**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Dec 13 02:59:57 2005 Dec 13 14:43:48 <[g2]> lennert so can I bug you about FGPAs and arm hw in here ? Dec 13 15:47:31 [g2]: sure Dec 13 15:47:47 [g2]: not guaranteed that you'll get the right answer, but you can always bug me :) Dec 13 15:57:32 <[g2]> lennert thx, ok first about the FPGAs Dec 13 15:57:53 <[g2]> I'm really near having a dev kit ready for the Loft Dec 13 15:58:04 <[g2]> that last piece is the JTAG support Dec 13 15:58:09 :) Dec 13 15:58:14 <[g2]> and I'd like to get that together Dec 13 15:59:07 <[g2]> I think there are 3 options on the table right now Dec 13 15:59:19 <[g2]> 1) Parallel adapter Dec 13 15:59:30 <[g2]> 2) ep1220's FTDI adapter Dec 13 15:59:39 <[g2]> 3) S3 adapter Dec 13 15:59:57 <[g2]> 1) will probably work for simple reflash Dec 13 16:00:17 ok, what do you mean by "loft dev kit"? Dec 13 16:00:19 <[g2]> 2 and 3 are very desirable for JTAG debugging Dec 13 16:01:10 <[g2]> The Loft dev kit is a Loft dev board, CD/DVD with kernel, rootfs, tools etc.... Dec 13 16:01:18 ok, i see Dec 13 16:01:53 <[g2]> I'd like to be able to offer a quick-start kit that has everything pre-built on it Dec 13 16:02:18 <[g2]> so they just stick the CD/DVD in an x86 box boot and everything is there Dec 13 16:02:44 <[g2]> others will just use the Debian port Dec 13 16:02:44 you mean bootloader/kernel/etc? Dec 13 16:02:54 <[g2]> I mean everything Dec 13 16:03:24 <[g2]> I've got source for everything and I can distribute IXP modules for customers buying Intel HW Dec 13 16:03:57 <[g2]> So the Loft is the mid-range HW Dec 13 16:04:21 <[g2]> I think the glomationinc hw and the NSLU2 are the low-end low-cost options Dec 13 16:04:48 <[g2]> There's a good chance I'll be able to have hw sent to several of you and that'll be the hw Dec 13 16:05:16 <[g2]> if the boads look good, that'll be my "low-cost" option Dec 13 16:05:26 <[g2]> s/boads/boards/ Dec 13 16:05:28 okay Dec 13 16:05:37 * lennert looks up glomationinc Dec 13 16:05:44 [g2]: if the parallel adapter comes with a small cpld, it outperforms the ft2232c solution several times Dec 13 16:05:48 <[g2]> http://www.glomationinc.com Dec 13 16:06:09 [g2]: ah, right, i remember Dec 13 16:06:20 the only drawback is the requirement of a legacy port that can't be found everywhere Dec 13 16:06:40 <[g2]> I think the program could get turned on in the next couple days and then it'll just be a wait for the hw Dec 13 16:06:57 'program'? Dec 13 16:07:24 <[g2]> yeah, I've talked someone in to sponsoring us with some free hw Dec 13 16:07:33 ah, cool Dec 13 16:08:16 <[g2]> it's kinda a trial flyer Dec 13 16:08:45 <[g2]> I think I can start with 5 9312-sx boards Dec 13 16:08:55 <[g2]> and PS + shipping etc... Dec 13 16:09:32 <[g2]> Right now lennert rwhitby dyoung and dwery and me are on the first list Dec 13 16:09:57 * dwery is happy to be on the list :-D Dec 13 16:10:16 <[g2]> dwery that was in not particular order Dec 13 16:11:00 I know :) Dec 13 16:14:23 9312sx looks cool Dec 13 16:14:34 8 GPIOs, which is plenty Dec 13 16:16:56 <[g2]> our config has 32MB flash too Dec 13 16:17:11 8 gpios should be enough for anyone.... :-D ehm... Dec 13 16:17:20 well, maybe :) Dec 13 16:17:26 i found out my via epia board has GPIOs too Dec 13 16:17:35 dwery: with 4 GPIOs you can do jtag, and jtag is enough to do anything ;) Dec 13 16:17:45 eheh Dec 13 16:18:04 you want to bitbang jtag on a 200mhz arm9? Dec 13 16:18:45 <[g2]> I think lennert asked how fast the GPIO can be driven Dec 13 16:18:54 via epia? my via c3 mainboard just exploded. bad caps. hate it. Dec 13 16:18:55 <[g2]> we need to check on both the Loft and the 93xx Dec 13 16:19:03 bullet: oh really? Dec 13 16:19:10 <[g2]> bullet sorry to hear that Dec 13 16:19:17 yeah. 2 years old. leaky caps from GSC Dec 13 16:19:18 bullet: my dual xeon intel server mainboard just exploded.. bad caps Dec 13 16:19:28 bullet: bye bye workstation Dec 13 16:19:33 love it Dec 13 16:20:37 <[g2]> lennert sorry to hear about the workstation Dec 13 16:21:36 i wouldnt have expected bad caps on a intel mainboard. that sure is a shame Dec 13 16:22:04 <[g2]> I guess they buy parts in China like everyone else Dec 13 16:22:11 yah Dec 13 16:22:51 this mainboard still goes for $400 Dec 13 16:22:58 it was a lot more two years ago Dec 13 16:23:09 [g2]: the 9312sx is a nice board! Dec 13 16:23:40 [g2]: a/d and d/a converters.. yummy Dec 13 16:23:46 <[g2]> I'm glad you like it :) Dec 13 16:23:49 [g2]: what does this thing cost normally? Dec 13 16:23:56 <[g2]> $195 US Dec 13 16:24:15 ai Dec 13 16:24:31 <[g2]> that's Q1 Dec 13 16:24:33 nice toys are always too expensive Dec 13 16:24:35 Q1 ? Dec 13 16:24:40 <[g2]> with 32 MB flash Dec 13 16:24:41 <[g2]> Quantity 1 Dec 13 16:24:45 oh Dec 13 16:25:03 <[g2]> lennert for you it shouldn't cost anything soon :) Dec 13 16:25:04 i see Dec 13 16:25:25 i kind of feel guilty when people give me stuff but i guess i shouldn't complain :) Dec 13 16:25:51 <[g2]> I'll bet you don't know why ppl give you stuff Dec 13 16:26:16 i have no idea whatsoever Dec 13 16:26:29 well, they don't give me lots of stuff though Dec 13 16:26:34 * [g2] guesses 95% of the time it's as a "thank-you" for all the stuff you've given to other ppl Dec 13 16:26:42 just every now and then Dec 13 16:26:53 well Dec 13 16:27:04 <[g2]> heh, I'm looking to change that "they don't give me lots of stuff" prot Dec 13 16:27:06 <[g2]> part Dec 13 16:27:19 a company would rather pay for a developer's hardware instead of paying his salary! Dec 13 16:27:32 $200 versus $X/hr Dec 13 16:28:03 <[g2]> well it's how much a company can commit Dec 13 16:28:14 <[g2]> $1K gets 5 boards Dec 13 16:28:15 true.. Dec 13 16:28:21 they want something in return as well Dec 13 16:28:46 <[g2]> well in this case it's kinda more like an experiment Dec 13 16:28:48 when giving folks hardware it's hard to say whether it'll give anything in return Dec 13 16:28:56 <[g2]> right Dec 13 16:29:11 i heard a while ago that of all the people that the linux-hppa people gave hppa hardware, only about 20% contributed actual code Dec 13 16:29:36 gah, management is hard. glad i'm just a coder. Dec 13 16:29:40 <[g2]> well you guys are all proven contribs :) Dec 13 16:30:01 yeah but you still can't say whether we'll continue contribbing, depends on so many factors really Dec 13 16:30:16 <[g2]> it does Dec 13 16:30:25 depends on whether something is in our particular area of expertise, whether it's fun, whether we'll have time Dec 13 16:30:36 also: on how communication with other developers with the same hardware goes Dec 13 16:30:59 if there's a prick with the same hardware, and you bump into that person too often, you can easily lose your pleasure in hacking on that hardware, f.e. Dec 13 16:31:00 <[g2]> well I'll be setting up a ml Dec 13 16:31:11 even if the actual hardware itself is ueber-cool Dec 13 16:31:30 <[g2]> right will have to have a prick-ban Dec 13 16:31:34 hehe Dec 13 16:31:35 <[g2]> girls only :) Dec 13 16:31:38 lol Dec 13 16:31:47 no hacking will get done then :) Dec 13 16:31:48 <[g2]> dongles need not apply Dec 13 16:32:16 :) Dec 13 16:32:19 ok, bed time for me, folks Dec 13 16:32:22 <[g2]> nite Dec 13 16:32:28 i'm off -- g'nite all Dec 13 16:34:50 <[g2]> lennert does your jtag.c code work on the PC ? Dec 13 16:45:26 [g2]: if you want, have a look at this: :pserver:anonymous@mmd.ath.cx:2401/openocd - the jtag interface code works with wigglers, ft2232c and a new config for amontec's chameleon dongle Dec 13 16:45:48 xsvf only works for xilinx coolrunner Dec 13 16:46:23 target support for arm7tdmi and arm9tdmi is there, a bug with breakpoint handling is still in it, and mmu/cache support is missing Dec 13 16:46:29 <[g2]> vmaster ok I'll check it out Dec 13 16:47:29 ok... i'm gone, too - n8 Dec 13 16:48:32 <[g2]> nite Dec 13 18:06:44 you don't say... Dec 13 18:52:15 * [g2] hugs ka6sox-office Dec 13 18:52:19 <[g2]> DOH! Dec 13 18:52:26 * [g2] hugs kas11 Dec 13 18:52:34 <[g2]> damn auto complete ! Dec 13 18:53:24 <[g2]> kas11 you know I've got hw now right ? Dec 13 19:01:31 Hiya [g2] *s* Dec 13 19:01:49 <[g2]> thx for stopping by! Dec 13 19:01:59 <[g2]> I hope you are well Dec 13 19:02:05 [g2] ... nope...I have had my head down for ages now...tell me more Dec 13 19:02:37 <[g2]> that's head down out of the loop right ? not head down not well ? Dec 13 19:02:52 doing fine here...just out slummin' tonite ;) Dec 13 19:02:58 <[g2]> http://www.giantshoulderinc.com/hw-4533 Dec 13 19:03:07 <[g2]> and ab3/case.jpg Dec 13 19:08:57 very kewl :) Dec 13 19:09:18 <[g2]> thx Dec 13 19:09:28 <[g2]> 533Mhz IXP425 and 64MB Dec 13 19:10:05 getting any inquiries from Tampa? I know where they could get someone to work on software for it cheap ;) Dec 13 19:11:54 <[g2]> not yet :) Dec 13 19:12:20 <[g2]> however if you're interested in playing with some hw I may be getting some to give away soon Dec 13 19:12:57 sorta like a fast slug without the warts.... Dec 13 19:13:57 I'd love too but i've moved so my working facilities are somewhat on the limited side right now Dec 13 19:14:47 <[g2]> yeah, it's called the Loft Dec 13 19:14:57 <[g2]> the other hw is from a different co Dec 13 19:15:04 <[g2]> http://www.glomationinc.com Dec 13 19:15:07 <[g2]> the 9312 Dec 13 19:15:46 <[g2]> kas11 still playing with the servers ? Dec 13 19:15:58 I'll prolly be moving to a bigger place in the Spring...and maybe even gainfully employed...this retired thing is not all its cracked up to be Dec 13 19:16:45 Not been doing much for the last couple months other than playing with a new laptop Dec 13 19:17:11 <[g2]> cool what kind ? Dec 13 19:17:55 got an X2 processor for the main box but haven't done much with it other than load a smp kernel... Dec 13 19:19:03 <[g2]> I think the X2's look way cool Dec 13 19:19:14 an HP zv6233...Athlon 64 3200+ with 512 mb...decent lil thang and I am still a non-Intel house if you don't count the slug that is lost in storage somewhere *lol* Dec 13 19:19:32 <[g2]> heh Dec 13 19:19:38 <[g2]> non-Intel x86 Dec 13 19:20:19 yeppers...altho I've been contaminated by the dreaded CSR ;) Dec 13 19:22:50 for some odd reason I've also developed a desire to tinker with an Xbox 360...I guess it is my yen for a PowerPC box to play with and the triple core Dec 13 19:23:20 <[g2]> you saw they hacked the fs right ? Dec 13 19:23:40 fortunately, the are composed largely of unobtainium so my check book hasn't yet suffered Dec 13 19:24:07 * [g2] lusts after the Nokia 770 more Dec 13 19:24:16 <[g2]> they cost around the same Dec 13 19:25:07 uh huh...but I expect there are many more secrets to decipher before linux is running on one...since I don't game, seems a waste of money now since I am way too lazy to actually hack most of that secret stuff anymore Dec 13 19:25:33 <[g2]> I've got the Halo games Dec 13 19:25:42 <[g2]> I can see later next year picking one up Dec 13 19:26:49 I had a friend who generated $400 worth of overages one month asking for my advice on his racecar...so I refuse to own anything with the Nokia logo on it now Dec 13 19:27:34 <[g2]> heh Dec 13 20:15:08 ok...gotta go...hope things continue to go well, [g2] ... and hi to ka6sox if he ever comes out of hiding ;) Dec 13 20:15:56 drat missed her. Dec 14 02:08:21 [g2]: it does **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Dec 14 02:59:56 2005