**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Nov 01 02:59:58 2012
Nov 01 09:42:02 <Jin^eLD> hi
Nov 01 09:42:29 <woglinde> hi jineld
Nov 01 09:43:07 <Jin^eLD> guys, is there a "stable" OE these days and is it maintained? I remember there was a stble branch long time ago, but I did not check the last developments
Nov 01 09:43:10 <Jin^eLD> hi woglinde :)
Nov 01 09:45:07 <woglinde> checkout denzel branch
Nov 01 09:46:04 <jackmitchell> Jin^eLD: you really want to be using danny now
Nov 01 09:46:14 <Jin^eLD> danny? what is that?
Nov 01 09:46:29 <jackmitchell> Jin^eLD: sorrt, OE 1.4 'Danny'
Nov 01 09:46:32 <Jin^eLD> we're currently on a tuned angstrom from hmm, early 2011 I think
Nov 01 09:47:00 <jackmitchell> http://www.yoctoproject.org/blogs/davest/2012/yocto-project-v1.3-released
Nov 01 09:47:07 <Jin^eLD> Danny is an OE release? or again someting standalone?
Nov 01 09:47:08 <Jin^eLD> thanks
Nov 01 09:47:11 <jackmitchell> and when I said 1.4 I actually meant 1.3 ;)
Nov 01 09:47:15 <Jin^eLD> :)
Nov 01 09:47:27 <Jin^eLD> so what is yocto and what is OE core, how do these to correlate?
Nov 01 09:48:55 <Jin^eLD> I know yocto is using OE but I was never sure if it is an own distro, like angstrom, or if it was "another OE"
Nov 01 09:49:22 <Jin^eLD> but I guess those answers are probably on the yocto project page, let me have a closer look :>
Nov 01 09:49:27 <jackmitchell> Jin^eLD: OE-Core is a repository of core linux package recipes, Yocto is a project which helps develop and make stable releases of OE Core with some additional 'developer friendly' features
Nov 01 09:49:47 <jackmitchell> so oe-core is the base
Nov 01 09:50:00 <jackmitchell> yocto provides a distro layer
Nov 01 09:50:27 <jackmitchell> and also provides some basic reference board BSP's
Nov 01 09:51:01 <jackmitchell> Jin^eLD: this should help: http://blogs.mentor.com/chrishallinan/blog/2012/04/13/yocto-versus-poky-versus-angstrom-etc/
Nov 01 09:51:58 <Jin^eLD> thanks, that link is exactly what I was looking for
Nov 01 09:55:51 <Jin^eLD> OK I see.. so it would make sense to switch to yocto and base our stuff on yocto releases
Nov 01 09:56:56 <jackmitchell> well you don't have to switch to the yocto distro
Nov 01 09:57:13 <jackmitchell> but it would probably be a good idea to base on oe-core stable releases
Nov 01 09:57:41 <jackmitchell> what I am currently doing is following master until we get a final release date
Nov 01 09:57:46 <Jin^eLD> rom what I read yocto is not a distro :)
Nov 01 09:58:01 <Jin^eLD> *from
Nov 01 09:58:27 <jackmitchell> ok, my apologies (it's all pretty convoluted), I meant you don't have to switch to the poky distro
Nov 01 09:58:38 <Jin^eLD> so yocto is using OE core, does a yocto release mean that there is an OE-core release along with it?
Nov 01 09:58:46 <jackmitchell> yes
Nov 01 09:58:49 <Jin^eLD> aha ok
Nov 01 09:59:04 <jackmitchell> so if you follow the yocto releases, you are essentially following the oe-core releases too
Nov 01 09:59:13 <Jin^eLD> I see
Nov 01 09:59:30 <Jin^eLD> so I guess my only "problem" is that I based my stuff on angstrom and did not roll an own distro or take poky
Nov 01 09:59:32 <jackmitchell> the yocto project bundles a version of bitbake, oe-core and the poky distro and yocto bsps into one package
Nov 01 10:00:12 <jackmitchell> well, it's not a problem that you used angstrom
Nov 01 10:00:55 <jackmitchell> angstrom uses oe-core too, angstrom is essentially just a distro configuration and some extra meta-layers
Nov 01 10:00:59 <Jin^eLD> it sort of is because angstrom took the systemd route which I do not want to follow anymore
Nov 01 10:01:06 <jackmitchell> ah, ok
Nov 01 10:01:33 <Jin^eLD> I patched the systemd stuff out for the last update
Nov 01 10:01:43 <Jin^eLD> but I guess by now they probably switched to systemd completely
Nov 01 10:01:49 <jackmitchell> yes
Nov 01 10:01:59 <jackmitchell> I believe Angstrom is systemD only
Nov 01 10:02:06 <Jin^eLD> yes, I think by now it is
Nov 01 10:02:34 <jackmitchell> by 1.4 I believe oe-core plans to have an option to use systemd or sysvinit
Nov 01 10:02:48 <jackmitchell> but I think Angstrom will stick with the 'forced' systemd
Nov 01 10:02:57 <Jin^eLD> yes, I guess so too
Nov 01 10:03:11 <jackmitchell> what I have done is to copy the poky distro config, strip it down and tailor it to my needs
Nov 01 10:03:53 <Jin^eLD> I more or less did the same with angstrom
Nov 01 10:04:07 <jackmitchell> I believe this is the best option for full control, you need your own distro really to get a grip on the whole process
Nov 01 10:04:24 <jackmitchell> and poky is a nice simple, well thoughout base to start from
Nov 01 10:06:48 <Jin^eLD> that'll be some "fun" I guess... to live update from an old angstrom distro to a new poky-based custom distro
Nov 01 10:09:51 <bluelightning> morning all
Nov 01 10:09:54 <Jin^eLD> hi
Nov 01 10:14:17 <woglinde_> jineld whats the problem with systemd for you?
Nov 01 10:14:20 <woglinde_> hi bl
Nov 01 10:14:36 <bluelightning> hi woglinde_
Nov 01 10:15:36 <Jin^eLD> woglinde: I guess I just don't like it :) but probably no rational reasons...
Nov 01 10:16:17 <Jin^eLD> but it's not just about systemd, I'm feeling that the predefined distros, like angstrom, are getting more and more complicated with more and more features
Nov 01 10:16:22 <Jin^eLD> which I do not need
Nov 01 10:17:11 <Jin^eLD> and it will become more and more complicated to get rid of those features so that they do not get pulled in and do not pollute the rootfs
Nov 01 10:17:19 <Jin^eLD> we have quite some .bbappends already
Nov 01 10:20:52 <woglinde> for an embedded system I would never take now something else than systemd
Nov 01 10:21:07 <Jin^eLD> really? what are the major benefits?
Nov 01 10:21:14 <woglinde> faster boot time
Nov 01 10:21:20 <woglinde> better service dependency
Nov 01 10:21:27 <woglinde> no shell involved
Nov 01 10:21:29 <Jin^eLD> we mostly use runit and only some non too relevant scripts are on systemd
Nov 01 10:21:36 <Jin^eLD> aem
Nov 01 10:21:39 <Jin^eLD> on sysvinit I mean
Nov 01 10:22:14 <woglinde> shell unless you put some script as executable in the configs
Nov 01 10:23:20 <Jin^eLD> boot time is not really critical for us either, he device does not have a display and is almost never powered off
Nov 01 14:17:37 <SorenHolm> Hi people:)
Nov 01 14:19:31 <SorenHolm> I'm currently running oe-core (about 2 months old metatdata). I see that utf8-support is somehow disabled. At least bash is unable to display æøå fx. I would realy like utf8-support enabled, do you have any hint on were I should look?
Nov 01 17:12:36 <alexandernst_> I just installed sb2 and qemu-arm on Kubuntu 12.10 but I'm getting this: ERROR: ld.so: object 'libsb2.so.1' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded: ignored.
Nov 01 17:13:07 <alexandernst_> Just to make it clear, I'm trying to compile libffi to get glib, so I can get gstreamer
Nov 01 17:14:26 <woglinde> what is sb2?
Nov 01 17:14:38 <alexandernst_> scratchbox2
Nov 01 17:15:09 <alexandernst_> In fact, I get this when I try to compile libffi: http://pastie.org/5167592
Nov 01 17:15:12 <woglinde> I thought the channel is called openembedded/oe
Nov 01 17:15:17 <robtaylor> alexandernst_: why are you asking on #oe?
Nov 01 17:15:42 <alexandernst_> I was told maybe you would know something about that, I'm sorry if this isn't the place 
Nov 01 17:15:47 <robtaylor> alexandernst_: also.. omg, someone using sb2?!!!
Nov 01 17:15:58 <woglinde> robtaylor maemoway
Nov 01 17:15:58 <robtaylor> alexandernst_: what brought you to that path?
Nov 01 17:16:15 <alexandernst_> robtaylor: I'm open to any suggestion that will make my life easier and let me compile everything needed to get gstreamer on ARM11
Nov 01 17:16:26 <woglinde> so use oe
Nov 01 17:16:34 <alexandernst_> robtaylor: some googling and not-enough-knowledge :(
Nov 01 17:16:43 <woglinde> btw why you need to compile it?
Nov 01 17:17:05 <woglinde> just install angstroem or some other oe featured distro and off you go
Nov 01 17:18:27 <robtaylor> alexandernst_: as woglinde says, easiest thing is probably yocto or angstrom
Nov 01 17:18:27 <alexandernst_> woglinde: I'm sorry, I'm really lost at oe, angstroem and any other things you could say. I need to google them. Anyways, I'm compiling gstreamer because I wrote a project using it. In fact, the project uses gstreamer, farstream and libnice
Nov 01 17:18:47 <robtaylor> alexandernst_: fun :)
Nov 01 17:19:06 <alexandernst_> let me google that
Nov 01 17:19:34 <alexandernst_> So, it's a distro, ok.
Nov 01 17:19:50 <alexandernst_> Are you suggersting creating a virtualbox with that distro and compiling there? :s
Nov 01 17:20:04 <robtaylor> alexandernst_: well, oe is an embedded system build environmenty
Nov 01 17:21:40 <woglinde> amgstroem is a distribution for installing on device
Nov 01 17:21:45 <woglinde> ups angstroem
Nov 01 17:21:59 <woglinde> which already has packages for gstreamer
Nov 01 17:22:10 <alexandernst_> oh, so no. That's not an option. I'm not allowed to change anything on the device.
Nov 01 17:22:12 <woglinde> you proably could even install ubuntu on your device
Nov 01 17:22:33 <woglinde> if you not allowed so you cannt even copy gstreamer over
Nov 01 17:22:48 <woglinde> so please your scenario more in detail
Nov 01 17:23:45 <woglinde> ups +describe
Nov 01 17:23:48 <alexandernst_> Oh sorry. I meant: I was told to build the project using gstreamer and farstream. Then get them build on the device's current OS (linux 2.6.34 IIRC). I'm not allowed to change the OS
Nov 01 17:24:12 <alexandernst_> So, I need to get gstreamer and farstream compiled for ARM11, and then compile my project on top of that
Nov 01 17:27:01 <woglinde> 2.6.34 oh my god
Nov 01 17:27:42 <woglinde> so no need for mess around with crosscompiler
Nov 01 17:27:57 <alexandernst_> woglinde: what do you mean?
Nov 01 17:28:04 <woglinde> if it compiles on your host, it will compile on the target
Nov 01 17:28:17 <alexandernst_> woglinde: I can't compile everything on that device! It will take ages
Nov 01 17:28:27 <woglinde> than you need an sdk
Nov 01 17:28:36 <woglinde> with the same libs
Nov 01 17:28:41 <woglinde> otherwise you are doomed
Nov 01 17:28:54 <alexandernst_> why? :s
Nov 01 17:29:02 <alexandernst_> I think you lost me again.
Nov 01 17:29:46 <bluelightning> gstreamer needs to link against a lot of libraries. if you link to versions of those libraries that are different from the ones on your target, the gstreamer binaries will not work when running on the target
Nov 01 17:29:51 <alexandernst_> There isn't any SDK. I just have a device that I'm paid to code for. The device was built from scratch (so it isn't any known-device, it's just an ARM11 CPU and some more stuff on it)
Nov 01 17:30:26 <alexandernst_> bluelightning: gstreamer (not -plugins) links against zlib and glib, so I'm crosscompiling those too
Nov 01 17:30:42 <woglinde> you got paid and you have no clue of crosscompiling?
Nov 01 17:30:44 <alexandernst_> and glib depends on libffi (which is what I'm stuck on) and maybe 2 or 3 more libs
Nov 01 17:30:51 <woglinde> man why dont I get such job
Nov 01 17:30:58 <woglinde> no clues bot a job
Nov 01 17:31:03 <woglinde> but
Nov 01 17:32:23 <alexandernst_> That is being rude. I'm just asking for some help
Nov 01 17:32:36 <alexandernst_> I bet you didn't know how to crosscompile the first time you did it, don't you?
Nov 01 17:32:36 <woglinde> sorry
Nov 01 17:32:58 <woglinde> sure but I did not take money for not knowing it
Nov 01 17:33:55 <alexandernst_> Well, I'm not paid for that project. I just work for my company and they assigned me this project
Nov 01 17:33:57 <bluelightning> alexandernst_: surely you don't just have a black box though, the OS on this device must have been supplied with some tools?
Nov 01 17:34:40 <woglinde> alexandernst_ okay
Nov 01 17:34:45 <alexandernst_> bluelightning: the closest thing is the FriendlyARM page. The device is a TINY 6410
Nov 01 17:35:08 <woglinde> alexandernst_ but again ask your company for an sdk
Nov 01 17:35:24 <woglinde> otherwise you will have great trouble
Nov 01 17:35:29 <woglinde> and ask for education
Nov 01 17:35:43 <bluelightning> alexandernst_: it's really the OS that's the issue rather than the similarity to another device
Nov 01 17:37:51 <alexandernst_> woglinde: I'll try, but I'm more than 100% sure that I won't get anything. And education... yeah... I tried once, I got a reply of the style "Aren't you a developer? You're supposed to know all that stuff" ("all that stuff" as in "all languages, all platforms, all everything")
Nov 01 17:38:15 <woglinde> alexandernst_ that would have been the time to quit
Nov 01 17:38:25 <woglinde> serouisly
Nov 01 17:38:32 <alexandernst_> Not the best momento to switch job :(
Nov 01 17:38:40 <alexandernst_> s/momento/moment
Nov 01 17:39:35 <woglinde> your other chance would de to find out which versions of libs are installed with which compiler build and trying to make an sdk yourself
Nov 01 17:39:37 <bluelightning> alexandernst_: so bottom line is, if you're not allowed to change the OS you need tools to match the OS. If that's some off-the-shelf OS on there that's probably not going to be too hard to download from somewhere; otherwise someone will have had an SDK at your firm at some point or another
Nov 01 17:39:50 <woglinde> but that will cost your more time than compile it on the device
Nov 01 17:39:59 <bluelightning> indeed, or as woglinde says you can try to cobble together an SDK yourself
Nov 01 17:40:26 <woglinde> okay time for dinner
Nov 01 17:40:28 <woglinde> till later
Nov 01 17:41:08 <alexandernst_> ok, thank you for the help. I'll try to compile on the device
Nov 01 17:58:03 <woglinde> re
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Nov 02 03:00:00 2012