**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Jan 11 02:59:57 2009 Jan 11 05:54:39 followinf this example and it's not working Jan 11 06:12:16 anyone who might be able to shed some light on swallowing an etk widget in to an edje part, particularly with etk_embed_position_method_set();? Jan 11 06:57:55 * raster knows nigh nothing of etk Jan 11 06:58:34 heh Jan 11 06:58:52 got the errors worked out, but the widget just isn't showing Jan 11 07:06:56 following this example: http://docs.enlightenment.org/api/etk/html/group__Etk__Embed.html except i have colorpicker = etk_entry_new(); and i named the Evas object Search Jan 11 07:09:22 is that horibly out of date or something? Jan 11 07:09:59 it is possible Jan 11 07:10:09 i didnt write etk - so the best u can do is.. read the src Jan 11 07:10:14 as thats what i would do Jan 11 07:11:20 any way to get text entry fields and scrolled lists w/o etk? Jan 11 07:13:01 elementary Jan 11 07:13:01 :) Jan 11 07:13:11 and it is much easier to swallow/mix Jan 11 07:13:16 it gives u standard evas objects Jan 11 07:13:22 hrm Jan 11 07:13:52 elementary already available as an ipk for the fr? Jan 11 07:14:25 http://trac.enlightenment.org/e/wiki/Elementary Jan 11 07:14:27 yes Jan 11 07:14:30 shr is using it Jan 11 07:15:03 perhaps what i ned to do then is figure out how to get my app to compile on the fr it's self Jan 11 07:24:54 thats hard Jan 11 07:25:06 as u now need to install all the dev tools Jan 11 07:25:10 gcc, all -dev packages etc. Jan 11 07:25:21 possibly autofoo (autoconf/make/libootl) etc. Jan 11 07:27:36 not to sure what better options i have Jan 11 07:27:45 do dev on your desktop Jan 11 07:27:56 i do all of mine there Jan 11 07:27:59 much faster and simpler Jan 11 07:28:02 debugging is much easier Jan 11 07:30:23 there is very little need to dev on the target EXCEPT for: Jan 11 07:30:27 1. speed testing Jan 11 07:30:59 2. real dirty inline assembly that is only supported on the target (you cant test arm asm on your x886.. well not sanely - u'd use qemu then anyway and by then the point is moot) Jan 11 07:31:11 3. driver writing for hardware that is only on the target Jan 11 07:31:17 everything else can be done on the desktop Jan 11 07:31:37 (unless it needs a service that is WORKING that only works on the target thanks to binaries or hardware) Jan 11 07:33:01 have been using my desktop, unfortunately the guy who took over the e17 rept for fedora seems to be very half hearted about it, last builds are from 2008-05 Jan 11 07:34:00 oh just build from svn Jan 11 07:34:02 thats trivial Jan 11 07:34:10 maybe i need to give up on him to and start building my own rpms again Jan 11 07:34:24 http://www.rasterman.com/files/get_e.sh Jan 11 07:34:35 all u need to do is make sure u have dependencies installed Jan 11 07:34:36 like gcc Jan 11 07:34:41 and libpng-devel Jan 11 07:34:47 libjpeg-devel Jan 11 07:34:49 or whatever Jan 11 07:34:52 thats just rpm goop Jan 11 07:35:04 if u want look at the .sh and there is an os detection bit Jan 11 07:35:08 that can install packages Jan 11 07:35:17 if u work out what u had to add over a base fedora install Jan 11 07:35:19 list them there Jan 11 07:35:23 did my own script, made rpms for all of efl, and a good number of the apps in about an hour, assuming no spec file updates needed/etc Jan 11 07:35:25 with am rpm -Uvh Jan 11 07:35:34 or yum install line Jan 11 07:35:50 ok - fair enough Jan 11 07:35:58 it is just as easy to do a direct src install Jan 11 07:36:04 its clean and wont mess outside its prefix Jan 11 07:37:00 imlib wouldn't conflict with the existing imlib install? Jan 11 07:37:42 u dont need imlib Jan 11 07:37:48 checlk get_e.sh Jan 11 07:37:50 which, iirc, is the only package of all of efl that is pre-installed in fedora, but that's cause so much uses it Jan 11 07:38:08 CORE_MODULES="eina eet evas ecore e_dbus efreet embryo edje" Jan 11 07:38:08 E_MODULES="e" Jan 11 07:38:08 k, i'll take a look at it Jan 11 07:38:12 thats all thats installed Jan 11 07:38:27 u dont need anythnig else Jan 11 07:38:34 THEN if u want - u can just build elementary Jan 11 07:38:35 hrm Jan 11 07:38:37 it needs nothnig more Jan 11 07:39:08 10 packages...that's not bad at all Jan 11 07:39:39 yes Jan 11 07:39:42 i had my script doing something like 30, was a real pain after major changes in svn :) Jan 11 07:39:43 its not as bad as u think Jan 11 07:39:51 its very easy Jan 11 07:39:57 that gets u everything u need Jan 11 07:40:04 u can run e in xephyr with illume profile Jan 11 07:40:10 to sumulate the exact same "Desktop" Jan 11 07:40:16 u have all u need there Jan 11 07:40:16 :) Jan 11 07:40:22 as i said - elementary is an addon then Jan 11 07:40:31 life is so much easier doing your dev that way Jan 11 07:40:53 anyway - it's my suggestion - it's how i do things and i am often amazed at how people complain how much trouble it is Jan 11 07:40:57 when it really is very little Jan 11 07:41:07 the good bit is all of "core efl" and e is totalyl consistent Jan 11 07:41:13 they all build and install the same exact way Jan 11 07:41:16 no exceptions Jan 11 07:41:45 then all i would need the fr for is when i'm finally ready to add the fso dbus calls and do final tweaking on the edje Jan 11 07:42:28 yup Jan 11 07:42:30 bingo Jan 11 07:42:38 thats why i am leaving fso hoosk till last Jan 11 07:42:46 as i can do all my stuff without them Jan 11 07:42:54 in fact i'd love to see fso witha n emulation-mode Jan 11 07:43:02 run on desktop and pretend u have a gsm modem etc. Jan 11 07:43:09 be able to inject events like incoming calls Jan 11 07:43:11 or sms's Jan 11 07:43:12 etc. Jan 11 07:43:22 someone in here seemed to be making an fso emulator Jan 11 07:44:10 forget who, but i could swear they were tied in to shr somehow Jan 11 07:47:18 waiting for it... Jan 11 07:47:19 :) Jan 11 07:48:26 mrmoku: i found it http://www.opkg.org/package_95.html Jan 11 07:48:36 i'm afraid you've lost me Jan 11 07:48:51 mrmoku: fdom uses a python script for the desktop submenus Jan 11 07:53:06 thats evil Jan 11 07:53:41 whats evil? Jan 11 07:54:47 scripts hacking away at the directory of .desktop symlinks to simulate subdirs Jan 11 07:54:47 :) Jan 11 07:56:35 raster: any consequences?;-) Jan 11 07:57:13 hmm well if u install/uninstall apps illume will just delete and overwrite it all Jan 11 07:57:19 it is evil still Jan 11 07:57:20 :) Jan 11 07:57:52 so we will avoid installing new apps;-) Jan 11 07:57:57 but the launcher was a quick 2hr afternoon hack to replace the slider mode launcher i spent a while on as that slider mode is sean's design Jan 11 07:57:59 and he wanted that Jan 11 07:58:13 i dont intend to invest any more time into the launcher as it stands because i didnt like it Jan 11 07:58:20 but it was better than the alternative Jan 11 07:58:37 launcher=apps launcher? Jan 11 07:59:08 yes Jan 11 07:59:14 i dont use it Jan 11 07:59:15 the icons u can scroll and press to run something Jan 11 07:59:27 on the desktop Jan 11 07:59:43 okay Jan 11 08:00:17 i actually had other ideas before what u saw Jan 11 08:00:19 but they didnt happen Jan 11 08:00:23 i probably will dig them back up Jan 11 08:00:39 the users need something like that Jan 11 08:00:49 as of different reasons Jan 11 08:01:34 some app should have the same positions on the desktop Jan 11 08:01:59 at least for me: dialer, sms tool, contacts, terminal Jan 11 08:02:17 i dont want to search them if i install a new app or delete one Jan 11 08:02:46 its not really searching ... Jan 11 08:02:54 BluesLee: i agree. but i am focusing my app on dialer, calendar, sms(/e-mail eventually), and contacts Jan 11 08:03:23 with a "today" screen Jan 11 08:03:32 kinda 2007.2-esque Jan 11 08:03:38 AntonTakk: sounds good Jan 11 08:04:00 BluesLee: i agree Jan 11 08:04:11 BluesLee: i wanted to allow you to place app icons anywhere u like Jan 11 08:04:14 and if i am in the mood to play something i press games and look what is there Jan 11 08:04:16 like cions on a normal desktop Jan 11 08:04:22 or.. andorid did it that way Jan 11 08:04:28 be able to have ways to arrange them Jan 11 08:04:38 mix that with desktop gagdtes that display time, status of things etc. Jan 11 08:04:49 its a bad workaround to add # or . in the desktop files Jan 11 08:05:24 so as such "T^oday" would just be your deskm,top config with whatever gadgets u have laid out Jan 11 08:05:37 raster: on my zaurus i have an app which does rearranging, choosing icons, categories ... Jan 11 08:05:41 as e already has virtual desktops - this means we can have one.. per virtual desktop Jan 11 08:05:41 :) Jan 11 08:05:50 BluesLee: e has this alreayd build in Jan 11 08:05:53 gadman :) Jan 11 08:05:59 wel for the desktop Jan 11 08:06:03 and filemanager too Jan 11 08:06:08 anyway Jan 11 08:06:14 i just never got to it Jan 11 08:06:48 virtual desktop means several desktops where i can put already started (!) apps or not? Jan 11 08:07:31 eh, i'm not really a fan of just having an ultra-small desktop with icons Jan 11 08:07:37 or can i put one desktop icons from desk1 to desk2 Jan 11 08:07:57 i dont use e on my pc:-) Jan 11 08:08:04 so i dont know .. Jan 11 08:09:06 AntonTakk: you have a working app for home screen? Jan 11 08:09:38 BluesLee: its technically very easy to do that Jan 11 08:09:43 assing a different fm dir per desktop Jan 11 08:10:04 AntonTakk: wait till i get to it then Jan 11 08:10:09 until then u have what u see Jan 11 08:10:09 :) Jan 11 08:10:31 maybe it makes me a sad little man, but i actually kinda like large portions of how the win mobile ui is done, granted there are some things that just annoy the bejesus out of me about it too, but i am to use only ideas i see as good ideas Jan 11 08:11:12 BluesLee: sort of Jan 11 08:11:28 AntonTakk: no problem, the today screen was there before win mobile was there i think, for instance in opie Jan 11 08:12:22 i have a bar at the top that has, or will have the various status indicators, carrier name, time, etc, and a row of four butons at the bottom to access the "main" "apps" i mentioned above ^^ Jan 11 08:12:53 okay Jan 11 08:13:08 thing is i'm writing this app as a single binary to handle all of that Jan 11 08:13:25 vblu it was in pocketpc before opia Jan 11 08:13:27 :) Jan 11 08:13:29 err opie Jan 11 08:13:47 AntonTakk: that bar at the top should always be there no matter your app Jan 11 08:13:47 AntonTakk: http://www.killefiz.de/zaurus/showdetail.php?app=147 Jan 11 08:13:59 raster: maybe ... anyways old stuff Jan 11 08:14:00 for example, you touch contacts - your contacts "app" appears between the top bar and menu at the botom, replacing the standard home screen contents Jan 11 08:14:01 imho Jan 11 08:14:10 well it is in illume Jan 11 08:14:12 raster: it is Jan 11 08:14:15 app name and other system status gadgets Jan 11 08:14:26 and access to flip apps and otherwise go home, close the app etc. Jan 11 08:14:33 thats your system control bar Jan 11 08:14:37 anything below that is app Jan 11 08:14:46 (sometimes shortened by vkbd sliding up) Jan 11 08:14:50 that's why i wanted to know how to swallow groups into other groups, so the top and bottom are always accessable Jan 11 08:15:55 ideally, as i see it atm (granted i have done 0 usability testing) Jan 11 08:16:43 you touch contacts, contacts appears between the status bar (top) and menu (bottom) and the button you just pressed to get to contacts becomes "back" Jan 11 08:17:42 with the diferent "apps" pulling eachother up as needed Jan 11 08:17:55 you're basically creating an app manager Jan 11 08:17:57 or almost a wm Jan 11 08:18:06 and i will bet.. you will be in for nasty surprises :) Jan 11 08:18:29 actually, i don't intend to manage other apps Jan 11 08:19:24 just my own built in stuff Jan 11 08:19:50 i'd like to find a way to kep them from covering my top bar, of corse, but if not, i can live with that Jan 11 08:20:46 you basically cant Jan 11 08:20:52 e will maximise windows to the area below its own bar Jan 11 08:21:52 can i make my app force it's self to be full screen, and let e handle keeping other apps from covering my(it's) top bar Jan 11 08:22:03 u can ask to be fullscreen Jan 11 08:22:12 but u lose the illume to pbar Jan 11 08:22:18 thus app back/forth and flipping Jan 11 08:22:23 same way apps do fullscrene on desktop Jan 11 08:22:37 but other apps wont be put on top Jan 11 08:22:42 if focus goes from your window Jan 11 08:22:52 hrm, can the e window list be puled in by an app? Jan 11 08:22:58 u will flip to the other window - unless its also fullscreen it will be sized normally Jan 11 08:23:09 not directly Jan 11 08:23:15 indirectly u can walk x's window tree yourself Jan 11 08:23:21 or u can use the netwk client list hint Jan 11 08:23:27 and walk the window id's and gather all the window info Jan 11 08:23:31 like title, icon, etc. etc. Jan 11 08:24:10 don't care so much about the icon, if you can't identify the app you want by name, you need better names (imho) ;) Jan 11 08:24:52 thou you do make a good point Jan 11 08:25:22 this is why i just put it in the wm Jan 11 08:25:23 as modules Jan 11 08:25:31 as al that work is alreayd done and there in data structs Jan 11 08:25:36 and tracked and handled internally Jan 11 08:25:44 anythign that borders on managing apps Jan 11 08:25:49 flipping betwene windows Jan 11 08:25:51 listing them etc. Jan 11 08:25:57 imho should just roll into the wm Jan 11 08:26:01 and whatever infra it has for that Jan 11 08:26:05 in e's case - thats modules Jan 11 08:26:38 maybe what i need to do is just let e handle the top bar and do up a custom theme/icon set Jan 11 08:26:43 to match my app Jan 11 08:26:50 maybe Jan 11 08:27:04 as it sounds like u are not just writign an app Jan 11 08:27:09 but trying to do a while ui setup Jan 11 08:27:18 including launching, managing windows etc. Jan 11 08:27:46 that was my original idea. thou i hadn't thought about how i would handle other apps/etc yet Jan 11 08:29:37 and i surely have no intention of writing a window manager, i haven't the skill or time for that Jan 11 08:30:39 :) Jan 11 08:30:40 my main goal is a set of well-integrated basic smart phone apps (dialer, calendar, contacts, messages) Jan 11 08:30:51 myabe make it 1 big process Jan 11 08:31:05 and simply run fullscreen with an exit button Jan 11 08:31:13 and the easiest way i can think of of making it very well integrated is to make it one app Jan 11 08:31:19 (or an exit and home button - home simple iconifies the window) Jan 11 08:31:29 then you have 100% of the screne to yourself Jan 11 08:31:36 yeah Jan 11 08:31:37 until the user flips away from your app Jan 11 08:31:44 vkbd still works Jan 11 08:31:47 that could work Jan 11 08:31:50 but u'll have to call it up via window hints Jan 11 08:32:02 and otherwise u'll just need to reproduce any useful info Jan 11 08:32:05 like battery level Jan 11 08:32:06 antenna Jan 11 08:32:09 etc. etc. Jan 11 08:32:20 yeah, had planned to do that anyways Jan 11 08:32:34 (this is why i think that top bar should always be there no matter the ap so the same app and same code always does that) Jan 11 08:32:36 :) Jan 11 08:32:41 but its up to u Jan 11 08:32:49 "u" Jan 11 08:32:50 just helping u to do it so u have the least pain Jan 11 08:34:16 does e or illume or the top bar in illume count as a window? Jan 11 08:34:56 in x's window list? Jan 11 08:36:53 yes it does actually Jan 11 08:37:01 but it wont be in the netwm window list Jan 11 08:37:07 its a window thats private to e Jan 11 08:37:14 hrm Jan 11 08:37:16 so you wont find anything useful about it Jan 11 08:38:16 not looking for usefull info, just a count of running apps that aren't myself or e/illume Jan 11 08:38:36 "I want useless information!" :) Jan 11 08:38:40 walking x'x window list will get u a LOT of window Jan 11 08:38:47 xwininfo -tree -root Jan 11 08:38:49 enjoy! Jan 11 08:38:50 :) Jan 11 08:39:19 even with no apps running? Jan 11 08:40:53 yup Jan 11 08:41:02 just the wm alonw will create a nice batch of them Jan 11 08:41:07 the desktop bg.. is a window too Jan 11 08:41:11 and there will be others Jan 11 08:41:14 (invisible ones) Jan 11 08:41:31 bummer Jan 11 08:41:38 :) Jan 11 08:41:47 you can figure out what a normal app window is or not Jan 11 08:41:50 with the properties Jan 11 08:41:55 and if its mapped Jan 11 08:41:56 etc. etc. Jan 11 08:42:03 yeah Jan 11 08:42:04 but you'rew goign to write a fair bit of code Jan 11 08:42:18 then you need to send more messages to the wm asking it to make other apps active for you Jan 11 08:42:19 etc. Jan 11 08:42:26 basically i would suggest not doing this Jan 11 08:42:31 youd trying to write half-a-wm Jan 11 08:42:35 i'm thinking the same Jan 11 08:42:37 but u dont want to write a wm either Jan 11 08:42:43 in the end u'll do a half-arse job Jan 11 08:42:47 with a lot of footwork Jan 11 08:42:58 unless you really understand that space of x Jan 11 08:43:03 and are willing to sink the time in Jan 11 08:43:14 if u ask me - just make your app its own world in a fullscreen window Jan 11 08:43:26 ignore the outside world except for 3 things Jan 11 08:43:35 1. vkbd hints (unless u want to implement your own kbd?) Jan 11 08:43:45 2. a close button to close the app somehow Jan 11 08:44:07 3. a home butotn that just iconifies your window (wm will handle this and hide u goign back to the previously focused window) Jan 11 08:44:56 yeah, that sounds easiest Jan 11 08:45:31 and fake a menu under the gsm carrier's name to implement the two buttons Jan 11 08:45:51 and I have no intention of writing my own vkbd system Jan 11 08:46:09 then those 3 things are all u need to worry about with the "outside world" Jan 11 08:46:12 mabe make a custome kbd or two for illume, but that would be the extent of that Jan 11 08:46:14 then concentrate on your own app Jan 11 08:46:16 and its own world Jan 11 08:48:39 and if i had the desire later on i could always theme illume to make it's top bar look like mine, just to have it feel more consistent Jan 11 08:48:48 yes Jan 11 09:01:35 DocScrutinizer2: Hello :) No more flu? Great :). My coworker's just performed a buzz rework on my phone. Didn't give a me chance to do it myself (hell, now i've no way to prove that i could have done it myself!). He actually installed 0603 R (we lack 0402 here) but it looks all right. Mic works all right but i can't test for buzz as the signal here is pretty strong. Thank you for your clear instructions, i even didn't need to look at pdf again, a Jan 11 09:11:45 * PaulFertser thinks that his life sucks exactly because he's insane. Instead of feeling relief and joy because of successful rework he feels much worse than he did before just because once the rework is done, there's no sense to do any more soldering. Fuck, it's time to try build some DIY electronic device, but i don't need any for anything. Jan 11 09:19:27 hope to have new efl/e17 installed soon :) then i'll go to bed, since if this was a work day, i'd be getting up in less that two hours Jan 11 09:19:44 hahahaha Jan 11 09:20:01 been awake 21 hours Jan 11 09:20:18 coding always gets my sleep schedule jacked :P Jan 11 10:10:58 anybody know how to tell the gta02 to stop charging even with USB connected? Jan 11 10:15:02 why would you want to do this? Jan 11 10:17:17 PaulFertser: thanks for the report/feedback Jan 11 10:18:26 i'm just testing something. never mind, though; i figured it out Jan 11 10:53:38 http://gizmodo.com/5020095/mio-moov-380-gps-has-a-cellphone-built-in-can-make-calls-send-text-messages < Looks neat, I want one -- running Linux Jan 11 11:10:03 the technical docs for the ti calypso are supposed to be closed, right? Jan 11 11:10:50 i may have just randomly found some on the net. google calypso "deep sleep" Jan 11 11:11:29 I mean 'calypso "deep sleep" ti' Jan 11 11:16:30 hey quickdev Jan 11 11:16:36 guten morgen Jan 11 11:17:48 Buongiorno hire Jan 11 11:18:11 wow Jan 11 11:18:15 an italian word :D Jan 11 11:18:53 i had to look it up in a dictionary as i was not sure how to write it Jan 11 11:19:04 ;-) Jan 11 11:19:54 it is correct Jan 11 11:30:59 budfive: yup, see wiki note on calypso. some URL: http://cryptome.org/ti-calypso2.pdf Jan 11 11:32:15 there's also ti-calypso1.pdf for the curious Jan 11 11:34:22 Hello DocScrutinizer2! Did you receive my letter ? Jan 11 11:35:22 ptitjes: yup. will send it out one of the next days Jan 11 11:35:39 hello Jan 11 11:35:40 (calypso) see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/TI_Calypso_D751992AZHH Jan 11 11:35:58 Is there any SHR dev ? Jan 11 11:36:10 and is there any elementary dev? Jan 11 11:37:13 I have found a problem in http://build.shr-project.org/shr-testing/images/om-gta02/ Jan 11 11:37:29 There is not root file system Jan 11 11:37:46 for gtao2 Jan 11 11:38:07 http://build.shr-project.org/shr-testing/images/neo1973/ Jan 11 11:38:08 it's in there Jan 11 11:38:10 for some reason Jan 11 11:38:26 the file is in http://build.shr-project.org/shr-testing/images/neo1973/ Jan 11 11:38:31 the reason was to split it like in unstable Jan 11 11:39:29 DocScrutinizer2: Thank you very much!! :) Jan 11 11:40:01 in http://build.shr-project.org/shr-unstable/images/om-gta02/, there are kernel and jffs2 file Jan 11 11:40:08 ptitjes: you asked for couple of C, some R, anything else? Jan 11 11:40:23 errr nothing that I can see Jan 11 11:40:37 ok Jan 11 11:40:53 Is there any other mod that I should do ? Jan 11 11:41:01 that I'm not aware of ? Jan 11 11:41:59 Bass sound mod? Jan 11 11:43:27 nah, if you *really* want to get into mod business, you could swap c4110/1 to a 100uF for decent bass, and you could increase Vsys cap to 100uF (c1706??? dunno atm) to cure low-bat-boot problems Jan 11 11:45:01 ptitjes: the caps i'll send to you are not siuted for c4110/1 tho Jan 11 11:47:10 ptitjes: i'll see what else i could throw in this bag, maybe some inches solder-tin ;-) Jan 11 11:48:27 You are so kind Jan 11 11:48:43 I was wondering whether I should throw some stuff in the envelope too Jan 11 11:48:53 Are you doing music stuff like midi ? Jan 11 11:49:13 I have some GM5 and PCBs to go with Jan 11 11:49:58 raster: you here? Jan 11 11:50:07 ptitjes: no midi here. but thanks :-) Jan 11 11:50:28 :) Jan 11 11:52:52 DocScrutinizer2, is there a good earset sound quality for playing mp3's if one swaps c4110/1 to a 100µF ? Or are there other issues? Jan 11 11:54:05 nope, no other issues. with decent c411x you should obtain real super audio quality Jan 11 11:55:52 DocScrutinizer2, is it hard to do? Maybe I ask an electronic shop to do it Jan 11 11:56:53 not yet ecaluated. problem is to find a nice volume where the Cs could reside Jan 11 11:57:12 s/ ec/ ev/ Jan 11 11:57:12 DocScrutinizer2 meant: not yet evaluated. problem is to find a nice volume where the Cs could reside Jan 11 11:58:02 And to fine-tune kernel parameters, just add what extra params you need to /boot/append-GTA02. BTW, Qi supports symlinks. Jan 11 11:58:12 DocScrutinizer2, so there's no conrete hardware fix right now? Jan 11 11:58:29 quickdev: nope Jan 11 11:58:40 ok, then I'll wait ;) Jan 11 11:59:39 ok, i might come up with a rework paper eventually ;-) Jan 11 11:59:59 would be great :) Jan 11 12:12:20 DocScrutinizer2, may I ask what you studied? eletronic engineering? Jan 11 12:12:52 quickdev: yes you may ask ;-) Jan 11 12:13:37 I'm thinking about what to study these days. At least something related to physics or informatics :) Jan 11 12:17:13 DocScrutinizer2, so you studied eletronic engineering? Jan 11 12:18:32 while i was 6..14y old, yes. Kinda... Jan 11 12:20:11 I have written a design / hardware overview of the Openmoko Freerunner, I would appreciate comments, take a look, http://www.scribd.com/full/10059758?access_key=key-9xkok577hjmzj4oseyd Jan 11 12:20:18 Ainulindale, ^ Jan 11 12:25:54 tordo: ja Jan 11 12:26:16 moin Raster :) Jan 11 12:27:05 DocScrutinizer2: doc doc! Jan 11 12:27:06 :) Jan 11 12:28:21 Someone? Jan 11 12:29:16 got a non-flash version? Jan 11 12:31:18 raster: nevermind, i figured it out Jan 11 12:31:34 was having trouble with the elementary list widget inside a container Jan 11 12:31:50 but i had gotten the evas_object_size_hint_blablabla-stuff wrong Jan 11 12:32:32 budfive, Unfortunately the .txt version will require you to login to scribd! Jan 11 12:33:35 I hate scribd. Jan 11 12:35:59 budfive, Sargun, http://pastebin.com/d1b2ea1dc Jan 11 12:36:11 Hopefully the text document here, http://pastebin.com/d1b2ea1dc should draw more eyes. Jan 11 12:36:23 aaaah Jan 11 12:36:24 :") Jan 11 12:38:56 * DocScrutinizer2 away for a nice breakfast Jan 11 12:44:21 king: accelerometers don't work for you? And are you really sure you need QVGA 3D games? Jan 11 12:45:06 king: a hole can be used to easily secure FR with a rope or whatever. Jan 11 12:45:22 PaulFertser, No they don't. I am saying just because the hardware is there doesn't mean we automatically assume it is utilised on the FR. There is a 'gap'. Jan 11 12:45:26 king: what kind of resume issues do you have? What kernel do you use? Jan 11 12:45:50 PaulFertser, A lanyard whole can be more subtle and appropriate. Placing it in the 'hole' would just make it slip. Jan 11 12:45:56 PaulFertser, Aren't you rational-lie-zing now? Jan 11 12:46:11 *clip Jan 11 12:47:07 king: what kernel do you use? Jan 11 12:47:17 PaulFertser, mwester's. Jan 11 12:47:34 That is, unsupported and abandoned by OM long time ago? Jan 11 12:48:32 hm? Jan 11 12:49:05 king: would you prefer solid plastic to the hole? I think the anthenna shape dictated the overall dimensions, but why have too much air inside? Better make it a hole. And, have you read Lao Tzi quote that came with FR? Jan 11 12:49:50 PaulFertser, The electronics could be shifted to make place for an app stylus, couldn't they? Jan 11 12:49:50 king: OM stopped the development of 2.6.24 kernels long time ago. It has many known problems with suspend/resume. Jan 11 12:50:11 And with accels. Jan 11 12:50:40 king: i'm not sure. I've seen nobody from the case designers on the mailing lists and IRC. Jan 11 12:50:41 PaulFertser, See where the first three lines of http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Qtopia point. Jan 11 12:52:07 do we still have troubles with kernels eating SDHC partition tables btw? Jan 11 12:52:11 king: so what? Jan 11 12:52:31 PaulFertser, That is the kernel I use. Jan 11 12:52:42 PaulFertser, Is that the one that has been abandoned? Jan 11 12:53:15 king: OM never supported mwester's kernel, actually. So i can't say it's abandoned. It was never supported. Jan 11 12:54:01 PaulFertser, You are too belligerent to have a proper discussion with. Jan 11 12:54:12 tordo: i think no. The problems are gone. Jan 11 12:55:43 cool Jan 11 12:55:58 then i can start doing some serious multibooting on my 4gb card \o/ Jan 11 12:57:34 king: Are you sure? I thought i was just stating the facts. Moreover, the fact is, Qtopia was never supported by OM, it's a Nokia's will to make a port, and they IMHO fail to properly communicate with the community to be any good for Freerunner. That's my impression. But i can assure you, 2.6.24 has known resume problems that nobody's going to fix, because 2.6.28 works much better in this regard. Ask lindi-, he has done some stress-testing recent Jan 11 12:58:17 hm, and when will there be packages of 2.6.28? Jan 11 12:58:42 Wonka: why do you need a package for a kernel, really? Jan 11 12:59:09 PaulFertser, Even I need a .bin to flash. Jan 11 12:59:13 i have tried building my own 2.6.28 and failed... would be easier just to install a package, including the modules Jan 11 12:59:34 PaulFertser, Haven't found enough time to invest in troubleshooting the build process, integrate the modules, etc Jan 11 12:59:42 king: BTW, i have a great respect to mwester, really! He's the man! No need to fight. Jan 11 12:59:51 king: afair you can just boot (or flash and boot) the ELF image. Jan 11 13:00:20 Wonka, Does the flashing work the same way as a .bin file? Jan 11 13:00:53 it's just a file. extensions don't matter. Jan 11 13:00:57 king: Andy builds the kernel with all staff built-in often and provides a bin you can flash or write to your SD. Jan 11 13:01:33 Wonka: for dfu-util to work, i believe a DFU-trailer should be added to a binary image. Jan 11 13:02:15 PaulFertser, Never seen Andy's work. Will have to investigate, what distro does he build for? Jan 11 13:02:56 king: He builds a kernel with all the features needed. Jan 11 13:04:07 PaulFertser, Just the kernel? Does it have the required modules/other things to work with any distro? (SHR, OM2008.12, FDOM?) Jan 11 13:04:10 king: that is, any distro should be happy with it. But only recent FSO versions are prepared to /sys paths changes. Jan 11 13:05:15 king: I think he has compiles in everything needed to use FR as a phone. No need for modules. Jan 11 13:05:31 Except for ipv6. Jan 11 13:06:48 Or web-cams or something like that. I think FSO project will soon (or has already) provide auto-built GTA02 images of andy-tracking. Jan 11 13:08:09 PaulFertser, And Andy's kernel would take care of the power management issues? Will it always resume properly (even after n hours)? How much then does the battery stretch to? Jan 11 13:10:10 king: it seems to resume here Jan 11 13:10:10 king: I think yes, the latest versions resume properly for almost everyone. Can't really test the battery as i'm rarely can't charge. Jan 11 13:11:07 lindi-, How much does OMs battery life stretch to now that power management is fixed? Jan 11 13:11:13 king: freerunner's? Jan 11 13:11:18 lindi-, Actually FR, yes Jan 11 13:11:22 king: power management is fixed? Jan 11 13:11:42 lindi-, You are saying resume is fixed. Jan 11 13:11:54 king: what has that to do with consumption? Jan 11 13:12:07 king: it's around one percentage unit of capacity per hour Jan 11 13:12:16 king: but i am not sure if those are linear Jan 11 13:12:44 king: i don't have time to test how long it lasts but it's at least more than a single day :) Jan 11 13:13:18 lindi-, My primitive understanding of power management issues is that - it doesn't resume and so it consumes battery all the time - hence 6hrs life only. Jan 11 13:13:31 lindi-, If that is fixed, isn't a major / all part of power management fixed? Jan 11 13:13:37 king: oh i have used suspend since last summer Jan 11 13:13:43 cpufreq Jan 11 13:14:06 PaulFertser, What about it? It needs to auto underclock when lying idle which it doesn't do? Jan 11 13:14:21 does Andy publish kernel images? if yes, where? Jan 11 13:14:37 Wonka: just build your own Jan 11 13:14:53 king: i'm afraid CPU clock management is not implemented yet. Jan 11 13:14:57 lindi-: up to now, all my 2.6.28 kernels failed to boot Jan 11 13:15:03 Wonka: odd Jan 11 13:15:06 PaulFertser, Is it what I just said? Jan 11 13:15:08 Wonka: that should be fixed Jan 11 13:15:21 Wonka: how do they fail? Jan 11 13:15:25 Wonka: http://people.openmoko.org/andy/ Jan 11 13:15:36 lindi-: ok, last try was weeks ago, don't even know how many... Jan 11 13:16:10 PaulFertser, What comes under the umbrella of power management? What parts are complete / being completed, and how much does each part help the FR stay alive longer? ? Jan 11 13:16:14 king: you're saying about changing clocks in a particular scheme. I'm saying that no scheme can be used because changing clock is not implemented. Jan 11 13:16:31 should stable-tracking work? and: which of the branches should one use? Jan 11 13:16:47 Wonka: you should use andy-tracking Jan 11 13:16:49 Wonka: stable-tracking does not work at the moment afaik. i use andy-tracking Jan 11 13:18:25 Does dfu-util flash a .udfu file? Jan 11 13:19:23 king: i think powering off all unneeded devices is possible now (it should be done by userspace). cpufreq doesn't work. suspend/resume does. Calypso's deep sleep mode works for some and is actively investigated. LCM controller (? or not ?) was provoken WSOD, one of the work-around was to disable its deep sleep. Not sure what's the state of the latest issue atm. And i don't know percentages. Jan 11 13:19:29 king: dfu-util flashes bytes Jan 11 13:19:36 king: it doesn't care what bytes Jan 11 13:19:43 lindi-: what about dfu-trailer? Jan 11 13:19:53 PaulFertser: what's that? Jan 11 13:20:26 PaulFertser, That was informative. Thanks. Jan 11 13:20:47 lindi-: added to the binary in the end of the kernel build process by mkimage. I think it might be necessary/useful. Jan 11 13:20:49 lindi-, So should I dfu-util the http://people.openmoko.org/andy/u-boot-gta02v5v6-stable_650149a53dbdd48b.udfu, instead of mwester's? And for what distro is it recommended? Jan 11 13:21:17 king: i don't know what that file is Jan 11 13:21:19 king: only for those containing recent FSO (1 Jan and later) Jan 11 13:21:45 king: i use andy-tracking b8b36e5ec3db71d5 Jan 11 13:21:56 king: and it seems to work mostly Jan 11 13:23:17 king: if you use u-boot and want to boot kernel from NAND, you'll have to tweak one parameter. Jan 11 13:23:54 lindi-, For what distros do you use it? Jan 11 13:23:59 king: debian Jan 11 13:24:05 PaulFertser, Where do I get the recent FSO builds? Jan 11 13:24:39 king: sorry, no idea. I use FSO from git on my Debian. Jan 11 13:24:51 PaulFertser, Tweaking a parameter is going to be tedious. Thanks anyways. Jan 11 13:25:07 king: Qi is much better than u-boot for most ordinary uses, IMO Jan 11 13:26:25 PaulFertser, Will have to look, I find the docs incomplete to find them 'actionable' Jan 11 13:26:36 PaulFertser: only if you actually implement the initramfs menu? Jan 11 13:26:40 king: i've read the sources Jan 11 13:27:05 lindi-: no, you can skip boot possibilities with AUX key. I think that's enough. Jan 11 13:28:24 king: or not. I think i flashed Qi as soon as i got my FR using the wiki page. I've started looking into the sources only after my new uSD card refused to work with it. Jan 11 13:29:44 PaulFertser, This will require more time commitment than I had planned. Jan 11 13:30:18 which depencies do I need for elementary_test? python-elementary, libelementary0, annything else? Jan 11 13:41:45 drivers/i2c/built-in.o: In function `pcf50633_reg_clear_bits': Jan 11 13:41:45 /home/w/!data/OM/kernel/linux-2.6/drivers/i2c/chips/pcf50633.c:174: multiple definition of `pcf50633_reg_clear_bits' Jan 11 13:41:48 drivers/mfd/built-in.o:/home/w/!data/OM/kernel/linux-2.6/drivers/mfd/pcf50633-core.c:108: first defined here Jan 11 13:43:59 any ideas? Jan 11 13:48:26 maybe unsetting CONFIG_SENSORS_PCF50633 helps... *make* Jan 11 13:50:36 Wonka: what rev are you building? Jan 11 13:50:45 PaulFertser: current andy-tracking Jan 11 13:51:15 ok, unsetting CONFIG_SENSORS_PCF50633 helped... now it errors much later... Jan 11 13:51:22 LD .tmp_vmlinux1 Jan 11 13:51:22 arch/arm/mach-s3c2440/built-in.o:(.data+0x19f4): undefined reference to `ts_filter_group_api' Jan 11 13:52:10 Wonka: you might try to build b8b36e5ec3db71d55d0edf944deec5cc3a33ce85 Jan 11 14:01:13 yeah... set a config option and it works. i love this. Jan 11 14:43:39 heyho Jan 11 14:43:52 hey Jan 11 14:47:00 hey morphis Jan 11 14:47:10 morphis, have you thought about my issue? :) Jan 11 14:49:35 aaargh. Jan 11 14:53:33 my andy-tracking does not boot. does not even spit any message. just hangs. Jan 11 14:53:38 quickdev: sorry, please could you describe it again - it's currently out of my mind :) Jan 11 14:54:10 morphis, the _callback_object elementary function prevents python from generating traces :) Jan 11 14:54:12 Wonka: sounds like bootloader issue Jan 11 14:54:28 Wonka: can you kexec boot it? Jan 11 14:54:29 lindi-: it boots the other kernels Jan 11 14:54:37 Wonka: are the others less than 2M? Jan 11 14:54:40 quickdev: ah I remember Jan 11 14:54:47 lindi-: yes, as is this one Jan 11 14:55:03 Wonka: andy-tracking is surely more than 2M Jan 11 14:55:12 lindi-: my own config Jan 11 14:55:19 quickdev: you I have a idea how to fix it? Jan 11 14:55:21 Wonka: try the known-working config Jan 11 14:55:29 lindi-: ok, which one is that? Jan 11 14:55:42 morphis, don't know...but that's a big problem when debugging :9 Jan 11 14:55:44 :) Jan 11 14:55:46 quickdev: otherwise I have a problem with mapping the python callback functions to the c-functions Jan 11 14:55:55 quickdev: right Jan 11 14:55:59 Wonka: ./arm/configs/gta02-moredrivers-defconfig Jan 11 14:56:18 lindi-: yep, but why? linux-openmoko-2.6.28 is 1,9MB and works well ;) Jan 11 14:56:21 I will look how the other e python bindings do it Jan 11 14:56:33 lindi-: will try Jan 11 14:56:52 quickdev: you know if the tracebacks works with the other python bindings? Jan 11 14:57:08 dos1: why what? Jan 11 14:57:19 morphis, don't know - never used them Jan 11 14:57:25 lindi-: why andy-tracking is so big Jan 11 14:57:47 dos1: it's just the default config with many things Jan 11 14:57:59 btw. 2.6.28 from oe works good :) Jan 11 14:58:05 only changing to qvga don't work Jan 11 14:58:15 suspend/resume works well, halting itp. Jan 11 14:58:17 etc.* Jan 11 14:58:32 it boots faster than 2.6.24 Jan 11 14:59:13 morphis, maybe there's another problem: When doing label_set() with a unicode string, it complains because it can't convert it to ascii. The ui should convert it to the system encoding..not to ascii afaik. Jan 11 15:01:10 hm, only with the python version or even with the elementary c functions? Jan 11 15:03:10 morphis, hm...just asking myself if chars like 'ä' shoud be converted to ä before doing label_set() - but even in a label? don't know Jan 11 15:04:22 quickdev: I do not know Jan 11 15:04:36 for the entry widget you could do it Jan 11 15:04:40 yeah Jan 11 15:05:01 < needs to be converted to < too Jan 11 15:05:39 all string should be utf8 Jan 11 15:05:41 always Jan 11 15:05:43 for efl Jan 11 15:05:55 quickdev: reminds me of http://shr.bearstech.com/trac/ticket/153 ;) Jan 11 15:06:11 raster: ok, and you can put stuf like ä into simple elementary labels? Jan 11 15:06:24 into labels yes Jan 11 15:06:25 butotns no Jan 11 15:06:29 buttons dont do markup Jan 11 15:06:32 use utf8 anyway Jan 11 15:06:37 ok Jan 11 15:06:49 it basically depends if the text is a text or textblock object Jan 11 15:06:54 textblock does markup Jan 11 15:07:00 text is more raw Jan 11 15:07:06 just a single line of utf8 chars Jan 11 15:07:11 morphis, if label use utf8 - then the binding shouldn't convert to ascii Jan 11 15:08:07 quickdev: I do no converting, only pass the params I get to the c functions Jan 11 15:08:31 maybe you hav to define something as a utf8 string? Jan 11 15:08:53 in python you should do u"Test" for unicode strings Jan 11 15:09:06 but I can convert every string I get to utf8 anyway Jan 11 15:09:46 as I thought ASII is the std. for strings in python Jan 11 15:11:02 * morphis closed the wrong window :) Jan 11 15:11:38 raster: Can you explain this error? http://pastebin.com/m29c01f8c Jan 11 15:12:48 when does it happen? Jan 11 15:12:49 quickdev: ok, basic byte strings in python uses your system locale for encoding Jan 11 15:16:05 dolf1074: when edje is having trouble calculating a minium size Jan 11 15:16:14 and its falling back to an older slower way of figurring it out Jan 11 15:16:30 basically it doesnt realise that elemtns wont ever change size Jan 11 15:16:35 no matte how hard it tries Jan 11 15:16:38 so it should give up Jan 11 15:16:50 okay Jan 11 15:17:54 Is the '_sizing_eval' needed in for example in our own designed elementary widgets? Jan 11 15:19:14 it depends Jan 11 15:19:16 possibly Jan 11 15:19:20 in fact probably Jan 11 15:20:02 right now tho designing your own widgets isnt really supported as the elementary widget internals are not exported Jan 11 15:20:41 yeah, but we need widgets ;) Jan 11 15:21:36 send patches Jan 11 15:21:42 do them properly Jan 11 15:21:43 :) Jan 11 15:23:32 hum.. could that string shizzle be why the elementary phonebook crashes on me? Jan 11 15:23:43 i have contacts with norwegian letters in their names Jan 11 15:25:27 raster: I'm trying with the little docs I have ;) Jan 11 15:25:45 what is a diffetence between frameworkd-config and frameworkd-config-shr? Jan 11 15:29:45 dos1: frameworkd-config-shr has a different rules.yaml and framework.conf Jan 11 15:29:51 +d Jan 11 15:30:17 mrmoku_: yep, but how different are those files? ;) Jan 11 15:31:24 frameworkd.conf sets logging to /var/log and turns of calypso deep sleep Jan 11 15:31:56 btw. oe is buliding 0.8.4.9+gitr1033 version of frameworkd on shr-unstable Jan 11 15:32:57 mrmoku_: shouldn't it be 0.8.4.4+gitr804? Jan 11 15:33:54 dos1: why? frameworkd switched back to master branch... and we need that for the .28 kernel Jan 11 15:34:22 mrmoku_: but is libframeworkd-phonegui compatible? upgrading is safe? Jan 11 15:34:41 is upgrading safe?* Jan 11 15:34:55 dos1: no idea ;) Jan 11 15:40:37 Ainulindale: ping Jan 11 16:35:02 hmm when can we expect new images including the shr-settings-new app? Jan 11 16:35:47 When it'll work Jan 11 16:36:33 doesn't it work yet? Jan 11 16:36:53 No idea Jan 11 16:37:13 Ainulindale: hey, how are you? Are the insurance nice to you (probably not :() Jan 11 16:37:19 +s Jan 11 16:37:33 mrmoku: Mine, no. My company's insurance, perhaps. I have to wait until tomorrow. Jan 11 16:37:47 Apart from that my neck hurts but that's all Jan 11 16:38:05 mhh, sorry for that Jan 11 16:38:24 But anyway, I have a biography to read Jan 11 16:38:34 It strengthens me up Jan 11 16:38:38 (I'm a bit dizzy) Jan 11 16:39:08 eh Jan 11 16:39:13 i am sorry for that Jan 11 16:39:15 look at the good side - you haven't been hurt that bad (thank god) and you might get a new car Jan 11 16:39:21 i did a bad incident some years ago Jan 11 16:39:43 bumbl: Well, "get" is relative Jan 11 16:39:43 I'm building another local image... if that works I will do a new unstable one, ok? Jan 11 16:39:43 I'll have to pay, that's all I see Jan 11 16:39:43 mrmoku: yeah please do Jan 11 16:40:14 with my stupid old smart Jan 11 16:40:50 i am literally rolled on the corner for 4-5 times Jan 11 16:40:52 if you have an accident with a smart it can easily get nasty Jan 11 16:41:09 the smart is a stupid and shitty car Jan 11 16:41:21 and i used it when I have problem with my personal car Jan 11 16:41:25 otherwise Jan 11 16:41:32 i get some scretch on the butt Jan 11 16:42:12 because my butt ( yes i know ... ) hurts on the window Jan 11 16:43:13 so, car destroyed and now I have my butt with 5-6 scars :D Jan 11 16:43:38 somewhere I have some photos Jan 11 16:46:37 * mwester really, really does not wish to see photo's of Hire's butt. Jan 11 16:46:44 why not? Jan 11 16:47:04 it is beautiful :/ Jan 11 16:50:48 * mrmoku does not want to see them either. PLEASE NOT Jan 11 16:51:08 * mrmoku prefers *female* italian butts ;) Jan 11 16:52:00 mrmoku: only if they haven't married yet Jan 11 16:52:52 now I am working Jan 11 16:52:59 and I see some splendid PENIS Jan 11 16:53:08 i did a very ugly work for telecom :| Jan 11 16:53:31 bumbl: it's only the southern italians that will kill you ;) Jan 11 16:53:59 and they will kill you even for unmarried ones... if you don't marry them after Jan 11 16:54:18 mrmoku: nah - italian females seem to get fat after they have married Jan 11 16:54:24 * bumbl ducks and runs Jan 11 16:54:26 indeed Jan 11 16:54:37 but that is a very sad story Jan 11 16:54:40 *sigh* Jan 11 16:54:50 and I don't want to see 100kg butts either Jan 11 16:57:47 bumbl: even that is more the southern ones ;) Jan 11 16:57:54 hehe Jan 11 16:57:55 yes Jan 11 16:57:59 * mrmoku is married with an italian butt that is NOT FAT Jan 11 16:59:27 lucky you Jan 11 16:59:43 Ainulindale: how can I modify git hooks on the buildhost? I want the Makefile to be updated on commits... Jan 11 17:00:13 bumbl: though I'm getting fat... too much pasta :p Jan 11 17:00:22 Ainulindale: ping ping ping Jan 11 17:00:23 ;) Jan 11 17:01:34 mrmoku: hehe - la cucina italiana Jan 11 17:01:40 yep Jan 11 17:09:48 so - now my father has signed a pact with the devil too - he is gmail user now :p Jan 11 17:10:18 i'm gmail user ;D Jan 11 17:10:56 me too Jan 11 17:11:20 they offer the best freemail service out there Jan 11 17:13:59 dos1: pong Jan 11 17:14:30 mrmoku: what do you want to do exactly? Jan 11 17:14:56 Ainulindale: did you get yoyo's ssh key? Jan 11 17:15:10 Yeah, and he has access Jan 11 17:16:25 Ainulindale: ok :) Jan 11 17:16:46 Ainulindale: and another question - oe is building new frameworkd now on shr-unstable Jan 11 17:17:08 Ainulindale: do you know that is this safe to upgrade? is libframeworkd-glib compatible with it? Jan 11 17:17:20 supposedly yes Jan 11 17:17:23 Ainulindale: I want to update the Makefile people download Jan 11 17:17:26 automatically Jan 11 17:17:33 mrmoku: make update should do that Jan 11 17:18:08 Ainulindale: hmmm, subelegant for people starting from scratch... but yes make update-common does that Jan 11 17:18:32 Ainulindale: so it *should* work, yep? :] Jan 11 17:18:35 thought I still think it would be more convenient to just download a current one Jan 11 17:18:40 dos1: yes Jan 11 17:18:56 mrmoku: well thanks to my headache I have no idea what you're talking about Jan 11 17:19:06 So I guess your idea is as good as mine Jan 11 17:19:43 Ainulindale: heh, ok... its in no way important. Get better first :-) Jan 11 17:19:56 have to eat now Jan 11 17:23:29 buona cena, mrmoku Jan 11 17:29:31 can anyone direct me to an example of using elementary objects in edje in c? Jan 11 17:33:28 kde 4.2 is at last usable! Jan 11 17:33:32 it has Eyes plasmoid! ;D Jan 11 17:46:49 brb Jan 11 18:01:37 Hire: grazie... era buono :D Jan 11 18:05:11 well, i think my elm_entry_add() object is being swallowed properly, but every time i click on the area it should be in the app crashes, also, it doesn't seem to have the label i think i am setting for it Jan 11 18:18:39 mrmoku: italian food? Jan 11 18:21:11 Hire: not today... noodle soup and meat Jan 11 18:21:18 italian cheese though Jan 11 18:22:48 oh :D Jan 11 18:22:56 i ate cannoli romani Jan 11 18:23:30 http://www.online.latina.it/rubriche/cucina/img/cannelloni.jpg <-- this Jan 11 18:23:33 * bumbl ate a good rumpsteak Jan 11 18:23:47 Hire: I love cannelloni Jan 11 18:25:13 sure, it is italian food Jan 11 18:25:30 it isn't impossibile to hate the italian food, we are like a drug Jan 11 18:25:36 haha Jan 11 18:25:41 *to love Jan 11 18:27:07 however I eat cannelloni, or pasta a forno, or fettuccine verdi/bianche with ragù eath week Jan 11 18:27:10 *each Jan 11 18:27:10 i love pizza made by the local offshoot of the cosa nostra too Jan 11 18:27:23 or my good... casa nostra :| Jan 11 18:27:26 i hate that name Jan 11 18:27:36 they can cook ... delicious Jan 11 18:27:41 yeah Jan 11 18:27:52 the best pizza, the best pasta, the best tiramisu Jan 11 18:28:00 but Jan 11 18:28:21 casa nostra is a famous name of the maphia :) Jan 11 18:28:28 ( southern of italy eh ) Jan 11 18:29:42 Hire: yep, i know ... i would say they have to do with the mafia ... and they are spreading (they started with a single restaurant and now they have three ... each one owned by the family) Jan 11 18:29:48 casa nostra stands for "ours home" Jan 11 18:30:05 yep Jan 11 18:30:50 Hire: i know, i speak a bit spanish (and tourist italian) - cosa nostra stands for "our thing/bussiness" Jan 11 18:31:22 yes, also :D Jan 11 18:32:30 uhh, they got him ;) Jan 11 18:33:07 italy = church + mafia + berlusconi + good food and wine Jan 11 18:33:32 oh my good Jan 11 18:33:39 *god Jan 11 18:33:51 italy= stupid people Jan 11 18:35:42 bumbl: though... mafia + berlusconi are one unit ;) Jan 11 18:36:28 AntonTakk: you might get more enlightening answers to your queries in #e or #edevelop ;] Jan 11 18:51:05 Bluetooth has a tendency to stop working... Jan 11 18:51:15 After a while I just can't turn it on anymore. Jan 11 18:51:46 The settings app thinks it's on, but the bluetooth shelf gadget doesn't appear and there is no hci0 interface. Jan 11 18:51:59 sicu: ive actually given up on getting any meaning full help in #e, but i did post the question, just in case Jan 11 18:52:32 Anyone know how to resuscitate it other than by rebooting? Jan 11 18:53:02 Digital-Pioneer: try powering off/on from the command line? rmmod/modprobe the module? Jan 11 18:53:13 AntonTakk: What's the module? Jan 11 18:53:29 that is an excellent question :) Jan 11 18:53:52 (i have no clue :-( ) Jan 11 18:54:35 My first guess is there isn't one -- it's probably compiled in. Jan 11 18:55:21 that's possible, thou i would think for the sake of easily supporting multiple platforms, all the non standard stuff would be modules Jan 11 18:56:44 hrm, it seems the elm_entry object is the only one that has this problem - unless i define no options what so ever for it Jan 11 18:57:05 in which case it doesn't crash, but is also useless for it's intended purpose Jan 11 19:00:51 * mrmoku is frustrated... Ainulindale is more enlighted even while suffering a severe headache Jan 11 19:04:26 mrmoku: Mor enlightened ? Jan 11 19:04:31 s/Mor/More/ Jan 11 19:04:31 Ainulindale meant: mrmoku: More enlightened ? Jan 11 19:04:35 What with? Jan 11 19:04:44 gsp stop work correctly on gta01 :/ Jan 11 19:04:49 Ainulindale: you were right... I'm stupid :-) Jan 11 19:05:05 Why is so? Jan 11 19:05:25 no need to keep the Makefile up-to-date... I forgot that it get's linked anyways Jan 11 19:05:35 Well, yes Jan 11 19:05:38 no need for a git hook :-) Jan 11 19:05:43 I think that's why I didn't understand what you meant Jan 11 19:05:46 * mrmoku likes git hooks ;) Jan 11 19:05:49 yep Jan 11 19:06:10 lindi-: andy-tracking with gta02-moredrivers-defconfig boots. will try to slim it down a little to fit it into flash. Jan 11 19:06:30 lindi-: but later, not now. Jan 11 19:10:44 where is changelog for fso-gpsd ? Jan 11 19:13:13 OK, fresh boot, bluetooth still won't come up. Jan 11 19:13:25 * Digital-Pioneer looks for console commands. Bleh. Jan 11 19:18:17 Anyone know how to use these 'DBUS Device APIs' the wiki says we should use to power up bluetooth? How do I do this from CLI? Jan 11 19:22:14 WTH is wrong with this thing??? Jan 11 19:22:28 Now it's suspending during an SSH session and won't wake up. Jan 11 19:27:35 Digital-Pioneer: cli-frameworkd is your friend Jan 11 19:28:01 -d (cli-framework) Jan 11 19:28:07 Digital-Pioneer: don't you just *LOVE* the idiots at bluez?? If you read their website, they think removing the bluetooth config files and replacing it all with dbus messages is a **FEATURE**!!!!!! Jan 11 19:28:53 mwester-laptop: LOL Jan 11 19:29:14 Apparently, according to the narrow minds at bluez, EVERYBODY runs some sort of network manager software to configure bluetooth, and nobody will every use config files or scripts again. :( Jan 11 19:29:23 Yeah, I'm not sure I like the way Linux is going... Lose /etc/*.conf in favor of... Less concrete configurations... Jan 11 19:30:40 Yep - it's going to create a rift between the small embedded devices and linux. How do you fit a full dbus server and all that software on 4MB of flash inside a router or other box? Jan 11 19:30:58 network manager would be ok, if it ignored all interfaces by default, and only managed the ones you told it to Jan 11 19:31:36 Or even 16MB for that matter. The point is that you'll just not see Linux being as good a fit anymore, and more vendors will follow the lead of Cisco/Linksys and abandon Linux on low-end devices. Jan 11 19:31:46 Digital-Pioneer: mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.odeviced /org/freesmartphone/Device/PowerControl/Bluetooth org.freesmartphone.Dev Jan 11 19:31:49 ice.PowerControl.SetPower False Jan 11 19:32:21 mrmoku: Is 'ice.Power...' given to STDIN? Jan 11 19:32:26 hey - i'm getting on starting paroli while the fso-framework is running: - http://pastebin.com/m717895bc - it tells me: "setting resource status for GSM from enabling to org.freesmartphone.Resource.Error: Modem unspecified not in available modems: ['singleline', 'qualcomm_msm', 'option', 'ericsson_F3507g', 'ti_calypso', 'cinterion_mc75', 'sierra', 'freescale_neptune', 'muxed4line']" Jan 11 19:32:45 Digital-Pioneer: hehe, no linebreak pleas :-) Jan 11 19:32:47 +e Jan 11 19:32:47 *i'm getting an error Jan 11 19:33:43 do i have to specify the used modem anywhere? Jan 11 19:33:45 mirko: looks like your frameworkd.conf is wrong Jan 11 19:34:21 modemtype = ti_calypso in [ogsmd] Jan 11 19:35:22 mrmoku: thanks a lot - will try it out Jan 11 19:42:00 mrmoku: sry for bothering you again - now i get this: http://pastebin.com/m61c5c21b Jan 11 19:43:29 how can I trace watch wrong with my gps ? Jan 11 19:44:14 after update it stops to work Jan 11 19:44:46 yoyo: check frameworkd log Jan 11 19:45:59 mirko: do you have /usr/sbin/gsm0710muxd started (showing up in ps)? Jan 11 19:47:10 i have to? i thought i just need the frameworkd-git-branch to get working :/ Jan 11 19:47:34 just /usr/bin/frameworkd and /usr/bin/paroli-launcher are runnning Jan 11 19:47:51 you need gsm0710muxd too Jan 11 19:49:18 do i need sth else? the gsmd e.g.? Jan 11 19:49:21 mirko: how is the paroli progress going? good? may i ask how responsive it is at the moment (launching time) Jan 11 19:49:33 i know it is in pre-alpha stages Jan 11 19:50:01 mirko: no gsmd NOT... frameworkd is playing that part Jan 11 19:50:10 ah, ok, thanks Jan 11 19:50:21 bumbl: i'm not mirko-paroli :) Jan 11 19:50:26 ah Jan 11 19:50:31 ok ;) Jan 11 19:50:45 2 mirko's - *sigh* ;) Jan 11 19:51:02 multi-mirko'd Jan 11 19:51:16 do we need a multiplexer here? ;) Jan 11 19:52:29 hey bumbl Jan 11 19:52:56 bumbl: progress is good I think, rather good :) Jan 11 19:53:30 bumbl: paroli itself launches in under 7sec but then you have to add the time for registering etc Jan 11 19:53:52 bumbl: and just a site note, we are heavily investigating why it takes 7sec ;) Jan 11 19:54:01 side note Jan 11 19:55:06 bumbl: in log in INFO enabling Jan 11 19:56:38 hey ho! Jan 11 19:56:50 hehe I learned the lesson of not mixing feeds, now it won't boot Jan 11 19:57:00 new image time! Jan 11 19:58:42 bumbl: no errors about gps in log Jan 11 20:02:39 mirko-paroli: well the 7s don't shock me - the freerunner is slow :( Jan 11 20:02:47 hi btw Jan 11 20:03:10 bumbl: the 7 secs is including profiling Jan 11 20:03:33 bumbl: and output + time etc Jan 11 20:03:48 bumbl: so we should be at between 4 + 5 I guess Jan 11 20:03:53 yoyo: log level debug ... out of the blue i would guess the gps chip sends nmea but frameworkd expects ubx Jan 11 20:04:43 mirko-paroli: and it is planned that paroli is always on? so that it is accessible immediatly? Jan 11 20:04:45 bumbl: set log_level=DEBUG? Jan 11 20:04:53 bumbl: yes Jan 11 20:05:17 bumbl: if we get the speed we need and figure out how to start as soon as e gives us all we need Jan 11 20:05:39 yoyo: yes Jan 11 20:08:06 bumbl: :| looks ok Jan 11 20:08:11 no errors Jan 11 20:08:32 bumbl: mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.frameworkd /org/freesmartphone/Framework org.freesmartphone.Framework.SetDebugLevel ogpsd DEBUG Jan 11 20:14:19 yoyo: hmm can't help you then Jan 11 20:14:37 bumbl: ok then how can help my ? Jan 11 20:15:42 yoyo: bug stefan_schmidt_ Jan 11 20:15:54 i think he is responsible for the fso gps part Jan 11 20:15:54 or it is next step to put my gta01 to trash Jan 11 20:16:10 ah you use gta01 Jan 11 20:16:18 the error i described is gta02 only Jan 11 20:16:50 I realy don't have many for gta02 :..>( Jan 11 20:17:06 yoyo: money ;] Jan 11 20:17:09 no Jan 11 20:17:17 I mean yes Jan 11 20:17:21 :D Jan 11 20:18:50 hehe Jan 11 20:20:38 stefan_schmidt_: ping Jan 11 20:22:21 yoyo: have you checked your frameworkd.conf? What do you have in device = in [ogpsd] section? Jan 11 20:23:21 is there some kind of "you have N missed calls" popup program for shr? Jan 11 20:23:31 PaulFertser: yyy no change Jan 11 20:23:53 PaulFertser: yy afret update nothing changed there Jan 11 20:24:36 yoyo: then pastebin an appropriate part of frameworkd log with ogpsd debug enabled. Jan 11 20:24:39 Mortak: popup not yet... you have to open the phonelog for that Jan 11 20:25:31 mrmoku: yeah i know Jan 11 20:25:31 PaulFertser: http://pastebin.com/d1e02e49e Jan 11 20:27:33 mrmoku: btw. thx :) Jan 11 20:28:45 yoyo: and what about logs? Jan 11 20:28:55 Mortak: hehe, np. one day me too wants a home screen with missed calls :-) Jan 11 20:29:52 mrmoku: me wants it now ^^ Jan 11 20:30:04 PaulFertser: when I start fso-gpsd in frameworkd.log is information not error about starting (enabeling) gps Jan 11 20:30:40 yoyo: enabling ogpsd and nothing more? Jan 11 20:31:05 PaulFertser: http://pastebin.com/d4cbb917f Jan 11 20:31:05 Mortak: so write it ;) Jan 11 20:31:21 looks cool Jan 11 20:32:15 yoyo: do you see gllin in process list after that? Jan 11 20:32:35 no Jan 11 20:32:51 mrmoku: ill try to Jan 11 20:34:18 yoyo: ok, i'll look at the sources Jan 11 20:35:41 PaulFertser: I shoud have 1.1 931 or 1.0 r350 gllin installed? Jan 11 20:36:14 yoyo: no idea, sorry. Jan 11 20:36:32 ok 350 will don't install Jan 11 20:39:18 PaulFertser: ok gllin is on the list "ps ax" Jan 11 20:39:42 "/tmp/nmeaNP" clean Jan 11 20:41:47 :.... I made somthing and it start to work o.O Jan 11 20:42:24 yoyo: so, you're happy now? Jan 11 20:43:59 PaulFertser: I'w dlike to know what happend Jan 11 20:46:38 yoyo: reproduce it again then :) Jan 11 20:51:07 PaulFertser: I didn't make any think wrong :/ and it stop to work :/ Jan 11 20:52:34 You should have tried to start (/etc/init.d/gllin start) by hand, it'd probably give you some clues. Maybe you had incomplete install or something. Jan 11 20:55:27 yoyo: and after that you could use nc (netcat) to check whether gllin's working as expected. Jan 11 20:57:27 PaulFertser: I don't know why it not start :/ and I don't know that it is nececery to work correctly Jan 11 20:58:46 yoyo: that's because you didn't tried to start it by hand, i guess. Or you would see an error. Jan 11 20:59:15 In desperation I start it but there whose any error :/ Jan 11 20:59:30 But did it run? Jan 11 20:59:53 Did it send data? to udp port 6000 or via file? Jan 11 21:00:12 I didn't chk that. Jan 11 21:00:35 I only know that what is on wiki (quait depricated) Jan 11 21:00:59 I didn't know about udp port seting by gllin :/ Jan 11 21:01:21 yoyo: from the wiki: '-udp 6000' [default] Jan 11 21:02:05 yes ok sorry Jan 11 21:02:31 yoyo: from the gpschannel.py: class GllinChannel( UDPChannel ): super( GllinChannel, self ).__init__( 6000 ) Jan 11 21:03:37 how can i set usb host mode in new framework? Jan 11 21:06:13 yoyo: i think you can sell your GTA01 to Andy (the kernel dev) (if he doesn't have one yet). :) Jan 11 21:07:05 on ms4 worked org.freesmartphone.Device.PowerControl (/org/freesmartphone/Device/PowerControl/UsbHost) Jan 11 21:07:21 now it doesn't exist ;x Jan 11 21:07:39 PaulFertser: good idea :) Jan 11 21:08:43 yoyo: i think you can find his e-mail, can't you? Jan 11 21:09:16 PaulFertser: I think I can try Jan 11 21:10:23 dos1: look at org.freesmartphone.odeviced Jan 11 21:10:55 is there somewhere tutorial to using mdbus? Jan 11 21:11:04 dos1: you sean "mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.opimd /org/freesmartphone/PIM/Messages" :)) Jan 11 21:11:38 yoyo: PaulFertser: (gta01) guess chances are better to swap it for a 02, by sending to me. mail me for details Jan 11 21:13:02 dos1: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenmokoFramework/mdbus Jan 11 21:13:15 mrmoku: thanks Jan 11 21:14:57 mrmoku: it lacks some details. E.g. type-casting sometimes needed. Probably types should be clarified. I'm not in position to do it, as i don't understand it well myself. Jan 11 21:15:18 dos1: have you found PowerControl/UsbHost ? Jan 11 21:15:28 PaulFertser: i'm searching ;) Jan 11 21:15:49 dos1: mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.odeviced Jan 11 21:16:29 PaulFertser: ok, i have :) Jan 11 21:17:46 mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.odeviced /org/freesmartphone/Device/PowerControl/UsbHost Jan 11 21:18:10 getDbusObject (self.dbus, "org.freesmartphone.odeviced", "/org/freesmartphone/Device/PowerControl/UsbHost","org.freesmartphone.Device.PowerControl") Jan 11 21:18:46 [METHOD] org.freesmartphone.Device.PowerControl.GetPower() Jan 11 21:18:46 what is wrong here? Jan 11 21:20:56 dos1: can't you see other methods? Jan 11 21:22:50 PaulFertser: i can see Jan 11 21:23:22 PaulFertser: but from python it still don't work Jan 11 21:23:58 mickeyl, I saw you once packaged python-sqlalchemy. sqlalchemy depends on pythons cgi module, but that isn't available. Ever dealt with that? Jan 11 21:24:30 PaulFertser: root@om-gta02:~# mdbus -s org.freesmartphone.odeviced /org/freesmartphone/Device/PowerControl/UsbHost org.freesmartphone.Device.PowerControl.GetPower Jan 11 21:24:30 /org/freesmartphone/Device/PowerControl/UsbHost: GetPower failed: org.freedesktop.DBus.Python.ValueError Jan 11 21:24:37 seems like frameworkd problem Jan 11 21:24:55 GetName works Jan 11 21:27:28 dos1: sorry, i can't help any further here atm. Jan 11 21:31:29 raster, here? Jan 11 21:40:50 mickeyl, cgi is packaged by python-netserver - so there should be a dependency on python-netserver? Jan 11 21:47:42 raster, is there a way to switch to fullscreen mode? Jan 11 22:03:35 hmmm Jan 11 22:06:20 quickdev: do you know what IBar Quick Launch is (illume)? Jan 11 22:06:34 no ;) Jan 11 22:07:11 I built a image with quite current e and on first start it asks me some more questions :-) Jan 11 22:08:34 hehe :) Jan 11 22:09:31 it asked me if I want to add mplayer to the desktop... and what apps to add to that IBar Jan 11 22:09:38 can't find it though :-) Jan 11 22:10:43 quickdev: know what would cause en elm_entry object swallowed in to an edje part segfault the app when you click on it? Jan 11 22:11:12 AntonTakk, show me your code ;) Jan 11 22:11:17 one sec Jan 11 22:11:24 mrmoku: iBar is just a module ... an animated application launcher bar Jan 11 22:11:49 didn't know it was in illume though Jan 11 22:11:52 sicu: ahh, thank you... will see if I can enable it :-) Jan 11 22:12:16 mrmoku: http://wiki.enlightenment.org/index.php/E17_User_Guide/iBar Jan 11 22:13:44 quickdev: http://pastebin.com/m6f277c46 Jan 11 22:14:49 activating modules on a Neo is not that easy ;) Jan 11 22:17:08 heh, nope ... easier done progmatically Jan 11 22:20:30 AntonTakk, elm_entry_add(ContactsUI); - instead I always used elm_entry_add($my_elm_window) Jan 11 22:37:43 is an elm_window needed? Jan 11 22:38:01 cause it worked fine replacing entry with clock and button Jan 11 22:40:56 Mr proposal is being beat to the ground by mickey and stefan. *cries* Jan 11 22:42:40 Hard to argue with those gentlemen. Jan 11 22:44:24 rob79 still there? Jan 11 22:45:32 AntonTakk, I don't know. Ask raster about it ;) Jan 11 22:45:40 or read some more sources :) Jan 11 22:45:53 know any good examples ? :) Jan 11 22:46:12 got this far reading Elementary.h Jan 11 22:48:55 honestly - don't know - maybe ask in #e Jan 11 22:49:23 did - unceremoniously ignored :) Jan 11 23:02:38 http://hosted.planetblur.org/shr_openmoko/index.php?shard=forum&action=g_reply&ID=3 Jan 11 23:05:32 It seems that the hardware team thinks "If it doesn't work, stick a cap in it" Jan 11 23:05:35 ;-P Jan 11 23:11:44 seems to have worked so far Jan 11 23:12:29 bah jan 6 image has no gps working Jan 11 23:46:50 query: yy if opimd will by redy. all gui apps like contacts, calender will by write from zero or some apps will be use as a base? Jan 11 23:46:52 n8 Jan 12 00:01:01 frameworkd has bug in rtc SetCurrentTime Jan 12 00:03:22 it says that pyrtc object don't exist Jan 12 00:30:54 py and rtc is an antinome Jan 12 00:33:24 can anybody tell me which gstreamer-plugins i need to get the fso-framework working? Jan 12 00:33:35 praise my lazyness, otherwise my neighbours' windows might be endangered. jOERG: special audio and photons Jan 12 00:34:44 mirko: Depends: python (>= 2.5), python-support (>= 0.7.1), python-serial, python-yaml, python-gst0.10, gstreamer0.10-alsa, python-dbus, gsm0710muxd, dbus, alsa-utils, fso-frameworkd-wireless-glue, ppp Jan 12 00:35:15 elektranox: oh, cool - thanks a lot for this list Jan 12 00:35:24 mirko: if noone went apeshit, you shouldn't need gstreamer to make Neo jell Jan 12 00:36:22 the default sounds of fso also need: Depends: gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly Jan 12 00:36:44 can you tell me which plugings exactly are needed? Jan 12 00:36:49 try aplay Jan 12 00:37:56 DocScrutinizer2: i'm not familiar with the fso - i didn't config anything but it tries to load the gstreamer-stuff Jan 12 00:38:01 so i thought i need it Jan 12 00:38:31 gstreamer sits on top of alsa Jan 12 00:38:42 like pulseaudio Jan 12 00:38:53 you dont need that Jan 12 00:39:09 use alsa tools Jan 12 00:39:15 like aplay Jan 12 00:39:18 oh, ok Jan 12 00:39:24 and enjoy Jan 12 00:39:34 how to config fso to not use gstreamer? Jan 12 00:39:40 can you give me some hints? Jan 12 00:40:33 i have not the faintest idea about fso Jan 12 00:40:57 mirko: you will have to modify the src Jan 12 00:41:04 if you want to avoid gstreamer Jan 12 00:41:10 if it is using gstreamer, i'd say "go, go!" Jan 12 00:41:28 as gstreamer is a good concept Jan 12 00:41:38 but it sits on alsa Jan 12 00:41:50 as everything does Jan 12 00:42:14 if you dont make aplay do what u want Jan 12 00:42:27 gstreamer never will Jan 12 00:43:40 ok, ic Jan 12 00:43:41 sorry, late at night, mirko.bhave to take another few hours outtime now. Jan 12 00:44:45 i'd like to continue this conversation tomorrow in the afternoon Jan 12 00:44:56 mirko: you will need gstreamer0.10-alsa + gstreamer0.10-ugly for default sounds or gstreamer0.10-base for yue sounds Jan 12 00:45:55 * raster yawns Jan 12 00:46:03 * raster stretches Jan 12 00:46:07 mooorning Jan 12 00:46:16 hi Jan 12 00:47:23 elektranox: yue sounds? Jan 12 00:47:42 debian guys created an package with alternative sounds Jan 12 00:47:49 a last statement: i prefer gstreamer way to pulseaudio. but i rarely seen good reason to abandon alsa. dont chose interface based on quality of docs Jan 12 00:47:53 ah, ok Jan 12 00:48:32 raster: sorry, night and bye Jan 12 00:49:38 DocScrutinizer2: nite! Jan 12 00:49:57 :-))) Jan 12 01:04:07 o.O Jan 12 01:31:22 O.o Jan 12 01:50:05 o.O Jan 12 01:51:45 a*A Jan 12 01:52:01 e-E Jan 12 02:02:53 raster: could you possibly tell me why this segfaults any time i click on the entry field? Which isn't actually visible, not even the text i set - but replacing entry with clock or button works, no text on the button thou: http://pastebin.com/m6f277c46 Jan 12 02:06:56 AntonTakk: because contactsui is not an elm widget Jan 12 02:07:12 when u create a new widget in elementary it looks for an existing one to tag it on to as a parent Jan 12 02:07:38 elm_win requires no parent thus can stand alone Jan 12 02:07:43 as there are NO saferty checks Jan 12 02:07:55 it blindly assumes its an elementary widget and goes accessing data Jan 12 02:08:02 the include file for elementary indicates it wants an Evas_Object Jan 12 02:08:06 there is a todo item for that Jan 12 02:08:17 no safety checks - any straying from the path will lead to bad things Jan 12 02:08:20 yes Jan 12 02:08:30 but evas objects come in varieties Jan 12 02:08:36 ah Jan 12 02:08:38 u wan an evas object created by elementary Jan 12 02:08:45 as it attaches extra data to it Jan 12 02:08:52 that elementary uses for handlign the widget heirachy Jan 12 02:09:03 so i have to create an elm_win, put the entry field in it, and then swallow the win? Jan 12 02:09:05 your ejde object wont have that data Jan 12 02:09:09 it'll have other data Jan 12 02:09:17 no Jan 12 02:09:23 u'll have to use thew elm_win as your window Jan 12 02:09:27 u cant swallow a elm_win Jan 12 02:09:29 (sanely) Jan 12 02:09:50 so elm_win will need to be your base window Jan 12 02:09:57 create all elm widgets with that as parent Jan 12 02:10:00 :) Jan 12 02:10:04 anyway - got to run Jan 12 02:10:05 lunch Jan 12 02:10:09 thanks **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Jan 12 02:59:57 2009