**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Apr 01 02:59:58 2011 Apr 01 03:00:46 are there any plans to add more web accounts to the v1.2? Apr 01 03:00:52 Touchscreen prices have gone way down. Apr 01 03:00:58 rdesfo: I have no idea. Apr 01 03:02:34 ya, the battery life is pretty amazing too. I've used the netbook for a few hours without any issue Apr 01 03:35:13 morning Apr 01 03:35:31 yo Apr 01 04:18:44 morning Apr 01 05:16:13 Package gconf-2.0 was not found in the pkg-config search path. Apr 01 05:16:27 while building source inside qemu Apr 01 05:16:39 which package i need to install Apr 01 05:41:26 \o/ my touchscreen works Apr 01 05:41:37 \o/ Apr 01 05:42:35 now to figure out how to port this config over to meego, and put the tablet UI on this Apr 01 06:05:02 rustylynch, I am bit worried about https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15089 - as if these patches removed compositing support from the compositor ... Apr 01 06:05:05 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug 15089 nor, Undecided, ---, x2rich, NEW, meegotouch based virtual keyboard does not open as expected Apr 01 08:03:11 Venemo, I have exams, and that's ignoring the fact that the tickets are $1600 Apr 01 08:04:06 meego spring conf? Apr 01 08:05:20 SF Apr 01 08:13:33 MohammadAG, yeah, but DawnFoster told me that there are sponsorship options. and if anyone should get that, that's you! Apr 01 08:14:22 the downside is that you have to make a payout first and then reimburse Apr 01 08:14:23 :P Apr 01 08:15:33 Venemo, there's an exam on 23 and another on 25 Apr 01 08:16:16 Stskeeps, OUCH! Apr 01 08:16:31 MohammadAG, well then get them to pay your trip back and forth :P Apr 01 09:23:12 http://mail.google.com/mail/help/motion.html Apr 01 09:29:50 lbt: hehe nice one. also, check http://www.opensuse.org/ Apr 01 09:39:55 el reg's been fairly subtle: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/04/01/seagate_triple/ Apr 01 09:58:04 I am getting a problem in meego-sdk-update-target Apr 01 09:58:20 can some one point out whats going wrong Apr 01 09:59:04 Error: The meego-handset-ia32-madde-sysroot-1.1.99.0.20110329.5.conf has been installed. A different name should be provided. Apr 01 10:00:44 It is referring to: /usr/lib/madde/linux-i686/cache/madde.conf.d/meego-handset-ia32-madde-sysroot-1.1.99.0.20110329.5.conf Apr 01 10:00:55 shall I delete it manually? Apr 01 10:13:31 hy. I'm having some problems compiling glibc on ARM. I am using MeeGo 1.1.90.5.20110301.7. The qemu installed on the worker is 0.14.0. Here is the error: http://pastie.org/1743070 .... any clues? Apr 01 12:02:03 a very nice joke: http://www.opensuse.org/ Apr 01 12:02:47 Venemo: same home page for all 5 Apr 01 12:03:16 lol, that's even funnier! :D Apr 01 12:08:25 CosmoHill, a nice extension to that: http://skvidal.wordpress.com/2011/04/01/new-linux-distro-and-pkg-manager/ :D Apr 01 13:10:07 can somebody tell me if I need binfmt misc support to allow qemu to build armv7el ?? Apr 01 13:10:33 yes Apr 01 13:12:07 yes Apr 01 13:15:55 jbos, can you compile inputmethod framework on meego yourself? Apr 01 13:49:36 fyi http://confusingdevelopers.wordpress.com/2011/04/01/intels-qt-quick-components-available-for-ubuntu/ Apr 01 13:50:12 pickers (date etc) don't work properly Apr 01 13:51:23 Why my QEMU cant't display the fonts? (black boxes instead...) Apr 01 13:51:42 ATI GPU + Ubuntu10.10 Apr 01 13:54:49 who's a moderator on the forum? Apr 01 13:55:08 click "report" Apr 01 13:55:15 yeah I just remembered that Apr 01 14:40:21 Hi! Anybody familiar with pulseaudio-setting-mfld in gitorious? Do you/they really want changes to .spec and .yaml trough gitorious? The files are there. Apr 01 14:43:18 sorry to everyone that was just forcibly exited from #meego-dev :) please read http://lists.meego.com/pipermail/meego-community/2011-March/003822.html Apr 01 14:47:18 by the sounds of it, that forced exit was probably the most activity it's seen Apr 01 14:47:44 Stskeeps: could you set the topic to something like "Please join #meego" Apr 01 14:47:48 i have Apr 01 14:47:52 good Apr 01 14:47:55 also it's +s now Apr 01 14:47:56 :P Apr 01 14:48:15 secret or silent? Apr 01 14:48:27 secret Apr 01 14:48:43 okay, now if only you could do that to #meego... Apr 01 14:49:13 we discussed this :) Apr 01 14:49:45 hence the ... Apr 01 14:54:27 question 2: I see ' echo "ia32_icdk" > /etc/boardname-override ' in meego-handset-ia32-mtf-1.1.99.1.20110331.81.ks but not in meego-tablet-ia32-mfld-1.1.99.1.20110331.81.ks So what's up with that? Apr 01 14:55:41 ssirkia: supposedly there's a bug with iCDK DMI Apr 01 14:55:49 and tablet prolly has a better DMI Apr 01 15:00:52 right - didn't realize that tablet may be another HW. Apr 01 16:18:18 rustylynch: hi, did things go back to working when you reverted the orientation changes? Apr 01 16:18:18 stskeeps: ping Apr 01 16:18:47 daw pong Apr 01 16:18:55 DawnFoster: pong Apr 01 16:19:26 Stskeeps: well, it's the first of the month, and I'm starting my metrics :) Apr 01 16:19:42 any chance you can run the irc stats in the next couple of days? Apr 01 16:19:50 (no big rush) Apr 01 16:20:15 * w00t_ should set up public stats for meego sometime Apr 01 16:20:23 I already run some for some Qt channels Apr 01 16:20:41 dneary is working on automating everything Apr 01 16:21:00 DawnFoster: will do Apr 01 16:21:15 http://wiki.meego.com/Metrics/Dashboard Apr 01 16:21:20 Stskeeps: thanks! Apr 01 16:34:22 DawnFoster, Thanks for the info Apr 01 16:34:39 On my way out the door to strip wallpaper all evening, but I'll see you next week in SFO Apr 01 16:35:49 dneary: have fun? :) Apr 01 17:03:23 w00t_: yes, after reverting then orientation changes across the board are working again Apr 01 17:05:37 rustylynch: ok, sorry for the hassle Apr 01 17:05:45 I will investigate what's going on on the n900 end Apr 01 17:06:13 well... i think the bug is still valid, it's just a matter if getting all the moving parts to agree on the definition Apr 01 17:08:03 easier said than done :) Apr 01 17:09:13 DawnFoster: http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/irc/data/irssistats.mar2011.html Apr 01 17:09:52 Stskeeps: no #meego-arm then? Apr 01 17:11:32 rustylynch: important info, please pass it along to your team: http://labs.qt.nokia.com/2011/04/01/qt-hidden-gems/ Apr 01 17:11:35 :-) Apr 01 17:11:44 * rustylynch looks Apr 01 17:12:14 w00t_: http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/irc/data/irssistats.arm.mar2011.html Apr 01 17:12:54 Stskeeps: could you make is so we can view the parent directory? Apr 01 17:12:54 thiago: *grin* Apr 01 17:12:58 w00t_: :-) Apr 01 17:13:05 * thiago needs to configure his webserver to reply with error 418 Apr 01 17:13:28 I am indeed a teapot Apr 01 17:13:33 however did you guess Apr 01 17:17:10 nice... didn't know about the -fkeep-programmers-inline, would be useful with a '-fread-your-damn-email' flag Apr 01 17:20:32 * w00t_ could make a joke about another flag starting with '-f' that would be useful during heated technical decisions, but refrains Apr 01 17:20:43 *discussions rather Apr 01 17:23:22 hmm no flames on the latest architecture change mail Apr 01 17:23:31 maybe people think it's an april 1st joke Apr 01 17:23:35 hey arjan Apr 01 17:24:31 arjan: it's also a bit less radical which helps :) Apr 01 17:24:33 arjan: it sounded to me very well reasoned, no need for flaming Apr 01 17:24:48 "hey, we don't think they're mature, so they stay but we don't want to commit to them just yet" Apr 01 17:24:52 "we want to let these components mature, so we're not making them mandatory" Apr 01 17:25:45 * w00t_ wonders why his USB disk is not showing up for him to write an image to it Apr 01 17:26:17 cos it remembers the last time you used it? Apr 01 17:26:41 arjan: are you coming to LCS next week? Apr 01 17:31:02 rustylynch: did the fixed packages make it into T:T by the way? Apr 01 17:31:10 or, somewhere on obs I can build an image against? Apr 01 17:34:24 for april falls MeeGo should have changed the converance location or date Apr 01 17:35:31 w00t_: yes, all my updates are now in T:T Apr 01 17:36:01 Stskeeps: thanks! Apr 01 17:40:28 arjan: nothing in that mail that isn't somehow based in reality at least - i'm personally missing a bit how the architecture diagram actually looks right now Apr 01 17:40:55 arjan: then there's of course the whole flux of project governance (who's in what roles), but that's a project-wide problem not specific to architecture Apr 01 17:41:10 we'll have a new diagram in a week or so Apr 01 17:41:13 good Apr 01 17:41:16 no point doing halfway ones ;) Apr 01 17:42:03 and in addition to that, to prevent people to do incompatible branches to fill the roles of those components, to somehow talk about the intended direction/roadmap of the features they cover Apr 01 17:42:46 (i do know it's not included in compliance) Apr 01 17:44:53 Stskeeps: wth, you kicking me from channels? XD Apr 01 17:45:21 :D Apr 01 17:45:32 auke: sorry, did actually note this in advance on meego-community@ :) Apr 01 17:45:36 * timoph should do the same in -qa-tools Apr 01 17:45:45 hopefully it'll make sure people don't come to a dead channel Apr 01 17:54:01 Stskeeps: they will Apr 01 18:00:18 we should clear users in here once in a while too, lol Apr 01 18:00:56 auke: screw it, let's close down meego and start a new project Apr 01 18:01:00 there's too many people here! :-P Apr 01 18:01:05 haha Apr 01 18:01:17 * TSCHAKeee gets ready to test Tablet UX on the Archos 9 Apr 01 18:01:22 * CosmoHill sets fire to octave Apr 01 18:03:32 TSCHAKeee, hi Apr 01 18:03:47 rofl, ears burning? ;) Apr 01 18:03:50 hey Martin. Apr 01 18:03:52 TSCHAKeee, hows things Apr 01 18:03:53 ;) Apr 01 18:04:31 good, am taking some idle time from work to cobble together a tablet ux ks for archos9 just to see if it comes up Apr 01 18:04:57 nice one, seen the N900 and vega videos Apr 01 18:04:59 came back from an extended date/sexcapade in Dublin all nice and rested. Apr 01 18:05:19 yes, I did..very nice :) Apr 01 18:05:29 is the Vega using acceleration? or is it just drawing really well? Apr 01 18:05:55 just frame buffer Apr 01 18:06:44 have not managed to get any perfomance out of the panels though, still a slide show there. Apr 01 18:07:40 A9 should rock with tablet UX Apr 01 18:08:53 panels idea is a little what we talked about, one QML app per panel for mce Apr 01 18:10:21 vgrade, tablet ux checks for intel products ;-P Apr 01 18:10:39 jk Apr 01 18:11:31 I'm really hoping now that Tablet UX is available Apr 01 18:11:40 that I can start developing the prototype ideas for a new orbiter Apr 01 18:11:46 maligor, what do you mean checks? Apr 01 18:11:52 Going to Mars? Apr 01 18:12:10 vgrade, it's intel code Apr 01 18:12:32 mnementh: were you going to merge async to libseaside master at some point, btw? Apr 01 18:12:34 and jk means just kidding Apr 01 18:12:55 and tablet ux is very raw still Apr 01 18:13:21 is it all running on a sort of generic QML engine? Apr 01 18:13:42 TSCHAKeee: see: meego-qml-launcher Apr 01 18:13:59 yup, all code is on gitorious Apr 01 18:15:13 Stskeeps: Do you know if mdecorator is still broken (I haven't checked last night's build) Apr 01 18:16:22 gabrbedd: i think it's still being discussed, it really wonders me that they pulled out entire decorator code for tablet ux Apr 01 18:16:35 i mean, something's wrong if not starting mdecorator doesn't do the trick :) Apr 01 18:17:59 gabrbedd: it's a patch that can be disabled, btw Apr 01 18:18:00 Stskeeps: It looked to me like it broke mdecorator on the Handset UX... which IMHO is a major party foul Apr 01 18:18:20 who's working on the handset ux nowadays ? Apr 01 18:18:27 (That is, Handset UX, too) Apr 01 18:18:52 arjan: well, the thing is noone actually said anything about handset in ages - or what the new UX's goal is in general Apr 01 18:19:07 I'd guess intel is pushing tablet now ;P Apr 01 18:19:27 and nokia people are wondering what they should be doing Apr 01 18:19:32 arjan, well, the whole unilateral dictate-from-Intel, behind-closed-doors, evidence-free way the last one went down was probably your core problem. :) Apr 01 18:19:39 there's no word if 'tablet UX' is supposed to be the handset one too :) Apr 01 18:19:53 Stskeeps, it wouldn't work Apr 01 18:20:06 arjan: our company hansen't decided between Handset UX and Tablet UX. Apr 01 18:20:08 maligor: was fairly decent for me Apr 01 18:20:17 why? I though it already works Apr 01 18:20:32 Stskeeps, yeah, but even with the touchscreen netbook I have at work, it's ... too ... wide? Apr 01 18:20:43 maybe if it was reorder to center instead of left Apr 01 18:20:49 but still, it's massive Apr 01 18:20:58 arjan: if it's possible, 5 lines talking about the UX purpose on a mailing list would solve a lot of problems :) Apr 01 18:21:10 arjan: Tablet UX broke mdecorator, and I kind of like the whole array of apps thing. Apr 01 18:21:37 is the rotation issue in the tablet ux still there?-) Apr 01 18:21:39 I'll argue that mdecorator was already broken, just in different ways ;) Apr 01 18:21:45 it's damn high up in the crash top 10 Apr 01 18:22:04 maligor: yes, but that's being investigated - it isn't as simple as it looks :) Apr 01 18:22:09 as in ... number one in the list with 4x more crashes than anything else Apr 01 18:22:14 it's certainly amusing :-P Apr 01 18:22:25 or frustrating if you have to use it Apr 01 18:22:42 (in case people care, this is the crash top 5: Apr 01 18:22:43 430 Guilty function: main in /usr/bin/mdecorator Apr 01 18:22:43 111 Guilty function: QGLWidget::event in /usr/lib/libQtOpenGL.so.4 Apr 01 18:22:43 61 Guilty function: ?? in meego-app-im Apr 01 18:22:43 55 Guilty function: main in /usr/lib/tumbler-1/tumblerd Apr 01 18:22:43 48 Guilty function: ?? in /usr/lib/meego-app-browser/meego-app-browser Apr 01 18:22:43 45 Guilty function: eglCreateImageKHR in /usr/lib/libEGL.so.1 Apr 01 18:22:44 ) Apr 01 18:23:02 arjan: Agreed... but it /existed/ (which can't be said for Tablet)... Apr 01 18:23:14 w00t_: I think i was waiting on dialer to finish testing. i'll double check and then yes Apr 01 18:23:25 arjan: And I can't get a straight answer on whether or not Tablet will have a replacement. Apr 01 18:23:41 about to push async to tablet after we debug some proxy model issues Apr 01 18:24:01 err not tablet sorry but the UX git repos Apr 01 18:24:30 UX is handset tablet ivi... i believe Apr 01 18:25:00 and that's the clear message that's not there :) Apr 01 18:26:18 arjan: why does your top 5 contain 6 entries? :-) Apr 01 18:26:20 because at the moment, people don't know if there's a seperate handset 'UX' under works, since it's called 'tablet UX', or it's all 'UX' for multiple verticals :) Apr 01 18:26:39 thiago: because I can't count when I cut and paste Apr 01 18:26:46 I actually have a top 50 that I pasted from Apr 01 18:26:51 arjan: I'm told you're the one who did the benchmarking of the performance penalty when using -fPIC Apr 01 18:27:11 I collected most of the data, I didn't do the actual typing to kick the benchmark Apr 01 18:27:18 -fPIC is about 20 to 25% on 32 bit x86 ;-( Apr 01 18:27:31 (which is a universal range that is used and confirmed all the time here) Apr 01 18:28:16 if you want to know where in the 20 to 25% range something will hit specifically we need to talk compiler and CPU versions ;-) Apr 01 18:28:33 right Apr 01 18:28:50 but my question is: was this tested with a regular application that has anywhere from 30 to 100 libraries loaded? Apr 01 18:28:50 Stskeeps: it is meant for handset tablet and ivi or whatever device. i currently test my code on a tablet and handset Apr 01 18:28:57 mnementh: thanks Apr 01 18:29:32 I don't doubt that -fPIC code is slower due to the missing register and to the indirect addressing Apr 01 18:29:36 thiago: pretty much; I've seen numbers in this range from browser benchmarks to .. to .. Apr 01 18:29:51 this is the overhead number if the majority of executed code is in the .so Apr 01 18:29:53 but I'm wondering if the impact is really relevant if most of the work is actually in the libraries Apr 01 18:30:28 if half your work is in the main binary and half in library... thumb in the air number would be 12% cost Apr 01 18:30:34 but libraries MUST be -fPIC Apr 01 18:30:49 yes Apr 01 18:30:52 you can do some things to make it less costly Apr 01 18:31:04 Stskeeps: there are design flaws on some things when you use them on a handset. i pulled out the index bar for contacts because on a handset it was unusable. i'm about to add another version back in. if you find issues with the code on a handset, file a bug. i know i need to add sms, im, call links into contacts. trying to figure out the best way to determine the difference between any generic dialer and tablet (runtime or compile time) deci Apr 01 18:31:05 like static leaf functions inside .c files will have less overhead potentially Apr 01 18:31:21 sorry, I didn't get this: if half the work is in the libraries, the impact is 12% Apr 01 18:31:31 if it's majority in the libraries, it's 20-25% Apr 01 18:31:43 compared to what? Everything in the app compiled without -fPIC? Apr 01 18:31:55 mnementh: you got cut off in the end - but anyway, on the n900 we had UX running quite quickly after released, but yes, we'll feed back issues Apr 01 18:32:16 arjan: I wonder if your libEGL crash is related to bug 13274. Apr 01 18:32:19 <_MeeeGoBot_> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13274 cri, High, ---, peng.li, WAIT, mcompositor (Mesa, EGL) crashes on unchecked pointer Apr 01 18:32:19 thiago: yup Apr 01 18:32:20 mnementh: one issue i see at the moment is that there doesn't seem to be lower-resolution (800x480) themes for UX, so that may be a performance hit Apr 01 18:32:25 compared to effectively a static binary Apr 01 18:32:32 (well not glibc static, but you know what I mean) Apr 01 18:32:41 mnementh: due to need to resize a lot Apr 01 18:32:50 there is something of a performance hit Apr 01 18:32:51 arjan: ok, so I have to ask: considering the libraries *are* there, what's the impact of having the app compiled as -fPIC, compared to the same app without? Apr 01 18:32:53 and also a memory hit Apr 01 18:33:02 Stskeeps: theme adds about 5mb onto meego-ux-daemon process Apr 01 18:33:09 Stskeeps: the bugzillas are sort of in chaos IMHO so just file a bug as best as you can categorize it. as long as anything Contact related has my or Kaitlin's name on it we will see it. :) Apr 01 18:33:13 yep Apr 01 18:33:29 vgrade: do I have to use the emgd against the automotive adaptation kernel? Apr 01 18:33:36 Stskeeps: file a bug on the theme :) and i will mention this to designers for you Apr 01 18:33:40 mnementh: thank you Apr 01 18:33:54 thiago: you mean PIE.. well so that depends on how much work is done in the app Apr 01 18:33:59 arjan: yes, PIE Apr 01 18:34:13 like for a browser, most work is done in the main binary (because of the pic cost, they moved the work to the main binary) Apr 01 18:34:22 arjan: the reason I'm asking: yesterday we were discussing the booster/kdeinit hack (fork+dlopen of the app) Apr 01 18:34:32 someone said you had said it was a bad idea due to the performance cost Apr 01 18:34:34 that breaks many other things Apr 01 18:34:37 arjan: meego-ux-daemon (for instance) does not do a lot of work Apr 01 18:34:40 like all security frameworks Apr 01 18:34:57 which is where we were discussing this about Apr 01 18:35:04 because it's been proven (NSA level academic proof) that the only time you can safely assign a security context is at exec time Apr 01 18:35:09 sorry, qml-launcher Apr 01 18:35:16 so fork+dlopen is an invalid optimization for that reason alone. Apr 01 18:35:24 right Apr 01 18:35:25 Stskeeps: i passed your comment on low-res asset alternative on to designers for you and will let you know if i hear back Apr 01 18:35:25 never mind performance Apr 01 18:35:45 so what we need is an improved loader Apr 01 18:35:56 thiago: do we have proof the loader is at fault ? Apr 01 18:36:00 for the overhead? Apr 01 18:36:06 also we need 1) less symbols Apr 01 18:36:11 and 2) prove that it's really link time Apr 01 18:36:12 yes, definitely Apr 01 18:36:15 TSCHAKeee, yes mate, are you going to take the latest EMGD Apr 01 18:36:22 since we do prelink everything.. linking is not all that expensive Apr 01 18:36:23 w00t spent a lot of time reducing the symbol exports of some libs Apr 01 18:36:28 unless you do millions and millions Apr 01 18:36:32 prelinking is also a good thing Apr 01 18:36:34 not relevent to this Apr 01 18:36:41 I do plan to do the same thing for a lot of these libraries though Apr 01 18:36:42 but C++ does have thousands of relocations, even in simple libs Apr 01 18:36:44 vgrade: whatever emgd-bin points to, yeah, i think that's 1893? Apr 01 18:36:56 TSCHAKeee, you could use other kernel but you would need the EMGD patch from automotive Apr 01 18:37:05 assuming I ever figure out how to get a sane development environment setup Apr 01 18:37:14 thiago: one thing I've been thinking about is to glob all qt libs into one .so Apr 01 18:37:20 then at least you don't need to do the cross .so linking Apr 01 18:37:21 vgrade: ok, just checking. Apr 01 18:37:29 (and we can also avoid PLT hops between them anyway) Apr 01 18:37:37 arjan: hmm Apr 01 18:37:43 in practice apps get the whole lot of them anyway Apr 01 18:37:47 arjan: never mind the BC breakage there, but that's an idea Apr 01 18:37:54 (maybe not ALL, but there's a common set of maybe 8 or so that are joint) Apr 01 18:38:08 BC breakage is inevitable at this point to get something to really perform Apr 01 18:38:10 it can be done on ELF Apr 01 18:38:22 without BC breakage, that is. Apr 01 18:38:25 we need to get over that first, get it working, and at the end see if we can put BC back without damage Apr 01 18:38:43 but we have bigger fish to fry before Apr 01 18:39:18 swap out the X11 code with Lighthouse on Wayland, bring OpenGL in (so one less lib) Apr 01 18:39:35 swapping out X11 removes a lot of libraries Apr 01 18:39:36 not one Apr 01 18:39:47 move the widgets out for non-desktop/netbook Apr 01 18:39:48 composite, fixes, ... Apr 01 18:40:13 TSCHAKeee, I don't think anyone outside intel boards have had 1893 runnig. lbt tried with the 1893 userspace with my joggler (older automtive) kernel without much success. So you do need a matched pair. Apr 01 18:40:28 * TSCHAKeee facepalms Apr 01 18:40:32 which one would that be? Apr 01 18:40:48 * w00t_ runs off to eat Apr 01 18:41:52 * lbt never got round to a kernel rebuild Apr 01 18:43:14 Stskeeps: We used to have different themes assets for the different devices but we haven't kept up with the lower-res versions so the answer is... there is a plan for it... and i will keep hounding them for you. :) Apr 01 18:45:55 * Stskeeps heads off for some badminton Apr 01 18:45:56 bbl Apr 01 18:46:06 * mnementh heads to lunch Apr 01 18:46:28 TSCHAKeee, latest is in https://build.meego.com/package/show?package=kernel-adaptation-intel-automotive&project=Trunk, https://build.meego.com/package/show?package=emgd-bin&project=Trunk%3Anon-oss Apr 01 18:55:59 Hi all Apr 01 18:56:12 what's the difference between the pan gesture and the swipe gesture? Apr 01 18:58:06 I'd imaging that "pan" moves the image in that direction where as swipe moves to the next or previous image Apr 01 18:58:30 "pan" would be for zoomed in images Apr 01 18:58:39 I see Apr 01 18:59:03 yep Apr 01 19:10:45 vgrade: linux-2.6.35-emgd-0002-1893-build.patch Apr 01 19:10:48 somebody remind me... what's the way we are suppose to annotate a bug # in changelogs, i seem to recall something like BEA#XXXX Apr 01 19:10:58 vgrade: that is in the latest automotive adaptation Apr 01 19:11:17 vgrade: so it looks like i have no choice. Apr 01 19:11:37 vgrade: I was able to get it up to an xterm, but the uxlaunched qml environment wouldn't come up Apr 01 19:11:52 hmm.... i see use of BMC#XXXX Apr 01 19:12:30 rustylynch: I think I saw it doc'd on the wiki. Possibly in the Packaging/Guidelines Apr 01 19:13:13 FYI: I'm changing some ldap settings on c. OBS - it may affect osc/login briefly Apr 01 19:17:17 TSCHAKeee, thats the patch Apr 01 19:17:34 vgrade: yup, it looks like it's matched to 1893 Apr 01 19:17:40 TSCHAKeee, you get a black screen? Apr 01 19:17:45 i'm building my own copy in my repo Apr 01 19:17:59 vgrade: i can get an xterm Apr 01 19:18:22 I mean when you launch tablet ux Apr 01 19:18:25 vgrade: but if i let uxlaunch go, it just sits at a black screen, and if I ctrl-alt-F1 to the console, uxlaunch barfs and tries to relaunch X Apr 01 19:19:11 try tapping, swiping on the right hand side of the screen in the half way up Apr 01 19:19:28 lock screen is invisible Apr 01 19:19:37 what ks did you base your buld off Apr 01 19:19:58 the one in trunk/latest .. 0330 Apr 01 19:20:02 20110330 Apr 01 19:21:04 rustylynch: http://wiki.meego.com/Packaging/Guidelines#Changelogs Apr 01 19:21:20 rustylynch: been documented forever... totally ignored Apr 01 19:21:57 TSCHAKeee, good to know we have latest EMGD up. That one should have working libva as well Apr 01 19:22:43 and another of those "meego isn't thinking about it's customers" issues ... why are features called FEA# ? don't you think vendors will have their own FEA# too ... Apr 01 19:23:19 vgrade: nope, nothing seems to be happening... of course, show cursor is off now so i can't see shit :P Apr 01 19:23:47 rustylynch: BMC==bugs.meego.com Apr 01 19:24:17 TSCHAKeee, try tapping swyping all around there have been some orientation issues Apr 01 19:25:02 ew Apr 01 19:25:10 looks like only thing running is mcompositor Apr 01 19:25:15 there should be other things running Apr 01 19:25:26 lbt: ok, that makes sense... a bit obscure, but makes sense Apr 01 19:26:13 TSCHAKeee, thats not right, you should have meego-ux-daemon, that kicks everthing else off Apr 01 19:26:30 sec, while I boot the vega Apr 01 19:26:55 TSCHAKeee: Did you build your image with `--pkgmgr=yum` ?? Apr 01 19:27:09 gabrbedd: nope i didn't. Apr 01 19:27:17 TSCHAKeee: I think I had something similar happen... and that fixed it. Apr 01 19:27:23 freaky ok Apr 01 19:27:32 gabrbedd: as option to mic-image-creator ? Apr 01 19:28:52 rustylynch: was supposed to increase the reliability of automated changelog->bug tools Apr 01 19:29:16 but since we can't even link a changelog entry to a particular rpm file ... well... Apr 01 19:29:21 lbt: which is fiction anyway Apr 01 19:29:32 arjan: what's fiction? Apr 01 19:29:41 that changlog->tools things actually work Apr 01 19:29:45 ROFL Apr 01 19:29:50 or changelog -> automatic statistics reporting Apr 01 19:29:58 we ran the whole thing in Nokia Apr 01 19:30:03 it worked perfectly Apr 01 19:30:08 TSCHAKeee: yes. Apr 01 19:30:10 it's putting the work on a lot of engineers to save one program manager from having to do work Apr 01 19:30:22 no, it's not Apr 01 19:30:30 lbt: it works in a completely closed system and by putting all the load on the engineers not the PMs Apr 01 19:30:41 it's ensuring that developers who make small errors have them caught early Apr 01 19:30:51 it ensures that you can focus on real issues Apr 01 19:31:07 take a look at why packages are rejected Apr 01 19:31:13 most can be caught by tools Apr 01 19:31:19 I know it's extremely frustrating Apr 01 19:31:27 I built most of those tools in a previous life Apr 01 19:31:29 then the RE guys can actually focus on using their brains Apr 01 19:31:31 but we also make the bar too high Apr 01 19:31:42 yeah - I build them for Nokia ... but you know that Apr 01 19:31:44 we reject things for nitpicking stuff too much as well Apr 01 19:32:06 and by the way... who is "we"? Apr 01 19:32:10 MeeGo? Apr 01 19:32:17 we as 'the whole meego project' Apr 01 19:32:24 including the vendors? Apr 01 19:32:32 whatever goes into meego.com Apr 01 19:32:34 who very rarely get considered Apr 01 19:32:46 this is one of my major frustrations with meego Apr 01 19:32:58 we/you don't consider how vendors are supposed to use it Apr 01 19:33:06 define vendor Apr 01 19:33:09 OSV or OEM ? Apr 01 19:33:17 both Apr 01 19:33:20 mainly OEM here Apr 01 19:33:23 well meego IS an OSV Apr 01 19:33:27 but well Apr 01 19:33:37 Nokia? LGE? Apr 01 19:33:52 to some degree you are right, but also to some degree their influence is proportional to the amount of work put in Apr 01 19:33:54 sure you have elite engineers in MeeGo (and not that many .... less experienced ones) Apr 01 19:34:08 we (Intel) are working with (unnamed) OEM on a product just fine Apr 01 19:34:16 and that seems to work out quite well Apr 01 19:34:16 but companies need to build product using their hired workforce Apr 01 19:34:24 and they need to automate and check Apr 01 19:34:35 having this in meego is eating your own dog food Apr 01 19:34:37 damn my mic isn't new enough Apr 01 19:35:03 and yes I'm talking about the whole BOSS vapourware thing Apr 01 19:35:35 we don't put enough effort into thinking how vendor e2e works - and the tools they need to manage repos Apr 01 19:35:38 if only there were 48 hours in a day and 8 days in a week and I'd redo the tooling I did in the previous job Apr 01 19:35:45 *nod* Apr 01 19:36:07 I would like to use some experience you have there to make BOSS based automation work better Apr 01 19:36:21 I think what you learn from android is that the OEM's will mess up the codebase so it's totally incompatible Apr 01 19:36:39 and then they say they can't update it because the hardware isn't compatible Apr 01 19:37:08 well, my focus is on being able to present a rational and viable tooling suite Apr 01 19:37:16 not "thou shalt" Apr 01 19:37:30 What is BOSS? Apr 01 19:37:48 what about STFU? Apr 01 19:37:58 it runs scripts one after the other using AMQP to ensure reliable processes Apr 01 19:37:59 Software Tools For U Apr 01 19:38:15 http://wiki.meego.com/Release_Infrastructure/BOSS Apr 01 19:38:55 lbt, you mean to help them mess it up faster for the product, heh Apr 01 19:38:56 and arjan "all the load" ... spelling bug# in a consistent way ? Apr 01 19:38:56 lbt: thanks Apr 01 19:40:11