**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 27 02:59:57 2011
Jul 27 08:12:43 <arfoll> ping X-Fade
Jul 27 08:14:01 <X-Fade> arfoll: pong
Jul 27 08:14:22 <arfoll> hey, if you have a minutes I wouldnt mind asking you a few OBS questions
Jul 27 08:14:59 <arfoll> basically I'd like to know wether you'd recommend using virtual servers for OBS if I only have one machine
Jul 27 08:17:21 <X-Fade> arfoll: Are you going to allow other untrusted users/sources on it?
Jul 27 08:17:48 <arfoll> X-Fade, no it's going to be closed
Jul 27 08:18:02 <arfoll> and reasonably trustworthy users
Jul 27 08:18:18 <X-Fade> arfoll: As builds run as root and they can mess up your system :)
Jul 27 08:18:47 <arfoll> X-Fade, it'll mostly be me building for now so i'm not too worried
Jul 27 08:20:03 <bonbinker> wake up system
Jul 27 08:20:19 <X-Fade> arfoll: Well then on one system is probably a bit faster. But once you want to scale it up, it is easier to have it in multiple vms.
Jul 27 08:20:37 <X-Fade> arfoll: And then the transition is harder when it is all on one system.
Jul 27 08:20:38 <bonbinker> go off work
Jul 27 08:20:43 <bonbinker> byby
Jul 27 08:21:22 <bonbinker> see you tomorrow
Jul 27 08:22:02 <arfoll> X-Fade: so really it's just for scaling? I'll skip it for now then
Jul 27 08:22:18 <X-Fade> arfoll: and security.
Jul 27 08:24:45 <arfoll> X-Fade: also are meego still on 2.1.6 like the wiki says and is it any problem for me to be on 2.1.9 (latest stable i gather)
Jul 27 08:25:15 <X-Fade> arfoll: I haven't looked at that lately.
Jul 27 08:25:33 <X-Fade> arfoll: for cobs we went to the latest in 2.1.
Jul 27 08:27:11 <arfoll> X-Fade: I'll do that as well then. cheers
Jul 27 08:29:32 * arfoll goes to buy some hardware
Jul 27 08:31:27 <X-Fade> arfoll: always a fun thing to do :)
Jul 27 08:31:47 <arfoll> X-Fade, not in Malta where no one stocks decent CPUs
Jul 27 08:32:04 <X-Fade> arfoll: UPS delivers there too no?
Jul 27 08:33:07 <arfoll> X-Fade: yeah but scan malta have told us they'd have the CPU by monday and it's wednesday. Apparently they're still unpacking the shipment
Jul 27 08:33:17 <arfoll> only in malta...
Jul 27 08:33:47 <X-Fade> arfoll: Nobody is in a hurry in the southern countries, you must know that by now :D
Jul 27 08:34:03 <X-Fade> If not today, then maybe tomorrow.
Jul 27 08:34:34 <arfoll> X-Fade, that's definately true. down south coffee breaks count as work ;-)
Jul 27 08:35:50 <X-Fade> Hmm billable coffee hours, me likes...
Jul 27 08:37:14 <arfoll> nothing quite like it... but the best is playing with a boat at work ;-) http://marssa.org/index.php/news/43-floating-boaters
Jul 27 08:38:46 <arfoll> we were driving it from the exopc on monday
Jul 27 08:41:11 <slaine> We've a pretty old installation in Malta arfoll, trying to get them to upgrade atm
Jul 27 08:41:48 <X-Fade> arfoll: Hehe, cool stuff.
Jul 27 09:10:13 <huge_> Someone has a working kickstart to build meego img for pandaboard?
Jul 27 09:11:18 <huge_> i'wasn't able to done with mic succesfully
Jul 27 09:13:20 <vvaltone> huge_, http://sagestechblog.blogspot.com/2011/03/creating-bootable-pandaboard-meego.html ?
Jul 27 09:15:06 <vvaltone> oh, that's missing it
Jul 27 09:22:35 <huge_> vvaltone ... i was trying it
Jul 27 09:22:52 <huge_> but is necessary to update repo
Jul 27 09:23:14 <huge_> and with repo that i was trying to use mic fail
Jul 27 09:24:31 <huge_> however ... someone can provide me another working ( updated ) kickstart for any arm architecture ... becouse i want be sure that is not a mic problem
Jul 27 09:24:47 <vvaltone> http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/OMAP4_Panda
Jul 27 09:24:53 <Stskeeps> huge_: check the n900 ones
Jul 27 09:25:01 <huge_> to old vvaltone
Jul 27 09:25:43 <vvaltone> not sure why you'd want to run it on a panda tho :P
Jul 27 09:25:58 <vvaltone> netbooks are easier
Jul 27 09:26:27 <huge_> becouse i've pandaboard :)
Jul 27 09:26:53 <huge_> Stskeeps ... handset for n900 is not updated
Jul 27 09:27:48 <huge_> this repo doesn't exist anymore http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/@BUILD_ID@/repos/oss/armv7hl/packages/
Jul 27 09:28:01 <Stskeeps> huge_: that's 1.3, we're working on the low levels of that for ARM still
Jul 27 09:28:19 <siddvicious> oh btw will i be able to send/receive calls and sms ?
Jul 27 09:28:26 <Stskeeps> siddvicious: yes
Jul 27 09:28:54 <siddvicious> Stskeeps: i should try meego 1,2 or 1.3 ?
Jul 27 09:29:02 <vvaltone> huge_, testing isn't good enough?
Jul 27 09:29:08 <Stskeeps> just grab the CE summer release
Jul 27 09:29:49 <siddvicious> Stskeeps: and what you reccomend on mmc or directly on n900 ?
Jul 27 09:30:11 <Stskeeps> mmc
Jul 27 09:30:24 <huge_> http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/trunk/latest/repos/oss/ does not contain armv7hl platform
Jul 27 09:30:31 <huge_> so witch repo to use??
Jul 27 09:30:41 <huge_> for arm platforms??
Jul 27 09:30:43 <Stskeeps> huge_: use 1.2 release
Jul 27 09:30:50 <Stskeeps> trunk is 1.3 and is broken at the moment
Jul 27 09:31:39 <vvaltone> testing isn't too bad on the N900 either
Jul 27 09:32:41 <huge_> http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1.2.0.90/latest/repos/oss/armv7hl/ ... this one??
Jul 27 09:32:43 <huge_> can be?
Jul 27 09:32:49 <vvaltone> that's testing
Jul 27 09:33:51 <Stskeeps> http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1.2.0.90/latest/images/meego-handset-armv7hl-n900/
Jul 27 10:03:42 <huge_> http://pastebin.com/9N9Wx8cG
Jul 27 10:03:50 <huge_> Error: Failed to run mic inside bootstrap environment. Return code: -4
Jul 27 10:04:02 <huge_> i'm flithing with this error
Jul 27 10:04:41 <huge_> i took handset  from here: http://repo.meego.com/MeeGo/builds/1.2.0.90/latest/images/meego-handset-armv7hl-n900/
Jul 27 10:05:00 <huge_> what's this Return code -4??? :(
Jul 27 10:05:06 <huge_> please help help
Jul 27 10:05:19 <Stskeeps> means interrupted system call
Jul 27 10:07:53 <huge_> it is an exception from mic
Jul 27 10:08:05 <huge_> i'm watching into the code
Jul 27 10:08:26 <Stskeeps> what does /usr/bin/qemu-arm* say?
Jul 27 10:08:32 <Stskeeps> er, ls
Jul 27 10:08:36 <Stskeeps> er, ls /usr/bin/qemu-arm*
Jul 27 10:10:19 <huge_>  ls /usr/bin/qemu-ar* /usr/bin/qemu-armeb-static  /usr/bin/qemu-arm-static
Jul 27 10:10:45 <Stskeeps> and mic-image-creator --version?
Jul 27 10:11:37 <huge_> mic version 0.24.12
Jul 27 10:14:42 <huge_> are you thinking about qemu-arm problem??
Jul 27 10:15:01 <huge_> or what can be ?
Jul 27 10:15:17 <Stskeeps> uname -a
Jul 27 10:15:21 <huge_> is possible that noone had this error ... :(
Jul 27 10:15:31 <Stskeeps> something like that is always possible :P
Jul 27 10:15:35 <huge_> Linux fabio 2.6.32-33-generic #70-Ubuntu SMP Thu Jul 7 21:09:46 UTC 2011 i686 GNU/Linux
Jul 27 10:16:05 <Stskeeps> and cat /proc/cpuinfo | grep ssse3
Jul 27 10:16:23 <huge_> empty
Jul 27 10:16:58 <Stskeeps> that might be a reason
Jul 27 10:17:06 <Stskeeps> the x86 of meego is built for atom and ssse3
Jul 27 10:18:10 <huge_> so i need a ssse3 processor to be able to build an image???
Jul 27 10:18:40 <Stskeeps> it is doing bootstrap mode, ie, it unpacks the meego x86
Jul 27 10:18:50 <Stskeeps> and yes, i agree it's crazy and i don't like that decision either
Jul 27 10:19:29 <huge_> i'm going to buy a new pc ...
Jul 27 10:19:36 <huge_> :)
Jul 27 10:20:00 <huge_> is there some trick for non ssse3 processor??
Jul 27 10:20:33 <Stskeeps> mmmmm. maybe fedora install and editing rpm configs to add armv7hl definitions
Jul 27 10:20:33 <vvaltone> does qemu support ssse3?
Jul 27 10:22:58 <huge_> so what to do??? 1) Fedora 2) if not work ... New PC???
Jul 27 10:25:57 <lcuk> morning \o
Jul 27 10:31:54 <lcuk> timoph, is your app repository building for both handset/n900 and tablet?
Jul 27 10:32:35 <timoph> for some packages yes
Jul 27 10:33:04 <lcuk> http://wiki.meego.com/Community_Office/Community_device_program/Nokia/Development_repos
Jul 27 10:33:12 <lcuk> your repository is not listed on here
Jul 27 10:33:27 <timoph> yep. for a reason :)
Jul 27 10:33:30 <lcuk> it seems to be obs/deb repos
Jul 27 10:33:34 <lcuk> is that why?
Jul 27 10:33:52 <timoph> I don't have any useful stuff for harmattan yet
Jul 27 10:33:59 <timoph> 1 broken package :)
Jul 27 10:34:03 <lcuk> \o/
Jul 27 10:34:35 <timoph> I need to do some coding before building packages
Jul 27 10:34:39 <lcuk> this packaging lark is frustrating to many people
Jul 27 10:34:46 <timoph> yep
Jul 27 10:34:54 <timoph> I can understand them
Jul 27 10:35:14 * lcuk nods
Jul 27 10:35:17 * timoph has been fighting with ots packaging the whole day :/
Jul 27 10:35:44 * lcuk slides coffee over (in an rpm package)
Jul 27 10:35:50 <timoph> :)
Jul 27 10:36:03 * vvaltone alienates lcuk
Jul 27 10:36:16 * lcuk notices the coffee becoming debified
Jul 27 10:37:18 <lcuk> speaking of alien, does it feasibly work for most packages?
Jul 27 10:37:34 <lcuk> http://www.kabatology.com/03/15/how-to-convert-rpm-files-to-deb-files-with-alien/
Jul 27 10:38:42 <vvaltone> depends on how complex the setup scripts are, and if the paths match
Jul 27 10:38:52 <lcuk> vvaltone, what are yoworking on?
Jul 27 10:39:08 <lcuk> yeah vvaltone
Jul 27 10:39:35 <vvaltone> usb gadget stuff
Jul 27 10:39:53 <lcuk> on the handset?
Jul 27 10:40:10 <vvaltone> on n900 atm, because I'm missing some hardware
Jul 27 10:41:10 <lcuk> vvaltone, host mode usb is not a default on the n900 at least around maemo,  are you modifying kernel to try and get it in?
Jul 27 10:41:43 <vvaltone> no.. usb gadgets are slaves
Jul 27 10:42:28 <lcuk> vvaltone, ah didn't know
Jul 27 10:42:38 <lcuk> so what connects happily?
Jul 27 10:43:31 <vvaltone> did I mention something about happy connections?-)
Jul 27 10:43:51 <lcuk> no
Jul 27 10:48:56 <lcuk> vvaltone, what do you mean
Jul 27 10:49:21 <vvaltone> I didn't quite follow 'so what connects happily?' :P
Jul 27 10:50:00 <lcuk> vvaltone, well you are talking about usb gadgets - what kind of devices connect to n900?
Jul 27 10:50:36 <vvaltone> usb gadget driver means that it functions as a slave
Jul 27 10:50:46 <vvaltone> not host mode
Jul 27 10:53:23 <lcuk> vvaltone, ahh I misunderstood entirely!  so are you doing the low level switching for "pc suite"/"mass storage" and that kind of thing?
Jul 27 10:54:02 <vvaltone> sort of, yes
Jul 27 10:59:23 * SpeedEvil ponders handy USB gadgets. USB barcode reader (with mbarcode), USB webcam, USB trackpad.
Jul 27 10:59:53 <vvaltone> USB N900BrickHouse
Jul 27 11:04:55 <vvaltone> barcode reader wouldn't be very hard
Jul 27 11:05:31 <vvaltone> it'd just be a hid keyboard and it'd work automagically on all systems
Jul 27 11:08:53 <SpeedEvil> Indeed.
Jul 27 11:36:13 <lcuk> Stskeeps, the sintel trailer which does not work on n900-ce
Jul 27 11:36:37 <lcuk> if the video mode in the player can be turned to 640*480 it should play happily
Jul 27 11:40:50 <lcuk> actually if it can be opened at 427*240 (video natve resolution) the xvideo will correctly stretch
Jul 27 11:40:51 * lcuk just tested
Jul 27 11:44:29 <x29a> hey there folks. quick question: is meego on the n900 stable for qt development?
Jul 27 11:45:31 <Stskeeps> i'd say so
Jul 27 11:45:40 * timoph agrees
Jul 27 11:45:45 <Stskeeps> a lot of youtube video out there using it for interesting experiments
Jul 27 11:46:18 <x29a> im having trouble with the scratchbox/qtsdk, so i thought why not give meego a chance
Jul 27 11:49:02 <lcuk> i just installed personal-lexicon on n900-ce :)
Jul 27 11:49:08 <lcuk> from fiferboys repository
Jul 27 11:49:21 <lcuk> it thinks maemo and meego are invalid words
Jul 27 11:49:37 <lcuk> but Community is valid :D
Jul 27 11:50:00 <lcuk> it knows of harmattan o_O but not fremantle
Jul 27 11:50:48 <lcuk> frals, what is the jabber address?
Jul 27 11:51:55 * lcuk goes sitting in garden reading
Jul 27 12:02:49 <lcuk> bah
Jul 27 12:02:55 <lcuk> flat battery on my ideapad
Jul 27 12:03:07 <lcuk> paper books do not run out of batteries!
Jul 27 12:03:18 <SpeedEvil> They do get bit-rot though.
Jul 27 12:03:29 <SpeedEvil> I've got ~100 books with actual woodworm holes in
Jul 27 12:04:51 <vvaltone> I wonder why the usb fifo on the n900 suddenly stops working with functionfs
Jul 27 12:05:22 <x29a> i just stumbled upon the meego image creator, is this kind of a meego from scratch approach, where everyone adds packages he might need to get a stripped down to the purpose version?
Jul 27 12:05:56 <lcuk> x29a, the image creator is indeed how you make your own images
Jul 27 12:06:10 <lcuk> so that not just stripping down to minimal, but also adding your own packages
Jul 27 12:06:21 <lcuk> and creating customised image thingies for installation
Jul 27 12:06:42 <lcuk> supposing you wanted meego with a set of extra apps installing on your 100 work machines
Jul 27 12:06:49 <lcuk> then make an image and install on all of them
Jul 27 12:06:50 <lcuk> :P
Jul 27 12:07:32 <x29a> ah, i see. what about: i dont want to tinker with the internals of meego, just use the most stable version/approach for porting a qt application which took way too much time already with scratchbox/maemo sdk?
Jul 27 12:08:03 <lcuk> x29a, so you already have a qt based app?
Jul 27 12:08:07 <lcuk> and you want to use it on meego?
Jul 27 12:08:18 <x29a> i want to use it on the n900
Jul 27 12:08:35 <x29a> maemo failed (or i failed with maemo), so this is my next try
Jul 27 12:08:41 <lcuk> heh
Jul 27 12:08:54 <lcuk> what happened with maemo?  lots of people manage to create qt apps there
Jul 27 12:09:42 <x29a> lcuk: it heavily relies on qwt, boost and some long double stuff, scratchbox versions were out of date and the qt sdk seemed a lot of hazzle to get everything working
Jul 27 12:10:14 <x29a> thatd be my next question: how is the crosscompiling done? is there a stable toolchain?
Jul 27 12:11:04 <x29a> ill just go through the meego creator steps to see my options, then decide. since i want to do an mmc install anyways, i might as well get the default-build later
Jul 27 12:11:29 <lcuk> x29a, the image creator might be too far for your thinking
Jul 27 12:11:48 <x29a> too advanced?
Jul 27 12:11:49 <lcuk> what people use is OBS/ocs to allow the builder to generate required binary packages for installation
Jul 27 12:12:35 <lcuk> x29a, I am using n900-ce image now
Jul 27 12:12:48 <lcuk> I have just been testing a qt app written by fiferboy
Jul 27 12:13:01 <lcuk> I did not recreate a whole image (mic2 approach) to test his app
Jul 27 12:13:13 <lcuk> I just added his repository and installed his app
Jul 27 12:13:40 <lcuk> http://wiki.meego.com/Getting_started_with_OBS
Jul 27 12:13:41 <x29a> ok, you lost me at n900-ce, whats that
Jul 27 12:13:52 <x29a> sorry about the difficulties, but im totally new to this
Jul 27 12:13:56 <x29a> thanks!
Jul 27 12:13:57 <lcuk> that is ok
Jul 27 12:14:10 <lcuk> the n900-ce is the Community Edition MeeGo n900 build :)
Jul 27 12:14:19 <x29a> sounds nice
Jul 27 12:14:25 <x29a> ah, mer, i remember that from my n810 times
Jul 27 12:14:36 <lcuk> ithttp://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/CE_Factsheet
Jul 27 12:14:52 <lcuk> http://wiki.meego.com/ARM/N900/CE_Factsheet
Jul 27 12:15:01 <x29a> i was able to remove the "it" part ;)
Jul 27 12:15:09 <x29a> lots of good entry points, thanks for now
Jul 27 12:15:18 <x29a> just good uboot setup, im going meego soon ;)
Jul 27 12:15:37 <x29a> ill just ping the channel with questions when they bubble up
Jul 27 12:16:14 <lcuk> \o
Jul 27 12:16:17 <lcuk> morning CoderForLife
Jul 27 12:16:20 <lcuk> CosmoHill too :P
Jul 27 12:16:25 <CosmoHill> morning
Jul 27 12:16:37 <CosmoHill> sat down on the sofa, forgot to plug in the power cable so the battery died
Jul 27 12:17:04 <lcuk> CosmoHill, lol I was just heading to the garden to read book when  found same
Jul 27 12:17:22 <CosmoHill> this is my home battery so only lasts 20 mins
Jul 27 12:17:39 <lcuk> meego ideapad lasts for hours
Jul 27 12:17:49 <lcuk> but I turned off suspend on lid close
Jul 27 12:18:13 * lcuk thinks perhaps suspend after lid closed for 5 minutes might be acceptable
Jul 27 12:18:13 <lcuk> hmm
Jul 27 12:18:44 <CosmoHill> channel 5 must hate it's viewers
Jul 27 12:18:51 <lcuk> why?
Jul 27 12:18:57 <CosmoHill> Big Brother 2011
Jul 27 12:19:15 <lcuk> i noticed last night @att on twitter did an interview with some major league soccer bloke
Jul 27 12:19:22 <lcuk> they lost followers by the end of it
Jul 27 12:19:38 <lcuk> CosmoHill, BB was awesome at first
Jul 27 12:19:45 <CosmoHill> indeed
Jul 27 12:19:58 <CosmoHill> still not my thing but it started reality tv
Jul 27 12:20:02 <lcuk> and still has big following
Jul 27 12:20:13 <lcuk> nahh there was reality shows before
Jul 27 12:20:24 <CosmoHill> the average IQ of the follower has dropped over the years
Jul 27 12:20:37 <lcuk> your age has changed
Jul 27 12:20:50 <thiago> CosmoHill: because of the following?
Jul 27 12:20:51 <vvaltone> so the conclusion is: Watching BB lowers the IQ
Jul 27 12:21:35 * CosmoHill is looking at ford stuff >.<
Jul 27 12:21:42 <thiago> post hoc ergo propter hoc
Jul 27 12:22:04 <Termana> CosmoHill, I thought the UK Big Brother was being axed?
Jul 27 12:22:10 <thiago> it could be the other way around: the IQ has lowered, therefore BB has continued to exist
Jul 27 12:22:23 <CosmoHill> Channel 4 got rid of it and channel 5 dug up it's corpse
Jul 27 12:22:34 <Termana> It got axed here in Australia
Jul 27 12:23:04 <Termana> I got bored of it and didn't really watch the last couple of seasons. On the other hand, I didn't want it to end :p
Jul 27 12:23:55 <CosmoHill> speaking of Australia TV, home and away is on tv
Jul 27 12:23:58 <vvaltone> CosmoHill, Ford stuff? You need to choose a car based on the principle that it has MeeGo IVI
Jul 27 12:24:21 <Termana> Like a BMW
Jul 27 12:24:25 <CosmoHill> I know you can fit a 7" touch screen in a ford
Jul 27 12:24:54 <CosmoHill> I like some but they're either driven by wankers or drug dealers
Jul 27 12:25:20 <CosmoHill> you own a BMW doesn't you...
Jul 27 12:25:38 <Termana> CosmoHill, your just jealous
Jul 27 12:25:47 <Termana> no I don't, I'm only a student at the moment
Jul 27 12:25:56 <CosmoHill> rear wheel drive + roundabouts should be fun
Jul 27 12:25:59 <Termana> but when I start bringing in the real moolah I want to own one
Jul 27 12:26:39 <Termana> If that makes me a wanker... well that's fine! :P
Jul 27 12:26:49 <vvaltone> a M series?
Jul 27 12:27:19 <CosmoHill> M1 looks nice
Jul 27 12:28:06 <Termana> vvaltone, the M series is nice, but I like the 3-series as well even though they are the second to bottom range
Jul 27 12:28:46 <Termana> We get a major luxury car tax here in Australia, so no BMW is "cheap" so to speak.
Jul 27 12:29:52 <Termana> Have to "protect the local brands" e.g. Holden and Ford. Both companies being owned by overseas companies
Jul 27 12:29:57 <Termana> and mainly being driven by bogans here
Jul 27 12:31:14 * Ronksu is taking notes on words to remember: moolah, bogan...
Jul 27 12:31:16 <CosmoHill> Dad saw a Holden Ute last week, looks cool
Jul 27 12:31:29 * CosmoHill wonders if he's the main cause of off topic chats
Jul 27 12:46:56 <lbt> auke: ping (important)
Jul 27 12:54:06 <lcuk> Stskeeps, if you want to assign the bug 13084 to me fine
Jul 27 12:54:09 <MeeGoBot> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, carsten, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink
Jul 27 12:54:19 <lcuk> but I don't know how to fix it
Jul 27 12:54:39 <lcuk> since the only demo video on n900-ce has this bug
Jul 27 12:54:49 <lcuk> thought it would be given some more priority
Jul 27 12:55:13 <Stskeeps> the guy who wrote xorg-x11-drv-fbdev-sgx isn't with nokia anymore and it isn't exactly clear code
Jul 27 12:55:39 <lcuk> Stskeeps, I don't even know how to get the pristine code
Jul 27 12:55:52 <lcuk> http://download.meego.com/live/MeeGo:/1.2:/non-oss/MeeGo_1.2/src.armv8el/xorg-x11-drv-fbdev-sgx-0.4.0-3.7.src.rpm
Jul 27 12:55:58 <lcuk> that is the 1.2 branch version
Jul 27 12:56:03 <lcuk> but it has patches inside
Jul 27 12:56:10 <lcuk> rather than just being a tar.gz
Jul 27 12:56:31 * lcuk confuddled with levels of abstraction
Jul 27 12:56:32 <Stskeeps> it has a tarball which is equal to what was in harmattan and some patches on top
Jul 27 12:56:46 <lcuk> yeah, so how do I apply those patches?
Jul 27 12:57:06 <Stskeeps> patch -p1 .. ?
Jul 27 12:57:12 <Stskeeps> patch -p1 < patchname
Jul 27 12:57:49 <lcuk> Stskeeps, ubt then after I have done some tweaking
Jul 27 12:57:58 <lcuk> won't I need to remake those patches?
Jul 27 12:58:05 <Stskeeps> not really, just make a patch on top
Jul 27 12:58:20 <Stskeeps> i usually have a dir-patched and dir-patched-mypatch
Jul 27 12:58:23 <Stskeeps> and then diff on top
Jul 27 12:58:25 <lcuk> this level of workflow is what shoulder surfing others doing same would help
Jul 27 12:58:30 * lcuk still misses office life :)
Jul 27 13:01:57 <Stskeeps> untar tarball, name it directory-orig, apply patches on top, cp -r directory-mypatch, cd directory-mypatch, tinker, cd .., diff -urN directory-orig directory-mypatch
Jul 27 13:02:34 <Stskeeps> or use git
Jul 27 13:06:45 <lcuk> Stskeeps, where is the git repository for the pristine sgx source?
Jul 27 13:07:20 <Stskeeps> lcuk: you're assuming there's one, just use the tarball
Jul 27 13:08:14 <vvaltone> I'm sure it exists, but it's unlikely to be pristine, nor freely available :P
Jul 27 13:08:32 <Stskeeps> in this case, xorg driver :P
Jul 27 13:09:16 <thiago> nor is it guaranteed to be Git
Jul 27 13:12:03 <lcuk> ok Stskeeps assign it to me, it may take a while but I will do best with this, it annoys me each day so will fix it
Jul 27 13:12:09 <Stskeeps> k
Jul 27 13:12:19 <lcuk> and indirectly fix harmattan build too
Jul 27 13:16:47 <vgrade> http://www.meegoexperts.com/2011/07/nvidia-meego-battle-ground/
Jul 27 13:17:16 <Kiranos> nice! would love to have meegon on my optimus2x
Jul 27 13:18:05 <vvaltone> I don't think nvidia has wayland plans, so it might get nasty with meego 1.3
Jul 27 13:18:09 <vgrade> Kiranos, post it to me , i'll see what I can do
Jul 27 13:19:17 <vgrade> vvaltone, what support do you need in the driver for wayland over and above gles2
Jul 27 13:19:30 <Kiranos> vgrade: :P it's my main phone therwise you'd get it..
Jul 27 13:20:03 <vvaltone> vgrade, well, openwf/drm/kms I guess
Jul 27 13:20:32 <vvaltone> I don't think it's fully stabilized yet
Jul 27 13:20:36 <Stskeeps> technically you only need hardware buffer sharing
Jul 27 13:21:43 <vvaltone> I could imagine nvidia supporting openwf I guess
Jul 27 13:23:02 <CosmoHill> Termana: how much for a holden commodore SS V-series redline with a manual gearbox?
Jul 27 13:23:40 <x29a> is "dd"ing the raw image onto my sd card the only thing i have to do in order to install meego? whats the vmlinuz for?
Jul 27 13:24:17 <Stskeeps> x29a: for those unfortunate enough to not want/have uboot
Jul 27 13:24:31 <x29a> ah i see
Jul 27 13:26:21 <Termana> CosmoHill, If your a South Australian Member of Parliament, $7000 AUD. Otherwise a 2011 Holden Commodore VE Series II SS V Redline seems to be about $50,000 AUD
Jul 27 13:27:07 <CosmoHill> okay that's about £33K
Jul 27 13:27:45 <vvaltone> Do you have to go to prison to become a South Australian Member of Parliament?
Jul 27 13:27:54 * CosmoHill was looking at Vans yesterday at about £27K
Jul 27 13:28:27 <Termana> vvaltone, lol
Jul 27 13:28:36 <Termana> JUST ABOUT
Jul 27 13:30:03 <berndhs> CosmoHill: buy an RV, save on rent
Jul 27 13:33:58 <Termana> CosmoHill, but you can get new lower-model Holden sedans for $30,000. Personally, if I was buying Holden I would probably either go for the lower model or go all out and buy an HSV (Holden Special Vehicle, which is the performance vehicle brand)
Jul 27 13:34:04 <Termana> (AUD)
Jul 27 13:35:51 * CosmoHill just speced up a Ford Modeo Titianium X sport for £31K
Jul 27 13:36:30 <CosmoHill> admidantly I could do without the dog guard
Jul 27 13:37:34 <Termana> It looks nice from Google Images. But I wouldn't buy Ford
Jul 27 13:37:39 <Termana> On principal
Jul 27 13:37:51 <Termana> When I show my boganness I am a Holden supporter.
Jul 27 13:38:21 <CosmoHill> (when I say ford I mean Ford EU)
Jul 27 13:38:54 <CosmoHill> If I were to get a holden I'd replace the vauxhall badges with holden badges
Jul 27 13:39:17 <Termana> What's the difference, it's all Ford?
Jul 27 13:39:27 <Termana> CosmoHill, it that the brand they are sold under there?
Jul 27 13:39:57 <CosmoHill> yeah but there's only one or two holdens for sale
Jul 27 13:40:19 <CosmoHill> there are fords like the ford falcon that you can only get in austraila
Jul 27 13:41:16 * CosmoHill goes to take the dog for a walk
Jul 27 13:54:29 <lcuk> Stskeeps, you mentioned the sgx pulled the m6 version then made some patches
Jul 27 13:54:53 <lcuk> does this imply backwards that if I use scratchbox and my n950 that fixing it there will also allow it to be fixed on meego?
Jul 27 13:54:58 <Stskeeps> right
Jul 27 13:55:24 <lcuk> cool
Jul 27 13:56:08 <lcuk> the source does not look massive which is a blessing but as you say it is quite convoluted
Jul 27 14:00:53 <timeless> so...
Jul 27 14:01:06 <timeless> DawnFoster: pong me when you wake up
Jul 27 14:01:48 * lcuk makes a clean testcase app first 
Jul 27 14:01:54 <lcuk> timeless, Yo!
Jul 27 14:03:19 * CosmoHill returns
Jul 27 14:04:12 <timeless> hi
Jul 27 14:05:04 <timeless> lcuk, et al: what does this mean: https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=18038#c10
Jul 27 14:05:06 <MeeGoBot> Bug 18038 nor, Low, ---, kevron_m_rees, VERI WONTFIX, Bluetooth icon should either not be present or clearly indicate it won't work when no bluetooth adap
Jul 27 14:07:37 <timeless> [ crickets ]
Jul 27 14:15:38 <realsportcars> hello
Jul 27 14:16:11 <khertan1> Hi, does there is problem currently with the community obs ? package doesn't seems to be moved to the repo
Jul 27 14:16:15 <khertan1> rpc timeout
Jul 27 14:16:57 <realsportcars> Does someone know where is located telepathy ConnectionManager in meego?
Jul 27 14:19:17 <Robot101> realsportcars: where in what sense? on the filesystem?
Jul 27 14:19:33 <realsportcars> in the source code
Jul 27 14:19:44 <realsportcars> I'd like to understand how it works
Jul 27 14:20:31 <realsportcars> really, I'd like to understand how "kill" a SMS before system-ui catch it
Jul 27 14:21:44 <timeless> realsportcars: what do you mean?
Jul 27 14:22:28 <realsportcars> timeless, I'm trying to write a message-blocker for meego, but atm I'm unable to block "silently" incoming SMS
Jul 27 14:22:44 <timeless> http://mxr.meego.com/meego.gitorious.org/source/telepathy-ring/
Jul 27 14:22:49 <timeless> are you looking for source code?
Jul 27 14:22:51 <timeless> for client apis
Jul 27 14:22:52 <timeless> for ...?
Jul 27 14:23:15 <timeless> http://mxr.meego.com/meego.gitorious.org/source/meego-app-im/telepathy-qml-lib/
Jul 27 14:23:36 <realsportcars> uhm...this could be helful
Jul 27 14:23:41 <realsportcars> *helpful
Jul 27 14:24:00 <realsportcars> sourcecode onyl for understand how it works
Jul 27 14:24:18 <realsportcars> I tryed with telepathy client approvers, but this isn't the right way
Jul 27 14:24:53 <realsportcars> approvers works quite good on maemo, but not on meego
Jul 27 14:25:24 <timeless> http://mxr.meego.com/draft-repo.meego.com/source/telepathy-logger/
Jul 27 14:25:29 * timeless shrugs
Jul 27 14:25:55 <timeless> http://mxr.meego.com/draft-repo.meego.com/find?string=telepathy&tree=draft-repo.meego.com&hint=
Jul 27 14:26:01 <timeless> there's plenty of stuff floating around
Jul 27 14:26:06 <lcuk> timeless, crickets were a mistimed cup of coffe
Jul 27 14:26:07 <lcuk> e
Jul 27 14:26:07 <timeless> there's also iirc an api.meego.com or something
Jul 27 14:26:25 <timeless> lcuk: ok, lemme know if you want to chirp
Jul 27 14:26:45 <realsportcars> ty timeless!
Jul 27 14:26:49 <lcuk> it seems that part of the bug has been resolved or not encountered
Jul 27 14:26:57 <lcuk> in latest image
Jul 27 14:27:10 <lcuk> but it certainly isn't clear
Jul 27 14:27:19 <timeless> lcuk: i'm pretty sure that the person didn't read the steps to reproduce
Jul 27 14:27:22 <timeless> but i can't be confident about that
Jul 27 14:27:30 <timeless> because i have *no* clue what that person did encounter
Jul 27 14:27:45 <timeless> my guess is that upon turning off bluetooth (which means the device isn't proper)
Jul 27 14:27:46 <lcuk> perhaps he has not got an exopc
Jul 27 14:27:51 <lcuk> and is also trying to help
Jul 27 14:27:56 <lcuk> but testing it how he can
Jul 27 14:27:57 <lcuk> :)
Jul 27 14:27:58 <timeless> ... the bluetooth icon disappeared from the status line at the top of the screen
Jul 27 14:28:02 <berndhs> send me an exopc and I'll check it out
Jul 27 14:28:08 <lcuk> lol berndhs
Jul 27 14:28:11 <timeless> which means he totally failed to read the steps to reproduce
Jul 27 14:28:12 <rm_work> lol
Jul 27 14:28:17 <timeless> berndhs: where are you?
Jul 27 14:28:21 <berndhs> Niagara
Jul 27 14:28:36 <timeless> as in near the CA/US border?
Jul 27 14:28:45 <timeless> (this is doable)
Jul 27 14:28:48 <berndhs> right, a little west of the falls
Jul 27 14:29:00 <timeless> I've been as far west as Hamilton of late
Jul 27 14:29:20 <berndhs> half way between N.Falls and Hamilton
Jul 27 14:29:40 <timeless> if you happen to head toward YYZ anytime, lemme know
Jul 27 14:29:45 <timeless> i can easily let you grab mine...
Jul 27 14:29:58 <berndhs> ok, will keep that in mind
Jul 27 14:30:22 <lcuk> or just have a meetup and chat about other stuff
Jul 27 14:30:27 <timeless> or that
Jul 27 14:30:53 <timeless> lcuk: anyway, it'd be good if someone slapped that guy
Jul 27 14:31:01 <timeless> (and the previous guy for that matter)
Jul 27 14:31:04 <lcuk> you should be able to install maliit or configure it to work by the way
Jul 27 14:32:12 <ali1234> timeless: i know... seems like nobody ever reads the steps to reproduce before they post "works for me"
Jul 27 14:32:25 <timeless> ali1234: pretty amazing
Jul 27 14:32:41 <lcuk> ali1234, do you have any other examples?
Jul 27 14:32:52 <ali1234> yes
Jul 27 14:33:00 <lcuk> actual bug numbers?
Jul 27 14:33:08 <ali1234> slow bugzilla is slow
Jul 27 14:33:21 <lcuk> works for me
Jul 27 14:33:26 <ali1234> bug 14307
Jul 27 14:33:29 <MeeGoBot> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14307 nor, Medium, ---, kai.chai, REOP, kernel build with rpmbuild fails during prep
Jul 27 14:34:07 <ali1234> oh, someone replied
Jul 27 14:34:28 <timeless> ali1234: you mean https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14307#c5 ?
Jul 27 14:34:44 <ali1234> timeless: that bug has been closed "works for me" about 3 times
Jul 27 14:34:48 <ali1234> and i just keep reopening it
Jul 27 14:34:51 <ali1234> because it really does not work
Jul 27 14:34:52 <timeless> heh
Jul 27 14:35:21 <timeless> technically it only looks like twice https://bugs.meego.com/show_activity.cgi?id=14307
Jul 27 14:37:19 <ali1234> this guy is telling me to do "sudo zypper si kernel" even though that doesn't work and isn't even supposed to work
Jul 27 14:37:25 <ali1234> https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=19153
Jul 27 14:37:28 <MeeGoBot> Bug 19153 nor, Undecided, ---, qiang.z.zhang, VERI INVALID, zypper si does nothing.
Jul 27 14:39:06 <timeless> ali1234: please click on a comment link and then copy that url
Jul 27 14:39:10 <timeless> it makes my life easier :)
Jul 27 14:39:18 * leinir thinks it's very silly that the tablet ux doesn't have any way of putting the device to sleep...
Jul 27 14:39:57 <ali1234> timeless: https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=19153#c12
Jul 27 14:40:00 <MeeGoBot> Bug 19153 nor, Undecided, ---, qiang.z.zhang, VERI INVALID, zypper si does nothing.
Jul 27 14:40:05 <timeless> :)
Jul 27 14:40:19 <timeless> leinir: the power button on the back!
Jul 27 14:40:30 <ali1234> basically the whole bug is "sudo zypper si kernel does nothing" "well, it's not supposed to" "oh, ok then"
Jul 27 14:40:31 <timeless> (ok, it shuts off the exopc, but that's a very very very deep sleep!)
Jul 27 14:41:06 <leinir> timeless: that's sort of my point ;)
Jul 27 14:42:25 <timeless> ali1234: impressive
Jul 27 14:42:39 <timeless> (reached comment 10)
Jul 27 14:43:00 * timeless sighs
Jul 27 14:43:04 <timeless> that bug is braindead
Jul 27 14:43:17 <timeless> the report has more than sufficient info for the QA to file the new bug
Jul 27 14:43:25 <timeless> and it *should* be the *job* of QA to file the new bug
Jul 27 14:43:38 <timeless> asking a random reporter to do it is mean and stupid
Jul 27 14:43:42 <timeless> (and prone to failure)
Jul 27 14:44:04 <ali1234> which bug?
Jul 27 14:44:16 <timeless> https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=19153#c14
Jul 27 14:44:19 <MeeGoBot> Bug 19153 nor, Undecided, ---, qiang.z.zhang, VERI INVALID, zypper si does nothing.
Jul 27 14:44:22 <ali1234> oh, yeah
Jul 27 14:44:26 <timeless> > Hi, ali1234 , if you get more info ,you can file new bug for warn info!
Jul 27 14:44:41 <timeless> what more info does he need? he has steps, he has logs, and he did the ****'ng analysis
Jul 27 14:45:12 <timeless> just write up the bug, assign it to the right person, cc the original victim, and comment in the old bug indicating the new bug number
Jul 27 14:45:12 <rm_work> well
Jul 27 14:45:41 <timeless> rm_work: please remember that i've been using bugzilla for >10 years
Jul 27 14:45:47 <timeless> and i've watched good QAs work
Jul 27 14:45:56 <rm_work> yeah, not that
Jul 27 14:46:00 <timeless> and i've watched groups lose volunteers or potential volunteers
Jul 27 14:46:06 <timeless> s/or/and/
Jul 27 14:46:06 <infobot> timeless meant: and i've watched groups lose volunteers and potential volunteers
Jul 27 14:46:13 <rm_work> my comment was going to be, did ali1234 go back and retry the original bug using root instead of sudo? :P
Jul 27 14:46:24 <rm_work> nothing about what you said
Jul 27 14:46:28 <rm_work> which is correct IMO
Jul 27 14:47:00 <rm_work> that was the first thing i noticed when comparing working to not working -- one had # and one had $ :)
Jul 27 14:47:12 <rm_work> sudo does strange things sometimes
Jul 27 14:47:21 <rm_work> it *shouldn't*, don't get me wrong, but it *does*
Jul 27 14:47:44 <rm_work> so it is a bug, but maybe a slightly different one (like he says at the end of 14307
Jul 27 14:47:48 <rm_work> )
Jul 27 14:47:56 <timeless> which he should file!
Jul 27 14:47:58 <rm_work> yes
Jul 27 14:48:00 <rm_work> no doubtr
Jul 27 14:48:01 <timeless> which is my point
Jul 27 14:48:07 <timeless> it shouldn't be the reporter's job
Jul 27 14:48:13 <rm_work> but i was wondering if ali went back and tried to reproduce again using root
Jul 27 14:48:16 <timeless> once you as QA discover a bug and determine it isn't the original bug
Jul 27 14:48:19 <timeless> you file the new bug
Jul 27 14:48:44 <rm_work> as followup to the original bug 14307
Jul 27 14:48:46 <rm_work> oh i meant:
Jul 27 14:48:46 <MeeGoBot> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14307 nor, Medium, ---, kai.chai, REOP, kernel build with rpmbuild fails during prep
Jul 27 14:48:58 <rm_work>  so it is a bug, but maybe a slightly different one (like he says at the end of 19153)
Jul 27 14:49:46 <timeless> ali1234: there's a reason i have a .rpmbuild which sets home to something other than /root :)
Jul 27 14:49:51 <timeless> it gave mxr a chance to do stuff
Jul 27 14:49:53 <rm_work> i have a feeling 14307 might work if you take the advice from 19153 (not that it's not a bug)
Jul 27 14:50:25 <rm_work> just do the whole thing as root, proves it's a permissions issue, which kinda makes sense
Jul 27 14:50:27 <timeless> rm_work: that isn't really intersting
Jul 27 14:50:34 <rm_work> and then see timeless' .rpmbuild :P
Jul 27 14:50:45 <timeless> all of these bugs are really that the error reporting is terrible (and absolutely broken)
Jul 27 14:51:03 <timeless> each bug should result in a fix to some error reporting instance
Jul 27 14:51:38 <rm_work> yes, sorry, getting sidetracked by trying to assist with the ACTUAL problem, which i realize in this conversation wasn't the point (which was that people suck when they use WFM all the time)
Jul 27 14:52:00 <rm_work> I assume you've seen Texrat's article on the matter (and probably linked it a few times)
Jul 27 14:54:56 <ali1234> rm_work: i've tried everything with root, sudo, normal user for both those bugs
Jul 27 14:55:06 <ali1234> the only thing i haven't done is opened that new bug for the warning
Jul 27 14:55:32 <rm_work> lol k
Jul 27 14:55:47 <ali1234> rm_work: i haven't tried 14307 using sudo when i'm already root
Jul 27 14:55:53 <ali1234> but that seems pointless
Jul 27 14:55:59 <ali1234> i mean, if that did work, it would be a bug in itself
Jul 27 14:56:06 <ali1234> how can sudo make you more root than root?
Jul 27 14:56:24 <ali1234> anyway if you read the logs you'll see the very first thing i do is "su -"
Jul 27 14:56:30 <ali1234> (or the comment i just added)
Jul 27 14:57:58 <CosmoHill> hmm, £540 for a set of alloys
Jul 27 14:58:29 <aleksander_m> if I launch a custom meego-core-ia32-base image with kvm... shouldn't I get at least a shell or something? getting a black screen here
Jul 27 14:59:34 <pebcak> on which cpu?
Jul 27 14:59:59 <aleksander_m> pebcak, intel i5
Jul 27 15:01:02 <pebcak> go to qemu shell and look what#s happening
Jul 27 15:07:12 <Stskeeps> Ulf^: hmm, why the downgrade of gtk?
Jul 27 15:07:18 <Stskeeps> (out of curiousity)
Jul 27 15:08:17 <Ulf^> Stskeeps, for nautilus-2.30 and other gtk2 based packages to build in Trunk:Testing in an effort to the restore the clutter UI based Netbook image
Jul 27 15:08:23 <Stskeeps> Ulf^: ah okay
Jul 27 15:08:41 <Stskeeps> yeah, i ran into the nautilus issue earlier, gvfs is unresolvable
Jul 27 15:08:55 <Ulf^> Not the issue I've been seeing
Jul 27 15:09:13 <Stskeeps> well, it was unresolvable because of nautilus failing ;)
Jul 27 15:09:17 <Stskeeps> on arm
Jul 27 15:09:41 <Stskeeps> but sure, would be good to get the stack validated, after all the systemd changes
Jul 27 15:09:49 <Ulf^> I had to enable deprecated symbols in GDK for the linker to be happy only to run a signal that wouldn't be resolved because it was deprecated in the GTK2 API
Jul 27 15:10:06 <Stskeeps> :nod:
Jul 27 15:11:44 <Ulf^> Stskeeps, How is Wayland with QT5 coming along?
Jul 27 15:12:46 <Stskeeps> Ulf^: great :) http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/wayland/20110722_002.jpg and http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/wayland/20110726_001.jpg for my side of things
Jul 27 15:13:10 <Stskeeps> we're continually improving the qt5 packaging and using same codebase both on intel and arm
Jul 27 15:13:12 <Ulf^> Stskeeps, Way to go!
Jul 27 15:13:40 <Stskeeps> so i have good faith in this working out for 1.3
Jul 27 15:13:51 <thiago> it's a victory to get it compiled at all :-)
Jul 27 15:13:55 <Stskeeps> yes, indeed
Jul 27 15:14:01 <Ulf^> thiago, hehe
Jul 27 15:14:22 <Stskeeps> we should really get 4.8-beta into trunk:testing
Jul 27 15:14:26 * Stskeeps checks when markus is back
Jul 27 15:14:49 <slaine> Created a tablet image for my bedside unit here
Jul 27 15:14:51 <slaine> not bad
Jul 27 15:14:55 <slaine> most works out of the box
Jul 27 15:15:12 <slaine> pity the UI requires a hard button to get back to the menu stuff
Jul 27 15:16:17 <Stskeeps> yeah.. but such are designs
Jul 27 15:18:26 <ali1234> Stskeeps: how come wayland screenshot i see, there's never a window manager?
Jul 27 15:18:32 <ali1234> (serious question)
Jul 27 15:18:49 <thiago> usually, the wayland server is the window manager too
Jul 27 15:18:59 <ali1234> well ok, so, where is it?
Jul 27 15:19:03 <Stskeeps> ali1234: in this particular case i don't think i had any logic associated
Jul 27 15:19:27 <Stskeeps> http://stskeeps.subnetmask.net/wayland/20110719_001.jpg is with qml-compositor
Jul 27 15:19:39 <ali1234> is it simply that no one got around to writing a real WM for it yet?
Jul 27 15:19:48 <ali1234> ok, so where's the window decorations/title bar?
Jul 27 15:19:58 <thiago> who says we need them?
Jul 27 15:20:01 <ali1234> well
Jul 27 15:20:05 <Stskeeps> noone's bothered to make them i guess ;)
Jul 27 15:20:08 <ali1234> i do
Jul 27 15:21:28 <ali1234> when i see screenshots and there's no window borders and other stuff, i think "oh great, still another couple of years away from being done"
Jul 27 15:21:29 <thiago> tablets and handsets shouldn't have visible windows anyway
Jul 27 15:21:35 <thiago> all applications should be maximised or fullscreen
Jul 27 15:21:53 <ali1234> if wayland is going to replace X then it needs to run on a little bit more than tablets and handsets
Jul 27 15:22:00 <thiago> true
Jul 27 15:22:06 <ali1234> now my perception is probably wrong, but there itis
Jul 27 15:22:21 <thiago> someone needs to write a wayland-WM with window decorations
Jul 27 15:22:29 <pebcak> thiago very limited view on what tablets should or shouldn't have
Jul 27 15:22:30 <thiago> I think martin grässlin is working on it with kwin
Jul 27 15:22:45 <pebcak> splits can be very useful, especially copy&paste, marking books etc.
Jul 27 15:22:48 <SpeedEvil> Larger tablets can certainly with profit use windows.
Jul 27 15:23:03 <thiago> pebcak: the current UX doesn't call for it.
Jul 27 15:23:13 <berndhs> the fullscreen-only policy should be based on physicla screen size, not whether there is a keyboard or not (tablet)
Jul 27 15:23:15 <fiferboy> If I remove source files from OBS does it removed the binaries that were built from them?
Jul 27 15:23:16 <SpeedEvil> I note that when I had a 640*480 10" laptop, I wasn't using one window only always
Jul 27 15:23:25 <pebcak> thiago that#s not what you said, you said "they shouldn't"
Jul 27 15:23:25 <Stskeeps> fiferboy: you can do osc wipebinaries, too
Jul 27 15:23:37 <Ulf^> fiferboy, nope
Jul 27 15:23:46 <thiago> pebcak: right. (MeeGo UX) Tablets and handsets shouldn't have it.
Jul 27 15:23:46 <pebcak> I think devs and users should be free to decide that for themselves
Jul 27 15:23:51 <fiferboy> Stskeeps: I wasn't intentionally intended for the binaries to be removed :)
Jul 27 15:23:56 <thiago> pebcak: shouldn't need it, I mean
Jul 27 15:23:58 <Stskeeps> fiferboy: ah..
Jul 27 15:23:58 <Stskeeps> :P
Jul 27 15:24:02 <thiago> pebcak: because our UX guidelines don't call for them.
Jul 27 15:24:08 <fiferboy> Ulf^: Does triggering a rebuild on newer source remove the old binary?
Jul 27 15:24:18 <pebcak> thiago there are always usecases when it would make sense
Jul 27 15:24:43 <Stskeeps> and there's possibility to make like that if you want that
Jul 27 15:25:10 <thiago> pebcak: sure. but our UX guidelines don't call for them or allow them now.
Jul 27 15:25:33 <pebcak> thiago well, I won#t comment that
Jul 27 15:25:37 <pebcak> :)
Jul 27 15:25:41 <Ulf^> fiferboy, yep
Jul 27 15:25:54 <fiferboy> Ulf^: Ah, that explains it then :)
Jul 27 15:26:11 <fiferboy> Although it makes the package unavailable for install while the new one is building
Jul 27 15:26:18 <fiferboy> And what happens if the build fails?
Jul 27 15:26:28 <ali1234> well, i don't care about window decorations in meego, but i just want to see wayland screenshots with a "traditional" window manager :)
Jul 27 15:26:38 * lcuk notes that wayland looks like liqbase
Jul 27 15:26:46 <timeless> rm_work: i probably haven't seen the article, i'll take a link :)
Jul 27 15:26:48 <ali1234> unfinished? :)
Jul 27 15:26:53 <lcuk> lol!
Jul 27 15:27:31 <lcuk> ali1234, it may be unfinished but I am actively using the completed bits
Jul 27 15:27:44 * lcuk tinkers with his garden as required
Jul 27 15:28:26 * SpeedEvil is seiving rocks.
Jul 27 15:28:33 <Stskeeps> ali1234: with qml-compositor you can basically treat a window as an element in qml, so you can do small dancing penguins around it if you so desire.. so it's just that engineers have no sense of art ;)
Jul 27 15:29:04 <Ulf^> Stskeeps, Due to lack of imagination? ;)
Jul 27 15:29:08 <ali1234> Stskeeps: ok for drawing decorations... what about resizing/minimize/dragging logic?
Jul 27 15:29:34 <ali1234> i'm excited about wayland but i won't really believe in it fully until i see these things actually working :)
Jul 27 15:29:36 <Stskeeps> similar, but look at the wayland shell protocol
Jul 27 15:31:12 <ali1234> what was the name of that really early compositing window manager? it was named after an artist i think...
Jul 27 15:31:22 <ali1234> (early for X)
Jul 27 15:31:25 <rm_work> timeless: http://tabulacrypticum.wordpress.com/2011/07/12/works-for-me/#more-3286
Jul 27 15:32:35 <rm_work> really early, as in waaay before compiz?
Jul 27 15:32:39 <ali1234> yeah
Jul 27 15:32:48 <rm_work> dunno, compiz was the first i played with :P
Jul 27 15:32:54 <ali1234> it had loads of pointless features like corner peeling, and you could rotate windows
Jul 27 15:33:04 <ali1234> but it was basically just a tech demo
Jul 27 15:33:11 <Stskeeps> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Looking_Glass ?
Jul 27 15:33:15 <lcuk> everything is just a tech demo
Jul 27 15:33:16 <ali1234> no
Jul 27 15:33:28 <rm_work> Stskeeps: i was thinking that, but that was a java thing wasn't it?
Jul 27 15:33:29 <ali1234> it was way before that
Jul 27 15:33:33 <ali1234> it was in like 2003
Jul 27 15:33:46 <ali1234> metisse
Jul 27 15:34:02 <ali1234> found in "see also" on that wiki page
Jul 27 15:35:18 <ali1234> anyway i feel like wayland is about at that stage - nice demo, but i can't actually use it yet
Jul 27 15:36:42 <lcuk> plan9
Jul 27 15:36:48 <rm_work> lcuk: rofl
Jul 27 15:37:19 * lcuk creating project_42
Jul 27 15:38:10 <slaine> DawnFoster: I got the me ego tablet ux running on our bedside hardware, http://yfrog.com/mwi0dz
Jul 27 15:38:41 <Stskeeps> the one for hospital?
Jul 27 15:39:07 <slaine> Yeah
Jul 27 15:39:11 <slaine> just goofing around
Jul 27 15:39:20 <lcuk> awesome
Jul 27 15:39:24 <slaine> But part of my plans of IBI (InBed Infotainment)
Jul 27 15:39:34 <lcuk> get the patients into meego and producing code fixes whilst being fixed themselves :D
Jul 27 15:39:42 <slaine> :)
Jul 27 15:40:21 <lcuk> slaine, when you are making movies, and showing touchscreen, do you look through the camera view to tell where to press?
Jul 27 15:40:23 <Stskeeps> In Bed Infotainment could be so misunderstood..
Jul 27 15:40:27 * lcuk always gets mixed up
Jul 27 15:40:29 * Stskeeps goes clean the kitchen
Jul 27 15:40:40 <slaine> Stskeeps: true
Jul 27 15:40:49 <lcuk> lol
Jul 27 15:41:02 <berndhs> with some of the drugs in hospital patients, you might get a new wave of psychedelic UIs
Jul 27 15:41:08 <lcuk> :D
Jul 27 15:41:09 <slaine> lcuk: bit of both, it's hard to know where to look, I know it's a bit shaky cam but it's my first post ;)
Jul 27 15:41:18 <lcuk> let you off then :P
Jul 27 15:41:47 <berndhs> in-bed infotainment, shaky cam, I don't know...
Jul 27 15:41:47 <lcuk> right, time to have a meego break and do some pruning around liqbase
Jul 27 15:41:50 <lcuk> back later \o
Jul 27 15:42:26 <lcuk> somebody please remind me not to reflash n900-ce
Jul 27 15:42:34 <lcuk> at least until I remove the source code from it
Jul 27 15:42:39 <rm_work> lcuk: don't reflash n900-ce
Jul 27 15:43:03 <rm_work> i wish i could script that to repeat every 15 minutes or so :P
Jul 27 15:43:55 <lcuk> lol
Jul 27 15:44:12 <lcuk> rm_work, tomorrow I will put the source onto repo but I CBA right now
Jul 27 15:44:21 <lcuk> i am making a testcase for bug 13084
Jul 27 15:44:22 <rm_work> :P
Jul 27 15:44:23 <MeeGoBot> Bug https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13084 maj, Medium, ---, liquid, ASSI, [n900] Horizontal tearing with xvimagesink
Jul 27 15:50:21 <timeless> rm_work: http://tabulacrypticum.wordpress.com/2011/07/12/works-for-me/comment-page-1/#comment-5611 :)
Jul 27 15:52:38 <rm_work> :P
Jul 27 15:55:14 <ali1234> i love the meego-troll on that page
Jul 27 15:57:05 <rm_work> yeah lol
Jul 27 15:57:17 <rm_work> where does all the meego-style art come from T_T
Jul 27 15:57:37 <Stskeeps> wasn't there a tool for it?
Jul 27 15:57:39 <Stskeeps> and texrat, mostly
Jul 27 15:58:11 <Guest33764> hello, I try compile basiclayouts example with Qt creator but got error MApplication: No such file or directory
Jul 27 15:58:15 <Guest33764> How can fix this?
Jul 27 15:58:30 <Guest33764> Was installed Meego SDK 1.2
Jul 27 15:59:11 <pebcak> rm_work appupavatar.com ?
Jul 27 16:15:52 <ali1234> rm_work: Stskeeps: there's a few tools including one by me: http://forum.meego.com/showthread.php?t=1338
Jul 27 16:22:16 * slaine wonders what MeeGo UX would look like using Harmatten style components
Jul 27 16:23:57 <leinir> slaine: well... arguably, swipe /is/ a meego ux... some of the underlying system's not meego, but the swipe bits would work just fine on top of meego-core...
Jul 27 16:24:04 <leinir> so it'd look the same ;)
Jul 27 16:25:04 <slaine> leinir, Isn't the Harmattan components style different to the MeeGo UX style ?
Jul 27 16:25:20 <slaine> Or is it that the MTF apps on Harmattan just look better :)
Jul 27 16:26:36 <leinir> slaine: Oh, you mean the Intel MeeGo Tablet UX?
Jul 27 16:27:13 <slaine> leinir: Yes
Jul 27 16:27:33 <slaine> That's confusingly called MeeGo UX
Jul 27 16:27:38 <leinir> *nods* Yeah
Jul 27 16:27:43 <leinir> not very happy about that situation
Jul 27 16:27:56 <slaine> there's a history of confusing names here
Jul 27 16:28:52 <slaine> I'm guessing that the End Game is for MeeGo UX to be the reference UX for all form factors, netbook, tablet, IVI, which tweaks per form factor
Jul 27 16:28:58 <slaine> wild speculation
Jul 27 16:29:16 <slaine> s/which tweaks/with tweaks
Jul 27 16:32:06 <gabrbedd> slaine: leinir: There was a discussion about this about 1-2 mos. ago on the dev ML.
Jul 27 16:32:24 <leinir> gabrbedd: it comes up every so often ;)
Jul 27 16:32:51 <gabrbedd> slaine: leinir: I think the "conclusion" was that MeeGo never /really/ want's to provide a production/stable out-of-the box UX.
Jul 27 16:33:06 <gabrbedd> They want a good proof of concept, and for vendors to provide their own.
Jul 27 16:33:21 <slaine> gabrbedd: Yeah, that's always been the case, even back to Moblin
Jul 27 16:33:27 <slaine> I think it's a pity
Jul 27 16:33:31 <gabrbedd> But you can never get anyone to commit to one or the other... but I think it's clear that this is the priority/marchin orders.
Jul 27 16:34:17 <gabrbedd> slaine: I tend to agree.  It makes app development MUCH more complex.
Jul 27 16:34:23 <slaine> It doesn't take much more effort cost wise to push the reference design over the barrier of being good enough to prove a point to being really nice and compelling.
Jul 27 16:35:21 <gabrbedd> slaine: The problem, they say, is that if the reference UX is too good -- it will hinder adoption.
Jul 27 16:35:53 <gabrbedd> slaine: the ability to totally re-do the UX is one of the chief things that distinguishes MeeGo.
Jul 27 16:39:01 <lcuk> vgrade, what did you say?
Jul 27 16:39:58 <slaine> If you look at all the MeeGo netbook announcements, they are variations on the stock UX, so I can't see that being a valid complaint
Jul 27 16:42:10 <berndhs> slaine: it depends on the company and the business. Car companies and phone companies probably want their own brand
Jul 27 16:43:07 <slaine> berndhs: that's my point I guess, any of the netbook release coming out are branded variants of the stock ux. So the stock ux has to be good enough for them to use and rebrand in the first place
Jul 27 16:43:37 <slaine> As opposed to say Audi doing a whole different UX design for their IVI product
Jul 27 16:43:51 <slaine> Something like that would be a minority
Jul 27 16:44:13 <gabrbedd> slaine: FWIW, I saw some new UX concepts at... what was it?  computex?
Jul 27 16:44:21 <berndhs> minority in what terms? in terms of number of platforms or in terms of number of chips sold?
Jul 27 16:44:26 <gabrbedd> slaine: And they were meego.
Jul 27 16:45:05 <slaine> berndhs: minority in terms of number of totally new ux implementations
Jul 27 16:45:15 <vgrade> lcuk, ?
Jul 27 16:45:32 <gabrbedd> slaine: However... my PERSONAL opinion is... when I get a phone I am really not interested in your crummy vendor-specific UX.
Jul 27 16:45:44 <slaine> berndhs: So far, the majority of UX's in shipping products have been variations on the stock
Jul 27 16:46:16 <berndhs> sure, but to what extent are those interesting to Intel ?
Jul 27 16:46:37 <gabrbedd> slaine: I think the DIY-UX feature is a huge benefit for IVI and TV... and I think it's a hinderance for handset and tablet.
Jul 27 16:47:14 <slaine> gabrbedd: I'd agree
Jul 27 16:47:39 <gabrbedd> ...and that seems to be the way things are playing out, too. :-/
Jul 27 16:47:44 <andyross> Amen.  In the android world, compare the UX experience of a Nexus S to *any* of the "customized" Galaxy S variants (there are now dozens), which are all basically the same hardware.  The Google UI is just plain better in every way.  All the vendor stuff is trash.
Jul 27 16:48:51 <slaine> berndhs: You're not getting the point I was making. I was simply saying that given the investment that Intel are putting into MeeGo and the development of the UX reference, it's not much of an expense to take them from three quarters of the way there to all the way there in terms of polish
Jul 27 16:49:20 <slaine> andyross: I'd disagree there. I think HTC's SenseUI is a huge improvement over the stock UI on android
Jul 27 16:49:21 <berndhs> slaine: sure that's very likely correct
Jul 27 16:49:47 <ceyusa> hi! is there a madde-config for meego-ia32-core-1.2.0 ???
Jul 27 16:49:50 <berndhs> and for tablets and netbooks and such, I would prefer to see that it's MeeGo
Jul 27 16:50:25 <berndhs> in fact I would like a MeeGo desktop UX as well
Jul 27 16:51:17 <andyross> To be clear: I've never used Sense, I was talking about the Samsung+Carrier enhancements to the Galaxy S phones, which I've dealt with.  They contain such gems as a modal dialog box which tells you (no joke) that "the battery is done charging, you may now remove the charger".  It gets bonus points for lighting the phone up and vibrating at 2am to tell you this.
Jul 27 16:51:21 <slaine> berndhs: There was talk of that in the VERY early days
Jul 27 16:51:44 <berndhs> actually, I look at it more as big-screen, rather than desktop
Jul 27 16:51:54 <slaine> andyross: ouch
Jul 27 16:53:02 <andyross> Also: the camera won't shoot video when the batter is <15%.   Because the app knows better than the user does how the user wants to spend their battery energy.
Jul 27 16:53:03 <slaine> berndhs: MeeGo did introduce to enhancements over Moblin (they where due for Moblin 2.2's release) for large screens, but I don't think that UX worked well enough on a large screen
Jul 27 16:53:52 <slaine> andyross: if your stuck on that phone and interested, I've heard very good things about the CM7 rom for it.
Jul 27 16:54:28 <berndhs> slaine: maybe it works well enugh just with xfce
Jul 27 16:54:40 <andyross> I'm already on a custom ROM, so no big deal.  Was just mentioning it as an example of the idiocy manufacturers and carriers inject into the process.  Basically gabrbedd is right: "custom" UIs are always a misfeature.
Jul 27 16:55:17 <dm8tbr> berndhs: I know people using meego as a base for their desktop/laptop with e.g. xfce
Jul 27 16:55:18 <slaine> Yeah, it's possible to do branded enhancements properly though, the HTC Desire was a good example of that.
Jul 27 16:55:31 <slaine> Is xfce still in the repos ?
Jul 27 16:55:49 <berndhs> last week it was there
Jul 27 16:56:14 <slaine> cool, was there but broken early in the meego cycle, I used to use it on moblin.
Jul 27 16:56:26 <slaine> not tried it since the move to meego
Jul 27 16:57:01 <berndhs> actually let me correct that statement, it is in a devel: repo
Jul 27 16:57:48 <arfoll> slaine, auke has put it back in MeeGo
Jul 27 16:58:14 <slaine> arfoll: happy days
Jul 27 16:58:37 <arfoll> slaine: I missed you earlier but you said you had offices in Malta?
Jul 27 16:59:21 <arfoll> I see you said installation
Jul 27 17:00:24 <slaine> Yeah, we've got a few units with Melita Cable in the MAtre Dai hospital (spelling ??)
Jul 27 17:01:16 <arfoll> slaine, I was there just last week. the hospital is nearly brand new though
Jul 27 17:01:26 <thiago> slaine: "mater dei" probably
Jul 27 17:01:34 <slaine> Brand new in building terms is not the same as brand new in PC terms
Jul 27 17:01:39 <slaine> thiago: thats it
Jul 27 17:01:50 <arfoll> slaine, was just about to say that...
Jul 27 17:02:00 <arfoll> thiago, spot on, your maltese is better than mine!
Jul 27 17:02:15 <slaine> Our older 600Mhz Celeron hardware
Jul 27 17:02:25 <thiago> arfoll: probably not :-)
Jul 27 17:02:46 <Stskeeps> ysss: see, i was ahead of the times :)
Jul 27 17:02:48 <Stskeeps> ;)
Jul 27 17:02:59 <arfoll> thiago, if you know more than 10 words you are...
Jul 27 17:03:08 <ysss> sts: haha you know everyone had the same thought
Jul 27 17:03:10 <thiago> I don't think I know any
Jul 27 17:03:28 <arfoll> slaine, thats probably high tech for them... I visited their IT department - not exactly state of the art
Jul 27 17:03:46 <Stskeeps> ysss: just click "report post" on every single problematic thing and that should do the trick
Jul 27 17:04:56 <auke> slaine: devel:xfce
Jul 27 17:05:12 <auke> it's entirely up to date, including zypper patterns to install easily
Jul 27 17:05:14 <ysss> i think the wheels are already turning for his exit ever since that love letter he wrote to chemist
Jul 27 17:05:42 * arfoll wonders why anyone bothers since there is openbox for meego....
Jul 27 17:06:37 <slaine> auke, that's made my day. Thanks
Jul 27 17:06:39 <auke> arfoll: I've been involved with xfce since before moblin existed...
Jul 27 17:07:23 <auke> slaine: it's building against both 1.2 and trunk, so, should be usable without any problems
Jul 27 17:08:01 <arfoll> auke, i know. i actually use some of it with openbox on meego :-)
Jul 27 17:22:07 <qgil> lbt X-Fade may I request an account for the COBS?
Jul 27 17:22:17 <lbt> of course
Jul 27 17:22:36 <lbt> open source ... right ?
Jul 27 17:22:40 <lbt> ;)
Jul 27 17:22:42 <lbt> done
Jul 27 17:22:44 <qgil> then I request is lbt  :)
Jul 27 17:22:58 <qgil> great, thanks!
Jul 27 17:23:00 * auke waves to qgil 
Jul 27 17:23:09 <qgil> hi auke !
Jul 27 17:23:38 <qgil> auke: I spent a week in Zeeland, and I was impressed by the interaction between the sea, the tide... and the rain in July
Jul 27 17:24:35 <qgil> auke: I didn't know there were seals in Europe (out of a zoo, that is) ... and I didn't know either so much rain could fall in July in Europe - still we had lots of fun
Jul 27 17:24:38 <qgil> and now back to topic
Jul 27 17:24:59 <lbt> auke ... msg?
Jul 27 17:26:25 <slaine> qgil: we have sharks, dolphins too
Jul 27 17:27:17 <qgil> slaine: I knew about sharks, dolphins and even the couple of whales lost in the mediterranean sea - but no seals
Jul 27 17:28:49 * gabrbedd is reminded of the movie "Roan Inish" ...
Jul 27 17:31:16 * slaine has snorkeled with dolphins, seals and saw a basking shark from a distance, all in the irish sea
Jul 27 17:31:29 <slaine> well, the dolphin was in the atlantic
Jul 27 17:35:05 <GeneralAntilles> lbt, while you're handing out free accounts . . . can I get in on it? ;)
Jul 27 17:35:17 <lbt> yep ...meego account name
Jul 27 17:35:23 <GeneralAntilles> generalantilles
Jul 27 17:35:26 <lbt> but c.obs is down ... looking at it
Jul 27 17:45:38 <lbt> c.obs is back
Jul 27 17:45:46 <lbt> disk full
Jul 27 17:46:03 <lbt> sorry .... monitoring system clearly not doing its job
Jul 27 17:46:30 <lbt> GeneralAntilles: done :)
Jul 27 17:46:35 <GeneralAntilles> Thanks!
Jul 27 17:46:40 <lbt> qgil:  ^^ back
Jul 27 17:46:49 <qgil> just logged in thanks!
Jul 27 17:52:19 <qgil> lbt: should I expect a MeeGo Harmattan target at https://build.pub.meego.com/project/add_repository_from_default_list or is that precisely the part that is missing?
Jul 27 17:57:41 <siddvicious> i get error usb0: unknown interface: No such device
Jul 27 17:57:48 <siddvicious> on fedora 15 64 bit
Jul 27 17:58:56 <qgil> ... oh my oh my... why did I decide to learn the basics of Qt Creator, Qt Quick, git and now OBS in the same week?
Jul 27 17:59:48 <deimos> qgil,  I feel like you with only Qt Quick :)
Jul 27 17:59:53 <siddvicious> Stskeeps: can you help ?
Jul 27 17:59:53 <lcuk> qgil, because actually walking the path any new developer must go through is invaluable if documented and discussed and processed and hopefully streamlined
Jul 27 17:59:53 <lbt> indeed ... the week before the weekend I finally get round to updating the tutorials too
Jul 27 18:00:17 <siddvicious> i have my n900 connected to notebook and its turned off
Jul 27 18:00:23 <siddvicious> is installer script
Jul 27 18:00:35 <qgil> is there a doc somewhere explaining step by step how to upload the files I got with Qt Creator to the COBS?
Jul 27 18:00:46 <siddvicious> but when it runs it says usb0 unkown interface
Jul 27 18:00:47 <lbt> no :(
Jul 27 18:01:18 <lcuk> qgil, the best starting point appears to be: http://wiki.meego.com/Getting_started_with_OBS which is a collaboration between jaffa and lardman mostly
Jul 27 18:01:43 <lcuk> it includes a section on publishing to harmattan
Jul 27 18:01:45 <qgil> thanks lcuk
Jul 27 18:02:05 <lcuk> \o
Jul 27 18:03:06 <lcuk> evening Simon \o
Jul 27 18:04:58 <lardman> hi lcuk
Jul 27 18:05:47 <lardman> been a busy day, fixing run away immersion heater, then internet arriving so been rebooting Windows machines for ~4hours while they download updates
Jul 27 18:08:16 <antman8969> So has any one else tried building against the Harmattan target in OBS and noticed that you can't include MDeclarativeCache
Jul 27 18:08:43 <qgil> lcuk: this is exactly what I was looking for. Linking it visibly from http://wiki.meego.com/Build_Infrastructure/Community_Builder - which is the first result I got
Jul 27 18:13:41 <siddvicious> can anyone help please
Jul 27 18:14:02 <siddvicious> i am trying to install meeg 1.2 on n900 f15 x64bit
Jul 27 18:14:02 <CosmoHill> maybe, ask another question and we'll see
Jul 27 18:14:21 <siddvicious> installed flasher 3.5 and its in /usr/sbin
Jul 27 18:14:40 <siddvicious> now i use installer script to install meego 1.2 ce on n900
Jul 27 18:14:57 <siddvicious> kept image and kernel file in the same folder
Jul 27 18:15:18 <siddvicious> started script when device was off it was connected to usb
Jul 27 18:15:34 <siddvicious> then it asked to shut off network manager i did yes
Jul 27 18:15:43 <Stskeeps> siddvicious: i would recommend you to use microsd instead
Jul 27 18:15:57 <siddvicious> and it asked for "after enter please turn on device"
Jul 27 18:16:00 <siddvicious> i did turn on
Jul 27 18:16:02 <siddvicious> but
Jul 27 18:16:16 <siddvicious> Suitable USB device not found, waiting.
Jul 27 18:16:18 <siddvicious> Unable to enumerate USB buses!
Jul 27 18:16:19 <siddvicious> flashing done
Jul 27 18:16:21 <siddvicious> SIOCSIFADDR: No such device
Jul 27 18:16:22 <siddvicious> usb0: unknown interface: No such device
Jul 27 18:16:24 <siddvicious> usb0: unknown interface: No such device
Jul 27 18:17:06 <Stskeeps> siddvicious: sudo su
Jul 27 18:17:18 <siddvicious> Stskeeps: i ran it from root already
Jul 27 18:20:30 <siddvicious> so i should try on mmc then ?
Jul 27 18:20:43 <Stskeeps> yes, microsd
Jul 27 18:24:27 <siddvicious> Stskeeps: then only thing i need to do is put car inside phone, and rest is same, right ?
Jul 27 18:24:44 <siddvicious> *card
Jul 27 18:26:06 <Stskeeps> right
Jul 27 18:41:22 <antman8969> qgil any luck with the harmattan target?
Jul 27 18:41:56 <qgil> yes, I added it to my COBS project antman8969
Jul 27 18:42:45 <antman8969> qgil have you attempted a build?
Jul 27 18:43:08 <lcuk> good stuff qgil
Jul 27 18:43:23 <Venemo> hey qgil, thanks for your good work on the N950 device program :)
Jul 27 18:43:24 <qgil> I'm in the point of adding files antman8969 - trying to figure out what is the best way to sync that process with the folders and files created by Qt Creator
Jul 27 18:44:21 <antman8969> hmm, I'm assuming you want to change the files it creates as little as possible?
Jul 27 18:44:44 <antman8969> i mean, if the qtc_packaging/harmattan dir instead was ./debian it wouldn't really require any change
Jul 27 18:44:51 <qgil> antman8969: I don't even know what files are needed since Qt Creator manages to build the package on the go - I'm missing that magic button in the OBS context  :)
Jul 27 18:45:02 <antman8969> lol
Jul 27 18:45:40 <antman8969> well if you uploaded your QtCreator src as .tar.gz  with a debian directory on the top level, after uploading a package.dsc file it would build correctly
Jul 27 18:45:50 <qgil> antman8969: Ideally I wouldn't need to touch a thing: build locally for my testing and then build remotely in COBS for sharing packages publicly
Jul 27 18:45:58 <Venemo> qgil, Qt Creator puts files to qtc_packaging/debian_harmattan, and it copies this directory to the root and names it 'debian', then runs dpkg-buildpackage (as far as I understand it)
Jul 27 18:46:15 <antman8969> ^^
Jul 27 18:46:16 <qgil> ok, lemme try this
Jul 27 18:46:37 <antman8969> obviously making sure you uncomming dh_shlibdeps in the debian/rules file too
Jul 27 18:47:15 <antman8969> i usually have a different debian directory that I maintain myself out of QtCreators watch
Jul 27 18:48:06 <Venemo> antman8969, and the evil Qt Creator can't make a package if you have your own debian dir
Jul 27 18:48:24 <antman8969> lol sure it can, you just need to leave the one it likes there too
Jul 27 18:48:52 <Venemo> nope.
Jul 27 18:49:03 <Venemo> it will say "alien debian directory detected" or sth like that
Jul 27 18:49:14 <Venemo> no, the word it uses is 'foreign'
Jul 27 18:49:22 <Venemo> whatever.
Jul 27 18:49:31 <antman8969> well idk what to say to that... it doesn't say that for me
Jul 27 18:49:47 <antman8969> right now I have a debain dir, AND a qtc_packaging/debian_harmattan
Jul 27 18:49:50 <antman8969> it finds it just fine
Jul 27 18:50:01 <antman8969> don't add the new debian dir to your .pro file
Jul 27 18:50:03 <antman8969> if you are
Jul 27 18:50:17 <Venemo> well, I had a project which already had a debian dir. then I added the harmattan target, and at first build, this is what it said.
Jul 27 18:50:40 <qgil> Venemo antman8969 my Qt Creator project is called testdef and parallel to the /testdef folder there is a /testdef-build-harmattan that contains the deb package, some files, and some more under a /debian subfolder - but I'm not sure if these are all the source files
Jul 27 18:51:17 <Venemo> qgil, what exactly are you trying to achieve?
Jul 27 18:51:44 <antman8969> automating the upload process I assume
Jul 27 18:52:44 <qgil> before "automating" I would like to learn what files I'm supposed to upload to the COBS
Jul 27 18:52:53 <antman8969> the testdef-build-harmattan doesn't contain all of what you need
Jul 27 18:53:01 <antman8969> the source isn't in there (or it shouldn't be)
Jul 27 18:53:07 <Venemo> mhm
Jul 27 18:53:12 <antman8969> what IS in there is the deb and .changes file
Jul 27 18:53:18 <antman8969> but what you need is the .dsc file
Jul 27 18:53:19 <Venemo> yeah, antman8969 is right.
Jul 27 18:53:31 <timoph> huh?
Jul 27 18:53:40 <antman8969> looking for it now... I don't see that qtcreator saves the .dsc file
Jul 27 18:53:40 <timoph> deb file to obs?
Jul 27 18:53:47 <antman8969> yes
Jul 27 18:54:12 <timoph> I thought you're supposed to upload your sources there
Jul 27 18:54:25 <timoph> and it makes the deb for you
Jul 27 18:54:43 <antman8969> yep
Jul 27 18:54:46 <antman8969> along with a .dsc
Jul 27 18:54:59 <wmarone> hey venemo
Jul 27 18:55:04 <Bostik> the spell to invoke for .dsc generation is "dpkg-source -b $srcdir"
Jul 27 18:55:04 <timoph> at least that's how the main obs works
Jul 27 18:55:31 <antman8969> Bastik, have you  tried getting QtCreator to generate a .dsc?
Jul 27 18:56:19 <Bostik> antman8969: not really, I used the older prototype version which blindly called dpkg-buildpackage (which in turn did the dpkg-source step)
Jul 27 18:56:35 <antman8969> right
Jul 27 18:56:48 <antman8969> hmm
Jul 27 18:57:00 <timoph> and more than that I like to create rpm and deb packages from the same source tar ball
Jul 27 18:57:03 <antman8969> well qgil, scratchbox definitly will do this for you....
Jul 27 18:57:14 <qgil> no way I get into scratchbox
Jul 27 18:57:20 <timoph> :)
Jul 27 18:57:21 <antman8969> lol
Jul 27 18:57:31 <antman8969> well all you're missing right now is the .dsc file
Jul 27 18:57:33 <Bostik> I know that feeling :)
Jul 27 18:57:38 <RST38h> qgil: QtSDK fails running an empty Harmattan QtQuick project though
Jul 27 18:57:49 <RST38h> something about dh-* scripts failing
Jul 27 18:58:03 <qgil> I have a folder with many files and /qml subfolder - I just want to know which files wants the OBS
Jul 27 18:58:06 <RST38h> Installed right out of the box, empty project, etc. Epic fail.
Jul 27 18:58:37 <qgil> the project works, the packages are build locally and I can run them in my device - I just want to share the package through the cmmunity OBS
Jul 27 18:58:41 <antman8969> qgil the obs wants testdef.tar.gz and testdef.dsc
Jul 27 18:58:52 <timoph> yep
Jul 27 18:59:07 <antman8969> where testdef.tar.gz is you project folder compressed, and the .dsc is made during the packaging step
Jul 27 18:59:17 <antman8969> BUT idk if qtcreator generates the .dsc... still looking to see
Jul 27 19:00:11 <qgil> oook, then this looks like http://wiki.meego.com/Getting_started_with_OBS#Adding_files_to_a_package_and_building_them - only that it's unclear where to get this .dsc from
Jul 27 19:00:35 <Venemo> by the final release date, this process should be fully supported by Qt Creator
Jul 27 19:00:43 <antman8969> you DEFINETLY get it from dpkg-buidlpackage
Jul 27 19:00:51 <qgil> ok, I'll try
Jul 27 19:01:32 <Venemo> Qt Creator does not generate a .dsc
Jul 27 19:01:34 <Venemo> afaic
Jul 27 19:01:37 <Venemo> afaict
Jul 27 19:02:02 <antman8969> where can you configure the packaging process?
Jul 27 19:02:11 <antman8969> don't see many options in the projects tab
Jul 27 19:03:05 <Venemo> antman8969, I don't think you can, but maybe you can in the projects tab/harmattan/run/create package
Jul 27 19:03:29 <antman8969> thats where I would have thought too
Jul 27 19:08:31 <qgil> I don't know how to use dpkg-buildpackage & I was so happy when Qt Creator just generated a deb package alone - I have a tar.gz but still no .dsc
Jul 27 19:08:55 <antman8969> aah got it
Jul 27 19:08:57 <antman8969> ok
Jul 27 19:09:01 <antman8969> what you have to do is
Jul 27 19:09:03 <qgil> but I understand this is uff-topic here, so I'll continue in #harmattan
Jul 27 19:09:13 <qgil> "uff-topic"  :D nice typo
Jul 27 19:09:13 <antman8969> oh no! I just got the answer
Jul 27 19:09:30 <qgil> ok  :)
Jul 27 19:09:32 <antman8969> you need to add a custom build step
Jul 27 19:09:35 <antman8969> in your project tab
Jul 27 19:09:48 <qgil> I'm liking this...
Jul 27 19:09:50 <antman8969> here are the arguments
Jul 27 19:10:01 <antman8969> Command: /home/anthony/QtSDK/Madde/bin/mad
Jul 27 19:10:10 <antman8969> except you arnt anthony lol
Jul 27 19:10:15 <antman8969> but it's the path to mad
Jul 27 19:10:35 <antman8969> woroking directory: %{buildDir}.......... that is good as default
Jul 27 19:10:52 <antman8969> Command arguments: -t harmattan-nokia-meego-api dpkg-buildpackage -sa -S -uc -us
Jul 27 19:11:02 <antman8969> assuming you are using the MeeGo 1.2 harmattan target
Jul 27 19:11:39 <antman8969> that generates all the files you need paralell to your project dir
Jul 27 19:12:38 <antman8969> actually, now I won't have to build in scratchbox anymore.... this is pretty nice
Jul 27 19:13:03 <Venemo> antman8969 :)
Jul 27 19:13:12 <antman8969> lol
Jul 27 19:13:55 <Venemo> antman8969, in the meantime, I've just figured out how to get Qt Creator _NOT_ to make packages every time :)
Jul 27 19:14:27 <antman8969> lol great, we can be as careless or careful as we want now
Jul 27 19:14:46 <Venemo> hehe
Jul 27 19:14:55 <qgil> antman8969: does this custom step go after qmake and Make?
Jul 27 19:14:56 <Venemo> nah, my train arrives in a minute so I need to leave now
Jul 27 19:14:58 <Venemo> bb
Jul 27 19:15:06 <antman8969> have fun
Jul 27 19:15:35 <antman8969> yep qgil
Jul 27 19:15:37 <antman8969> the last one
Jul 27 19:15:43 <antman8969> not that it matters actually
Jul 27 19:15:58 <antman8969> i'ts a standalone dpkg command that just generates the files you want
Jul 27 19:16:06 <antman8969> but last is safe
Jul 27 19:17:13 <antman8969> was there a problem with it qgil?
Jul 27 19:17:54 <qgil> antman8969: no, I rebuild and everything seems to work fine in the package, the device, etc Now... what has changed?  ;)
Jul 27 19:18:42 <antman8969> lol now parallel to your testdef direcotry you should see 3 new files
Jul 27 19:18:46 <antman8969> not inside of it
Jul 27 19:19:05 <qgil> ah yesssssssss
Jul 27 19:19:16 <antman8969> lol
Jul 27 19:19:25 <antman8969> that should be all you need to upload
Jul 27 19:19:29 <qgil> with version number and everything: beautiful
Jul 27 19:19:33 <antman8969> BUT
Jul 27 19:19:42 <antman8969> does your application use the invoker to launch?
Jul 27 19:19:42 <qgil> good that I refused to go for scratchbox
Jul 27 19:19:46 <antman8969> ol
Jul 27 19:20:01 <qgil> er... what is the invoker
Jul 27 19:20:24 <antman8969> lol maybe not then. Well does you main.cpp file have #include <MDeclarativeCache>
Jul 27 19:21:07 <qgil> nope
Jul 27 19:21:13 <antman8969> well then no worries!
Jul 27 19:21:25 <antman8969> the harmattan target on OBS doesn't seem to have the file, thats why I asked
Jul 27 19:21:26 <qgil> ok, so I'll try now
Jul 27 19:23:01 <antman8969> you will also need to add the harmattan target to your obs project
Jul 27 19:25:45 <antman8969> oh wait lol, you packaged the testdef-build-harmattan dir as a tar.gz
Jul 27 19:25:52 <antman8969> should have uploaded testdef.tar.gz
Jul 27 19:26:05 <qgil> antman8969: you seem to be watching behind my neck - I'm adding the repo but for some reason it doesn't "stick" - let me look again
Jul 27 19:26:14 <antman8969> lol
Jul 27 19:26:49 <siddvicious> okay got it working on mmc card :)
Jul 27 19:26:51 <qgil> I'll delete files locally and build again
Jul 27 19:27:21 <siddvicious> can i use wifi with it ?
Jul 27 19:29:19 <qgil> antman8969: what can I do? the custom build is compressing the testdef-build-harmattan folder indeed
Jul 27 19:29:25 <qgil> let me look again under projects...
Jul 27 19:29:50 <antman8969> yea I see that
Jul 27 19:29:55 <antman8969> i'm building mine now to test something
Jul 27 19:31:22 <qgil> antman8969: I see, this is exactly what Qt Creator was told to do. This was the directory selected already
Jul 27 19:31:44 <antman8969> yea we told it to use builddir
Jul 27 19:31:56 <antman8969> should instead be the path to your project
Jul 27 19:32:02 <qgil> ok
Jul 27 19:32:54 <antman8969> not sure exactly what you have to put into the custom step to make that happen tho
Jul 27 19:33:38 <antman8969> oh ok
Jul 27 19:33:40 <qgil> antman8969: mmm I justb selected the
Jul 27 19:33:41 <antman8969> its just the path to your source
Jul 27 19:33:48 <qgil> folder through the UI, but now I get plenty of complaints
Jul 27 19:34:17 <qgil> tail: cannot open `debian/changelog' for reading: No such file or directory dpkg-buildpackage: failure: tail of debian/changelog gave error exit status 1 The process "/home/qgil/QtSDK/Madde/bin/mad" exited with code 1. Error while building project testdef (target: Harmattan) When executing build step 'Custom Process Step'
Jul 27 19:34:40 <antman8969> I was just able to do it by setting  "Working Directory: " to /home/anthony/Desktop/linkedup
Jul 27 19:34:46 <antman8969> my project atm is linkedup
Jul 27 19:34:55 <antman8969> and it is in /home/anthony/Desktop/linkedup
Jul 27 19:35:16 <antman8969> setting that in the custom build step
Jul 27 19:35:23 <antman8969> BUT
Jul 27 19:35:32 <antman8969> that's because I have a debian driectory in there
Jul 27 19:35:55 <antman8969> you would have to copy your qtc_packaging/debian_harmattan directory to testdef/debian
Jul 27 19:36:12 <antman8969> for it to work for you, because dpkg expects a debian dir to exist along with your src
Jul 27 19:36:44 <qgil> ooohh we were almost there
Jul 27 19:37:51 <antman8969> fifer boy had a good solution, making a link to the directory with ln (if you're on linux)
Jul 27 19:38:34 <qgil> antman8969: I'm in Linux but I can't find this qtc_packaging dir
Jul 27 19:38:44 <antman8969> should be inside of testdef/
Jul 27 19:38:50 <antman8969> the one that QtCreator makes
Jul 27 19:39:44 <qgil> antman8969: I see, so I just need to copy it one level up?
Jul 27 19:40:07 <antman8969> and rename it "debian" instead of "debian_harmattan" or w/e
Jul 27 19:40:15 <antman8969> ALSO, you need to go into the rules file
Jul 27 19:40:28 <antman8969> and make sure dh_shlibdeps is not commented out anymore
Jul 27 19:40:38 <antman8969> or it won't build on the obs
Jul 27 19:42:00 <qgil> ok... done, let's see
Jul 27 19:42:20 <arfoll> is there a way of getting arch differences in yaml?
Jul 27 19:42:50 <antman8969> I made my .spec file by hand :/
Jul 27 19:44:41 <qgil> antman8969: do you mind continuing in #harmattan - this is getting to deb here
Jul 27 19:44:46 <qgil> too
Jul 27 19:46:03 <Stskeeps> arfoll: in Patches: you can do arm:patchname.patches
Jul 27 19:46:05 <Stskeeps> for instance
Jul 27 19:46:14 <Stskeeps> or ix86:
Jul 27 19:46:54 <arfoll> Stskeeps: that's cool but I need to do it for a configure option
Jul 27 19:47:10 <Stskeeps> arfoll: hmmm..
Jul 27 19:47:15 <arfoll> i could patch the configure file in case of arm but thats ugly
Jul 27 19:47:20 <Stskeeps> arfoll: yes it is
Jul 27 19:47:34 <Stskeeps> i wonder if that's possible
Jul 27 19:47:35 <Stskeeps> sec
Jul 27 19:49:02 <Stskeeps> arfoll: i think you can do arm: there too, give it a try?
Jul 27 19:49:06 <Stskeeps> in ConfigOptions
Jul 27 19:49:16 <arfoll> Stskeeps, ok sec
Jul 27 19:50:22 <arfoll> Stskeeps, cool :-) Thanks alot
Jul 27 19:50:38 <antman8969> afk'd
Jul 27 19:50:42 <antman8969> dc'd rather
Jul 27 19:50:51 <Stskeeps> arfoll: np
Jul 27 19:56:09 <jedix> is there any reason rc.local wouldn't be executed after booting?
Jul 27 19:58:22 <gabrbedd> jedix: what version of meego?
Jul 27 19:59:32 <jedix> gabrbedd: 1.2
Jul 27 20:00:10 <arfoll> is c.obs being funny again?
Jul 27 20:00:44 <arfoll> i can't seem to commit my changes to my pkg, the upload fails with a broken pipe error
Jul 27 20:02:41 <andyross> Last I remember checking rc.local wasn't wired in meego init.  Certainly it's unlikely to survive in systemd in any case.  The official startup hook is a sysv init script.
Jul 27 20:03:41 <jedix> I thnk it's because I was touching a file in a dir that didn't exist
Jul 27 20:03:46 <jedix> so it exited before finishing
Jul 27 20:03:54 <gabrbedd> jedix: I can't say.  I recall it worked in 1.1, and I'm pretty sure it's replaced by systemd in 1.2.90.
Jul 27 20:04:12 <jedix> iirc, rc.local does that sort of thing.. but none of my systems seem to have the man page
Jul 27 20:04:22 * jedix googles for the man
Jul 27 20:04:29 <jedix> ....man page
Jul 27 20:04:40 <gabrbedd> hee hee
Jul 27 20:04:42 <CosmoHill> keep away from google images :p
Jul 27 20:05:26 <andyross> rc.local is just a shell script invoked from /etc/rc or /etc/rc.sysinit or wherever.  It's not a core feature really, just a 4BSD compatibility holdover (albeit a useful one -- much simpler than the alternatives)
Jul 27 20:05:41 <jedix> yeah
Jul 27 20:05:54 <jedix> but it exits on a failure, right?
Jul 27 20:06:19 <jedix> /bin/sh -e
Jul 27 20:06:26 <andyross> In the sense of "set -e"  you mean?  Pretty sure no, it should run to completion
Jul 27 20:10:15 <jedix> it seems to behave in the `set -e` way
Jul 27 20:11:11 <jedix> maybe osmething I'm calling sets it
Jul 27 20:29:09 <lcuk> frals, whatever does your last tweet mean? :P
Jul 27 20:42:16 <Ulf^> Stskeeps?
Jul 27 22:25:23 * timeless pokes andre__ or DawnFoster 
Jul 27 22:25:30 * timeless double pokes DawnFoster 
Jul 27 22:26:17 * CosmoHill pokes timeless for personal amusement
Jul 27 22:26:40 * timeless teehees
Jul 27 22:26:52 <timeless> ooh, that tickles
Jul 27 22:26:58 <timeless> how's it going?
Jul 27 22:27:08 <CosmoHill> it varies
Jul 27 22:27:19 <CosmoHill> monday was an awesome day that I loved
Jul 27 22:27:29 <CosmoHill> today has been meh, just dossing about on the internet
Jul 27 22:27:34 * timeless is old as of yesterday
Jul 27 22:27:50 <CosmoHill> you mean you had your 29th birthday again?
Jul 27 22:28:24 <timeless> yeah, 3rd time
Jul 27 22:28:43 <CosmoHill> my cousin turned to me on my 20th and went "your old now"
Jul 27 22:29:04 <CosmoHill> I think I said "at least I don't have 5 years of high school to do"
Jul 27 22:29:38 <timeless> Canada got rid of grade 13 a while back
Jul 27 22:30:22 <timeless> s/Canada/Ontario/
Jul 27 22:30:25 <CosmoHill> she had just started high school iirc
Jul 27 22:30:35 <timeless> (that was 2003)
Jul 27 22:30:41 <timeless> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ontario_Academic_Credit fwiw
Jul 27 22:31:20 <CosmoHill> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_England
Jul 27 22:32:46 <timeless> yeah, yopu guys are special :)
Jul 27 22:32:49 <timeless> s/p//
Jul 27 22:33:22 <timeless> middle school too early
Jul 27 22:33:28 <CosmoHill> middle school?
Jul 27 22:33:40 <CosmoHill> we don't have it at this part of the country
Jul 27 22:34:03 <timeless> which flavor are you in?
Jul 27 22:34:16 <timeless> i was reading the far right column, it was the only one i saw w/ 5 years of HS
Jul 27 22:35:05 <CosmoHill> we have the far left
Jul 27 22:35:22 <timeless> > Any Part B success criteria that refer to authors only apply during authoring sessions.
Jul 27 22:35:52 <DawnFoster> timeless: pong
Jul 27 22:35:55 * timeless can't figure out how to count to 5 on the far left, but ok...
Jul 27 22:36:00 <timeless> DawnFoster: one sec
Jul 27 22:36:14 <timeless> DawnFoster: https://bugs.meego.com/show_bug.cgi?id=18038#c10
Jul 27 22:36:17 <MeeGoBot> Bug 18038 nor, Low, ---, kevron_m_rees, VERI WONTFIX, Bluetooth icon should either not be present or clearly indicate it won't work when no bluetooth adap
Jul 27 22:36:28 <timeless> can you please take a wet trout to that commenter
Jul 27 22:36:40 <timeless> (a cluebat might be necessary, but perhaps intel doesn't approve)
Jul 27 22:36:53 <timeless> i'm 99% certain that the commenter did not read:
Jul 27 22:37:00 <timeless> 1. The Bug Status
Jul 27 22:37:11 <timeless> 2. The Bug Summary
Jul 27 22:37:22 <timeless> 3. Comment 0, aka The Bug Report
Jul 27 22:37:40 <timeless> (or perhaps "The Bug Description")
Jul 27 22:38:37 <timeless> ignoring that, which is hard, but... I don't believe that the comment clearly indicates *which* thing disappears and I'm fairly certain that the comment does not indicate the hardware being tested
Jul 27 22:39:23 <timeless> ... the bug is requesting that Control Panel not have a Bluetooth icon if there's no Bluetooth adapter
Jul 27 22:39:41 <DawnFoster> I'd ignore him
Jul 27 22:39:51 <timeless> I believe the clueless commenter indicated that disabling Bluetooth causes an icon at the top of the Display to disappear
Jul 27 22:40:01 <timeless> DawnFoster: sadly, he changed the bug status from RESOLVED WONTFIX to VERIFIED...
Jul 27 22:40:04 <DawnFoster> never heard of him before, and it's pretty clear that he doesn't really know what he's talking about :)
Jul 27 22:40:11 <DawnFoster> hmmm
Jul 27 22:40:16 <timeless> if he didn't deal damage to the bug report's status, i'd ignore him
Jul 27 22:40:16 <timeless> but he did
Jul 27 22:40:31 <timeless> comment 8 is also damaging and never responded to comment 9
Jul 27 22:40:52 <andyross> timeless: bluetooth should work on an exopc.  What does "hcitool dev" tell you in a console?
Jul 27 22:41:12 <timeless> andyross: it did not work on the devices using the stack that was avaiable in SF
Jul 27 22:41:16 <timeless> and that's absolutely irrelevant
Jul 27 22:41:19 <timeless> please understand that
Jul 27 22:41:22 <timeless> the steps are:
Jul 27 22:41:31 <timeless> 1. have a device with no functional bluetooth adapter
Jul 27 22:41:37 <timeless> 2. expect not to see useless icons in settings
Jul 27 22:41:44 <DawnFoster> I reopened it :)
Jul 27 22:41:48 <timeless> DawnFoster: thanks
Jul 27 22:42:11 <timeless> andyross: there will be devices that won't have bluetooth
Jul 27 22:42:31 <timeless> just because the exopc technically has bluetooth doesn't mean that the software stack shouldn't not be stupid when it encounters such a device
Jul 27 22:42:43 <andyross> I know this isn't relevant to your bug vs. settings, but the premise is wrong: there should be a device present on that hardware, and it should work.  There were a few gotchas a while back with a patch being dropped, and one with the firmware not being present.  But I'm pretty sure that was all sorted out.
Jul 27 22:43:04 <timeless> ?
Jul 27 22:43:07 <timeless> the premise is clear in the summary
Jul 27 22:43:13 <timeless> > Bluetooth icon should either not be present or clearly indicate it won't work when no bluetooth adapter is present
Jul 27 22:43:29 <timeless> the summary does not mention exopc
Jul 27 22:43:39 <andyross> Fine fine.  I thought you were mostly complaining about bluetooth.  I'll leave your beef with settings and QA to others.
Jul 27 22:44:02 <timeless> andyross: right, i'm not complaining about bluetooth, just settings and QA
Jul 27 22:44:20 <timeless> if i wanted to complain about bluetooth, i would have filed a bug somewhere near bluetooth
Jul 27 22:44:32 <timeless> but it'd be stupid since i got a release note that clearly listed bluetooth as not working :)
Jul 27 23:14:00 <wmarone> Venemo: are you there?
Jul 27 23:14:21 <Venemo> wmarone, yes
Jul 27 23:14:43 <wmarone> ok, can you add smokku to the founders list for #cordia and turn off +m?
Jul 27 23:15:12 <wmarone> it's rather quiet in there ;)
Jul 27 23:15:19 <Venemo> wmarone, I already added him to the necessary privileges
Jul 27 23:15:54 <wmarone> ah, can you -m it anyway?
Jul 27 23:21:52 <berndhs> the cordia stuff focuses on Hildon ?
Jul 27 23:22:54 <wmarone> cordia uses hildon, yes
Jul 27 23:23:05 <wmarone> it's based on hildon-desktop after all
Jul 27 23:23:26 <berndhs> so its maemo5++ --> meego or something
Jul 27 23:23:50 <wmarone> well, it's meego. just the UX uses hildon/gtk3 instead of Qt
Jul 27 23:25:21 <berndhs> yeah
Jul 27 23:37:51 <nemequ> is conic still alive? I'm wonder how to handle https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=602578 and I can't seem to find any web sites, git repositories, etc...
Jul 27 23:43:55 <Venemo> wmarone, '-m'?
Jul 27 23:44:12 <wmarone> what smoku just did ;)
Jul 27 23:47:18 <Venemo> wmarone, and what is it good for?
Jul 27 23:49:14 <wmarone> well, when a channel is +m it is muted for all but operators and people with +v set by the operators
Jul 27 23:49:46 <Venemo> ah, that sounds very wrong
Jul 27 23:49:58 <wmarone> eh, I think it's just chanserv with some odd defaults
Jul 27 23:50:20 <wmarone> and it has its purposes
Jul 27 23:51:11 <Venemo> mhm
Jul 27 23:56:57 <CosmoHill> cyas
Jul 28 00:04:07 <Termana> morning
Jul 28 00:12:09 <berndhs> evening
Jul 28 00:27:47 <bonbinker> morning sir
Jul 28 01:07:15 <Elleo> lbt / X-Fade: all current build attempts appear to be failing with: "connect to store-vlan60.pub.in.meego.com:5352: Network is unreachable" (or some variation thereof)
Jul 28 01:24:25 <meivi> is it me or is meego 1.2's repo broken..
Jul 28 01:24:37 <meivi> cant install gstreamer-plugins
Jul 28 01:31:28 <nomo> so... I tested meego with netbook ux just now. first I was like: "wow, boots fast!" then I was like "where is the window list... oh it's this zone-thingy, arkward but I could live with that" then I was like: "hey isn't banshee a mono app? wtf?" then i was like: "tracker? indexing it all? whats next, sharing it?" then I was like: "fuck that shit!"
Jul 28 01:34:00 <Corn_man> Wait what?
Jul 28 01:35:50 <TSCHAKeee> nomo: so, let me get this straight...
Jul 28 01:35:56 <TSCHAKeee> nomo: you came in here just to troll?
Jul 28 01:36:07 <TSCHAKeee> nomo: if i may borrow your phrase here...FUCK THAT SHIT!
Jul 28 01:36:11 <TSCHAKeee> ;)
Jul 28 01:36:41 <Corn_man> TSCHAKeee I don't understand what he said.
Jul 28 01:36:51 <Corn_man> It's hard reading idiot.
Jul 28 01:37:01 <TSCHAKeee> yeah.
Jul 28 01:37:13 <TSCHAKeee> seems as if he's mad on religious grounds.
Jul 28 01:37:23 <TSCHAKeee> or just simply he doesn't like the software selection.
Jul 28 01:37:37 <TSCHAKeee> some people are funny.
Jul 28 01:37:57 <Corn_man> If he doesn't like meego I suggest he should try linux mint.
Jul 28 01:38:07 <TSCHAKeee> yeah, choice is a good thing
Jul 28 01:39:00 <jcharpak> isn't banshee standard on linux mint as well? :)
Jul 28 01:39:06 <Corn_man> Yes.
Jul 28 01:39:18 <TSCHAKeee> i really could care less
Jul 28 01:39:26 <TSCHAKeee> for me, MeeGo is a base system for me to do research work
Jul 28 01:39:40 <TSCHAKeee> i'm making my own appliances
Jul 28 01:39:44 <TSCHAKeee> and MeeGo is perfect for that.
Jul 28 01:45:41 <Corn_man> MeeGo looks like it would be awesome for tablets.
Jul 28 01:46:11 <vgrade> TSCHAKeee, \o
Jul 28 01:46:34 <TSCHAKeee> hey vgrade!
Jul 28 01:46:40 <vgrade> hows things
Jul 28 01:46:45 <vgrade> get your 950
Jul 28 01:47:16 <TSCHAKeee> fantastic, and yes
Jul 28 01:47:21 <TSCHAKeee> we've been going full steam ahead on qOrbiter
Jul 28 01:47:25 <TSCHAKeee> one sec
Jul 28 01:47:50 <vgrade> I've been working trimslice, http://www.meegoexperts.com/2011/07/nvidia-meego-battle-ground/
Jul 28 01:48:01 <vgrade> nvidia sent the hardfp drivers I needed
Jul 28 01:48:41 <TSCHAKeee> vgrade: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hz-InWQX4U :)
Jul 28 01:49:06 <TSCHAKeee> oh wow nice
Jul 28 01:49:11 <TSCHAKeee> that thing is iiittty bitty
Jul 28 01:49:31 <TSCHAKeee> as for me, I've been testing our stuff on my Archos 9 and N950 side by side
Jul 28 01:49:31 <nomo> well... that wasn't trolling by the way. that was pretty much my expirence from "wow!" to NonononNOOOO!!! in 10 Minutes. Some digging in "Meego World" I also found some more seriously bad things about this project, and I wonder what you guys are up to?
Jul 28 01:49:47 <TSCHAKeee> nomo: we're working.
Jul 28 01:50:29 <Corn_man> I'm toying with os's.
Jul 28 01:51:27 <jcharpak> just out of curisosity, how likely is a fully functional meego on an archos 43?
Jul 28 01:51:27 * TSCHAKeee is a core dev for LinuxMCE, and is working on our next generation UI engine (and UI)
Jul 28 01:51:40 <TSCHAKeee> jcharpak: you'd probably want to ask vgrade.
Jul 28 01:52:54 <jcharpak> it was an open question :)
Jul 28 01:53:24 <vgrade> TSCHAKeee, great progress. Qt looks to be all its cracked up to be
Jul 28 01:54:13 <jcharpak> so vgrade, meego on archos43?
Jul 28 01:54:16 <nomo> Oh, archos 43? very much unlikely. the openaos project might manage something in the near future, but I would expect it to be broken on all ends (like battery or wifi).
Jul 28 01:54:45 <vgrade> jcharpak, not familiar with the 43
Jul 28 01:54:54 <vgrade> what OS does it ship with
Jul 28 01:54:56 <TSCHAKeee> nomo: perhaps you would leave that to someone who actually spends his days doing hardware adaptation of our project.
Jul 28 01:55:26 <jcharpak> android 2.2 pretty stock as far as I know
Jul 28 01:55:30 <TSCHAKeee> vgrade: i'm loving it, and the N950 hardware is buttery smooth.
Jul 28 01:55:54 <nomo> where was my statement wrong?
Jul 28 01:56:09 <jcharpak> same tech as a droid x or a n900 more or less
Jul 28 01:56:35 <TSCHAKeee> jcharpak: if we knew what chipsets were available, we could tell you better.
Jul 28 01:56:55 <TSCHAKeee> jcharpak: Archos has actually been very lassaez faire as to allowing other firmware on their devices
Jul 28 01:57:06 <jcharpak> the os can be swaped with a very basic linux
Jul 28 01:57:32 <wmarone> jcharpak: omap3?
Jul 28 01:57:33 <jcharpak> but doing so violates your warranty...
Jul 28 01:57:33 <TSCHAKeee> jcharpak: try taking one of the existing adaptation kickstarts and see how far you get.
Jul 28 01:57:35 <Corn_man> For some reason I was thinking of arch linux.
Jul 28 01:57:36 <vgrade> jcharpak, sounds like you would be able to get a long way to getting a functioning device
Jul 28 01:57:51 <vgrade> as always the devil is in the detail
Jul 28 01:58:18 <jcharpak> ...and apparntly watermarks the device somehow so they know you did it
Jul 28 01:58:25 <vgrade> jcharpak, hardware adaptation is dangerous
Jul 28 01:58:30 <TSCHAKeee> I've been able to get al the hardware working on my Archos 9, for example (and it is a GMA500 x86, which is a hairy beast to get running correctly.)
Jul 28 01:58:56 <TSCHAKeee> i'm still hoping that Intel will release an EMGD with a working VA API at some point.
Jul 28 01:59:08 <jcharpak> oy the one intel video driver that doesn't play nice oon linux, right?
Jul 28 01:59:21 <TSCHAKeee> (but OpenGL/GLES and 2D work fantastic with it.)
Jul 28 01:59:34 <TSCHAKeee> oh it plays nice, you just have to match the environment it requires
Jul 28 01:59:39 <vgrade> jcharpak, never bricked anything so far, but there will be a first time
Jul 28 01:59:42 <TSCHAKeee> currently they build their driver for MeeGo
Jul 28 01:59:46 <TSCHAKeee> and Fedora
Jul 28 02:00:04 <jcharpak> not ubuntu/debian/mint?
Jul 28 02:00:11 <TSCHAKeee> but mainly, you have to use specific versions of Xorg
Jul 28 02:00:14 <vgrade> TSCHAKeee, fedora have an EMGD package now
Jul 28 02:00:26 <TSCHAKeee> jcharpak: if you match the Xorg, then have at it.
Jul 28 02:00:49 <TSCHAKeee> EMGD is a driver package intended for hardware OEMs
Jul 28 02:00:53 <TSCHAKeee> it's not meant for end users at all
Jul 28 02:01:03 <TSCHAKeee> so they really don't give a damn if an end user can use it.
Jul 28 02:01:25 <TSCHAKeee> really, it's main target is In-Vehicle-Infotainment computers.
Jul 28 02:01:35 <jcharpak> like nvidia and ancient nv15 drivers :)
Jul 28 02:03:07 <jcharpak> (yes I still have a 10 year old computer with a geoforce2 gts or whatever nvidis's 2nd gen video card was called)
Jul 28 02:07:31 <meivi> ...anyone else having trouble installing gstreamer plugins ?
Jul 28 02:08:51 <nomo> i think i read just something that meego doesn't include that, because it's a oem thing to or something like that.
Jul 28 02:09:26 <nomo> but found a vlc howto also.
Jul 28 02:15:57 <nomo> I thought about how to make meego better. but that I realized I'd propose debian but being faster, so I don't. by the way, have you ever thought about doing everything 3d, opengl and stuff isn't all that wise because of the lack of working 3d on linux?
Jul 28 02:17:09 <jcharpak> 3d works fine on x86 nvidia and amd and most intel
Jul 28 02:17:55 <jcharpak> it's the tablet/handset linux drivers where it's spotty
Jul 28 02:19:59 <nomo> thats why I am saying it. (oh and x86 is better but also not exactly all flowers and sunshine and stuff)
Jul 28 02:23:20 <nomo> jcharpak: about the archos from before. you realize that the archos kernel is in a pretty bad shape for general linux usage? android might be fine, but meego/ ubuntu/whatever will give you a pretty bad time trying.
Jul 28 02:24:39 <jcharpak> I know that there was a debian for archos project that looked like it was making progress
Jul 28 02:26:56 <nomo> you shouldn't belive in openaos stuff like that. if they say XYZ is "working" then they mean something like "50-70% working" or "I looks like it might, but actually doesn't".
Jul 28 02:27:42 <Corn_man> I need to break the link of thinking archos = arch linux.
Jul 28 02:28:31 <jcharpak> the alternative os is openaos
Jul 28 02:29:08 <jcharpak> you multiboot that and from there can install other os's
Jul 28 02:31:51 <nomo> wrong. it's SDE with angstrom linux rootfs. openaos is the project wich lets you multiboot stuff, they also trying to make other linux distos work on archos devices, but as far as I can tell, they fail.
Jul 28 02:35:01 <nomo> hey about meego... don't you think that suse OBS is also fail? wherever I look it just sucks.
Jul 28 02:35:50 <TSCHAKeee> care to actually back that up with some facts?
Jul 28 02:36:28 <TSCHAKeee> i mean...SuSE manages to build what amounts to a distribution with the HIGHEST package count and the lowest package regression count i've EVER seen in a distribution, EVER.
Jul 28 02:37:22 <TSCHAKeee> it's a build system, if it builds packages, and doesn't crash, it does its job.
Jul 28 02:38:06 <berndhs> builds packages for all interesting distro targets, very convenient
Jul 28 02:38:15 <nomo> as long you don't try to combine that packages to something as a useable distro, that is.
Jul 28 02:38:20 <Corn_man> I like OpenSUSE.
Jul 28 02:38:39 <TSCHAKeee> nomo: seriously, are you actually going to back those statements up? because right now, you're looking like a troll.
Jul 28 02:41:57 <nomo> to much of a pain, because my english sucks. if it works for you, fine it's not all that bad then but I can't see why.
Jul 28 02:43:37 <berndhs> nomo: you're feeling way too negative about everything. Have some tea, or a good beer, or some ice cream. Something pleasant.
Jul 28 02:44:01 <Corn_man> I need a copy of hiew.
Jul 28 02:44:24 <berndhs> i need a faster network :)
Jul 28 02:44:38 <Corn_man> Try motel internet
Jul 28 02:44:50 <Corn_man> Dial up speeds
Jul 28 02:45:05 <Corn_man> "High speed" My ass.
Jul 28 02:45:09 <jcharpak> ouch
Jul 28 02:45:22 <berndhs> oh just my local net is too slow, 100Mbit card in the middle somewhere, its a pain to copy 120 GB
Jul 28 02:45:34 <jcharpak> is it free at least?
Jul 28 02:45:38 <Corn_man> yes
Jul 28 02:46:33 <Corn_man> 50 kb/s Not worth even 1 dollar a gb/ Assuming you could get a gb by the time your stay is done.
Jul 28 02:48:00 <jcharpak> shoould jjust use an n900, n950, n9 whahever :)
Jul 28 02:50:12 <Corn_man> Any RTOS's you guys recommend?
Jul 28 02:50:49 <SpeedEvil> You can get most of a gig a day on dialup
Jul 28 02:51:11 <Corn_man> SpeedEvil I was being sarcastic.
Jul 28 02:51:30 * SpeedEvil used to download a lot over dialup.
Jul 28 02:51:34 <jcharpak> "yes but who would want to" :)
Jul 28 02:53:05 <jcharpak> I still remember downloading windows updates over dialup...PAINFUL
Jul 28 02:53:14 <nomo> won't ISPs nowadays disrupt or disconnect dail-up connections whenever it looks like it's acually beeing used?
Jul 28 02:53:35 <SpeedEvil> hmm
Jul 28 02:53:53 <Corn_man> Doubt it.
Jul 28 02:55:54 <Corn_man> Gonna goto bed
Jul 28 02:55:57 <Corn_man> G'nite
Jul 28 02:56:05 <jcharpak> night!
Jul 28 02:56:45 <berndhs> night
Jul 28 02:56:47 <Corn_man> Be back in the morning
Jul 28 02:56:57 <meivi> )= my internship sucks
Jul 28 02:57:07 <Termana> jcharpak, updates? Meaning more than one? You only need one update to Windows
Jul 28 02:57:12 <Termana> An update to a Linux distro
Jul 28 02:57:15 <Termana> ba dum tss :p
Jul 28 02:57:39 <berndhs> meivi: we wont tell your employer thats not paying you :)
Jul 28 02:57:43 <jcharpak> well yeah major reason I switched to dapper drake
Jul 28 02:58:13 <meivi> berndhs, yea, thanks
Jul 28 02:58:30 <jcharpak> of course I then got cablle modemm like a month later :)
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Jul 28 02:59:57 2011