**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Aug 25 02:59:56 2007 Aug 25 02:59:58 maybe... Aug 25 03:00:03 let me try again with grps Aug 25 03:02:31 rootfs is too full and I don't know what to do...thinking about re-flashing for expedience's sake, but meh Aug 25 03:03:26 I can't do an ipkg remove right now Aug 25 03:04:32 hrm Aug 25 03:04:38 openmoko-dialer2 isn't an executable I have Aug 25 03:04:42 I have an openmoko-dialer Aug 25 03:12:37 jadams_, yup, Aug 25 03:12:45 openmoko-dialer it is. Sorry Aug 25 03:13:13 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Neo1973_GTA01_Power_Management]] [[P1_Owners]] Aug 25 03:13:50 alright, well I'm going to flash it and start from scratch again Aug 25 03:14:07 incorporate your fix there Aug 25 03:18:43 OK. I did an ipkg upgrade instead of a new flash Aug 25 03:22:21 daMaestro: Good morning (uct) Aug 25 03:22:48 sagacis, moin Aug 25 03:25:05 Gack! md5sum is wrong for http://downloads.sleepycat.com/db-4.3.29.tar.gz Aug 25 03:25:48 * mwester goes to doublecheck... Aug 25 03:29:25 * mwester makes note to go yell at his ISP once again. Aug 25 03:31:30 sagacis: I only did a new flash because I used up all the disk space and wanted a second chance :) Aug 25 03:34:13 Cool, I now have a simple pygtk T9 like input example going. Aug 25 03:38:35 morning Aug 25 03:39:24 good morning, mr rwhitby Aug 25 03:39:45 got your phone yet? Aug 25 03:39:50 yep Aug 25 03:40:29 I'm watching my disk space disappear as I build the latest images. I guess I should have cleaned out the old 2007.1 stuff first... :-D Aug 25 03:40:36 hm, still trying to figure out how to get tapping working in qemu Aug 25 03:41:19 jadams_, did you erase rootfs first? Aug 25 03:41:26 mwester: BTW, dfu-util on slugos works nicely to flash the neo Aug 25 03:42:59 heh - I didn't even think of that. I built and installed on my main build machine... Aug 25 03:51:40 re Aug 25 03:52:23 mwester: I have mine connected to the fsg-3 router and flash from there. Aug 25 03:52:45 (since dfu-util doesn't work from vmware) Aug 25 03:53:02 * hhf423 yawns Aug 25 04:01:16 I have been having a problem while building 2007.2 using MokoMakeFile, uicmoc4-native fails to build. does anyone know what to do about this? Aug 25 04:01:19 the complete error I am getting is at: http://pastebin.com/m3ae75cb9 Aug 25 04:04:56 cibomahto: dunno about that one. that package has been recently changed by mickey|offline Aug 25 04:05:56 rwhitby: ok, thanks, i just found that he opened a new bug report for it as well Aug 25 04:06:26 it built for me earlier today on 32 bit Debian Etch Aug 25 04:07:31 hmm, i guess it might be time to start building things in a 32bit environment :-) Aug 25 04:09:11 it does seem to be the path of least resistance if your goal is not to spend your time debugging build issues. Aug 25 04:15:25 thanks for answering though. I'll see if i can figure out whats going on Aug 25 04:16:16 did anyone here got bluetooth to work? Aug 25 04:19:46 STR=`AT+CFUN=1' Aug 25 04:19:47 RSTR=`+CME ERROR: 10' Aug 25 04:19:49 Hmm Aug 25 04:20:17 hhf423: Nope, not really. I hear some BT keyboards are working. Aug 25 04:20:28 hhf423: I've failed at connecting my BT headset Aug 25 04:21:07 sagacis: with 2007.2? Aug 25 04:21:11 yup Aug 25 04:21:17 today's build Aug 25 04:21:20 oh, interesting Aug 25 04:21:42 It finds the headset, and I can see the 'info', but when I 'cc', nothing happens Aug 25 04:21:43 what do you get on hciconfig Aug 25 04:22:00 nada Aug 25 04:22:13 I only get "Address family not supported by protocol" Aug 25 04:22:27 That's what jadams_ was getting Aug 25 04:22:49 hmmm Aug 25 04:23:17 WIth hciconfig, I get 'No such device'. I didn't notice that before. Aug 25 04:23:20 what happens when you do "modprobe gta01-pm-bt" Aug 25 04:23:31 On the other hand, I can query the device with hcitool. Aug 25 04:23:37 alright, I've got a fresh 2007.08.24 image Aug 25 04:24:00 I'd like to install some stuff via ipkg to /media/card to avoid the nastiness I just ran into re: full disk Aug 25 04:24:04 hhf423: are you sure that's the right one? Aug 25 04:24:07 anyone done that? Aug 25 04:24:13 jadams_ you should be able to stay current with just ipkg updates Aug 25 04:24:25 jadams_, what are you planning to install? Aug 25 04:24:37 heh - I was ssh'd to the wrong neo - I only have a sim in one of them Aug 25 04:24:38 hhf423: yeah, I reinstalled because I ran out of disk space and all kinds of things couldn't be done any more Aug 25 04:24:40 ooo... I'm pretty much full, too, with pidgin and minimo loaded Aug 25 04:24:43 sagacis: ruby, mysql, others Aug 25 04:24:52 rwhitby: I was smart. I only bought one! Aug 25 04:25:00 mysql on a phone? Aug 25 04:25:01 sagacis: where did you get pidgin from? Aug 25 04:25:04 minimo? Tried the webkit-based one? Aug 25 04:25:16 'bitbake pidgin' Aug 25 04:25:22 ah, ok Aug 25 04:25:34 what happens when you do "modprobe gta01-pm-bt" Aug 25 04:25:36 jadams_, I haven't seen how to build it. minimo just built. Aug 25 04:25:45 hhf423: module not found Aug 25 04:25:49 sagacis: ScaredyCat's repository has a package for it Aug 25 04:25:54 runs google maps fine Aug 25 04:25:56 sagacis: and "modprobe hci_usb" ? Aug 25 04:26:19 hci_usb seems ok Aug 25 04:26:47 lsmod shows: ohci_hcd, hci_usb... Aug 25 04:26:49 bluetooth... Aug 25 04:26:53 once I can get the phone and the nokia bluetoothing, I should be good to go on wifi/gprs sharing betwixt 'em Aug 25 04:26:53 hmm, hcitool scan says "Device is not available: Address family not supported by protocol Aug 25 04:27:05 hhf423: yeah, that's what I had Aug 25 04:27:12 jadams_, where's SC's repo? Aug 25 04:27:22 jadams_ "had" as in you solved it? Aug 25 04:27:41 hhf423: 'had' as in I started over and haven't gotten back to bluetooth yet :) Aug 25 04:27:46 sagacis: look in wiki under repositories, I put a description in Aug 25 04:27:50 sagacis: wiki, search 'repositories' Aug 25 04:27:56 k Aug 25 04:28:20 jadams_: ah, ok. let me know if it works with your latest snapshot Aug 25 04:29:40 mtpaint's pretty fun on it Aug 25 04:30:27 what's the module package for BT called? Aug 25 04:31:42 bluetooth Aug 25 04:32:03 from lsmod: bluetooth 48512 6 rfcomm,hidp,l2cap,hci_usb Aug 25 04:39:40 sagacis: alright, so I've got the stop/start stuff going on before openmoko-dialer loads Aug 25 04:39:50 not sure that it's solved it for me though Aug 25 04:40:04 well...worked when I restarted the xserver just fine Aug 25 04:40:07 df With minimo installed: 94%. with minimo removed: 82%. with webkit-gdklauncher installed: 81%. It's -1%! Aug 25 04:43:18 sagacis: awesome, so my phone works (gsmd) from boot now, thanks to your suggestino Aug 25 04:43:19 hhf423: So, I found webkit-jdklauncher, but where's the webkit-gtk package? Aug 25 04:43:29 We should put that in the wiki somewheres Aug 25 04:43:32 next step is to get it auto-connecting via gprs whenever I need internet and I don't have it Aug 25 04:43:56 jadams_, probably not going tohappen immediately. The gsmd doesn't know about gprs. Aug 25 04:44:08 AFAK Aug 25 04:44:12 sagacis: nah, I had gprs working earlier Aug 25 04:44:12 AFAIK Aug 25 04:44:26 jadams_, I have gprs working, but not automagically Aug 25 04:44:32 just a matter of setting linux up to auto-connect the same way you would have with dial up though Aug 25 04:44:36 since it's just using pppd Aug 25 04:44:56 OK. It won't disconnect, though, rihgT? Aug 25 04:44:58 right? Aug 25 04:45:16 Also, I haven't gotten it to stay up unless I run it in a terminal Aug 25 04:45:17 what do you mean? and I have no way of speaking with authority, I'm too much of a ren00b on this stuff Aug 25 04:45:31 yeah, I've only run it in a terminal so far Aug 25 04:46:04 jadams_, The only way I know to disconnect is to ctrl-c or kill the process Aug 25 04:46:30 webkit-gtk should also be there Aug 25 04:47:18 oot@fic-gta01:~$ ipkg list |grep webkit-gtk Aug 25 04:47:20 libwebkitgdk-dbg - 0.0+svn20070824-r1 - Version 0.0+svn20070824-r1 of package webkit-gtk Aug 25 04:47:25 and so on Aug 25 04:47:51 Nope, but I have four sources of the webkit stuff... Aug 25 04:48:09 Right, but none are the root webkit-gtk package, right? Aug 25 04:48:14 Where's the bin? Aug 25 04:49:50 isn't that installed with e.g. midori? Aug 25 04:49:57 midori Aug 25 04:50:05 sagacis: ipkg install midori (ftw) Aug 25 04:50:48 all I know, is exporting totem to the neo made me smile a bunch Aug 25 04:50:51 man I'm tired.... Aug 25 04:50:56 ;-) Aug 25 04:51:22 Mucho bettero Aug 25 04:51:47 would someone be willing to dial my phone to see if it'll ring for incoming calls? Aug 25 04:52:50 jadams: sure. No other phone in your possession? Aug 25 04:52:57 it's late and I want to play with it, but i told the girlfriend to call me back and want to at least *know* whether I'm neglecting or not :) Aug 25 04:52:58 Assuming you're US, that is Aug 25 04:53:01 sagacis: or I wouldn't ask :) Aug 25 04:53:10 msg Aug 25 04:53:11 jadams: sure I can call anywhere Aug 25 04:53:33 let me know. I'd love to test the dialer anyway Aug 25 04:53:51 sagacis: test the dialer. number's in a msg to you Aug 25 04:54:49 maybe ringing Aug 25 04:55:09 I've got nothing Aug 25 04:55:45 I just made an outgoing call, but who knows if it's still working... Aug 25 04:56:09 eww Aug 25 04:56:13 dialer crashed when I hit dial Aug 25 04:56:20 seems like I've got a one-call-maximum at the moment Aug 25 04:56:24 mine, too. Aug 25 04:56:29 Ringing on another phone now Aug 25 04:56:30 ring Aug 25 04:56:35 ring Aug 25 04:56:43 4 rings Aug 25 04:57:20 msg again Aug 25 04:58:33 alright, taking the SIM out for now Aug 25 04:58:55 since I can't receive calls reliably and am expecting one. Tomorrow, though Aug 25 04:59:04 this thing already ate up all my time today Aug 25 04:59:08 I'm scared Aug 25 04:59:16 and I need to focus on bluetooth Aug 25 04:59:23 so I can get a fabric bt keyboard rocking Aug 25 05:00:05 I tried to dial again, and dialer crashed again. Aug 25 05:00:27 I added scaredycat's repo, and upgrade installed new kernel packages Aug 25 05:00:38 now all the modules are out of sync with the kernel Aug 25 05:00:49 midori doesn't have a desktop entry installed? Aug 25 05:00:57 sagacis: not yet Aug 25 05:01:02 run it from rxvt on the device Aug 25 05:01:06 Can I update the kernel or do I have to flash a new one? Aug 25 05:01:13 sure, but the minimo had a nice globe icon Aug 25 05:01:28 gcb77: I don't know.... You should be able to ipkg it Aug 25 05:01:48 gcb77: interesting, that did not happen to me Aug 25 05:02:09 uname -a shows fic-gta01 2.6.21.5-moko10 Aug 25 05:02:36 ouch. 2.6.22 is the current version. Aug 25 05:02:59 I have both kernel-2.6.21.5-moko10 and kernel-2.6.21.6-moko11 installed Aug 25 05:03:01 fic-gta01 2.6.21.5-moko10 #1 Aug 25 05:03:33 I, too, have 2.6.21.5 Aug 25 05:03:42 hmm, sagacis 2.6.22 is in the latest snapshop or what? Aug 25 05:03:49  Aug 25 05:03:51 fic-gta01 2.6.21.5-moko10 Aug 25 05:04:31 oh, sorry Aug 25 05:04:34 nah http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/openmoko/images/?C=M;O=D also only has 2-6-21 -- but .6 tho Aug 25 05:04:45 the snapshot IS 2.6.21.5-moko10 Aug 25 05:05:02 I guess the .22 was before the 2007.2 switch Aug 25 05:05:24 heh... if I remove 2.6.21.5-moko10 I should still have 2.6.21.6-moko11, right? Aug 25 05:05:44 hrm. when I run hciconfig now it just returns nothing Aug 25 05:05:59 root@fic-gta01:~$ hcitool scan Aug 25 05:05:59 Device is not available: No such device Aug 25 05:06:19 hmm, I'll go flash the 2.6.21.6 Aug 25 05:06:25 see what gives Aug 25 05:06:26 jadams: Yay! You caught up with me... :( Aug 25 05:06:31 sagacis: heh Aug 25 05:06:52 raster: as in rasterman? Or no...he's not from jp I dun think... Aug 25 05:06:58 (I know he's not japanese) Aug 25 05:07:33 ばか！！！ Aug 25 05:07:41 sagacis: echo "1" > /sys/bus/platform/devices/gta01-pm-bt.0/power_on Aug 25 05:07:42 jadams: the username was right earlier, in .jp. People travel and visit and work other places too. Aug 25 05:07:45 do that, then hciconfig Aug 25 05:07:48 日本にすんでますよ！ Aug 25 05:07:59 jadams: Already did that... Aug 25 05:08:12 sagacis: then /etc/init.d/bluetooth stop (then start) Aug 25 05:08:17 and then rebooted... Hang on Aug 25 05:08:20 * hhf423 does the dfu-util dance Aug 25 05:08:41 i am from many places Aug 25 05:08:49 I was excited about minimo, but midori rocks in comparison! It's MUCH faster. Aug 25 05:08:50 raster: are you by chance from #e? Aug 25 05:08:51 where i irc from does not mean it means i come from there Aug 25 05:09:08 maybe most people you know are born, grow up, live and die in 1 town Aug 25 05:09:10 oh meh, we all understands the internets Aug 25 05:09:16 but there are others tht don't Aug 25 05:09:17 :) Aug 25 05:09:22 oh stfu, I've lived on two continents :) Aug 25 05:09:24 * hhf423 may be at many places, but is always only from one place Aug 25 05:09:42 i've lived on 5 Aug 25 05:09:47 I was just trying to ask the question efficiently (in terms of characters). Clearly I've failed horribly Aug 25 05:09:57 i have been to 6 Aug 25 05:09:59 * mwester is always just lost... Aug 25 05:10:04 while living on any of those five, were you involved in imlib? :) Aug 25 05:10:16 i need to yet visit antarctica Aug 25 05:10:21 I've been to three Aug 25 05:10:24 ok, anyone want to place bets? I removed both kernel versions (moko10 and moko11) and I re-installed moko11. What are the odds I'll have to reflash a kernel? Aug 25 05:10:25 just to be able to say i have been to every continent :) Aug 25 05:10:41 gcb77: no idea I pass :-) Aug 25 05:10:43 gcb: 85% Aug 25 05:10:45 jadams: yes - i wrote that once apon a time Aug 25 05:10:49 in a land far far away Aug 25 05:10:51 literally Aug 25 05:10:54 far far away Aug 25 05:11:22 alrighty then :) Many thanks go out to you, as e was what got me interested in linux in the first place back when I was stupid and themeability mattered more to me than either software or freedom :) Aug 25 05:11:31 raster: these days you can get almost anywhere civilized within 24h if you have proper management support Aug 25 05:12:03 hhf423: what management suport in particular? Aug 25 05:12:15 hrm...hcitool scan isn't picking up my headset Aug 25 05:12:25 raster: just a manner of speaking Aug 25 05:12:35 jadams: tnx :) Aug 25 05:12:46 hhf423: u can get anywhere - with enough money Aug 25 05:12:48 :) Aug 25 05:12:51 raster: whatever management matters to you :-) Aug 25 05:12:52 hcitool scan finds mine. hcitool info does too. Aug 25 05:12:59 hcitool cc does nothing Aug 25 05:13:07 garr...don't know if it's just this headset, never used it with anything Aug 25 05:13:12 got it off of woot a while back Aug 25 05:13:20 Verizon? Aug 25 05:13:30 didn't work with my failure of a phone from Amp'd Mobile Aug 25 05:13:39 it's a Mustek Aug 25 05:13:53 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Alabama]] [[Talk:Manually_using_Bluetooth]] [[Main_Page/kr]] Aug 25 05:13:54 Bummer. Got mine off woot two weeks ago Aug 25 05:14:27 according to hcitool scan it's a: LG HBM-710, branded "Verizon" Aug 25 05:14:45 I'll put a sticker over the marque if I can get it to work. Aug 25 05:15:18 TiVo sux. LinuxMCE! Aug 25 05:15:42 Hey, I have a BT connection! Aug 25 05:15:45 is it safe to flash a mokomakefile-generated uboot-gta01bv4-latest.bin? Aug 25 05:15:58 bmidgley: Do you have a development board? Aug 25 05:16:03 But it dies before a second or two Aug 25 05:16:04 * hhf423 congratulates sagacis Aug 25 05:16:04 er, debug? Aug 25 05:16:09 no Aug 25 05:16:32 The good news is that the NEO came back up and is running, but ipkg can't install new kernel :( Aug 25 05:16:34 I get: "Connections: < ACL 00:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx handle 42 state 1 lm MASTER " Aug 25 05:16:45 hey LaF0rge Aug 25 05:16:46 boyyy, this .6 kernel takes an insane time to boot the first time Aug 25 05:16:50 there was a note with the 2007.2 snapshot saying a uboot update was needed or recommended Aug 25 05:17:08 * gcb77 breaks out laptop for uboot update Aug 25 05:17:10 A uboot update is recommended, but I haven't done it yet. Aug 25 05:17:22 bmidgley: I think it is save to flash the u-boot on the openmoko site. I did it and had no issues Aug 25 05:17:32 So, does anybody know what that BT message means? Aug 25 05:18:24 sagacis: what message Aug 25 05:18:34 hhf423: url? Aug 25 05:18:38 fic-gta01 2.6.21.6-moko11 Aug 25 05:19:20 hhf423: did it work? Aug 25 05:19:32 bmidgley: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/images/ there is the ubott which fixes the bug which required nand erase in the past Aug 25 05:19:59 gcb77: i flashed the .6 kernel and so far not much is different Aug 25 05:20:01 hhf423: what's the importance of the uboot update? Aug 25 05:21:27 jadams: it fixes a bug where sometimes a few mb did not get properly erased when flashing a new image which is smaller that the one on the device or so Aug 25 05:21:43 bmidgley: ACL 00:xx:xx:xx:xx:xx handle 42 state 1 lm MASTER Aug 25 05:21:57 jadams: basically, no nand erase required no more with the new uboot Aug 25 05:22:00 aha...so it doesn't affect me at present Aug 25 05:22:17 hhf423: what's the url to the kernel image you flashed? Aug 25 05:22:38 gcb77: http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/openmoko/images/?C=M;O=D Aug 25 05:22:41 sagacis: was that in the log or did you run something that printed that Aug 25 05:24:10 ooooh Aug 25 05:24:19 bluetooth is now working! Aug 25 05:25:00 what happens if you don't nand erase and also don't upgrade uboot? Aug 25 05:25:01 bmidgley: hcitool cc, followed immediately by hcitool con. Aug 25 05:25:12 hhf423: working still? Mine drops after about a second Aug 25 05:25:20 maybe my passkey isn't working? Aug 25 05:25:26 root@fic-gta01:~$ hcitool scan Aug 25 05:25:28 Scanning ... Aug 25 05:25:29 00:19:63:04:78:AB K610ron Aug 25 05:25:57 hhf423: connect to it with "hcitool cc 00:19:63:04:78:AB" Aug 25 05:26:05 then, you should see it with "hcitool con" Aug 25 05:26:14 segacis: did you start a passkey agent? Aug 25 05:26:20 yes Aug 25 05:28:31 I get a "Passkey-agent released" after the connection Aug 25 05:28:51 segacis: what are you trying to connect to Aug 25 05:29:21 A headset Aug 25 05:30:04 last time i checked, bluez utils was not being built with headset support enabled Aug 25 05:30:53 well, that could be a restriction on using it, eh? Aug 25 05:30:57 wish me luck... i'm flashing u-boot Aug 25 05:30:57 * sagacis blushes Aug 25 05:31:09 I didn't even think that would be the case. Aug 25 05:31:20 * hhf423 wishes bmidgley luck Aug 25 05:31:23 tyime to rebuild this moko foo Aug 25 05:31:25 maybe I'd have better luck if I tried supported hardware? Aug 25 05:31:50 hmm, hcitool cc
gives nothing Aug 25 05:32:38 hhf423: Right. Nothing seemst o happen Aug 25 05:32:59 hhf423: I always got nothing, but I tried hcitool con right after it and saw the connection briefly Aug 25 05:33:04 ok i think it worked Aug 25 05:34:02 bmidgley: good Aug 25 05:34:11 all right. I must hit the sack. Morning is creeping up and I have a busy day tomorrow. Aug 25 05:34:35 good night sagacis Aug 25 05:38:50 anyone in ubuntu got usb0 autoconfiguring properly? Aug 25 05:39:02 i have to ifdown usb0; ifup usb0 Aug 25 05:39:07 or it has no address assigned Aug 25 05:40:05 looks like someone has got OM 2007.2 running on a HTC phone http://www.flickr.com/photos/ph5/1194094827/ Aug 25 05:40:42 fat fonts! Aug 25 05:41:59 hmm, pand does not work Aug 25 05:43:12 woo hoo, I have modules now too :) thanks hhf423 Aug 25 05:43:37 gcb77: glad I could help Aug 25 05:43:47 bmidgley edit /etc/udev/rules.d/85-ifupdown.rules Aug 25 05:44:38 bmidgley http://pastebin.ca/669902 is mine that works Aug 25 05:44:40 bmidgley: the advice in wiki / usb networking worked for me Aug 25 05:44:59 net_end is at the wrong position or so Aug 25 05:52:53 argh. it STILL comes up with no address until i ifdown usb0;ifup usb0 Aug 25 05:52:57 sigh, one more try with bluetooth and then back to bed Aug 25 05:55:20 ipkg upgrading... Aug 25 05:57:05 guess i should reboot it now Aug 25 05:59:31 is the alsactl stuff required or does the dialer take care of it now Aug 25 06:00:42 bmidgley: the dialer should take care of it Aug 25 06:00:48 bmidgley: and mostly does Aug 25 06:00:58 hey the date got set somehow Aug 25 06:05:33 does someone have a working time server? Aug 25 06:05:50 pool.ntp.org Aug 25 06:06:07 aria tried that, always get timeout or connection refused Aug 25 06:07:09 moin Aug 25 06:07:19 moin Aug 25 06:07:29 ahh ptbtime1.ptb.de worked Aug 25 06:07:29 pool.us.ntp.org? Aug 25 06:14:11 what's the new magic to get the onscreen keyboard? Aug 25 06:15:08 allo Aug 25 06:15:30 i got ERROR: Openembedded's config sanity checker detected a potential misconfiguration. Aug 25 06:15:42 what's wrong with it? Aug 25 06:15:42 bizkut: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Aug 25 06:16:03 bmidgley: it should pop up automagically Aug 25 06:16:27 not for terminal i guess Aug 25 06:16:28 bmidgley: if not, start the input manager and then its the same like before (rectangle on top) Aug 25 06:18:24 i got MokoMakefile problem Aug 25 06:20:55 bizkut: The text around that error message will tell you what the problem is that the config sanity checker discovered. Aug 25 06:21:00 will ipkg upgrades be sufficient from now on? Aug 25 06:21:21 i guess that doesn't cover kernel upgrades... Aug 25 06:21:29 bizkut: and what did bitbake print out after that? Aug 25 06:23:41 rwhitby Either fix the cause of this error or at your own risk disable the checker (see sanity.conf). Aug 25 06:24:30 have you read any further, where it actually says what the error is? Aug 25 06:24:47 Following is the list of potential problems / advisories: Aug 25 06:24:48 Please install following missing utilities: help2man Aug 25 06:25:01 thats all Aug 25 06:25:07 isn't that enough? Aug 25 06:25:11 i got help2man on my system Aug 25 06:25:20 that's all i got on screen Aug 25 06:25:30 make: *** [openmoko-devel-image] Error 1 Aug 25 06:25:35 what's the output of "which help2man" ? Aug 25 06:26:16 . /usr/bin/which: no help2man in (/usr/kerberos/bin:/usr/local/bin:/bin:/usr/bin:/home/bizkut/bin) Aug 25 06:26:25 emm Aug 25 06:26:27 missing Aug 25 06:26:37 ./usr/bin/help2man Aug 25 06:26:41 that Aug 25 06:26:50 yeah Aug 25 06:27:03 LOL help2man is missing Aug 25 06:27:07 sorry Aug 25 06:27:14 thanks rwhitby Aug 25 06:27:14 :P Aug 25 06:29:02 ~emulate rwhitby Aug 25 06:29:03 Well, my work here is done. Aug 25 06:29:20 ah... changing allow-hotplug to auto made it work Aug 25 06:29:28 also upgraded to gutsy ifupdown package Aug 25 06:31:07 segacis: asleep? found out bluez utils now enable audio server Aug 25 06:32:14 bmidgley: I'm currently trying starting from the 2007.08 snapshot and ipkg upgrading from there. Aug 25 06:32:31 (to see if that will get my gsmd staying alive) Aug 25 06:33:37 argh I can get python but not python-dbus Aug 25 06:33:50 need the latter for bluetooth dbus scripts Aug 25 06:53:49 rwhitby: I'm trying to build using the MokoMakefile in a vm w/ 10GB available and it keeps running out of disk space... I already have rm_work set Aug 25 06:54:03 does it just take a lot more space now? Aug 25 06:56:40 gcb77: dunno Aug 25 06:57:49 segacis: when you are awake, have a look at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Manually_using_Bluetooth#Headset_Audio Aug 25 06:59:03 we could really use python-dbus for working over the bluetooth services :) Aug 25 07:03:45 DukeOfURL, ok.. Aug 25 07:06:44 oh wow, does anyone have mtpaint on the NEO? Aug 25 07:10:25 when I start it from the Terminal (mrxvt) its really choppy, can't draw a straight line Aug 25 07:10:44 but when I ssh in, export the display, and start it from there its really really smooth Aug 25 07:14:13 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Manually_using_Bluetooth]] [[Neo1973_Audio_Subsystem]] [[User:Hhf423]] Aug 25 07:30:26 gcb77: that's cause the graphics on the neo is the bottleneck, not the cpu power. Aug 25 07:30:46 gcb77: my 2007.2 build is 6.7GB with rm_work enabled Aug 25 07:32:26 rwhitby: there's got to be something else... I'm exporting the display to the NEO Aug 25 07:32:38 and is that a graphics driver problem or a graphics hardware bandwidth problem? Aug 25 07:33:28 oh, I thought you were running on the neo and displaying somewhere else Aug 25 07:34:13 I ssh in and export DISPLAY=:0 Aug 25 07:34:18 then start mtpaint Aug 25 07:34:45 oh, I completely misunderstood then Aug 25 07:35:00 no idea why that would make a difference Aug 25 07:37:56 It takes the same amount of CPU from both places, between 30% and 50% while drawing Aug 25 07:50:41 I was looking at a cheap second hand Palm Tungsten-E today wondering if it would run Linux, bugger me it does and it looks pretty cool http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESCqQdsIoLI Aug 25 07:53:45 Linux_Galore: yeah, I played with that for a while... a lot of the credit for that goes to balrog-kun ( he was on this channel for a while ) Aug 25 07:55:19 I've been looking at the mtpaint performance... if you: export HOME=/home/root from mrxvt its really fast Aug 25 07:57:16 gcb77: if the PDA is still in the shop next weekIm going to grab it and do some Linux hacking Aug 25 07:58:03 gcb77: US $50 for a second hand Tungsten-E in good condition isnt too bad Aug 25 08:02:30 Linux_Galore: ooh, nice Aug 25 08:10:44 cjb_ie: my Zaurus 5600 packed up 2 weeks ago and now I have nothing to hack on :-(, this Tungsten-E may tide me over before I start rewiring the house Aug 25 08:11:15 Linux_Galore, hey, the iphone is hacked - just port openmoko to it.... ;) Aug 25 08:11:42 rewiring the house seems like a bit of an extreme reaction to lack of hacking opportunity... Aug 25 08:12:31 cjb_ie: its a saying not a literal Aug 25 08:14:24 I have Linux running on my iPOD and Im working on getting a keyboard also up and going with it Aug 25 08:15:56 www.ipodlinux.org Aug 25 08:18:11 cool. a friend of mine put up an evil comic about linux on ipods :( Aug 25 08:18:59 can't find the url though Aug 25 08:21:21 oh wow, we really need an image viewer... Aug 25 08:23:41 oh, got it: http://www.monkeyfight.org/ipodlinux.jpg - i hasten to add that's from a couple of years back Aug 25 08:25:29 :D nice comic... Aug 25 08:25:50 i'll tell him you complimented his artwork :-) Aug 25 08:26:56 cjb_ie, it's more the text than the artwork ;) Aug 25 08:28:34 heh, nice Aug 25 08:36:41 cd .. Aug 25 08:36:44 oops, sorry Aug 25 08:40:24 new GP2X on the way and its "touch screen" http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/gaming/gp2x-f+200-portable-game-system-has-divx-xvid-and-emulator-support-293303.php Aug 25 08:41:23 http://www.streetracers.de.tp/?wid=9128 Aug 25 09:02:19 Linux_Galore: lovely system .. i have 5 gp2x's myself .. will probably get one of the new ones when its ready.. Aug 25 09:02:37 is there anything on the NEO now that can record audio? Aug 25 09:02:58 * gcb77 is playing mp3 using madplay :) Aug 25 09:03:28 i dunno but i for one would be very interested in what sort of audio i/o can be done with the phone .. Aug 25 09:03:39 i've always wanted a phone i could use to implement my own IVR system, for example. Aug 25 09:03:45 on-phone IVR == hell of an application Aug 25 09:08:35 | /home/j/hak/openmoko/build/tmp/work/armv4t-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/gdkbigger-0.1+svn20070825-r3/temp/run.do_clean.5498: line 427: syntax error near unexpected token `(' Aug 25 09:08:47 offending line is: Aug 25 09:08:47 dir=$dir`(cd $dir;find . -name "$dotlai") | sed "s/^\.//;s/\/$dotlai\$//;q"` Aug 25 09:08:54 i don't get it .. Aug 25 09:13:24 heh ZunePhone parody video http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/ip0wn/zunephone-shows-its-superiority-to-the-iphone-292990.php?autoplay=true Aug 25 09:14:14 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Press_Coverage]] [[OpenMoko2007.2]] Aug 25 09:15:15 Hi Aug 25 09:15:28 Linux_Galore, but the callingwheel would be a nice gadget Aug 25 09:15:41 looks like http://www.openembedded.org/wiki/ is kaput Aug 25 09:16:31 darn it, i was already planning on making a rotary phone emulator for the openmoko Aug 25 09:16:39 stapel: It was updated to Drupal sometime in the last 24 hours - perhaps that's the cause. Aug 25 09:16:44 cool Aug 25 09:17:33 torpor: bash vs dash? Aug 25 09:18:21 shit could it really be that? i fixed it yonks ago. Aug 25 09:18:49 hi rwithby.. darn i wanted to check out http://www.openembedded.org/wiki/OEandYourDistro Aug 25 09:18:54 i might have to wait alittle Aug 25 09:19:08 btw rob your makefile rules.. Aug 25 09:19:25 j@boko-ubu:~/hak/openmoko$ ls -alF `echo $SHELL` Aug 25 09:19:25 -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 700560 2007-04-11 01:32 /bin/bash* Aug 25 09:20:34 ah now it works Aug 25 09:22:56 i had to reinstall ubuntu 3 times now in vmware .. everytime i noticed my partition was full Aug 25 09:23:04 20 GB partition should do the trick now :) Aug 25 09:23:06 i hope Aug 25 09:23:19 i even added the rm_work to the config file Aug 25 09:23:47 stapel: I just finished doing the exact same thing, but I just grew the partition in vmware from 10G to 20G Aug 25 09:24:21 erm.. you can extend it? Aug 25 09:24:26 good day Aug 25 09:24:31 i just deleted it an reinstalled Aug 25 09:25:30 stapel: vmware-vdiskmanager comes with the free VMWare Server Aug 25 09:25:39 you can use it to conver disks and re-size in the process Aug 25 09:26:50 hmm Aug 25 09:27:01 i just downloaded the vmware workstation Aug 25 09:27:16 stapel: did you get a lincense? Aug 25 09:27:39 30 day trial licence Aug 25 09:27:44 ah Aug 25 09:28:00 VMWare server is free for home-use, with registration Aug 25 09:28:11 as is VMWare Player Aug 25 09:28:22 hmm sounds cool Aug 25 09:28:37 and the VMware server you have it running on a different machine then i guess.. Aug 25 09:28:59 I just have VMWare Server... there's a built-in viewer too Aug 25 09:29:39 i used it for home use only so that sounds cool Aug 25 09:30:43 * gcb77 just realized that growing the disk doesn't grow the partition... DOH! Aug 25 09:31:25 hehe Aug 25 09:31:47 there is a linux tool though to extend the partition also i think Aug 25 09:31:57 i have done it long time ago Aug 25 09:33:25 parted, gparted Aug 25 09:33:27 I'm booting a knoppix ISO and hoping it will have parted or gparted Aug 25 09:33:34 heh yea Aug 25 09:34:00 i'll be using it soon, upgrading the laptop from 100 to 160G Aug 25 09:34:06 dd and parted will be my friends Aug 25 09:43:54 (script) planet: Rod Whitby: Stopping the OpenMoko startup sound http://www.rwhitby.net/blog/openmoko/stopping-the-openmoko-startup-sound.html Aug 25 09:45:31 gcb77: VMWare server is free for commercial use too. Aug 25 09:45:43 rwhitby: thank you... that sound's been driving me crazy Aug 25 09:46:18 workstation and the GS and ES bare-metal server versions are the ones that are not free to use. Aug 25 09:47:55 is there a wayto stop that stupid popup keyboard appearing? Aug 25 09:51:01 * stapel is going to get his NSLU2 today.. whoop can't wait to tryout the master makefile for that..:) Aug 25 09:51:21 i wonder.. can you install openmoko on a Nokia N700 or > Aug 25 09:51:23 stapel: what firmware are you going to run on the lsug? Aug 25 09:51:58 maybee the one specialy for comunicating with the neo Aug 25 09:52:04 haven't decided yet :) Aug 25 09:52:32 if you've got serial on it, and don't intend putting a disk on it, run mokoslug. Aug 25 09:52:52 if you're going to put a disk on it, or don't have serial, run slugos (le or be, your choice). Aug 25 09:52:59 dfu-util works nicely in both for flashing the neo. Aug 25 09:54:36 mokoslug sounds interesting. Aug 25 09:54:57 it's not polished yet, so only choose it if you're going to help finish it. Aug 25 09:55:42 (i.e. it doesn't have the pivot-root to external usb disk functionality like slugos yet - the bits are all available, but no-one has taped it all together yet) Aug 25 09:56:10 * rwhitby reboots the neo and no longer wakes the kids Aug 25 09:56:41 sounds like a good starting project no? Aug 25 09:56:56 creating mokoslug with external usb disk option? Aug 25 09:58:37 gota go.. talk to you later :) Aug 25 09:59:24 * gcb77 kicks off new OpenMoko build with 20 GB of disk and goes to sleep Aug 25 10:24:12 if i've run into a dash problem, then resort out /bin/bash so its a proper link (/bin/sh i mean), what do i have to do to fix the 'pollution' that might've been caused by this dash issue? Aug 25 10:24:48 i tried to make my own .bb file yesterday, and it worked. then today i did an update and now i'm getting this error whenever i try to use my .bb file : Aug 25 10:24:51 | /home/j/hak/openmoko/build/tmp/work/armv4t-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/gdkbigger-0.1+svn20070825-r3/temp/run.do_configure.12526: line 427: syntax error near unexpected token `(' Aug 25 10:25:10 so i'm wondering if i've got some dash/bash pollution somewhere thats giving me this headache. Aug 25 10:25:19 which blows because yesterday it was running and compiling just fine. Aug 25 10:27:49 here is my bb recipe file, which i'm trying to use to build a gdk-ish app for the first time on moko: Aug 25 10:27:53 http://rafb.net/p/OFWstp74.html Aug 25 10:28:19 if anyone has any clues, please let me know .. this is rapidly killing my desire to focus on openmoko and making me think i should just stick with the much simpler linux distro's for handhelds instead .. Aug 25 10:31:24 torpor: dude, it's saturday morning Aug 25 10:31:27 everyone's asleep Aug 25 10:32:39 is there an openmoko-dev mailing llist? I'm only on the community one Aug 25 10:33:11 there are multiple dev mailing lists, even Aug 25 10:33:26 just see http://lists.openmoko.org/ Aug 25 10:33:32 torpor: I suggest you look there Aug 25 10:33:41 this place can be dead some times of the day Aug 25 10:33:43 i'm on those lists. Aug 25 10:34:06 yeah i realize that, but i also know that some coders read the logs and respond when they've caught up .. i'm not looking for an instant soltuion, just tips and advice on where to go next. Aug 25 10:34:41 torpor: that error also comes when you're running an executable for the wrong architecture Aug 25 10:35:00 are you sure you haven't installed an arm binary on your host, or a host binary in the staging area? Aug 25 10:35:01 ah, i see. Aug 25 10:35:10 well, actually, its possible .. Aug 25 10:35:30 the last thing i tried to do was work out how to get pkg-config working from within my recipe so i could pick up the needed libs for my target .. Aug 25 10:35:42 maybe this is causing grief: Aug 25 10:35:42 ${STAGING_BINDIR}/pkg-config --cflags --libs openmoko-libs gtk+-2.0` Aug 25 10:36:29 torpor: dude, it's saturday morning <-- Sat 10:36 PM here :P Aug 25 10:37:28 Sat 8:10pm here Aug 25 10:37:53 this is the aussie hours :-) Aug 25 10:46:41 hi Aug 25 10:48:08 hehe it's not morning everywhere though.. it's 1:47 PM here :) Aug 25 10:48:29 and "here" is Denmark Aug 25 10:48:43 12:47pm here in vienna Aug 25 10:49:25 So yeah, some of us have been up for quite a while now.. :D Aug 25 10:50:09 But torpor.. i'm sorry, but even though i've been up some time, i'm not in any position to help you.. have no experience with coding Aug 25 10:50:47 only ASP.NET (using VBScript) Aug 25 10:50:48 no worries Aug 25 10:50:57 rwhitby set me on the right track. Aug 25 10:51:05 so you could say i'm a real noob at it.. :D Aug 25 10:51:15 though i would never in a million years have realized this might've been an ARM vs x86 binary problem .. ;) Aug 25 10:52:05 haha.. well that's what the community is here for.. sharing experience... Aug 25 10:52:08 torpor: the error message complaining about an open paren always gives it away. Aug 25 10:53:00 rwhitby: i'll remember that for future reference .. but that sort of error really doesn't indicate "platform binary problem" to me, sorry .. Aug 25 10:53:23 i think thats one of the things that openembedded-experienced developers would catch and intuitively know about, but coming at it fresh its like .. WTF? .. you know? Aug 25 10:54:32 btw, what is the 'proper' way to do a "pkg-config --cflags gtk+-2.0" style compile option in do_compile() bb recipes? i'm not overlooking something obvious am i? should i just put "DEPENDS += gtk+-2.0" in there and let bitbake fix it up, or what? Aug 25 10:55:29 torpor: actually, it's not openembedded-related - just experience of running x86 programs on arm and vice versa Aug 25 10:55:35 GPS - I really hope this isn't high power. http://dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.3623 Aug 25 11:09:20 I wonder why we don't turn the bluetooth on by default at boot ... Aug 25 11:09:41 security? Aug 25 11:09:49 rwhitby: because it drains power? Aug 25 11:10:13 I would have thought developer access to features would be more important than both those things at this point in the project. Aug 25 11:10:38 that I can agree with Aug 25 11:11:00 me too Aug 25 11:11:24 * rwhitby symlinks /etc/rc.boot to /media/card/etc/rc.boot, and starts adding extra startup scripts ... Aug 25 11:11:40 perhaps its just the 'glory stage' of the initial release that we don't want to trample on with such reports by hundreds of new users that they only get 10 minutes of battery life out of their neo's .. Aug 25 11:12:03 rwhitby: are you actually putting root on /media/card now? i thought that was dangerous at the moment .. Aug 25 11:12:47 no, I'm symlinking some additional startup scripts, and files that I change, onto the media card, so when I reflash I can just do a recursive symlink and be back where I was Aug 25 11:12:56 ah i see Aug 25 11:12:58 makes sense Aug 25 11:13:15 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] Aug 25 11:13:44 Don't forget a script on the card to link the directories up. Aug 25 11:14:02 symlinks I mean. Aug 25 11:14:15 yep Aug 25 11:16:26 torpor: btw, openembedded build should go through now. Aug 25 11:16:54 torpor: the remaining problems have been fixed. if it crashes somewhere, do a clean and remove the source files and restart make. that should go through right now. Aug 25 11:17:27 SpeedEvil.. noohhh.. not a GPS Blocker.. the rest of the world is trying to keep track of everything, and then someone is blocking us.. :S Aug 25 11:18:19 i'm doing okay now thanks ixs .. just trying to build my first recipe .. blustering through it right now .. Aug 25 11:19:02 really not sure how i can get the pkg-config for the native ARM target though, so i'm doing silly things like this: Aug 25 11:19:05 http://rafb.net/p/CsGMMc71.html Aug 25 11:19:09 Well.. as long as no one is creating mega GPS blockers everywhere i'm okay with it.. Aug 25 11:19:21 see the -I${STAGING_INCDIR} stuff? is that the right way to do it? because i'd rather use pkg-config .. Aug 25 11:20:08 torpor: have you looked at the classes that support pkgconfig ? Aug 25 11:20:17 nope. Aug 25 11:20:18 openembedded/classes/.... Aug 25 11:20:21 ok Aug 25 11:20:29 like i said .. blustering .. Aug 25 11:21:01 bubbi: gps blocking is actually an art. You'll need some pretty widesprad noise on a pretty whide frequency spectrum. Friends of mine did it for a few minutes for about 200m, I think you should find their thesis on it somewhere on google... Aug 25 11:21:41 No, it's not really. Aug 25 11:21:52 GPS blocking of military recievers is hard. Aug 25 11:22:19 couldn't be any harder than trying to work out how to use pkgconfig in a brand new recipe. Aug 25 11:22:23 ;) Aug 25 11:22:28 Commercial recievers will be basically wiped out by broadband noise over the 1575Mhz band. Aug 25 11:22:38 And the power needed is bugger all. Aug 25 11:22:58 A milliwatt can wipe out a moderately large area. Aug 25 11:23:17 A watt - on a properly designed meaconing transmitter can do 50Km. Aug 25 11:24:23 ixs: hehe.. my brother was a tele engineer while he was in the military, and when they went out and well.. did the war thing, then they brought "huge" communication blockers.. pretty much all frequencies were blocked he said.. no wifi, mobile antennas and such, could get through for quite some miles he said... but it was only for a test to see if it would work Aug 25 11:24:29 until you find an anti-rad missile incoming on your position in excess of mach 2 :) Aug 25 11:25:08 of course it blocked their internal frequencies also, so it kindda blew it for both "teams".. Aug 25 11:25:12 I did some costings for a jammer. Aug 25 11:25:26 I came up with (in bulk) $10 for a solar powered 1W jammer. Aug 25 11:25:31 excellent, my neo and my home bluetooth access point (nslu2 with usb bt dongle) can scan each other :-) Aug 25 11:25:33 But i'm sure it doesn't cause cancer.. haha Aug 25 11:25:33 This is at qty 10K or so. Aug 25 11:25:48 This will basically wipe out civilian GPS over a country. Aug 25 11:26:12 The latest GPS system features steerable 'm-code' spot beams. Aug 25 11:26:24 haha.. nice SpeedEvil.. but please.. don't put them up in Denmark.. i neeeeed to find my way around Aug 25 11:26:24 With 100 times the normal GPS power, aimed at 'hot-spots'. Aug 25 11:26:42 bubbi: well, just jamming is not that interesting. What is _really_ interesting is sniffing the stuff. There are complete cryptoanalysis and decryption devices available for sattelite networks such as thuraya et al. Added bonus, they even tell you where the handsets are located... Aug 25 11:27:27 The sat system broadcasts the handsets location? Aug 25 11:27:28 hmm.. nice, but maybe overkill for my kindda use of GPS.. Aug 25 11:28:03 no they don't.. but i think IXS means that it can "read" where the devices "suck" the information Aug 25 11:28:07 like radar Aug 25 11:28:14 SpeedEvil: nope. The handsets feature a gps and send their location to the satellite in order to not broadcast the traffic through the whole area but jsut use the smaller spot antennas to pinpoint the handset Aug 25 11:28:32 ixs: Oh - right. Aug 25 11:28:32 bubbi: no, in the thuraya case you get gps locations of the handsets. Aug 25 11:29:15 I was thinking you meant that it was hackable on the ground to find locations of nearby users. Aug 25 11:29:22 there are a few companies specialising on that stuff. Interestingly, even their product brochures will only be available after signing an NDA... Aug 25 11:29:38 But some friends of mine left theirs around... :-) Aug 25 11:29:51 ixs: hmm... but handsets don't "send" information back to the satelites right?.. that would first of all need a very large disc to send upwards, and the overload on that the satelites would kill all trafic? Aug 25 11:30:02 Not with GPS. Aug 25 11:30:09 With satellite phones, yes. Aug 25 11:30:12 That's how they work. Aug 25 11:30:39 the thuraya handsets do have gps Aug 25 11:31:03 but the gps location is sent via the normal sat antenna Aug 25 11:31:04 ahh... but not with, say normal tomtom GPS Aug 25 11:31:08 just out-of-band signaling. Aug 25 11:31:16 bubbi: ahh, no way. these are receiver-only-devices. Aug 25 11:31:17 No, not with normal GPS. Aug 25 11:31:34 great.. you had me confused for a moment :P Aug 25 11:31:37 In principle, you could probably detect an operating GPS reciever within 10m or so. Aug 25 11:31:40 * ixs notes, no dialing with latest openmoko... :( Aug 25 11:31:41 It's hard though. Aug 25 11:32:15 detecting a receiver? Aug 25 11:32:16 SpeedEvil: detecting receivers? How would that work? Aug 25 11:32:41 Basically pick up random emissions from the reciever. Aug 25 11:32:45 At the IF frequency Aug 25 11:32:56 emission from the receiver? Aug 25 11:33:01 what's IF frequency? Aug 25 11:33:10 was anybody actually working on a "nearby network of neo's" kindda thing? now that we're talking about GPS and such.. where you could see where neo's were around the world? Aug 25 11:33:21 It's an intermediate frequency generated in the reciever from the incoming signal, to be using to Aug 25 11:33:27 decode the signal Aug 25 11:33:34 bubbi: even better for mugging then the white ipod headphones? Aug 25 11:33:51 yes, the base signal that's used to get the real data out Aug 25 11:34:04 but that's basically saying you can detect an electrical device within 10m Aug 25 11:34:04 bubbi: i will probably be referee on someones Master's thesis that will deal with secure group communication using OpenMoko Aug 25 11:34:13 so near-bye Neo's and meches should be on topic there Aug 25 11:34:19 guaqua: Google 'tv detector van' Aug 25 11:34:22 i hope we get some software bits out of this work Aug 25 11:35:28 ixs: mugging you say?.. heh well.. i was more in the spirit of saying WUHU.. i've got a nerd around the corner.. Aug 25 11:36:16 bubbi: well, there've been reports in the past that people were picked for mugging because they were carring these white ipod headphones. Aug 25 11:36:50 froscon: nice, it is really a subject that has a lot of potential discussions and possibilities Aug 25 11:37:01 yeah, i agree Aug 25 11:37:16 ixs: heh.. well it's the ipod.. what were you expecting? ;) Aug 25 11:38:07 Everything from dating (member of the opposite sex, that you've been in proximity to (50m) several times, and shares interests. To least-cost routing and mesh networking. Aug 25 11:38:27 apple marketed (is that the right word?!) the ipod for people who wanted to be different in a fashionable way... but beeing different, means that you don't follow the mass.. and the mass bought ipods.. soo.. hmm Aug 25 11:39:45 SpeedEvil: Hmm.. that's a thing that i didn't think of, mokoDating.. :D Aug 25 11:40:47 anyone know how to do a proxy-arp type thing with bnep ? Aug 25 11:41:53 although i don't personally think that "matching interests" is always good.. it blocks out possibilities, but thats just my personal thoughts.. Aug 25 11:42:20 my neo and my blueslug can ping each other, but what I really want to do is to have the neo automatically connect to the blueslug and be part of the home network so I can just ssh into it from the laptop) Aug 25 11:42:36 rwhitby: my words exactly Aug 25 11:42:56 bubbi: mokodating is actually a wonderful idea. That would work out splendid at a ccc camp or so... Aug 25 11:43:46 bubbi: and matching interests might just be an added bonus, chances are that the other person of the fitting gender is a good match as long as he/she is also carrying an openmoko device. :-) Aug 25 11:44:01 heh Aug 25 11:44:03 ixs: haha.. Aug 25 11:44:09 that may be a bit farfetched ;) Aug 25 11:44:20 some might consider it a contraindication ... Aug 25 11:44:34 yeah.. I can't stop laughing about that idea... but the worst part is that it might even work.. heh Aug 25 11:44:39 chances are, you might know them already :) Aug 25 11:44:57 ~lart rwhitby for posting instructions how to turn off an exceptional piece of art Aug 25 11:44:57 * apt makes a balloon animal out of rwhitby for posting instructions how to turn off an exceptional piece of art Aug 25 11:44:59 haha.. strange things happen when ppl get a neo in the hands.. Aug 25 11:45:05 i only wanna know openmoko people who know how to build their own recipes and also don't mind talking newbies through it .. Aug 25 11:45:10 but hell, if we could market neo as a dating phone, it might actually sell really well :D Aug 25 11:45:29 ~lart the openmoko boot sound for waking my 2 year old daughter at 11pm. Aug 25 11:45:30 * apt hooks into a hydrant and hoses the openmoko boot sound down for waking my 2 year old daughter at 11pm. Aug 25 11:45:37 heheh Aug 25 11:45:39 sorry Aug 25 11:45:48 the next bootup will be something more lean and mean Aug 25 11:45:51 didn't actually happen, but could easily. Aug 25 11:45:55 i will personally create it Aug 25 11:46:03 mickey|froscon: i'd like to make a bootup .. shall i send some recommendations? Aug 25 11:46:13 torpor: sure Aug 25 11:46:18 i've got tons of synths for the job here Aug 25 11:46:21 cool Aug 25 11:46:25 "the free dating phone" Aug 25 11:46:28 bubbi: well, I'm pretty sure that for some people openmoko is dead sexy. At the camp I was repeatedly told that me starting at rhat next month is sexy... so why not a nice mobile phones? Some people have ferraris, others have phones. *g+ Aug 25 11:46:33 * rwhitby will continue to turn any bootup sound into a click, just like he does on windows :-) Aug 25 11:46:52 rwhitby: we're going to have preferences soon Aug 25 11:47:11 anyone know of any openembedded/linux-arm/embedded job openings around? i'm looking for work .. Aug 25 11:47:18 when we have preferences, openmoko is more advanced than iphone :D Aug 25 11:47:25 changeable ringtones ;) Aug 25 11:47:40 * rwhitby goes back to figuring out how to do proxyarp with pand ... Aug 25 11:47:50 rwhitby: what is pand? Aug 25 11:47:59 bluetooth networking Aug 25 11:48:04 ohh. Aug 25 11:48:19 rwhitby: does it appear as a normal interface on the host? Aug 25 11:48:24 I want me neo to act as if it is ethernet wired into my home lan whenever it is range. Aug 25 11:48:37 ixs: precisely, and well, owning an openmoko phone is as you said, sexy... grrraaurrrr.. Aug 25 11:49:12 ixs: yeah, I know I can bridge it if i have to, but I'm hoping there is something much easier, like the proxyarp option in pppd that I use when the Treo650 becomes part of the LAN via bluetooth ... Aug 25 11:49:44 then just use "arp -i eth0 -s moko-ip host-arp-address pub" on your bluetooth host. Aug 25 11:50:22 but i don't personally think that i will put myself on the meatmarked as a champ for owning a special phone.. hmm.. maybe in a couple of years when everybody knows what openmoko is.. Aug 25 11:51:27 hi.. i've just tried moko make file with qemu to run the new 2007.2 snapshot image.. it boots fine and shows the open moko today application, however when I can't seem to interact with it. When I click with the mouse I get a quick beep, but nothing responds - like clicking on the 'run app' or 'running apps' tabs the bottom Aug 25 11:51:55 Fracture: i heard that in qemu emulation, pointer calibration blows.. so you have to run the calibration again for qemu Aug 25 11:52:04 bubbi: well, it depends. I'll prefer some girl who actually knows what the openmoko is right now. That means less "get away from the damn computer"... Aug 25 11:52:09 torpor: how do I do that ? Aug 25 11:52:13 bubbi: and in the past, that worked out quite well... Aug 25 11:52:34 bubbi: if you're target area is the general meatmarket though... better wait a few years. Aug 25 11:52:40 i think you remove /etc/pointercal from the image and then boot qemu .. it will re-run calibration on startup .. or something like that. i can't be sure, just going on what i heard here recently Aug 25 11:53:15 ok.. how do I access that folder in the image ? Aug 25 11:53:26 for me, it'll be enough when my newborn son finds his dads old neo1973 at the bottom of some junkbox somehwere and he picks it up and uses it for something in, say, 2012 .. Aug 25 11:54:16 torpor: you honestly expect your mobile phone to live that long? Aug 25 11:54:38 sure Aug 25 11:54:54 i don't really agree with the consumer mentality that things must be thrown away just because they're scratched Aug 25 11:55:09 ixs - My me45 is like 5 years or more old. I still use it. Aug 25 11:55:38 And I like it, cause it works great in bright sun light. Aug 25 11:56:50 me45 is awesome Aug 25 11:57:11 it'll probably never break if you haven't broken yours...i have... Aug 25 11:57:12 Elrond: well, I'm using a s45 right now, but that one is severly damaged right now. I could probably fix it by dismantling it and reseating the display connectors and looking for the spare battery lid but I really hope the neo will be usable for voice and sms _REAL SOON NOW_. Aug 25 11:57:37 okay, i really do not understand this. i've build a simple gdk app and now trying to write my own recipe for it .. instead of copying someone else .. but what i don't get is how do i get the libs for GDk (and includes) picked up at compile in my recipe? i've got a do_compile() which manually CC's the app .. does this automatically preclude any benefit i get from using DEPENDS and the rest of the recipe stuff? Aug 25 11:57:38 torpor: I'm not thinking about scratched, I was more thinking along the lines of not working anymore. Aug 25 11:57:53 I broke about 7 s25 phones in two years. Siemens must have really hated me. Aug 25 11:57:53 ixs: stuff rarely "does not work any more" around my house... Aug 25 11:57:55 ixs: well, yeah maybe you are a bit right about them girls :) i'm gonna look for a woman that knows about openmoko.. hehe.. Aug 25 11:58:10 bubbi: good luck then. :-) Aug 25 11:58:20 bubbi: just paint your moko pink. Aug 25 11:58:24 for example, this pkgconfig info here: Aug 25 11:58:24 http://www.openembedded.info/wiki/Bitbake_recipes#inherit_pkgconfig_.28for_anything_with_.3Cpkg.3E.pc_files.29 Aug 25 11:58:25 they'll be all over it Aug 25 11:58:33 ixs - My me45 works fine. :) Aug 25 11:58:48 seems to be more inclined for packages that *provide* .pc files, and doesn't tell me how i *use* pkgconfig within my recipe to get the details for gdk for the Target, etc. Aug 25 11:58:52 but i'm not that much interested in beeing more infront of the computer.. i'm already 12 hours infront of it a day because of work :D Aug 25 11:59:15 raster: haha.. that might help Aug 25 11:59:24 bubbi: it'd work in asia Aug 25 11:59:31 like bees to honey Aug 25 11:59:33 make it pink Aug 25 11:59:34 bubbi: if you work with computers all day, that is understandable. Aug 25 11:59:40 put in kitten pictures Aug 25 11:59:42 bingo\ Aug 25 11:59:50 bubbi: for others though, the computer stuff is still a hobby, so they work on it in the afternoon... Aug 25 12:00:03 .oO( The hello neo phone. ) Aug 25 12:00:29 haha.. i'm in denmark :D pink isn't the right colour for dating a woman here.. hehe.. Aug 25 12:00:42 see Aug 25 12:00:46 european women Aug 25 12:00:49 stylish please.. not flashy Aug 25 12:00:53 they are too complex Aug 25 12:00:56 make it too hard Aug 25 12:00:58 :) Aug 25 12:01:00 here Aug 25 12:01:03 not european.. scandinavian.. even better ;) Aug 25 12:01:05 add diamons Aug 25 12:01:07 rubies Aug 25 12:01:09 anything shiny Aug 25 12:01:10 glittery Aug 25 12:01:11 pink Aug 25 12:01:20 with kittens Aug 25 12:01:21 .. not JUST european.. was the meaning :D Aug 25 12:01:34 and make sure the phone strap has soft plush animals Aug 25 12:01:38 haha Aug 25 12:01:38 and its 3x the size of the phone Aug 25 12:01:42 and you're in. Aug 25 12:01:50 laughing here.. plz stop Aug 25 12:01:51 its a seller Aug 25 12:01:54 raster: i gather you don't live in asia? :) Aug 25 12:01:57 this isn't a joke Aug 25 12:02:02 i've lived in japan for 2.5 years Aug 25 12:02:08 3.5 Aug 25 12:02:17 okay :D Aug 25 12:02:21 that is hilarious Aug 25 12:02:28 guaqua, trust him.. it's true.. Aug 25 12:02:28 i am exaggerating a bit Aug 25 12:02:31 its not 100% Aug 25 12:02:37 but very close Aug 25 12:02:42 but a large percentage of girls choose phoens based on how cute the phone is Aug 25 12:02:46 not if it has features Aug 25 12:02:49 or even makes calls Aug 25 12:02:52 and cute means pink Aug 25 12:03:01 and/or shiny diamon things Aug 25 12:03:09 there are entire stores devoted to customising phones Aug 25 12:03:16 by covering them with fake "diamonds" Aug 25 12:03:27 u see girls with phones that have "straps" Aug 25 12:03:37 and straps with little animals/soft toys Aug 25 12:03:43 and the straps are 3x the size of the phone Aug 25 12:03:43 a friend of mine did that...covered her phone with fake diamonds, but it was for a joke :/ Aug 25 12:03:52 here its no joke Aug 25 12:03:55 its for real Aug 25 12:04:02 its quite funny Aug 25 12:04:03 :) Aug 25 12:04:09 i can imagine :) Aug 25 12:04:31 *sigh* Aug 25 12:05:08 raster: where did you live in japan? Aug 25 12:06:33 http://strapya.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/ribbontomoechan.jpg Aug 25 12:06:36 for a tame example Aug 25 12:06:42 torpor: yes Aug 25 12:06:45 i remeber that there were an online webshop, where you could order a phone specially designed with cover and fake diamonds and ALOT of diodes.. you could design the phone online and get it a few days later Aug 25 12:07:17 http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=00016gk5.jpg :) Aug 25 12:07:23 raster: where tho? tokyo? Aug 25 12:07:35 http://www.tokyomango.com/tokyo_mango/images/diy.jpg Aug 25 12:07:57 torpor: yup. tokyo Aug 25 12:08:11 me too .. in asagaya-kita, near koenji Aug 25 12:08:12 ARGH... i WANT THAT PHONE!!... or not.. heh Aug 25 12:08:32 dcordes: which device is that? Aug 25 12:09:05 mickey|froscon: sharp zaurus sl-c1000 (akita) Aug 25 12:09:13 fun :) Aug 25 12:09:20 can you make that a bit sharper? Aug 25 12:09:29 I'd like to include it in my talk Aug 25 12:09:35 hi folks, isn't it a good idea to put an option to the mokomakefile for compiling qemu related stuff? Aug 25 12:09:35 "ports" Aug 25 12:09:36 I have another pic just a second Aug 25 12:09:53 mickey|froscon: I can also make you a small video if you like Aug 25 12:10:02 dcordes: ooh that would rock! Aug 25 12:10:29 mickey|froscon: http://img463.imageshack.us/my.php?image=00005yd6.jpg Aug 25 12:10:52 it's actually not openmoko but angstrom Aug 25 12:11:07 only installed the UI Aug 25 12:11:08 thanks Aug 25 12:11:25 that looks mighty sweet Aug 25 12:11:51 openmoko may as well put some new life into the Zaurus Aug 25 12:11:54 I love that ui :) it makes gpe pretty usable Aug 25 12:12:03 yes indeed Aug 25 12:12:06 hey zecke_ Aug 25 12:13:38 somehow kinetic scrolling is slow in landsacape mode but when I flip the screen it is pretty smooth Aug 25 12:14:14 landscape mode is software rotated Aug 25 12:14:34 hmm.. isn't that a killer for the cpu then? Aug 25 12:14:39 :) Aug 25 12:14:50 I think it's just xrandr? Aug 25 12:14:52 should be more efficient on gta02, what with the gpu Aug 25 12:14:53 i thought it was hardware based rotation Aug 25 12:15:05 hope so Aug 25 12:15:20 yes it's xrandr, that doesn't mean it's hw rotated Aug 25 12:15:27 yes, that's the software rotating Aug 25 12:16:27 torpor: oh cool! こんばんわ Aug 25 12:16:30 so has anyone heard of a toolchain for this dv007 linux phone Aug 25 12:17:08 dv007? Aug 25 12:17:53 utstarcom dv007 Aug 25 12:18:07 hello Aug 25 12:18:49 anyone can suggest a tutorial or some kind of documentation on how to create bb recipes or use the cross tools to create executables? Aug 25 12:19:10 I am trying to make my first program but I'm having some problems Aug 25 12:19:11 openembedded manual? Aug 25 12:19:42 This content requires the latest Macromedia Flash Player. Get it here Aug 25 12:19:44 baah Aug 25 12:19:47 ~lart utstarcom Aug 25 12:19:48 * apt takes a rusty axe and swings it violently, taking utstarcom's head off Aug 25 12:20:14 mickey|froscon: moin, so how is froscon? Aug 25 12:20:36 I considered going, but I am on a wedding tomorrow Aug 25 12:20:36 hen Aug 25 12:20:36 hhf423: cool. great organization, nice venue, good weather :) Aug 25 12:20:55 mickey|froscon: excellent. you talked yet? Aug 25 12:20:58 Ghiottone: http://www.openembedded.org/user-manual&dpage=chapter_recipes Aug 25 12:21:09 hhf423: no, it's tomorrow 15.15 Aug 25 12:21:17 mickey|froscon: That's the same like last year. How many people? That was the sad thing last year. Aug 25 12:21:31 Ghiottone: i'm currently working through my own hacking at this exact thing .. we could work together. Aug 25 12:21:51 stefan_schmidt: i can't tell yet, but it looks fairly ok. it's not supercrowded, but not empt Aug 25 12:21:51 y Aug 25 12:21:55 i've got basic recipes for making a very simple C lib, and am now struggling to do the same for GDK apps Aug 25 12:22:26 mickey|froscon: ok, last year it looks a bit empty in the big venue Aug 25 12:22:50 unfortunately the user manual recipes are very, very banal. there is no details in ther ebout how to make a more complicated app. its very much geared towards those who only want to port existing packages, and not start from scratch Aug 25 12:22:51 emre_: "make qemu" compiles the qemu stuff. is that what you meant? Aug 25 12:23:04 i hope that my om build will finish this century... Aug 25 12:23:30 torpor: well that's what OE is pretty much about Aug 25 12:23:33 doh? my neo is dead this morning and I did pull the battery? how come? Aug 25 12:23:36 rwhitby: I want the opposite, I have the device and I want to build image to copy to the neo, so I dont want it to download or compile qemu related things.. Aug 25 12:23:37 for example, you either have an ultra simple do_compile() stage, or use autotools. what if you want to write a new openembedded app from scratch? Aug 25 12:23:56 dcordes: let it plug into usb and charge for a while Aug 25 12:24:14 emre_: make openmoko-devel-image instead of make all Aug 25 12:24:14 dcordes: it takes about 30 minutes to recover from a dead charged battery Aug 25 12:24:46 raster: torpor I guess that was for hhf423 Aug 25 12:25:02 * hhf423 read on the community list that a lot of gsmd/dialer bugs were fixed? Aug 25 12:25:03 dcordes: oh yeah... oops Aug 25 12:25:05 rwhitby: I typed "make openmoko-devel-image" but it failed for qemu. NOTE: package qemu-native-0.9.0+cvs20070613: started Aug 25 12:25:05 NOTE: package qemu-native-0.9.0+cvs20070613-r5: task do_configure: started Aug 25 12:25:05 ERROR: function do_configure failed Aug 25 12:25:05 ERROR: log data follows (/home/emre/moko/build/tmp/work/i686-linux/qemu-native-0.9.0+cvs20070613-r5/temp/log.do_configure.20895) Aug 25 12:25:22 dcordes, thanks. It seems that I just did not find it out. I found only bitbake manual and such but they don't say much Aug 25 12:25:31 raster, torpor thanks, thats what I'll do Aug 25 12:25:52 emre_: put ENABLE_BINARY_LOCALE_GENERATION = "0" in your local.conf file Aug 25 12:26:02 * rwhitby considers making that the default for mokomakefile Aug 25 12:26:27 seems logical to me rwhitby .. i mean, its not like locales are terribly important at this stage in openmoko Aug 25 12:26:40 emre_: and add a tip about that to the wiki please Aug 25 12:26:40 rwhitby: qemu is failing during configure, I thought the locale stuff was problematic during build and not during configure Aug 25 12:26:49 anything that gets in the way of new hackers getting ramped up and writing code for openmoko should be paired down in my opinion. Aug 25 12:27:25 torpor, yeah we could do it. although I have little time atm. maybe later or in the next few days Aug 25 12:27:26 ixs: disable locale generation, and it doesn't matter where in qemu-native it fails :-) Aug 25 12:27:48 torpor: I totally agree !! so help me with this calibration issue :) Aug 25 12:27:49 torpor: "paired down"? Should be shot, hacked into small pieves, trmpled upon, roasted in hot oil and then some Aug 25 12:28:02 rwhitby, would it prevent also glibc from needed a really lot of time to compile? Aug 25 12:28:12 rwhitby: let me try it. Aug 25 12:28:19 * hhf423 can help with the shooting and hacking and roasting Aug 25 12:28:30 rwhitby: ahh well. locale generation works fine here. Aug 25 12:28:36 Fracture: i don't know a solution, i don't like using qemu (since i access my linux box from remotely) so i cna't help more than that. Aug 25 12:28:38 about compiling, I'm stuck bitbaking uicmoc4-native_4.3.1 on amd64 any hint ? Aug 25 12:28:50 Ghiottone: no, that's a different local.conf setting to only build limited locales Aug 25 12:28:54 and i'm currently trying to grok recipes so i can write a very basic app and use the libs that are provided in the openembedded suite .. Aug 25 12:29:15 vivo: bitbake -cmrproper uicmoc4-native Aug 25 12:29:25 torpor: no worries.. thanks Aug 25 12:29:40 torpor: that will clean and restart? I'l try Aug 25 12:29:47 worked for me vivo Aug 25 12:29:57 rwhitby: So what is this qemu-native, and why is it compiling anyway? Aug 25 12:30:24 emre_: that's a question for #oe, not for me. Aug 25 12:30:55 rwhitby: just asking to put a note to the wiki. I mean, I should write, why are we adding this line ;) Aug 25 12:30:57 Fracture calibration on qemu? I tried to solve it somehow this night. No solution for now, any hints? Aug 25 12:32:23 Any_Key: I dunno, sorry.. I can;t seem to find out how to Aug 25 12:32:54 Fracture: rm /etc/pointercal on your image Aug 25 12:33:01 torpor: where is the image ? Aug 25 12:33:05 mount the fs image locally, remove /etc/pointercal from it. Aug 25 12:33:10 the jffs2 file you're burning to your neo.. Aug 25 12:33:28 .. or running in qemu Aug 25 12:33:33 torpor: i'm using 'make qemu' so I don't know which file is the image Aug 25 12:33:55 well i'd suggest you work that out first .. there is going to be one jffs2 image for you to use - it gets burned to the neo, or it gets run in the qemu... Aug 25 12:34:11 emre_: my understanding is that qemu-native is used to do some stuff about locales at build time instead of at run time. trouble is that qemu-native is a real bastard to build, and seems to not work on many environments (including yours). Aug 25 12:34:16 torpor: ok .. I found that. Aug 25 12:34:29 it'll be in build/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01 Aug 25 12:34:53 rwhitby: ok. Aug 25 12:35:15 anyone know how to use ppp on a neo to dial into a dund server over bluetooth? Aug 25 12:35:17 mount: unknown filesystem type 'jfss2' Aug 25 12:35:19 fracture: there are symlinks pointing to the latest files in that directory. Aug 25 12:35:37 insmod jffs2 Aug 25 12:36:10 Fracture, correct your typo Aug 25 12:36:52 sudo mount -o loop -t jffs2 OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-P1-August-Snapshot-20070819-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 /media/rootfs/ Aug 25 12:36:59 gives : mount: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/loop0 Aug 25 12:37:26 do you have jffs2 support in your kernel? Aug 25 12:37:48 lsmod | grep jffs2 - shows it ther Aug 25 12:37:49 how can I remake the uImage file? Aug 25 12:38:25 dunno but is the jffs2 file compressed? Aug 25 12:39:14 when I run 'file imagename' it says : OpenMoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-P1-August-Snapshot-20070819-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2: Linux jffs2 filesystem data little endian Aug 25 12:39:32 i have the same problem Aug 25 12:39:48 dmesg | tail shows : 92922.195000] Attempt to mount non-MTD device "/dev/loop0" as JFFS2 Aug 25 12:40:39 Hello folks Aug 25 12:43:08 fracture: found this on google. Aug 25 12:43:10 # modprobe loop Aug 25 12:43:11 # modprobe mtdblock Aug 25 12:43:11 # losetup /dev/loop0 /path/to/imagefile.jffs2 Aug 25 12:43:11 # insmod blkmtd erasesz=256 device=/dev/loop0 Aug 25 12:43:11 # mount -t jffs2 /dev/mtdblock0 /mnt Aug 25 12:44:03 any brazillian here? Aug 25 12:44:03 jonathan_br_ba: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Aug 25 12:44:26 emre_: insmod: can't read 'blkmtd': No such file or directory Aug 25 12:45:05 Fracture, http://www.handhelds.org/hypermail/familiar/62/6232.html Aug 25 12:45:53 hi Aug 25 12:45:55 Fracture, but I have problem with jffs2 module... Aug 25 12:45:57 can so help me? Aug 25 12:46:00 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking Aug 25 12:46:12 i did the manual method Aug 25 12:46:31 but my neo does not connect to the internet... Aug 25 12:46:48 ccube: what is your computer's ip? Aug 25 12:46:53 Any_Key: cool.. that worked Aug 25 12:47:03 from the LAN-Adapter? Aug 25 12:47:05 Fracture, rrrrr Aug 25 12:47:07 yep Aug 25 12:47:11 its another subnet than the neo Aug 25 12:47:18 i know this is the problem Aug 25 12:47:20 Any_Key: but I presume that I am working on a copy of the image now ? and will somehow need to re-package it ? Aug 25 12:47:24 ge@oberx:/home/moko/build/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01$ sudo modprobe jffs2 Aug 25 12:47:24 WARNING: Error inserting mtdsuper (/lib/modules/2.6.22-1-686/kernel/drivers/mtd/mtdsuper.ko): Unknown symbol in module, or unknown parameter (see dmesg) Aug 25 12:47:24 FATAL: Error inserting jffs2 (/lib/modules/2.6.22-1-686/kernel/fs/jffs2/jffs2.ko): Unknown symbol in module, or unknown parameter (see dmesg) Aug 25 12:47:34 but dont know how to solve Aug 25 12:47:36 i.e. the dd coppied them image to the /dev/mtd0 device Aug 25 12:47:49 Any_Key: eek Aug 25 12:48:07 ccube: i had the same problem when two networks (pc to out, neo to pc) had the same network address. Aug 25 12:48:18 Fracture, make flash-qemu-local I think will reflash it Aug 25 12:48:27 how to solve? Aug 25 12:48:51 change one of the network addresses. i.e., if it is 192.168... change it to 10.2.xxx Aug 25 12:48:56 should I use my own page on the wiki to save tips that I think will be useful? Aug 25 12:49:16 which one? The Neos one? Aug 25 12:49:17 Any_Key: but, if I make a change to the image stored in /dev/mtd0 (not the same thing as the image I dd'ed into that device) how will that flash program pick up mY changes ? Aug 25 12:49:19 Fracture, copy it back before Aug 25 12:49:24 i cannot change the computers IP Aug 25 12:49:41 Any_Key: so, just use dd to copy into a new file.. ok Aug 25 12:50:24 ccube: doesn't matter, just change one of. gotta go by the way.. Aug 25 12:50:33 k, thx Aug 25 12:50:34 ccube: this works for me Aug 25 12:50:41 ifconfig usb0 down Aug 25 12:50:42 I can't update the image .. "rm etc/pointercal" : rm: cannot remove `etc/pointercal': No space left on device Aug 25 12:50:43 ifconfig usb0 192.168.0.200 netmask 255.255.255.0 up Aug 25 12:50:44 Fracture,if You dd to new file make changes to Makefile to flash THIS new file Aug 25 12:50:45 iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -j MASQUERADE -s 192.168.0.0/24 Aug 25 12:50:45 echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward Aug 25 12:50:48 iptables -P FORWARD ACCEPT Aug 25 12:51:26 Fracture, mounted rw ? Aug 25 12:51:32 ill try, thx Aug 25 12:51:50 Any_Key: mount -t jffs2 /dev/mtdblock0 /media/rootfs/ Aug 25 12:52:07 Fracture, what mount say? Aug 25 12:52:17 /dev/mtdblock0 on /media/rootfs type jffs2 (rw) Aug 25 12:52:27 Fracture, hm.. Aug 25 12:52:28 df shows : /dev/mtdblock0 4096 4096 0 100% /media/rootfs Aug 25 12:52:37 4 meg image.. 100% full Aug 25 12:53:06 ccube: dont forget to copy your /etc/resolv.conf to your neo ;) Aug 25 12:53:07 u@MandraxX:~/openmoko$ sudo echo 1 > /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward Aug 25 12:53:07 -bash: /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward: Permission denied Aug 25 12:53:44 you need to be root maybe Aug 25 12:53:59 sudo makes me root?? Aug 25 12:54:00 Any_Key: which is strange, given the jffs2 image is 41 meg Aug 25 12:54:11 yo Aug 25 12:54:19 doesnt work anyway Aug 25 12:54:38 try sudo su Aug 25 12:54:43 k Aug 25 12:54:52 Fracture, yea, strange enough, but I still cannot mount it, need to success modprobe jffs2 first, so you the first Aug 25 12:55:09 nope... Aug 25 12:55:22 hmmm Aug 25 12:55:29 ccube: do a sudo bash and try again Aug 25 12:55:35 from a root bash Aug 25 12:55:44 ccube: cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward # what show ? Aug 25 12:56:04 Any_Key: there was an error when using dd : writing to `/dev/mtd0': No space left on device Aug 25 12:56:11 0 Aug 25 12:57:22 dont have the rights Aug 25 12:57:25 ubuntu sucks Aug 25 12:57:31 it's ok for "sudo echo" not to work as echo is a builtin bash Aug 25 12:57:32 surely there's a smarter way to do things than this: http://rafb.net/p/REw4XM48.html Aug 25 12:57:33 :) Aug 25 12:57:35 if so i'd loe to know it. Aug 25 12:57:49 * hhf423 gets scared, Neo still not booting. Screams: "but the battery was almost full and outside the neo during the night" Aug 25 12:58:00 no, i also have no acces to the file while editing manually Aug 25 12:58:16 ccube: did you do a sudo bash and then work from there? Aug 25 12:58:57 guys, its my first contact with openmoko and i'm excited i running it in qemu but i think its to slow, its normal? another thing what is funcional in UI Aug 25 12:59:13 WORKED! :) Aug 25 12:59:21 thx Aug 25 12:59:26 :) Aug 25 12:59:46 Any_Key: you may find some interesting reading http://www.linux-mtd.infradead.org/faq/jffs2.html Aug 25 12:59:56 NEO is online now! Aug 25 12:59:57 jonathan_br_ba, well, on my AMD64X2 4400+, qemu was somewhat slower than the actual gta01, never mind gta02 Aug 25 13:00:03 thx guys Aug 25 13:00:06 * hhf423 quotes from wiki: "If you are doing the echo 1 > /proc/... command manually, sudo may not be enough, then you will have to execute it from a sudo bash. " Aug 25 13:00:09 very nice support here Aug 25 13:00:15 im learning as well, hehe Aug 25 13:00:34 ill write it into the wiki the next days Aug 25 13:01:03 jonathan_br_ba, it's still not blazing on gta01, mind you, but not qemu slow Aug 25 13:01:37 what is gta01 02 ? Aug 25 13:02:05 jonathan_br_ba: the hardware you can buy at the moment is gta01 Aug 25 13:02:10 gta01 is the currently sold development hardware, gta02 is the upcoming revision that will also be the mass-market device Aug 25 13:02:20 how do i add an app to the applications list? Aug 25 13:02:20 the hardware which will be available later this year is gta02 Aug 25 13:02:49 torpor: I have been told with a .desktop file, but I have no idea how this works Aug 25 13:03:11 /usr/share/applications, look at existing ones and learn Aug 25 13:03:13 ccube, if you do sudo cmd > file the file is first opened under your current user and only after that sudo is executed Aug 25 13:03:15 ahh ok, i think use my pc to devel to him Aug 25 13:03:18 whats the best option Aug 25 13:03:27 qemu or xephyr? Aug 25 13:03:31 i am finally able to compile a basic app for moko, but two things: it doesn't end up installed with executable permission, and there is no entry in the apps list .. Aug 25 13:03:56 ccube, you have to do two separate commands. first sudo su - (which will let you become root) and then the echo command Aug 25 13:04:15 Ghiottone: sudo bash is easier :-) Aug 25 13:04:34 ccube: I think Ghiottone is right so what I've said before about bash builtin was wrong Aug 25 13:04:41 hhf423, that should be the same as sudo su :) Aug 25 13:04:52 vivo: :) Aug 25 13:05:02 Ghiottone: right :-) Aug 25 13:05:14 Ghiottone: kk, i see Aug 25 13:05:25 /clear/clear Aug 25 13:08:53 hmm, a new image on buildhost Aug 25 13:09:48 Fracture, thanks for the link, I've tried nandwrite, flashcp, first problem - /dev/mtd0 is too small Aug 25 13:10:07 Any_Key: yeah.. I dunno how to resized it.. doing some googling Aug 25 13:11:40 there is have to be some options for mtdblock module i think Aug 25 13:13:16 Fracture, sudo mtd_debug info /dev/mtd0 Aug 25 13:14:08 Any_Key: rmmod mtdram; modprobe mtdram total_size=50000 erase_size=256 Aug 25 13:14:10 gdkbigger: error while loading shared libraries: libmokoui.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory Aug 25 13:14:15 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[User:Alessandro]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Linkoping]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Belo_Horizonte]] Aug 25 13:14:21 ^^ anyone know why i'm getting this when i try to run my app on the cmd line? Aug 25 13:14:36 Fracture, hey-ho Aug 25 13:16:27 torpor: uicmoc4 still failing :( Aug 25 13:16:48 Any_Key: but,I don't know the impact of having too big a jffs image Aug 25 13:17:27 Fracture, me to, mounting may be slow... Aug 25 13:17:46 Any_Key: well.. when I dd'ed out of the new /dev/mtdblock0 image, after making my change.. it crashed the flasher Aug 25 13:18:10 Any_Key: Please wait, programming the NAND flash... qemu: fatal: Trying to execute code outside RAM or ROM at 0x00000004 Aug 25 13:20:23 Fracture, the size of MTD device crated now is 48M my jffs image was ~39M maybe this is the point? Aug 25 13:21:17 Any_Key: yeah.. my jffs image is 42188800 bytes, which /1024 = 41200, therefore the modprobe command is : modprobe mtdram total_size=41200 erase_size=256 Aug 25 13:21:54 i'm going to try making an image of that size, copy the image to it, mount it, unmount it, make a new image from the device, and flash it .. to see if I can do a rount trip without touching aything Aug 25 13:21:57 hi Aug 25 13:22:08 i am using openmoko with qemu, but there is a biggy mouse support. What can i do to get rid of it? Aug 25 13:22:58 delete the /etc/pointercal file in the image, serenity Aug 25 13:23:08 that is not an easy task, however Aug 25 13:23:19 why? Aug 25 13:24:54 sorry, should be "how". How can i delete this? Aug 25 13:25:29 Fracture, I'm already thinking about finding recipe that inserts this /etc/pointercal, edit it & rebuil... Aug 25 13:26:57 are there any plans to release a new image? Aug 25 13:27:34 Any_Key: yeah, that will be a good idea.. however my "make openmoko-devel-image" is still running in the background, and seems to take a while Aug 25 13:27:50 serenity, take a look at IRC log for last hour or last night some people trying it, include myself Aug 25 13:28:05 oh... Aug 25 13:28:17 :-( Aug 25 13:28:22 finished building fine for me. Aug 25 13:28:40 Any_Key: I managed to flash an unmodified jffs2 image that I did a round trip (dd into and outof the /dev/mtdblock0 device) Aug 25 13:28:55 Any_Key: now, to try increasing the image size Aug 25 13:29:11 I ran the battery from full to empty and it lasted just shy of 6hrs... Aug 25 13:29:31 latest 2007.2 from mokomakefile Aug 25 13:29:44 Fracture, goood Aug 25 13:31:13 serenity, don't despair, you always can do something Aug 25 13:31:30 Any_Key: tell me :) Aug 25 13:32:05 did some screenshots for the folks Aug 25 13:32:18 * Any_Key slaps serenity on the shoulder Aug 25 13:32:23 to get a closer look into it Aug 25 13:32:38 Fracture, Any_Key: maybe this helps: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Userspace_root_image#Mounting_the_JFFS2_image_on_a_loop_back_.28MTD_RAM.29_device Aug 25 13:32:39 * hhf423 is scared, the neo daoes still not boot Aug 25 13:32:58 can be seen here Aug 25 13:32:58 http://www.ssg-radenbeck.de/other/moko/ Aug 25 13:33:09 moin Aug 25 13:33:14 b1303s__: legend Aug 25 13:33:17 hhf423: you broke your pohe? Aug 25 13:33:35 moin sagacis Aug 25 13:34:33 sagacis: I have no idea. I usually do not leave the battery in the phone overnight to prevent discharging. but today the phone does not boot. I now had the neo hooked up for an hour or so and still no boot Aug 25 13:34:52 give it time hhf423 Aug 25 13:35:06 the same thing happened to me too but i had to really charge the battery for a while to get it working. Aug 25 13:35:14 Any_Key: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Userspace_root_image#Mounting_the_JFFS2_image_on_a_loop_back_.28MTD_RAM.29_device works ;) Aug 25 13:35:20 also, try the AUX+Power switch on boot up to get uboot menu up .. Aug 25 13:35:27 hhf423, and if it still doesn't boot, remove the battery for a while and try again Aug 25 13:35:59 however, when I flash my new larger image, it still crashed qemy Aug 25 13:36:06 :) Aug 25 13:36:07 s/qemy/qemu Aug 25 13:36:13 hhf423: You'll be fine after about 2 hrs plugged into an active USB port. Aug 25 13:36:58 I tried to plug into a Windows machine and said 'no' to install the detected device, and the neo wouldn't fast-charge. Aug 25 13:37:30 sagacis: Doesn't windows turn off the USB port if it has no driver? Aug 25 13:37:36 As much as possible, I leave my neo plugged into a fast-charge. Aug 25 13:37:44 mwester: Yup. That's the prob. Aug 25 13:37:46 Any_Key: using dd to copy the changed image back doesn't seem to work.. using the mkjs.jffs2 command does however !! cool Aug 25 13:38:40 * mwester was forced to purchase Motorola's cell phone software just so that he could charge his RAZR from the USB port on his laptop when necessary... :( Aug 25 13:38:52 * hhf423 hopes for the best Aug 25 13:38:53 Fracture, cool! dos it calibrate itself on bootup? Aug 25 13:39:00 Any_Key: still booting Aug 25 13:39:12 Any_Key: qemu seems slow :( Aug 25 13:39:16 * Any_Key crossing fingers Aug 25 13:39:26 motorola chargers are special, too, so you can't just use a dumb charger Aug 25 13:40:02 but an "open" phone should work with any charger imho Aug 25 13:40:03 Not with linux. (also windows driver available on motodev) Aug 25 13:40:33 I have a solar charger and a crank charger that are useless with neo Aug 25 13:40:37 bmidgley: The neo does, just only 100ma, which isn't enough to keep the phone alive Aug 25 13:41:08 you just have to crank hard for 12 hours straight! Aug 25 13:41:09 change in Makefile "-M neo -m 130 -usb -show-cursor \" to "-M neo -m 260 -usb -show-cursor \" example if seems to fasten a little Aug 25 13:41:15 is there any way to run qemu with an accelerator to make it run faster .. I knew something like that was availible for normal linux kernels on qemu ? or is it different due to the guest os's architecture ? Aug 25 13:41:27 The problem is that we have high expectations of the neo in terms of standards, and apparently the 100ma/full charge thing is related to the USB spec... Aug 25 13:41:52 mwester: Sort of. It's like the mailing list header issue.... Aug 25 13:41:58 bmidgley, and indeed it is open enough that you can code support for forced fast charging while the phone is in linux; look at u-boot for model and hack away Aug 25 13:42:05 I thought there was a way to fix that in u-boot -- can't you bump the charge current to the full 500ma? Aug 25 13:42:36 mjr I actually did dig into it for a while but it is hard to tell who calls the shots in the code Aug 25 13:42:37 mwester: neo is following the letter of the usb law. It's the ONLY phone that does that. Every other phone has a way to detect and fast-charge on a dumb charger. Aug 25 13:42:52 mwester: Yes, but not while running. Aug 25 13:42:55 Any_Key: it seems stuck at the 'please wait while the UI starts up" stage Aug 25 13:43:02 neo also can detect a special charger Aug 25 13:43:09 Fracture, hm Aug 25 13:43:14 bmidgley: I found the code last night. Haven't found where i2c is in the kernel yet. Aug 25 13:43:33 if the hub doesn't reply then neo's obligation to be kind is met and it can use 500mA Aug 25 13:43:38 Fracture, Ctrl+Alt+3 Aug 25 13:43:58 Any_Key: shows ATZ Aug 25 13:44:42 Any_Key: with a cursor under the A char Aug 25 13:45:24 bmidgley: that's huge -- if the P1 units can be made to work with a dumb chargers, it's much more useful (I don't have smart chargers in my automobile) Aug 25 13:45:29 it's crazy that everybody tells me it's a good idea that the crank, solar, and auto adapters I already have won't work Aug 25 13:45:37 and should never work Aug 25 13:45:44 obstinance Aug 25 13:46:01 bmidgley, get a grip Aug 25 13:46:33 bmidgley: no, you are right. its stupid, plain and simple. Aug 25 13:46:33 Fracture, it on the late stage of boot, early it shows dmesg or so Aug 25 13:46:44 everybpdy Aug 25 13:46:51 everybody's _not_ saying that at all Aug 25 13:47:32 but in my opinion everyone is entitled to a stupid decision every now and then Aug 25 13:47:47 hhf423: I hope so, or I'm in BIG trouble :) Aug 25 13:48:09 sagacis: hahaha Aug 25 13:49:15 are there chargers for the neo battery? or can I get a second battery with a charger somewhere? I can not have the neo hooked up for two hours every now and then when I least expect it Aug 25 13:50:03 a nokia phone Aug 25 13:50:08 will charge the battery Aug 25 13:50:12 no it won't Aug 25 13:50:29 anyway, charging and power management are the two hurdles to leaving the house with neo Aug 25 13:50:31 bloody ubuntu kernel' OOPS'ed me Aug 25 13:50:41 the neo can use nokia batteries, nokias won't use neo batteries Aug 25 13:50:48 mjr ok Aug 25 13:50:59 hmm nokia bl-5c batts? Aug 25 13:51:03 the battery is not free, it seems :-) Aug 25 13:51:07 some random non-brand charger that does nokia batteries will probably charge neo batteries Aug 25 13:51:22 mjr: Not in fast mode. Aug 25 13:51:44 sagacis, we're not talking USB here Aug 25 13:51:46 You can use random any charger that puts power on the usb line to 100ma charge ('pre') Aug 25 13:51:59 sagacis: if the battery is directly charged, why should it not charge the neo battery with 500mA or more? Aug 25 13:52:10 Oh Aug 25 13:52:17 Then mjr's probably right Aug 25 13:52:18 sagacis: we were talking direct charge Aug 25 13:52:21 meh battery not free it's just a component. I think the only free battery are the old 5110 batteries that have AAA ni-cads inside Aug 25 13:52:21 sorry Aug 25 13:52:30 went away for donuts.... Aug 25 13:52:55 whats the copatible nokia battery called then? Aug 25 13:53:09 bl-5c for example as ME-tan said Aug 25 13:53:23 mjr thanks Aug 25 13:53:35 hhf423: There's a discussion on the wiki about it Aug 25 13:54:00 but yeah, at least nokia phones check the battery metadata and refuse to deal with neo batteries; maybe their external chargers don't, but dunno Aug 25 13:54:07 ooh, I can get it at amazon. how convenient Aug 25 13:54:47 Hmm. Aug 25 13:54:49 "However, currently Neo1973 won't charge BL-5C batteries." Aug 25 13:54:58 ok, so there's that issue still Aug 25 13:55:31 I have a general build question, if anybody knows something about bitbake, etc. Aug 25 13:55:40 anyway, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Battery has the info Aug 25 13:59:46 anyone know where sdpd has gone in the new bluez-utils? Aug 25 14:06:48 --enable-old-daemons compile option. Aug 25 14:07:16 Any_Key: I am giving up for tonight.. good luck to you :) Aug 25 14:07:45 bye all Aug 25 14:07:50 see you maybe later Aug 25 14:07:59 Fracture, good luck & goodnight Aug 25 14:19:00 hhf423: how's the neo? Mine doesn't boot this morning either, I left the battery in overnight Aug 25 14:19:15 that has happened to me twice. Aug 25 14:19:21 you leave the battery out for an hour. Aug 25 14:19:27 then put the battery back, and let it charge. Aug 25 14:19:29 for 2 to 3 hours. Aug 25 14:19:36 hold down the power button, hard and firm. Aug 25 14:20:20 any hints that it's charging when the phone's off? Aug 25 14:20:25 any lights come on or anything? Aug 25 14:20:29 or is it an act of faith? Aug 25 14:20:35 nope Aug 25 14:20:44 its all pretty much totally haywire. Aug 25 14:20:54 but thats why you got it in the first place right? Aug 25 14:20:58 it is a development machine. Aug 25 14:20:59 correct Aug 25 14:21:07 I just want to be developing on it now :-\ Aug 25 14:21:12 this was supposed to be my day Aug 25 14:21:36 the problem is abysmal powermanagement in the kernel/distrosetup right now. it deflates all batteries, and leaves the onboard capacitors in a sorry state. a bit of wiggle is what you need. Aug 25 14:21:53 be patient. don't get stressed. its all i can say. Aug 25 14:22:10 happened to me twice this week. i hope powermanagement is a priority next week. Aug 25 14:22:15 I have the other battery, but it's at work Aug 25 14:22:16 sigh... Aug 25 14:22:26 just give it a bit of a wiggle. Aug 25 14:22:37 i bet it boots. Aug 25 14:23:03 and anywyay .. how far along are you with developing for the moko? its quite possible you can have work to do to set it up before you can turn it on anyway .. Aug 25 14:23:05 trying to find a usb wall charger right now Aug 25 14:23:16 torpor: meh, I've had it booting, etc. already Aug 25 14:23:19 whats wrong with your PC for charging .. Aug 25 14:23:24 laptop Aug 25 14:23:25 do you have the devkit set up and working? Aug 25 14:23:40 I don't have the build env. going at work for 2007.2 yet Aug 25 14:23:49 thats a lot of effort. Aug 25 14:23:55 Hi all, ipkg update && ipkg upgrade have installed a new kernel, but Neo boots with the old one. I tried to -force-reinstall the new kernel image (kernel-2.6.21.6-moko11). I need to remove the old one? Aug 25 14:24:04 it probably would be good for you to have a working neo to play with for days and days while you wait for the build to complete. Aug 25 14:24:13 hehe! Aug 25 14:24:15 yeah Aug 25 14:24:46 seriously though, there is a *lot* of rampup to be done to get to the point where you're coding for the neo. Aug 25 14:25:15 I'm considering hijacking the wife's computer (quad-core w/2GB) just so I can build faster... Aug 25 14:25:40 torpor: except ruby and gprs were working, and I had tons of stuff I was going to do with just those two Aug 25 14:26:04 mybe I should get the bt-14 charger from nokia to charge the battery. should go a lot fater Aug 25 14:26:51 this is not funny, neo still deos not boot Aug 25 14:28:21 hhf423: tried the other battery? Aug 25 14:29:04 any idea what could be using the gsm serial line? Aug 25 14:29:06 which other batter? Aug 25 14:29:06 root@fic-gta01:~$ lsof | grep ttySAC0 Aug 25 14:29:07 root@fic-gta01:~$ cu -l /dev/ttySAC0 Aug 25 14:29:07 cu: open (/dev/ttySAC0): Permission denied Aug 25 14:29:07 cu: /dev/ttySAC0: Line in use Aug 25 14:29:07 root@fic-gta01:~$ Aug 25 14:29:22 ixs: you need to change the permissions Aug 25 14:29:51 chown uucp.uucp /dev/ttySAC0 Aug 25 14:30:27 jadams: which other battery? Aug 25 14:30:35 mwester: http://www.openembedded.org/icecc : It is possible to compile on a cluster of machines with OE, and quite easily so. This code is still somewhat experimental, but ... Aug 25 14:30:35 hhf423: ohh. strange. I always thought cu should work as I'm root and root has rw Aug 25 14:31:07 ixs: yes, but aparrently not even root is allowed everything just so Aug 25 14:31:55 hhf423: very strange. Aug 25 14:32:02 mwester: a distcc host on your wifes computer would probably be easy to do for openembedded .. Aug 25 14:32:07 someone needs to make a LiveCD that has icecc setup on it.. so that you can just bung it into other spare PCs around your home/office, and off you go :) Aug 25 14:32:30 torpor: aparently dist-cc is a no-go for cross compiling Aug 25 14:32:42 torpor: checkout icecc instead http://www.openembedded.org/icecc Aug 25 14:32:54 ah, thats what i meant. Aug 25 14:32:56 Lend me your ears now, Montenegrins! Aug 25 14:32:58 Full fifty years I’ve spun of my life's thread, Aug 25 14:33:00 And summer on this mount have ever spent, Aug 25 14:33:01 Ascending quite to this commanding peak. Aug 25 14:33:03 A hundred times I’ve gaz’d at floading clouds, Aug 25 14:33:04 Sailing as phantom ships high off the sea, Aug 25 14:33:06 And casting anchor on this mountain range! Aug 25 14:33:07 Now here, now there I’ve watch’d them break away, Aug 25 14:33:09 With darts of lightning and with rumblings dread - Aug 25 14:33:10 And sudden roar of all the sky’s artillery! Aug 25 14:33:12 A hundred times have I watch’d from these heights, Aug 25 14:33:13 And quietly basked beneath the genial sun, Aug 25 14:33:15 While lightnings flash’d and thunders peal’d below: Aug 25 14:33:16 I saw and heard how they did rend the skies; Aug 25 14:33:18 Downpours from heaven of most hostile hail Aug 25 14:33:19 Robbed Mother Earth of her fertility. Aug 25 14:33:21 And how a wonder new comes into view: Aug 25 14:33:22 Observest thou - if thou thy God dost know! - Aug 25 14:33:24 How much is sea and how much is of shore? Aug 25 14:33:24 SteveTheFaag: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Aug 25 14:33:26 View Bosnia’s plains! Herzegovina see! Aug 25 14:33:27 Albania spreading straight unto the waves! Aug 25 14:33:28 but its not true you can't use distcc for crosscompiling .. Aug 25 14:33:29 Seest thou how much is Montenegrin soil? Aug 25 14:33:30 SteveTheFaag, that's enough, thanks - please respond to your /mgss.. Aug 25 14:33:31 One single cloud doth surely cover all! Aug 25 14:33:33 All around doth peal the crashing thunder, Aug 25 14:33:35 Behold beneath us how the lightnings flash, Aug 25 14:33:37 Alone on us doth smile the cheering sun: Aug 25 14:33:39 Kindly the air doth greet our faces now - Aug 25 14:33:41 ’Tis wont on Lovtchen to blow somewhat cool! Aug 25 14:33:43 Aug 25 14:33:45 OBRAD Aug 25 14:33:47 Didst thou mark the wonder and the omen - Aug 25 14:33:47 gawd, can someone kick the spammer Aug 25 14:33:49 How in the sky two flashes made a Cross! Aug 25 14:33:51 One flash there was from Kom straight on to Lovtchen; Aug 25 14:33:53 From Scutari another - unto Ostrog! Aug 25 14:33:54 kick! Aug 25 14:33:55 They made a cross of living fire; Aug 25 14:33:57 Most beautiful indeed to view; Aug 25 14:33:59 Never before in this wide world Aug 25 14:34:01 Was like unto it seen or even heard, Aug 25 14:34:03 God help us Serbs in all our misery, Aug 25 14:34:03 its quite funny to read Aug 25 14:34:05 And let this Cross be unto us good omen! Aug 25 14:34:07 Aug 25 14:34:09 VUK RASLAPCHEVITCH Aug 25 14:34:11 Say, Drashko, say! Whereat dost point thy jeferdar? Aug 25 14:34:13 Aug 25 14:34:15 VOIVODA DRASHKO Aug 25 14:34:17 Tempted am I to shoot a little cuckoo, Aug 25 14:34:19 But rather grudge to spend on it the bullet! Aug 25 14:34:21 Aug 25 14:34:23 VUK RASLAPCHEVITCH Aug 25 14:34:25 Save it, then, Drashko! Let life more precious be! Aug 25 14:34:27 From shooting cuckoos there can come no good; Aug 25 14:34:29 Dost thou not know - if the Devil hath not thee? - Aug 25 14:34:31 That cuckoos are the daughters of Tsar Lazar? Aug 25 14:34:33 Aug 25 14:34:35 (Much shouting is heard near the ruins on Aug 25 14:34:36 SteveTheFaag, last chance - stop, please. Aug 25 14:34:37 the hill-top on the north side, above the Lake.) Aug 25 14:34:39 Aug 25 14:34:41 SERDAR VOUKOTA Aug 25 14:34:43 What cause for this ado? Why uproar thus? Aug 25 14:34:45 Such babbling were a shame to any children! Aug 25 14:34:46 I think its a bot Aug 25 14:34:47 Aug 25 14:34:49 VOUKOTA MRVALYEVITCH Aug 25 14:34:50 sudo kick SteveTheFaag Aug 25 14:34:50 this is opera or so? Aug 25 14:34:51 A flight of partridges upon us came, Aug 25 14:34:51 boot! Aug 25 14:34:57 And every bird of them we took alive: Aug 25 14:34:57 On which account this uproar great amongst us! Aug 25 14:34:57 (More shouting.) Aug 25 14:34:57 ~ Aug 25 14:34:59 Let these birds go; I swear it is God’s will! Aug 25 14:35:01 For ’twas distress that brought them here; Aug 25 14:35:01 chatzilla says whois Aug 25 14:35:03 How could ye captive make of one of them, Aug 25 14:35:05 Since they do fly to you for kindly care, Aug 25 14:35:07 ’Tis not God’s will that ye should them all kill! Aug 25 14:35:09 Aug 25 14:35:11 (They let the birds fly off, and the young men Aug 25 14:35:13 ~lart the ops for not paying attention to serbian history!!! Aug 25 14:35:13 * apt whips the ops with a wet and grimy noodle just because for not paying attention to serbian history!!! Aug 25 14:35:13 return to the crosses, with the aid of which they Aug 25 14:35:15 had caught the birds.) Aug 25 14:35:17 Aug 25 14:35:19 AN ASSEMBLY AT CETTIGNÉ ON THE 8TH SEPTEMBER, ON THE OCCASION OF THE FESTIVAL OF THE NATIVITY OF THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY Aug 25 14:35:22 Aug 25 14:35:24 (Some disputes are to be settled. The People Aug 25 14:35:26 dance the Kolo; the Chiefs go aside) Aug 25 14:35:27 ~lart the ops paying attention to serbian history!!! Aug 25 14:35:27 * apt installs PocketPC on the ops paying attention to serbian history!!!'s PDA Aug 25 14:35:28 The People, as they dance the Kolo,* sing: Aug 25 14:35:30 Our God hath poured His wrath upon the Serbs, Aug 25 14:35:32 For deadly sins withdrawn His favour from us: Aug 25 14:35:34 Our Rulers trampled underfoot all law, Aug 25 14:35:36 With bloody hatred fought each other down. Aug 25 14:35:38 Tore from fraternal brows the living eyes: Aug 25 14:35:40 Authority and Law they cast aside, Aug 25 14:35:41 ~lart the ops for not paying attention to serbian history!!! Aug 25 14:35:42 * apt pulls out a ClueBat (tm) and thwaps the ops for not paying attention to serbian history!!! Aug 25 14:35:42 Instead chose folly as their rule and guide! Aug 25 14:35:44 And those who served our kings became untrue, Aug 25 14:35:46 Crimson they bathed themselves in kingly blood! Aug 25 14:35:48 Our noblemen - God’s curse be on their souls - Aug 25 14:35:50 Did tear and rend the Kingdom into pieces, Aug 25 14:35:52 And wasted wantonly our people's power. Aug 25 14:35:54 The Serbian magnates - may their name rot out! - Aug 25 14:35:55 ~lart the ops for not paying attention to serbian history!!! Aug 25 14:35:55 * apt takes large quantities of Krispy Kream donuts and stuffs them one after another down the ops's throat until the ops puts on 150lbs for not paying attention to serbian history!!! Aug 25 14:35:56 They scatter’d broadcast Discord’s evil seed, Aug 25 14:35:58 And poisoned thus the life-springs of our race. Aug 25 14:36:00 Our Serbian chiefs, most miserable cowards, Aug 25 14:36:02 damnit Aug 25 14:36:09 that took a while :F Aug 25 14:36:18 lol Aug 25 14:36:19 we need to have some sort of protection against that Aug 25 14:36:30 yeah its called a non-sleeping ops Aug 25 14:36:50 Sorry, guys. He's been disrupting multiple channels. Aug 25 14:36:53 He shouldn't cause you any more problems :) Aug 25 14:37:44 oh, you were an op :) Aug 25 14:37:50 ok Aug 25 14:37:55 where were we .. Aug 25 14:38:13 If someone's been particularly disruptive like this, it's generally worth pinging a staffer or #freenode - we can't really intervene in channel issues, but this both was particularly disruptive and affecting multiple channels :) Aug 25 14:38:17 guaqua, nope, I'm a freenode staffer. Aug 25 14:38:24 okay Aug 25 14:38:45 guaqua: mhm, I've only seen such problems on freenode I think. Looks like the existance of ChanServ is leading to less people being ops. Less ops means less people able to kick someone like that. Aug 25 14:39:14 and pinging staffers might work, but is not the direct way of solving problems. Aug 25 14:39:28 also leads to less hijackings due to the fact that hijacking doesn't really lead anywhere Aug 25 14:39:55 njan: i was glad of the history lesson, that is some nice literature .. Aug 25 14:39:58 ixs, actually, since chanserv lets folk op themselves up whenever they want, the presence of chansrev generally makes it easier to maintain a trusted group of folk with the requisite superpowers to take action if it's required.. Aug 25 14:40:10 ixs, it's just unfortunate that this channel doesn't have >1 op in the Chanserv ACL :) Aug 25 14:40:13 guaqua: nah, hijacking problems are not really that common anymore. Aug 25 14:41:23 njan: sure, like I said, chanserv leads to less ops as there's no danger of the ops suddenly getting disconnected and then returning to a opless channel. Side effect is, that many chanowners do not assign as man op flags anymore, resulting in above when the one guy (or the small group) fell asleep. Aug 25 14:41:26 We could prolly do with more ops. Aug 25 14:41:30 There is currently one. Aug 25 14:41:39 ixs, maybe. I haven't found that to be the case. Aug 25 14:41:52 ixs, some channels stick *!*@freenode/staff/* and *!*@freenode/helper/* in the ACL if they have fewer ops, or just as a contingency in case no-one's around / there's a particularly disruptive problem. Aug 25 14:42:43 njan: mhm, I've seen that happen on quite a lot of channels I'm on. Might be though, that I'm only picking the bad ones on freenode. :-> Aug 25 14:43:15 Okay, but back to neo-stuff Aug 25 14:43:36 any suggestion _why_ the modem is not answering to AT requests? neither via cu nor via gpsd. Aug 25 14:43:41 s/gps/gsm/ Aug 25 14:43:42 ixs meant: any suggestion _why_ the modem is not answering to AT requests? neither via cu nor via gsmd. Aug 25 14:43:52 it's off? Aug 25 14:43:56 mjr: nope. Aug 25 14:44:02 power_on says 1 Aug 25 14:44:09 (and it worked in the past) Aug 25 14:44:28 <6>gta01-pm-gsm gta01-pm-gsm.0: powering up GSM, thus disconnecting serial console Aug 25 14:44:36 so I guess it's really powered on. Aug 25 14:46:26 ixs, *shrug*.. I'd recommend talking to whoever's in charge of the channel and explaining the problem to them :) Aug 25 14:46:42 ixs, obviously if they're not there to fix it they may not be there to see it either :) Aug 25 14:46:49 njan: nah, *shrug* is my opinion as well... Aug 25 14:47:10 who's in charge of this channel anyway? Aug 25 14:49:15 anyone else in here a bitbake newbie? Aug 25 14:51:14 fsck, the neo is still dead Aug 25 14:51:52 take the battery out Aug 25 14:51:58 hold down the power, hold down AUX. Aug 25 14:52:00 torpor: done Aug 25 14:52:00 do that twice. Aug 25 14:52:09 hold down the power, put the battery back in. Aug 25 14:52:13 torpor: done already Aug 25 14:52:27 putting battery in while holding power? Aug 25 14:52:32 then leave it in charging overnight and try again tomorrow. Aug 25 14:52:39 yes.. Aug 25 14:53:41 howdy howdy! Aug 25 14:53:59 My cablemodem just conked out, so I slaved through my neo... Aug 25 14:54:01 this is stupid voodoo Aug 25 14:54:25 this battery/chaging issue is a serious drawback. what crap. Aug 25 14:59:33 darn, lost internet Aug 25 15:02:15 hhf: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Charging Aug 25 15:02:21 see the emergency charging bit Aug 25 15:02:35 torpor seems a bit confused. Aug 25 15:03:11 hhf423: mine boots fine now Aug 25 15:03:28 all I did was take the battery out, stick it back in, leave it plugged up to my laptop for an hour Aug 25 15:03:57 sagacis: lost the neo internet? Aug 25 15:04:23 I get my new laptop on or around labor day, once that's here I'll get bluetooth phone/computer connection rocking Aug 25 15:04:35 or once I flash my 770 with a new image Aug 25 15:04:36 jadams: yeah, I know. Thats what I did last time and the neo was fine after an hour. but now its NOT fine still after 3 hours + Aug 25 15:04:57 I've wanted to do the (770 shares wifi with neo shares gprs with 770) dance for a while now Aug 25 15:05:23 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Charging#Neo1973_emergency_charging read that hhf423 ? Aug 25 15:05:34 jadams: of course Aug 25 15:05:38 hhf423: just leave it overnight. Aug 25 15:05:52 chanserv, I can has an ops ? Aug 25 15:06:07 torpor: easy to say, you do not have no neo to play with. this plainly sucks Aug 25 15:06:43 hhf423: read the above link, you do not need overnight properly done, an hour at most. Aug 25 15:07:03 SpeedEvil: its already three hours and not back from the dead Aug 25 15:07:54 did you take the battery out for 10 mins, then plug it all in Aug 25 15:08:03 is you usb 500ma > Aug 25 15:08:07 ? Aug 25 15:08:16 torpor: you did leave it out for 20 secs? Aug 25 15:08:23 oh, 10min says scaredycat Aug 25 15:09:02 ScaredyCat: yes, my USB is 500mA Aug 25 15:09:21 ScaredyCat: yes, I did all the battery take out voodoo Aug 25 15:09:39 ok, so once it's all plugged in and left for a futher 20 mins then power up Aug 25 15:09:55 ie don't power up immediately Aug 25 15:10:23 jadams: I lost my main broadband internet. Happens often... Aug 25 15:10:28 ScaredyCat: I did that. still dead after an hour, after two hours and after 3 hours Aug 25 15:10:46 hhf: Do you have a voltmeter? Aug 25 15:11:22 SpeedEvil: the Neo has charges cccv on this usb port before. I know that it has 500mA Aug 25 15:11:29 Err - no. Aug 25 15:11:34 cccv/fast Aug 25 15:11:40 The Neo draws only what it decides to draw at any time. Aug 25 15:11:47 This is not specified by the port, but the neo. Aug 25 15:12:14 SpeedEvil: sure, right. Is probably so dead now that it only charges 100 Aug 25 15:12:27 40mA in reality Aug 25 15:12:51 crap Aug 25 15:13:44 An hour - after battery taken out and put back in and not touched - should get you enough for 5 mins easily. Aug 25 15:14:17 SpeedEvil: I already did that. So I should probably be very worried now Aug 25 15:14:36 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Flashing_openmoko]] [[Neo1973_Battery_Charger]] [[MokoMakefile]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Warsaw]] Aug 25 15:14:56 SpeedEvil: and the best thing is: I do not even know how the battery got drained, because it was NOT in the neo over night Aug 25 15:15:12 jadams: yup.. i left it out for a few hours. Aug 25 15:15:17 then i charged overnight Aug 25 15:17:58 did I already mention that the battery was not in the phone overnight? and that is was almost full when I took it out? Aug 25 15:29:24 hhf|away: :/ Aug 25 15:29:58 hhf|away: it is a brand name charger/port, not a no-name one? Aug 25 15:30:24 Though 'brand name' may be meaningless - I've had a Belkin Tetrahub output 10V Aug 25 15:30:37 which diddn't do most of the stuff connected to it much good at all. Aug 25 15:45:29 hhf|away: Did you put it in the phone backwards? Aug 25 15:45:32 ;-) Aug 25 15:53:18 pfew Aug 25 15:53:24 phew Aug 25 15:54:05 I took the battery out, went to mow my lawn and now I am back, I put the battery back in and the Neo boots Aug 25 15:54:17 this is crazy Aug 25 15:54:49 all the "take out, press power button, press aux & power" blabla voodoo for nothing Aug 25 15:55:04 just take the battery out for like half an hour Aug 25 15:55:47 this is chaos, there are no patterns, no order Aug 25 15:56:32 * hhf does the ipkg dance Aug 25 15:57:59 has anyone built OM2007.2 on Debian Etch? Aug 25 15:59:25 g Aug 25 15:59:28 goodmoring all* Aug 25 16:02:05 hhf: well, good news anyway Aug 25 16:02:28 this thing needs a bigger root partition, that's all there is to it Aug 25 16:02:57 is the root fs bigger on the consumer version by chance? Aug 25 16:03:21 why do you need a bigger root partition? Aug 25 16:04:19 BryceLeo: meh, just installed like two things through ipkg yesterday and ate up all the space Aug 25 16:04:43 what two things? Aug 25 16:04:43 and the libs take up most of it, and I don't really want to put linked libs on removable media Aug 25 16:04:55 midori and mysql, mtpaint and a couple others maybe too Aug 25 16:05:01 but it wasn't very much stuff Aug 25 16:05:16 and most of them were tiny on inspection, think midori was one of the big problems Aug 25 16:05:27 what's midori? i only knowit as alcohol Aug 25 16:05:38 webkit-based browser Aug 25 16:05:41 google maps works great in it Aug 25 16:05:46 (as should all iphone apps) Aug 25 16:05:50 niice that's awesome Aug 25 16:05:53 yeah Aug 25 16:06:10 but the rootfs needs to be bigger, at least big enough to hold a few more libs than it can now Aug 25 16:06:32 unless I just start keeping all apps, .Desktop entries, and libs for a given app on the same removable drive Aug 25 16:06:47 err, microsd Aug 25 16:06:53 hmm i thought there was a google code project going on for this already... that seems like a bit of duplicated work Aug 25 16:07:03 there probably is, I just haven't heard of it Aug 25 16:07:12 jadams: the microsd is as "removable" as an internal HD is Aug 25 16:07:50 cesarb: what's the appropriate way to switch it to handle /lib, etc then? Aug 25 16:08:18 move stuff to /media/card/lib and symlink that? Aug 25 16:08:36 I don't want to make partitions on the card, I know that much Aug 25 16:09:50 jadams: if you want to use it to expand rootfs, you'll want ext2 at least, so what's the problem with some extra partitioning? Aug 25 16:10:10 jadams: (of course, the real solution is to increase the internal flash... which I think GTA02 does Aug 25 16:10:11 ) Aug 25 16:10:33 cesarb: I don't want to choose how to split up a meager 512M...I'd rather it be more fluid Aug 25 16:10:42 I'd partition the whole thing ext2, but I don't want multiple partitions Aug 25 16:10:57 but I just want it to store apps on Aug 25 16:11:07 I don't want installing two big applications to end the phone for me Aug 25 16:11:08 Strange, $HOME variable is not defined on the running device. Aug 25 16:11:18 I couldn't even ipkg remove because it would try to write to log and run out of space before removing Aug 25 16:11:58 emre_: worse than that, everything runs as root Aug 25 16:12:23 emre_: which is something you got on operating systems of the last century Aug 25 16:12:24 that's ok, but there is a /home/root path. I was hoping that would be the $HOME. Aug 25 16:12:30 cesarb: most explots are buffer overflows once you pop a buffer you can run as root Aug 25 16:13:02 there's really not a terribly amount of risk with everything running as root Aug 25 16:13:16 BryceLeo: are you kidding? Aug 25 16:13:42 no Aug 25 16:13:44 heh, think about this way, do I really want to enter a root password every time I want to install a new device? Aug 25 16:13:52 if you're smart about using your device then you're fine Aug 25 16:14:05 do you want to enter a root password to turn the gprs radio on and off? Aug 25 16:14:10 BryceLeo: but everyone's running packages they download from the repository all the time Aug 25 16:14:14 yes Aug 25 16:14:16 give me sudo Aug 25 16:14:26 then you need a trusted repo, that's the point Aug 25 16:14:29 hey, does the neo have a magnetic leaf switch inside it like the blackberry? Aug 25 16:14:31 and let me set a few executables to run sudo Aug 25 16:14:33 the problem is keyboard. Aug 25 16:14:40 BryceLeo: yeah, but I trust it now, and it could get hacked Aug 25 16:14:45 trusted isn't unhackable Aug 25 16:14:50 so could any repo ever! Aug 25 16:14:54 I know that Aug 25 16:15:02 if you have a plam device you don't worry about a phone virus too much Aug 25 16:15:08 you don't worry about a blackberry virus too much Aug 25 16:15:09 but I'm not running most apps as root Aug 25 16:15:20 and for the love of god you don't worry abut win moblile viruses Aug 25 16:15:22 BryceLeo: but I have a linux device now... Aug 25 16:15:23 why is this any different? Aug 25 16:15:33 yes a linux device which is if anything MORE SECURE Aug 25 16:15:33 I just dislike running as root on a machine Aug 25 16:15:46 superuser should be a privileged operating method, not the default. That's my position. Aug 25 16:16:02 BryceLeo: and which I will be running LOTS OF OPEN PORTS ON Aug 25 16:16:08 and which will just be an internet device Aug 25 16:16:28 the winmo phones don't have that many paths in, but email on mine scared the bejeezus out of me Aug 25 16:16:29 jadams: then for your special case you can setup sudo Aug 25 16:16:42 (not reeally, but it made me concerned I'd get a virus that way, given ms's track record w/ outlook) Aug 25 16:16:59 BryceLeo: big fan of Ubuntu's default policies here Aug 25 16:17:14 me to, i love the idea of it, but it doesn't belong on a mobile device Aug 25 16:17:20 the most they'll steal is contact information Aug 25 16:17:20 meh Aug 25 16:17:22 there's no money in that Aug 25 16:17:30 there's not credit card numbers, no social security number Aug 25 16:17:44 I don't see how using something as "just an internet device" is a special case Aug 25 16:17:46 my concern is just getting 0wned Aug 25 16:17:51 what they take isn't a big deal to me Aug 25 16:18:00 plus we're evaluating the phones for building part of our business on them Aug 25 16:18:02 hell look at the people who would kazaa your quicken or turbo tax data and send you a crafted email to extort the hell out of you Aug 25 16:18:03 so yeah, it matters to me Aug 25 16:18:15 because we MIGHT store sensitive data on there, and I don't want the base ui running as root dammit Aug 25 16:18:22 but that's not my immediate concern Aug 25 16:18:34 then jadams you can create a special security enhanced build for your sitiuaiton and maybe even make it a full on project Aug 25 16:18:59 BryceLeo: I might do it. My point was just that you acted like it was a silly thing to say, and there are loads of business scenarios that differ with that opinioin. Aug 25 16:19:05 s/opinioin/opinion Aug 25 16:19:08 i totally agree, but imo sensetive data should always be under lock and key, shouldn't even go on a laptop Aug 25 16:19:18 encrypt, encrypt, encrypt Aug 25 16:19:40 but the sensitive data part, again, isn't as big of an issue as disrupted service or general 0wnage would Aug 25 16:19:40 any encryption can be broken, computers are getting to fast and people are to sloppy with encryption keys and passwords Aug 25 16:19:52 this is the stupidest discussion I've ever heard Aug 25 16:19:55 jadams: with the small problem you cannot do full-partition encryption on jffs2, due to its use of OOB data... Aug 25 16:20:12 jadams: so you'd need to do the encryption on the sd card Aug 25 16:20:16 high-bit RSA encryption can't be broken brute force. There are large prizes for solving the factorization challenges. (large-ish) Aug 25 16:20:20 could always port true crypt and just make an encrypted file in the partition, slow and balls but possible Aug 25 16:20:24 I've worked on research on factorization methods Aug 25 16:20:54 jadams: where do you store your encrypiton key? the pass phrase? you still have dumb users out there who will keep it in a text file or taped to their phone Aug 25 16:21:05 there's actually one method that worked great for smaller numbers (faster than any other I know of), but there was some threshold that killed the algorithm...in terms of performance. Never fixed that one. Aug 25 16:21:06 sensetive data should never be on a portable device Aug 25 16:21:22 BryceLeo: but because idiots will do it doesn't change the inherent security Aug 25 16:21:31 idiots aren't going to win, sure Aug 25 16:21:35 security is only as strong as the weakest link Aug 25 16:21:57 but *I* should be able to. And idiots shouldn't be running as root without knowing what they're doing. Aug 25 16:22:04 running as root is not a problem for most users Aug 25 16:22:06 oh my god, stop spouting off shit like that Aug 25 16:22:07 I'm aware Aug 25 16:22:14 then what's your point? Aug 25 16:22:28 I meant in response to 'security is only as strong as the weakest link' Aug 25 16:22:32 fringe cases and businesses that want to put secure data on a device that can fit in someones pocket? Aug 25 16:22:44 my point has never been about secure data Aug 25 16:22:46 I've said this repeatedly Aug 25 16:22:51 the issue for me is 0wnage in the first place Aug 25 16:22:53 you don't want the device owned right Aug 25 16:22:59 it takes about 10 minutes to reflash Aug 25 16:23:15 anyone else having the "Warning: unable to open initial console" problem w/ 2.6.12.6-moko11 ? Aug 25 16:24:00 mickeyl: i wasn't 2 days ago, i wont be able to re-build till i get my new drive in Aug 25 16:24:13 k Aug 25 16:24:25 sorry i can't get you anything more recent Aug 25 16:25:37 np Aug 25 16:25:49 * mickeyl reinstalls 2.6.21.5 and tries again Aug 25 16:26:12 is there a package installer native for neo out there yet? i.e. can i do some sort of graphical install setup to test my new .ipks? Aug 25 16:26:42 try installing openmoko-applicationmanager Aug 25 16:26:52 not yet converted to 2007.2 Aug 25 16:27:08 oh, i see.. Aug 25 16:29:34 is openmoko-applicationmanager on some feed somewhere thats not normal on a neo1973? Aug 25 16:29:37 running 2007.2 i mean? Aug 25 16:30:34 There is no good solution to the ownage problem at the moment - for someone with a torx and a debug board. It can be fixed in software for the case of someone with a laptop, and a DFU image. Aug 25 16:30:45 does anyone knwo if there is a difference in uImage-fic-gta01-latest.bin vs uImage-2.6.21.5-moko10-r4-fic-gta01.bin on the buildhost? Aug 25 16:31:24 What'd really be needed to make an ownage resistant device would be to epoxy the debug connector, or to have some passphrase to get to JTAG. Aug 25 16:31:36 try ipkg install openmoko-appmanager Aug 25 16:31:41 can't the the feed atm. Aug 25 16:32:44 mickeyl, how is the froscon? Aug 25 16:33:03 torpor: uploading it to the feed atm. hold on a couple of seconds Aug 25 16:33:06 ok Aug 25 16:33:08 then ipkg update and ipkg install openmoko-appmanager Aug 25 16:33:13 Shoragan: good so far. Aug 25 16:33:15 yup, understood. Aug 25 16:33:17 thanks btw. Aug 25 16:33:27 Shoragan: are you on an uptodate rootfs? Aug 25 16:33:36 Shoragan: i have problems with "unable to open initial console" Aug 25 16:33:37 i'm compiling right now Aug 25 16:33:40 ok Aug 25 16:33:43 please keep me posted Aug 25 16:33:43 <--- w000t1!! just ran my first moko app, written from scratch, new bitbake ande verything! ;) Aug 25 16:33:49 torpor: congrats! Aug 25 16:33:54 SpeedEvil: that would be great if there was a jtag passphrase, but with a custom debug board couldn't that be overcome? Aug 25 16:33:55 SpeedEvil: the interesting case is avoiding ownage while under the linux kernel Aug 25 16:33:56 yeah thanks micky Aug 25 16:34:04 * hhf congratulates torpor Aug 25 16:34:05 haha nice job torpor! Aug 25 16:34:10 feels good tob e back in the land of openembedded and actually doing something with it for a change! :) Aug 25 16:34:14 what kind of app is it torpor? Aug 25 16:34:19 SpeedEvil: so the user can only keep physical control and avoid connecting usb when on uboot, and that's all needed to avoid ownage Aug 25 16:34:38 BryceLeo: an app to test my ability to write a bitbake recipe, work out what goes what, and display a few silly thingson the screen! Aug 25 16:34:48 now i'm gonna dive into librsvg and see what it takes to do me some graphics .. ;) Aug 25 16:34:55 haha niice Aug 25 16:34:57 enjoy! Aug 25 16:35:03 phew. Aug 25 16:35:06 finally. Aug 25 16:36:08 torpor: you have it building using auto tools? Aug 25 16:36:13 yes Aug 25 16:36:14 ;) Aug 25 16:36:21 so i'll have to try to compile it on my linux box now .. Aug 25 16:36:38 cesarb: You also need to resist the 'phone unattended for 5 mins' case as much as possible IMO. Aug 25 16:36:43 hmm... mind tossing a tar.gz of your stuff up somehere or emailing it? Aug 25 16:37:17 BryceLeo: not yet! but yes i will make an open source app out of this today/tomorrow, and then release it. Aug 25 16:37:20 does anyone knwo if there is a difference in uImage-fic-gta01-latest.bin vs uImage-2.6.21.5-moko10-r4-fic-gta01.bin on the buildhost? Aug 25 16:37:22 SpeedEvil: if your phone is unattended for 5 minutes, it can get stolen, and you are owned no matter what you do Aug 25 16:37:31 BryceLeo: I was meaning a hardware device on the board that would not let JTAG through until you'd configured it with passphrase. Aug 25 16:37:49 BryceLeo: but for sure i will share/help you get up to speed too .. it was a seriously long effort - took me a week and a half to get everything smoothed out so i could build something. Aug 25 16:37:52 cesarb: Nope. There is also the virtualisation/keylogger/... attack. Aug 25 16:38:06 you could have a BT token on you and the phone will destroy all data if it can not see the BT token anymore :-) Aug 25 16:38:10 if you're on a mactel, i could consider sharing my parallels image with you - its a linux machine with all build tools onboard, built, etc. Aug 25 16:38:47 torpor: i don't know autotools i write these odd little hackjob scripts to do my compilation Aug 25 16:38:57 ah Aug 25 16:39:04 torpor: did you check out the Applicaiton development crash course? Aug 25 16:39:06 SpeedEvil: so, you need to resist for 5 minutes... the best I can think of is an uboot password before allowing dfu/console (perhaps with you needing to type it on the usb console before dfu can run), and a tamper-evident seal to avoid jtag attacks Aug 25 16:39:21 yeah i just got up to speed on autotools today too, i sorta was glib and ignorant about it, but openembedded forced me to read up on it .. Aug 25 16:39:26 building my own 2007.2 right now, once that's completed I'll look at mimicking torpor :) Aug 25 16:39:52 yeah, i did the crash course: its crap! woot for a simple main().c app and thats it! what i've got now is the framework to use whatever libs are on board, link, form dependencies, etc. Aug 25 16:39:59 yeah torpor if you can send me that tar i'd be glad to tear it apart, learn auto-tools and fix up the crash course Aug 25 16:40:10 jadams: l) Aug 25 16:40:19 SpeedEvil: the _right_ way to make a almost unownable phone (owning time of several hours) would be to have a TPM... Aug 25 16:40:31 i'll clean it up a bit and maybe i should add to the app crash course now .. Aug 25 16:40:44 of course, i'll probably have a few nasty words from the openembedded crew about my bitbake, but whatever! :) Aug 25 16:40:56 torpor: i can go through and fix up your bitbake files Aug 25 16:41:02 ok Aug 25 16:41:17 then i will now take a break and come back to this and then have a go at updating the wiki for you guys .. Aug 25 16:41:32 awesome Aug 25 16:41:34 then i'll hack for a couple days and release a GPL package too, just so its all easier. Aug 25 16:41:45 alrighty sounds good to me Aug 25 16:41:53 I'll be waiting on my work machine to build that image anyway, so... Aug 25 16:42:11 maybe I'll just play with pygtk on the device Aug 25 16:42:20 yeah .. you really gotta get the builds done. thats a drag. Aug 25 16:42:49 torpor did you setup a local overlay? Aug 25 16:42:52 once we're actually developing our apps for the phone (assuming we decide it's a good investment), I'll just buy a buildfarm for us or something :) Aug 25 16:43:01 but actually maybe it'd be cool if we all shared a virtual machine image (parallels here) that has it already up and running, no further building necessary. i'm considering doing that with the open2x/GP2X toolchains i've been working on too, so maybe it'd work to just bung openmoko in it too .. Aug 25 16:43:28 can parallels not import a vmware image? Aug 25 16:43:32 I know qemu can run one... Aug 25 16:43:41 no on the local overlay. i think thats not workable for me .. its too un-compatible with my other build systems for the rest of my codetree's .. Aug 25 16:44:00 jadams: yeah, vice versa too i think. Aug 25 16:44:18 good, good Aug 25 16:44:19 torpor: ... yowch.... ok... well i'll see what you did when you pop back with it Aug 25 16:44:26 We use qemu/kqemu for everything Aug 25 16:44:34 My love affair with OSS is only growing Aug 25 16:45:02 okay time for a small break, then i'm gonna come back and really hack on some code, finally, and not just a build system .. Aug 25 16:45:14 FlowPlayer is awesome by the way...off-topic, but it's an open source .flv player (a la youtube's flash player) Aug 25 16:45:54 really polished and completely production ready...I just found it last week for the first time... Aug 25 16:46:00 yeah i know, its ported to gp2x already .. ;) Aug 25 16:46:15 the GP2X crowd have some very nice software up their sleeves, by the way .. ;) Aug 25 16:46:57 gp2x as in the handheld gaming console that's hackable? Aug 25 16:47:07 yup Aug 25 16:47:12 wiiiiiide open. Aug 25 16:47:14 lovely machine. Aug 25 16:47:16 very loverly. Aug 25 16:47:26 i'm especially fond of its second processor, an ARM940 Aug 25 16:47:53 any bluetooth on that guy? Aug 25 16:48:22 no, but full USB host. Aug 25 16:48:44 so you can just plug in whatevery ou want - WLAN, bluetooth, midi .. audio .. wacom tablet, mouse, powermate .. ;) Aug 25 16:48:57 i have 2 poewrmates and 2 midi interfaces on one of my gp2x machines. Aug 25 16:49:04 is it full usb host? Aug 25 16:49:10 thought you had to provide external power Aug 25 16:49:14 maybe I read wrong Aug 25 16:49:55 well, its got a docking station, and i leave mine fully plugged in anyway, so .. Aug 25 16:51:15 how much are they? Aug 25 16:57:25 I did an update and now I have no recognized sound cards Aug 25 16:57:29 this happened to me yesterday too Aug 25 16:57:33 anyone seen this? Aug 25 16:57:39 err, upgrade Aug 25 16:58:21 it might be that you upgraded to 2.6.21.6 kernel modules Aug 25 16:58:26 in that case you need to update uImage as well Aug 25 16:58:32 since ipkg doesn't update the kernel Aug 25 16:58:38 How long does it take to boot the device? Aug 25 16:58:45 aha...updated uImage is on the buildhost I assume Aug 25 16:58:48 unfortunately ipkg updates kernel modules as well, it shouldn't really Aug 25 16:59:02 like on desktop systems, it should rather add them Aug 25 16:59:15 jadams: i hope so. if not i'll build one Aug 25 17:04:34 alright, flashing latest uImage Aug 25 17:04:42 i really need to get my nas box setup Aug 25 17:05:59 hrm...I still see on boot 'alsa device list: no soundcards found' Aug 25 17:06:38 nope, no sound Aug 25 17:06:48 i see that too now .. Aug 25 17:06:57 just did ipkg upgrade as well. Aug 25 17:07:01 and no sound. Aug 25 17:07:12 hrm Aug 25 17:07:19 what's uname -a for you? Aug 25 17:07:31 I'm: fic-gta01 2.6.21.6-moko10 Aug 25 17:07:33 when it should be 11 Aug 25 17:07:36 no soundscards found on boot is no problem Aug 25 17:07:38 I thought Aug 25 17:07:42 modules are loaded later on Aug 25 17:07:55 but i hav eno sound Aug 25 17:07:57 mickeyl: I have no sound Aug 25 17:08:27 you probably need 2.6.12.6-moko11 then Aug 25 17:09:09 I just flashed this onto the device though: http://buildhost.openmoko.org/OM2007.2/tmp/deploy/glibc/images/fic-gta01/uImage-2.6.21.6-moko11-r2-fic-gta01.bin Aug 25 17:09:22 so why is uname returning moko10? Aug 25 17:11:29 urgs Aug 25 17:11:43 because someone broke defconfig Aug 25 17:11:50 let me fix that, and then i need to run Aug 25 17:11:55 alright, thanks Aug 25 17:13:55 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Flashing_openmoko/Known_good_rootfs_flash_dfu-util_output]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_East_Midlands]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[Talk:OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[Flashing_openmoko/Known_good_kernel_flash_dfu-util_output]] [[Flashing_openmoko/Known_good_kernel_flash_U-Boot_output]] and other changes Aug 25 17:23:20 mickeyl: so once defconfig is fixed, what's the next step to getting my neo running the right kernel? Aug 25 17:23:52 jadams: use ipkg update && ipkg upgrade again to update the modules Aug 25 17:24:01 then grab the new 2.6.21.6 uimage and DFU it Aug 25 17:24:10 ok, it's on the buildhost now Aug 25 17:24:14 good luck Aug 25 17:24:16 need to run now Aug 25 17:25:05 hi Aug 25 17:25:13 some developers here who can help me? Aug 25 17:26:06 great Aug 25 17:27:26 same exact filename for the new uImage? Aug 25 17:27:28 oh, he's gone Aug 25 17:30:31 jadams: it'll show up when its done building i think.. Aug 25 17:32:11 jadams: uImage-2.6.21.6-moko11-r2-fic-gta01.bin seems to be the most recent stuff Aug 25 17:35:37 how do i restart the "Today" app (or whatever it is) without rebooting? Aug 25 17:36:19 torpor: I'd restart X Aug 25 17:36:42 ok Aug 25 17:37:25 is there a tutorial for what i need to develop on the official build? Aug 25 17:39:11 not much goin on here right now... :P Aug 25 17:39:17 its a bit queit Aug 25 17:39:17 hmm, that latest .6 kernel does no longer support BT Aug 25 17:39:37 ccube: there is an application quick-start on the moko wiki .. Aug 25 17:40:39 my problem is that im doing several times what is explained here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile Aug 25 17:40:51 but always my build crashes Aug 25 17:41:05 i dont know what im doing wrong... Aug 25 17:41:40 how do i find the quick start? Aug 25 17:48:57 ccube: its not so easy. Aug 25 17:49:00 what is wrong with your build? Aug 25 17:49:01 hehe Aug 25 17:49:50 torpor: hmm Aug 25 17:50:02 torpor: do i have a logfile somewhere? Aug 25 17:52:33 yes Aug 25 17:52:54 it'll be off your openmoko/build/tmp/ dir somewhere .. but you should see whats failing and know to look there. Aug 25 18:00:54 hey Aug 25 18:01:01 how do i get a complete build tree? Aug 25 18:02:02 philip_: wget http://www.rwhitby.net/files/openmoko/Makefile && make Aug 25 18:02:40 this will download oe upstream + patches and build them? Aug 25 18:03:53 philip_: this will download everything needed for the current software, including oe + patches, bitbake, gcc etc. and spit out flashable images. as an added benefit, it'll leave you with a complete build tree. Aug 25 18:08:33 yay. for what's it worth: 2007.1 => working gsm and dead audio || 2007.02 => dead gsm and working audio... Aug 25 18:08:39 i wonder why this isn't documented as such Aug 25 18:09:48 mickeyl, i get unable to open an initial console, too Aug 25 18:10:10 but after some waiting it continues Aug 25 18:14:27 philip_: it takes quite a while to complete a build from scratch .. Aug 25 18:14:58 took me 6 days to complete. Aug 25 18:17:50 what machine do you have? Aug 25 18:18:11 it's also about your bandwidth Aug 25 18:18:13 it downloads a lot Aug 25 18:18:26 i usually run out of disk space instead ;) Aug 25 18:19:36 torpor: i guess i'll set up a distcc at the lab Aug 25 18:19:53 so we can use the dualcore machine with the 4 gigs ram ;) Aug 25 18:21:04 hehe Aug 25 18:21:05 nice one Aug 25 18:26:01 philip_: we can't use distcc to do this, we have to use ieccc Aug 25 18:26:16 but its a good idea anyway Aug 25 18:26:25 i'll share my build tree with you .. Aug 25 18:38:48 did anyone here succeeded in setting up a gprs connection? Aug 25 18:40:01 * SpeedEvil did. Aug 25 18:40:09 how? Aug 25 18:40:14 just normale ppd? Aug 25 18:40:17 * Aug 25 18:40:19 basically. Aug 25 18:40:22 *pppd Aug 25 18:40:27 great Aug 25 18:40:32 I followed the 'manually using GPRS' instructions in the wiki Aug 25 18:40:42 sweet Aug 25 18:40:50 thanks Aug 25 18:41:12 I had free GPRS for 10 days - so I was playing with it. Aug 25 18:49:57 Now it's only free after the first 136K at 7p per K :/ Aug 25 19:00:23 hi all Aug 25 19:02:20 I've got a problem with mokomakefile -> package quilt-native-0.45-r1 Aug 25 19:02:42 the makefile tries -> /usr/bin/install -c -d /usr/local/bin Aug 25 19:03:00 and obviusly -> cannot create regular file `/usr/local/bin/quilt': Permission denied Aug 25 19:03:45 may anybody help me? Aug 25 19:04:09 It tends to be quite quiet at this sort of time on a saturday. Aug 25 19:05:26 oh Aug 25 19:09:54 * hhf mixed images and now has to clean up Aug 25 19:14:10 make clean-package-quilt doesn't fix it Aug 25 19:14:20 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Hhf423]] [[OpenMoko_supported_hardware]] [[Talk:MacOS_X]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] Aug 25 19:17:20 I wonder why one has to stop x, restart gsmd and start x to make it work. whats the problem with properly starting gsmd before x? Aug 25 19:22:22 hhf: put '/etc/init.d/gsmd stop; /etc/init.d/gsmd start' in your /etc/matchbox/session file before 'openmoko-dialer &' Aug 25 19:22:54 jroman: can you 'sudo apt-get install quilt' to fix it? Aug 25 19:25:01 sagacis: good point. you know why thats not there by default? Aug 25 19:25:26 sagacis: yum install quilt didn't help me :-( Aug 25 19:28:53 thaks a lot (i have to go) Aug 25 19:40:27 Is it normal to get "+CME ERROR: 3" as the answer to AT+COPS=? when you don't have a SIM inserted? Aug 25 19:47:29 !counter Aug 25 19:47:32 counter Aug 25 19:47:32 http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter Got it, get yours from openmoko.com (and read topic) (1803;252) Aug 25 19:51:32 anyone able to help figure out why my V4 build box doesn't power on anymore? Aug 25 19:51:38 Battery reads 3.0V unloaded Aug 25 19:51:51 but, even many hours of USB connection doesn't appear to help Aug 25 19:55:42 keithp: hooked up to a linux box or what? Aug 25 19:56:33 sagacis: that works excellent, now it asks me for the PIN every time Aug 25 19:57:01 hhf: yes Aug 25 19:57:11 hhf: would an AC charger work better? Aug 25 19:57:21 keithp: no, definitely not Aug 25 19:57:31 (yes, I know, USB specs, and all, but seriously, 'just working' would be a huge feature at this point) Aug 25 19:57:41 keithp: I fully agree Aug 25 20:09:47 keithphttp://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Charging - keithp Aug 25 20:11:32 * hhf is very happy as he now gets asked for the PIN every bl**dy time Aug 25 20:11:53 * hhf now worries about BT which does not seem to work Aug 25 20:11:58 * SpeedEvil passes hhf a pincushion. Aug 25 20:12:09 :-) Aug 25 20:12:16 SpeedEvil: yeah, tried that; still no booty Aug 25 20:12:20 Oh - and :) Aug 25 20:12:21 the PIN in a haystack! Aug 25 20:12:32 I'll try again... Aug 25 20:12:47 Apparantly the correct procedure is: Aug 25 20:12:47 I did manage to get a new software stack built, and would like to give it a try... Aug 25 20:12:54 keith did you try setting the phone to autofast in uboot? Aug 25 20:12:59 keithp hm yes try to remove the battery for 10 seconds Aug 25 20:13:07 Take battery out, mow lawn, put battery back in. Aug 25 20:13:10 :) Aug 25 20:13:10 hhf: it isn't powering up to that point Aug 25 20:13:19 SpeedEvil: ah, remove for a *long* time. Aug 25 20:13:24 hahaha. SpeedEvil that worked for me! Aug 25 20:13:27 Well - some have had success. Aug 25 20:13:42 For me - 10s has always worked. Aug 25 20:13:43 * hhf mowes his lawn in 30-40 mins Aug 25 20:13:54 How can I tell if it is working? Aug 25 20:13:59 Will I see anything on the host USB? Aug 25 20:14:02 keithp: no. Aug 25 20:14:08 cool Aug 25 20:14:15 keithp: it only shows up on USB when the processor is booted. Aug 25 20:14:25 keith can you power up the phone at the moment? Aug 25 20:14:26 Unless you have a voltmeter. Aug 25 20:14:36 yeah, have voltmeter Aug 25 20:14:44 You can make a breakout USB cable then. Aug 25 20:14:45 hhf: no, it's completely dead Aug 25 20:14:52 ah, then measure current Aug 25 20:14:59 Take a USB extension cable you don't care for. Aug 25 20:15:06 oh, I've got plenty of USB cables :-) Aug 25 20:15:10 Chop it open, and cut the red wire. Aug 25 20:15:27 NO, NOT THE BLUE WIRE! Aug 25 20:15:41 *cough* 'scuse me Aug 25 20:15:45 Insert multimeter on a range which can measure 500mA into the red wire, and you can see what it's drawing. Aug 25 20:15:54 keithp: ah, ok. then pull out battery, wait for some minutes (seconds worked for me once, but not today) and then plug in the battery and then hook up to linux usb and then wait for 30/60mins Aug 25 20:15:56 Which can be handy. Aug 25 20:16:06 keithp: only then try to boot Aug 25 20:16:14 Pretty much. Though any charger source will work. Aug 25 20:17:09 keithp: you could report the voltage on the battery - you just measure between the two outside terminals. Aug 25 20:19:58 SpeedEvil: hmm. plugging in to USB doesn't appear to change the voltage Aug 25 20:20:07 that seems bad Aug 25 20:20:45 * hhf wants BT to work! Aug 25 20:20:54 hhf? Aug 25 20:20:57 wantwantwant, doh Aug 25 20:21:02 Shouldn't change the voltage Aug 25 20:21:03 hhf with gui or what? Aug 25 20:21:12 woglinde: no, at all Aug 25 20:21:14 otherwise bt should work from console Aug 25 20:21:18 or rather - what are you measuring keithp. Aug 25 20:21:31 hhf423: you do know that BT is not enabled on boot? Aug 25 20:21:33 woglinde: I can start BT ok Aug 25 20:21:34 I couldn't get incoming calls earlier...dialing out worked, but never rang on incomin Aug 25 20:21:41 and you've got to echo 1 to the appropriate file? Aug 25 20:22:42 SpeedEvil, woglinde I do the echo stuff and then hciconfig reports one interface Aug 25 20:23:03 SpeedEvil, woglinde I can then do hcitool scan ok and see other devices Aug 25 20:23:17 SpeedEvil, woglinde but I can not create connections to them Aug 25 20:23:40 jadams: did it vibrate on incoming? Aug 25 20:23:45 hhf423: nothing Aug 25 20:23:46 :/ Aug 25 20:23:53 no events showing up from gsmd, nothing Aug 25 20:24:03 (I do xserver-nodm restart so I can watch stuff on the hsot) Aug 25 20:24:16 jadams: did you put '/etc/init.d/gsmd stop; /etc/init.d/gsmd start' in your /etc/matchbox/session file before 'openmoko-dialer &' ? Aug 25 20:24:28 hhf423: yeah, and dialing out works Aug 25 20:24:47 right now I can't mess with it though Aug 25 20:24:50 SIM's in a real phone Aug 25 20:25:02 hmm, funny, dial in also works for me, see: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Phase_1_Software_Testing#Snapshot_20070825_with_2.6.21.6-moko11-r2 Aug 25 20:25:05 I *could* dial out a seemingly arbitrary number of times (earlier it would only work once) Aug 25 20:25:27 SpeedEvil, woglinde any idea? Aug 25 20:25:37 about the BT? Aug 25 20:26:16 I see the same thing, can dial out numerous times (after putting the gsmd stop/start in session file) but I can not get any indication of an incoming call even watching gsmd output Aug 25 20:26:34 is address book -> dialer working? Wasn't on mine, but that page says it is, so... Aug 25 20:26:38 SpeedEvil: just measuring the voltage on the battery Aug 25 20:26:44 cindy: you aren't alone then :) Aug 25 20:26:57 keithp: while the battery is in circuit? What's the voltage? Aug 25 20:27:01 SpeedEvil: usually, applying a charge to a battery increases the measured voltage Aug 25 20:27:05 I did not try address book Aug 25 20:27:12 SpeedEvil: with the battery in the circuit, I measure 3.39V Aug 25 20:27:46 with no battery, it's 2.8V Aug 25 20:27:59 It may take some time to qualify the battery at a very very low current Aug 25 20:28:02 with USB disconnected, it's .5V Aug 25 20:28:14 then it will start moderately rapidly charging. (40mA) Aug 25 20:28:27 I'll wait for it to hit 0V without USB before connecting battery and USB again Aug 25 20:28:57 * cesarb is taking his "Claro Chip" off his Razr to test it with the Neo... wish me luck ;-) Aug 25 20:29:06 cesarb: what's a Claro Chip? Aug 25 20:29:21 jadams: SIM Aug 25 20:29:48 ah, dialing from contacts does not work Aug 25 20:30:23 hhf423: glad to hear *that* wasn't unique to me too Aug 25 20:30:39 to be honest, the software's farther than I'd expected it to be by the time I got my phone Aug 25 20:30:46 but this may be due to my phone taking so long to come :) Aug 25 20:32:36 jadams: what I find promising is how fast it is progressing. and of course that compiling other packages like mysql is straightforward :-) Aug 25 20:33:00 hhf423: I still haven't compiled any new packages into it myself, but I'm pushing for that shortly Aug 25 20:33:14 I just need to get a decent ruby dev env set up on it Aug 25 20:33:17 I'd really like BT to work as USB networking does not work with my windows box, but BT networking would Aug 25 20:33:25 bluetooth fabric keyboard, vim + vim-ruby, and irb should do it Aug 25 20:33:45 yeah, I want BT for the keyboard Aug 25 20:34:08 jadams: yes, that the other good thing, that people using "high level" languages like ruby can also start coding Aug 25 20:34:24 yeah. I might have to pick up some python again just for pygtk Aug 25 20:34:50 I always just used python for tying into windows COM+ stuff Aug 25 20:36:19 hm, the automatically started gsmd was in a loop sending "AT+COPS=0", and the one I just started is stuck at "ATZ" Aug 25 20:37:23 * cesarb turns off the modem to see if it makes it work Aug 25 20:39:26 does anyone know what the status of the GPS is? Aug 25 20:39:27 still stuck on ATZ Aug 25 20:41:51 hhf423: last e-mail I saw on it they're in the final stages of an agreement with Global Locate Aug 25 20:41:58 hhf423: how's the open source hammerhead stuff coming? Aug 25 20:42:27 How long shold the calypso take to answer to the gsmd initial ATZ? Aug 25 20:42:36 gcb77: I also saw that, but that was a while ago, was it not? Aug 25 20:42:49 cesarb: very fast Aug 25 20:42:59 jadams: not seen anything Aug 25 20:44:19 hhf423: then, it's stuck :( Aug 25 20:44:48 hhf423: either the modem is misbehaving, or gsmd is misbehaving... Aug 25 20:45:52 hhf423: aobut a 3 days ago Aug 25 20:45:56 probably gsmd Aug 25 20:46:49 SpeedEvil: well, the battery is up to 3.46V now; I guess it's doing something Aug 25 20:47:03 seems like a *very* slow charge though Aug 25 20:48:33 hhf423: There's another message from Sean saying almost the same thing from Jul 29 :( Aug 25 20:49:16 gcb77: well, Sean is always optimistic, no? :-) Aug 25 20:49:22 * hhf423 has gprs up Aug 25 20:50:32 So is the dialer in 2007.2 after updating expected to work? Aug 25 20:50:55 * cesarb is getting stuck on cu Aug 25 20:51:47 I'm getting "Connected.", "AT", "OK", blank line, "OK", "AAT-Command Interpreter ready", and it seems to ignore me Aug 25 20:52:18 (I first got stuck on "Connected.", but then powered off/on the modem) Aug 25 20:53:36 And now gsmd seems to have waken up... seems like you have to try power off/on the modem a lot of times before it behaves Aug 25 20:55:37 cesarb: what are you trying to do? Aug 25 20:55:46 hhf423: check if the modem, like, works Aug 25 20:55:59 ah Aug 25 20:56:15 hhf423: I just tried to register (made gsmd send "AT+COPS=0"), got back "+CME ERROR: 3" Aug 25 20:56:25 ah, ok Aug 25 20:56:37 AT+COPS=? also gives +CME ERROR: 3 Aug 25 20:56:51 In fact, looks like every single thing I try to do will give me +CME ERROR: 3 Aug 25 20:57:05 thats a bit funny Aug 25 20:57:13 not ha ha funny Aug 25 20:57:15 you have a SIM in there, no? :-) Aug 25 20:57:25 hhf423: yep Aug 25 20:57:37 hhf423: but I just tried "n" (aka AT+CNUM) Aug 25 20:57:49 hhf423: and it gave me "+CME ERROR: 10" Aug 25 20:58:05 hhf423: which is "SIM? What SIM?" Aug 25 20:58:20 hi Aug 25 20:58:34 * cesarb thinks he perhaps didn't poke the holder in the precise fashion needed for it to work correctly Aug 25 20:59:13 which would also explain the misbehaving modem... it might get held in reset if the SIM is misinserted Aug 25 21:00:02 maybe, could be Aug 25 21:01:21 are there any news on the "my mouse doesn't work within qemu" front? Aug 25 21:01:56 serenity: could it be because the touchscreen isn't configured? Aug 25 21:02:25 i don't know Aug 25 21:02:41 does it only affect 2007.2? Aug 25 21:02:48 * hhf423 will go to bed now, need to get up early tomorrow, waves good night! Aug 25 21:03:07 Vegar, i started with 2007.2 Aug 25 21:03:12 so, can't say Aug 25 21:03:12 ah Aug 25 21:03:29 well, apparently the clicks are rotated 90 degrees Aug 25 21:03:58 so if you manage to get to the menu and launch the terminal, you can run ts_calibrate Aug 25 21:04:02 or whatever the command was Aug 25 21:05:00 will try, thanks Aug 25 21:05:06 Hi folks, I'm following the openembedded manual but can't correctly compile a program. I've created this directory structure, and typed bitbake -b local-packages/myhelloworld_0.1.bb but it gave an error. directory structure is: Aug 25 21:05:09 local-packages/ Aug 25 21:05:09 local-packages/myhelloworld_0.1.bb Aug 25 21:05:09 local-packages/myhelloworld Aug 25 21:05:09 local-packages/myhelloworld/files Aug 25 21:05:09 local-packages/myhelloworld/files/README.txt Aug 25 21:05:11 local-packages/myhelloworld/files/myhelloworld.c Aug 25 21:05:13 great, stuck in a loop sending "AT+COPS=0" Aug 25 21:05:15 and the error is: Aug 25 21:05:24 cp: cannot stat `/home/emre/moko/openembedded/local-packages/myhelloworld/myhelloworld.c': No such file or directory Aug 25 21:05:55 any ideas? Aug 25 21:07:02 and restarting gsmd gets it stuck on ATZ... again Aug 25 21:08:31 is it realistic to get the neo released in Oktober? Aug 25 21:11:21 emre_ it searches for your .c in the wrong directory Aug 25 21:12:09 shoragan: obviously.. how to fix it? Aug 25 21:12:50 perhaps something work in the SRC_URI of your bb file? Aug 25 21:13:13 it's just file://myhelloworld.c Aug 25 21:13:29 i assumed it is directly looking for the files directory.. Aug 25 21:13:36 go to your build dir Aug 25 21:13:36 serenity:no, absolutely not. :') Aug 25 21:13:37 build from there Aug 25 21:14:06 i do bitbake -b ../../hak/myapp.bb and it works fine. but if i'm not in the build dir, it doesn't. Aug 25 21:14:19 when i browse the wiki, i see so many open tasks. Will take some longer. Aug 25 21:14:20 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Phase_1_Software_Testing]] [[User:Mmontour/HHNotes]] [[OpenMoko2007.2]] [[Flashing_openmoko]] [[User:Hhf423]] Aug 25 21:20:52 Powering off the modem for a while, powering it on by hand, waiting some seconds, and then restarting gsmd made it recognize the modem again... which is still returning "+CME ERROR: 10" to AT+CNUM Aug 25 21:22:57 torpor: I'm getting the same error, with build directory do you mean ${OMDIR}/build? Aug 25 21:23:07 WOAH Aug 25 21:23:08 torpor: I set up the environment with mokomakefile. Aug 25 21:23:38 making libgsm-tool shell ask gsmd to "power off" then "power on" resulted in a flurry of unsolicted responses Aug 25 21:23:50 eww Aug 25 21:23:56 including cell ID and CSQ! Aug 25 21:23:59 just got a winxp box up for the first time I've run it in eight months Aug 25 21:24:02 *shudder* Aug 25 21:24:27 0x28D4 Aug 25 21:24:32 oops wrong window Aug 25 21:25:34 grr the "alive timer" dumped me out Aug 25 21:28:15 is a CSQ of 26 good? Aug 25 21:30:23 torpor, ts_calibrate worked, thanks again Aug 25 21:31:23 serenity: glad to hear it Aug 25 21:31:47 emre_: not sure what the problem could be .. try running bitbake with -v -D and see if you spot something obvious .. Aug 25 21:33:15 okay goodnight everyone Aug 25 21:33:24 Cool, I can see a change of the signal quality just by putting my hand covering the antenna Aug 25 21:33:25 thanks again for all the help .. was a good day for me today. i got somewhere. Aug 25 21:34:09 cesarb: neo gps ant? Aug 25 21:34:41 dcordes: yep Aug 25 21:35:17 dcordes: -61 dBm without my hand over it, -65 dBm with my hand covering it (on the desk, so it isn't covering all) Aug 25 21:35:36 cesarb: I noticed similar effects with my old usb gps mouse Aug 25 21:35:54 gps signal with "normal" devices seems week Aug 25 21:36:15 s/week/weak Aug 25 21:36:55 I have a slight problem with my UI - I don't get the keyboard when it is neccessary to insert text Aug 25 21:36:56 dcordes: ah, sorry gsm not gps Aug 25 21:36:59 * cesarb gets them confused Aug 25 21:37:05 oh ok ^^ Aug 25 21:37:20 Hm, is the dialer supposed to work? Aug 25 21:37:36 I dialed my home phone number, but gsmd's log says it sent the command "AT" Aug 25 21:37:41 Which of course dials nothing Aug 25 21:39:22 morning Aug 25 21:39:41 hello rwhitby Aug 25 21:39:57 which ipk provides the on screen keyboard? Aug 25 21:42:28 Managed to make the phone answer... And told the dialer (which doesn't dial) to dial at the same time, to setup the audio routing... I can hear the input from the neo's mic, but there seems to be no audio output on the neo Aug 25 21:44:09 dcordes: onscreen keyboard is not available in .2 right now Aug 25 21:46:39 And now for the _very_ interesting results of +COPS=?: the three carriers which are on 900/1800 are there. The fourth carrier (the one which is also a CDMA carrier), the one which is on 850/1900 (and which my Razr easily finds), is not there Aug 25 21:47:10 Some googling on the internet wednesday told me that the missing carrier is using precisely GSM850... Aug 25 21:48:17 Which is another data point to the fact that GSM850 does not work, at all, with GTA01BV4, making it in practice a triband Aug 25 22:09:49 re Aug 25 22:09:59 Anyone got gsmd to startup properly on boot ? Aug 25 22:10:12 on my host system i have an internet connection, how to get this working in qemu? Aug 25 22:10:33 frma: is your gsmd simply not running or is it running but does not work? Aug 25 22:11:59 serentify: Start qemu with -net user and run dhcp from your target image. qemu has a built in dhcp server. After that you can connect anything from your target, in order to connect to the target you need to use the redir option of qemu Aug 25 22:12:24 frma: mine does start up properly on boot, but stays stuck in a loop doing a +COPS thing Aug 25 22:13:03 frma: I managed to make it work after a turn off modem/turn on modem/register by hand dance, but I don't know which of the several steps I did were necessary Aug 25 22:13:05 cesarb - BTW: You asked for me a few days ago? Aug 25 22:13:07 ixs: When it starts at boot it doesn't get any response from the modem, if i restart it (with /etc/init.d/gsmd stop/start) it works. Aug 25 22:13:11 Elrond: yes Aug 25 22:13:31 cesarb - So what's up? Aug 25 22:13:46 Elrond: if you want someone in the south hemisphere (and west of the greenwhich line) to test sphyrna, I can help now... Aug 25 22:13:53 Elrond: mine arrived tuesday Aug 25 22:14:01 frma: fun. Aug 25 22:14:05 cesarb - Ahh, great. :-)) Aug 25 22:14:18 frma: I'm not even getting a response by restarting. Since .2 the gsm modem here seems dead. Aug 25 22:14:35 cesarb - I'm currently somewhat distracted from sphyrna... But I hope to get back soon. Aug 25 22:15:14 cesarb - If you want to help, you could file a bug and request pyserial for 2007.2. You'll need it. :-) Aug 25 22:16:04 ixs: Strange, I built my image from the lastest sources (a couple of hours ago) Aug 25 22:16:28 ixs: try killing gsmd, turning it off via /sys, waiting several minutes, turning it on via /sys, waiting several seconds, trying to use it manually with cu, failing because even if it says something it doesn't answer you, restarting gsmd, and using libgsmd-tool to power if off, power it on, and register Aug 25 22:16:48 ixs: that's more or less what I did, but I don't know which parts of it are really needed Aug 25 22:17:25 Elrond: according to wikipedia, I should be around 22°53′00″S, 43°06′13″W Aug 25 22:17:53 Anyone heard anything about the gps-software licensing problem ? It sould be cool to be able to start playing with the gps. Aug 25 22:18:56 cesarb: I did kill gsmd, powercycled via /sys/, tried manually et all. Aug 25 22:19:05 no such luck, won't answer to AT requests. Aug 25 22:19:07 ixs: Have you ever had any response from your gsm modem ? Aug 25 22:19:16 frma - In a few weeks, sphyrna will hopefully be able to at least list the visible satelittes PRNs. ;o) Aug 25 22:19:31 frma: installing 2007.1 I have a working gsmd, upgrading to 2007.2 kills it. reproducably. Aug 25 22:21:06 * cesarb has noticed a strange WTF in the FCC application Aug 25 22:21:19 GSM : Tri-band Monopole Antenna Aug 25 22:21:22 tri-band? Aug 25 22:21:43 Elrond: nice, when can I get actual positions out of it ? (I don't know what PRNs is ?) Aug 25 22:21:50 ixs: odd ! Aug 25 22:22:30 frma: bug #256 Aug 25 22:23:33 anyone know a good linux package to see some metric of a wireless network's strength? I need to reposition my router for better coverage in my room Aug 25 22:23:57 iwlist scanning and iwconfig will both show the values Aug 25 22:24:19 frma - position: months, many months. Aug 25 22:25:23 ixs / frma : read on bug 256, i thought mine didn't work but it did. try what I did (Andrew B. Crawford) Aug 25 22:26:21 ixs / frma : with August 2007.2 snapshot I get the following: Aug 25 22:26:24 awesome, thanks for that Aria Aug 25 22:26:38 jadams: sure thing! Aug 25 22:26:45 root@fic-gta01:~$ lsof | grep gsmd Aug 25 22:26:45 openmoko- 1187 root mem REG 31,4 12348 1233 /usr/lib/libmokogsmd2.so.0.0.1 Aug 25 22:26:45 openmoko- 1187 root mem REG 31,4 10484 1179 /usr/lib/libgsmd.so.0.0.0 Aug 25 22:26:45 matchbox- 1189 root mem REG 31,4 12348 1233 /usr/lib/libmokogsmd2.so.0.0.1 Aug 25 22:26:45 matchbox- 1189 root mem REG 31,4 10484 1179 /usr/lib/libgsmd.so.0.0.0 Aug 25 22:26:49 I got my router moved enough to get my newly reconnected winxp desktop in my room on the network Aug 25 22:27:08 technil: Yeah, with cu and stty it always works for me with the latest image. But gsmd mysteriously fails when startd at boot. Aug 25 22:27:35 alter the gsmd boot script to strace it to a log file? Aug 25 22:29:04 I always remove signal(SIGSEGV, sig_handler); from gsmd.c that way I can at least se if gsmd has crashed :I Aug 25 22:29:30 Aria: good idea, tnx ! Aug 25 22:30:23 technil: your problem is something completely different. Aug 25 22:30:39 as pH5 said, your modem works. Aug 25 22:36:43 I'm running uboot 1.2.0-moko8_r5_..._9_1910 (May 5 2007 - 04:22:55). Would updating it avoid the 'shutdown when idle' trouble? Aug 25 22:36:50 Or is updating to scary to contemplate? Aug 25 22:38:09 keithp: isn't setting a value on the environment enough? Aug 25 22:38:51 cesarb: not that I could find Aug 25 22:39:34 keithp - What "shutdown when idle" trouble? Aug 25 22:40:03 keithp - What model do you have there? Bv03? Bv04-from-taiwan? Aug 25 22:40:06 Elrond: uboot puts the phone to sleep when I don't touch it Aug 25 22:40:12 BV04 from taiwan, I think Aug 25 22:40:31 it's from 2007 04 20 Aug 25 22:40:48 at least it seems to not do that when downloading the rootfs Aug 25 22:40:50 keithp: first thing I did with mine was to dfu upload a backup. second thing I did with mine was to dfu download the 2007.2 kernel, to check that dfu download worked. third thing I did with mine was to flash uboot to the 2007.2 snapshot release ;-) (but then, I do have the unbricker board) Aug 25 22:40:51 keithp - Hmm. u-boot normally boots the kernel, if one leaves it alone too long. Aug 25 22:41:16 Elrond: heh. I touched the aux key once Aug 25 22:41:24 keithp, i'm using moko9 and it switches off too after some time in the bootloader Aug 25 22:42:19 i've got to try the bootloader from the snapshot anyway Aug 25 22:42:22 Shoragan: sounds like I shouldn't bother trying an upgrade then; it's only slightly annoying Aug 25 22:42:34 I have 2040. Aug 25 22:43:24 Shoragan: AFAIK, the timeout is configurable Aug 25 22:44:25 Shoragan: updating to the snapshot does not prevent the switch off when idle. Aug 25 22:47:30 hi Aug 25 22:48:00 i am having troubles building uicmoc4-native on a non 64 Bit system Aug 25 22:48:33 keithp, if you have the device running, you could just flash kernel&rootfs Aug 25 22:48:47 it does not seem to pick up any functions from the libaries in lib Aug 25 22:48:49 http://pastebin.com/m444bf8df Aug 25 22:50:49 the needed symbols are in QtNetwork but it avoids picking them up? Aug 25 22:51:45 Shoragan: working; but the phone sleeps if idle -- the Flashing_openmoko page mentions a bug in uboot Aug 25 22:52:39 after flashing a kernel u-boot doesn't switch itself off Aug 25 22:53:15 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko says Note: Some devices have been reported to turn off after a short period of inactivity while on the uboot menu. To avoid this, simply press the AUX button every 30 seconds or so. Aug 25 22:53:17 the snapshot should just disable the screen when idle (and not suspend) Aug 25 22:53:58 Shoragan: and flashing the kernel leads to uboot powering off the phone. flashing uboot or rootfs doesn't. just for the record. Aug 25 22:54:12 ixs, no Aug 25 22:54:33 atleast not with the snapshot-uboot Aug 25 22:54:41 Shoragan: which snapshot uboot? todays does. Aug 25 22:54:56 http://buildhost.openmoko.org/snapshots/2007.08/images/ Aug 25 22:55:44 Shoragan: nope, that one has exactly the described problem I described. seems we have different phones. Aug 25 22:55:59 anyone localizing? Aug 25 22:56:00 ~seen abraxa Aug 25 22:56:01 mayfair1: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Aug 25 22:56:02 mickey|froscon: i haven't seen 'abraxa' Aug 25 22:56:08 ~seen abraxa_ Aug 25 22:56:09 abraxa_ was last seen on IRC in channel #openmoko, 16d 1h 17m 57s ago, saying: 'Bummer.'. Aug 25 22:56:38 having trouble finding where to set the global locale Aug 25 22:57:07 ah, i've tried using dfu-util with -R and it seem that the timeout is only active in 'USB runtime' mode and not 'DFU' mode Aug 25 22:57:49 i've got a gta01b_v4 built on 2007-04-20 Aug 25 23:03:37 /quit Aug 25 23:14:19 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Manually_using_Bluetooth]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[Phase_1_Software_Testing]] Aug 25 23:35:19 is there an X-Windows trick so I can see my neo's screen on my laptop? Aug 25 23:35:28 I'd like to show people what it's doing in a presentation Aug 25 23:35:43 bmidgley: umm, vnc? Aug 25 23:37:02 bmidgley: I was going to look into how to run Xvnc on the neo too Aug 25 23:37:18 bmidgley: ask harald. he did a presentation in taiwan copying the framebuffer from the neo onto his notebook Aug 25 23:37:46 vnc isn't perfect I will ask him what he did Aug 25 23:38:20 fbgrab[-native] Aug 25 23:38:42 bmidgley: try x11 forwarding Aug 25 23:38:44 but it slows down your Neo to a crawl since all bandwidth gets eaten up by transferring images to the server Aug 25 23:39:01 anyways, nice tool Aug 25 23:39:10 bmidgley: maybe just export the display to your desktop machine? Aug 25 23:39:19 things like calculator, etc. are easy to show off that way Aug 25 23:39:50 what changed in uboot? Aug 25 23:39:56 I'll play around with a few things... it really depends what I'll show off Aug 25 23:39:59 " ssh -l root -X -v 192.168.0.202 " will redirect x apps to your desktop Aug 25 23:40:17 DukeOfURL: A change to clear the partition first, so that you can write smaller images than what were there before Aug 25 23:40:28 blindcoder: if you want the complete screen on your notebook, try x2vnc. Aug 25 23:40:29 ok Aug 25 23:40:42 sorry, x11vnc Aug 25 23:40:48 x2vnc is somethign else. :D Aug 25 23:40:51 http://www.karlrunge.com/x11vnc/ Aug 25 23:41:15 it will screengrab the whole screen on your real x11 server and just offer it via vnc. Aug 25 23:41:31 not a new x11 display like the normal vnc server does. Aug 25 23:47:53 I solved it, after putting a Aug 25 23:48:19 ... 'stty -F /dev/ttySAC0 crtscts in /etc/init.d/gsmd I can boot and dial/receive calls ! Aug 25 23:50:15 * rwhitby tries it Aug 25 23:50:59 * technil tries it Aug 25 23:51:17 you guys couldn't dial either? Aug 25 23:52:00 The stty should be right after turning the modem on, before "# Start daemons." Aug 25 23:52:15 jadams: Only if I manually restarted gsmd Aug 25 23:52:45 frma71: there's something on the wiki where sagacis gave a line to put in /etc/matchbox/session to get it working on boot, too Aug 25 23:52:54 this is prol ymore correct Aug 25 23:53:07 jadams: Haven Aug 25 23:53:20 ? Aug 25 23:53:52 jadams: ooops, Havn't seen it, but at first i had /etc/init.d/gsmd stop followed by /etc/init.d/gsmd stop in /etc/matchbox/session... but it's kind of uggly :I Aug 25 23:54:06 'stty -F ${GSM_DEV} crtscts' unfortunately doesn't fix it here :-( Aug 25 23:58:02 rwhitby: Does the start/stop tip work for you ? Aug 25 23:58:02 frma71: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Aug 26 00:02:05 mickey|froscon, still there? Aug 26 00:04:44 jadams: I meant '/etc/init.d/gsmd start' the second time. Aug 26 00:12:45 Night.. Aug 26 00:21:28 i finally got stereo mp3 output Aug 26 00:21:51 had to fiddle with the plug for a bit and it finally worked Aug 26 00:46:07 Aug 26 01:14:40 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Tyler_Oderkirk]] [[User_talk:Hhf423]] [[Booting_from_SD]] Aug 26 01:29:31 what sort of time should I expect "make openmoko-devel-image" to take ? Aug 26 01:29:40 6d? Aug 26 01:29:46 Plus or minus. Aug 26 01:30:00 ok, thanks Aug 26 01:34:38 really? Aug 26 01:35:18 roll a d6, then multiply by 4 Aug 26 01:36:05 heh Aug 26 01:37:41 Yeah, it's a huge build. Aug 26 01:37:51 many, many gb of procut Aug 26 01:37:54 er.. product Aug 26 01:38:27 117G free, I should be ok Aug 26 01:39:32 though I do seem to be 10G out since this morning :) Aug 26 01:48:34 hey all Aug 26 01:49:27 has anyone gotten the qemu version with the mokomakefile working? it is giving me troubles with the tapping, i think it might be something with the offsets, any suggestions? Aug 26 01:50:13 guyz when i run my open moko under qemu some links dont work Aug 26 01:50:28 some buttons Aug 26 01:50:45 thats just what i was asking about Aug 26 01:50:51 i havent found a solution Aug 26 01:51:52 only us see this? Aug 26 01:52:20 no, yesterday i was talking and some other people said it happened too, but no one had a fix Aug 26 01:52:36 ExxonValdeez: I had the same problem. Issue is related to pointer calibration information which is incorrect for qemu Aug 26 01:52:37 really? Aug 26 01:52:54 its a problem, to develop on it no? Aug 26 01:52:57 The screen seems to think it is rotated 90 degrees. Aug 26 01:53:21 tap on the screen until you hit the list of applications Aug 26 01:53:24 romu1us: thats what i had seen when looking around on the site and in this irc, did you find a way to remedy it? Aug 26 01:53:58 Once I get the list of apps I can run terminal and then run ts_calibrate. THat fixes it for that session Aug 26 01:54:10 ah Aug 26 01:54:15 Haven't gotten around to a permanent solution yet Aug 26 01:55:03 i wonder if i could ssh into it Aug 26 01:55:36 okay, i will try that Aug 26 01:55:42 the ts_calibrate Aug 26 01:55:53 around where on the screen would you say? Aug 26 01:56:40 left hand side, half way down the screen. I just tap until I see the list of applications Aug 26 01:57:25 ExxonValdeez: how can i connect over ssh to it? Aug 26 02:00:10 i dont know if you can jonathan_br_ba, i would think so Aug 26 02:01:10 i do no see an ssh server in the /etc/init.d/ Aug 26 02:01:50 dropbear is an ssh server Aug 26 02:04:01 i cant load the application list Aug 26 02:04:13 the button dont work Aug 26 02:04:22 i got it working, i just need to figure out the ssh stuff Aug 26 02:04:36 and i got the calibration Aug 26 02:05:07 how i calibrate? Aug 26 02:06:21 you first need to get to the applications Aug 26 02:06:25 and then the terminal Aug 26 02:06:29 and then type Aug 26 02:06:32 ts_calibrate Aug 26 02:08:06 hmmm... latest image -- how does one get the on-screen keyboard in the terminal emulator? Aug 26 02:08:56 mwester: run 'Input Manager' Aug 26 02:08:59 it's in utilities Aug 26 02:09:13 I'm operating from memory since my neo's not booting right now Aug 26 02:09:13 ExxonValdeez: the applications is in the [+] button right? Aug 26 02:09:20 yup Aug 26 02:10:53 left hand side, half way down the screen. I just tap until I see the list of applications, if your calibration is still messed up Aug 26 02:11:31 Input manager starts a calculator. Aug 26 02:11:35 Sigh. Aug 26 02:11:44 mwester: run it from 'all' then Aug 26 02:12:00 I've seen that bug on the menu for other categories (not on utilities typically though) Aug 26 02:12:16 mwester: just run it from the 'all' category and it'll work Aug 26 02:12:23 but it just puts a white box at the top of the screen Aug 26 02:12:24 then run terminal Aug 26 02:12:29 and click the white box to open the keyboard Aug 26 02:12:46 gst-launch filesrc location=/usr/j.mp3 ! mad ! audioconvert ! esdsink, no music comes out, no error message. why? Aug 26 02:12:54 jadams: I always see the bug on utilities Aug 26 02:13:01 madplay is ok Aug 26 02:13:12 Richard_: are those exclamations and not pipes? Aug 26 02:13:14 Richard_: madplay doesn't work for me. Maybe I should install gstreamer Aug 26 02:13:17 Thanks~ Aug 26 02:13:22 that works... Aug 26 02:13:23 jadams: Yes. That's correct for gst-launch Aug 26 02:13:27 ahh Aug 26 02:13:34 custom pipes Aug 26 02:14:01 jadams: no warning or error messages Aug 26 02:14:41 sagacis: If madplay doesn't work , gst will not . gst uses libmad Aug 26 02:15:05 Setting pipeline to PAUSED ... Aug 26 02:15:06 Pipeline is PREROLLING ... Aug 26 02:15:06 Pipeline is PREROLLED ... Aug 26 02:15:06 Setting pipeline to PLAYING ... Aug 26 02:15:06 New clock: GstAudioSinkClock Aug 26 02:15:33 is it possible to ssh into the qemu image? Aug 26 02:15:37 jadams: my gst works when play wav Aug 26 02:15:39 Wow, I didn't even know gst was on the neo Aug 26 02:15:40 any brazillian in the house? my english is too poor Aug 26 02:16:10 Suddenly madplay works. Aug 26 02:16:25 Why do I sometimes get "/dev/dsp in use" and other times not? Aug 26 02:16:27 i wish, i barely speak spanish even though both my parents do Aug 26 02:17:12 sagacis: you should use soundserver with madplay. Aug 26 02:17:27 Richard_: I get ''WARNING: erroneous pipeline: no element "esdsink"'. Did you install another sink? Aug 26 02:18:13 sagacis: neo is using pulseaudio, but I'm using esd. Aug 26 02:18:17 Richard_: OK, looks like I need to do some googling. I've just been piping things to madplay Aug 26 02:18:20 where do you click to go back to the home screen? Aug 26 02:19:14 ExxonValdeez: use the AUX button Aug 26 02:19:25 If you are in the app list, the bottom left button Aug 26 02:19:32 takes you to "Today" Aug 26 02:20:08 i was in contacts, i figured it out, thanks Aug 26 02:20:56 i thin my cursor dont work fine, i cant load any buttton only by aux and power buttons Aug 26 02:21:35 ahh.... autoaudiosink Aug 26 02:21:51 and scrolling? Aug 26 02:21:52 Richard_: It works fine for me. Aug 26 02:22:04 Richard_: Did you check alsamixer settings? Aug 26 02:22:08 nvrmnd Aug 26 02:23:05 sagacis: volume settings is ok, because gst works when play wave file. Aug 26 02:23:42 Richard_: Right. You said that. Aug 26 02:24:17 sagacis: I really don't know what's wrong. Aug 26 02:24:52 Richard_: As you can tell, I'm not much help. I've seen other areas where programs just stop with no message.... Aug 26 02:25:03 sagacis: my gst loading is slow, for several seconds. Aug 26 02:25:07 Maybe something isn't compiled into the gst on your build that esd needs? Aug 26 02:25:17 Can you try with alsasink? Aug 26 02:26:39 sagacis:I will try, thanks! Aug 26 02:28:18 what a f.. how i do my moko works hehehee, i want to to explore it eheh Aug 26 02:30:30 is it normal? whe i lick sounds a tooc tooc Aug 26 02:31:58 the clicking sound when you tap it? Aug 26 02:32:00 yeah Aug 26 02:33:48 yes Aug 26 02:33:50 hm, well, its very interesting Aug 26 02:34:24 how mouse button i have to user? Aug 26 02:34:38 i think a test model would be more fun to play with as the os would actually run smoothly, thanks for the help! :) Aug 26 02:34:43 gst use my cpu cycles 100% Aug 26 02:34:50 it was fun messing with Aug 26 02:35:00 I thinks it's the problem Aug 26 02:35:40 jonathan_br_ba: are you still trying to calibrate your mouse? Aug 26 02:36:05 ExxonValdeez: yes man, i cant click in nothing on the qemu Aug 26 02:36:22 nothing works Aug 26 02:37:28 when i user AUX and POWER somethings works but i can click on application menu Aug 26 02:38:14 jonathan_br_ba: have you been able to see the list of applications? Aug 26 02:38:56 did you try clicking where i said?, hm, lets see if google translator helps: lado da mão esquerda, incompletamente abaixo a tela. Eu bato apenas até que eu v a lista das aplicações Aug 26 02:39:46 that does not make any sense translated back into english Aug 26 02:40:30 left hand side ? i said left screen ? Aug 26 02:40:36 lect on screen? Aug 26 02:40:43 yes, left hand side Aug 26 02:41:05 ohhh it load hehehe Aug 26 02:41:12 and now Aug 26 02:41:14 load terminal ? Aug 26 02:41:15 in the middle, click around there, hopefully the apps list with pop up, then try to search around for the terminal Aug 26 02:41:18 yes Aug 26 02:41:25 but you have to click around Aug 26 02:41:42 Once you have the list of apps, use the arrow keys and enter to run the terminal Aug 26 02:42:13 ok Aug 26 02:42:26 its loaded Aug 26 02:42:39 you got the terminal Aug 26 02:42:40 ? Aug 26 02:42:48 yes Aug 26 02:42:54 i got Aug 26 02:43:02 you ran the program? Aug 26 02:43:22 how program i run on it to calibrate? Aug 26 02:43:34 ts_calibrate Aug 26 02:43:45 then it will make you click on the screen in various spots Aug 26 02:45:15 i did Aug 26 02:45:20 i will test now Aug 26 02:47:03 ExxonValdeez: its working now hehehe thanks man, now i will fun hehe Aug 26 02:53:41 My madplay use about 50% cpu, what about yours? Aug 26 02:54:51 ExxonValdeez: if you run xstcal instead of ts_calibrate it saves the calibration information Aug 26 02:55:42 20% on madplay Aug 26 02:55:56 sagacis: really? Aug 26 02:56:45 gcb77: thats interesting, it seemed to do it anyway because i closed qemu and started it again but it might be because i havent restarted the whole computer, i will remeber that, thanks! :) Aug 26 02:56:53 Yup, with: 5 Layer III, 128 kbps, 44100 Hz, joint stereo (MS), no CRC Aug 26 02:56:54 sagacis: why mine is 50%, Aug 26 02:57:01 using top to measure Aug 26 02:57:17 sounds great Aug 26 02:57:46 sagacis: great, are you using neo? Aug 26 02:58:30 are you playing music sagacis? Aug 26 02:59:23 ExxonValdeez: its not xstcal, it xtscal Aug 26 02:59:43 oka Aug 26 02:59:44 y Aug 26 02:59:44 cool **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Aug 26 02:59:57 2007