**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Feb 06 02:59:56 2010 Feb 06 07:11:39 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r594b4494a1a0 10/fsomusicd/ (5 files in 3 dirs): fsomusicd: ship default configuration Feb 06 07:23:51 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r4c75945401bf 10/fsogsmd/ (9 files in 8 dirs): fsogsmd: add build skeleton for modem_qualcomm_palm plugin Feb 06 09:36:47 root@om-gta02 ~ $ apm Feb 06 09:36:47 -1% - charging Feb 06 09:36:53 I think I broke it :o Feb 06 11:01:20 why the heck doesn't opkg install the package i'm telling it to install? http://pastebin.com/d1abd25f2 Feb 06 11:01:43 i guess it's related to version naming but if someone could enlight me.. Feb 06 11:01:52 (running shr) Feb 06 11:05:41 KaZeR: "flite would not be a valid package name in debian, not sure about SHR Feb 06 11:06:52 that's the thing: i don't want flite & co, i just want the 2949 revision from navit, not the 2934 fro shr Feb 06 11:10:14 KaZeR: shr has newer version, opkg always installs the newer version that is available? Feb 06 11:10:23 (again trying to guess from debian) Feb 06 11:17:54 lindi-, nop, rev 2949 from navit is newer than 2934 from shr Feb 06 11:28:30 KaZeR: nope, "1:0.1.0+svnr2934-r5.4.4" is newer than "svn-2949" when it comes to opkg Feb 06 11:28:45 KaZeR: $ dpkg --compare-versions 1:0.1.0+svnr2934-r5.4.4 gt svn-2949; echo $? Feb 06 11:28:48 0 Feb 06 11:31:44 thanks for the tip! Feb 06 11:33:29 KaZeR: opkg can't read your mind on this one :) Feb 06 11:33:47 sure Feb 06 11:37:58 lindi-, are the version informations also contained within the ipk, or only in the name? Feb 06 11:38:55 KaZeR: in the package of course Feb 06 11:39:15 ok Feb 06 11:39:24 thanks Feb 06 12:19:04 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07fso-term * rf8aadb64652d 10/ (configure.ac src/reader.vala vapi/readline.vapi): use upstream readline.vapi; requires vala 0.7.10 Feb 06 12:19:26 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rc85c1f86ca03 10/tools/mdbus2/ (configure.ac src/Makefile.am src/main.vala): mdbus2: prepare for interactive mode Feb 06 12:19:27 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r5c30629b5e48 10/ (3 files in 3 dirs): fsogsmd: cosmetics Feb 06 12:23:04 mickey|fosdem, http://cgit.openembedded.org/cgit.cgi/openembedded/commit/?id=571ca73733dddc5e18e27c6a51483637ca5e6b54 Feb 06 12:24:11 hi Feb 06 12:24:21 is anyone using SHR on the htc dream? Feb 06 12:26:44 graziano, ask leviathan Feb 06 12:27:09 eh I am pinging him on #htc-linux since weeks Feb 06 12:27:13 he never answers Feb 06 12:27:37 I hoped someone else here tried it too Feb 06 12:27:56 just to know, apart from the freerunner, where are you using SHR? Feb 06 12:28:09 dcordes-fosdem: http://blog.freenode.net/2010/01/migration-to-new-ircd/ Feb 06 12:28:18 dcordes-fosdem: see i.e. the new /mode command Feb 06 12:28:32 graziano: some of us are working on that, yes Feb 06 12:28:36 oh mickey|fosdem you are @fosdem too, gnutoo is there too Feb 06 12:28:42 mickey|fosdem, ok thanks a lot Feb 06 12:28:55 graziano: yah, looking for him Feb 06 12:28:59 graziano: we're in the AW hacker room Feb 06 12:29:12 wow wonderful :) Feb 06 12:29:34 mickey|fosdem, do you have you adp with SHR with you? Feb 06 12:29:40 he came into #lp-italia before Feb 06 12:30:03 playya_: no, never booted into anything UI Feb 06 12:30:07 playya_: still busy with console mode Feb 06 12:30:13 hmm. ok Feb 06 12:30:47 maybe greg wants to see it and help use porting SHR/FSO to new devices Feb 06 12:33:52 playya_, afaik gnutoo told me leviathan in #htc-linux compiled an image and flashed its dream with that Feb 06 12:34:00 yes Feb 06 12:34:05 i saw it in berlin Feb 06 12:34:19 I was able to boot into gui with shr on the dream with the help of gnutoo Feb 06 12:34:28 but it was really buggy Feb 06 12:34:36 *bugged Feb 06 12:35:12 anyway last time I talked to gnutoo he told me leviathan made many progresses Feb 06 12:35:36 I just wasn't able to talk to him so I did not understand what functions and what doesn't in his image Feb 06 12:35:45 and I *really* would like to know :) Feb 06 12:36:32 i met him in berlin and killed his device ;) Feb 06 12:36:39 do not use illume2 ;) Feb 06 12:37:12 :) Feb 06 12:38:05 once I will be able to use shr daily on my dream I would like to contribute some ideas to UI design and so on Feb 06 12:38:12 awesome Feb 06 12:38:20 there's a lot that can be done UI-wise Feb 06 12:38:25 you can even cook your own Feb 06 12:39:00 unfortunately I am not a developer so I need someone's help to flash a quite stable shr image on my dream Feb 06 12:39:56 anyway I looked at many recent mobile devices and their UI: android, iphone os x mobile, Feb 06 12:40:13 I would like to compare them to shr to see how we can benefit from their work in terms of UI Feb 06 12:40:28 freesmartphone.org: 03morphis 07cornucopia * r908fa1ab6640 10/tools/serial_forward/src/ (forward.c hsuart.h): serial_forward: add hsuart specific support and make it available through cmd argument Feb 06 12:40:55 don't forget webos Feb 06 12:41:00 this UI rocks IMO Feb 06 12:41:04 much more than android Feb 06 12:41:09 mickey|fosdem: where are you? Feb 06 12:41:18 AW115 Feb 06 12:41:22 (hacker room) Feb 06 12:41:22 ok Feb 06 12:41:28 I'm coming Feb 06 12:41:30 :) Feb 06 12:41:31 oki Feb 06 12:41:36 dcordes-fosdem and cr2 are here as well Feb 06 12:41:55 leviathan, YOU Feb 06 12:41:56 :) Feb 06 12:41:58 bring a coffee... Feb 06 12:42:03 * mickey|fosdem in desperate need of caffeine Feb 06 12:42:14 leviathan, looking forward Feb 06 12:42:21 mickey|fosdem, oh I never had a chance to test a web os device Feb 06 12:42:28 I only saw some screenshots Feb 06 12:42:40 iirc you can download an emulator Feb 06 12:44:11 * PaulFertser is green with envy Feb 06 12:44:27 In fact no, i'm really glad you're having fun there folks. Feb 06 12:44:34 :) Feb 06 12:47:42 mickey|fosdem: can you please lift your finger? Feb 06 12:47:46 ^_^" Feb 06 12:47:54 now? Feb 06 12:47:58 :D Feb 06 12:48:03 yes Feb 06 12:48:14 did that Feb 06 12:48:25 hacker room? Feb 06 12:48:27 ahahah Feb 06 12:48:28 AW115 Feb 06 12:48:33 how many people is there?? Feb 06 12:48:41 in the hacker room? Feb 06 12:48:50 15 Feb 06 12:48:51 AW115 is the building where the OE booth is also Feb 06 12:49:00 not the main building Feb 06 12:49:05 across the street Feb 06 12:49:14 it's in the historic university building. very striking Feb 06 12:49:22 oh, ok Feb 06 12:49:33 that's why i asked for coffee Feb 06 12:49:37 no stand here to get beverages Feb 06 12:49:50 an hacker cage :D Feb 06 12:52:32 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rd6082d0c4e29 10/tools/serial_forward/ (configure.ac src/Makefile.am): serial_forward: link statically Feb 06 12:54:07 mickey|fosdem: now again please ^_^ Feb 06 12:54:21 moin Feb 06 12:55:41 DocScrutinizer: moin Feb 06 12:56:38 he didn't bring coffee :/ Feb 06 12:57:38 ahahaha Feb 06 12:59:15 hacker meeting without even coffee. incredible Feb 06 12:59:43 eheh Feb 06 12:59:53 I just had an italian one Feb 06 13:00:01 * DocScrutinizer51 enjoys his first caffee latte Feb 06 13:00:12 of the day Feb 06 13:04:15 there is coffee. but it can't be reached w/o moving out the hacking room Feb 06 13:11:59 out there's evil fresh air? Feb 06 13:12:38 There no evil so great that it cannot be faced in the pursuit of coffee. Especially good coffee. Feb 06 13:20:45 was it W.Ambros to say "we hang around in the cafes so we don't have to cpe with the evil fresh air outside"? At least the one saying this knew *where* to hang around :-) Feb 06 13:41:09 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * rf9842d23202d 10/tools/serial_forward/src/forward.c: serial_forward: fix argument parsing Feb 06 13:51:20 ~ping Feb 06 13:51:21 ~pong Feb 06 14:17:27 ynezz, PaulFertser: can you test/check this UBI params? http://jama.homelinux.org/org.openembedded.shr.images/0001-om-gta01.conf-update-ubi-params.patch Feb 06 14:18:20 ynezz, PaulFertser: from that pastebin it should be updated like this (not sure about -c --max-leb-cnt=COUNT maximum logical erase block count) Feb 06 14:18:46 JaMa|Gone: oh, i forget all that stuff every time shortly after discussing... Guess somebody should just check if it works. Feb 06 14:19:51 Sorry :( Feb 06 14:20:03 PaulFertser: I don't have gta01 for test.. Feb 06 14:20:11 ynezz: can you please test? :) Feb 06 14:20:30 Neither me. But i'm sure the mtd parameters for it are not the same as on gta02. Feb 06 14:20:48 I have gta01 for test in fact, but testing that is a bit complicated. Feb 06 14:21:07 PaulFertser: yes.. that patch is changing it from gta02 values to coresponding to what ynezz sent in http://pastebin.ca/1787257 Feb 06 14:21:44 JaMa|Gone: cool Feb 06 14:21:57 PaulFertser: if you can ubiformat it with those params and then mount empty volume.. I think is worth commiting to oe.dev and I would rebuild gta01 ubinized image for final test Feb 06 14:25:34 then we should enable lzma compressed ubi images and hopefully make it small enough for that 64M flash.. Feb 06 14:26:07 now ubi images are bigger than jffs2 so I guess that lzma enabled in kernel and we have to supply mkfs.ubifs with compression param Feb 06 14:26:30 default is "lzo" Feb 06 14:28:25 ubifs support lzo and gzip, never head about lzma support Feb 06 14:28:56 and with lzma writes can become really slow Feb 06 14:30:58 JaMa|Gone, can you try squashfs rootfs for testing purpose? Feb 06 14:33:40 max_posedon1: ah you're right.. I've seen lzma support for kernel image and recalled wrong that I've seen the same option for ubi too Feb 06 14:33:54 max_posedon1: but zlib is said to be slower but with better compression Feb 06 14:34:17 given the overall system speed of the FreeRunner I recommend disabling compressed flash fs altogether Feb 06 14:34:59 max_posedon1: I'm not interested in squashfs.. so I would let that test for someone else.. Feb 06 14:35:26 max_posedon1: actually I was interested in ubifs just because I wanted to fix params in gta* configs in oe.dev :) Feb 06 14:35:56 ok.. i ll do it myself when be at home Feb 06 14:36:23 max_posedon1: because first it was failing to build ubi images without it and then I pushed some default, which I wanted to confirm and then run to that problem with BGT thread.. you then solved with disable Feb 06 14:37:22 mickey|fosdem, writes and reads so slow, that compression can improve it Feb 06 14:37:43 and I have few spare uSDs so why bother using nand :) Feb 06 14:37:51 mainly reads Feb 06 14:38:02 max_posedon1: hmm, given the slow CPU on the freeRunner, i think you will spend more time decompressing the data than reading it Feb 06 14:40:05 I've read similar article describing that compressed reiser4 will be faster on average desktop cpu but on neo I agree with mickey that it's not win Feb 06 14:40:52 it should be tested, but I don't think so Feb 06 14:43:58 well even if it would be a bit faster on neo without load, then maybe not worth slowing cpu when doing something a bit cpu intensive (maybe running navit..) Feb 06 14:44:16 but test would be nice Feb 06 14:45:16 gzip compression - 1Mb/s Feb 06 14:45:47 decompression - 5Mb/s (in terms of uncompressed size) Feb 06 14:47:26 gzip -1 compress 1mb/s'; decompress 6Mb/s Feb 06 14:47:39 nice for heavy gzip Feb 06 14:47:59 do we have lzo command ? Feb 06 14:48:45 I exept 3x results which will prove that neo fast eniugh for it Feb 06 14:51:09 (all tests done eith 15mb data copied to tmpfs) Feb 06 14:51:24 *with* Feb 06 14:56:03 JaMa|Gone, squashfs is nice, its next step for me - split ubi in 2 partions and use unionfs Feb 06 14:56:04 i Feb 06 14:57:19 if all boot required files can be read with one sequrnce read, it will gain boot improvment and app start Feb 06 14:57:25 JaMa|Gone: so I should just ubiformat with values from your patch, ok? Feb 06 15:10:13 ynezz: yup Feb 06 15:11:42 JaMa|Gone: but it's not possible :) Feb 06 15:12:18 is it safe to upgrade SHR-u...? Feb 06 15:12:46 ThibG: as always :) Feb 06 15:12:54 ynezz: why not? Feb 06 15:13:02 as always /o\ Feb 06 15:13:19 well, I'll try Feb 06 15:13:27 ThibG: but last 2 main issues were resolved Feb 06 15:13:36 ThibG: and I don't know about any show stopper Feb 06 15:13:41 ok :) Feb 06 15:13:58 JaMa|Gone: root@om-gta01 ~ $ ubiformat /dev/mtd4 -m 512 -p 16KiB -s 512 -O 512 Feb 06 15:14:02 ubiformat: invalid option -- 'm' Feb 06 15:14:27 can you give me valid commandline you want to test Feb 06 15:19:06 ynezz: for ubiformat is -m and -p probably autodetected... but -s and -O are still interesting.. Feb 06 15:20:39 ynezz: and then -O for ubiattach Feb 06 15:24:47 ;f Feb 06 15:25:20 JaMa|Gone: any idea how to investigate why my gsm went off after using gprs Feb 06 15:25:32 it happend yesterday afer reboot ;/ Feb 06 15:27:43 soltys: went off? Feb 06 15:28:19 lindi-: after reboot it not connects to gsm Feb 06 15:28:27 or eaven toruns on ;) Feb 06 15:28:39 according to shr-settings Feb 06 15:28:50 and slider don't want to move ;) Feb 06 15:29:06 soltys: does it consume energy? Feb 06 15:29:25 lindi-: how to check that ? Feb 06 15:29:35 brb Feb 06 15:29:44 lindi-: :-D Feb 06 15:33:46 JaMa|Gone: http://pastebin.ca/1788080 Feb 06 15:33:56 greetings from FSODEM Feb 06 15:33:58 FOSDEM Feb 06 15:34:17 soltys: i don't know if SHR provides a command for checking that Feb 06 15:34:37 does some SHR dev know? Feb 06 15:43:57 Deubeuliou: you did it again ;-D Feb 06 15:45:08 lindi-: a command for what? the winning numbers of next week's lotery? Feb 06 15:45:59 DocScrutinizer: for getting current energy consumption of the battery Feb 06 15:46:24 bq27k-detail is distro independant Feb 06 15:46:54 so is omhacks :) Feb 06 15:47:00 though on SHR you get all the data you need from settings-power Feb 06 15:47:41 DocScrutinizer: some gui thing? Feb 06 15:48:13 lindi-: still I don't see how the knowledge about calypso consuming power or not will help you whatsoever to solve soltys' problem Feb 06 15:48:36 DocScrutinizer: well you aren't debugging this problem :) Feb 06 15:48:55 uhu Feb 06 15:48:57 got event MSMCOMM_EVENT_CALL_INCOMMING Feb 06 15:48:58 got event MSMCOMM_EVENT_CALL_END Feb 06 15:49:01 * mickey|fosdem dances a jig Feb 06 15:49:07 ~praise morphis Feb 06 15:49:09 All hail morphis! Feb 06 15:51:06 lindi-: get another glass of that stuff of yesterday eve. Should help reportedly Feb 06 15:51:29 * DocScrutinizer pissed Feb 06 16:26:29 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07cornucopia * r92b05a9ed452 10/fsomusicd/ (configure.ac src/Makefile.am): fsomusicd: fix compilation Feb 06 17:09:37 Hi. I'm having trouble using dbus in vala to talk with fso. Feb 06 17:09:59 The code ( http://pastebin.com/d448e50c8 ) gives an "org.freesmartphone.ousaged was not provided" error Feb 06 17:10:13 Does anyone know what the error could be? Feb 06 17:10:22 hi there Feb 06 17:10:31 hi serdar Feb 06 17:10:32 mickey|zzZZzz, Heinervdm Deubeuliou ping? Feb 06 17:11:13 hi blu Feb 06 17:11:17 BluesLee, Feb 06 17:21:11 I can successfully talk with Navit over d-bus, so can't understand why not org.freesmartphone.ousaged Feb 06 17:30:41 hi Feb 06 17:30:56 Heinervdm, Deubeuliou mickey|zzZZzz ping? Feb 06 17:43:00 Serdar: pong Feb 06 17:43:33 oh one is ponging. Feb 06 17:43:38 Heinervdm, are you here? Feb 06 17:43:52 i'm now back from launch Feb 06 17:44:03 Serdar: no Feb 06 17:44:11 will arraive tomorrow Feb 06 17:44:14 oh Feb 06 17:44:23 will you make it in time? Feb 06 17:44:49 I tried today and instead of 8 it was 12. Feb 06 17:44:50 i try to arrive at 9 o' clock Feb 06 17:45:00 why? Feb 06 17:45:16 ebbe: fso runs on system bus Feb 06 17:45:17 I got lost Feb 06 17:45:21 3 times :) Feb 06 17:45:23 ebbe: not session bus Feb 06 17:45:35 Serdar: i have a printed map and a navi Feb 06 17:45:46 I only have the first one :) Feb 06 17:45:51 :) Feb 06 17:46:04 but for me it looks very easy Feb 06 17:46:12 from? Feb 06 17:46:16 i will come from A3 Feb 06 17:46:16 paris right? Feb 06 17:46:23 Serdar: no germany Feb 06 17:46:34 then it was Deubeuliou who comes from paris Feb 06 17:46:41 that would be simple I guess. Feb 06 17:46:46 Bonn? Feb 06 17:47:15 1 hour away from bonn Feb 06 17:47:25 me too. Feb 06 17:47:39 im 1 hour south Feb 06 17:48:13 Duesseldorf: A59->A46->A57->A52->A73 wrong direction ->A2->... Feb 06 17:48:41 Koblenz: A61 -> A4 -> A44 -> begium Feb 06 17:48:58 you want a l? Feb 06 17:49:20 yes :) Feb 06 17:50:16 Serdar: but mickey|zzZZzz is there at fosdem Feb 06 17:50:36 but where? Do you have some mickeytracking? Feb 06 17:50:54 No, he left IRC one hour ago Feb 06 17:51:19 I wanted to gather all one who will talk tomorrow, but it is not that easy Feb 06 17:51:49 I hope i will arrive at 8:30 Feb 06 17:52:11 I hope someone will have a good microphone, because I don't have one... Feb 06 17:52:23 wanted to buy one yesterday, but 99 EUR is bit much for me :/ Feb 06 17:52:38 i only have very cheap one Feb 06 17:52:58 2€ or so i guess Feb 06 17:53:11 I have also a cheap one, but this does not work for my macbook, because it does not have a audio input. Feb 06 17:53:15 only output Feb 06 17:53:20 bluetooth would work Feb 06 17:53:27 Heinervdm, distutils scripts are now in evopedia sources ;) Feb 06 17:53:47 pespin: great will have a look tomorrow or the day after Feb 06 17:54:02 ok, thanks ;) Feb 06 17:54:04 I was thinking that all of the speaker are useing my macbook for presentation so we don't need to try if it works with other notebooks etc. Feb 06 17:54:16 we can also use my wii remote :) Feb 06 17:54:36 we will see tomorrow Feb 06 17:55:09 i'm having a bluetooth headset, but i don't know if it's so good Feb 06 17:55:59 it's a logitech HS02-V07 Feb 06 17:57:01 hmm Feb 06 17:57:17 we can try, tomorrow Feb 06 17:57:31 then I need a program to record voice. Feb 06 17:58:11 will there be online streaming? for those at home?¿ :P Feb 06 17:58:27 or we can try to record the voice with my archos a404 Feb 06 18:02:43 if we can get a clear voice recording it's okay Feb 06 18:03:00 lets see tomorrow, never tried that Feb 06 18:03:18 we got a camera but it's an old one with cassettes but we can only record only one hour... Feb 06 18:08:19 Heinervdm, you can try to use gstreamer for it: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/GStreamer#Doing_live_streaming_video_from_an_xo Feb 06 18:10:14 and Deubeuliou is there, too Feb 06 18:10:33 he made streams availble on FSOSHRUDCON Feb 06 18:11:42 the least thing we can do is to record the voice and snycronize it with the slides. Feb 06 18:21:25 Heinervdm: any bt headset should be good enough to record a talk Feb 06 18:21:45 any? Feb 06 18:21:50 also some for 15 EUR? Feb 06 18:22:12 i just flashed current shr-testing after not updating for a few months; it is very fast, and feels good, nice work Feb 06 18:22:19 if it's good enough for phoencalls, it's good enough for recording as well Feb 06 18:22:34 hi Feb 06 18:22:58 ynezz: please also ubimkvol and then mount, thanks Feb 06 18:24:04 ynezz: sofar it looks sane.. Feb 06 18:24:16 of course the speaker has to wear it the way it's supposed to ;-P Feb 06 18:31:14 JaMa|Gone: http://pastebin.ca/1788229 Feb 06 18:40:11 ynezz: thanks, building now Feb 06 18:42:56 you're building image smaller than 56MB ? Feb 06 19:18:21 hmmm... Feb 06 19:18:28 * Weiss worries about UBIFS Feb 06 19:19:14 I've managed to hose it three times in about as many hours Feb 06 19:40:38 hi everone Feb 06 19:41:00 does some one know where gsmhandset.state is now. no /usr/share/openmko dir... Feb 06 19:41:39 Weiss: that's the gods telling you that bare NAND is evil :) Feb 06 19:43:49 wpwrak: is proprietary firmware in eMMC chips that some folks borked in theirs SmartQ's good then? Feb 06 19:45:39 PaulFertser: a survey finding out which firmware is safe and which isn't would be Feb 06 19:46:33 wpwrak: i'm not sure that's good. While you can often update the kernel it's not possible to update mask roms. Feb 06 19:46:39 And every software has bugs. Feb 06 19:46:44 PaulFertser: a continuously maintained set of test cases to compare the performance of said firmware against references such as jffs2 and ubifs would be even better Feb 06 19:47:08 PaulFertser: you can't fix the cards but you can refuse to buy from vendors that make bad ones Feb 06 19:47:30 wpwrak: if it's not soldered on the board. Feb 06 19:47:54 PaulFertser: if it's soldered to the board, you're likely back to bare NAND anyway, with all its problems Feb 06 19:48:38 wpwrak: smartq has eMMC chips Feb 06 19:49:48 PaulFertser: one could consider this a poor choice of direction Feb 06 19:51:09 PaulFertser: it makes sense to put black boxes on the board if you're certain that they're superior to anything you could do within the part of the device's lifespan relevant to sales Feb 06 19:51:13 wpwrak: you want to outsource some work to the vendors and then blame them for faults ;) Feb 06 19:51:36 PaulFertser: no, i want the option to upgrade :) Feb 06 19:51:51 PaulFertser: but yes, i also want to blame the bad ones :) Feb 06 19:51:52 wpwrak: but what's wrong with bare nand, anyway? Feb 06 19:52:38 PaulFertser: its poorly managed complexity Feb 06 19:53:27 PaulFertser: you don't get nice abstraction boundaries. instead, you're confronted with the peculiarities of bare nand at all levels Feb 06 19:53:45 well, almost all Feb 06 19:54:11 wpwrak: that's the price to have an efficient storage i guess. Feb 06 19:54:38 PaulFertser: properly working uSD seems to be pretty efficient as well Feb 06 19:54:54 One can write a driver to emulate a regular block device and to it the way SD vendors do. Feb 06 19:56:05 wpwrak: from the description i read it seems like it shouldn't be that hard, a simple wear-levelling layer and you get your usual block device on top. Feb 06 19:56:14 PaulFertser: also, with on-board NAND, you're limited to the state of the art (particularly in terms of storage density and cost) of the time of design, while removable media lets you make a first choice later in the development process, and the choice can be revised any number of times later, at considerably lower cost than with on-board NAND Feb 06 19:57:20 wpwrak: that is indeed an argument applicable to wide-purpose portable devices, i fully agree. Feb 06 19:59:05 PaulFertser: you then get problems like your CPU being unable to boot from bare NAND. so you need a boot loader implementing the algorithm. this in turn means that your either need to upgrade your boot loader when your algorithm changes or you need partitions. if you need to be able to upgrade your bootloader, unbrickability becomes more difficult. and so on. the complexity spreads. Feb 06 20:00:57 PaulFertser: yes, i'm talking about things like the GTA02. if you're building black boxes you're shooting into space or dropping into deep-sea trenches, the situation changes :) Feb 06 20:04:20 wpwrak: i guess for devices that are not supposed to be really upgraded in the field it's cheaper to place a NAND chip than to add another SD socket and deal with mechanical contacts, card compatibility and the like. Another option is eMMC. Feb 06 20:04:57 SHR: 03tom 07libphone-ui-shr * r36c0c3ca6e3a 10/ (TODO src/util/ui-utils.c): Temporarily removed the call to the destroy function form deinit and wrote in the TODO the real needed solution Feb 06 20:05:59 PaulFertser: bare NAND is cheap, i agree. it also depends on how specific the use of the device is supposed to be. if you don't share control of what the device does with others, things get simpler. Feb 06 20:07:49 PaulFertser: in any case, if you can't or don't want to upgrade your storage, you have to evaluate the options you have early during development. if you have only broken eMMC and a passably manageable but reliable (possibly with some effort) UBIFS, JFFS2, etc., then the latter is the best choice Feb 06 20:08:13 :D Feb 06 20:08:21 PaulFertser: or you may just plan in not having reliable storage and deal with occasional loss Feb 06 20:09:27 wpwrak: and tweaking sd_drive and shielding from GSM etc etc :) Feb 06 20:09:27 PaulFertser: but for a design that tries to be open at many levels, all this sounds like bad news Feb 06 20:09:50 wpwrak: fully agree Feb 06 20:10:08 PaulFertser: (tweaking) well, there's only so much engineering you can do through a peephole :) Feb 06 20:13:41 shr-u: any idea how I can help debug non-registering gsm. this happens on unstable since upgrade 2 or 3 days ago. shr-t works fine... Feb 06 20:14:40 TAsn: any news on "Cell phone" prob? Feb 06 20:14:54 Q-Master, the db you gave me? Feb 06 20:15:01 I haven't had the time, I told you it might happen :| Feb 06 20:16:06 TAsn: pity. 8( Feb 06 20:16:21 I know :( Feb 06 20:16:30 TAsn: when then? 8) Feb 06 20:16:42 no idea Feb 06 20:16:59 heh Feb 06 20:17:41 freaking toys fair Feb 06 20:20:52 DocScrutinizer51: is it nasty? Feb 06 20:21:34 yesterday had no diinner as all the restaurants in vicinity were overbooked Feb 06 20:22:19 DocScrutinizer: learn to harness the power of microwaveable supermarket food ? :) Feb 06 20:22:22 Your city is too popular ;) Feb 06 20:22:52 And really cool, i liked it in fact. Feb 06 20:24:59 One can buy some potatoes, wrap in foil, microwave, add some souce, nice meal ready. Feb 06 20:25:13 s/souce/sauce/ Feb 06 20:25:13 PaulFertser meant: One can buy some potatoes, wrap in foil, microwave, add some sauce, nice meal ready. Feb 06 20:25:52 Or just boil some rice until its ready. ;) Feb 06 20:37:51 ~ping Feb 06 20:37:52 ~pong Feb 06 20:38:06 DocScrutinizer: /ping ? Feb 06 20:39:25 hmm Feb 06 20:40:38 not really an alternative as it echoes to freenode server subwin Feb 06 20:41:21 DocScrutinizer: how does it matter where it shows up ? Feb 06 20:42:45 DocScrutinizer: alternatively, /msg apt ping would work too, if you prefer a different window/tab/etc. :) Feb 06 20:43:02 it matters as I,m a lazy lad, and also it's highly unconvenient to scroll the chanlist on xchat Feb 06 20:43:43 wpwrak: looks like he missed our great food recipies ;) Feb 06 20:44:08 PaulFertser: famished DocScrutinizer probably passed out for a moment Feb 06 20:45:05 23:22 < wpwrak> DocScrutinizer: learn to harness the power of microwaveable supermarket food ? :) Feb 06 20:45:14 23:25 < apt> PaulFertser meant: One can buy some potatoes, wrap in foil, microwave, add some sauce, nice meal ready. Feb 06 20:45:17 23:25 < PaulFertser> Or just boil some rice until its ready. ;) Feb 06 20:46:03 heh Feb 06 20:52:08 is it just for me that shr-u refuses to register with gsm network? Feb 06 20:52:22 SHR: 03tom 07libphone-ui-shr * r241f7d577013 10/ (TODO src/util/ui-utils.c src/view/contact-view.c): destroy function now is only called when really destroying and not on delete request as before Feb 06 20:52:23 SHR: 03tom 07libphone-ui-shr * r379ac9b2c993 10/src/view/ (dialer-view.c idle-view.c quick-settings-view.c): Changed all the screens to support the change in destroy_cb behavior Feb 06 21:07:32 GarthPS: /etc/freesmartphone/alsa/default Feb 06 21:07:58 topro: I had the same problem but downgrade libfsotransport a bit 2 days ago solved that issue for me Feb 06 21:08:27 topro: and the downgrade would be upgrade from your POV.. and installed automatically by opkg upgrade Feb 06 21:08:59 JaMa|Gone: and the downgrade would be upgrade from your POV <-- now I am confused! Feb 06 21:09:30 is there something more recent than shr-u? Feb 06 21:11:37 no Feb 06 21:11:45 list_installed gives me libfsotransport0 - 1:0.9.4+gitr803+0c1e8c057b4110b1d8d2c24fd93744c03c304cc8-r2.0.4 Feb 06 21:13:26 Jama: it is not that /usr/share/shr/scenarii/ ??? Feb 06 21:20:02 GarthPS: I'm not sure what is/was in /usr/share/shr/scenarii, but AFAIK fso now reads /etc/freesmartphone/alsa/ directory Feb 06 21:20:57 ok thanks and that makes more sense Feb 06 21:20:59 topro: that's because I downgraded it in oe.dev and because of how SRCPV works it would be upgrade for you (higher version of resulting ipk file) Feb 06 21:22:27 scenarii was a duplicate of scenarios Feb 06 21:22:42 JaMa|Gone: ok, can you tell when it will be in shr-u repository then? Feb 06 21:22:47 and a really useless invention Feb 06 21:23:00 topro: it's for about 2 days Feb 06 21:23:19 mmt I'll give you right revision Feb 06 21:23:47 http://cgit.openembedded.org/cgit.cgi/openembedded/commit/?id=49742ce6ddca78ad8bc05dfd722c4ba2e017fadb Feb 06 21:23:50 opkg update/upgrade didn't solve the problem for me, though. as posted before I have libfsotransport0 - 1:0.9.4+gitr803+0c1e8c057b4110b1d8d2c24fd93744c03c304cc8-r2.0.4 installed Feb 06 21:24:02