**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jan 17 02:59:56 2008 Jan 17 03:06:58 mm hair of the dog Jan 17 03:07:54 lets see here Jan 17 03:08:03 damn you, sailor jerry, heh Jan 17 03:08:39 I hacked the install script as described in that bug and same old crap Jan 17 03:08:54 lovely heh Jan 17 03:08:59 try the source? Jan 17 03:09:09 scant: are you using optware mpd ipk, or slugosbe ipk? Jan 17 03:10:44 daniel, how easy this would be if you could have used the debian package ;) Jan 17 03:10:57 I don't honestly know Jan 17 03:11:05 no, it would be heh Jan 17 03:11:25 eno:i don't know Jan 17 03:11:43 eno: i ran ipkg update; ipkg install mpd Jan 17 03:11:48 openwrt is so easy.. it has its own make menuconfig, you pick the bits you want to build.. cross compile toolchain, kernel image, individual packages, etc Jan 17 03:12:00 and it just does it Jan 17 03:12:04 scant: what is the version, is the ipkg /usr/bin/ipkg or /opt/bin/ipkg ? Jan 17 03:12:33 i usually keep /opt last in my path and use ipkg-opt to avoid confusion Jan 17 03:13:09 teletype: good idea Jan 17 03:13:13 eno: my SlugOSBE install doesn't have an opt dir, so i guess it's using /usr/bin/ipkg, version 0.99.163 Jan 17 03:13:29 then you aren't using optware Jan 17 03:13:30 yay Jan 17 03:13:35 daniel, it works? Jan 17 03:13:42 must have made a typing error somewhere Jan 17 03:13:45 ahh Jan 17 03:14:00 did you check out wot i said above about the kernel install Jan 17 03:14:01 scant: try ask help from osas Jan 17 03:14:03 copied the line out instead of changing the bits Jan 17 03:14:16 commented? Jan 17 03:14:30 damn Jan 17 03:14:43 all kinds of errors on emchain Jan 17 03:14:51 ruh roh Jan 17 03:15:14 /usr/bin/fakeroot: 166: debian/rules: not found Jan 17 03:15:15 dpkg: error processing binutils-arm-linux-gnu__i386.deb (--install): Jan 17 03:15:15 cannot access archive: No such file or directory Jan 17 03:15:15 Errors were encountered while processing: Jan 17 03:15:15 binutils-arm-linux-gnu__i386.deb Jan 17 03:15:23 is where it appears to start to go all wrong Jan 17 03:15:28 did you emsetup again? Jan 17 03:15:32 emsetup --arch arm Jan 17 03:15:49 or dpkg-reconfigure emdebian-tools Jan 17 03:15:50 scant: ipkg list | grep mpd ? Jan 17 03:16:03 Error: emsetup is unable to proceed - cannot find gcc for arm! Jan 17 03:16:11 eno: i already resolved the issue Jan 17 03:16:16 grrr Jan 17 03:16:21 eno: i was just wondering if there was a way to prevent it Jan 17 03:16:31 wtf Jan 17 03:16:47 lol.. that's what you want it to do! Jan 17 03:16:54 try the dpkg-reconfigure Jan 17 03:17:11 scant: what's the issue, and what's the resolution? Jan 17 03:17:17 eno: i created a /etc/init.d/mpd script Jan 17 03:17:34 to which directory? Jan 17 03:17:40 which dir? Jan 17 03:17:58 eno: if the the /etc/init.d/mpd script is supposed to be created when installing mpd by using ipkg on slugosbe, it's not Jan 17 03:18:10 preferred working directory Jan 17 03:18:22 I guess I can leave it blank Jan 17 03:19:04 same thing with emsetup Jan 17 03:19:14 argh Jan 17 03:19:23 I should have just hacked the debian sources in there Jan 17 03:19:43 heh Jan 17 03:19:52 well you could manually build a toolchain Jan 17 03:20:01 or search for a package for gutsy for a precompiled one Jan 17 03:20:07 once you have that just do what i said above and you have your kernel Jan 17 03:20:14 and then you can build it in 10 mins from then on, not 8 hours Jan 17 03:21:49 a precompiled toolchain? Jan 17 03:23:08 i donno i looked but didn't find one Jan 17 03:23:10 you may have better luck Jan 17 03:23:17 eno: have you been able to reproduce this? Jan 17 03:23:23 yeah, look how well luck is working for me tonight Jan 17 03:23:38 well if it takes you less time than it takes to build the kernel on the slug, it's a win Jan 17 03:24:06 except compiling on the slug is a start and walk away thing Jan 17 03:24:07 woo, i've half figured out how to remove the damn annoying "slide to unlock" thing on my ipod Jan 17 03:24:30 this is like banging my head against a frying pan Jan 17 03:24:59 found a prog to dump a list of methods/objects from a mach-o binary, hacked around til i found out which one brings up the slide to unlock bar, and then made a little objective-C code to override that method with one that just returns void Jan 17 03:25:26 made a dynamic lib out of that and preloaded it before springboard (the ipod/iphone UI app) =) Jan 17 03:25:44 sounds like a lot of trouble ;) Jan 17 03:25:53 no, it's for fun Jan 17 03:25:58 plus i really hate the slide to unlock =) Jan 17 03:26:30 scant: i'm more responsible for optware packages Jan 17 03:26:46 Ubuntu and other Debian derivatives are not fully supported yet. Non-Debian distributions are not supported at all. Ubuntu users are recommended to create a Debian chroot for Debian sid and work with emdebian-tools inside that chroot. Jan 17 03:26:55 http://www.emdebian.org/docs/howto.html Jan 17 03:27:04 ah you're a maintainer? got to thank you then. Jan 17 03:27:07 good stuff Jan 17 03:27:40 does it tell you how to create a chroot? Jan 17 03:27:48 of course Jan 17 03:27:49 not Jan 17 03:27:52 heh Jan 17 03:28:23 teletype: glad you like our projects, your car-puter setup is really cool Jan 17 03:28:43 thanks eno. it's only phase 1 Jan 17 03:29:32 just the proof of concept phase, to make sure i could leave it booted 24x7 in there, and make sure it wouldn't overheat in the glove box Jan 17 03:29:35 do you think it's doable with a WRTSL54GS instead of (nslu2 + wrt)? Jan 17 03:29:53 probably, depends how much power it takes Jan 17 03:30:25 the WRT54GC is only temporary though. i'll put a USB 802.11 adapter on eventually. so i can act as a client too Jan 17 03:30:26 k Jan 17 03:30:35 hahahaha Jan 17 03:30:37 http://www.howtoforge.com/chrooted_debian_sarge_lamp_on_ubuntu_desktop Jan 17 03:30:46 daniel: it's easy, just use debootstrap Jan 17 03:30:50 "Have Your Own (Chrooted) Debian LAMP Server While Running The Perfect Ubuntu DesktopĀ " Jan 17 03:31:17 debootstrap will build your jail with one command Jan 17 03:31:34 debootstrap --arch i386 etch /path/to/jail http://http.us.debian.org/debian Jan 17 03:32:04 eno: apcupsd is available on this feed: optware_nslu2_cross_stable, but on openslug ipkg doesn't find it, and when i manually install it by wgetting the package, it installs it in /opt Jan 17 03:32:04 hmm I might already have debootstrap Jan 17 03:32:12 anyone know of a USB 802.11 adapter that both has an external antenna connection, and supports master mode? Jan 17 03:32:26 daniel, if not it's in apt Jan 17 03:32:40 scant: http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/Optware/Slugosbe Jan 17 03:32:49 how big are we talking, I have less than 1 gb left Jan 17 03:33:04 optware packages are supposed to be installed under /opt Jan 17 03:33:26 then just follow the directions on emdebian.org, to install the compiler bin from their apt source Jan 17 03:33:26 that makes them standalone and optional Jan 17 03:33:34 and don't worry about emdebian-tools Jan 17 03:33:52 if you have decent bandwidth debootstrap won't take long at all Jan 17 03:34:00 512k Jan 17 03:34:11 ah could take a little bit then Jan 17 03:34:13 might try this from work tomorrow instead Jan 17 03:34:14 shouldn't be too bad tho Jan 17 03:34:26 teletype: thank you for your help Jan 17 03:34:33 i have 18-19 times more bandwidth at home then work :) Jan 17 03:34:39 I will try and loop back around Jan 17 03:34:41 daniel, no problem, nothing better to do Jan 17 03:34:51 we have a 10 or 12mb f-t3 Jan 17 03:34:51 once you get the compiler just do wot i said above for the kernel build Jan 17 03:34:58 ah we have a t1 in the office Jan 17 03:35:05 all my servers are on 100 meg in colo Jan 17 03:35:39 thanks again Jan 17 03:35:40 well not all.. but the US ones. we have a bunch in UK on megabit =( and 2 in china that are SUPER fast.. but only within china. Jan 17 03:35:42 no worries Jan 17 03:35:53 2 megabit that should have said Jan 17 04:05:16 when should i use an optware package vs. an openslug/slugosbe package Jan 17 04:06:41 use optware when the package is not available from the native feed. Jan 17 04:06:57 or when you want it in /opt Jan 17 04:07:22 * mwester thinks the native feed is always preferable, but whatever... Jan 17 04:07:25 like with my setup, i've got /opt on a usb flash drive, with, well, all the optional stuff i don't need to make the car setup work. so it can do its primary functions without it Jan 17 04:07:34 mwester: is it the case, that generally, a package will be upgraded/updated in optware b4 native? Jan 17 04:07:37 mwester: it's just more convenient for above situation Jan 17 04:09:05 scant: There's no telling. Until recently, there was a package manager for optware, and none for the native packages, so optware usually was better maintained. We now have a package manager for both, so I suspect parity, with the edge going to the native feeds for all things that are closely tied to the kernel. Jan 17 04:09:19 teletype: Convenient yes, but you may end up with duplicate libs that way. Jan 17 04:09:33 true Jan 17 04:09:43 but that can be desirable too Jan 17 04:10:07 mwester: i would like to stay with the native feed, but i don't see a wiki page on how to port optware to native for packages that don't have equal versions Jan 17 04:10:08 when i get a second slug, i'd like to be able to pop out my /opt drive and swap it between them. but they won't have all the same base packages as they'll be in different applications Jan 17 04:13:32 scant: the native feeds come from openembedded: www.oe.org Jan 17 04:14:22 er, www.openembedded.org (sorry) Jan 17 04:20:11 optware isn't openembedded? Jan 17 04:24:37 No, optware is rather different. Jan 17 04:43:47 who is the package manager for slugosbe? Jan 17 04:55:27 http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/Info/WhoIsWho Jan 17 10:46:00 I have a problem with missing attributes and functions in the time module of package Python2.4. Can anyone help or direct me to someone who can? Jan 17 10:55:40 in particular, variable "tzname" doesn't exist (contrary to documentation) therefore function strptime fails with "AttributeError: 'module' object has no attribute 'tzname'" Jan 17 10:57:34 problem also exists in Python2.5, so appears to be a build problem Jan 17 15:37:09 hi Jan 17 15:39:07 has anyone here 'fattened' their slug Jan 17 16:07:54 * jprind has not Jan 17 16:13:03 :( Jan 17 17:27:04 teletype: you still around? Jan 17 23:03:31 This is probably going to cause me to be called all varieties of noob and invoke a flamewar, but which of the current nslu2 distros is the fastest for network performance? Jan 17 23:04:10 I'm running unslung right now and it is start to act weird like dropping the disk randomly and not allowing me to ssh Jan 17 23:04:18 and I just want to reformat the sucker Jan 17 23:04:33 * mwester rolls his office chair over to the cabinet, and begins to refill the tank on his flamethrower... Jan 17 23:04:36 :p Jan 17 23:04:45 heh Jan 17 23:04:59 Lunchbox_: What application do you have in mind? Jan 17 23:05:27 well, I am going to be using it for streaming music to all the computers in my house Jan 17 23:05:38 I'm not sure if I'm going to use samba or what yet Jan 17 23:05:52 but it's purpose is streaming media Jan 17 23:05:57 or uPnP.. Jan 17 23:06:31 Generally, the "BE" versions (Unslung and SlugOS/BE) can be considered to be "fastest" on the network, but it's really an acedemic difference. In reality, the advantage of BE for network performance is far overshadowed by the poor USB disk transfer rate. :( Jan 17 23:07:17 With all the current versions of Unslung, SlugOS, and Debian, just pick the most efficient music player, and see if that restricts your choice of firmware. Jan 17 23:07:42 * mwester suggests seeing if mediatomb is an option. Jan 17 23:07:57 lemme bring up google Jan 17 23:08:18 I find it interesting about the USB thing though Jan 17 23:08:31 Is the USB transfer rate enough of a problem that it would cause choppy playback? Jan 17 23:08:42 many people stream music fine.. Jan 17 23:09:30 Well, that's for disk I/O. For the media streaming, then real killer is that the NSLU2 doesn't have a floating point unit. So your selection of media players and codecs and such are limited to the ones that run in fixed point/integer math, generally. Jan 17 23:10:49 how about that new angstrom OS? Jan 17 23:11:02 Choppy playback can be caused by so very many things. Personally, I would avoid Unslung if you have any Linux experience -- going with SlugOS or Debian will offer a true Linux environment, and give you better control over the processes that run, as well as having a modern (2.6.x) kernel. Jan 17 23:11:40 I would prefer no Interface over the crappy one that it has anyway Jan 17 23:11:44 * Lunchbox_ ducks and runs Jan 17 23:12:04 angstrom is, IMO, not yet ready for folks other than developer-types -- as a general rule, I would say that if you don't have a serial port soldered onto your NSLU2 yet, then you shouldn't yet consider angstrom. It needs a bit more time, I think. Jan 17 23:12:35 gotcha, I'm not really into the scene enough to do the serial port yet Jan 17 23:12:42 I did the de/underclock Jan 17 23:12:55 thats almost childsplay ;) Jan 17 23:12:58 That'll help all sorts of things run faster. Jan 17 23:13:35 well, that was the idea, but now that my unslung install is acting so weird everything is messing up Jan 17 23:13:41 i can't find my nslu2 on the network after i flashed it with debian Jan 17 23:14:01 is openwrt stable enough to install? Jan 17 23:14:18 Oh absolutely Jan 17 23:14:24 nmap isn't showing it Jan 17 23:14:34 I was wondering if it would perform faster without the need for a USB disk to hold the entire OS Jan 17 23:14:37 smultron_: fixed IP or DHCP? Jan 17 23:14:45 dhcp Jan 17 23:14:53 Lunchbox_: but you need a disk for the media anyway, Jan 17 23:15:00 right-o Jan 17 23:15:38 plus any of the running applications would be cached in ram anyway Jan 17 23:15:38 smultron_: boot the device without the network cable attached, wait until it beeps, plug it back in, and see if it's at 192.168.1.77 Jan 17 23:15:46 so that was sort of a hair-brained idea Jan 17 23:16:02 mwester, will try that, thanks Jan 17 23:16:29 mwester, however my network is in th 10.0.1.* range Jan 17 23:17:04 No, not at all - there seems to be an emerging "culture" around the NSLU2 that says that the OS should always be on a flash drive. I have no problem with that, but it seems to me that it ends up often just wasting a USB port if you need a large disk anyway. JMO. Jan 17 23:17:42 no that seems logical to me Jan 17 23:18:13 smultron_: Did it correctly DHCP before you installed Debian (on the native Linksys firmware)? Jan 17 23:18:31 is it possible to install the OS to the same disk as your media share? Jan 17 23:18:42 yeah, it would be.. Jan 17 23:18:46 debian partitions the drive Jan 17 23:18:50 or you can select sizes Jan 17 23:18:59 so you can have an os partiton, then files and such after Jan 17 23:19:27 does debian perform as well as the other options out there? Jan 17 23:19:44 it seems like it would be a little bloated for an embedded system like the NSLU2 Jan 17 23:19:55 although I really don't know much about the distro Jan 17 23:19:58 mwester, yes Jan 17 23:20:18 Lunchbox_, it depends what packages you install on it.. Jan 17 23:21:00 mwester is quite a slugOS advocate IIRC Jan 17 23:21:34 I see, and you advocate debian I assume? Jan 17 23:21:41 not really.. Jan 17 23:21:50 Ive just got it on one, and unslung on the other Jan 17 23:22:00 Its horses for causes... Jan 17 23:22:03 I confess that I am not a debian user, and am biased towards SlugOS. My opinion is that Debian is a full-featured desktop operating system, and that it has installation and operational characteristics that match. SlugOS is tuned to small devices such as the NSLU2, and has characteristics that take into account the special needs for small devices that lack consoles. Jan 17 23:22:40 i'll figure it out later, gotta go. thanks mwester Jan 17 23:22:47 I'll buy that Jan 17 23:23:04 assuming debian is out of the picture, I'm torn between openslug and openwrt Jan 17 23:23:15 I would select SlugOS if the application is available on SlugOS because it's smaller, lighter, faster to install (by several hours), and beause when my USB disk or flash goes belly-up, I can recover by booting from flash with SlugOS (I'm just plain S.O.L. with Debian). Jan 17 23:23:48 Between SlugOS (OpenSlug) and OpenWRT, you'll have to decide - both work great. Jan 17 23:23:56 hmm Jan 17 23:24:15 and openwrt is designed not to need a disk - use from flash Jan 17 23:24:36 Anyone got a soundbridge here? Jan 17 23:24:38 see I find that a really neat feature Jan 17 23:25:18 but, I just read it uses uClibc Jan 17 23:25:26 does that lead to any problems? Jan 17 23:27:10 if uClibc doesn't lead to problems, it seems nice to where if a disk were to fail my little NSLU2 would just keep right trucking Jan 17 23:33:38 * Reedy_Boy should really try some of the other OS's - ie SlugOS/OpenSlug Jan 17 23:37:38 Ok now for a tough one (although you guys know your stuff), which would be more efficient, UPNP with a program like djmount so I can listen from amarok Jan 17 23:37:54 or a samba share (or NFS/whatever) Jan 17 23:41:23 samba is one of the slowest protocols on the slug IIRC Jan 17 23:41:24 errm Jan 17 23:41:52 so what's your favorite? Jan 17 23:41:56 http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/Info/Performance Jan 17 23:42:00 (I hate samba btw) Jan 17 23:42:08 lol Jan 17 23:42:28 ftp's faster than samba... Jan 17 23:42:42 yeah... Jan 17 23:42:48 that's just downright sad Jan 17 23:42:50 Im a windows guy.. So im a bit stuck as to what i can use... Jan 17 23:43:03 However, my nslu2 have only just started doing things Jan 17 23:43:06 ie a print server Jan 17 23:43:22 How does UPNP handle transfers Jan 17 23:43:29 I guess I should have a look at the spec Jan 17 23:44:20 the wiki generally has quite a bit of useful info Jan 17 23:45:43 im hopefully gonna remove the use of my server 2003 box to my 2 nslu2's... Jan 17 23:46:01 could do with trying to work out why my unslung one wont be reflashed via network though.. Jan 17 23:48:44 hope mine doesn't do that... Jan 17 23:48:54 no Jan 17 23:49:00 mine was fine, something went funny with it Jan 17 23:49:03 the other one is fine Jan 17 23:49:11 I haven't even tried redboot since I went to unslung Jan 17 23:49:19 needs investigating.... Jan 17 23:49:21 mwester, are you still about? Jan 18 01:21:04 teletype: ? Jan 18 01:21:55 hm? Jan 18 01:22:10 what's happening! Jan 18 01:22:13 nothing Jan 18 01:22:19 I'm sorry to say, "I'm back" Jan 18 01:22:21 banging my head against the desk over fw1 as usual Jan 18 01:22:50 so... I got my debian chroot Jan 18 01:23:01 seems to be working properly from what I can tell Jan 18 01:23:27 installed the emdebian-tools package and the post-install script worked better than on ubuntu Jan 18 01:23:45 but... Jan 18 01:24:02 dependency problems Jan 18 01:24:24 why not just install the binary packages for the compiler? Jan 18 01:24:29 rather than use emdebian-tools to build it Jan 18 01:24:35 um, ok Jan 18 01:24:52 I was trying to follow the instructions we were running with Jan 18 01:25:01 ah Jan 18 01:25:05 no i said that toward the end i think Jan 18 01:25:18 there should be an apt source on emdebian's site for the binary packages for the cross compilers Jan 18 01:25:19 ok what do I do instead? Jan 18 01:25:27 then wot i said about the kernel package build should work Jan 18 01:25:46 remember the first apt-get we tried that failed? when you added the source on ubuntu Jan 18 01:25:50 you'll want to do that in your chroot Jan 18 01:26:31 need help with making my own bb file Jan 18 01:27:01 teletype: what source? Jan 18 01:27:12 eh? Jan 18 01:27:18 it's on emdebian's site somewhere Jan 18 01:27:21 that's where i found it Jan 18 01:27:34 should be an etch source for binutils/gcc Jan 18 01:31:38 teletype: is this the one you were talking about? Jan 18 01:31:38 http://www.emdebian.org/tools/crosstools.html Jan 18 01:31:48 apt-get install g++-4.2-arm-linux-gnu Jan 18 01:31:51 yup Jan 18 01:31:54 that's the one Jan 18 01:32:02 that's the one that gives me dependency problems Jan 18 01:32:07 such as? Jan 18 01:32:15 what distro are you on? etch? Jan 18 01:32:35 if you're on etch are you using deb http://www.emdebian.org/debian/ stable main ? Jan 18 01:32:42 or unstable like they've got uncommented Jan 18 01:32:53 if it's 4.2 i think that's only in unstable Jan 18 01:32:56 it looks like sid Jan 18 01:32:56 you want stable and 4.1 Jan 18 01:33:01 yours is sid? Jan 18 01:33:07 it would appear so Jan 18 01:33:10 oh ok Jan 18 01:33:12 unstable it is then Jan 18 01:34:03 not sure if that'll work Jan 18 01:34:03 I had similar errors under etch - which is what I think you instructed me to install with deb auto chroot install Jan 18 01:34:15 under etch? i thought you had ubuntu Jan 18 01:34:28 i didn't instruct you to do that. a web page did ;) Jan 18 01:34:42 hm if you're on sid that should have worked Jan 18 01:34:51 i would have gone for etch personally Jan 18 01:34:54 who knows what changed Jan 18 01:35:01 hence the name unstable Jan 18 01:35:46 (10:31:36 PM) teletype: debootstrap --arch i386 etch /path/to/jail http://http.us.debian.org/debian Jan 18 01:35:57 oh you mean the way i said to Jan 18 01:36:03 did you use that command exactly? Jan 18 01:36:06 if so it's etch no? Jan 18 01:36:25 sorry i'm out of it. knee deep in fw1 bs =( Jan 18 01:36:34 I tried that and when I had dependency problems so I blew that away and tried it with sid Jan 18 01:37:13 dependency problems? oh when installing it? Jan 18 01:37:25 the crosstools packages i mean Jan 18 01:37:30 no with the endebian steps Jan 18 01:37:31 yeah Jan 18 01:37:54 installed perfectly on my etch box Jan 18 01:38:20 zarquon:~# dpkg -S /usr/bin/arm-linux-gnu-gcc-4.1 Jan 18 01:38:21 gcc-4.1-arm-linux-gnu: /usr/bin/arm-linux-gnu-gcc-4.1 Jan 18 02:04:07 don't remove the dir you made Jan 18 02:04:13 oops Jan 18 02:59:23 hello everybody Jan 18 02:59:30 hi Jan 18 02:59:44 i need some help with my unslung 6.10 Jan 18 02:59:56 can u support me? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Jan 18 02:59:57 2008