**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Dec 16 02:59:58 2012
Dec 16 10:28:31 <zhuang> GUNtoo,I have got my camera and put it in my phone
Dec 16 10:28:50 <zhuang> but it doesn't work
Dec 16 10:31:56 <zhuang> but it can indentify the camera
Dec 16 11:13:07 <PaulFertser> Hey! Bunnie's building a real cool laptop: http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=2686
Dec 16 18:02:38 <vquicksilver> GNUtoo: I've been testing more the booting problem, and seems like it's on the generated zImage generated using bitbake, if I do a compilation using the replicant toolchain with the same kernel config it works
Dec 16 18:26:25 <GNUtoo-x60> ahhh
Dec 16 18:26:39 <GNUtoo-x60> toolchain issue probably
Dec 16 18:27:01 <GNUtoo-x60> check crespo alignements patches...
Dec 16 18:46:06 <vquicksilver> GNUtoo-x60: ok
Dec 16 18:49:22 <vquicksilver> GNUtoo-x60: where can I find that patches? in SHR? or oe-core?
Dec 16 18:49:43 <GNUtoo-x60> shr kernel
Dec 16 18:49:59 <GNUtoo-x60> in git.shr-project
Dec 16 18:50:10 <vquicksilver> GNUtoo-x60: ok thanks
Dec 16 18:50:41 <JaMa> vquicksilver: https://github.com/shr-distribution/linux/tree/crespo/2.6.35/master
Dec 16 18:51:03 <JaMa> https://github.com/shr-distribution/linux/commit/3ee21899d953f8a3f0736eba3a01aedce3641e8a
Dec 16 18:51:17 <vquicksilver> great, thanks JaMa 
Dec 16 18:53:02 <GNUtoo> hi JaMa 
Dec 16 18:54:55 <JaMa> hi
Dec 16 18:56:27 <GNUtoo> JaMa, GTA04 will work fine for me very soon, 
Dec 16 18:56:56 <GNUtoo> so once that's done I'd like to make GTA04 more free, like to comply more to DFSG or fsf guidelines
Dec 16 18:57:28 <GNUtoo> so the first pass would be to make sure there are no non-free stuff in userspace and kernel etc...
Dec 16 18:57:41 <JaMa> ok
Dec 16 18:57:57 <GNUtoo> how should I implement that?
Dec 16 18:58:15 <GNUtoo> should I do another repo with that structure:
Dec 16 18:58:29 <GNUtoo> for instance meta-freedom/meta-openembedded
Dec 16 18:58:41 <GNUtoo> meta-freedom/meta-smartphone/meta-shr
Dec 16 18:58:42 <GNUtoo> etc...
Dec 16 18:58:43 <PaulFertser> You'll have to sacrifice wifi if you want FSF-compliance :/
Dec 16 18:58:43 <GNUtoo> ?
Dec 16 18:58:55 <GNUtoo> that will be in a second pass
Dec 16 18:59:00 <GNUtoo> first I do the most urgent
Dec 16 18:59:09 <JaMa> GNUtoo: cannot you just BBMASK stuff you don't want?
Dec 16 18:59:17 <GNUtoo> hmmm
Dec 16 18:59:31 <GNUtoo> JaMa, some packages will need to be modified, and some masked
Dec 16 18:59:31 <JaMa> duplicating everything seems like too much work
Dec 16 18:59:35 <GNUtoo> ok
Dec 16 18:59:43 <GNUtoo> can I whitelist licenses instead?
Dec 16 18:59:48 <JaMa> GNUtoo: you can .bbappend them
Dec 16 18:59:50 <GNUtoo> like I modify a bbclass to do that
Dec 16 19:00:05 <JaMa> in some meta-freedom layer
Dec 16 19:00:13 <GNUtoo> yes that was what I wanted to do
Dec 16 19:00:15 <GNUtoo> a bbappend
Dec 16 19:00:21 <GNUtoo> I never wanted to fork
Dec 16 19:00:49 <GNUtoo> s/a/some /
Dec 16 19:00:49 <apt> GNUtoo meant: I never wsome nted to fork
Dec 16 19:00:55 <GNUtoo> lol
Dec 16 19:01:01 <JaMa> then yes, you can use the same structure for people to use only some .bbappends for layers in use (like meta-systemd does)
Dec 16 19:01:10 <GNUtoo> ok
Dec 16 19:01:26 <GNUtoo> let me see meta-systemd
Dec 16 19:02:07 <JaMa> you can also try http://patches.openembedded.org/patch/39613/
Dec 16 19:02:39 <GNUtoo> ok let me read that
Dec 16 19:03:51 <GNUtoo> ok thanks a lot
Dec 16 19:10:55 <GNUtoo> JaMa, for masking proprietary things, I use the same class that masks GPLv3 and modify it?
Dec 16 19:12:28 <JaMa> which class?
Dec 16 19:12:35 <GNUtoo> let me find it
Dec 16 19:13:06 <GNUtoo> license.bbclass I guess
Dec 16 19:13:59 <GNUtoo> basically there was a mecanism to blacklist GPLv3
Dec 16 19:14:10 <GNUtoo> I want the countrary, to whitelist only free software licenses
Dec 16 19:14:15 <GNUtoo> since it's easier that way....
Dec 16 19:16:26 <PaulFertser> GNUtoo: you'll also have to provide completely separate software repository and use a "deblobbed" kernel.
Dec 16 19:18:23 <JaMa> GNUtoo: then yes
Dec 16 19:18:34 <GNUtoo> I know, I use trisquel and I'm trying parabola 
Dec 16 19:20:06 <GNUtoo> the big issue will be wifi if I use the linux-libre scripts
Dec 16 19:20:22 <GNUtoo> so I was thinking of doing like replicant
Dec 16 19:20:40 <GNUtoo> not deblobing but not providing either the wifi firmwares
Dec 16 19:21:07 <PaulFertser> GNUtoo: RMS says no blobs can be stored on host system. So you won't be able to store the wifi firmware anyway.
Dec 16 19:21:24 <GNUtoo> I'll ask him then
Dec 16 19:21:35 <PaulFertser> GNUtoo: are you sure linux-libre prevents the user from using external firmware? I doubt that, e.g. carl9170 uses the same mechanism with free firmware.
Dec 16 19:21:57 <GNUtoo> basically they prevent non-free firmware from beeing loaded:
Dec 16 19:22:08 <GNUtoo> usually free driver are able to detect the firmware version
Dec 16 19:22:19 <GNUtoo> for instance for the b43
Dec 16 19:22:35 <GNUtoo> in b43 it prints something when they find the free driver in the mainline kernel
Dec 16 19:22:40 <GNUtoo> *free firmware
Dec 16 19:22:52 <GNUtoo> so...they deblob it for non-free firmwares
Dec 16 19:22:57 <GNUtoo> and still permit to load free firmwares
Dec 16 19:23:04 <PaulFertser> I'm not sure preventing non-free firmware from being loaded is sensible and is according to the policies. They do not prevent non-free userspace apps, do they?
Dec 16 19:23:35 <GNUtoo> basically in trisquel they do not provide non-free userspace apps
Dec 16 19:23:41 <GNUtoo> they don't point to it either
Dec 16 19:23:55 <GNUtoo> so for instance firefox is modified to point only to free add-ons
Dec 16 19:24:06 <GNUtoo> but they don't prevent running them:
Dec 16 19:24:24 <GNUtoo> if someone downlads something non-free, chmod+x it and runs it it works I guess
Dec 16 19:24:56 <GNUtoo> deblobing is also a sensible aproach: in debian they don't deblob and they have technical issues because of that:
Dec 16 19:25:07 <PaulFertser> I guess it should be the for loading firmware then.
Dec 16 19:25:17 <GNUtoo> on resume I think that without the ATI firmware you have to wait for the timeout(60s)
Dec 16 20:55:38 <vquicksilver> GNUtoo: JaMa the patch worked, thanks guys, now the kernel is able to boot
Dec 16 21:05:07 <GNUtoo> nice
Dec 16 23:12:11 <tg> meh, upgrading shr was not a good idea, it failed and now it's unbootable
Dec 16 23:13:11 <tg> guess i'll do a fresh install then
Dec 16 23:15:26 <tg> what to install on a gta02 if i actually want to use it as a phone?
Dec 16 23:40:48 <GNUtoo> tg, hi
Dec 16 23:40:56 <GNUtoo> what version of SHR did you install?
Dec 16 23:41:04 <GNUtoo> and how did it fail?
Dec 16 23:41:27 <tg> i had an shr-unstable from 2009 and ran opkg-update then opkg-upgrade
Dec 16 23:41:37 <GNUtoo> ah that cannot work
Dec 16 23:41:40 <tg> it failed during upgrading base-files
Dec 16 23:41:52 <GNUtoo> we're now on shr-core
Dec 16 23:41:52 <tg> then i had no cat diff and the like anymore
Dec 16 23:42:08 <tg> yes that's what i will install
Dec 16 23:42:09 <GNUtoo> and shr-core is tested by users and feeds are synced only when good enough
Dec 16 23:42:17 <GNUtoo> ok
Dec 16 23:42:19 <tg> is aurora worth a try?
Dec 16 23:42:23 <GNUtoo> no
Dec 16 23:42:46 <GNUtoo> it's not developed anymore and was a test application that emulated a feature phone(understand: not a smart phone)
Dec 16 23:42:53 <tg> i see
Dec 16 23:43:00 <tg> i'll try shr-core then
Dec 16 23:43:06 <GNUtoo> but we have better GUI on SHR-core
Dec 16 23:43:13 <GNUtoo> it's based on elfe
Dec 16 23:43:19 <tg> great
Dec 16 23:43:27 <tg> is it faster now than in 2009? :)
Dec 16 23:43:36 <GNUtoo> no idea
Dec 16 23:43:51 <tg> ok will try
Dec 16 23:43:55 <GNUtoo> maybe it's a bit slower because of elfe tough
Dec 16 23:44:24 <GNUtoo> but the old GUI is still in the Image, it can be activated
Dec 16 23:44:48 <GNUtoo> basically trough the enlightenment modules you have to disable elfe and enable illiume-home
Dec 16 23:44:52 <GNUtoo> or something like that
Dec 16 23:45:33 <tg> well, i'll try elfe first and see if it's usable
Dec 16 23:46:50 <tg> btw, is everything still running as root?
Dec 16 23:57:31 <GNUtoo> yes it's still
Dec 16 23:57:47 <GNUtoo> everyone complains and no one fixes it
Dec 16 23:58:23 <GNUtoo> I've started documenting what was necessary to fix it
Dec 16 23:58:31 <GNUtoo> and not a lot of work is required it seems
Dec 16 23:58:41 <GNUtoo> mainly iliwi needs to be fixed
Dec 16 23:58:52 <GNUtoo> if I remember well
Dec 16 23:58:54 <khorben> is shr still targetting the freerunner?
Dec 16 23:59:00 <GNUtoo> yes
Dec 16 23:59:11 <GNUtoo> we target 4 devices:
Dec 16 23:59:11 <khorben> good to know
Dec 16 23:59:20 <khorben> I might resurrect hackable:1 some day
Dec 16 23:59:59 <GNUtoo> freerunner, gta04, n900(bad telephony), crespo(not finished but really close, only scenarios files for telephony + opening the sound card before switching the scenarios the first time are needed)
Dec 17 00:00:12 <khorben> ok
Dec 17 00:00:49 <GNUtoo> hackable:1 is not developped anymore?
Dec 17 00:01:01 <GNUtoo> I tough it switched to defora OS GUI
Dec 17 00:01:12 <khorben> I'm the only guy left
Dec 17 00:01:26 <khorben> (and the one behind DeforaOS too)
Dec 17 00:01:37 <khorben> I haven't updated/released anything in a year or so
Dec 17 00:01:51 <khorben> DeforaOS itself has made significant progress
Dec 17 00:06:44 <GNUtoo> ok
Dec 17 00:07:22 <GNUtoo> I'll go since it's late
Dec 17 00:07:23 <GNUtoo> bye
Dec 17 00:13:16 <tg> well, this does not seem to work
Dec 17 00:13:38 <tg> i get an error like
Dec 17 00:14:25 <tg> systemd: failed to mount /dev: no such device
Dec 17 00:16:29 <tg> oh probably it's the wrong kernel
Dec 17 00:18:53 <tg> yup, that was it, now it boots
Dec 17 01:31:35 <tg> well, shr-core is pretty much unusable on gta02
Dec 17 01:31:49 <tg> damn slow
Dec 17 01:31:58 <tg> and when i start a call  the screen gets distorted
Dec 17 01:32:03 <tg> just displaying random noise
Dec 17 01:32:41 <tg> and remained like that after the call ended
Dec 17 01:35:03 <khorben> I wonder how a newer hackable:1 would fare
Dec 17 02:10:52 <tg> khorben: try it and let me know? :)
Dec 17 02:47:35 <khorben> tg: it's a lot of work before I can try it
Dec 17 02:48:34 <tg> i quickly checked, its latest stable release is from 2009
Dec 17 02:48:45 <tg> and the daily builds stopped in march 2012
Dec 17 02:49:10 <tg> so i guess it's dead as well
Dec 17 02:50:31 <khorben> no there was a release in 2011 I think
Dec 17 02:50:34 <khorben> but semi-official
Dec 17 02:50:47 <khorben> I'm the one who did it
Dec 17 02:51:58 <tg> where is it?
Dec 17 02:52:21 <khorben> https://trac.hackable1.org/trac/wiki/AvailableVersions/dse2
Dec 17 02:53:00 <khorben> https://trac.hackable1.org/trac/wiki/DeforaOSSmartphone
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Dec 17 02:59:58 2012