**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Dec 28 02:59:57 2008 Dec 28 03:00:22 Yeah, echo 9.2 > /sys/devices/platform/lis302dl.1/full_scale fixes event2 for me. Dec 28 03:00:30 It shuts event3 off completely. Dec 28 03:35:07 What should be changed on the freerunner for make a cheaper version? Dec 28 03:37:00 Lose one accel, and produce a hundred thousand of them. Dec 28 03:37:06 That'd make it lots cheaper Dec 28 03:37:38 I would guess the price for the FRs construction runs something like $180 - in small volumes - neglecting sunk costs. Dec 28 03:37:52 Go to high volumes, and that might drop to $100 Dec 28 03:39:55 Get rid of the high-res display. Dec 28 03:40:04 That'd help somewhat, yes Dec 28 03:40:11 cut the internal flash to 16MB and use an SD card instead Dec 28 03:40:19 that too is probably a good plan Dec 28 03:40:27 go to a software assisted GPS probably too Dec 28 03:40:49 Those values would be for the redux version right? Dec 28 03:40:56 probably switching to closed proprietary GPS or wifi would cut costs too. Dec 28 03:41:29 nicfer: no - my first estimate of $180 was what it might have cost openmoko to make 2000 of the same model of the FR Dec 28 03:41:46 (neglecting design costs or setup costs, which are significant) Dec 28 03:42:46 mwester: $50K prize for a $1 reduction in BOM would bring all sorts of stuff. Dec 28 03:43:03 mwester: (assuming that >50000 were to be made) Dec 28 03:43:46 As in open-sourcing efforts for closed wifi and GPS solutions Dec 28 03:45:41 Reducing cost in devices produced in low volumes is hard. Dec 28 03:46:03 For example. Yes, OM could slash the RAM in half, and code their software to cope with that. Dec 28 03:46:47 But that would mean more effort on the software side, and it won't take that many man-hours before the saving of $2000 on 1000 units is eaten up. Dec 28 03:47:21 And those man-hours are then wasted when the next model comes along with more RAM. Dec 28 03:49:36 My goal is to produce a free phone oriented to developing countries Dec 28 03:49:46 Good luck. Dec 28 03:49:52 First obtain a million dollars. Dec 28 03:49:57 Then get back to us. Dec 28 03:50:25 You absolutely can't do small volume electronics production at competitive rates. Dec 28 03:51:16 A lot can be learned from the OLPC project on that sort of stuff... Dec 28 03:51:19 I've estimated in the past that someone - who could obtain all the parts for the FR - and was very skilled in the art would be very lucky to get a 'working' (booting, but with a few issues) FR clone made for $2K for example. Dec 28 03:51:48 Of course - the next one would be only $400 or so. Dec 28 03:52:09 And 'can obtain all the parts' is a bitch. Dec 28 03:52:39 There is a local minima which you can get to fairly easily, which is buying modules for stuff. That greatly reduces your design effort. Dec 28 03:53:07 But, it boosts the price you will eventually be able to sell them for by 150-200%, and increases volume, weight, and power use. Dec 28 03:54:34 But a "free phone" for developing countries does not fit what Openmoko is all about -- such a phone would not run Linux, nor would it in any way need to be open, and certainly it wouldn't need accelerometers, or WIFI. Dec 28 03:54:43 yeah Dec 28 03:54:46 that Dec 28 03:55:41 That would be best handled, IMO, by purchasing the rights to an old model dumb phone from nokia or erricsen, after convincing them that such a project would be worthy of some sort of corporate sponsorship. Dec 28 03:55:53 Though that has problems too. Dec 28 03:56:06 some of the old chipsets are about to be - or have been EOLd. Dec 28 03:56:10 Nokia 3310! Dec 28 03:56:21 And you won't easily convince the makers to resurrect them. Dec 28 04:12:14 I asked this because of the high taxes on my country, such a device costs 660 dols here Dec 28 04:14:29 The best way would be to install a factory in the country, so you don't have to import it Dec 28 04:18:11 Well - no Dec 28 04:18:26 if imported equipment and components also incur taxes. Dec 28 04:18:40 Then it may work out as well making it in hong kong. Dec 28 04:19:12 are you in sweden? Dec 28 04:20:36 Argentina Dec 28 04:20:59 use the cad images an run a production yourself Dec 28 04:21:04 Does removing the touchscreen make the device cheaper? Dec 28 04:21:06 Slaxxer: can't Dec 28 04:21:11 Slaxxer: they have lots of missing stuff Dec 28 04:21:17 oo Dec 28 04:21:24 Slaxxer: for exmaple, PDFs won't import into EE software. Dec 28 04:21:27 that cant be right Dec 28 04:21:42 And they don't list what sort of component '10pf capacitor' is for example. Dec 28 04:21:56 Neglecting the IP rights. Dec 28 04:22:08 And the fact you won't be able to get calypso chips in onesies. Dec 28 04:22:20 well that just simply sucks Dec 28 04:23:37 The phone is open - the hardware design is even open. This doesn't automatically give the rights to copy it. Dec 28 04:27:55 Does removing the touchscreen and adding buttons instead make the device cheaper? Dec 28 04:28:08 Not really. Dec 28 04:28:13 the touchscreen isn't expensive. Dec 28 04:29:11 nicfer: basically - first to get the same sort of price, you will need to make >50 devices. And that's to hit the cost of buying them. And neglecting import duties, as that'll add to the components the same way. Dec 28 04:29:30 And that's to meet the price - not to make it cheaper than it. And leaving no profit Dec 28 04:31:06 Bigger screens are expensiver Dec 28 04:31:47 you want to build an OpenMoko Dec 28 04:31:48 ? Dec 28 04:31:55 er, and OM device Dec 28 04:32:48 Do I have face of manufacturer? Dec 28 04:33:12 I've never seen your face ;-) Dec 28 04:40:39 i had to load up windows :( Dec 28 05:45:47 !logs Dec 28 05:45:49 Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at: Dec 28 05:45:50 http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko Dec 28 05:45:51 Live-logs are available at Dec 28 05:45:52 http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog Dec 28 05:45:54 See ?? help-logs for usage instructions Dec 28 09:05:27 I managed to get debian installed, but it fails to start zhone. Only X with "trayer" at the top. does anyone have a hint ? Dec 28 09:09:31 im still trying to get QTextended 4.4.2 to boot from the sd card, without much luck Dec 28 11:05:12 hi, is there any way to creare an ipk without the toolchain? Dec 28 11:37:00 finnarne: what does zhone print to stdout? Dec 28 11:42:38 ahoi Dec 28 11:44:01 matey Dec 28 12:11:04 I'm playing around with my BleuTooth keyboard, and keep getting 'no route to host' when doing hidd --connect. What's up with that message? Dec 28 12:19:27 is there any way to avoid qemu when building _anything_ with OE? Dec 28 12:20:32 yes, i can't remember the make option but there is a build everything except qemu, check the wiki Dec 28 12:20:59 OE or OM wiki? Dec 28 12:21:06 om wiki Dec 28 12:21:42 i think it was build stack or something Dec 28 12:23:44 pretty hard to find anything useful in the wiki :( Dec 28 12:43:10 mahlzeit Dec 28 13:00:38 thomasg: just go to openmoko.org and search for qemu and go to the qemu page Dec 28 13:03:11 Ok, this may have solved my problem... This is the script I'm using at the moment: http://pastebin.com/m4dc40427 Dec 28 13:03:26 I'll put it on the WIki, perhaps other people find it usefull... Dec 28 13:59:53 lindi-: http://paste.debian.net/24595 Dec 28 14:24:08 sorry how do you close an application in openmoko? (2008.x) Dec 28 14:24:38 nvm, got it :) Dec 28 14:24:58 Unplug the USB, unplug the battery, wait 5 mins, ... :) Dec 28 14:25:08 USB networking isn't working for me, like it was in Qtopia Dec 28 14:25:17 is there something I need to activate somewhere? Dec 28 14:25:17 :/ Dec 28 14:26:35 StealthCP: modprobe usbnet; modprobe cdc_ether? Dec 28 14:27:37 hmm Dec 28 14:27:56 ..I don't have networking yet, so I can't get a terminal lol Dec 28 14:28:04 StealthCP: on pc :) Dec 28 14:31:30 nope, windows computer Dec 28 14:31:58 networking worked fine on both linux and windows when I was running Qtopia yesterday and the day before Dec 28 14:34:47 heh Dec 28 14:34:54 I just phoned my phone Dec 28 14:34:56 and it worked Dec 28 14:35:12 2008.12 doesn't seem so bad after all :P Dec 28 14:35:20 self.call(self) Dec 28 14:35:21 :-p Dec 28 14:36:20 finnarne: google finds http://www.mail-archive.com/smartphones-userland@linuxtogo.org/msg00450.html Dec 28 14:36:22 StealthCP you have the windows drivers? Dec 28 14:36:27 yep Dec 28 14:36:31 like I said it worked before Dec 28 14:36:36 on Qtopia Dec 28 14:37:08 qtopia and the other images can use a different id, so install the same drivers for the new device if required Dec 28 14:37:10 I'm getting a "Network cable unplugged" sort of message Dec 28 14:37:33 no it picked up on it being the same device as before, so same network device in Windows and so on Dec 28 14:37:47 only it appears as if there's no connection Dec 28 14:39:03 well i can remember ages ago that qtopia used a different device id so it would be a different network device wen qtpia used it, it still used the same driver but windows saw it differently Dec 28 14:39:54 I'll remove the devices then Dec 28 14:40:25 perhaps reboot windows Dec 28 14:40:32 done Dec 28 14:40:48 like I said, it detects the phone and everything like before Dec 28 14:40:53 (and same on Linux) Dec 28 14:41:08 on Windows, I get "cable unplugged" malarky Dec 28 14:41:23 on Linux, the equivilent (device is there but no connection) Dec 28 14:41:55 i had that a while ago and now everything works fine so i can't remember what i did, the usb networking on windows had something written about it Dec 28 14:43:43 StealthCP: did you reboot the device while it was plugged in? or plugged it few times over? Dec 28 14:45:26 what I've done is removed the devices from device manager, rebooted the phone, connected a cable, installed the driver, and same thing happens Dec 28 14:45:43 brand new device under networking, with the appearance of cable unplugged Dec 28 14:46:04 upgradeing the kernel or having a different kernel to the rest of the modules can beak things Dec 28 14:46:37 I've flashed both the rootfs and kernel from the om2008.12 files Dec 28 14:47:04 ok it can't be that then Dec 28 14:48:47 anyone played with matchbox-stroke yet? http://matchbox-project.org/?p=1 - looks really cool Dec 28 14:53:21 Defiant-: So.... Handwriting recognition? Dec 28 14:53:32 Now THERE'S a big project. :P Dec 28 14:54:01 Speech recognition Dec 28 14:54:07 Defiant-: yes, a bit Dec 28 14:54:07 Digital_Pioneer: looks more then a palm graffiti variant then handwriting Dec 28 14:54:24 Defiant-: once I found the guide Dec 28 14:54:24 Heheh Dec 28 14:54:30 Defiant-: it's older than grafiti I think Dec 28 14:54:33 yeah grafiti would be nice to have Dec 28 14:54:35 it's a simple recogniser Dec 28 14:54:42 SpeedEvil: Is there any good speech recognition for FR yet? Dec 28 14:54:45 take the inputted gluyph Dec 28 14:55:10 project it onto a 3*3 grid (constrained to be no more than 1.5* high than wide) Dec 28 14:55:12 looks like matchbox-stroke uses a 3x raster Dec 28 14:55:14 yes Dec 28 14:55:26 then match with a set of regexes Dec 28 14:55:47 It's surprisingly good. Dec 28 14:55:57 I got sidetracked into trying to design my own glyph set. Dec 28 14:56:29 SpeedEvil: currently trying to copy the palm one. Juse running into a problem with D/B Dec 28 14:56:50 IMO, the xstroke one doesn't look bad Dec 28 14:57:14 the xstroke author popped up here a few months ago Dec 28 14:58:45 qwo doesn't look bad either. http://qwo.projects.openmoko.org/ Dec 28 14:59:44 but I think the stroke one is the cooler approach Dec 28 15:00:15 no I still can't get this working, it's annoying me Dec 28 15:00:55 how/where is wifi configuration? Dec 28 15:01:03 under settings I can only see Bluetooth and GPS Dec 28 15:07:30 oh my, it's working now Dec 28 15:18:38 freesmartphone.org: 03morphis * r328 10/trunk/python-elementary/ (21 files in 5 dirs): Dec 28 15:18:38 freesmartphone.org: Many new stuff Dec 28 15:18:38 freesmartphone.org: - new widgets Dec 28 15:18:38 freesmartphone.org: - documentation Dec 28 15:18:38 freesmartphone.org: - testing Dec 28 15:20:16 but no ssh.. Dec 28 15:26:09 working Dec 28 15:26:12 * StealthCP sighs Dec 28 15:29:44 <|Marco|_> StealthCP: what distro ? Dec 28 15:29:58 2008.12 Dec 28 15:30:02 <|Marco|_> ah Dec 28 15:30:22 how is SHR anyway? Dec 28 15:30:35 what do I miss by changing to that? Dec 28 15:31:31 <|Marco|_> well, I'd like the wifi manager from 2008 in shr, or just a grafical one at all that works Dec 28 15:31:35 freesmartphone.org: 03w-fso 07zhone * rcf48d98b8e99 10/src/zhone: Dec 28 15:31:35 freesmartphone.org: Enhance the display of GPS data in zhone: Dec 28 15:31:35 freesmartphone.org: - the left page shows GPS time, fix status, course, speed and climb rate too Dec 28 15:31:35 freesmartphone.org: - the middle page shows its data in a tabular form which is much easier to read and comprehend Dec 28 15:31:37 freesmartphone.org: - the right page shows satellites with elevation 90 in the middle of the sky instead of at the horizon Dec 28 15:33:25 freesmartphone.org: 03morphis * r329 10/trunk/python-elementary/ (elementary/__init__.py tests/test.py): Fix IdentationError and missing function call Dec 28 15:34:38 <- that there w-fso :) Dec 28 15:38:02 wifi manager?! is there such a thing Dec 28 15:38:53 there is a thing that displays ESSIDs of wlans in the area and lets you select one Dec 28 15:38:59 <|Marco|_> Shlee: a few.. not all very stable Dec 28 15:43:48 how do I change the input method? Dec 28 15:43:57 to a _standard_ on screen keyboard Dec 28 15:44:17 and not predictive rubbish (I'm trying to type www) Dec 28 15:55:54 root@om-gta02:~# opkg install minimo Dec 28 15:55:54 Collected errors: Dec 28 15:55:54 * Could not obtain administrative lock Dec 28 15:56:00 what's locking it? Dec 28 15:58:19 Some other instance of opkg? Maybe some stale file? Dec 28 15:59:06 well I've rebooted it Dec 28 16:01:03 oh this is just incredibly stupid, dunno if it's Windows but even after unplugging the phone from USB it still thinks the damn thing is connected Dec 28 16:16:16 okay, made a few calls to the om2008.12 on Freerunner, and a few things I noticed (thank god for free calls) Dec 28 16:16:42 well, call quality seems to be pretty good, it's clear on either end as far as I can tell Dec 28 16:17:56 made one call from my other mobile. This caused signal noise for the neo, which would be heard in the receiver end of the other phone Dec 28 16:18:34 so if I walk past or near other mobile users I'll get that interference when I'm on a call (or at least the other person will) Dec 28 16:20:38 StealthCP: yes, that is expected - the GSM buzz problem does not care where the GSM signal comes from. Dec 28 16:21:24 of course Dec 28 16:21:43 this could (have) be(en) solved by.. sheilding? Dec 28 16:25:05 StealthCP: shielding isn't an answer. Dec 28 16:25:38 StealthCP: it's an answer - but only in the sense that you can improve your cars ride smoothness by adding 48 tons of concrete. Dec 28 16:26:23 what do other phones do then? Dec 28 16:27:03 it's easy to see how phones affect so much electronic equipment, including planes etc Dec 28 16:28:00 To use the above analogy, they improve the ride by optimising the suspension. Dec 28 16:28:57 Shielding is a partial answer - but it doesn't work fully if you've got wires coming into and out of the shield. Dec 28 16:29:25 you need to actually do design, and thorough testing to see where voltage is induced, and if it's gooing to be a problem. Dec 28 16:32:20 In this case, Om has found where the problem is introduced (and sheilding cannot fix it), and they have figured out how to do a field hardware repair - but it is difficult for most. Dec 28 16:32:23 ok. well is there any shielding of that kind in the Freerunner? Dec 28 16:32:35 i seee Dec 28 16:32:57 Yes, the entire audio section is under a metal can in the device. Dec 28 16:33:20 The problem is that the GSM signal is carried in via a wire that goes to the headphone - so you cannot shield it. Dec 28 16:34:50 Complicating the problem is that it does not appear unless the GSM is transmitting at relatively high power, and thus you need to be some distance from a tower for it to happen -- this is why it was not detected early. (and yes, that SHOULD have been a test to have run, but it was not, it appears) Dec 28 16:35:11 also frequency band matters Dec 28 16:35:47 and it requires _really_ expensive test kit to simulate a GSM base-station, if you don't happen to be in a country with that frequency band so you can test it in real life Dec 28 16:39:21 freesmartphone.org: 03morphis * r330 10/trunk/python-elementary/elementary/elementary.c_elementary.pyx: Add Toggle.state_get() to get the current state of a Toogle Widget Dec 28 16:46:04 how to export contacts with addressbook? Dec 28 16:48:44 root@om-gta02:~# opkg install minimo Dec 28 16:48:44 An error ocurred, return value: 2. Dec 28 16:48:54 * StealthCP is not sure where to go aftre this error Dec 28 16:49:13 basic troubleshooting. Dec 28 16:49:35 ok, but Dec 28 16:49:48 a) do not assume that opkg provides useful messages; so this may very well be a simple "that package doesn't exist" or "I can't reach the URL" problem :) Dec 28 16:49:53 http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Opkg#Error_Codes Dec 28 16:50:00 b) opkg list minimo Dec 28 16:50:07 or opkg list | grep minimo Dec 28 16:50:16 then you can try opkg download minimo Dec 28 16:50:27 that will determine if it can download it from the repo Dec 28 16:51:05 and if all that works, then it might be package corruption - opkg install ./ might provide more info. Dec 28 16:51:08 got there :) Dec 28 16:51:20 ok, will try that Dec 28 16:52:05 At any time the "verbosity" options to opkg can be used to make it provide a bit more detail on what its doing. Dec 28 16:52:45 I used them, but I didn't know what the error code meant, the wiki helped me there Dec 28 16:56:24 hi!!! Dec 28 16:57:07 i'm very tired, i have rererererereflash my nfr Dec 28 16:57:21 now i have the 2008.9 Dec 28 16:57:30 FDOM i think Dec 28 16:57:50 but now the usb dont work Dec 28 16:57:59 there's no wifi option Dec 28 16:58:11 :( Dec 28 16:58:58 i want a testing version (like lenny in debian) that works Dec 28 16:59:27 what i need to download? please Dec 28 17:00:13 leia_20: tried fso? Dec 28 17:00:19 yes Dec 28 17:00:33 is the worst ... for me Dec 28 17:00:49 it havent a option to turn of the wifi Dec 28 17:00:54 off Dec 28 17:01:13 afaict there are nearly no working wifi guis. Dec 28 17:01:38 maybe but almost that can turn off Dec 28 17:02:38 any recomendation? i want that my nfr will be my daily phone Dec 28 17:02:51 i want shell Dec 28 17:02:52 who doesn't... Dec 28 17:03:00 leia_20: tried SHR? Dec 28 17:03:06 ummm Dec 28 17:03:09 2008.8? Dec 28 17:03:14 try rebooting once Dec 28 17:03:16 nope SHR Dec 28 17:03:26 do you know what is default password of openmoko-testing-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2 ? I see in wiki password is blank but blank(just enter) don't work Dec 28 17:03:36 http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-testing/images/neo1973/?C=M;O=D Dec 28 17:03:53 shr ... ok, i'll try Dec 28 17:04:02 flash one more time ... Dec 28 17:04:10 use shr from the 15th Dec 28 17:04:21 Milad: it should be blank. how are you trying to connect? Dec 28 17:04:36 leia_20: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Jokes third joke ;-) Dec 28 17:04:50 henk, ssh Dec 28 17:05:08 henk, ssh -l root -v 192.168.0.202 Dec 28 17:05:34 shr-lite-image-om-gta02.jffs2 or penmoko-shr-lite-image-glibc-ipk--20081216-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2 Dec 28 17:06:06 i would go 1 day earlier an dont use lite Dec 28 17:06:38 shr-image-om-gta02.jffs2 ?? Dec 28 17:06:46 some say to use nand erase before flashing Dec 28 17:06:53 yup Dec 28 17:06:57 ok Dec 28 17:07:03 downloading Dec 28 17:07:24 an a new kernel from that page Dec 28 17:07:52 say me Dec 28 17:08:11 u may want to use 20098.12 Dec 28 17:08:17 2008.12 Dec 28 17:08:34 works? Dec 28 17:08:49 hard to add applicatations to shr Dec 28 17:08:56 ... Dec 28 17:09:06 nothing better? Dec 28 17:09:11 2008.12 does work Dec 28 17:09:11 Slaxxin: hard? opkg install.... Dec 28 17:09:36 maybe it was just me Dec 28 17:09:39 ok, 2008.12 kernel ... searching Dec 28 17:10:18 if u install shr be sure to use the kernel from shr page Dec 28 17:10:25 this 12http://shr.bearstech.com/shr-testing/images/om-gta02/ ? Dec 28 17:10:35 latest.bin Dec 28 17:10:37 ? Dec 28 17:10:57 zorkman u had no troubles with installing apps on shr? Dec 28 17:11:23 henk, do you know any clue how to add default route in GUI ? Dec 28 17:11:27 leia yup[ Dec 28 17:11:43 ok, thanks! Dec 28 17:12:02 freesmartphone.org: 03morphis * r331 10/trunk/python-elementary/ (elementary/elementary.c_elementary.pyx tests/test.py): Dec 28 17:12:03 Milad: no, sorry Dec 28 17:12:08 zorkman? Dec 28 17:12:10 :) Dec 28 17:12:14 Slaxxin: none whatsover Dec 28 17:12:21 really Dec 28 17:12:38 yeah.. honestly, what kind of problems did you ahve? Dec 28 17:12:40 *have Dec 28 17:12:54 sometiems i have to edit a *.desktop file but that's about it... Dec 28 17:13:15 i have never had shr accept any packages to work through opkg Dec 28 17:13:32 they install but dont work Dec 28 17:13:44 oh fuck Dec 28 17:13:49 upon opkg upgrade Dec 28 17:13:57 the ssh daemon restarted Dec 28 17:14:05 eddectively terminating the application Dec 28 17:14:11 eff* Dec 28 17:14:18 Slaxxin: strange... never encountered that behavious and have been using SHR for some time now.... Dec 28 17:14:33 StealthCP: just opkg upgrade from your FR Dec 28 17:14:49 ok i will do it again Dec 28 17:14:52 what terminal program should I install? Dec 28 17:15:21 qemu+wine+hyperterminal. Dec 28 17:15:54 StealthCP: i use vala-terminal on my SHR Dec 28 17:16:18 I'm using 2008.12 here, I'm guessing that package is available for it too? Dec 28 17:16:21 on 2008.x i thinkg you can use openmoko-terminal2 or xterm or some other terminal of your choice Dec 28 17:16:41 StealthCP: just do an opkg list |grep terminal Dec 28 17:16:48 and then choose the one you want and opkg install it Dec 28 17:16:50 yep Dec 28 17:23:40 anyone watch harald welte's presentation? Dec 28 17:23:51 at the ccc, just minutes ago Dec 28 17:23:54 wuz interesting Dec 28 17:24:35 igor321: cccp? Dec 28 17:24:53 no, that's former soviet superstate Dec 28 17:25:00 i mean chaos computer conference Dec 28 17:25:02 * SpeedEvil sighs. Dec 28 17:25:27 * SpeedEvil has trouble believing presentations. Dec 28 17:25:31 http://events.ccc.de/congress/2008/Fahrplan/events/3008.en.html Dec 28 17:25:32 igor321: I know what cccp is, ccc wasn't familiar Dec 28 17:25:49 Tm_T: i kno u kno :P Dec 28 17:25:56 SpeedEvil: it was all true Dec 28 17:26:51 There is truth - as believed by the person at the time. Dec 28 17:27:03 And then there is truth in reality 3 months down the line. Dec 28 17:27:30 i dunno man, all i heard was objective and absolute truth Dec 28 17:28:55 igor321: oh - from that summary, I think I could pretty much answer 'yes' to the tagline. Dec 28 17:29:11 'Do you know the architecture of contemporary mobile phone hardware?' Dec 28 17:29:21 It is an interesting topic Dec 28 17:29:28 I was assuming it was to do with OM future. Dec 28 17:29:57 naaah, no such topic there :) Dec 28 17:29:57 Which for reasons others may not understand, I feel that presentations may not reflect later reality. Dec 28 17:30:42 he no longer works for the company, so i don't think he would hold such a presentation anyway Dec 28 17:31:08 busy with gnufiish these days, i think Dec 28 17:31:08 * SpeedEvil isn't keeping up. Dec 28 17:31:19 (on who's left) Dec 28 17:33:04 * SpeedEvil finds that http://gnufiish.org/ does not enlighten him. Dec 28 17:34:08 try http://git.gnufiish.org/ Dec 28 17:34:33 basically it's about running linux on the glofiish phones Dec 28 17:34:51 * SpeedEvil has never heard of those. Dec 28 17:34:53 they are really similar to gta2, but have 3.5g, keyboard Dec 28 17:34:59 stuff like that Dec 28 17:35:02 ah Dec 28 17:36:09 same soc as gta02 and devices that mostly already have linux drivers Dec 28 17:36:50 it's gonna make the 4 glofiish owners that like linux very happy ;) Dec 28 17:37:07 igor321: what's 3.5g? Dec 28 17:37:18 bumbl: hsdpa Dec 28 17:37:22 ah ok Dec 28 17:37:34 i would have called that 3g too Dec 28 17:37:53 i'd call it 4g myself Dec 28 17:38:01 it's _much_ faster Dec 28 17:38:06 it is yes Dec 28 17:38:15 and it has by far better pings Dec 28 17:45:19 igor321: all 4 of them, huh? Wow! Dec 28 17:45:22 :D Dec 28 17:45:48 mwester: yeah :) Dec 28 17:49:36 rosetta also looks like a nice input method. More mature then matchbox-stroke http://www.handhelds.org/project/rosetta/ Dec 28 18:10:28 anyone here who can help me with om 2008.12? Dec 28 18:19:28 seameat: just ask Dec 28 18:19:58 oh, well, i was wondering how to register my sim under om 2008.12 Dec 28 18:20:20 also, my freerunner keeps going to sleep and refusing to wake up. any thoughts? Dec 28 18:26:34 seameat: register your sim? what do you mean? Dec 28 18:26:48 on the GSM network. so i can make calls Dec 28 18:27:19 seameat: suspend is a problem. but it should be less dramatic in 2008.12. are you running a late kernel and a late bootloader (either qi or a recent u-boot)? Dec 28 18:27:34 that should happen all by itself afaik... Dec 28 18:28:11 i am running whatever is default bootloader, all i flashed was rootfs and uImage Dec 28 18:28:52 and it sometimes suspends when i am in the middle of navigating the menus Dec 28 18:29:51 try upgrading the boot loader. and always boot via the bootloader in nand. afaihh the bootloader plays a role in that whole suspend/wakup-problem... Dec 28 18:30:30 oooh ok, i didn't know, i'll try upgrading that now Dec 28 18:30:55 do you have a recommendation on bootloader choice? Dec 28 18:31:56 i like qi. simple, fast, ... but a recent u-boot is probably more useful and perhaps the 'more supported' way. Dec 28 18:32:11 sorry, can't tell any more about it. Dec 28 18:32:19 ok thanks Dec 28 18:36:58 it's going to be the file called gta02v5_and_up-u-boot.bin, right? Dec 28 18:38:04 yes Dec 28 18:38:09 alright great Dec 28 18:43:33 you said a minute ago to always boot via bootloader in NAND... how is that different from just booting by holding power button? why is it important? Dec 28 18:47:53 seameat: as i said: bootloader influences suspend/resume. so using the nor u-boot (which is old, as it can't be updated so easily) might make problems while using the recent u-boot in nand might help with those problems. holding the button makes the nand bootloader 'boot' (as in the menu 'boot') Dec 28 18:48:08 ok great Dec 28 18:48:18 thanks for your patience, henk Dec 28 18:48:53 you're welcome Dec 28 18:50:39 aww damn. still went into suspend mode Dec 28 18:50:41 :/ Dec 28 18:51:29 maybe i'll try a different distro Dec 28 18:52:26 perhaps other kernel will already help Dec 28 18:53:13 perhaps Dec 28 18:53:16 i'll try that Dec 28 18:58:38 I'm afraid an opkg upgrade has buggered X up Dec 28 18:58:49 on 2008.12 Dec 28 18:58:59 I had the um Dec 28 18:59:06 Angstrom Repository added Dec 28 18:59:08 was that wise? Dec 28 19:08:11 well looks like I'm going to have to reflash now anyway, unless someone can suggest an alternative Dec 28 19:08:24 might try out Android this time or SHR Dec 28 19:09:51 actually, I'll explain what I want from the phone, I'd like TangoGPS, a browser (probably minimo), media player, and well if it receives calls and texts, that's a plus bonus Dec 28 19:10:50 should I stick with 2008.12 or would SHR be any better? (I noticed SHR seems more advanced at times than 2008.12, what with GSM multiplexing and all) Dec 28 19:32:23 hi all Dec 28 19:34:16 Hi Mortak, how's it going? Dec 28 19:35:01 jonkristian: hi :) fine, and self? Dec 28 19:35:35 I'm building shr atm, this time it actually seems to work. Had some patch problems earlier, like a month ago. Dec 28 19:36:47 jonkristian: yesterday i testet it too, but didnt work. in a few minutes i kick a hackable:1 on my sd card Dec 28 19:36:53 Not 100% fine, think I've had too much coffee today. Dec 28 19:37:11 Mortak: they've changed the makefile and wiki afaik, just half an hour ago. Dec 28 19:37:28 So you might get lucky this time aswell;) Dec 28 19:37:40 jonkristian: but shr rocks, and my "An error ocurred, return value: -49936." error is gone Dec 28 19:37:49 sweet Dec 28 19:37:57 Using unstable or testing? Dec 28 19:38:04 yeah, i test it now :) Dec 28 19:38:16 i think stable Dec 28 19:38:43 Mortak: is the md5sum problem gone? Dec 28 19:39:14 jonkristian: ? Dec 28 19:39:19 sec Dec 28 19:39:41 maybe i was drunken :) Dec 28 19:39:42 Package libframeworkd-glib0 md5sum mismatch. Dec 28 19:39:44 lol Dec 28 19:39:47 yeah, maybe Dec 28 19:40:08 oh, yeah, its resolved on opkg site, i think they put the crrect md5sum on the serers :) Dec 28 19:40:18 "opkg side" Dec 28 19:40:30 ok, any new updates recently? Dec 28 19:40:35 many many typos, just ignore them Dec 28 19:40:51 yeah Dec 28 19:40:52 nope, nothing important i can remember Dec 28 19:41:47 alrighty Dec 28 19:43:34 do any of you know if different distributions are better at registering SIM cards on the GSM network than the openmoko distros? Dec 28 19:45:39 seameat: i tested 2008.12,fdom and shr, and all of them registered fine (now and then a reboot was required) Dec 28 19:46:30 hi again!! i have reflash, now i have shr, it's very very nice, but in Midory where is the direction bar? Dec 28 19:46:48 hmmm... i tried the default 2007.2, 2008.9, 2008.12 none of them register my sim Dec 28 19:47:23 what country are you in? Dec 28 19:47:46 USA Dec 28 19:47:53 and what network are you on? Dec 28 19:47:57 AT&T Dec 28 19:48:00 not 3g Dec 28 19:48:05 hmm, in germany it works :)# Dec 28 19:48:24 i see. hmm. Dec 28 19:49:02 SIM registration is a software issue, right? so potentially, different distros could do a better job than the openmoko ones, is this correct? Dec 28 19:49:23 could, if that's the problem Dec 28 19:49:28 ok Dec 28 19:50:23 i'll scour the wiki for info before i do anymore flashing :P Dec 28 19:50:27 jonkristian: makeing image too, now :) Dec 28 19:50:36 "making" Dec 28 19:53:52 what means: "NOTE: preferred version 2.2.1 of pidgin not available (for item pidgin)" ? Dec 28 19:54:22 is it in the image now, or not? hmm.. Dec 28 19:59:49 seameat: Does your phone not recognize the SIM? Dec 28 20:00:46 Digital_Pioneer, no it doesnt Dec 28 20:01:10 Digital_Pioneer, when i was on Om 2007.2, it just kept trying to register, ad infinitum Dec 28 20:01:19 seameat: Mine didn't either, until I flashed a new GSM firmware. Dec 28 20:01:40 Hmm, on mine, ophonekitd simply said there was no SIM and exited. Dec 28 20:01:47 ah, that solved it for you, huh? Dec 28 20:01:50 Yeah. Dec 28 20:02:05 But note that a new distro is NOT a new GSM firmware. Dec 28 20:02:08 ok, and all the info for doing that is on openmoko.org wiki, right? Dec 28 20:02:13 ok good to know Dec 28 20:02:18 Yeah. Dec 28 20:02:52 seameat: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/GSM/Flashing Dec 28 20:03:14 fantastic Dec 28 20:05:04 Hello, is it possible to have multiple root filesystems on the same physical root filesystem? Dec 28 20:05:49 kW: like, unionfs? Dec 28 20:06:16 zash__: more like chroot configurable in the kernel command line Dec 28 20:06:31 kW: just use initramfs or something to configure it Dec 28 20:06:58 kW: or write /sbin/init -wrapper that does chroot and then runs real init if you are really allergic to initramfs Dec 28 20:07:04 zash__: I'd like to have multiple distributions on my SDcard but I do not want to create a partition for each of them Dec 28 20:07:34 lindi-: mhh Dec 28 20:08:27 kW: initramfs already has code for parsing /proc/cmdline Dec 28 20:08:46 kW: so you want to reuse it even if you don't general initramfs Dec 28 20:08:51 s/general/generate/ Dec 28 20:08:52 lindi- meant: kW: so you want to reuse it even if you don't generate initramfs Dec 28 20:09:16 i use dirty symlinks to do that ;) Dec 28 20:09:29 batchy: what runs chroot? Dec 28 20:09:54 nothing, i just symlinks /etc, /usr ... to somewhere else in the partition Dec 28 20:10:10 batchy: or does find / -maxdepth 1 include only symlink... Dec 28 20:10:11 ok Dec 28 20:10:34 batchy: that does not allow you to choose the distro with uboot menu entry Dec 28 20:10:45 no Dec 28 20:10:45 (or do you have some clever trick for that?) Dec 28 20:12:12 well i didn't tried to be able to choose distribution when booting Dec 28 20:12:45 as long as i can use nand to do that choice ;) Dec 28 20:17:38 Digital_Pioneer, that GSM flashing tutorial scares me. lol Dec 28 20:17:52 seameat: LOL, just SSH in and copy and paste. Dec 28 20:18:01 seameat: It scared me too. ;) Dec 28 20:18:05 Digital_Pioneer, hahaha Dec 28 20:18:39 Digital_Pioneer, you are uding the openmokoo distro? 2008.x? Dec 28 20:19:16 OM 2008.12 - when the screen goes dark a few seconds after you stop pressing buttons, how do you get back to the OS again? Dec 28 20:19:34 almien, i was just dealing with that today Dec 28 20:19:56 almien, i ended up rolling back to 2008.9 because in .12 it will not resume Dec 28 20:20:03 seameat: No, I use SHR. Dec 28 20:20:10 Digital_Pioneer, i see Dec 28 20:20:19 Digital_Pioneer, wifi work on SHR? Dec 28 20:20:26 seameat: Yes. Dec 28 20:20:29 Well... Dec 28 20:20:35 Yes, but mofi does not. :) Dec 28 20:20:46 Digital_Pioneer, lol. ok, thats fine, i just want wifi Dec 28 20:21:07 I suppose in reality, mofi does too, but udhcpcd or whatever the DHCP client is does not. Dec 28 20:21:26 So you have to use a static IP. At least I do. Dec 28 20:21:44 hi! Dec 28 20:21:48 oh i see Dec 28 20:21:51 wb leia Dec 28 20:22:13 how i permit ssh to my nfr by wifi? Dec 28 20:22:55 i've just been using usb networking so far. wifi is spotty in lots of distros, it seems. Dec 28 20:22:58 leia_20: you are using dropbear ssh server? Dec 28 20:23:05 seameat: spotty? Dec 28 20:23:08 yes Dec 28 20:23:24 leia_20: odd, i didn't do any special configuration for it to listen on all interfaces Dec 28 20:23:39 lindi-, yes, why, does your wifi work well? and what distro are you using? Dec 28 20:23:46 leia_20: netstat -alpn|grep :22 should show the address where it listens Dec 28 20:23:55 ok Dec 28 20:24:18 seameat: andy-tracking de473ca893c928 kernel Dec 28 20:24:30 o.O Dec 28 20:24:37 tcp 0 0 192.168.0.202:22 0.0.0.0:* LISTEN Dec 28 20:24:53 lindi-, i am not familiar with that one Dec 28 20:25:10 seameat: have used that for 12 days now, wlan seems to work quite well (had only one crash but i have not yet submitted a bug about that) Dec 28 20:25:40 lindi-, i see. where can i find that online to read about it? Dec 28 20:25:42 seameat: (it didn't crash the whole system, just printed kernel error message and stopped all wlan stuff) Dec 28 20:25:55 seameat: git.openmoko.org has linux-2.6 tree with andy-tracking branch Dec 28 20:26:20 leia_20: it seems to indeed be listening only on your usb0 address Dec 28 20:26:37 where i change this? Dec 28 20:26:38 leia_20: does ps axuf show that it is started with some special arguments? Dec 28 20:27:19 seameat: http://iki.fi/lindi/openmoko/kernel.txt has some oldish notes Dec 28 20:27:31 brb Dec 28 20:27:45 lindi-, ok, will read Dec 28 20:28:32 seameat: ah OK, so 2008.12 is just unusable then? Dec 28 20:28:54 seameat: i copied most of them to wiki to page development_environment or something Dec 28 20:28:57 hey. does the freerunner support fltk? i am not sure about that, cause i haven't got my freerunner yet... Dec 28 20:29:03 almien, for me it was. after 10 seconds of inactivity, it suspended without being able to resume Dec 28 20:29:28 root_at: fltk is software, freerunner is hardware :) are you trying to ask if om 2008.12 distro supports it? Dec 28 20:29:37 ok thanks. It also only has about 3 programs installed - FDOM had 20 or so, makes it seem quite bare Dec 28 20:30:10 does om2008.12 support it? and more important for me, does shr support it? Dec 28 20:30:38 almien, i havent tried fdom yet. just got my freerunner yesterday Dec 28 20:30:39 root_at: that i do not know sorry, i have not managed to compile it yet Dec 28 20:30:51 root_at: but i'm sure it works fine in debian :-) Dec 28 20:31:37 i read alot about the images, and i prefer shr up to now Dec 28 20:31:58 but thanks...may anyone else knows it? Dec 28 20:32:00 seameat: it's very good. the only reason I'm briefly trying 2008.12 was a problem getting USB networking in FDOM, not sure if it's just my laptop or the distro Dec 28 20:32:26 seameat: FDOM even comes with duke nukem (if you edit the config file to turn sound off) Dec 28 20:32:38 almien, i see. wow lol i love duke nukem! Dec 28 20:33:09 almien, is the fdom keyboard better than the om 2008.x keyboard? Dec 28 20:33:50 dunno, 2008.12 won't wake up to try it Dec 28 20:34:11 almien, lol Dec 28 20:34:31 its keyboard is pretty usable though. it has a terminal mode so you can actually do stuff with it (enter key, tab, escape, cursor keys, etc), but I'm wondering about getting an external keyboard for it Dec 28 20:34:35 almien, if you hold the power button for `8 seconds, it'll actually turn the phone off, then you can boot up again Dec 28 20:35:43 any idea how I can turn off the suspend within the first 10 seconds after booting it? Dec 28 20:39:13 almien, no, i tried going to the settings menu, and adjusting the setting for suspend, but it doesn't affect it Dec 28 20:40:05 almien, which kernel were you using with FDOM? i currently have the 2008.9 kernel installed Dec 28 20:41:22 seameat: no idea. I thought it came as a jffs image? Dec 28 20:41:40 almien, isnt that just the rootfs? Dec 28 20:42:47 almien, i am gonna flash the FDOM image now Dec 28 20:42:58 Does anybody know what these "-lowlevel.bin" files on http://downloads.openmoko.org/daily/testing/ are for? Dec 28 20:46:19 seameat: in that case, no idea - I didn't know you had to install kernel separately Dec 28 20:47:07 almien, probably just running whatever kernel came pre-installed, then, eh Dec 28 20:48:06 probably. where do you download newer ones from? Dec 28 20:48:08 cant find the shr irc channel : / can anyone tell me plz the adress? Dec 28 20:49:29 almien, the uImage.bin here is what I am using http://downloads.openmoko.org/releases/Om2008.9/ Dec 28 20:50:37 i back, how i permit ssh to the wifi of my nfr? in usb works fine, but not in wifi Dec 28 20:50:53 Digital_Pioneer, i just found out that the AT&T network in my area is having huge problems, so it might not be my GSM firmware... i'll wait for that to be resolved before flashing the GSM Dec 28 20:50:55 root_at: This IS the SHR IRC channel... :) Dec 28 20:51:08 leia_20: is your wifi up? Dec 28 20:51:08 seameat: Probably not a bad idea. :) Dec 28 20:51:09 o rly? oO Dec 28 20:51:09 leia_20: isnt there some iptables port? Dec 28 20:51:22 root_at: Yeah, I don't think there is a separate SHR channel. Dec 28 20:51:28 root_at, at least, its an all-inclusive OpenMoko phone channel Dec 28 20:51:30 root_at: What's your problem? Dec 28 20:51:43 does shr support fltk for sure? Dec 28 20:51:49 is recently flash to SHR, i dont know if had iptables, the wifi is on and working Dec 28 20:51:55 Well, that is fltk? :P Dec 28 20:52:08 has Dec 28 20:52:11 a toolkit for gui Dec 28 20:52:12 leia_20: you can ping google or something? Dec 28 20:52:14 (sorry for my english) Dec 28 20:52:18 yes Dec 28 20:52:26 or ping your desktop / laptop? Dec 28 20:52:31 yes Dec 28 20:52:38 the wifi is working fine Dec 28 20:52:53 Digital_Pioneer: like gtk...but not that big Dec 28 20:53:01 root_at: Technically, if it runs on any distro, it should run on SHR too... But it may not always work out so nicely. :P Dec 28 20:53:20 ii think it for the dropbear Dec 28 20:53:54 ok in 2008.12 I dunno how to bring the keyboard up, or toggle it, where is the button to do so? Dec 28 20:54:09 Digital_Pioneer: yeah and this is my problem. i am waiting for my freerunner, and i would like to learn programming a gui now, but i dont know which cause i am not sure if my freerunner will support it : / Dec 28 20:54:38 4[undrwater4] any idea? Dec 28 20:55:13 ouch Dec 28 20:55:15 isnt there an ircchan from the shr-devs? Dec 28 20:55:38 root_at: Well, I'll search for a package. Hold on. Dec 28 20:55:58 leia_20: can you restart dropbear? Dec 28 20:56:05 cool, thanks in advance :) Dec 28 20:56:10 yes, i have do that many times Dec 28 20:56:17 leia_20: what's the message from the pc? Dec 28 20:56:34 root_at: Doesn't appear to be a package for it. Dec 28 20:56:56 connection refused Dec 28 20:57:21 F*CK! no more tickets for 25C3 Dec 28 20:57:30 DocScrutinizer, ? Dec 28 20:57:36 Digital_Pioneer: thanks..hmm...i will try to ask an dev, just to be sure. Dec 28 20:57:48 DocScrutinizer: yeah :( Dec 28 20:57:57 root_at: OK. GL Dec 28 20:59:04 Can I get a real BASH on my FR? Curses upon this stupid busybox joke... Dec 28 20:59:13 won't travel to Berlin, to stand a queue at 8PM, and learn day-tickets are sold out and I can give away my SMT-components in front of the entrance in the cold Dec 28 21:00:17 DocScrutinizer: its too crowded there, i`ll watch some of the feeds, or wait for the torrents :) Dec 28 21:00:49 Digital_Pioneer, it's best to SSH for most of your terminal needs... no '/' key on keyboard, at least on om 2007.2, 2008.x Dec 28 21:01:05 ok, so right this moment I'll cancel my plans to meet some of you guys there. Sorry Dec 28 21:01:26 seameat: I do. I guess SSH has real bash somehow... Dec 28 21:01:40 But I do use the terminal on the phone every now and then, and it SUCKS. Dec 28 21:01:42 I have a problem with gprs. Everything works well for a while, then all the GSM engine blocks and I have to reboor my FR to have back GSM and GPRS working again. Anyone experienced the same problem? (I am running Debian/FSO) Dec 28 21:01:43 DocScrutinizer: ^^ Dec 28 21:02:04 * mwester wonders why Digital_Pioneer doesn't just do "opkg install bash" ? Dec 28 21:02:15 anybody asking for big-C components please send me a mail instead. Dec 28 21:02:17 mwester: Because that package doesn't exist. Dec 28 21:02:23 ooooooooh good call. didnt know you could, mwester Dec 28 21:02:31 or not Dec 28 21:02:35 :/ Dec 28 21:02:36 It's in the angstrom feeds Dec 28 21:02:55 and someone should just ask to have it put in the FSO/SHR/OM feeds ;) Dec 28 21:03:06 I'm asking. Dec 28 21:03:25 "no GPS found" i hate that! Dec 28 21:03:37 by "ask", of course I meant to open a ticket in the usual fashion for the distro in question ;) Dec 28 21:04:06 Oh, I'm too lazy for that... Dec 28 21:04:15 Digital_Pioneer, oh geez Dec 28 21:04:19 Digital_Pioneer, lol Dec 28 21:04:20 then you don't *really* want bash. Dec 28 21:04:21 LOL Dec 28 21:04:58 i hope my FDOM flash finishes soon... i have to go to work shortly Dec 28 21:05:33 "to stand a queue at 8PM" s/PM/AM/ Dec 28 21:07:03 seameat: I didn't care for FDOM much... It's the same as OM, except with a ton of apps you don't want. Dec 28 21:07:19 Digital_Pioneer, lol i see Dec 28 21:07:27 mwester: Sure I do, I just go find this Angstrom thing... Dec 28 21:07:45 Digital_Pioneer, some users seem to think certain features work better in FDOM than OM Dec 28 21:08:06 seameat: *Shrug* I just use SHR, and don't worry about it. :) Dec 28 21:08:33 heh. its quite likely i'll try 4 or 5 more distros before i settle on one Dec 28 21:11:00 does anyone know where e is accessing the touch screen? Dec 28 21:11:21 tslib ;) Dec 28 21:11:46 undrwater: Perhaps /dev/input/touchscreen0?' Dec 28 21:12:34 Digital_Pioneer: i'm trying to troubleshoot a zaurus...trying to use FR for help in that arena... Dec 28 21:12:58 can't get touch screen to work on Z...is there a config file or a file from E that uses the /dev/input? Dec 28 21:13:10 I don't even know what a zaurus is... Dec 28 21:13:49 e use X's mouse Dec 28 21:14:05 (which use tslib on openmoko) Dec 28 21:14:36 Wow, huge upgrades... Dec 28 21:14:53 can someone help me with a usb-rj45 adaptor? the lsusb show 0a46:9601 Davicom Semiconductor and dmesg new full speed USB device using s3c2410-ohci and address 70 Dec 28 21:15:11 but no new interface Dec 28 21:18:11 any idea? Dec 28 21:19:07 lindi-: thx. looks like there is a problem building zhone. it failed at my end as well... Dec 28 21:20:24 Digital_Pioneer: zaurus is linux PDA Dec 28 21:20:25 I'm really not sure what is better to use, SHR or om2008 Dec 28 21:20:39 undrwater: Hmm, cool. Dec 28 21:20:41 seems most use SHR. Dec 28 21:20:49 I wouldn't tag om2008 usable... Dec 28 21:21:00 not even 2008.12? Dec 28 21:21:02 Digital_Pioneer: made by Sharp Dec 28 21:21:15 bear in mind I haven't tried SHR yet Dec 28 21:21:24 i'll make sure tslib is where it's supposed to be Dec 28 21:21:28 and even then there seems to be choice (stable, unstable, testing) Dec 28 21:21:36 StealthCP: I guess it depends on what you want. I use everything but the gsm. Most user seem to want vice versa Dec 28 21:22:06 Digital_Pioneer: fltk seems to work: http://www.mail-archive.com/fltk-dev@easysw.com/msg00835.html just wanted to let you know that...but i am still not sure whats about shr Dec 28 21:22:06 earlier someone said it was hard to add software to SHR, so I immediately skipped trying that Dec 28 21:22:18 and Android didn't seem to even start booting for me Dec 28 21:24:12 Ugh, curse those blasted md5sum mismatches... Dec 28 21:25:36 oh swell, I guess I'm trying SHR now Dec 28 21:25:59 though I want to know what's difficult about 'adding software' or whatever it is Dec 28 21:27:46 StealthCP: I've had little trouble adding programs to my SHR. Dec 28 21:28:10 ok. where should I look first? Dec 28 21:28:33 I'll not bother building my own image - I don't honestly see the point Dec 28 21:28:44 but unstable/testing, what do you use? Dec 28 21:29:50 StealthCP: Uhh, I use stable I think. Dec 28 21:30:16 you think? Dec 28 21:31:51 StealthCP: go for testing =] Dec 28 21:31:57 I just downloaded the latest one in the directory I was linked to. :) Dec 28 21:32:13 sicu, what's up with testing? :P Dec 28 21:32:25 also I don't want to have daily updates of all packages Dec 28 21:32:32 and things should 'work' Dec 28 21:32:38 that's why I was considering unstable Dec 28 21:33:32 that's why you should go for testing ;p Dec 28 21:33:37 unstable is unstable ;p Dec 28 21:35:07 if I'm not mistaken (I'm not a debian fan) testing is more unstable than unstable? Dec 28 21:35:40 is it not stable, unstable, testing, experimental? Dec 28 21:36:46 unstable has all those new bright and shiny features Dec 28 21:37:28 testing/unstable I fail to see the point in that. There's either unstable or there's stable. Dec 28 21:38:28 I thought that was what branches in git were for;p Dec 28 21:39:02 well ... i guess it'll stay 'testing' until such a time they deem it worty of a release and will then become stable Dec 28 21:45:21 did I miss anything? Dec 28 21:45:41 missed everything after my last line, I hate running out of memory on this thing Dec 28 21:46:03 nope, nothing :) Dec 28 21:46:03 jonkristian: well until there is no release there is no stable branch Dec 28 21:46:24 so unstable or testing yo Dec 28 21:46:34 so there is testing = that what becomes stable sometime soon Dec 28 21:46:45 and unstable = here the development goes on Dec 28 21:48:34 yo Dec 28 21:48:35 :D Dec 28 21:50:55 jonkristian: are you still compiling shr? :) Dec 28 21:52:00 how do you get keyboard in SHR? Dec 28 21:54:07 ok, found it Dec 28 21:54:30 Mortak: my computer crashed, and I had to get back to work. Dec 28 21:55:10 jonkristian: that sucks Dec 28 21:55:25 almien: was too late :) Dec 28 21:55:58 Mortak: yeah, tell me about it, ugh:/ Dec 28 21:56:08 jonkristian: :) Dec 28 21:56:41 jonkristian: im building themes and icons atm Dec 28 21:56:44 can anyone plz tell me something about the mailinglists? is it only for important stuff, or would it be ok to ask if shr supports fltk? Dec 28 21:57:47 There are lots of random posts on there. Although you might want to see if the SHR project has their own ML Dec 28 21:57:49 root_at: i think its ok to ask Dec 28 21:58:07 dufflebunk: ML? Dec 28 21:58:12 mailing list Dec 28 21:58:28 openmoko-shr :D Dec 28 21:58:34 http://shr.bearstech.com/trac/wiki/How%20to%20join Dec 28 21:58:57 hi Dec 28 21:58:59 * dufflebunk goes back to waiting fro qt4 to compile Dec 28 21:59:02 yo Dec 28 21:59:03 i cannot get my gps to work Dec 28 21:59:07 hey Dec 28 21:59:16 me too :) Dec 28 21:59:24 gpsd is running but "cat /dev/ttySAC1" simply returns eof. Dec 28 21:59:48 (right now i'm running debian on the freerunner, but i didn't have luck with other distributions either) Dec 28 22:00:01 Did you turn the GPS on? Dec 28 22:00:43 yes, i did: echo 1 > /sys/class/i2c-adapter/i2c-0/0-0073/neo1973-pm-gps.0/pwron Dec 28 22:01:03 hmm, is something else using it? Dec 28 22:01:10 lsof /dev/ttySAC1 Dec 28 22:01:48 need to install lsof first Dec 28 22:02:15 just wondering about the design decision behind having root as the default user. I don't need to be a very informed hacker to wreck havoc on the openmoko. Of course, having root as the default user is wrong, are there any initiatives to create a more secure base model for the userland side of openmoko? I take 2008.12 as a reference, but know that fso is the way to go. from Dec 28 22:03:14 ivom: you mean having an ssh server, with a blank root password might not be secure? Dec 28 22:03:48 I guess he's primarily referring to the default user as in "the user who starts X" Dec 28 22:04:05 correct moritz, i mean that every app is running as root. Dec 28 22:04:11 ivom: the general idea is to first make the basic phone actually work, to some degree. Then security can be considered. Certainly not running as root is important, but someone has even messed with selinux on the device. But first it would be nice if one could reliably place and recieve phone calls ;) Dec 28 22:04:20 dufflebunk: yes, there is a process using that device: it's frameworkd. Dec 28 22:04:34 dufflebunk: is that an explanation for me not being able to read from that device? Dec 28 22:04:48 moritz: Yeah, only one thing gets the file at a time. Dec 28 22:04:57 hey, Android released without security and no-one complained :-) Dec 28 22:05:07 just don't send a text with rm -rf / Dec 28 22:05:14 moritz: you need to reset gps first? Dec 28 22:05:15 hehe! Dec 28 22:05:23 moritz: 2008.12 has gpsd, which I think does multiplexing. I don't know what frameworkd does Dec 28 22:05:38 Yes, but the design of Android doesn't include shell access, at least for the first version. :) Dec 28 22:05:43 (i would just be glad to have gps working once) Dec 28 22:05:44 moritz: ignore previous line :) Dec 28 22:05:54 mwester: pity they included the shell access then :-D Dec 28 22:06:12 dufflebunk: i killed that process, but still i get eof. Dec 28 22:06:16 moritz: i use gpsd -F gpsd.sock -N -n -D 1 /dev/ttySAC1 Dec 28 22:06:17 XorA: Are you saying that Android on the G1 has shell access? Dec 28 22:06:20 I didn't know that. Dec 28 22:06:39 mwester: yes it does, everything typed into virtual keyboard goes to tty0 console :-) Dec 28 22:06:48 *snicker* Dec 28 22:06:51 Hmm... is that intentional? Dec 28 22:06:53 mwester: until they patched it, putting the word reboot into a text message rebooted the phone Dec 28 22:07:00 Ouch. Dec 28 22:07:04 ! Dec 28 22:07:06 mwester: rf -rf / would have killed it for good Dec 28 22:07:24 * mwester wonders where he's been that he didn't know of this problem! Dec 28 22:07:33 is patched now, but I bet its kludged not fixed :-) Dec 28 22:07:48 That's frightening. (but funny, in a way!) Dec 28 22:08:04 as far as i know that was some kind of debugging code, in android. Dec 28 22:08:08 (still funny) Dec 28 22:08:28 all i/o was sent to a root shell in the background. Dec 28 22:09:13 I guess it would have made jail breaking the phone easy :-D Dec 28 22:09:16 But as I google this, I get the feeling that there are many ways to gain shell access, in one form or another. I guess that's all the more reason to not run Om's stuff as root, in the long run. Dec 28 22:09:44 Don't want to have that sort of press for the device, if you can avoid it! Dec 28 22:10:07 heh, maybe you should msn the bugs then :-D Dec 28 22:10:10 lindi: i don't have gpsd. I have fso-gpsd and this one doesn't know about "-F" and it spits out several warnings like "WARNING: Timeout: no gypsy device created". Dec 28 22:10:30 i guess, that's because i'm running debian on it. Dec 28 22:10:38 sigh. Dec 28 22:13:31 I just made a QT Extended 4.4.3 image based on FSO, it works well Dec 28 22:15:03 Fish: care to elaborate? Dec 28 22:16:26 That's been around for a while - http://moko.mwester.net/qtextended.html describes the process. Dec 28 22:17:05 hum yes Dec 28 22:17:11 I didn't know that :) Dec 28 22:17:53 :D Well, that's good - then you just validated the approach through independent work. Dec 28 22:18:33 i thought it was qtopia with an fso telephony backend Dec 28 22:18:53 I haven't seen any updated 4.4.3 sources for many weeks from Nokia/Trolltech, though. :( Dec 28 22:19:11 hi there. is it possible to configure zone so that it vibrates when there is a incoming call or message? pls Dec 28 22:19:16 the last snapshot is from 9 december Dec 28 22:28:23 bah, untangle crashed my phone Dec 28 22:34:01 Hello, does anybody know how to boot from an SDHC card which is ext2 formatted? Dec 28 22:34:29 as far as i know you have two choices: Dec 28 22:34:36 (1) use Qi as bootloader Dec 28 22:34:45 (2) modify the uBoot environment Dec 28 22:34:58 moritz: I tried to modify the uBoot environment, but without luck Dec 28 22:35:05 Does Qi remove the risk of corrupting the partition table? Dec 28 22:35:11 i don't know Dec 28 22:35:15 i have installed Qi Dec 28 22:35:18 it worked so far Dec 28 22:35:34 I do "ext2load mmc 1 0x32000000 ${sd_image_name}", but it tells me "** Unable to read "uImage.bin" from mmc 1:1 **" Dec 28 22:35:58 I've updated the bootloader to U-Boot 1.3.2-moko12 (Dec 28 2008) Dec 28 22:36:41 I installed BASH, but now /etc/profile, ~/.bashrc are not getting sourced. Dec 28 22:36:49 dunno, but if that doesn't work, how about trying Qi? Dec 28 22:37:17 In the on-phone terminal that is. SSH works fine. Dec 28 22:37:34 Well, Qi looks even less versatile... I won't have a boot menu... Dec 28 22:37:46 kW: There's still NOR. Dec 28 22:38:25 kW: Qi is the way of the future anyways. :P I believe that it's to replace uboot eventually. Dec 28 22:38:33 mhh Dec 28 22:39:03 that's what i read as well Dec 28 22:39:29 does anybody know whether the current uboot ext2 driver does support symlinks? Dec 28 22:39:38 (like grub does) Dec 28 22:41:24 Yeah, Qi is the future, whether we like to give up the boot menu or not. But to be fair, the tools have been around for a year, and users haven't stepped up to the plate to build a replacement for the boot menu. That's not something that should be done by the bootloader in the first place... Dec 28 22:41:54 anyone have the same error? "NOTE: package python-etk-0.3.0+svnr37812-r0: task do_compile: failed" Dec 28 22:41:59 mwester: you talk about running a boot-menu-linux? Dec 28 22:42:13 What's especially interesting is that there are some really excellent examples already in OE of how you can do the replacement of the boot menu with kexec and a initramfs, etc. :) Dec 28 22:42:57 kW: Yep, that's it exactly - minimal kernel with a tiny rootfs, and kexec -- can do whatever we want it to do -- even boot the phone (for recovery for example) from a tftp server. :) That's cool. Dec 28 22:45:35 mwester: I'd opt for entering a strong crypto password using just a sequence of strokes along the screen and having the rest of the device's storage media (internal flash, SDHC card) being encrypted... Dec 28 22:51:32 kW: That's a useful idea -- and should be very practical, with the possible exeption of translating strokes to an encryption key. Dec 28 22:53:42 mwester: well.. you can divide the area into 8*6 subareas, so you can yield about 5.5 bits per stroke Dec 28 22:54:42 so you need about 23 strokes for 128 bits... quite a lot, but maybe doable by using pictograms ... Dec 28 22:55:18 and then the strokes are varied a little bit when trying to decrypt "the real key" for the devices, to cater for errors on input Dec 28 23:01:05 By the way, is there a special FSO channel? Dec 28 23:04:57 question: how can I turn on / off bluetooth? Dec 28 23:12:14 moritz: you can apt-get install gpsd to test Dec 28 23:23:10 is it normal that 'sleep' button in SHR brings up "suspending your computer, please wait" dialog for a few seconds then just returns to the main desktop? Dec 28 23:26:15 almien: nope :) Dec 28 23:26:48 it should work? ok, useful to know Dec 28 23:27:25 almien: normally it suspends Dec 28 23:27:34 thanks Dec 28 23:48:02 oh my Dec 28 23:48:18 * StealthCP has just seen SHR for the first time Dec 28 23:48:35 congratz :) Dec 28 23:48:55 best yet Dec 28 23:48:59 I keep dis Dec 28 23:50:33 did you build it by you rown or did you flash a image? Dec 28 23:51:21 flashed the latest one from testing Dec 28 23:51:39 ah, ok :) Dec 28 23:51:49 i would build my own, but I don't have a need to Dec 28 23:52:09 not right now anyway - I wanted to see SHr before I started wasting time doing that :P Dec 28 23:52:11 i tried to, but it stops after some hours :) Dec 28 23:52:17 ^^ hehe Dec 28 23:53:52 here why has the power LED lit up when i plugged in the charge? Dec 28 23:53:57 it's normally the aux :o Dec 28 23:54:45 :) Dec 28 23:57:42 much better though :P Dec 28 23:57:50 it makes more sense, and looks cooler Dec 28 23:57:56 is there anything SHR can't do? Dec 28 23:58:21 gps at my phone atm Dec 28 23:58:25 * StealthCP feels like he's part of a cult now Dec 28 23:58:31 omg the led turned blue :O Dec 28 23:58:36 you are :) Dec 28 23:59:56 oh my god I've got console colours and htop on the phone D8 Dec 29 00:00:33 ^^ Dec 29 00:00:50 now, I load up the terminal app, how do I get a keyboard? Dec 29 00:01:26 top shelfe, qwerty Dec 29 00:01:30 normally :) Dec 29 00:01:38 i do not see that Dec 29 00:01:46 I'm using illume-SHR Dec 29 00:01:49 erm.. Dec 29 00:01:51 me too Dec 29 00:02:00 as I was asked on the pre-install config :) Dec 29 00:02:07 well, dunno, let's see Dec 29 00:02:29 then i dunno atm Dec 29 00:02:40 :( Dec 29 00:03:35 I'm decompiling the theme file Dec 29 00:03:58 so I'll edit and make it appear, though I hope it wasn't as messy looking as it was on Om2008.12 Dec 29 00:06:52 hmm Dec 29 00:06:53 http://pastebin.com/m5b31b5e1 Dec 29 00:07:00 what do I change here? Dec 29 00:09:49 oh hmm Dec 29 00:09:51 it's hidden Dec 29 00:09:54 oh weird Dec 29 00:13:09 we need acceleration on the graphics chip D: Dec 29 00:13:21 * StealthCP wants enlightenment's composite effects on his phone Dec 29 00:13:33 e doesnt have composite effects Dec 29 00:13:35 :) Dec 29 00:13:44 E17 does Dec 29 00:13:47 well not unless u load bling as a module Dec 29 00:13:52 no it doesnt Dec 29 00:13:54 aye Dec 29 00:14:02 :) Dec 29 00:14:06 nothing included with e17 does compositing Dec 29 00:14:09 (of client windows) Dec 29 00:14:13 bling is an external module Dec 29 00:14:14 well whatever lol, surely we could make our own for the Neo Dec 29 00:14:18 also is riddled with bugs Dec 29 00:14:20 :) Dec 29 00:14:28 you can just use bling Dec 29 00:14:29 that isn't riddled with em Dec 29 00:14:32 if u want Dec 29 00:14:36 but it'll be slow Dec 29 00:14:39 yeah Dec 29 00:14:44 it can be fixed of course Dec 29 00:14:46 unless we get acceleration I guess Dec 29 00:14:48 but it'll be bitch-slow Dec 29 00:14:54 i wouldnt even dram of compositing on the FR Dec 29 00:15:04 dont bother Dec 29 00:15:07 thats my advice Dec 29 00:15:08 hmm ok Dec 29 00:15:14 no one listens of course Dec 29 00:15:23 but i know what the glamo can and can't do Dec 29 00:15:25 compositing == don' Dec 29 00:15:30 compositing == don't bother Dec 29 00:16:45 i can go explaining if u must know Dec 29 00:16:50 but glamo has too many limitations Dec 29 00:16:55 where it speeds thng X up Dec 29 00:17:02 I get ya Dec 29 00:17:07 it wil slow thing Y down Dec 29 00:17:07 eg Dec 29 00:17:16 it can ONLY composite TO rgb565 Dec 29 00:17:16 no destination ARGB32 supported Dec 29 00:17:26 that emans all rendering of an ARGB32 window surface (ie a window with an alpha channel) Dec 29 00:17:31 needs to be done in software and copied up Dec 29 00:17:37 rgb32 is 2x the data of rgb565 Dec 29 00:17:42 thus uplaods will be 1/2 the speed Dec 29 00:17:48 and u still software render it Dec 29 00:17:57 i see.. didn't know that Dec 29 00:17:59 and in return the compositing itself now is accelerated Dec 29 00:18:05 so you win on compositing Dec 29 00:18:15 lose on updates Dec 29 00:18:18 heh Dec 29 00:18:20 yep Dec 29 00:18:26 lose any accelration you can have for rendering the contents Dec 29 00:18:41 admittedly evas if using software engines isnt using accel anyway Dec 29 00:18:47 you can use xrender Dec 29 00:18:50 but evas uplaods rgb565 Dec 29 00:18:53 not arg32 Dec 29 00:19:03 err argb32 Dec 29 00:19:28 i can go list everything - but in the end you likely will get things slower, not faster Dec 29 00:19:46 withotu compositing you can work on accel - and likely not get any speedups - stand still Dec 29 00:20:00 and chances are you'll still be using the cpu a lot Dec 29 00:20:25 if you add compositing you change the entire pipeline and thus my bet is on a partial slowdown from what you have now Dec 29 00:20:30 even with al the accel you can manage Dec 29 00:21:07 of course... you are free to prove me wrong :) Dec 29 00:22:58 stealthcp try adding an applicatation or your choice Dec 29 00:23:08 of* Dec 29 00:23:36 fbreader is a good 1 Dec 29 00:24:16 see if bright player will work for us Dec 29 00:24:26 now.. on a better piece of hardware - i might consider it Dec 29 00:24:30 is u still have shr Dec 29 00:24:32 drop to qvga and get yourself 133DDR ram and i'd even think it might be doable without acceleration Dec 29 00:31:38 raster, I got you on that Dec 29 00:31:52 yes the acceleration would be better spent on other things rather than composition :P Dec 29 00:33:34 Slaxxin, what's a recommended media player? Dec 29 00:34:23 i would think anything at the applicatations wiki would suffice Dec 29 00:34:33 or opkg.org Dec 29 00:34:41 StealthCP: did you get the keyboard showing? should be on the top shelf by default :/ Dec 29 00:34:55 sicu, yes I did Dec 29 00:35:01 thanks :) Dec 29 00:35:01 good good Dec 29 00:35:11 look at all this support Dec 29 00:35:19 this is bril, I want a coffee now Dec 29 00:35:31 hehe ... SHR ftw ;p Dec 29 00:35:42 it is pretty Dec 29 00:35:53 I'm gonna phone it Dec 29 00:35:58 and see if phone works Dec 29 00:36:46 yaaaaa Dec 29 00:36:47 oh my god.. Dec 29 00:37:10 it even woke up from standby Dec 29 00:37:18 ugly ring sound, uh? :) Dec 29 00:37:29 it's better than my stomach Dec 29 00:37:43 and Mofi, a simple yet working Wifi gui Dec 29 00:37:56 it worked? Dec 29 00:38:02 ugh ... don't like mofi :p Dec 29 00:38:15 better than nothing at this stage Dec 29 00:38:26 no, it doesn't look like it's working Dec 29 00:38:34 if i could make it work maybe Dec 29 00:38:40 do you have phonelog too StealthCP? Dec 29 00:38:49 can't remember if it's there in testing ... Dec 29 00:39:01 pre 16 images no Dec 29 00:39:10 ahh .. k Dec 29 00:39:29 i do indeed Dec 29 00:39:34 or maybe 15th Dec 29 00:39:53 missed calls, received and made all nice and seperate Dec 29 00:39:55 colours Dec 29 00:40:05 what else, maybe I'll send it an SMS Dec 29 00:40:12 install an applicatation with opkg an lets see if it works Dec 29 00:40:21 see if it takes longer than a reboot to receive :P Dec 29 00:40:31 Slaxxin: i do it all the time, never had any problems Dec 29 00:40:43 i miss some kind of a "you have missed calls" popup at the desktop Dec 29 00:40:51 i dont know what my problem is then Dec 29 00:41:03 ok how do I close applications? Dec 29 00:41:11 X Dec 29 00:41:14 in om2008 I had a tiny thing called 'remove' Dec 29 00:41:14 big x at topshelf :) Dec 29 00:41:21 oh LOL Dec 29 00:41:28 thanks :P Dec 29 00:41:31 StealthCP: or quick press on pwrbtn and then select X from the list Dec 29 00:41:32 ^^ Dec 29 00:42:13 so an application (Mofi) has frozen Dec 29 00:42:20 I can use htop to bring it down \o/ Dec 29 00:42:33 though, a kill button would be a nice to have feature Dec 29 00:42:45 X it Dec 29 00:42:47 mofi always locks on me too Dec 29 00:42:50 or a popup about an application being unresponsive, do you want to kill it Dec 29 00:42:52 will go away Dec 29 00:42:57 oh hmm Dec 29 00:43:02 took it a while Dec 29 00:43:16 yeah and those boxes need to be scrollable Dec 29 00:43:22 content that's too big for the screen Dec 29 00:43:27 how do we work around that? Dec 29 00:43:48 Slaxxin: do you get any output when trying to install a package ? Dec 29 00:44:09 its been a few days Dec 29 00:44:37 i shall wite it down Dec 29 00:44:53 I see sicus Dec 29 00:44:58 some just never appear after install Dec 29 00:45:13 SLAXIN Dec 29 00:45:17 wat Dec 29 00:45:20 brb Dec 29 00:45:33 happy new year Daave Dec 29 00:45:46 Dave! Dec 29 00:46:12 heh .. bit early for the fireworks still mr Slaxxin :p Dec 29 00:46:35 we have 1 extra second this year Dec 29 00:46:50 MR? Dec 29 00:47:04 o i forgot i AM old Dec 29 00:47:29 Slaxxin: a lot of apps have some wird category in the .desktop file ... if you just change it to something like: Office; it will display correctly Dec 29 00:47:45 wow that is wierd Dec 29 00:47:51 though if it dosn't run from terminal, then it wont help much Dec 29 00:48:06 s/dos/does/ Dec 29 00:48:07 sicu meant: though if it doesn't run from terminal, then it wont help much Dec 29 00:48:32 its ok though considering what we are working with here Dec 29 00:49:27 the FR is great =] Dec 29 00:50:29 :P Dec 29 00:50:50 apt meant, you're all fools! Dec 29 00:51:07 haha Dec 29 00:51:48 can anyone help me with this error while "make image"? http://pastebin.com/m17d4f601 Dec 29 00:52:01 make mordor Dec 29 00:52:21 btw. its shr :) Dec 29 00:55:12 any ideas? :) Dec 29 00:55:39 ok.. media player wise, what's everyone's choice? Dec 29 00:55:59 something that works? :P Dec 29 00:56:04 Hi Ken Dec 29 00:56:11 I liked the Qtopia media player, albeit the buggyness and memory leaks Dec 29 00:56:16 Hi Dave - What's new with you? Dec 29 00:56:52 Nothing relating to Openmoko, that's for sure. Dec 29 00:57:34 pythm just about works Dec 29 00:57:40 well cool :) Dec 29 00:57:53 Mortak: sorry, no idea Dec 29 00:58:09 sicu: :) no problem Dec 29 01:00:53 man alsamixer's a bag of fun :P Dec 29 01:00:55 Mortak: what is the contents of /usr/src/openmoko/shr/shr-testing/tmp/work/armv4t-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/python-etk-0.3.0+svnr37812-r0/temp/log.do_compile.23031 ? Dec 29 01:01:05 this is more advanced than I'd previously thought Dec 29 01:02:14 wait Dec 29 01:02:19 why is GPS not working Dec 29 01:03:32 kW: isn't that log posted @ line 40 and onwards ? Dec 29 01:03:44 in the pastebin Mortak provided Dec 29 01:03:47 sicu: I see Dec 29 01:04:49 Mortak: though you're not builing the same image, it seems you have the same error as: http://n2.nabble.com/FSO-compile-error-tp681272p796054.html Dec 29 01:07:25 sicu: found this thread earlier, but i cant see a solution for my problem Dec 29 01:07:31 maybe im too tired now Dec 29 01:07:50 Mortak: and there it seemed to be an issue in --autorev--.inc ... and quickdev and mrmoku were doing some modifications wrt shr-unstable-autorev.inc just a couple of hours ago Dec 29 01:08:16 Mortak: but could just be a coinsidence ... i have no idea Dec 29 01:08:56 i'll try it tomorrow :) Dec 29 01:09:17 but thx! Dec 29 01:14:48 http://pastebin.com/d5fb6d844 Dec 29 01:14:56 problem here with GPS Dec 29 01:20:16 any thoughts? Dec 29 01:26:33 There was a page on http://wiki.openmoko.org/ talking about an upgrade path from Om2008.9 to Om2008.12 without re-flashing, but now it seems vanished... does anybody know how to perform this upgrade? Dec 29 01:27:08 StealthCP: what does "bash -x /etc/init.d/fso-gpsd start" say? Dec 29 01:27:38 it's init.d/fso-gpsd that's screwed a bit Dec 29 01:27:42 I'm trying to fix it up Dec 29 01:28:18 and I don't have bash :p Dec 29 01:29:02 StealthCP: what does "cat /etc/init.d/fso-gpsd | grep start-stop" say? Dec 29 01:29:16 apparently "start-stop-daemon" does get a "-P" parameter which it does not expect Dec 29 01:29:39 http://pastebin.com/mcd4673e Dec 29 01:29:42 that's my changes so far Dec 29 01:29:50 I replaced -P with --pidfile Dec 29 01:29:58 and moved it, still nothing Dec 29 01:30:03 added --make-pidfile Dec 29 01:31:40 StealthCP: well, the "start-stop-daemon" on your system (provided by busybox) does not seem to support other paramters besides "-S" or "-K" Dec 29 01:31:45 someone couldn't pastebin, show me theirs? Dec 29 01:32:00 i see Dec 29 01:32:23 well this is testing branch Dec 29 01:42:33 got it working Dec 29 01:42:34 I think Dec 29 01:48:23 nope Dec 29 01:48:32 well fixed the init script Dec 29 01:48:45 but fso-gpsd doesn't seem to work well anyway Dec 29 01:51:13 (at all) Dec 29 02:06:05 mhh Dec 29 02:09:28 boing Dec 29 02:44:33 I just trashed my production rootfs and the backup (created by dfu-util) proved to be worthless :-(( Dec 29 02:51:11 ooo my god whats next Dec 29 02:51:41 superdave Dec 29 02:51:48 and guess what how I got it trashed: "opkg upgrade" and some time later "opkg: write: No space left on device" Dec 29 02:52:16 its alll still a big damn test Dec 29 02:53:24 never know whats going to happen nextt aint it fun Dec 29 02:54:09 i really liked the earlier shrs Dec 29 02:54:42 mhh... :-\ Dec 29 02:55:06 Does anybody know the correct block erase size of the freerunner? Dec 29 02:55:41 dave how would i go about changing me keyboard to the black background w/white letters in 2008.12? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Dec 29 02:59:56 2008