**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun May 23 02:59:57 2010 May 23 05:48:09 JaMa|GoNe: yep May 23 07:07:13 mrmoku|away: you're using linux-openmoko-devel_git.bb? imho it should be linux-openmoko-shr-devel_git.bb and I think prepends are not overwritten but each one gets prepended (so it should be already fixed in that prepend we got from linux.inc) May 23 07:07:40 JaMa|GoNe: seems that navit shows some crap instead of a map. 8( May 23 08:04:37 JaMa|GoNe: ohh... me got confused by all those kernel recipes :P May 23 08:05:18 and even more confused... very confused May 23 08:05:35 JaMa|GoNe: did not realize that is already _prepend May 23 08:06:55 JaMa|GoNe: and to be honest it still does not make a lot of sense to me May 23 08:08:15 mrmoku: Just got the grip on the locale problem from yesterday. Thanks. May 23 08:08:32 Almost there the do_rootfs is in progress. May 23 08:11:25 shazkhan: good :) May 23 08:13:23 mrmoku: Next I want to change the kernel to 2.6.32 and manage it's configuration and then add some libs and utilities. Hope it's easier than locales ;p May 23 08:17:40 shazkhan: open openembedded/conf/machine/om-gta02.conf May 23 08:17:41 ~nf May 23 08:17:42 The #openmoko-cdevel Newsflash Bulletin Board. (continued at ~NF2. For help see ~NF-help) - - - Recommended URLs and channels(chanlogs etc):see ~RL - - - NEWSFLASH [2010-03-28 21:09 UTC]:buildhost got rebooted... new RAM will arrive beginning of next week May 23 08:17:55 shazkhan: in there you will find some PREFERRED_PROVIDER_virtual/kernel_shr May 23 08:33:55 mrmoku: on it .. May 23 08:35:22 shaz123: btw. there is 2.6.34 already too... has at least problems with suspend/resume though May 23 08:36:36 as you say ... I am not interested in suspend/resume .. more in functionality and less in performance. Experimentation is my game .. May 23 08:36:44 :) May 23 08:37:13 then use linux-openmoko-2.6.34_git.bb May 23 08:37:24 right. May 23 09:10:28 mrmoku: PREFERRED_PROVIDER_virtual/kernel_shr = "linux-openmoko-shr-devel" should be = linux-openmoko-2.6.34 ? May 23 09:11:46 shazkhan: yep May 23 09:12:13 and where do I get the linux-openmoko-2.6.34_git.bb? May 23 09:14:32 mrmoku: linux-openmoko-2.6.32_git.bb is available in OE recipies ... do I need to update my OE or do I copy and reuse linux-openmoko-2.6.32_git.bb? May 23 09:18:53 copy and reuse will not work because I just read the internals of it and they are very version dependent due to patches mentioned May 23 09:23:27 shazkhan: you should update oe. May 23 09:23:35 shazkhan: just do a git pull May 23 09:23:49 shazkhan: beware though: updating oe might introduce new build issues... May 23 09:24:58 Kensan: so I should save an archive before I do git pull? May 23 09:25:47 shazkhan: no, that's not necessary. Since git has the complete history you can revert to a known good version anytime. May 23 09:26:07 shazkhan: but maybe you could write down the current revision so you know how to get back to that May 23 09:26:26 hmmm ... forgetting the git commands ... let me see ... May 23 09:26:30 shazkhan: or simply create a branch like so: git checkout -b know-good May 23 09:26:41 thanx May 23 09:26:59 shazkhan: then to update git checkout org.openembedded.dev May 23 09:27:04 shazkhan: git pull May 23 09:27:20 shazkhan: if something doesn't work and you want to go back just switch to your branch May 23 09:27:25 shazkhan: git checkout known-good May 23 09:31:23 Kensan: Why checkout oe (shazkhan: then to update git checkout org.openembedded.dev) when I have it already .... and there are 2 OEs ... one in shr-unstable and another in ../shr-unstable. I bet the one in shr-ustable is the one we are interested in. Wont git pull be enough? May 23 09:32:56 shazkhan: actually three (or even four) OEs... one main one... and one for shr-unstable, shr-testing and shr-stable respectively May 23 09:33:05 they share git objects May 23 09:33:09 shazkhan: git pull fetches the changes from origin and apply's updates on to the branch you currently have checked out May 23 09:33:41 shazkhan: you can specify which branch you want to update by May 23 09:33:46 okies May 23 09:34:19 git pull origin your-local-branch-to-update May 23 09:34:47 shazkhan: git checkout simply switches between branches May 23 09:34:59 shazkhan: git checkout -b some-branch-name May 23 09:35:01 got it ... the local brach is org.openembedded.dev May 23 09:35:31 shazkhan: creates a copy of the currenty branch and calls it "some-branch-name" and automatically switches to this new branch. May 23 09:36:59 i started building shr-u from scratch May 23 09:37:03 qemu_0.12.4 fails to build May 23 09:37:08 how do i disable it? May 23 09:37:30 (one of the same old questions i guess) May 23 09:37:43 md2k7: what is the error you get? May 23 09:37:58 Kensan: Thanks ... it worked .. now I have 2.6.34.bb! May 23 09:38:04 shazkhan: good :) May 23 09:38:49 qemu-native-0.12.4-r0 logfile has a lot of stuff May 23 09:38:55 mrmoku: have you built cornucopia with revision 38d52c1...? May 23 09:39:01 problems start with warnings like stdio.h: No such file or directory May 23 09:39:22 first error is May 23 09:39:24 targphys.h:14: error: expected '=', ',', ';', 'asm' or '__attribute__' before 'target_phys_addr_t' May 23 09:39:37 md2k7: then it's missing some libraries... May 23 09:39:42 ah, that might be the GCC version?! May 23 09:39:53 shouldn't bitbake handle fetching everything needed? May 23 09:40:14 md2k7: yes it should but there might be an mistake in one of the recipes. May 23 09:40:30 md2k7: how current is your oe repos? May 23 09:40:49 Kensan: as stated, just checked out May 23 09:40:59 started from scratch with SHR Makefile May 23 09:41:49 i can remember some GCC version problem with qemu, but it was a long time ago May 23 09:41:54 md2k7: hm ok... well I know there's an issue with tcltk which overwrites header files with it's own. May 23 09:42:11 md2k7: maybe there's something on the oe.devel ml. May 23 09:42:30 i'll google a bit May 23 09:44:00 md2k7: hm ok the tcltk issue has been fixed in 104b91c... May 23 09:45:20 md2k7: that commit is just 104 minutes old though... May 23 09:45:34 md2k7: but might not be related to your issue at all May 23 09:46:54 i'll try installing gcc 3.4 May 23 09:47:06 but meanwhile do you know a way to disable building qemu? May 23 09:51:01 I just found ASSUME_PROVIDED += "qemu-native" in somebody's local.conf May 23 09:51:12 * md2k7 hopes that will work May 23 09:51:45 md2k7: well, somewhere qemu gets pulled in as dependency. You would need to find that dependency chain and break it at some place. May 23 09:52:20 mhm... seems like a lot of work May 23 09:53:09 md2k7: are you building shr-u for x86 or for your phone? May 23 09:53:26 md2k7: I think building for your host plls in qemu... May 23 09:53:41 pulls May 23 09:54:24 i just made 'make image' May 23 09:54:35 in the hope that it would defaultly build for gta02 May 23 09:54:49 md2k7: check your local.conf May 23 09:55:15 md2k7: I d'guess it's building for your host and thus building qemu May 23 09:55:31 md2k7: but I might be wrong. I haven't built shr in ages... May 23 09:55:42 shr-unstable/local.conf? pretty empty May 23 09:55:47 except for parallel build options etc May 23 09:56:17 hm seems I am wrong May 23 09:56:31 the wiki says by default its building for gta02 May 23 09:58:47 md2k7: can you check shr-unstable/conf/auto.conf? May 23 09:58:52 just to be sure May 23 10:06:16 Kensan: yep May 23 10:07:50 Kensan: MACHINE = "om-gta02" May 23 10:14:09 mrmoku: the build seems to fail for me with current HEAD. May 23 10:14:13 mrmoku: errors like "The name `isDaemonRunning' does not exist in the context of `Msmcomm'" May 23 10:14:36 Kensan: hmm... building which part? May 23 10:15:04 mrmoku: pinning cornucopia to an earlier rev like 55e52e4 works though. May 23 10:15:07 mrmoku: fsogsmd May 23 10:15:25 Kensan: do you build with -b ? May 23 10:15:31 mrmoku: I suspected morphis forgot to commit some files but if it works for you something might be off. May 23 10:15:48 Kensan: msmcomm is indeed morphis... but fsogsmd built for me May 23 10:15:52 * mrmoku rechecks May 23 10:16:01 mrmoku: no, I was doing a build of fso2-console-image May 23 10:16:07 tmp/deploy/ipk/armv4t/fsogsmd_0.5.0+gitr2+38d52c14a09dd7afc22048f2ed278e336f42a933-r2.2.4_armv4t.ipk May 23 10:16:29 mrmoku: which valac are you using? May 23 10:16:32 Kensan: probably I did not rebuild the msmcomm stuff... and it works because of that May 23 10:16:45 mrmoku: ok, I will ping morphis when he is around. May 23 10:17:19 mrmoku: I suspect you would see the same issue if you cleaned all of cornucopia and did a fresh build... May 23 10:17:33 0002 mok@gonzales[pts/5]:~/shrbuild/shr-unstable-> tmp/sysroots/x86_64-linux/usr/bin/valac --version May 23 10:17:36 Vala 0.8.1.1 May 23 10:17:41 Kensan: yep, probably :/ May 23 10:18:08 mrmoku: ok then there's no relation to valac. I thought maybe something had changed there. May 23 10:18:39 Kensan: guess we need morphis now :P May 23 10:18:48 mrmoku: ok, will pull morphis' ear when he gets in ;) May 23 10:40:58 SHR: 03seba.dos1 07shr-settings * rb6de5ae2e6b7 10/shr_settings_modules/shr_sim.py: [SIM] make basics working with fsogsmd, temporariely disable broken things May 23 11:31:03 GNUtoo: hi May 23 11:48:46 Kensan: update SRCREV in msmcomm recipe to latest and build again May 23 12:02:54 JaMa|GoNe: heh... sure... stupid me :P May 23 12:04:47 how can I fix | /home/soltys/oe/shr-unstable/tmp/cross/armv4t/lib/gcc/arm-oe-linux-gnueabi/4.4.4/../../../../arm-oe-linux-gnueabi/bin/ld: cannot find -lstdc++ May 23 12:04:49 | collect2: ld returned 1 exit status May 23 12:04:51 ? May 23 12:26:31 soltys: rebuild eglibc? May 23 12:26:39 (and maybe gcc... dunno) May 23 12:27:36 Kensan, hi May 23 12:49:28 mrmoku: I get same problem of soltys ... May 23 12:50:44 soltys: Any luck? May 23 13:25:40 hi May 23 13:26:24 GNUtoo, any dream news ? May 23 13:32:19 dcordes, apart gps that seem to work and that I've an idea of what causes the framebuffer bug,no May 23 13:32:33 it seems to work? May 23 13:32:58 you getting the NMEA stream now without crash? May 23 13:33:15 dcordes, I get NMEA stream but I'm not shure it never crashes May 23 13:33:47 I didn't try extensively and vaguely remember it crashing once,and another time I wasn't there so I can't tell why he crashed May 23 13:36:59 anybody had luck with -lstdc++ error? May 23 13:38:20 from OE latest build ... May 23 13:40:59 GNUtoo, doesn't sound too bad May 23 13:41:12 GNUtoo, I am asking because you put in the wiki you are waiting for gpsd implementation May 23 13:41:52 GNUtoo, is this necessary for switching gps on/off ? I think you should be able to use it directly w/o gpsd May 23 13:42:03 as long as it is switched on May 23 13:42:05 basically May 23 13:42:14 gpsd implementation was abandoned May 23 13:42:16 but May 23 13:42:27 we have a standalone program May 23 13:42:33 whith source code May 23 13:42:37 MIT licensed May 23 13:42:52 but unfortunately it need the android build system to be built May 23 13:42:55 so for now May 23 13:42:58 I mount android May 23 13:43:02 and chroot May 23 13:43:10 like May 23 13:43:24 chroot /media/android /system/bin/gps-test May 23 13:43:31 and it starts the gps May 23 13:43:41 killing or ctrl+c ing the program stops the gps May 23 13:43:49 sources are at: May 23 13:44:05 http://gnutoo.homelinux.org/android/librpc.tbz2 May 23 13:44:17 there is no license in it but: May 23 13:44:24 *phh told me it was MIT May 23 13:44:37 *according to sflc lawyers if he told that it's valid May 23 13:44:54 s/it was MIT/he licensed it under the MIT May 23 13:45:06 so add MIT headers May 23 13:45:14 if you push it somewhere May 23 13:45:18 GNUtoo: why do sources include binaries? May 23 13:45:25 no May 23 13:45:31 sources does not include binaries May 23 13:45:36 else it's an error May 23 13:45:58 GNUtoo: 'clnt.o: ELF 32-bit LSB relocatable, ARM, version 1 (SYSV), not stripped' May 23 13:46:04 GNUtoo: 'ops.o: ELF 32-bit LSB relocatable, ARM, version 1 (SYSV), not stripped' May 23 13:46:05 ah ok I'll look May 23 13:46:08 make clean then May 23 13:46:16 or mm clean under android May 23 13:46:25 GNUtoo: I see no makefile May 23 13:46:51 lindi-, it's android build system May 23 13:46:53 Android.mk May 23 13:47:31 the interesting file is test.c May 23 13:55:13 hello. want to ask some questions about .32. May 23 13:55:51 I've compiled kernel from git, but got only wsod May 23 13:56:03 gena2x: please report bugs May 23 13:57:03 lindi-: first, i need to veryfy that i did everything in right way May 23 13:57:25 gena2x: in the bug report you can describe exactly what you did May 23 13:57:30 may be some special options need to uboot? May 23 13:58:34 i used config from .29 , is it ok sould use some special one? May 23 13:59:14 gena2x: i have not used .32 on freerunner May 23 13:59:25 lindi-: anyway, i can't file report now - i'am GPRS May 23 13:59:31 gena2x: file it to local file May 23 13:59:43 then send it when you have faster connection May 23 14:01:12 i want to compile and run 32 kernel this week, if it is possible May 23 14:01:38 so i'm asking for help on irc May 23 14:02:15 if i'll find bug - be sure, i'll file report May 23 14:02:31 gena2x: wsod is a bug :) May 23 14:04:13 lindi-: may be i got wrong sources, wrong kernel parameters, wrong toolchain, and so on. Dont be so fast qualifying my WSOD as bug :) May 23 14:05:28 lindi-: may be my WSOD mean only that glamo were not init at all for example May 23 14:05:50 ah I've tried .32 too I'll report bugs too then but where? May 23 14:06:15 I've used the oe2 compiled version tough May 23 14:06:22 GNUtoo: did it boot succesfully? May 23 14:06:31 yes but after I had some huge issues May 23 14:06:44 also sometime it didn't boot May 23 14:06:47 so try several times May 23 14:07:24 GNUtoo: bugs.openmoko.org May 23 14:07:29 What the hell did "compiler support for __thread is required" come from .... now what should be done? Get the library or remove it from .bb file of eglibc-initial? May 23 14:08:22 GNUtoo: I have to compile it. May 23 14:08:33 lindi-, ok thanks May 23 14:08:37 gena2x, ok May 23 14:08:46 gena2x, any special reasons ? May 23 14:09:57 GNUtoo: I was told that worst issue is power er consumption owhile sleep (in qtmoko v23) May 23 14:10:11 ouch ok May 23 14:10:13 I think I should go back to 2.6.32 ... the latest oe update is still messy ... May 23 14:10:57 GNUtoo: I want to try fix my bluetooth May 23 14:11:10 ah ok May 23 14:11:20 I never used blutooth apart for trying remoko May 23 14:11:32 I bet remoko is not ported to bluez4 May 23 14:12:05 GNUToo: but as always got various issues not related to main problem May 23 14:12:14 ok May 23 14:13:25 indeed remoko seem dead May 23 14:14:58 GNUtoo: for example, yesterday i had to write chatscript for pppd in debian to get internet connection... May 23 14:15:05 ouch ok May 23 14:15:17 is there fso2 on debian? May 23 14:16:12 yes. i don't know version but fso is in May 23 14:16:29 I know there is at least fso1 May 23 14:16:35 but I wondered about fso2 May 23 14:17:25 because someone came to me asking questions,his goal was to put debian on the htcdream,but for phone calls fso2 is much much better than fso1 for this phone May 23 14:17:41 don't know - i'm not using it. May 23 14:17:45 ok May 23 14:17:59 ah right qtopia phone system May 23 14:18:23 I'm using debian for development/experiments and qtmoko for phone calls May 23 14:18:33 ok May 23 14:18:49 but qtmoko uses debian right? May 23 14:18:56 right May 23 14:19:14 ok May 23 14:19:15 GNUtoo: there is fso-usaged in Debian May 23 14:19:20 Maybe someone knows how to get host mode with power using shr-kms 2.6.32 kernel? What I can find on web gives me only hostmode and no power May 23 14:19:25 is there fso-gsmd ? May 23 14:19:26 but nothing more from cornucopia yet i think May 23 14:19:30 ok May 23 14:19:33 too bad then May 23 14:20:07 REalm: requesting UsbHost resource doesn't work? May 23 14:21:03 ok, back to kernel. which branch should work? which toolchain? May 23 14:21:30 which boot parameters? anyone? May 23 14:21:43 dosl: not sure what you mean by that. Usb section doesn't appear in connectivity settings. echo host > /sys/devices/platform/s3c2410-ohci/usb_mode - this gives host mode, but /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0073/neo1973-pm-host.0/hostmode doesn't exst May 23 14:21:51 gena2x, there is howto somewhere May 23 14:22:47 gena2x, http://build.shr-project.org/tests/mrmoku/2.6.32/images/om-gta02/README.html May 23 14:24:31 REalm: i mean - for instance, fsoraw -r UsbHost -- some_app May 23 14:24:48 REalm: look at fsoraw -l, if it contains UsbHost listed May 23 14:26:31 dos1, interesting May 23 14:26:35 nope. It's not there May 23 14:26:42 can you request cpu resources like that? May 23 14:27:20 GNUtoo: hmm? May 23 14:27:29 fsoraw -r CPU,Display,Whatever -- app May 23 14:40:07 ok thanks May 23 14:40:09 I'll try May 23 14:46:29 anyone has any sugestions about hostmode on 2.6.32? Or should I go back to 29? May 23 14:47:21 REalm: using kernel built how and where? May 23 14:48:32 available to download from shr-kms May 23 14:48:56 hmm... we have a patch re-adding usbhost mode to 2.6.32... so it should be there May 23 14:49:10 http://build.shr-project.org/shr-kms/ May 23 14:49:18 I get hostmode itself May 23 14:49:24 but can't get power May 23 14:49:41 i'm having trouble compiling xserver-xorg-2_1.8.1-r16.1 May 23 14:50:02 compiler errs out on syntax in regex.h May 23 14:50:45 or I might just be stupid forgetting to read the said patch :] it desribes new path to enable power. Trying that... May 23 14:52:43 am I building the right version of X server? May 23 14:52:55 (this is the one which builds as default) May 23 14:53:26 (still shr, still today morning's checkout) May 23 15:05:20 where can I change the x server SHR builds with? May 23 15:05:49 md2k7: conf/machine/om-gta02.conf May 23 15:06:09 mrmoku: thx May 23 15:08:27 md2k7: just the type of x server though... not the version May 23 15:10:58 mrmoku: just noticed... how do i pin the version? May 23 15:13:14 what's still holding SHR to stay with 2.6.29 kernel? May 23 15:14:21 ok just found bitbake's PREFERRED_VERSION_ May 23 15:14:22 mickey|munich: thanks for bringing nice weather with you :) May 23 15:14:24 hope it will work May 23 15:14:49 mrmoku: it was a pleasure :) May 23 15:27:42 same error with xserver-xorg 1.8.0 :( May 23 15:27:48 regex.h:138: error: expected '=', ',', ';', 'asm' or '__attribute__' before 're_void' May 23 15:29:34 I've been seeting the same for some time :-/ May 23 15:29:51 some other angstrom ml says May 23 15:30:17 "this seems to be a problem where May 23 15:30:18 This seems to be a problem where the wrong include file is in the May 23 15:30:20 compiler tree. May 23 15:30:26 ouch May 23 15:40:56 zub: needed to run bitbake eglibc May 23 15:41:03 it fixed the regex.h file May 23 15:53:30 md2k7: thanks, gonna try May 23 16:15:00 dos11: shr-settings in feed... thanks :) May 23 17:36:08 next problem in shr-unstable build May 23 17:36:22 matchbox-panel won't build May 23 17:36:24 svn: Failed to add directory 'applets': an unversioned directory of the same name already exists May 23 17:36:53 i guess bitbake cleaned up, because i can't find the applets directory :( May 23 17:38:45 it is fun, but now the phone doesn't ring after suspend. I hear rings in the other phone, but neo keeps shut and the meter shows none May 23 17:38:49 WTF? May 23 17:40:30 Q-Master: i'm not into FR near-hardware programming, but that sounds like an interrupt problem May 23 17:40:56 seems that it is a fsogsmd problem May 23 17:41:16 mickey|tv: ^^^ May 23 17:44:52 Q-Master: what meter? May 23 17:51:20 Q-Master: mdbus2 -s -l and see if it emits the signals it should May 23 17:51:57 Kensan: i'm currently experiencing the msmcomm issue you had today May 23 17:52:01 Q-Master: then it all depends on your system: if you use oeventsd for ringing, then quite possibly the problem is with its bugs May 23 17:52:04 what can I do to make it build? May 23 18:02:35 okay i found jama's comment on it to update srcrev of msmcommd May 23 18:13:21 matchbox svn issue solution here: http://www.mail-archive.com/shr-devel@lists.shr-project.org/msg01025.html May 23 18:14:20 * md2k7 won't believe his eyes if he finally manages an shr-u build May 23 18:27:57 is there a way to "hotplug" mmc card? May 23 18:28:31 (i.e. you can swap mmc when on usb power, but then no device appears in /dev) May 23 18:28:42 md2k7: doesn't freerunner have SD? May 23 18:29:22 lindi-: sorry May 23 18:29:28 lindi-: i meant uSD May 23 18:29:55 i was just a bit distracted May 23 18:30:15 because device should be /dev/mmcblk0 May 23 18:31:42 my problem is that i have lost my adaptor, so i can't plug in uSD into laptop (which has normal sized SD slot) May 23 18:32:22 the uSD contains an old SHR which is "updated dead" May 23 18:32:24 ah, wait May 23 18:32:35 there is still uboot in fallback flash... May 23 18:33:41 md2k7: go buy SD adapter to your pc May 23 18:34:04 lindi-: I'd be interested in how you'd do that on sunday 20:30 May 23 18:34:57 by waiting till monday :) May 23 18:35:21 lindi-: that would certainly be an option, but probably the last one i'd consider :P May 23 18:37:32 my SHR build is complete! I can't believe it! May 23 18:43:08 lindi-: probably tuesday :P May 23 18:58:27 fsogsmd doesn't compile for me: src/plugins/modem_qualcomm_palm/plugin.vala:51.13-51.35: error: The name `isDaemonRunning' does not exist in the context of `Msmcomm' May 23 18:58:37 here is the whole log: http://linux.fjfi.cvut.cz/~zub/SHR/log.do_compile.26862 May 23 18:58:51 mickey|tv: hi :) it'd be interesting to know what do you think about suspending a phone (leaving the sound amp chip on of course) during a lengthy talk? May 23 18:58:54 I just did clean build May 23 19:01:05 maybe someone with expierence of building .32 is here? May 23 19:01:47 i still can't build working kernel... May 23 19:06:26 zub: you need to update the revision of msmcomm recipe May 23 19:07:05 i set the most recent one, don't know if it will work but builds fine May 23 19:07:07 SRCREV = "cdbb26ba215cf314cf8ccf25a5e7cbdcb9f7bece" May 23 19:07:16 in ecipes/freesmartphone/msmcommd_git.bb May 23 19:07:19 *recipes May 23 19:22:09 md2k7: already pushed (now) May 23 19:23:09 zub: git pull (make update) May 23 19:24:30 thanks May 23 19:35:02 PaulFertser: this is an interesting thought. if you manage to keep the amp on, it might work. i'm not so sure whether the user experience will be fluid enough though May 23 19:35:57 the shr first-run wizard is broken in current shr-unstable May 23 19:36:01 mickey|tv: it does work on FR actually. And my experience was never fluid anyway. May 23 19:36:13 i can't get past "local number settings" May 23 19:36:18 heyho May 23 19:36:46 PaulFertser: how do you hang up? :) May 23 19:37:09 md2k7: resume from suspend, hangup. May 23 19:37:36 PaulFertser: okay, that's what mickey|tv calls a lack of fluid user xp ;-) May 23 19:38:43 md2k7: you know what has fluid user experience? Emacs! And yet i seem to be the only user of the FSO emacs UI. May 23 19:40:22 :) May 23 19:42:05 mickey|tv: let me bother you about this: http://lists.linuxtogo.org/pipermail/smartphones-userland/2010-May/002555.html May 23 19:42:06 JaMa|GoNe: after i tried using emacs on my PC (after having used vim for years) i felt something that reminded me of "Poi performance" or juggling. Fluid and elegant, with nice transitions between elements. May 23 19:42:24 mickey|tv: I'd like to see it integrated, as it works for me. May 23 19:42:34 alternatively tell me what's wrong with it :) May 23 19:42:40 zub: sounds reasonable, will take a look tomorrow May 23 19:42:46 oook, thx :) May 23 19:42:59 hi morphis, how are things? May 23 19:43:49 mickey|tv: good, birthday of my girldfriend with big party is over :) May 23 19:44:21 tomorrow I will start to work again on msmcomm May 23 19:44:36 ok, sounds good May 23 19:44:53 did anyone of our helpers report about BT and/or WiFi yet? May 23 19:45:56 no, nobody May 23 19:46:06 but Wifi should be easy to try May 23 19:46:38 we can try with libertas and the driver from marvell (searched for it some weeks ago, but only found it on a ubuntu server= May 23 19:46:51 s/=/\)/ May 23 19:46:53 morphis meant: we can try with libertas and the driver from marvell (searched for it some weeks ago, but only found it on a ubuntu server\) May 23 19:47:25 ok May 23 19:47:39 freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07utilities * rc0339e14de38 10/android/rpc/ (28 files in 4 dirs): android: add rpc helpers for gps May 23 19:48:46 PaulFertser: I'm not laughing on your emacs fluid experience just ""i seem to be the only user of the FSO emacs UI"" feels a bit funnily sad :) May 23 19:48:48 mickey|tv: did you try the fso2-preview-image on your Palm Pre? May 23 19:48:56 morphis: no, i wasn't at home May 23 19:49:05 ah ok May 23 19:49:30 i hope to find some minutes tomorrow to try May 23 19:50:11 is the modem hooking up to the AT channel these days? May 23 19:50:22 for some reason this didn't work via serial_forward last time i tested May 23 19:50:30 you mean from local? May 23 19:50:32 s/modem/fsogsmd/ May 23 19:50:42 yeah, it didn't work remote, is it working locally? May 23 19:51:40 didn't try it, just tested that msmcommd is started by fsogsmd May 23 19:51:43 k May 23 19:54:11 JaMa|GoNe: behaving clown-like in RL changes the way one express his thoughts eventually May 23 19:54:41 ? May 23 19:54:53 GNUtoo: fwiw, i quickly hacked the GPS stuff into GNU. if you have time, have a look whether it works pelase May 23 19:54:54 PaulFertser: did i miss sth? :D May 23 19:54:55 bbl May 23 19:55:03 GNUtoo: it's in the utilities.git May 23 19:55:04 * JaMa|GoNe is a bit tired to be able to parse^^sentence correctly :) May 23 19:55:31 JaMa|GoNe: i mean i'm a clown, that's the reason i say funny things May 23 19:55:42 you're real clown? :) May 23 19:55:47 JaMa|GoNe: fake of course May 23 19:56:15 Or rather improvised May 23 19:56:22 :) May 23 19:56:34 Krusty! 8-O May 23 19:56:39 yesterday I found again that whole MS is full of clowns... May 23 19:57:06 nobody can sell their products with serious face.. May 23 19:58:25 JaMa|GoNe: in fact i'm really unhappy about the amount of feedback i got wrt emacs ui. May 23 19:59:22 PaulFertser: probably all new users are happy with it already :) May 23 19:59:46 PaulFertser: but I agree that in many cases I found surprising how little feedback some announcements got on ML :/ May 23 20:00:18 or how long is delay before someone rediscover something announced few months ago May 23 20:09:37 PaulFertser: I would like to have a console sms app, but as I don't know Emacs, I don't even know how to use fso.el. May 23 20:09:54 so instead I'm exploring vala and tikining of writing something :) May 23 20:13:13 PaulFertser: sorry, I made my decision 3-4 years ago to use vi May 23 20:13:24 PaulFertser: emacs is voodoo for me :) May 23 20:16:02 BTW: what's the "official" way in SHR to use wifi? May 23 20:16:07 (with a GUI i mean) May 23 20:16:18 opkg doesn't find mokonnect and mofi May 23 20:16:27 md2k7: iliwi May 23 20:16:30 those 2 are the only ones i remember May 23 20:16:46 thx May 23 20:16:49 np May 23 20:18:16 zub: to send sms you do not need any app, mdbus2 is good for that. May 23 20:19:02 mrmoku: iliwi segfaults for me on current shr-u (after scanning, and now every time) May 23 20:19:35 md2k7: i once read that many notable programmers use/used emacs. And i had that "i shouldn't be an old conservative jerk" feeling again (that made me learn Dvorak and many other cool things), so i started. May 23 20:20:16 PaulFertser: i wouldn't learn Dvorak for sure. what for? May 23 20:20:34 PaulFertser: i was taught touch-typing on the standard german qwertz layout May 23 20:21:14 PaulFertser: and the probability that i may someday find a dvorak layout somewhere is astonishingly low May 23 20:21:26 md2k7: when i learned that qwerty was developed to slow down typing and that it was actual only for typing machines prior to 1900, and that dvorak is superior, scientifically proven, causes less injury etc, i decided to switch immediately. May 23 20:21:48 md2k7: dvorak layout is everywhere. Even windows supports it out of the box! May 23 20:21:48 PaulFertser: not for me :-/ May 23 20:22:23 md2k7: it's a matter of 20 sec to switch to it in windows or in macos x. And a matter of typing "setxkbmap -layout dvorak" in any *nix with modern X. May 23 20:23:02 zub: what's wrong with mdbus2 for you? May 23 20:23:20 I guess I'm too lame for it - never remember methos/interfaces/paths May 23 20:23:34 PaulFertser: in the time you've typed the DBus names, I've written my whole message :) May 23 20:23:35 I could make up a script for it, yup. But I'd like to have something nice. May 23 20:23:39 zub: make an alias May 23 20:23:49 PaulFertser: that's an option of course May 23 20:24:01 something like a simple mail client... something like alpine :) May 23 20:24:19 md2k7: i mean i better spend time learning something new rather than use clearly an inferior technology. May 23 20:24:44 * PaulFertser switched from pine to mutt and never looked back May 23 20:25:48 Speaking of emacs, I've just found why Chrom{ium,e} are unusable on my system. Spacebar key isn't working in input bar and I've found that it is caused by gtk-key-theme-name = "Emacs" in my gtkrc file :/ May 23 20:25:53 mickey_away, ok thanks a lot!!! May 23 20:26:08 PaulFertser: mutt rulez ^^ May 23 20:26:28 McKael: when i complained to gtk devs that they do not use gtk-key-theme-name = "Emacs" by default they started to laugh at me :/ May 23 20:27:13 PaulFertser: do you have chromium? (to know if it's reproducible) May 23 20:27:16 That they rather do something that more users will like without caring if it's a right thing to do or not. May 23 20:27:22 any hint for smart usb-mode switching (host->device)? May 23 20:27:25 McKael: nope, sorry. May 23 20:27:34 PaulFertser: well I'm too used to these Emacs shortcuts, I can't live without them now May 23 20:27:54 I bought hw keyboard for my freerunner (ie to kill not-responging Xorg from car without booting notebook) May 23 20:27:58 Same here. Especially given they're everywhere. Readline, irssi, mcabber :) May 23 20:28:17 but on many other ocassions is usb net faster solution for killing Xorg May 23 20:28:48 Quite often I close every tabs in Pidgin with ctrl-w :) May 23 20:28:59 so something like detection that on other end is also usbhost with usb-net then switch to device mode would be great May 23 20:30:49 McKael: oh yeah, it's very funny when i start to press all the familiar keys in programs not suitable for that :) Also closing tabs in terminals on my friend's pc and the like :) May 23 20:31:08 But gtk devs do not agree :/ May 23 20:31:55 They told me i'm 1% of 1% nerds just because i know what GNU Octave is :/ May 23 20:32:38 And that means they assume only 1 of a 1000 cares about emacs-like keybindings and hence they do not care. May 23 20:35:05 JaMa: i'd imagine you can use a specialised cable since FR is capable of measuring id pin resistance. Probably would require a bit of kernel hacking. May 23 20:37:17 PaulFertser, I for once do not care about emacs. May 23 20:38:12 i was really disappointed when I heard that again, no shr release will be pushed out May 23 20:38:26 but now i have to speak out my appreciation May 23 20:38:34 shr-unstable is working fine at the moment May 23 20:38:42 you guys have done a great job May 23 20:38:55 TAsn: you do not quite get what i'm talking about. There's basically two common ways to editing text. Modal and non-modal. Modal is vi-like, and the only common non-modal keybindings are emacs-like. It just doesn't make sense to invent any other non-modal keybindings. Especially given they're used by default in readline (and that means they're everywhere: bash, bc, octave, python, scheme etc etc) May 23 20:39:04 (apart from a few small things...) May 23 20:40:38 TAsn: and even currently there's no really functional non-modal non-emacs-like keybindings. So called CUA is not nearly on par functionality-wise. May 23 20:41:33 PaulFertser: isn't the windows/mac/freedesktop.org keybbinding system also non-modal? May 23 20:41:36 So it doesn't make any sense, and yet gtk devs do it. FUCK THEM May 23 20:41:41 PaulFertser: well, luckily we are all free to set our keybindings to our liking :) May 23 20:41:54 lindi-: not comparable functionality-wise, just as i told. May 23 20:43:01 md2k7: not really. With firefox 2.x i had to disable menu accelerators because there's no way to choose a compatible key. May 23 20:44:45 PaulFertser, don't mind me, I just use every opportunity for flame wars :P May 23 20:45:36 TAsn: and i use every opportunity to sell my religion May 23 20:46:27 PaulFertser, I know, that's why I often find my self starting flame wars with you :P May 23 20:46:32 * md2k7 feels sorry he doesn't know emacs interface well enough so as to actively dislike it :P May 23 20:46:41 md2k7, neither do I. May 23 20:47:47 md2k7: if you use shell, you'd better learn basic keys to improve your productivity. May 23 20:48:20 JaMa: watching the hockey? May 23 20:49:55 I just heard somebody shout outside. Was that a goal or something? :) May 23 20:50:11 zub: well, PaulFertser, sorry May 23 20:50:14 :) May 23 20:50:33 aa... it's czk-ru, I recall overhearing May 23 20:50:42 * vanous123 hasn't really watched, just checked the radio for last 20 sec May 23 20:51:29 vanous123: i never understood that game -- didn't spend enough time to get the feel of logic in it, and without knowing it feels too fast, can't follow what happens. May 23 20:51:51 vanous123: no May 23 20:52:00 vanous123: reinstalling windows try 5 :) May 23 20:52:02 PaulFertser, I always thought it's the same as football (soccer) May 23 20:52:02 well, neither here May 23 20:52:14 I still do actually :P May 23 20:52:18 TAsn: no, football is much slower May 23 20:52:20 it's damn hard and user-unfriendly May 23 20:52:24 Yeah, same idea. May 23 20:52:36 Volleyball, basketball too May 23 20:52:38 s/./ though/ May 23 20:52:38 TAsn meant: Yeah, same idea though May 23 20:52:41 JaMa: in fact, to your issue, i can apply PaulFertser's comment: i never understood that game -- didn't spend enough time to get the feel of logic in it, and without knowing it feels too fast, can't follow what happens. May 23 20:52:57 :)) May 23 20:53:04 PaulFertser, but hockey and football are more similar than volleyball and basketball May 23 20:53:08 hehe Paul had good one also for soccer yesterday... :) May 23 20:53:18 yes? :) May 23 20:53:40 * mrmoku demands change of topics ;) May 23 20:53:40 23:25:09 < PaulFertser> mrmoku: do not you consider professional sport to be one of the obvious manifistations of the modern evil consumerist society? May 23 20:53:43 TAsn: i'm not sure about the similarities, all of these games are so different... May 23 20:54:15 JaMa: well, i can sign below that too. May 23 20:54:18 PaulFertser: well said May 23 20:54:21 JaMa: wow, you seem to be a very attentive person :) May 23 20:54:22 well, as for the olympics, and pretty much all the top-events I'd agree with PaulFertser May 23 20:54:56 I consider football and team handball to be exactly the same :P May 23 20:55:04 So I guess our points of view are different. May 23 20:55:22 PaulFertser: well I share this option.. so when I noticed it on channel I remembered it for day or 2 ;) May 23 20:55:43 TAsn: i never studied handball rules, so can't say anything about it. May 23 20:55:57 neither have I. May 23 20:56:13 PaulFertser: and thanks for usb cable hint (I won't probably realize it - i was hoping for simplier solution usable by all out-of-the-box) May 23 20:56:31 what program is it that displays the "desktop" icons in SHR? May 23 20:56:51 JaMa: it makes me uncomfortable all those people (professional atheletes) are harming themselves for mirages (of success/power/happiness/whatever). May 23 20:58:01 TAsn: there are games where one is allowed to touch the ball with the hand? wow :P May 23 20:58:18 mrmoku, most of the games are like that :P May 23 20:58:26 At least the less popular ones. May 23 20:58:27 kids games ;) May 23 20:58:34 TAsn: wrt volleyball: there's a funny feeling i have about it when i occassionaly watch it on TV. I apparently like more to watch at women but they play it so uncool comparing to men it's not even funny. May 23 20:58:35 PaulFertser: here in CR there is too many people watching sports (in pubs with beer) without ever playing them.. that looks stupid to me May 23 20:59:13 JaMa: PaulFertser: while 99% cz population watched the game i had an extraordinary experience here: - was cutting hay with scythe, while somewhere in the neighborhood someone played saxophone... May 23 20:59:19 PaulFertser: if I like some game I want to play it myself first and then maybe watch how it should be played (by watching match of professionals) May 23 20:59:30 PaulFertser, yeah, without being a chauvinist, women sports are inferior comparing to mens. May 23 20:59:40 bah May 23 20:59:54 Mud-wrestling is FAR better when done by women. May 23 21:00:01 mwester: hahaha May 23 21:00:04 :P May 23 21:00:04 mwester: hey man :) got a highlight for "women"? ;) May 23 21:00:08 :)) May 23 21:00:17 mrmoku, You germans and your elite football league. May 23 21:00:58 Us regular people have to watch hands-involving games. May 23 21:01:04 JaMa: i can watch some "extreme" sports performances, though i'm not sure i want to do that myself. But generally speaking, yes, i agree, sport should encourage activity. May 23 21:01:12 * mrmoku wants to stress out that german women are soccer world champion _and_ european champion at the same time May 23 21:01:43 mrmoku, doesn't being the best in the world mean you are also the best in europe? May 23 21:01:51 TAsn: no May 23 21:01:52 mwester: how are you? Anything cool on the horizon? May 23 21:01:53 * mwester thinks sports watching in pubs is a fine activity -- if the TV sets were powered by pedals mounted beneath the bar.... May 23 21:02:03 mrmoku, Weird jock logic... May 23 21:02:15 mrmoku, just kidding, I knew it, just saying... May 23 21:02:31 PaulFertser, I'm staying alive, locked up behind a corporate firewall on the other side of an international border. May 23 21:02:36 mwester: :) May 23 21:03:02 mwester: and beer pipes too... May 23 21:03:22 mwester: one or two SlugOS commits are seen to sneak through those firewalls... from time to time :) May 23 21:03:46 To illustrate how horrible it has become to navigate US customs and borderr security each week, I submitted to fingerprinting and a retinal scan so that I can speed through the lines... :( I never thought I would ever let not just one but two governments have that much access to my personal information. May 23 21:04:35 * JaMa thinks that mwester doesn't have and never will have facebook account :) May 23 21:04:37 mrmoku, Yes, I finagled an old laptop, and convinced a VP to sign off on an account "for vendor support purposes" on the guest network, which allows me to punch through the firewall with SSH. :) May 23 21:04:52 mwester, Ouch. :( May 23 21:04:56 JaMa is very correct. :D May 23 21:05:24 mwester: did it pay off at least? 50% boost? May 23 21:05:57 mrmoku: updated fso will be in feed in few mins May 23 21:05:57 or was it just empty promises to get your personal data... and you still have to queue up? May 23 21:06:07 From an average of over an hour to clear customs, it's down to under 5 minutes. I still have to clear security still. May 23 21:06:08 JaMa: what changed in FSO land? May 23 21:06:21 mrmoku: your cornucopia rev update :) May 23 21:06:33 JaMa: ahh... I only built that partially yes May 23 21:06:52 I did take my GTA02 on the last trips this past month, but I have been saddened that the SHR images have not been so good :( Anything major change in the past week or two? May 23 21:07:45 mwester: not so good from what aspect? May 23 21:08:08 * JaMa usually use only navigation.. :) May 23 21:08:10 Wouldn't wake from suspend for the first flash (about 3 weeks ago). May 23 21:08:31 PaulFertser: i know you were testing gprs, how is it for you now, with fsogsmd? May 23 21:08:47 The next image seemed that some daemon (the one in charge of the GSM) kept segfaulting. :( May 23 21:08:50 vanous123: very stable May 23 21:09:04 vanous123: very stable for me too May 23 21:09:08 PaulFertser: and phone calls with or rather say after gprs disconnect? May 23 21:09:31 Then I tried the latest Unstable, which actually worked better than the two testing versions I tried -- but it lost communcations with the GSM rather regularly. May 23 21:09:47 vanous123: i think it worked, i can connect right atm with gprs and call me from the fixed line just to prove it works fine, do you want me to? May 23 21:09:49 mwester: seems to happend with some images (and most likely with jffs2), but I never got it (suspend/resume always works here) May 23 21:10:06 dc May 23 21:10:20 mwester: and segfaults were fixed probably next day May 23 21:10:30 PaulFertser: i seem to have issues still after gprs disconnect May 23 21:11:04 but i haven't managed to collect logs yet May 23 21:11:30 PaulFertser: i just tested, but my second sim picked up the registration so i have to switch it off, but it's not right here where i am atm... May 23 21:11:50 what i see is gsm not working after gprs disconnect May 23 21:11:56 have latest everything May 23 21:12:06 gprs stopped working today, I've tried everything but I had to reboot eventually :/ May 23 21:12:08 Well, if I were to flash an image today, which one should I flash? Testing or Unstable? Or neither? And does jffs2 still not work as well as the SD card image? May 23 21:12:31 but have no logs, which i intended to collect for a week already, but no opportunity May 23 21:12:59 PaulFertser: mrmoku: glad to hear it's working for you. here generally too, unless i disconnect... May 23 21:14:15 GNUtoo: hi May 23 21:15:06 Kensan, hi May 23 21:15:13 be back soon,trying xmonad May 23 21:15:23 zub: applied May 23 21:15:25 SHR: 03mok 07libphone-ui-shr * r0df4d56a9de2 10/ (data/phonelog.edc src/view/phone-log-view.c): phone-log-view: fix duration May 23 21:15:31 SHR: 03zub 07libphone-ui-shr * r29f50f4482fe 10/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs): Improve error handling in libphone-ui-shr May 23 21:16:14 vanous123: disconnecting and reconnecting GPRS works fine for me... phone calls I did not try after that though May 23 21:20:00 mwester: unfortunatelly I think SD still works a lot better than jffs2 May 23 21:20:24 mrmoku: i turned DEBUG on today, so if anything happens, i will collect logs finally... May 23 21:20:32 vanous123: good May 23 21:20:35 mrmoku: danke! :) May 23 21:20:59 zub: dank Dir :) May 23 21:21:16 blah, german reminds me of work :) May 23 21:21:38 hehe... dunno how to say that in czech May 23 21:22:12 díky would do (slightly informal) May 23 21:22:59 * mrmoku notes that in some brain angle May 23 21:23:06 :) May 23 21:23:07 which unfortunatelly does not mean I will remember it :/ May 23 21:23:18 :) May 23 21:23:38 there are plenty of more important things that one should remember... and still forgets May 23 21:23:47 so I'm ok with that :) May 23 21:23:49 mrmoku: how are you going to type that strange "i"? ;) May 23 21:24:37 díky ? May 23 21:24:52 PaulFertser: I need those for italian too :P May 23 21:30:03 what language is this? :) http://jama.homelinux.org/trash/2010-05-23/cZwindows7.png - really professional translation.. May 23 21:30:28 seems like NL? May 23 21:30:42 I was going to guess Polish May 23 21:30:49 no way May 23 21:30:53 looks romanian to me May 23 21:31:06 zub: yeah, that seems closer May 23 21:31:46 Kensan, back,issues with xmonad May 23 21:32:14 badcloud: necessary condition for Polish: too many 'w's :) May 23 21:32:21 zub: haha May 23 21:32:38 JaMa: google is guessing estonian May 23 21:33:25 and romanian May 23 21:35:01 see for yourself: http://ro.wikipedia.org/ vs. http://et.wikipedia.org/ May 23 21:46:59 vanous123: already found some discussion about it claiming it was fixed 3 months ago (I don't think so :)) http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/cs-CZ/windows7cs/thread/1ca46b80-3b5d-4618-a594-a26ce5f19189 May 23 21:47:37 wow May 23 21:47:41 :))) May 23 21:50:58 clicky, click upgrade May 23 21:51:33 but now it's fixed with that upgrad May 23 21:56:44 JaMa: good May 23 22:02:15 vanous123: SHR is better :) May 23 22:02:20 gnight May 23 22:02:24 gn May 23 22:07:12 yeah... gnight May 23 22:10:33 mickey_away: forget about the patch on ML and better look at this pls. http://linux.fjfi.cvut.cz/~zub/SHR/0001-vala-terminal-Make-window-title-handling-respect-ter.patch May 23 22:11:45 mickey_away: in original patch I had an extra unneeded signal param (learning vala on the go :). Both versions work, but the newer one is by \epsilon better. :) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon May 24 02:59:56 2010