**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Dec 20 02:59:57 2006
Dec 20 07:10:46 <buz_> http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS6177996610.html
Dec 20 07:25:03 <LaF0rge> buz: thanks. unfortunately the neo1973 ony has transflash (like many other phones), so SDIO will not be of much help
Dec 20 07:25:25 <LaF0rge> the mechanical connector is just not meant for miniSD or full-size-SD
Dec 20 07:27:11 <buz_> there's a over length microsd wlan card from spectec
Dec 20 07:27:42 <LaF0rge> buz: which only works if the microSD socket is accessible from the edge of the device
Dec 20 07:27:58 <LaF0rge> buz: also, looking at that code, it will be a long, long way until any of it is acceptable to mainline
Dec 20 07:30:11 <buz_> but that's still a shorter way to go than to write a stack without even having the spec ;)
Dec 20 07:31:10 <buz_> unless the code is really really bad of course
Dec 20 07:35:48 <LaF0rge> buz: yes, it is a step in the right direction. but not really relevant to Neo1973 - maybe further down the road of OpenMoko: yes
Dec 20 07:40:05 <buz_> maybe this helps getting minisd or sd itself into 2
Dec 20 07:40:07 <buz_> v2
Dec 20 07:44:19 <greentux_alt> sdio is interesting for so many toys :) I hope the have no legal issues left...
Dec 20 08:48:13 <niv_one_three> hi all
Dec 20 08:48:16 <niv_one_three> I am new
Dec 20 08:48:41 <niv_one_three> is there any news of when the FIC phone/pda will be out/
Dec 20 08:48:42 <niv_one_three> ?
Dec 20 08:49:09 <rwhitby> see /topic
Dec 20 08:49:51 <niv_one_three> rwhitby: 10x
Dec 20 08:50:07 <niv_one_three> slash topic only points to the web site
Dec 20 08:50:26 <so_solid_moo> it also says "ETA: January 2007"
Dec 20 08:50:27 <niv_one_three> the web sitw shows  general invitation for the conference
Dec 20 08:50:34 <niv_one_three> oh
Dec 20 08:50:35 <niv_one_three> ok
Dec 20 08:50:51 <niv_one_three> so I need to wait to Janurary
Dec 20 08:50:54 <niv_one_three> vr well
Dec 20 08:51:01 <niv_one_three> hi hrw
Dec 20 08:51:02 <hrw|work> morning
Dec 20 12:57:04 <aquo> hi
Dec 20 13:04:18 <koen> mickeyl: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-devel-list/2006-December/msg00073.html might interest you
Dec 20 13:05:45 <mickeyl> koen: *nod* i've seen that, it's very good timing, for OpenMoko we need exactly that. i'm really looking forward to seeing that happening and then refining the OpenMoko framework
Dec 20 13:06:29 <koen> mickeyl: btw, what does 'patch --version' say on your workstation?
Dec 20 13:06:56 <mickeyl> hold on
Dec 20 13:06:58 <mickeyl> *booting workstation*
Dec 20 13:07:06 <koen> heh
Dec 20 13:07:32 <koen> I suspect OE needs 'patch-native' :(
Dec 20 13:08:40 <mickeyl> 2.5.9
Dec 20 13:09:04 <koen> hmmm
Dec 20 13:09:05 <koen> same here
Dec 20 13:09:17 <koen> but no problems with patching gcc-*
Dec 20 13:13:46 <mickeyl> odd. on all mandriva machines it doesn't work
Dec 20 13:17:37 <mickeyl> when i have time, let me try generating the patch on my machine 
Dec 20 13:17:45 <mickeyl> then let's see whether it works on yours
Dec 20 13:18:05 <koen> ok
Dec 20 13:18:20 <koen> it also works in the angstrom chroot hrw made :)
Dec 20 13:21:37 <mickeyl> who's that Tim Janik btw.?
Dec 20 13:21:53 <CM> mickeyl: http://blogs.gnome.org/view/timj/2006/12/20/0
Dec 20 13:21:55 <koen> the BEAST/BSE developer
Dec 20 13:22:06 <koen> imendio gtk+ dude
Dec 20 13:22:16 <hrw|work> mickeyl: 19M archive: http://www.openembedded.org/~hrw/arch.tar.bz2 - Angstrom i686 chroot
Dec 20 13:22:21 <hrw|work> food
Dec 20 13:22:22 <CM> He just blogged this, on gtk+ maintainer shortage
Dec 20 13:22:42 <koen> CM: he also mailed it to the gtk list :)
Dec 20 13:23:28 <CM> koen: Yes, reading that one now from the link in the post :)
Dec 20 13:24:54 * robtaylor isn't going to get suckered into maintaining another core component ;)
Dec 20 13:43:08 <koen> robtaylor: become maintainer, rip out cairo ;)
Dec 20 13:53:23 <buz_> mhh considering that i can now get 2gb sub sticks for about 15$ neo should really come with more flash ;)
Dec 20 13:54:10 * koen will probably use root-on-sd
Dec 20 13:54:14 <hrw|work> 2gb flash in phone.. add good headphones and good audio player...
Dec 20 13:54:21 <koen> with flash as /home
Dec 20 13:54:56 <robtaylor> koen: meh, give it a month and gtk+cairo'll be faster than 2.6 ;)
Dec 20 13:55:50 <buz_> the day i can get 8gb flash for about 80$ i'll put my notebook on flash
Dec 20 13:56:03 <buz_> no more moving parts
Dec 20 13:56:31 <CM> What about those 16 and 32gb flash laptops? Besides being expensive they seem really nice
Dec 20 13:56:34 <mjr> yah the default neo memory is a bit low but at least there's the microsd
Dec 20 13:57:49 <buz_> well trouble is the FS
Dec 20 13:57:50 <koen> robtaylor: I hope that'll be the case for ARM
Dec 20 13:57:58 <buz_> there's really no useful flash fs for linux
Dec 20 13:58:18 <hrw|work> jffs2 is hm.. quite working
Dec 20 13:58:52 <robtaylor> koen: well, that's what everyone's testing on, so i'd expect so
Dec 20 13:59:58 <niv_one_three> koen: I am pinging you at #oe :-)
Dec 20 14:02:31 <buz_> ok maybe JFFS2 is ok
Dec 20 14:02:32 <mickeyl> feel free to pester for more flash via the mailing list
Dec 20 14:02:43 <buz_> but not exactly what I'd want to use for the 150K files in my home
Dec 20 14:02:45 <mickeyl> btw., what's the ETA for gtk+ 2.12 ?
Dec 20 14:03:16 <buz_> especially because of "All nodes must still be scanned at mount time. This is slow and is becoming an increasingly serious problem as flash devices scale upward into the gigabyte range."
Dec 20 14:03:24 <buz_> not really an option for multi gb devices
Dec 20 14:03:31 <koen> use logfs :)
Dec 20 14:04:35 <buz_> "The file system is still experimental and may eat up your disk/memory and/or lock up your machine"
Dec 20 14:04:44 <hrw|work> mickeyl: sent ;D
Dec 20 14:04:51 <mickeyl> excellent :)
Dec 20 14:06:29 * mickeyl pestered also, but via a different list
Dec 20 14:06:55 <hrw|work> slaves@fic.com.tw?
Dec 20 14:07:32 <mickeyl> how do you know???
Dec 20 14:07:51 <mickeyl> :D
Dec 20 14:08:02 <hrw|work> mickeyl: you did not know before who answer there? D:
Dec 20 14:30:50 <CM> buz_: Wikipedia on jffs2: All nodes must still be scanned at mount time. This is slow and is becoming an increasingly serious problem as flash devices scale upward into the gigabyte range.
Dec 20 14:31:01 <CM> Ouch for 32gb..
Dec 20 14:31:04 <buz_> yeah
Dec 20 14:31:13 <buz_> my home has 150k files
Dec 20 14:31:21 <buz_> and it's not even much over 8G
Dec 20 14:31:34 <buz_> thats gonna take, well forever
Dec 20 14:31:46 <CM> I have no clue how many files I have, but I think just the portage tree is 147k
Dec 20 14:31:58 <koen> jffs2 has 32bit pointers
Dec 20 14:32:02 <koen> so it stops at 4GB
Dec 20 14:32:10 <CM> aha
Dec 20 14:32:50 <xorAxAx> olpc will use jffs2 on 512 MB
Dec 20 14:34:00 <mjr> hmh, I just noticed there are 2 gig microsds and I seem to recall that at least someone on the list sometime mentioned that up to 1 gb was possible to add via the microsd slot; is it just that 2 gb microsds are new or is there a gigabyte limit somehow on the neo?
Dec 20 14:34:24 <buz_> yeah i wonder about that as well
Dec 20 14:34:31 <buz_> nobody could give conclusive answer so far
Dec 20 14:34:44 <koen> I think there is some controller issue with large cards
Dec 20 14:35:02 <buz_> 1G seems a weird limit tho
Dec 20 14:35:06 <buz_> i'd understand 2G
Dec 20 14:35:19 <tm_> hi all
Dec 20 14:35:25 <mjr> I'll live with a gig, but 2 would be nicer ;)
Dec 20 14:35:26 <koen> hey tm_
Dec 20 14:35:56 <buz_> with 2g one could reasonably have wikipedia mobile on his phone
Dec 20 14:35:58 <tm_> koen ; do you think its possible to preorder an openmoko ?
Dec 20 14:36:10 <koen> tm_: no
Dec 20 14:36:17 <jjazz> I am under the impression (perhaps mistaken) that olpc won't often fully shutdown, so the startup scan cost won't be paid often.
Dec 20 14:36:50 <hrw|work> suspend support in linux-2.6 is ... and ...
Dec 20 14:37:07 <koen> suspend for x86 is horrendous
Dec 20 14:37:08 <jjazz> tm_: My understanding is they'll start taking pre-orders in January.
Dec 20 14:37:13 <hrw|work> koen: x86-64 too
Dec 20 14:37:21 <hrw|work> koen: but suspend2 worked for me
Dec 20 14:37:24 <tm_> rah , my boss is ok to buy one on the 2006 money ( there is probably a better word for that) 
Dec 20 14:37:27 <koen> jjazz: s/pre-orders/orders/
Dec 20 14:37:29 <buz_> suspend to ram works perfectly on my toshiba notebook
Dec 20 14:37:29 <jjazz> tm_: As in, you'll order it, but it won't ship for a couple weeks.
Dec 20 14:37:41 <buz_> not as much luck with suspend to disk, sadly
Dec 20 14:38:03 <tm_> no problem  for the shipping 
Dec 20 14:38:21 <jjazz> tm_: It might be late Jan.
Dec 20 14:38:36 <aquo> how much does the phone cost?
Dec 20 14:38:45 <aquo> development-ready?
Dec 20 14:38:46 <jjazz> aquo: $350
Dec 20 14:39:00 <tm_> Im curently manage a devel team on linux qtopia handset, and we are very interrested in openmoko technology 
Dec 20 14:39:37 <jjazz> tm_: I imagine you are.
Dec 20 14:39:41 <tm_> rah , i will have to buy it on my own money
Dec 20 14:39:56 <koen> openmoko is free as in beer as well
Dec 20 14:40:04 <aquo> so you manage just code, not money?
Dec 20 14:40:12 <koen> unlike some other phonestack
Dec 20 14:40:14 <tm_> aquo : yes
Dec 20 14:40:19 <tm_> :(
Dec 20 14:47:27 <mickeyl> what kind of applications are you developing? 
Dec 20 14:55:50 <buz_> tm_: care to give any specs about that handset?
Dec 20 14:58:14 <tm_> buz_ : about the handset im currently working on ? 
Dec 20 14:58:18 <buz_> yes
Dec 20 14:58:50 <tm_> yes of course
Dec 20 14:59:08 <tm_> its a Wistron build on OMAP 1710 
Dec 20 14:59:23 <buz_> successor of GN1?
Dec 20 14:59:27 <buz_> or GN1 itself?
Dec 20 14:59:36 <tm_> with a montavista distrib , and Qtopia 2.1.2 ( its old) 
Dec 20 14:59:55 <tm_> 95bogomips , i cant use DSP (yet ?)
Dec 20 15:00:05 <tm_> GN1 ?
Dec 20 15:00:12 <robtaylor> tm_: well, i guess you can use dspgateway
Dec 20 15:00:15 <buz_> i think thats the name of their GSM WIFI phone
Dec 20 15:00:21 <buz_> (which supposedly is pure crap)
Dec 20 15:00:27 <robtaylor> tm_: but there's still a load of work to do on dsp side that isn't open
Dec 20 15:00:45 <tm_> robtaylor : i tryed but it still doesnt works 
Dec 20 15:01:08 <robtaylor> tm_: yeah, you need to add a lot on the dsp side
Dec 20 15:01:13 <tm_> buz_ wistron ?
Dec 20 15:01:33 <buz_> thought so anyway
Dec 20 15:01:34 <robtaylor> tm_: problem is the only guys doing it have been nokia, and thats all closed
Dec 20 15:01:48 <tm_> wistron call it GW1 
Dec 20 15:01:53 <buz_> ah yeah
Dec 20 15:01:55 <buz_> exactly
Dec 20 15:02:23 <tm_> robtaylor dspgateway ?
Dec 20 15:02:30 <robtaylor> tm_: yeah
Dec 20 15:02:32 <buz_> i believe that is about the only "for sale" qtopia handset
Dec 20 15:02:48 <koen> robtaylor: it's dspgateway obsolete and dpsfs the bomb nowadays?
Dec 20 15:02:56 <robtaylor> tm_: the dsp support side, that is
Dec 20 15:03:08 <robtaylor> koen: dspfs is a new one to me, link?
Dec 20 15:03:24 <tm_> robtaylor :  yeah , but iasked for an OMAP H3 board with DSP, maybe we are able to spend some time on it 
Dec 20 15:03:53 <robtaylor> tm_: have you got an rtos for the dsp side?
Dec 20 15:04:12 <koen> robtaylor: http://www.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/lethal/dspfs-2.6.git/description
Dec 20 15:04:33 <koen> and http://linux.omap.com/pipermail/linux-omap-open-source/2006-September/007921.html
Dec 20 15:04:41 <tm_> buz_ : no you can find one in trolltech the "greenphone" , but theres no wifi 
Dec 20 15:04:52 <buz_> that's not really for sale
Dec 20 15:05:21 <buz_> they even TELL you not to use it as daily phone
Dec 20 15:05:41 <robtaylor> koen: ooh, Paul dumped it before he left, cool :)
Dec 20 15:05:41 <CM> koen: Hehe, verbose description there in the kernel src
Dec 20 15:07:00 <tm_> buz_ : ha ok , i didnt noticed thaht
Dec 20 15:07:07 <robtaylor> koen: nng, kernel gitweb still f**kd
Dec 20 15:07:46 <tm_> robtaylor : no
Dec 20 15:07:46 <robtaylor> tm_: h,, that'll be intersting then :)
Dec 20 15:08:40 * robtaylor has been wanting to port ecos or l4 or somesuch to c5x for a while :)
Dec 20 15:09:33 * koen is curious about the davinci stuff
Dec 20 15:10:05 <robtaylor> yeah, some of that is cute.. 
Dec 20 15:10:31 <robtaylor> I hope the OMAP guys really do manage to get their documentation out in the open like they were promising..
Dec 20 15:10:43 <tm_> i hope too 
Dec 20 15:10:44 <koen> "not overnight"
Dec 20 15:10:48 * koen coughs
Dec 20 15:10:51 <robtaylor> heh
Dec 20 15:11:24 <tm_> we have developed all stuff step by step without documentation
Dec 20 15:11:32 <robtaylor> ouch
Dec 20 15:12:10 <robtaylor> tm_: omap dev costs too high? or did they just consider you too small?
Dec 20 15:12:45 <tm_> btw its was not really hard , our biggest job was to crosscompil mplayer , and make it light and fast enough to run 
Dec 20 15:13:01 <tm_> robtaylor : expensive 
Dec 20 15:13:12 <koen> 'bitbake mplayer'
Dec 20 15:13:24 <koen> there, now mplayer is cross-compiled
Dec 20 15:13:43 <tm_> when we started we didnt found it 
Dec 20 15:14:38 <robtaylor> tm_: there's a good few guys (some here) who offer development expertise on linux on embedded. i'd reccoment using one as it can save a lot of learning curve pain ;)
Dec 20 15:15:01 <tm_> koen  what its exctly bitbake?
Dec 20 15:15:27 <koen> tm_: http://www.openembedded.org/
Dec 20 15:17:13 <robtaylor> koen: thats an idea, how about a contractors page on OE, like on debian.org?
Dec 20 15:17:46 <koen> robtaylor: the lists of 'blessed companies' is under consideration
Dec 20 15:17:51 <robtaylor> koen: rock :)
Dec 20 15:20:00 <[g2]> tm_ are you an OMAP guy ?
Dec 20 15:20:11 <hrw|work> Basically OpenEmbedded project itself does not provide support other then on irc/www/mailinglist.
Dec 20 15:21:07 <koen> robtaylor: does robtaylor ltd want to get blessed?
Dec 20 15:21:11 <hrw|work> Paid support is provided by few companies which 'were/are/will be' 'blessed' for it.
Dec 20 15:21:39 <robtaylor> koen: heh, I certainly wouldn't complain ;) still thinking of a name for it though
Dec 20 15:21:59 <robtaylor> koen: my latest iteration is 'Polipo Ltd', what do you think?
Dec 20 15:22:23 <tm_> [g2] : what do mean by an OMAP guy; im not working for them , i use an OMAP , and to be clear and honnest , im only team manage , im not THE REAL developer 
Dec 20 15:22:31 <koen> robtaylor: ehm
Dec 20 15:22:46 <koen> robtaylor: that makes me think of intestinal defects
Dec 20 15:22:57 <koen> (polips and ventricles)
Dec 20 15:23:03 <robtaylor> koen: hmm, maybe not so good then..
Dec 20 15:23:38 <koen> robtaylor: razorshark ultra 6000
Dec 20 15:23:50 <robtaylor> (its actually italian for octopus, but langauge morphology being what it is...)
Dec 20 15:23:58 <tm_> [g2] : btw , if i can help you ..
Dec 20 15:24:02 <robtaylor> koen: that probable the best one so far =)
Dec 20 15:24:25 * robtaylor hates thinking up company names
Dec 20 15:24:38 <hrw|work> robtaylor: 'polipo ltd' is as good as 'PowerGen Italia'
Dec 20 15:24:40 <[g2]> tm_ user/dev/familar with it.  The OSD by Neuros is a media player using a TMS320DM320.  The codec and some other drivers are binary from a BSP provider
Dec 20 15:25:25 <[g2]> but the rest of the box is pretty much fully open
Dec 20 15:28:16 <[g2]> tm_ did you see the OMAP pathes submitted to l-a-k ?
Dec 20 15:28:28 <[g2]> s/pathes/patches/
Dec 20 15:28:29 <apt_> [g2] meant: tm_ did you see the OMAP patches submitted to l-a-k ?
Dec 20 15:28:42 <robtaylor> hrw|work: 
Dec 20 15:28:57 <hrw|work> robtaylor: 
Dec 20 15:29:22 <robtaylor> oops
Dec 20 15:33:10 <tm_> apt_ / [g2] : l-a-k ?
Dec 20 15:33:25 <[g2]> linux-arm-kernel
Dec 20 15:33:32 <[g2]> the ARM kernel mainline
Dec 20 15:33:38 <tm_> ho 
Dec 20 15:33:42 <tm_> no 
Dec 20 15:34:00 <[g2]> I think there was a snapshot of 2.6.18 
Dec 20 15:34:02 * buz_ would prefer to pay 10$ more to get more flash, really
Dec 20 15:34:07 <tm_> but i cant build the kernel for the handset 
Dec 20 15:35:36 * [g2] scrolls up... Ok you're building a handset ?
Dec 20 15:36:52 <robtaylor> tm_: openembedded will build for omap 1710
Dec 20 15:39:12 <robtaylor> koen: Phase Transition ltd? :)
Dec 20 15:40:05 <tm_> robtaylor : reading openembedded.org
Dec 20 15:40:08 <tm_> :)
Dec 20 15:40:43 <robtaylor> tm_: cool :)
Dec 20 15:41:39 <koen> robtaylor: better :)
Dec 20 15:41:49 <robtaylor> koen: yay :)
Dec 20 15:46:58 <noidd> so, any leaked photos? :-)
Dec 20 15:51:38 <hrw|work> noidd: your gf naked leaked
Dec 20 15:51:47 <noidd> don't tell my wife :-P
Dec 20 15:53:53 <hrw|work> cu
Dec 20 15:54:00 <mickeyl> l8ater hrw
Dec 20 15:54:13 <mickeyl> ok, new task today
Dec 20 15:54:25 * mickeyl learns how to write matchbox-panel-apps
Dec 20 15:54:57 <koen> heh
Dec 20 15:55:16 <koen> almost-raw-xlib-apps
Dec 20 15:57:58 <mickeyl> *nod*
Dec 20 15:58:18 <mickeyl> mallum needs to explain to me what libmb really is for
Dec 20 16:00:21 <robtaylor> i wonder if matchbox2 will ever happer? :)
Dec 20 16:00:52 <mickeyl> hehe
Dec 20 16:00:53 <mickeyl> probably
Dec 20 16:01:02 <koen> http://svn.o-hand.com/view/matchbox/trunk/matchbox-window-manager-2/
Dec 20 16:01:27 <mickeyl> last change 3 weeks ago
Dec 20 16:01:28 <mickeyl> looks good
Dec 20 16:02:33 <robtaylor> i guess mallum is managaging to scape some time here and there..
Dec 20 16:02:41 <koen> "Support XFixesHide/ShowCursor if XFixes lib and recent 
Dec 20 16:02:41 <koen>         enough extension available. Really hides cursor now."
Dec 20 16:02:43 <robtaylor> maybe we should help him out :)
Dec 20 16:02:44 <koen> interesting
Dec 20 16:04:55 <mickeyl> ya know, o-hand is one of the few companies i really could imagine working full time for
Dec 20 16:07:30 <koen> is mickey-lauer-freelancers inc such a bad employer?
Dec 20 16:07:34 <mickeyl> hehe
Dec 20 16:07:40 <mickeyl> no, he's great, but I miss team-work
Dec 20 16:07:55 <mickeyl> if all goes well...
Dec 20 16:08:03 <robtaylor> mickeyl: i know the feeling
Dec 20 16:08:16 <mickeyl> .... then i start a "real" company in 2008 with 3 or 4 guys
Dec 20 16:08:42 <koen> so zecke and I should hurry up with our diploma?
Dec 20 16:08:46 <robtaylor> mickeyl: i think it'd be hard to go back to being an employee after running your own business
Dec 20 16:09:12 <xorAxAx> mickeyl: a corperation :)
Dec 20 16:10:01 <mickeyl> koen: absolutely. I'm pestering him every now and then
Dec 20 16:10:01 <mickeyl> it's just that it's _very_ hard to find people with the same skill set and the same level of motivation to get things done
Dec 20 16:10:01 <mickeyl> xorAxAx: ya
Dec 20 16:10:01 <mickeyl> koen: how long do you need?
Dec 20 16:10:01 <mickeyl> (for the diploma)
Dec 20 16:10:21 <koen> 2008 is a good guess
Dec 20 16:10:29 <robtaylor> mickeyl: its not impossible.. 
Dec 20 16:11:54 <mickeyl> robtaylor: impossible not, but frankly, in germany I didn't meet more than 4 guys yet whom I'd like to work with.
Dec 20 16:12:17 <robtaylor> mickeyl: don't limit yourself to people in the same country..
Dec 20 16:12:33 <robtaylor> mickeyl: though it is nice to have some people around, isn't it?
Dec 20 16:12:43 <mickeyl> dunno. being in the same region would be important for me
Dec 20 16:12:58 <mickeyl> of course. 
Dec 20 16:13:04 <xorAxAx> mickeyl: ask a headhunter :)
Dec 20 16:13:09 * koen proposes moving to .mx
Dec 20 16:13:24 <xorAxAx> the mail exchanging country?
Dec 20 16:13:29 <robtaylor> mickeyl: with collabora we had a couple of full-times in the office and subcontractors in various other countries
Dec 20 16:13:36 <robtaylor> mickeyl: worked pretty well
Dec 20 16:13:46 <mickeyl> robtaylor: yeah, a model like that could work.
Dec 20 16:13:58 <mickeyl> or like o-hand, a couple of guys in the office, some teleworking
Dec 20 16:14:19 <xorAxAx> mickeyl: canonical has mostly teleworking as well
Dec 20 16:14:24 <robtaylor> mickeyl: yeah, exactly. regular get-togethers are important though
Dec 20 16:15:16 <robtaylor> mickeyl: one thing i've learnt though, is be very careful who gets on the board..
Dec 20 16:15:51 <robtaylor> mickeyl: and always keep at least 51% share for yourself.
Dec 20 16:16:43 <mickeyl> *nod*
Dec 20 16:41:13 <buz_> two more things: good lawyer (in optimal case, he only gets to review contracts), good accounting/all around finance guy
Dec 20 16:51:02 <robtaylor> buz_: oh, for sure
Dec 20 16:56:35 <koen> and a private army
Dec 20 17:06:14 <robtaylor> and a pony
Dec 20 17:50:41 <koen> heh
Dec 20 17:50:45 <noidd> company pony
Dec 20 17:51:09 <koen> "I know it's unpowered, but [..] provide enough power to [..]"
Dec 20 17:51:12 <koen> priceless
Dec 20 17:51:36 <noidd> a lot of my friends here (in Charlotte NC - the Buckle of the Bible Belt) work for aebn which is one of the fastest growing porn companies in the world.
Dec 20 17:51:52 <noidd> they have work related functions at strip bars :-P
Dec 20 17:52:45 <noidd> I just realised, all my friends who work there are female :-P   That probably doesn't conform to your average stereotypical porn sysadmin / web design peep.
Dec 20 17:52:55 <noidd> but yeah, a company pony
Dec 20 17:53:21 <noidd> you know the problem with that tho would be shipping it to the various teleworkers.  Add to that the possibility of quarantine.
Dec 20 17:53:34 <noidd> yeah, you'd need all your workers in one country :-)
Dec 20 18:49:28 <buz_> that sounds like one hell of a job hehehe
Dec 20 19:55:30 <lkcl> http://source.mvista.com/~dsingleton/sdio/welcome-to-SDIO-linux
Dec 20 20:39:07 <willr> when is the sdk going to be released?
Dec 20 20:45:14 <buz> january
Dec 20 20:55:41 <willr> you'd think people would want an application base before it is released
Dec 20 20:57:13 <buz> i believe its not at all finished so far
Dec 20 20:57:33 <buz> and considering we havent seen any leaked shots of neo, i have my doubts if it will make january release
Dec 20 20:57:48 <willr> yeah
Dec 20 21:21:42 <noidd> http://www.improvfu.com/band.mp3
Dec 20 21:22:22 <noidd> I feel guilty using it in a play soundtrack but it was the only thing I could find that was described as "Bad school band music"
Dec 20 21:22:24 <noidd> ack, misstell
Dec 20 21:22:27 <noidd> sorry
Dec 20 22:53:57 <BastetFurry> Hi!
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Dec 21 03:00:03 2006