**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Aug 22 02:59:57 2009
Aug 22 04:38:32 <WalterN> hey... I got my check today and I'm feeling rich and I dont have a cellphone... been dreaming about getting the NeoFreerunner.. looks like if I get it directly from openmoko.com then there is a 'buzz issue'... what is that? and how bad is it?
Aug 22 04:39:00 <Blu3> are you in the US?
Aug 22 04:39:08 <WalterN> aye
Aug 22 04:39:14 <Blu3> hit up SDG
Aug 22 04:39:21 <WalterN> Oregon :)
Aug 22 04:39:24 <Blu3> they're a US distributor
Aug 22 04:40:17 <WalterN> its $139 more though
Aug 22 04:40:18 <WalterN> :P
Aug 22 04:40:19 <Undrwater> buzz is bad if it's not fixed...
Aug 22 04:40:36 <Undrwater> so buy one that's been fixed unless you can do yourself
Aug 22 04:40:39 <Blu3> ok, find another :)
Aug 22 04:42:17 <WalterN> I was just wondering... so openmoko.com is only selling them with the buzz? and distributors fix it themselves? or do they have the next generation in stock?
Aug 22 04:42:40 <WalterN> (if there is a next generation)
Aug 22 04:42:45 <WalterN> (being produced)
Aug 22 04:43:03 <WalterN> (I guess A7)
Aug 22 04:43:30 <WalterN> heh
Aug 22 04:46:01 <WalterN> let me rephrase... do the distributors get the A7 generation NeoFreerunner from the factory? or do they get the A6 and fix them?
Aug 22 04:49:51 <Blu3> i've no idea really
Aug 22 04:50:15 <WalterN> fair enough I guess
Aug 22 04:50:19 <WalterN> :)
Aug 22 04:50:35 <Blu3> i'm sure distributors will tend to have a6 in stock and want to get rid of it, and eventually a7 would replenish their sold items
Aug 22 04:50:57 <WalterN> is the A7 being mass produced?
Aug 22 04:51:12 <Blu3> when i bought mine, i got an a6.  i got the buzz fix deal
Aug 22 04:51:27 <Blu3> i don't know that either :)
Aug 22 04:51:37 <WalterN> how do you like it?
Aug 22 04:52:38 <WalterN> I have been following openmoko and the 1979/freerunner for a while now..
Aug 22 04:52:42 <Blu3> i like the phone quite a bit.  the software (in this case the shr-u distribution) can get on my nerves now and then, but i am capable of fixing most of the little things that pop up
Aug 22 04:53:00 <WalterN> shr-u?
Aug 22 04:53:25 <Blu3> shr unstable
Aug 22 04:53:34 <WalterN> never heard of it
Aug 22 04:53:42 <WalterN> what is it?
Aug 22 04:53:44 <Blu3> SHR is the distribution, i prefer the unstable branch
Aug 22 04:53:59 <Blu3> if you hit up the openmoko wiki and go to distributions, you'll see a group of them
Aug 22 04:54:02 <Blu3> SHR will be listed
Aug 22 04:54:07 <WalterN> oh... heh.. gotcha
Aug 22 04:54:38 <Blu3> =]
Aug 22 04:55:06 <WalterN> why shr over openmoko?
Aug 22 04:56:48 <Blu3> well.  let's see how i can e'splain this
Aug 22 04:57:13 <Blu3> first came the phone, then the egg and the chicken, then the waffle...  hmm.  not quite working.
Aug 22 04:57:37 <WalterN> heh
Aug 22 04:58:07 <Blu3> openmoko made a phone.  FSO (freesmartphone.org) made a framework to fit the phone (and others).  a lot of people are making distributions that fit on top of the FSO framework
Aug 22 04:58:41 <Blu3> everyone likes to splinter and reinvent the wheel their own way ;)
Aug 22 04:59:02 <WalterN> sometimes its easier that way :P
Aug 22 04:59:28 <Blu3> sometimes it is
Aug 22 04:59:45 <Blu3> but in general it means progress is uneven and slower
Aug 22 04:59:58 <WalterN> that too
Aug 22 05:00:11 <Blu3> in the end you'll have a variety of polished options
Aug 22 05:00:16 <WalterN> spread people out inventing their own wheel
Aug 22 05:00:36 <WalterN> so inh is that much better?
Aug 22 05:00:38 <Blu3> and the better projects will gain followers while the not so better... will fade into obscurity
Aug 22 05:00:54 <WalterN> err
Aug 22 05:00:55 <WalterN> shr
Aug 22 05:01:07 <Blu3> SHR is one of the dominant distributions
Aug 22 05:01:21 <WalterN> hard to install/configure?
Aug 22 05:01:28 <WalterN> easy?
Aug 22 05:01:34 <Blu3> it receives the most attention here, as most of the people here in these channels are SHR peeps
Aug 22 05:01:46 <Blu3> painfully easy once you get it
Aug 22 05:01:55 <WalterN> linux tends to be either easy or hard to install/setup
Aug 22 05:01:55 <Blu3> basic steps
Aug 22 05:02:14 <WalterN> depending on the distro
Aug 22 05:02:14 <Blu3> 1) buy phone, it arrives.  2) wipe up drool and shock that there isn't a printed user manual
Aug 22 05:02:33 <Blu3> 3) use dfu-util to reflash (1) your kernel and (2) your rootfs
Aug 22 05:03:09 <Blu3> 4) reboot your phone, start playing.  it takes a couple minutes for everything to start up and register on the network
Aug 22 05:03:23 <Blu3> but it should be functional as a phone at this point
Aug 22 05:03:23 <WalterN> hmm
Aug 22 05:03:43 <Blu3> don't worry, using dfu-util is actually very simple
Aug 22 05:03:52 <Blu3> don't let "reflash your phone" scare you
Aug 22 05:03:58 <WalterN> neh
Aug 22 05:04:11 <WalterN> I installed dd-wrt on linksys once
Aug 22 05:04:13 <Blu3> think of it as untarring your disk image to /
Aug 22 05:04:16 <Blu3> ok
Aug 22 05:04:19 <WalterN> that was actually kinda scarry
Aug 22 05:04:24 <WalterN> thought I borked it
Aug 22 05:05:05 <WalterN> anyway, it was fun :)
Aug 22 05:05:17 <Blu3> aye
Aug 22 05:05:28 <WalterN> and think it would be awesome to have a phone that I can run my website from
Aug 22 05:05:29 <Blu3> futzing with a freerunner is pretty fun too
Aug 22 05:05:37 <WalterN> :P
Aug 22 05:06:18 <Blu3> you'll have your "omg i broke it!" moments followed shortly by "oh. heehee, i didn't"
Aug 22 05:06:20 <WalterN> oOo... plug.. that... yeah.. I gotta have one now
Aug 22 05:07:19 <WalterN> I almost forgot I tore out my radio from my car to make a bracket that my laptop would slide into and plug into
Aug 22 05:07:36 <Blu3> ver' nice
Aug 22 05:07:37 <WalterN> the hole is a little small... so I was thinking about the Acer one
Aug 22 05:07:49 <WalterN> but the cellphone would be ideal :)
Aug 22 05:08:11 <WalterN> (I work in a machine shop and program for a hobby)
Aug 22 05:08:27 <Blu3> very handy :)
Aug 22 05:10:10 <WalterN> well
Aug 22 05:10:31 <WalterN> the problem is projects grow exponentially
Aug 22 05:10:34 <WalterN> heh
Aug 22 05:10:45 <Blu3> i am very familiar with that :(
Aug 22 05:11:28 <WalterN> so the laptop/car thing gets shoved to almost the bottom... and there is still a gaping hole there
Aug 22 05:11:51 <Blu3> ayup
Aug 22 05:12:03 <WalterN> I should get the cellphone and an amplifier
Aug 22 05:12:12 <Blu3> i have a couple of old laptops, one of them is destined in a similar manner
Aug 22 05:12:26 <WalterN> and make a plastic holder dock stationg thing
Aug 22 05:14:00 <WalterN> Blu3: would you buy a docking station thing if I made a few?
Aug 22 05:14:37 <Blu3> for the neo?  depends on the appearance, method of mount, sturdiness, features, etc
Aug 22 05:14:47 <WalterN> hmm
Aug 22 05:14:54 <WalterN> annodized alluminum?
Aug 22 05:15:11 <WalterN> black plastic?
Aug 22 05:15:17 <WalterN> 4140?
Aug 22 05:15:19 <WalterN> heh
Aug 22 05:15:31 <WalterN> stianless steel?
Aug 22 05:15:40 <Blu3> heheh, if it can take a beating and still look good without coming loose..
Aug 22 05:15:41 <WalterN> magnesium?
Aug 22 05:15:50 <Blu3> i'd probably prefer a stiff metal
Aug 22 05:16:03 <WalterN> 4140 is tough stuff
Aug 22 05:16:09 <WalterN> steel
Aug 22 05:16:34 <WalterN> chrome plated is used for hydraulic stuff
Aug 22 05:16:43 <WalterN> and drive shafts
Aug 22 05:16:47 <WalterN> good stuff
Aug 22 05:16:57 <WalterN> in fact I have a bar of it
Aug 22 05:17:20 <WalterN> can send it in to be hardened for spring steel :D
Aug 22 05:18:14 <WalterN> but... I'm guessing that might not be a good option for just a cellphone dock station/holder thing
Aug 22 05:18:50 <WalterN> (I think I'm over doing this already...)
Aug 22 05:19:02 <Blu3> it doesn't need to be super strong.  just strong enough to weather a backpack with books in it hitting it
Aug 22 05:19:18 <WalterN> plastic
Aug 22 05:20:08 <WalterN> easy to work with and the UHMW stuff is used for bearings - good stuff
Aug 22 05:20:40 <WalterN> the recycled stuff is kinda cool looking... black with different colors speckeled in it
Aug 22 05:21:00 <WalterN> (or whatever color is desired)
Aug 22 05:22:16 <WalterN> Blu3: how is using the GPS?
Aug 22 05:22:26 <WalterN> useable while driving?
Aug 22 05:22:32 <Blu3> i only use it rarely, but it works for me (while driving)
Aug 22 05:22:49 <WalterN> ok
Aug 22 05:23:37 <WalterN> I heard that GPS on phones suck in general.. wanted to know how it was
Aug 22 05:24:06 <Blu3> gps on phones -- is normally something you gotta pay out the ass for
Aug 22 05:24:39 <Blu3> tangogps is normally spot-on for me
Aug 22 05:25:14 <WalterN> is that a mapping system?
Aug 22 05:25:24 <WalterN> for the GPS
Aug 22 05:25:32 <Blu3> yup
Aug 22 05:25:39 <WalterN> ok
Aug 22 05:26:01 <WalterN> do I need to plan on buying a memory card?
Aug 22 05:26:20 <WalterN> microSD if I remember right?
Aug 22 05:26:24 <Blu3> i would, yes
Aug 22 05:26:36 <Blu3> order one from pricewatch
Aug 22 05:26:44 <Blu3> don't spend 100x too much at a local store
Aug 22 05:27:08 <Blu3> getting a brand name card is probably good.  i.e. kingston etc
Aug 22 05:27:11 <WalterN> pricewatch.com ?
Aug 22 05:27:13 <Blu3> yep
Aug 22 05:35:04 <Blu3> http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-rx51-n900-en.shtml
Aug 22 05:35:29 <Blu3> i think this might be my next phone :D
Aug 22 05:35:34 <WalterN> Blu3: so you like it... is there another phone you would get over the neofrerunner if you were to do it over again?
Aug 22 05:35:45 <Blu3> --^
Aug 22 05:39:37 <Blu3> the hardware of this phone is hugely impressive compared to the neo
Aug 22 05:46:24 <Blu3> i've got gym workout in a few hours, scootin' off to bed
Aug 22 05:47:39 <WalterN> ok
Aug 22 07:56:32 <Ddorda> still doesn't fond the usb0 :S
Aug 22 08:02:33 <tomcatek> ifconfig -a
Aug 22 08:02:35 <tomcatek> ?
Aug 22 08:02:43 <tomcatek> what dows it shows
Aug 22 08:10:06 <Ddorda> ath0, eth0, lo, pan0 (?), wifi0
Aug 22 08:14:20 <Kero> pan could be bluetooth netwrok profile? no idea about usb0 missing.
Aug 22 08:14:57 <Ddorda> have no bluetooth
Aug 22 08:16:12 <Ddorda> i will try another PC
Aug 22 08:29:46 <DocScrutinizer> Ddorda: on recent SHR it changed name to ethX with X = first free number
Aug 22 08:39:35 <Ddorda> DocScrutinizer: i'm using OM2008.9
Aug 22 08:39:46 <Ddorda> i think the problem is with the computer
Aug 22 08:39:54 <DocScrutinizer> omg
Aug 22 08:40:31 <Ddorda> omg?
Aug 22 08:45:09 <DocScrutinizer> 2008.9 is rather obsolete
Aug 22 08:45:31 <DocScrutinizer> anyway usb0 should work
Aug 22 08:46:04 <DocScrutinizer> sometimes the usb locks, you need to replug
Aug 22 08:46:54 <DocScrutinizer> I suggest to "less +F /var/log/messages" on your pc prior to plugging in
Aug 22 08:50:15 <Ddorda> Aug 22 11:48:56 dor-laptop kernel: [45477.989331] usb0: unregister 'cdc_ether' usb-0000:00:13.0-1, CDC Ethernet Device
Aug 22 08:50:15 <Ddorda> Aug 22 11:49:23 dor-laptop kernel: [45505.420048] usb 2-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 9
Aug 22 08:50:15 <Ddorda> Aug 22 11:49:24 dor-laptop kernel: [45505.657283] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 2 choices
Aug 22 08:50:15 <Ddorda> Aug 22 11:49:24 dor-laptop kernel: [45505.660957] cdc_acm 2-1:1.0: ttyACM0: USB ACM device
Aug 22 08:50:15 <Ddorda> Aug 22 11:49:24 dor-laptop kernel: [45506.091448] usb 2-1: USB disconnect, address 9
Aug 22 08:52:32 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: means you stay in u-boot most probably
Aug 22 08:52:48 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: at least the previous to last line in the log suggests that.
Aug 22 08:53:21 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: Aug 22 11:53:05 dor-laptop kernel: [45727.048068] usb 2-1: new full speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 14
Aug 22 08:53:21 <Ddorda> Aug 22 11:53:06 dor-laptop kernel: [45728.374604] usb 2-1: configuration #1 chosen from 2 choices
Aug 22 08:53:21 <Ddorda> Aug 22 11:53:06 dor-laptop kernel: [45728.416516] usb0: register 'cdc_ether' at usb-0000:00:13.0-1, CDC Ethernet Device, 5a:cb:17:4b:d8:36
Aug 22 08:53:24 <Ddorda> not anymore
Aug 22 08:53:25 <Ddorda> :P
Aug 22 08:54:11 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: so, it's clearly written you have usb0 on host.
Aug 22 08:54:27 <Ddorda> but ifconfig doesn't show it
Aug 22 08:55:37 <Ddorda> when the moko is on sleeping mode the PC doesn;t recognize it
Aug 22 08:55:53 <Ddorda> it has to be on non-sleeping mode so i can flash it?
Aug 22 08:56:43 <Ddorda> dfu-util --list gives nothing
Aug 22 08:56:46 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: what about "ifconfig -a"
Aug 22 08:57:13 <Ddorda> usb0 only when not on sleeping mode
Aug 22 08:57:16 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: dfu-util is applicable only when the phone acts as a dfu-capable device, for that you need to be running u-boot, not Linux.
Aug 22 08:57:32 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: and of course while the device is suspended, you can't have any access to it.
Aug 22 08:58:03 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5518 10/trunk/gta02-core/modules/stdpass.fpd: 
Aug 22 08:58:03 <CIA-52> openmoko: - modules/stdpass.fpd: enjoy our new freedom and adjust measurement offset to
Aug 22 08:58:03 <CIA-52> openmoko:  package dimensions
Aug 22 08:58:03 <CIA-52> openmoko: - modules/stdpass.fpd: renamed outline L and W to Ox and Oy, and moved them to
Aug 22 08:58:03 <CIA-52> openmoko:  the root frame. Less confusing that way.
Aug 22 08:58:28 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5519 10/trunk/eda/fped/ (README gui_style.h inst.h postscript.c): 
Aug 22 08:58:28 <CIA-52> openmoko: - postscript.c: added DSC comments
Aug 22 08:58:28 <CIA-52> openmoko: - postscript.c: generate a page for each package
Aug 22 08:58:28 <CIA-52> openmoko: - gui_style.h: changed monospaced font to Liberation Mono, to alleviate "l" vs.
Aug 22 08:58:29 <CIA-52> openmoko:  "1" problem
Aug 22 08:58:55 <Ddorda> i'm on u-boot, "ifconfig -a" gives nothing
Aug 22 08:59:42 <Ddorda> i mean gives no usb0
Aug 22 09:02:43 <Kagee> Ddorda: u-boot is not capable to register as a ethernet device, but dfu-util will be able to communicate with it using another protocol
Aug 22 09:02:45 <kardan|> can you tell me what is the gsm frequence of the om freerunner?
Aug 22 09:03:12 <Kagee> Ddorda: See if you can find it with "dfu-util -l"
Aug 22 09:03:49 <Ddorda> nada
Aug 22 09:04:01 <Kagee> Ddorda: what linux distro?
Aug 22 09:04:05 <Ddorda> Ubuntu
Aug 22 09:04:47 <Kagee> "sudo dfu-util -l" - and make sure the phone has not powered off - it only stays in u-boot for 30 seconds if you don't do something
Aug 22 09:06:14 <Ddorda> still nothing :(
Aug 22 09:06:57 <Ddorda> i got something!
Aug 22 09:07:05 <Ddorda> Found Runtime: [0x1d50:0x5119] devnum=24, cfg=0, intf=2, alt=0, name="USB Device Firmware Upgrade"
Aug 22 09:07:24 <Kagee> that's the neo
Aug 22 09:07:38 <Ddorda> dfu-util -a kernel -R -D uImage-2.6.29-oe10+gitr119838+2d158aae9d8d36f575504f59884ed8e80802efe2-r3.5-om-gta02.bin
Aug 22 09:07:41 <Ddorda> this line is fine?
Aug 22 09:07:52 <Ddorda> afraid to ruin something :P
Aug 22 09:08:00 <DocScrutinizer> do it
Aug 22 09:08:30 <DocScrutinizer> Ddorda: you can't ruin anything
Aug 22 09:08:41 <Kagee> Ddorda: you probably want "sudo" before that
Aug 22 09:08:47 <DocScrutinizer> almost
Aug 22 09:08:57 <Ddorda> did
Aug 22 09:08:59 <DocScrutinizer> yup, sudo
Aug 22 09:09:08 <Ddorda> thanks guys :D
Aug 22 09:09:17 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5520 10/trunk/gta02-core/ (Makefile docs/GETTING-STARTED gta02-core.erx): 
Aug 22 09:09:17 <CIA-52> openmoko: - docs/GETTING-STARTED: added fped's new font dependency
Aug 22 09:09:17 <CIA-52> openmoko: - docs/gta02-core.erx: added U3001-CON1701 conflict and added comment for
Aug 22 09:09:17 <CIA-52> openmoko:  U7607 vs. GND conflict (now, fix the syntax or find a work-around ?)
Aug 22 09:09:17 <CIA-52> openmoko: - Makefile: updated list of common targets (reported by Nathael Pajani)
Aug 22 09:09:48 <PaulFertser> kardan|: freerunner is tri-band
Aug 22 09:10:32 <kardan|> i mean the frequence o gps module - how can i measure the position in a second
Aug 22 09:10:50 <kardan|> most loggers are only able to log one point per secand
Aug 22 09:10:58 <Ddorda> now i'm flashing the rootfs
Aug 22 09:11:28 <kardan|> the accelerometer has 100 to 400 Hz
Aug 22 09:11:33 <Ddorda> i need to touch the u-boot from while to while so it won't quit?
Aug 22 09:11:43 <kardan|> but for the gps module i did not find a value
Aug 22 09:12:29 <PaulFertser> kardan|: there're "us" and "european" versions.
Aug 22 09:12:29 <PaulFertser> kardan|: read more on the wiki please.
Aug 22 09:12:35 <PaulFertser> kardan|: gps can give you up to 4 measures per second.
Aug 22 09:12:47 <PaulFertser> kardan|: iirc
Aug 22 09:12:51 <kardan|> thanks! i didnt find that at the wiki
Aug 22 09:13:17 <PaulFertser> kardan|: currently it's unsupported by FSO but you can use omgps that uses u-blox protocol directly.
Aug 22 09:14:18 <Kagee> Ddorda: not during a update/transfer
Aug 22 09:14:28 <Ddorda> Kagee: okay, thanks
Aug 22 09:14:34 <Ddorda> i feel like such a noob
Aug 22 09:16:49 <KenYoung> I just had a nasty thing happen - I ran Yaouh! to update my map tiles, but Openstreetmap's servers of down for maintenance, so Yaouh! replaced all my tiles with the Openstreetmap massage saying the server is down.
Aug 22 09:41:25 <Ddorda> SHR boots real slow or it's onlt me?
Aug 22 09:42:11 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: first boot is slow
Aug 22 09:42:43 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: i should choose Illume or Illume SHR profile?
Aug 22 09:44:40 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i think illume shr
Aug 22 09:49:34 <Ddorda> none of the programs run :S
Aug 22 09:50:46 <Ddorda> not even the setting manager!
Aug 22 09:55:58 <CIA-52> freesmartphone.org: 03seba.dos1 07framework * rb0bd10d3c6a1 10/framework/subsystems/opimd/pimd_notes.py: opimd: Notes: rename GetTags to GetUsedTags
Aug 22 09:57:46 <Ddorda> 9/17 apps runs :S
Aug 22 09:59:03 <Ddorda> can i have any help please?
Aug 22 09:59:11 <Ddorda> i can't run most of the programs
Aug 22 10:01:01 <max_posedon> depends on which are you tring to run
Aug 22 10:01:15 <max_posedon> also, I don't suggest run any, before neo will connect to gsm
Aug 22 10:02:33 <Ddorda> contacts, mplayer, SMS, Mokonnect, Settings, sketch, vagalu..
Aug 22 10:02:45 <Ddorda> all of these show errors when trying to load them
Aug 22 10:04:29 <Ddorda> i saved some logs
Aug 22 10:04:40 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: is it SHR unstable?
Aug 22 10:05:51 <max_posedon> contcats, SMS, Settings <- your neo isn't started fully yet (as I said, you should wait for neo connected to gsm)
Aug 22 10:05:55 <Ddorda> indeed
Aug 22 10:05:56 <max_posedon> mplayer - console app)
Aug 22 10:06:19 <max_posedon> Mokonnect in first group too.
Aug 22 10:07:07 <soltys>                                                               │+_7days
Aug 22 10:07:20 <soltys> blah ppm ;/
Aug 22 10:07:43 <Ddorda> so i can't run any program if i'm not connected to a gsm?
Aug 22 10:08:05 <max_posedon> why you can't?
Aug 22 10:08:14 <max_posedon> many of them you can
Aug 22 10:08:34 <Ddorda> i can't watch my contacts..?
Aug 22 10:08:44 <Ddorda> or whats my sms's?
Aug 22 10:08:51 <Ddorda> or even change the settings?
Aug 22 10:09:18 <Ddorda> sounds pretty odd to me
Aug 22 10:10:13 <max_posedon> I thought contacts and smses is gsm related stuff)
Aug 22 10:10:45 <max_posedon> also, I didn't understand why you don't wait until it will connect
Aug 22 10:11:04 <Ddorda> i have no sim
Aug 22 10:11:08 <Ddorda> for now :P
Aug 22 10:11:46 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: so you can't see contacts or smses.
Aug 22 10:11:53 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: those apps are sim-only.
Aug 22 10:13:16 <Ddorda> i see
Aug 22 10:13:20 <Ddorda> and the settings?
Aug 22 10:13:20 <Kero> just curious, is there no ipv6 on SHR or did I disable that in my self-built kernel...
Aug 22 10:13:53 <PaulFertser> Kero: hm, i think it's supported with defconfig.
Aug 22 10:14:06 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: no idea, ask dos1 ;)
Aug 22 10:14:49 <dos1> ?
Aug 22 10:14:55 <Ddorda> i just g2g
Aug 22 10:14:56 <Ddorda> ttyl
Aug 22 10:17:33 <PaulFertser> dos1: he just installed SHR unstable and complained that shr settings don't work ("crashing") for him.
Aug 22 10:18:03 <dos1> how "crashing"?
Aug 22 10:18:17 <dos1> Ddorda: did you flash shr-fat, or shr-lite?
Aug 22 10:18:25 <dos1> damn, someone should remove that fat image ;/
Aug 22 10:18:30 <dos1> Ainulindale: ping
Aug 22 10:18:59 <dos1> Ddorda: opkg install -force-reinstall python-codecs
Aug 22 10:50:10 <Ainulindale> dos1: pong
Aug 22 10:54:27 <dos1> Ainulindale: could you remove shr-fat 08.08 image? it has few packages broken
Aug 22 10:54:33 <dos1> Ainulindale: but only fat, lite is ok
Aug 22 10:58:35 <soltys> Ainulindale: how can I contribute to shr ? 
Aug 22 11:00:13 <Ainulindale> On what basis?
Aug 22 11:00:22 <Ainulindale> What do you want/know to do?
Aug 22 11:00:50 <soltys> hm I can help with testing stuff and maybe with some Python apps
Aug 22 11:02:32 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03alvieboy * r5521 10/trunk/gta02-core/docs/ecn/STATUS: Update ECN0029 status
Aug 22 11:02:40 <Ainulindale> soltys: good :-)
Aug 22 11:02:51 <Ainulindale> soltys: well first step is to register to the ml, shr-devel mainly
Aug 22 11:03:01 <Ainulindale> soltys: then have a look on trac for the tickets
Aug 22 11:03:08 <Ainulindale> try to see if something would be interesting to fix for you
Aug 22 11:03:11 <Ainulindale> that's the best way to start
Aug 22 11:03:16 <Ainulindale> it'll help you to feel around
Aug 22 11:03:29 <soltys> Ainulindale: will do that
Aug 22 11:59:16 <Ddorda> back
Aug 22 12:00:03 <Ddorda> dos1: it's not the lite version
Aug 22 12:00:16 <dos1> Ddorda: flash lite, fat is buggy
Aug 22 12:00:34 <Ddorda> what's the differents?
Aug 22 12:00:45 <Ddorda> what's the different
Aug 22 12:02:07 <Ddorda> dos1: 
Aug 22 12:02:26 <dos1> Ddorda: lite works ok ;P
Aug 22 12:02:38 <Ddorda> and..? any more changes?
Aug 22 12:02:53 <Ddorda> what makes the lite one to be lite?
Aug 22 12:03:02 <dos1> Ddorda: just less packages installed
Aug 22 12:03:10 <dos1> Ddorda: you can install them from repo
Aug 22 12:03:29 <Ddorda> i see
Aug 22 12:04:00 <Ddorda> everytime i flash the kernel i need to flash the uimage too?
Aug 22 12:04:02 <PaulFertser> The fat one has them pre-installed with the lite one you'll need to install all the buggy packages from repo :D
Aug 22 12:04:23 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: flashing the kernel == flashing uimage.
Aug 22 12:04:25 <dos1> Ddorda: kernel==uImagw
Aug 22 12:04:27 <dos1> e
Aug 22 12:04:38 <dos1> PaulFertser: hehe ;) but not in this case
Aug 22 12:05:03 <Ddorda> so what's the "lite-om-gta02" thing?
Aug 22 12:07:10 <Ddorda> ..?
Aug 22 12:27:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5522 10/trunk/eda/fped/ (TODO gui_canvas.c gui_tool.c inst.c inst.h postscript.c): (log message trimmed)
Aug 22 12:27:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: Selection now tries to help us not to get lost.
Aug 22 12:27:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: - postscript.c: started adding generation of object-level frames (on-going)
Aug 22 12:27:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: - gui_canvas.c: moved call to inst_deselect into inst_select, so that
Aug 22 12:27:51 <CIA-52> openmoko:  inst_select can keep track of the previous selection (if any)
Aug 22 12:27:55 <CIA-52> openmoko: - inst_select: if clicking on the location of the previous selection, try to
Aug 22 12:27:57 <CIA-52> openmoko:  select the next matching item
Aug 22 12:48:27 <Ddorda> how do i connect to a wifi with SHR?
Aug 22 12:55:54 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: how do i connect to a wifi with SHR?
Aug 22 12:59:21 <Ainulindale> Ddorda: there's mokonnect for instance
Aug 22 12:59:58 <Ddorda> i don't see this app anywhere. .how can i download it if i have no network..?
Aug 22 13:00:32 <Ainulindale> It should be there on full, not lite though
Aug 22 13:02:01 <Ddorda> SHR full (of bugs) version
Aug 22 13:02:18 <Ddorda> dos1 recommended installing the lite version
Aug 22 13:02:40 <soltys> Ddorda: opkg install mokonnect
Aug 22 13:02:57 <soltys> it isn't in -lite image by default
Aug 22 13:04:13 <Ddorda> opkg was not found :O
Aug 22 13:06:35 <soltys> omg
Aug 22 13:06:47 <Ddorda> how odd :S
Aug 22 13:06:54 <soltys> omg ;P
Aug 22 13:06:58 <soltys> it's fixed now
Aug 22 13:07:20 <soltys> opkg-cli update && opkg-cli install opkg libopkg0
Aug 22 13:07:22 <soltys> ;P
Aug 22 13:07:31 <soltys> and you'll have opkg ;P
Aug 22 13:07:59 <soltys> s/-cli/-cl/
Aug 22 13:08:03 <soltys> damn
Aug 22 13:08:48 <soltys> or you can symlink opkg-cl to opkg...
Aug 22 13:10:42 <Ddorda> opkg-ci was not found too
Aug 22 13:10:50 <Ddorda> cli
Aug 22 13:10:53 <Ddorda> oh.. i see
Aug 22 13:12:01 <Ddorda> soltys: what are these colors on the power button?
Aug 22 13:12:04 <Ddorda> blue and red
Aug 22 13:12:41 <soltys> red -> charging, blue -> charged (battery)
Aug 22 13:12:51 <Ddorda> cool :D
Aug 22 13:14:04 <Ddorda> the om have internet from the PC?
Aug 22 13:14:16 <Ddorda> from where does it get connection?
Aug 22 13:16:14 <soltys> Ddorda: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking
Aug 22 13:18:18 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5523 10/trunk/eda/fped/ (TODO inst.c): - inst.c: we can drag points at a frame base again
Aug 22 13:30:50 <Ddorda> soltys: thanks
Aug 22 13:32:10 <soltys> Ddorda: np
Aug 22 13:34:50 <Ddorda> ermm.. i can't get to usb0
Aug 22 13:35:07 <soltys> hm now it's ethX ;P
Aug 22 13:35:11 <soltys> afair
Aug 22 13:35:42 <Ddorda> ifconfig -a doesn't show anything special
Aug 22 13:35:47 <Wonka> mh, eth0 on FR has always been the wifi device...
Aug 22 13:35:56 <soltys> Wonka: no pc ;)
Aug 22 13:36:03 <soltys> s/no/on
Aug 22 13:36:08 <soltys> afaik
Aug 22 13:36:18 <Wonka> ah. ok. has always been usb0 here too.
Aug 22 13:36:41 <soltys> not on shr with kernel>= 2.6.28 or sth like that
Aug 22 13:36:48 <soltys> (gta02)
Aug 22 13:38:59 <Ddorda> tried using less +F /var/log/messages
Aug 22 13:39:05 <Ddorda> but didn't show anything
Aug 22 13:45:09 <Wonka> SHR with 2.6.29-rc3 on FR; 2.6.30.x on PC
Aug 22 13:45:13 <Wonka> usb0 on both sides#
Aug 22 13:46:35 <Ddorda> when i used OM i had usb0, but now it's gone
Aug 22 13:46:40 <Ddorda> and i dont have any eth0
Aug 22 13:46:42 <Ddorda> eth1*
Aug 22 13:49:57 <soltys> strange ;)
Aug 22 13:50:11 <soltys> Wonka: I had usb0 and now I have eth2 ;)
Aug 22 13:53:27 <Wonka> mhf...
Aug 22 13:53:54 <Wonka> sometimes, i'd like it if the FR looked like _both_ cdc_ether and ttyUSB
Aug 22 13:54:01 <Wonka> serial console via USB too
Aug 22 13:54:20 <Wonka> so one could just log in with picocom and fix networking...
Aug 22 13:54:27 <Wonka> instead of doing it via touchscreen
Aug 22 13:55:56 <Ddorda> okay, the problem was with the usb port
Aug 22 14:02:46 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: (wifi) please read FSO_Resources wiki page.
Aug 22 14:04:05 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: i'm trying to install opkg with ssh, but it can't resolve host name, but when i try the download links, it works very well
Aug 22 14:04:57 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: are you sure you've set up your host properly to do NAT? And that you also have some sane resolv.conf on your device?
Aug 22 14:04:58 <Ddorda> so my guess is that the moko can't access my network
Aug 22 14:05:25 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: not sure at all. can you link me?
Aug 22 14:05:45 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: to a network administration guide? hm
Aug 22 14:06:09 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: my network works fine
Aug 22 14:06:22 <Ddorda> using DHCP
Aug 22 14:07:03 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: can't resolve host name says it's not. And by network i mean not only the way your host gets internet but also how you're going to use the internet from the device.
Aug 22 14:08:06 <Ddorda> erm.. now i'm confused lol
Aug 22 14:09:20 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: probably this one but it's outdated :( At least it describes the networking concepts ... http://tldp.org/HOWTO/IP-Masquerade-HOWTO/
Aug 22 14:10:22 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: this one is more uptodate: http://iptables.org/documentation/HOWTO/cn/NAT-HOWTO.html
Aug 22 14:10:25 <Ddorda> holly :S
Aug 22 14:10:33 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: heh, not cn, of course
Aug 22 14:10:56 <PaulFertser> And it's still old :(
Aug 22 14:12:42 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i learned iptables mostly with the help of "man iptables"
Aug 22 14:13:22 * Kagee learned iptables from google :)
Aug 22 14:14:08 <Ddorda> i will just ask for help in the israeli OM mailing list
Aug 22 14:15:02 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: wrong idea
Aug 22 14:15:49 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: to learn networking it's better to do just that, read various descriptions of networking concepts and iptables manual.
Aug 22 14:15:53 <PaulFertser> imho
Aug 22 14:15:57 <Ddorda> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking#USB_Networking_support
Aug 22 14:16:04 <Ddorda> where i should do that?
Aug 22 14:16:11 <Ddorda> it says just "go to ...."
Aug 22 14:16:33 <Ddorda> but where? i can't find it in the moko or in my ubuntu..
Aug 22 14:17:09 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i gave you a link to networking concepts description.
Aug 22 14:17:34 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: and NAT is explained there in detail (2.4 is a bit old but the knowledge should work for 2.6 as well).
Aug 22 14:17:56 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: you're trying to find some device-specific instructions instead. imho that's wrong.
Aug 22 14:18:09 <Ddorda> well, it seems to be a REAL long, i don't have so much time..
Aug 22 14:18:14 <Ddorda> i have H.W to do :P
Aug 22 14:18:35 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: you want to do something REAL hard -- to master administration of a GNU/Linux based router.
Aug 22 14:18:42 <PaulFertser> No wonder it should take long.
Aug 22 14:18:53 <Kero> networking is complex. of course it's long! ;)
Aug 22 14:19:29 <Ddorda> so for now my moko is useless? :(
Aug 22 14:20:06 <PaulFertser> (thinking of it a bit more there's something perverted in the requirement to be a Linux administrator to hook up once's phone to the internet, but hell, that's how i see it, that's what life is like)
Aug 22 14:20:21 <Ddorda> can't install anything, can't even connect the network, don't have sim, no games.. i'ts not even a advanced calculator :(
Aug 22 14:20:42 <Kero> there was a calculator app once...
Aug 22 14:20:55 <Ddorda> there is one, a simple one :P
Aug 22 14:21:22 <Ddorda> is there any way to copy files from my PC to the device?
Aug 22 14:21:23 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: there's an advanced one preinstalled too: python.
Aug 22 14:21:27 <Kero> Ddorda: 1) is the /etc/resolv.conf on Neo OK?
Aug 22 14:21:29 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: sure, scp files.
Aug 22 14:24:58 <Ddorda> Kero: checking
Aug 22 14:25:22 <Ddorda> nameserver 208.67.222.222
Aug 22 14:25:22 <Ddorda> nameserver 208.67.220.220
Aug 22 14:26:10 <Ddorda> on my ubuntu i don't have this file cause ubuntu is a weird distro
Aug 22 14:26:12 <Kero> unlikely :) the sme trail in mine. I put my real DNS server at the top
Aug 22 14:26:47 <Ddorda> i use DHCP, the OM doesn't have a DHCP client?
Aug 22 14:27:16 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: did you bridge your usb0 and network interface you have dhcp at?
Aug 22 14:27:20 <Kero> hehe, don't knowwhat Ubuntu does by default, resolvconf package? but even so, /etc/resolv.conf should contain your DNS.
Aug 22 14:27:38 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: do you understand the way you want packets to go?
Aug 22 14:28:04 <Ddorda> this noob feeling starts to be annoying
Aug 22 14:28:36 <Ddorda> i have no usb0, but i have eth1
Aug 22 14:28:41 <Kero> the trick is to ping all the machines on the way he packets should go, closest to Neo first.
Aug 22 14:28:44 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: ah, ok, that's what i meant.
Aug 22 14:28:55 <Kero> when a pign fails, you know roughly where the problem is.
Aug 22 14:29:15 <PaulFertser> Kero: the first decision to be made is whether he wants to make his host a bridge or a router.
Aug 22 14:29:18 <Kero> then it can still be firewalls, routing or nat poblems/
Aug 22 14:29:54 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5524 10/trunk/eda/fped/ (gui_tool.c obj.c): 
Aug 22 14:29:54 <CIA-52> openmoko: Bug-fixing ...
Aug 22 14:29:54 <CIA-52> openmoko: - obj.c: embarrasingly, the default offset wasn't a distance
Aug 22 14:29:54 <CIA-52> openmoko: - connect_obj: didn't update the object's frame pointer, deeply confusing
Aug 22 14:29:54 <CIA-52> openmoko:  deletion
Aug 22 14:29:57 <Ddorda> i added my DNS to the resolv.conf, but a ping to google still doesnt do anything
Aug 22 14:30:11 <Kero> first ping your PC, then your DNS :)
Aug 22 14:30:39 <Ddorda> which IP? the inside-network one?
Aug 22 14:30:42 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: decide if you do a router or bridge
Aug 22 14:31:06 <Kero> PaulFertser: I've forgotten which is which. I prefer transparent stuff. MASQUERADE works well for me.
Aug 22 14:31:16 <PaulFertser> Kero: that's router of course.
Aug 22 14:31:33 <Ddorda> how do i know what i need? why does the moko have to be a router or a bridge?
Aug 22 14:31:35 <PaulFertser> Kero: but you won't have DHCP through that, will you?
Aug 22 14:32:06 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: you want your host to somehow transfer packets from/to your device. I know of 2 most widely used techniques: routing, bridging.
Aug 22 14:32:26 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: also in routing case you might need to employ NAT.
Aug 22 14:32:32 <Kero> PaulFertser: nope. fixed addresses and such.
Aug 22 14:32:48 <PaulFertser> Kero: and Ddorda says he wants to use his DHCP server...
Aug 22 14:32:49 <Ddorda> i want to the device (so i can surf the network in the moko)
Aug 22 14:33:37 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: probably i'm dead wrong, wait for the other guys to come and say something...
Aug 22 14:34:29 <Kero> true. then ping the DHCP server ;)  lovely how my router is a bridge and my laptop does routing... guess I better stop adding to the confusion.
Aug 22 14:35:35 <PaulFertser> Kero: same here, my zxdsl831 adsl modem/router is so fucked up i had to switch it to briding-only mode and use my desktop as a ppp point and router instead.
Aug 22 14:35:59 <Wonka> I think, pointing people at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/USB_Networking#Debian.2C_Ubuntu_and_others should be enough in most cases
Aug 22 14:36:20 <Wonka> also, repairing those gui network managing apps would be nice... but not for me
Aug 22 14:36:44 <PaulFertser> Wonka: that's the point. I'm so much frustrated over stupid pages with iptables recipies that don't give any understanding that i want to literally crash something!
Aug 22 14:36:48 <PaulFertser> Fuck it.
Aug 22 14:37:08 <Ddorda> Tom from SHR told me that in the next version they will put Mokonnect to the lite version
Aug 22 14:37:25 <Wonka> "up iptables -A POSTROUTING -t nat -s 192.168.0.0/24 -j MASQUERADE"
Aug 22 14:37:25 <PaulFertser> And no, in my opinion gui network managing apps can't help anybody who doesn't understand networking in the first place.
Aug 22 14:37:30 <Wonka> wtf is that shit?
Aug 22 14:37:41 <Wonka> no -i usb0 or something
Aug 22 14:38:00 <PaulFertser> Wonka: and netmask is wrong
Aug 22 14:38:07 <Wonka> this /etc/network/freerunner is much better
Aug 22 14:38:14 <PaulFertser> Wonka: etc. You see how stupid is to put the recipies on the wiki?
Aug 22 14:38:30 <Wonka> PaulFertser: mh, isn't the default config 192.168.0.202/24?
Aug 22 14:38:38 <Wonka> my personal one is /30 too...
Aug 22 14:39:00 <PaulFertser> Wonka: it's unreasonable to use /24 on host, makes colliding with other network easier.
Aug 22 14:39:06 <Wonka> ack.
Aug 22 14:39:14 <Wonka> but the default is that stupid, afair
Aug 22 14:40:43 <PaulFertser> Wonka: it doesn't matter that much what's the default on FR itself. Netmask is something that affects only routing so in the simplest case when FR is connected via usb to a host, there's only one physical route anyway.
Aug 22 14:41:25 <PaulFertser> Well, not exactly. Broadcast address etc... It all depends on particular setup.
Aug 22 14:41:31 <Kero> *mumble* -o eth2 -j MASQUERADE and restrict 192.168 or usb0 on INPUT.
Aug 22 14:41:40 <PaulFertser> And this is why i say users should understand networking themselves.
Aug 22 14:41:53 * Kero agrees with PaulFertser on that
Aug 22 14:42:17 <ShellEvil> Imagine the fun in a couple of years - when ipv6 raises its head
Aug 22 14:42:35 <ShellEvil> (in a big way)
Aug 22 14:44:30 * pabs3 uses 192.168.0.200/29
Aug 22 14:44:45 <PaulFertser> I guess the only "sane" way to support end-users is to say something like this: "If your host has internet access, then install 3proxy version x.x and this config file." And SHR guys make a script to auto-configure the device to use that proxy.
Aug 22 14:44:50 <pabs3> IPv6 will be awesome, no more NAT
Aug 22 14:45:47 <PaulFertser> Of course, choice of the particular light proxy is subject to discussion. But you got the idea.
Aug 22 14:45:48 <Wonka> mh... uSDHC 16GB class 2 53.95 EUR
Aug 22 14:45:48 <ShellEvil> Sure - but IPV6/4 mixed nets
Aug 22 14:46:33 <DocScrutinizer> Wonka: my nokia card was 4bucks cheaper
Aug 22 14:47:40 <DocScrutinizer> PaulFertser: I like your idea very much ;-P
Aug 22 14:47:49 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer: i don't ;)
Aug 22 14:48:10 <PaulFertser> DocScrutinizer: but neverthereless it's something to be discussed.
Aug 22 14:48:30 <DocScrutinizer> PaulFertser: even rmote-configure XD
Aug 22 14:49:01 <PaulFertser> Hehe, backdoors in SHR preinstalled, *neat* idea
Aug 22 14:49:07 <DocScrutinizer> and SHR guys sit all the day and night at 1.level helpdesk
Aug 22 14:49:45 <pbaxter> can someone tell me how to convert a tar.gz image into a jffs2?
Aug 22 14:50:01 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: the exact command line is device-dependent.
Aug 22 14:50:33 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: are you sure you want to do that? Just boot from SD and use rsync to copy all the filesystem to flash.
Aug 22 14:51:28 <pbaxter> PaulFertser
Aug 22 14:51:34 <pbaxter> i dunno what to do
Aug 22 14:51:41 <DocScrutinizer> that's btw how I created the moko11-uSD-flash-img
Aug 22 14:52:16 <pbaxter> i need to transform the image of archmobile.tar.gz in jffs2
Aug 22 14:52:28 <pbaxter> i'm on an ubuntu machine
Aug 22 14:53:14 <pbaxter> can someone help me?
Aug 22 14:53:23 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: why can't you boot it from SD
Aug 22 14:53:42 <pbaxter> i don't like booting from sd
Aug 22 14:54:36 <DocScrutinizer> nevermind my last line
Aug 22 14:55:03 <Ddorda> for now, how can i use the WIFI in the moko to connect the network?
Aug 22 14:55:10 <DocScrutinizer> yayayayay
Aug 22 14:56:00 <pbaxter> so how can i convert it?
Aug 22 14:56:08 <pbaxter> can you give me a link to a page on the official wiki?
Aug 22 14:57:22 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: http://paste.debian.net/44805/
Aug 22 14:57:33 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: the command used by SHR.
Aug 22 14:58:04 <pbaxter> ok
Aug 22 14:58:06 <DocScrutinizer> google.com?q=site:wiki.openmoko.com%20jffs2
Aug 22 14:58:07 <pbaxter> but i'm on a pc
Aug 22 14:58:56 <DocScrutinizer> *sigh*, not the time of day for that
Aug 22 14:59:00 <DocScrutinizer> cya
Aug 22 14:59:08 <pbaxter> ok Doc thx
Aug 22 14:59:11 <pbaxter> thx paul
Aug 22 15:01:29 <DocScrutinizer> pbaxter: boot to any uSD image, mount NAND (dev/mtdblk6), untar to NAND, done
Aug 22 15:01:50 <pbaxter> ok...i have to put something on SD
Aug 22 15:02:04 <Wonka> hrmf. did I find out correctly that the SPI stuff on the debugboard's J11 connector is just passed through from the ribbon connector CN1 and not connected to any chip?
Aug 22 15:02:29 <DocScrutinizer> yo
Aug 22 15:03:05 <Wonka> damn. so I need another FT2232 based device for doing SPI stuff.
Aug 22 15:03:06 <DocScrutinizer> which chip would u like  it to be connected to?
Aug 22 15:03:12 <Wonka> FT2232D
Aug 22 15:03:17 <Wonka> those do SPI too...
Aug 22 15:03:27 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: so, didn't you like the command? You don't need SD for that
Aug 22 15:03:31 <Wonka> yeah, not in that configuration maybe...
Aug 22 15:03:36 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: that's how the image is done in SHR build process.
Aug 22 15:03:51 <pbaxter> Paul..i can't understand what you say
Aug 22 15:04:16 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: you asked me which command prepares the filesystem image for freerunner.
Aug 22 15:04:31 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: obviously that's mkfs.jffs2 with relevant parameters.
Aug 22 15:04:41 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: i pasted parameters suitable for FR.
Aug 22 15:04:56 <pbaxter> Paul i just need to put a file called archmobile.tar.gz on my Flash
Aug 22 15:05:02 <pbaxter> but i don't know how to make
Aug 22 15:05:17 <pbaxter> Paul you mean the pastebin.debian.de?
Aug 22 15:05:21 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: yes
Aug 22 15:05:31 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: http://paste.debian.net/44805/
Aug 22 15:06:02 <pbaxter> but can i ask you what do i use of all these parametres?
Aug 22 15:06:18 <PaulFertser> pbaxter: can't you read mkfs.jffs2 manual yourself?
Aug 22 15:06:28 <pbaxter> ok i'll search
Aug 22 15:06:35 <pbaxter> didn't understand have to use that command
Aug 22 15:06:57 <Ddorda> "iwconfig eth0 key PASSWORD essid NETWORK_NAME" suppose to work, right?
Aug 22 15:07:28 <DocScrutinizer> pbaxter: your either need to create a rootfs.jffs2 file out of tgz and use dfu-util. that's paul's. or you simply copy to the existing jffs2 fs in NAND, that's my suggestion
Aug 22 15:08:02 <PBeck> hi
Aug 22 15:08:11 <pbaxter> and hot to create that jffs2 from tar?
Aug 22 15:08:29 <mjr> untar and mkfs.jffs2
Aug 22 15:08:52 <DocScrutinizer> wtf? that's what paul just explained
Aug 22 15:09:32 <pbaxter> i'm so noob
Aug 22 15:09:40 <pbaxter> ok i've not understood anything about what to do
Aug 22 15:09:45 <pbaxter> and also my pc is going to destroy
Aug 22 15:10:09 <Wonka> aaaah, i _might_ be able to use the jtag header for spi...
Aug 22 15:10:22 <Wonka> MPSSE is used for both jtag and spi
Aug 22 15:10:25 <Wonka> and i2c too
Aug 22 15:21:20 * Kero sets OE to compile a bunch of gnome things for a ruby binding...
Aug 22 15:22:33 <Kero> think I'm slowly understanding how OE and bitbake work, though not necessarily why it works that way ;)
Aug 22 15:35:20 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i think that any shr user, especially the one that wants to use wifi, needs to read and understand FSO_resources wikipage.
Aug 22 15:35:33 <Digital_Pioneer> Hahahah
Aug 22 15:35:41 <Digital_Pioneer> @Kero
Aug 22 15:41:57 * Kero should be thinking ahead on how to explain to his colleagues how to make recipes. likely they have never cross compiled anything... gonna be hard :/
Aug 22 15:43:04 <Kero> unless "inherit autotools" does the trick :D
Aug 22 15:46:56 <Wonka> hrgmf.
Aug 22 15:48:15 <Wonka> sound does not work, aplay always hangs with something like "suspended, trying to resume"...
Aug 22 15:48:41 <Wonka> rmmodding snd_soc_neo1973_gta02_wm8753 hangs...
Aug 22 15:55:40 <PaulFertser> (continuing networking talks) So, did anybody managed to use Bluetooth networking finally?
Aug 22 15:59:01 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5525 10/trunk/eda/fped/ (10 files): (log message trimmed)
Aug 22 15:59:01 <CIA-52> openmoko: Made life in mil-land a little less painful.
Aug 22 15:59:01 <CIA-52> openmoko: - .fpd file format: new directive "unit" to set the default unit
Aug 22 15:59:01 <CIA-52> openmoko: - new selection was too aggressive - make it only rearrange settings if we also
Aug 22 15:59:01 <CIA-52> openmoko:  fail the second vector search
Aug 22 15:59:01 <PaulFertser> It works more reliable than wifi and you don't need any special equipment (AP) for that, just use bluetooth module in your laptop or a BT dongle in your desktop.
Aug 22 15:59:02 <CIA-52> openmoko: - gui_draw_pad_text: calculation of height vs. width lost too much precision,
Aug 22 15:59:06 <CIA-52> openmoko:  causing pad text to be rotated arbitrarily
Aug 22 16:01:09 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5526 10/trunk/gta02-core/modules/ (INFO STATUS mkloe wm3236aq.fpd): 
Aug 22 16:01:09 <CIA-52> openmoko: Added draft of 48QFN for WM3236AQ (WLAN). 2*13+2*11 pads, dimensions
Aug 22 16:01:09 <CIA-52> openmoko: specified in mil - could it get any weirder ?
Aug 22 16:02:46 <haeger> can someone give me a hint which distribution should be used first to get familiar with the freerunner?
Aug 22 16:02:58 <PaulFertser> haeger: i'd recommend SHR
Aug 22 16:03:09 <Slyon> haeger: i'd recommend SHR, too
Aug 22 16:04:59 <haeger> thank you :) 
Aug 22 16:14:25 <haeger> to dev apps for shr i have to get familiar with enlightment?
Aug 22 16:15:07 <Kero> gtk stack works, so I don't think so.
Aug 22 16:15:20 <Kero> depending on what you want, you still might
Aug 22 16:15:39 <ndnihil> perl-tk!
Aug 22 16:15:48 <ndnihil> no E required :)
Aug 22 16:16:01 * Kero has the ruby-tk binding compiled for SHR ;)
Aug 22 16:16:07 <Kero> not intending to use it
Aug 22 16:16:27 <Kero> but I should probably check whether it works...
Aug 22 16:16:44 <haeger> hmm i don't want to learn more languages... c, bash and java ist enough ^^
Aug 22 16:16:54 <ndnihil> I did perl-tk, Net::DBus, XML::Parser, and XML::Twig
Aug 22 16:18:13 <Kero> haeger: new programming language every year! good for your programming skills
Aug 22 16:19:01 <Kero> python and vala would be obvious choices for openmoko
Aug 22 16:19:12 <haeger> ^^ python is interesting... ruby on rails sounds good too 
Aug 22 16:19:27 <Kero> (assuming vala has enough momentum on OM, that is)
Aug 22 16:20:07 <haeger> is there an gtk based frontend for freerunner?
Aug 22 16:20:14 <haeger> -an +a
Aug 22 16:20:16 <dos1> haeger: frontend?
Aug 22 16:20:29 <dos1> (gtk on freerunner sucks)
Aug 22 16:20:29 <haeger> ui whatever you want ^^
Aug 22 16:20:43 <dos1> haeger: there were om2007 and om2007.2
Aug 22 16:20:46 <dos1> too slow
Aug 22 16:21:28 <dos1> qt works better on fr, and enlightenment libraries much better than gtk and qt together
Aug 22 16:21:30 <haeger> kay -.- that are very depricated distributions 
Aug 22 16:21:36 <dos1> (in my opinion)
Aug 22 16:21:38 <djp`> can anyone tell me the difference between the neo freerunner 6, 6+ and 7?
Aug 22 16:22:27 <haeger> okay maybe i will give enlightment libs a chance when i finished my study ^^
Aug 22 16:22:28 <SpeedEvil> 7 comes with a portable mobility system and power source. (a sheep with a car battery on top).
Aug 22 16:23:02 <dos1> djp`: there are three hardware revisions out in mass market
Aug 22 16:23:09 <dos1> djp`: gta02a5, a6 and a7
Aug 22 16:23:32 <djp`> thanks dos1 and SpeedEvil
Aug 22 16:23:36 <dos1> djp`: a5->a6 - applied sd-gps fix, fixed current from red led on aux
Aug 22 16:23:49 <dos1> djp`: a6->a7 - buzz-fix
Aug 22 16:24:04 <djp`> so is it best to go for a7 or can a5 be upgraded to a7?
Aug 22 16:24:15 <dos1> (with both are also other small fixed which i don't remember ATM)
Aug 22 16:24:31 <dos1> djp`: there is no "6+", but probably that's how you reseller marks "a6 with buzzfix applied by us"
Aug 22 16:25:15 <djp`> just that the a5 is almost 100 euros cheaper than a7
Aug 22 16:25:17 <dos1> djp`: if you are familiar with soldering then you can upgrade a5 to a7
Aug 22 16:25:42 <dos1> well, buzzfix is the only one really important change from a5 to a7
Aug 22 16:25:52 <dos1> maybe aux led could be too, but i don't know if it's fixable
Aug 22 16:25:55 <PaulFertser> dos1: full ack
Aug 22 16:26:03 <djp`> thanks dos1
Aug 22 16:26:12 <SpeedEvil> Is there any wiki page about this?
Aug 22 16:26:15 <SpeedEvil> There should be.
Aug 22 16:26:21 <dos1> i saw some ages ago
Aug 22 16:26:31 <dos1> dunno where it is now ;p
Aug 22 16:26:35 <djp`> is 299 euros a reasonable price for the a7?
Aug 22 16:27:14 <Ddorda> why the PC doesn't see the moko :(((
Aug 22 16:27:21 <djp`> it looks like i'll need to buy from europe as the uk doesn't have any in stock
Aug 22 16:27:24 <Ddorda> i'm working over an hour to fix that one :(
Aug 22 16:27:38 <dos1> Ddorda: check which interface it has
Aug 22 16:27:39 <haeger> ddorda: linux pc?
Aug 22 16:27:41 <dos1> Ddorda: it won't be usb0
Aug 22 16:28:00 <Ddorda> i don't have no usb0. no eth1
Aug 22 16:28:03 <Ddorda> yes, linux
Aug 22 16:28:06 <PaulFertser> djp`: 299EUR is too much
Aug 22 16:28:16 <pabs3> Ddorda: does it show up in lsusb?
Aug 22 16:28:20 <PaulFertser> djp`: i'd buy A6 and applied the buzzfix myself.
Aug 22 16:28:25 <haeger> djp: where do you come from? in germany you can obtain it for 199 €
Aug 22 16:28:41 <djp`> haeger, i'm in the uk
Aug 22 16:29:09 <haeger> djp: kay :D
Aug 22 16:29:18 <djp`> PaulFertser, will the buzzfix from a6 to a7 require soldering?
Aug 22 16:29:18 <Ddorda> Bus 001 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0002 Linux Foundation 2.0 root hub
Aug 22 16:29:19 <Ddorda> Bus 003 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Aug 22 16:29:19 <Ddorda> Bus 002 Device 088: ID 045e:0040 Microsoft Corp. Wheel Mouse Optical
Aug 22 16:29:19 <Ddorda> Bus 002 Device 001: ID 1d6b:0001 Linux Foundation 1.1 root hub
Aug 22 16:29:50 <haeger> ddorda: seems no be shown by lsusb
Aug 22 16:29:57 <pabs3> Ddorda: looks like it doesn't show up. if using SHR, try suspending & resuming
Aug 22 16:30:09 <djp`> haeger, are you allowed to supply a link to the 199 euro offer?
Aug 22 16:30:25 <haeger> djp: moment please
Aug 22 16:30:36 <Ddorda> pabs3: omg! thanks!
Aug 22 16:30:37 <PaulFertser> djp`: of course
Aug 22 16:30:51 <pabs3> Ddorda: it worked?
Aug 22 16:30:56 <Ddorda> Bus 002 Device 108: ID 1457:5122 First International Computer, Inc. OpenMoko Neo1973 kernel cdc_ether USB network
Aug 22 16:30:58 <Ddorda> indeed
Aug 22 16:30:59 <Ddorda> :D
Aug 22 16:31:01 <Ddorda> yay
Aug 22 16:31:20 <haeger> ddorda: nice when things get work?? :D
Aug 22 16:31:49 <Ddorda> yea :D
Aug 22 16:31:58 <dos1> ...
Aug 22 16:32:04 <Ddorda> now i just need to figure out what the hack is the network problem
Aug 22 16:32:11 <haeger> djp: http://www.pulster.de/
Aug 22 16:32:31 <djp`> thanks haeger
Aug 22 16:32:33 <dos1> i still try to remind, where i saw "First International Computer" before OpenMoko...
Aug 22 16:32:36 <dos1> err
Aug 22 16:32:38 <haeger> djp: no problem :)
Aug 22 16:32:46 <dos1> i know where - in some market, on some thing
Aug 22 16:32:53 <dos1> but what thing? :x
Aug 22 16:33:21 <Wonka> I've got Windows 3.1 disks... yes, those 3.5" thingies containing 1.44MB each...
Aug 22 16:33:26 <Wonka> with FIC logo on them
Aug 22 16:33:29 <haeger> ok ok my next phone will be a freerunner :)
Aug 22 16:33:47 <dos1> haeger: are you geek?
Aug 22 16:33:47 <ndnihil> noob, I've got 8" 48k floppies in the basement 
Aug 22 16:33:49 <ndnihil> ;)
Aug 22 16:33:56 <ndnihil> maybe they're 64k
Aug 22 16:34:04 * Wonka also got an 8° 160k floppy on the wall
Aug 22 16:34:09 <Wonka> 8"
Aug 22 16:34:09 <dos1> haeger: are you prepared for fighting with console to get things, which "just works" on other phones?
Aug 22 16:34:21 <haeger> dos1: yes linux on my desktop, on my laptop, at work... why not on my phone?? :D
Aug 22 16:34:25 <Wonka> aaaand also i got some IBM punch cards. unpunched.
Aug 22 16:34:29 <dos1> haeger: are you used to troubleshooting linux systems?
Aug 22 16:34:52 <dos1> haeger: if to at least 2 of those questions you can answer "yes"...
Aug 22 16:34:52 <ndnihil> I threw out an at&t 3b1 earlier this summer
Aug 22 16:34:57 <dos1> haeger: then welcome ;)
Aug 22 16:35:10 <haeger> dos1: yes to both ^^
Aug 22 16:35:34 <ndnihil> think I still have a ][c clone down there 
Aug 22 16:37:22 <Ddorda> how do i know the ip of the device?
Aug 22 16:37:25 <haeger> i love my vash, my vim and i'm responsible for embedded linux systems at work ^^ is that enough?
Aug 22 16:37:34 <haeger> bash -.-
Aug 22 16:39:51 <Ddorda> $ ssh root@192.168.0.202
Aug 22 16:39:51 <Ddorda> ssh: connect to host 192.168.0.202 port 22: No route to host
Aug 22 16:40:21 <haeger> ddorda: ping 192.168.0.22
Aug 22 16:40:45 <PaulFertser> haeger: sure
Aug 22 16:40:54 <Ddorda> ssh: connect to host 192.168.0.22 port 22: No route to host
Aug 22 16:41:03 <Wonka> haeger: hey, that's my IP!
Aug 22 16:41:04 <Ddorda> oh.. oopsy
Aug 22 16:42:03 <dos1> :D
Aug 22 16:42:03 <Ddorda> haeger: doesn't work
Aug 22 16:43:24 <haeger> ddorda: is that the correct ip?
Aug 22 16:43:43 <Ddorda> have no idea.. that's what i'm trying to check
Aug 22 16:43:51 <Ddorda> oh.. dinner is ready
Aug 22 16:43:55 <dos1> Ddorda: 192.168.0.202 is default FR ip by default
Aug 22 16:44:00 <Ddorda> ttyl all, thanks for all your help
Aug 22 16:44:07 <Ddorda> dos1: i didn't changed anything
Aug 22 16:44:11 <Ddorda> bbl
Aug 22 16:44:22 <dos1> Ddorda: you should check if it doesn't interfere with your home lan
Aug 22 16:44:58 <PaulFertser> dos1: what do you think about my proxy suggestion?
Aug 22 16:45:17 <dos1> proxy
Aug 22 16:45:19 <dos1> ?
Aug 22 16:49:21 <PaulFertser> 18:43 < PaulFertser> I guess the only "sane" way to support end-users is to say something like this: "If  your host has internet access, then install 3proxy version x.x and this config  file." And SHR guys make a script to auto-configure the device to use that proxy.
Aug 22 16:49:30 <PaulFertser> dos1: ^^
Aug 22 16:50:08 <dos1> PaulFertser: it didn't came to channel (at last not for me) before :o
Aug 22 16:52:13 <haeger> enlightment libs and gtk seems to be very similar to use :) that's nice 
Aug 22 16:52:42 <djp`> would the freerunner be suitable for a gnu/linux noob?
Aug 22 16:52:55 <dos1> djp`: probably no
Aug 22 16:53:19 <dos1> djp`: unless he is REALLY patient and know how to search things without asking stupid questions
Aug 22 16:53:38 <djp`> dos1, right... maybe i should give it a miss for now. :)
Aug 22 16:53:51 <haeger> no question is stupid...
Aug 22 16:54:41 <dos1> haeger: ok, s/stupid questions/questions, which were asked and answered milions of times before/
Aug 22 16:55:06 <PaulFertser> haeger: but not every quetion is smart 
Aug 22 16:55:23 <haeger> dos1: maybe not for the people how ask them? 
Aug 22 16:55:41 <djp`> apologies if i've asked some stupid questions here today. i didn't mean to offend.
Aug 22 16:56:11 <dos1> djp`: no, i'm talking generally, not about you. no offence
Aug 22 16:56:34 <dos1> (maybe you asked stupid questions, i didn't pay attension, sorry ;D)
Aug 22 16:56:35 <haeger> paulfertser: maybe not but is a great problem that newbies are treated kindly sometimes
Aug 22 16:56:45 <haeger> aren't
Aug 22 16:57:03 <dos1> haeger: bad thinking
Aug 22 16:57:11 <dos1> haeger: being newbie != being idiot
Aug 22 16:57:34 <dos1> we should help newbies
Aug 22 16:58:01 <haeger> dos1: that what i mean ^^
Aug 22 16:58:30 <djp`> dos1, i've only recently switched to gnu/linux. i bought a yeeloong and installed gnewsense mips-l on it. my mobile phone contract is up for renewal and i was contemplating the switch to a free software mobile also
Aug 22 16:59:12 <dos1> haeger: but many people, when see that idiots are treated badly, says "you are bad, you don't help newbies!"
Aug 22 17:00:07 <PaulFertser> dos1: i know what you mean :)
Aug 22 17:00:24 <dos1> you can ask smart, good questions when you're newbiee; but when you're asking idiotic questions, then don't be suprised you'll be threated as idiot
Aug 22 17:00:32 <dos1> all in that topic :)
Aug 22 17:00:48 <haeger> dos1: the question is how is an idiot? someone how is absolutly new to some subject? An has questions that seem to be very simply to other people?
Aug 22 17:00:57 <haeger> who
Aug 22 17:01:59 <PaulFertser> haeger: e.g. when someone asks "how do i turn my home pc into a router" and then gets a link to a page explaining networking concepts says "i can't read that, i don't have time, just tell me what to do" is somehow questionable..
Aug 22 17:02:10 <dos1> PaulFertser: ++
Aug 22 17:02:33 <haeger> paulfertser: okay :D
Aug 22 17:03:00 <PaulFertser> dos1: so what about my proxy suggestion to help total newbs?
Aug 22 17:04:32 <Ddorda> back i black :D
Aug 22 17:04:52 <Ddorda> dos1: how do i check that one?
Aug 22 17:05:02 <haeger> i'm hardened because i have been a private tutor for mathematics :D
Aug 22 17:06:44 <PaulFertser> haeger: real mathematics or stupid school stuff?
Aug 22 17:07:48 <haeger> unfortunately most time school stuff but sometime something little bit more ambitious
Aug 22 17:08:27 <PaulFertser> haeger: does school stuff include ad-hoc analisys?
Aug 22 17:09:13 <haeger> no ^^ no fourier/laplace analysis too -.-
Aug 22 17:09:17 <Kero> shr-unstable gdk-pixbuf failed to build
Aug 22 17:10:29 <PaulFertser> haeger: in russia school children get some elements of analysis, at least they can take derivatives, integrate some simple cases etc. I can't see how can one study physics without it... school sucks :(
Aug 22 17:11:07 <Kero> education s*cks big time.
Aug 22 17:11:18 <Kero> +systems
Aug 22 17:11:46 <dos1> yup...
Aug 22 17:12:03 <dos1> PaulFertser: dunno what to think about that proxy
Aug 22 17:12:29 <PaulFertser> dos1: choice of proxy doesn't matter, the only requirement is lightweight crossplatform http/ftp/https proxy.
Aug 22 17:12:45 <dos1> people who need such thing aren't target of SHR now
Aug 22 17:12:52 <PaulFertser> dos1: so we can choose one of that and make instructions for clueless people.
Aug 22 17:12:58 <haeger> paulfertser: study  sciences without calculus is impossible 
Aug 22 17:13:00 <dos1> maybe in (far) future
Aug 22 17:13:04 <Ddorda> dos1: how do i check that one?
Aug 22 17:13:25 <dos1> but well, someone can do that, of course
Aug 22 17:14:29 <PaulFertser> dos1: imagine we remove _all_ iptables instructions from both OM and SHR wiki.
Aug 22 17:21:20 <bogenfreund> hi. i am looking for an original Om 2007.2 image. I know it is not longer supported, and that there are alternative images from celtune and scaredycat. But it there any possiblity to get an "original" image (like the one the freerunners are sometimes shipped with now).
Aug 22 17:22:03 <dos1> bogenfreund: that default one really sucks, it is cutted from most of useful things
Aug 22 17:22:08 <bogenfreund> i know
Aug 22 17:22:21 <bogenfreund> but i loaned one from university and fucked up the original image
Aug 22 17:22:23 <haeger> have to go now thanks for help and conversation ^^
Aug 22 17:22:27 <bogenfreund> so i just want to reset it :)
Aug 22 17:25:44 <Weiss> bogenfreund: i'm SURE noone will be upset if you return it with a more modern distro installed..
Aug 22 17:26:38 <dos1> bogenfreund: original image is available on openmoko servers, it should be in Om2008.4 repo somewhere (it's still 2007.2, don't be suggested by directory name)
Aug 22 17:26:44 <dos1> bogenfreund: but... why do you need 2007.2?
Aug 22 17:26:59 <bogenfreund> thank you very much for the hint
Aug 22 17:27:01 <dos1> om2007.2, celtune and scaredycat - they all are dead :P
Aug 22 17:27:31 <bogenfreund> Weiss: yes, I suppose they won't be too sad.
Aug 22 17:27:54 <bogenfreund> I just want to have the option to restore it to the state I got it in. Just in case they would be complaining.
Aug 22 17:28:09 <Weiss> in fact, while i don't know the circumstances of the loan, i'd hope they'd be more upset if you DID return it with the same image.. :)
Aug 22 17:28:12 <Weiss> (it's OPENmoko..)
Aug 22 17:29:16 <bogenfreund> Weiss: lol
Aug 22 17:29:28 <bogenfreund> I know its stupid
Aug 22 17:29:32 <bogenfreund> they will replace it anyway
Aug 22 17:29:52 <Ddorda> i added a gadget in SHR. how can i remove it?
Aug 22 17:33:10 <Kero> Ddorda: you will have to phrase questions in a clearer way. for one, you did *not* explain what you did by saying you "added a gadget".
Aug 22 17:33:56 <Kero> for two, why did removing, which assumedly is done similary like adding it, not work, despite you trying so.
Aug 22 17:34:17 <Kero> for three, why would you want to remove it, is it wreaking havoc?
Aug 22 17:34:23 <Ddorda> i went to setting > Extensions > Gadgets > Add
Aug 22 17:34:34 <Ddorda> i cant see any removing button..
Aug 22 17:35:14 <Kero> beats me. I have SHR20090808 and in Settings I don;t have Extensions.
Aug 22 17:35:19 <Kero> gta01
Aug 22 17:36:21 <max_posedon1> Kero, he mean e17-settings
Aug 22 17:36:33 <max_posedon1> not shr-settings
Aug 22 17:39:00 <Kero> there, all useful information!
Aug 22 17:40:28 <Ddorda> now i can't rid of this lame extension :S
Aug 22 17:45:53 <max_posedon1> rm -rf ~/.e
Aug 22 17:46:10 <max_posedon1> always works)
Aug 22 17:48:20 <Ddorda> max_posedon1: not only it didn't helped removing the gadget, it removed all the icons
Aug 22 17:49:05 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: as expected
Aug 22 17:49:21 <Ddorda> well, that's not what i meant to do
Aug 22 17:49:23 <Ddorda> :P
Aug 22 17:49:31 <PaulFertser> max_posedon1: i wonder what would he say if you suggested him to do "rm -rf /"
Aug 22 17:49:37 <PaulFertser> ;)
Aug 22 17:49:49 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: i won;t do that, i'm not that stupid
Aug 22 17:50:23 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: cool
Aug 22 17:50:57 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: what about :(){ :|:& };: 
Aug 22 17:52:13 <max_posedon1> Ddorda, icons stored in otger place!
Aug 22 17:52:45 <Ddorda> i'm reflashing the rootfs
Aug 22 17:56:07 <max_posedon1> oh
Aug 22 17:56:23 <max_posedon1> as you wish)
Aug 22 17:56:43 <max_posedon1> but empty rootfs haven't .e too
Aug 22 17:57:05 <max_posedon1> it filled on boot
Aug 22 17:57:17 <max_posedon1> )
Aug 22 17:57:58 <Ddorda> yea, i messed up something else too :P
Aug 22 18:17:40 <Ddorda> i run these commands:
Aug 22 18:17:42 <Ddorda> sudo ip address add 192.168.0.200/24 dev eth1
Aug 22 18:17:42 <Ddorda> sudo ip link set dev eth1 up
Aug 22 18:17:42 <Ddorda> sudo ifconfig eth1 192.168.0.200 netmask 255.255.255.0 up
Aug 22 18:17:54 <Ddorda> and then
Aug 22 18:17:55 <Ddorda> ssh root@192.168.0.202
Aug 22 18:18:05 <Ddorda> gives: ssh: connect to host 192.168.0.202 port 22: No route to host
Aug 22 18:18:26 <lindi-> Ddorda: why do you mix ip and ifconfig?
Aug 22 18:18:31 <lindi-> Ddorda: where do you run these commands?
Aug 22 18:18:40 <Ddorda> in my PC
Aug 22 18:18:46 <Ddorda> i shoukd do just or this or this?
Aug 22 18:19:29 <lindi-> ip address add 192.168.0.200 dev eth1; ip link set eth1 up; ip route add 192.168.0.0/24 dev eth1?
Aug 22 18:19:39 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: why do you mix "ip" and "ifconfig" commands? Ifconfig is the traditional bsd way of doing things, "ip" is modern linux way.
Aug 22 18:19:40 <lindi-> i hope you are not using 192.168.0.0/24 anywhere else
Aug 22 18:20:04 <Ddorda> nope
Aug 22 18:20:08 <Ddorda> not as much as i know
Aug 22 18:20:19 <Ddorda> i changes my home network to 192.168.1
Aug 22 18:20:37 <PaulFertser> lindi-: i've already adviced him to read an article about networking concepts and iptables but he refused. :-/
Aug 22 18:21:18 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: it would take me a month :S
Aug 22 18:21:43 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: you're overestimating it i'm afraid.
Aug 22 18:23:03 <Ddorda> now i did just ifconfig
Aug 22 18:23:09 <Ddorda> and then tried the ssh
Aug 22 18:23:14 <Ddorda> got the same prompt
Aug 22 18:24:06 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: when is ipv6 coming? It looks like no ISP here in moscow supports it :(
Aug 22 18:24:58 <SpeedEvil> Some places have apparantly deployed it. 
Aug 22 18:26:36 <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPv6_deployment
Aug 22 18:28:40 <PaulFertser> SpeedEvil: do you recommend to start using it right now and if yes, what technology do you suggest? Getting ip from some brokers like sixx and use 6t4? Or use teredo/miredo?
Aug 22 18:30:12 <Ddorda> i don't see what i did wrong. it worked to me once, what wrong this time? :(
Aug 22 18:30:20 <SpeedEvil> I was meaning in the future - when IPV6 is being deployed variably around the world - and people have hardware and software that doesn't properly support - net config is going to be even more fun
Aug 22 19:00:58 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5527 10/trunk/eda/fped/ (10 files in 2 dirs): 
Aug 22 19:00:58 <CIA-52> openmoko: - new visualization option: show all frames or show only current frame
Aug 22 19:00:58 <CIA-52> openmoko: - new visualization option: highlight pads and silk ("final" view)
Aug 22 19:03:15 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: i did it
Aug 22 19:03:18 <Ddorda> :D
Aug 22 19:03:23 <Ddorda> thanks for all your help
Aug 22 19:03:40 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i'm glad to see you're not offended
Aug 22 19:03:57 <PaulFertser> Because i meant no offence. :D
Aug 22 19:04:08 <Ddorda> not at all, i know you're just trying to help
Aug 22 19:46:37 <Ddorda> what is the package name for the frozen-bubble game?
Aug 22 19:46:57 <Ddorda> and is there any good games but mokomze and frozen-bubble?
Aug 22 19:47:13 <Ddorda> and ffs this device doesn't have any snake game?!
Aug 22 19:47:25 <dos1> i don't think frozen-bubble is available
Aug 22 19:51:38 <Ddorda> i saw it does in the wiki
Aug 22 19:51:56 <Ddorda> and how do i install fennec? opkg install fennec didn't work
Aug 22 19:52:33 <dos1> fennec sucks on om (at last alpha2 sucked)
Aug 22 19:52:45 <dos1> i'm more interested in eve
Aug 22 19:52:46 <Ddorda> it's still on alpha?
Aug 22 19:53:01 <Ddorda> a friend told me it works fine, just a little slow
Aug 22 19:53:20 <Elleo> last time I tried it "a little slow" meant unusably slow
Aug 22 19:53:48 <Ddorda> i want to at least try it once
Aug 22 19:54:03 <Ddorda> there's no package for it?
Aug 22 20:00:24 <Elleo> Ddorda: when I tried it I just used the angstrom packages
Aug 22 20:00:58 <Ddorda> angstrom packages?
Aug 22 20:01:13 <Elleo> angstrom's built with a different set of base libraries though, so you'll need to fiddle around a bit to get the right packages installed and --force-depends on others
Aug 22 20:01:19 <Elleo> http://www.angstrom-distribution.org/repo/?pkgname=fennec
Aug 22 20:01:44 <Elleo> angstrom pretty much builds the latest version of every package in OE
Aug 22 20:02:10 <Elleo> alternatively you could try building the fennec package with the SHR checkout of OE
Aug 22 20:02:43 <Ddorda> SHR checkout of OE
Aug 22 20:02:47 <Ddorda> link me?
Aug 22 20:03:06 <Elleo> http://shr-project.org/trac/wiki/Building%20SHR
Aug 22 20:03:16 <Elleo> if you're not familiar with OE then you probably don't want to go down that route
Aug 22 20:03:32 <Ddorda> what's OE?
Aug 22 20:03:35 <Elleo> open embedded
Aug 22 20:03:52 <Elleo> it's the build system used by a lot of mobile distribution
Aug 22 20:04:03 <Ddorda> opkg?
Aug 22 20:04:04 <Elleo> (OpenMoko, SHR, FSO, OpenZaurus, Angstrom, etc.)
Aug 22 20:04:10 <Elleo> opkg is a package manager
Aug 22 20:04:17 <Elleo> OE creates ipks for use with opkg
Aug 22 20:04:54 <Elleo> but if you're not interested in doing some serious development work then getting to grips with OE probably isn't worth your time
Aug 22 20:06:31 <Elleo> anyway, personally I found the old minimo packages to be much more usable if you want something gecko based
Aug 22 20:06:58 <Elleo> http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Minimo
Aug 22 20:07:37 <Ddorda> i'm searching for a browser that works fine, with gmail too
Aug 22 20:07:46 <Elleo> minimo will
Aug 22 20:07:50 <Elleo> midori should too I'd have thought
Aug 22 20:08:30 <Ddorda> midori doesn't look like something for mobile phones, it's like pidgin
Aug 22 20:12:34 <CIA-52> freesmartphone.org: 03seba.dos1 07dos/opimd-tracking * rc1befb68390a 10framework/framework/subsystems/opimd/pimb_sqlite_notes.py: opimd: SQLite-Notes: support editing multiple values of one field
Aug 22 20:12:47 <Ddorda> Elleo: does minimo have no problem showing gmail?
Aug 22 20:13:15 <Elleo> nope, it's a pretty normal gecko (mozilla) renderer
Aug 22 20:13:30 <Ddorda> great! D
Aug 22 20:13:32 <Ddorda> :D
Aug 22 20:13:40 <Ddorda> btw, how about openmoko-browser2?
Aug 22 20:19:34 <CIA-52> freesmartphone.org: 03seba.dos1 07dos/opimd-tracking * rf6ff7cc6a224 10framework/framework/subsystems/opimd/ (5 files): opimd: SQLite-*: support editing multiple values of one field
Aug 22 20:31:47 <Ddorda> is there any appmanager for shr?
Aug 22 20:32:00 <max_posedon> Ddorda, opkg?
Aug 22 20:32:14 <Ddorda> graphical one
Aug 22 20:32:41 <max_posedon> opkg in vala-terminal?)\
Aug 22 20:33:07 <Ddorda> i mean like in OM2008 (don;t know if 2009 has one too)
Aug 22 20:38:51 <Ddorda> minimo exists in the shr repos?
Aug 22 20:43:26 <max_posedon> some people working on shr-installer
Aug 22 20:49:59 <Ddorda> shr-installer?
Aug 22 20:52:03 <Slaxxer> huh?
Aug 22 20:53:37 <Slaxxer> looks like   a  new shr-U might be showing up soon
Aug 22 20:54:53 <max_posedon> Ddorda, yes, as packagekit (and opkg) frontend
Aug 22 20:55:24 <Slaxxer> it appears that the latest shr-u is in the "old" folder   lolol
Aug 22 20:55:38 <Ddorda> Elleo: minimo is awsome! :D thanks
Aug 22 20:56:54 <Elleo> no problem :)
Aug 22 20:57:01 <Ddorda> little slow, but hey - it works
Aug 22 20:57:32 <max_posedon> Slaxxer, shr-U great distro, it can become old, and outdated in 2 days)
Aug 22 20:57:44 <Slaxxer> yea
Aug 22 20:58:25 <Ddorda> oh.. now i see it even slower than i thought :(
Aug 22 20:58:47 <dos1> Slaxxer: i moved it to "old"
Aug 22 20:58:54 <dos1> Slaxxer: newest shr-full is broken
Aug 22 20:58:58 <dos1> Slaxxer: use newest shr-lite
Aug 22 20:59:05 <Slaxxer> i do
Aug 22 20:59:09 <Slaxxer>  i have
Aug 22 20:59:16 <dos1> and if you want full, then just install task-shr-* packages
Aug 22 20:59:46 <kac> Hi
Aug 22 21:00:21 <kac> can anyone help me doing first steps with oe?
Aug 22 21:00:52 <Slaxxer> switch to   shr
Aug 22 21:01:04 <Slaxxer> read the topic
Aug 22 21:01:32 <Ddorda> i installed minimo, how can i remove it without touching the dependecies?
Aug 22 21:01:38 <Guest4814> hi all, could any one help me building openmoko?
Aug 22 21:01:39 <kac> ok thnx
Aug 22 21:01:51 <Ddorda> dependencies*
Aug 22 21:02:06 <Slaxxer> why to remove?
Aug 22 21:02:15 <Ddorda> too slow for me
Aug 22 21:02:25 <madel> hi all, could any one help me building openmoko?
Aug 22 21:02:27 <Ddorda> i dont need more than one browser on the device
Aug 22 21:02:35 <Slaxxer> woosh?
Aug 22 21:02:42 <Ddorda> didn't tried it yet
Aug 22 21:02:53 <Slaxxer> what u using then?
Aug 22 21:03:05 <Ddorda> nothing for now
Aug 22 21:03:11 <Ddorda> but minimo is too slow
Aug 22 21:03:24 <Ddorda> maybe i'll change back to midori
Aug 22 21:03:28 <Slaxxer> dillio?
Aug 22 21:03:31 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i use links2, it supports graphics and is fast
Aug 22 21:03:36 <Slaxxer> Dillo
Aug 22 21:03:37 <PaulFertser> Yes, or dillo.
Aug 22 21:04:18 <Ddorda> what's better? links2 or dillo?
Aug 22 21:04:19 <Slaxxer> make us an package Paul
Aug 22 21:05:25 <PaulFertser> Slaxxer: sorry, i would but i use Debian :p
Aug 22 21:05:59 <Slaxxer> why not then   if u use debian
Aug 22 21:06:04 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: links doesn't support neither JS nor much of CSS.
Aug 22 21:06:21 <Ddorda> oh.. so i guess i'll go on the dillo?
Aug 22 21:06:23 <PaulFertser> Slaxxer: debian has that already packaged i think.
Aug 22 21:06:28 <Slaxxer> ok
Aug 22 21:06:30 <Slaxxer> good
Aug 22 21:06:52 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i suggest just not using websites requiring that shit ;)
Aug 22 21:07:42 <Ddorda> dillo is faster the woosh?
Aug 22 21:08:13 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i think yes, but also more limited wrt "modern web".
Aug 22 21:08:25 <Ddorda> wrt?
Aug 22 21:08:59 <SpeedEvil> With Regards To
Aug 22 21:09:05 <madel> hi all, could any one help me building openmoko?
Aug 22 21:09:28 <Ddorda> well, how can i remove minimo without hearting anything installed?
Aug 22 21:09:35 <PaulFertser> madel: can you follow "building SHR" guide from their wiki?
Aug 22 21:09:48 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i think "opkg remove" will do exactly that.
Aug 22 21:10:31 <Ddorda> it wants to remove a lib that some apps use
Aug 22 21:10:43 <PaulFertser> Are you sure?
Aug 22 21:11:10 <Ddorda> Collected errors:
Aug 22 21:11:10 <Ddorda>  * Package libxft2 is depended upon by packages:
Aug 22 21:11:10 <Ddorda>  * 	minimo
Aug 22 21:11:10 <Ddorda>  * 	vala-terminal
Aug 22 21:11:10 <Ddorda>  * 	libvte9
Aug 22 21:11:11 <Ddorda>  * 	pango
Aug 22 21:11:15 <Ddorda>  * 	xtscal
Aug 22 21:11:17 <Ddorda>  * These might cease to work if package libxft2 is removed.
Aug 22 21:13:09 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: see?
Aug 22 21:13:31 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: we usually use pastebin for that kind of pastes. Please do it too the next time.
Aug 22 21:13:37 <Ddorda> okay
Aug 22 21:13:43 <Ddorda> sorry
Aug 22 21:13:47 <WalterN> http://pastebin.com
Aug 22 21:13:50 <WalterN> :)
Aug 22 21:13:55 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: hm, what command do you use, just "opkg remove minimo"?
Aug 22 21:14:10 <madel> PaulFertser: could you please give me a link to building SHR
Aug 22 21:15:00 <PaulFertser> madel: http://shr-project.org/trac/wiki/Building%20SHR
Aug 22 21:15:49 <Ddorda> no
Aug 22 21:16:27 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: why not?
Aug 22 21:16:41 <Ddorda> oh! oopsy..
Aug 22 21:23:03 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03rehar * r5528 10/trunk/gta02-core/audio.sch: removed R4407/4405 from audio sheet
Aug 22 21:27:36 <Ddorda> PaulFertser: do you know any good wifi manager?
Aug 22 21:27:53 <Ddorda> not mokonnect, which makes my moko crash
Aug 22 21:27:54 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: i think using vim to edit wpa_supplicant.conf is ok.
Aug 22 21:28:05 <PaulFertser> Ddorda: so no i don't
Aug 22 21:28:12 <Ddorda> i see
Aug 22 22:04:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03rehar * r5529 10/trunk/gta02-core/ (components/INFO docs/ecn/ecn0015.txt docs/ecn/ecn0032.txt): 
Aug 22 22:04:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: - added Commit info to ECN0015
Aug 22 22:04:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: - added beads to INFO
Aug 22 22:04:51 <CIA-52> openmoko: - replaced bead in EMI filter ECN0032
Aug 22 22:34:02 <jesperj>  Id like to get advice on a virtualization tool for installing , checking out (and maybe even develop for on) openmoko, qtopia, gpe, symbian and the like 
Aug 22 22:48:13 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03rehar * r5530 10/trunk/gta02-core/ (5 files in 2 dirs): 
Aug 22 22:48:13 <CIA-52> openmoko: - set status of ECN0015 to Execute
Aug 22 22:48:13 <CIA-52> openmoko: - set status of ECN0031 to Execute
Aug 22 22:48:13 <CIA-52> openmoko: - added info about B4102 removal to ECN0010, set status to Execute
Aug 22 22:48:13 <CIA-52> openmoko: - reviewed ECN0020 and set status to Cancel
Aug 22 22:48:16 <CIA-52> openmoko: - fixed typos
Aug 22 22:55:42 <CIA-52> openmoko: 03werner * r5531 10/trunk/eda/fped/ (12 files in 2 dirs): 
Aug 22 22:55:42 <CIA-52> openmoko: - when displaying loop iterations, we now use the active count, not just the
Aug 22 22:55:42 <CIA-52> openmoko:  last count
Aug 22 22:55:42 <CIA-52> openmoko: - loop iterations now show the actual value, not the zero-based iteration
Aug 22 22:55:42 <CIA-52> openmoko:  number
Aug 22 22:55:43 <CIA-52> openmoko: - gui.html: added a GUI manual (in progress)
Aug 22 23:10:08 <Ddorda> how can i transfer files to the moko?
Aug 22 23:10:28 <Etu> Ddorda: scp over usbnetwork
Aug 22 23:12:59 <Ddorda> Etu: thanks
Aug 22 23:23:45 <Kero> whee, ruby+cairo+gtk2/rsvg  http://scap.linuxtogo.org/files/e0c929c8a73033196a55c2f73e5cc7c7.png
Aug 23 00:23:18 <|Marco|> is there a list of changes from Freerunner A5 to A6 anywhere ? I'd like to take a look at it if there is any list
Aug 23 00:35:47 <|Marco|> found it
Aug 23 00:42:23 <Psi> does shr show/save your sent sms anywhere? or is that not written yet?
Aug 23 00:48:53 <WalterN> what would be the best way to use VOIP on the openmoko?
Aug 23 00:49:06 <SpeedEvil> WalterN: over wifi
Aug 23 00:49:30 <WalterN> erm.. not a good way to phrase what I'm wondering :P
Aug 23 00:49:59 <WalterN> I was thinking more like.. well.. I dont think Skype has a client made
Aug 23 00:50:06 <SpeedEvil> ah
Aug 23 00:50:14 <SpeedEvil> skype doesn't have one, no.
Aug 23 00:50:25 <SpeedEvil> I don't really know of any voip software. 
Aug 23 00:50:29 <SpeedEvil> search the wiki?
Aug 23 00:50:43 <WalterN> I think pidglin (or however its spelled)
Aug 23 00:50:51 <SpeedEvil> pidgin
Aug 23 00:51:03 <WalterN> (heh)
Aug 23 00:51:07 <SpeedEvil> Actually - I think it recently added voip - I'm unsure
Aug 23 00:51:09 <SpeedEvil> #pidgin
Aug 23 00:51:44 <WalterN> but.. thats just the client... how would you connect a client like that to a VOIP server?
Aug 23 00:52:28 <SpeedEvil> duct tape.
Aug 23 00:52:34 <WalterN> heh
Aug 23 00:52:36 <WalterN> and a wire
Aug 23 00:52:39 <SpeedEvil> wifi
Aug 23 00:52:45 <WalterN> for data :)
Aug 23 00:52:45 <SpeedEvil> or bluetooth PAN
Aug 23 00:52:57 <WalterN> USB :P
Aug 23 00:53:02 <SpeedEvil> If you want to connect over GPRS - you really can't easily
Aug 23 00:53:14 <WalterN> GPRS?
Aug 23 00:53:25 <SpeedEvil> mobile data
Aug 23 00:53:37 <WalterN> hmm
Aug 23 00:54:01 <WalterN> could I set up my own server?
Aug 23 00:59:36 <SpeedEvil> yes - google asterix
Aug 23 00:59:40 <SpeedEvil> or go to #asterix
Aug 23 01:00:11 <WalterN> ok
Aug 23 01:01:25 <WalterN> hmm... I think I remember coming across this before... only looking for something different for this guy I know
Aug 23 01:01:47 <WalterN> as I recall it looked really complicated
Aug 23 01:01:49 <WalterN> heh
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Aug 23 02:59:56 2009