Nov 21 13:50:46 kyb3R: you are asking meego people who care about openness, it is needed. Nov 21 13:50:56 kyb3R: lcuk_meegoip's right Nov 21 13:51:09 add some questions like i had trouble filling this questionnare (and i don't have asberger) to make'em happy :) Nov 21 13:51:10 you're asking for data from an open community, to some extent you need to provide the data back Nov 21 13:51:46 Can anybody help me with some light on an OBS issue? I can't get pass the %prep and I am running out of guesses Nov 21 13:51:48 ofc they bring information Nov 21 13:52:00 fcrochik: heh Nov 21 13:52:19 kyb3R: and NGO isn't "the third sector" Nov 21 13:52:20 actually raw data would be nice :) Nov 21 13:52:30 there's the "third world" (which is where a number of NGOs work) Nov 21 13:52:38 timeless_mbp: there is nothing I tried that will let me get anything different than https://build.pub.meego.com/package/live_build_log?arch=i586&package=macuco&project=home%3Afcrochik&repository=meego_1.1_extras_Netbook Nov 21 13:52:52 got one little problem here with meego... no wget, any suggestions how to get that in with the package system that exist for meego? Nov 21 13:52:59 zinit: try man curl? Nov 21 13:53:02 zypper install wget? Nov 21 13:53:13 sais wget wasnt there Nov 21 13:53:20 revdkathy got it on Nov 21 13:53:21 man curl Nov 21 13:53:32 i think she has timoph's repo tho Nov 21 13:54:00 for some insane reason distro people like curl (it's more unixy) over wget (which is more user friendly) Nov 21 13:54:20 they're both a bit weird imo Nov 21 13:54:29 + $'\r' Nov 21 13:54:29 curl's here. Nov 21 13:54:29 timeless_mbp: I tried all the variants I could come up with for the %prep section but doesn't make any difference... it seems that is failing with the same errors regardless of what I have under the %prep section.... Nov 21 13:54:33 * lcuk_meegoip fills in the survey but i think some details will be out of date Nov 21 13:54:46 fcrochik: you should get it to cat the file Nov 21 13:54:49 like, income will be out of date after taxes ;) Nov 21 13:54:54 lcuk_meegoip: such as? Nov 21 13:54:55 there's something wrong w/ the line after 'unset DISPLAY' Nov 21 13:55:13 kyb3R: details, i might fill it in twice :P Nov 21 13:55:19 timeless_mbp: I don Nov 21 13:55:21 lcuk_meegoip: ah ok Nov 21 13:55:45 timeless_mbp: I don't have unset DISPLAY anywhere...it is something the OBS is creating by itself Nov 21 13:55:51 fcrochik: well err :) Nov 21 13:56:00 macuco' /home/abuild/rpmbuild/SOURCES/macuco2.spec Nov 21 13:56:00 Executing(%prep): /bin/sh -e /var/tmp/rpm-tmp.hvzHS0 Nov 21 13:56:08 odds are the tmp file came from that spec file Nov 21 13:56:13 so you'd want to look at the spec file Nov 21 13:56:35 it looks like a script was expecting output and got a strange line feed instead Nov 21 13:56:40 and then more or less tried to execute it Nov 21 13:56:43 (which rarely works) Nov 21 13:56:56 timeless_mbp: that is what I have tried for the past many hours since I got access to the obs.... but doesn't matter what I change on the spec file I get the same result Nov 21 13:57:10 fcrochik: try 'file macuco2.spec' ? Nov 21 13:57:27 or dos2unix or suchlike Nov 21 13:57:28 timeless_mbp: where? try what? Nov 21 13:57:47 fcrochik: somewhere where your package sources are Nov 21 13:57:49 ... Nov 21 13:58:04 random carriage returns make for the most exciting problems :D Nov 21 13:58:05 yeah, or just dos2unix as sp3000 noted (may require installing dos2unix...) Nov 21 13:58:18 sp3000: hey, i haven't hit one of those in at least... a week? Nov 21 13:59:03 timeless_mbp: I created it and changed it several times... no matter how simple or complex I make it I always get the same result.... I wonder if it is not something else... I haven't found any packages that were actually created recently Nov 21 13:59:19 kyb3R: the survey assumes I have a single focus on device type, i have multiple handsets around me and am using meego netbook now, but only one option is available Nov 21 13:59:35 timeless_mbp: if you know about spec can you look at https://build.pub.meego.com/package/view_file?file=macuco2.spec&package=macuco&project=home%3Afcrochik? Nov 21 13:59:56 timeless_mbp: sorry.... added a question mark to the url: https://build.pub.meego.com/package/view_file?file=macuco2.spec&package=macuco&project=home%3Afcrochik Nov 21 14:00:09 my irc client ignored your ? mark :) Nov 21 14:00:10 fcrochik, nice pic of you on my flickr page. Nov 21 14:00:33 GAN900: where? I have never seen I nice pict of myself :( Nov 21 14:00:56 fcrochik: sadly it's rather hard to trust a web server about line endings Nov 21 14:01:05 and i don't know obs well enough to know how raw raw is Nov 21 14:01:47 fcrochik, generalantilles on flickr Nov 21 14:02:02 oh wow Nov 21 14:02:11 google has a "Search flickr.com" button Nov 21 14:02:30 lcuk_meegoip: the question includes word 'primary' for that reason. If you are referring to the Q:19b Nov 21 14:02:44 sp3000: aww http://www.flickr.com/photos/sjgadsby/2883122372/in/photostream/ Nov 21 14:02:50 flickr doesn't think the cat has a face Nov 21 14:03:30 fcrochik, http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/5193491175/ Nov 21 14:03:31 GAN900: context... Picasa likes to accuse statues of having faces Nov 21 14:04:07 GAN900: hey I look as good as ever! :) Nov 21 14:04:13 ooh, i was shot! http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/5193491967/in/set-72157625434963604/ Nov 21 14:05:02 timeless_mbp, got a few more, those were the first tier shots, though. Nov 21 14:05:34 sp3000: check out the face in the top left corner http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/5193488127/in/set-72157625434963604/ Nov 21 14:05:37 it's Qole :) Nov 21 14:06:13 impressive Nov 21 14:06:31 * timeless_mbp feels better now Nov 21 14:07:23 awesome I am on a picture :D Nov 21 14:07:33 lcuk_meegoip =~ s/on/in/ Nov 21 14:07:37 unless you're sitting on it... Nov 21 14:07:59 fcrochik: some of us having been doing OSS for a while Nov 21 14:08:07 you should have an option "I can't remember" Nov 21 14:08:31 also, I think MeeGo is in its first year Nov 21 14:08:46 so asking which year someone got income from MeeGo in is mostly a stupid question Nov 21 14:08:59 That may be a British way to say it Nov 21 14:09:14 the same survey will be done yearly, so that's why the question is there Nov 21 14:09:25 kyb3R: "annually" :) Nov 21 14:09:29 sorry Nov 21 14:09:38 kyb3R: this is for your benefit, not mine Nov 21 14:09:47 > 13. On average, how many hours per week do you use on MeeGo development? Nov 21 14:09:50 s/use/spend/ Nov 21 14:09:50 timeless_mbp meant: > 13. On average, how many hours per week do you spend on MeeGo development? Nov 21 14:09:53 survey? Nov 21 14:09:59 timeless_mbp: it is very hard when you don't know what you are doing .... took me a while to figure out the autobuilder on maemo and now I have this :( Nov 21 14:09:59 w00t: "NEEDSWORK" Nov 21 14:10:01 feedback Nov 21 14:10:13 feedforward Nov 21 14:10:19 fcrochik: yeah Nov 21 14:10:20 formfeed Nov 21 14:10:30 fcrochik: i'd suggest trying to build a basic rpm locally Nov 21 14:10:33 E:PRINTERONFIRE Nov 21 14:11:03 > 14. If working on Meego is part of your job, please tell the name of the company that employs you. (The information is kept confidential.) Nov 21 14:11:07 timeless_mbp: I have to say that this is one option that I haven't had considered :) Nov 21 14:11:23 kyb3R: please spell MeeGo consistently (and correctly) Nov 21 14:11:30 GAN900: awesome shot Nov 21 14:11:58 http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/5193490049/in/set-72157625434963604/ Nov 21 14:12:04 * lcuk_meegoip rarely has photos of him Nov 21 14:12:06 self Nov 21 14:12:11 kyb3R: s/please tell the name of the company.*/what company do you work for?/ Nov 21 14:12:18 lcuk: Was there bacon in the box? Nov 21 14:12:29 >15. When companies give money to a community, it should be free to decide how to use it? Nov 21 14:12:36 kyb3R: the question here is ambiguous Nov 21 14:12:43 * NooBmonk3y blinks Nov 21 14:12:46 RST38h: for once, no Nov 21 14:12:51 do you mean / or Nov 21 14:13:09 pffft, the singular it totally resolves that ;) Nov 21 14:13:11 * lcuk_meegoip had sleeves rolled up and was getting involved \o/ Nov 21 14:13:16 sp3000: yeah yeah Nov 21 14:13:33 it's better to write "Communities should be free to use money donated by companies however they please" Nov 21 14:14:13 sp3000: i think my parser expanded it as: Nov 21 14:14:21 that is something new: segmentation fault on zypper trying to install rpmbuild.... Nov 21 14:14:26 my god at full resolution thats a decent camera GAN900 Nov 21 14:14:29 When companies give money to a community, each company ... Nov 21 14:14:51 fcrochik: sounds like apt :) Nov 21 14:14:57 you should feel right at home :) Nov 21 14:15:03 is this sudo Nov 21 14:15:16 timeless_mbp: yes! Nov 21 14:15:18 sp3000: are you a meego dev? Nov 21 14:15:19 yea, the rhythm seems to suggest that Nov 21 14:15:23 timeless_mbp: never had this issue with apt :) Nov 21 14:15:41 timeless_mbp: I don't do labels :) Nov 21 14:15:45 > 17. During the last year, how often have you had face-to-face contacts with other MeeGo developers (on average)? Nov 21 14:15:53 sp3000: you have to so i can answer question 17 :) Nov 21 14:16:06 timeless_mbp: with this success rate I am just going to shutdown my ideapad and go back to the n900... It is so much nicer to me! :) Nov 21 14:16:08 is there a "maybe"? Nov 21 14:16:17 no Nov 21 14:16:36 daily, weekly, monthly, more than once a year, once a year, never Nov 21 14:16:49 why does chromium seem to work so much worse on the ideapad than my laptop? Nov 21 14:16:57 kyb3R: in the context of a year "once a year" should just be "once" Nov 21 14:16:59 pages lock up *all the time* Nov 21 14:17:04 is it a duff version or something? Nov 21 14:17:08 and "more than once a year" should be "a couple of times" Nov 21 14:17:17 (a couple is understood to be <<12) Nov 21 14:18:08 > 19. b) What is the primary device type for your MeeGo development? Nov 21 14:18:09 Robot101: lock up how? Nov 21 14:18:14 I think I may have maintained a patch queue for something that appears somewhere Nov 21 14:18:15 lcuk_meegoip: this is the question you didn't like? Nov 21 14:18:22 I think that makes me a janitor Nov 21 14:18:22 i've noticed problems with flash on there at least Nov 21 14:18:30 sp3000: you're definitely a janitor Nov 21 14:18:36 but haven't yet been able to find specifically what causes it Nov 21 14:18:37 that wasn't in the list of options Nov 21 14:18:38 timeless_mbp: sure, it should be multichoice Nov 21 14:18:58 lcuk_meegoip: tbh, i don't understand the question Nov 21 14:19:10 is it "what do you use", "what do you build on", "what do you build for", or something else? Nov 21 14:19:12 Robot101: depends what sites perhaps? i had flash crash once and kill youtube I was playing and all other tabs Nov 21 14:19:17 i probably build on my mbp Nov 21 14:19:26 today i probably use my ideapad Nov 21 14:19:33 and tomorrow i probably build for handset Nov 21 14:19:37 timeless_mbp: debian tends to make some distinction between creatures like maintainers and developers Nov 21 14:19:50 sp3000: clearly for good reason Nov 21 14:20:05 tell that to kyb3R (possibly in finnish, maybe it'd be easier for him?) Nov 21 14:20:58 ok...something "funny".... on the ideapad "sudo zypper install rpm-build" crashes with segmentation fault when downloading elfutils-lib... if I install it by itself and then the rest it works... it is just my luck these days! Nov 21 14:21:16 fcrochik: stackwanted Nov 21 14:21:18 bugwanted Nov 21 14:21:34 hrm, dinner for yesterday wanted Nov 21 14:21:36 * timeless_mbp considers Nov 21 14:21:40 fcrochik: gdb it and figure out what is wrong? Nov 21 14:21:41 sp3000: have you had food? Nov 21 14:21:50 (sp3000 no longer lives i Espoo) Nov 21 14:22:11 RST38h: if you're going to say that you should be willing to do some hand holding :) Nov 21 14:22:20 like steps to install debug symbols for zypper :) Nov 21 14:22:25 lcuk_meegoip: no, just loads and loads of sites - flash, youtube, last.fm, twitter, we7, etc, all crashing and hanging randomly Nov 21 14:22:36 * RST38h is ok with handholding in this case Nov 21 14:22:44 > 21. If you have participated in proprietary software development, what role have you had? Nov 21 14:22:48 no, but I have plans for for the next 2h or so Nov 21 14:22:55 eek Robot101 thats not good at all Nov 21 14:22:57 w00t: pages just stopping responding, and sometimes it does the whole, page has crashed, thing Nov 21 14:23:04 sp3000: plans for food? Nov 21 14:23:08 No netbooks or Meego here, so my handholding will be limited by whatever google codesearch finds Nov 21 14:23:16 the rest of everything on the netbook works fine, and chromium works much better for me everywhere else Nov 21 14:23:23 is a product which is derived from open source software considered proprietary? Nov 21 14:23:23 timeless_mbp: feedback from conf? Nov 21 14:23:26 no, other stuff :) Nov 21 14:23:39 sp3000: hrm, i might be able to wait 2 hours Nov 21 14:23:43 ping me when you're done? Nov 21 14:24:01 sivang: a survey which needs a lot more work than your slides Nov 21 14:24:08 timeless_mbp: ha ha ha Nov 21 14:24:14 timeless_mbp: :) Nov 21 14:24:16 timeless_mbp: where is it? Nov 21 14:24:23 k Nov 21 14:24:27 somewhere a couple hundred lines back, b kyb3R Nov 21 14:25:14 > I participate only as much is needed to use the system Nov 21 14:25:21 kyb3R: s/is/as/ Nov 21 14:25:35 What is the point of making a convertible netbook if the viewing angle is so shit that you can't see the screen right from dead center? Nov 21 14:25:37 kyb3R: note that you shouldn't use a agree/netural/disagree Nov 21 14:25:44 * GAN900 stabs Lenovo to death. Nov 21 14:25:47 GAN900: heh Nov 21 14:25:54 kyb3R: you need to support things like "sometimes" Nov 21 14:26:06 e.g. there are some projects where i only contribute to get things working Nov 21 14:26:14 and there are some projects where i contribute a lot more Nov 21 14:26:30 * kyb3R is taking notes Nov 21 14:26:30 Turning itself off for no reason when you're rotating the screen is also cool. Nov 21 14:26:48 kyb3R: :) Nov 21 14:26:59 GAN900: hrm, i don't think i recall that Nov 21 14:27:01 gan: gotta have the right specs sheet and the right price Nov 21 14:27:12 timeless_mbp: right, found it Nov 21 14:27:15 gan: screen quality is not a requirement though Nov 21 14:27:24 > Form is going to be submitted. Nov 21 14:27:24 > Proceed Nov 21 14:27:47 kyb3R: hrm.. that's not what you want to write Nov 21 14:27:53 try taking some surveys from american firms Nov 21 14:28:08 (or british, it hardly matters) Nov 21 14:28:18 > Finish (Send all Data) Nov 21 14:28:23 also not the right text Nov 21 14:28:33 timeless_mbp: are the spelling mistakes so bad? ;) Nov 21 14:28:34 > The data has been successfully saved! Nov 21 14:28:42 sivang: spelling mistakes are *always* bad Nov 21 14:28:49 RST38h, wish I had kept the box. Would probably sell it. Nov 21 14:28:50 * timeless_mbp filed a bug about lenovo misspelling Firefox Nov 21 14:28:51 timeless_mbp: I used OOo's spelling checker :-p Nov 21 14:29:03 sivang: you need to use a grammar checker too :) Nov 21 14:29:09 dunno if OOo has one Nov 21 14:29:14 Might've gotten me partially to a MacBook Air. Nov 21 14:29:17 sivang: actually, your spelling wasn't bad at all Nov 21 14:29:27 GAN900: i have a box here Nov 21 14:29:31 gan: well, it is still usable as a torrent/file/media server Nov 21 14:29:32 well, i hope so Nov 21 14:29:36 timeless_mbp: well, for someone who's not a native speaker, working his ass off on the slides and data gathering until last minute before the talk, I think it turned out to be quite good ;) Nov 21 14:29:40 * timeless_mbp hasn't opened luggage after it arrived last night Nov 21 14:29:48 sivang: oh, it did Nov 21 14:29:52 RST38h, I've got plenty of things for that. Nov 21 14:30:02 i'm trying to compare your rather good text to the survey i just finished Nov 21 14:30:03 timeless_mbp: grammer is always hard, indeed Nov 21 14:30:08 which was abysmal Nov 21 14:30:20 kyb3R: one other detail... Nov 21 14:30:20 gan: will it play full-sized videos without hiccups btw? Nov 21 14:30:28 timeless_mbp: heh, coming from you, I feel complimented as you I know your attentions to these details and appreciate it. Nov 21 14:30:35 s/you// Nov 21 14:30:36 sivang meant: timeless_mbp: heh, coming from , I feel complimented as you I know your attentions to these details and appreciate it. Nov 21 14:30:48 that s/// failed ;-) Nov 21 14:30:52 haha Nov 21 14:30:53 it di! Nov 21 14:30:54 did Nov 21 14:30:55 sivang: glad you understood it correctly Nov 21 14:31:20 kyb3R: i'm not sure what the license MeeGo has for its Art Nov 21 14:31:25 timeless_mbp: I wish I was natie speaker, maybe if I get to relocate I will go to study *proper* english abroad. Nov 21 14:31:38 *native Nov 21 14:31:40 :) Nov 21 14:31:42 #define proper English Nov 21 14:31:53 Oxford? ;) Nov 21 14:31:56 RST38h: en-IL and en-RU and en-FI are *not* proper Nov 21 14:32:09 nor is en-IT for that matter Nov 21 14:32:20 en-MANC is :P Nov 21 14:32:26 timeless: Neither is en-US, you despicable scoundrel! Nov 21 14:32:35 * RST38h cackles with satisfaction Nov 21 14:32:35 tho sometimes we need subtitles Nov 21 14:32:36 :) Nov 21 14:32:42 RST38h: properly tagged en-US is valid Nov 21 14:32:47 properly tagged en-GB is valid Nov 21 14:32:53 there is no such thing as "proper english". all english speaking countries have their own definition:P Nov 21 14:32:55 mistagged en-US/en-GB is not Nov 21 14:33:13 zinit: speaking en-GB and thinking it's en-US isn't proper Nov 21 14:33:16 and the converse Nov 21 14:33:18 zinit: even in england there is a wide variety of accents and differences Nov 21 14:33:23 exacly Nov 21 14:33:31 also, en-GB-cockney isn't proper English Nov 21 14:33:38 it may be spoken by some of The English Nov 21 14:33:40 but it isn't proper Nov 21 14:33:59 exacly... Nov 21 14:34:58 * kyb3R will take several English courses before submitting a new survey, perhaps even spend some time with ppl who speak proper English Nov 21 14:35:07 ask a londoner, a welsh, a scot, and an irishman... they all speak english, and they will say they speak "proper" englisg and the others dont.. Nov 21 14:35:07 i saw something about Oulu having a huge amount of bike paths Nov 21 14:35:12 do they also have bike hire? Nov 21 14:35:49 zinit: Well, a spoken language is usually a living thing, it changes with time and allows for variations Nov 21 14:35:59 yepp Nov 21 14:36:15 zinit: As to written language, different people have different views Nov 21 14:36:20 yepp Nov 21 14:36:23 * timeless_mbp sighs Nov 21 14:36:33 sp3000: view-source:http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/ Nov 21 14:36:34 zinit: There are some who allow for variations, and then there are grammar nazis =) Nov 21 14:36:52 in norway we got a gouvernment counsel for that... Nov 21 14:36:57 they are the worst... Nov 21 14:37:17 timeless_mbp: hm? Nov 21 14:37:17 zinit: In Japan, the NHK (!) publishes a list of new words annually Nov 21 14:37:19 zinit: France and Germany and Japan (?) have similar Nov 21 14:37:25 Nov 21 14:37:35 sp3000: note the extra single quote before class? Nov 21 14:37:37 zinit: There are no other ways they formalize their language, AFAIK Nov 21 14:37:38 there are 2 written languages in norway... one is basicly danish with some norwegian words, and thee other is fabricated from dialects in a small geographic area... Nov 21 14:37:41 (fixed in local instance) Nov 21 14:38:17 heh Nov 21 14:38:20 RST38h: well, to be able to author content without breaking phrases, which often happens when you are not native. e.g. using a phrase in a wrong construct, wrong tense etc. Nov 21 14:38:42 more around what timeless_mbp said, I'd like to pick en-GB and stick to it, follow it properly Nov 21 14:39:00 lcuk_meegoip: reload http://mxr-test.konigsberg.mozilla.org/ideapad/source/fingerable%20clock/ Nov 21 14:39:14 cause now it is a mesh of phrases from tv, spoken british/american english, phrases I imported from Hebrew to English etc. Nov 21 14:39:19 sivang: Native speakers also make similar errors, all the time Nov 21 14:39:35 RST38h: I feel it is less in rate, though Nov 21 14:39:42 RST38h: but they do, sure Nov 21 14:39:46 sivang: Still, the kind of errors you make depends on your native language Nov 21 14:40:00 RST38h: hence wanting to stick to one and propely follow it, yes Nov 21 14:40:10 zinit: nb-NO/nb-NN or whatever Nov 21 14:40:24 sivang: Both Germans and Russians absolutely LOVE passive tense in English, for example =) Nov 21 14:40:33 RST38h: and Finns Nov 21 14:40:49 RST38h: also, having practiced enough phrases and constructs in speech so when I get a bit nervous, like in the talk, I use the proper english constructs and import from Hebrew. Nov 21 14:40:53 RST38h: :) Nov 21 14:41:12 sivang: Americans often mess up past/present times, in their own language Nov 21 14:41:17 exacly... nb-NO is the danish with a few norwegian words, and nb-NN is the fabricated one Nov 21 14:41:41 RST38h: instead of "importing from Hebrew" that is Nov 21 14:42:09 sp3000: i really need to do something about colspan Nov 21 14:42:18 lbt: Hi! I would like to have my account activated for the community obs. My account name is "kossebau". I was told that you can do that :) Nov 21 14:42:26 the reason i don't normally let source work for big images is that you get lame jumping Nov 21 14:42:47 sivang: Very few people *speak* proper English any more, so do not worry :) Nov 21 14:43:22 frinring: also X-Fade is able to, but since its Sunday it may be that you could wait till tomorrow, I believe there is also a wiki page somewhere to add name to and they can get round to it asap Nov 21 14:43:36 RST38h: can't you just define your own locale if people complain ? Nov 21 14:43:41 RST38h: :) Nov 21 14:46:01 berndhs: language is a convention used to enable mutual understanding Nov 21 14:46:01 berndhs: Yes, just use the "I am an asshole." disclaimer =) Nov 21 14:46:14 if people don't understand your locale, your use of language is useless Nov 21 14:46:14 RST38h: however, studying english is rather a pleasure for me, as well as dealing with it in any event. And I've always took interest in British literature and language. You can get a lot of insight into culture when studying a language, as I found out with Hungarian. Nov 21 14:46:19 (possibly quite harmful) Nov 21 14:47:00 sivang: I have found reading to be the best way to study though Nov 21 14:47:40 lcuk_meegoip: thanks. any idea how to find that wiki page? is not referenced from http://wiki.meego.com/Build_Infrastructure/Packagers_Developers#How_to_get_started Nov 21 14:47:55 sivang: As to English classes, dunno about the Brits, but the US ones were next to useless =( Nov 21 14:49:02 frinring: it was mentioned in passing whilst I had no computer/irc to log from, we shall have to ensure its found and linked to that page for later, for now wait for lbt or X-Fade to pick up your request and perhaps they will also know the url Nov 21 14:49:02 sivang: They do not teach English structurally, like it is done abroad, and the whole process just feels confusing Nov 21 14:49:40 RST38h: true,I should get more into proper redin Nov 21 14:49:55 RST38h: e.g. less technical and more literature wise Nov 21 14:50:02 RST38h, which English classes? Nov 21 14:50:10 technical authors tend to not be too good with the language Nov 21 14:50:27 "seperate presentation from model" :-) Nov 21 14:51:08 lcuk_meegoip: okay, will stay tuned Nov 21 14:51:36 GAN: Standard stuff, ESL for immigrants, ENGL101, then some graduate writing class Nov 21 14:51:48 separate, too. Nov 21 14:52:02 GAN: ENGL101 was actually useful, to understand how everybody expects an essay to be structured Nov 21 14:52:46 sp3000: yes Nov 21 14:54:02 Heya. Nov 21 14:54:02 RST38h, ah. Nov 21 14:54:07 hey till Nov 21 14:54:30 We're here at the KDE mobile sprint, playing with some of our apps on the IdeaPads Nov 21 14:54:49 There seems to be a font quality problem in Qt, atm, has anyone researched that yet? Nov 21 14:55:08 Missing font package? Antialiasing turned off somewhere low level? Nov 21 14:55:08 sp3000: this happens when you hear the word and write it how it sounds, instead of remembering how it is written, this always happens for words that the spelling is not as intuitive to the sound. Nov 21 14:56:14 seprät Nov 21 14:57:40 another nice video on the ideapad arriving btw :) Nov 21 15:14:36 how much cpu.power does it take to maintain a bluetooth list of nearby devices? Nov 21 15:15:02 not much Nov 21 15:15:03 is it something that can be done in the background when in conference mode? Nov 21 15:15:58 and does it always take a long time to update? for instance is it fast enough to make device ping when it recognises someone on the corridor Nov 21 15:16:05 as walking past them Nov 21 15:16:30 uhm, is the main repository down? Nov 21 15:16:47 can't seem to install base packages from zypper atm Nov 21 15:25:47 uhm, happens both in the chroot environment and from the lenovo Nov 21 15:26:27 lcuk: It takes that long becauseit is achieved by scanning bt frequencies Nov 21 15:26:54 lcuk: And even if you have got a list, you won't be able to connect to any of these devices without pairing, which always includes a manual component Nov 21 15:27:11 lcuk: Could you explain the top view of what you would like to achieve? =) Nov 21 15:28:24 Stskeeps: around? Nov 21 15:40:31 till: people were talking about font problems the other day; i forget what they said though. something about subpixel rendering i think? Nov 21 15:43:00 sub pixel hinting? Nov 21 15:43:29 * notmart sad that can't download dependencies in the chroot env to try local package building Nov 21 15:48:29 the font issue seems just settings Nov 21 15:48:46 forcing rto antialias in systemsettings does work Nov 21 15:50:16 On the OBS, when it asks you to upload files, should you upload the individual files needed to build, or a tarball as you'd put in ~/rpmbuild/SOURCES? Nov 21 15:50:31 tarball Nov 21 15:50:42 cheers Nov 21 15:51:18 another obs question, for anyone in the know. i depend on packages in meego-extras, so i need to link/aggregate, right? i'm trying but failing Nov 21 15:52:24 here's what i've put in _aggregate: http://pastebin.ca/1997984 Nov 21 15:54:14 the obs tells me "missing repositories: MeeGo:1.1:Extras" Nov 21 15:55:18 good morning Alison_Chaiken \o Nov 21 15:55:38 Good morning lcuk. Nov 21 15:55:42 meow Nov 21 15:56:52 i am finally out of bed anyway :) Nov 21 15:57:24 side by side, meego netbook boots up much faster than ubuntu :) Nov 21 15:57:40 awesome Nov 21 15:57:54 wait, it's almost 4pm Nov 21 15:57:59 moblin people specifically worked toward boot time reduction Nov 21 15:58:02 yeah, hence good morning! Nov 21 15:58:31 lcuk, lol, it's the best APS-C camera ever made. Nov 21 15:58:36 yeah I know RST38h, only niggle is that its set to ask for password and it doesnt Nov 21 15:58:58 GeneralAntilles, outstanding photos, bet you are glad you got it now Nov 21 15:58:59 Neither does Maemo! =) Nov 21 15:59:18 good point RST38h Nov 21 15:59:29 but my laptop has a password and expects one Nov 21 15:59:54 how do I install more than lastfm and twitter support in meego? Nov 21 15:59:57 easier to just keep my nokia in my pocket than a big laptop I might leave around Nov 21 16:00:12 lcuk, yeah, just wish I had gotten more pictures of Dublin on Sunday. Nov 21 16:00:30 GeneralAntilles, collectively I think we can piece together the whole event Nov 21 16:00:37 there were enough photos of all sorts of places Nov 21 16:01:22 GeneralAntilles, does your eos connect easily to your ideapad for offloading the photos, or did you not try yet Nov 21 16:01:35 lcuk, yeah, works fine. Nov 21 16:01:41 even more awesome would be using hostmode on handset :) Nov 21 16:01:43 Although the 18MP RAW files bring it to its knees. Nov 21 16:02:09 its not always a bad thing Nov 21 16:02:20 Does it run...mghm...GIMP? Nov 21 16:02:43 RST38h, need to learn to use that one day. . . . Nov 21 16:02:47 How's F-Spot? Nov 21 16:03:02 Tried F-Spot a few times, it works, but it is no GIMP of course Nov 21 16:04:14 RST38h, at the conf Nov 21 16:04:39 there was a discussion about a usable simple ui front end to gimp Nov 21 16:05:10 lcuk: Such a discussion should always start with defining what the hell do you want from it, which subset of functions :) Nov 21 16:05:24 can't have simple and all features at the same time Nov 21 16:05:34 of course RST38h - it was mentioned by me that this sort of ting is alweays difficult Nov 21 16:05:42 get it wrong and its like windows wizards Nov 21 16:05:57 where people can walk through once but then still get lost when they need to tweak beyond that Nov 21 16:06:09 thing ^ Nov 21 16:07:00 but at least having data modified in a way you understand and filled in allows you to map the actions and choices you made in the simple UI into the more complex one Nov 21 16:07:32 * lcuk uses microsoft photo editor from office 2000 for many simple tasks still Nov 21 16:07:37 Has anyone tried paint.net? it comes close to a simple ui with a decent set of features Nov 21 16:08:15 croland, will it build on mono? Nov 21 16:08:18 lcuk: btw, photo processing on handhelds is probably a fail Nov 21 16:08:22 ie usable on meego Nov 21 16:08:30 lcuk: considering image sizes and the swap usage =( Nov 21 16:08:42 RST38h, it shouldnt be, theres simple effects and transformations that are commonly requested Nov 21 16:08:59 lcuk: Yes, a few simple things should be possible Nov 21 16:09:02 take crop for instance, it even managed to emerge on n900 maemo Nov 21 16:09:09 don't know, it's closed source, but free. I've used it a couple times and always thought it did a decent job of keeping things simple, but had the features I needed Nov 21 16:09:34 croland, its also windows specific? Nov 21 16:09:39 lcuk: there is even a tool like that, written in python unfortunately Nov 21 16:09:55 yeah, I threw it out there more as an example of a simple ui :) Nov 21 16:10:09 RST38h, python backed by well formed libraries with a sane object model is not such an issue Nov 21 16:10:28 even 20 years ago we had that functionality on 14mhz amigas (arexx) Nov 21 16:10:42 binding glue Nov 21 16:10:45 lcuk: I do not like what it does to themount table, otherwise I am ok Nov 21 16:11:00 RST38h, sure, that seems overly excessive Nov 21 16:11:13 not sure how it sits on meego though yet Nov 21 16:11:23 lcuk: In fact, the simulation framework we use at work is based on python Nov 21 16:12:44 sure Nov 21 16:12:57 how do i stop my ideapad from blanking screen after a few minutes idle Nov 21 16:13:04 i only want it to go off if i close the lid Nov 21 16:13:25 "power and brightness" settings are both to "Never" Nov 21 16:13:38 but it still goes off Nov 21 16:13:39 YOu file a bug report. Nov 21 16:13:58 well I was pondering if its a bug or my lack of knowledge of settings :) Nov 21 16:14:05 BTW, it may be a screensaver (not related to power saving) Nov 21 16:14:40 lcuk: you have a Flickr account? Nov 21 16:14:46 no GeneralAntilles Nov 21 16:14:58 lcuk, ah, damn, trying to tag all of the relevant people in my photos. Nov 21 16:15:21 sivang: "always happens for words that the spelling is not as intuitive to the sound"... like, for english words? :) Nov 21 16:15:50 timeless_mbp: so, where to Nov 21 16:15:54 Too many languages making up the mix. Nov 21 16:16:11 sp3000: so, indian is an option Nov 21 16:16:24 but i'm open to others Nov 21 16:16:31 indian sounds good Nov 21 16:16:48 so the place by the radison Nov 21 16:16:55 how long does it take for you to get there? Nov 21 16:17:07 i'm working w/ db48x on slides, almost done Nov 21 16:18:02 I don't know Nov 21 16:18:19 how can greasemonkey still not be compatible with fxwhateverimusing Nov 21 16:18:28 heh Nov 21 16:18:45 lbt: ping Nov 21 16:18:50 DawnFoster: ping Nov 21 16:18:55 I actually have to figure out myself where I am :) Nov 21 16:19:23 lcuk is already a taken name at flickr Nov 21 16:19:24 lst time I estimated a roundtrip to kamppi I was about 2x off Nov 21 16:19:25 hm Nov 21 16:19:57 from where? Nov 21 16:20:30 a walking distance :) Nov 21 16:21:12 timeless_mbp: :30 Nov 21 16:21:45 sp3000: ok, so i'll head out in :20 i think Nov 21 16:21:50 see you at :45 Nov 21 16:22:09 at :30 I meant fwiw :) Nov 21 16:22:14 oh Nov 21 16:22:22 ok, then i'll leave in :05 and see you there! Nov 21 16:22:27 GeneralAntilles, "lcukmeego" Nov 21 16:22:49 lcuk, excellent. Nov 21 16:23:25 and if anybody didn't catch the silly MeeGo advertisement during the game: http://www.flickr.com/photos/generalantilles/5193447749/ Nov 21 16:24:14 meego football ux was cool :D Nov 21 16:25:49 I saw another advert which I think said "Finish stronger" I thought they had made a typo Nov 21 16:27:04 lcuk, the Viagra ad? ;) Nov 21 16:27:08 \o/ Nov 21 16:29:30 https://docs.google.com/present/edit?id=0ASgJOFz-h_P4ZGZkaDdqNWNfOTdkZnRqdnRoag&hl=en&authkey=CO3ovQQ Nov 21 16:29:39 GAN900, et al: ^ i think the slides are somewhat/mostly done Nov 21 16:30:38 frinring: done https://build.pub.meego.com/ Nov 21 16:30:45 berndhs: give me 10m Nov 21 16:30:53 lbt: no rush Nov 21 16:30:55 timeless_mbp, titles should be bigger than content. Nov 21 16:31:00 Bold will help, too Nov 21 16:31:03 * lcuk slides over a guinness to lbt :) Nov 21 16:31:19 GAN900: yeah yeah Nov 21 16:31:29 if you have a gdocs account, i'll give you edit and you can clean up Nov 21 16:31:34 we only finished the slides now Nov 21 16:31:56 * lcuk likes the idea of contributing to a contribution slideshow Nov 21 16:31:58 timeless_mbp, sure, can do that this evening Nov 21 16:32:04 rabelg5 at gmail Nov 21 16:32:18 another OBS question. I'm getting the error "nothing provides nautilus-devel". Why does nothing provide it? I can see it fine with zypper over here. Nov 21 16:32:31 alright Nov 21 16:32:52 s/Dedicated hobbyists developers/Dedicated hobbyist developers/ Nov 21 16:32:59 Slide 7 Nov 21 16:33:17 yes Nov 21 16:33:25 but i'm off to meet sp3000 for food Nov 21 16:36:05 marnanel: sounds like the same problem i have. could it be that nautilus-devel isn't in the meego core repository, but in e.g. meego extras? Nov 21 16:36:26 hahaha jacob is on google typing a search Nov 21 16:36:37 he is trying to bring up google Nov 21 16:36:48 oh, now he is looking for ferraris Nov 21 16:37:04 mortenmj: interesting: thanks. I wonder how I tell it to look in meego-extras then. Nov 21 16:39:17 BTW, given a string in UTF8, how do I tell the browser that it is utf8? Nov 21 16:39:52 RST38h: how are you giving the string to the browser? Nov 21 16:40:05 marnanel: i've been wondering the same for the past 30 minutes Nov 21 16:40:17 thiago: inside an html page Nov 21 16:40:29 the page has an encoding Nov 21 16:40:45 lcukn900: well, I have a nice head on my coffee anyhow ;) Nov 21 16:40:47 ah found it Nov 21 16:40:50 berndhs: ? Nov 21 16:40:54 http-equiv etc Nov 21 16:41:13 lbt: me and marnanel have some build dependencies on packages not in meego-core. how do we resolve that? Nov 21 16:41:27 in my case, they're in meego-extras Nov 21 16:42:29 (my dependency is "nautilus-devel", fwiw) Nov 21 16:42:57 GAN900: do you get slide #19? I'm not sure I follow Nov 21 16:43:26 so... I see 2 roles: maintainer and porter Nov 21 16:43:48 porter is when you'd expect to see a dependency in MeeGo but it isn't there Nov 21 16:44:01 maintainer is when you maintain the package Nov 21 16:44:04 lbt, I just poured a bottle of guinness into a wine glass. interesting experiment Nov 21 16:44:09 ideally we'd have surrounds Nov 21 16:44:20 for now just port the package to your project Nov 21 16:44:22 lbt: isn't that planned? Nov 21 16:44:52 I can create a temporary top level shared area if it would be useful Nov 21 16:44:55 sivang: yes Nov 21 16:45:23 lcuk: try a sherry glass tower a little later in the evening Nov 21 16:45:28 thiago: I'm back :) Nov 21 16:45:37 lbt, you will have to show me that trick Nov 21 16:46:20 mortenmj: what do you mean "in my case, they're in meego-extras" Nov 21 16:46:22 hey Dawn \o enjoying Sunday I hope Nov 21 16:46:53 lcuk: Enjoying it so far, but I just woke up :) Nov 21 16:47:10 DawnFoster: hey... wanted to ask you for a pub-dev mailing list when you get time... any dev stuff that's not intended for core Nov 21 16:48:05 lbt: me an marnanel both have the same problem, separately. the packages i need are in meego-extras Nov 21 16:48:28 hello guys Nov 21 16:49:00 define "meego-extras" ... ? Nov 21 16:49:02 lbt: that's going to need to be carefully named to avoid confusion with meego-dev and meego-sdk Nov 21 16:49:08 is there a developer of meego on N900??? Nov 21 16:49:20 lbt: what kinds of things would people use it for? Nov 21 16:49:24 * thiago_home points to Stskeeps Nov 21 16:49:30 rsc85: ^^^ Nov 21 16:49:43 rsc85: theres many folks around, whats your boggle? Nov 21 16:49:44 hello thiago_home Nov 21 16:49:48 DawnFoster: you mentioned family reading blogs in Dublin. That reminded me of something... Nov 21 16:50:05 lbt: for my part, I am getting the error "nothing provides nautilus-devel", which confuses me, because my copy of zypper can see it Nov 21 16:50:10 im interesting in know more about develop and perhpas contribute in this project Nov 21 16:50:11 DawnFoster: http://labs.qt.nokia.com/2007/07/31/qtwebkit-on-windows/ <--- second to last comment Nov 21 16:50:21 DawnFoster: this is what happens when parents read blogs :-) Nov 21 16:50:23 lbt: thanks! Nov 21 16:50:24 marnanel: are you on netbook? Nov 21 16:50:26 rsc85: #meego-arm is a good place to hang out Nov 21 16:50:27 DawnFoster: yes... I intended to use "pub" since that's where the community OBS lives Nov 21 16:50:33 yes Nov 21 16:50:34 marnanel: it probably has nautilus, but core doesn't Nov 21 16:50:34 it covers the same scope Nov 21 16:50:35 thank you w00t Nov 21 16:50:52 w00t are you the w00t on maemo.org? Nov 21 16:50:54 thiago: lol. that's hilarious! Nov 21 16:51:02 Robot101: oh, okay. do you know if there's a way to persuade the OBS to look in the netbook repos, then? Nov 21 16:51:04 lbt: it's what the repository is called in meego... Nov 21 16:51:34 lbt: yes, that will be obvious to people who are familiar with the comm OBS but confusing for others Nov 21 16:51:43 rsc85: yes Nov 21 16:51:44 * Jay_BEE did not know about #meego-arm, heading there now thx w00t Nov 21 16:52:03 eheh so i know you :) anyways thank you for your help Nov 21 16:52:05 lbt: in the obs it's listed as meego_1.1_extras Nov 21 16:52:19 DawnFoster: everyone will be familiar eventually :) Nov 21 16:52:27 thiago: yeah, my mom used to comment sometimes until she realized that everyone else can read it Nov 21 16:52:47 mortenmj: paste a url Nov 21 16:52:52 lbt: right now, we have a lot of developer confusion about where to post things Nov 21 16:52:53 DawnFoster: I sent the link to my talk to my dad yesterday Nov 21 16:53:05 lbt: I don't want to make it worse Nov 21 16:53:06 DawnFoster: agreed ... meego-dev is about the core Nov 21 16:53:08 DawnFoster: he kept asking questions, as it's very hard to understand without the context Nov 21 16:53:33 this is about app-dev and surrounds and anything not 'core' Nov 21 16:53:42 where core is anything on Anas' OBS Nov 21 16:53:47 lbt: i only know how to add it with zypper, i'm not sure where to find it on the web Nov 21 16:53:59 lbt: yes, but meego-sdk is already for app development Nov 21 16:54:05 ! Nov 21 16:54:09 seriously? Nov 21 16:54:13 lbt: yep Nov 21 16:54:19 Nov 21 16:54:21 daft name Nov 21 16:54:29 sounds like where the sdk is developed Nov 21 16:54:31 descriptions here: http://wiki.meego.com/Community_communication Nov 21 16:54:51 lbt: well, created that one before I started naming things properly ;) Nov 21 16:55:02 lbt: it's an entirely official repository... Nov 21 16:55:09 lbt: meego-dev, meego-sdk were created before I joined Nov 21 16:55:25 hello Nov 21 16:55:36 DawnFoster: mmm "can also ask general application development questions here." Nov 21 16:55:36 other stuff on the tablet :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKdLCGCTu8w Nov 21 16:56:08 DawnFoster: most focus is on "toolchains, sysroots, emulators, IDEs, documentation" Nov 21 16:56:52 lbt: the description can use some more work, the focus of that mailing list is using the SDK and related tools to develop applications Nov 21 16:57:11 lbt: I think we should use that mailing list for stuff intended for the community obs Nov 21 16:57:25 DawnFoster: OK ... I'll let others worry about it... as long as I can point at an ml Nov 21 16:57:37 short question what is a good dev hardware platform? controled with touchscreen Nov 21 16:57:53 lbt: let's start with meego-sdk and then if it doesn't work, we'll switch to something else Nov 21 16:58:21 ok, enough IRC, I'm on vacation, I'm going to go read something printed on a dead tree :) Nov 21 16:58:31 sure ... I just assumed there was nowhere to cover that topic - I guarantee no-one will find it by name :) Nov 21 16:58:39 enjoy it :D Nov 21 17:00:08 DawnFoster: have fun Nov 21 17:00:14 thanks! Nov 21 17:01:24 mortenmj: what arch ? Nov 21 17:01:49 I only see it for i586 in the netbook area Nov 21 17:03:25 lbt: hang on. i'll boot into meego and look at my config Nov 21 17:07:34 lbt: on my netbook the address is http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/releases/1.0/extra/repos/ia32/packages Nov 21 17:10:59 mortenmj: OK ... give me an urls for your project/package Nov 21 17:11:18 lbt: my project is up on home:mortenmjelva:zeitgeist Nov 21 17:11:27 in the obs Nov 21 17:12:18 now, there doesn't seem to be a meego-extras repo for 1.1, and i can't find the packages i need from the 1.0 repo in 1.1's meego-core. any chance of having those packages put in meego-core? Nov 21 17:12:44 i hope to get zeitgeist in meego-core, so i suppose it would be necessary for that to be possible Nov 21 17:13:24 show it building and working on all ux'es would be a start Nov 21 17:13:57 lcuk: it's currently not building because i haven't figured out how to satisfy the build dependencies Nov 21 17:14:04 which is what i'm talking to lbt about... Nov 21 17:14:08 yip Nov 21 17:16:32 hm. gconf2-devel i actually had to get from opensuse. i suppose i might as well package that for meego, so we can push it into meego-core? Nov 21 17:16:49 mortenmj: "nothing provides gconf2-devel, nothing provides python-rdflib, nothing provides libraptor-devel" Nov 21 17:17:00 so... you're going to need them Nov 21 17:17:08 i am Nov 21 17:17:17 yeah, gimme a sec Nov 21 17:17:24 oh, wait... Nov 21 17:18:19 you'll need to port and maintain them too Nov 21 17:18:23 raptor-devel is in meego-extras in 1.0. python-rdflib is as far as i can tell nowhere, and gconf2-devel is in opensuse. Nov 21 17:18:44 is there a quick way to get rpms from opensuse into meego? Nov 21 17:19:00 i mean, it installs just fine on my machine Nov 21 17:19:03 does that raptor have anything to do with the Symbian buildsystem called Raptor? Nov 21 17:19:25 raptor, at least in this context, is an rdf parser toolkit Nov 21 17:19:39 ok Nov 21 17:20:26 lbt is extremely popular now, poor guy :) Nov 21 17:20:39 lbt: the specfile online is outdated compared to the one i'm using locally. the package is called raptor-devel Nov 21 17:22:38 mortenmj: I think berndhs can help you there... Nov 21 17:24:39 berndhs: do we have a system for importing packages from opensuse? Nov 21 17:25:01 mortenmj: I can answer that: I don't know Nov 21 17:25:10 berndhs: great! Nov 21 17:25:47 other than getting their spec file and foo.tar.gz, and making a meego rpm Nov 21 17:25:56 yup Nov 21 17:26:52 easy enough. already on it in fact Nov 21 17:29:52 lbt: when you have time, can you add "earthling" to the pub obs, or should I get a new name ? Nov 21 17:30:53 is that your meego.com account name? Nov 21 17:31:00 lbt: yes Nov 21 17:31:04 marnanel, GAN900 should also be consulted on the keyboard and would be a good person to be involved in the testing and feedback loop Nov 21 17:31:07 done Nov 21 17:31:11 since he was the fastest typer on n800 ever Nov 21 17:31:17 with all my 4 posts or so :) Nov 21 17:31:50 lbt: thank you Nov 21 17:35:37 lcuk, hmm? Nov 21 17:37:22 GeneralAntilles, http://wiki.meego.com/Predictive_virtual_keyboard Nov 21 17:44:17 wow the fastest roller coaster in the world is at ferrari world Nov 21 17:49:42 * NooBmonk3y is away: I'm busy Nov 21 19:14:38 so, a random thought: meego's targetting to be a platform and people's problem with it is that it's not really end-user friendly as it only contains reference apps. What if we created the MeeGo Community Product, which is the meego platform + things to make it nicer for end-users, actively pushing things into platform part that make sense, like a vendor would? Nov 21 19:15:00 because platform needs productization (could be done by a community) to be suitable for end-users Nov 21 19:15:51 Stskeeps: A random answer to a random thought: your idea only makes sense if you know for SURE that you (and a group of interested people, give the list please) are capable ofproductizing it Nov 21 19:16:07 this would solve many of the complaints about end-user friendliness and would maybe be a good direction for let's say netbook users or n900 Nov 21 19:16:24 Debian and Fedora have the same problem - their user base is too wide or indistince Nov 21 19:16:25 RST38h: agreed Nov 21 19:16:49 Stskeeps: As much as I respect you, making a consumer-ready product may end up well above the free share of your capabilities :) Nov 21 19:16:51 to properly rally the project behind productizing the software for one target audience Nov 21 19:17:14 RST38h: was a random thought :) i know what i'd be driving - and that'd be platform work Nov 21 19:17:28 Stskeeps: Another point to consider: Nov 21 19:17:58 Stskeeps: You have got several Intel teams working specifically on Meego (Moblin before that) Nov 21 19:18:21 Stskeeps: These guys are *paid* to create a semi-productized Meego distro (actually, 3 distros) Nov 21 19:18:42 Stskeeps: And they are not there yet. Nov 21 19:18:47 intel has far more people on platform & distro than products Nov 21 19:18:47 point Nov 21 19:18:52 nokia the other way round Nov 21 19:18:56 as you'd expect, really Nov 21 19:19:00 but yeah, the platform is bigger than the reference ux'es Nov 21 19:19:10 As far as I understand, Nokia is not contributing to reference apps,no? Nov 21 19:19:21 RST38h: we have people from our team contributing to handset stuff Nov 21 19:19:36 both product teams have been upended by platform changes over time, but it seems to be settling out a bit now Nov 21 19:19:41 RST38h: and all of control panels are nokian Nov 21 19:19:53 well, many, at least Nov 21 19:20:33 ah ok Nov 21 19:20:36 interesting Nov 21 19:20:40 all of the (non-apps) bit of handset ux too like mcompositor, at least initially.. no idea if intel are doing work on that Nov 21 19:21:20 i wonder if there'd be value in seperating out reference apps outside 'platform' Nov 21 19:21:29 and brewing those outside platform process Nov 21 19:21:35 Stskeeps: Basically, creating a semi-complete, semi-usable apps suite is 4-6 months of highly determined, well paid labor of a single person Nov 21 19:21:57 Stskeeps: Well... one thing i can mention there is that the kde mobile sub-team are working on something like that... dunno if you might be keen on joining that effort :) Nov 21 19:22:18 Stskeeps: Estimate based on the availability of usable QtQuick (yes,components too) and reuse of some existing OSS stuff Nov 21 19:22:22 you probably saw the videos posted earlier today... if not, gimme a second ;) Nov 21 19:22:50 Stskeeps: And the notion that the guy will be working 8-10 hours a day Nov 21 19:23:07 i guess the opposite side of the coin is "why would anyone not just make a company and build a stack instead, selling it".. Nov 21 19:23:23 Stskeeps: You seriously do not know why? Nov 21 19:23:31 i know why Nov 21 19:23:32 :P Nov 21 19:23:36 Stskeeps: During the Handset UX Roadmap talk, the guy (whose name I'd have to look up), specifically said (in response to my question) that they'd take new apps into the reference apps if they were better than the current ones. Nov 21 19:23:42 Good, I guess we are on the same page then ;) Nov 21 19:23:43 Jaffa: ah, that's good Nov 21 19:24:11 Jaffa: Well, you know what that mean Nov 21 19:24:12 Jaffa: and the usual disclaimer: that they were bsd/mit licensed, probably.. Nov 21 19:24:22 Jaffa: i think there's a tiny tidbit about that laying aroun Nov 21 19:24:23 d Nov 21 19:24:24 It was Sami Jaffa Nov 21 19:24:32 Stskeeps: Why would you want BSD license if the rest of your OS is GPLed? Nov 21 19:24:45 slaine: Thanks. Nov 21 19:24:46 the reference UX apps (at least for handset) aren't GPL Nov 21 19:24:48 they're APL Nov 21 19:24:49 You want to leave the ability to create custom derivatives? Nov 21 19:25:03 And if that was you, I should have introduced myself, saw you about the place a few times Nov 21 19:25:07 probably for precisely that reason Nov 21 19:25:17 slaine: I meant to hunt you down ;-) Nov 21 19:25:38 I think we even say beside each other at one point, d'oh Nov 21 19:25:49 Stskeeps: Architecturally, if I were writing the apps suite, I would start by writing QML prototypes Nov 21 19:25:55 RST38h: yeah, now Nov 21 19:25:56 slaine: gcobb and I were the ones doing most of the talking at the community infrastructure/repos/extras BoF with lbt Nov 21 19:25:58 Stskeeps: This has two advantages Nov 21 19:26:03 QML is awesome Nov 21 19:26:26 Stskeeps: First is speed. Second is great reusability Nov 21 19:26:40 * Jaffa loved the QML demos (from achipa primarily ;-)) at the conference; and has been playing with Qt Creator 2.1 beta + Nokia Qt SDK this afternoon. Very shiny stuff Nov 21 19:26:52 Stskeeps: The current barrier to that is that QML by itself is kinda useless,and QtComponents for QML are not ready yet Nov 21 19:26:55 is fMMS written in Qt? Nov 21 19:26:56 Actually, n900 question, microSD only or microSDHC also ? Nov 21 19:27:09 slaine: microsdhc is better, naturally Nov 21 19:27:10 slaine: All MicroSD is, AFAIK, MicroSDHC Nov 21 19:27:26 Jay_BEE: python (pygtk/hildon) Nov 21 19:27:30 cool, class 6 min too I guess Nov 21 19:27:33 Stskeeps: After doing the UIs (andprobably discussing them with people at tmo), I would see if any current Unix software could be used as backens for these UIs Nov 21 19:27:48 Stskeeps: I.e. using ready-made email client libraries, etc Nov 21 19:28:01 frals: ah ok, cool Nov 21 19:28:02 RST38h: Like tinymail ;-) Nov 21 19:28:11 Stskeeps: At that point, someone should be making artwork in parallel Nov 21 19:28:17 Any good/interesting links cropped up this week? MWKN's surprisingly sparse. Nov 21 19:28:35 Jaffa: could you hint on that there's a 'demo' image on tablets-dev that's surprisingly faster? Nov 21 19:28:37 Stskeeps: So, yes,you CAN get a usable apps suite in 4-6 months, just not for free. Nov 21 19:28:43 Stskeeps: I was promoting "the community OBS and stuff" as a potential reference build-on-meego ISV Nov 21 19:28:53 lbt: true Nov 21 19:28:58 Jaffa: videos of kontact touch and plasma-tablet running on meego, would that suffice? ;) Nov 21 19:29:12 actually MicroSD and MicroSDHC are different, the latter supports higher storage capacities for one Nov 21 19:29:12 RST38h: well, i guess it bends down to: why on earth wouldn't you just turn capitalist and sell a set of working apps instead Nov 21 19:29:15 :P Nov 21 19:29:23 Jaffa: community OBS, fremantle on OBS of course Nov 21 19:29:29 Stskeeps: ...and we both know the answer to that. Nov 21 19:29:36 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsWnfny61oI <-- kontact touch Nov 21 19:29:41 (notlike people have not tried before) Nov 21 19:29:59 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKdLCGCTu8w <-- plasma mobile, modified a touch for use on a tablet Nov 21 19:30:39 I had dinner with some of the release guys on thursday Nov 21 19:30:53 the whole Surrounds thing is of interest Nov 21 19:31:04 leinir: Was just watching that. Very cool. Nov 21 19:31:14 having opensuse as our upstream for contrib wasn't welcome :) Nov 21 19:31:16 leinir: nice =) Nov 21 19:31:22 Jaffa: *nods* about three days worth of work... 'tis pretty sweet stuff Nov 21 19:31:23 but it was supported and understood ! Nov 21 19:31:26 :) Nov 21 19:31:33 lbt: Indeed, got community OBS. Was there an announcement, apart from the slide? Nov 21 19:31:46 RST38h: Very, i'm really impressed with the speed of development here :) Nov 21 19:31:53 it's clear we need to start to build an area around meego Nov 21 19:32:11 we have Team: area and we will have Extras: and Surrounds: Nov 21 19:32:26 surrounds is supposed to be meego staging? Nov 21 19:33:12 leinir: Mind if I use those as quotes? ;-) Nov 21 19:33:20 Jaffa: not hugely ... but we have ~ 50+ users now Nov 21 19:33:44 Jaffa: Not at all :) i don't tend to say stuff in public that isn't quotable ;) Nov 21 19:33:51 no Nov 21 19:34:03 more 'contrib' Nov 21 19:34:08 i do tend to get annoyed when quoted out of context, but as long as the context is available or at least clear, i'm good ;) Nov 21 19:34:14 although obviously there's a route to core Nov 21 19:34:45 I'd actually like to see meego span the core and community OBSes Nov 21 19:34:49 if the context is clear, then you're not out of context Nov 21 19:34:57 core is what device vendors would rely on Nov 21 19:35:07 thiago_home: yeah, that's sort of my point :) Nov 21 19:36:32 heh... exactly 50 users have asked for accounts Nov 21 19:36:46 lbt: Contacting you (say via IRC), still the preferred account enablement process? Nov 21 19:38:10 currently, yes Nov 21 19:39:26 I'm happy for the community via CO to define a preferred process Nov 21 19:40:21 we don't yet have a policy for OBS either... I assume OSI-approved only Nov 21 19:40:47 lbt: It's interesting, because it's a lot more technical than previous CO topics. I guess they'd want a concrete proposal. Nov 21 19:41:29 lbt: suggestion for core of proposal: content - OSI-approved, as you say; users - any meego.com account who writes a few sentences on how they're intending to use it (and then manually approved by a group of folk, like X-Fade and yourself) Nov 21 19:41:54 lbt: QA then on top (TBD) for moving from Extras:Testing to Extras Nov 21 19:42:16 lbt: ...and then all the stuff from the BoF for moving from Extras(:Testing?) to Surrounds Nov 21 19:42:26 * lbt mutters about the community repo WG we proposed in feb... which would have made core sort so much of this out Nov 21 19:42:53 yes Nov 21 19:43:09 X-Fade did some work on that in the wiki iirc Nov 21 19:43:20 all good Nov 21 19:43:59 lbt: The CRWG could well be the people tasked with a) approving people and b) maintaining & defining the various processes. Nov 21 19:44:04 hmm.... http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=1451 Nov 21 19:44:13 lbt: It might be more accepted now that it seems much closer and tangible. Nov 21 19:44:21 any issues about mp3 codecs I wonder? Nov 21 19:45:19 lb probably yes Nov 21 19:45:32 maybe the infrastructure group could expand out that way Nov 21 19:45:48 evening Nov 21 19:46:11 we're doing all the technical design for security and other stuff under the meego.com infra Nov 21 19:46:15 * NooBmonk3y is back (gone 01:56:32) Nov 21 19:46:34 so validating that with ryan ware etc Nov 21 19:46:54 who actually has a deputy joining us on our weekly meetings Nov 21 19:47:09 'lo julienf Nov 21 19:49:54 Stskeeps: BTW, speaking of app suites, some things can be down with a web server and php :) Nov 21 19:53:22 Jaffa: good post about the conf :) Nov 21 19:54:31 julienf: Thanks :-) Nov 21 20:00:26 salut ali1234 Nov 21 20:12:04 re people Nov 21 20:15:44 Jaffa: so... Nov 21 20:15:49 amusing feature Nov 21 20:16:03 ovi suite doesn't correctly configure cellular service for my n900s w/ Elisa Nov 21 20:16:11 nokia's main provider here in finland :) Nov 21 20:16:28 lbt, can I trouble you to throw the switch allowing user 'vgrade' access to community OBS, TIA Nov 21 20:16:48 youalready there Nov 21 20:16:53 heh Nov 21 20:17:02 bad key Nov 21 20:19:38 lbt, thanks Nov 21 20:21:51 is there a webinterface for searching through meego packages? Nov 21 20:29:44 timeless_mbp: well, it did seem to configure it fine, it just made a random different guess apparently... Nov 21 20:30:30 re slides, "dedicated hobbyist" seems detailed enough to try to be normative Nov 21 20:30:40 (the parenthetical part) Nov 21 20:30:41 mortenmj: http://repo.meego.com Nov 21 20:30:55 so it probably needs ellipsis or e.g. Nov 21 20:31:20 otherwise it's like you have to be unemployed to be dedicated Nov 21 20:31:59 slaine: well, yes, but there's no search? Nov 21 20:32:04 * timeless_mbp fishes for sp3000 's gmail Nov 21 20:32:09 ? Nov 21 20:32:12 the sorting is slightly odd in that it introduces downstream consumer before consumer Nov 21 20:32:20 doesn't your browser have in page searching ? Nov 21 20:32:49 mortenmj: what exactly are you trying to do I guess Nov 21 20:33:04 slaine: search for packages, the way you can in e.g. ubuntu or opensuse Nov 21 20:33:19 slaine: navigating the hierarchy and using in-page search isn't quite the same Nov 21 20:33:37 so then you're left wondering why a downstream consumer is more interesting (as the order suggests contrib magnitude to some extent) Nov 21 20:33:40 zypper search FOO ? Nov 21 20:33:56 Bostik: only works within meego Nov 21 20:34:05 ah, true enough Nov 21 20:34:09 Oh, ok, I get you. No, there's nothing like that Nov 21 20:34:22 Submit a request Nov 21 20:34:31 ok. maybe i should submit a request for something like that. if it exists for opensuse, and it does, it might not be too hard to implement Nov 21 20:34:37 packages.meego.com wouldn't be a bad service, though... Nov 21 20:34:39 slide 5 should be some sort of graphic although the number of dimensions makes that interesting Nov 21 20:34:44 Bostik: exactly Nov 21 20:35:09 Oh, news flash on RTE about how f*@k'd ireland is Nov 21 20:35:09 perhaps venn can handle it Nov 21 20:35:12 slaine: the sharing tab didn't have the knowledge i needed Nov 21 20:35:23 i used gmail to find what i needed Nov 21 20:35:42 the table format is a bit hard for me to get traction on Nov 21 20:36:00 was that slide 4? Nov 21 20:36:16 slaine: did they get boned by wall street as well? Nov 21 20:36:24 the previous coment was Nov 21 20:38:00 reward and management are mutually implied so it's three dimensions topographically sorta Nov 21 20:38:52 although I'm not sure if the consumer type should self-manage Nov 21 20:38:59 that slide grew since the last time i changed it Nov 21 20:38:59 mortenmj: nothing different to any other country, but we're very small so we've lived way beyond our means for way too long Nov 21 20:39:00 none is a bit weird :) Nov 21 20:40:12 sp3000: can you log into gdocs so it knows which page you're on? :) Nov 21 20:40:13 "paid to get things right"? Nov 21 20:40:20 that's not how it usually works :) Nov 21 20:45:37 8 doesn't fit Nov 21 20:47:12 but I guess it isn't quite time for that Nov 21 20:48:50 ok, now gdocs knows you and thinks you're looking at slide 1 :) Nov 21 20:49:23 hrm, and now gdocs is being stupid? Nov 21 20:50:11 timeless_mbp: managed to get back in shape? ;) Nov 21 20:50:33 ? Nov 21 20:51:08 last memory I have of you is sleeping on a chair in the hacker's lounge ;) Nov 21 20:51:47 timeless_mbp: well, minefield sprung an update Nov 21 20:51:53 heh Nov 21 20:51:59 julienf: ah Nov 21 20:52:06 timeless_mbp: can you enable comments for me? I just wish to add some sidenotes, not edit the slides themselves. Some things are not clear to me as non native, also examples for projects that use a qa team and a ticket tracker are ubuntu and plone, as most proximate examples. Nov 21 20:52:36 done Nov 21 20:52:40 timeless_mbp: thanks Nov 21 20:55:35 is BZR spelled like that? Nov 21 20:56:20 probably not Nov 21 20:56:23 sp3000: http://bazaar.canonical.com/en/ Nov 21 20:56:26 although the channel is #bzr Nov 21 20:56:27 For Bazaar? Nov 21 20:56:29 Yeah Nov 21 20:56:30 sp3000: so "bazaar' Nov 21 20:56:40 note inconsistent use of quotes Nov 21 20:56:44 ;) Nov 21 20:56:47 ;) Nov 21 20:57:02 sp3000: it is amazing how bad can a bad keyboard and touchpad combo do Nov 21 20:57:18 s/bad/harm/ Nov 21 20:57:18 sivang meant: sp3000: it is amazing how harm can a bad keyboard and touchpad combo do Nov 21 20:57:23 err Nov 21 20:57:28 * sivang gives up Nov 21 20:57:43 sivang: fwiw if you do a second s/// right after the first one Nov 21 20:57:51 the bot will apply it to the original string Nov 21 20:58:26 and then get merge conflicts? :) Nov 21 20:59:23 nah, second change wins :) Nov 21 21:01:28 some projects try to enforce bisectability, so if review comments fix something in a patch that qualifies as a regression then the bad commit should live on a branch (and if the committer is clever enough, try to choose the right 1st-parent for the merge too) Nov 21 21:01:36 but that's a bit of a digression ;) Nov 21 21:01:57 s,bad,intermediate, Nov 21 21:02:14 Anyone here know something about the openness of the top/UI-layer of Meego..? I see plenty of videos of Meego+KDE (see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKdLCGCTu8w ) - just curious if that'll be the most popular open option... Nov 21 21:07:08 * sp3000 hits alphabetical dissonance at bug A comment B attachment C Nov 21 21:08:02 nice i got xchat installed and working Nov 21 21:08:34 WIIman, which instructions did you follow? Nov 21 21:08:49 one sec ill get the link Nov 21 21:08:53 ta Nov 21 21:09:28 sp3000: heh Nov 21 21:10:04 http://blog.beford.org/2010/10/24/xchat-2-8-on-meego/ Nov 21 21:12:00 sivang: you are right, an idea that started to emerge at the conf and followed up on a bit is: http://wiki.meego.com/Predictive_virtual_keyboard Nov 21 21:12:32 WIIman: thanks! Nov 21 21:12:35 i addaed the lin to my twitter page too Nov 21 21:13:00 lcuk: irc logs are problematic Nov 21 21:13:03 im papatwilight on twitter Nov 21 21:13:05 you don't want to take misspelled words Nov 21 21:13:26 timeless_mbp: sure, then make a note about that Nov 21 21:13:39 ... Nov 21 21:13:44 lcuk_idea, np Nov 21 21:13:45 the weighted usage of words is important too Nov 21 21:13:59 and since we talk about lots of things often ;) Nov 21 21:14:23 rhkfin: what are you interesting in knowing about, specifically? Nov 21 21:14:39 * timeless_mbp tries to remember how the heck to use openid Nov 21 21:14:46 timeless_mbp: i have a whole history of every word I have ever typed on IRC. as training text for my personalised keyboard, I think thats important Nov 21 21:14:52 i just had to have xchat i hated haveing pidgin and empothy just for irc Nov 21 21:15:28 any other training text would not be "me" ? Nov 21 21:15:40 jonnor: not quite sure.. Hmm.. Well first, when Meego phones will be out in the stores, will they have closed UX layer? Nov 21 21:15:45 it would be second guessing what I think rather than looking at everything I have typed before Nov 21 21:15:46 two multiprotacal client is overkill xchat fills the missing irc client bill niceliy Nov 21 21:16:08 for general training texts, sure Nov 21 21:16:58 rhkfin: that is entirely up to the people shipping the phones. And since no phones have been announced, we do not know. Nov 21 21:17:13 ok.. Nov 21 21:17:34 [13:00] nice i got xchat installed and working <--- congrats! Nov 21 21:17:52 * timeless_mbp sighs Nov 21 21:17:59 * timeless_mbp beats the stuffing out of openid Nov 21 21:18:29 rhkfin: for details on what needs to be open/existing and what not on a "Meego" device, check the compilance specifications Nov 21 21:19:29 jonnor: ok, thanks.. Nov 21 21:19:34 wtf! somehow I have managed to open a youtube link from within webchat here on the ideapad. but theres no window or tab for it so i cant stop it. Nov 21 21:21:58 im glad you did get xxchat working :) Nov 21 21:22:19 xchat even Nov 21 21:23:02 sp3000: hrm Nov 21 21:23:12 it might be possible to draw a couple of venn diagrams Nov 21 21:25:49 hello all ! Nov 21 21:27:46 where i can download package with meego sdk? Nov 21 21:28:49 Mat_Matan: http://meego.com/downloads/releases/1.1/meego-v1.1-sdk Nov 21 21:29:19 jonnor: BIG THX :] Nov 21 21:30:18 Mat_Matan: it is linked from meego.com frontpage :) Nov 21 21:30:55 stuff in the frontpage isn't easy to find Nov 21 21:31:05 spent 5 minutes searching the sign up link for the conference... Nov 21 21:34:06 Mat_Matan: depending on what distro you're on there might be a repository as well Nov 21 21:34:09 debian/ubuntu has one Nov 21 21:34:27 opensuse and fedora as well Nov 21 21:47:56 ok, so... Nov 21 21:56:38 I have latest 1.1.80.7... installed on N900 - any chances to SSH in over WLAN? Would be easier than usb.. Nov 21 21:56:57 netbook or handset? :) Nov 21 21:56:59 (or IVI?) Nov 21 21:57:10 handset Nov 21 21:58:10 Can't find xterm in the menu any more :/ In 1.1 it was still there Nov 21 22:10:01 lcuk: interesting idea, why not just use a dictionary and speed search through it while typing, only instead of showing remaining possible words, dim the letters that no longer take part Nov 21 22:10:12 lcuk: I think there's something like this for samsung devices Nov 21 22:10:33 lcuk: At least I had it in a very old amsung phone, also I think some symbians have it Nov 21 22:11:13 lcuk: ofcourse make sure you can press them but require more time on "press" for them to work to allow easy fast typing Nov 21 22:14:08 lcuk: completely disabling other letters is annoying when the guess failed Nov 21 22:14:26 lcuk: speaking out of experience with similar magic on other platforms. Nov 21 22:29:49 sony seems to be developing their own gnu/linux based tablet OS too. Nov 21 22:30:20 does it have rootkits? Nov 21 22:31:10 no idea, but they use gnustep toolkit Nov 21 22:31:17 oshin: they should give up and be assimilated Nov 21 22:31:18 snap.sonydeveloper.com Nov 21 22:31:34 very early state, but they are doing it. Nov 21 22:31:49 wow, gnustep, cool Nov 21 22:32:15 interesting choice Nov 21 22:32:20 gnustep, is that still going Nov 21 22:32:26 which looks almost like a suicide to me. Nov 21 22:32:36 yes. Nov 21 22:32:48 still going. Nov 21 22:33:49 apple won't be happy. Nov 21 22:34:08 or they did, enemy committing suicide. Nov 21 22:34:18 I'd say Sony are hoping to leverage the wealth of iOS developers out there Nov 21 22:34:23 clever move actually Nov 21 22:34:39 hopefully they've actually hired some of the GNUStep folks Nov 21 22:34:48 hopefully. Nov 21 22:35:25 they have multi-touch code in their branch. Nov 21 22:36:09 probably done by some gs dev Nov 21 22:36:25 oshin, i still cant do a touchpad 100% let alone multi touch ..does that mean fingers and thumbs ;) Nov 21 22:36:37 :) Nov 21 22:39:37 ok who here still has moblin themed meego ie with all the old look and feel of moblin or have you all still fallen for meego? Nov 21 22:44:50 andybleaden: nobody has fallen, everyone here has risen above such lowly concerns :) Nov 21 22:45:29 berndhs, does that mean you still have moblin settings then :P Nov 21 22:45:58 me? I ssh into my meego machine from my fedora xfce Nov 21 22:46:02 berndhs, I still cannot warm to meego UI .linked as it is to moblin Nov 21 22:46:46 berndhs,sounds complicated.does that mean you are not really in meego then.just there virtually? Nov 21 22:46:48 sivang, nobody suggested completely disabling, merely making the most used easier to click Nov 21 22:47:03 and please add your comments remarks and things to the page Nov 21 22:47:11 its there for all of us to work out Nov 21 22:47:24 andybleaden: actually both, it is sometimes just more convenient to use ssh Nov 21 22:48:33 berndhs, never got round to doing that yet.closest I got was a live usb and maybe that is the best I can do Nov 21 22:49:27 berndhs, i always wanted to get ssh to work but could not sort it from work - proxy 'issues' Nov 21 22:49:58 andybleaden: I ssh into a machine that sits a few inches away Nov 21 22:50:23 berndhs: sometimes over my ipv6 tunnel across 1/2 the continent :) Nov 21 22:50:30 berndhs, did you try moblin before that then?.why do you ssh then..if so close.or is it because you just 'can' Nov 21 22:51:18 andybleaden: sometimes its more convenient to do things from a bigger display, when I do stuff on meego and fedora at the same time Nov 21 22:51:32 hi, where I can find more repositories for meego? extras seems not be available anymore Nov 21 22:51:37 berndhs, so for numpties like me that means you have a desktop with fedora on it and you log in to a meego set up on a netbook? Nov 21 22:51:53 andybleaden: right Nov 21 22:51:55 berndhs, ah I see Nov 21 22:52:06 berndhs, nifty Nov 21 22:53:13 berndhs, maybe I should try that and stop effing with my netbook...that has had a weekly change in OS for the past year Nov 21 22:53:59 andybleaden: depends on what you want to do with it Nov 21 22:55:51 berndhs, could do with being able to ssh in and out of my desktop ..it will wait Nov 21 23:03:26 just published a quick post about the MeeGo install on the Lenovo Ideapad: http://wp.me/pPWnp-bM Nov 21 23:15:07 julienf: i want instructions for doing dualboot :) Nov 21 23:15:57 hey Nov 21 23:16:09 i wonder if i could use backup if my usb stick was formatted exfat or ntfs :) Nov 21 23:17:48 timeless_mbp: so you're more of a chicken than a pig? ;) Nov 21 23:18:52 I decided to go full MeeGo and build it up to a usable machine, but not sure if that's gonna work out.. Nov 21 23:18:59 could try to put OSX on it ;) Nov 21 23:30:58 dear god why do that OSX is nearly as virus prone as windows Nov 21 23:34:33 coz windows get better? or you mean trojan? Nov 21 23:35:12 I'm immune, everyone loves powerPC Nov 21 23:35:32 won't survice script Nov 21 23:35:46 survive* Nov 21 23:35:58 been trying to boot my emac with a thumbdrive Nov 21 23:36:06 dvd drive was broken Nov 21 23:36:17 ah thanks Nov 21 23:37:07 most virus hit mac os as well as windowa as they desided to hit bit widows and mac os Nov 21 23:37:48 like breaking an existing exploit? Nov 21 23:37:53 for programming apps for MeeGO, i will have to use C++ & QT for GUI right? Nov 21 23:38:18 abstract3d: Qt is the official toolkit for Meego, yes. Nov 21 23:38:35 gtk+ will work right? Nov 21 23:38:41 and i am porting gnustep Nov 21 23:38:55 is there any recomendation for IDE? Nov 21 23:39:00 Several other toolkits are currently part of the core as well, including gtk+ and clutter. Nov 21 23:39:08 abstract3d: QtCreator is the official IDE. Nov 21 23:40:16 QT is a good tool kit if gtk and be not added but gtk apps be remade by qt format that would be cool Nov 21 23:40:41 Sorry, clutter is _not_ part of the core. Nov 21 23:41:52 i usualy prefer a pure qt based os or pure gtk based os as i like things clean and pure based on on format Nov 21 23:42:11 and less memory usage. Nov 21 23:42:21 but it isn't that much Nov 21 23:42:47 meego is taking the right steps in the qt directinon Nov 21 23:43:01 just need a biger repo Nov 21 23:43:21 more apps and games for entertainment pupeses Nov 21 23:43:22 WIIman: i prefer apps that work. if k3b is the best burning app and gimp is the best image editing app, why not use them? Nov 21 23:43:24 Good applications are good applications. Toolkit used is of secondary concern. Nov 21 23:44:36 i agree that some apps have there place in the os so if balnsed and clean suport for both qt and gtk that is fine just a cut down on dependancies Nov 21 23:44:37 thp: i prefer usable apps :) Nov 21 23:46:25 * oshin prefers 70% usability but free software. Nov 21 23:47:13 may be adding a repo or so from say opensuse or fedora Nov 21 23:47:39 is there is compatability Nov 21 23:48:30 timeless_mbp: well working is a prerequisite. after that, having usable apps is even better :p Nov 21 23:49:49 considering meego well suports the graphics cards in netbooks and other devices adding some decent games to the repos would be good Nov 21 23:50:32 is meego going to have the connectivity integration on the level of maemo 5? Nov 21 23:51:27 zr0, I think with enough people working hard meego will raise the bar a few notches. Nov 21 23:52:25 to me, that's the biggest innovation maemo brought to the smartphone market Nov 21 23:52:39 WIIman: please note that the core repositories are intentionally very slim. Community repos and applications stores will provide such things you are looking for, eventually. Nov 21 23:52:49 maybe meego could advertise on distrowatch shashdot and the register as a way to get there message out Nov 21 23:52:55 the skype, sip, gtalk integration is fantastic Nov 21 23:53:32 I cannot phantom anyone wanting to regress in this area. On the contrary ;) Nov 21 23:55:35 i doubt im alone wanting some fun games and other apps available most of us that use out devices like to play once and a wile and sometimes more often :) Nov 21 23:55:36 zr0, indeed :) Nov 21 23:55:51 * lcuk takes his bloaty feeling body to bed Nov 21 23:59:33 you spent 8 hours out of bed today lcuk Nov 21 23:59:58 yeah, and it was hard work being so lazy :P Nov 22 00:00:05 lol Nov 22 00:00:31 I've been productive and perplexed by prime numbers Nov 22 00:00:39 * WIIman is disabled its always hard finding things to do with the time awake lol Nov 22 00:00:52 bbiam Nov 22 00:01:14 why did I read that as "liam" Nov 22 00:05:54 I'm off to sleep now, cyas Nov 22 00:15:06 ctrl + r does not work Nov 22 00:15:21 or is it super+r Nov 22 00:15:52 niether here Nov 22 00:18:37 check keyboard setting in settings go to keyboard shortcuts Nov 22 00:18:46 see if its enabled Nov 22 00:19:00 WIIman: its more widespread I think Nov 22 00:19:14 just a thought about the handling of that super button Nov 22 00:19:52 as it happens now, once you have pressed it, you then have to move to the screen to use the mouse Nov 22 00:20:35 you can add the shortcut there and assine it it may do the trick Nov 22 00:21:12 [super] + type "term" for instance should do some filtering and offer me terminal, or typing "gary" should have me left with contact. etc .. Nov 22 00:21:46 the disconnect and inability to use the keyboard once that menu up is glaring Nov 22 00:22:37 what menu ? Nov 22 00:22:55 the main meego handset drop down Nov 22 00:23:15 the one that pops down from the top when you mouse to the roof or press the [super] key Nov 22 00:23:16 i use touch pad or superkey to get the menu bar and pull down the menu i need Nov 22 00:23:26 no kb shortcuts Nov 22 00:23:43 WIIman: once you press the [super] key, you cannot use the keyboard then until you are done Nov 22 00:24:05 even something as simple as using numbers to open the associated menu ;) Nov 22 00:24:26 lcuk_idea: please check that these bugs are filed, or file if not Nov 22 00:24:33 and drastic simple things like pressing escape again once you know what time it is ;) Nov 22 00:24:39 jonnor: i am defining the structure for the bug Nov 22 00:24:44 and how to describe it Nov 22 00:25:29 lcuk_idea: good, good Nov 22 00:27:45 [super] + "m" (media) change music and back to original task without ever actually needing to reach as far as the top of the screen. all in one motion with your arm Nov 22 00:33:27 hmm i quess so lol never tryed to use key wile menu bar was down Nov 22 00:33:52 superkey works to close it so i never though the other keys wouldnt Nov 22 00:37:02 * WIIman rarely uses keys to navigte menus touchpad with meego netbook interfase give near touchscreen power to navigation Nov 22 00:37:25 WIIman: do you have a wii? Nov 22 00:37:42 hm. every time i try to resolve a dependency *that* package depends on five others, that aren't in meego Nov 22 00:37:47 yes i do Nov 22 00:37:53 any particular reason why we don't have gconf2 in our repositories? Nov 22 00:37:56 remember the first day you got it and you would jump around playing wii sports? Nov 22 00:38:38 then a few weeks later, you would lie on the couch and just twitch the mote to get the same effect.. Nov 22 00:38:39 still play the wii sports bowlling and boxing lol Nov 22 00:38:54 weeks? try 5 minutes Nov 22 00:39:00 hahah Nov 22 00:39:26 better wii comming out next year Nov 22 00:39:34 hd Nov 22 00:39:40 well, sat with keyboard on my knee and the screen a defined distance away (in laptop mode..) its easy to hit a key sequence if you are actually typing at the time Nov 22 00:39:56 more like xbox 360 but with better controls Nov 22 00:40:22 the wii defines a genre already Nov 22 00:40:53 * lcuk_idea likes the wii Nov 22 00:41:02 seriously though the netbook ux needs to be more touchscreen friendly Nov 22 00:41:13 i love the wii selling curent one to save for new upgraded one Nov 22 00:41:26 it needs several changes Nov 22 00:41:26 it will be 299 dollers Nov 22 00:42:00 but i am wanting to see how well the handset ux will sit on it Nov 22 00:42:13 i tried it the other day Nov 22 00:42:20 it's much worse Nov 22 00:42:44 it doesn't even fill the screen... it's locked to 800x480 Nov 22 00:43:19 bug filed ? that shouldnt happen, i know it has config options for other dimensions Nov 22 00:44:07 * lcuk_idea must sleep anyway my bloaty feeling is getting worse Nov 22 00:44:10 gnite chaps \o Nov 22 00:45:17 night Nov 22 00:56:20 btw WIIman i probably wouldn't have noticed the key thing if the meego menu bar was at the bottom of the touchscreen ;) Nov 22 00:57:05 yeh i dont have a touch screen so no way to test that Nov 22 00:57:46 at some time i may get a touch screen but atm im very happy with my net book Nov 22 00:58:28 less i can get a freebe or loaner to test it i dont see spending money on a tablet atm Nov 22 01:02:59 i would love to atend a conferance but i cant drive and tansportation is limeted for me do to income constrantes Nov 22 01:21:52 WIIman: apply for sponsorship Nov 22 01:23:08 how do aply for sponcership Nov 22 01:23:29 meego is agreat progect i want to get involved Nov 22 01:23:41 that why i set up my twitter acount Nov 22 01:25:51 WIIman: next conference is in may. no need to think about it until much closer to that time Nov 22 01:34:17 yeh still a wile off yet Nov 22 01:45:36 seems no one's here Nov 22 01:46:16 #meego-handse Nov 22 01:49:06 * javispedro is trying to get the ideapad accelerometer to work Nov 22 01:50:11 hi,anyone is there? Nov 22 01:50:21 noone. Nov 22 01:50:26 ;P Nov 22 01:50:57 no body? Nov 22 01:51:50 who am I ? /n Im no body. Nov 22 01:56:09 im here was just on the phone with my children Nov 22 01:58:44 aha, WIIman. i've got a question with meego platform. Could you help me with it? Nov 22 01:59:15 i can try Nov 22 01:59:28 whats question Nov 22 02:00:45 * WIIman waits patiantly Nov 22 02:00:56 last week i tried to set up the meego sdk1.1 env, but it doesn't work. Nov 22 02:01:41 im not runing sdk atm , how is it not working ? errors ? Nov 22 02:02:06 it seems that the sdk 1.1 doesn't include some libs. Nov 22 02:02:34 have you tryed pulling thoses libs from pkg manager ? Nov 22 02:03:11 when i build some apps with the sdk, it always present some errors like undefined refrence to ** Nov 22 02:03:22 im i little suprizesd that its missing libs as its a devl platform Nov 22 02:03:36 yeah i have tried Nov 22 02:05:02 floridapeng: undefined reference doesn't necessarily mean missing libgs Nov 22 02:05:07 i wish i knew im not usedd to devl ing for qt i just build apps from source when i need them src rpm mostly Nov 22 02:05:24 following a guide lol Nov 22 02:05:37 undefined reference just means that the linker hasn't found some symbols Nov 22 02:06:13 are you building as user or root ? Nov 22 02:06:23 i've tried to include the libs myself. But the packages cannot be compiled. Nov 22 02:06:28 you should build as user and install as root Nov 22 02:06:51 you mean install the sdk as root ? Nov 22 02:07:54 any time you compile you build the app as user so it has the right permitions but install as root wont let you install app as user because the system Nov 22 02:07:55 i think there's no diffrence with the user athuentation. Nov 22 02:09:00 ie ./configure and make are done as user and make install are done as root Nov 22 02:09:17 sudo in meegos case Nov 22 02:09:29 make cannot work well. Nov 22 02:09:49 im not sure about sdk but thats the way you build any ather app Nov 22 02:10:10 floridapeng: what's wrong with "make" ? Nov 22 02:10:22 the commands are abit diferant for src rpms though Nov 22 02:10:39 make has been used for eons Nov 22 02:10:54 if make is broken, you're pretty much dead Nov 22 02:11:12 i download the package qt mobility to include some libs by myself. Nov 22 02:11:55 but when I make the the package source , i pops out errors Nov 22 02:12:27 the libs have to be the right version to sys correctly with what you building Nov 22 02:12:55 floridapeng: dont' look at dozens of errors, only look at the first 1 or 2 Nov 22 02:12:55 they are all the new version. Nov 22 02:13:26 floridapeng: after the first 1 or 2 error messages, the rest gets confused Nov 22 02:14:26 berndhs: yeah, i just did like this. Nov 22 02:15:08 floridapeng: can you paste the first 1 or 2 of thsoe "undefine reference" errors in pastebin.org ? Nov 22 02:15:38 remember every app has dependancies those HAVE to be installed before thee app itself is instaled Nov 22 02:15:49 ie the build wont work Nov 22 02:16:19 the reference problems are not always external references Nov 22 02:16:25 i can tcode but i have build enough apps to how the prosess gos Nov 22 02:16:43 berndhs: libQtServiceFramework.so: undefined reference to `QLocalSocket::isValid() const' Nov 22 02:18:08 look at the something.pro file for that project Nov 22 02:18:26 xchat for example built fine for but i got all the deps first Nov 22 02:18:29 is should mention QT += ... network ... somewhere Nov 22 02:18:56 dsaf Nov 22 02:19:08 or, see in the SDK if you have QtNetwork installed, it should normally be there Nov 22 02:19:11 Tobren Nov 22 02:20:13 yeh i dont know the sdk version i mentioned earlier just what i know about building an app hope the other can help sorry i cant Nov 22 02:20:13 it's just a source package from the meego.com. Nov 22 02:21:06 when i try ./configure and make , the error is like this. Nov 22 02:21:11 QLocalSocket is from QtNetwork Nov 22 02:21:49 apparently you do have QtNetwork, otherwise if would fail earlier in the compile Nov 22 02:21:52 you mean the source pkg doesn't include the lib? Nov 22 02:22:06 no, why would it ? Nov 22 02:22:20 the source package for A doesn't include lib B Nov 22 02:23:43 so i should include QT += ... network ... at the .pro? Nov 22 02:23:57 see what it looks like first Nov 22 02:24:25 it should be in there already Nov 22 02:26:35 my network will go down in the next 2 or 3 hours, unannounced Nov 22 02:26:59 its sunday night, the ISP's hamster gets tired and they lose power Nov 22 02:27:34 each source should come with a readme and a install file most of what you need to know about installing from the source should be there regardless of platform Nov 22 02:28:45 yes good advice, if there is a file README, go read it Nov 22 02:29:33 should be in the unpacked tar folder Nov 22 02:29:51 if not in the root of that folder then in src Nov 22 02:30:12 based on past experiance any way Nov 22 02:49:00 all my stuff builds. awesome! Nov 22 02:49:22 cool Nov 22 02:49:45 berndhs: were you at the conference? Nov 22 02:50:02 no, i was admiring the video feed of the movie stars Nov 22 02:50:16 just wondering. met a bernd there Nov 22 02:50:26 its a common name Nov 22 02:50:34 it is Nov 22 02:50:53 so i have plausible deniability Nov 22 02:51:01 berndhs: do you know who i'd talk to to get my packages into meego-core? Nov 22 02:51:14 not really Nov 22 02:51:36 in the abstract, you can use bugzilla Nov 22 02:51:49 complain that its not there, and tell them that you have it Nov 22 02:52:01 and why they need it Nov 22 02:52:33 Which carrier can you use with the N900 in the USA? Nov 22 02:52:41 I think t-mobile Nov 22 02:53:42 berndhs: i represent the team behind these packages, so that sounds strangely self-serving Nov 22 02:54:01 well, i represent the team behind two of them, and the other two we have as dependencies Nov 22 02:54:06 well, it they really need your SlicedBread package, you have to tell them Nov 22 02:54:25 oh they need it. it's just that cool Nov 22 02:54:25 how would they know ? Nov 22 02:55:33 you could fake it, have your wife's second cousin complain that its missing, but that's not real nice **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Nov 22 02:59:58 2010