**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Apr 16 02:59:56 2008 Apr 16 06:25:27 morning Apr 16 07:56:38 03koen 07org.oe.dev * r48cd1ade... 10/ (1 contrib/angstrom/sort.sh mtn:execute true): angstrom contrib: add sort.sh Apr 16 07:56:43 03koen 07org.oe.stable * r02f2658a... 10/ (1 contrib/angstrom/sort.sh): angstrom contrib: sync latest changes Apr 16 08:17:15 re Apr 16 08:17:40 re Apr 16 08:34:45 XorA: ping Apr 16 08:34:53 ScaredyCat: gnop Apr 16 08:35:18 does the git cock up extent to the qtopia stuff too? Apr 16 08:35:23 extend Apr 16 08:35:54 ScaredyCat: it seems to extend to anything git :-( and doesnt even seem to be OM specific, so maybe its a bug in git fetcher Apr 16 08:36:08 :/ Apr 16 08:36:31 but yeah OM qtopia repo also had the OOM problem that the kernel one did Apr 16 08:36:38 and what's with all the 403's Apr 16 08:36:57 still got CVS_TARBALL_STASH commented out? Apr 16 08:37:35 * ScaredyCat checks Apr 16 08:38:19 * ScaredyCat sighs Apr 16 08:38:42 ~blame random-people Apr 16 08:38:43 * ibot blames random-people (and Canada) for all the evil in the world Apr 16 09:01:36 03koen 07org.oe.dev * r0283c5ac... 10/ (9 files in 3 dirs): xserver-kdrive: add 1.4.0.90 Apr 16 09:01:40 03koen 07org.oe.dev * r1023754a... 10/ (1 conf/distro/include/angstrom-2008-preferred-versions.inc): angstrom 2008: prefer kdrive 1.4.0.90 Apr 16 09:28:37 XorA: how can I force a git checkout and rebuild of a tarball ? Apr 16 09:29:32 ScaredyCat: I know not Apr 16 09:29:47 hrmrm.. Apr 16 09:29:51 RP & mickeyl are the experts I think Apr 16 09:29:54 seems stupid... Apr 16 09:30:09 s/git/stupid/ :-D Apr 16 09:30:10 it can't find the tarball (because it doesn't exist) Apr 16 09:30:33 but shouldn't it build the tarball if it doesn't exist? Apr 16 09:30:44 * ScaredyCat sighs Apr 16 09:31:53 * ScaredyCat nudges mickey|zzZZzz && RP Apr 16 09:37:05 man irc Apr 16 09:37:28 :) Apr 16 09:49:29 good morning Apr 16 09:57:19 koen: http://pastebin.com/m2857fc45 Apr 16 09:58:29 XorA: change the PR Apr 16 10:29:45 morning Apr 16 10:32:54 re Apr 16 10:37:06 03koen 07org.oe.dev * r7302918a... 10/ (8 files in 3 dirs): (log message trimmed) Apr 16 10:37:06 xserver-kdrive: add 1.5rc (1.4.99.901). WIP, Disabled by default: Apr 16 10:37:06 patch status: Apr 16 10:37:06 * enable-tslib: patch updated Apr 16 10:37:06 * enable-xscalibrate: is upstream Apr 16 10:37:07 * xcalibrate-coords: doesn't maybe, maybe it's already upstream Apr 16 10:37:09 * root-ppm patch: doesn't apply, needs updating Apr 16 11:41:25 uf. one mailinglist less to read Apr 16 11:41:31 openmoko-abusers this time Apr 16 11:41:51 hrw: you mean community? :) Apr 16 11:43:14 stefan_schmidt: what I wrote? Apr 16 11:47:56 hrw: abusers Apr 16 11:48:08 hrw: So yeah, abusers == community here ;) Apr 16 11:51:52 hi zecke Apr 16 11:54:38 whats going on, I dont read abusers ;-) Apr 16 11:56:01 XorA: You would just need a steve filter ;) Apr 16 11:58:52 mv ste* /dev/null :-) Apr 16 12:03:17 zecke: there are a couple of issues with qtopia-phone-x11 ... it appears that the TARGET-DEVICE isn't picked up correctly, and assassin ( task-openmoko-qtopia-x11 ) needs to be temporarily removed until thos completes his api changes for thepackagekit stuff Apr 16 12:06:08 ScaredyCat: or lock opkg to a version without the API change? ;) Apr 16 12:06:39 aye that too :) Apr 16 12:07:55 hehe, but my USB disk emulates a dead disk :) Apr 16 13:13:53 03tmbinc 07org.oe.dreambox * r281d0032... 10/ (4 files in 2 dirs): enigma2{,-plugins,skins}: use 2.4 release branch by default Apr 16 13:36:11 http://o-hand.com/jobs/ - OH is hiring Apr 16 13:36:58 re Apr 16 13:37:43 hrw: filling up the office then? Apr 16 13:37:56 * XorA notices all jobs are listed as in office Apr 16 13:39:08 ;) Apr 16 13:39:24 bit of a long commute :-( Apr 16 13:39:25 XorA: now you understand why my moving to London was so pure fun Apr 16 13:39:33 heh Apr 16 13:39:42 the OE position is interesting, but moving.... grml Apr 16 13:39:55 hrw: worse thing is I didnt see your blog until the day you revealed all, so I was extra confused Apr 16 13:45:27 maybe .pl office :) Apr 16 13:45:40 * ScaredyCat giggles... Apr 16 13:45:48 * ScaredyCat saw hand jobs Apr 16 13:46:19 The o-hand London office is near where my mother grew up Apr 16 13:46:26 * Crofton is not certain that is a good thing Apr 16 13:46:58 Crofton: I prefer to be self employment Apr 16 13:47:15 taxes thing Apr 16 13:47:17 me too Apr 16 13:47:21 boss thing Apr 16 13:47:45 Crofton: your family is scattered all over europe? and you have a lovely cat :) Apr 16 13:48:01 Crofton: mallum is not bad boss Apr 16 13:48:43 zecke, all over the world Apr 16 13:49:03 close family in England and Australia Apr 16 13:49:36 Crofton: well, you have to extend the outreach? apply at google for the moonbase? Apr 16 13:49:41 Good Morning Apr 16 13:49:51 * chouimat|work now knows that 500km away from his mother is not enought since his sister, who live 200km away has a baby Apr 16 14:14:40 * XorA watches mickey|bbiab open the can of worms on distro-devel Apr 16 14:15:23 XorA, ? Apr 16 14:19:26 * RP helps open the can :/ Apr 16 14:19:57 * CM just looks into it Apr 16 14:20:01 * Crofton wonders where the can is Apr 16 14:20:08 http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/distro-devel/2008-April/000347.html Apr 16 14:20:53 ah Apr 16 14:21:02 I'm not on that list Apr 16 14:21:30 who the hell thinks using qemu is how to compile stuff....roflmao Apr 16 14:22:57 using qemu is fine as long as you not on fedora, or ppc or spark or....... Apr 16 14:23:05 debian people .. Apr 16 14:23:27 and why is cross compiling wrong... wtf is going on... Apr 16 14:23:46 ScaredyCat, some people have strange ideas Apr 16 14:24:15 anyway time for me to off, I shall laugh tomorrow when this thread explodes into flames Apr 16 14:26:26 XorA|gone: ;) Apr 16 14:27:44 the funny thing is that Poky SDK *is* expandable in a way which one of om devels do on redhat Apr 16 14:28:42 I thought mickey|bbiab was rather restrained in his responses on that thread, but I do think the potential is as XorA|gone suggests... Apr 16 14:29:05 I think I shall stay away from it altogether, and focus on fixing bugs instead ;) Apr 16 14:30:37 RP: Like the last sentence in your mail.. Just adding a little fuel are we? ;) Apr 16 14:34:05 * * OE Bug 4181 has been created by pieterg(AT)gmx.com Apr 16 14:34:07 * * PATCH building xserver-kdrive-1.4.0.90 without XKB defined Apr 16 14:34:09 * * http://bugs.openembedded.net/show_bug.cgi?id=4181 Apr 16 14:34:38 * broonie notes that most of the DDs he knows doing embedded work use OE. Apr 16 14:35:12 broonie: OLPC guys used OE Apr 16 14:38:28 if only the people bitching would put time and effort into working on SDK solutions ... Apr 16 14:38:48 "I also want to add a personal observation about Openmoko. From my Apr 16 14:38:48 perspective there have been a lot of sharp changes in direction, often Apr 16 14:38:48 due to people's personal views on things and I think this lack of Apr 16 14:38:48 dedication to decisions has cost the project badly already." - Amen! Apr 16 14:53:00 CM: The one about Poky? Apr 16 15:24:49 RP: Yes :) Apr 16 15:35:01 http://ftp.5z.com/pub/gob/gob2-2.0.14.tar.gz no longer exists for gob2 .. 2.0.15 is the only version there Apr 16 15:36:38 Yeah, he archives the old releases pretty soon after he makes a new one. Apr 16 16:32:13 bye Apr 16 16:32:18 cu hrw Apr 16 16:33:45 beware my "How to use Poky SDK to build apps" post! Apr 16 16:33:59 ~curse openmoko devs Apr 16 16:34:00 May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, openmoko devs ! Apr 16 16:34:00 ;D Apr 16 16:36:07 heh Apr 16 16:36:21 ~curse openmoko, inc. devs, that is Apr 16 16:36:21 ;) Apr 16 16:36:22 May you be reincarnated as a Windows XP administrator, openmoko, inc. devs, that is ! Apr 16 16:36:42 * mickeyl wonders how much longer he can stand all these tiny fighting areas Apr 16 16:41:20 03koen 07org.oe.dev * rad52fedc... 10/ (12 files in 3 dirs): linux-omap2 git: add beagle patches and move to 2.6.25rc9 Apr 16 16:56:37 is there a build-essential equivalent package in OE? I want to build the standard dev tools for a target system and then install them on the target system. Apr 16 17:07:19 "The neighbours potatoes"... never heard it phrased that way before, but that's good. Apr 16 17:09:17 ya, love it Apr 16 17:11:40 * ScaredyCat stares blankly into the channel Apr 16 17:20:33 03jeremy_laine 07org.oe.dev * r0964506a... 10/ (4 files in 3 dirs): linux_2.6.24.bb: build yenta-socket module for mpc8313e-rdb Apr 16 17:20:37 03jeremy_laine 07org.oe.dev * r3aba2971... 10/ (3 files in 3 dirs): linux_2.6.24.bb: remove kexec on mpc8313e-rdb which accidentaly slipped in Apr 16 17:21:46 seems to me that there's a lot of discussion about things that should have been sorted out a long long time ago. This seems to keep happening it's like noone is prepared to make the decision and stick with it... Apr 16 17:22:42 nearly 12 months down the line from the release of the gta01 and it looks like yet another change (build system or underlying system).. Apr 16 17:23:04 it's a waste of time. No wonder noone is doing any real apps.. why should they... Apr 16 17:23:25 om will probably move to windows ce next month... Apr 16 17:23:43 and then symbian the month after... Apr 16 17:23:54 (all imho of course) Apr 16 17:24:50 mickeyl, there are people that like to cause arguments, don't let the bastards get you down Apr 16 17:26:33 Crofton: righto. usually i'm solid as a rock, but that constant nagging gets really annoying when it passes a certain threshold Apr 16 17:27:35 ScaredyCat: i think the problem is every once and then new people come into the play with the attitude of "everything you did until know was crap. now i'm on board and we need to do it my way" Apr 16 17:27:44 s/know/now/ Apr 16 17:27:46 heh Apr 16 17:27:53 that is normal human behavior Apr 16 17:28:03 is it? Apr 16 17:28:07 hell i'm glad i'm not normal Apr 16 17:28:08 :D Apr 16 17:28:17 my ex-research group is going through that pahse atm Apr 16 17:28:39 mickeyl, if we were normal, we'd be doing something else Apr 16 17:28:49 hahaha Apr 16 17:28:54 now that is oh-so-true Apr 16 17:28:57 windows dev's or asking people if they want fries with that Apr 16 17:29:02 :D Apr 16 17:29:33 it just seems to waste so much time... Apr 16 17:29:53 and nothing moves forward while everyone gets worried about if they are just wasting their time... Apr 16 17:30:34 so they stop doing stuff... wait.. nothing or little changes ... they start again... then the next pile of donkey poo turns up... Apr 16 17:30:38 * ScaredyCat sighs Apr 16 17:31:07 don't worry. the movement will continue. what we are doing with the "moko underground" stuff will succeed eventually. no matther whether om inc. will support that or not. if they support it, it will be done faster, that's the only difference Apr 16 17:31:43 yeah, that seems to work quite well.. Apr 16 17:32:06 I wish we could harness the bitching energy to creating really good SDK's from OE Apr 16 17:32:14 the thing is.. for an open company... they're being quite closed. Apr 16 17:32:44 there's been no announcemnt about what's going on with qtopia, elf etc... Apr 16 17:32:50 btw RP++ for engaing the libtool people Apr 16 17:32:52 how difficult would it be to build an SDK for OE? Apr 16 17:33:01 there is one Apr 16 17:33:04 ScaredyCat: I agree Apr 16 17:33:04 SDK with OE :) Apr 16 17:33:10 what's a definition of an SDK? ;> Apr 16 17:33:15 just meta-toolchain or more stuff? Apr 16 17:33:21 software development kit Apr 16 17:33:24 the toolchain Apr 16 17:33:33 mickeyl did it iirc :) Apr 16 17:33:35 and be able to extend toolchain with dev packages Apr 16 17:33:40 scant: oh :) Apr 16 17:33:48 not scant, ScaredyCat Apr 16 17:33:53 basically, to the point where the guys that want to dev shut up :) Apr 16 17:33:56 Crofton: I know the abbreviation ;) Apr 16 17:34:00 or find something else to bitch about Apr 16 17:34:14 I meant - is it just the crosscompiler + libs as produced by meta-toolchain, or is there more stuff to it Apr 16 17:34:17 * Crofton wasn't sure if we were having native speaker issues Apr 16 17:34:28 Jin^eLD, packages needed for run time Apr 16 17:34:31 * ScaredyCat breaks all the rules anyway.. Apr 16 17:34:32 x libs Apr 16 17:34:35 etc Apr 16 17:34:46 * ScaredyCat uses oe to build and develop with... Apr 16 17:34:49 assume the target has a know set of libs Apr 16 17:34:55 * ScaredyCat dances around Apr 16 17:35:03 well isn't that all already being produced by OE? Apr 16 17:35:14 the only thing that is still shaky is the meta-toolchain itself, but otherwise... Apr 16 17:35:19 it's all there, no? Apr 16 17:35:32 i don;t know if it builds anymore Apr 16 17:35:53 ScaredyCat: in stable it does, in .dev it gets broken all the time Apr 16 17:36:12 hmmm... Apr 16 17:36:16 btw there is one weird issue with it in both branches, can be worked around easily but hard to track down Apr 16 17:36:36 I submitted a PR for it... username/permissions stuff Apr 16 17:36:41 really weird crap Apr 16 17:40:17 Jin^eLD: fails miserably here Apr 16 17:40:39 binutils barfs Apr 16 17:41:30 ScaredyCat: what are you building? I was using ansgstrom 2007, oe stable branch Apr 16 17:41:33 for arm9 Apr 16 17:42:35 this is the om branch Apr 16 17:42:51 meta-toolchain-openmoko Apr 16 17:43:38 can't say anything about that, never tried it Apr 16 17:51:24 is viewmtn brkoen? Apr 16 17:54:12 Crofton: you mean this? http://www.openembedded.org/filebrowser/org.openembedded.dev - that works Apr 16 18:10:52 03koen 07org.oe.dev * rf2ba3663... 10/ (4 files in 3 dirs): linux omap2 git: update beagleboard sd patch Apr 16 18:10:52 hmm, I went a different way Apr 16 18:13:25 Jin^eLD, thats not up to date ...... Apr 16 18:14:39 oh hmm Apr 16 18:16:54 http://amethyst.openembedded.net/oe/viewmtn/viewmtn.py/revision/browse/ad52fedc3842762d7f68017f93f02cf2b16a33fb Apr 16 18:20:27 Crofton: this works here... Apr 16 18:20:31 if that was the questin :> Apr 16 18:20:35 s/questin/question/ Apr 16 18:21:00 click on packages :) Apr 16 18:25:33 I tried "files" and that worked, let me try packages.. Apr 16 18:25:43 uuh..indeed :> Apr 16 18:45:10 l8r Apr 16 21:27:27 re Apr 16 22:23:29 * XorA|gone reads email and cries blood Apr 16 22:26:26 XorA|gone: distro-devel? Apr 16 22:26:30 or something completely unrelated? Apr 16 22:26:32 mickeyl: yeah Apr 16 22:26:40 *nod* Apr 16 22:27:15 imagine what i have been doing here Apr 16 22:28:27 luckilly its too late for me to get riled up Apr 16 22:30:00 wise move Apr 16 22:30:06 or sheer luck ;) Apr 16 22:30:45 my level of participation ended. i said all i had to say. now it's your turn ;) Apr 16 22:31:08 I was gming WFRP so my violence is sated attacking my players with chaos worshippers Apr 16 22:31:18 heh Apr 16 22:31:37 I shall look tomorrow and summerise some of the FUD, I think I sucessfully shot down the .ipk fud :-) Apr 16 22:31:45 yea Apr 16 22:32:03 perhaps after a day sleeping he understands the difference between app developing and distro building Apr 16 22:32:04 *shrug* Apr 16 22:32:27 * XorA|gone loses heart with OM everyday Apr 16 22:33:05 don't give up until the powers decide Apr 16 22:33:11 all is chit chat until know Apr 16 22:33:14 s/know/now/ Apr 16 22:34:03 heh Apr 16 22:37:10 * XorA|gone gets the heavy weight champions belt polished for RP Apr 16 22:37:27 Hi everybody. What are you two talking about? Apr 16 22:37:42 thesing: read openmoko distro-devel mailing list Apr 16 22:37:56 what topic? Apr 16 22:38:12 Openmoko build infrastructure questions Apr 16 22:38:19 or the topic that just filled the list :-D Apr 16 22:38:54 for the records... it wasn't my choice to bring this topic up now, i have been forced to Apr 16 22:39:13 mickeyl: no probs, this has been rumbling around for ages Apr 16 22:39:22 *nod* Apr 16 22:52:32 mickeyl: hey, it looks like I mised a funny mailinglist ;) Apr 16 22:52:58 *cough* Apr 16 22:53:09 it would be funny if they weren't serious Apr 16 22:53:10 if you don't suffer from high blood pressure already, feel free to read Apr 16 22:53:37 i need to see a doctor to give him a chance to deny some mailing lists to me ;) Apr 16 22:53:49 I'll call my sister Apr 16 22:53:58 isn't she a lawyer? Apr 16 22:54:04 hehe Apr 16 22:54:07 another sister Apr 16 22:54:10 aah Apr 16 22:54:14 not the one we googled ;) Apr 16 22:54:20 mickeyl: ok... I take that back... after reading a few lines Apr 16 22:54:29 anyways, i need to watch some hours tv to be able to sleep after that day Apr 16 22:54:31 g'night guys Apr 16 22:54:35 flo_lap: *nod* Apr 16 22:54:37 * Crofton is from a family of over-achievers Apr 16 22:54:43 hehe Apr 16 22:54:46 join the crowd ;) Apr 16 22:54:56 mickeyl: feel lucky... I still have some work to do Apr 16 22:55:00 mickey|zzZZzz: good night Apr 16 22:55:03 http://www.healthgrades.com/directory_search/physician/profiles/dr-md-reports/Dr-Nicolette-Naso-MD-53367205.cfm Apr 16 22:55:05 gn Apr 16 22:55:43 bother, no one has rated her Apr 16 22:56:38 whats the list address again? Apr 16 23:06:15 For the record, I wasn't involved in the mailing list fracas today! :p Apr 16 23:09:35 Crofton: openmoko distro-devel Apr 16 23:12:47 yeah, people are confused Apr 16 23:13:07 they completely fail to understand how to build sane images for embedded systems Apr 16 23:13:40 walk through the Fedora Core/ Fedora Extras process :) Apr 16 23:13:48 and how they combined them Apr 16 23:14:38 imagine Openmoko (built from OE) and OpenMoko Extras, built with someone's idea of a tool chain Apr 16 23:16:33 hehe Apr 16 23:17:40 For some reasons people seem to like insane ideas... Apr 16 23:20:04 It seems to me that it's always only one guy who keeps such discussions running. Apr 16 23:27:11 usually... yes Apr 16 23:28:57 03koen 07org.oe.dev * r94558013... 10/ (3 files in 3 dirs): linux-omap2: enable usb for beagleboard Apr 16 23:30:56 zecke is a saint Apr 16 23:33:24 http://fosdem.org/2008/schedule/events/475 Apr 16 23:35:07 apparently no one working on apps for openmoko paid attention to this talk Apr 17 00:06:18 night all Apr 17 00:24:44 hi Crofton Apr 17 01:39:35 scant, gn **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Apr 17 02:59:57 2008