**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Aug 15 02:59:57 2007 Aug 15 03:02:24 counter Aug 15 03:02:24 http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter Got it, get yours from openmoko.com (and read topic) (1800;252) Aug 15 03:06:47 hey hey Aug 15 03:09:10 * Sargun can't wait until the GTA02 Aug 15 03:09:21 WiFi! Aug 15 03:09:44 This will be the first time in over 4 years I'll have a phone without a keyboard. Aug 15 03:09:52 and go back to using crappy GSM Aug 15 03:28:35 hello Aug 15 03:32:40 Hey hey. Aug 15 03:40:49 happycube: use openssh 4.6p1 which I added recently Aug 15 03:40:53 I vote we put openssh in there instead of dropbear in any case. Aug 15 03:42:32 Just bought a USB hub. It says there is 500ma on each port. Aug 15 03:42:55 Neo says it is in mode "fast_cccv" at 3773 Aug 15 03:45:40 file /sys/bus/i2c/devices/0-0008/uevent has only root write ppermission. Is this a hardware interface? Aug 15 04:08:28 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r113 10mokomakefile/: Branched for OM-2007.2 support Aug 15 04:18:47 Does does a phone come out that is all free software and uses openmoko? Aug 15 04:19:01 Is there a date? what carrier will use it? specs of phone etc? Aug 15 04:19:11 faq? Aug 15 04:19:11 See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) Aug 15 04:19:20 thanks Aug 15 04:19:25 The neo1973 is the first phone - no carriers yet Aug 15 04:19:28 any GSM network Aug 15 04:20:05 we don't need no stinkin carriers Aug 15 04:20:21 So right now, you can't hook the phone up to a phone network? Aug 15 04:20:25 just really long bits of string Aug 15 04:20:34 sid: any GSM network. Aug 15 04:20:52 rwhitby: not true Aug 15 04:20:53 rwhitby: Will carriers let you hook it up to their GSM network? Aug 15 04:21:08 ie, Verizon, ATT, Qwest, etc (the 3 biggest telecoms in USA) Aug 15 04:21:10 rwhitby: some GSM networks now have a hybrid setup Aug 15 04:21:11 ok, "most" GSM networks. Contrary to popular belief, you don't need to get a restrictive contract from a carrier to use a GSM phone. Aug 15 04:21:29 sid generally they don't know it's a different phone Aug 15 04:21:45 some lock it to devices but you can transfer numbers to others there, can't you? Aug 15 04:21:50 doc|home: So people are using the phone right now throughout the world? Aug 15 04:21:58 let them compete on being less restrictive :) Aug 15 04:22:05 doc|home: no idea, that's why I came in here. Aug 15 04:22:07 linux_galore: have we found a GSM network outside of the USA which won't take the Neo? Aug 15 04:22:32 rwhitby: yes NextG by Telstra here in AU Aug 15 04:22:37 sid: it's very much in development now. I'd suggest waiting until oct unless you want to develop. You'll get a better phone too Aug 15 04:22:52 linux_galore: I don't consider NextG to be GSM. Aug 15 04:22:53 sid gta02 comes with wifi and a faster proc, amongst other things Aug 15 04:22:54 rwhitby: Telstra use 800Mhz CDMA for data Aug 15 04:23:17 If I can't use GSM voice and GPRS data, then I don't call it a GSM network :-) Aug 15 04:23:49 doc|home: So stores will sell it in October? Aug 15 04:23:53 rwhitby: everyone will have to swap to CDMA for data because GSM has a bottle neck problem Aug 15 04:23:53 physical stores Aug 15 04:24:00 linux_galore: Even Telstra don't call it their GSM network. Aug 15 04:24:03 sid: i don't know to be honest. Anyone got an answer to that? Aug 15 04:24:13 sid where are you? Aug 15 04:24:18 sid: I doubt it. Aug 15 04:24:47 Distribution deals usually require working hardware and software, and then some time *after* that to negotiate the arrangements. Aug 15 04:24:48 rwhitby: yes, they cal it nextg because its a hybrid network Aug 15 04:25:06 doc|home: New York Aug 15 04:25:17 linux_galore: right. So the Neo works on the GSM networks in Australia, and does not work on the Hybrid networks. Aug 15 04:25:20 I've never owned a phone, I'm a GNU/Linux user Aug 15 04:25:33 I'd like this to be my first phone, but I want it to work and hook up to the network easily without hassle. Aug 15 04:25:37 rwhitby: yes, but Telsta are the biggest Aug 15 04:25:46 and the worst :-) Aug 15 04:26:05 rwhitby: not if your in the country, no data if your not on telsta Aug 15 04:26:13 sid: I don't know what mobile telcos are like there. Can you buy sim cards on their own? Aug 15 04:26:20 linux_galore: so move to the city ;-) Aug 15 04:26:25 doc|home: They're all evil. Aug 15 04:26:32 anti-competitive, anti-progressive Aug 15 04:26:48 They get government subsidies to do things like invest in fiber infrastructure, and they just keep the money and do nothing. Aug 15 04:27:00 hmm iPhone has been cracked by the looks, now you can run it on any network Aug 15 04:27:12 It's been like this for the last century.(them being monopolistic/evil/anti-competitive) Aug 15 04:27:16 some weird SIM card hack Aug 15 04:27:36 linux_galore: cool - got a URL? Aug 15 04:27:39 sid: ok, well, I'd suggest you go into some stores and ask, or google :/ If you can use a sim card on any phone on any of them, they should work with the neo Aug 15 04:27:57 unless anyone here is from NY and can answer sid's question? Aug 15 04:29:39 rwhitby: http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/breaking/iphone-100-unlocked-using-turbo-sim-card-289148.php Aug 15 04:30:44 rwhitby: the Meizu M8 might be a better buy though Aug 15 04:30:58 due out this december Aug 15 04:31:25 http://www.meizume.com/showthread.php?t=720 Aug 15 04:31:27 Will the final product have a camera? Aug 15 04:31:53 sid: nope, but you can always add one because the OM can host devices Aug 15 04:31:58 sid: nope, but I had a camera on my last phone and used it zero times. Aug 15 04:32:38 if you want a camera, get a camera. You'll get pictures you can actually look at, unlike those crappy <1mp phone cameras :) Aug 15 04:33:05 Why not use Atheros 5221 chipset, that runs openhal Aug 15 04:33:19 That is the best working chipset for openhal, iirc Aug 15 04:35:37 sid: power and is there a portable version Aug 15 04:36:14 I think there are other issues like you have to change the whole setup with some chips Aug 15 04:36:59 ie totally different cpu family Aug 15 04:37:06 the atheros 6000 has integrated hal/firmware Aug 15 04:38:24 so you can write a relatively simple driver and have it be GPL and absolutely in the clear Aug 15 04:38:27 (fcc-wise) Aug 15 04:39:18 I think there was a debate on this before and the issue was they would have to change the whole chipset Aug 15 04:39:27 very $$$ Aug 15 04:40:47 linux_galore: yea, you're probably right Aug 15 04:41:06 How much power does this thing suck up? it seems like it had a lot of devices, and a big color lcd etc Aug 15 04:48:50 well the Atheros 6000 is still on the table Aug 15 04:48:55 from what i can see Aug 15 04:49:52 lots - 3 hours of life worst case Aug 15 04:54:48 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:PTT]] [[Wishlist:Auto_Align_Map]] [[Wishlist_-_Hardware:_Digital_compass]] [[Technical:Accelerometer_Fundamentals]] [[P1_Owners]] Aug 15 04:59:11 * rwhitby adds a 'check-generation' target to mokomakefile, which blows away stuff when you change generations Aug 15 05:01:43 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r114 10mokomakefile/patches/ (8 files in 6 dirs): Remove patches that are now obsolete in 2007.2 Aug 15 05:07:08 moin Aug 15 05:07:30 seas Aug 15 05:23:57 not a good week for Nokia http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/6945593.stm Aug 15 05:27:07 How much do you think that battery recall will cost em? Aug 15 05:32:45 43 million batteries, the batteries themselves wont cost them a dime because the manufacturer will be stuck with that but the logistics will cost a bit Aug 15 05:33:27 US$5 per battery easy Aug 15 05:37:26 they'll probably get the mfr to cover that too. Aug 15 05:38:07 Matsushita isnt that the parent company for Panasonic Aug 15 05:38:19 believe so Aug 15 05:39:12 serves them right for buying Panasonic batteries heh Aug 15 05:39:58 The company I work for used to use Panasonic batteries, we found they didnt last though so swapped to Duracell Aug 15 05:40:18 doc|home: there are some surprisingly good phone cameras now, 3MP+... though the optics still leave something to be desired Aug 15 05:40:47 yeah, on a sensor that size it's bound to be a bit .... lacking Aug 15 05:40:55 by the way, mind if I ask what ie stands for? Aug 15 05:40:56 cjb_ie: Casio now sell a compact camera with a mobile phone built in\ Aug 15 05:41:07 doc|home: ireland Aug 15 05:41:16 greets. Aug 15 05:41:46 cjb_ie: from Ireland myself, bit past your bedtime, isn't it? :) Aug 15 05:42:07 past my bedtime? i just woke up. Aug 15 05:42:18 :) Aug 15 05:42:20 6:42am here Aug 15 05:42:29 openmoko: 03rwhitby * r115 10mokomakefile/trunk/patches/ (openmoko-1004/ openmoko-1146/): Removed obsolete patches Aug 15 05:42:31 man, that's way too early to be out of bed Aug 15 05:42:39 didn't say i was out of bed :p Aug 15 05:43:02 hehe Aug 15 05:43:07 a dub? Aug 15 05:43:18 nah, cark bai Aug 15 05:43:25 sorry 'bout that :) Aug 15 05:43:35 <- waterford Aug 15 05:43:38 but in .ca Aug 15 05:43:40 though i'm really dutch. Aug 15 05:43:58 Casio camera with a mobile phone (not sold outside of Korea) http://www.intomobile.com/2007/05/23/casio-w53ca-exilim-mobile-phone-launched-look-out-sony-ericsson-cybershot.html Aug 15 05:44:02 ah, i went to school in waterford Aug 15 05:44:16 me too, again, sorry 'bout that :| Aug 15 05:44:33 ah it was grand Aug 15 05:44:39 where'd you go? Aug 15 05:44:45 newtown Aug 15 05:44:50 yourself? Aug 15 05:45:02 St. Paul's, but I should add that I'm not a scumbag Aug 15 05:45:35 dunno it, but i didn't leave school grounds much - spent most of my spare time in the computer room Aug 15 05:45:46 <-- life long geek Aug 15 05:45:52 linux_galore: that looks more like a camera than a phone :) Aug 15 05:45:56 hehe Aug 15 05:47:37 back in a bit, food time Aug 15 05:48:23 ooh, a camera phone that actually focuses Aug 15 05:49:26 yeah samsung have a unit with optical zoom Aug 15 05:49:35 10MP too Aug 15 05:51:47 http://www.cameraphonereport.com/2006/10/samsungs_ten_me.html Aug 15 05:52:41 I would say within two years a camera phone without optical zoom will be a budget bin unit Aug 15 05:54:48 The current camera phones are quite dissapointing. Aug 15 05:55:07 Many cameras scan the image line by line, not a frame at a time. Aug 15 05:55:20 Which means that if anything moves, the image will be highly distorted. Aug 15 05:55:57 There are cameras with very bad autofocusing, too. Aug 15 05:56:03 Tronic: I havent had too many issues with my N95 Aug 15 05:56:45 I must admit though a DSLR is still the way to go Aug 15 05:56:47 ... and in general, the image quality is still not that good. Especially colors are far off, probably due to insufficient filtering (in order to reduce the noise in bad lighting conditions). Aug 15 05:57:01 what I need is a Nikon D200 with a phone heh Aug 15 05:58:36 plug Nikon into OM.....perfect Aug 15 06:00:59 I was just wondering if you could get a camera with GPS built in to tag images and bugger me there are a few units available Aug 15 06:01:35 yup, they're generally mindbuggeringly expensive though. Aug 15 06:01:47 however, post-processing solutions exist Aug 15 06:02:22 take a photo of your GPS to figure out the difference between camera time and GPS time Aug 15 06:02:38 and then correlate GPS log with image timestamps Aug 15 06:03:41 i'm sure (more than) one of the openstreetmap guys has scripts to geocode exif data Aug 15 06:04:08 and JOSM will show the relevant picture to a given point on your GPS trace. Aug 15 06:06:06 also, rumour has it some bluetooth cameras with suitable firmware will talk to bluetooth GPSes and give the functionality you describe - but i'm not aware of any actual examples Aug 15 06:24:44 linux_galore: might i suggest #osm and/or #geo on oftc? Aug 15 06:37:43 rwhitby: does the om..20007.2 makefile make use of multi processor/cores? Aug 15 06:54:48 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Carriers]] [[P1_Owners]] Aug 15 06:59:02 ScaredyCat: you can specify that in your OE config Aug 15 06:59:25 same format as local.conf for .1 ? Aug 15 06:59:36 it's OE so I think so :) Aug 15 07:24:48 seems to have totally ignored inherit Aug 15 07:28:25 That's real competitor for neo1973: http://glofiish.com/products/Communication/X500+.php Aug 15 07:29:53 that's about as open as my bank's safe Aug 15 07:30:16 how many people care about openness? Aug 15 07:30:23 everyone here? Aug 15 07:30:29 313 so far Aug 15 07:30:52 314 Aug 15 07:31:32 Not enough for commercial success. Aug 15 07:31:41 there are 1001 windows mobiles out there already Dmitry_Platonov.... Aug 15 07:32:08 well, this is the developer preview, nothng more... Aug 15 07:32:25 ScaredyCat, this one is very close in hardware to neo. Aug 15 07:32:34 it doesn't matter... Aug 15 07:32:55 there's a huge %age of people that will always buy a windows mobile device Aug 15 07:33:11 the use windows, they want outlook integration etc Aug 15 07:33:21 mornin' Aug 15 07:33:24 you will never pursuade tham to use anything else... Aug 15 07:33:29 even the iphone.... Aug 15 07:33:38 can't break that... Aug 15 07:33:45 mnin Placid Aug 15 07:33:55 -accelerometers, +edge, +camera, -3D/video accel Aug 15 07:34:32 the neo doesn't have accs or 3d vid acc Aug 15 07:34:47 It will. Aug 15 07:34:58 but it doesn't *now* Aug 15 07:35:19 it might get a thermonuclear detonator, but until it actually does... Aug 15 07:36:46 om2007.2 takes forever to build Aug 15 07:37:22 yep Aug 15 07:37:46 blame webkit Aug 15 07:38:15 ScaredyCat, wanna yesterday images? Aug 15 07:38:34 I'm still building yesturdays :) Aug 15 07:38:58 :) Aug 15 07:39:01 it's been running all night and still hasn't completed on a 2x2.4ghz box with 2gb ram Aug 15 07:39:03 :( Aug 15 07:39:26 First time sure takes long Aug 15 07:39:45 i'm at 2602/3522 Aug 15 07:39:49 it's finally building the image now Aug 15 07:40:03 Running task 3521 of 3522 Aug 15 07:40:07 rootfs even Aug 15 07:41:23 Dmitry_Platonov: which images do you mean? I've tried this http://people.openmoko.org/mickey/images/ and they won't boot Aug 15 07:41:48 NOTE: build 200708142131: completed Aug 15 07:41:56 hurrah!! Aug 15 07:42:31 my images. I build 2007.2 sometimes 8). My yesterday images booted/worked fine in qemu. Aug 15 07:44:11 hope I'll have mine today also :p Aug 15 07:46:33 it still ignored my local.conf though Aug 15 07:46:39 http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/smartphones/openmoko-smartphone-did-they-have-a-time-machine-or-what-229243.php Aug 15 07:47:12 Did you list proper dir in BBPATH? Aug 15 07:47:54 i've put my local.conf in the dir where is auto.conf Aug 15 07:47:59 and it works Aug 15 07:48:07 mine is where the sample one is Aug 15 07:48:58 there is a symlink to sample, auto.conf and my local.conf Aug 15 07:49:38 openmoko/conf Aug 15 07:50:03 mine is under build/conf, and full path to build dir is in BBPATH before org.openembedded.dev Aug 15 07:50:14 OM2007.2/common/conf Aug 15 07:50:53 ScaredyCat, is full path to OM2007.2/common/conf in BBPATH? Aug 15 07:51:17 i don't think so Aug 15 07:52:19 basically, local.conf should be in subdir conf of some dir listed in BBPATH. Aug 15 07:52:48 hrrmm Aug 15 07:53:08 * ScaredyCat copies it to openmoko/conf/ Aug 15 07:55:45 ScaredyCat, do you use parallel bitbake? Aug 15 07:56:32 -j 4 and 4 threads Aug 15 07:56:57 PARALLEL_MAKE = "-j 4" Aug 15 07:56:58 BB_NUMBER_THREADS = "4" Aug 15 07:57:16 ok Aug 15 08:00:38 hi all Aug 15 08:16:57 ... I've even appended it to the auto.conf and it's ignored :/ Aug 15 08:19:55 why do you think it's ignored? Aug 15 08:20:35 I have no idea... Aug 15 08:20:52 that's where it picks up the machine type, architecture etc Aug 15 08:21:10 hm. what makes you think it's ignored? Aug 15 08:21:54 because the inherit += "rm_work" didn't clear down Aug 15 08:22:22 Istarted with 17.5GB, I now have 5.6GB free Aug 15 08:22:58 hey guys, got my neo :-) Aug 15 08:24:01 good good, did you update the p1 owners page? Aug 15 08:25:59 ScaredyCat, you meant INHERIT += "rm_work" Aug 15 08:26:07 ? Aug 15 08:26:17 yes Aug 15 08:27:07 try bitbake -e Aug 15 08:28:24 bitbake openmoko-devel-image -c rmall Aug 15 08:28:53 not yet, the payment dates etc are at work. I will update them soon Aug 15 08:54:28 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[No_Linux]] [[Nand_erase]] [[Phase_1_Software_Testing]] [[Carriers]] Aug 15 09:04:53 hello Aug 15 09:05:37 hi Aug 15 09:41:15 is anyone here? Aug 15 09:42:27 ~seen anyone Aug 15 09:42:48 zeke: could you help me with qemu a bit? Aug 15 09:42:51 anyone was last seen on IRC in channel #kde, 86d 45m 10s ago, saying: 'argh... it's registered...'. Aug 15 09:42:58 SliMM: unlikely Aug 15 09:43:00 while we are all looking for anyone... Aug 15 09:43:19 Is the gui from Braunschweig here who took photos at the CCCamp2007? Aug 15 09:43:33 I ain't looking for anybody Aug 15 09:43:37 ok, i have a problem with compiling qemu Aug 15 09:43:42 :-P Aug 15 09:43:43 SliMM, ask you question - I'll try to help Aug 15 09:44:09 tilli_ You mean the guy or the gui? Aug 15 09:44:29 I need photographic evidence for my exchange Nokia770 -> Neo :) Aug 15 09:44:38 DonLemmi: ops Aug 15 09:45:10 Dmitry_Platonov: http://pastebin.ca/658034 Aug 15 09:45:11 oh shit. irssi set the wrong nick Aug 15 09:47:43 SliMM, you need zlib headers (package zlib-devel or something like this) Aug 15 09:47:59 SliMM: this within or outwith OE? Aug 15 09:47:59 Dmitry_Platonov: thanks Aug 15 09:48:19 XorA: i don't understaind :) Aug 15 09:48:49 SliMM: are you a) compiling qemu by hand or b) is this a fail building openmoko with OE Aug 15 09:49:32 i think OE stainds for open embeded, and it's point a) Aug 15 09:49:55 SliMM: ok, then zlib devel package on your host Aug 15 09:50:06 ok, thanks Aug 15 09:50:11 SliMM: because b) would have been a bug that shouldnt happen Aug 15 09:50:19 and for open embeded what do i do? Aug 15 09:50:33 building apps for the emu with oe Aug 15 09:50:57 SliMM: what it says in the wiki I suppose Aug 15 09:51:29 ok Aug 15 09:52:50 i love synaptic package manager :P Aug 15 09:53:29 wil neo1973 be able to connect to windows? Aug 15 09:53:33 will* Aug 15 09:54:15 yes Aug 15 09:57:22 in future Aug 15 09:59:10 stefan@marta:~/openmoko/qemu-neo1973$ openmoko/flash.sh Aug 15 09:59:10 Splash needs 'pngtopnm' and 'ppmtorgb3' - make sure that they're in $PATH. Aug 15 09:59:31 What should i do? :-s Aug 15 09:59:52 dpkg -S pngtopnm Aug 15 10:00:08 apt-get install Aug 15 10:01:00 stefan@marta:~/openmoko/qemu-neo1973$ dpkg -S pngtopnm Aug 15 10:01:00 dpkg: *pngtopnm* not found. Aug 15 10:01:47 E: Couldn't find package pngtopnm Aug 15 10:02:05 the last line is after apt-get install Aug 15 10:02:14 netpbm Aug 15 10:02:18 try that package Aug 15 10:02:39 the program is named pngtopnm Aug 15 10:03:02 oups, sorry.. ;) Aug 15 10:03:17 ynezz: yep, it works now, thanks Aug 15 10:04:02 i have problems building a new kernel with openmoko - it fails building u-boot.... anyone else a problem with u-boot? Aug 15 10:04:09 how do i make a bash file? Aug 15 10:05:05 mdt: you can either BB_MASK="uboot" in your local.conf or do make update && make setup Aug 15 10:05:26 mdt, mokomakefile? Aug 15 10:05:32 you're probably using some older version of MokoMakefile setup which have broken uboot Aug 15 10:07:14 ynezz, no, i updated the makefile yesterday Aug 15 10:07:31 it's not enough Aug 15 10:07:39 ynezz, wow... ;) Aug 15 10:07:55 read a MokoMakefile wiki Aug 15 10:08:19 Hello Aug 15 10:08:25 there is recomended to do 'make update && make setup && make openmoko-devel-image' Aug 15 10:08:30 and it works Aug 15 10:08:32 ynezz, i do, ...ah you mean the part saying to do an update before reporting problems... shure ;) Aug 15 10:08:49 So is there some trick to getting the back cover off the neo? Aug 15 10:09:18 mdt: pastebin your problem then Aug 15 10:10:56 ozarka: no... Aug 15 10:11:09 at the top of the neo is a slight dip... Aug 15 10:11:11 ynezz, i changed my root-fs alot and don't want to flash it completely. so i build .ipk and install those. this time is the first time i try to build a new kernel. can i go further this way, just flash the kernel and ipkg install the modules somehow? Aug 15 10:11:16 use your fingernail Aug 15 10:11:20 ozarka, just use nails or guitar pick and some gentle pressure Aug 15 10:11:43 s/nails/fingernails/ Aug 15 10:11:44 jeddy3 meant: ozarka, just use fingernails or guitar pick and some gentle pressure Aug 15 10:12:04 It takes me 10 minutes every time. Aug 15 10:12:05 mdt: it should work that way Aug 15 10:12:07 ynezz, what is the right target to just build the kernel? make build-package-linux-gta01? Aug 15 10:12:16 qemu never gave me this kind of trouble. :-) Aug 15 10:12:37 mdt: i think, that you need to use bitbake Aug 15 10:12:42 ozarka, :D Aug 15 10:13:37 well, it takes quite a while to start openmoko Aug 15 10:13:41 at least in the emu Aug 15 10:14:23 mdt: ah there is such target in Makefile, so yep it should work Aug 15 10:15:00 how does the input work in the emu? Aug 15 10:16:40 touchscreen emulation. add -usbdevice keyboard to have keyboard emulation Aug 15 10:17:46 or just run "make run-qemu" Aug 15 10:17:53 this is using bitbake: http://rafb.net/p/gnn44c92.html , http://rafb.net/p/f7Pmgp40.html is using make Aug 15 10:18:15 rwhitby: !!! Aug 15 10:18:24 * ScaredyCat spanks rwhitby a little Aug 15 10:20:42 Dmitry_Platonov: how does touchscreen emulation work? Aug 15 10:21:10 SliMM, like a ordinary mouse pointer :) Aug 15 10:21:20 you click mouse, it translates to touchscreen event Aug 15 10:21:25 well, it doesn't work for me Aug 15 10:21:35 how do i re-calibrate? Aug 15 10:21:35 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r116 10mokomakefile/Makefile: Initial stab at a multi-generational MokoMakefile Aug 15 10:21:58 Note that it's on a branch. Aug 15 10:22:16 rwhitby: INHERIT += 'rem_work' not working for om2007.2 / Aug 15 10:22:17 ? Aug 15 10:22:21 rm_work Aug 15 10:22:29 ScaredyCat: works for me. Aug 15 10:22:29 SliMM, exit qemu, mount image, rm etc/pointercal Aug 15 10:22:44 SliMM, how did you managed to calibrate if it didn't work? Aug 15 10:23:14 So I'm looking for multi-generational MokoMakefile testers. Aug 15 10:23:14 i didn't touch the first crosshair Aug 15 10:23:15 ScaredyCat: I have witnessed this as well, rm_work is only called when creating the rootfs Aug 15 10:23:20 i think that's the problem Aug 15 10:23:34 SliMM, ah Aug 15 10:23:45 ynezz, no idea? Aug 15 10:23:49 SliMM, or simply flash again Aug 15 10:24:11 mdt: that bitbake one, you need to setup your env Aug 15 10:24:13 SliMM, either do as Dmitry_Platonov suggested - remove /etc/pointercal, or just make qemu again Aug 15 10:24:28 that's no good then zecke ... since the rootfs is the last bit... Aug 15 10:24:31 mdt: you don't have paths set or so Aug 15 10:24:42 To test the multi-generational MokoMakefile, download http://svn.nslu2-linux.org/svnroot/mokomakefile/branches/OM-2007.2/Makefile and set OPENMOKO_GENERATION at the top appropriately. Aug 15 10:24:42 ynezz, yes, saw that for bitbake Aug 15 10:25:06 ynezz, but setting env shows with bitbake the same error message as with make Aug 15 10:25:41 pastebin this /home/mdt/Source/openmoko/build/tmp/work/armv4t-linux/uboot-gta01-1.2.0+svnnow-r13_0_2632_0/temp/log.do_compile.19985 Aug 15 10:25:47 Only experienced testers with plenty of disk space at this stage please. I'll only be accepting MokoMakefile bugs, not OpenEmbedded or OpenMoko build problems. Aug 15 10:26:04 (since OM2007.2 is not live yet) Aug 15 10:26:30 rwhitby, how can you define "live" Aug 15 10:26:41 officialy... Aug 15 10:26:45 i like mastermakefile Aug 15 10:26:50 Dmitry_Platonov: according to mickey|dinner asking me not to convert MokoMakefile until he says so. Aug 15 10:27:10 ynezz, http://rafb.net/p/RR2XqZ83.html Aug 15 10:27:55 rwhitby: I have disk space, I'd just rather not have to reserve it just to build .2 Aug 15 10:28:12 ScaredyCat: guess you don't qualify then ;-) Aug 15 10:28:23 mdt: no idea on that one, btw do you need uboot? Aug 15 10:28:26 rwhitby: do i have tp clean the old Makefile direcotry? Aug 15 10:28:47 DPThought: best to use a completely different area at this stage. Aug 15 10:28:59 rwhitby: ok Aug 15 10:29:08 I am attempting to make it a clean in-place upgrade, but I'm still testing that part. Aug 15 10:29:57 (I'm not sure what it does in the build/tmp directory yet - whether you could possibly switch back and forward, or whether it's a one-way transition) Aug 15 10:30:19 rwhitby: will uboot build out of the box with this version? I had this prolem with the old makefile but did not investigate any further yet Aug 15 10:30:44 DPThought: I have today built OM2007.1 and OM2007.2 on Debian Etch. Aug 15 10:31:00 nice Aug 15 10:31:15 i've built both on ubuntu hour ago Aug 15 10:31:26 ynezz, no, i dont but linux-gta01 seems to need it Aug 15 10:31:36 and http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/buildlogs/autobuild-nudi-last.txt shows that OM2007.2 continues to build fine on Debian Etch on the nslu2-linux autobuilder. Aug 15 10:31:45 i'm not quite sure if debian unstable is the right environment. But it is what i have atm :) Aug 15 10:31:51 mdt: just put BB_MASK="uboot" in your local.conf Aug 15 10:32:05 ynezz, what does that do? Aug 15 10:32:16 don't build uboot Aug 15 10:32:47 good idea ;) Aug 15 10:33:14 i hope i will understand the build environment soon. Because that would be the only place where i can really halp at the moment. Aug 15 10:33:32 writing code is not so much my league Aug 15 10:33:37 mdt: anyway you must use some old environment, i've build uboot succesfully today... Aug 15 10:34:40 mdt: it's BBMASK, sorry Aug 15 10:35:40 rwhitby: found one MokoMakefile bug already Aug 15 10:36:01 rwhitby: .PHONY: copy-package-% is followed by qemu-copy-package-%: Aug 15 10:36:18 rwhitby: clearly it should be .PHONY: qemu-copy-package-% Aug 15 10:36:41 rwhitby: (you forgot to update the .PHONY line when changing the target name from my patch) Aug 15 10:41:04 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r117 10mokomakefile/Makefile: Fixed qemu-copy-package phony target. Aug 15 10:41:22 ls Aug 15 10:41:58 ScaredyCat: bin boot cdrom dev... Aug 15 10:42:13 ;) Aug 15 10:42:20 openmoko: 03rwhitby * r118 10mokomakefile/trunk/Makefile: Fixed qemu-copy-package phony target. Aug 15 10:42:46 * cesarb thinks we need a bot to answer to people who type things like "ls" and "su" in this channel Aug 15 10:43:11 we have you. Aug 15 10:43:12 :) Aug 15 10:44:12 ScaredyCat: a bot is never away, I'm away almost all the time Aug 15 10:44:27 that's because you're a lazy bot ;) Aug 15 10:44:47 we should chain you to the channe; Aug 15 10:44:52 s/;/l/ Aug 15 10:45:47 monotone drives me up the wall evey time.Ho can software be so sloooooooooow Aug 15 10:46:06 DPThought: profile it :) Aug 15 10:46:19 zecke: use git :p Aug 15 10:46:46 did you mean me? Aug 15 10:46:47 MookiE: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Aug 15 10:48:56 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XpnKHJAok8 Linus torwalds on git. And why he built it. He mentions monotone was nearly what he wanted. But unusable slow. :) Aug 15 10:50:19 DPThought: there is nothing that stops you implementing a mtn tool that is using git-fast-import... Aug 15 10:50:28 DPThought: ever used Rational Clearcase? Aug 15 10:50:38 * XorA hides from the scary words Aug 15 10:50:45 DPThought: if you're more than 100ms from the server, it stops working... Aug 15 10:50:51 needs binary kernel modules Aug 15 10:50:53 it's hellish Aug 15 10:51:20 Clearcase was the most insane system I ever seen, luckilly its insane price eventually halted the managments attempts to force it upon us Aug 15 10:51:26 zecke: hehe, the pain is bearable. I think i will use what is there :) Aug 15 10:51:41 I would rather use git also, have to learn monotone just for OE... Aug 15 10:52:02 XorA: I encountered it in IBM, we have a Corportate Policy (tm) that everyone _had_ to use clearcase Aug 15 10:52:28 ewon: Our management were insistant on having use use Rose/Clearcase/Clearquest all in harmony Aug 15 10:52:39 XorA: jesus wept Aug 15 10:52:40 ewon: but they werent going to hire a sys admin Aug 15 10:52:46 lol Aug 15 10:52:56 ewon: I used ClearCase for 10 years Aug 15 10:52:57 we had 2 fulltime admins just to look after the clearcase server Aug 15 10:53:13 sounds more like babysitting Aug 15 10:53:25 rwhitby: impressive. are you off the medication yet? Aug 15 10:53:43 ewon: I write Makefiles for therapy. Aug 15 10:53:49 rwhitby: hah :) Aug 15 10:54:09 rational purify is a nice piece of software, once you munge your project to work with it, but jesus, clearcase gave me the creeping horrors Aug 15 10:54:13 the other thing that saved us was I wrote a batch file to do all clearcases multi site usage with VSS :-) Aug 15 10:54:38 what was that crazy arse Rational Test all about though Aug 15 10:54:45 never went near it Aug 15 10:54:50 it couldnt even generate a valid test case for main(){} Aug 15 10:54:55 heh Aug 15 10:55:08 it would define all its internal variables as const then write to them Aug 15 10:55:08 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[FAQ]] [[User:Phlash]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Melbourne]] Aug 15 10:55:39 that thing wasted a week of my life and led to my heavy drinking Aug 15 10:55:55 clearcase easily halved my team's productivity Aug 15 10:56:06 you could spend a whole day trying to merge a stream Aug 15 10:56:25 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r119 10mokomakefile/Makefile: Remove the oe symlink for OM-2007.2 Aug 15 10:57:55 and dont even get me started on the decision to use Rational Rose as the IDE for the project Aug 15 10:58:07 ha Aug 15 10:58:08 haha Aug 15 10:58:12 oh dear God Aug 15 10:58:36 luckilly if you installed visual studio plugin for vim, then you could trick rose into loading vim :-) Aug 15 10:58:50 after a couple of months we mutinied and went back to using subversion + bugzilla Aug 15 11:00:36 * XorA puts on his napoleon hat and starts drinking scotch Aug 15 11:01:19 we had a strict no-alchohol-on-campus policy in IBM, it was a pity. Would have made clearcase a lot more tolerable. Aug 15 11:02:00 heh heh, my last company we used to go to Princes Street gardens with a carryout to survive the horror Aug 15 11:02:31 ewon: sounds like IBM was very much like Motorola/Freescale. Aug 15 11:04:11 * XorA is even more scared of a workplace that is called "campus" Aug 15 11:04:43 DPThought: I'm going to make it move the old build tree aside (to preserve it) at the expense of disk space if someone doesn't clean it up. Aug 15 11:04:46 rhelmer: I think it's a Gigantic Company(tm) thing Aug 15 11:05:02 hey ho... By flashing my Neo Bootloader I have the error -110 and have to change the size of the NAND Partitions. I can connect to my Neo with cu but I don't know how and how big I must made the partitions. Can someone help me? Aug 15 11:05:14 I went from a company with 300,000 employees, to a company with 12 employees, and it's much nicer. Aug 15 11:05:27 why do you need to change the partitions? Aug 15 11:06:00 ewon: same here, except smaller at the top end, and a bit larger at the lower end (we started with 25) Aug 15 11:06:38 I often thought if IBM issued a gun to every employee, we could take over a medium-sized country. Aug 15 11:07:06 Pitch it to managment :) Aug 15 11:07:11 hah :) Aug 15 11:07:59 I had to use ClearCase at Ericsson, was barely useful at all Aug 15 11:08:14 Me and another guy set up our own svn server instead Aug 15 11:08:25 @SpeedEvil: I read on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Dfu-util#Source_Code if I have "error -110" I need to change the size of partitions. Aug 15 11:09:12 what are you trying to flash? Aug 15 11:09:24 the bootloader Aug 15 11:09:29 Why? Aug 15 11:10:01 MookiE: Do you have a debug board? Aug 15 11:10:36 no Aug 15 11:10:48 Why do you want to flash the bootloader. Aug 15 11:10:57 Then be very very careful to touch u-boot Aug 15 11:11:00 You shouldn't normally ever flash it without extreme good reason. Aug 15 11:11:05 ...I see that i'm a idiot Aug 15 11:11:31 MookiE: Don't worry, I was too. ;) Aug 15 11:12:04 But I was told to update u-boot by mickeyl since mine was too old Aug 15 11:12:34 Had to get help from ScaredyCat to get it back in working state. Aug 15 11:12:43 (See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Bricked) Aug 15 11:13:17 Unless you have phase 0 hardware, that has never been updated. Aug 15 11:13:29 (I doubt there are more than 5 in this condition worldwide) Aug 15 11:14:38 SpeedEvil: mickeyl guided me through last week while he was on the train. I had a problem booting the rootfs, and he said it was a known problem in the old u-boots and I needed a more recent one. Aug 15 11:15:01 I wonder if all shipped Neos have the same uboot and rootfs? Aug 15 11:16:04 * XorA has been through quite a few u-boot re-installs Aug 15 11:16:09 Odd. Aug 15 11:16:12 What problem? Aug 15 11:16:39 did you try simply nand erase in u-boot? Aug 15 11:17:10 if you were trying to flash a larger image on the existing FS. Aug 15 11:24:56 SpeedEvil: I guess a nand erase could have worked Aug 15 11:25:11 SpeedEvil: irc log: http://pastebin.ca/658111 Aug 15 11:30:05 yeah - looks like it. Aug 15 11:37:17 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r120 10mokomakefile/Makefile: Multi-generational MokoMakefile can now build OM-2007.1 and OM-2007.2 alternately (not concurrently) in the same directory tree. Aug 15 11:39:27 ok, those who are willing to risk loosing their build tree can test it out at http://svn.nslu2-linux.org/svnroot/mokomakefile/branches/OM-2007.2/Makefile Aug 15 11:39:45 * CM dives right in :) Aug 15 11:40:14 CM: how was your uboot too old? Aug 15 11:40:42 CM: ah, sorry just saw the note on rootfs issues you had Aug 15 11:41:09 hhf423: NP. I should have done a nand erase kernel and rootfs first, that's all Aug 15 11:41:25 But it was 6 in the morning, what can you expect? ;) Aug 15 11:42:05 ah, so you didn't actually need a new uboot? Aug 15 11:42:49 * hhf423 is still annoyed that uboot does not stay online and drops dead after a few seconds if there is no activity Aug 15 11:43:03 No, I should have doen a nand erase and just reflashed Aug 15 11:43:23 hhf423: I agree, it turns off too quickly Aug 15 11:43:24 I see Aug 15 11:43:58 hhf423: you can set that. Aug 15 11:44:18 You can set most stuff in uboot Aug 15 11:51:12 greets Aug 15 11:51:36 i have my neo1973 sitting right here, booted up just nicely .. still finishing the Makefile tools build however .. Aug 15 11:51:56 the question i have: is this the best choice for a development environment, or should i pursue the VMWare images instead? Aug 15 11:52:42 i want to be able to maintain concurrency and parity with the mainline openmoko project, and contribute actively .. but obviously i have to have the same/similar environment as the one that is in use by the openmoko crew Aug 15 11:53:08 so hopefully i can get some ideas. in the meantime, the openembedded/openmoko Makefile is doing its thing .. i hope it will give me a usable environment when it is complete. Aug 15 11:54:26 SpeedEvil: oh? how would I set that? Aug 15 11:54:50 torpor: welcome Aug 15 11:54:55 torpor: What distro are you on? :) Aug 15 11:55:05 rwhitby: thanks.. Aug 15 11:55:16 cm: i'm mostly using ubuntu-studio at the moment. Aug 15 11:55:21 but its a typical ubuntu config.. Aug 15 11:55:22 torpor: rwhitby ist the Makefile maker ;) Aug 15 11:55:31 thx for the intro! Aug 15 11:55:48 rwhitby: am i right in thinking there are two versions of the Makefile out there ..? Aug 15 11:56:08 torpor: there is the official MokoMakefile, which builds OM-2007.1 Aug 15 11:56:17 ah right Aug 15 11:56:22 of course - release/pre-release .. Aug 15 11:56:30 there is the nslu2-linux Master Makefile, which can build lots of OE stuff, including OM-2007.2 Aug 15 11:56:33 so i would like to perhaps be involved with the newest one .. Aug 15 11:57:02 and there is http://svn.nslu2-linux.org/svnroot/mokomakefile/branches/OM-2007.2/Makefile which is ready for alpha testing (it will be the next version of the MokoMakefile which can build either 2007.1 or 2007.2) Aug 15 11:57:16 what i've done so far: put the jffs2 img on there using the OpenMoko Flasher (on OSX/Intel) .. the 'latest' image in that list, whatever it was. Aug 15 11:57:56 what i want: to go from the OpenMoko build environment->custom image. i would like most of all to assist OpenMoko with the environment/build/syslib configuration and fixups to get it all nicely packaged.. Aug 15 11:58:27 i would like then to be able to add kernel modules and libs and apps through the .ipk delivery mechanism .. Aug 15 11:58:43 i have an application for which openmoko is now my primary target, among 4 or 5 others .. ;) Aug 15 11:59:12 torpor: have you developed with OE before? Aug 15 11:59:13 openmoko: 03njp * r2703 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokogsmd2/ (3 files in 2 dirs): (log message trimmed) Aug 15 11:59:13 openmoko: 2007-08-15 Neil J. Patel Aug 15 11:59:13 openmoko: * libmokogsmd/moko-gsmd-connection.c: Aug 15 11:59:13 openmoko: (moko_gsmd_connection_dispose), (moko_gsmd_connection_class_init), Aug 15 11:59:13 openmoko: (_moko_gsmd_connection_source_prepare), Aug 15 11:59:14 openmoko: (_moko_gsmd_connection_source_check), Aug 15 11:59:16 openmoko: (_moko_gsmd_connection_source_dispatch), Aug 15 12:01:31 rwhitby: yes, quite a bit .. still have my old zaurus (collie) booted up and running a little webserver on the bookshelf in fact .. ;) Aug 15 12:01:49 i've also done linux custom builds since the days of the minix-list, professionally. Aug 15 12:02:28 recently have been working in the embedded world - studio electronics - with linux as well .. and am now doing my own apps on the side, targetting openmoko, gp2x, ds-linux, and such things .. Aug 15 12:02:43 torpor: MokoMakefile just sets up a standard OE build environment in a common way. After that, you can either continue to use the make commands or go straight into bitbake in the created directory structure. Aug 15 12:02:58 got a games engine i'm porting to as many devices as i can before i release it. ;) http://shop.subotron.com <-- upcoming event about such things. Aug 15 12:03:43 rwhitby: cool .. i have now switched to the alpha Makefile, and will build that today. shall i actively report issues, or do you want me to use a bugtracker? Aug 15 12:04:21 torpor: just ping me here Aug 15 12:04:24 ok Aug 15 12:04:52 whats your estimate on a build time, based on a 2ghz dual-core machine with 1gig of RAM? Aug 15 12:05:26 between 4 and 14 hours Aug 15 12:08:39 I'd say ~10 Aug 15 12:09:01 if your build is parallel Aug 15 12:10:06 you mean with psyco? Aug 15 12:10:13 or -j 20? Aug 15 12:10:31 Took about 7.5h from scratch on my AMD64 3000+ with 1gb ram Aug 15 12:10:51 ok so i'm gonna have to let it sit a while then .. Aug 15 12:10:56 with BB_NUMBER_THREADS = "4" Aug 15 12:10:58 rwhitby: make update-makefile on the alpha reverts to the 2007.1 version btw Aug 15 12:12:08 CM: yeah Aug 15 12:13:45 does anybody have an update on the status of the GPS? Aug 15 12:14:08 CM: I won't be changing that before that one goes live. Aug 15 12:14:16 * CM nods Aug 15 12:14:23 Kelly: the software has not been officially released yet. Aug 15 12:14:37 Kelly: open-source GPS work continues slowly. Aug 15 12:16:03 i wonder why it takes so long Aug 15 12:16:26 lack of a designated global-locate poking person. Aug 15 12:17:10 rwhitby: make update-makefile loads the old makefile Aug 15 12:17:28 DPThought: yep Aug 15 12:17:50 that's a failsafe ;-) Aug 15 12:18:28 rwhitby: and it probably overwrites your changes in the makefile OPENMOKO_GENERATION should probably be defined outside the file. ENV-Variable or include file Aug 15 12:19:10 DPThought: OPENMOKO_GENERATION will follow mickey's pronouncement on which version is live Aug 15 12:19:37 ok Aug 15 12:19:43 (and eventually 2007.1 will drop out) Aug 15 12:20:32 the idea is that there is a slight barrier for people to build something other than what the core team wants to be the official build Aug 15 12:20:50 (slight == you have to edit a line in the makefile at the moment) Aug 15 12:21:17 btw. what did the old version build? 2007.1 or 2007.2? Aug 15 12:21:28 But yeah, "make update-makefile" is not recommended with the alpha version. Aug 15 12:21:31 2007.1 Aug 15 12:21:58 (at least not recommended until it is released for general use) Aug 15 12:22:07 rwhitby: so good you came up with it. Or i just had done a downgrade. :) Aug 15 12:22:31 i got the latest and greatest on the camp Aug 15 12:23:40 SpeedEvil: the closed source gps program would be sufficient. Is there any clues on how long it will be before its officially released? Aug 15 12:23:44 i have seen that there are many applications like media player in the svn. but not on the image. What defines what is to be build? (Or should i not care becaus they are all only templates) Aug 15 12:24:18 rwhitby: Have you gotten it to build with the alpha makefile? I get a lot of Parsing errors: http://pastebin.ca/658140 Aug 15 12:24:48 Maybe a zsh issue? Aug 15 12:24:49 rwhitby: this 'sheep barrier' you're imposing would be better solved with repositories, in my opinion. i.e. the official 'consumer repository', and the 'developer repo' .. Aug 15 12:24:51 CM: did it remove the oe symlink in the top-level dir? Aug 15 12:25:03 Kelly: nope. Aug 15 12:25:12 'real soon now' is the latest official word. Aug 15 12:25:22 I have no symlink in /home/moko Aug 15 12:25:22 torpor: I believe something like that is planned by the core team. I just work with what they provide :-) Aug 15 12:25:47 CM: did it move aside your build dir? Aug 15 12:25:54 i dig it.. but old solutions often become standards just because someone didn't raise their hand. i don't wanna be that kind of sheep, but often am. Aug 15 12:26:02 Yes, I have build-OM-2007.1 and build Aug 15 12:26:32 CM: and did it update you to bitbake 1.8, and you have no other bitbake installed earlier in the path? Aug 15 12:26:59 Ah, that can be it.. It did update, but maybe I have an old bb in the path Aug 15 12:27:36 strange, cause setup-env should put the local one first Aug 15 12:27:39 I have 1.8.6 installed the normal way.. Aug 15 12:27:53 you should have seen it svn co from the 1.8 branch Aug 15 12:28:10 (I'm not getting those parse errors here) Aug 15 12:28:19 It did, and it wanted pysqlite Aug 15 12:30:02 My $PATH isn't correct I guess.. Just did a ./setup-env Aug 15 12:30:22 hey rwhitby i hate to be a pain but i'm using irc remotely and my histroy doesn't go back that far... mokomakefile alpha link? Aug 15 12:30:26 CM: the make commands to build the image should do that automatically Aug 15 12:30:44 BryceLeo|WrkLnch: wget "http://svn.nslu2-linux.org/svnroot/mokomakefile/branches/OM-2007.2/Makefile" Aug 15 12:30:57 thanks rwhitby Aug 15 12:31:04 thx CM Aug 15 12:31:18 rwhitby: I know, and bitbake --version shows BitBake Build Tool Core version 1.8.6, bitbake version 1.8.6 Aug 15 12:31:37 CM: maybe a PYTHONPATH or something? Aug 15 12:31:58 my bitbake was not upgraded from 1.6.9 either .. Aug 15 12:32:05 still trying to build 2007.2 with bb 1.6.9 Aug 15 12:32:21 The python path is /usr/lib64/portage/pym Aug 15 12:32:31 torpor: the 'check-generation' target should fix that Aug 15 12:32:47 * rwhitby goes to watch some tv ... Aug 15 12:33:04 torpor why not apt-get remove? Aug 15 12:33:14 Thanks, I'll look around on my own Aug 15 12:33:19 :-) Aug 15 12:33:35 okay check-generation it is ... Aug 15 12:35:08 * CM fails to get past the parsing errors and does some actual work-work instead Aug 15 12:35:18 BryceLeo: make setup-bitbake works just fine .. Aug 15 12:35:26 CM what errors? Aug 15 12:35:37 torpor: http://pastebin.ca/658140 Aug 15 12:35:47 When trying to build the openmoko-image Aug 15 12:35:53 i have installed psyco Aug 15 12:35:54 .. Aug 15 12:36:13 I haven't, since I'm on 64-bit Aug 15 12:36:53 openmoko: 03njp * r2704 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-dialer.c): Aug 15 12:36:53 openmoko: 2007-08-15 Neil J. Patel Aug 15 12:36:53 openmoko: * src/moko-dialer.c: (on_network_registered): Aug 15 12:36:53 openmoko: Print the type of registration information. Aug 15 12:50:25 mickeyl: multi-generational mokomakefile at http://svn.nslu2-linux.org/svnroot/mokomakefile/branches/OM-2007.2/Makefile - a couple of people are alpha testing it now Aug 15 12:50:42 i'm running it now still .. Aug 15 12:50:57 rwhitby: good work! Aug 15 12:51:08 rwhitby: means we can switch instantanesouly Aug 15 12:51:11 ? Aug 15 12:51:23 apt: spell instantaneously Aug 15 12:51:25 'instantaneously' may be spelled correctly Aug 15 12:51:29 ~botsnack Aug 15 12:51:30 :), mickeyl Aug 15 12:51:33 mickeyl: it can alternately build 2007.1 or 2007.2, but not both concurrently Aug 15 12:51:50 rwhitby: ok, cool. concurrently is not that interesting imo Aug 15 12:51:57 nod Aug 15 12:52:20 I bet it still dosn;t do rm_work.... Aug 15 12:52:31 mickeyl, ping Aug 15 12:52:31 ~lart rwhitby Aug 15 12:52:39 * apt crushes rwhitby with a full height scsi disk Aug 15 12:53:36 is any new development being done on 2007.1? Aug 15 12:54:13 i.e., where is the dialer development? Aug 15 12:54:17 mickeyl: it keeps the openmoko svn checkout, but removes the oe symlink. when you switch, please remove the oe/packages stuff from site.conf Aug 15 12:54:47 (make that when you officially deprecate 2007.1) Aug 15 12:54:48 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Switzerland]] [[User:Yvanxxx]] [[FAQ]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Vienna]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Vienna]] Aug 15 12:55:35 leaving it in during the transition period is fine - it's just a harmless bitbake error due to the missing directory in BBFILES Aug 15 13:01:40 ScaredyCat: still want the scummVM bb? Aug 15 13:02:07 yes please.... building with .2 doesn;t work either Aug 15 13:02:12 so Aug 15 13:02:14 ye Aug 15 13:02:15 a Aug 15 13:02:17 h Aug 15 13:02:38 how should I send it to you? Aug 15 13:03:21 you can email me if you like... or put it up somewhere... Aug 15 13:03:26 maybe, post on OE bugtracker? Aug 15 13:03:58 ScaredyCat: I currently have no suitable server to put it up. Aug 15 13:06:01 I want to play Full Throttle again 8) Aug 15 13:06:18 if I run "poweroff" in the console, does it leave anything on in the phone ? Aug 15 13:06:33 on wednesday the battery showed 50% full when I turned it off, today it wouldn't start Aug 15 13:06:57 (50% according to the panel application) Aug 15 13:07:23 Dimitry_Platanov: it's "tailored" for Openmoko 2007.1 with automated menu entries etc. Once the overlay-merge is done patches will be submitted Aug 15 13:13:51 Kensan, overlay-merge? Aug 15 13:20:27 Dimitry_Platanov: The Openembedded-overlay that was in the Openmoko svn repository is being merged upstream (back to Openembedded). Aug 15 13:21:30 Isn't merging already done? Aug 15 13:22:44 openmoko: 03njp * r2705 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-dialer.c): Aug 15 13:22:44 openmoko: 2007-08-15 Neil J. Patel Aug 15 13:22:44 openmoko: * src/moko-dialer.c: (on_keypad_pin_entry), Aug 15 13:22:44 openmoko: (on_network_registered), (moko_dialer_init): Aug 15 13:22:44 openmoko: Check for registration type, and take the right action. Aug 15 13:27:31 openmoko: 03njp * r2706 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-dialer.c): Aug 15 13:27:31 openmoko: 2007-08-15 Neil J. Patel Aug 15 13:27:31 openmoko: * src/moko-dialer.c: (on_network_registered): Aug 15 13:27:31 openmoko: Remove the registration timeout out on registration. Aug 15 13:31:53 openmoko: 03njp * r2707 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-dialer.c): Aug 15 13:31:53 openmoko: 2007-08-15 Neil J. Patel Aug 15 13:31:53 openmoko: * src/moko-dialer.c: (on_network_registered): Aug 15 13:31:53 openmoko: Fix a typo. Aug 15 13:51:42 funny how Sean always references GPS as allowing for such nice ideas and then GPS is the thing that works least Aug 15 13:53:16 hhf423: I don't think that's fair. There are all sorts of other things that don't work at all :) Aug 15 13:53:30 hahaha Aug 15 13:54:32 * hhf423 waits for a new harddisk Aug 15 13:56:13 * xkr47 's moko battery is alive again :) Aug 15 13:57:20 is there an application allowing the user to choose between different alsa profiles ? Aug 15 13:57:51 alsactl? Aug 15 13:59:47 Intel's embedded promo: http://ignite.intel.com/ Aug 15 13:59:53 a graphical application, rather Aug 15 14:00:15 alsactl is what I'm using right now, but it's horrible to use with a stylus :) Aug 15 14:00:28 indeed :) Aug 15 14:00:40 :) Aug 15 14:00:50 you can script and make menu entries Aug 15 14:01:06 yeah that's what I'm about to do Aug 15 14:01:45 once I manage to read the appropriate docs Aug 15 14:12:16 * ScaredyCat dances Aug 15 14:12:31 hm chopperputer, seems like they want to be able to disable not only cars remotely :p Aug 15 14:18:05 i know you guys are focused on the October release, but is there a site/page/rundown of expected GTA03 stuff yet? Aug 15 14:18:41 heh Aug 15 14:20:18 rmitchell: GTA03 hardware I guess ? Aug 15 14:21:19 yeah, or just possible hardware Aug 15 14:21:40 I didn't find anything on the wiki, so I assume that not much is known yet Aug 15 14:21:46 yay! there was a response to my mail about my openmoko going to the wrong continent! :P Aug 15 14:21:57 rmitchell: possible hardware is in the wiki, like possibly wlan Aug 15 14:22:13 but I'm just hanging here, so I'm also just reading tea leafes Aug 15 14:22:41 wlan? wifi is in the GTA02 correct? Aug 15 14:22:41 Currently sold Neo1973 GTA01B_v04 (P1) doesn't have WiFi, GTA02 (P2) which is scheduled for October will have WiFi with free (libre) drivers (Atheros AR6K): http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ#Q:_What_is_the_rationale_behind_the_exclusion_of_WiFi.3F Aug 15 14:23:05 usb2 also Aug 15 14:23:14 I was wondering about the likelyhood of a camera Aug 15 14:23:18 more than anything Aug 15 14:23:25 usb2 would be great Aug 15 14:23:28 hi Aug 15 14:23:37 rmitchell: I doubt a camery will be added anytime this year Aug 15 14:23:42 ScaredyCat: you got it running? Aug 15 14:23:52 is GTA03 planned for this year or next? Aug 15 14:23:53 yah Aug 15 14:23:55 why everybody wants a camera Aug 15 14:24:10 ynezz: just for having one ;) Aug 15 14:24:11 just copying monkey island Aug 15 14:24:13 its not a big deal, but I would wait less than a year for one Aug 15 14:24:14 across Aug 15 14:24:43 but with usb2 you could plug in any webcam *lol* Aug 15 14:24:50 that would be sweet Aug 15 14:25:07 I was wanting one mainly to display a pic of the person calling Aug 15 14:25:19 but since that is minor thing, I can live without one Aug 15 14:25:21 Do all webcams really require usb2? I thought they just need power Aug 15 14:25:43 as of now, the neo1973 is not a powered usb Aug 15 14:25:52 from what I understand Aug 15 14:25:58 CM: no way Aug 15 14:26:09 plenty of pre-USB2 webcams in existence Aug 15 14:26:10 rmitchell: what do you mean by "as of now"? you think this is going to change? Aug 15 14:26:14 rmitchell: next. Aug 15 14:26:31 as of now, i don't thing there is any USB Aug 15 14:26:36 Only really quite expensive webcams are USB2 Aug 15 14:26:41 USB host is not brought to connector Aug 15 14:26:41 Writchie: ??? Aug 15 14:26:48 Writchie: yes, it is. Aug 15 14:26:49 ScaredyCat to start Monkey Island 2 you have to pass scummvm "--boot-param=10001" Aug 15 14:26:49 anyone understand this differently Aug 15 14:27:04 Writchie: there is a two port internal host Aug 15 14:27:12 one port of which can be switched to be a device Aug 15 14:27:21 this port is brought out to the exposed connector Aug 15 14:27:28 rmitchell: GTA03: next year (we should hear more when GTA02 is released) Aug 15 14:27:29 the internal port is connected to the bluetooth Aug 15 14:27:34 you mean switched on the chip Aug 15 14:27:37 yes. Aug 15 14:27:44 that's very good to hear Aug 15 14:27:59 The kernel doesn't properly support it yet, so it won't work though. Aug 15 14:28:14 that is what I figured, and a press/media coverage thing said 3 more versions beyond GTA02 Aug 15 14:28:19 then why wasn't usb OTG included? Aug 15 14:28:27 Writchie: becasue it wasn't. Aug 15 14:28:35 i know, lack of time Aug 15 14:28:36 Writchie: there is additional hardware needed. Aug 15 14:28:42 not much Aug 15 14:28:43 SpeedEvil: I don't really understand that. What does the usb host port have in common with bt? Aug 15 14:28:57 the bluetooth module uses USB Aug 15 14:28:59 dcordes: the bt module is connected to one port of the two port host. Aug 15 14:29:02 ah i see Aug 15 14:29:03 USB host Aug 15 14:29:17 so there are actually two usb hosts? Aug 15 14:29:51 of which one leads to the external connector and one is used by the bt device? Aug 15 14:30:06 yes Aug 15 14:30:16 and the external one can be switched to behave as a device Aug 15 14:30:32 ...but without power. ;) Aug 15 14:30:38 yes. Aug 15 14:30:46 ..you need a powered hub :) Aug 15 14:30:50 so mass storage is possible? Aug 15 14:30:51 No. Aug 15 14:31:05 You need a powered hub happy to run from a host with no power. Aug 15 14:31:07 Most won't. Aug 15 14:31:15 Yes, you can use mass storage. Aug 15 14:31:23 are there yet nice battery powered usb adators avaialble? Or do you have to solder? Aug 15 14:31:33 DPThought: you can make one Aug 15 14:31:40 i've seem them Aug 15 14:31:55 there are also battery packs for usb with 4 AA cells Aug 15 14:32:14 easy. But i know that many devices have these problems. So there is maybe time for a universal solution :) Aug 15 14:32:18 I own a 2000mah usb battery pack with li ion battery Aug 15 14:32:32 there is a universal solution, its called USB OTG Aug 15 14:32:32 DPThought: get one of those Aug 15 14:32:44 Writchie: what is OTG? Aug 15 14:32:54 the USB On The Go standard Aug 15 14:33:00 uhu Aug 15 14:33:03 specifically designed for mobile devices Aug 15 14:33:14 with power constraints Aug 15 14:33:21 I think since there is no power at all on the moko Aug 15 14:33:30 that does pretty much not have any relevance Aug 15 14:33:31 and the need to switch back and forth from host to device Aug 15 14:33:38 s/moko/neo Aug 15 14:33:45 Writchie: aaahh. now i get it Aug 15 14:34:00 there are some mobile devices which have a certain power output Aug 15 14:34:04 is octobre still ok for GTA02? Aug 15 14:34:14 although very low only- like some sharp zaurus Aug 15 14:34:23 October is the official date. Aug 15 14:34:27 There is some doubt. Aug 15 14:34:36 oh, is OTG no-power or low-power? Aug 15 14:34:52 and hardware will not change any more after gta02 until release? Aug 15 14:34:53 negotiable power IIRC Aug 15 14:35:16 Kensan: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Scummvm Aug 15 14:35:56 there is a page dedicated to build software for neo? Aug 15 14:36:34 diego71: wiki.openmoko.org Aug 15 14:37:01 ScaredyCat: yeah, saw that. Aug 15 14:37:08 i suppose... but till now i just some sparse information... Aug 15 14:37:14 *see some Aug 15 14:37:16 i just added it Aug 15 14:37:24 should I get GSM 1900 or GSM 850 for my openmoko.. I know 3G isn't supported yet Aug 15 14:37:26 ? Aug 15 14:38:00 ScaredyCat: I will add a comment about monkey2 Aug 15 14:38:14 mintee_: where are you? Aug 15 14:38:17 yah.. and any other issues :0 Aug 15 14:38:31 Writchie, philadelphia Aug 15 14:38:50 t-mobile is 1900 only and is known to work. Aug 15 14:38:55 ScaredyCat: there's 2 games that are freely available. Aug 15 14:39:01 ScaredyCat: niiiice. I'm ot sure the screen will be big enough. It was very dificult to us the stylus even on the N770, which has a bigger screen. But no device with screen will ever be complite without scumvm. :) Aug 15 14:39:26 AT&T is mixed 850 / 1900 but I've not seen anyone confirming that 850 is actually working. Aug 15 14:39:30 Neo is quad band AFAIK so should connect to any netowrk Aug 15 14:39:43 Also known problems at the moment with AT&T SIM Cards - see wiki Aug 15 14:39:59 cool, then i'll start looking for the cheapest t-mobile phone i can get.. Aug 15 14:40:11 Kensan: what are they, and where are they Aug 15 14:40:20 so i can get a damn sim card... so sad i have to buy a phone for it Aug 15 14:40:25 DPThought: it's a little tricky :) Aug 15 14:40:28 brb Aug 15 14:40:40 no escape or F5 Aug 15 14:40:54 pre-paid t-mobile SIMs in US do not permit data AFAIK Aug 15 14:41:10 http://openmoko.com/products-neo-base-00-stdkit.html [2.5G GSM – quad band, voice, CSD, GPRS] Aug 15 14:41:44 * XorA feels lucky at time to be in the UK where you can do what you like with your SIM Aug 15 14:41:47 DPThought: the FCC test reports show testing only at 1900 and above. Aug 15 14:42:19 DPThought: this plus strange behavious on AT&T networks, inbound calls only, raises some suspicions. Aug 15 14:42:55 rwhitby: i gotta get off the 'net - quick question: is there a way pre-load all required packaages for a complete build with the new Makefile? Aug 15 14:42:59 Before entering a service contract, its helpful to have confirmation that it is going to work. Aug 15 14:43:05 well, i don't have any specific insight . Only what is on the net. Aug 15 14:43:47 I understand. Sometimes what is on the net or the wiki is wrong or misleading. Aug 15 14:44:21 US, unfortunately, is not normal case for GSM Aug 15 14:44:24 it works fine with t-mobile UK Aug 15 14:44:42 I'm sure it does Aug 15 14:44:55 it works fine on t-mobile USA Aug 15 14:45:05 Writchie: i just expect gsm to work anywhere besies maybe japan. But that is probably european gsm chauvinism :) Aug 15 14:45:06 well not fine, but works as Aug 15 14:45:26 GSM works everywhere the operator implements GSM Aug 15 14:46:01 unfortunately, in the US the tower spacing (for 800) is unsuitable for GSM 1900 Aug 15 14:46:23 GSM 1800/1900 were intended as overlays to increase capacity. Aug 15 14:46:25 yay for scummvm! Aug 15 14:46:33 but luckilly the SIM has no cares on the transmition frequency Aug 15 14:46:56 but the radio does Aug 15 14:47:09 and the radio is quad band Aug 15 14:47:22 we think and hope it works quad band Aug 15 14:48:02 800 is only a smill diff from 900 which is the standard in .eu Aug 15 14:48:08 it is quad. But i don't know if thiw means it would work everywhere Aug 15 14:48:33 should work and works are two different things Aug 15 14:48:41 anywhere that is not using GSM-400 Aug 15 14:48:49 the chipset is designed for quadband Aug 15 14:48:59 the antenna, i hope, is quadband Aug 15 14:49:06 i remember harald welte pointing it out, that it is quat and should work everywhere, at a speak on the chaos camp last week Aug 15 14:49:06 * XorA thiks that as TI designed the chipset and they are quite well known for USA it probably works Aug 15 14:49:33 the reaons why the FCC test reports omit 850 is what raises the greatest concern - combined with the silence from FIC about it. Aug 15 14:49:56 Writchie: but who cares. Making calls does not work at the moment anyway. :) Aug 15 14:50:06 making calls works fine Aug 15 14:50:20 making calls worked since BV2 Aug 15 14:50:20 from the command line ;) Aug 15 14:50:21 Writchie: ... on the shell Aug 15 14:50:41 Writchie: and with lots of audio feedback Aug 15 14:50:43 this is a developer preview Aug 15 14:50:51 its not a phone Aug 15 14:50:53 no complaining :) Aug 15 14:51:07 the feed back is a one finger operation to fix Aug 15 14:51:16 but atm i cound not care less about the gsm part *g8 Aug 15 14:51:19 just set Amp Mode in mixer to Handset Speaker Aug 15 14:51:37 just when I did the state files the phone I have had a broken speaker Aug 15 14:51:59 XorA: have you posted a state file that works? Aug 15 14:52:22 ScaredyCat: added info about Monkey 2. Maybe you should mention that F5 is mapped to AUX which is needed to access the menu. Aug 15 14:52:24 XorA: i yust leave phone integration to the experts and care for things i can really fix :) Aug 15 14:52:29 Writchie: no, Im busy and havent powered the phone up for weeks, but I keep telling people, its not my fault open source is failing here Aug 15 14:52:49 aahh good - didn't know that :D Aug 15 14:53:12 the problem is the time to investigate this ALSA stuff is signficant for someone not familiar with it. Aug 15 14:53:33 load state file, find Amp Mode, change setting Aug 15 14:53:56 there's like 97 controls Aug 15 14:54:06 ScaredyCat: see http://www.scummvm.org/downloads.php#extras for games. Aug 15 14:54:36 in fact in state file I have here which is the one I originally loaded it is set correct Aug 15 14:54:49 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[USB_Networking]] [[Wishlist:Games]] [[Scummvm]] [[User_talk:PTT]] [[Neo1973:_GTA01Bv4_versus_GTA02_comparison]] [[User_talk:Tingo]] [[MacOS_X]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Carriers]] Aug 15 14:55:03 XorA: is that posted anywhere Aug 15 14:55:31 http://opensource.wolfsonmicro.com/~gg/neo1973/gsmhandset.working.state Aug 15 14:55:48 ScaredyCat: you need to change permissions on the files. Aug 15 14:55:59 I think I tried that one to no avail, but I will try it again. Aug 15 14:56:04 XorA: thanks Aug 15 14:56:27 * XorA has made a phone call with that state on bv2/3 Aug 15 14:56:30 oops Aug 15 14:56:32 ta Kensan Aug 15 14:57:02 XorA: the headset state worked fine Aug 15 14:57:57 Writchie: diff the two states Aug 15 14:58:43 Writchie: it looks to me like Amp Mode is Off in the state file on Neo, that is bad Aug 15 14:58:49 should be Call Speaker Aug 15 15:00:05 Writchie: ignore that last, I looked at wrong file Aug 15 15:00:19 it looks on Aug 15 15:00:59 should be sorted Kensan Aug 15 15:01:16 XorA: are you going to be around for a bit? Aug 15 15:01:33 Writchie: I think it could be volume problems with handset state Aug 15 15:02:05 it's feedback and probably volume as well Aug 15 15:02:47 ok, i'm back.. sorry to chop up the conversation... Aug 15 15:02:56 XorA: if you'll be around for bit, I can get set up for testing. I need to put SIM etc., or another time if that's more convenient. Aug 15 15:03:03 so did we confirm that t-mobile pre-paids doens't allow data? Aug 15 15:03:28 Writchie: I shall have to go through these files with the audio map again, I think these ones have mistakes, and Im not sure where they came from, Ive made so many different versions over the months Aug 15 15:03:54 Writchie: time is the only thing that prevents me fixing, that should be fixed soon Aug 15 15:04:06 I'll be happy to test whatever you have. Aug 15 15:04:11 I have two neo's Aug 15 15:04:17 mintee_: IUn the UK they do Aug 15 15:04:30 * mintee_ moves to the UK :P Aug 15 15:04:34 Writchie: its more that there is the audio map to follow and find out where stuff routes Aug 15 15:04:59 7p/Kb ($.14us), Aug 15 15:05:20 mintee_: AFAIK for t-mo us you need the $5 plan for WAP data (which does you little good) and the $30 plan to get real internet access. Aug 15 15:05:24 SpeedEvil: or webnwalk which caps that at a max of 1GBP a day Aug 15 15:05:29 yes - that I meant Aug 15 15:05:34 to add. Aug 15 15:05:43 * SpeedEvil often fails to Aug 15 15:05:46 complete thoughts. Aug 15 15:05:55 * XorA has contract WebNWalk and its awesome Aug 15 15:06:04 * SpeedEvil has no contract. Aug 15 15:06:32 Writchie, ouch. that's $30 on top of the voice pre-pay eh? Aug 15 15:06:39 $30 on top Aug 15 15:06:42 used to be $20 Aug 15 15:07:14 but at least it is unlimited Aug 15 15:07:21 i use tmobile pre-pay. i havent seen a dataplan for that. Aug 15 15:07:42 damn them... and I'd have to buy a phone on top of that... cause I heard in the UK providers give away SIM cards, but in the US we actually would have to buy one but it's cheaper to just get a phone Aug 15 15:07:53 don-o, where are you located Aug 15 15:07:53 mintee_: not on top of prepay, on top of contract Aug 15 15:07:53 In the UK, it's 20 pounds/month for the cheapest contract, then you can add unlimited internet for 7.50/mo Aug 15 15:08:08 mintee_: currently, los angeles Aug 15 15:08:31 SpeedEvil: that sounds like a great deal Aug 15 15:08:39 SpeedEvil, yeah really. Aug 15 15:08:42 that deal sounds familiar :-) Aug 15 15:08:44 Alternatively. Aug 15 15:08:52 but 27.50 sterling is $55 Aug 15 15:08:55 You buy a pay-as-you-go SIM. Aug 15 15:09:10 And pay up to a pound a day for unlimited data. Aug 15 15:09:21 7p/kb, capped at 1 pound (136K) Aug 15 15:09:23 not bad at all.. Aug 15 15:09:31 and the simcard was free, right? Aug 15 15:09:39 No, 50p. Aug 15 15:09:48 oh Aug 15 15:10:49 SpeedEvil: this probably sounds terribly ignorant but isnt england using the euro? Aug 15 15:10:52 t-mo USA also has free unlimited through your home gateway if you get the right phone Aug 15 15:10:55 No, not yet. Aug 15 15:11:20 home gateway? Aug 15 15:11:23 Kensan: aux != f5 for me Aug 15 15:11:32 you DSL or cable broadband Aug 15 15:11:41 it runs GSM protocol through the internet Aug 15 15:11:46 Writchie, that's on a contract plan though, right? Aug 15 15:11:50 ah, that sick stuff Aug 15 15:11:51 yup Aug 15 15:12:03 * nibbler_de prefers sip over that Aug 15 15:12:15 Can't roam with SIP. Aug 15 15:12:26 of course you can Aug 15 15:12:34 why should i want to "roam"? Aug 15 15:12:36 UMA is seamless switch over Aug 15 15:12:51 i don't need seamless switch over Aug 15 15:12:58 You start a call on your wireless router over the internet, walk out the door, and it continues on GSM. Aug 15 15:12:59 good for you Aug 15 15:13:08 For some people that's a vital use-case. Aug 15 15:13:17 the interesting kicker with the t-mobile is how the billing works Aug 15 15:13:28 they bill you based on what network you start your call on Aug 15 15:13:46 nibbler_de not everybody has as cheap plans as we do and calls on gsm instead of using dect or other shortrange services for 300meter Aug 15 15:13:47 * nibbler_de does 50-100h/month and never felt the need for such a feature Aug 15 15:14:02 so if you start a call on wifi, but then switch over to the cell network, its free Aug 15 15:14:03 maybe, yeah. Aug 15 15:14:16 juco: they will plug such holes Aug 15 15:14:24 no free lunch Aug 15 15:14:31 Writchie, it works the other way too Aug 15 15:14:41 good to know Aug 15 15:14:48 nibbler_de btw... still in big b? Aug 15 15:14:52 if you start on the cell network, but then switch to wifi, they charge the whole thing as a cell call Aug 15 15:14:54 uhuh Aug 15 15:15:00 roh: until mo/di next week ;) Aug 15 15:15:10 they advertise this Aug 15 15:15:19 juco: i suspect this is a limitation of their current billing system Aug 15 15:15:23 yeah Aug 15 15:15:37 i probably will schedule a date with mme. jasinska this week (the older mme. jasinska that is) Aug 15 15:15:42 whether they fix it or not, will probably depend on what it ends up costing them Aug 15 15:16:05 nibbler_de heh.. me too *sigh* Aug 15 15:16:05 they still have costs when the call switches over Aug 15 15:16:09 unless its on-net Aug 15 15:16:30 but the LD side is virtually free anyway. Aug 15 15:16:47 ScaredyCat: do you get the ScummVM when you press AUX in-game? Aug 15 15:19:04 ScaredyCat: the F5 = AUX assignement is done (via xmodmap) in the openmoko-scummvm script. Aug 15 15:24:18 linux noob needs help: jsut got the phone, need to flash it. I downloaded the dfu-util binary, how does I makes it run? (hangs head in shame) Aug 15 15:24:42 ahhhhhh Aug 15 15:24:54 ok, I was calling scummvm Aug 15 15:24:56 radiorental: Did you check the wiki? Aug 15 15:25:08 followed the wiki Aug 15 15:25:13 radiorental: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko Aug 15 15:25:17 yup Aug 15 15:25:26 are you on a linux box.osx.or.xp Aug 15 15:25:38 64bit? Aug 15 15:26:00 ubuntu Aug 15 15:26:03 bash: dfu-util: command not found Aug 15 15:26:16 try ./dfu-util Aug 15 15:26:19 put it in your path or use ./dfu-util to call it Aug 15 15:26:28 are you saying that dfu-util.bin should just become a command? Aug 15 15:26:48 ok - thanks, will try that, I'm in the same dir Aug 15 15:26:49 also when i flashed mine from the aux/power boot i had to insert the usb cable several times till the DFU mode kicked in Aug 15 15:27:02 and dotn use a hub Aug 15 15:27:26 radiorental make sure to chmod +x dfu-util.bin Aug 15 15:27:48 I'm not getting that far, dfu-util is not a recognised command, again I'm a linux noob so I thought there might have been something else to do to make the binary and executable command Aug 15 15:28:00 chmod +x ./dfu-util Aug 15 15:28:05 that makes it executable Aug 15 15:28:11 thank jrom - thats what I was looking for Aug 15 15:28:34 sorry, I'm a gui designer, incase you're wondering wtf I'm doing with this thing - thanks all for your help Aug 15 15:28:38 openmoko: 03thomas * r2708 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/libmokoui2/ (ChangeLog libmokoui/moko-stock.c): Aug 15 15:28:38 openmoko: * libmokoui/moko-stock.c: (_moko_stock_add_icon): Add a hack to make sure we Aug 15 15:28:38 openmoko: at least have a version of the icons available at each possible GtkIconSize Aug 15 15:28:42 radiorental: Also, remember to press the aux button a few times to keep the phone alive while it's plugged in Aug 15 15:29:04 yer welcome radio. i am happy that people are working on this Aug 15 15:29:07 At least before the flashing starts Aug 15 15:31:06 jr0m: no worky )o; pauric@pauric-desktop:~/Desktop$ ls Aug 15 15:31:06 dfu-util Aug 15 15:31:06 openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01-20070612040932.rootfs.jffs2 Aug 15 15:31:06 uImage-2.6.21.3-moko10-r3_0_0_2189_0-fic-gta01.bin Aug 15 15:31:06 pauric@pauric-desktop:~/Desktop$ sudo chmod +x ./dfu-util Aug 15 15:31:07 pauric@pauric-desktop:~/Desktop$ dfu-util Aug 15 15:31:09 bash: dfu-util: command not found Aug 15 15:31:11 pauric@pauric-desktop:~/Desktop$ Aug 15 15:31:18 ./dfu-util Aug 15 15:31:26 from the dir you are in Aug 15 15:31:42 radiorental: Also, that looks like an old build Aug 15 15:31:43 you need to use "./" to run a binary not in your path Aug 15 15:31:46 doh! (o; thnx Aug 15 15:32:02 I'd suggest flashing a newer one Aug 15 15:32:02 get a newer image too Aug 15 15:32:18 im using gta01-20070803091138 Aug 15 15:32:19 CM: grabbed from latest, will go back and look again Aug 15 15:32:30 thnx both! Aug 15 15:32:43 radiorental: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp/deploy/images/openmoko-devel-image-fic-gta01-20070803091138.rootfs.jffs2 Aug 15 15:32:59 radiorental: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp/deploy/images/uImage-2.6.21.6-moko11-r1_0_0_2388_0-fic-gta01.bin Aug 15 15:33:10 anyone tried using with USA Cingular Aug 15 15:33:11 ? Aug 15 15:35:58 jr0m, http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=666 Aug 15 15:36:45 ScaredyCat: don't you have a entry in the menu under Games? Aug 15 15:37:01 I just added it myself Aug 15 15:37:18 well, I added it after installing... Aug 15 15:37:33 ScaredyCat: it should create one automatically. Aug 15 15:37:34 but I didn;t see any other entry there Aug 15 15:38:37 I only have scummvm.desktop which i created... Aug 15 15:38:50 maybe I wasn't paying attention :/ Aug 15 15:39:48 ScaredyCat: it should automatically create the appropriate entry in the "main" menu under Games. Aug 15 15:40:05 thanks juco Aug 15 15:45:09 ScaredyCat: say, does 2007.2 yet ask you for a PIN on its own? Aug 15 15:45:36 depends which image data etc ... Aug 15 16:09:23 mhm. fun. .2 and the icon bar on the top disappears when selecting power on Aug 15 16:10:10 ixs, call it by the name: it doesn't disappear, it crashes :) Aug 15 16:11:04 thomasg: :-) Aug 15 16:11:28 thomasg: I actually first wrote crashes, considered, deleted it and wrote disappears instead. :D Aug 15 16:12:08 (script) openmoko-devel: "Michael 'Mickey' Lauer" Re: How to rebuild xorg-xserver Aug 15 16:13:14 what gsm provider are people in the US using with the Neo's? (re: post on -community) Aug 15 16:14:18 * SpeedEvil stabs idiot phone vendors that don't put out clear releases. Aug 15 16:14:20 ' Aug 15 16:14:21 Nokia has identified that in very rare cases the affected batteries could potentially experience over heating initiated by a short circuit while charging, causing the battery to dislodge. Nokia is working closely with relevant local authorities to investigate this situation. ' Aug 15 16:14:34 What the hell does that mean. Aug 15 16:14:43 Does it mean that if it's shorted, it can overheat? Aug 15 16:14:57 speedevil the know it and didnt say until some batteries blow up Aug 15 16:15:31 woglinde: but thoese were surely some 3rd party ripp-offs from china or something, amirite? :-> Aug 15 16:15:40 ixs no original Aug 15 16:15:43 No, OEM. Aug 15 16:15:48 Some with phones. Aug 15 16:15:53 ixs maybee manufactured in the same fabric Aug 15 16:15:56 who knows Aug 15 16:16:17 fuck Aug 15 16:16:21 okay. I'll just repeat that "amirite" is something akin to "!!!!1111!!1111!11" thus indicating a joke. Aug 15 16:16:24 you can laugh now. :D Aug 15 16:16:31 why I didnt by vmware stocks Aug 15 16:18:18 woglinde: so go buy now, the market is open Aug 15 16:18:25 jgm lol Aug 15 16:18:31 is it planned to give openmoko applications a (context) menu like the one in the titlebar of maemo apps? I think this would be very much needed for conetext sensitive stuff and most of all for copy&pase stuff. Aug 15 16:18:35 you know how the market works Aug 15 16:19:04 klicking in the title bar brings uo menu in openmoko. but with only one entry, the home screen afaik Aug 15 16:19:14 woglinde: yep and if they were a good buy yesterday they're a good buy today Aug 15 16:20:07 Or buy EMC, there must be some drag-along in there that the market isn't showing (for some weird reason) Aug 15 16:20:26 jgm no now its to late and to risky Aug 15 16:20:55 I remember people saying that about Google the day after it floated Aug 15 16:21:03 (And Brocade, if you can remember that far back) Aug 15 16:21:09 ERROR: '/home/tilli/moko/openembedded/packages/linux/linux-gta01_2.6.21.5.bb' failed Aug 15 16:21:11 (And actually a bunch of other stocks, but hey :)) Aug 15 16:21:28 Strangely this happens while building glibc. And i see no output for this problem Aug 15 16:22:28 oh, i see. glibc is done. maybe linux-gta01 would be the nex receipe. But how can i check what is wrong without output? Aug 15 16:22:49 DPThought: look in work/linux-gta01-2.6.21.5/temp/log.* for the error Aug 15 16:25:43 pH5: thx Aug 15 16:27:56 interesting i have a 63698A 1002 SIM, wiki says it should work. Do i need to use the commandline string to test dialing? Aug 15 16:28:32 pH5: cant file such file. should that be build/tmp/work/ (new MakeFile) Aug 15 16:28:54 jr0m try it Aug 15 16:29:01 but dont forget to stp the dialer before Aug 15 16:29:15 ty woglinde Aug 15 16:29:48 i got my openmoko last night. this is my first hour with it Aug 15 16:30:44 jr0m than read the wiki read the wiki and ask when something is not in the wiki *g* Aug 15 16:31:37 yup. sorry to spam Aug 15 16:32:19 *g* Aug 15 16:32:21 no prob Aug 15 16:32:44 ahhh i just found the entry for Manually using GSM. thank you wiki Aug 15 16:32:54 screw the dialer... Aug 15 16:33:02 * ScaredyCat can;t stop playing monkey island Aug 15 16:33:14 ScaredyCat *g* Aug 15 16:33:19 blackbox is pretty addictive too... Aug 15 16:33:22 DPThought: yes, that would be it. Aug 15 16:33:30 * pH5 tries to build Jagged Alliance 2 Aug 15 16:33:53 a pinball game where nice Aug 15 16:35:27 woglinde: for that I'd need the accelerometers though :) Aug 15 16:35:37 ph5 yes *g* Aug 15 16:36:33 * CM has once broken his wrist on a pinball game Aug 15 16:36:45 (And yes, it did tilt..) Aug 15 16:36:55 cm lol Aug 15 16:37:07 pH5: oh, i think there is a bug in the makefile. Maybe that is causing it. thank you Aug 15 16:37:09 (script) openmoko-community: "Michael 'Mickey' Lauer" Re: Open Hardware Aug 15 16:37:44 rwhitby: ERROR: opening /home/tilli/moko/oe/packages/*/*.bb: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/home/tilli/moko/oe/packages/*/*.bb' Aug 15 16:38:04 rwhitby: there is no dir in my moko dir Aug 15 16:38:20 * pH5 bows to CM's violence Aug 15 16:38:29 rwhitby: i mean no 'oe' dir Aug 15 16:38:54 * * OM Bug 708 has been created by kresp0(AT)yahoo.es Aug 15 16:38:55 * * when ask for PIN, the number sign key (#) must work as "OK" Aug 15 16:38:56 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=708 Aug 15 16:38:59 I have my phone up and running with a t-mob sim card, but no volume, known issue? Aug 15 16:39:15 radiorental alsamixer Aug 15 16:39:20 thnx Aug 15 16:39:24 per default all is mute Aug 15 16:39:54 how do I turn on the backlight manually ? Aug 15 16:40:37 xkr47 should be in the wiki Aug 15 16:40:41 at powersavings Aug 15 16:43:26 woglinde: how do I configure it, got it running in the terminal but dont know how to navigate it Aug 15 16:43:46 radiorental open the the keyboard Aug 15 16:43:50 yup Aug 15 16:43:51 but the second one Aug 15 16:43:59 with the up down keys Aug 15 16:44:01 yup Aug 15 16:44:16 ah Aug 15 16:44:18 try m Aug 15 16:44:22 for mute/unmute Aug 15 16:44:30 than up down keys and right left Aug 15 16:46:11 * xkr47 finds /sys/class/backlight/gta01-bl Aug 15 16:46:29 sorry, me stupid, not seeing any keyboard with direction keys: caps, small, numeric, special char and a null button Aug 15 16:47:03 hi everyone Aug 15 16:47:37 * xkr47 does not get backlight to turn on Aug 15 16:48:21 I am trying to rebuild OpenMoko. I did the make update-makefile and make setup again. Now I'm getting patch problems with uboot's include/asm-arm/mach-types.h Aug 15 16:50:13 anyone know how to get around this? Aug 15 16:50:29 the actual_brightness says 0 Aug 15 16:50:35 inverted Aug 15 16:50:48 hmm when I pressed the power button now, the screen turned on Aug 15 16:52:15 main screen turn on? Aug 15 16:52:28 :D Aug 15 16:52:37 We got signal? Aug 15 16:52:57 s/got/get/ Aug 15 16:53:09 or hmm how was it :) Aug 15 16:53:32 get Aug 15 16:53:54 What happen? Aug 15 16:53:55 Somebody set up us the bomb Aug 15 16:54:22 we get signal! Aug 15 16:54:25 the moko :) Aug 15 16:54:40 ? Aug 15 16:54:48 rxr, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_your_base_are_belong_to_us Aug 15 16:54:49 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Camera]] [[Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Scroll-wheel_%28side-mounted%29]] [[Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Touch_strip_sensor_%28side-mounted%29]] [[Scummvm]] [[P1_Owners]] [[User_talk:THe_IkkE]] and other changes Aug 15 16:54:52 * ScaredyCat goes back to monkey island.. Aug 15 16:55:48 http://www.allyourbase.com Aug 15 16:55:52 cd /sys/class/backlight/gta01-bl ; for i in `seq 5194 -100 0` `seq 0 100 5194` ; do echo $i > brightness ; done Aug 15 16:55:58 :) Aug 15 16:56:12 whooaa. it's dead Aug 15 16:56:28 what you say! Aug 15 16:56:46 On my neo, 204 is '0' approximately. Aug 15 16:56:49 did anyone ever used the http://www.frogpad.com/? I think i need a small (wareable?) bluetooth keyboard in the next future... Aug 15 16:56:59 brightness ? Aug 15 16:56:59 make your time Aug 15 16:57:27 yes. Aug 15 16:57:40 206 is clearly visible (in the dark) Aug 15 16:57:46 200 is black. Aug 15 16:57:52 DPThought: I'm too old to re-learn how to type Aug 15 16:58:39 206 sure, but dunno if I can read it Aug 15 16:58:45 (console) Aug 15 16:58:48 Repeat: I am trying to rebuild OpenMoko. I did the make update-makefile and make setup again. Now I'm getting patch problems with uboot's include/asm-arm/mach-types.h Aug 15 16:58:57 206 is pitch black for me Aug 15 16:59:12 206 or so by memory Aug 15 16:59:15 it's around there. Aug 15 16:59:59 216 ? Aug 15 17:00:23 ScaredyCat: same here, i think. i can use a new way to hack on my keybard (i'm using a typematrix board right now) but it whould at least have querty. Aug 15 17:00:38 s/whould/should/ Aug 15 17:00:39 DPThought meant: ScaredyCat: same here, i think. i can use a new way to hack on my keybard (i'm using a typematrix board right now) but it should at least have querty. Aug 15 17:01:15 apt: ;) Aug 15 17:01:16 (: Aug 15 17:01:35 * xkr47 makes a stroboscope out of his neo ;) Aug 15 17:02:00 2500 is way bright enough indoors Aug 15 17:02:03 i tried learning dvorak. It did not work. I think i will just continue hating qwerty the rest of my live :) Aug 15 17:02:44 i don;t hate qwerty.... Aug 15 17:02:48 it's all i know Aug 15 17:02:55 yeah, 2500 is nice Aug 15 17:03:01 none of that weird foreign azerty shite Aug 15 17:03:26 jseghers: can you pastebin the error-log? Aug 15 17:06:17 DPThought, if you try the frogpad, tell me the results :) Aug 15 17:06:59 ScaredyCat: qwerty is definitely the coders layout. It is inefficient and designet for mechanical constrains on typewriters. But it's at least way better than let's say the germen layout (qwertz). As long as coders have to use []{}&*()$@ all the time, us layout is just the best way to go. But i still hate it for it's impropriety, i'm just not using a typewriter any more. :) Aug 15 17:07:23 thomasg: the price tag is a bit high for a trial Aug 15 17:07:53 DPThought, that was also my opinion - nevertheless the concept is interesting Aug 15 17:09:54 oh, i have to go. My colleague is waiting. We will watch "Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas" open ait. Should be fun but we are not yet drunk... Aug 15 17:10:11 cya Aug 15 17:11:11 Kensan: I'm currently using Trillian for my IRC client... can't see a way to paste the error as a file. Aug 15 17:13:36 jseghers: pastebin.ca Aug 15 17:14:14 jseghers: or pastebin.com Aug 15 17:14:59 Kensan... switching to xchat on my linux box... be back in a moment. Aug 15 17:19:39 Kensan: OK... I didn't realize what pastebin was... here's the error: Aug 15 17:19:40 http://pastebin.com/m22be0eaf Aug 15 17:32:22 jseghers: either put BBMASK="uboot" in build/conf/local.conf (this says bitbake to not build uboot) or update your environment -- you can find instructions how to do so on wiki for MokoMakefile Aug 15 17:34:51 ynezz: I did update the environment (unless you're saying to move to 2007.2?) I see at the bottom of the MokoMakefile page it suggests using a specific Revision of U-boot... How do I modifiy the .bb to use that specific revision? Aug 15 17:35:18 ynezz: never mind... I think I just found an example. Aug 15 17:37:09 if you're not hacking on uboot you don't need it to built it anyway... Aug 15 17:40:34 ynezz: OK. I won't worry about it...but it does seem to be building now using rev. cc3023b9f95d7ac959a764471a65001062aecf41 Aug 15 17:41:31 ynezz: I'm due to get my neo today, so I'm rebuilding to make sure I've got a current image including the stuff I'm working on :) Aug 15 17:47:16 Thanks for the help! bye now... Aug 15 17:57:40 OpenMoko is slow on QEmu :( Aug 15 17:58:04 indeed Aug 15 18:01:51 OpenMoko is slow on Neo1973 P1 too :P Aug 15 18:05:06 ;) Aug 15 18:06:53 I was actually pleasantly surprised that Moko was faster on the actual hardware than my AMD64X2 4400+ Aug 15 18:07:03 (when using qemu, 'course) Aug 15 18:11:10 damn Neo phonoe battery drains in one day even if the phone is "off", ??? Aug 15 18:11:45 same here, was wondering if some device is accidentally left on Aug 15 18:12:13 again, the gsm module can be left off even if the linux system is down Aug 15 18:12:18 left on Aug 15 18:12:27 again.. :) Aug 15 18:12:29 is there some kind of holiday where FIC are? Aug 15 18:12:36 needs to be deliberately turned off Aug 15 18:12:52 they asked me to send in new CC, sent it in, then 1 week silence :/ Aug 15 18:33:55 rxr: if you want to avoid that, pull the battery out for ten seconds after you power down. Aug 15 18:34:13 what's going on is that the power management chip stays live after shutdown, and slowly drains the battery. Aug 15 18:43:38 hello openmokians! Aug 15 18:46:26 greets! Aug 15 18:53:22 NICE Aug 15 18:53:26 just got my neo in Aug 15 18:53:42 boots straight to a kernel panic... that was to be expected though... :D Aug 15 18:53:44 mellon: normal phones have a standby time of a week and a switched off time of a month or so .. Aug 15 18:53:49 very nice piece of hardware Aug 15 18:53:57 of much µA does the PMU chip draw ? :-) Aug 15 18:54:00 rxr: I'm just telling you why it's happening, not saying it's correct. Aug 15 18:54:08 probably the GSM is left on by the kernel right now or so Aug 15 18:54:10 rxr: I think the number bandied about was 10ma. Aug 15 18:54:17 mintee you gotta flashit Aug 15 18:54:35 m as in milli ? Aug 15 18:54:37 that is much Aug 15 18:54:38 jr0m, yeah, i figured something like that... i'm going to read up some moor on the wiki Aug 15 18:54:38 for a PMU Aug 15 18:55:07 yeah, I think it's not being shut down properly. but this is just based on some stuff that went by a couple of days ago; someone probably knows better by now. Aug 15 18:55:29 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Wishlist:NeoMidiTracker]] [[Current_events]] Aug 15 18:55:46 mintee: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/SH1 Aug 15 18:56:02 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko Aug 15 18:56:53 thanks jr0m Aug 15 18:57:11 question, intermittently when I try to 'power on the gsm antenna' the whole taskbar dissappears. How can I recover that without rebooting? thnx Aug 15 18:57:47 ssh is your friend radiorental Aug 15 18:58:58 thanks jr0m (o; Aug 15 18:59:09 j/k sorry Aug 15 19:01:26 known issue or just me? Aug 15 19:02:19 I have the same Aug 15 19:03:24 radiorental: that is a bug that happens from what I saw when you have no SIM or no compatible SIM in the device Aug 15 19:04:25 rxr, interesting. The sim card has worked. But with the taskbar bombs, the sim card isnt 'working' Aug 15 19:05:05 that is, it wont pick up a signal. Its a straight t-mob sim Aug 15 19:05:24 been dialing/receiving since getting the phone up and running Aug 15 19:06:02 rxr: but thanks, that explains a few things. Aug 15 19:06:55 wow this build system is nice. goodwork OpenMoko Aug 15 19:06:55 radiorental: your welcome Aug 15 19:07:08 OE and nice ? Aug 15 19:07:52 yes, i just built it up on ubuntu 7.04, it just seems more polished than my gumstix toolchain buildroot system Aug 15 19:08:07 are you using t-mobile pay as you go or post-paid? Aug 15 19:08:18 jr0m: using mokomakefile? Aug 15 19:08:23 yup Aug 15 19:08:26 jr0m: http://www.t2-project.org/ Aug 15 19:08:57 ferric, pay as you go Aug 15 19:09:01 hmm. neeto Aug 15 19:09:52 this might call for a new VM for T2 Aug 15 19:09:59 thanks rxr Aug 15 19:10:04 VM ? Aug 15 19:10:13 virtual machine. i use parallels Aug 15 19:10:21 haha, yeah Aug 15 19:12:54 so all the devices are GTA01Bv4 ? Aug 15 19:13:07 Anyone know which item in alsmixer controls the internal speaker, cant seem to unmute it - thanks Aug 15 19:14:02 radiorental: "amp mode" Aug 15 19:14:08 rxr: fwiw I rebooted and powered up the antenna OK, so I think its not really a case of no/bad sim... Aug 15 19:14:17 thanks jeddy3 Aug 15 19:14:17 rxr: are you using t2/neo on yer omoko? Aug 15 19:14:53 jr0m: yes, I already have a uClibC based system on the SD Aug 15 19:15:19 radiorental: aha - for me the panel always crashed when there was no compatbiel or no SIM Aug 15 19:15:33 jr0m: but it takes some more days until we have a full UI stack Aug 15 19:15:40 but I'll not use the moko widgets Aug 15 19:15:51 I do not like the reinvention of yet another Gtk+ wheel Aug 15 19:16:09 aside GPE comes to mind, we'll also in-house write EFL (E17) applications Aug 15 19:16:31 jr0m: T2 is already in quite wide use as you can imagine from the news feed Aug 15 19:16:52 but not yet on phones, that is why I got us the Neo, as a T2 testbed ... Aug 15 19:17:15 cu - have to run for dinner :-) Aug 15 19:17:21 9pm here in Germany Aug 15 19:17:39 yes i liked rasterman's work with evas/e17 Aug 15 19:18:35 rxr: how's the efl-work going forward? Aug 15 19:21:50 rxr: what do you mean by the gtk+ wheel? Aug 15 19:23:49 rxr: so put up your SD flash image.... Aug 15 19:23:59 i have an extra 512 right here. :> Aug 15 19:24:12 rxr: also, made some calls and then it stopped. Tried to power down the antenna and the taskbar crashed. Aug 15 19:28:32 :( No DFU capable USB device found Aug 15 19:28:48 anyone ever got that? Aug 15 19:29:07 u-boot failed, or device off, or device has booted linux Aug 15 19:29:14 or broken usb controller host side Aug 15 19:29:18 mintee_: is dfu-util run as root ? Aug 15 19:29:22 or that Aug 15 19:29:23 yeah Aug 15 19:29:23 >.> Aug 15 19:29:29 shouldn't be root? Aug 15 19:29:31 should be Aug 15 19:29:35 hum.. Aug 15 19:29:43 make sure /proc/bus/usb is mounted Aug 15 19:29:45 could be be because host machine is a 2.4 kernal? Aug 15 19:29:45 libusb uses it Aug 15 19:29:50 thats probably it Aug 15 19:30:03 2.4 is a bit old D: Aug 15 19:30:09 yeah, no /proc/bus/usb Aug 15 19:30:18 won't work then Aug 15 19:30:20 wow, 2.4... Aug 15 19:30:22 2.4.31 # Aug 15 19:30:26 is that still allowed to run ? Aug 15 19:30:29 lol Aug 15 19:30:40 allowed? Aug 15 19:30:42 ...why not? Aug 15 19:31:07 anrp: because it's almost older than the sun Aug 15 19:31:12 it was a joke Aug 15 19:32:10 lukhas_nowhere: No jokes, please. This is irc. Serious business only. Aug 15 19:32:26 :) Aug 15 19:44:45 i have suns much older than that machine. :) Aug 15 19:45:41 * mwester has daughters much older than that machine. :) Aug 15 19:46:37 i got a 2.6.11 kernel going on two years now D: so Aug 15 19:49:43 hmmm, does someone know why the Neo always looses its date/time? Aug 15 19:50:27 i am in canada, does anyone know how much openmoko phone costs? and how i can get it ? pls ? Aug 15 19:50:48 er, order it from the website? Aug 15 19:50:50 hhf423, there's no sync to hardware-clock on shutdown Aug 15 19:50:59 ah Aug 15 19:51:02 i can use with my carrier here ? Aug 15 19:51:03 vj_vj, see topic, though there's apparently a bit of a queue at this point Aug 15 19:51:19 vj_vj, if you have GSM providers, you should Aug 15 19:51:43 vj_vj, though there's some issue with at least US AT&T/Cingular's some (not all) SIMs not working currently Aug 15 19:51:48 hhf423, you can use 'hwclock' (see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973#Setting_date_and_time) Aug 15 19:52:33 i will need to connect with rogers, any one had previous experience ?? Aug 15 19:52:38 Kensan: I once tried stelling the date via ubott and it tooks the time, but after the next flash it was gone again Aug 15 19:54:20 vj_vj: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Carriers#Canada Aug 15 20:06:47 hhf423: hwclock -w Aug 15 20:07:00 in linux. Aug 15 20:07:38 ScaredyCat: just to let you know, your 2007.1 from August 10 image did ask me for PIN and registered on the network, the 2007.2 image from today do not Aug 15 20:37:05 if we get a GTA01, will it be possible to change order/add pieces to make it a 02 later on or are we stuck buying a full 02? Aug 15 20:37:05 mobodo: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Aug 15 20:38:29 mobodo: forget this Aug 15 20:38:35 ok Aug 15 20:39:05 it was discussed but its just too difficult and likely to destroy delicate parts like the lcd which is glued in Aug 15 20:39:27 there will probably be an ebay market for GTA01's Aug 15 20:39:43 they will be far from worthless when the software is further along Aug 15 20:40:15 indeed - without wifi with stereo versions that'll run the same software Aug 15 20:40:20 sure, the hardware as it is would probably be enough for my needs, but I'll want wifi Aug 15 20:40:48 (script) planet: Michael "mickeyl" Lauer: Python 2.5 in OpenEmbedded http://www.vanille-media.de/site/index.php/2007/08/15/python-25-in-openembedded/ Aug 15 20:40:57 I need wifi more than stereo. Both would be better but i'll take what i can get Aug 15 20:41:08 you have to give both arms and sell your parents here to get internet on your cellphone Aug 15 20:41:29 i've been using internet on my mobile phone for 6 years Aug 15 20:41:32 :D Aug 15 20:41:50 you do know that you bluetooth into a linux box and get a couple of hundred Kps Aug 15 20:41:54 started out with hscsd 14.4kbps connection from a journada 540 Aug 15 20:42:04 it's bluetooth 2? Aug 15 20:42:27 2.0 and also EDR IIRC Aug 15 20:42:32 ahh! nice Aug 15 20:42:44 you actually might get closer to a megabit Aug 15 20:42:57 yeah, that's not bad Aug 15 20:43:10 a class 1 dongle will give you decent range Aug 15 20:43:17 but not worth 300$ now if waiting 3-4 months gets me wifi Aug 15 20:43:51 class 1 should be 10 metres - certainly enough range for some asshat to send me midget porn on the train from the other end of the carriage Aug 15 20:43:58 ill get the next one too. all my mom wants is a dialer/addressbook openphone Aug 15 20:44:08 she can have my sh1 Aug 15 20:44:14 class 1 is 100 meters Aug 15 20:44:18 i deluged him with cat pictures in return Aug 15 20:44:19 class 2 is 10 meters Aug 15 20:44:25 how's the development organized - can you simulate the device on a linux box? Aug 15 20:44:26 your mileage may vary Aug 15 20:44:27 oops Aug 15 20:44:33 the development isn't organized Aug 15 20:44:38 ahah Aug 15 20:44:48 mobodo: see the wiki under qemu Aug 15 20:44:50 mobodo. you can use qemu/xoo/xephyr Aug 15 20:44:59 ok Aug 15 20:45:23 the openmokomakefile is pretty smooth to setup a build enviornment Aug 15 20:45:42 the osx openmoko flasher is sweet as weel Aug 15 20:45:48 someone's working on a video player? Aug 15 20:48:00 mobodo: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Video_Player Aug 15 20:48:14 mobodo: it's worth taking a closer look at the wiki, tons of info. Aug 15 20:48:40 yeah, just thought I'd get a quick start here, I'll have a look :) Aug 15 20:49:41 wiki is best place for a quick start Aug 15 20:49:54 this room is mainly for bashing developers Aug 15 20:49:58 ;) Aug 15 20:50:10 how about shipping personell? can i bash them? :) Aug 15 20:50:23 you got to find them first Aug 15 20:50:48 not that i have time to dev on my openmoko... i've already got openmosix, xrdp, qemu, and prototype wearable computing gear... Aug 15 20:51:38 and two jobs.. Aug 15 20:52:54 does anyone know approx. how many Neo1973 GTA02 units will be ready to ship in Oct.? Aug 15 20:53:05 it seems like their is going to be quite a demand Aug 15 20:53:10 there* Aug 15 20:55:09 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko2007.2]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Wishlist_-_Hardware:_Digital_compass]] [[User_talk:PTT]] Aug 15 21:01:02 should there be something about resolv.conf here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking Aug 15 21:13:50 my openmoko has been expidited... to the other side of the bleeding planet. Aug 15 21:14:13 juri_: wow Aug 15 21:16:51 juri_, how did that happen ?-( Aug 15 21:20:57 hi all Aug 15 21:21:53 tuukkah: no-one knows yet. ;P Aug 15 21:22:22 ScaredyCat: I turned off my Neo, and when trying to boot the same thing happened again.. No boot menu, just boot and factory reset. :( Aug 15 21:22:56 ScaredyCat: Tried to overwrite mtdblock1 again like last time, but that didn't really help. I'll leave it for later... Time to sleep Aug 15 21:23:05 hi stefan_schmidt Aug 15 21:23:16 hi woglinde Aug 15 21:27:39 woglinde, hi Aug 15 21:29:24 hi guillaum Aug 15 21:29:56 grr, "telinit 1" was not a good idea Aug 15 21:33:18 oops Aug 15 21:33:56 doh, it looks like I have only broken harddisks left... Aug 15 21:34:32 * hhf423 wonders where he has left the one harddisk he knows is not broken Aug 15 21:41:30 where the HECK did it go? Aug 15 21:42:09 hhf423: Don't give up. We're all counting on you. Aug 15 21:42:16 :-) Aug 15 21:48:52 * hhf423 now has three and a half candidates for "festplattenweitwurf" Aug 15 21:52:26 are you people able to resolve host names in 2007.2? Aug 15 21:53:43 tuukkah: no, well not after starting up gprs maunally and getting a connection Aug 15 21:53:57 anyone plans to go to FrOScon? Aug 15 21:54:09 i'm trying on usb networking Aug 15 21:54:55 tuukkah: with USB networking I did not even try. did you configure a nameserver? Aug 15 21:57:40 hhf423: I will be @ froscon. Aug 15 21:57:45 even talking, I'm afraid Aug 15 21:57:46 :D Aug 15 21:58:08 /etc/resolv.cong thukka Aug 15 21:58:16 nameserver 1.2.3.4 Aug 15 21:58:18 there was no /etc/resolv.conf but i tried to make one with "nameserver 192.168.0.200" but it didn't help Aug 15 21:58:20 nameserver 4.5.6.7 Aug 15 21:58:33 mickeyl: yes, :-) I read that Aug 15 21:58:35 it won't - unless that box is acting as a nameserver Aug 15 21:58:41 it is Aug 15 21:58:52 and unless you've set that box as your gateway Aug 15 21:58:56 need to prepare some OM-2007.2 images Aug 15 21:58:59 for the slides Aug 15 21:59:04 woglinde, did you try some complex MIDlets on the neo ? Aug 15 21:59:06 and you've got it properly setup to forward to the internet Aug 15 21:59:15 mickeyl, have you seen abraxa? Aug 15 21:59:23 <-- is noon Aug 15 21:59:39 speerschleuder: not for a while. i think he's in USA now isn't he? Aug 15 21:59:40 <--- is ten past three. Aug 15 21:59:43 mickeyl: you probably don't need any help, but if you do, let me know. I am good with storylines for slides Aug 15 22:00:33 hhf423: thanks. i was planning to reuse an older presentation with some current info ;) Aug 15 22:01:18 whooo, looks like ubuntu is installing ok on a half broken hdd Aug 15 22:01:44 mickeyl, yes he is. but is not his deadline coming? Aug 15 22:01:58 SpeedEvil, perhaps it's my firewall... let me check Aug 15 22:02:12 mickeyl, I think on the 20. or something like taht Aug 15 22:03:29 mickeyl: if you have some way of showing the kinetic scrolling live, that will "wow" the audience, even if its kind of a cheap trick :-) Aug 15 22:03:30 SpeedEvil, yeah, that was it, sorry for the trouble Aug 15 22:03:34 :) Aug 15 22:03:49 speerschleuder: i don't know the gsoc dates offhand, but yes, it's not far away Aug 15 22:04:10 What is the easiest way to fetch the latest updates of the openmoko-source and rebuild the image without rebuilding everything. Aug 15 22:04:11 hhf423: agreed. i'm not sure how to do this without camera though. Aug 15 22:04:26 hhf423: perhaps a video would be ok, since VNC or any similar method is too slow Aug 15 22:04:31 i also noticed ogg123 started working only after running madplay. perhaps an oss vs. alsa issue Aug 15 22:04:48 mickeyl: video is a good idea Aug 15 22:05:18 hhf423: i need to check with the organization then. videos always give problems w/ beamer Aug 15 22:05:25 s/always/often/ Aug 15 22:05:25 mickeyl meant: hhf423: i need to check with the organization then. videos often give problems w/ beamer Aug 15 22:05:35 mickeyl: there is no GPS stuff that you can demo, no? Because Sean used that as a nice feature a lot in his talks/interviews Aug 15 22:06:03 mickeyl: a video embedded in the presentation should be a no brainer Aug 15 22:06:09 i'm afraid i would have to use GPS for the first time on a Neo Aug 15 22:06:17 i have stayed out of all that closed-source crap for now Aug 15 22:06:32 ~lart gllin Aug 15 22:06:32 * apt pulls out his louisville slugger and uses gllin's head to break the homerun record Aug 15 22:06:37 well, then it has to wait Aug 15 22:07:19 mickeyl: make sure that you talk about what is available to developers right now, the ones who have and the ones who have no neo Aug 15 22:07:24 btw: they got the doppler shift now set :-) Aug 15 22:09:52 anyway. time for bed. bye Aug 15 22:15:21 could it be that the click sound blocks ogg123 from working Aug 15 22:16:35 at least "sleep 30; ogg123" works better Aug 15 22:18:40 now i have an excuse to carry the neo around wherever i go :-) Aug 15 22:18:40 t Aug 15 22:19:49 here I go, the bl**dy linux up and running Aug 15 22:20:00 ogg D: Aug 15 22:20:05 146 updates... Aug 15 22:20:57 I need a faster harddisk Aug 15 22:21:08 who doesn't ? Aug 15 22:21:15 * mickeyl needs a faster computer Aug 15 22:22:49 mm, how to use headphones instead of speakers? Aug 15 22:26:16 honestly, this harddisk is half broken , 20gb and from like 6 years ago. but a new one is ordered. ata133 should do something for the speed Aug 15 22:26:37 I'm not fussy. Aug 15 22:26:41 these days I think most of the bottleneck is actually the harddisk and maybe RAM Aug 15 22:27:10 try alsactl restore -f /etc/headphones.state (or so) Aug 15 22:27:56 "Amp Mode" is able to switch off the stereo speakers and use "call speaker" instead, but in amp mode "headphone" i can still hear nothing from the headphones Aug 15 22:28:05 I would sooo like to have a 2007.2 which will bother me for the SIM PIN Aug 15 22:29:16 mickeyl, that state file is missing from this image (2007.2 unofficial snapshot from 20070813) Aug 15 22:29:38 tuukkah: we include all we have IIRC Aug 15 22:29:43 might mean we don't have one now Aug 15 22:29:51 i'd be thankful for one Aug 15 22:30:21 hhf423: me too. we have some gsmd developer shortage ... *cough* Aug 15 22:32:20 mickeyl: if you had a good spec for a dbus layer to control the phone and handset functions would you incorporate it? Aug 15 22:33:01 Writchie: yes, however only if it is an additional package to gsmd. The gsmd author insists on making the core package without a dependency to dbus. Aug 15 22:33:15 e.g. gsmd-dbus would be most appreciated Aug 15 22:34:23 mickeyl: I think he can life with dbus code inside the the libgsmd tree, but be able to choose if it is enabled or not Aug 15 22:34:24 i'm thinking in terms of layers dbus -> libgsmd -> gsmd where any layer is in principle replacable Aug 15 22:34:35 stefan_schmidt: yes Aug 15 22:34:40 Writchie: yeah Aug 15 22:35:21 i just don't want to waste my time if its not going to be seriously considered Aug 15 22:35:33 mickeyl: ++ from me on this. dbus is nice, but having the choice is better. And don't forget taht he never has done dbus before. :) Aug 15 22:35:52 right Aug 15 22:35:58 Writchie: it would be most appreciated, really. Aug 15 22:36:18 Writchie: it even is on my agenda, however very far down, so I'd be happy if someone would beat me to it Aug 15 22:36:56 i have a more elaborate vision for the capabilities of the "phone" daemon Aug 15 22:37:13 like? Aug 15 22:37:41 like do what handsets do, including MMS, EMS, WML, etc. - perhaps not all at once Aug 15 22:38:12 and most particular i18n Aug 15 22:38:12 according to wiki the difference between speakers and headset is "LM4857: route to LLS+-/RLS+- " vs. "routed on LM4856 to LHP/RHP" Aug 15 22:38:47 SpeedEvil: and provide underlying capability to meet the gsm handset MMI spec. Aug 15 22:47:40 "There's a National Semiconductor LM4857 Stereo Amplifier at the analog audio output of the WM8753" Aug 15 22:48:06 RP: is the problem known that if you supply multiple packages on the command line that depend on each other their dependencies are not honored ? Aug 15 22:48:12 e.g. foo depends on bar Aug 15 22:48:14 bitbake foo bar Aug 15 22:48:21 tries to build both at once w/ multiple bitbake threads Aug 15 22:48:28 mickeyl: no :/ Aug 15 22:48:53 i think this is a bug since long Aug 15 22:48:59 ouch Aug 15 22:49:01 i forgot to report though Aug 15 22:49:10 since it's a rare case probably noone else noticed Aug 15 22:49:20 Nobody's told me about it :) Aug 15 22:49:34 Well, until now Aug 15 22:49:48 I'd file a bug so we don't forget Aug 15 22:50:07 k Aug 15 22:55:28 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User_talk:Hhf423]] [[Booting_from_NFS]] [[P1_Owners]] Aug 15 22:56:02 hahaha, the openmoko is probably the only phone you can boot from NFS Aug 15 23:00:07 hhf423 hm the motorolas should be too Aug 15 23:05:05 re Aug 15 23:07:56 mickeyl: I can't reproduce. bitbake dbus dbus-glib does exactly what I'd expect here Aug 15 23:08:20 lm4856 datasheet doesn't show any LLS+-/RLS+- or LHP/RHP connectors. instead, it shows two mono inputs, one stereo input, one mono output, and one stereo output Aug 15 23:08:38 They are probably internal names. Aug 15 23:08:44 Which would be on teh schematic. Aug 15 23:09:05 I assume left loudspeaker, left headphone, ... Aug 15 23:09:22 the mono output is I believe the earpiece speaker. Aug 15 23:09:27 RP: how many threads do you have enabled? Aug 15 23:09:32 * mickeyl BB_NUMBER_THREADS = 10 Aug 15 23:09:33 mickeyl: 4 Aug 15 23:10:19 mickeyl: The number of threads wouldn't matter though, I had enough idle to allow it to run dbus-glib while it was waiting for dbus-glib-native and it didn't Aug 15 23:10:33 hmm bummer Aug 15 23:10:46 mickeyl: bitbake -g showed the dependency and it honored it Aug 15 23:11:04 mickeyl: Does bitbake -g show the dependency in your python case? Aug 15 23:12:10 RP: how can i view dot files again? Aug 15 23:12:38 mickeyl: I just read them by hand, I can't find a viewer that can cope with the number of links we have Aug 15 23:12:46 heh, k Aug 15 23:12:54 SpeedEvil, lm4857 seems to have LLS+-/RLS+- and LHP/RHP (also EP+- and mono LINEOUT) Aug 15 23:14:05 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "gcc-cross.do_populate_staging" Aug 15 23:14:05 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "python.do_populate_staging" Aug 15 23:14:05 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "shasum-native.do_populate_staging" Aug 15 23:14:05 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "python-vorbis.do_unpack" Aug 15 23:14:07 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "python-vorbis.do_patch" Aug 15 23:14:08 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "libvorbis.do_populate_staging" Aug 15 23:14:10 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "glibc.do_populate_staging" Aug 15 23:14:12 "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "python-native.do_populate_staging" Aug 15 23:14:15 there's no python-ogg staging here Aug 15 23:15:50 ok, its bedtime for me now Aug 15 23:15:52 mickeyl: ok, that points the finger at taskdata.py or DEPENDS is being overritten Aug 15 23:15:54 bye all Aug 15 23:16:21 mickeyl: runqueue itself isn't at fault as it isn't getting correct data Aug 15 23:18:06 anyways, i'm pretty tired. Aug 15 23:18:08 need to sleep Aug 15 23:18:11 g'night folks Aug 15 23:18:32 'night mickey|zzZZzz Aug 15 23:21:12 mickey|zzZZzz: I see "python-vorbis.do_configure" -> "python-ogg.do_populate_staging" here :-( Aug 15 23:26:49 where can i see the schematics of the neo? Aug 15 23:32:37 You can'ty. Aug 15 23:32:37 schematics? Aug 15 23:32:45 Unfortunately. Aug 15 23:33:15 why is that ? Aug 15 23:33:22 is it not open ? Aug 15 23:33:24 Openmoko is open. Aug 15 23:33:32 The phones that run it are not as open. Aug 15 23:33:49 The hardware that runs it is not as open. Aug 15 23:34:03 damn burocrats :D Aug 15 23:34:38 SpeedEvil: openhardware is starting to be produced and sold I noticed Aug 15 23:34:53 What do you mean? Aug 15 23:34:55 including complete drawings of the modules Aug 15 23:35:06 google openhardware Aug 15 23:35:28 its a movement similar to FOSS Aug 15 23:35:34 oh - right. Aug 15 23:35:43 =( Aug 15 23:35:53 they are now going into production with some modules Aug 15 23:36:22 i can't know if i'm thinking something wrong or if the alsa driver is doing something wrong or if my phone is improperly assembled Aug 15 23:36:39 they are taking the unix tact were you build devices from modules Aug 15 23:37:54 they are trying to do for hardware what BSD/Linux did to software Aug 15 23:37:56 if "Amp Mode" includes "Headphones" the same sound that comes from the speakers should simply come from the headphones Aug 15 23:39:10 Not really practical - the fundamental problem is that PCBs are the natural and best packed form. Modules take up lots more volume, if only for connectors. Aug 15 23:39:54 for small things that is. Aug 15 23:40:03 if weight, volume doesn't matter, it's not so important. Aug 15 23:44:03 how hard would it be to shrink the depth of the Neo to near-RAZR size? Aug 15 23:44:46 rmitchell: moto fab their own chips Aug 15 23:44:48 that seems to be the only thing -as far as size- that I see as a downside Aug 15 23:45:24 one of the major advantages moto and the other big players have is they can fab their own all in one chips Aug 15 23:45:39 so they fab everything to fit in their case, and FIC is building a case around the chips? Aug 15 23:45:50 No. Aug 15 23:46:00 you can out source an all in ones though (our company gets custom asics made) Aug 15 23:46:17 With the Razr, and stuff, for example, instead of like in the neo, with the modem being a seperate CPU, with seperate RAM and flash, and ... Aug 15 23:46:17 asics? Aug 15 23:46:27 application specific IC Aug 15 23:46:33 ok Aug 15 23:46:34 There is one CPU, which attaches to a radio chip. Aug 15 23:46:55 This eliminates maybe a dozen or several parts. Aug 15 23:47:04 ok, so it is just streamlining? Aug 15 23:47:08 pretty much. Aug 15 23:47:10 still, 18 mm is pretty slim Aug 15 23:47:17 yeah, also moto make all in one cdma gsm multi bandwidth chips Aug 15 23:47:17 .68 in Aug 15 23:47:40 To an extent, increasing the amount spent on the PCB can also reduce size. Aug 15 23:47:59 But only to a limited degree. Aug 15 23:48:20 With complex stuff like phones, the boards are pretty much completely packed with chips and stuff. Aug 15 23:48:31 so the neo is about as thin as the hardware will allow? Aug 15 23:48:36 but if you look at the razr though as an engineer there is allot of compromises in the design Aug 15 23:48:52 such as? Aug 15 23:48:53 Is the razr touchscreen? Aug 15 23:48:55 I forget. Aug 15 23:48:56 no Aug 15 23:49:08 mine isn't (V3m) Aug 15 23:49:10 also razr uses a pretty small battery Aug 15 23:49:15 but it has two screens ;-) Aug 15 23:49:19 battery life sucks Aug 15 23:49:24 what about the alsa driver, where would i see the code for that? Aug 15 23:49:29 low res screen slow cpu not allot of ram etc Aug 15 23:49:30 how thick is the SLVR? Aug 15 23:49:38 the kernel tuukkah. Aug 15 23:49:40 that is prob closer to the neo Aug 15 23:49:46 as in, not a flip Aug 15 23:49:48 look on svn for neo related patches IIRC. Aug 15 23:50:06 so somewhere here? http://svnweb.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/ Aug 15 23:50:11 yes Aug 15 23:51:21 rmitchell: making things pretty is about compromises, people often note how thin the iPhone is, what they dont mention is how wide it is Aug 15 23:51:44 if anyone wants the details, RAZR is 13 mm thick, with the SLVR at 11.5 Aug 15 23:51:53 yeah, I think the neo is a good phone Aug 15 23:52:08 seems to be this: http://svnweb.openmoko.org/trunk/src/target/kernel/patches/asoc.patch?rev=2063&view=auto Aug 15 23:52:34 RAZRs seem a little fragil, the neo looks like it could survive a fall ( I did find some drop tests on the wiki) Aug 15 23:53:21 my razrv3xx sucks (i really, really don't like it) Aug 15 23:53:28 * mjr gets to test the dead battery recharging procedure Aug 15 23:53:30 i got it free with my new att plan, luckly the sim works with the neo Aug 15 23:53:34 rmitchell: have you seen the Meizu M8, its smaller thinner than the iPhone and has more features Aug 15 23:54:12 rmitchell: it shows how Apple took some shortcuts Aug 15 23:54:16 yeah Aug 15 23:54:19 but more $$ Aug 15 23:54:52 rmitchell: prices Im seeing put it on par with the iPhone Aug 15 23:55:23 I saw something that said 799 Aug 15 23:55:28 us dollars Aug 15 23:55:50 rmitchell: I think thats for a 16GB unit Aug 15 23:55:52 though from what I saw, there was a 16G Aug 15 23:55:54 yeah Aug 15 23:56:10 they have a 4GB unit going for around US$400 Aug 15 23:56:23 does the neo have the same kind of display as the iphone? Aug 15 23:56:34 higher resolution Aug 15 23:56:39 i know it isn't multitouch Aug 15 23:56:42 no multitouch Aug 15 23:56:48 right Aug 15 23:56:50 rmitchell: slighly smaller but better DPI and resolution but no multi Aug 15 23:56:52 is multi just software though? Aug 15 23:56:57 no, it's not Aug 15 23:57:11 ah, so if multi is added, a new display will be needed Aug 15 23:57:16 iPhone ues a display design done by a German company Aug 15 23:57:23 uses* Aug 15 23:57:24 fancy Aug 15 23:57:50 Yes. (Though you could possibly kludge some limited multitouchish capabilities by extrapolation, but don't expect that.) Aug 15 23:58:05 only down side though is the DPI rating on the iPhone is pretty average Aug 15 23:58:09 how useful is multitouch Aug 15 23:58:27 from what I have seen on the iphone, they just use it to zoom and stuff Aug 15 23:58:37 it's as useful as you make it Aug 15 23:58:44 anyway, iphone is 320x480, Neo is full VGA, which is still beautiful to look at Aug 15 23:58:51 it's useless if there is no code to support it Aug 15 23:58:52 rmitchell: you need zoom for a reason, the DPI is too low for good text reading Aug 15 23:59:05 ah, but it seems a little of a waste for multi Aug 15 23:59:23 and it's extremely useful if you can think of an efficient way to express yourself with multitouch Aug 15 23:59:30 * mjr has run landscape evince on the Neo (remotely) to see if it's a good PDF reader; good enough for me :) Aug 15 23:59:36 rmitchell: put it this way, you dont need zoom multi touch if the display is very clear Aug 15 23:59:54 right, but there are ways to zoom without multi Aug 16 00:00:20 yeah Aug 16 00:00:29 even though the OM has a smaller screen because of the higher DPI rating text is still clearer Aug 16 00:00:45 right, and do we have more colors? Aug 16 00:00:59 or about the same? (as iphone) Aug 16 00:01:22 Ive never looked at the colour spec to be honest Aug 16 00:01:36 because the iphone looks pretty, though I have only seen simulated images Aug 16 00:01:41 Neo uses 16 bit color, dunno about iPhone really Aug 16 00:01:47 16 bit is good Aug 16 00:01:53 is that what the emu runs at? Aug 16 00:02:10 i loaded up the emulator under QEMU, and the colors were good enough Aug 16 00:02:10 mjr: wont the GTA02 be better with its 3D chip Aug 16 00:02:32 linux_galore, good question actually, I don't know Aug 16 00:02:40 what are we going to use the accelerometers for? Aug 16 00:02:53 I think the display was limited to 18 bits of color resolution though Aug 16 00:02:54 rmitchell: turn the phone on its side etc Aug 16 00:02:55 can the screen detect landscape, and rotate Aug 16 00:03:01 yes Aug 16 00:03:05 sweet Aug 16 00:03:08 rmitchell: shake it to go back to main menu lol Aug 16 00:03:14 see [[Accelerometer_fundamentals]] on the wiki Aug 16 00:03:19 and the related category Aug 16 00:03:22 do swooshing lightsaber applications Aug 16 00:03:30 nice, eth-a-sketch screen clearing?? Aug 16 00:03:31 drop it and it cries Aug 16 00:03:41 yeah, I can imagine some geek adding light saber sounds to the OM Aug 16 00:03:52 fall off a skyscraper and it detects the free-fall and calls the hearse Aug 16 00:04:11 detects the g-forces your body goes through when you hit the ground Aug 16 00:04:14 Naah - it calls FIC, and voids the warranty. Aug 16 00:04:21 beeps when you reach terminal velocity Aug 16 00:04:35 OM "you seem to be falling from a critical height, do you wish me to call and ambulance ?" Aug 16 00:04:57 alsa would seem to do the right (very simple) thing wrt Amp Mode Aug 16 00:04:59 upon 150 G, 911 is autodialed Aug 16 00:05:24 s/and/an/ Aug 16 00:05:24 linux_galore meant: OM "you seem to be falling from a critical height, do you wish me to call an ambulance ?" Aug 16 00:06:00 If falling from a sufficient height, it launches a skydiving tutorial. Aug 16 00:06:13 And guides to to the terrain most likely to be soft. Aug 16 00:06:16 deploys the phones parachute to save the neo Aug 16 00:06:21 GTA03 needs to have an integrated parashoot or hang-glider Aug 16 00:06:31 Flying without wings Howto lol Aug 16 00:06:54 There have been a number of people who've survived falling out of airplanes. Aug 16 00:07:03 a number... like 4? Aug 16 00:07:05 Sure, it's a low probability, but it's not zero Aug 16 00:07:14 IIRC a few dozen Aug 16 00:07:21 yeah, just playin Aug 16 00:07:41 the neo needs a poximity sensor Aug 16 00:07:44 like the iphone Aug 16 00:07:45 I met a guy once who did it twice Aug 16 00:07:54 A mediocre paratrooper Aug 16 00:08:02 ironically, he was a paratroop trainer, too. Aug 16 00:08:03 i wouldn't wager on his walking away a third time Aug 16 00:08:35 are we going to be able to put Pidgin/GAIM on the neo? Aug 16 00:08:40 for use in wifi areas? Aug 16 00:08:57 those or something similar, sure Aug 16 00:09:18 * mjr doesn't plan to limit himself to ircin on wifi areas Aug 16 00:09:24 cool, the iPhone lacks IM and GPS, which the neo can do Aug 16 00:09:28 what does im have to do with wlan? Aug 16 00:10:16 * mjr guesses "highway robbery data rates at rmitchell's GSM providers" Aug 16 00:10:45 * rmitchell no want to pay outragous data fees Aug 16 00:10:55 rmitchell: people also keep saying the iPhone has a camera, one small problem, no flash so you cant take indoors pictures Aug 16 00:11:10 leave it to apple Aug 16 00:11:18 speaking of data rates, I'm having troubles with my gprs connection after upgradeing to 2007.2.... Aug 16 00:11:19 though I don't think my RAZR has flash Aug 16 00:11:22 Is that expected? Aug 16 00:11:39 sagacis, I'm pretty sure "trouble" is expected Aug 16 00:12:14 are they planning for the phone to be 100% usable with the Oct launch? Aug 16 00:12:17 OK. So is it not working on .2 right now? I was working find all week on .1 Aug 16 00:12:29 s/find/fine Aug 16 00:13:51 my ttySAC0 seems to be 7-bit now.... Aug 16 00:13:55 rmitchell I think they are aiming at functional, it will take a good year to buff out the bugs, Apple had to put its OSX release back because they needed a shit load of programmers for the iPhone Aug 16 00:14:14 right... but it should dail and have contacts and such? Aug 16 00:14:37 how easy is it to update the phones software from wifi connection? Aug 16 00:15:13 rmitchell: cant answer what we dont know Aug 16 00:15:33 I have actually done an OTA download on the neo. Aug 16 00:15:38 Im not even sure they have a sample GTA02 yet Aug 16 00:15:42 Downloading an image over GPRS. Aug 16 00:15:42 ah Aug 16 00:15:51 it launches in a month Aug 16 00:16:12 or two depending on which part of Oct, and if it is on time Aug 16 00:16:20 sagacis stty something Aug 16 00:16:31 rmitchell: I bet on Jan 08 Aug 16 00:16:44 for GTA02? Aug 16 00:17:04 stty pass8 /dev/ttySAC0 Aug 16 00:17:13 pppd file /etc/ppp/gprs Aug 16 00:17:15 oops Aug 16 00:17:31 yep, they may get the hardware out in September but Im betting they wont release a fully stable unit till Jan 08 Aug 16 00:17:47 ah Aug 16 00:18:03 the time line is just too short Aug 16 00:18:11 i am probably going to wait for GTA03 or 04 Aug 16 00:18:17 Im in hardware and even I view the time line as too short Aug 16 00:19:18 takes a good 6 months to make the software stable for the hardware Aug 16 00:27:13 are they planning for neo screen protectors? Aug 16 00:27:18 like for PDAs? Aug 16 00:32:31 * mwester sees a new mega-global business arising -- purchasing palm-style screen protectors, packaging them with a pair of scissors, and selling them as Neo screen protector kits... Aug 16 00:33:49 figuring this out turned out to be too difficult without the schematics :-( Aug 16 00:36:21 tuukkah: please phrase a precise question about what information yo need, send it to neo1973-hardware and we'll make sure it gets a proper answer Aug 16 00:37:10 audio? Aug 16 00:37:48 SpeedEvil, yes, the output to headphones part Aug 16 00:38:48 LaF0rge, i wanted audio to headphones but "Amp Mode" "Headphones" isn't enough but i don't know what's missing Aug 16 00:39:17 tuukah: please, this is way too time-consuming on synchronous communication such as irc. Aug 16 00:39:29 also, schematics don't help much. Aug 16 00:39:50 the internal routing of the wm8753 is the complicated one. Aug 16 00:40:01 also, we should have a *headset.state for exactly that purpose Aug 16 00:40:29 LaF0rge, this seems to be after wm8753, in lm4857 which chooses between headphones and speakers Aug 16 00:40:42 we currently don't have that state file Aug 16 00:41:34 there's captureheadset and gsmheadset but no stereoheadset or something like that Aug 16 00:41:54 but I'll mail a list Aug 16 00:42:47 or file a bug that that .state file is missing Aug 16 00:44:37 right, i'll do that, thanks Aug 16 00:52:42 DPThought: the missing oe/packages/*/*.bb is normal for OM2007.2 - it will go away when mickey|zzZZzz changes the site.conf file to remove the overlay stuff. Aug 16 00:52:58 (for om2007.2 there is no oe symlink) Aug 16 00:55:07 SpeedEvil: no joy yet with stty Aug 16 00:55:49 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User_talk:HaraldWelte]] [[P1_Owners]] Aug 16 00:56:54 * * OM Bug 709 has been created by Tuukka.Hastrup(AT)iki.fi Aug 16 00:56:55 * * headset.state file missing, needed for headphone output Aug 16 00:56:56 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=709 Aug 16 01:00:49 How are we doing with hcitool? I find my headset on scan, but hcitool cc doesn't seem to do anything. Aug 16 01:05:15 sagacis : what do you mena - what are you trying to do? Aug 16 01:05:47 So, I got me this woot-special BT headset, and I can scan for it on the neo... Aug 16 01:06:00 I can get info from it, I can query it and I can find its name... Aug 16 01:06:06 But, I cannot connect to it. Aug 16 01:06:17 I mean with stty Aug 16 01:06:19 hcitool cc xx:xx:xx:xx doesn't do anything Aug 16 01:06:21 Oh, sorry. Aug 16 01:06:24 * SpeedEvil not done BT Aug 16 01:06:29 No luck there either Aug 16 01:06:46 I'm not sure how to use stty, actually Aug 16 01:07:09 I get stty: invalid number `/dev/ttySAC0' Aug 16 01:08:42 When I cu ttySAC0, I get "Connected." followed by nothing. No input, to output. Aug 16 01:08:51 Maybe I'll reboot the neo and pray Aug 16 01:10:36 Where's the gsmd syslog? Aug 16 01:24:55 SpeedEvil: this is what I get with the pppd script: Aug 16 01:24:58 Connect: ppp0 <--> /dev/ttySAC0 Aug 16 01:25:06 you want cu -l /dev/ttySAC0 Aug 16 01:27:04 Still doesn't work for me. Aug 16 01:27:22 Nothing in or out Aug 16 01:27:29 you have turned on the modem? Aug 16 01:27:37 Sure Aug 16 01:27:50 can you normally dial? Aug 16 01:28:07 what do you mean by "normally?" Aug 16 01:28:57 with the dialer Aug 16 01:29:09 It didn't work earlier. Let me try right now. Aug 16 01:30:46 nope Aug 16 01:30:51 not using the dialer Aug 16 01:31:17 has your modem ever worked? Aug 16 01:31:30 Yup,until I loaded 2007.2 yesterday Aug 16 01:31:35 k. Aug 16 01:31:45 odd Aug 16 01:32:25 I"m shutting down for a reset Aug 16 01:36:58 buena Aug 16 01:37:03 sorry Aug 16 01:37:08 * arw_ hello people Aug 16 01:42:52 SpeedEvil: Using libgsmd-tool, I can register with the network Aug 16 01:43:30 SpeedEvil: Successful dial/ring using libgsmtool Aug 16 01:43:36 what happens if you now do killall gsmd Aug 16 01:43:43 then cu -l /dev/ttySAC0 Aug 16 01:43:49 then at Aug 16 01:43:59 permission denied, line in use Aug 16 01:44:07 hmm. Aug 16 01:44:13 unsure wehre the lockfile is. Aug 16 01:44:23 /var/spool? Aug 16 01:44:48 killall didn't seem to work rihgt Aug 16 01:44:50 right Aug 16 01:45:27 /var/lock/subsys/gsmd Aug 16 01:46:34 Line in use, but no processes claim it with lsof Aug 16 01:47:21 try nuking the lockfile Aug 16 01:47:28 No joy Aug 16 01:47:33 the gsmd lockfile? Aug 16 01:48:03 yes Aug 16 01:48:06 That's the only lockfile I have in /var/lock Aug 16 01:48:10 It didn't help Aug 16 01:48:14 I dunno, sorry, tired. Aug 16 01:48:21 I hear ya.... Aug 16 01:48:22 * SpeedEvil was asleep. Aug 16 01:48:33 What the heck are you doing here, then??? Aug 16 01:48:38 morning sagacis Aug 16 01:48:51 woke up, couldn't sleep, picked up laptop. Aug 16 01:48:55 * jaebird is sure SpeedEvil is a bot Aug 16 01:48:59 morn' jaebird Aug 16 01:49:11 SpeedEvil is always here Aug 16 01:49:21 SpeedEvil is too tired to help sagacis Aug 16 01:49:23 SpeedEvil: botsnack Aug 16 01:49:30 heh Aug 16 01:49:49 * SpeedEvil would prefer at the moment... A nice apple pie. Aug 16 01:50:04 anything good happening around here lately? Aug 16 01:50:33 Not good. Aug 16 01:50:41 Can't get my gsm working on this build... Aug 16 01:50:47 uh oh, your gsmd still not working Aug 16 01:51:09 your build? Aug 16 01:51:17 makefile update gave me: fetch http://You-Have-To-Download-The-Microcode-Manually-So-Please-Read-ixp4xx-npe_2.3.2.bb-For-Instructions/IPL_ixp400NpeLibrary-2_3_2.zip Aug 16 01:51:38 BT headsets not registering with moko Aug 16 01:51:44 yowzer! Aug 16 01:52:14 stoopid usb cables Aug 16 01:52:20 BT is tricky...lots of subsystems Aug 16 01:52:38 I can info it, name it, scan it query it, but the connection doesn't seem to do anything Aug 16 01:52:45 Before long, I'm going to have to go read code. Aug 16 01:52:49 I'm too tired and lazy for that... Aug 16 01:53:02 i attempted to get BT dun on my pc once...gave up Aug 16 01:53:42 wonder how the week long sprint is going in de? Aug 16 01:54:56 i haven't flashed my neo in awhile! wonder if i hold the record? Aug 16 01:55:08 Just your uboot? Aug 16 01:55:19 nice :) Aug 16 01:55:45 is uboot getting more features...other than the flash wipe Aug 16 01:55:55 Not at the moment. Aug 16 01:56:12 I was updating my build because Harald commited a bunch of gsm patches today.... Aug 16 01:56:27 We also got a python2.5 bitbake.... Don't know if it's in the moko or not Aug 16 01:56:29 ah, maybe that is why it is not working for you now... Aug 16 01:56:51 saw the doctor's blog Aug 16 01:57:00 heyho.... Aug 16 01:57:05 Moin Aug 16 01:57:14 python...hmmm Aug 16 01:57:28 my neo dont accept the clear root-pw Aug 16 01:57:43 if i want to connect with ssh Aug 16 01:57:48 sagacis: which makefile are you using? Aug 16 01:57:50 you are doing ssh root@phone? Aug 16 01:57:55 There's a bluetooth category for "Doll / Action Figure" Aug 16 01:57:57 the ixp4xx stuff is only for NSLU2 devices Aug 16 01:58:28 rwhitby: Using the MasterMakefile. Come to think of it, I should probably update it. Aug 16 01:58:36 rwhitby: Good to see you again Aug 16 01:58:45 well, you should use the MokoMakefile alpha version for 2007.2 now Aug 16 01:59:06 rwhitby: really? sweet Aug 16 01:59:43 link rwhitby? Aug 16 01:59:54 * * OM Bug 710 has been created by sean(AT)theSheedys.com Aug 16 01:59:55 * * lists.openmoko.org SMTP server not acking mail promptly; retries appear as duplicate messages Aug 16 01:59:56 * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=710 Aug 16 01:59:58 wget http://svn.nslu2-linux.org/svnroot/mokomakefile/branches/OM-2007.2/Makefile and "make setup update all". If you "make update-makefile" it will take you back to 2007.1, so don't do that. Aug 16 02:00:07 **** I forgot to login as root... -.- thank you SpeedEvil for the second time today, that you help me by damn easy problems... Aug 16 02:00:25 :) Aug 16 02:00:31 Man, and I JUST got the mastermakefile working. Aug 16 02:00:43 Here comes another 5 hr build? Aug 16 02:00:52 Note that it's *alpha* so if you have the disk space you might want to do it in a separate directory. It is designed to be a seamless upgrade from 2007.1, but you are the guys testing that seamlessness. Aug 16 02:01:11 i was just gunna spin up another toolchain Aug 16 02:01:11 hey guys Aug 16 02:01:22 hey roh Aug 16 02:01:44 Yup. Already made another directory. I could try the .1 upgrade, if you would like.... Aug 16 02:01:48 jr0m: mickey has not given the official "GO" to switch mokomakefile from 2007.1 to 2007.2 yet. Aug 16 02:01:49 What do I have to lose? Aug 16 02:01:51 rwhitby nice.. should i test it? ive got a last build from end of july Aug 16 02:02:21 roh: sure. it works for me. you can go backwards and forwards between 2007.1 and 2007.2, but not build both concurrently. Aug 16 02:02:22 sagacis some 5-12gb diskspace and 6hours of build time and some traffic Aug 16 02:02:41 if i just build 2007.1 today, why would i not just go to 2007.2 and work from there? Aug 16 02:02:44 No prob. I have hundreds of gigs left Aug 16 02:02:49 sagacis: using the same directory as 2007.1 would be a good test, yes. Aug 16 02:03:12 Starting in the .1 directory now.... Aug 16 02:03:14 jr0m: cause 2007.1 and 2007.2 have very different functionalities at this point. Aug 16 02:03:32 sagacis: keep a log of what happens so you can pastebin it. Aug 16 02:03:40 * jaebird starting in new directory... Aug 16 02:04:21 * rwhitby wishes his builds only took 6 hours. 14hrs+ and still going here, but I'm used to that. Aug 16 02:04:27 * jaebird changes mind..starting in .1 dir too Aug 16 02:04:48 Making a log, but I had started a bit already.... Aug 16 02:05:06 Hmm - the first bit is important, cause that's where it adjusts your directory for 2007.2 Aug 16 02:05:13 Some of the stuff doesn't > nicely (mtn must use curses or soemthing) Aug 16 02:05:50 it should move your existing build dir to build-OM-2007.1, and remove the oe symlink (amongst some other things) Aug 16 02:06:25 if you go back to 2007.1, it will move the new build dir to build-OM-2007.2, and move the build-OM-2007.1 dir back to build. Aug 16 02:06:31 http://pastebin.ca/659046 is the first part, until I stopped it Aug 16 02:06:40 so you can swap between them without needing to rebuild stuff Aug 16 02:06:56 That's a big advancement Aug 16 02:07:17 that's why they pay me the big bucks .... Aug 16 02:07:36 oh, hang on, they don't pay me at all for this stuff. Doh! Aug 16 02:07:47 if you really got big bux, you wouldn't be taking 14 hours to build! Aug 16 02:08:42 sagacis: that pastebin looks correct Aug 16 02:09:05 did i get a 404 not found for this file: sounds_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target.OM-2007.artwork_2690_.tar.gz? Aug 16 02:09:32 yep, that's the tarball cache of the svn checkout - it should continue to check it out from svn instead Aug 16 02:09:44 yeah it is...just checking :) Aug 16 02:10:12 where did it try to get the tarball from? Aug 16 02:10:36 rwhitby: what about a little ascii art with version at beginning... Aug 16 02:10:43 another @ http://downloads.openmoko.org/sources/gsm_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target_2686_.tar.gz Aug 16 02:11:05 http://downloads.openmoko.org/sources/sounds_svn.openmoko.org_.trunk.src.target.OM-2007.artwork_2690_.tar.gz Aug 16 02:11:09 jaebird: ok, that means that the openmoko folks have been negligent in not pushing the build results to the sources dir Aug 16 02:11:28 jaebird: please submit a patch for the ascii art Aug 16 02:11:38 put it in the check-generation target Aug 16 02:11:56 ok :) Aug 16 02:13:25 jaebird: don't go overboard on the size of the banner Aug 16 02:13:55 no, of course not...more informational than art Aug 16 02:16:18 new target right? or am i losing my mind Aug 16 02:16:53 no, add it inside the check-generation target Aug 16 02:18:11 the target doesn't appear to be in the alpha version, although it does exist in the "normal" version Aug 16 02:21:00 oops...my bad, disregard stupidity Aug 16 02:25:41 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r121 10mokomakefile/Makefile: Fixed the update-makefile and check-makefile targets. Removed the push-makefile target. Aug 16 02:27:58 sagacis: so is it building? Aug 16 02:30:07 rwhitby: do you mind if I @ the commands in the check-generation target? Aug 16 02:30:43 actually, at this stage, yes. then I won't be able to see if it's working for people. Aug 16 02:31:36 you can @ the echo commands which print the banner. Aug 16 02:32:04 sure, ok... Aug 16 02:32:20 banner: OpenMoko 2007.2 Aug 16 02:33:45 i think i got bluetooth and pand starting automatically on my moko now Aug 16 02:34:06 Im wondering how long it will be before another maker takes up the OM software Aug 16 02:34:17 happycube: please share the info Aug 16 02:35:03 should have a hat raffle bet Aug 16 02:37:57 rwhitby: Building along.... step 24 Aug 16 02:38:39 * daMaestro looks if there is any public facing build newer then 20070808 Aug 16 02:39:47 daMaestro: http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/openmoko/images/ builds every 15 minutes ... Aug 16 02:39:52 hmmm 20071010 was not working for me, anyone used these: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/tmp2/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01/ Aug 16 02:40:01 rwhitby, i'll check it Aug 16 02:40:20 ahh see there i was looking ~ 10-12 and there is nothing Aug 16 02:40:23 rwhitby, good work Aug 16 02:40:40 those are all om2007.2 built on debian etch Aug 16 02:40:57 any of them have a working gsmd at boot? Aug 16 02:41:34 rwitby: where do you want the patch Aug 16 02:42:20 daMaestro: I couldn't get gsmd to work well after boot, either Aug 16 02:42:34 or, y'know, at all Aug 16 02:42:58 well it worked for me after boot, but not via the dialer app Aug 16 02:43:04 Hey, there's a "fixchicken.patch" Aug 16 02:43:24 daMaestro: The current code (from yesterday) doesn't seem to work at all. Aug 16 02:43:32 Can't talk to ttySAC0 Aug 16 02:43:53 happycube: Did you get BT stuff working? I have a headset that doesn't connect Aug 16 02:44:49 i haven't tried any phone stuff yet Aug 16 02:45:15 i'm planning on using mine as an n800-type thingie soon Aug 16 02:45:19 and later on as a phone ;) Aug 16 02:45:40 probably a good idea, considering.... Aug 16 02:46:27 jaebird: pastebin it Aug 16 02:47:47 http://pastebin.ca/659082 Aug 16 02:48:23 jaebird, nice banner Aug 16 02:49:07 hey...ascii art never dies :) Aug 16 02:51:19 just got my bt keyboard working Aug 16 02:51:32 that was easy(tm) Aug 16 02:51:55 wish i knew how to automate it though Aug 16 02:52:23 happycube: python script? Aug 16 02:52:35 shell script Aug 16 02:53:14 could do it now with shell script and dbus-send but that's pretty ugly Aug 16 02:53:21 only at build step 147 Aug 16 02:54:44 openmoko: 03rwhitby 07OM-2007.2 * r122 10mokomakefile/Makefile: Added some ascii art to print the openmoko build generation. Thanks to jaebird. Aug 16 02:55:28 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MokoMakefile]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU_on_MacOSX]] Aug 16 02:55:51 http://nerdvittles.com/index.php?p=185 -- They say the iphone can do bluetooth for 8 hours with no battery drain Aug 16 02:56:11 Is there someone with a fully up-to-date 2007.1 build who can test moving to a 2007.2 build, stopping it shortly after it starts, then moving back to 2007.1 and making sure that build is still up to date, and then going back to 2007.2 and continuing that build? Aug 16 02:56:36 orzo: wow - a perpetual motion machine - "no" battery drain ;-) Aug 16 02:56:37 i already wiped my .1 builds :P Aug 16 02:57:13 well they say "virtually no battery drain" Aug 16 02:57:44 accelerometers must be good generators :) Aug 16 02:57:53 ok, that i can believe. bluetooth is much more power efficient than wifi. Aug 16 02:57:59 * sagacis shakes his iPhone to recharge it... Aug 16 02:58:11 how much drain does it do on the neo? Aug 16 02:58:17 * jaebird slaps sagacis for saying he has an iPhone Aug 16 02:58:37 the neo doesnt currently seem to have much battery life Aug 16 02:58:52 Heck, it even drains the battery when off! Aug 16 02:59:11 that's a feature - it reminds you it's a developer release. Aug 16 02:59:18 heh Aug 16 02:59:24 why does it drain when off? Aug 16 02:59:29 it keeps you always connected to USB Aug 16 02:59:46 off isn't off - stuff like gsm modem is still on Aug 16 02:59:49 my iPAQ does that **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Aug 16 02:59:57 2007