**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Apr 14 02:59:57 2009 Apr 14 03:02:59 ho Apr 14 07:24:56 good morning Apr 14 08:12:20 good morning Apr 14 08:37:36 Ainulindale: ping Apr 14 08:42:48 hi, i would like to investigate why many of shr applications segfault on my gta02, but i didn't find anything interesting with strace Apr 14 08:42:57 then my question : how to get gdb for it ? Apr 14 08:43:29 ( there is no opkg for it with default repositories ). Apr 14 08:44:44 nullix: IIRC opkg install gdb worked for me Apr 14 08:44:52 I remember having gdb-ed some apps on the FR Apr 14 08:45:17 (I'm running shr-unstable, but I'd expect gdb to be even in testing) Apr 14 08:46:01 also, it it a real segfault, or you just see the app-died window in illume? Apr 14 08:46:45 seems a real segfault ( seen with strace ) Apr 14 08:46:50 aha Apr 14 08:47:15 not any segfaults for me... Apr 14 08:47:20 s/any/many/ Apr 14 08:47:20 dent meant: not many segfaults for me... Apr 14 08:47:30 perhaps my rootfs image was just rotten Apr 14 08:51:59 i installed a testing version Apr 14 08:52:30 it seems that there are newer images in unstable Apr 14 08:59:10 ptitjes: Pong. Apr 14 08:59:21 Ainulindale: hello Apr 14 08:59:31 Ainulindale: I have a little question Apr 14 09:00:11 Ainulindale: when I pull in shr-unstable/openembedded (with master fso/milestone5.5) it says I'm up to date Apr 14 09:00:25 Ainulindale: but when I do git diff, I have lots of differences Apr 14 09:00:34 I told you that several times already Apr 14 09:00:37 hi 'vrybody Apr 14 09:00:39 We have patches in the overlay Apr 14 09:00:41 THat's normal. Apr 14 09:00:41 Ainulindale: do we apply some patches on top of it ? Apr 14 09:00:47 OK Apr 14 09:01:04 This won't be corrected until we got in oe, that is right ? Apr 14 09:01:38 This will stay this way Apr 14 09:01:45 mrmoku|e`: Ping Apr 14 09:01:48 Ainulindale:even if we go in oe ? Apr 14 09:02:13 Even if we go in OE, as we can't commit everything right away, or we might need to do things contrary to the usual policies Apr 14 09:02:14 Ainulindale: another question shr/ and openembedded/ are the only thing to pull ? Apr 14 09:02:18 So the current architecture will stay this way Apr 14 09:02:20 No. Apr 14 09:02:29 make update pulls what is necessary Apr 14 09:02:34 Ainulindale: having a branch in oe might be a better way no ? Apr 14 09:02:34 and add patches on top of that Apr 14 09:02:47 ptitjes: No. Apr 14 09:02:49 Ainulindale: make update just scratches my changes Apr 14 09:03:04 You can do make update-X Apr 14 09:03:06 check the makefil Apr 14 09:03:07 +e Apr 14 09:05:09 For the branch, keep in mind accesses, the fact that we're already using fso/ms5. Apr 14 09:05:22 Ainulindale: but make update-shr-unstable does git checkout and not pull Apr 14 09:05:53 Ainulindale: there is no probs with git to do a branch that track another branch Apr 14 09:06:19 +s Apr 14 09:06:27 ptitjes: THat's normal (again) Apr 14 09:06:35 That's why you shouldn't do update-shr-unstable Apr 14 09:06:37 Read the makefile Apr 14 09:06:49 And that isn't a problem of tracking a branch Apr 14 09:06:50 I'm reading it Apr 14 09:07:00 That's a matter of preventing stupid duplication everywhere Apr 14 09:07:02 I don't want that Apr 14 09:07:33 Ainulindale: so what make update should I do ? Apr 14 09:07:45 Did you read the makefile? Apr 14 09:07:50 shr-unstable/openembedded do not link anymore on openembedded/ Apr 14 09:07:55 Ainulindale: please Apr 14 09:08:05 I have it in front of my eyes now Apr 14 09:08:09 Then reread it =) Apr 14 09:08:43 And if what is there is not what you need, you can modify it, can't you? Apr 14 09:10:08 Removing the update part on the shr tree would be enough in your case, but that only means you're setup is wrong Apr 14 09:10:21 You should have an additional overlay for your local recipes Apr 14 09:10:30 s/you're/your/ Apr 14 09:10:33 (Damn I'm tired) Apr 14 09:10:39 Ainulindale: but that is the matter of git Apr 14 09:10:52 Ainulindale: I'm just maintaining some local commits Apr 14 09:11:04 Ainulindale: that is the way SHR handles it that is wrong IMHO Apr 14 09:11:08 I don't c are Apr 14 09:11:14 I can't see why you want to update everytime Apr 14 09:11:19 You don't need to Apr 14 09:11:29 THis is done this way, because there is no better way currently Apr 14 09:12:01 (Do I have to underline the fact that I'm tired, and cranky today?) Apr 14 09:12:05 I want to be up to date, because merges are better made the sooner Apr 14 09:12:28 Ainulindale: (No you don't need, this is very apparent :D) Apr 14 09:12:37 And you don't need to do make update for that (again) Apr 14 09:12:50 k let me stay to my git pull Apr 14 09:13:10 make update will only be useful if you want to have an updated OE tree with patches applied Apr 14 09:13:19 along with what it does, it also pulls in SHR Apr 14 09:13:29 which you are able to do manually Apr 14 09:13:45 ok that is what I doing until now Apr 14 09:14:16 I can't see why you always want to find another method to do something which works Apr 14 09:14:27 (Or find complicated way to do things differently from all others, such as building on top of a ppc) Apr 14 09:14:34 see my earlier question: Apr 14 09:14:34 [11:02] ptitjes: Ainulindale: another question shr/ and openembedded/ are the only thing to pull ? Apr 14 09:14:38 (but hey, that's only MY humble opinion =) ) Apr 14 09:14:50 ppc ? Apr 14 09:14:52 ptitjes: None are the thing to pull Apr 14 09:15:01 what ppc ? Apr 14 09:15:15 Your mac isn't even a ppc? Sheesh, that sucks even more =) Apr 14 09:15:29 he man do you live in the 80th ? Apr 14 09:15:47 pfff Apr 14 09:15:50 :D Apr 14 09:16:06 As I was saying, none are the thing to pull Apr 14 09:16:08 ppc aren't used in Macs for years now Apr 14 09:16:21 OE should only be updated by the makefile Apr 14 09:16:30 If you pull it manually, you'll have to apply the patches Apr 14 09:16:36 and shr/ isn't the one used Apr 14 09:17:58 ouch... Apr 14 09:18:10 I have something I did not have before my mrproper Apr 14 09:18:31 A penis? =) Apr 14 09:18:51 is there a problem I am not aware of with OM's git? Apr 14 09:19:07 Is that tichy complaining? Apr 14 09:20:21 nah. andy tracking Apr 14 09:21:44 it is just that I ^C while downloading I think... Apr 14 09:24:13 Does anyone know what ipk socat is in? Apr 14 09:32:38 Ainulindale: I was reading your posts about OE, and i was thinking to get some functionality from poky to OE Apr 14 09:33:11 Ainulindale: You could define some overlay without re-writing the recipes Apr 14 09:40:40 is the speakerphone supposed to work with shr? Apr 14 09:44:26 methril|work: that's what we did Apr 14 09:44:53 Ainulindale: but you didn0t need to patch the recipes Apr 14 09:45:03 Ainulindale: i think so Apr 14 09:45:18 Yes we did, for some issues we couldn't commit per se in OE Apr 14 09:45:37 For instance we needed to temporarily add a patch to evas Apr 14 09:45:48 We can't upgrade our e rev Apr 14 09:45:52 But we need that patch Apr 14 09:45:54 and is not better to upgrade the PV? Apr 14 09:46:01 oh!! ok Apr 14 09:46:17 Trust me, for the time being, it was the only viable solution Apr 14 09:46:22 i see that some patches are into mainline dev repo Apr 14 09:46:30 This thing helped us a lot when we tried to use the fastboot patches Apr 14 09:46:35 As they were commited and removed Apr 14 09:46:40 And recommited (partly) Apr 14 09:46:45 well, i was trying to extend to other machine, and it's easier if it's not patched ;) Apr 14 09:46:48 All in all it was a mess Apr 14 09:46:57 methril|work: other MACHINE you mean? Apr 14 09:47:02 yes Apr 14 09:47:09 Well why would it be easier if not patched? Apr 14 09:47:43 well, because you could stay in dev Apr 14 09:47:52 for unstable Apr 14 09:48:18 i know that the base branch is fso/mileston5.5 Apr 14 09:48:22 Well as we need to be sure we're using the same revs and all than FSO Apr 14 09:48:25 We can't Apr 14 09:48:34 Because we need to be sure we're talking about the same thing (for bugs and all) Apr 14 09:48:35 yes, good to know :) Apr 14 09:48:42 What is necessary is to cherry pick stuff in fso/ms5.5 Apr 14 09:49:02 what stuff? Apr 14 09:49:02 But we can't deliver pertinent bug reports without even having the same revs Apr 14 09:49:07 methril|work: well what is on OE dev Apr 14 09:49:20 :) Apr 14 09:49:48 but at least fso/ms5.5 is not going to be merged with dev? Apr 14 09:49:55 I have no idea about that Apr 14 09:50:01 But I'm not sure it'd be a good idea Apr 14 09:50:25 well, the worst thing is the packages -> recipes movement Apr 14 09:50:32 Nah, that's not a bad thing Apr 14 09:50:37 Easy to cherry pick and modify Apr 14 09:50:42 We just need to synchronize Apr 14 09:51:18 * methril|work nods, and like to help a little bit, to make shr support another machine, as fso is not a final distro Apr 14 10:07:42 methril|work: sorry, proxy issue, it eventually restarted Apr 14 10:08:02 methril|work: no problem with that, I can help you with what you need Apr 14 10:08:19 But right now, I'm going to eat Apr 14 10:08:30 Colleagues are waiting for me Apr 14 10:08:34 Ainulindale: ok, thank you. I'm trying to make a modem for FSO :) Apr 14 10:09:18 Ainulindale: ok, bom apettite (or something like that) :) Apr 14 10:11:43 methril|work: modem for fso? Apr 14 10:12:09 lindi-: implement a fso modem in ogsmd Apr 14 10:12:30 methril|work: what does that mean? Apr 14 10:12:56 i've other GSM modem than the FSO ones (a telit one) and i'm trying to get it working with FSO Apr 14 10:13:11 ah so you add support for a modem Apr 14 10:13:15 yes Apr 14 10:13:45 you though that i was developing a HW modem from scratch? Apr 14 10:13:52 or a simulator Apr 14 10:14:25 this was in my mind too, but i need to understand the GSM modem architecture Apr 14 10:14:33 :) Apr 14 10:44:44 Graaah. Apr 14 10:58:30 Ainulindale, is it just me or did you close a lot of bugs in the last 24hrs? Apr 14 11:00:27 I closed ~60 bugs, dos1 closed ~30 Apr 14 11:01:10 sweet! ;] Apr 14 11:01:17 it's noticeable. Apr 14 11:01:24 Well tell that to my mailbox Apr 14 11:01:30 I've been thoroughly spammed Apr 14 11:01:49 ;] Apr 14 11:01:56 well at least there are only 95 left Apr 14 11:02:04 which fit into one page ;] Apr 14 11:02:14 one page buglist is great! Apr 14 11:06:16 TAsn: I created other reports by the way Apr 14 11:07:01 * dos1 too Apr 14 11:07:24 dos1: you created other reports? Apr 14 11:07:27 cool ;] Apr 14 11:07:38 I also try to create reports all the time. Apr 14 11:07:48 there was so many tickets about opimd Apr 14 11:08:12 i integrated it in one ticket Apr 14 11:08:56 there are still few tickets about the same Apr 14 11:09:56 btw Apr 14 11:10:23 I heard kdrive is deprecated and Xorg should be used instead. Apr 14 11:10:27 TAsn: have you seen the pyphonelog bugreport? Apr 14 11:10:38 I think lindi- and PaulFertser have said it. Apr 14 11:10:47 bumbl, the one about the call duration? Apr 14 11:11:01 nah the other one Apr 14 11:11:13 requesting to open an expandable view with a double click Apr 14 11:11:23 bumbl: which i closed? :DDD Apr 14 11:11:31 or using an other theme Apr 14 11:11:37 expandable view Apr 14 11:11:40 dos1: i don't think it is a duplicate Apr 14 11:11:41 i.e pushing the arrow? Apr 14 11:11:44 yes Apr 14 11:11:51 the arrow is too small Apr 14 11:11:54 I already said many times before Apr 14 11:12:00 dos1: as i feature request something Apr 14 11:12:01 that the arrow is small and the gtkrc in the wiki Apr 14 11:12:01 but arrow is a theme issue Apr 14 11:12:09 should be used instead Apr 14 11:12:33 bumbl: so it's duplicate of "use another gtk theme" :P Apr 14 11:12:36 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/PyPhonelog#Installation Apr 14 11:12:51 dos1, please add this fix to the default gtk theme. Apr 14 11:13:08 TAsn: hmm, ok Apr 14 11:13:22 bumbl, fixed. ;] Apr 14 11:13:27 dos1, thanks. Apr 14 11:13:58 Ainulindale: did you remember my problem with the trac.shr-project.org login? i'm still with that problem. Apr 14 11:14:17 Well I don't understand, you're the only one, so I can't help you Apr 14 11:14:21 It could be something related to DNSs, but it fails with thor network Apr 14 11:14:32 could you remove my user and i try to do it again? Apr 14 11:15:15 Done Apr 14 11:15:37 TAsn, dos1 thanks Apr 14 11:17:41 Ainulindale: now it works Apr 14 11:17:50 commited Apr 14 11:17:56 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * r99d87be4b92e 10/openembedded/packages/images/shr-image.inc: shr-image.inc: increase expanded size in GTK theme Apr 14 11:18:08 expander* Apr 14 11:18:09 wrr Apr 14 11:20:05 haha ;) Apr 14 11:21:10 methril|work: good :-) Apr 14 11:21:47 Ainulindale: have you seen #345? Apr 14 11:22:27 Never saw Apr 14 11:22:29 (this issue) Apr 14 11:23:12 dos1, I think maybe someone should make a blog post Apr 14 11:23:20 requesting for gtk theme tweaks before release Apr 14 11:23:31 there are probably many skilled gtk theme designers out there Apr 14 11:23:54 Yep, might be interesting. Apr 14 11:23:59 and we can probably make gtk look similar to elementary or at least conform to the style/finger friendliness. Apr 14 11:24:05 TAsn: i've seen somewhere GTK+ theme which looked like elementary theme Apr 14 11:24:34 dos1, do you by any change remember where? ;] Apr 14 11:24:57 unfortunately, no :) Apr 14 11:25:03 s/:)/:(/ Apr 14 11:25:04 dos1 meant: unfortunately, no :( Apr 14 11:25:13 elm-gtk theme would be great Apr 14 11:25:25 dos1, is our elementary theme the default elementary theme? Apr 14 11:25:33 TAsn: yep Apr 14 11:25:37 now it is Apr 14 11:29:34 raster: ping Apr 14 11:29:46 http://www1.get-e.org/Themes/Toolkits/GTK2/ Apr 14 11:29:47 ? Apr 14 11:31:53 no Apr 14 11:32:02 it looked like actuall e17 theme Apr 14 11:37:50 dos1, do you remember the context btw? I mean, was it in a moko related site? Apr 14 11:41:30 Hey guys, as I told ptitjes, I'm in a shitty mood, he kept insisting until I told him he was getting on my nerves. Just as a warning, if I tell you, today, I don't want to or , leave me in peace Apr 14 11:41:44 ('Nuf said) Apr 14 11:45:28 * bumbl stops himself from writing "Ainulindale do you want to fix ... Apr 14 11:46:00 bumbl: That's not a problem, it's just a matter of listening when I say stop Apr 14 11:46:23 I'm truly angry today for no reason (I don't understand why), I'd rather warn. Apr 14 11:48:57 well then: could you give me a status update on your work with opimd (as i have read mrmoku|e` has integrated it into contacts) but it misses adding and creating contacts Apr 14 11:49:25 mrmoku has integrated it into contacts? Didn't know that =) Apr 14 11:49:33 Well I'll look into it after my break Apr 14 11:49:40 bumbl: IIRC he integrated it into lfg Apr 14 11:49:56 Anyway, break time, will come back in a jiffy Apr 14 11:49:59 btw. i used shr + the neo last week as my main phone Apr 14 11:50:12 Ainulindale: he integrated, but he didn't commit it Apr 14 11:50:18 Ainulindale: yesterday he said he has an opimd contact app Apr 14 11:50:26 Ainulindale: he is offline, and he was in bar with open wifi network Apr 14 11:50:30 yestarday Apr 14 11:50:43 and he said that he has nice opimd feeded contact list ;) Apr 14 11:51:18 and he said that opimd lacks support of deleting contacts Apr 14 11:51:28 and he has to write in python then ;) Apr 14 11:51:35 (to extend opimd) Apr 14 11:52:25 bumbl: pong Apr 14 11:54:04 raster: have you thought of contacting one of the big oss companies (ibm, sun, maybe red hat) about supporting an open phone financially as a fully open phone with some custom software is in my opinion a really nice addition t Apr 14 11:54:10 for companies Apr 14 11:54:11 that "sleep(10);" in ophonekitd is really ugly... Apr 14 11:54:36 e.g. sys admins use it to manage the servers as they are better integrated than the htcs with the server software Apr 14 11:54:58 or tracking and managing from outdoor support workers,... Apr 14 11:56:24 bumbl: ibm is trying to move as far from consumer as it can Apr 14 11:56:32 bumbl: sun... is trying to just survive... Apr 14 11:56:45 canonical :D Apr 14 11:56:47 "ubuntu phone" Apr 14 11:56:50 ;) Apr 14 11:56:51 bumbl: redhat i am not sure will be that interested - its not part of their market/business plan Apr 14 11:56:58 ubuntu if anyone is closest (canonical) Apr 14 11:57:11 Ainulindale, dos1, bumbl, so what do you think about moving to Xorg? Apr 14 11:57:19 raster: well they could expand their red hat distribution to the open phone and integrate the software Apr 14 11:57:20 TAsn: i think we should do it Apr 14 11:57:33 TAsn: but i don't think i'm the person, who should do it ;) Apr 14 11:57:36 so let's go ;] Apr 14 11:57:36 and i talked to mark s. years ago about embedded stuff and he wasnt to interested Apr 14 11:57:41 TAsn: moving to xorg? yes sure -kdrive sucks Apr 14 11:57:46 canonical as such is pretty mcuh all about packaging stuff Apr 14 11:57:49 they dont do development Apr 14 11:58:00 so i seriously doubt they'd want to do an actual phone hw Apr 14 11:58:24 but they do something like ubuntu mobile Apr 14 11:58:28 or ubuntu embedded Apr 14 11:58:41 (i don't remember name :P) Apr 14 11:58:45 they dont do any coding as such Apr 14 11:58:50 they just package Apr 14 11:58:59 its a big fancy word for "we repackaged for arm!" Apr 14 11:58:59 raster, hey, sup? Apr 14 11:59:00 it's the ubuntu bussiness Apr 14 11:59:02 dos1: yeah the sleep(10) is ugly Apr 14 11:59:04 TAsn: yow! Apr 14 11:59:05 :) Apr 14 11:59:10 bumbl: how was last week then? Apr 14 11:59:15 TAsn: Already thought about that Apr 14 11:59:19 TAsn: (moving to xorg) Apr 14 11:59:19 Ainulindale: i deleted it in my local build and testing Apr 14 11:59:28 I don't know about the technical implications Apr 14 11:59:29 we could try Apr 14 11:59:32 but i dont rate high success Apr 14 11:59:36 Ainulindale: ? for me it was relaxed Apr 14 11:59:44 ubuntu could have ome bought a laptop years ago Apr 14 11:59:45 bumbl: usable? Apr 14 11:59:46 and put modesettings into the kernel, it's that possible raster? Apr 14 11:59:47 raster, do you by any chance know about a gtk theme that will conform to enlightenment one? (and possibly be finger friendly?) Apr 14 11:59:48 and shipped ubuntu on it Apr 14 11:59:49 they didnt Apr 14 11:59:52 Ainulindale: yes Apr 14 11:59:56 the neo gets hot Apr 14 11:59:57 bumbl: happy with it? Apr 14 11:59:58 i do not see them touching mobile hw Apr 14 12:00:02 dos1, what sleep 10? Apr 14 12:00:07 when a call lasts > 1h Apr 14 12:00:21 TAsn: after recieving message and before showing it there is sleep(10); Apr 14 12:00:21 but i was surprised by good battery life Apr 14 12:00:23 dos1: well originally it was there to prevent dbus from failing, because we had an issue with it Apr 14 12:00:25 methril|work: modesettings.. eh? um.. context? Apr 14 12:00:31 dos1: I'd be glad if you were able to find a better solution for that Apr 14 12:00:33 hi, i updated my testing into unstable and (opkg update + opkd upgrade) it installed a new kernel BUT didn't do the depmod then at restart no usb connectivity, after managing to launch depmod it fixes usb ( then ssh connectivity ) Apr 14 12:00:35 dos1, lol, why? Apr 14 12:00:38 kernel modesettigns (2.6.30 ) Apr 14 12:00:40 and later Apr 14 12:00:45 nullix: yeah, known issue. Apr 14 12:00:49 for the graphics Apr 14 12:00:55 nullix: mwester was working on that, supposedly Apr 14 12:01:02 ah and a friend of mine said: "bumbl! you are again using your strange new phone, don't you" as a greeting Apr 14 12:01:21 bumbl: buzz? :-) Apr 14 12:01:25 bumbl, lol, same thing happened here ;] Apr 14 12:01:26 methril|work: whats possible? Apr 14 12:01:29 < echo Apr 14 12:01:49 Ainulindale: i suspended, then send sms to neo Apr 14 12:01:52 bumbl: i think you need a company that is hw friendly Apr 14 12:01:55 that has done hw before Apr 14 12:01:55 Ainulindale: i don't know what Apr 14 12:01:57 Ainulindale: i loose all apps icon too... Apr 14 12:01:58 i said no Apr 14 12:01:59 Ainulindale: it resumed and showed message Apr 14 12:02:00 ;) Apr 14 12:02:01 well are the new kernel features comming for intel cards (now ati and nvidia are working on it too) Apr 14 12:02:03 white lie Apr 14 12:02:15 Ainulindale, I too don't know about the technical implications, though PaulFertser and lindi- seems to know. Apr 14 12:02:25 PaulFertser, lindi-, I hereby summon thee. Apr 14 12:02:33 raster: well there are very few who do and are open Apr 14 12:02:37 dos1: yes? Apr 14 12:02:48 Ainulindale: maybe it was frameworkd problem, which is fixed now? Apr 14 12:02:51 raster, talking about the rPhone? Apr 14 12:03:12 dos1: resuming with SMS is normal Apr 14 12:03:18 that's what it does Apr 14 12:03:25 but hey Apr 14 12:03:33 The question is: do we want to do it that way? Apr 14 12:03:34 the call was neo <-> lg renoir Apr 14 12:03:37 Ainulindale: so why there is that sleep(10) Apr 14 12:03:44 This has nothing to do with that Apr 14 12:03:50 and i can't decide which of those sucks more with call quality Apr 14 12:03:51 ah wonderfull, at least on testing repo there is a gdb Apr 14 12:03:53 i thing the lg Apr 14 12:03:57 this sleep(10) was there for the initial power up antenna Apr 14 12:04:00 i mean on unstable Apr 14 12:04:04 (if we're talking about the same) Apr 14 12:04:10 bumbl: i know. Apr 14 12:04:14 (not only tested with the neo but with a sane phone too) Apr 14 12:04:16 TAsn: well any old "open phone" Apr 14 12:04:24 ie something that is really open Apr 14 12:04:24 Ainulindale: no, we're not talking about the same Apr 14 12:04:28 /* FIXME: Quick and dirty hack to avoid the GSM not enable error after suspend */ Apr 14 12:04:28 sleep(10); Apr 14 12:04:36 in void ophonekitd_sim_incoming_stored_message_handler(const int id) { Apr 14 12:04:39 Ainulindale, you know something went wrong when you have more than one sleep 10 ;] Apr 14 12:04:40 dos1: this one, I don't know about Apr 14 12:04:46 dos1: is it working for you? Apr 14 12:04:50 without it Apr 14 12:04:52 Ainulindale: yes Apr 14 12:04:58 Then please commit your modification Apr 14 12:05:02 Ainulindale: and there is no another sleep in ophonekitd Apr 14 12:05:02 :P Apr 14 12:05:07 dos1: well there was one originally Apr 14 12:05:29 TAsn: what? where? Apr 14 12:05:50 lindi-, Ainulindale also wants to move to Xorg instead of kdrive Apr 14 12:06:06 Ainulindale: if you have debian its easy, i don't unfortunately know about OE Apr 14 12:06:12 can you explain a bit about possible implications/drawbacks vs advantages Apr 14 12:06:18 dos1: well ok I remember we added g_timeout Apr 14 12:06:23 TAsn: I don't want to Apr 14 12:06:31 TAsn: I'm wondering if it would be interesting Apr 14 12:06:31 TAsn: ah well :) Apr 14 12:06:45 And I'm wondering what we would have to do in order to do that Apr 14 12:06:49 (technically speaking) Apr 14 12:06:51 Ainulindale: has been quite stable at least, nothing interesting happening :) Apr 14 12:06:55 Ainulindale, that's what I meant. Apr 14 12:07:09 TAsn: Yeah b ut that's not what you said :-) Apr 14 12:07:20 Ainulindale, shh, you are ruining my plans ;] Apr 14 12:07:22 Ainulindale: commited Apr 14 12:07:36 Ainulindale: why there are no CIA messages from shr.git? Apr 14 12:07:37 TAsn: i've been using X.org for a while. one implication: the power and aux buttons appear differently, so they don't work as normal Apr 14 12:07:42 from shr-settings and shr-overlay there are Apr 14 12:08:11 Ainulindale, dos1, btw, thanks. I'm amazed by the bug hunting commit rates done in the last week. Apr 14 12:08:21 dos1: let me add it Apr 14 12:08:24 you closed A LOT of bugs. Apr 14 12:08:25 ok Apr 14 12:08:27 there are no bugs! Apr 14 12:08:34 there are features! Apr 14 12:08:35 :D Apr 14 12:08:41 Weiss, this can probably be set in illume. Apr 14 12:08:51 raster, there are bugs! Apr 14 12:09:13 btw, for some reasons some of the elementary widgets wrap strange Apr 14 12:09:17 well, far better user experience without that sleep(10); Apr 14 12:09:22 very strange. Apr 14 12:09:24 dos1, probably. Apr 14 12:09:35 TAsn: yeah. i had a look, but couldn't easily find it. the power button appears as XF86PowerOff, and the aux button isn't mapped by default (if my understanding is correct) Apr 14 12:09:37 let's see if it doesn't break something for someone ;) Apr 14 12:09:52 TAsn: bugs! bah! never! Apr 14 12:10:01 dos1: done. Apr 14 12:10:25 dos1, even if it does break something, we have a clean bug tracker to monitor it ;] Apr 14 12:10:32 ;) Apr 14 12:11:29 so, I'll check for #345 Apr 14 12:12:05 root@om-gta02 ~ $ opkg search .svn Apr 14 12:12:05 root@om-gta02 ~ $ Apr 14 12:12:18 Ainulindale, fixed? Apr 14 12:12:21 ;] Apr 14 12:12:27 No, just non existent here Apr 14 12:12:55 i'm doing find . | grep .svn now Apr 14 12:13:21 root@om-gta02 ~ $ find / -name *svn* Apr 14 12:13:21 root@om-gta02 ~ $ Apr 14 12:13:23 but for now it has only seen mine svn trees ;) Apr 14 12:13:34 so - close it Apr 14 12:13:34 ;) Apr 14 12:13:37 as invalid Apr 14 12:13:45 Nope, that's not the way it has to be done Apr 14 12:13:52 First, confirm this isn't a special case Apr 14 12:13:55 Which I just did Apr 14 12:14:01 (asking him details) Apr 14 12:14:09 Then if it is, close it as invalid, if not, solve it Apr 14 12:14:18 ok Apr 14 12:14:30 Some people have issues which won't appear here Apr 14 12:14:44 methril|work for instance was unable to log to trac for no reason Apr 14 12:14:58 deleting and recreating his account solved his issue Apr 14 12:15:03 This doesn't mean there was no problem Apr 14 12:15:24 By the way guys Apr 14 12:15:29 If any of you are bored Apr 14 12:15:31 http://shr.bearstech.com/trac/report/12 Apr 14 12:15:52 raster: what about SVG and GIF loaders in evas wrt OE? Apr 14 12:16:01 It seems they were causing some issue Apr 14 12:16:22 Ainulindale: I'll take a look Apr 14 12:16:29 Ainulindale: they are disabled by default in evas Apr 14 12:16:46 they are available Apr 14 12:16:46 Ainulindale: i noticed that when i was compiling e17 on my desktop Apr 14 12:16:57 if u wish to build with libgif and librsvg dependencies Apr 14 12:17:14 librsvg sucks in glib, gdk/gtk and a bunch more Apr 14 12:19:15 Well is this recommended? Apr 14 12:19:20 (to build them that is) Apr 14 12:19:22 raster: to ask the creator himself: is it easily possible to get a 3 parts layout with elementary that is split into ~10%/70%/20% of the vertically available space without using edjes? Apr 14 12:19:29 well oe disabled svg to stop half the gtk world gettign sucked in Apr 14 12:19:40 but its an optional module able to be packages separately Apr 14 12:19:53 i see no reason it shouldnt be at least built and packaged Apr 14 12:20:02 if u wish to include it.. is up to the distro Apr 14 12:20:48 bumbl: hmmm tried weight? Apr 14 12:20:54 raster: yes Apr 14 12:20:57 tho that'd require they all have the same content min size Apr 14 12:21:09 if al had the same u could use weights 0.1, 0.7 and 0.2 Apr 14 12:21:20 ah Apr 14 12:21:24 they shoudl get poportionalyl allocated that space Apr 14 12:21:39 ok i'll try immediatly Apr 14 12:21:47 but if one of them exceeds 10% of the space Apr 14 12:21:50 different thnigs may happen Apr 14 12:22:00 depends basically ont he math - how it ends up in the output Apr 14 12:22:03 because when i tried changes in weight didn't make any difference Apr 14 12:22:04 * dos1 wonders if someone understand layouting in elementary, except raster of course ;D Apr 14 12:22:04 dunno - i just wrote the math Apr 14 12:22:11 i didnt intend it to do anything! Apr 14 12:22:12 :) Apr 14 12:22:26 dos1: well i dont see whats had about weight Apr 14 12:22:36 TAsn: w.r.t. 377 Apr 14 12:22:38 especially given the way bumble described it Apr 14 12:22:40 Did you commit what you did? Apr 14 12:22:46 ie 10% 70% 20% Apr 14 12:22:53 wight... 0.0 -> 1.0 maps directly Apr 14 12:22:55 Ainulindale, no. Apr 14 12:23:01 TAsn: Would you be able to? Apr 14 12:23:08 I wanted to know what you guys think first. Apr 14 12:23:26 About what? Apr 14 12:23:33 Ainulindale, hm.. before I commit I actually want to modify some stuff (concerning rules.yaml) Apr 14 12:23:38 Ainulindale, about the yaml rules Apr 14 12:23:49 *rules.yaml Apr 14 12:23:51 Well, tell me what you need to know Apr 14 12:23:55 about the oevents rules. Apr 14 12:24:00 I'll try to answer Apr 14 12:24:01 Ainulindale, I don't need to know nothing. Apr 14 12:24:14 just what you think about it. Apr 14 12:24:18 what I essentially did Apr 14 12:24:27 is having a gsmcall.state state file Apr 14 12:24:36 that is the state file that should be loaded by the framework Apr 14 12:24:49 and if the headset is in Apr 14 12:25:06 it'll load the headset.state otherwise it'll load the handset Apr 14 12:25:16 it's supposed to be just a link. Apr 14 12:25:22 Well oeventsd is supposed to handle that Apr 14 12:25:35 Ainulindale, fact is that it doesn't, so I had to add this hack. Apr 14 12:25:54 well it's not really a hack. Apr 14 12:26:02 Well this is weird it always worked here Apr 14 12:26:05 it's an hackish/almost legit solution. Apr 14 12:26:12 Maybe that's because our rules.yaml is outdated compared to the standard one Apr 14 12:26:12 Ainulindale, headset works for you? Apr 14 12:26:20 I don't use a headset Apr 14 12:26:28 let me check Apr 14 12:26:28 so what are you talking about? Apr 14 12:26:33 I tried a while ago and it worked Apr 14 12:26:40 That was my point :-) Apr 14 12:26:43 Ainulindale: are you regenerating image? Apr 14 12:27:12 raster: as i expected with size_hint_weight_set( 1.0, 0.2 ) it does not change anything Apr 14 12:27:14 Ainulindale: outdated? hmm... i will look at it Apr 14 12:27:15 I can't fakeroot complains about space Apr 14 12:27:38 There are extra things in the official rules.yaml Apr 14 12:27:42 http://git.freesmartphone.org/?p=framework.git;a=blob;f=etc/freesmartphone/oevents/rules.yaml;h=1ab637b5f75794993543bd56dfc63636d8b305d5;hb=HEAD Apr 14 12:27:48 using py-elm (but that should not matter) Apr 14 12:27:48 u want it broken up: Apr 14 12:27:50 68 - BTHeadsetIsConnected() Apr 14 12:27:53 | | | | Apr 14 12:27:54 ? Apr 14 12:27:57 or vertically? Apr 14 12:27:59 Ainulindale, hm.. Apr 14 12:28:01 sec. Apr 14 12:28:02 vertically Apr 14 12:28:06 aaah ok Apr 14 12:28:10 and about headsdet Apr 14 12:28:21 I'm wondering if that isn't just the fact that it was renamed Apr 14 12:28:23 well i guess the min size settings will skew that Apr 14 12:28:26 Ainulindale: would you like me to merge that changes to our file? Apr 14 12:28:29 basically everything ois assigned min size Apr 14 12:28:31 Ainulindale, still no headset support though. Apr 14 12:28:32 a box with item one box_horizontally item two list item three box_horizontally1 Apr 14 12:28:34 THEN with the leftover EXTRA space Apr 14 12:28:42 each is assigned their weight proportion of that extra Apr 14 12:28:43 ie Apr 14 12:28:54 if 100pixels was left after packingt everything at min height Apr 14 12:29:11 dos1: yes please :-) Apr 14 12:29:13 one with eight 0.2 woudl get 20, one fith 0.7 woudlk get 70 and with 0.1 get 10 EXTRA Apr 14 12:29:17 pixles Apr 14 12:29:20 in addition to min sizew Apr 14 12:29:59 well TAsn can't find my headset at work Apr 14 12:30:07 It's at home I suppose, I can't test Apr 14 12:30:11 Ainulindale ;\ Apr 14 12:30:16 you can read the rules.yaml though Apr 14 12:30:20 it says nothing about headset. Apr 14 12:30:35 you're wrong Apr 14 12:30:46 trigger: InputEvent() Apr 14 12:30:46 filters: Apr 14 12:30:46 - HasAttr(switch, "HEADSET") Apr 14 12:30:48 Mine. Apr 14 12:30:52 yeah Apr 14 12:30:56 but look what it does Apr 14 12:31:06 just turns the stereo speaker off Apr 14 12:31:07 Yeah, it mutes the speaker Apr 14 12:31:09 yeah. Apr 14 12:31:14 Which is supposed to redirect audio towards the headset Apr 14 12:31:19 I know Apr 14 12:31:19 DocScrutinizer? Apr 14 12:31:24 and headset will probably work Apr 14 12:31:28 TAsn: It worked in the past, I'm sure about that Apr 14 12:31:35 if you click the speaker button while in a call Apr 14 12:31:37 I can't see what your issue is? Apr 14 12:31:40 raster: at the moment it looks like that http://img3.imagebanana.com/view/75rkwun/snapshot2.png Apr 14 12:31:58 though it should be main, and speakerout should be the alternative. Apr 14 12:31:59 hmmm Apr 14 12:31:59 the list should use all the available space if possible Apr 14 12:32:02 to be honest Apr 14 12:32:07 i.e when the headset is in the alternatives should be: Apr 14 12:32:12 headset , speaker Apr 14 12:32:13 not Apr 14 12:32:16 i'd simply let the bottom buttons not expand Apr 14 12:32:17 handset, headset Apr 14 12:32:22 (weight 0) Apr 14 12:32:25 same with top ropw Apr 14 12:32:28 TAsn: on that I agree Apr 14 12:32:29 and set weight 1.0 for list Apr 14 12:32:34 ANd isn't it the case then? Apr 14 12:32:39 elementaryw ill upsize the buttons so they are finger-hiddable Apr 14 12:32:42 hittable Apr 14 12:32:49 you dont have to do that by allocating 20% for them Apr 14 12:32:50 Ainulindale, no. Apr 14 12:32:51 (for example) Apr 14 12:32:57 TAsn: You mean you have to click "speaker" on the phone to wire it to the headset? Apr 14 12:33:09 Ainulindale, haven't tested that, I suppose it works. Apr 14 12:33:11 raster: thousand thanks Apr 14 12:33:16 that was the error Apr 14 12:33:20 so no need to giv 10%, 20% 70% Apr 14 12:33:26 elementary will "just handle it" Apr 14 12:33:28 I just did a hack to make the headset be default as a poc (which I use here) Apr 14 12:33:39 TAsn: please give me a *precise* problem you're having Apr 14 12:33:39 ooh also Apr 14 12:33:46 I still have no idea about what you're having there Apr 14 12:33:52 alignt -1.0 -1.0 (which means fill the allocated space) Apr 14 12:34:00 Ainulindale, ok, first thing first. Apr 14 12:34:07 In you're ticket you're talking about a speaker issue Apr 14 12:34:09 Which issue? Apr 14 12:34:13 bumbl: on a desktop try this: Apr 14 12:34:14 only thing i have to figure out now is how to center the lables but that hould be easy Apr 14 12:34:14 State the problem first please Apr 14 12:34:17 the speakerout.state is bad Apr 14 12:34:23 Ok, why? Apr 14 12:34:25 export ELM_SCALE=2.0 Apr 14 12:34:28 as I explained in the ticket Apr 14 12:34:29 then run your app Apr 14 12:34:33 the power to the speaker is off Apr 14 12:34:37 notice how now buttons are forced to be much bigger Apr 14 12:34:39 you can verify Apr 14 12:34:40 No you didn't TAsn Apr 14 12:34:41 as wella s font sizes go up Apr 14 12:34:45 and some other things Apr 14 12:34:48 Ainulindale, really? Apr 14 12:34:54 Well not in the descriptive Apr 14 12:34:57 (which is what I'm reading) Apr 14 12:34:58 bumbl: http://trac.enlightenment.org/e/wiki/Elementary Apr 14 12:35:07 Ainulindale, oh right, I haven't. Apr 14 12:35:18 ok, sec I'll tell you exactly what's wrong in it. Apr 14 12:35:26 see Configuration Apr 14 12:35:31 TAsn: suddenly I feel better at just thinking I'm not that mad :-) Apr 14 12:35:31 it lists all the env vars you can use Apr 14 12:35:35 raster: brilliant Apr 14 12:36:10 (one is not documented - ELM_FPS - i havent documented that yet) Apr 14 12:36:47 TAsn: So quick info, here if I click power, it mutes the sound. Apr 14 12:36:53 (err speaker) Apr 14 12:37:05 Which is the entry I'm supposed to switch? Apr 14 12:37:07 (let me confirm it) Apr 14 12:37:10 ok Apr 14 12:37:11 sec Apr 14 12:37:26 iirc 'DAPM Stereo Out' Apr 14 12:37:27 is off Apr 14 12:37:32 should be on though. Apr 14 12:37:50 please verify (I deleted the old state file, only have my fix) Apr 14 12:38:05 You're right Apr 14 12:38:05 amixer sset 'DAPM Stereo Out' on Apr 14 12:38:08 cool. Apr 14 12:38:15 So this is upstream Apr 14 12:38:17 TAsn: i will work on rules.yaml about headset, and you will work on state files, ok? :D Apr 14 12:38:35 dos1, the state files are just fine ;] Apr 14 12:38:39 dos1: it's supposed to be good, dos1 Apr 14 12:38:41 rules.yaml Apr 14 12:38:42 Proof is Apr 14 12:38:49 dos1, concerning the rules.yaml Apr 14 12:38:51 Ainulindale: no, it isn't Apr 14 12:38:55 Why? Apr 14 12:38:58 it's just a bad behavior by the framework Apr 14 12:39:02 I don't want to hack it Apr 14 12:39:06 I want them to fix it upstream. Apr 14 12:39:14 Because right now you explained the speaker issue, but not the headset issue :-) Apr 14 12:39:15 trigger: InputEvent() Apr 14 12:39:16 filters: Apr 14 12:39:16 - HasAttr(switch, "HEADSET") Apr 14 12:39:16 - HasAttr(event, "pressed") Apr 14 12:39:16 actions: Command('amixer -d sset "Amp Spk" mute') Apr 14 12:39:16 - Apr 14 12:39:18 trigger: InputEvent() Apr 14 12:39:20 filters: Apr 14 12:39:21 - HasAttr(switch, "HEADSET") Apr 14 12:39:23 dos1, die. Apr 14 12:39:24 - HasAttr(event, "released") Apr 14 12:39:26 actions: Command('amixer -d sset "Amp Spk" unmute') Apr 14 12:39:28 that can't be good Apr 14 12:39:30 :P Apr 14 12:39:33 Why? Apr 14 12:39:35 TAsn: that's my laziness :P Apr 14 12:39:38 dos1, http://shr.bearstech.com/trac/ticket/377 Apr 14 12:39:41 Why can't it be good? Apr 14 12:39:43 I added a nice hack Apr 14 12:39:58 Ainulindale, because when a call arrives Apr 14 12:40:05 it loads the gsmhandset state Apr 14 12:40:22 I don't see any reason why the framework should load the state file automatically Apr 14 12:40:28 I think this should be handled by ophonekitd Apr 14 12:40:36 don't you agree? Apr 14 12:40:40 So your problem is Apr 14 12:40:53 let us say I have a headset plugged in Apr 14 12:41:03 TAsn: state file is loaded in rules.yaml Apr 14 12:41:06 it mutes the speaker (behaviour we need) Apr 14 12:41:14 i think rules.yaml is the right place to do all headset support Apr 14 12:41:14 but when the call comes in Apr 14 12:41:15 dos1, I know. Apr 14 12:41:18 it erases that value Apr 14 12:41:23 loading the state file Apr 14 12:41:25 is that what you mean? Apr 14 12:41:27 dos1, I think rules.yaml shouldn't be used to load state Apr 14 12:41:39 and ophonekitd should load the state instead. Apr 14 12:41:42 Nah Apr 14 12:41:47 ah and raster: is it possible to format text within a list in the form: texttext2 so that it looks like |text text2| Apr 14 12:41:48 Certainly not Apr 14 12:41:50 I won't do that TAsn Apr 14 12:41:52 Ainulindale, why not? Apr 14 12:41:57 It has to be done by a 3rd party rule processing engine Apr 14 12:42:02 Which is currently oeventsd Apr 14 12:42:07 Even though it's crappy Apr 14 12:42:12 bumbl: not a normal list Apr 14 12:42:17 but you still didn't answer to my question Apr 14 12:42:19 Ainulindale, it loads the gsmhandset state file Apr 14 12:42:24 genlist.. technically yes.. *IF* you died a custom item style of your own Apr 14 12:42:27 i only did 1 style Apr 14 12:42:30 which is not correct for use with the headset! Apr 14 12:42:31 (by default) Apr 14 12:42:36 TAsn: Answer to my question Apr 14 12:42:37 anyhow, concerning the state file loading Apr 14 12:42:39 Ainulindale, ? Apr 14 12:42:44 Grrrrr Apr 14 12:42:49 TAsn: i don't think your hack is nice Apr 14 12:42:57 dos1, I don't either. Apr 14 12:42:57 ;] Apr 14 12:42:58 I spent a minute trying to sum up what I thought your problem was Apr 14 12:43:01 in rules.yaml there are nice Not(x,y) and Or(x,y) commands Apr 14 12:43:03 raster: hmm genlist is still missing in py-elm so it is not an option ;( Apr 14 12:43:05 As you didn't explain it at all Apr 14 12:43:06 Ainulindale, I answered it. Apr 14 12:43:09 No Apr 14 12:43:11 Ainulindale, it loads the gsmhandset state file Apr 14 12:43:14 which is not correct for use with the headset! Apr 14 12:43:23 bumbl: that... is beyond my ability to help you with :) Apr 14 12:43:23 You didn't answer to my question Apr 14 12:43:27 14:40 < Ainulindale> So your problem is Apr 14 12:43:27 14:40 < Ainulindale> let us say I have a headset plugged in Apr 14 12:43:29 14:41 < Ainulindale> it mutes the speaker (behaviour we need) Apr 14 12:43:30 raster: yes i know Apr 14 12:43:31 14:41 < Ainulindale> but when the call comes in Apr 14 12:43:31 we can use it to make rules, which handle all of headset support Apr 14 12:43:33 14:41 < Ainulindale> it erases that value Apr 14 12:43:35 14:41 < Ainulindale> loading the state file Apr 14 12:43:37 without messing with links and cp Apr 14 12:43:37 14:41 < Ainulindale> is that what you mean? Apr 14 12:43:40 That was my question Apr 14 12:43:46 Ainulindale, not only Apr 14 12:43:56 ("Yes" or "No" would be enough as an answer to that kind of question) Apr 14 12:43:57 it erases the value, and loads the gsmhandset file for the call Apr 14 12:44:01 No Apr 14 12:44:07 It erases the value BECAUSE it loads the state file Apr 14 12:44:09 so i will now just try to wrap around it by adding 4 spaces between text and text2 Apr 14 12:44:12 Which is a lot different Apr 14 12:44:18 Ainulindale, yes. Apr 14 12:44:22 So a good solution to your problem would be to filter events on HANDSET and callstatus Apr 14 12:44:26 And to have an additional state file Apr 14 12:44:37 Ainulindale, there's already an additional state file Apr 14 12:44:48 and my hack does exactly that, filters the callstatus events Apr 14 12:44:49 I k now, but no rule to use it properly Apr 14 12:44:54 (best would be if it would be possible to add a horizontal box as list item Apr 14 12:44:57 ) Apr 14 12:45:03 TAsn: Why don't you explain things properly first thing? =) Apr 14 12:45:08 Ainulindale, ;] Apr 14 12:45:14 let me check your file Apr 14 12:45:17 ok, now let me explain why I think state file handling should be done by ophonekitd Apr 14 12:45:17 ! Apr 14 12:45:24 No, your file is wrong Apr 14 12:45:28 Dirty even Apr 14 12:45:34 Ainulindale, it is terribly dirty Apr 14 12:45:35 I'd even say UGLY Apr 14 12:45:43 I said it's only a poc Apr 14 12:45:44 51 while: CallStatus() Apr 14 12:45:44 52 filters: Or(HasAttr(status, "outgoing"), HasAttr(status, "active")) Apr 14 12:45:45 and bad Apr 14 12:45:47 53 actions: Apr 14 12:45:50 54 - SetScenario(gsmcall) Apr 14 12:45:52 55 - OccupyResource(CPU) Apr 14 12:45:54 you just have to use a different scenario Apr 14 12:45:56 that Apr 14 12:46:11 listen! Apr 14 12:46:20 I think ophonekitd should load the state file Apr 14 12:46:23 and not the framework Apr 14 12:46:24 I disagree Apr 14 12:46:26 because Apr 14 12:46:28 I already explained why Apr 14 12:46:28 let me finish Apr 14 12:46:29 ffs Apr 14 12:46:34 I'll still disagree but go on Apr 14 12:46:44 bumbl: list items are not just any old widget becaudse they are handled specially Apr 14 12:46:48 because lets say I implemented a Apr 14 12:46:53 voicemail app Apr 14 12:47:03 if the framework handles the state file loading Apr 14 12:47:04 list doesnt (currently) do antything special - but genlist definitely does Apr 14 12:47:10 it will load the gsm handset state file Apr 14 12:47:15 as if I'm initiating a call Apr 14 12:47:17 genlist minimises the # of items active by creating/deleting them on the fly Apr 14 12:47:24 so u couldt just put a box in Apr 14 12:47:32 as it'd be created and deleted as you scroll around Apr 14 12:47:33 and will therefore create a race condition if I try to set the state with the voicemail app Apr 14 12:47:36 define voicemail app Apr 14 12:47:46 an app that autoanswers after 10 rings Apr 14 12:47:51 Ok then again Apr 14 12:47:52 You're wrong Apr 14 12:47:55 TAsn: take a look at BTHeadset handling Apr 14 12:47:57 Why, you might ask me Apr 14 12:47:59 plays a message and records after the beep. Apr 14 12:48:04 Ainulindale, I might. Apr 14 12:48:07 Because this isn't *at all* ophonekitd role Apr 14 12:48:11 I'll repeat myself Apr 14 12:48:11 hi Apr 14 12:48:17 This is the role of a rule processing engine Apr 14 12:48:19 Ainulindale, YOU GOT ME WRONG Apr 14 12:48:21 Which we are currently developing Apr 14 12:48:34 TAsn: acting upon the phone shouldn't be done by ophonekitd by any mean Apr 14 12:48:44 maybe ophonekitd should ask to initiate a call Apr 14 12:48:46 raster: is it possible to set center relative to the available space (to center a label horiz and vert) Apr 14 12:48:46 soundwise Apr 14 12:48:50 all I mean Apr 14 12:49:02 dos1, ping Apr 14 12:49:02 is that doing it automatically, like it's done now Apr 14 12:49:05 is a bad idea. Apr 14 12:49:08 TAsn: And again I disagree, again, and again Apr 14 12:49:10 TAsn: it's task fof orulesd, not ophonekitd Apr 14 12:49:10 Because again, and again Apr 14 12:49:14 Gorbusch: pong Apr 14 12:49:17 This isn't one of ophonekitd task Apr 14 12:49:24 This is the task of a rule processing engine Apr 14 12:49:31 Which you'll ship rules for with your voicemail app Apr 14 12:49:34 Which will handle that Apr 14 12:49:36 bumbl: technically - yes, but the label edje design doesnt do that Apr 14 12:49:43 Ainulindale, I think I just got the role of ophonekitd bad, I meant the app that you click answer in. Apr 14 12:49:47 ophonekitd has nothing to do with that kind of specific issue, and I surely don't want that Apr 14 12:49:53 TAsn: that is lfp Apr 14 12:49:57 ok ;] Apr 14 12:50:01 sorry for the mix then Apr 14 12:50:01 (lifdrameworkd-phonegui) Apr 14 12:50:02 unfortunately labels dont have styles Apr 14 12:50:03 that's what I meant. Apr 14 12:50:09 And you're wrong again Apr 14 12:50:10 Even more Apr 14 12:50:11 thus i havent made it possible to have differently styled labels Apr 14 12:50:14 :-) Apr 14 12:50:15 dos1, about the battery profiles, you are right about the "daemon", that was the idea i had in mind as well, some daemon using the profiles and settings to configure it. Apr 14 12:50:15 not currently Apr 14 12:50:15 the app that wants to start a call Apr 14 12:50:19 and even if i added it now Apr 14 12:50:20 should ask for the state file Apr 14 12:50:23 I disagree Apr 14 12:50:28 Again :-=) Apr 14 12:50:31 it'd take time to drift up to python Apr 14 12:50:33 Because you'll do that for one lib Apr 14 12:50:34 dos1, should i split it into daemon first and afterwards the setting thing? Apr 14 12:50:34 then for another Apr 14 12:50:37 not an automatic rule that will decide for it and will block any creativity attempts. Apr 14 12:50:38 you'll just duplicate stuff Apr 14 12:50:50 Gorbusch: talk with FSO guys then, as it should be integrated in frameworkd ;) Apr 14 12:50:50 this is why we need a contextual rule processing engine Apr 14 12:50:57 which you'll be able to ship rules for Apr 14 12:50:58 as rules.d Apr 14 12:51:07 and this is what ologicd is supposed to be in the end Apr 14 12:51:18 Ainulindale, ok whatever. Apr 14 12:51:24 TAsn: my point is Apr 14 12:51:35 setting a scenario is "business" processing Apr 14 12:51:40 this is common to all the UIs Apr 14 12:51:45 All I meant is that the app that asks for a call should also ask for the type of the call Apr 14 12:51:45 if you start to put that into one Apr 14 12:51:50 you'll have to put that in all of them Apr 14 12:51:53 Ainulindale, ok, tell me how to handle this: Apr 14 12:51:59 let's say I want to start a call Apr 14 12:52:02 in speaker mode Apr 14 12:52:05 how would you do that? Apr 14 12:52:13 through rules, through ologicd Apr 14 12:52:28 Ainulindale, that's just forcing the use of ologicd Apr 14 12:52:41 TAsn: Don't misunderstand me Apr 14 12:52:41 raster: i understand a bit of edje and i can search the according functions in the C->python map so you don't need to dig into python - so it is not possible to center a label Apr 14 12:52:45 For lfp-X things Apr 14 12:52:47 It'll be used, yes. Apr 14 12:52:50 That is a must do. Apr 14 12:52:56 If you want to do your own app on top of fso Apr 14 12:52:58 You can do what you want Apr 14 12:53:07 But still, this kind of processing will happen in lfp Apr 14 12:53:11 I don't want to do that. Apr 14 12:53:16 And it will be this way because this the only way for it to be clean Apr 14 12:53:19 All I want is that apps will get what they want Apr 14 12:53:25 and not what the framework assumes they want. Apr 14 12:53:29 TAsn: You can already do that now Apr 14 12:53:35 Ainulindale, how? Apr 14 12:53:41 Well you call then you set the scenario Apr 14 12:53:54 (please don't tell me there will be a second of lag) Apr 14 12:54:03 Ainulindale, there will be a race condition. Apr 14 12:54:06 no Apr 14 12:54:09 yes. Apr 14 12:54:12 because you'll remove the scenario handling of rules.yaml Apr 14 12:54:13 so no race Apr 14 12:54:17 Ainulindale, OK Apr 14 12:54:22 that's what I said from the start!!! Apr 14 12:54:31 to remove the rules.yaml handling of state files Apr 14 12:54:35 And what I say is Apr 14 12:54:37 and setting the state by myself. Apr 14 12:54:40 Currently, we, (I), won't do that Apr 14 12:54:46 First, because we need such an engine as oeventsd Apr 14 12:54:52 Which is crappy but still exists Apr 14 12:55:02 but you do believe it's a wanted behavior? Apr 14 12:55:04 Second, because we can't expect every piece of UI to do that Apr 14 12:55:09 TAsn: What is? Apr 14 12:55:16 dos1, they mention in their wiki that they use this channel as well, can you give me a name? Apr 14 12:55:20 setting the state files as wanted Apr 14 12:55:22 not as is. Apr 14 12:55:29 you should unify call initiation Apr 14 12:55:31 What is wanted? What is "as is"? Apr 14 12:55:36 will explain: Apr 14 12:55:52 TAsn: I'll just give you the conclusion of some thoughts we had a while ago Apr 14 12:55:54 I mean you should unify call initiation by a wrapper function that accepts a type argument Apr 14 12:56:08 Currently oeventsd can only process information from frameworkd, mostly Apr 14 12:56:08 so we can initiate an headset/speaker/handset call Apr 14 12:56:09 Gorbusch: i'm sure mickey|sun is FSO guy ;) Apr 14 12:56:13 hello guys Apr 14 12:56:21 It lacks some contextual information based on what the UI could know about the user wishes Apr 14 12:56:29 nytowl! Apr 14 12:56:37 TAsn: This is why we need something as ologicd Apr 14 12:56:42 Ainulindale, ok. Apr 14 12:56:48 TAsn: And when this thing will exist Apr 14 12:56:55 Your point will be valid but resolved another way Apr 14 12:57:01 I'm working on a bluetooth scanner, and I need some help for the "ASk PIN code" part of it Apr 14 12:57:12 Wrapping it that way is a church quarrel Apr 14 12:57:15 Because you'll do that Apr 14 12:57:17 Then someone will say Apr 14 12:57:27 "Hey, I want to start in landscape mode! Let's wrap & wroll!" Apr 14 12:57:29 Etc. Apr 14 12:57:38 basically i juste want a popup with a numeric keypad wichi retrun the pin code when it's destroyed Apr 14 12:57:39 If we do that kind of thing, then, to me, it seems something is lacking Apr 14 12:57:46 And I think this is some kind of "context-aware" rules Apr 14 12:57:55 nytowl: I have to bother you about what TAsn found out Apr 14 12:58:01 nytowl: speaker out is broken in the openmoko scenarii Apr 14 12:58:54 TAsn: Did you get what I meant, or did you just throw the towel? :-) Apr 14 12:59:11 Because in the end I agree with what you think, I just disagree with how you want to do that :-) Apr 14 12:59:25 Ainulindale, a little bit of both. Apr 14 12:59:43 Pfff :-) Apr 14 12:59:44 I still think having a "divine force" that does everything from above Apr 14 12:59:49 That's not a divine force Apr 14 12:59:51 is a bad idea. Apr 14 13:00:02 You don't know how the sound is supposed to be handled Apr 14 13:00:12 It might not even be state files Apr 14 13:00:17 (I don't know any example) Apr 14 13:00:21 (I'm just saying that as is) Apr 14 13:00:23 I know Apr 14 13:00:30 that's why I think you should wrap it Apr 14 13:00:30 To me, having some kind of context is more modular Apr 14 13:00:34 (using bluetooth audio devices bey example Ainulindale) Apr 14 13:00:36 And more open to modification Apr 14 13:00:45 s/bey/by Apr 14 13:00:47 and make it ask for state Apr 14 13:00:49 i.e Apr 14 13:00:51 the illume bugs also have to reported to the fso tracker or is there a seperate one? Apr 14 13:00:56 call(number, speaker) Apr 14 13:01:01 call(number, handset) Apr 14 13:01:05 call(... Apr 14 13:01:05 .. Apr 14 13:01:13 well, TAsn, sorry to say again I disagree Apr 14 13:01:23 because you start with that Apr 14 13:01:26 TAsn: i disagree too Apr 14 13:01:29 then you'll want to have a flag to log the call or not Apr 14 13:01:33 well I disagree about your disagreement! ;] Apr 14 13:01:34 then to do this or that Apr 14 13:01:41 TAsn: Yeah but I win because I'm bigger Apr 14 13:01:54 TAsn: he has longer nick Apr 14 13:01:55 ;) Apr 14 13:01:57 (Or not) Apr 14 13:02:02 dos1, ;] Apr 14 13:02:03 so he won Apr 14 13:02:04 ;D Apr 14 13:02:32 anyway, I think both solutions work Apr 14 13:02:35 bumbl: m no. there is no sentered style Apr 14 13:02:43 the only (and default) is top-left Apr 14 13:02:53 though having ologicd to handle that is not correct. Apr 14 13:03:08 but Apr 14 13:03:18 I'm willing to accept any working modular solution ;] Apr 14 13:03:22 is it just me Apr 14 13:03:45 dos1, got eve? Apr 14 13:03:47 or is there something incredibly hilarious about a "o-logic-d" ?:) Apr 14 13:04:03 TAsn: no :( Apr 14 13:04:11 dos1, ;[ Apr 14 13:04:18 quit? Apr 14 13:04:22 anyway cya for now. Apr 14 13:04:26 Ainulindale K send a aptch :) Apr 14 13:06:07 ologicd sounds great but i think it will be a long way to get it useful Apr 14 13:08:24 yep, now ologicd sounds like sign of future ;x Apr 14 13:08:45 like opimd support (but mrmoku had yesterday changed it ;) ) Apr 14 13:08:52 TAsn: hey Apr 14 13:09:02 TAsn: send a patch to nytowl ! :-) Apr 14 13:09:12 to me is sounds like "my god! computers are not logical! quick! add a logic daemon to get some logic into these damn circuits!" Apr 14 13:09:34 raster: :) Apr 14 13:09:44 raster: well ptitjes chose the name, we can argue, I personally don't care Apr 14 13:10:14 if computers were so logical, they would not rely on humans to code them. Apr 14 13:10:26 logic != intelligence Apr 14 13:10:28 Ainulindale: i just think its funny :) Apr 14 13:10:29 meh =) Apr 14 13:10:40 raster: well for all I care we could have named that oseand Apr 14 13:10:48 That wouldn't be related to logic though Apr 14 13:12:00 I'm bored with this fakeroot issue, what is this problem again... Apr 14 13:12:02 Ainulindale: HAHHAHA Apr 14 13:12:27 Ainulindale: btw, where should be implemented reading contact name by voice synthezer on incoming dial? Apr 14 13:12:43 dos1: I'd say up your ass Apr 14 13:12:48 As this isn't useful at all to me :-p Apr 14 13:12:55 But more seriously, hmmm Apr 14 13:12:57 It depends Apr 14 13:13:05 I'd say it'd be a good thing for ologicd Apr 14 13:13:09 dos1: my plan was to have it be a feature of the in-call screen Apr 14 13:13:23 depending on the mode the phone is in Apr 14 13:13:35 dos1: because, to me, this should be "optional" somehow, but I don't want to introduce that much settings in lfp Apr 14 13:13:47 use the flite libs directly, or something Apr 14 13:14:13 nytowl, mail? Apr 14 13:14:27 dos1: but we can do that as a module to the newest vala ophonekitd too Apr 14 13:14:29 nytowl@openmoko.org Apr 14 13:14:29 TAsn: angus@om Apr 14 13:14:37 Damn, he's tricky Apr 14 13:14:38 Ainulindale: agreed, the phone shouldn't just blutr out "Missy Night, Mistress of Pain" in the middle of a meeting Apr 14 13:14:42 cool. Apr 14 13:14:46 AntonTakk: heh :-) Apr 14 13:15:00 yeah for some reason they wouldn't give me angus oh well Apr 14 13:16:18 Ainulindale: hmm... when we want to switch to vala ophonekitd? Apr 14 13:17:36 Well when we'll have some people testing it :-) Apr 14 13:17:37 Ainulindale, dos1, i had figured that would be a feature of a "hands-free" in car mode, with various options, and designed inteligently, like speak the name of the caller, and to answer, you have to drop the noise level below a (specifiable?) ammount Apr 14 13:17:55 I don't know what its state is, as ptitjes told me one day it was working, then told me it was lacking this or that Apr 14 13:17:58 In the end I don't know Apr 14 13:18:43 dos1: when we have recipes for it Apr 14 13:18:48 I'm working on it Apr 14 13:19:02 (very slowly though) Apr 14 13:22:20 nytowl, sent. Apr 14 13:22:41 thx TAsn i'll add it to my monster commit Apr 14 13:22:47 nytowl, ;] Apr 14 13:23:11 nytowl: you want to induce an heart attack for Koen? Apr 14 13:23:20 Hahaha Apr 14 13:23:34 not one his brnaches that's later in the week :) Apr 14 13:24:19 nytowl: and mwester commited a patch in SHR for the kernel Apr 14 13:24:47 need to send that to Arhuaco Apr 14 13:24:52 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * rb68ae3c249e0 10/openembedded/packages/frameworkd-config-shr/frameworkd-config-shr/ (om-gta01/rules.yaml om-gta02/rules.yaml rules.yaml): frameworkd-config-shr: catch up rules.yaml with changes in frameworkd-config Apr 14 13:25:06 dos1: thanks a lot Apr 14 13:25:41 * dos1 is searching his Neo's headset to play with rules.yaml Apr 14 13:28:08 oh Apr 14 13:28:12 there is a button Apr 14 13:28:17 are we supporting it? Apr 14 13:28:18 ;x Apr 14 13:28:35 hw does Apr 14 13:28:47 sw not? Apr 14 13:29:22 even kernel does Apr 14 13:32:49 lindi-: so where i can find some event caused of that button? Apr 14 13:32:59 any of /dev/input/eventX doesn't show it Apr 14 13:40:12 How are you gentlemen? Apr 14 13:41:47 fine Apr 14 13:42:45 :) Apr 14 13:44:14 raster: how much work would it be to change the cool clock input into a all numbers input method Apr 14 13:45:23 TAsn does gta01 need a similar patch ? Apr 14 13:45:31 cd .. Apr 14 13:46:28 nytowl: well yes Apr 14 13:46:36 nytowl: pwd is /openmoko-cdevel Apr 14 13:46:54 (i'd love to use it as input of money values [with changing the account and currency instead of the change am pm]) Apr 14 13:46:56 su Apr 14 13:46:58 qwerty Apr 14 13:46:59 ;D Apr 14 13:46:59 thx Ainulindale :) Apr 14 13:47:42 how can i reset my illume screen settings? Apr 14 13:48:10 display is just showing nothing readable anymore, restart doesn't change this Apr 14 13:49:01 nytowl: did you have the fakeroot "no space left on device" issue? Apr 14 13:49:19 nope ? what's that Apr 14 13:49:56 http://tinderbox.openembedded.net/public/logs/4355759.txt Apr 14 13:51:08 interesting. I haven't looked at buildhost in the last couple of days. Apr 14 13:51:30 I've been getting ready to dump a whole bunch of commits onto MS5.5 Apr 14 13:51:41 oh great Apr 14 13:51:44 dos1 strikes again Apr 14 13:51:53 it's like a bad openmoko movie :p Apr 14 13:52:26 Dave: what did he do this time? Apr 14 13:53:29 i never seen this fakeroot error Apr 14 13:53:43 Dave doesn't like me :P Apr 14 13:54:07 methril|work: we had it one time Apr 14 13:54:14 mrmoku|e` corrected it, can't recall how Apr 14 13:54:40 dos1: well Dave only likes his mokos Apr 14 13:54:51 then it has to be in the git-repo Apr 14 13:55:10 :D Apr 14 13:55:32 but they hate him Apr 14 13:55:51 :p Apr 14 13:55:58 >:p Apr 14 13:57:25 :O Apr 14 14:00:53 it looks like the only thing that mrmoku does was bump the fakeroot prefered version... Apr 14 14:03:34 Well it happened just after a make update on my side Apr 14 14:03:48 nytowl: did you change something about fakeroot recently? Apr 14 14:04:40 (I doubt you did, according to the log) Apr 14 14:06:24 I'm wondering if this could be due to bitbake Apr 14 14:06:28 git diff with the overaly? Apr 14 14:07:00 Ok, I know I think. Apr 14 14:07:49 he linked fakeroot to fakeroot-ng Apr 14 14:07:52 Ainulindale: give us more details :) Apr 14 14:07:55 because fakeroot-sysv was failing Apr 14 14:08:05 The question is : is bitbake still using this link? Apr 14 14:08:11 I just changed to fakeroot-tcp Apr 14 14:08:12 Will see Apr 14 14:11:56 Hmpf. Same thing. Apr 14 14:14:51 Nice var. Apr 14 14:14:53 "HOST_NONSYSV" Apr 14 14:14:59 let us use that Apr 14 14:15:33 * spaetz checks git lokk of SHR. loads happened Apr 14 14:15:48 while I venture away setting up a new openstreetmap server :) Apr 14 14:16:33 spaetz: ah, there you are Apr 14 14:16:34 So Apr 14 14:16:41 A bug wrangler should bug wrangle! :-p Apr 14 14:17:26 :) Apr 14 14:17:55 did I really type lokk instead of 'log'. Gosh I need coffee Apr 14 14:18:05 * spaetz spanks himself a little Apr 14 14:18:09 ;D Apr 14 14:19:17 spaetz: seriously, have a look a trac Apr 14 14:19:18 +t Apr 14 14:20:51 raster: (sorry for disturbing you again) are subitems already supported by genlist? [genlist feature list looks awesome] Apr 14 14:21:06 bumbl: yup. Apr 14 14:21:19 bumbl: do u have elementary etc. on your desktop? Apr 14 14:21:23 tun elementary_test Apr 14 14:21:23 yes Apr 14 14:21:25 scroll down Apr 14 14:21:27 RASTER Apr 14 14:21:27 LOTS of test Apr 14 14:22:08 Dave: soof! Apr 14 14:22:11 methril|work: currently testing with HOST_NONSYSV = 1 which builds fakeroot-native using -tcp Apr 14 14:22:20 at the bottom Apr 14 14:22:25 genlist tree Apr 14 14:22:26 its there Apr 14 14:24:39 ah found it Apr 14 14:25:19 raster: for what do you use the pager widget? Apr 14 14:28:52 bumbl: i dont use it for anything... but its meant for you to put multiple pages inside a window Apr 14 14:28:54 and stack them Apr 14 14:28:57 one on top of the other Apr 14 14:29:02 and push/pop and activate them Apr 14 14:29:40 hmm ok Apr 14 14:30:00 (i thought all the widgets you write you need for you swisscom demo app) Apr 14 14:40:43 sylar91 just posted this; maybe something to add in shr? :p http://www.freerunner.netsons.org/immagini/birra.jpg Apr 14 14:47:24 nytowl, can't confirm, I don't have a gta01 therefore I never checked the state file/know the naming, easy to check though, only one field is changed with the patch. Apr 14 14:48:09 Zorkman: I like it :-) Apr 14 14:48:33 Zorkman: If you're able to package it in a custom bb file, I'll include it as an alternative Apr 14 14:48:38 when i arrive home (1 hour later) i'm going to drink one :) Apr 14 14:48:48 TAsn there isn't a control with the same name but I'll look later to see if there is an equivalent one Apr 14 14:49:18 nytowl, cool. Apr 14 14:49:19 Ainulindale: I hope you solve your fakeroot issue Apr 14 14:49:21 bbl Apr 14 14:49:24 bumbl: ooh no - i am implementing wiwdgets i feel are generally useful Apr 14 14:49:29 I'm retesting currently methril|work Apr 14 14:49:43 bumbl: and i felt this was useful in being able to stick a bunch of "pages" inside a window and being able to flip between them Apr 14 14:50:10 raster: did you include TAsn's patch for rtl by the way? Apr 14 14:50:31 Ainulindale, yeah, he has. Apr 14 14:50:42 if you rev up e you can drop my patch. Apr 14 14:50:48 Ok then we'll have to remember that when we'll upgrade our e SRCREV Apr 14 14:50:54 Ainulindale: yups Apr 14 14:51:04 Yups yourself Apr 14 14:51:22 Ainulindale, just wait until breaks ;] (j/k) Apr 14 14:51:33 Yeah I know it'll break as you're the developer Apr 14 14:51:51 (how to be a motivational bastard) Apr 14 14:52:27 Ainulindale, ;] Apr 14 14:52:47 I was talking about the patch ;] Apr 14 14:53:00 I know :-) Apr 14 14:54:11 ok, just making sure. Apr 14 14:56:08 well, still the same issue with fakeroot here Apr 14 14:56:19 Although I built all that was needed Apr 14 14:57:04 raster, no idea about a gtk theme that conforms to the illume theme? Apr 14 14:58:56 TAsn: not really - gtk is overall less capable Apr 14 14:59:12 how do i had applications on my Desktop ? since my shr testing->unstable i lost all icons on Desktop Apr 14 14:59:18 tho for gtk on my desktop to make it half-look like elm Apr 14 14:59:24 Ainulindale: i'm playing with headset support in rules.yaml Apr 14 14:59:24 i use the B_and_W theme Apr 14 14:59:24 Tasn! Apr 14 14:59:26 google for it Apr 14 14:59:33 i cant remeber where i got it Apr 14 14:59:39 but it was maybe on gnome-look.org Apr 14 14:59:41 or something Apr 14 14:59:48 raster: http://linux.softpedia.com/get/Desktop-Environment/Themes/E17-B-and-W-44068.shtml Apr 14 14:59:51 raster, thanks. we are trying to make the gtk on the moko more e. ;] Apr 14 15:00:03 DAVE! Apr 14 15:00:31 nullix: you shouldn't do what you did Apr 14 15:00:35 you should reflash Apr 14 15:01:10 dos1, looks more than decent Apr 14 15:01:20 what do you say about applying this as the default theme? Apr 14 15:01:29 oh god Apr 14 15:01:36 Nooooooooooooooooooo Apr 14 15:01:36 (btw don't forget to add my correction for the expander size) Apr 14 15:01:43 Dave, stfu! ;] Apr 14 15:01:44 Ainulindale: yep, but i want to understand a little, then i prefer fighting with 'how it works'... Apr 14 15:02:01 nullix: well here there is unfortunately nothing to understand, it'll fail because too many changes Apr 14 15:03:35 you mean that there are too many things to understand, there is always something to understand. Apr 14 15:12:23 I don't have a tmp/work///temp/log.do_package_stage.xxxxx file Apr 14 15:12:30 only do_package_stage_all Apr 14 15:12:38 how can I know what happened wrong during the do_package_stage phase ? Apr 14 15:13:26 ptitjes :o Apr 14 15:14:39 hello Dave Apr 14 15:17:08 TAsn: i think we should use it Apr 14 15:17:09 ;) Apr 14 15:17:26 dos1, the black and white? Apr 14 15:17:30 YEAH we should. Apr 14 15:17:38 don't ask Dave Apr 14 15:17:40 he's a mad man. Apr 14 15:17:41 ;] Apr 14 15:17:44 madman* Apr 14 15:18:18 just apply it and close that damn ticket about the gtk theme ;] (change expander size and scrollbar size though) Apr 14 15:18:34 i.e, make a correction gtkrc that will also be included Apr 14 15:18:51 that will force size changes for the moko, so even if you switch a theme, size changes will remain. Apr 14 15:18:54 ciao, gtg. Apr 14 15:21:33 expander is changed Apr 14 15:21:43 scrollbar not now Apr 14 15:22:14 what are you using for debugging? gdb or anything graphical? Apr 14 15:26:49 I'm doing something really ugly here Apr 14 15:27:07 Ainulindale: you ugly boy Apr 14 15:27:20 dos1: well fakeroot is going mad Apr 14 15:27:54 Let us see if it works properly Apr 14 15:28:31 Seems it does Apr 14 15:28:50 Ainulindale: so new image will be there? Apr 14 15:28:58 Hopefully. Apr 14 15:29:09 i want to test newly generated image Apr 14 15:29:11 But first I'll make update Apr 14 15:29:17 as i'm using one flashed in january Apr 14 15:29:19 I thought you didn't reflash Apr 14 15:29:21 and only upgraded Apr 14 15:29:21 ;) Apr 14 15:29:27 Well you're mad Apr 14 15:29:44 Ok let me launch it =) Apr 14 15:29:45 that's why i didn't have problems with all those settings icons Apr 14 15:29:47 Ainulindale: hi Apr 14 15:30:07 cause i installed package, and that hack in shr-image.inc wasn't done for me ;) Apr 14 15:30:13 Ainulindale: openBmap recipe for 0.2.1 has hit OE thanks to Stefan. Could you add it to SHR? Apr 14 15:30:22 onen: Yeah I will Apr 14 15:30:48 dos1: Ah you mean the >> category office ? Apr 14 15:31:29 Ainulindale: yep Apr 14 15:31:35 is there a usable program for audio-mapping in shr? Apr 14 15:31:36 Good thinking, I forgot about that Apr 14 15:33:28 Just for the record Apr 14 15:33:41 I copied fakeroot-tcp in the staging directory Apr 14 15:33:52 As it seems it just wouldn't build it with TCP instead of the SYSV IPC Apr 14 15:33:57 So it's really ugly Apr 14 15:35:25 Ainulindale: thanks! Apr 14 15:35:35 ONEN Apr 14 15:37:03 Dave: yes Dave, stop shouting at me :'-( Apr 14 15:37:08 Dave: :-P Apr 14 15:48:10 :P Apr 14 15:49:32 * mwester storms into the channel, and kicks the bot, just because he's generally crabby. Apr 14 15:49:37 ~kick bzzbot Apr 14 15:50:02 (stupid bot) Apr 14 15:50:11 ~shrbug 123 Apr 14 15:50:21 bah. Apr 14 15:50:35 :P Apr 14 15:50:43 curmudgeon! Apr 14 15:50:50 stupid bot Apr 14 15:50:51 haha Apr 14 15:50:53 s/stupid/good/ Apr 14 15:50:55 stupid dos Apr 14 15:50:59 ;x Apr 14 15:51:03 :p Apr 14 15:51:06 s/dos/Dave/ Apr 14 15:51:17 I'll undo those changes, 'cause that didn't work very well. Apr 14 15:51:21 er... Apr 14 15:51:32 bzzbot isn't coming back. Apr 14 15:51:46 Ah. Apr 14 15:51:57 stupid bot Apr 14 15:51:59 ~whine mwester Apr 14 15:52:01 s/stupid/good/ Apr 14 15:52:01 dos1 meant: good bot Apr 14 15:52:12 ~shrbug 123 Apr 14 15:52:25 ~seen dos1 Apr 14 15:52:26 dos1 is currently on #openmoko-cdevel. Has said a total of 4 messages. Is idling for 0s, last said: '~seen dos1'. Apr 14 15:52:49 dos1: shrbug ddin't work. I need to actually look at the code this time. :) Apr 14 15:53:00 mwester: I already have a bot to do that Apr 14 15:53:08 Oh. Apr 14 15:53:17 mwester: so do not exhaust yourself with it Apr 14 15:53:17 Then I shall I not bother. Apr 14 15:53:25 mwester: as you wish, I don't care Apr 14 15:53:31 It's offline because I don't have a proper connection at home Apr 14 15:53:41 I'll have it back by the end of the week I think Apr 14 15:53:56 No proper connection? I thought you even had a backup connection... Apr 14 15:54:10 Yeah, but I can't plug my switch Apr 14 15:54:14 So my server is down Apr 14 15:54:27 maybe run it on some shell? ;x Apr 14 15:54:37 dos1 Apr 14 15:54:40 + for file in '$patches' Apr 14 15:54:40 + patch Apr 14 15:54:40 patch: **** read error : Is a directory Apr 14 15:54:45 I wonder whose fault that is Apr 14 15:54:50 mine! Apr 14 15:54:58 :x Apr 14 15:55:46 Meanwhile I'll comment it out Apr 14 15:55:57 My fakeroot hack seems to work that's something at least Apr 14 15:57:05 * mwester wants someone in this hemisphere to send out C and R for buzzfixing. Apr 14 15:57:37 Ainulindale: but whole image fault because of that? Apr 14 15:57:54 s/image/image generation/ Apr 14 15:57:54 dos1 meant: Ainulindale: but whole image generation fault because of that? Apr 14 15:58:31 dos1: yeah Apr 14 15:58:34 Can you tell me where i can get the gdbserver for the freerunner? Apr 14 16:00:24 Gorbusch: in debian at least? Apr 14 16:01:05 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * rb9b5a07feb90 10/openembedded/packages/images/shr-image.inc: shr-image.inc: fix sending directory to patch Apr 14 16:01:23 lindi, no i need it for shr Apr 14 16:01:25 You should test your stuff dos1 =) Apr 14 16:01:31 Gorbusch: I'll compile it asap Apr 14 16:01:42 Ainulindale: i can't Apr 14 16:01:59 my build fails on vala-native Apr 14 16:02:12 Why? Apr 14 16:02:20 Gorbusch: you said you wanted it for fr :) Apr 14 16:02:27 I'm sure that's because you didn't do bitbake vala-bootstrap-native Apr 14 16:02:39 Ainulindale. if you use another way for debugging, willing to try it Apr 14 16:02:39 Do that, thank me, and test your stuff :-p Apr 14 16:02:48 Gorbusch: Well yeah I have another way Apr 14 16:02:52 I ask for other people to test it for me Apr 14 16:02:58 hihi Apr 14 16:02:59 That's less time consuming Apr 14 16:03:36 dos1: image built (without your klog patch) Apr 14 16:03:42 (I commented it temporarily) Apr 14 16:05:36 ok, reflashing the whole stuff, hoping I didn't bork half the planet with my dirty hack Apr 14 16:07:17 ;) Apr 14 16:08:05 Meanwhile I'll go and grab a coffee Apr 14 16:08:12 dos1: Please tell me I solved your issue :-) Apr 14 16:09:49 Ainulindale: wait wait, bitbake is regenerating bb cache ;x Apr 14 16:11:51 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * re47892b75d3b 10/ (6 files in 3 dirs): Apr 14 16:11:51 freesmartphone.org: * [ogsmd] Support handling setup and tethering of PDP connections on our own. Apr 14 16:11:51 freesmartphone.org: * [ogsmd] [QUALCOMM MSM]: Handle setup the PDP connection. Apr 14 16:12:05 mickey|sun: ping Apr 14 16:13:10 hmmmmmm Apr 14 16:24:06 dos1: booting. Apr 14 16:24:22 Will tell you what fails, and will accuse you no matter what :-) Apr 14 16:25:29 mwester. Apr 14 16:25:31 ? Apr 14 16:25:48 dos1: image is booting Apr 14 16:25:55 (properly) Apr 14 16:26:23 No extra icon it seems. Apr 14 16:26:34 No htop though. Apr 14 16:28:21 So my guess is, removing your hack, you removed other stuff :-) Apr 14 16:28:26 err, the desktop hack Apr 14 16:30:05 but i think we should fix that icons in packages Apr 14 16:30:16 not in shr-image Apr 14 16:30:33 I agree but this is a huge task Apr 14 16:30:45 and... do we really need htop desktop icon? ;) Apr 14 16:31:57 * mwester removes his mittens and says hi to Ainulindale. Apr 14 16:32:09 dos1: yes Apr 14 16:32:13 (I'd say) Apr 14 16:32:17 ptitjes: can we rename the .vala files to .vapi in fso-glib? Apr 14 16:32:22 But for now, let us focus on real stuff Apr 14 16:32:24 :) Apr 14 16:32:24 ptitjes: can you regenerate btw.? Apr 14 16:32:34 mwester: what about this depmod thing? :-) Apr 14 16:32:42 The "Exec" line is wrong for htop in the .desktop file -- in needs to be vala-terminal -e htop Apr 14 16:32:48 Ainulindale: fixed. Apr 14 16:32:55 mickeyl: vapis are produced by valac Apr 14 16:32:55 mwester: Where? Apr 14 16:33:03 unstable Apr 14 16:33:07 mwester: here I had to depmod -a at boot Apr 14 16:33:13 (today build) Apr 14 16:33:23 mwester: it was corrected a while ago Apr 14 16:33:26 mickeyl: renaming them as vapis would not enable compilation of the dbus stubs, etc... Apr 14 16:33:28 but dos modified the image.inc file Apr 14 16:33:37 oh Apr 14 16:33:41 ptitjes: hmm, k Apr 14 16:33:47 mickeyl: I wait for you for days :) Apr 14 16:33:54 mickeyl: some questions: Apr 14 16:34:00 ptitjes: did you think about handling some non-standard attributes? Apr 14 16:34:15 mickeyl: what is the status for fso's vbala git Apr 14 16:34:19 * mwester throws a dirty dishwashing sponge at dos1 for breaking the patches, and goes to clean his env and find out what went wrong. Apr 14 16:34:46 mickeyl: in fact I'm waiting for you to answer those two questions before making an annouce mail on fso-standards about that Apr 14 16:34:56 Ainulindale, mwester: show me where I broked something :P Apr 14 16:35:01 s/broked/broke/ Apr 14 16:35:03 dos1 meant: Ainulindale, mwester: show me where I broke something :P Apr 14 16:35:08 dos1: http://git.shr-project.org/git/?p=shr-overlay.git;a=blobdiff;f=openembedded/packages/images/shr-image.inc;h=e8df879c1b39a9ac1b91fae0254da7f00581009a;hp=4535c8780e25047b2955182569f071a4d480a9f7;hb=f15f7124228c539fb5ae95463912f3f839b1d784;hpb=abde39cd1b6d93cd1d157f20d27dbbd89a44039d this is invalid and not useful anymore Apr 14 16:35:13 (IIRC) Apr 14 16:35:21 ptitjes: i'm afraid we pretty much broke the repo. there's vala-lang now where master tracks master, mickey/0.6/posix is a 0.6 based branch. I think it would make sense to bring your gir-introspection stuff over to vala-lang Apr 14 16:35:29 mickeyl: my next two weeks will be for specs&libfso-glib&vala Apr 14 16:35:31 http://git.shr-project.org/git/?p=shr-overlay.git;a=blobdiff;f=openembedded/packages/images/shr-image.inc;h=863bdabeebf82c26150c85a8b4e3de8d4c427bf9;hp=6a49161d277743f0f53f273549382e61e98d4d46;hb=ab9aa3d018062bdf18c047f2d6ae48cd8b9bd7a8;hpb=1506d17d0ad62e4459b7c69ce5286475b6894314 <= this is very good, thanks Apr 14 16:35:35 * mwester cannot cut and paste from his xchat to his browser, so he begins to type the URL that Ainulindale posted. Apr 14 16:35:37 ptitjes: ah, pretty cool Apr 14 16:35:38 sihg Apr 14 16:35:39 (and vala-dbus-binding-tool) Apr 14 16:35:41 er, sigh. Apr 14 16:36:00 ptitjes: good timing. Apr 14 16:36:21 Ainulindale: I added it, because there was said that it's fixed upstream, but when we bumped EFL_SRCREV, it didn't ;p Apr 14 16:36:24 mickeyl: so this brings my second question Apr 14 16:36:25 :) Apr 14 16:36:37 dos1: well to me it seems it is, I might be mistaken Apr 14 16:36:45 But as you didn't install a fresh image Apr 14 16:36:48 I don't trust you! Apr 14 16:36:52 mickeyl: what items still prevent you to move to 0.7 ? Apr 14 16:36:56 mwester: http://tinyurl.com/cn3yrj Apr 14 16:36:56 mwester Apr 14 16:37:04 root@om-gta02 ~ $ opkg upgrade Apr 14 16:37:04 root@om-gta02 ~ $ Apr 14 16:37:09 This is good, thanks for kernel fix. Apr 14 16:37:19 ptitjes: fso 5.5 will take my attention for the next two weeks Apr 14 16:37:24 i don't have time to adjust all my vala projects Apr 14 16:37:34 to build with 07 Apr 14 16:37:41 opkg upgrade and depmod has not been fixed or even looked at to see if it is broken; I do not support opkg upgrade of kernels. Apr 14 16:37:46 that's the only concern Apr 14 16:37:48 gurugentoo: thanks! Apr 14 16:37:56 mickeyl: you mean the Makefile (I ask this to be sure we understand eachother) Apr 14 16:38:03 the build system changes, yes Apr 14 16:38:05 onen? Apr 14 16:38:12 mickeyl: ok Apr 14 16:38:18 mwester: well yes but you produced rightly named packages Apr 14 16:38:31 Well, then it was quite by accident! ;-) Apr 14 16:38:33 mickeyl: I query you (too much noise here ;)) Apr 14 16:38:45 Ainulindale: so? would you like me to add "depmod -a" to shr-image.inc? :P Apr 14 16:38:48 I am too noisy for ptitjes now??? Apr 14 16:38:55 :D Apr 14 16:38:57 dos1: that's not what we need Apr 14 16:38:59 feel free to, but i think the public is interested :) Apr 14 16:39:04 Ainulindale: i know. Apr 14 16:39:16 Ainulindale: but you said i broke something ;p Apr 14 16:39:22 * mwester shuts up Apr 14 16:39:26 Yeah, just for the sake of the principle of accusing someone else Apr 14 16:39:32 ;x Apr 14 16:39:41 mwester: so, this depmod patch? :-) Apr 14 16:39:44 mickeyl: ok but I'm having difficulties to concentrate on my sayings :) Apr 14 16:39:55 mickeyl: so my plans for the next two weeks are: Apr 14 16:40:22 mickeyl: 1) add --with-specs-dir configure option for libfso-glib Apr 14 16:40:41 mickeyl: so that it can be buildt easily as part of oe Apr 14 16:41:06 good Apr 14 16:41:29 mickeyl: 2) add enumeration values in the specs and support it in vala-dbus-binding-tool Apr 14 16:42:17 mickeyl: 3) add support for dbus errors in vala, declare them in the specs and support it in vala-dbus-binding-tool Apr 14 16:42:28 excellent Apr 14 16:43:53 mickeyl: 4) add support for transparent proxies in place of ObjectPathes, add an attribute to declare the dbus object type where needed in specs, and support that in vala-dbus-binding-tool Apr 14 16:44:09 mickeyl: so 1) is straight forward Apr 14 16:44:58 mickeyl: for 2), 3) and 4) we need to discuss the details of the xml format extensions Apr 14 16:45:04 for this I need you Apr 14 16:45:28 ok Apr 14 16:45:32 mickeyl: for 3) and 4) I need an uptodate vala repository Apr 14 16:45:52 then create a branch based on master in vala-lang Apr 14 16:45:56 mickeyl: I think the fso repository' master should track master from gnome Apr 14 16:46:06 correct. this we do Apr 14 16:46:09 [in vala-lang.git] Apr 14 16:46:35 mickeyl: and have a 0.6 branch that tracks the gnome 0.6 branch for you to have time to upgrade your Makefiles Apr 14 16:46:54 (which btw is quite straight forward...) Apr 14 16:47:37 vala-lang.git ? Apr 14 16:47:50 yes, i created this repo when we broke vala Apr 14 16:47:55 ohhh Apr 14 16:48:05 you should have tell me :) Apr 14 16:48:07 i did Apr 14 16:48:11 more than once :) Apr 14 16:48:18 so can I recreate my gir-support branch on it ? Apr 14 16:48:18 but we always don't read logs ;) Apr 14 16:48:23 yes, please Apr 14 16:48:26 cool Apr 14 16:48:50 also I should have created a topic branch for the transparent proxy instanciation at first Apr 14 16:48:51 * Ainulindale *coughs* doesn't *cough* listen *cough* told him *cough* Apr 14 16:48:58 yeah Apr 14 16:49:18 * Ainulindale flees to his whistling again Apr 14 16:49:50 mickeyl: could you make it public (I mean on the web) Apr 14 16:50:15 it should be Apr 14 16:50:23 hmm Apr 14 16:50:32 for some reason the project file is inconsistent Apr 14 16:50:35 *sigh* Apr 14 16:50:36 * mickeyl fixes Apr 14 16:50:59 mickeyl: also do you specify PREFERRED_VERSION for vala and vala-native in fso/5.5 ? Apr 14 16:51:21 mickeyl: I'd like we can have 0.7 bb files too Apr 14 16:51:27 done Apr 14 16:51:33 thanks Apr 14 16:51:48 yes, i can add 07 to 5.5 Apr 14 16:52:09 i didn't look at 5.5 for a while, but as we're working on it now, I#ll doo Apr 14 16:52:17 thank you Apr 14 16:52:31 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * rb572f8cfa1be 10/openembedded/packages/images/shr-image.inc: shr-image.inc: fix patching Apr 14 16:52:33 don't spank me :x Apr 14 16:52:59 mickeyl I think the packages -> recipes copy should get done to 5.5 Apr 14 16:53:20 i agree Apr 14 16:53:27 the newer recipes I've been chery-picking don't end up in the right spot Apr 14 16:54:19 nytowl: please mail me before :-) Apr 14 16:54:30 dos1: did my answer work? Apr 14 16:54:52 Ainulindale: i still don't know ;x Apr 14 16:54:53 oh kinda like the mail you sent about the menu-freesmartphone thing ok done ;) Apr 14 16:55:03 nytowl: tsss :-) Apr 14 16:55:12 nytowl: well I solved this issue myself Apr 14 16:55:27 Apparently this was included in a task which PR wasn't changed Apr 14 16:55:36 well if mickeyl is in agreement may as well do it right now Apr 14 16:55:50 yeah, please go ahead Apr 14 16:56:12 Ainulindale you ready for it ? Apr 14 16:56:17 Yeah, rock my world Apr 14 16:56:41 Anyway, nytowl, right now : NOTE: Running task 1726 of 10008 Apr 14 16:56:50 (bitbake task-openmoko-feed) Apr 14 16:57:26 so it sounds like a good time to break it it's only 10% done ;) Apr 14 16:57:51 By the way nytowl Apr 14 16:57:59 Do you have the same problem we have with distro-feed-configs? Apr 14 16:58:05 That is, a non existent "armv4" repo? Apr 14 16:58:12 (this is what generates the opkg feeds) Apr 14 16:58:19 not that I've noticed whats the problem ? Apr 14 16:58:22 (feeds URLs, I mean, in /etc/opkg) Apr 14 16:58:39 Well it's generating a non existent feed URL Apr 14 16:58:39 yes it's way down on my todo list Apr 14 16:58:42 Ok then Apr 14 16:58:50 a config file somewhere Apr 14 16:58:52 Was just wondering if you had the issue Apr 14 16:58:57 I think I'll try to fix that tonight Apr 14 16:59:00 It's annoying me Apr 14 16:59:07 suits me fine Apr 14 16:59:16 Yeah as long as you don't have to do it... :-p Apr 14 16:59:23 Lazy canadian:! Apr 14 16:59:23 exactly Apr 14 16:59:38 Oh and by the way Apr 14 16:59:39 kiss my ass frenchy :) Apr 14 16:59:45 If you happen to hit this fakeroot issue Apr 14 16:59:52 (fakeroot complaining about no space left on device) Apr 14 17:00:03 tune-arm920t.inc:PACKAGE_EXTRA_ARCHS += "armv4 armv4t" Apr 14 17:00:05 I had to link to fakeroot-tcp on my host in the staging directory Apr 14 17:00:17 mickeyl: Yeah, thanks, you're ruining my work-to-be Apr 14 17:00:23 Now I don't know what to do Apr 14 17:00:34 Yay!! I shall wait until the recipe/package thing is commited, then pull... Apr 14 17:00:36 mickeyl: is this logical anyway? Apr 14 17:00:39 * mwester waits for CIA Apr 14 17:00:48 the tune file is correct Apr 14 17:00:54 armv4t can still deal with armv4 Apr 14 17:00:59 mickeyl: so how come we don't have an armv4 repo? Apr 14 17:00:59 nytowl is a canuck? Apr 14 17:01:00 it's our problem that we don't generate pacakges for it Apr 14 17:01:08 Ok then Apr 14 17:01:10 * mwester grew up in Canada... Apr 14 17:01:10 yay mwester Apr 14 17:01:19 but escaped. :P Apr 14 17:01:21 where are you now Apr 14 17:01:23 Chicago Apr 14 17:01:30 Ainulindale: you could answer leonti's question about opimd, if you're bored ;) Apr 14 17:01:35 Man would I be moving back Apr 14 17:01:37 Have family in Toronto and Sarnia, still. Apr 14 17:01:41 mickeyl: by the way Apr 14 17:01:45 did you follow what mrmoku|e` said? Apr 14 17:01:56 no, when and what did he say? Apr 14 17:01:58 He has a functional opimd based contacts reader Apr 14 17:02:01 whew! Apr 14 17:02:05 For the time being he can't write or delete Apr 14 17:02:08 But he can read Apr 14 17:02:14 amazing Apr 14 17:02:15 nytowl: if the economy doesn't get better, I may be moving, but I fear I have lost my landed immigrant status in Canada... so they may not let me back in. Apr 14 17:02:20 All included in libframeworkd-phonegui-efl Apr 14 17:02:24 So this is going forward for us Apr 14 17:02:31 pretty good news Apr 14 17:02:32 Seems, IIRC, that it's lacking add/delete Apr 14 17:02:35 ya, could be Apr 14 17:02:48 But I hope he'll tell you when he'll be back Apr 14 17:02:51 oki Apr 14 17:03:03 I'll vouch for yay Apr 14 17:03:39 Anyway, I'm leaving Apr 14 17:03:43 See you suckers! Apr 14 17:03:47 (especially nytowl) Apr 14 17:04:10 yeah go riddance dude Apr 14 17:04:15 :-) Apr 14 17:04:18 s/go/good/ Apr 14 17:04:18 nytowl meant: yeah good riddance dude Apr 14 17:04:31 cu Ainulindale Apr 14 17:04:37 You'll have me on your back tonight for your package->recipes thing anyway :-) Apr 14 17:04:48 I don't think this has that much impact anyway Apr 14 17:04:54 (for us at least) Apr 14 17:04:59 note to self don't login later , ok cool got it Apr 14 17:05:04 We just have to modify the makefile a bit Apr 14 17:05:07 nytowl: pffft! :-) Apr 14 17:12:21 mickeyl : I just reviewed the oe.dev packages rename and it looks like all that is required is "git mv " Apr 14 17:13:25 yes, but there's more to it Apr 14 17:13:34 we use this in a couple of build classes and configurations Apr 14 17:13:59 check the 1st commit after the git mv when OE did that Apr 14 17:14:10 thats what I though , ok Apr 14 17:19:14 ;x Apr 14 17:19:24 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * rf44285282b04 10/openembedded/packages/images/ (3 files in 3 dirs): shr-image.inc: revert support for patches Apr 14 17:20:26 Ainulindale will kill me i think ;x Apr 14 17:20:37 What did you do??! Apr 14 17:20:57 i've commited untested stuff. Apr 14 17:21:05 and then again Apr 14 17:21:06 and again Apr 14 17:21:35 * mwester tosses dos1 into the polar bear cage, for his sins. Apr 14 17:28:15 Ainulindale: ping Apr 14 17:28:52 DocScrutinizer: ping Apr 14 17:33:07 mickeyl: ping Apr 14 17:36:39 yo? Apr 14 17:37:05 mickeyl: is headset supposed to fully work on frameworkd? Apr 14 17:37:40 mickeyl: i think we need something simillar to BTHeadsetIsConnected with cable headset Apr 14 17:37:45 bt headset? Apr 14 17:37:51 no, wired Apr 14 17:38:17 well, plugging in the wired headset should change the state file accordingly Apr 14 17:38:21 at least for playback this works Apr 14 17:38:24 never tried for phone Apr 14 17:38:29 thinking about it Apr 14 17:38:36 ah, it's likely not working Apr 14 17:38:41 yet Apr 14 17:38:51 mickeyl: i have played with rules.yaml file Apr 14 17:39:04 i have working pluging and unpluging, during call or without it Apr 14 17:39:05 but Apr 14 17:39:39 i don't have working starting call with headset plugged in Apr 14 17:39:44 or releasing call Apr 14 17:40:46 mickeyl: is there a way to use some input event data in filters, when in while/trigger CallStatus is specified? Apr 14 17:41:46 i'm afraid this won't work without writing a special trigger that keeps state Apr 14 17:42:00 this is where the rules engine shows its limit Apr 14 17:44:00 mickeyl: so is there any chance of having HeadsetIsConnected, similar to BTHeadsetIsConnected? Apr 14 17:45:13 what would this signal give you more than INPUT HEADSET? Apr 14 17:45:25 we already have a signal that indicates when the headset is connected Apr 14 17:45:35 mickeyl: not signal Apr 14 17:45:36 filter Apr 14 17:45:47 so we can use: Apr 14 17:45:53 trigger: something Apr 14 17:46:04 filers: HeadsetIsConnected() Apr 14 17:46:32 then we can load proper scenario when call is starting, or it is released Apr 14 17:46:35 yes, that could work. for this to work we need this special filter and checking whether the headset is plugged. this we can do with odeviced Apr 14 17:46:39 dos1: have you actually tried to use GSM with wired headset (especially headset's mic)? Apr 14 17:46:52 PaulFertser: i tried, but without mic Apr 14 17:47:07 dos1: you're supposed to get violent buzz if you enable mic :) Apr 14 17:47:16 "violent"? Apr 14 17:47:24 yep, i know Apr 14 17:47:24 worse than normal mic? Apr 14 17:47:43 i have early gta02v5 :P Apr 14 17:47:51 mwester: i'm not sure violent is exactly the word, but it's so strong that it will hurt ;) Apr 14 17:47:52 * mwester wonders if maybe the community would be better served if everyone were to focus on making BT headsets work. Apr 14 17:47:57 so i have all problems ;D Apr 14 17:48:04 That's violent, all right! Apr 14 17:48:07 mwester: why do you think bt headsets don't work already? ;) Apr 14 17:48:35 PaulFertser: because I don't see an icon named "Connect BT HeadSet" in SHR. Apr 14 17:48:53 mwester: shr devs are too lazy, that's it ;) Apr 14 17:49:07 (I really don't think that opening a term window, and typing dbus commands, is "working") Apr 14 17:49:07 mwester: I'm working on it. But I'm stuck with the lack of doc concerning both elementary and bluez4 Apr 14 17:49:23 Okhin: seen the wiki entry about using bluez manually? Apr 14 17:49:37 Okhin: in fact bluez4 docs suck, but the source is ok :) Apr 14 17:49:38 yes Apr 14 17:49:41 and it works :) Apr 14 17:49:58 now I'm trying to have a friendly app taht use it through dBus Apr 14 17:50:03 * mwester hates most of all about bluez that they seem to think that dbus is a UI. Apr 14 17:50:17 and I just need that f*** widget for inputing pin code :/ Apr 14 17:50:18 Okhin: so hereby you confirm that bluetooth headsets work OK with FSO? Apr 14 17:50:27 no Apr 14 17:50:30 hehe! Apr 14 17:50:39 there's a lot of mechanism taht needs ti be solved Apr 14 17:50:52 but IO think it's more an alsa problem tahn a FSO one Apr 14 17:50:55 Okhin : I have some gtk based code that scans and pairs using bluez4 did you want to bring it onto elementary Apr 14 17:51:07 PaulFertser is a geek and he *DOES* key in dbus commands to make his phone work! :-D Apr 14 17:51:09 Okhin: widget for typing pin is in libframeworkd-phonegui-efl Apr 14 17:51:17 by exemple, you have to swap a controller and to put it in its original set for having some sound Apr 14 17:51:19 dos1: for your issue Apr 14 17:51:26 add a rule for callstatus plus input headset Apr 14 17:51:29 I think you can do that Apr 14 17:51:32 (IIRC) Apr 14 17:51:34 dos1 oki, How can I use it with python? Apr 14 17:51:41 Ainulindale: how? Apr 14 17:51:43 Anyway, this should be implemented using ologicd, when it'll work Apr 14 17:51:55 onen: openbmap-logger compiled Apr 14 17:52:35 dos1: forget what I said Apr 14 17:52:41 You can't because of the rule engine Apr 14 17:52:46 What I'd suggest is Apr 14 17:52:47 Okhin: using bluetooth headset for GSM doesn't have much to do with alsa (except loading a right state file and touching one control once to workaround a driver bug). Apr 14 17:52:49 Add a filter Apr 14 17:52:49 Ainulindale: great! thanks! Apr 14 17:53:01 This is easy, I don't think mickeyl would be against it Apr 14 17:53:06 * onen discovered the magic tab autocompletion for nicknames! Apr 14 17:53:10 PaulFertser: yes, and it's this bug that bugging me :) Apr 14 17:53:20 Okhin: it's already workarounded in FSO Apr 14 17:53:34 otherwise, everithing wors great (don't know if pressing the answer key on the HS work though) Apr 14 17:53:36 Ainulindale: that's exactly what i was asking mickeyl ;) Apr 14 17:53:50 Well I did that at a time IIRC Apr 14 17:53:54 PaulFertser: great, I ddidnt' know that :) Apr 14 17:53:56 Okhin: no, pressing keys on HS does nothing in current code. Apr 14 17:53:57 (adding a filter or action) Apr 14 17:54:01 Or planned to anyway Apr 14 17:54:16 yes, but there's a signal in bluez... I think i saw it Apr 14 17:54:17 nytowl? Apr 14 17:54:23 yah Apr 14 17:54:24 Is there a task I can compile for paroli compliance? Apr 14 17:54:28 I don't know how to map it :) Apr 14 17:54:51 Ainulindale not even sure what your asking Apr 14 17:55:06 nytowl: well for instance there is task-fso-compliance Apr 14 17:55:14 If I want to be sure I have everything I need for paroli, as is Apr 14 17:55:17 Plus diagnostic tools Apr 14 17:55:27 I know I've never looked at what it does :) Apr 14 17:55:30 Is there a task which will build all the necessary packages? Apr 14 17:55:41 paroli Apr 14 17:55:41 nytowl: well mostly ships fso-gpsd, the muxer and such Apr 14 17:55:54 nytowl: Is it part of task-openmoko-feed? Apr 14 17:56:00 hmm paroli-image Apr 14 17:56:13 yeah it's in the feed Apr 14 17:56:36 Ok, nice Apr 14 17:56:51 nytowl: I'd like to make a diff between our feed and yours, one of these days Apr 14 17:56:57 It might be useful to have only one Apr 14 17:57:15 I'd like our feed to RRECOMMEND yours Apr 14 17:57:16 yeah ours needs cleaning and reorganizing Apr 14 17:57:49 Did you apply your all breaking patch by the way? Apr 14 17:58:40 yeah they're all in main thing was an efl bump Apr 14 17:58:55 Can we trust your bump? :-) Apr 14 17:58:58 just testing the packages rename now Apr 14 17:59:19 dos1: In fact I need a "function" in python (or anything else, I don't really care) taht stop the execution flow, display a popup, ask for the pin and return the pin code (whatever the format of it) when the window is destroyed (ie the OK button is pressed) before releasing the execution flow Apr 14 17:59:20 as long as you don't use etk it _should_ be fine Apr 14 17:59:29 Ok then I won't use yours :-) Apr 14 17:59:42 nytowl: Please keep me in touch, I'd like to keep in sync Apr 14 17:59:57 python-ecore needs a patch to work properly Apr 14 18:00:11 Damn raster! Apr 14 18:00:47 yeah he's got the bug report just needs fixing now Apr 14 18:01:40 Okhin: that should not be hard to do with any toolkit Apr 14 18:02:14 bumbl: perhap's but I'm not a big coder, and I'm not a big UI coder Apr 14 18:02:28 and I can find any usable documentation about python-elementary Apr 14 18:02:40 checkout the sources :-> Apr 14 18:02:44 and I can fiond a python sample that do it neither Apr 14 18:08:23 Ainulindale mwester the recipes rename is in Apr 14 18:08:45 Thanks Apr 14 18:11:53 nytowl: by the way Apr 14 18:12:14 Is the minimo/fennec recipes problem on your todo list? Apr 14 18:12:32 nope didn't know there was a problem Apr 14 18:12:40 onen: pong Apr 14 18:12:42 Well they won't build Apr 14 18:12:57 I was waiting for eve :) Apr 14 18:13:55 eve? Apr 14 18:14:04 a rename of ewww Apr 14 18:14:10 Щр Apr 14 18:14:14 Grmbl. Apr 14 18:14:21 I should change this keyboard switching shortcut. Apr 14 18:14:57 i don't know what that char was but it looks like your giving me the finger Apr 14 18:16:06 lol Apr 14 18:16:22 i'm testing new image Apr 14 18:16:26 GPRS works out of box Apr 14 18:16:38 dimming screen Apr 14 18:17:14 talking about om2009? Apr 14 18:17:30 nytowl: :-) Apr 14 18:17:47 bipak_: SHR unstable Apr 14 18:17:47 it's "chtch" in russian if I'm not mistaken Apr 14 18:17:56 plus a r Apr 14 18:17:56 dos1: ah ok Apr 14 18:18:36 ah so you giving me the russian finger Apr 14 18:18:52 DocScrutinizer: hallo Apr 14 18:19:05 moin Apr 14 18:19:31 DocScrutinizer: do you know if there is a way to know the power the phone is currently emitting? Apr 14 18:19:40 bipak_ are you running Om2009 Apr 14 18:19:55 no, im still running 2008.12 :\ Apr 14 18:20:06 but i'll try 2009 soon Apr 14 18:20:07 SHR: 03ainulindale 07shr-overlay * rc5c7b13443d4 10/ (460 files in 176 dirs): On to the breakage. Following OE package renaming. Apr 14 18:20:38 put it on a sd card for starters see if you like it Apr 14 18:20:54 Ainulindale: looks like everything works on shr-lite out-of-box (except depmod -a), but we have to adjust default e settings to neo... Apr 14 18:21:07 Ainulindale: what do you think about disabling drop shadows module? Apr 14 18:21:11 by default? Apr 14 18:21:14 onen: there's a value in AT%EM like txlvl or sth, but I never got values I could interpret and understand Apr 14 18:21:29 nytowl: yes that was the plan :) Apr 14 18:21:58 SHR: 03ainulindale 07shr-makefile * r0c40e3c9b8b6 10/ (Makefile conf/site.conf openembedded.mk): On to the breakage, part #2. Following OE package renaming. Apr 14 18:21:59 dos1: Well I'd say, ask that on the ML. Apr 14 18:22:20 heh Apr 14 18:22:35 it really don't work well on neo... Apr 14 18:22:39 s/don't/doesn't/ Apr 14 18:22:39 dos1 meant: it really doesn't work well on neo... Apr 14 18:23:08 nytowl: I'd say, here in SHR, we're good. Apr 14 18:23:12 Not sure :-> Apr 14 18:23:32 But I'll check that now. Apr 14 18:23:56 thanks to sed -i -e 's/packages/recipes/g' I almost did nothing Apr 14 18:24:01 And if it breaks it's sed fault Apr 14 18:24:13 ;D Apr 14 18:24:23 Or dos1 Apr 14 18:25:20 onen: for gps-locating txlvl is uedeless anyway as it varies massively over MT-type, way to hold the device etc pp Apr 14 18:25:43 DocScrutinizer: you mean Serving Cell Information (2,1) , txlev Transmit Power Level ? Apr 14 18:26:10 Although I know now that I broke testing :-> Apr 14 18:26:14 maybe thats cell power, not MT power Apr 14 18:26:15 DocScrutinizer: MT-type means? Apr 14 18:26:30 Ainulindale I just had to update my local.conf and move my overlay dirs Apr 14 18:26:47 nytowl: You didn't change that too for fso/ms5? Apr 14 18:26:56 No, you didn't it seems. Apr 14 18:27:04 nokia xyxy vs OM FR vs Samsung OMNIa Apr 14 18:27:18 Ainulindale change what Apr 14 18:27:32 Ainulindale: + [ ! -e shr-unstable ] || ${MAKE} shr-unstable-recipes Apr 14 18:27:32 + [ ! -e shr-testing ] || ${MAKE} shr-testing-recipes Apr 14 18:27:37 i think that should still be packages Apr 14 18:27:48 we are not building recipes ;) Apr 14 18:27:55 I'll buy a bunch of SD cadrs tommorow. what do you recommend for 2GB cards ? better Transcend, SanDisk or other ? Apr 14 18:28:06 onen: what we would want to know probably is PCF Apr 14 18:28:29 SHR: 03ainulindale 07shr-makefile * rae857d42a123 10/Makefile: Fix overenthusiastic commit for testing. Should work. Apr 14 18:28:35 onen: never found a way to read it out though Apr 14 18:28:41 dos1: I don't care you know, it's all the same =) Apr 14 18:29:03 Anyway we don't use that directive Apr 14 18:29:37 DocScrutinizer: MT-type == Mobile Terminal-type ? Apr 14 18:30:05 onen: nokia xyxy vs OM FR vs Samsung OMNIa Apr 14 18:30:35 DocScrutinizer: PCF? Apr 14 18:30:36 Anyway dos it seems the site.conf doesn't depend on that Apr 14 18:30:41 So for the time being I'll break testing Apr 14 18:31:38 onen: Power Control Factor or PCL ..Level Apr 14 18:32:24 onen: sorry not on operation temp yet, need a coffee Apr 14 18:33:08 onen: you could read out current consumption from smartbat Apr 14 18:33:37 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * r10723be1d2d9 10/ (460 files in 176 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of git+ssh://git@shr.bearstech.com/shr-overlay Apr 14 18:33:38 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * rc7ea2fade896 10/openembedded/packages/e-wm-config-illume-shr/e-wm-config-illume-shr/e.src: e-wm-config-illume-shr: disable dropshadow module by default Apr 14 18:33:55 shit Apr 14 18:34:28 Ahem. Apr 14 18:34:32 SHR: 03ainulindale 07shr-makefile * rbd88255a9f6f 10/ (Makefile conf/site.testing.conf): Last trick to still be able to build testing. Apr 14 18:34:36 DocScrutinizer: you mean: I would build my own scale and say that I am very low level emition because current drained is low, and emition is high because lot of power is drained? Apr 14 18:34:40 * Ainulindale is fumbling around his desk to find his whip Apr 14 18:34:50 dos1! COME TO DADDY! Apr 14 18:35:09 onen: but as GSM is burst and stops sending during voice pause this prolly won't yield results as well Apr 14 18:35:11 * dos1 hides away Apr 14 18:35:14 :xxxxxxxxxxx Apr 14 18:35:38 ok seems it 's parsing correctly Apr 14 18:35:41 onen: otherwise yes thats the idea Apr 14 18:35:50 My job is done, I can remove my super-hero outfit Apr 14 18:35:57 * Ainulindale is super-breaker Apr 14 18:36:04 (but mostly nytowl's sidekick) Apr 14 18:36:22 ok, it merged correctly Apr 14 18:36:37 no I said I want to be boy-breaker Apr 14 18:36:40 dos1: hmmm Apr 14 18:36:45 Did you listen when I told you to ask on the ML? Apr 14 18:36:53 Or did you think I was joking? Apr 14 18:36:55 Because I wasn't Apr 14 18:37:14 but it sucks really hard.. Apr 14 18:37:21 * Ainulindale is looking for his chainsaw Apr 14 18:37:25 It sucks what? :-> Apr 14 18:37:35 dos1: listen Apr 14 18:37:39 glamo i think ;x Apr 14 18:37:40 I personnaly don't care at all Apr 14 18:37:42 People might Apr 14 18:37:48 There are ways to do that anyway Apr 14 18:37:53 First, compare the perfs Apr 14 18:37:56 State the difference Apr 14 18:38:02 Point people towards your opinion Apr 14 18:38:04 They'll see Apr 14 18:38:16 Then if they disagree Apr 14 18:38:22 after reading maillist, some people even wants to have x11-16 by default :P Apr 14 18:38:23 Just build your own e-wm config Apr 14 18:38:29 Commit it as a new bb recipe providing the conf Apr 14 18:38:43 And name it e-wm-config-which-does-not-suck Apr 14 18:38:57 As anyway, I'll use it myself because I don't care, as stated before Apr 14 18:39:04 dos1: my point was just Apr 14 18:39:15 Please do not remove things you might think are useless but people might think are useful Apr 14 18:39:18 DocScrutinizer: ok so we cannot really measure the current emitting level/power. That is too bad. Thanks a lot for your insight! Apr 14 18:39:24 You know that I agree with you on dropshadows Apr 14 18:39:29 But I'm not the user, I'm not SHR all by myself Apr 14 18:39:32 That's my point Apr 14 18:39:42 ok Apr 14 18:39:43 but Apr 14 18:39:48 (and this is a big but) Apr 14 18:39:52 * Ainulindale coughs Apr 14 18:40:05 then we should ask ml on every change... Apr 14 18:40:09 Nope Apr 14 18:40:17 dropshadow is really stupid change, oneliner Apr 14 18:40:22 You should ask for that kind of "important" thing Apr 14 18:40:25 What is visible Apr 14 18:40:31 What is immediately noticeable Apr 14 18:40:34 * onen understands Ainulindale jokes... and it hurts Apr 14 18:40:35 Or big changes in what you want to do Apr 14 18:40:44 yep Apr 14 18:41:05 I don't want you to tell people on the ML "well, we changed that line because it was prettier" Apr 14 18:41:06 people will notice that shadows isn't lagging anymore Apr 14 18:41:10 Get me right :-) Apr 14 18:41:13 and top shelf works faster Apr 14 18:41:29 dos1: Yeah but maybe some of them were bragging about the fact they had dropshadows on their device Apr 14 18:41:42 I don't know, I'm just picturing dumb things, just want you to get my point properly dos1 :-) Apr 14 18:41:59 heh, i understand you Apr 14 18:42:02 dos1: as a good example Apr 14 18:42:11 Remember when spaetz commited the new ringtone? Apr 14 18:42:17 This was a tiny change Apr 14 18:42:24 But he made the whole call ringtone slow as hell Apr 14 18:42:31 s/he/it/ (sorry spaetz :-p) Apr 14 18:42:45 His intention was good, I agree Apr 14 18:42:50 no, ringtone is bigger change Apr 14 18:42:55 But first, a ringtone needs to be discussed as this is something noticeable Apr 14 18:43:03 And second, this had impact :-) Apr 14 18:43:21 You might not know the impact (I don't for instance) of dropping dropshadows (shadows dropped, then) Apr 14 18:43:36 (Even though I know you tested it) Apr 14 18:43:40 (Did you? :->) Apr 14 18:44:18 you know i tested Apr 14 18:44:23 don't change that :D Apr 14 18:44:23 Meh Apr 14 18:44:35 dos1: did my solution work for your issue by the way? Apr 14 18:44:39 (vala-native) Apr 14 18:44:47 Ainulindale: looks like yes Apr 14 18:44:51 Good Apr 14 18:45:02 You can send your donations at my snail mail address Apr 14 18:45:20 but i'm not sure, as i didn't generate whole image :P Apr 14 18:45:37 "Julien 'SuperStar' Cassignol, Best of the Best road, NoBragging City" Apr 14 18:45:48 sooooooo Apr 14 18:45:55 Or you can just say my head is about to explode out of bragging :-) Apr 14 18:46:12 (I learned that from nytowl) Apr 14 18:46:13 changing default GTK+ theme to be looking similar to e one should be discussed on maillist? :D Apr 14 18:46:21 dos1: I seriously think it is, yes Apr 14 18:46:44 dos1: but anyway I'll write docs for that Apr 14 18:46:50 What I'd rather have is Apr 14 18:46:55 When you want to do something like that Apr 14 18:46:58 You do an alternative Apr 14 18:47:00 You commit it Apr 14 18:47:11 You tell people to test it and give their thoughts Apr 14 18:47:13 Then we decide Apr 14 18:47:24 And the final choice goes to testing and stable Apr 14 18:47:51 Unstable is the realm of the enthusiast, IMHO, as long as we don't break everything out of enthuasiasm Apr 14 18:47:56 s/enthua/enthu/ Apr 14 18:47:57 Ainulindale meant: Unstable is the realm of the enthusiast, IMHO, as long as we don't break everything out of enthusiasm Apr 14 18:48:35 Ainulindale: when one reads what you write one might think you use debian and not gentoo Apr 14 18:49:10 bumbl: my problem with debian is the slowness and the politics Apr 14 18:49:22 I don't like their "all GPL" approach Apr 14 18:49:26 I think the user should have the coice Apr 14 18:49:27 +h Apr 14 18:49:32 Which is what Gentoo is doing Apr 14 18:49:40 Plus in Gentoo I can control every part of my system Apr 14 18:49:42 I can't using debian Apr 14 18:49:53 And everybody has guessed by now I'm a control freak Apr 14 18:50:11 dos1: I'm regenerating an image Apr 14 18:50:12 *chrm* unstable -> testing -> stable is not that fast Apr 14 18:50:24 bumbl: well we don't have anything working as we want right now Apr 14 18:50:28 When we'll have, it'll be Apr 14 18:50:31 i'd drop stable Apr 14 18:50:34 ;) Apr 14 18:50:39 dos1: so please tell me if you have anything to commit again :-) Apr 14 18:50:57 bumbl: well on a phone problems are more noticeable I think Apr 14 18:51:05 Ainulindale, all gentoo users understand your opinion, all debian users may be never understand it). Apr 14 18:51:06 Plus we don't have so many things to check Apr 14 18:51:35 max_posedon: full ack Apr 14 18:51:36 max_posedon: well I don't know, but at least it's mine :-) Apr 14 18:51:48 * bumbl throws neos at Dave Apr 14 18:52:00 Anyway, I'll state what I think about that in the convention Apr 14 18:52:04 Even though it'll be boring Apr 14 18:52:20 And after that I think we'll build formal decision processes Apr 14 18:52:29 (And maybe "elections" for my position) Apr 14 18:52:47 (and other one which will be needed as soon as a momentum will be reached) Apr 14 18:53:02 because we'll need to make decisions soon Apr 14 18:53:06 That is, focusing on other devices, etc. Apr 14 18:53:15 (building a new toolkit) Apr 14 18:53:20 (migrating to ophonekitd vala) Apr 14 18:53:23 (and so on) Apr 14 18:54:08 I hope I do what I do kindly, I don't want to make people like dos1 stop working :-) Apr 14 18:54:25 It's just that IMHO, someone telling "you shouldn't do that" is needed in every project Apr 14 18:54:45 And it's easier I think for FSO because it's not directly noticeable. It's harder for a distro :-) Apr 14 18:55:04 by the way dos1 Apr 14 18:55:08 there is a "theme" repo Apr 14 18:55:12 which is there just for that type of thing Apr 14 18:55:25 put your toolkit config there, your alternative configs, etc Apr 14 18:55:46 I still want to devise a way to "open" that Apr 14 18:56:31 (I'm talking too much today) Apr 14 18:56:59 ;D Apr 14 18:57:01 ok Apr 14 18:57:05 right now i have to test it on neo Apr 14 18:57:15 well if you are willing to wait I'm rebuilding Apr 14 18:57:28 by the way Apr 14 18:57:31 you didn't bump PR Apr 14 18:57:32 BAD BOY Apr 14 18:58:11 * mwester issues an edict: FAST and FUNCTIONAL FIRST (The FFF adage), then we can play fun games with drop-shadows. and non-dropped shadows. and sideways shadows, with little purple highlights. and... Apr 14 18:58:17 Neither did you on frameworkd-config-shr Apr 14 18:58:29 mwester: and shadow warriors! Apr 14 18:58:34 ninja shadows! Apr 14 18:58:45 here's a good name for your theme dos1 Apr 14 18:58:50 shr-non-ninja Apr 14 18:59:10 yeah! Apr 14 18:59:19 it's not my theme, and it's only to make GTK+ apps looking like E17 Apr 14 18:59:20 :P Apr 14 18:59:28 With little mwester's whining on the wallpaper! Apr 14 18:59:34 s/'s/s/ Apr 14 18:59:34 Ainulindale meant: With little mwesters whining on the wallpaper! Apr 14 18:59:43 * mwester loves the scene in "Interesting Times" where the aged barbarians take out the ninjas. Very appropriate in this case. Apr 14 18:59:53 meh :-) Apr 14 19:00:00 Ptttthhht! Apr 14 19:00:10 mwester: want a dried frog pill? Apr 14 19:00:21 Remember: only fools put up wallpaper before the it is built. Apr 14 19:00:26 s/the// Apr 14 19:00:27 mwester meant: Remember: only fools put up wallpaper before it is built. Apr 14 19:00:40 mwester: guess what Apr 14 19:00:41 Yes, I could use many dried frog pills. Apr 14 19:00:55 I've been fighting against that kind of thing from the start Apr 14 19:01:02 I know :) Apr 14 19:01:10 It's truly annoying Apr 14 19:01:18 I know why people wants to have everything from the start Apr 14 19:01:30 And doing a fine job, although you remind me much of a foreman shouting at his crew! Apr 14 19:01:37 And I keep ensuring them that a ferrari without any kind of engine is worth as much as a bike Apr 14 19:01:49 mwester: ah that's because I like to shout Apr 14 19:02:04 Worth less, even. Not to mention that a ferrari without an engine is a poor reflection of the builder. Apr 14 19:02:06 But well, I do it in my own humorous way, I hope Apr 14 19:02:25 Ok, rebuilding lite now Apr 14 19:02:28 dos1, it's up? Apr 14 19:02:34 can I opkg upgrade to get it? Apr 14 19:02:40 (gtk theme) Apr 14 19:02:40 TAsnn: theme? Apr 14 19:02:41 no Apr 14 19:02:42 TAsnn: Nothing is up. The matrix has you. Apr 14 19:02:45 i'm testing it now Apr 14 19:02:48 * mwester removes the "upgrade" option from opkg. Apr 14 19:02:52 dos1, pics? Apr 14 19:02:55 Ainulindale, shit. ;] Apr 14 19:03:02 TAsnn: you should study Apr 14 19:03:04 dos1, please scap pyphonelog Apr 14 19:03:06 Ainulindale, can't Apr 14 19:03:11 my brother's birthday Apr 14 19:03:19 we are celebrating. Apr 14 19:03:30 he is 18. Apr 14 19:03:30 TAsnn: Then drink milk along with your sausages for me Apr 14 19:03:32 * Ainulindale whistles Apr 14 19:03:49 Ainulindale, I don't mind, I'm not orthodox. (if that's what you meant) Apr 14 19:03:55 I'm not even religious;] Apr 14 19:04:06 TAsnn: By the way, I found out the other day that the okapi was casher Apr 14 19:04:08 though I had to warn grandpa about the milk in the cookies. Apr 14 19:04:10 I'm sure you're thrilled by the fact Apr 14 19:04:11 * mwester is off -- must go deposit final paycheck in the bank account. Apr 14 19:04:30 mwester: good luck. Apr 14 19:04:30 Ainulindale, you can't even start to believe. Apr 14 19:04:35 heh :-) Apr 14 19:04:47 TAsnn: i need to increase size of expanders and scrollbars Apr 14 19:04:49 especially since I don't have the slightest idea what okapi is. Apr 14 19:04:59 dos1, you got my recommended size for expanders Apr 14 19:05:01 dos1: you're starting to talk as a spammer I know Apr 14 19:05:20 "increase your expanders size..." Apr 14 19:05:23 and for scrollbars, just rip the 2007 theme, take the scrollbar size Apr 14 19:05:23 Seriously guys Apr 14 19:05:28 and cut it in half Apr 14 19:05:28 ;] Apr 14 19:05:35 they seriously overdid it there. Apr 14 19:05:35 ;] Apr 14 19:06:02 (damn kdelibs, compiling forever) Apr 14 19:06:04 TAsnn: look at scup Apr 14 19:06:07 (And I don't use kde...) Apr 14 19:06:09 dos1, loading... Apr 14 19:06:14 kdelibs on FR? Apr 14 19:06:15 Ainulindale, I hate kdie. Apr 14 19:06:28 kde* Apr 14 19:06:29 kdelibs4 or kdelibs5? Apr 14 19:06:35 4 Apr 14 19:06:42 sweet! Apr 14 19:06:43 TAsnn: So do I Apr 14 19:06:50 dos1, it's looking great! Apr 14 19:06:50 dos1: nah, for my desktop Apr 14 19:07:06 dos1: wasn't it supposed to look bigger? Apr 14 19:07:08 Ainulindale, no way! you are trying to mock me, there's no way we agree on something ;] Apr 14 19:07:18 TAsnn: you're mistaken Apr 14 19:07:24 the other day we agreed on the fact pyphonelog was crap Apr 14 19:07:29 Or was I agreeing with myself? :-> Apr 14 19:07:35 Ainulindale, lol. Apr 14 19:07:46 we agreed that python is crap (on the moko) Apr 14 19:07:47 Ainulindale: yep, it should be bigger Apr 14 19:07:48 nothing more. Apr 14 19:07:49 bitch. Apr 14 19:07:51 i will work on that Apr 14 19:07:54 but not today Apr 14 19:07:59 dos1, anyhow, it's great! Apr 14 19:08:01 dos1: good :-) Apr 14 19:08:04 please commit it ;] Apr 14 19:08:04 Ainulindale: you can get down the time used for kdelibs quite easily with gentoo Apr 14 19:08:22 bumbl: tell me more about that and maybe you'll have a kiss. Or not, depending on your needs. Apr 14 19:08:38 dos1: hmm Apr 14 19:08:47 I didn't even notice it was more e look-alike Apr 14 19:09:04 buttons? :P Apr 14 19:09:07 Ainulindale, look at the buttons Apr 14 19:09:08 yeah. Apr 14 19:09:10 Yeah but I didn't notice that Apr 14 19:09:17 Ainulindale, because it's slick Apr 14 19:09:18 it's great. Apr 14 19:09:20 That'll show you how much I care about UI... Apr 14 19:09:22 it's just natural. Apr 14 19:09:34 Ainulindale, you should, this gray is UGLY! Apr 14 19:09:41 I don't care about ugly Apr 14 19:09:43 I care about functional Apr 14 19:10:20 dos1: about klogd patches Apr 14 19:10:26 I don't think they should be included as is in the image Apr 14 19:10:36 That's why I was wondering about what the "commiter" was thinking Apr 14 19:10:38 i reverted it :P Apr 14 19:10:43 How he thought we should apply them Apr 14 19:10:44 I know Apr 14 19:10:49 Just telling you my thoughts Apr 14 19:10:58 I was wondering about the best way to apply them Apr 14 19:10:59 hi mickeyl Apr 14 19:12:13 dos1, TAsnn Apr 14 19:12:14 Image is here Apr 14 19:12:25 dos1, anyhow, I love the theme. looks like if I wrote pyphonelog with elementary! Apr 14 19:12:27 Ainulindale, huh? Apr 14 19:12:33 (latest lite) Apr 14 19:12:46 what are the changes? Apr 14 19:12:54 Ainulindale: well you can turn off most of the useflags USE="-doc -fam -jpeg2k -kerberos -semantic-desktop -zeroconf -ssl Apr 14 19:12:57 " Apr 14 19:13:02 btw Ainulindale I'll open a bug (and set it to critical) Apr 14 19:13:04 TAsn: Can't recall Apr 14 19:13:06 ah and -spell Apr 14 19:13:12 I want pymokoui!!! Apr 14 19:13:20 what's that? Apr 14 19:13:23 all useless if you don't use kde itself imo Apr 14 19:13:24 the phonelog app is BAD without it. Apr 14 19:13:36 it's libmokoui2's python bindings Apr 14 19:13:39 bumbl: ok thanks :-) Apr 14 19:13:43 i.e kinetic scroll Apr 14 19:13:50 instead of the ugly scrollbars Apr 14 19:13:53 in pyphonelog Apr 14 19:13:56 You mean it scrolls with the power of your mind? :-) Apr 14 19:14:01 but i am sure you already did that Apr 14 19:14:10 Ainulindale, almost Apr 14 19:14:12 bumbl: I have no idea, I'll check Apr 14 19:14:16 by the power of your fingers. Apr 14 19:14:42 TAsn: i think i have now enough knowledge about bitbake to write bb file for it Apr 14 19:14:42 bipak_: 4.2.2-r1(4.2)!t(21:10:26 14/04/2009)(acl alsa bzip2 fam nls opengl semantic-desktop spell ssl -3dnow -altivec -bindist -debug -doc -jpeg2k -kdeprefix -kerberos -mmx -openexr -sse -sse2 -test -zeroconf) Apr 14 19:14:52 huh? Apr 14 19:14:53 so open ticket, i will accept it Apr 14 19:15:09 dos1, cool ;] Apr 14 19:15:12 Ainulindale: nick-completion mistake? :) Apr 14 19:15:14 as I said, I'll mark it as critical. Apr 14 19:15:19 bipak_: yep :-) Apr 14 19:15:20 sorry Apr 14 19:15:21 just for the kicks. Apr 14 19:15:25 np :) Apr 14 19:15:47 dos1, there's only one thing, I don't know where the hell to get the sources from Apr 14 19:15:54 I still have the binaries lying around Apr 14 19:16:00 though that's not enough. Apr 14 19:16:02 hmm Apr 14 19:16:07 I'll try to google for it. Apr 14 19:16:12 that can be problem Apr 14 19:16:25 Yeah so set his critical to trivial Apr 14 19:16:33 Just to piss him off for his laziness Apr 14 19:16:46 it was trevino who compiled it :P Apr 14 19:17:00 TAsn: can you ask him? Apr 14 19:17:21 dos1, no idea who that is (except for the fact he also compiled your eve{ Apr 14 19:17:42 dos1, sec, will find it. Apr 14 19:17:48 hey folks =] Apr 14 19:17:56 TAsn: i don't know too, but i have seen he on maillist :D Apr 14 19:18:06 dos1: what does it do exactly? Apr 14 19:18:09 hmpf Apr 14 19:18:12 s/dos1/Tasn/ Apr 14 19:18:18 dos1, http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=7&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdocs.openmoko.org%2Ftrac%2Fticket%2F2011&ei=XOHkSfzNCc6L_Qag1aSKCQ&usg=AFQjCNEcjAldpq6ax57Ae6ERd-PvfK-sFg&sig2=pAfb1q1_fef7A5nS_6id7g Apr 14 19:18:31 Ainulindale, python bindings for libmokoui2 Apr 14 19:18:35 So? Apr 14 19:18:47 which is in turn, a gtk widget that enables kinetic scrolling Apr 14 19:18:49 i.e finger scrolling Apr 14 19:19:00 Ah, ok, you can't finger scroll now Apr 14 19:19:02 Didn't know that Apr 14 19:19:05 (I don't use phonelog) Apr 14 19:19:16 Ainulindale, yeah I know you don't. Apr 14 19:19:25 Well that's half the truth Apr 14 19:19:35 I use it to find the number of some people I didn't add to my sim out of laziness Apr 14 19:19:57 pythm can use python-mokoui too Apr 14 19:19:58 Ainulindale, lol, same here. Apr 14 19:20:02 My point is that I didn't notice there was no finger scrolling Apr 14 19:20:02 dos1, yeah Apr 14 19:20:04 I know. Apr 14 19:20:13 Mostly because well, I don't notice that kind of stuff Apr 14 19:20:51 TAsn: have you opened ticket? Apr 14 19:20:59 dos1, here Apr 14 19:21:02 exactly what you need Apr 14 19:21:04 http://yerga.net/blog/2008/01/28/testing-libmokoui2-python-bindings-in-maemo/ Apr 14 19:21:08 dos1, yeah, I have. Apr 14 19:21:28 marked as critical enachment ;] Apr 14 19:22:03 btw Ainulindale Apr 14 19:22:05 http://docs.openmoko.org/references/libmokoui2_r3462/doc/reference/html/ Apr 14 19:22:11 this is what libmokoui has to offer. Apr 14 19:25:12 join #upstart Apr 14 19:31:18 pwgen: why? ;) Apr 14 19:32:31 why ? hmm, what do you mean with why ? .. Apr 14 19:32:55 14.04.09 21:24 < pwgen> join #upstart Apr 14 19:33:34 i missed the leading / , and i try to get upstart running with openembedded especial the upstart dbus interface .. Apr 14 19:33:56 but my upstart isnt registered as dbus instance .. (:-(( Apr 14 19:37:43 dos1, hows everything going? Apr 14 19:38:00 btw have you stopped trying to make eve? or are you still giving it a go once every two days? Apr 14 19:39:01 actually i stopped Apr 14 19:39:18 dos1, shit ;] Apr 14 19:39:27 dos1, I may give it a try after my exam period. Apr 14 19:39:33 dos1, what about mokoui2? Apr 14 19:40:07 TAsn: building to test Apr 14 19:40:14 cool ;] Apr 14 19:40:41 As I said before, I'm not sure if it's just me, though I think shr improved A LOT in the last week. Apr 14 19:42:08 Why would you say that? Apr 14 19:42:44 no idea, just a feeling. Apr 14 19:43:02 well there's a lot of work going on, yes, I wouldn't say it improved that much Apr 14 19:43:07 maybe all the bugs you closed made me a bit fizzy ;] Apr 14 19:43:19 It'll improve a lot as soon as mrmoku|e` will commit his changes wrt opimd :-) Apr 14 19:43:31 If we can have a working PIM by the 22nd I'll be more than happy Apr 14 19:43:33 s/fizzy/dizzy/ Apr 14 19:43:34 TAsn meant: maybe all the bugs you closed made me a bit dizzy ;] Apr 14 19:43:43 Ainulindale, pim will be a game changer. Apr 14 19:43:50 the 22nd of april? Apr 14 19:43:54 may Apr 14 19:43:59 that's when we'll release Apr 14 19:44:03 why wouldn't you have? Apr 14 19:44:13 wouldn't we have what? Apr 14 19:44:22 (booting latest here) Apr 14 19:44:23 working pim Apr 14 19:44:26 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-overlay * r0539755a2376 10/openembedded/conf/distro/include/shr-autorev-unstable.inc: shr-autorev-unstable.inc: bump libmokoui2 to 4695 Apr 14 19:44:29 because it needs some more work Apr 14 19:44:42 dos1: did you test the impact of such a thing? Apr 14 19:44:44 dos1, also compiled the python bindings, right? ;] Apr 14 19:44:50 :-> Apr 14 19:44:58 (I'll drive him nuts) Apr 14 19:45:03 Ainulindale, man you are stiff. Apr 14 19:45:04 it's unstable Apr 14 19:45:06 Ainulindale: yep - i was using that revision even with 2007.2 :P Apr 14 19:45:13 everything is supposed to break ;] Apr 14 19:45:26 TAsn: yeah it's unstable, but spaetz bumped vala to 0.7.0 and didn't know it was useless Apr 14 19:45:33 Ainulindale, ;] Apr 14 19:45:38 So half of the software used by developers wasn't working anymore Apr 14 19:45:39 spaetz, bad spaetz! Apr 14 19:45:47 (I'm exaggerating) Apr 14 19:45:56 But my point isn't to be stiff or anything Apr 14 19:46:01 Ainulindale, ;] Apr 14 19:46:04 Just to make sure people measure the impact of such a thing Apr 14 19:46:12 It's that which is important Apr 14 19:46:26 Plus I'm good at whining Apr 14 19:46:52 TAsn: i don't know if python-mokoui2 is compiled and working Apr 14 19:46:53 ;) Apr 14 19:47:12 i have to test it ;p Apr 14 19:47:39 dos1: well latest seems to work Apr 14 19:47:48 What should I notice wrt dropshadows? Apr 14 19:48:12 * spaetz had tested vala .7 with my software Apr 14 19:48:19 on main screen (illume launcher) Apr 14 19:48:21 spaetz: I know :-) Apr 14 19:48:25 click power button Apr 14 19:48:31 and then cancel Apr 14 19:48:33 i'm not awarevof any other vala soft on the fr ;-P Apr 14 19:48:43 yet Apr 14 19:48:43 if you see laggy shadow under already hided window Apr 14 19:48:44 yes? Apr 14 19:48:51 dropshadow is enabled :D Apr 14 19:49:03 Ah it was laggy? Apr 14 19:49:08 No idea it was Apr 14 19:49:19 <= totally unaware Apr 14 19:49:30 disable! Apr 14 19:49:31 spaetz: vala-terminal for isntance Apr 14 19:49:33 ophonekitd vala :-) Apr 14 19:49:40 spaetz: i disabled ;) Apr 14 19:49:52 dos1: do you know why python-elementary is that slow on some things? Apr 14 19:49:52 is ophonekitd vala running? Apr 14 19:49:55 dos1, just try using pyphonelog. Apr 14 19:50:04 bumbl: glamo Apr 14 19:50:05 spaetz: latest yes, not deployed yet Apr 14 19:50:05 e.g. comparing the C slider with the python slider Apr 14 19:50:09 try to run it with x11-16 Apr 14 19:50:13 it's waaaaay faster Apr 14 19:50:16 Ainulindale: cool Apr 14 19:50:23 dos1: nah with C it is fast enough Apr 14 19:50:33 bumbl: then i don't know Apr 14 19:50:37 (elm-test app or vala-settings) Apr 14 19:50:56 hmmm that's weird Apr 14 19:51:00 dos1: the slider used for setting the background light e.g. Apr 14 19:51:04 dmesg says the cdc gadget is detected Apr 14 19:51:06 but no networking Apr 14 19:51:35 it is more or less unusable with shr-settings but works fine with vala-settings and elm test app Apr 14 19:51:44 python should't be that slow Apr 14 19:52:12 bumbl: in shr-settings there is scroller Apr 14 19:52:16 maybe that's the cause Apr 14 19:52:26 hmmm network unreachable Apr 14 19:52:37 hmm i'll try myself tomorrow Apr 14 19:52:48 no route Apr 14 19:52:59 there are even vala bindings to libmokoui2 :) Apr 14 19:53:35 * mwester returns and peeks about to see what sort of trouble everyone has stirred up in the past hour. Apr 14 19:53:35 I restarted networking, and now I have routes Apr 14 19:53:45 mwester: this might be interesting for you Apr 14 19:53:56 I flashed, booted. Plug/unplug USB: dmesg says yes Apr 14 19:54:03 dos1: maybe morphis messed something or it is really pyhton to blame to be even slower as expected Apr 14 19:54:03 devices are configured Apr 14 19:54:05 no route Apr 14 19:54:14 I restart /etc/init.d/networking Apr 14 19:54:15 Now I have routes Apr 14 19:54:18 But still no ping Apr 14 19:54:27 bumbl: i really think that's the Scroller ::P Apr 14 19:54:38 Scroller + glamo = sloooooowneeeeeessss Apr 14 19:55:05 Unless I can get wifi working on first boot, I'm going to need to disassemble one of my gta02s and attach the bloody debug board. Apr 14 19:55:29 ah ok Apr 14 19:55:52 ping to .202 works but not .200 Apr 14 19:56:52 netstat -r Apr 14 19:57:54 * mwester wonders if nytowl has finished fixing all the fallout from the packages->recipes change. Apr 14 19:57:56 mwester: I rmmod g_ether, modprobe it Apr 14 19:58:01 nothing more Apr 14 19:58:15 foo. bad stuff. Apr 14 19:58:33 (nothing more ping wise that is) Apr 14 19:58:34 mwester seems to be building fine here on my 3 build Apr 14 19:58:39 and about routes, they were fine Apr 14 19:59:05 Ok, I hate to do this as the connector is only rated for a dozen insertion/removal cycles, but I shall have to attach the debug board. :( Apr 14 19:59:10 thanks. Apr 14 19:59:57 by the way dos1 Apr 14 19:59:59 for klogd patch Apr 14 20:00:02 I did something similar Apr 14 20:00:05 check /boot Apr 14 20:01:13 error: recipes/netbase/netbase_4.21.bb: patch does not apply Apr 14 20:01:21 Same for opkg_svn.bb Apr 14 20:01:30 and for fstab Apr 14 20:02:06 yeah Apr 14 20:02:08 no problem Apr 14 20:02:14 we will remove them Apr 14 20:02:16 mwester: by the way Apr 14 20:02:18 weird thing Apr 14 20:02:20 rmmod g_ether Apr 14 20:02:22 then we can remove those patches? Apr 14 20:02:30 g_ether isn't listed anymore in lsmod Apr 14 20:02:35 but ifconfig shows the iface Apr 14 20:02:41 odd Apr 14 20:03:03 * mwester wonders if it is a module dependency/ordering problem Apr 14 20:03:11 heyho Apr 14 20:03:25 which could be aggravated by depmod Apr 14 20:03:29 just removed ohci_hcd Apr 14 20:03:33 i'm checking what I can remove Apr 14 20:03:35 bumbl: sorry I didn't have some time today to take a watch at your code Apr 14 20:03:39 I hope I will do this tomorrow Apr 14 20:04:48 mwester: is there a way to see which module provides which iface? Apr 14 20:05:00 Not AFAIK Apr 14 20:05:15 because the iface being there without any related module sounds weird Apr 14 20:05:41 yes, it sounds quite borken -- it wouldn't surprise me if a kernel in that state might panic at some point. Apr 14 20:05:50 Ainulindale sounds like your kernel is hosed Apr 14 20:06:11 nytowl: well latest Apr 14 20:06:30 I'm trying to explain the no usb at boot issue Apr 14 20:06:34 ok Apr 14 20:06:36 have to go Apr 14 20:06:42 it's messed up on the neo side or the desktop Apr 14 20:07:14 Ainulindale: isn't there a reference to module in devices' /sysfs entry? Apr 14 20:09:18 Ainulindale: mwester: probably a good way to really make the kernel panic is to reat out this sysfs-entry ;) Apr 14 20:09:32 That's what I'm thinking, actually. :) Apr 14 20:09:34 well yeah I'd like to Apr 14 20:09:39 But I'm just wondering where it is Apr 14 20:09:44 And I only have a virtual keyboard to do that Apr 14 20:09:54 So it's a bit shitty Apr 14 20:10:01 I'd have to poke about, and my gta02 is not happy right now. Apr 14 20:10:05 thanks to nytowl I have a stylus though Apr 14 20:10:33 * mwester wonders if this could get a lot easier if we just modprobe g_ether (or insmod even) before udev starts... Apr 14 20:11:03 nytowl sent you a stylus? I would have thought they would have those in France... Apr 14 20:11:26 haha, I didn't send it, I deleivered it ;) Apr 14 20:11:46 * mwester remembers the the peugot, and takes back his comment about having stylii in France. :p Apr 14 20:12:09 haha funny thing guys Apr 14 20:12:12 morphis: i fixed it myself (and with the help of raster Apr 14 20:12:15 I did /etc/init.d/udev restart Apr 14 20:12:18 then ifconfig Apr 14 20:12:20 seg fault Apr 14 20:12:24 :) Apr 14 20:12:27 no need to look at it Apr 14 20:12:45 can you rmmod and modprobe the usb stuff Apr 14 20:13:10 the only thing i am asking myself is why the slider in shr-settings used for background light setting is 100 times slower than the one used in elm test app and vala-settings Apr 14 20:13:24 even with python being slower than c it should not be that bad Apr 14 20:13:28 nytowl: did that once or twice Apr 14 20:13:42 and anyway didn't see it at first but udev complains about an error Apr 14 20:13:59 bumbl: how do you fix it? Apr 14 20:14:00 Ainulindale: SEGV woohoo ;D Apr 14 20:14:06 it can't find the drawer where his sockets are Apr 14 20:14:06 * mwester is building the latest image and will try to do some quick hacks to work around this Apr 14 20:14:18 you said g_ether but you also tried ohci_hcd ? Apr 14 20:14:26 yes Apr 14 20:14:26 Ainulindale: i can't acces *.shr-project.org (except for blog.shr-project.org) from here; but who is the main shr-settings dude? (is it mrmoku|e` ?) Apr 14 20:14:28 and btusb Apr 14 20:14:34 Zorkman: dos Apr 14 20:14:41 morphis: should i paste the code? Apr 14 20:14:42 ok thx Apr 14 20:14:49 hmm very weird Apr 14 20:15:17 bumbl: jepp Apr 14 20:15:20 would be great Apr 14 20:15:22 morphis: btw. could you fix python-elementary test.py so that the hovers work? Apr 14 20:15:40 bumbl: jepp Apr 14 20:15:54 oh it is already fixed but I never pushed it :) Apr 14 20:15:55 morphis do you have commit access to elementary.org Apr 14 20:15:57 URL: http://rafb.net/p/ofJFIX99.html Apr 14 20:16:19 yay Apr 14 20:16:21 panic Apr 14 20:16:22 nytowl: both elementary and python-elementary Apr 14 20:16:29 elementary.org is an unregistred domain Apr 14 20:16:40 mwester: way to reproduce it Apr 14 20:16:42 mwester: flash, boot Apr 14 20:16:47 rmmode g_ether Apr 14 20:16:48 I meant enelightenment.org Apr 14 20:16:51 killall udevd Apr 14 20:16:53 restart udevd Apr 14 20:16:56 there is a way to have leds switched on in suspend? Apr 14 20:16:57 that did it for me Apr 14 20:17:03 nytowl: you mean svn.enlightenment.org? Apr 14 20:17:08 Ok, that is very helpful. Apr 14 20:17:23 PANIC!!! Apr 14 20:17:28 xD Apr 14 20:17:30 (and every time with ifconfig then) Apr 14 20:17:31 yes morphis that's what I meant I'll get there sooner or later Apr 14 20:17:38 * mwester gives DocScrutinizer another cup of coffee. Apr 14 20:17:54 nytowl: ? Apr 14 20:18:04 "unable to handle kernel NULL pointer dereferance" Apr 14 20:18:06 mwester: thanks! Apr 14 20:18:26 do you have commit access to svn.enlightenment.org Apr 14 20:18:28 Ainulindale: I'll try a few things to make a quick (hacky) fix, and then we can sort out why it does this later. Apr 14 20:18:44 nytowl: jepp, but why do you want to know this? Apr 14 20:18:53 I think if we insmod g_ether before udev, we'll be ok. Apr 14 20:19:08 morphis because there's bug I would like patched Apr 14 20:19:09 let me reboot and paste the log Apr 14 20:19:31 morphis: when it is fixed push it ;) Apr 14 20:19:32 nytowl: elementary or python-elementary? Apr 14 20:19:34 nytowl: sound too... Apr 14 20:19:42 bumbl: wait some minutes Apr 14 20:19:49 morphis python-ecore Apr 14 20:20:01 Ainulindale, sound ? Apr 14 20:20:09 nytowl: yeah, first boot, no sound here (IIRC) Apr 14 20:20:16 morphis: + how is genlist integration going? Apr 14 20:20:22 * DocScrutinizer wonders where in hell this nullpointer is supposed to point to (if it weren't NULL) Apr 14 20:20:26 * bumbl stops asking stupid questions for today Apr 14 20:20:28 promise Apr 14 20:21:44 bumbl: creeping ... Apr 14 20:23:22 bumbl: pushed Apr 14 20:23:35 Ah, no network after a reboot Apr 14 20:23:36 bumbl: if you want you can help me with it :) Apr 14 20:24:07 morphis: tell me what to do ;) Apr 14 20:24:56 bumbl: simply look at list or toolbar implementation and do the same for genlist :) Apr 14 20:25:25 I have already some code Apr 14 20:26:15 some dispatching for the genlistitemclass have to be done Apr 14 20:33:55 hmmm I'm wondering if this might not be the dreaded "do not boot with usb plugged in" Apr 14 20:34:07 Three boots with USB, same thing, no USB Apr 14 20:34:15 Trying without the cable Apr 14 20:36:18 morphis: hi. I would like to try to help make SHR run on my x800. But I do not know where to start. Do you have any pointers for me? I don't know, Haret would probably be a good start, but maybe some articles and/or tutorial I should learn about kernel or sth? Any thoughts? Apr 14 20:36:30 hmmm no Apr 14 20:36:34 I don't have USB anymore. Apr 14 20:36:46 onen: you have shr running on the x800? Apr 14 20:36:54 * mirko-paroli needs clubbing :) Apr 14 20:36:56 My host may be totally delirious Apr 14 20:38:24 onen: for kernel issues there are some bugs in the track system on gnufiish.org to work on Apr 14 20:38:49 morphis: yes I do. I have sshed to it, and try to play around with activation of GPS using echo 1> ... from the freerunner wiki page. but I think I should try to get some basic knowledge to start with Apr 14 20:38:53 onen: otherweise there are even some things to change in the shr distribution Apr 14 20:39:31 morphis: I thought about playing with haret to try to map the GPIOs and so forth... would that make sense? Apr 14 20:39:37 on handhelds.org is a good documention of haret Apr 14 20:39:53 jepp Apr 14 20:40:09 would be a great start, currently somethings are still missing Apr 14 20:40:24 morphis: I am completely new to all of this (GPIOs, kernel, hardware etc...) Apr 14 20:40:42 morphis: so sorry if I ask stupid questions ;-) Apr 14 20:40:45 onen: me too, but try to learn it :) Apr 14 20:40:54 onen: plus you are french Apr 14 20:41:01 so stupid out of the definition Apr 14 20:41:29 s/but/but I/ Apr 14 20:41:30 morphis meant: onen: me too, but I try to learn it :) Apr 14 20:41:32 Thats just what we tell you Ainulindale Apr 14 20:41:34 morphis: as said before, I have an x800, not an m800. And I thought the GPS could be mapped differently or sth. So fill out the wiki page about it Apr 14 20:41:46 onen: would be great Apr 14 20:42:01 nytowl: :-) Apr 14 20:42:28 Ainulindale: very funny |-S Apr 14 20:42:35 Ainulindale: :-P Apr 14 20:43:13 anybody know what the various wolfson alsa controls are? I just got my speakerphone to work in shr, but I had to tweak some settings that are undocumented (afaik) and that I don't fully understand Apr 14 20:43:19 the French and their hartly humor :-P Apr 14 20:43:22 morphis: ok, I will start with this, try to figure out what the heck is GPIO to start with ;-) Apr 14 20:43:34 :) Apr 14 20:43:49 budfive there was a fix for the alsacontrols submitted earlier today Apr 14 20:44:01 General Purpose Input Output Apr 14 20:44:02 nytowl: for the speakerphone? Apr 14 20:44:07 yup Apr 14 20:44:25 nytowl: haha. all right then Apr 14 20:44:43 It should hit the builds tomorrow Apr 14 20:45:02 morphis: I saw Stefan wrote 90% for GPS support for x800 (IIRC). I wanted to try if this works, in order to learn. But I was not even sure what I should do! Apr 14 20:45:25 onen: how do try it? Apr 14 20:45:27 budfive: there are no (or all) undocumented 8753 controls :P Apr 14 20:45:35 cat /dev/ttySAC2? Apr 14 20:45:39 morphis: that is why I would like to try to write also the way to test a thing, so that it can be reproduced by people Apr 14 20:45:56 ah ok Apr 14 20:46:21 jepp, you have to activate the gps through the sysfs Apr 14 20:47:05 morphis: well I have tried this, without luck. but another command from gps-utils package printed out some nice strings. but the value were always the same. which looks suspicious to me. so I tried to see if the GPS was really powered on, if I could power it off, and if I could get some values which would change Apr 14 20:47:11 morphis: but no luck Apr 14 20:47:26 budfive, though furthermore, everything is docmuented in the wiki. "neo 1973 audio subsystem" or something like that. Apr 14 20:48:04 morphis: I followed the wiki page about the freerunner. but I am not sure it is the same paths for the eten Apr 14 20:48:14 morphis: ok, I will try to help with this Apr 14 20:48:29 morphis: so far, all the people involved have m800, right? not x800? Apr 14 20:48:55 onen: I never really tried it, but it should be the same syspath Apr 14 20:49:02 onen: I think so Apr 14 20:49:14 TAsn: not everything is on that page. controls 87-94 is what I tinkered with and none of those are on that page Apr 14 20:49:21 morphis: ok, then it is me against *my* x800 then ;-) Apr 14 20:49:30 budfive, 87-94 = DAPM? Apr 14 20:49:43 TAsn: i guess so. what's DAPM? :) Apr 14 20:49:57 http://www.alsa-project.org/main/index.php/DAPM Apr 14 20:50:06 budfive: that's powerswitches basically Apr 14 20:50:31 they are not all DAPM, though the issue with the speaker was DAPM related Apr 14 20:50:42 so I figured that's what you were talking about. Apr 14 20:50:57 i see. Apr 14 20:51:17 so where was the fix submitted? I don't see the update in the openmoko.org svn Apr 14 20:52:34 onen: should be /sys/bus/platform/drivers/neo1973-pm-gps/neo1973-pm-gps.0 Apr 14 20:54:05 budfive http://svn.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/audio/om-gta02/gsmspeakerout.state Apr 14 20:54:33 morphis: ok thanks. I will give it another try. Apr 14 20:54:39 morphis: thanks for your help Apr 14 20:54:49 nytowl: oh, yeah. thanks. Apr 14 20:54:50 good night folks Apr 14 20:54:57 and you have to initialize it with 57600bps Apr 14 20:55:02 Ainulindale: good night even to you :-P Apr 14 20:55:30 morphis: ok that is already too much for me, I don't know where I should do that! Apr 14 20:56:23 morphis: I will look for the way to set the speed Apr 14 20:56:27 morphis: thanks again Apr 14 20:56:30 morphis: bye Apr 14 20:57:41 onen: simply 'stty -F /dev/ttySAC2 speed 57600' Apr 14 21:03:06 byebye Apr 14 21:32:58 * mwester searches for something like "zenity" for e Apr 14 22:07:09 * DocScrutinizer wonders why neotool devels never seem to have considered using kdialog alternatively to zenity, if the script finds zenity isn't installed but kdialog actually is Apr 14 22:09:30 mwester: anyway check kdialog cmdline syntax (err set of options). It's more comprehensive than zenity so might give you a better idea of what to develop if you eventually make up your mind to create Edialog or Eenity by yourself Apr 14 22:09:56 * mwester doesn't like kde :P Apr 14 22:10:17 so what? Apr 14 22:10:32 But I can do stuff with Perl and gtk+, and I hear that etk is rather like gtk+. Apr 14 22:10:45 I know. You've told maybe 24h ago Apr 14 22:11:03 I did? Apr 14 22:11:10 yup Apr 14 22:11:12 * mwester must have been typing in his sleep Apr 14 22:11:22 otherwise I wouldn't have known Apr 14 22:13:44 hmm, maybe it's moths ago. My storage doesn't tag the info entities with creation dates usually ;-) Apr 14 22:14:24 moNths even Apr 14 22:14:40 moths? Must be the bats getting hungry. Apr 14 22:14:48 hehehe Apr 14 22:15:23 Hmm... updown usb0; ifup usb0 seems to bring up the interface just fine after first boot. Apr 14 22:15:36 So that would seem to imply that it's just a timing problem. Apr 14 22:16:01 And every time I see timing problems with device drivers and modules, it's almost always udev at fault. Apr 14 22:16:24 ack Apr 14 22:17:46 anyway /me taking a bikeride to enjoy the mild calm night Apr 14 22:19:56 anyone know a good "force 500mA" charge app for shr? Apr 14 22:20:09 gui would be handy Apr 14 22:20:27 should be dead simple Apr 14 22:20:38 yeah i know, but is there already one out there? Apr 14 22:20:56 not specifically for SHR afaik Apr 14 22:21:35 though I wonder where the specifics might come from with such a simple app Apr 14 22:22:08 i thought fso used another way to controll charging than 200x.y; i guess i was wrong then Apr 14 22:22:18 there have been GUI apps anyway, for maybe 1/2 a Y or gerlon Apr 14 22:23:04 http://hdr.meetr.de/neo/openmoko/battery/battery_0.20080721_armv4t.ipk for example can't read battery levels on shr Apr 14 22:23:05 duh, cursed touchpad Apr 14 22:24:49 ask mwester to create Edialog ;-) then it's a 5liner shellscript using either sysfs or mdbus Apr 14 22:26:07 never heard of Edialog, but if mwester finds it usefull he has my blessing to create it ;) Apr 14 22:26:40 Zorkman: I don't know of a recent "force charge" app, but you could probably get an older one to work by editing the /sys paths that it uses Apr 14 22:29:01 Zorkman: I need such an app as well; my FR is useless with a car charger because it only pulls 100ma max. :( Apr 14 22:29:25 mwester: when i find the links to the /sys paths i will edit one Apr 14 22:29:36 have the same problem with car charger :) Apr 14 22:30:11 I don't have access to a FR right now, but you can search for "usb_curlim" and "chg_curlim" controls in /sys (IIRC) Apr 14 22:30:32 Zorkman: I rather expect that someone will tell us to use the DBUS methods. So that we would get to write 100 lines of code to interact with DBUS rather than writing "1" to a sysfs node. :( Apr 14 22:30:53 I've been contemplating sharing my dead trivial e gui app -- grid buttons that runs something from the command-line Apr 14 22:31:52 t seems to be all the rage among the fashionable Linux developers -- replace every config file and useful api with DBUS -- pretty soon someone will probably propose "KDBUS", a kernel implementation of DBUS, which would have many advantages, although nobody could really outline them. Apr 14 22:32:23 I'll try wrap up the simple gui app tonight if I get the chance. Apr 14 22:32:26 ok, i found the paths and i don't really care about what people will tell Apr 14 22:32:26 (Of course, it would require a quad-core Intel with 4GB of RAM to boot... :p ) Apr 14 22:32:50 when they make a nice app i will gladly use it, but i'm too noobish to be able to make a dbus api myself :) Apr 14 22:33:17 eolson: I would find such a thing useful as an easy way to add funtionality to SHR. Apr 14 22:33:54 Rather like assigning macros to function keys, back in the days before X and bitmapped UIs... Apr 14 22:35:05 mwester, ok, cool, some motivation for me to get it done then :) Apr 14 22:39:02 Zorkman: why do you need an application for forcing 500mA? Apr 14 22:39:24 lindi-: the same reason as mwester: the car charger only gives 100mA Apr 14 22:39:32 that is not enough to use the FR Apr 14 22:39:39 Zorkman: but you don't need a separate app for that Apr 14 22:39:53 Zorkman: i just have a menu entry that does echo Apr 14 22:39:53 (a gui would be nice... finger friendly and stuff) Apr 14 22:40:00 Zorkman: menu is finger friendly Apr 14 22:40:09 lindi-: i'm all ears :) Apr 14 22:40:12 (and fingers :)) Apr 14 22:40:14 I find it hard to open vala-terminal and type while I'm driving. Apr 14 22:40:15 ? Apr 14 22:40:24 lindi-: what app are you talking about Apr 14 22:40:42 ah, you mean a desktop icon Apr 14 22:40:47 Zorkman: I packaged usbmode for that Apr 14 22:40:56 (forcing 500mA) Apr 14 22:41:04 * mwester looks at his brand-new desktop for usbmode. Apr 14 22:41:05 Zorkman: i just have prog 500mA 500mA sudo sh -c '. $HOME/.sysfsrc; echo 500 > $sys_force_usb_limit_dangerous' in .icewm/menu Apr 14 22:41:18 (gui app) Apr 14 22:41:42 Ainulindale: does it use sudo to get root privs? Apr 14 22:41:52 lindi-: Do I ship apps for debian? :-) Apr 14 22:42:43 lindi-: does that automatically reset to the defaults when the power supply situation changes? IE it resets when you unplug and then re-plugin you FR? Apr 14 22:42:50 * Failed to download http://build.shr-project.org/shr-unstable/ipk//armv4/Packages.gz, error 404 Apr 14 22:42:54 futz. Apr 14 22:42:55 Toaster`: yep Apr 14 22:43:01 ugly Apr 14 22:43:06 mwester: that's not a problem but that's ugly Apr 14 22:43:11 we talked about that with mickeyl today Apr 14 22:43:37 Ok. :) I'm a bit of a perfectionist, and such things are just, well, they just look sloppy and unprofessional. Apr 14 22:43:44 I completely agree Apr 14 22:43:53 Fact is, it's based on MACHINE_ARCH Apr 14 22:44:00 which is armv4 armv4t Apr 14 22:44:08 so it generates the feed entry Apr 14 22:44:15 Ainulindale: couldn't something like a power overide be added to SHR-Settings? Apr 14 22:44:36 Toaster`: You should ask that question to dos1 Apr 14 22:44:43 We could just create a dummy package with arch armv4, which would cause the feed to be built. Apr 14 22:44:54 mwester: we could Apr 14 22:44:56 Ainulindale, Toaster`; i was going to propose that to dos, but i haven't seem him online today Apr 14 22:45:01 He was Apr 14 22:45:06 Zorkman: but meanwhile, use usbmode Apr 14 22:45:08 It does that Apr 14 22:45:08 Probably not the right solution, but it might suffice until upstream (aka mickeyl ;) ) finds time to fix it. Apr 14 22:45:18 plus it's in python so my guess is dos1 will try to use it Apr 14 22:45:47 thanks Ainulindale Apr 14 22:46:05 You're welcome Apr 14 22:46:23 Oooh - nice. :) Apr 14 22:46:32 That'll work for me, just fine. Apr 14 22:46:45 what? usbmode? Apr 14 22:46:58 yep Apr 14 22:47:26 does it do the "ifup usb0" and "ifdown usb0" as it switches modes, too? Apr 14 22:47:40 No idea at all Apr 14 22:47:55 But it's gpl, so I think dos will fork it Apr 14 22:48:03 ok. Apr 14 22:48:23 Wow, this all gets inter-tangled quickly. Apr 14 22:48:55 inter tangled? Apr 14 22:49:01 Power settings interact with USB mode, and that interact with the networking, and of course the wifi interacts directly with the power mode... Apr 14 22:49:27 that's a bit circular Apr 14 22:49:31 Yes. Apr 14 22:50:02 The point is that simply playing with the usb mode might result in a new network interface (usb0) coming or going... Apr 14 22:50:15 fair enough Apr 14 22:51:12 which might affect default routes, which may require that an app which needs internet would have to seek an altenate connection, so it may have to cause the wifi to power up and search, or establish GPRS... (all depending on what has been enabled, of course, but that's all quite reaonable to expect at some point int eh maturity of the software) Apr 14 22:51:13 And in USB host mode you might have a 'usb0' interface that's connected to a cdc_ether gadget on the other end of the cable. Apr 14 22:51:28 mmontour: good point. Apr 14 22:51:45 In USB host mode, it could even be full 100Mbit ethernet device. Apr 14 22:51:49 You're old granpas trying to find a problem =) Apr 14 22:52:33 Ainulindale: no, we're middle-aged men delicately probing a sore tooth, and being very concerned about what we might find that we do not wish to find... Apr 14 22:53:29 then tyr it =) Apr 14 22:53:33 s/tyr/try/ Apr 14 22:53:33 Ainulindale meant: then try it =) Apr 14 22:54:07 Adding a simple "Force 500mA" option to SHR-Settings shouldn't be too hard Apr 14 22:54:17 the rest might be a bit tricky though Apr 14 22:54:24 For the moment, it is quite adequate for me to get the basics working, and let the user sort out what network devices need to be started or restarted if they twiddle with the usb settings or power settings. We just need the UI to let them do that. Apr 14 22:55:10 Perhaps if the (non-existant) wifi settings UI were to also allow usb0 to be started and stopped, that would be entirely sufficient. Apr 14 22:56:33 One approach might be to use a different interface name (like usb1) for host-mode USB networking. There's probably a way to do that with udev or module parameters Apr 14 22:56:53 Let me show you how it looks Apr 14 22:58:08 http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/a5c8deb5bd4462ba8c15d936fb2b525d.png Apr 14 23:10:13 Ainulindale: have you tested it? Apr 14 23:10:16 it doesn't seem to work here... Apr 14 23:11:11 my fr was charging (at 500mA); i launched the program, pressed the first button and then pressed the force 500mA; when i take a look at power applet in shr-testing; it says "not charging" Apr 14 23:11:26 disconnecting the usb cable and reconnecting, or pressing the force 500mA doesn't work... Apr 14 23:11:39 Zorkman: what's current_now? Apr 14 23:11:49 first it is discharging, then i connect cable and it says "not charging" it's 101mA Apr 14 23:12:01 but i have wifi and gps on, so it's probably chargign at 100mA Apr 14 23:12:13 Zorkman: the current_now file? Apr 14 23:12:54 it says so in the power sectiong of shr-testing Apr 14 23:13:11 Zorkman: but i'd like to know about the contents of the current_now file ;) Apr 14 23:13:30 Zorkman: /sys/class/power_supply/battery/current_now Apr 14 23:13:44 153937 Apr 14 23:14:03 but it seems that usbmode still uses the old /sys paths Apr 14 23:14:08 Force USB Charge Mode (500mA) Apr 14 23:14:08 sh: can't create /sys/devices/platform/s3c2440-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0073/chgmode: nonexistent directory Apr 14 23:14:08 sh: can't create /sys/devices/platform/s3c2440-i2c/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0073/force_usb_limit_dangerous: nonexistent directory Apr 14 23:14:41 Zorkman: hard coding sysfs paths to applications does not work. Apr 14 23:15:40 * mwester takes back the good thoughts about usbmode.py Apr 14 23:15:45 :( Apr 14 23:16:04 lindi-: it *DOES* work, if the kernel devs wouldn't change it about every other commit. Apr 14 23:16:20 yep but at the moment it doesn't :) Apr 14 23:17:03 yeah. now how do you fix it? Have a different user-space and different feeds for every different kernel git hash? Apr 14 23:17:08 sigh. Apr 14 23:17:46 This is what I've been railing against for two years with this project. It's such a PITA for users, and the user-space devs, total distractions from what they should be doing. Apr 14 23:18:07 This is why kernel devs earn every bad thing user-space devs say about them. Apr 14 23:18:19 Apr 14 23:21:08 mwester: autodetect on bootup, cache to some file Apr 14 23:22:17 isn't this something that the framework handles? Apr 14 23:22:45 it's something it probably should I suppose. Maybe in the power interface? Apr 14 23:22:51 budfive: possibly but i don't want to go through it Apr 14 23:23:02 but that's outta my league :) Apr 14 23:23:06 budfive: i want more reliable solution Apr 14 23:23:31 lindi-: heh? why? what's wrong with the framework? Apr 14 23:24:08 it's run by communists last i heard ;) Apr 14 23:24:35 budfive: there's still a bug where frameworkd goes to a state where it does not reply to anything over dbus Apr 14 23:25:28 lindi-: ugh. that's not good. but is that it? there aren't deeper philosophical issues that i'm not aware of? Apr 14 23:25:55 budfive: well, i wouldn't trust dbus for anything that critical :) Apr 14 23:26:15 lindi-: ok. fair enough. Apr 14 23:26:43 budfive: the bug is http://trac.freesmartphone.org/ticket/348 Apr 14 23:27:09 budfive: i have no idea how to debug it Apr 14 23:28:15 lindi-: hmmm. are you the only one who sees this? not many other comments in that report Apr 14 23:28:52 budfive: don't know, i have talked to many people about this but they haven't just used trac Apr 14 23:30:02 lindi-: oh, sorta related, why you see your gsm bug (2257), how unresponsive is the modem? Could my bug (2264) be the same as yours? Apr 14 23:30:23 budfive: bugs.openmoko.org? Apr 14 23:30:31 https://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2257 Apr 14 23:31:29 budfive: i don't think it is the same bug since here using socat helped Apr 14 23:31:50 lindi-: but that's after you power-cycled the modem, no? Apr 14 23:32:24 budfive: yep but gsm0710muxd wasn't able to talk to it after that Apr 14 23:33:38 lindi-: the two bugs may be the same. I haven't tried very hard to resurrect the thing after it died. Have you tried to get the gsm log when you see 2257? Apr 14 23:33:54 budfive: gsm log? Apr 14 23:34:13 budfive: gsm0710muxd can't talk a single byte with calypso, nothing to log there Apr 14 23:34:35 * mwester has nspy in a very recent kernel; nspy logs would be very helpful for these issues. Apr 14 23:34:37 budfive: i think it's clearly a kernel serial port issue since it happened after kernel upgrade Apr 14 23:34:47 mwester: it should be added to andy-tracking Apr 14 23:35:05 Too intrusive Apr 14 23:35:13 make it less :) Apr 14 23:35:27 Can't. That's the whole idea of such a debugging tool. Apr 14 23:35:44 but i would need to run it for weeks to hit the bug anyway Apr 14 23:35:53 It'll do that. Apr 14 23:35:53 lindi- with 2264, I see the calypso crash in the log. After it crashes, the modem no longer responds and you can't get anything out of the calypso. If you cat the log and then make it crash, maybe you'll see the calypso crash as well Apr 14 23:36:16 lindi-: also, do you have a good way to reproduce your bug? Apr 14 23:36:22 budfive: but why would that occur only with new kernel? Apr 14 23:36:27 budfive: no way to reproduce sorry Apr 14 23:36:34 it uses a ring buffer for the traffic and events; it'll just sit there logging the data -- when it happens, dump the last 8KB of logged data and events. Easy. Apr 14 23:37:02 lindi-: surely the kernel should not matter, but if you don't have a reliable way to reproduce it, maybe it actually does happen with the other kernel, but you haven't noticed it? Apr 14 23:37:34 budfive: i run a watchdog that talks to calypso regularly Apr 14 23:37:44 budfive: i also make automated test calls every two hours Apr 14 23:38:11 budfive: i have been using the b8b36e5ec3d for months without hitting this Apr 14 23:38:36 budfive: so yes i'm quite confident that this is a kernel bug and not some deep calypso bug Apr 14 23:38:55 lindi-: ok. fair enough. i might try to break my calypso running your good kernel. Apr 14 23:39:17 budfive: but if you get backtrace from calypso then obviously it its own fault :) Apr 14 23:39:28 budfive: so we just have different bugs here Apr 14 23:40:01 lindi-: do you have a calypso debug cable? have you looked at a trace when your bug happens? Apr 14 23:40:11 budfive: i'm still working on it Apr 14 23:40:20 lindi-: oh yeah. you're avr man Apr 14 23:40:45 it happens so seldom that i need a mobile calypso debug logger (tm)(R) Apr 14 23:42:14 anyways, now i better sleep. happy bug hunting! Apr 14 23:55:40 * mwester suggests that lindi- employ a pair of neos, each one serving as the mobile calypso debug logger(tm)(R) for the other. This would also statistically double the chances of catching a trace. :D Apr 14 23:59:59 mwester: ( total distractions from what they should be doing.) ACK Apr 15 00:06:38 moo Apr 15 00:16:06 budfive: lindi- you've seen Dieter's comment on https://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2264#comment:10 ?? Apr 15 00:18:16 DocScrutinizer: yeah, i saw it. but in my mind there's a question as to whether 2257 is the same bug Apr 15 00:18:57 budfive: see *my* comment here: https://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/2257#comment:14 Apr 15 00:19:27 sure it's a question still Apr 15 00:19:31 DocScrutinizer: well yeah, i saw that. That's the same conjecture, but not evidence Apr 15 00:19:55 sure it's a question still Apr 15 00:20:17 DocScrutinizer: my method of reproducing my crash is less reliable than I'd like it to be, so I'm trying to find somethign better right now. Apr 15 00:20:30 DocScrutinizer: then I can try it on lindi-'s "good" kernel Apr 15 00:20:34 good approach Apr 15 00:21:14 also I'd strongly recommend to put mwester's nspy to purpose Apr 15 00:21:40 DocScrutinizer: problem is, there are other calypso problems that make it hard to reproduce. any time i try to download something with gprs, it tends to stall a lot (bad cell reception maybe) Apr 15 00:21:56 mwester: tell me about nspy :) Apr 15 00:23:58 mwester: i saw your comment about nspy on bug #2264. Right now I'm getting calypso debug logs from the headphone jack. Does nspy produce something more useful? Apr 15 00:31:38 budfive: sorry I don't see any comment about nspy at #2264 Apr 15 00:32:34 ack. 2257 i mean Apr 15 00:32:36 probably you meant #2257 Apr 15 00:33:34 budfive: nspy is creating a log of the tty communication Apr 15 00:34:03 budfive: you won't get this from hs-jack log Apr 15 00:35:19 hs-jack will log debug data from the calypso's internal processor, nspy will log serial I/O at the driver/UART interface (along with some other related events such as GSM interrupts, overruns, flow-control and mode changes). Apr 15 00:35:39 Anyone running Qi -- Can someone post the output from /proc/cmdline for me, plz? Apr 15 00:41:03 mwester: so If the calypso crashes and we see a crash dump in the hs jack, then is nspy useful? Apr 15 00:41:36 mwester: i'm using qi Apr 15 00:41:37 mwester: loglevel=4 console=tty0 console=ttySAC2,115200 init=/sbin/init ro mtdparts=physmap-flash:-(nor);neo1973-nand:0x00040000(qi),0x00040000(depr-ub-env),0x00800000(kernel),0x000a0000(depr),0x00040000(identity-ext2),0x0f6a0000(rootfs) g_ether.host_addr=00:1F:11:01:1D:A9 g_ether.dev_addr=00:1F:11:01:1D:A9 rootfstype=jffs2 root=/dev/mtdblock6 Apr 15 00:42:12 budfive: I can't say -- but I think that if I were debugging what happened on the Calypso, it might be useful to have a dump of the last several KB of data that was sent and received by the Calypso. Apr 15 00:42:26 mwester: i have mtdparts=physmap-flash:-(nor);neo1973-nand:0x00040000(qi),0x00040000(cmdline),0x00800000(backupkernel),0x000a0000(extra),0x00040000(identity),0x0f6a0000(backuprootfs) loglevel=4 console=tty0 console=ttySAC2,115200 init=/sbin/init ro rootfstype=jffs2 root=/dev/mtdblock6 Apr 15 00:42:35 mwester: exactly Apr 15 00:42:53 mwester: ok, fair enough. let me work on more reliably making it die. Then I can do all sorts of things Apr 15 00:42:54 budfive: Thanks! That's perfect, exactly what I needed is on that line --- and Weiss -- also good info, because your's is missing that item (g_ether) Apr 15 00:43:09 * mwester should handle both cases. Apr 15 00:43:18 mwester: what're you doing with qi? Apr 15 00:43:27 mwester: budfive : maybe some special sequence is crashing calypso? (e.g. "+++") Apr 15 00:43:42 mwester: hmm.. i have a custom-configured kernel and quite an old Qi, if that's relevant Apr 15 00:44:02 nothing with qi -- but I'm trying to pull out the g_ether params it is passing in to the kernel so that we make sure to pass them on to g_ether when it is not in-kernel, but is a module instead. Apr 15 00:44:24 Weiss: Yes, only newer Qi's will pass in the g_ether parameters. Apr 15 00:44:43 * DocScrutinizer panics Apr 15 00:44:52 ;) Apr 15 00:46:10 * Weiss segfaults Apr 15 00:47:02 :O Apr 15 00:48:10 * raster SIGURG's Apr 15 00:48:59 sigzig Apr 15 00:49:22 there is no sigzig! Apr 15 00:49:23 :) Apr 15 00:49:39 * raster SIGILL's DocScrutinizer Apr 15 00:49:59 already feeling sick Apr 15 00:50:57 raster: seen dialog werner/me on om-devel? Apr 15 00:52:37 hmm Apr 15 00:52:39 need to scroll... Apr 15 00:57:31 DocScrutinizer: somehow.... i just dont really believe in "gta02 with minor fixes" is going to do a lot. Apr 15 00:58:14 the design is mostly seen as ugly (do a poll and find out - but an informal one of most people here not to mention just normal people who've seen it) would say about 80-90% think its "ugly" Apr 15 00:58:29 raster: neither do i. i think that opportunity has passed. but if it helps to get people off their asses ... :) Apr 15 00:58:38 raster: Steve is talking about GTA02+p+e-g and has nothing less than GTA03 in mind, but using the silly gta02 case Apr 15 00:58:41 :-((( Apr 15 00:58:42 so keeping the gta02 case to me only makes sense from the point of view of trying to re-use the cases and avoid new case molds (tooling etc.) Apr 15 00:58:58 DocScrutinizer: we still have to fix the ID paralysis Apr 15 00:59:15 also it doesnt fix naggingly horrid problems of - it's not a stylus device... but no space for a stylus.. and the screne is indented losing a chunk of the tiny screen space for finger use. Apr 15 00:59:25 those 2 alone i think warrant new id Apr 15 00:59:43 and with new id... you now have the fgreedom to adjust the id around what you can do with a screen and board Apr 15 00:59:44 :) Apr 15 01:00:08 raster: (stylus) where's the contradiction ? :) Apr 15 01:00:18 wpwrak: if u ask me - id need to be flexbile and MEET with ee. Apr 15 01:00:32 wpwrak: indetned screen is usable with stylus - well the design is Apr 15 01:00:37 ACK!!! Apr 15 01:00:38 as u can get the corners with a stylus Apr 15 01:00:43 u cant with a finger Apr 15 01:00:52 thus u go from 2.8" to 2.2" screen (for finger input) Apr 15 01:01:06 and it has no qwerty kbd Apr 15 01:01:20 in the end trying to do a vkbd on what is effectively 2.2" of screen is going to result in pain Apr 15 01:01:22 no matter what Apr 15 01:01:34 there's a reason apple chose 3.5" for an iphone Apr 15 01:01:36 raster: (ID) yeah. that process was totally fucked up. until relatively close to the end, ID wouldn't even talk to engineering ... Apr 15 01:01:44 thats almost a minimum size to even consider a vkbd Apr 15 01:01:47 and a flat surface Apr 15 01:01:54 even then enough people complain it is too small for that Apr 15 01:02:11 wpwrak: i noticed that. i had tried to talk to thomas many times Apr 15 01:02:16 as i knew it was coming down the pipeline Apr 15 01:02:17 raster: well, GTA03 has a nice big cap touch screen. i think you'd like it :) Apr 15 01:02:20 he wouldnt talk to me Apr 15 01:02:20 The point is we're discussing silly implemetation details long been solved with gta03 proto, but we don't ever mention ID which has been the main obstacle Apr 15 01:02:22 i sent several mails Apr 15 01:02:26 asked sean to bridge the gap Apr 15 01:02:29 nothnig happened Apr 15 01:02:39 i knew that id needs to talk to software Apr 15 01:02:44 and of course - i assumed it'd talk to ee Apr 15 01:03:07 wpwrak: and yes. the flat cap screen on gta03 i think would be a big step up Apr 15 01:03:13 DocScrutinizer: i wouldn't even mind if we set up a "toy" project to design some sort of gta02+ Apr 15 01:03:17 wpwrak: but.. how muihc of gta03's id is done beyond designs? Apr 15 01:03:25 ie is the tyooling done Apr 15 01:03:32 DocScrutinizer: even if it's just as a warm-up exercise. Apr 15 01:03:35 is the cap screen now available in units/quantities? Apr 15 01:04:00 if these arent there - tyhen its nothing better that a scribble on a napkin and can be modified or replaced Apr 15 01:04:02 raster: (tooling) no. and you wouldn't want to keep the stacking. too complex. also some parts of the case are too complex to manufacture. Apr 15 01:04:07 wpwrak: that's cheeting on community Apr 15 01:04:16 raster: that is, unless you're willing to CNC them one by one, then hand-polish ;-) Apr 15 01:04:24 wpwrak: ok. so losing the gta03 id pretty mush is a "no loss" Apr 15 01:04:27 community doesn't want toy projects, they want an cool device Apr 15 01:04:37 wpwrak: hehehe Apr 15 01:04:44 wpwrak: though seriously.. macbooks are cnc'd Apr 15 01:04:52 (i believe) Apr 15 01:05:01 DocScrutinizer: i didn't suggest to lie about the purpose of that project Apr 15 01:05:03 yup Apr 15 01:05:19 macbook is cnc per device Apr 15 01:05:32 raster: some people have way too much money :) Apr 15 01:05:44 wpwrak: true :) Apr 15 01:05:49 wpwrak: no, you are just not mentioneing the purpose all tohether Apr 15 01:06:07 wpwrak: but.. the tooling for a mold is hella-not-cheap either Apr 15 01:06:15 ack Apr 15 01:06:25 raster: (cap screen, qty) dunno. looks like a fairly standard design, though, so it shouldn't be all that hard. coating is a bit of an issue. Apr 15 01:06:27 u can make 100 cases cheaply with cnc Apr 15 01:06:39 for a mold u'd need to make 1000's to make back the tooling Apr 15 01:06:57 wpwrak: whos the cap scr from? amtel? synaptics? Apr 15 01:06:59 make that 5000 Apr 15 01:07:02 i doubt its synaptics Apr 15 01:07:24 DocScrutinizer: right now, we're merely discussing options. i'm quite happy that steve wants to hear about what's readily doable, i.e., a bottom-up approach Apr 15 01:07:30 DocScrutinizer: sure. but we need to know u will sell 5k before you go do the tooling Apr 15 01:07:33 raster: dunno Apr 15 01:08:03 raster: thats the point Apr 15 01:08:42 wpwrak: as best i know a cap scr can be slapped onto any surface - with the right coatings... but if you go talk to the cap screen makers... they will either happily resell uyou an existing cap screen design (so now yu have to design your entire thing around the existing surface) OR you need to make a hefty quantity before they consider a custom screen Apr 15 01:08:45 raster: (mold) depends on the technology. there are lots of plastic-shaping technologies that don't have a few hundred kUSD startup cost Apr 15 01:08:51 and even then thats a biggish NRE to get started Apr 15 01:09:12 wpwrak: hahaha the few hundred k is kind of the problem :( Apr 15 01:09:24 hoping more for the few k side :) Apr 15 01:10:07 at least for a prorotype i considered simply 3d-printing the case Apr 15 01:10:12 DocScrutinizer: (bottom-up) the alternative being to go back to the very basics. and i guarantee you that little but endless discussions will happen for many months if you do this, while all the technology we have already validated fades away. Apr 15 01:10:22 you can churn out 10 or 20 of them at an ok cost with 3d printing Apr 15 01:10:25 it wont be durable Apr 15 01:10:29 but it should work. Apr 15 01:10:45 wpwrak: dont get ya Apr 15 01:11:06 wpwrak: i didn't suggest that Apr 15 01:11:09 raster: forget 3d printing unless for mold-making. but you can just mill that mold, no problem. Apr 15 01:11:26 raster eeh.. you know that gismo and i have a cnc mill here in berlin? Apr 15 01:11:45 raster: get an mdx-15 and a block of wood, and you're pretty much there ;-) okay, make it aluminium for injection molding Apr 15 01:11:46 3-axis, with a 800W spindle motor... can do steel Apr 15 01:11:55 wpwrak: well it depends what u want to invest. 3d printing pretty much is 0 investment beyond design Apr 15 01:12:07 and its relatively easy to go from 3d model to "real thing" Apr 15 01:12:21 cnc milling the mold definitely might be a next-stage effort Apr 15 01:12:22 and we also know a plasic casing-manufacturer here in berlin ;) Apr 15 01:12:26 DocScrutinizer: well, what exactly do you want then ? :) Apr 15 01:12:30 roh: thats cool! Apr 15 01:12:36 pff Apr 15 01:12:44 roh: speaking of berlin... i'll be coming by in may. before fsoshrcon Apr 15 01:12:46 that plastic-guy also did a lot of successfull cases already.. all fritzboxes are from them Apr 15 01:12:55 roh: nice equipment :) how many axes ? Apr 15 01:12:57 raster cool. Apr 15 01:13:12 I think I made my point quite clear Apr 15 01:13:15 wpwrak just 3.. but one can add more if needed and has money ;) Apr 15 01:13:23 roh: the question is.. how much is it to get a mold to do cases Apr 15 01:13:41 last i checked a mold was starting at 50k and for anything complex $100k+ Apr 15 01:13:46 raster: 3D printing usually has expensive material, doesn't produce particularly good quality, and the material often isn't great for handling Apr 15 01:14:01 wpwrak: i know. thats why i'd do it only for the first 10 prototypes Apr 15 01:14:09 wpwrak: ie when the board is the "Right size" Apr 15 01:14:11 raster: you can optimize some of these parameters, but it won't be easy Apr 15 01:14:16 and components int he right places -s creen etc. Apr 15 01:14:17 raster i think doing one mold is easy if you are sure your design is correct. the difficult part is getting there. Apr 15 01:14:26 i'd do it jyust to hold it together and enclose it Apr 15 01:14:45 roh: yup. thats why i was thinking 3d printing Apr 15 01:14:55 that would be a cheap re-spin cycle Apr 15 01:15:04 raster: a simple alu mold should be dirt-cheap as long as you provide the machine-ready design Apr 15 01:15:04 defintiely not solid, durable, tough etc. Apr 15 01:15:09 will not be the right colors etc. Apr 15 01:15:25 3d-printing one can buy if the design is right. the plasic guy also has such equipment.. they use it for prototyping. Apr 15 01:15:36 wpwrak: that is the bit i dont know (yet) i know i can go direct from 3d model in blender to 3d print Apr 15 01:15:43 raster: in fact, you can just get a block of aluminium, mill it yourself, put it in the factory's fixture and you're done Apr 15 01:15:46 thus i'd be doing that as a verification stage Apr 15 01:16:17 wpwrak: ok - so if you can just get 3d model -> cnc instr's for a goopd cnc miller.. you're done Apr 15 01:16:35 raster: you need some conversion software. for 3d printers, it's probably all very proprietary. for mills, there are some standard languages Apr 15 01:17:14 raster: then you need a tool path generator that converts your 3d model to a sequence of movements. google for heekscam for some examples. Apr 15 01:18:05 roh: 4 axes would be nice. removes the messy turning over :) Apr 15 01:19:07 I just so happen to be retrofitting my rotary 4th axis hehe Apr 15 01:19:16 wpwrak: for 3dprinters theres a standard .. ummm.. http://www.shapeways.com/ Apr 15 01:19:22 blender directly supports this format Apr 15 01:19:27 a few more parts to cut still Apr 15 01:19:28 as do several 3d modellers Apr 15 01:19:34 raster! Apr 15 01:19:55 raster: btw, cnc mills aren't all that expensive, e.g., http://www.rolanddga.com/asd/products/scanners/MDX15/ Apr 15 01:20:12 wpwrak: x3d Apr 15 01:20:13 thats it Apr 15 01:20:20 Dave: doof! Apr 15 01:20:31 wpwrak: anyway - not suggesting 3dprinting for production Apr 15 01:20:33 Affirmative. Apr 15 01:20:38 only as a fast prorotyping stage Apr 15 01:20:55 you email off your x3d and back comes a box with a model in it Apr 15 01:21:12 would be good to verify the id desigtn sizing/details match the board Apr 15 01:21:19 and it actually fits int he hand right Apr 15 01:21:21 etc. etc. Apr 15 01:21:47 raster: seems that milling is pretty much on par there as well. 3d printing still doesn't seem to be quite mature enough yet. it has great advantages if you have really nasty shapes, but for a case, you don't really need all that. Apr 15 01:22:07 nah, GTA03 ML is about reusing "proven" gta02 case anyway Apr 15 01:22:21 wpwrak we got this one http://syil.com.cn/en/bf20.asp Apr 15 01:23:23 and about repeating all the engineering steps that resulted in working GTA03 samples already Apr 15 01:23:51 roh: nice one ! i'm mildly unhappy that they don't have that one in argentina. only bigger models. the kind that would just go through the floor :-( Apr 15 01:24:18 DocScrutinizer: well, yesterday we already found some mismatched levels :) Apr 15 01:24:48 wpwrak: well if milling then doing 1-off molds is as cheap and easy... sure Apr 15 01:25:13 Raster, any docs, paper, or additional info as of late? :) Apr 15 01:25:27 wpwrak: while talking about implementation details the community has no access to Apr 15 01:25:33 wpwrak: http://code.google.com/p/heekscad/ Apr 15 01:25:43 wpwrak: that's silly Apr 15 01:25:53 raster: yup. looks nice, doesn't it ? Apr 15 01:25:55 Dave: i started... but i need to redo it. i need to make the first page the 30 second elevator pitch Apr 15 01:26:02 wpwrak: damn windows poo! Apr 15 01:26:03 :) Apr 15 01:26:12 ooh wait Apr 15 01:26:18 it can work on linux Apr 15 01:26:18 raster: i just wish he'd fix bug #114 so that i could use it :) http://code.google.com/p/heekscad/issues/detail?id=114 Apr 15 01:27:12 DocScrutinizer: ah well, they get the overall picture. don't try to do everything in one big leap. Apr 15 01:27:36 bah Apr 15 01:27:57 how the hell are u meant to build this sucker? Apr 15 01:28:14 DocScrutinizer: hey, it's quite a *lot* of stuff that needs to be done to turn that stuff into a community project. do you really expect this to happen within a week ? Apr 15 01:28:22 I have a strong feeling like someone's going to leak gta03 schem eventually Apr 15 01:28:41 raster: http://code.google.com/p/heekscad/wiki/CompilingForDebian Apr 15 01:29:01 yup, I expect that to happen before we discuss 1kR issues Apr 15 01:29:02 DocScrutinizer: I think steve is working on that :) Apr 15 01:29:15 how hard can it be? Apr 15 01:29:40 DocScrutinizer: dunno. ask sean :) Apr 15 01:29:40 if he did, he for sure had asked me to prepare pdf Apr 15 01:29:52 raster - alright, alright Apr 15 01:30:20 Dave: i also realised i need another image done Apr 15 01:30:25 to look into NDA issues as I did for gta02 Apr 15 01:30:26 * mwester intrudes with a question -- for the g_ether device, is it correct that both "dev_addr" and "host_addr" are set to the same MAC? Apr 15 01:31:55 wpwrak: instead he's asking to explain to him the problems related to topics that are already been solved Apr 15 01:32:15 wpwrak by the way.. the mill is fine... its the sw part that sucks.. (as usual) ... we currently use mach3 on a dedicated win32 machine.. but i think we really need to do the same as most hobbyists and settle onto linuxcnc (emc2) Apr 15 01:32:36 to me that's cheating, or call it a hoax Apr 15 01:34:02 DocScrutinizer: well, you can ask him and offer your help. Apr 15 01:34:23 roh: yes, you should ;-) Apr 15 01:34:48 wpwrak: I think I did. won't repeat Apr 15 01:34:51 wpwrak will get a bigger machine for that this week.. the laptop is too weak (ram) Apr 15 01:34:55 roh: that's nice about the roland thingies. they speak rml-1, which is just a dialect of hpgl. Apr 15 01:35:13 also needs rtai linux and stuff... its controlled via parallel port which drives pwm controllers Apr 15 01:35:46 mwester: i wouldn't, but some people think it's good enough. not sure if we have any experimental data that strongly favours one side. Apr 15 01:36:03 wpwrak the coolest thing would be to get that reprap-avr code to parse g-code working with it, to use a s a serial gcode to realtime-controlling interface... Apr 15 01:36:22 Ok, because it seems that's what Qi is doing, and I only see one USB MAC addr in the factory partition. Apr 15 01:36:37 roh: (bigger machine) hehe, when i read that sentence, i thought you means a bigger mill ;-)) btw, you also seem to need some rt-kernel extension. Apr 15 01:37:01 roh: (gcode) yup, should be entirely feasible Apr 15 01:37:35 hot Apr 15 01:37:51 mwester: macs are allocated in blocks of three, so you just make one end "mac", the other end "mac+1", and you still have one left for BT Apr 15 01:38:15 DocScrutinizer: it may be a lossy transmission. just retransmit :) Apr 15 01:38:43 roh: (rtai) yup, that's the one. didn't like that bit. Apr 15 01:38:47 wpwrak: I'll research, I guess -- in the meantime, I'm just going to pull off of /proc/cmdline what Qi passed in for g_ether, and pass it on to modprobe. We might as well behave the same way as the in-kernel build. Apr 15 01:39:25 roh: i found a diy-ish mill for about USD 3000 but it would have needed a dedicated controller, just like your syil Apr 15 01:40:04 mwester: yeah, consistency is generally desirable :) Apr 15 01:40:22 ;) and often in too-short supply Apr 15 01:40:31 but life is like that... Apr 15 01:40:49 mwester: ... and endless struggle against entropy ;-) Apr 15 01:40:54 s/and/an/ Apr 15 01:40:54 wpwrak meant: mwester: ... an endless struggle against entropy ;-) Apr 15 01:40:59 hehe! In all things, it seems. Apr 15 01:43:22 raster: if you can find out what caused that darn BadMatch, i'd be eternally grateful :) Apr 15 01:50:42 wpwrak: ... Apr 15 01:50:44 http://members.iinet.net.au/~haste/e17/WFM.png Apr 15 01:52:00 :o Apr 15 01:52:03 raste: @#$*! Apr 15 01:52:53 hehehehe Apr 15 01:52:57 ity does Apr 15 01:53:00 ":works for me" Apr 15 01:53:25 wpwrak: are u runing in 16bpp? Apr 15 01:53:26 or 8bpp? Apr 15 01:54:23 raster: TrueColor, 24 planes Apr 15 01:54:43 what else Apr 15 01:54:44 hmm Apr 15 01:54:45 ok - same Apr 15 01:54:52 i dont use multihead Apr 15 01:54:54 just a single head Apr 15 01:55:01 raster: who has that trademarked?! That's a perfect image for so many uses.. :D Apr 15 01:55:03 it works on screen #0 for you? Apr 15 01:55:05 you say it doesnt Apr 15 01:55:08 but are you sure? Apr 15 01:55:19 mwester: toma did it Apr 15 01:55:22 one head is just enough to care about for me ;-) Apr 15 01:55:27 mwester: as we use it so damn often on #e Apr 15 01:55:33 we made it official Apr 15 01:55:43 i have a xchat command to spew out the url Apr 15 01:55:45 /wfm Apr 15 01:55:46 http://members.iinet.net.au/~haste/e17/WFM.png Apr 15 01:55:49 raster: yup, tried on all screens. nothing works :-( Apr 15 01:55:57 wpwrak: ok Apr 15 01:56:08 well those were my obvious candidates Apr 15 01:57:25 raster: i use mesa for gl. could that cause the problem ? Apr 15 01:57:48 does this use gl? Apr 15 01:58:00 god damn Apr 15 01:58:02 a 17m binary! Apr 15 01:58:18 ooh Apr 15 01:58:20 gdb debugging Apr 15 01:58:22 2.6m Apr 15 01:58:24 better Apr 15 01:58:54 wpwrak: hmm it could be. i have nvidia. maybe its a mesa issue? Apr 15 02:01:01 raster: i'd really hate that ... Apr 15 02:03:35 hm mm Apr 15 02:03:50 then it could be a matter of mis-seleced visuals Apr 15 02:03:58 tho nvidias drivers have normally been much pieckier there Apr 15 02:11:51 raster: seems to come from XCopyArea, called by gdk_x11_draw_drawable ... gdk_window_draw_drawable ... wxDCBase::Blit ... wxPropertyGrid::DrawItems Apr 15 02:13:05 ah .. that's code in HeeksCAD itself. let's see ... Apr 15 02:15:54 now I see it clear: project-B is memdoubler. And GTA03 an even smarter concept Apr 15 02:16:13 ;P Apr 15 02:16:16 night Apr 15 02:18:40 DocScrutinizer: gta03 is memtripler, as the name suggests ") Apr 15 02:19:40 mem * .03 Apr 15 02:20:31 DocScrutinizer: nite! **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Apr 15 02:59:57 2009