**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Oct 02 02:59:57 2007 Oct 02 03:02:56 cesarb: Nope. I'm feeling pretty grumpy about it, too. Oct 02 03:03:33 I just ran "make force-rebuild". That seems to take a while. The "make all" is likely to take at least all night. Oct 02 03:03:41 hopefully after that, I'll have something I can use. Oct 02 03:06:08 Back in a bit. I'm going to upgrade to pidgin Oct 02 03:06:15 /partall Oct 02 03:06:17 oops. Oct 02 03:23:32 sagacis: if it makes you feel better, it took me a while too before everything started building fine (of course, I'm stubbornly refusing to change my /bin/sh symlink to /bin/dash) Oct 02 03:24:08 cesarb: I was building fine for over a month. Oct 02 03:24:13 This is recent. Oct 02 03:24:25 sagacis: it's annoying when that happens :( Oct 02 03:24:33 Yup. Joys of development. Oct 02 03:25:05 sagacis: living on the bleeding edge... Oct 02 03:25:38 A friend told me recently that our company lives on the edge of technology... Oct 02 03:25:47 Not the leading one, mind you, the other one Oct 02 03:26:07 sagacis: ah, but which edge? there's a sharp (bad pun) distinction between the leading and bleeding edges... Oct 02 03:26:13 damn I'm slow to type ;-) Oct 02 03:26:32 (of course, there's also the trailing edge... :D ) Oct 02 03:26:35 It's pretty safe on the trailing edge Oct 02 03:26:38 heh Oct 02 03:26:52 Maybe I can figure out how to get a vcr to record something. Oct 02 03:27:27 sagacis: the only problem with the trailing edge is when the world decides to pull a Y2K on you (or, as it happens almost every swearword year, change the DST rules again ;-) ) Oct 02 03:28:23 I guess we have to be resigned to rebuilding and hoping, eh? Oct 02 03:28:40 "There are no fixed start and end dates for summer time; they are decided every year by one or more decrees. [...] Sometimes these decrees are published very close to the start date, or even after it[1]." <- what I wrote at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_in_Brazil Oct 02 03:29:09 Wow. Oct 02 03:29:19 At least in the US it's normally pretty standard.... Oct 02 03:29:21 Except for this year. Oct 02 03:29:39 To save energy resources, they changed DST this year and next, as an experiment. Oct 02 03:30:30 sagacis: us in Brazil were like "what's the big problem? it happens every year for us, and nothing breaks!" :D Oct 02 03:30:58 cesarb: Yeah, we were all just late to work for a few days. Oct 02 03:31:11 cesarb: We should just always be on DST. Oct 02 03:31:22 sagacis: that's not possible Oct 02 03:31:31 sagacis: if you were always in DST, that would become the normal time zone Oct 02 03:31:34 cesarb: I hate the changes. Have to get up earlier, etc. Oct 02 03:31:42 sagacis: which would mean you are not in DST anymore ;-) Oct 02 03:31:57 sagacis: ah, but it's such a joy when it changes back ;-) Oct 02 03:32:16 cesarb: Another hour of trying to build moko Oct 02 03:32:25 (around here the change is always in a weekend, to give folks time to adjust themselves) Oct 02 03:33:25 Ah, and in a openmoko-related note, the auto-updating clock of cell phones tends to get really wonky in the week after the change... It is as if the change were a manual process in the base stations -- the time doesn't update for an arbitrary number of days Oct 02 03:33:30 cesarb: It's always on a weekend here, too. Oct 02 03:33:59 cesarb: It probably is a relatively manual process. I'm sure they have to propogate the change across towers. Oct 02 03:34:01 * cesarb always has to disable the auto-update and fix it manually... only the debian/ubuntu computers are always right, due to well-timed zoneinfo updates ;-) Oct 02 03:34:18 argh! I can't build pidgin either! Oct 02 03:34:53 * sagacis yawns Oct 02 03:34:57 well, I'd better go to sleep, as it's really late. night all. Oct 02 03:35:02 Speaking of time, I gotta get up early. Oct 02 03:35:03 heh... Oct 02 03:35:07 'night Oct 02 04:49:56 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Gsmd/document]] Oct 02 04:57:28 hmm, looks like gta02s might be out in november Oct 02 04:57:45 Oh? Oct 02 04:58:11 in an email from Michael Shiloh Oct 02 04:58:11 to List Oct 02 04:58:11 Oct 02 04:58:11 show details Oct 02 04:58:11 1:42 am (5 hours ago) Oct 02 04:58:20 The November release of GTA02 is still aimed at Oct 02 04:58:20 developers Oct 02 04:59:17 Nov release => Dec ship .. that would be consistent with some of the other guestimates that have been made. Oct 02 04:59:32 nice Oct 02 05:00:37 very nice Oct 02 05:03:45 moin Oct 02 05:05:11 what ap is responsible for the icons at the top? Oct 02 05:05:17 they have disapeared for me Oct 02 05:05:46 Hmm.. Was it the battery status icon that was broken? Oct 02 05:06:30 Is Openmoko looking for more ring tones? I could make a few if you like. :D Oct 02 05:07:28 encompass: I'm sure there can't be too many to chose from ;) Oct 02 05:08:30 orzo: that's the panel. Oct 02 05:08:33 The battery applet does that once in a while. Oct 02 05:08:51 hehe, sounds great, I will see if I can submit them... I haven't uses a cvs different than bzr so this will be a new experience Oct 02 05:08:56 If you wish, edit /etc/matchbox/session, last line, and remove the battery-applet command-line option. Oct 02 05:09:26 i got a white screen with teh word today at the top and it wont show aps even if i run tehm with ssh Oct 02 05:10:07 encompass: Get them up anywhere so people can listen. Not sure how wansti does with his ringtones Oct 02 05:12:10 CM: you bet, thanks Oct 02 05:13:23 encompass: I'm not an employee or so, just so you know. :) Oct 02 05:13:44 encompass: But the more ringtones the better Oct 02 05:14:02 I can always develop for open source :D Oct 02 05:14:31 * CM can't get the latest openmoko image to call and goes to work instead Oct 02 05:14:40 morning morning morning all Oct 02 05:14:46 Any_Key: howdy Oct 02 05:14:52 Any_Key: Morning Oct 02 05:14:59 Did you see my replies last eve? Oct 02 05:15:09 fine enough Oct 02 05:15:15 CM, no Oct 02 05:15:26 ~log Oct 02 05:15:27 rumour has it, log is as piece of wood, or a record, or the opposite of exponentiation Oct 02 05:15:31 Any_Key: http://claesmogren.com/~cm/neo/ts_harvest.out Oct 02 05:15:38 Any_Key: http://claesmogren.com/~cm/neo/ts_print.txt Oct 02 05:16:11 Basically, I got ok values except some negative ones when circling around the edge of the touchscreen Oct 02 05:16:23 * CM leaves for work in a hurry Oct 02 05:16:40 OK thanks alot Oct 02 05:19:50 hm, i rebooted and still no icons Oct 02 05:25:23 the ar6k in the gta02, how will it be connected up? Oct 02 05:52:40 Why haven't there been any updates on builthost images since 17sep?? :S Oct 02 06:02:28 ljp: Mornin'. I noticed someone mentioning GoogleSync in Qtopia - does ti work properly? Oct 02 06:03:33 s/ti/it/ Oct 02 06:03:33 jorgenpt meant: ljp: Mornin'. I noitced someone mentioning GoogleSync in Qtopia - does ti work properly? Oct 02 06:05:15 yay regex :) Oct 02 06:08:29 whats googlesync Oct 02 06:21:07 ljp: Synchronization of calendar versus Google, I assume Oct 02 06:21:12 (Google Calendar) Oct 02 06:31:12 anyone know with the nov release, will it be a limited dev release or an open release like the most recent gta01 release? Oct 02 06:32:11 also, is it likely to have firmware problems that can only be fixed by sending it back to the factory? :/ I'm happy to have a semi-functioning phone, but don't want a brick when it gets to production releases :/ Oct 02 06:40:39 doc|home: See topic, "(December as of last update)" Oct 02 06:41:00 doc|home: Also, GTA02 will be idiot-proofed with regards to bricking it with a firmware upgrade. Oct 02 06:41:18 I was the person who resulted in that being put in the topic :) I'm asking because of the current mails on the mailing list which suggest a dev version in nov Oct 02 06:41:33 doc|home: GTA01 _can_ be broken, but it requires quite a bit of sloppyness and anyone with the "advanced kit" can fix it for you. Oct 02 06:41:47 Oh, okay. Sorry, I guess I'm a bit behind on the ML then. :-) Oct 02 06:41:59 sure, but if a bug in the firmware is found, you can't flash it yourself due to nda Oct 02 06:42:07 NDA? Oct 02 06:42:22 Define "firmware", please. Are you talking about OM itself and the Linux kernel? Oct 02 06:42:25 and that'd be my only fear, I can live with a not-entirely stable phone, once it's not inherently flawed Oct 02 06:42:32 no, gps chips, gsm chips Oct 02 06:43:47 I'd hardly think the GSM & GPS chips have any breaking firmware-bugs, but even if you mis-flashed it (assuming you can flash it), the phone would still operate, so couldn't you just reflash? Oct 02 06:44:01 But I'm not familiar enough with the internals of the GSM & GPS to talk about it. Oct 02 06:44:11 Though I heard they were going for another GPS chip for GTA02? Oct 02 06:44:18 The gsm chip has a problem right now Oct 02 06:44:22 not if there's a bug in the firmware, that was a worry when certain at&t (*spit*) sims wouldn't work, that it was a firmware bug Oct 02 06:44:40 CM: right, and can't be fixed without returning the unit, right? :/ Oct 02 06:44:41 But according to a comment on bug 666 yesterday ti has released new firmware Oct 02 06:44:58 doc|home: I suspect so, but I don't know Oct 02 06:45:09 someone here mentioned NDA restrictions :/ Oct 02 06:45:34 I thought the NDA restrictions were related to open driver-development for the GPS chip? Oct 02 06:45:34 Well, I'm still not able to call with OpenMoko Oct 02 06:45:49 CM: That can't be a firmwar bug? Oct 02 06:45:52 firmware* Oct 02 06:46:05 jorgenpt: No, that's just kernel and gsmd problems Oct 02 06:46:14 Qtopia wokrs Oct 02 06:46:17 works Oct 02 06:46:24 What does Qtopia use differently? Same kernel, right? Oct 02 06:46:30 Yes, same kernel Oct 02 06:47:01 But it handles the gsm modem differently and doesn't get stuck on all the crap coming from it ;) Oct 02 06:47:07 Okay ;P Oct 02 06:47:39 But qtopia doesn't power off correctly for me, soesn't turn off the lcd and so on Oct 02 06:47:41 CM hello to working people Oct 02 06:47:48 Any_Key: :-) Oct 02 06:47:56 * ljp is about to update the qtopia image Oct 02 06:47:59 * CM is having coffee at work Oct 02 06:48:10 ljp: Nice, I'll try right away :) Oct 02 06:48:40 ljp: Suspend working, or isn't it done yet? Oct 02 06:48:53 not done yet Oct 02 06:49:12 i was working on audio stuff Oct 02 06:49:26 Ringtone this time? :D Oct 02 06:49:37 yep Oct 02 06:49:55 * CM needs to refill his phonecard Oct 02 06:50:17 ljp: Does it switch between alsastates automagically now? Oct 02 06:50:51 yes Oct 02 06:51:07 Any way to adjust sidetone and speaker volume in the gui? Oct 02 06:51:12 havent test bluetooth audio though Oct 02 06:51:22 Okay Oct 02 06:51:22 CM: not yet Oct 02 06:51:40 Ok. alsamixer is fine ;) Oct 02 06:51:56 ljp: Do you kill gsm & amp at shutdown? Oct 02 06:52:05 ljp: AT@POFF and some kernel patch, someone said. ;-) Oct 02 06:52:19 (do you have a revision-log somewhere, or another type of changelog?) Oct 02 06:54:52 no public changelog, really Oct 02 06:54:57 ok Oct 02 07:14:41 einen schönen guten Morgen meine Leidensgenossen! :) Oct 02 07:15:30 is there a solution to that sigfault problem with the dialer? Oct 02 07:15:33 yet? Oct 02 07:17:14 how do i find out the image version used on the phone? Oct 02 07:20:58 aehhm - something went wrong with my newst update/build - I dont even get any UI now - only D-bus library appears to be incorrectly set up.... Oct 02 07:21:06 AAAHHHARRRRRR!! :( Oct 02 07:21:53 Ralph: Oh, I finished a build last night, flashed it this morning Oct 02 07:21:58 Worked for me Oct 02 07:22:39 Well, calling didn't work out of the box. Still not patched.. Oct 02 07:26:07 good morning Oct 02 07:27:59 Ralph: are you missing /usr/bin/dbus-daemon? Oct 02 07:28:56 CM, as I see in ts_harvest.out there is HUGE difference between expected and measured values Oct 02 07:29:18 Any_Key: Yes, I noticed that too. Can't say why though. Oct 02 07:29:50 Any_Key: What I did in those logs was either tapping quickly, slowly, drawing lines or drawing circles Oct 02 07:30:17 I used the stylus too, not my finger Oct 02 07:31:17 CM can you put full file somewhere I'll try to analyze pattern, It might be software related, the same behavior in qemu Oct 02 07:31:32 any suggestions on this? http://pastebin.ca/722699 using OM2007.2 Oct 02 07:31:54 Any_Key: I'll make a longer log later. That is the full file :/ Oct 02 07:32:35 Any_Key: Or maybe someone here have their Neo around and can make a log right away. :) Oct 02 07:32:48 CM, little boring to tap, ugh? Oct 02 07:33:14 Any_Key: Hehe.. Naa.. But I'm at work and have left the phone at home Oct 02 07:34:09 CM, Yap I remember, you ssh-ing in a lot :-) Oct 02 07:34:13 Any_Key: What would give the best data? Oct 02 07:35:07 I mean what kind of tapping or drawing Oct 02 07:35:16 (script) planet: Thomas Wood: Two Neo1973s calling each other http://blogs.gnome.org/thos/2007/10/02/two-neo1973s-calling-each-other/ Oct 02 07:35:41 Writing a spiral or so can give 50-60 points, but tapping gives 3-4 or so Oct 02 07:35:42 CM, only ts_harvest i think Oct 02 07:35:49 *nod* Oct 02 07:36:27 hello, can someone help me? I'm still trying to compile an openmoko-devel-image and get this error now: http://nopaste.org/p/aAaWaQpNJ Oct 02 07:36:44 CM, it pretty long, and fills the screen with defined dots Oct 02 07:37:53 Any_Key: Ah, ok. I ran it on qtopia and I think it borked a bit. I'll try it on OM when I get home today, just flashed a new image Oct 02 07:38:39 how do i find out which version of OM2007.2 I am running on the device? Oct 02 07:39:01 CM, you are the best Oct 02 07:39:29 mbuf: The kernel is easy, but the rootfs I don't really know how to check Oct 02 07:39:52 CM, uname -a does tell the kernel; rootfs is something I am interested in Oct 02 07:40:04 mbuf: Maybe check when the root folder was created? Oct 02 07:40:27 how can I fix this: hello_world.c:0: error: bad value (armv4) for -march= switch Oct 02 07:40:31 mbuf: But that only tells you when you flashed it.. Oct 02 07:40:50 edistar: Are you trying to build for i486? Oct 02 07:41:01 CM, i have put the OM2007.2/ folder in one of the folders, and found the snapshot images there, thanks :) Oct 02 07:41:06 CM: yes, I am wondering why it wants to crosscompile Oct 02 07:41:22 so back again Oct 02 07:41:28 well i am stunned Oct 02 07:41:40 its just getting worse Oct 02 07:41:55 new image -> less functionality Oct 02 07:41:55 I wonder that too. Built the image tonight on 64-bit, no problem with uboot there Oct 02 07:42:16 Ralph: I think it's been that way for a month now Oct 02 07:42:25 yes Oct 02 07:42:55 i am building now with a amd64 host - psyco dont work for those :( Oct 02 07:43:01 but its still faster Oct 02 07:43:23 CM: did you check my link? It seems to wan to build for gta01, and btw I wrote i686 not i486 in the local.conf Oct 02 07:43:42 edistar: Why not building for arm? Oct 02 07:44:13 CM: don't have a gta01 ;) and I tried to emulate the arm but it was really slow Oct 02 07:44:21 Ah, ok Oct 02 07:44:37 Ralph: is it much faster with 64-bit? Oct 02 07:44:38 And you want xoo instead or so? Oct 02 07:44:44 CM: xephyr Oct 02 07:44:46 edistar: To compile Oct 02 07:44:49 *nod* Oct 02 07:44:58 CM: should i try to build again right now- or better wait for now? Oct 02 07:45:07 using an old stable one? Oct 02 07:45:19 Ralph: I'd use a known working one Oct 02 07:45:42 which one has gsm working Oct 02 07:46:10 ? Oct 02 07:46:24 Ralph: The only image I've ever been able to call with is ScaredyCat's from Sept 03 Oct 02 07:46:27 Ralph: I think the ones till 3 september Oct 02 07:46:35 Ralph, yes, I would like to know which OM2007.2 image has gsm working as well Oct 02 07:46:54 http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/OpenMoko-scaredycat-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-August-Snapshot-20070903-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 Oct 02 07:47:01 ok thanks guys - ill install that - want to start developing my stuff finaly :) Oct 02 07:47:16 which kernel would you suggest to that? Oct 02 07:47:18 CM: so you have no idea how to fix my problem?:( Oct 02 07:47:43 edistar: No, not really. I assume you're following the wiki? Oct 02 07:47:53 ScaredyCat: Hey there Oct 02 07:48:25 ScaredyCat: What kernel is good with your Sept 03 image? uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11-r1-fic-gta01.bin I guess Oct 02 07:48:43 Ralph: My guess: http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11-r1-fic-gta01.bin Oct 02 07:49:07 ok thx CM Oct 02 07:49:28 is there a way to directly gcc on neo? Oct 02 07:49:52 CM: yes, even took no risks and used the settings from the wiki exactly for my local.conf Oct 02 07:50:09 Ralph: would be very slow.. Oct 02 07:50:32 not for my little bits of software Oct 02 07:50:46 edistar: You can disable building uboot somehow, but I can't remember how. I think it's in the mailinglists or some bug-report Oct 02 07:50:59 CM: ok Oct 02 07:51:03 CM: thx Oct 02 07:51:28 Ralph: I'm sure you can install gcc as an ipkg, just build it and copy over :) Oct 02 07:56:02 ok - can I build it with the latest devel src? -would it work on that old rootfs? Oct 02 07:56:49 Ralph: should do, the rootfs isn't that old Oct 02 07:57:10 alright Oct 02 08:08:13 blah! Oct 02 08:08:18 hey CM Oct 02 08:13:06 ScaredyCat: Bad connection? Oct 02 08:14:04 yeah, much like my journey in today - 'Road Closed' or 'Diversion' :/ Oct 02 08:21:09 ljp, bluetooth seems busticulated Oct 02 08:21:36 how so? Oct 02 08:21:51 it doesn;t see the device Oct 02 08:21:58 'bluetoth not available' Oct 02 08:22:53 which version? the preview? Oct 02 08:23:27 snapshot from 27th and 30th Oct 02 08:29:27 how to invoke the keyboard for the terminal on OM2007.2 Oct 02 08:48:56 ScaredyCat: hey, do you have any local patches in your build at the moment? Oct 02 08:49:20 no... no local patches to kernel. Oct 02 08:49:38 ScaredyCat: I meant to any bb files Oct 02 08:50:10 ScaredyCat: at least, I still have a patch to the openmoko-dates bb file and I'd be surprised if anyone could build without it Oct 02 08:50:42 mmm.... everything seems to build fine.. did one last night Oct 02 08:50:49 Here too Oct 02 08:50:49 hmm Oct 02 08:50:56 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Talk:MokoMakefile]] [[OpenMoko:Community_Portal]] Oct 02 08:50:58 did openmoko-dates2 build ok then? Oct 02 08:51:06 * ScaredyCat checks Oct 02 08:51:24 ScaredyCat: and do you know what revision? Oct 02 08:51:33 ScaredyCat: I presume you are not using autorev? Oct 02 08:52:38 openmoko-dates2-0.1.0+svnr563-r0 built at 2007-10-01 22:24 for me Oct 02 08:53:36 oh that's quite old Oct 02 08:53:42 latest revision is 617 Oct 02 08:53:58 I guess they have a locked src-rev in oe then Oct 02 08:54:29 thos: shout if you need rev bumping or patches applied Oct 02 08:54:52 XorA: well I did the other week :-P Oct 02 08:54:55 HA! wonderful! the old image can make a phonecall!!! Oct 02 08:55:04 Ralph: ? Oct 02 08:55:22 * CM hands thos a megaphone Oct 02 08:55:23 what happend that it kept getting worse? Oct 02 08:55:24 thos: just give me a known working rev and Ill update Oct 02 08:56:15 Ralph: I think it's changes to both gsmd and the kernel Oct 02 08:56:21 i dont know why I had to boot it twice - than had to stop the UI and the gsmd just to restart it - but then it worked just fine :) Oct 02 08:56:39 Heh, obviously.. But I'm not sure what the changes were good for Oct 02 08:56:39 XorA: latest :-) Oct 02 08:56:40 i just build an image and had some ssl-certificate trouble when downloadind (fonts). i put 'check_certificate = no' into ~/.wgetrc, is that normal? Oct 02 08:56:53 XorA: 617 for dates Oct 02 08:56:53 * ScaredyCat points at CM's response Oct 02 08:57:18 they obviously where not god for the phone-funktionality ;) Oct 02 08:57:38 thos: dates2? Oct 02 08:57:42 XorA: yes Oct 02 08:57:52 Ralph: new images should be much better at making phone calls Oct 02 08:58:00 thos: testing Oct 02 08:58:11 well - i also found that the libgsm-tools had much less options - but they worked Oct 02 08:58:36 thos - no i dont think so - probably we wont never be abel to phone again :) Oct 02 08:58:42 thos: I think the problem is that none of the new images work out of the box. Not even with some simple gsmd restart or so Oct 02 08:58:50 XorA: I expect you will need the gtk doc pre-configure foo Oct 02 08:59:14 CM, Ralph: well considering I made phone calls between two neos "out of the box" yesterday... Oct 02 08:59:26 thos: I saw the video ;) Oct 02 08:59:34 come guys - lets take that old revision and start over again from there , wont you? Oct 02 08:59:37 CM, Ralph: this is why I'm just making sure people have updated srcrevs Oct 02 08:59:56 which image did you use thos? Oct 02 09:00:01 Ralph: my own Oct 02 09:00:13 thos: where do I nick that from? Oct 02 09:00:29 XorA: +do_configure_prepend() { Oct 02 09:00:29 + touch gtk-doc.make Oct 02 09:00:29 +} Oct 02 09:00:56 what is the base of your build? Oct 02 09:01:10 Ralph: base? Oct 02 09:01:26 yeah, where did you get it from and when? make update? Oct 02 09:01:52 Ralph: I don't use MokoMakefile Oct 02 09:02:08 my latest build is from yesterday and it didnt even start up the GUI Oct 02 09:02:21 Ralph: you never answered the question I asked Oct 02 09:02:23 allright then, thos, what did you do ? Oct 02 09:02:45 Ralph: mtn pull; mtn up; cd ..; bitbake openmoko-devel-image ;-) Oct 02 09:02:46 XorA sorry- what did you ask? Oct 02 09:02:52 Ralph: are you missing /usr/bin/dbus-daemon? Oct 02 09:02:57 Ralph: I could put the images up somewhere if people want Oct 02 09:03:23 Ralph: I have autorev enabled which makes sure I get the latest of anything from svn Oct 02 09:03:24 oh! well, i have to get back to the new image to check that Oct 02 09:03:56 well thos - how about a mini-howto for us? Oct 02 09:04:19 so that we can setup a working development enviroment finally? Oct 02 09:05:12 Ralph: do you want a development environment, or do you want to build images Oct 02 09:05:18 Ralph: the two don't have to be the same Oct 02 09:05:19 XorA - if dbus would run - do you think that i would have been able to dial out? Oct 02 09:05:34 Ralph: if dbus is broken, the UI is not going to work properly Oct 02 09:05:46 sure Oct 02 09:06:00 but why was it broken on a new image? ;) Oct 02 09:06:07 Ralph: there was a bug fixed yesterday where dbus-daemon was missed from image, if you happened to build just beffore that point, stuuff wouldd be broken Oct 02 09:06:30 thos - i want to be up to date with the rootfs while working on my own apps Oct 02 09:06:58 aha XorA - good to know Oct 02 09:07:25 Ralph: just do make update; make openmoko-devel-image and your new image will probably work Oct 02 09:07:27 so - than i am going to make update again and start over? Oct 02 09:07:38 Ralph: no start over, just make a new image Oct 02 09:07:50 aha ok Oct 02 09:07:58 Ralph: unless something went terminally wrong there is no need to destroy what you already built Oct 02 09:07:59 no make clobber , right? Oct 02 09:08:06 yeah, none of that Oct 02 09:08:15 thats good news XorA Oct 02 09:08:43 i am doing so now - reporting back as soon as i have running my new image on my neo Oct 02 09:08:46 thx allot! Oct 02 09:08:52 XorA: I had to do a clean rebuild yesterday. Something was wrong with icu and I just couldn't figure out what Oct 02 09:09:26 CM: rebuilding should be discouraged except where failure is truly terminal Oct 02 09:10:16 XorA: Of course, but it's usually an easy fix Oct 02 09:10:32 Ralph: I'll see what I can do Oct 02 09:10:41 CM: I just feel sorry for people waiting another 8 hours Oct 02 09:10:45 Ralph: one problem is I also have an unreleased patch to bitbake for svn revisions Oct 02 09:11:10 * CM nods. 10h for me, + 30 min before I noticed that uicmoc4 was still broken Oct 02 09:11:25 * CM points at OMbug 747 Oct 02 09:11:32 bitbake is in the makemoko Oct 02 09:11:53 * thos has just found he has a load of uncommitted openmoko-dialer code Oct 02 09:13:09 thos - however - we should find a way to shorten the time for updating the system Oct 02 09:13:51 someone using psyco? Oct 02 09:14:02 not me, doesnt run on amd64 Oct 02 09:14:13 thats what i found too Oct 02 09:14:21 why? Oct 02 09:14:38 its a source distribution Oct 02 09:14:47 its a JIT, and doesnt make code for x86_64 Oct 02 09:14:58 there should be way to build it for amd64 Oct 02 09:15:08 oh! ic Oct 02 09:15:19 well - that a bigger issue here Oct 02 09:15:21 :) Oct 02 09:15:43 is it really that faster? Oct 02 09:16:06 Ralph: I notice no difference on amd64 Oct 02 09:16:40 you cant- there is no psyco for amd64 Oct 02 09:17:22 Ralph: well, ideally buildhost would be updated every day I guess Oct 02 09:17:38 why dont openmoko have a big sun or whatever to build regulary Oct 02 09:17:57 no idea Oct 02 09:18:03 Ralph: They do have a build host, it's just not running Oct 02 09:18:13 Ralph: if I run psyco on 32bit on amd64 I notice no speed increase Oct 02 09:18:25 some company could do that for us - like IBM or such Oct 02 09:18:27 * XorA hides from this discussion Oct 02 09:18:40 thos: update is pushed Oct 02 09:18:47 oh - how can you rung 32bit on 64? Oct 02 09:19:03 Ralph: what distro do you use Oct 02 09:19:23 on my build host? debian Oct 02 09:19:35 Ralph: then use debootstrap to create a 32bit chroot Oct 02 09:20:19 aha - cool -didnt know that - however - you allready told me that there was no difference Oct 02 09:23:14 XorA: so can we push a few more srcrevs now then? Oct 02 09:24:24 XorA: Please add the patch in http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=747 too. It's a pain when the builds break after 6h every time Oct 02 09:24:28 thos - what are you talking about? Oct 02 09:24:29 Ralph: vmware Oct 02 09:24:56 vmware? Oct 02 09:24:59 yes Oct 02 09:25:01 Hmm.. Not every time, but every time you restart Oct 02 09:25:02 Ralph: sorry? Oct 02 09:25:02 vmware Oct 02 09:25:18 oh - how can you rung 32bit on 64? Oct 02 09:25:32 Or a 32-bit chroot :) Oct 02 09:25:35 i see Oct 02 09:25:37 yes.. Oct 02 09:25:47 but vmware means it's portable Oct 02 09:25:59 ok that says it al Oct 02 09:26:11 ie scp user@host:/vmware/ ./ Oct 02 09:26:14 thos - what do you push? Oct 02 09:28:58 Ralph: more updated srcrevs Oct 02 09:30:16 thos: if you can feed me a list of known working ones, I can update Oct 02 09:30:30 thos: its my job :-) Oct 02 09:30:41 XorA: all I can say is all the current latest revs should work Oct 02 09:30:57 XorA: i.e. that's what I built most recently Oct 02 09:31:03 * XorA goes to play with svn info Oct 02 09:31:15 :) Oct 02 09:31:30 XorA: I guess you could set the latest openmoko svn sourcerev on most packages Oct 02 09:32:36 thos: you guys didnt keep stuff in nice easy to find places :-D Oct 02 09:32:41 isn't that the new guy's job? :) Oct 02 09:33:40 Graeme's primary task is maintaining the OpenMoko distribution in OpenEmbedded, keeping classes and recipes up to date, ensuring that the distribution is buildable at all times and managing distribution releases. Oct 02 09:33:49 /endquote Oct 02 09:34:05 Who's that Graeme dude Oct 02 09:34:46 Today I'm extremely excited to announce our latest employee: Graeme Oct 02 09:34:46 Gregory. He's going to be our OpenEmbedded and BitBake developer. (We're Oct 02 09:34:46 really trying hard to add more depth to our team to support this huge Oct 02 09:34:46 effort.) Oct 02 09:34:49 /endquote Oct 02 09:35:03 what a stupid name! Oct 02 09:35:15 ~lart ScaredyCat for excessive linebreaks Oct 02 09:35:16 * apt blasts ScaredyCat with a huge firehose then strangles ScaredyCat with it for excessive linebreaks Oct 02 09:35:27 :D Oct 02 09:36:20 hey, i edited the first one, what more do you want Oct 02 09:39:00 I want lunch :P Oct 02 09:39:46 CM: I do too Oct 02 09:40:21 XorA: Hey, you're missing from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graeme ;) Oct 02 09:41:04 CM: heh heh, feel free to update it Oct 02 09:41:21 Ive even got the proper spelling Oct 02 09:41:31 * SpeedEvil contemplates http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humans . Oct 02 09:41:38 * SpeedEvil contemplates http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humans (list of) . Oct 02 09:41:39 Is it pronounced the same way? Oct 02 09:42:05 CM: yes, normally in Scotland Graeme is a forename Graham is a surname, in England Graham rules all Oct 02 09:42:15 CM: although I am English I have Scottish name Oct 02 09:42:24 CM: and no bugger can spell it right Oct 02 09:42:26 Ok, thanks :) Oct 02 09:42:28 Hehe Oct 02 09:43:06 Well, I spell my name Claes, but the typical swedish i Klas. (Pronounced like english class) Oct 02 09:43:10 CM: in a previous job there were three Graemes then a Graham started, as soon as he did, every one spelt Graeme wrong Oct 02 09:47:11 or cockney Klaus Oct 02 09:47:59 * CM puts on the santa-hat Oct 02 09:48:16 no ... KLaaass Oct 02 09:48:25 not claus Oct 02 09:48:31 not claws Oct 02 09:48:35 Hehe Oct 02 09:48:41 http://mjr.iki.fi/cos/cos.png Oct 02 09:49:01 (the actual Church of Santa text is in Finnish, sadly) Oct 02 09:49:09 :( Oct 02 09:49:29 yeah, but Santa is really the devil in disguise Oct 02 09:49:46 <_diego_> the funny thing is that Santa Claus is actually from Africa ^^ Oct 02 09:50:15 in th e/uk he's from the North Pole. in .nl he's from Spain iirc Oct 02 09:50:35 in Finland he's from Finland Oct 02 09:50:58 <_diego_> yes, but Santa Claus, was San Nicolaus, a person really existed Oct 02 09:51:17 Wasn't that in Turkey somewhere? Oct 02 09:51:23 <_diego_> sorry, not africa, turkish ^^ Oct 02 09:51:56 and we've actually managed to market the Finnish version decently; while others have been grabbing Santa also, ours gets mail from all over the world, some tourists too Oct 02 09:52:34 Dutch one is SinterKlaas Oct 02 09:52:59 I thought it was supposed to be St. Nicholas anyho Oct 02 09:53:06 or... any ho ho ho Oct 02 09:54:07 I'll ge me coat... Oct 02 09:54:09 the Finnish origins are rather our own also, and the name reflects that Oct 02 09:54:16 joulupukki, lit. "christmas goat" Oct 02 09:54:31 which, you know, what with the devil in disguise thing, fits Oct 02 09:54:36 openmoko: 03thomas * r3068 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-keypad.c src/moko-keypad.h): Oct 02 09:54:36 openmoko: * src/moko-keypad.c: Oct 02 09:54:36 openmoko: * src/moko-keypad.h: Add moko_keypad_set_display_text() Oct 02 09:54:43 the America one was invnted by CocaCola Oct 02 09:55:03 yeah... Oct 02 09:55:10 yeah ours dress like the coca cola santa nowadays too Oct 02 09:55:28 it's a bit too much of a coincidence that 'Santa' and 'Satan' contain the same letters Oct 02 09:56:13 this also made it simple to create terminology for the Church of Santa Oct 02 09:56:28 or Pukin kirkko (Church of the Goat) Oct 02 09:56:29 <_diego_> probably you can get 666 from the name of santa :) Oct 02 09:57:07 Santa Worshippers (Pukinpalvojat, Goat worshippers), Santaists (Pukistit, Goatists) Oct 02 10:00:06 openmoko: 03chris * r3069 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/libraries/moko-gtk-engine/ (ChangeLog ltmain.sh src/moko-draw.c): Add 16-bit dithering for gradients Oct 02 10:03:10 _diego_: yes... Oct 02 10:03:43 Santa : ((19 x 1 x 14 x 1 x 20) / 5) -398) Oct 02 10:07:08 oh... Oct 02 10:11:58 rwhitby: you on the NSLU2 list? Oct 02 10:12:05 or anyone else for that matter Oct 02 10:14:59 * Ralph happy again :) Oct 02 10:15:08 everything works just fine now Oct 02 10:15:41 besides that i had to restart the gsmd and the xserver after boot Oct 02 10:15:53 why is this -any one knows? Oct 02 10:19:18 Ralph: because gsmd is not 100% reliable Oct 02 10:19:55 Ralph: you should only have to restart the dialer, but restart X is easier Oct 02 10:26:26 using OM2007.2, does anyone know what causes this run-time dependancy? "libmokoui0 (>= 0.4+svn20070924) libmokojournal0 (>= 0.4+svn20070924) libmokogsmd0 (>= 0.4+svn20070924)" Oct 02 10:26:41 "ERROR: Cannot satisfy the following dependencies" Oct 02 10:35:40 bah I missed the christmas talk. Oct 02 10:38:59 openmoko: 03thomas * r3070 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-dialer.c): Oct 02 10:38:59 openmoko: Patch by: Roman Moravcik Oct 02 10:38:59 openmoko: * src/moko-dialer.c: (moko_dialer_init): Fix the loading of moko journal, Oct 02 10:38:59 openmoko: (on_talking_reject_call): Write journal to storage after call is rejected, Oct 02 10:38:59 openmoko: (on_keypad_dial_clicked): Outgoing call had set wrong journal direction. Oct 02 10:40:29 mbuf, did u link against openmoko-libs ? Oct 02 10:41:32 zedstar, let me post the .bb file, and give the URL Oct 02 10:41:57 openmoko: 03thomas * r3071 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-dialer.c): Oct 02 10:41:57 openmoko: Patch by: Roman Moravcik Oct 02 10:41:57 openmoko: * src/moko-dialer.c: (on_keypad_dial_clicked), (on_incoming_call), Oct 02 10:41:57 openmoko: (on_network_registered): Store network information (LocationAreaCode, Oct 02 10:41:57 openmoko: CellID) in moko journal. Oct 02 10:42:05 mbuf well....what i learnt recently is u need to link to the updated libraries otherwise u get those odd dependencies Oct 02 10:42:42 mbuf have on a sec ill have a look Oct 02 10:42:44 zedstar, updated libraries? want me to do an update with the MokoMakefile? i have temporarily commented the updates Oct 02 10:44:16 zedstar, the .bb sample file is here, http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2007-September/001564.html Oct 02 10:45:55 mbuf libmokoui2 is what i think u need to link against instead of openmoko-libs Oct 02 10:46:15 mbuf i had similar dependencies problems but i have not tried yet to fix it Oct 02 10:47:08 zedstar, so DEPENDS += "gtk+ libgsmd libmokoui2" ? PKG should be changed as well? Oct 02 10:47:14 mbuf as a kludge u can just put those dependencies in the ipk file if u want to the app to install and run if u dont link to the new libr Oct 02 10:48:45 mbuf i guess so i build from command line so i would do something like `pkg-config --libs libmokoui2 gtk+-2.0` Oct 02 10:49:21 actually thomas (thos) told me about this at the weekend so he can better answer if u get no joy... hi thos btw! Oct 02 10:49:39 hidi ho Oct 02 10:49:54 but it same problem i had Oct 02 10:49:54 wazzup Oct 02 10:50:11 that linking to old library with weird dependency issue Oct 02 10:50:47 for example `pkg-config --libs openmoko-libs gtk+-2.0`" would require some odd dependencies so needed libmokoui2 Oct 02 10:51:16 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MokoMakefile]] [[Hardware:Neo1973:Alternate_Cases:Ruggedized]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Talk:Building_Gadget_USB_Module]] Oct 02 10:53:06 openmoko: 03thomas * r3072 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-history.c): (log message trimmed) Oct 02 10:53:06 openmoko: Patch by: Roman Moravcik Oct 02 10:53:06 openmoko: * src/moko-history.c: (moko_history_load_entries): History list wasn't Oct 02 10:53:06 openmoko: corectly filled with moko journal entries, Oct 02 10:53:06 openmoko: (on_delete_clicked), (history_add_entry): Function Oct 02 10:53:10 openmoko: moko_journal_remove_entry_by_uid need uid value instead of contact_uid, Oct 02 10:53:12 openmoko: (history_add_entry): Replace phone number with name of contact if there Oct 02 10:53:32 zedstar, thanks! it works, DEPENDS += "gtk+ libmokoui2 libgsmd" Oct 02 10:53:43 zedstar, PKG = `${OMDIR}/build/tmp/staging/i686-linux/bin/pkg-config --cflags --libs libmokoui2 gtk+-2.0 libgsmd` Oct 02 10:53:47 zedstar: yeah, use libmokoui2 Oct 02 10:53:53 infact, you don't need gtk+-2.0 Oct 02 10:54:00 libmokoui2 should bring that in for you Oct 02 10:54:03 mbuf....kewl Oct 02 10:54:11 ok thanks thos Oct 02 10:54:56 thos, i see Oct 02 10:55:17 will try that out later today and rebuild my ipk Oct 02 10:56:28 zedstar, have you checked in your code to projects.openmoko.org? if yes, which project? Oct 02 10:57:12 mbuf not yet...i intend to once i made a few changes...i packages ipk and source tarball Oct 02 10:57:13 zedstar, there were some e-mails earlier that svn commits weren't taking place with the server? Oct 02 10:57:26 zedstar, cool, thanks Oct 02 10:58:49 zedstar, out of curiosity, do you guys update your build environments on a daily basis? i just commented the update targets in the MokoMakefile Oct 02 10:59:43 mbuf well i actually just build stuff from command line with cross tools rather than use openembedded etc like i should do i guess Oct 02 11:00:09 zedstar, i see Oct 02 11:00:40 mbuf i then just build ipk from hand also Oct 02 11:01:02 zedstar, is there any documentation on doing it manually? Oct 02 11:01:08 mbuf i will get round to doing it properly though Oct 02 11:01:22 mbuf not that i am aware of other than copying the example hello world on the wiki Oct 02 11:01:28 zedstar, ok Oct 02 11:02:09 mbuf that should work ok though if u copy it Oct 02 11:02:25 mbuf then just get the ipkg-build stuff to make roll your own Oct 02 11:02:30 * CM finished a "make all" for the first time ever Oct 02 11:02:32 zedstar, well, i would like end-users to install a package :) Oct 02 11:02:48 zedstar, need to read on that from some documentation Oct 02 11:03:01 mbuf yeh sure.....making ipk is pretty easy though and like debian package Oct 02 11:03:08 zedstar, i see Oct 02 11:03:13 u can just copy one Oct 02 11:05:13 ok Oct 02 11:13:15 Is anyone able to enlighten me regarding my app design questions? Oct 02 11:13:29 So where would be the right place to cache podcast media files and to store preferences and configuration items? Oct 02 11:13:30 ~/.foobar ? Oct 02 11:13:31 jumpy33: what is your question? Oct 02 11:13:44 /var/something ? Oct 02 11:14:00 jumpy33: what sort of application? Oct 02 11:14:14 Podcatcher Oct 02 11:14:44 jumpy33: gconf is useful for storing configuration options Oct 02 11:15:34 ok, but what about files? A podcatcher would read RSS feeds, download podcast media files and queue them for playing. Oct 02 11:15:51 so where to store them? Oct 02 11:16:31 jumpy33: probably in ~/.foobar as you suggested Oct 02 11:16:54 Ok, will this be on the microSD card? Oct 02 11:17:02 no Oct 02 11:17:25 hmm Oct 02 11:17:27 that's bad, because of the limited space Oct 02 11:17:40 jumpy33: yeah, i would ask the user to store them on sd card then Oct 02 11:18:29 So all of the basic file system will be on the neo? Oct 02 11:18:49 ans the sd card is only in /mnt/whatever? Oct 02 11:18:58 well, /media, yes Oct 02 11:19:15 you will not be required to have an sd card to boot Oct 02 11:19:33 the rootfs sits entirely on flash Oct 02 11:20:01 ok, so I guess I'll have to make this path user configurable. With a default to /media/.../podcasts or something Oct 02 11:21:10 sounds reasonable Oct 02 11:21:59 jumpy33: /media/card/podcasts sound reasonable to me too :) Oct 02 11:22:41 Second thing was already commented on openmoko-devel, but to be sure: is it ok to use cron for regular automatic update of the feeds? Otherwise the application has to be running all the time which I think is bad for memory ... Oct 02 11:23:12 * CM is a crooner ;) Oct 02 11:25:35 jumpy33: well yes you could use cron Oct 02 11:27:39 ~seen zdanek Oct 02 11:27:40 zdanek was last seen on IRC in channel #openmoko, 10d 13h 26m 3s ago, saying: 'cu'. Oct 02 11:37:23 ljp: What should someone who hasn't developed a single Qt application look at if he wishes to do any kind of Qtopia app development? Oct 02 11:38:13 I find a lot on how to set up the build environment and qtopia, but only something about creating a taskbar applet when it comes to app development Oct 02 11:39:01 Hm, perhaps I found something a bit more relevant. Oct 02 11:39:42 I think http://doc.trolltech.com/qtopia4.3/tut-index.html might have more of what I was looking for. Oct 02 11:50:31 CM and thos: Thank you very much for your comments! :-) Oct 02 11:59:28 jorgenpt: Try asking around in #qtopia :) Oct 02 11:59:43 Ooh Oct 02 12:02:24 thos - i am back from lunch Oct 02 12:02:47 what caused gsmd or the dialer to fail? Oct 02 12:03:02 is gsmd not responding to the dialer app? Oct 02 12:03:20 or does it fail to connect to the modem? Oct 02 12:03:39 Ralph: it has bugs Oct 02 12:04:08 well - sure - but do you kown spezific? Oct 02 12:04:26 Ralph: look in OE for a list of patches Oct 02 12:05:58 they are not in the cvs or so? Oct 02 12:06:05 no Oct 02 12:06:16 there have been no updates to svn since the middle of august Oct 02 12:06:49 is there a reason to this? - will it be done some day? Oct 02 12:07:07 ask Harald Oct 02 12:07:27 so Harald does the svn update? Oct 02 12:08:19 hi! I just got an error while building my openmoko image with the makefile - could reproduce this issue after updating three times. uboot-openmoko failed to compile with the following error: "hello_world.c:0: error: bad value (armv4) for -march= switch" Oct 02 12:08:24 OE is the openembedded right? gsmd is there? Oct 02 12:09:37 josch: are you compiling for x86? Oct 02 12:10:02 jumpy33: yes you are right Oct 02 12:10:12 is thi a common error? Oct 02 12:11:01 Ralph: Harald is the gsmd maintainer Oct 02 12:11:03 I don't get why it's trying to build uboot for x86 Oct 02 12:11:41 has been the same for me... Oct 02 12:12:18 jumpy33: did you solve it? Oct 02 12:13:11 no, I gave up :-) Oct 02 12:13:21 -_- Oct 02 12:13:30 I have reported this to openmoko-deveĺ (see http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2007-September/001521.html) Oct 02 12:13:38 but I did not get an answer. Oct 02 12:14:02 I don't know, if this is an error in MokoMakefile or in the build process. Oct 02 12:14:14 If it is the latter, we could file a bug ;-) Oct 02 12:14:17 was just about to ask this question ^^ Oct 02 12:14:35 does rwhitby know about it? Oct 02 12:14:52 jumpy33: why are you building for x86? Oct 02 12:14:57 depends on whether he read my post ;-) Oct 02 12:15:56 because I want to do app development and qemu doesn't work for me either (see http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2007-September/001555.html) Oct 02 12:16:15 jump33: I con confirm this - my error log is identical to yours Oct 02 12:16:23 jumpy33: you don't need that for app development Oct 02 12:17:03 thos: well I didn't know back then. I wanted to know how the app looks like. Oct 02 12:17:03 just edit the mokomakefile and remove the part that builds uboot Oct 02 12:17:59 nbd: but if I do this I have to avoid doing a make update-makefile, right` Oct 02 12:18:18 thos: In the meantime I figured an easy way to do WYSIWYMG app development for the NEO based on Xephyr/Xnest Oct 02 12:18:34 jumpy33: yeah, much easier :-) Oct 02 12:18:45 josch: yup Oct 02 12:19:58 Well, the problem is in part that the wiki does not give information on how to start if you want to do "just" application hacking ... Oct 02 12:20:24 jumpy33: yeah I discussed this with zedstar on sunday Oct 02 12:20:45 jumpy33: your name sounds german - you can check out #neo1973-germany there are other app-developers like me, fgau or PBeck Oct 02 12:21:08 thos: what was the result? Oct 02 12:21:15 josch: cool, thanks Oct 02 12:21:30 thos: I also only want to set up openmoko for x86 for app-development Oct 02 12:21:50 I've just tried the new snapshot from qtopia on my neo and when I power it on it just cycles through an error message constantly Oct 02 12:22:17 duffyd: what kernel ? Oct 02 12:22:29 josch: you can do all your development with libraries from your distribution Oct 02 12:22:29 thos i had a word with micheal about this stuff....see if they could simplify getting started with a bare bones tools setup and example etc Oct 02 12:22:36 sannes: one that was bundled with the preview Oct 02 12:22:38 duffyd: Poke ljp or ask in #qtopia :) Oct 02 12:23:04 uImage-2.6.22.5-moko11-r2-fic-gta01.bin Oct 02 12:23:09 There will be a new release of qtopia "soon" Oct 02 12:23:10 CM: ok :) Oct 02 12:23:13 josch: you could do this instead: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2007-September/001560.html Oct 02 12:23:14 That kernel worked for me Oct 02 12:23:23 CM: oh really Oct 02 12:23:27 thos: I thought so but when I gave my perl and python scripts to some neo owners they reported that all the required perl and python libs were broken Oct 02 12:23:31 CM: so you got it running? Oct 02 12:23:49 duffyd: Sure, from when it was realeased until this morning, no problems at all Oct 02 12:24:04 mmm, better flash it again then Oct 02 12:24:05 Well, only one problem, i finished my prepaid card calling.. :P Oct 02 12:24:19 And the powermanagement wasn't that good. Oct 02 12:24:24 josch: possibly because they are not built in openmoko by default Oct 02 12:24:34 i don't currently have a card inserted but shouldn't matter Oct 02 12:24:52 Hi Oct 02 12:24:53 Hmm.. Maybe that could be it though. I never tried without a sim Oct 02 12:24:58 thos: they installed them with ipkg but the files got into the wrong placed, were not in PATH or simply not found Oct 02 12:25:07 Anyone know what SIP stack is in the Neo (if any)? Oct 02 12:25:29 * duffyd goes off to install SIM Oct 02 12:25:35 dneary: None right now afaik Oct 02 12:26:02 OK - thanks for the info. When does Mickey get back from the Algarve? Oct 02 12:26:10 dneary: there is none Oct 02 12:26:13 dneary: next week Oct 02 12:26:21 thos: this was the reason I asked several times for anyone to try out a little perl script of mine to check this issue Oct 02 12:26:29 2 weeks in portuga, and it's been one week so far Oct 02 12:26:50 dneary: Have any suggestions on a sip stack? Oct 02 12:27:06 dneary: btw, Neo1973 is the hardware, OpenMoko is the software Oct 02 12:27:14 I've heard people talk about pjsip, and doesn't telepathy have a sip backend now? Oct 02 12:27:30 hy does anyone know how to add files for playback in the new media player? i tried to create a new playlist but tis just crashes it .. Oct 02 12:27:34 thos: yup Oct 02 12:27:43 should i add a manual playlist to the media card? Oct 02 12:27:58 jumpy33: thanks for the link but my app is not high-level enough to work with this setup Oct 02 12:27:59 CM: nah it just cycles through saying magic bitmask not found :( Oct 02 12:28:40 its not intuitive how to add a file to the player .. Oct 02 12:30:04 duffyd: sorry? Oct 02 12:30:42 thos: He's trying the qtopia image Oct 02 12:31:05 CM: who is? Oct 02 12:31:12 duffyd: :) Oct 02 12:31:18 and? Oct 02 12:31:18 CM: hi Oct 02 12:31:25 CM: just reflashing now Oct 02 12:31:26 But now I saw the "yup" Oct 02 12:31:36 Sorry for adding to the confusion Oct 02 12:31:45 thos: I was just answering yes to your earlier question re. neo1973 and OM Oct 02 12:31:45 so again: I would be very happy if anyone could try out this little perl script http://celpaste.morb-design.com/pastebin.php?show=m91a763 on his neo - it needs perl and the Encoding.pm module Oct 02 12:33:13 duffyd: that wasn't a question Oct 02 12:33:32 so nobody using the media player? Oct 02 12:33:35 thos: oh sorry, ignore me then ;) Oct 02 12:34:16 torpor: I haven't tried yet. Ask abraxa if he comes back online Oct 02 12:34:21 ok Oct 02 12:34:35 Is it the playlist that's breaking it? Oct 02 12:34:41 well yeah Oct 02 12:34:45 File a bug about it :) Oct 02 12:34:48 but there's no obvious way to load a track Oct 02 12:34:56 so i try to 'create a new playlist' and it faults. Oct 02 12:34:57 josch, just try in in the emulator :) Oct 02 12:35:07 this is with a build of devel-image from today Oct 02 12:35:27 anyone else having uicmoc4-native fail to build? Oct 02 12:35:37 shorogan: i didn't get a network connection to work between qemu and the host Oct 02 12:35:42 xzcvczx: Yes, the fix is in bug 747 Oct 02 12:35:47 CM: For a SIP stack, I'm involved in the OpenWengo project, and we have one Oct 02 12:36:06 dneary: I know you are, but I don't know your sip stack ;) Oct 02 12:36:11 We have even done a prototype convergence phone for a telco here in France a couple of years back Oct 02 12:36:21 shorogan: the problem is, that it did't work for two people and that I want to confirm that something is broken Oct 02 12:36:22 thos: Thanks for the clarification Oct 02 12:36:54 CM: We use a high-level API called phapi, which depends on osip Oct 02 12:37:09 Ah, ok Oct 02 12:37:55 jumpy33: removed uboot-openmoko from the makefile - now it seems to work Oct 02 12:38:02 All C, platform independent Oct 02 12:38:09 Which is nice Oct 02 12:38:22 Definitely Oct 02 12:38:30 * xzcvczx apoligies profusely for not searching properly Oct 02 12:38:34 thanks CM Oct 02 12:38:50 * CM made a partial SIP stack in C# for Ericsson a few years ago Oct 02 12:39:29 CM: same issue when reflashing Oct 02 12:40:03 thos: where can i find Harald? Oct 02 12:40:09 duffyd: That sucks, and really strange. Maybe try ScaredyCat's image: http://buildhost.automated.it/OM2007.2/qtopia-image-fic-gta01.jffs2 Oct 02 12:40:14 Ralph: good question ;-) Oct 02 12:40:15 hier on this channel? Oct 02 12:40:20 no idea Oct 02 12:40:33 have not heard from him for a few weeks Oct 02 12:40:44 Ralph: He's here as LaF0rge some times, but not talking much Oct 02 12:40:59 aha Oct 02 12:41:03 Ralph: if you wonder about gsmd, mail to the gsmd mailinglist Oct 02 12:42:15 hi PBeck! Oct 02 12:42:20 hi Oct 02 12:42:32 hi josch :) Oct 02 12:43:20 * duffyd is embarassed Oct 02 12:43:29 CM: I was flashing the tar file :P Oct 02 12:43:42 Hehe.. "OOups.." ;) Oct 02 12:43:43 it's too late over here - my brain is fried ;) Oct 02 12:45:24 * Ralph subscribed to gsmd-devl Oct 02 12:45:31 So how do I go about proposing stuff for OpenMoko? Oct 02 12:47:32 what sort of "stuff"? Oct 02 12:51:37 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Fradeve11]] [[Community_nominees_for_GTA02_P0]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Automatic_emulation_in_Ubuntu/it]] [[Installation_guide/it]] [[MokoMakefile/it]] Oct 02 12:54:56 CM: hooray is working! Oct 02 12:55:04 first brain in gear.. Oct 02 12:55:44 !scaredycat Oct 02 12:57:22 anyone have scaredycats url handy? Oct 02 12:57:48 torpor: You mean http://buildhost.automated.it Oct 02 12:58:40 thats the one Oct 02 12:58:57 are there any other good repo's that i should know about? i wanna load up my neo for a demo session .. Oct 02 13:03:37 torpor: your own? Oct 02 13:03:46 dneary: So far, people seem to mail suggestions to the mailinglists for discussion, or add pages to wiki with the Wishlist tag Oct 02 13:03:47 emdete: bahdumpsh. Oct 02 13:03:49 i got one. Oct 02 13:03:57 but i only have a very basic application in it right now. Oct 02 13:03:58 Or just talk here to some devs :) Oct 02 13:04:14 :) Oct 02 13:04:17 whats the name of the application installer/manager? its not installed by default right? Oct 02 13:07:52 torpor: ipkg is Oct 02 13:08:08 no there's a GUI but i always forget its name after i do a new image .. Oct 02 13:08:51 * CM doesn't know Oct 02 13:15:36 did someone just not me! Oct 02 13:16:13 hi jpcass! Oct 02 13:16:27 hi zedstar! Oct 02 13:16:34 how's the chicken? Oct 02 13:17:04 jpcass good :) they stuck videos up on youtube from the weekend Oct 02 13:17:32 i need a little help from my friends here .... Oct 02 13:17:32 ah - must have a look... Oct 02 13:18:01 patching of gsmd Oct 02 13:18:04 how to? Oct 02 13:18:39 there are some 10 files to patch the reason soucecode of gsmd Oct 02 13:18:51 how is this be done? Oct 02 13:19:01 Ralph: I think there's two ways Oct 02 13:19:06 the ar6k in the gta02, how will it be connected up? Oct 02 13:19:40 Either use quilt, or add all of them to the files folder for gsmd and then add them to the .bb file Oct 02 13:20:31 CM: how would I shutdown the OM when it locks up when trying to shutdown via qtopia? Oct 02 13:20:46 duffyd: Mine does too. Just take out the battery Oct 02 13:21:17 add them to the .bb file - ähm - how? :( Oct 02 13:21:19 Ralph: Ask XorA or ScaredyCat or someone else who knows more than me Oct 02 13:21:27 aha Oct 02 13:21:29 CM: ok, good idea :) Oct 02 13:21:31 Look at some bb file that's already patched Oct 02 13:21:44 eg.? Oct 02 13:21:52 I managed to get some program patched a while ago, but I can't remember wich one it was Oct 02 13:22:12 and quit is like patch Oct 02 13:22:19 or what? Oct 02 13:22:41 quilt is a patch management system Oct 02 13:22:47 I don't know much about it :/ Oct 02 13:23:13 ok, still allot more than me here :) Oct 02 13:23:18 Ralph: also, quilting is when you put together lots of patches of cloth to make a blanket ;) Oct 02 13:23:37 ;) Oct 02 13:29:48 Ralph: You have to add something like this to the bitbake file: SRC_URI += "file://name.patch;patch=1" Oct 02 13:30:07 Ralph: And then you have files/name.patch in the same dir Oct 02 13:35:45 aha! CM - thx Oct 02 13:39:17 torpor: Btw, saw you have a really low Slashdot number.. 458! :P Oct 02 13:39:43 I'm sure you could sell those on ebay :) Oct 02 13:40:16 And the rumor the gp quoted that multitouch might be availible through a driver update is false.. Oct 02 13:41:43 CM: is multitouch more than a software issue? Oct 02 13:41:50 josch: shure Oct 02 13:42:00 unfortunately yes.. Oct 02 13:42:57 * CM takes a coffee break Oct 02 13:44:56 * zash` takes a break-break Oct 02 13:45:13 hi Oct 02 14:24:58 * ScaredyCat stabs someone for all those locales Oct 02 14:26:14 Ouch! Oct 02 14:26:16 ScaredyCat: apparently you can disable them Oct 02 14:26:57 and why would you want multi touch on such a small screen anyway Oct 02 14:27:04 seems a bit silly Oct 02 14:28:17 * mwester imagines working with a pair of stylii, much like chopsticks. Oct 02 14:28:26 thos - I have them turned off - it ignored me Oct 02 14:28:41 ScaredyCat: that was also mentioned to me ;-) Oct 02 14:29:02 seems like my completely fresh build is finishing though Oct 02 14:29:03 woo Oct 02 14:30:29 Nice, are all the src-revs updated in om? Oct 02 14:31:14 * ScaredyCat grrrs Oct 02 14:31:33 * mwester reads that log, and notices that things seem to be happening in OpenMoko-land once again... Oct 02 14:32:33 CM: ask XorA ;-) Oct 02 14:32:37 ScaredyCat: Did you set up a rig to measure battery current draw? Oct 02 14:33:02 I did and it flattened my battery in no time Oct 02 14:33:54 I'm going to try to measure current draw as well for some gsmd patches -- how did you do it? Oct 02 14:34:15 thos: not yet Oct 02 14:34:33 XorA: I don't exactly remember how autorev works anyway Oct 02 14:34:36 thos: as all the sources are all over the shot, I need to setup a complete new build env Oct 02 14:34:51 thos: I cant just svn co, svn info Oct 02 14:35:10 hmm Oct 02 14:35:17 XorA: you mean things that are not from openmoko svn? Oct 02 14:35:47 thos: yeah Oct 02 14:36:58 did someone try to compile rrd for arm? Oct 02 14:36:59 mwester: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_GTA01_Power_Management Oct 02 14:37:04 ScaredyCat: (from waaaay back in the log) I'm on the NSLU2 lists as well... Oct 02 14:37:16 XorA: well, most of the UI stuff is in openmoko svn Oct 02 14:37:21 XorA: apart from contacts and dates Oct 02 14:37:43 thos: I think the best plan is to have an autorev build then ls *svn* Oct 02 14:37:49 mwester: aahh .. somone asked about using lcd4linux with a pertelian lcd device... Oct 02 14:38:17 I wrote the driver for it at the weekend and submitted it for inclusion... Oct 02 14:38:25 it's now in lcd4linux svn... Oct 02 14:38:31 but I'm not on that list... Oct 02 14:38:42 XorA: would you like me to do that? Oct 02 14:38:51 so wondered if you could locate the message and let them know.. Oct 02 14:38:56 not vital... Oct 02 14:38:58 but hy Oct 02 14:39:00 ...hey Oct 02 14:39:05 my build has just produced a 139MB image though, which must be wrong Oct 02 14:39:09 I'll go search for that, and offer the pointer to the lcd4linux svn. Thanks! Oct 02 14:39:14 i included feed reader this time Oct 02 14:39:26 thos: that would be a good start, then I know what builds and can bump thos Oct 02 14:39:41 thos: then Ill work on getting my autorev build up and running Oct 02 14:39:41 thos: LOL Oct 02 14:40:33 XorA: ok one sec Oct 02 14:43:39 XorA: this what you want? http://folks.o-hand.com/thomas/svn-revs.txt Oct 02 14:44:06 unfortunately I still have a lot of old sources Oct 02 14:44:12 thos: no, same thing, but in ipk directory, that way I know what actually built Oct 02 14:44:25 oh good plan Oct 02 14:46:50 XorA: ok refresh that page now Oct 02 14:47:14 thos: brilliant Oct 02 14:51:37 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Wish_List]] [[User:ChrisLord]] [[MokoMakefile/it]] Oct 02 14:53:36 there is something weird about that script Oct 02 14:56:20 openmoko: 03thomas * r3073 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/applications/openmoko-dialer2/ (ChangeLog src/moko-contacts.c): Oct 02 14:56:20 openmoko: Patch by: Roman Moravcik Oct 02 14:56:20 openmoko: * src/moko-contacts.c: (moko_contacts_add_contact): Read phone number from Oct 02 14:56:20 openmoko: VCARD. Oct 02 15:23:09 Wow, Qtopia is really far along Oct 02 15:23:31 compbrain: well duh Oct 02 15:23:38 compbrain: it's been in development for over four years Oct 02 15:23:51 I'm just trying it now though. Sluggish as hell, but impressive anyway Oct 02 16:02:53 I managed to get openmoko running on x86 with xephyr but is there a way to change the dpi so that the fonts get bigger? Oct 02 16:04:33 josch: Xephyr :1 -ac -screen 480x640x16 -dpi 284& Oct 02 16:04:46 thos: thx! Oct 02 16:05:19 it worked!! :-) Oct 02 16:07:44 well yeah :-P Oct 02 16:08:43 added it to the wiki ^^ Oct 02 16:09:02 josch: where? Oct 02 16:11:12 thos: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_OpenMoko_working_on_host_with_Xephyr#Launching_Xephyr Oct 02 16:13:33 josch: Thanks for adding good tips to the wiki :) Oct 02 16:14:24 CM: everything I learn from you guys I will gladly pass to others by adding the solution to the wiki! Oct 02 16:16:55 josch: Sometimes I'm too lazy to update the wiki.. I'm lurking here a lot anyway ;) Oct 02 16:17:19 * CM invites more people to vote or nominate at: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Community_nominees_for_GTA02_P0 Oct 02 16:18:09 * Mek creates a new wiki account to nominate himself :P Oct 02 16:18:12 I agree a lot with rwhitby, openmoko needs more low-level people hacking Oct 02 16:18:17 Mek: Hehe Oct 02 16:24:53 http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS3405111195.html is that of any use? Oct 02 16:25:33 Wow, I thought that project died years ago Oct 02 16:26:32 looks like they somehow found money for it Oct 02 16:26:45 ISTR that it was not really useable Oct 02 16:26:50 lol Oct 02 16:26:52 Porting Dillo from GTK1 to GTK2 was ruled out due to the relatively large system resource requirements. Oct 02 16:30:26 ...and then it would be like firefox..kinda ironic fx started out to be light weight browser Oct 02 16:30:51 firefox wasnt really ever lightweight Oct 02 16:31:00 the whole xul idea prevented that very reliably Oct 02 16:31:46 firefox was netscape and there is no leigthweight Oct 02 16:32:30 firefox was always gecko which is not very much of netscape Oct 02 16:33:59 openmoko: 03thomas * r3074 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2007.2/panel-plugins/openmoko-panel-gsm/ (ChangeLog configure.ac src/openmoko-panel-gsm.c): Oct 02 16:33:59 openmoko: * configure.ac: Oct 02 16:33:59 openmoko: * src/openmoko-panel-gsm.c: (gsm_applet_update_signal_strength), Oct 02 16:33:59 openmoko: (gsm_applet_autoregister_network), (gsm_applet_power_down_antenna), Oct 02 16:33:59 openmoko: (mb_panel_applet_create): Oct 02 16:34:01 openmoko: Add libnotify support Oct 02 16:34:11 ok would anyone like to test that commit for me Oct 02 16:34:38 as I am having to rebuild my rootfs from scratch (again( Oct 02 16:34:52 hehe Oct 02 16:35:38 it should now popup a message "Registered to Network" when it becomes registered to a network Oct 02 16:35:45 using libnotify Oct 02 16:35:59 what's average battery life these days? Oct 02 16:36:16 ewon: depends what profile you use :-P Oct 02 16:36:23 I see :) Oct 02 16:36:28 * ewon goes to gander around the wiki Oct 02 16:40:55 hi!! Oct 02 16:51:17 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Getting_OpenMoko_working_on_host_with_Xephyr]] Oct 02 16:51:24 say, how hard would gsm multiplexing be to impliment? Oct 02 16:51:42 couple of lines of shell script isn't it :) Oct 02 16:51:49 heh Oct 02 16:52:00 thats how i did it on my last linux phone :) Oct 02 16:52:08 Haven't looked at the protocol. Oct 02 16:54:21 * cb22_ still misses his good ol' hp h6315 Oct 02 16:55:59 * CM updates and builds a new rootfs Oct 02 17:08:57 I have a problem running the OpenMoko QEMU based emulator.... can someone help me? Oct 02 17:08:57 Commands: counter (see estimated time until P1), counter_msg (set message for counter), faq (gives this link: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ ) Oct 02 17:09:59 what is problem? (somebody might know answer, but without knowing actual problem its hard to answer ;-) Oct 02 17:10:13 counter Oct 02 17:10:14 http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter Got it, get yours from openmoko.com (and read topic) (1813;252) Oct 02 17:12:19 aloril: lol Oct 02 17:12:33 aloril: after a long waiting Oct 02 17:13:12 appeared: wrong data CRC in data node etc etc etc.... Oct 02 17:13:29 what can I do? Oct 02 17:16:41 Any_Key: Did a complete ts_harvest... Looks weird: http://claesmogren.com/~cm/neo/ts_harvest.out Oct 02 17:32:55 no one can help me? Oct 02 17:35:05 Gianfrix: We don't know what is wrong, that's why we can't help Oct 02 17:35:40 Are you trying to run a qemu image? Built it yourself? With the makefile? What qemu are you using? Oct 02 17:37:57 thos: The latest build fails to start x Oct 02 17:42:03 thos: Restarting xserver-nodm worked.. Oct 02 17:45:35 thos: Caling worked! :D Oct 02 17:45:56 thos: But the calls were not logged... Does (openmoko-dialer:1785): Gtk-CRITICAL **: gtk_tree_model_filter_refilter: assertion `GTK_IS_TREE_MODEL_FILTER (filter)' failed say anything to you? Oct 02 17:47:09 CM: I followed this guide: http://pollycoke.wordpress.com/2007/04/08/ecco-lemulatore-di-neo1973-con-immagine-di-openmoko-nella-vostra-box/ Oct 02 17:47:17 it's italian Oct 02 17:52:07 Gianfrix: That's very old. Please try this from the wiki instead: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko_under_QEMU Oct 02 17:53:50 ok Oct 02 17:54:50 They looked similar in the instructions though Oct 02 17:56:39 yes, I think they're the same :-) Oct 02 17:57:23 I've only used qemu by building it by myself using the makefile Oct 02 17:57:31 I'll try that now and see if it works Oct 02 18:16:07 CM: It works!!!! I hope only it won't be so slow on the Neo1973... Oct 02 18:42:57 CM: hmm Oct 02 18:43:10 CM: I added some patches to the dialer today to fix call history Oct 02 18:52:25 I'm going to buy a Neo, can someone tell if it really works for making calls? Oct 02 18:52:49 yes Oct 02 18:53:10 edu as soon as there is completed software, yes. Oct 02 18:54:14 edu: The latest OpenMoko builds makes calls just fine, but the battery doesn't last very long Oct 02 18:54:21 so the software is not completed yet, neither source code for compiling it? Oct 02 18:54:42 It compiles fine, even for a novice like me. Just use "The Makefile" :) Oct 02 18:55:25 (He's referring to MokoMakefile - wiki it ;) Oct 02 18:55:43 now is out of stock, isn't it? Oct 02 18:56:33 how's OM coming along? Oct 02 18:56:35 edu: If you're not in too much of a hurry, wait a month and get the GTA02 Oct 02 18:56:43 i'm going to flash my device tonight Oct 02 18:56:52 * ljp still waiting shipment even though CC has been billed two weeks ago Oct 02 18:57:17 daMaestro: Finally some progress I think.. Managed my first call in a month with the neo using the stock OM build about 2h ago Oct 02 18:57:29 oh wow. nice. Oct 02 18:57:42 Had to restart X once though for it to boot up correctly, and something is messed up with the call history Oct 02 18:57:45 i made calls almost right away.. but had to deal with alsa Oct 02 18:58:02 CM, i'm showing it off on campus tomorrow Oct 02 18:58:09 Ah, ok :) Oct 02 18:58:43 aka, open source users found out i'm a developer when i jumped into a conversation about RockBox and iPodLinux firmware Oct 02 18:59:08 is the whole binary in the Neo, as source code available to download and compile? Oct 02 18:59:17 edu, yes Oct 02 19:01:17 edu, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Application_Development_Crash_Course http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Building_OpenMoko_from_scratch Oct 02 19:07:15 http://www.linux.com/feature/119429 Oct 02 19:10:47 sup: svn: Can't connect to host 'svn.berlios.de': Connection refused Oct 02 19:10:48 ? Oct 02 19:11:07 berlios is often down.. Not reliable at all Oct 02 19:11:32 damnit Oct 02 19:12:14 Hmm.. I can browse websvn now though Oct 02 19:14:41 thos: ping Oct 02 19:15:25 quicksand: 20:46 -!- thos [n=thomas@88-96-30-67.dsl.zen.co.uk] has quit ["Leaving."] Oct 02 19:15:34 ah, thanks Oct 02 19:15:54 Just wanted to pass along my compliments on the new gtk theme and engine. Oct 02 19:16:09 there's just been a christmas advert on tv Oct 02 19:16:20 It's quite a bit snappier, and things (e.g. comboboxes) aren't quite so ginormous anymore. Nice to use. Oct 02 19:17:17 The file selection dialog is actually usable now! Oct 02 19:19:56 is an http browser included in the neo? Oct 02 19:20:35 edu: midori and openmoko-browser Oct 02 19:22:33 They're still not in the image by default though.. Oct 02 19:23:48 easy to install tho' .. Oct 02 19:33:03 http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8294545513.html wtf would you need virtualization on neo Oct 02 19:33:51 run openmoko and qtopia at the same time? Oct 02 19:34:25 you can do that without virtualisation... Oct 02 19:34:30 or should be able to, anyway Oct 02 19:35:31 virtualization is trendy Oct 02 19:35:35 then again, you could run the proprietary gllin in a vm, thus alleviating paranoid fears ;) Oct 02 19:35:53 i can't think of a good use for it on arm, but its nice to have such developments ongoing with non-intel architectures, anyway .. Oct 02 19:37:04 oh nice L4 on the neo Oct 02 19:37:09 next step: ngHurd ! Oct 02 19:38:10 ibm mainframes have been doing it for decades, so you have non intel architectures pioneering it, even Oct 02 19:38:40 buz_: it's not so much virtualization as running multiple instances of the l4linux server on top of a properly designed kernel Oct 02 19:38:41 i know that but its not a consumer-grade thing when you talk about power arch virtualization Oct 02 19:39:29 there's no need for something like virtual image virtualization in the magical L4 land where all the kernel does is handle IPC and give people physical memory Oct 02 19:45:05 Hi Oct 02 19:45:24 Is there for avoiding this error Oct 02 19:45:33 when trying make update Oct 02 19:45:41 svn: Can't connect to host 'svn.berlios.de': Connection refused Oct 02 19:45:44 ??? Oct 02 19:45:44 zilux`: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1, SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully these links answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) Oct 02 19:46:25 zilux`: berlios seems to go down quite a bit ... Oct 02 19:47:03 is it possible to download from the openmoko mirrors? Oct 02 19:47:51 if you could get qtopia compiled against x11, you could run openmoko and qtopia at the same time Oct 02 19:49:10 ljp: Would it work having two gsm daemons running at the same time against the same modem? Oct 02 19:49:30 qtopia doesnt use gsmd Oct 02 19:50:02 No, but it must use something Oct 02 19:50:04 but other than modem access, it would be the screen/framebuffer access thatst he problem Oct 02 19:50:05 yeah. If it did, it would probably be easier to have them running at the same time. You know, assuming working gsmd :] Oct 02 19:50:25 * CM nods Oct 02 20:44:35 moin Oct 02 20:44:48 * hhf423 looks around Oct 02 20:47:54 You lookin' at me? YOU LOOKIN AT ME? Oct 02 20:48:46 ~fish quicksand Oct 02 20:48:47 * apt slaps quicksand around with a large trout Oct 02 20:49:00 hahaha Oct 02 20:49:06 Mmmm, fish. Oct 02 20:49:22 so, any news on anything neo related? Oct 02 20:49:53 I dunno. If you haven't tried the new gtk+ theme engine yet, I recommend it. Oct 02 20:50:01 'new' Oct 02 20:50:09 doesn't look like anything significant, from the recent wiki changes Oct 02 20:50:09 you mean .2 ? Oct 02 20:51:02 * ScaredyCat is still compiling from earlier today :( Oct 02 20:51:16 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] Oct 02 20:51:26 It's a few days old -- newer than .2. See Thomas Wood's post on planet. Package is . . . let's see here . . . moko-gtk-engine. Oct 02 20:51:41 There was a lot of updated today Oct 02 20:51:41 It's not built by default. Oct 02 20:51:59 s/ted/tes/ Oct 02 20:52:00 CM meant: There was a lot of updates today Oct 02 20:52:13 quicksand: but that's on the top... the work needs to be done underneath Oct 02 20:52:25 what kind of updates? GUI or also gsmd even? Oct 02 20:52:44 I think mostly the dialer, but also more patches Oct 02 20:52:50 ScaredyCat: I'm sure that's true . . . but it is an improvement. It's faster because of fewer (no?) pixmap scaling. Oct 02 20:52:52 calling worked out of the box from my build today Oct 02 20:53:03 And widget proportions seem a bit more appropriate. Oct 02 20:53:07 on om cm ? Oct 02 20:53:23 ScaredyCat: Yes Oct 02 20:53:38 quicksand: yes still small... need bigger buttons or a bigger screen Oct 02 20:53:43 Oct 02 20:54:01 The dropdown menues don't work so well with fingers Oct 02 20:54:10 And they're usually too long in the games for example Oct 02 20:54:11 1853 of 4693 Oct 02 20:54:16 ScaredyCat: I agree -- for finger operations we need big finger buttons. For stylus-oriented stuff, smaller is good. Oct 02 20:54:27 seems to be taking forever x 3 Oct 02 20:54:27 ScaredyCat: Heh, only 5h to go or so then.. Oct 02 20:54:39 it's been running all day CM Oct 02 20:54:46 ScaredyCat: uicmoc4 still failed for me Oct 02 20:55:00 And I think that's around 1986 or so Oct 02 20:55:24 Tried to flash qemu today though, but that didn't work at all Oct 02 20:55:36 also the number keys need to be on right for right - handed people to minimize thumb extention (IMHO) Oct 02 20:55:38 Same u-boot problem as eveyone else seems to have Oct 02 20:55:53 native? Oct 02 20:55:57 Writchi1: Good point Oct 02 20:55:59 naive! Oct 02 20:56:07 has anybody in here tried the "undocumented" at commands? Oct 02 20:56:10 ScaredyCat: No, arm qemu image Oct 02 20:56:31 what number keys ? Oct 02 20:56:38 LittleIdiot: which ones - the documented or undocumented undocumented commands? Oct 02 20:56:39 ...or can anyone of the ones who have signed the nda tell me if some of them may brick the modem Oct 02 20:56:39 ahh I don't build qemu Oct 02 20:56:56 Writchi1: ti's commands Oct 02 20:57:06 ScaredyCat: Me neither, just tried today because many seem to have trouble with it Oct 02 20:57:15 LittleIdito: there is little danger of damaging the modem Oct 02 20:57:41 certain engineering mode commands could put it in a funky state, however, which should be recoverable by a power cycle Oct 02 20:57:48 ok, then i'll try out and document them ;) Oct 02 20:57:50 i've tried a lot and yet to have it fail Oct 02 20:57:52 I guess you only really need qemu if you're waiting for a neo Oct 02 20:58:14 Writchi1, try find the at command that will give it HSDPA :) Oct 02 20:58:36 ScaredyCat: Any_Key is testing a lot of stuff only using qemu Oct 02 20:58:39 AT@NOWAY Oct 02 20:58:45 at+domagic Oct 02 20:59:03 AT&T=suck Oct 02 20:59:06 ScaredyCat: He's in russia and can't affort a Neo. Didn't think he could get one through customs anyway even if he could Oct 02 20:59:27 not unless you swallowed it CM ;)))) Oct 02 20:59:28 AT@PROMISCIOUSMODE, but i don't think that'll happen ;) Oct 02 20:59:41 did you see the terms of the new At&t service agreement - thou shalt not badmouth ma bell Oct 02 21:00:01 yeah... well... Oct 02 21:00:08 that says it all really Oct 02 21:00:14 Writchi1: whut? Oct 02 21:00:37 and you probably should not hack the iphone, hehe Oct 02 21:00:53 they are in competition with Sprint to who can be the biggest bell shaped head Oct 02 21:02:24 wtf is thumtribes? Oct 02 21:03:24 http://chicken.wiki.br/thumbtribes Oct 02 21:04:43 mmm.... Oct 02 21:05:27 ScaredyCat: Whatch the video thos posted Oct 02 21:05:58 ScaredyCat: cool tool Oct 02 21:06:08 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ambe5dPz3-A Oct 02 21:06:25 sounds like a tool for under 25's to me Oct 02 21:08:25 ScaredyCat: mmm probably the utility factor for the 40 years zone is not so huge Oct 02 21:08:29 not a new concept Oct 02 21:08:49 he ljp Oct 02 21:08:57 hi Oct 02 21:09:25 yeah, i don;t think I want any weirdo getting my info... Oct 02 21:09:35 hey ljp... Oct 02 21:09:49 ^^^ not related to previous comment Oct 02 21:09:57 CM: but the keyboard in the video posted is not so new... Oct 02 21:10:11 Not working so good either.. Oct 02 21:12:11 which version of OM keyboard software should be in the video? Oct 02 21:12:18 OM 2007.1? Oct 02 21:15:46 hi all Oct 02 21:20:28 hi daltona Oct 02 22:25:49 hello Oct 02 22:25:59 anybody alive? Oct 02 22:26:12 I ask because I have 0:25 CET Oct 02 22:26:52 I want to ask how to enter USB-host mode Oct 02 22:26:58 anybody knows it? Oct 02 22:27:51 I guess all went sleep Oct 02 22:28:01 I'll do the same and ask tomorrow Oct 02 22:28:30 impatient guy... Oct 02 22:29:32 * mwester never sleeps. Oct 02 22:29:41 * mwester is very, very tired by now... Oct 02 22:34:25 hell moko monkeys Oct 02 22:34:32 okay so this month the 1973 goes on sale? Oct 02 22:34:42 No. Oct 02 22:34:50 * SpeedEvil points holycow to the topic Oct 02 22:34:56 oops! Oct 02 22:35:05 Basically december. Oct 02 22:35:12 aha, coolness Oct 02 22:35:34 * ljp is waiting for shipment Oct 02 22:35:47 how is everyone digging their developer versions? Oct 02 22:37:00 I'm about to start making an accelerometer and battery monitor board for it tomorrow - designing the PBC Oct 02 22:37:02 diggin good Oct 02 22:37:03 PCB Oct 02 22:38:09 neato Oct 02 22:39:54 * daltona advertise developments ongoing in the mokostats project Oct 02 22:41:05 * daltona added some kind of first try to create a cellid <-> location database building feature Oct 03 00:52:16 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_San_Francisco]] Oct 03 01:19:39 <3 Oct 03 01:19:47 what ipkg repository do I need for perl? is there a repo that automagically combines a lot of others into one? Oct 03 01:24:07 when will openmoko start? Oct 03 01:24:20 * Bish wants to hold it in his hands Oct 03 01:24:50 openmoko is the software, neo1973 is the hardware Oct 03 01:25:15 .. yeah exact like evry linuxuser.. Oct 03 01:25:24 okaay. when will the phase 2 of neo1973 start? Oct 03 01:25:30 Dec Oct 03 01:25:45 thats quite cool , as present Oct 03 01:25:48 <3 Oct 03 01:25:51 thank u Oct 03 01:25:58 what ipkg repository do I need for perl? is there a repo that automagically combines a lot of others into one? Oct 03 01:26:15 sry for double posting... :-/ Oct 03 01:27:00 i tried the repos of ScaredyCat and Marcel_M and searched the others but I couldn't find perl Oct 03 01:27:05 sorry for posting nonsense Oct 03 01:28:41 Bish: it's okay, we're used to it :) Oct 03 01:31:35 i believe that :D Oct 03 01:31:43 i just want to have this freakin genius linux phone ! Oct 03 01:32:59 i even dont have 600 usd .. but i will rob a bank or somethin Oct 03 01:33:31 exec genlop -c Oct 03 01:33:42 if you just want to have it, you certainly won't need the aadvaced kit, so you'd only need 450 usd :P Oct 03 01:34:09 yeah but i already see me with broken uboot Oct 03 01:34:28 so i need the advanced kit :D , and i want to code, for sure Oct 03 01:34:55 with the GTA02 I think you won't really need the debug board even to reflash uboot I think... Oct 03 01:34:56 ok, thats no argument Oct 03 01:35:16 for what exactly i will need the advanced kit? Oct 03 01:35:24 and there's people with debug boards that will debrick phones on request anyway Oct 03 01:35:26 and what about the great openmoko bag? Oct 03 01:35:35 cjb_ie: for money, yay Oct 03 01:35:38 UPS both ways and you have it back in a couple of days Oct 03 01:35:52 with the GTA01 (the current version) you need it if you break uboot, but the GTA02 will have some built in recovery stuff I think... Oct 03 01:35:55 what will it cost to ship a gta02 to germany :D Oct 03 01:35:57 Bish: not necessarily Oct 03 01:36:09 so you'd only need the debug board to do some pretty low level debugging/hacking Oct 03 01:36:39 hm , i would like to learn asm so i dont know if i will need it Oct 03 01:42:21 yeah u got me know i will buy the standard package Oct 03 02:19:44 ATT SUCKS! Oct 03 02:40:43 http://blog.janik.cz//images/OOXMLSpec.png Oct 03 02:40:56 thats the ooxml specification printed Oct 03 02:41:00 (each of this books) Oct 03 02:41:01 omg Oct 03 02:42:41 hmm... that must be some thin paper.... the version a friend of my got was 40cm.... Oct 03 02:42:48 :D Oct 03 02:51:36 (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Buying_Interest_List]] **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Oct 03 02:59:56 2007