**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 04 02:59:57 2008
Oct 04 04:19:27 <slaxxin> my fdom doesnt show friends on tango
Oct 04 06:45:18 <deever> anyone here with qtopia on openmoko and working suspend?
Oct 04 06:45:49 <graaff> deever: define "working" 
Oct 04 06:45:58 <graaff> It does seem to work for me to some extend
Oct 04 06:46:33 <deever> graaff: so that it doesn't show only a white screen anymore on wakeup
Oct 04 06:46:52 <graaff> No, wakes up fine when I press the power button briefly
Oct 04 06:48:16 <deever> and if you let it lock the keys (in homescreen option), can you unlock it again?
Oct 04 06:49:35 <graaff> I'm not sure what lock function you mean (only got the phone this week)
Oct 04 06:54:53 <lpotter> screenlock? or pin lock?
Oct 04 06:55:15 <deever> graaff: in Settings/Homescreen,Idle you can lock the keys, on display off f.e.
Oct 04 06:55:43 <deever> lpotter: neither one. key lock! ;)
Oct 04 06:57:00 <graaff> I don't seem to have the Homescreen option in Settings...
Oct 04 06:57:24 <deever> graaff: do you have qtopia at all? ;)
Oct 04 06:57:30 <graaff> Yes
Oct 04 06:57:54 <graaff> I think so, at least, flashed the Om2008.9 image when the phone arrived, that has Qtopia, right?
Oct 04 06:58:16 <deever> lol
Oct 04 06:58:31 <deever> i mean qtopia from trolltech
Oct 04 06:58:42 <raster> qtopia in 2008.x only uses some of the apps built into qpe
Oct 04 06:58:45 <graaff> Ah, that isn't the same thing?
Oct 04 06:58:46 <raster> like dialler, contacts and sms
Oct 04 06:58:48 <raster> nothing else
Oct 04 06:58:51 <raster> so no home screen etc.
Oct 04 06:58:55 * graaff 's newbie status is quickly revealed
Oct 04 06:59:00 <raster> its dfefinitely not the same stuff
Oct 04 07:00:39 <lpotter> ya, what he said. its not even qtopia
Oct 04 07:01:13 <Shlee> The uptime on this new release seems to lower..
Oct 04 07:01:19 <graaff> I guess I was confused since the package names in the installer mention qtopia
Oct 04 07:01:29 <Shlee> but I'm generally happy with it. apart from the sms cloning issue (and other bugs)
Oct 04 07:01:33 <lpotter> yep. easy to get confused
Oct 04 07:01:43 <lpotter> even OM is confused about it
Oct 04 07:02:42 <deever> graaff: i mean this one http://qtextended.org/modules/devices/openmoko.php
Oct 04 07:03:04 <graaff> deever: as you've guessed by now I don't have any experience with that. :_)
Oct 04 07:03:17 <deever> ok! ;)
Oct 04 07:03:50 <deever> but suspend now seems to work after reflashing...:o
Oct 04 07:04:51 <jitu3485> anyone tried zhone and fso image on fedora, is it working? which version of fedora if yes
Oct 04 07:05:27 <Toriku1> what about android
Oct 04 07:06:21 <jitu3485> that is also good
Oct 04 07:13:13 <lpotter> deever: thats not even qtopia either! :)
Oct 04 07:13:29 <deever> lpotter: ?
Oct 04 07:13:44 <lpotter> thats qt extended 
Oct 04 07:14:00 <deever> how ever...;)
Oct 04 07:14:05 <lpotter> hehehhe
Oct 04 07:16:52 <sigius> deever: disregarding suspend,  how do you like it ?
Oct 04 07:17:09 <raster> lpotter:  whats qtexetended vs qtopia?
Oct 04 07:17:59 <sigius> same thing, new name i think
Oct 04 07:18:16 <lpotter> qtopia is 4.3.x qt extended is 4.4.1 :)
Oct 04 07:18:25 <lpotter> plus new copyright headers
Oct 04 07:18:33 <raster> but its the same thing renamed?>
Oct 04 07:18:38 <lpotter> and new features
Oct 04 07:18:41 <raster> (sure
Oct 04 07:18:46 <raster> so its qtopia 4.4.1
Oct 04 07:18:50 <raster> but ... with a rename
Oct 04 07:18:51 <raster> etc.
Oct 04 07:19:01 <raster> ie next thing in the development line
Oct 04 07:19:03 <lpotter> yes. it was qtopia 4.4.0 release and then qt extended 4.4.1
Oct 04 07:19:08 <raster> qtopia stops with 4.3.1
Oct 04 07:19:15 <raster> err
Oct 04 07:19:18 <raster> 4.4.0 then
Oct 04 07:19:19 <raster> ?
Oct 04 07:19:20 <lpotter> well. officially it was 4.4.0
Oct 04 07:19:30 <lpotter> commercial release only .. touted as beta :)
Oct 04 07:19:45 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: 03mickey 07framework * r068eb4ac1e2d 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/modems/abstract/ (mediator.py modem.py): ogsmd: fix enabling direct SMS sending. Todo: add unsolicited handler for CMT
Oct 04 07:19:57 <raster> will there in future be qtopia AND qtex releses
Oct 04 07:20:00 <raster> ie now 2 products
Oct 04 07:20:09 <raster> or it has moved qtopi a-> qtex ?
Oct 04 07:20:13 <raster> :)
Oct 04 07:21:57 <deever> ah, now again! :(
Oct 04 07:22:59 <deever> the white screen, when i press the power butten (wake up)
Oct 04 07:25:02 <deever> really noone else having this?
Oct 04 07:25:50 <Shlee> Any advantage over the download.openmoko nightly kernel over the mwesters compiles?
Oct 04 07:28:58 <graaff> Hmm, there is no way for opkg to tell what packages it wants to upgrade before actually doing so?
Oct 04 07:29:20 <graaff> Also, where to file bugs for opkg?
Oct 04 07:34:11 <deever> there is also an open ticket: http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1841
Oct 04 07:34:21 <lpotter> raster: I think qtopia is in the past 
Oct 04 07:38:26 <raster> lpotter:  gotcha. so qtex (formerly known as qtopia)...
Oct 04 07:38:32 <raster> (qtextended)
Oct 04 07:45:06 <sylar91> hi, how could I compile a c file from openmoko via ssh?
Oct 04 07:46:41 <deever> sylar91: "a c file from openmoko"?
Oct 04 07:47:04 <sylar91> yes, I want to make "gcc file.c" and compile it
Oct 04 07:47:51 <deever> and what has this to do with openmoko?
Oct 04 07:48:06 <sylar91> that I want to make it on my openmoko device
Oct 04 07:48:13 <malik1972> raster: nice image
Oct 04 07:48:53 <deever> sylar91: install gcc on the device?
Oct 04 07:49:27 <raster> malik1972: bootilicious?
Oct 04 07:49:32 <sylar91> I installed it... but I get an error
Oct 04 07:50:22 <deever> well, is my problem hardware-related? do i have to send back the device?
Oct 04 07:50:25 <malik1972> raster: your "new" gui
Oct 04 07:50:35 <raster> yes
Oct 04 07:50:39 <raster> but does it have booty?
Oct 04 07:50:40 <raster> :)
Oct 04 07:50:49 <malik1972> sure
Oct 04 07:50:58 <malik1972> you mean the "e"?
Oct 04 07:51:27 <malik1972> no boots
Oct 04 07:51:35 <malik1972> now i understand
Oct 04 07:51:46 <malik1972> it has a golden "e"
Oct 04 07:52:39 <sylar91> I get this error cc: error trying to exec 'cc1': execvp: No such file or directory
Oct 04 07:52:40 <sylar91> , why?
Oct 04 07:53:32 <deever> sylar91: probably because this file doesn't exist?
Oct 04 07:53:53 <sylar91> yes but the file is in what package?
Oct 04 07:53:59 <sylar91> how can I fix it?
Oct 04 07:54:24 <malik1972> raster: are there any plans or a time horizon for integration of your ui to fso?
Oct 04 07:55:12 <deever> sylar91: wouldn't be better off cross-compiling?
Oct 04 07:55:40 <sylar91> it is easier and faster to compile directly on the device
Oct 04 07:56:04 <deever> sylar91: i can't imagine an advantage of compiling directly on the device!
Oct 04 07:56:10 <deever> sylar91: false
Oct 04 07:56:32 <sylar91> how can I crosscompile easily?
Oct 04 07:56:35 <parodyoflanguage> deever: Being able to compile while away from the computer?
Oct 04 07:56:42 <raster> malik1972:  golden e?
Oct 04 07:57:00 <raster> no i means booty
Oct 04 07:57:02 <raster> as in booty
Oct 04 07:57:03 <raster> umm..
Oct 04 07:57:32 <deever> parodyoflanguage: well, if you want this? ;)
Oct 04 07:57:34 <raster> just put that into google image search
Oct 04 07:57:35 <raster> and see
Oct 04 07:57:39 <malik1972> had to look it up
Oct 04 07:57:55 <sylar91> how can I compile for armv4 from x86?
Oct 04 07:58:15 <deever> parodyoflanguage: btw, do you also have this wsod problem?
Oct 04 07:58:25 <parodyoflanguage> wsod?
Oct 04 07:58:26 <deever> http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1841
Oct 04 07:58:27 <raster> fso - once fso behaves. and i have a replacement for zhone (the python gui).
Oct 04 07:58:31 <malik1972> raster: i see a lot of nacked women;-)
Oct 04 07:58:45 <malik1972> raster: i missed them in you image
Oct 04 07:58:51 <malik1972> hehe
Oct 04 07:58:59 <deever> sylar91: read the docs on openmoko.org
Oct 04 07:59:28 <parodyoflanguage> deever: I don't yet own a neo :)
Oct 04 07:59:42 <malik1972> raster: i guess you mean the black boots, there are no boots, i saw a golden e (the one from e17) while booting
Oct 04 07:59:43 <raster> malik1972:  i was implying "does it look sexy"?
Oct 04 07:59:44 <raster> ir good
Oct 04 07:59:55 <malik1972> raster: aaaah:-)
Oct 04 07:59:55 <raster> therer should be no golden e
Oct 04 07:59:56 <raster> at all
Oct 04 07:59:58 <raster> zero
Oct 04 08:00:03 <raster> if u used the image i made
Oct 04 08:00:12 <malik1972> its a zero, okay:-)
Oct 04 08:00:44 <malik1972> raster: yes, its sexy enough, polished
Oct 04 08:00:59 <malik1972> raster: and it looks "from one hand"
Oct 04 08:01:40 <raster> "from one hand" ?
Oct 04 08:01:48 <raster> and no
Oct 04 08:01:50 <raster> not that polished
Oct 04 08:01:53 <raster> needs much more work
Oct 04 08:01:55 <parodyoflanguage> Is that a reference to masturbation?
Oct 04 08:01:57 <raster> i only shiop 3 apps
Oct 04 08:02:07 <raster> gpe-scap so i have somethnig to screenshot easily with
Oct 04 08:02:10 <raster> terminal for just testing
Oct 04 08:02:19 <raster> and alarm whihc is testign out a new mobile-ui-toolkit
Oct 04 08:04:11 <deever> anyone else here with #1841: "white screen of death (WSOD) after resume"?
Oct 04 08:05:23 <malik1972> deever: only once in about 3 months
Oct 04 08:06:25 <deever> malik1972: i mean each time on resume
Oct 04 08:06:39 <malik1972> deever: ohhh!
Oct 04 08:06:50 <malik1972> deever: which distro?
Oct 04 08:06:51 <deever> miip: yes! ;)
Oct 04 08:06:56 <deever> qtopia
Oct 04 08:07:08 <malik1972> deever: you mean trolltechs stuff
Oct 04 08:07:20 <deever> s/miip/malik1972/ ;)
Oct 04 08:07:38 <malik1972> deever: or the images from om?
Oct 04 08:07:49 <deever> malik1972: well, qtopia 4.3.3
Oct 04 08:08:53 <malik1972> deever: i think this behaviour depends on the neo used, many people do not have the problem
Oct 04 08:09:18 <malik1972> deever: every suspend gives you a wsod? thats hardcore
Oct 04 08:14:30 <malik1972> raster: but its promising, superior to the one from om 
Oct 04 08:17:55 <raster> malik1972: i'd hope so!
Oct 04 08:17:56 <raster> :)
Oct 04 08:18:13 <raster> no phone stuff yet as 1. zhone/frameworkd dont even work for me
Oct 04 08:18:17 <raster> i cant make/recieve calls
Oct 04 08:18:26 <raster> also its all in flux
Oct 04 08:18:34 <raster> and right now i want to focus on doing the core ui and making that better
Oct 04 08:18:41 <raster> and that has zero to do with phone stuff
Oct 04 08:18:42 <raster> :)
Oct 04 08:18:50 <raster> just general embedded touchscreen ui stuff
Oct 04 08:21:39 <Shlee> FSO is a massive work-in-progress... once everything is set out in python, I assume moving to c is planned?
Oct 04 08:23:42 <raster> dunno
Oct 04 08:23:48 <raster> i kind of would think so in the long run
Oct 04 08:23:56 <raster> i know that i will eventually do a C gui for it
Oct 04 08:24:17 <raster> i am currently putting together an efl widget set specifically devoted to doing touchscreen/phone ui's
Oct 04 08:34:43 <Shlee> can I fix the 20ish splash-write errors on boot?
Oct 04 08:35:02 <deever> malik1972: yes, "hardcore" is a good word for it! :)
Oct 04 08:55:36 <Shlee> bah QT 4.4 keeps crashing on the contact list
Oct 04 08:57:58 <sylar91> hi, with the toolchain I get this error libtool: link: cannot find the library `/space/fic/openmoko-daily/neo1973/work/armv4t-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/pango-1.18.3-r0/pango-1.18.3/pango/libpangoft2-1.0.la' or unhandled argument `/space/fic/openmoko-daily/neo1973/work/armv4t-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/pango-1.18.3-r0/pango-1.18.3/pango/libpangoft2-1.0.la' , how can I resolve?
Oct 04 08:59:03 <malik1972> Shlee: nice! i have also problems, there is no phone book anymore
Oct 04 08:59:37 <malik1972> Shlee: you should make pressure on the responsibles;-)
Oct 04 09:03:20 <Shlee> o_0
Oct 04 09:04:40 <[df]> hmm, maybe I'll wait a bit before installing 4.4
Oct 04 09:05:24 <[df]> why's it called 'qt extended' now anyway?
Oct 04 09:06:01 <moo---> nokia marketing droids had to be feeded?
Oct 04 09:06:21 <[df]> heh
Oct 04 09:22:12 <IOhannes> can anybody tell me how i can control the volume of the outgoing and incoming signals of a phone call?
Oct 04 09:22:35 <IOhannes> i don't understand the 50 (or more) controls in the alsamixer
Oct 04 09:36:00 <ieatlint> wow... oj simpson guilty
Oct 04 09:36:10 <lpotter> they wanted to emphasize 'Qt'
Oct 04 09:36:15 <ieatlint> and, the verdict comes 13 years to the day after he was aquitted for murder
Oct 04 09:36:22 <ieatlint> nice coincidence
Oct 04 09:36:57 <raster> should rename it busu!
Oct 04 09:37:00 <ieatlint> i'm sure the goldman family is celebrating
Oct 04 09:38:49 <ieatlint> heh, and i've just learnt that on november 4th, i'm supposed to vote on 35 different things, including the presidency... direct democracy sucks :(
Oct 04 09:39:38 <lpotter> except you aren't really voting directly for the president
Oct 04 09:40:05 <ieatlint> true, but this year that benefits my candidte, so it doesn't upset me (don't politics rule?)
Oct 04 09:40:14 <lpotter> US isnt a democracy. its a republic
Oct 04 09:41:20 <ieatlint> nothing says democracy like obama winning in polls by 9%, but in the same polls, winning by a 19% margin in elecoral votes
Oct 04 09:41:49 <ieatlint> the logic of course is the same as the EU
Oct 04 09:42:24 <ieatlint> a state votes one way; a country votes one way... the principles are identical
Oct 04 09:43:33 <ieatlint> anyway, california has direct democracy... and 34 of thethings are specific to where i live, and NO ONE has enough free time to go through over 500 pages of voter pamphlets (no kidding) ad make an "informed" decision
Oct 04 10:07:30 <exco> Is it known if building on Ubuntu 8.10 works?
Oct 04 10:19:55 <buffoon> Hi! I have a non working (new) SIM Card from Vodafone (Italy). It works on another Cellphone so the SIM should be fine.Are there any things I can try to get it working or does it just not work
Oct 04 10:20:21 <buffoon> I have to insert the PIN always 2 times and then i get "Network Registration denied" on QTopia 4.3
Oct 04 10:22:46 <max_posedon> buffoon, I think you should begin from installing QTopia 4.4
Oct 04 10:23:03 <max_posedon> (actualy QtExtended 4.4)
Oct 04 10:23:06 <Kensan> raster: ping
Oct 04 10:23:14 <raster> PONG!
Oct 04 10:23:33 <leinir> Dayum, that's some heavy duty pongin' there! ;)
Oct 04 10:24:05 <Kensan> raster: oh there you are :) Didn't expect you to answer so quickly since you must be busy. Talked to Thomas last night. Good stuff! :)
Oct 04 10:24:24 <raster> aaha u did speak with thomas?
Oct 04 10:24:31 <Kensan> raster: did you read my msgs from yesterday, about your scripts?
Oct 04 10:24:37 <raster> hmm no
Oct 04 10:24:38 <raster> i was off
Oct 04 10:24:41 <Kensan> raster: yes.
Oct 04 10:24:47 <raster> drinking beer for about 12 hours
Oct 04 10:24:51 <raster> and eating
Oct 04 10:24:59 <raster> back to work now though
Oct 04 10:25:03 <Kensan> raster: right. and I was led to believe you were busy working ;)
Oct 04 10:25:13 <raster> HAHAHHAHAHAHA
Oct 04 10:25:16 <raster> i am now
Oct 04 10:25:18 <raster> saturday
Oct 04 10:25:23 <raster> and tomorrow too :)
Oct 04 10:25:29 <raster> and tonight (saturday night)
Oct 04 10:25:32 <Kensan> raster: You aussies and your barbeques, one fridge for the meat, one fridge for the beer.
Oct 04 10:25:36 <raster> i need to do some surgery to elementary
Oct 04 10:26:15 <buffoon> max_posedon: is there a ready to use rootfs and kernel image? i didn't find it until now
Oct 04 10:26:17 <Kensan> raster: The scripts are not working, because the var OMDIR is not set when local.conf is processed.
Oct 04 10:26:42 <Kensan> raster: btw, Thomas was showing of the illume image and the alarm clock etc. Everybody was migthy impressed ;)
Oct 04 10:26:50 <max_posedon> buffoon, yes.
Oct 04 10:27:10 <raster> Kensan:  how can it not be set?
Oct 04 10:27:22 <raster> Kensan:  aaah they have mov ed to use the image...
Oct 04 10:27:29 <raster> i made the illume image for them actiually
Oct 04 10:27:32 <raster> well partly
Oct 04 10:27:43 <raster> because it means the look of the alarm app (and elementary) match illume and everything else
Oct 04 10:27:47 <raster> so it all looks consistent and nice
Oct 04 10:27:54 <raster> its also a "small" image to work on
Oct 04 10:27:58 <raster> with very little extra in it
Oct 04 10:27:58 <Kensan> raster: I don't know but it seems, that eventhough it's exported in setup-env it is not being processed by bitbake once local.conf is read in.
Oct 04 10:28:12 <raster> thats odd
Oct 04 10:28:15 <raster> it is for me
Oct 04 10:28:33 <Kensan> raster: I added something like OMDIR="path/to/foo" at the top of local.conf and it ran!
Oct 04 10:28:38 <Kensan> raster: very confusing.
Oct 04 10:29:17 <Kensan> raster: It might be, that he simply flashed the illume image to show off at the moko party last night.
Oct 04 10:30:18 <Kensan> raster: Of course I had that image flashed to and I also showed it around a bit. People dig it! Especially because it feels very responsive and looks sexy.
Oct 04 10:30:30 <Kensan> raster: it's just missing a boobsplash *harrharr*
Oct 04 10:31:20 <raster> Kensan:  that is bizarre
Oct 04 10:31:22 <raster> totally
Oct 04 10:31:28 <raster> for me - it works. it evals properly
Oct 04 10:32:09 <raster> Kensan: hmm well i did tell thomas about the im,mume image and that i made it for them so its easy to work/test/demo the stuff
Oct 04 10:32:13 <raster> to save them time and effort
Oct 04 10:32:22 <raster> and make it easy for me to know what the "base platform" is
Oct 04 10:32:25 <Kensan> raster: it's AWESOME
Oct 04 10:32:30 <raster> i will suck in FSO over time as needed
Oct 04 10:32:34 <raster> thats trivial to do
Oct 04 10:32:45 <raster> FSO packages are just commented out in illume-image.bb
Oct 04 10:33:04 <raster> and bootsplash - i dont touch any splash stuff until kernel is up and kicking
Oct 04 10:33:06 <Kensan> raster: seriously, it has a very natural feel to it and as I said it's very responsive + eyecandy.
Oct 04 10:33:16 <raster> in fact... not entirely sure how to "package" that
Oct 04 10:33:23 <ieatlint> well... bravo raster... the #1 issue with fso has been a lack of UI designers
Oct 04 10:33:35 <raster> i probably should make a flahs image file that i flahs onto the splash partition
Oct 04 10:33:50 <Kensan> raster: yup
Oct 04 10:33:53 <ieatlint> i design UIs worse than the fso team myself, so i'm glad to see someone competent with them has taken some interest :)
Oct 04 10:34:13 <Kensan> raster: well you could give me a picture and I would do the splash img stuff.
Oct 04 10:34:43 <Kensan> raster: you have more interesting stuff to do I believe ;)
Oct 04 10:35:37 <john> Mornin' raster.
Oct 04 10:36:10 <Kensan> raster: hm... what bitbake version do you use? Maybe they just had a change as of late that changes the evaluation of ENV vars when local.conf is being processed...
Oct 04 10:37:00 <Kensan> raster: from the svn log r1090: "bin/bitbake: Add better environmental variable handling."
Oct 04 10:37:06 <Kensan> raster: that was 30/09
Oct 04 10:38:24 <Kensan> raster: I just looked at the diff, it is the cause actually.
Oct 04 10:38:38 <Kensan> raster: only specific env vars are accepted now.
Oct 04 10:40:13 <Kensan> raster: I just verfied it.
Oct 04 10:40:38 <raster> Kensan: hmm an image.
Oct 04 10:40:49 <raster> i can probably brew something up...
Oct 04 10:40:57 <raster> john:  boo
Oct 04 10:40:59 <ieatlint> raster, is "soft" australian licorice purely an export, or is it actually a common local candy?
Oct 04 10:41:19 <ieatlint> (that will be the most important question posed all week -- trust me)
Oct 04 10:41:53 <Kensan> raster: where should I send patches? ;)
Oct 04 10:42:07 <raster> Kensan:  i swear i tried a clean checkout of bitbake and all
Oct 04 10:42:17 <raster> ok
Oct 04 10:42:25 <raster> my current tree is at 1078...
Oct 04 10:42:37 <raster> aha
Oct 04 10:42:38 <raster> damnit
Oct 04 10:42:44 <raster> btibake b0rked me upssors!
Oct 04 10:43:22 <Kensan> raster: I'll send patch, but to which address?
Oct 04 10:44:08 <Kensan> raster: btw, patch 0011 is not needed anymore, it got fixed upstream.
Oct 04 10:44:50 <Kensan> raster: and patch 0010 does not apply either.
Oct 04 10:44:58 <Kensan> s/either/anymore/
Oct 04 10:44:59 <apt> Kensan meant: raster: and patch 0010 does not apply anymore.
Oct 04 10:46:28 <sigius> Hi, does anyone have an impression of what the respective sizes are of the userbases of the different distributions ? Is there maybe a recent poll somewhere online?
Oct 04 10:46:50 <Zorkman> that would be a nice poll
Oct 04 10:48:17 <Zorkman> anybody tried qtopia extended 4.4?
Oct 04 10:48:35 <leinir> Yup, works really nicely :)
Oct 04 10:49:12 <Kensan> raster: you've got mail.
Oct 04 10:50:39 <Kensan> raster: about the uboot splash pic: it should be (480x640) 8 color.
Oct 04 10:51:05 <john> How functional is qt ext4.4?
Oct 04 10:52:12 <john> I'm still usin' 2007 cause it just works for me. I've got FSO on SD but I can't even SMS with it.
Oct 04 10:52:55 <john> But I kinda like QT. It's what I want to learn to program in.
Oct 04 10:58:36 <leinir> It works really well - there's a bug or five, absolutely, but it's really neat in general :)
Oct 04 10:59:53 <john> I don't mind a few bugs, as long as I can get general use as a phone, with text, wifi and terminal.
Oct 04 11:00:37 <leinir> Wifi is dodgy, but that's a general thing :)
Oct 04 11:05:20 <john> Mine works fine at home, almost on top of my wifi router, but not very well at work. But most people find the work wifi dodgy at best anyway.
Oct 04 11:05:41 <Shlee> I cannot get wiki working at all on QT 4.4... I should look into it
Oct 04 11:05:49 <Shlee> The rest of the compile looks fine.
Oct 04 11:09:39 <AJuOnLiNE|sh> wifi isnt usable ?
Oct 04 11:10:11 <raster> Kensan:  8 color? don't think so... 16bit color
Oct 04 11:13:22 <Hire> it will be cool to see a dialer efl :)
Oct 04 11:13:55 <Kensan> raster: I thought I read in the wiki that it's 8 color...
Oct 04 11:14:09 <raster> Kensan:  i seriously doubt it.. as u'd also need a palette then
Oct 04 11:14:15 <Kensan> raster: hm ok.
Oct 04 11:14:32 <raster> anbd the uboot "code" that dies it
Oct 04 11:14:52 <raster> is simple load splash partition - gunzip and write to video memory
Oct 04 11:14:55 <raster> no palette setup
Oct 04 11:14:57 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:15:06 <Kensan> raster: it says "PNG 480x640x8" in the wiki.
Oct 04 11:15:10 <Kensan> raster: hehe ok
Oct 04 11:15:17 <Kensan> raster: btw, did you get my mail?
Oct 04 11:16:20 <emacsian> i have om2008.9 on my SD card and I'm able to boot into it only every alternate time.
Oct 04 11:16:43 <Sgnabul> hi ther is some ITALIAN here?
Oct 04 11:17:14 <emacsian> the other time in the bootmenu I get uImage.bin not present and returns to the bootmenu
Oct 04 11:18:11 <raster> Kensan:  yes. patch. :)
Oct 04 11:18:55 <Hire> (13:15:18) Sgnabul: hi ther is some ITALIAN here? <-- io perché? O_o
Oct 04 11:19:20 <Sgnabul> perche' non trovo una chat italiana di openmoko o del freeRunner
Oct 04 11:19:30 <raster> Kensan: 
Oct 04 11:19:30 <Hire> sarebbe da crearla :D
Oct 04 11:19:37 <raster> setenv splashimage nand read.e 0x32000000 splash 0x5000\; unzip 0x32000000 0x33d00000 0x96000
Oct 04 11:19:37 <raster>    saveenv
Oct 04 11:19:39 <Hire> comunque no purtroppo non esiste 
Oct 04 11:19:39 <Sgnabul> esiste una chat IT sul FreeRunner?
Oct 04 11:19:43 <Hire> nono
Oct 04 11:19:57 <raster> as u can see all that does is unzip the splash into the fb
Oct 04 11:20:25 <Sgnabul> allora se si crea mi potresti mandare una e-mail a info@urbancenter.it ?
Oct 04 11:20:27 <raster> if u look really carefully...
Oct 04 11:20:33 <raster> check the imghs.pl
Oct 04 11:20:37 <raster> especially
Oct 04 11:20:41 <raster>     $v = ($r >> 3) << 11 | ($g >> 2) << 5 | ($b >> 3);
Oct 04 11:21:14 <raster> whihc.. bingo.. takes the r, g and b, and packs into 16bpp rgb565
Oct 04 11:21:16 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:21:25 <raster> it 4bits red, 6 green, 5 blue - packed into 16bits
Oct 04 11:21:28 <raster> msb to lsb
Oct 04 11:22:31 <raster> so basically it ends up a raw blob of 16bpp rgb565 fraembuffer data just to be zipped up and put into flash
Oct 04 11:22:41 <raster> then on boot u-boot just unzips that data and write it to the fb
Oct 04 11:22:43 <raster> simple
Oct 04 11:22:44 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:22:57 <raster> so as such... that wiki page is wrong
Oct 04 11:23:07 <raster> for better waulity make it a 16bpp image
Oct 04 11:23:19 <john> Everything's simple once you learn it, raster.
Oct 04 11:23:19 <raster> and if u are smart - u'll use xephyr in 16bpp mode
Oct 04 11:23:25 <raster> and something like evas that dithers in 16bpp
Oct 04 11:23:38 <raster> draw it to xephyr
Oct 04 11:23:43 <raster> then screengrab scephyr
Oct 04 11:23:48 <raster> then take that image
Oct 04 11:23:52 <raster> as it will then be pre-dithered
Oct 04 11:23:52 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:24:18 <john> So, Cinepaint would be overkill?
Oct 04 11:24:50 <raster> well draw it in whatevre u like first
Oct 04 11:24:51 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:25:05 <leinir> Hmm... i think that's the first time in a year or two i've seen that name on IRC...
Oct 04 11:25:45 <leinir> And yesterday, i attended a talk here at OpenSourceDays where one of the guys involved with the project spoke about Linux in Hollywood ;)
Oct 04 11:26:09 <Hire> cinepaint, right?
Oct 04 11:26:17 <exco> I'm trying to setup an OE build environment on Ubuntu 8.10 - but I can't get it to work. Can someone have a look at this http://pastebin.com/d227a637d and please tell me what I'm doing wrong?
Oct 04 11:26:20 <leinir> Yeah :)
Oct 04 11:27:19 <john> Yea, I thought it was dead too, but then I was a new article from Robin insisting it wasn't and he didn't hate all the Gimp coders, and it's not his fault they won't stop picking on him.
Oct 04 11:29:04 <leinir> *giggles* Yeah, i kinda got that vibe :)
Oct 04 11:30:54 <john> I think the new GEGL engine will do everything cinepaint did, plus a whole lot more.
Oct 04 11:33:25 <SpeedEvil> Real-time raytraced 3d desktop FTW!
Oct 04 11:34:01 <leinir> SpeedEvil: ouch ;)
Oct 04 11:34:17 <john> On the FR using the Glamo!
Oct 04 11:38:11 <Sgnabul> thanks ! see you all ... bye
Oct 04 11:43:02 <Kensan> raster: ok, thanks for the explanation. You should take up a career in teaching, since I now actually understand what it's doing ;)
Oct 04 11:43:37 <john> Yea. I want to get a job with raster. Maybe I'll actually learn something.
Oct 04 11:43:51 <raster> Kensan:  HAHAHAHHA
Oct 04 11:44:05 <raster> Kensan:  i have done teaching beforew.. but it doesnt pay anywhere near as wel as actual developing stuff
Oct 04 11:44:07 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:44:09 <Kensan> raster: ah ok, so that's the right address to send patches then ;)
Oct 04 11:44:19 <raster> and yes
Oct 04 11:44:21 <john> Plust I'll be earning in a currency that has a future.
Oct 04 11:44:28 <raster> raster@rasterman.com
Oct 04 11:44:36 <raster> havent changed email addresses in a looooong time
Oct 04 11:44:39 <raster> probably never will
Oct 04 11:44:43 <raster> google knows my address
Oct 04 11:44:46 <raster> always ask google
Oct 04 11:44:47 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:45:02 <Kensan> raster: yes, and I believe it's not as gratifiying. I know what I am talking about because I was a student not too long ago *harrharr*
Oct 04 11:45:20 <john> Where do you work, and are they hiring interns?
Oct 04 11:46:38 <Kensan> raster: he does not work anywhere. People carry money to his bungalow on a deserted island and pray for him to take it and kick out some code that does what they dreamed about ;)
Oct 04 11:46:55 <Nameeater> is it possible to use the gprs connection for applications like a webbrowser/irc/ssh on the neo 1973? I've done a fair amout of googling and all I can find for is about bridging the gprs connection to a laptop
Oct 04 11:47:07 <raster> Kensan:  actually i like teaching
Oct 04 11:47:09 <raster> it is fun
Oct 04 11:47:23 <raster> but i doubt i have the patience to teach the same thing.. again and again. i liek to teach new stuff
Oct 04 11:47:32 <raster> so i guess i'm better off in a waterfall kind of thing
Oct 04 11:47:33 <Kensan> raster: yeah, I was just insinuating that my teacher must have had a terrible ride with me as a student.
Oct 04 11:47:42 <raster> ie i teach a few people something new i know...
Oct 04 11:47:48 <raster> they in turn teach others below/after them
Oct 04 11:47:51 <Kensan> raster: my teachers rahter---
Oct 04 11:47:52 <raster> and so on down the waterfall
Oct 04 11:48:09 <raster> and in the meantime i march on to new funky stuff
Oct 04 11:48:10 <Kensan> raster: yeah.
Oct 04 11:48:30 <raster> john: i dont work anywhere. i quit openmoko. i basically am my own consulting firm right now
Oct 04 11:48:44 <balrog-k1n> Nameeater: if you connect to gprs, the neo 1973 can browse www/irc/ssh automatically
Oct 04 11:49:00 <Nameeater> balrog-k1n: awsome, thanks :)
Oct 04 11:49:02 <balrog-k1n> Nameeater: perhaps that's why there are no instructions to set it up
Oct 04 11:49:03 <raster> Kensan:  hahahaha.. yeah.. but really my problem is  time
Oct 04 11:49:06 <Kensan> raster: If you can explain something to a person really well, you understood what you are talking about.
Oct 04 11:49:12 <raster> i have X hours a day ater sleeping and eating and other life things
Oct 04 11:49:17 <john> Didn't sound like you were enjoying working at OM anyway.
Oct 04 11:49:23 <raster> i need to maximise the productivity of those X hours
Oct 04 11:49:38 <raster> and invariably i tend to focus on sure-bets i know will produce stuff
Oct 04 11:49:40 <Nameeater> I was hoping that was the case, but didn't want to pay for one off (insert new zealand ebay clone) and not be sure
Oct 04 11:49:55 <Kensan> raster: 12 hours of drinking beer and eatling does not leave all too many hours for work *hehe*
Oct 04 11:50:02 <balrog-k1n> Nameeater: it's identical to connecting with pppd on your pc
Oct 04 11:50:20 <Nameeater> wicked
Oct 04 11:50:24 <raster> Kensan:  i know.. thats why i devoted my whole weekend to work :) monday is a holiday - working then too
Oct 04 11:50:30 <balrog-k1n> Nameeater: if you connect and want to NAT so that other computer at home can use the connection, *then* you need to do something in addition
Oct 04 11:50:38 <raster> 9:48pm saturday night.. cxoding
Oct 04 11:50:46 <raster> welcom to rasterman inc.
Oct 04 11:50:56 <raster> "bizarre working times come with the job"
Oct 04 11:50:57 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:50:58 <balrog-k1n> but if you type an address into the browser it will use the ppp0 interface to load the page
Oct 04 11:51:15 <Kensan> raster: well it's not good to keep on going without a break: beer good food etc etc. 
Oct 04 11:51:18 <john> Where do I send my C.V. then?
Oct 04 11:52:08 <Kensan> raster: btw, I heard you will be "in the region" in a couple weeks ;)
Oct 04 11:54:20 <Kensan> raster: btw, I shaved off 20 secs of boottime by just deactivating the really obvious things. so it's now around 1min 30 which is still VERY painfull.
Oct 04 11:54:49 <leinir> Hehe, gotta do what they did with the eeePC ;)
Oct 04 11:55:04 <leinir> Boot to an idle desktop in five seconds flat ;)
Oct 04 11:55:52 <raster> Kensan:  that was my break :) a longish one... :)
Oct 04 11:55:55 <Kensan> leinir: yeah, that story seems to be the hot topic currently.
Oct 04 11:56:15 <raster> Kensan:  and i may be in the region - not sure what time i will have to go where etc.
Oct 04 11:56:17 <Kensan> raster: a very wise decision. I would have opted for the longish one too *hehe*
Oct 04 11:56:24 <raster> and btw boot time shaving
Oct 04 11:56:27 <raster> tell em the details
Oct 04 11:56:31 <raster> inf act email me patches
Oct 04 11:56:34 <raster> i'll put into the tree
Oct 04 11:56:34 <Kensan> raster: I just heard all you guys were meeting up.
Oct 04 11:56:37 <balrog-k1n> if om only took the init scripts from poky (OE based, too) they'd get 30s boot up right away
Oct 04 11:56:37 <raster> :)
Oct 04 11:56:55 <balrog-k1n> poky loads in 13s on an omap3
Oct 04 11:57:21 <Shlee> beagleboard?
Oct 04 11:57:37 <balrog-k1n> yep
Oct 04 11:57:38 <Kensan> raster: yeah I will eventually send patches but I really want them to actually be an improvement. So it will take some time.
Oct 04 11:58:18 <Kensan> raster: I will be on the road all next week so no time to futher look into that...
Oct 04 11:58:37 <raster> balrog-k1n:  mdev?
Oct 04 11:58:54 <raster> Kensan:  aaah ok. no problem
Oct 04 11:59:11 <raster> i am busy redoing some infra work for elementary (swisscom) as i think i paintet myself into a corner
Oct 04 11:59:15 <raster> i am much happier now though
Oct 04 11:59:21 <raster> and this will mean rapid moving forward
Oct 04 11:59:23 <balrog-k1n> raster: i don't know, you'd have to ask the distribution people :p
Oct 04 12:00:29 <raster> balrog-k1n:  omap3 is not very comparable to fr
Oct 04 12:00:36 <raster> fr is a pitifully slow system :(
Oct 04 12:02:07 <balrog-k1n> well, yes, though there are some things om does that are really backwards, during boot-up, i heard hrw commenting on it when speeding up the poky boot up :p
Oct 04 12:02:13 <balrog-k1n> soo there's lots to gain
Oct 04 12:02:30 <raster> i'm totally not surprised
Oct 04 12:02:38 <raster> i have noted many sillinesses in the boot myself
Oct 04 12:02:50 <raster> but only have so much time...
Oct 04 12:03:00 <raster> so my priority is x and e and illume and stuff
Oct 04 12:03:01 <balrog-k1n> sure
Oct 04 12:04:30 <balrog-k1n> one of the things was loading the bootsplash and pulling in all the dynamic libs iirc ;)
Oct 04 12:05:23 <balrog-k1n> which caused the boot splash to appear on the screen later than poky would have fully booted already
Oct 04 12:06:16 <balrog-k1n> or, well, booted into x, cause some stuff goes into the background
Oct 04 12:07:58 <raster> balrog-k1n: l yes. thats exqusitie
Oct 04 12:08:05 <raster> it linsk to ecore and so on
Oct 04 12:08:14 <raster> and ecore_x sucks in xlibs etc.
Oct 04 12:08:20 <raster> it DOES mean x later starst faster
Oct 04 12:08:26 <raster> as libs already loaded
Oct 04 12:08:34 <raster> so all u rally do is bring forward stuff
Oct 04 12:08:46 <raster> exquisitie should have a static build tho only wiht minimal framebuffer stuff
Oct 04 12:08:48 <raster> it can be done
Oct 04 12:08:50 <raster> just isnt in OE
Oct 04 12:08:57 <raster> it shares the same dynamic libs
Oct 04 12:09:13 <raster> personalyl i'd argue that yuou should even bringt x up that early
Oct 04 12:09:23 <raster> ie run your boot splash in x
Oct 04 12:09:46 <balrog-k1n> yeah, that would seem best, since x alone isn't so fat.. only if you add gtk, e, etc
Oct 04 12:09:54 <raster> yeah
Oct 04 12:10:02 <raster> then run a bootsplash in x
Oct 04 12:10:21 <raster> then u at least can stop the "random console text messages" popping up
Oct 04 12:10:32 <raster> and make transition from boot to "ui" more seamless
Oct 04 12:10:43 <balrog-k1n> oh if the bootslpash was static i guess you could even do that without using any program
Oct 04 12:10:45 <raster> so just let uboot do the single static image splash
Oct 04 12:10:51 <raster> havekernel utterly ignore the fb
Oct 04 12:10:57 <raster> do nothnig to it console-wise
Oct 04 12:10:57 <balrog-k1n> iirc the xserver has some parameter to set the default background to a bitmap
Oct 04 12:11:04 <raster> THEN x just jumps in from there
Oct 04 12:11:09 <balrog-k1n> instead of the b & w checker
Oct 04 12:11:18 <raster> yes - i know
Oct 04 12:11:23 <raster> some patches
Oct 04 12:11:26 <raster> i sue it in my image
Oct 04 12:11:28 <raster> use
Oct 04 12:11:38 <raster> as such tho
Oct 04 12:11:45 <raster> dynamic lib loading SHOULD be much faster
Oct 04 12:11:47 <balrog-k1n> humm, i thought x on my desktop has that too (?)
Oct 04 12:11:48 <raster> even wiht a lot of them
Oct 04 12:11:53 <raster> if flash wanst so damned slow
Oct 04 12:11:59 <raster> the flash on the fr is abysmal
Oct 04 12:12:05 <raster> like 2mb/sec raw read rates
Oct 04 12:12:11 <raster> not including any jffs2 overhead
Oct 04 12:12:12 <balrog-k1n> iirc even xfree86 had it..
Oct 04 12:12:18 <raster> hmm no
Oct 04 12:12:23 <raster> it doesnt
Oct 04 12:12:33 <raster> its a patch
Oct 04 12:12:49 <balrog-k1n> ah, you have to use xsetroot
Oct 04 12:12:52 <raster> yes
Oct 04 12:12:55 <raster> so x is already up
Oct 04 12:12:58 <balrog-k1n> but it's part of xfree86 since the 90s
Oct 04 12:13:05 <raster> u are now in the "x clients can do what they like" mode
Oct 04 12:13:27 <raster> the only standfrad option is to have a "black screen" instead of the x weave
Oct 04 12:13:37 <balrog-k1n> oh, true
Oct 04 12:14:29 <Kensan> raster: since everybody is passing around links to the "booting eeepc in 5 seconds": do you think the changes they made to X could also be done to the FR X?
Oct 04 12:14:30 <Shlee> I don't know what the issue is.. but I seem to have alot of mis-hits on the qt4.4 keyboard
Oct 04 12:14:38 <Shlee> compared to the FDOM build anyway
Oct 04 12:15:50 <Kensan> raster: compilation of keyboard mappings for example.
Oct 04 12:17:11 <raster> Kensan:  ugh... u need to relate them to me. havent looked.
Oct 04 12:17:13 <raster> as i siad
Oct 04 12:17:15 <raster> been there - done that
Oct 04 12:17:18 <raster> patches x startup
Oct 04 12:17:29 <raster> removed mountains of exsess module stats/load/relaods
Oct 04 12:17:36 <raster> and excess x driver chip re-inits
Oct 04 12:17:45 <Kensan> raster: http://lwn.net/Articles/299483/
Oct 04 12:17:59 <Kensan> raster: Haven't looked for the actual patches tho
Oct 04 12:18:13 <raster> btw
Oct 04 12:18:17 <raster> 1 second budget is high
Oct 04 12:18:54 <raster> for kernel
Oct 04 12:19:25 <Kensan> raster: well FR takes 16 atm :(
Oct 04 12:19:27 <raster> the solution we did was everything in initrd
Oct 04 12:19:31 <raster> and almost nothing in kernel
Oct 04 12:19:36 <raster> that made it damn fast
Oct 04 12:19:51 <raster> we didnt do any readhahead patch
Oct 04 12:19:56 <raster> as the initrd solved that
Oct 04 12:19:59 <Kensan> raster: you mean module wise?
Oct 04 12:20:08 <Shlee> Anyone bootcharted fr?
Oct 04 12:20:17 <Kensan> Shlee: yes I did a couple
Oct 04 12:20:22 <raster> i nixed keymaps entirely
Oct 04 12:20:24 <Kensan> Shlee: there's also one in the wiki
Oct 04 12:20:33 <Kensan> raster: ah ic.
Oct 04 12:21:13 <raster> u want to nuke x's need for a fixed and cursor font too
Oct 04 12:21:17 <raster> i patched x to not need them
Oct 04 12:21:28 <raster> as any cursor and font are set up later by x clients
Oct 04 12:21:34 <raster> why bother make x look for and require them
Oct 04 12:21:46 <raster> so its similar things
Oct 04 12:21:59 <raster> as such kdrive makes our lives much easier - less nasty than xorg desktop x
Oct 04 12:22:00 <Kensan> raster: ah.
Oct 04 12:22:42 <Kensan> raster: yeah, I was wondering how much of their changes could actually also be applied to FR's X
Oct 04 12:23:10 <Kensan> raster: and since you were readily answering all of my questions I thought I might ask *hehe*
Oct 04 12:24:05 <raster> hahahaha
Oct 04 12:24:15 <raster> really the initial rc/rcS in oe need a lot of fixzing
Oct 04 12:24:17 <raster> the bootscripts
Oct 04 12:24:29 <raster> and exquisite is a little nasty in its loading of shared libs that it doesnt need
Oct 04 12:24:32 <raster> (ie al the x libs)
Oct 04 12:25:01 <raster> i have considered making ecore_x actuually totally dynamically load all x libs/extensions as oppsoed to compile-time link
Oct 04 12:25:06 <raster> but thats a fair bit of code
Oct 04 12:25:19 <Kensan> raster: hm ok.
Oct 04 12:25:37 <john> What
Oct 04 12:25:49 <Kensan> raster: the next thing I wanted to take a look at was udev. It takes 20 secs on it's own.
Oct 04 12:25:55 <john> what's the trade-off between X and FB?
Oct 04 12:27:34 <Kronk> Howdy all :)
Oct 04 12:27:38 <john> With QTembedded natively being FB, would it be an idea to try to port other Desktop code to frame buffer?
Oct 04 12:27:57 <raster> Kensan:  udev is a major problem - yes. mdev i thnk is the solution
Oct 04 12:28:12 <raster> ... but if u have something faster that ":solves the problem" as well as udev
Oct 04 12:28:23 <raster> john:  no real tradeoff between x and fb
Oct 04 12:28:48 <raster> fb can be written to sooner, and has a little less overhead, but u get no infra for drawing or sharing the fb - x provides that
Oct 04 12:29:04 <raster> as such qt has its "own world"
Oct 04 12:29:08 <john> In the eeePC solution, they used the old-fashioned /dev directory for boot-time, then udev only for hot-plug stuff.
Oct 04 12:29:14 <raster> where qt acts as xserver basically
Oct 04 12:29:27 <raster> it locks/unlocks fb and gfx chip access and co-ordinates
Oct 04 12:29:33 <raster> as such that is just what x already does
Oct 04 12:29:45 <raster> qt just re-invented it in qt-emebdded (qtopia)
Oct 04 12:30:32 <john> But does it do it better, faster, stronger than X?
Oct 04 12:30:45 <john> Just brainstorming here.
Oct 04 12:30:58 <Kensan> raster: oh uh, reinvented.
Oct 04 12:31:04 <raster> no
Oct 04 12:31:14 <raster> qt-e doesnt do better - or worse than x in principle
Oct 04 12:31:17 <raster> EXCEPT one thing
Oct 04 12:31:18 <raster> DGA
Oct 04 12:31:26 <raster> whihc as such over the long termis not a very good option
Oct 04 12:32:03 <Kensan> raster: duplicating work just sucks.
Oct 04 12:32:14 <raster> (direct fb access for x clients - x DEOS suppor it via DGa but it comes with caveats - ie ONLY useful in fullscreen mode. qte hasd a nice method with qtdirectpainter to do this AND handle cliping rects properly - if you as an app are smart. the evas qtopia enigne does this actually)
Oct 04 12:32:23 <john> So, porting QTembedded to use X is the quicker option than porting Gnome, E, etc, etc to QTembedded.
Oct 04 12:32:38 <raster> so x misses the ability to do direct fb access AND still do cliprects for other on0-screen widgets
Oct 04 12:32:39 <raster> BUT
Oct 04 12:32:43 <raster> all this becoems moot if u
Oct 04 12:32:47 <raster> 1. do compositign and alpha blending
Oct 04 12:32:54 <raster> 2. if your gfx hw doesnt allow direct writes to the fb
Oct 04 12:33:07 <raster> and hw more and more either doesnt allwo "sane" direct writes
Oct 04 12:33:08 <raster> OR
Oct 04 12:33:16 <raster> thgnis mroe to compositing (with alpha blending etc.)
Oct 04 12:33:22 <raster> and so it becomes "useless" to have it
Oct 04 12:33:35 <raster> as such qte to x is the better option
Oct 04 12:33:45 <raster> the probhlem is qte "assumes" it runs on its own fb implementation
Oct 04 12:34:03 <raster> thus it "assumes" things like going from gtqimage ->< pximaps and back to qtimage is "instant" but
Oct 04 12:34:10 <raster> the qt x11 port does it the long way
Oct 04 12:34:15 <raster> all the way to real pixmap in x and back
Oct 04 12:34:18 <raster> and thus is sloooooooooooooow
Oct 04 12:34:24 <raster> it does silly things on the x11 port
Oct 04 12:34:27 <raster> those just need fixing
Oct 04 12:34:40 <raster> and it should run about as fast in x11 as "native qte on fb"
Oct 04 12:34:45 <john> And are you done fixing them yet (-;
Oct 04 12:34:49 <raster> no
Oct 04 12:34:53 <raster> not my job
Oct 04 12:34:59 <raster> i have e and efl and illume to wory about
Oct 04 12:35:05 <raster> qt is someone elses work
Oct 04 12:35:15 <raster> i just happen to keep tabs in whats going on in that box
Oct 04 12:35:24 <raster> got my own sandbox to make yummy
Oct 04 12:35:25 <raster> :)
Oct 04 12:35:26 * john prods lpotter
Oct 04 12:36:10 <john> It's nice to know you're the best person to get info from.
Oct 04 12:36:33 * Kensan is happy raster got his own sandbox again
Oct 04 12:37:44 * Wonka hands raster a shovel and sieve to keep his sandbox clean
Oct 04 12:38:14 <Wonka> hrmf. i want e and illume in debian.
Oct 04 12:39:02 <Wonka> any way to disable decoration for particular windows in xfce?
Oct 04 12:39:41 <Wonka> the active window is already marked and named in the panel... why does it need another title bar?
Oct 04 12:42:47 <raster> hehehehe
Oct 04 12:42:56 <raster> oook
Oct 04 12:43:04 <raster> my redo of elementary api is coming on...
Oct 04 12:43:10 <raster> now just 1 more widget to test for tonight
Oct 04 12:48:57 <Shlee> lol, this QT4.4 sms bug is great.. 12 new messages!
Oct 04 12:49:57 <OdyX> how is this qtextended ? useable GPS ?
Oct 04 12:52:53 <Kensan> raster: so I will start the illume build. Guess it will be a while ;) I will tell you/send patches if I hit other bumps along the way.
Oct 04 12:57:37 <leinir> Shlee: *giggles*Yes, that one is really random :)
Oct 04 12:58:49 <raster> Kensan:  :)
Oct 04 12:58:51 <raster> let it go
Oct 04 12:58:54 <raster> once u've built it once
Oct 04 12:58:57 <raster> its faster later
Oct 04 13:02:23 <Kensan> raster: well that's why I bought my shiny new rig so finally I can put it to good use :)
Oct 04 13:02:39 <raster> hehehe
Oct 04 13:04:34 <Kensan> raster: well gotta do some stuff. You should go on tidying up your sandbox ;)
Oct 04 13:04:59 <Kensan> raster: everybody is waiting to be invited to play along *heh*
Oct 04 13:06:05 <bumbl> raster: elementary = your new gui framework based on evas and edje?
Oct 04 13:09:28 <raster> Kensan:  hmm kind of already invited
Oct 04 13:09:55 <raster> i dont tend to make grandiose marketing invitations etc.
Oct 04 13:10:15 <raster> i just tend to plod along and wonder if others want / will join in the plodding ad a i walk past
Oct 04 13:10:17 <raster> bumbl:  yes
Oct 04 13:10:17 <Shlee> the sms part of 4.4 is boned.. If you're writing a message while you recieve a message. it will ask if you want to return to the originally message.... forever
Oct 04 13:10:17 <raster> :)
Oct 04 13:11:03 <bumbl> raster: nice 
Oct 04 13:11:19 <bumbl> when will it move to e17 svn or is it already there
Oct 04 13:12:09 <raster> already there
Oct 04 13:13:19 <Kensan> raster: hehe yes, that's much better imho. I am definitely for plodding along. Plus the rumour has already spread. 
Oct 04 13:16:19 <raster> :)
Oct 04 13:16:26 <raster> i much prefer the rumor-mill method
Oct 04 13:16:28 <raster> more low-key
Oct 04 13:16:39 <raster> eart your merits by actual work and results
Oct 04 13:16:47 <raster> not just marketing blurbs and publicity
Oct 04 13:50:54 <Kronk> Can anyone recommend a semi-functional distro to run on Neo 1973 GTA01-V4 other than OM 2007-02 ? Been going through the wiki and it seems rather dis-jointed re Freerunners now over Neo 1973 :(
Oct 04 13:51:36 <Shlee> Kronk: The QT4.3/4.4 release is the best functional distro for a phone
Oct 04 13:51:51 <Shlee> if you want to mess with the ports/applications, check FDOM
Oct 04 13:52:48 <Kronk> Ta 4.4 working on Neo 1973 ? I've loaded it to my Freerunner and it's pretty sweet but I'd like to update my Neo 1973 as well :) Wasn't anything in QTextended 4.4 for GTA01-v4 the other night when I checked :)
Oct 04 13:52:51 <leinir> Qt Extended 4.4.1 with mwester's kernel :)
Oct 04 13:55:01 <Kronk> Thanks :)
Oct 04 13:56:16 <Kronk> Neo 1973 4.4.1 image is up on QTexteneded now :)
Oct 04 13:57:39 <Shlee> Nods.
Oct 04 13:58:25 <Kronk> Out of interest will the FDOM image work on a GTA01 ? Or are they only for GTA02 ?
Oct 04 13:59:32 <Kronk> I'm looking @ these
Oct 04 13:59:33 <Kronk> http://compartida.net/openmoko/FDOM/
Oct 04 14:01:13 <Kronk> mwester's kernel site link from QTextended appears to be down !
Oct 04 14:12:58 <sicu> Kronk: http://moko.mwester.net/dl.html#kernels
Oct 04 14:13:28 <Kronk> Ta sicu :)
Oct 04 14:17:23 <Shlee> Don't forget to grab the modules.
Oct 04 15:03:32 <Kronk> QTextened 4.4 seems to be up and running on my GTA01 thanks again :)
Oct 04 15:03:52 <Sylar91> good luck, you need it a lot...
Oct 04 15:03:57 <Kronk> lol
Oct 04 15:04:14 <Sylar91> it is very unusable...
Oct 04 15:04:37 <Kronk> more for dev and testing on the GTA01 so not to phased :)
Oct 04 15:16:22 <caratorn> Hello, I'm trying to find imlib2 package for OM2008.9, does anyone have a clue?
Oct 04 15:16:46 <swc|666> nope
Oct 04 15:29:45 <Guest88390> eya dudes
Oct 04 15:59:19 <jones__> are there any mpd clients running on openmoko
Oct 04 16:06:49 <jones__> i think the other jones is me
Oct 04 16:06:57 <jones__> damn screen sessions
Oct 04 16:07:53 <Dave> What!?
Oct 04 16:08:01 <Dave> identity crisis?
Oct 04 16:08:16 <PBeck> ahoi
Oct 04 16:11:38 <Dave> yarr
Oct 04 16:17:46 <jones__> PBeck, yes
Oct 04 16:18:11 <PBeck> jones__: harhar :D
Oct 04 16:19:01 <jones__> im worried, somewhere on an indetermant computer im running irssi
Oct 04 16:19:08 <jones__> i no idea where
Oct 04 16:20:11 <jones__> could a mod kick the other me please
Oct 04 16:20:40 <Dave> I think pbeck is a typo for pebkac
Oct 04 16:22:08 <Wonka> jones__: doesn't help anything. register your nick and use the local incarnation of the "ghost" command
Oct 04 16:22:52 <Dave> Wonka Wonka Wonka
Oct 04 16:22:53 <Tig|> 'nings Dave
Oct 04 16:22:57 <Dave> HALLO TIG
Oct 04 16:23:28 <PBeck> Dave: what means pebkac?
Oct 04 16:23:41 <Tig|> my freerunner is having an attack of fail again :)  so time for another reflash :)  are there any images kicking around for the SHR?
Oct 04 16:23:48 <SpeedEvil> problem exists between keyboard and computer
Oct 04 16:23:51 <PBeck> Dave: PBeck is a mix out of my suname and name
Oct 04 16:23:52 <SpeedEvil> problem exists between keyboard and chair
Oct 04 16:24:00 <Dave> ooh la la
Oct 04 16:24:11 <PBeck> *surname
Oct 04 16:24:15 <Tig|> apart from the bearstech buildhost as that only has gta01 images on there :(
Oct 04 16:24:16 <PBeck> Patrick Beck :)
Oct 04 16:24:42 <Dave> Problem exists between kiwi and cantalope
Oct 04 16:25:14 <Tig|> Dave: ah that would explain it,  my freerunner has not got libcantalope installed :)
Oct 04 16:25:33 <Tig|> and also I was using an emu to input it not a kiwi 
Oct 04 16:28:20 <Dave> Tig :D
Oct 04 16:28:24 <Dave> :D
Oct 04 16:33:04 <lesouvage> I got a message after starting "mapping demo" on qt extended  "Connecting waiting for fix"  Any suggestion to get it working?  
Oct 04 16:33:24 <lesouvage> I have tried it outside and wait for 10 minutes.
Oct 04 16:35:20 <lesouvage> Message is "Connected, waiting for fix..."
Oct 04 16:36:25 <mwester> wait longer :)  lots longer, up to an hour.  Also, keep the phone vertical somehow -- with the face of the phone perpendicular to the ground.
Oct 04 16:37:56 <SpeedEvil> The hole down
Oct 04 16:38:27 <mwester> Greetings Mr. SpeedEvil.
Oct 04 16:38:34 <SpeedEvil> :)
Oct 04 16:39:16 <SpeedEvil> What we need is for someone with a full bladder and a flash camera to do the experiment. 20KV optional.
Oct 04 16:39:21 <SpeedEvil> oops - mischan
Oct 04 16:39:25 <Tig|> mwester: that is a tad sucky even indoors I get a fix with fso in about 5 mins tops and that is in my study which only has a small window and it is not near the desk
Oct 04 16:39:44 <mwester> Tigl: the issue is the first fix
Oct 04 16:39:58 <mwester> thereafter, at least until the state is lost by the GPS chip, it is fine.
Oct 04 16:40:18 <mwester> FSO saves the state, no other images do that AFAIK!
Oct 04 16:40:22 <Tig|> mwester: ah,  I am damn sure I have never waited an hour for it though :)
Oct 04 16:40:29 <Tig|> ah :)
Oct 04 16:40:35 <lesouvage> mwester: I don't have to turn on gps somewhere? I can't find the option. I have seen the maping demo working but now it doesn't. Any suggestion?
Oct 04 16:40:37 <mwester> Neither have I, but some have reported times approaching that.
Oct 04 16:41:09 <mwester> lesouvage:  Depends on the image, but yes the GPS needs to be turned on by something.
Oct 04 16:59:01 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: 03jluebbe 07framework * rc8c70b0d02c4 10/framework/persist.py: persist: fix loading empty file
Oct 04 17:03:01 <Staticwave_Ace> does anyone know if qtopia will notify about voicemails yet?
Oct 04 17:08:26 <bipak> mwester: is there something like a changelog for your kernels? or a list of what your images fix?
Oct 04 17:13:10 <lesouvage> mwester: for some reason it start working in my own, solid brick build house. The gps chip most be of good quality, it just ake a while to let it show ;-)
Oct 04 17:15:41 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * rbd4b1b4080cf 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/gpsdevice.py: 
Oct 04 17:15:41 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Make Gypsy .Server methods callable if the resource is disabled
Oct 04 17:15:41 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: Without this fix standard Gypsy programs wont work
Oct 04 17:15:42 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r686ab06b63be 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/gpschannel.py: 
Oct 04 17:15:42 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: Clear sendbuffer after sending stuff (emdete)
Oct 04 17:15:46 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: Before we would resend everything that has ever been sent again and
Oct 04 17:15:48 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: again. Big thanks to emdete for discovering!
Oct 04 17:15:50 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r0c5bca63bac7 10/framework/subsystems/ogpsd/om.py: 
Oct 04 17:15:52 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: ogpsd: GPS epoch is Oct 6th not Oct 5th 1980
Oct 04 17:15:54 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: With this fix the time should be calculated correctly for the GPS
Oct 04 17:15:56 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: receiver. Also slightly increase the time we wait after power on so the
Oct 04 17:15:58 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: first configure packets don't go astray.
Oct 04 17:18:01 <mwester> bipak:  There should be, I haven't written that up yet.  Basically, at this particular point in time, I add only some latent debugging code that has no user-impact.  There are currently no features or fixes beyond what is in the official Openmoko "stable" branch.
Oct 04 17:18:49 <mwester> The only other thing that might be different is the kernel configuration -- but that's specific to each distro anyway.  For my kernels, you can get that from /proc/config.gz 
Oct 04 17:19:15 <Dave> Mwester!
Oct 04 17:19:26 <Dave> Have you heard about this usaf thing?
Oct 04 17:19:27 <bipak> mwester: ok, thanks
Oct 04 17:21:05 <bipak> mwester: so in a user point of view, it makes no sense using your kernel?
Oct 04 17:21:46 <mwester> bipak:  an interesting way of putting it.
Oct 04 17:22:12 <Bundestrojaner> is it right that the freerunner supports only USB 1.1?
Oct 04 17:23:55 <bipak> schäuble: yes
Oct 04 17:24:39 <Bundestrojaner> rofl :D
Oct 04 17:24:55 <bipak> :)
Oct 04 17:24:57 <Bundestrojaner> hm, but why?
Oct 04 17:25:10 <Bundestrojaner> this means, i need a few hours to put my mp3-collection on it...
Oct 04 17:25:43 <bipak> you could fill your SD card with a cardreader and put it back into the fr
Oct 04 17:29:32 <lesouvage> how do I startup the sshd with qt extender image installed. I want to ssh to the freerunner over wlan connection but got the message  "ssh: connect to host 192.168.1.102 port 22: Connection refused". Any suggestions or pointers?
Oct 04 17:30:03 <bipak> sshd is running per default. 192.168.1.102 is the ip address of the usb interface
Oct 04 17:31:32 <bipak> no sorry its 192.168.0.202 
Oct 04 17:32:19 <lesouvage> bipak: no, this is a wlan IP number. I can ping to it. Should I change the ssh.conf file on the freerunner to accept connections from 192.168.1.00
Oct 04 17:33:25 <bipak> maybe your sshd listens only on the usb interface? 
Oct 04 17:36:03 <lesouvage> bipak: yes, i guess I have to change some settings. 
Oct 04 17:36:06 <lindi-> ssh.conf?
Oct 04 17:36:31 <Bundestrojaner> btw: how does gps work on the freerunner? i mean with wich software?
Oct 04 17:37:44 <lesouvage> lindi: I just made that up. Do you know the the name of the file I have to change?
Oct 04 17:39:57 <lindi-> lesouvage: which ssh server do you use?
Oct 04 17:40:02 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: gps works well, eve inside the house. The only thing is that it takes a serious time before it works.  
Oct 04 17:40:27 <Libellensommer> hallöchen
Oct 04 17:40:46 <Bundestrojaner> lesouvage: i don't doubt on the gps-receiver but: Hwo makes the maps for it?
Oct 04 17:41:09 <Bundestrojaner> lebellensommer: hallo
Oct 04 17:41:32 <kpawanro> are there more people with Om2008.9 who can't configure there OpenMoko decently because the letters in the configure screen are too large?
Oct 04 17:43:57 <lesouvage> lindi: I have qt extender 4.4.1 installed. I guess it is dropbear
Oct 04 17:43:58 <Libellensommer> *winker*
Oct 04 17:45:51 <lindi-> lesouvage: simple man dropbear shows how to make it listen on specific address
Oct 04 17:46:53 <Bundestrojaner> has anyone gsp running on a openmoko-system?
Oct 04 17:47:03 <Bundestrojaner> where did you get the maps?
Oct 04 17:47:25 <lindi-> gsp?
Oct 04 17:47:37 <Bundestrojaner> gps
Oct 04 17:47:42 <lindi-> sure
Oct 04 17:48:24 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: on om2008.9 there is great software that makes use of the opencontent project  "open street maps"  If it all works as intended my opinion is that it is a real killer app.
Oct 04 17:49:07 <Bundestrojaner> what is om2008.9?
Oct 04 17:49:07 <Bundestrojaner> shall this be a url?
Oct 04 17:49:28 <jones__> the .9 domain isnt too popular
Oct 04 17:50:04 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo_FreeRunner
Oct 04 17:50:40 <lesouvage> and the rest of this wiki
Oct 04 17:51:02 <markit> is something like TomTom navigator available for OM?
Oct 04 17:52:16 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: tangogps is what you are looking for.
Oct 04 17:52:18 <CIA-22> freesmartphone.org: 03daniel 07framework * r6d30d6eb5e13 10/framework/subsystems/ogsmd/ (gsm/const.py modems/abstract/mediator.py): ogsmd: Replace timeouts of individual commands with command classes
Oct 04 17:54:57 <Bundestrojaner> wow, the street where i live is in it :P
Oct 04 17:55:10 <Bundestrojaner> who creates this maps?
Oct 04 17:56:15 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: it is open content. Lots of people walked, biked and drive the streets collecting coordinates every second and uploaded the info collected to the openstreet project. 
Oct 04 17:56:38 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: are you trying tangogps?
Oct 04 17:57:05 <Bundestrojaner> lesouvage: i don't have a openmoko-system
Oct 04 17:57:25 <Bundestrojaner> i think on buying one, that's why i'm here
Oct 04 17:57:40 <malik1972> Bundestrojaner: dont buy it
Oct 04 17:57:55 <Bundestrojaner> why not?
Oct 04 18:00:33 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: the idea of an open phone is great, but the phone is more or less in beta stage and not suitable for day to day use. You need lots of linux knowledge, time and expertise to get it working more or less. 
Oct 04 18:00:37 <jones__> can you use openmoko to map?
Oct 04 18:01:07 <SpeedEvil> yes.
Oct 04 18:01:13 <jones__> good
Oct 04 18:01:20 <jones__> mine arrives at some point on monday
Oct 04 18:01:22 <SpeedEvil> But not I think with any specific software.
Oct 04 18:01:30 <Bundestrojaner> lesouvage: i'm using Gentoo as only system ;)
Oct 04 18:01:31 <SpeedEvil> I've used cat+gzip to log the GPS output.
Oct 04 18:01:35 <SpeedEvil> Also tangogps
Oct 04 18:02:02 <jones__> would it be a challenge to hack some together
Oct 04 18:02:35 <lesouvage> Bundestrojaner: If you are a kind of uber geek and you like to hack, try, develope on an open platform this phone is yout wettest dream.
Oct 04 18:02:52 <lesouvage> yout=your
Oct 04 18:03:02 <SpeedEvil> jones__: there is no real app for it specifically.
Oct 04 18:03:27 <jones__> hmmm, is it just formatted data
Oct 04 18:03:38 <jones__> wouldnt be too difficult to put together
Oct 04 18:04:16 <jones__> seems my flt is already on open streetmap
Oct 04 18:05:13 <jones__> actaully the complex is theres only like four of the buildings
Oct 04 18:05:33 <jones__> have you maed structures SpeedEvil?
Oct 04 18:05:38 <jones__> mapped*
Oct 04 18:06:45 <SpeedEvil> yes
Oct 04 18:08:16 <jones__> i feel obliged to get my student accomodation on correctly then
Oct 04 18:08:37 <SpeedEvil> Done most of 
Oct 04 18:08:39 <SpeedEvil> http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=56.1957&lon=-3.1377&zoom=12&layers=B000FTF
Oct 04 18:08:51 <SpeedEvil> Needs me to fill in names, and do more streets.
Oct 04 18:09:50 <jones__> you're only in Glenrothes?
Oct 04 18:09:58 <jones__> im up in aberdeen
Oct 04 18:11:04 <SpeedEvil> Think I've only got as far as a bit above montrose on one occasion mapping.
Oct 04 18:12:04 <jones__> Hmm think I'll do some of the godo bike routes
Oct 04 18:12:31 <jones__> bright pink are details areas right?
Oct 04 18:13:58 <SpeedEvil> bright pink?
Oct 04 18:14:08 <jones__> pinkish areas
Oct 04 18:14:27 <jones__> if you look at aberdeen its mostly grey, but there are some pink areas
Oct 04 18:14:57 <SpeedEvil> pink is the colour of landuse:residential tagged areas.
Oct 04 18:15:05 <SpeedEvil> On the default maps.
Oct 04 18:15:14 <jones__> ah okay
Oct 04 18:16:21 <SpeedEvil> Err - sorry
Oct 04 18:16:26 <SpeedEvil> landuse:industrial
Oct 04 18:16:35 <SpeedEvil> landuse:residential is gray.
Oct 04 18:19:02 <SpeedEvil> jones__: and it seems someone's been tracing from yahoo over aberdeen.
Oct 04 18:19:26 <SpeedEvil> jones__: that can be inaccurate both due to old imagery, and bad registration of the images.
Oct 04 18:20:08 <jones__> either way, if i do any mapping ill catch alot of areas again
Oct 04 18:20:27 <SpeedEvil> Ypou'll notice there are no streetsigns.
Oct 04 18:20:37 <SpeedEvil> s/sign/name/
Oct 04 18:20:37 <apt> SpeedEvil meant: Ypou'll notice there are no streetnames.
Oct 04 18:21:40 <SpeedEvil> streetnames, traffic light, oneways, ...
Oct 04 18:22:14 <edje> hi all, wpa_supplicant is only working once. after a disconnect it won't start again. is there a fix for this? ( using wpa/tkip )
Oct 04 18:28:30 <lesouvage> Should tangogps run on QT extender?
Oct 04 18:33:20 <deever> anyone else here with #1841: "white screen of death (WSOD) after resume"?
Oct 04 18:42:08 <Bundestrojaner> Physics is to math what sex is to masturbation :D
Oct 04 18:43:23 <Bundestrojaner>  - Feynman
Oct 04 18:43:41 <viq> There was some other nice quote somewhere
Oct 04 18:43:51 <viq> Though I don't think from him
Oct 04 18:45:14 <viq> Something along the lines of: You drive over a bridge, which was build by an engineer according to rules specified by materials specialists, which worked usig rules figured out by physicists, who used an equation created by a matematician - who had no idea it could be put to any practical use.
Oct 04 19:23:36 <lesouvage> I'm reflashing my device from qt extender to om2008.9 . Hope to get the basics up and running. 
Oct 04 19:26:58 <Tig|> lesouvage: imhe I would reflash to FDOM rather than om2008.9 to get things up and running 
Oct 04 19:27:48 <lesouvage> Tigl: I haven't tried that image but I will give it a shut. Do I have to reflash the kernel and the rootfs?
Oct 04 19:28:04 <lesouvage> I'm now running kernel of om2008.9
Oct 04 19:28:19 <Tig|> lesouvage: probably just the rootfs then
Oct 04 19:28:49 <Tig|> it is basically 2008.9 with some userland fixes and some preinstalled apps
Oct 04 19:29:06 <Tig|> all info is on the wiki under distributions :)
Oct 04 19:32:08 <lesouvage> Tigl: thanks, I'm downloading the image and will flash it in short time.
Oct 04 19:32:20 <Tig|> no worries :)
Oct 04 19:35:15 <sigius> Are images of SHR available online  or should I build them myself if I wanted to try this distribution ?
Oct 04 19:37:09 <Tig|> sigius: there might be some kicking about but the only ones I have seen are for the gta01
Oct 04 19:39:18 <sigius> Tigl, ok thanks. ill try out another one first then
Oct 04 19:41:15 <lesouvage> Tigl: I read that nano is part of the image. A useble editor will help a lot ;-)
Oct 04 19:43:18 <mwester> emacs is, or was, available.
Oct 04 19:43:24 <mwester> I use "joe"
Oct 04 19:43:49 <mwester> (joe has "jmacs" -- a lot like emacs, but lighter-weight)
Oct 04 19:44:02 <Tig|> mwester: he did say usable so not emacs :)
Oct 04 19:44:10 <mwester> tsk tsk
Oct 04 19:44:46 <Tig|> htf can you do all the chorded keyboard stuff on a predictive text keyboard? :) 
Oct 04 19:45:03 <Tig|> unless someone has made an emacs dictionary :)n 
Oct 04 19:45:20 <mwester> :)    Bluetooth keyboard, who wants to use that on-screen thingy anyway??
Oct 04 19:46:05 <Tig|> ctrl+alt+w+t+f == prediction:  either you are using emacs or a spider is having a fit on your phone :P
Oct 04 19:46:47 <Tig|> mwester: I like my bt keyboard but the whole hidd deprication thing could suck a basketball through a hosepipe
Oct 04 19:47:53 <lesouvage> Linphone is part of the image? I have a Russian webpage open about FDOM and I see the word VOIP and LINPHONE between the russian character written page.
Oct 04 19:48:00 <Tig|> without a replacement for hidd bluez on the commandline is broken for a non programmer
Oct 04 19:48:01 <mwester> I suppose we could port Windows "notepad" for those who aren't up for using emacs...
Oct 04 19:48:26 <Tig|> mwester: or just use vim :)
Oct 04 19:48:42 <lesouvage> Nano is fine for me
Oct 04 19:48:44 <mwester> vi and vim are to text editors as uboot is to the kernel.
Oct 04 19:49:17 * mwester enjoys an occaisional round of the ancient game of "editor wars" :)
Oct 04 19:49:21 <lesouvage> I ahve ever understand the charme and ease of use of vi. It just drives me crazy.
Oct 04 19:49:26 <mwester> But I have to run now - happy editing!
Oct 04 19:49:39 <Tig|> mwester :)  toodle pip :)
Oct 04 19:49:48 <lesouvage> hoi
Oct 04 19:51:26 <Tig|> lesouvage: if you use vim -N then things are less painful :) things like normal arrow keys work,  then once you have figured insert and overtype modes then you are basically sorted :)
Oct 04 19:52:17 <Tig|> although for just editing the one line nano is great for normal people :)
Oct 04 19:55:10 <GNUtoo> hello, is FSO testing down? and what package were present? a lot or few packages? like normal FSO or like 2008.9?
Oct 04 19:55:27 <GNUtoo> s/testing/testing repository/
Oct 04 19:55:27 <apt> GNUtoo meant: hello, is FSO testing repository down? and what package were present? a lot or few packages? like normal FSO or like 2008.9?
Oct 04 19:59:40 <lesouvage> Tigl: I just finished the fdom flash. The bootproces fails with lots of kernel kind of errors. Now flashing kernel of om2008.9 . Hope this wil fix the problems.
Oct 04 20:00:39 <lesouvage> No rebooting with new kernel
Oct 04 20:01:01 <Tig|> lesouvage: FDOM worked for me the other day 
Oct 04 20:02:02 <Tig|> GNUtoo: interesting,  both the FSO buildhost and the bearstech one now seem only to have gta01 images available,  I think something silly has happened to them and been shoved into git
Oct 04 20:02:33 <lesouvage> Tigl: I'm not a novice but i have a kind of talent to mix this kind of things up. libz.so.1 is missing and generates endless number warning lines
Oct 04 20:03:29 <Tig|> lesouvage: not sure what is happening then :(
Oct 04 20:05:08 <lesouvage> Is it possible that I picked a GT01 image instead of a GT02. I saw just one version.
Oct 04 20:05:28 <Tig|> lesouvage: where were you downloading it from 
Oct 04 20:06:50 <lesouvage> Tigl: http://compartida.net/openmoko/FDOM/  I picked the first ne in the list.
Oct 04 20:08:15 <Tig|> there are known issues with that server it can be a bit odd sometimes see :  http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FDOM#Download
Oct 04 20:08:34 <Tig|> I used the truebox one and had no problems.
Oct 04 20:08:52 <Tig|> might be worth md5 checking the files you have before you re-download
Oct 04 20:09:57 <Tig|> lesouvage: they would be better not pointing to that server on the distro page
Oct 04 20:10:08 <deever> anyone else here with #1841: "white screen of death (WSOD) after resume"?
Oct 04 20:10:20 <Tig|> right I have to dash off for a bit, toodles
Oct 04 20:13:56 <AJuOnLiNE|sh> .o/
Oct 04 20:52:15 <lesouvage> Tigl: rebooting again, the problem seems to be fixed. 
Oct 04 20:53:13 <lindi-> deever: does it only happen with xglamo?
Oct 04 21:04:23 <CIA-22> openmoko: 03julian_chu 07org.openmoko.dev * r25a1910a6e4b 10/packages/efl1/edje_svn.bb: [edje-utils] Add recommends to edje-utils
Oct 04 21:25:18 <deever> lindi-: no, 'm using qtopia
Oct 04 21:31:52 <sigius> I'm scp-ing a file on my pc over to my sdcard in the openmoko. Speeds slow down quickly from something like 300kbps to about 10kbps. This is regardless of whether I am scp-ing over usb or wifi. Any suggestions as to what could be the reason ?
Oct 04 21:32:16 <lindi-> sigius: can you try netcat?
Oct 04 21:32:25 <Dave> nice
Oct 04 21:32:30 <Dave> is the sd fs fat?
Oct 04 21:32:55 <sigius> Dave, no its ext2
Oct 04 21:33:01 <sigius> lindi-, ill try that now
Oct 04 21:33:03 <Dave> Ah, okay
Oct 04 21:33:13 <Dave> bugcat lindi
Oct 04 21:35:13 <GNUtoo> sigius, try remounting the card with async
Oct 04 21:39:28 <sigius> lindi-, tried netcat, about as slow as before
Oct 04 21:39:36 <sigius> GNUtoo, ill try that
Oct 04 21:47:27 <Dave> Hmm
Oct 04 21:48:28 <sigius> GNUtoo, that definitely helped things. Its still quit slow though (100kbps on average)  but that workable
Oct 04 21:49:01 <sigius> s/that/thats
Oct 04 21:49:56 <Dave> hrm
Oct 04 22:02:24 <deever> anyone else here with #1841: "white screen of death (WSOD) after resume"?
Oct 04 22:09:52 <lesouvage> I just flashed fdom. Although the device indicates that there is a wlan connection there isn't. ifconfig only shows localhost and usb0. What should I do to get the wlan connection up and running?
Oct 04 22:35:22 <SpeedEvil> Odd.
Oct 04 22:35:23 <SpeedEvil> http://dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.16200
Oct 04 22:51:09 <niklauz> hi guys
Oct 04 23:04:22 <deever> anyone else here with #1841: "white screen of death (WSOD) after resume"?
Oct 04 23:11:29 <cjb> hey, I haven't reflashed my FR in like three weeks now
Oct 04 23:11:48 <cjb> what new release is there for me to waste time installing?  ;-)
Oct 04 23:13:55 <KenYoung> cjb, THere's a new qtopia release, and an FDOM from the 27th of Sept.
Oct 04 23:14:55 <cjb> ooh.  what's an FDOM?
Oct 04 23:15:47 <KenYoung> Fat Dirty Open Moko - it's 2008.9, with many of the things everyone gripes about (like the keybord) fixed, and lots of applications pre-loaded.
Oct 04 23:17:00 <KenYoung> cjb, http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FDOM
Oct 04 23:20:05 <cjb> oh, wow
Oct 04 23:20:18 <cjb> I was going to make a joke about how there might be a new distribution since the last time I looked
Oct 04 23:20:23 <cjb> but  I didn't expect it to be true
Oct 04 23:21:02 <KenYoung> Hey, 3 or 4 distributions have probably gone through their entire life-cycle in the last three weeks.
Oct 04 23:22:25 <Dave> KenYoung!
Oct 04 23:22:43 <KenYoung> Howdy Dave.
Oct 04 23:22:58 <Dave> Remember that link I said I'd find you?
Oct 04 23:23:01 <Dave> to that orrery ripoff?
Oct 04 23:23:11 <Dave> (discounting whoever really came first) :P
Oct 04 23:23:19 <KenYoung> Yes, but I thought I was going to do the ripping off.
Oct 04 23:23:29 <Dave> :D
Oct 04 23:23:32 <KenYoung> Did you find the link?
Oct 04 23:23:35 <Dave> apparently it's called KStars
Oct 04 23:23:36 <Dave> yes
Oct 04 23:23:38 <Dave> http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/8a741e60e709246577ba461fbd849db6.png
Oct 04 23:23:46 <Dave> http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/f444ec19ec4c88399c2141711c3684b8.png
Oct 04 23:24:14 <KenYoung> Boo hoo - looks better than mine.
Oct 04 23:24:31 <KenYoung> I was going to put in constellation boundaries this weekend.
Oct 04 23:25:28 <KenYoung> Oh, It's kstars.   I've heard people talk about that one.
Oct 04 23:25:39 <mjr> oh my god, it's full of kstars
Oct 04 23:25:59 <KenYoung> mjr, Boy that was a terrible flick!
Oct 04 23:27:51 <KenYoung> Dave, Thanks for the pointer.
Oct 04 23:32:56 <tessier> Hello all!
Oct 04 23:33:03 <edistar> hello!
Oct 04 23:33:50 <tessier> What is the most usable freerunner image these days? Still qtopia? I've got a $400 investment just sitting here doing nothing because the software that came with it is hardly functional. :) I need to reflash it with something newer and I'm wondering what to use.
Oct 04 23:35:26 <KenYoung> tessier, For plain phone functionality, qtopia seems to get the best marks, but it doesn't support some important features, such as GPS.
Oct 04 23:36:17 <KenYoung> tessier, I've had good luck with FDOM, but it still hangs unresumably every two or threee days.
Oct 04 23:36:23 <tessier> What about wifi or gsm modem for web browsing and email checking?
Oct 04 23:37:00 <tessier> GPS won't be that important to me until we get turn by turn driving directions or a decent interface for recording locations.
Oct 04 23:37:52 <KenYoung> tessier, I think WiFi is irratic on all distributions,   I've had good luck connecting WiFi with FDOM, but after a few hours it punks out on me.
Oct 04 23:38:45 <lindi-> KenYoung: isnt wifi only about the kernel?
Oct 04 23:38:48 <tessier> What is FDOM?
Oct 04 23:39:11 <tessier> Is that aka 2008.8? Having so many different distros for the phone is confusing as well.
Oct 04 23:39:18 <KenYoung> lindi-, I don't know, but that may be why none of the distributions have seamless WiFi.
Oct 04 23:39:45 <KenYoung> tessier,  Fat Dirty Open Moko - it's 2008.9, with many of the things everyone gripes about (like the keybord) fixed, and lots of applications pre-loaded.
Oct 04 23:39:46 <edistar> yes, wifi is a driver problem..
Oct 04 23:39:55 <lindi-> tessier: investment? you should be developing it ;)
Oct 04 23:40:05 <KenYoung> tessier,  http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FDOM
Oct 04 23:40:20 <tessier> KenYoung: Ah! That sounds like the one for me then.
Oct 04 23:40:28 <lindi-> KenYoung: what else could affect it?
Oct 04 23:40:33 <davo_> Atheros went back to an older version of the HAL
Oct 04 23:40:35 <tessier> Now to figure out how to flash it...
Oct 04 23:40:43 <davo_> odds are the driver is flaky
Oct 04 23:40:54 <edistar> davo_: 20:1, ok?
Oct 04 23:41:01 <davo_> ?
Oct 04 23:41:12 <davo_> ahh
Oct 04 23:41:13 <davo_> lol
Oct 04 23:46:14 <tessier> lindi-: Unfortunately I don't really have time. But I wanted to buy one to support the concept. 
Oct 05 00:25:40 <Sargun> Where can I find Sean Moss-Pultz?
Oct 05 00:38:04 <raster> not here
Oct 05 00:38:32 <edistar> good morning
Oct 05 00:44:34 <davo_> lol
Oct 05 00:44:36 <davo_> good job
Oct 05 00:44:44 <davo_> http://wiki.openmoko.org/index.php?title=Flashing&action=edit
Oct 05 00:46:15 <davo_> flashing openmoko should point at neotool
Oct 05 00:46:27 <davo_> not the flashing edit page
Oct 05 00:46:37 <davo_> which the average user isn't going to have access to
Oct 05 01:52:56 <edistar> ls
Oct 05 01:53:58 <swc|666> ls: command not found
Oct 05 01:56:34 <si-m1> ls: wrong window, try that one ------------>
Oct 05 01:58:30 <swc|666> ;)
Oct 05 02:01:17 <balrog-kun>  .           ..
Oct 05 02:01:58 <lpotter> tessier: Qt Extended supports GPS
Oct 05 02:21:41 <slaxxin> lpotter   does qt ext have a full gps program or just a demo?
Oct 05 02:22:06 <lpotter> demo
Oct 05 02:22:25 <lpotter> but there are a couple 3rd party map/gps apps about somewhere
Oct 05 02:22:35 <slaxxin> tango?
Oct 05 02:22:39 <lpotter> nope.
Oct 05 02:22:49 <lpotter> unless someone ported that to qt extended
Oct 05 02:23:25 <slaxxin> navit?
Oct 05 02:24:46 <slaxxin> citymap i guess?
Oct 05 02:26:50 <lpotter> ya citymap I think
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Oct 05 02:59:57 2008