**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Nov 19 02:59:58 2010
Nov 19 07:58:40 <[Steven_M]> I was told from a guy in #android that this project is dead, is that true?
Nov 19 07:59:17 <max_posedon> its depend on what is dead
Nov 19 07:59:36 <max_posedon> projectc/community/company
Nov 19 08:01:25 <[Steven_M]> max_posedon: can I buy a Openmoko smart phone to use in New Zealand?
Nov 19 08:02:35 <max_posedon> if you ok with internet shopping - I think yes
Nov 19 08:02:56 <Heinervdm> [Steven_M]: You can find the distributors here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Distributors
Nov 19 08:05:22 <[Steven_M]> how do I know if it will work on my phone network?
Nov 19 08:10:24 <[Steven_M]> As I said to  a guy in #android: As a Linux fan I am torn between buying an Android phone and waiting for a GNU/Linux smart phone to come out.
Nov 19 08:12:05 <PaulFertser> [Steven_M]: it works with any GSM network but limited to 2G (no support for EDGE even). Be sure to buy "international" (900MHz) version (and not US-specific 850MHz).
Nov 19 08:12:54 <PaulFertser> [Steven_M]: if you're a GNU/Linux fan you can also consider N900 or the upcoming N9 though the degree of freedom these devices offer to one is considerably low comparing to the FreeRunner.
Nov 19 08:18:43 <[Steven_M]> PaulFertser: What's the difference between 2G and 3G again?
Nov 19 08:19:51 <PaulFertser> [Steven_M]: from end-user pov: speed.
Nov 19 08:20:32 <PaulFertser> [Steven_M]: by 3G i mean HSDPA/HSUPA, that kind of stuff. You'll find plenty of info on wikipedia ;)
Nov 19 08:20:51 <[Steven_M]> ok, is upcoming N9 3G?
Nov 19 08:31:35 <[Steven_M]> PaulFertser: Is the upcoming N9 going to be 3G?
Nov 19 08:42:16 <Heinervdm> [Steven_M]: yes, nearly every upcomming smartphone has 3G
Nov 19 08:44:38 <[Steven_M]> Heinervdm: thanks
Nov 19 08:45:48 <[Steven_M]> Can you gtk2 apps on it such as pidgin and claws-mail?
Nov 19 08:50:21 <Heinervdm> [Steven_M]: Don't know, i never used MeeGo
Nov 19 08:52:59 <[Steven_M]> Heinervdm: what's meeGo?
Nov 19 08:53:46 <Heinervdm> [Steven_M]: The OS that will be running on N9, it's a linux distri developed by intel and nokia
Nov 19 08:55:17 <[Steven_M]> Heinervdm: ok, forgive my ignorance
Nov 19 14:47:49 <pabs3> anyone know where I can find the kernel config for SHR-u 2.6.34?
Nov 19 14:48:20 <tomcatek> /boot ?
Nov 19 14:48:59 <pabs3> nope, nor /proc
Nov 19 14:50:10 <PaulFertser> pabs3: the OE repository
Nov 19 14:51:04 <jluis> pabs I could post mine but it only boots and neither touchscreen nor X11 work
Nov 19 15:27:23 <Heinervdm> PaulFertser: gta01? http://cgit.openembedded.org/cgit.cgi/openembedded/tree/recipes/linux/linux-2.6.34/om-gta01/defconfig
Nov 19 15:27:46 <PaulFertser> pabs3: ^^
Nov 19 15:27:49 <PaulFertser> Heinervdm: thanks
Nov 19 15:28:02 <pabs3> yep, already cloned and found it (gta02)
Nov 19 15:28:27 <Heinervdm> PaulFertser: ups, wront autocompletion :)
Nov 19 15:28:31 <Heinervdm> wrong
Nov 19 15:28:36 <pabs3> (trying to figure out why aplay doesn't work with the Debian pkg-fso 2.6.34 kernel)
Nov 19 15:37:23 <pabs3> anyone else experiencing aplay/mplayer being broken with Debian and pkg-fso 2.6.34 kernel?
Nov 19 20:23:19 <luke-jr> someone sent me a Freerunner. it doesn't seem to boot. is that to be expected? :P
Nov 19 20:23:58 <PaulFertser> luke-jr: only if it's totally discharged. BTW, does NOR u-boot work?
Nov 19 20:24:07 <luke-jr> INFO: RCU detected CPU 0 stall (t=4294909852/2000 jiffies)
Nov 19 20:24:19 <luke-jr> NOR u-boot⁇
Nov 19 20:26:10 <max_posedon> looks like kernel boots
Nov 19 20:26:38 <max_posedon> so, just flash kernel, and rootfs and bootloader, from shr-unstable for example
Nov 19 20:35:07 <luke-jr> how?
Nov 19 20:35:25 <luke-jr> probably the bigger question is how to backup existing content first
Nov 19 20:35:47 <PaulFertser> luke-jr: you do not really need to backup anything usually.
Nov 19 20:35:57 <PaulFertser> luke-jr: to flash just use nor u-boot and dfu-util on host.
Nov 19 20:40:07 <max_posedon> luke-jr, press aux, press power, wait 2-3 sec, release power, release aux
Nov 19 20:40:15 <max_posedon> you will see nor u-boot menu
Nov 19 20:40:38 <luke-jr> flashing replaces data. that implies a need to backup
Nov 19 20:40:40 <max_posedon> install dfu-util , and next you can easyly flush kernel/uboot/rootfs
Nov 19 20:40:55 <max_posedon> dfu-util could do backup
Nov 19 20:41:56 <PaulFertser> NOR dfu-util can't do a backup
Nov 19 21:27:04 <luke-jr> ugh, dfu-util exists only as some unstable 0.1? :/
Nov 19 21:27:52 <PaulFertser> luke-jr: yes but so far it was quite stable. 0.2 was released just about a week ago.
Nov 19 22:40:35 <luke-jr> so where can I find the open source cell firmware?
Nov 19 22:43:41 <max_posedon> in PI, but I don't remember exact ofset and limit
Nov 19 22:44:26 <max_posedon> in short, Neo Freerunner haven't open source cell firmware
Nov 19 22:45:57 <luke-jr> max_posedon: I heard it did, but it was as of yet incomplete
Nov 19 22:46:10 <luke-jr> how can I be sure bugs 676 and 1843 aren't affecting me?
Nov 19 22:46:29 <Kamping_Kaiser> cell?
Nov 19 22:46:33 <Kamping_Kaiser> oh, network. right.
Nov 19 22:47:16 <luke-jr> looks like my U-Boot is 1.3.2-moko12 May 9 2008 @ 10:28:40
Nov 19 22:48:22 <max_posedon> nor or nand?
Nov 19 22:48:27 <max_posedon> freerunner have 2 uboots)
Nov 19 22:49:24 <luke-jr> NOR
Nov 19 22:50:03 <max_posedon> its ok, usually people flush recent uboot(or qi but its another story) to nand and use it
Nov 19 22:50:58 <luke-jr> We have 7 DFU Interfaces/Altsettings, you have to specify one via --intf / --alt options
Nov 19 22:51:01 <luke-jr> how do I list them?
Nov 19 22:51:13 <max_posedon> lsusb
Nov 19 22:51:18 <luke-jr> …
Nov 19 22:51:32 <max_posedon> ah, sorry, --alt
Nov 19 22:51:58 <max_posedon> u-boot | kernel | rootfs
Nov 19 22:52:02 <luke-jr> -i vs -a is index vs name?
Nov 19 22:52:03 <max_posedon> man u-boot have examples)
Nov 19 22:52:27 <max_posedon> -a accepts index, I prefer names
Nov 19 22:52:41 <luke-jr> what's -i then?
Nov 19 22:52:56 <max_posedon> may be I lied about -a, but I remember -a 0 and so on
Nov 19 22:53:02 <max_posedon> as I said, I prefer names
Nov 19 22:53:07 <luke-jr> O.o
Nov 19 22:53:21 <luke-jr> me too, but I want to be sure I backup everything…
Nov 19 22:53:27 <luke-jr> is -a different data than -i?
Nov 19 22:54:38 <max_posedon> I don't think so
Nov 19 22:55:56 <luke-jr> PaulFertser: any idea how to identify if my backups are affected by bugs 676 & 1843?
Nov 19 23:30:39 <luke-jr> dfu_upload: usb_control_msg returned -84: error sending control message: Invalid or incomplete multibyte or wide character
Nov 19 23:30:40 <luke-jr> wtf
Nov 19 23:47:15 <SpeedEvil> bogus use of ERRNO I think
Nov 19 23:47:27 <SpeedEvil> -84 is a common USB error.
Nov 19 23:47:34 <SpeedEvil> 'I've fallen over and I can't get up' IIRC
Nov 19 23:47:59 <SpeedEvil> Or it may be EPAININTHEDIODESDOWNMYRIGHTHANDSIDE
Nov 20 00:07:22 <luke-jr> what's the best firmware if I want to just do calls over SIP?
Nov 20 00:08:48 <luke-jr> SpeedEvil: same error on retry :/
Nov 20 00:08:57 <luke-jr> both images are 258076672 bytes
Nov 20 00:09:10 <undrwater> who's got a sip client?
Nov 20 00:09:20 <undrwater> pretty sure there's sipphone on shr
Nov 20 00:10:01 <undrwater> hmm..not by default
Nov 20 00:10:13 <luke-jr> not merely a client, I want it native
Nov 20 00:10:24 <luke-jr> as in able to replace the default GSM
Nov 20 00:10:42 <undrwater> ahh...don't think ANYONE has done that :)
Nov 20 00:10:56 <undrwater> but i've been away with android for a while
Nov 20 00:10:56 <luke-jr> except Nokia?
Nov 20 00:11:06 <undrwater> for openmoko i mean
Nov 20 00:12:35 <undrwater> android allows google voice natively
Nov 20 00:18:03 <luke-jr> undrwater: any idea how large the rootfs partition is?
Nov 20 00:18:57 <luke-jr> undrwater: which build of Android do you use?
Nov 20 00:19:10 <undrwater> the latest i've used that works is 1.6
Nov 20 00:19:24 <luke-jr> ._.
Nov 20 00:19:25 <undrwater> there's a 2.2 that runs, but is slow
Nov 20 00:19:27 <luke-jr> where is that?
Nov 20 00:19:38 <undrwater> search for android on freerunner
Nov 20 00:19:38 <luke-jr> I only see a weekly from April 2010, and 0.2.0-rc1
Nov 20 00:19:43 <undrwater> there's a wiki
Nov 20 00:19:52 <undrwater> on the wiki?
Nov 20 00:20:02 <luke-jr> the dl page
Nov 20 00:20:10 <luke-jr> "A fully charged Openmoko Freerunner GTA02 telephone"
Nov 20 00:20:15 <luke-jr> how do I make sure?
Nov 20 00:20:29 <luke-jr> "Some way of connecting your SD card to your computer." -- don't have ☹
Nov 20 00:21:42 <luke-jr> wiki refers back to dl page
Nov 20 00:21:50 <undrwater> yep...
Nov 20 00:22:28 <luke-jr> which only has 2010-16 and 0.2.0-rc1
Nov 20 00:22:29 <undrwater> http://serdar-dere.net/~serdar/daily/
Nov 20 00:22:51 <luke-jr> no 1.6 there either :/
Nov 20 00:23:07 <undrwater> 1.6 is which?
Nov 20 00:23:17 <undrwater> i can't stand these code names
Nov 20 00:23:35 <luke-jr> uh?
Nov 20 00:23:37 <luke-jr> dunno
Nov 20 00:23:48 <undrwater> i think cupcake is 1.6
Nov 20 00:23:49 * luke-jr knows almost nothing about Android
Nov 20 00:23:56 <luke-jr> which cupcake then?
Nov 20 00:24:01 <luke-jr> or do they all usually work?
Nov 20 00:24:19 <undrwater> nevermind donut is 1.6
Nov 20 00:24:45 <undrwater> i'll link the one i have
Nov 20 00:25:43 <undrwater> http://openmoko.senfdax.de/android/
Nov 20 00:25:57 <undrwater> so that's 1.5 on SD
Nov 20 00:26:14 <undrwater> don't need to flash the NAND
Nov 20 00:27:08 <undrwater> i use uboot and created a menu entry for that on a partition of my SD
Nov 20 00:27:14 <luke-jr> where can I find one for dfu-util?
Nov 20 00:32:41 <undrwater> luke-jr: http://code.google.com/p/android-on-freerunner/wiki/GetIt
Nov 20 00:32:54 <undrwater> apparently no dfu-util install :)
Nov 20 00:33:04 <undrwater> but it does an internal NAND flash
Nov 20 00:33:32 <luke-jr> but i fail 50% of the requirements
Nov 20 00:33:55 <luke-jr> don't know if my phone is charged, and no way to do SD from my PC
Nov 20 00:34:35 <undrwater> do you have usb cable for moko?
Nov 20 00:34:38 <luke-jr> yes
Nov 20 00:34:53 <undrwater> when plugged in, do you see lit led in power switch?
Nov 20 00:35:03 <luke-jr> no
Nov 20 00:35:11 <luke-jr> only U-boot works
Nov 20 00:35:25 <undrwater> if you hold power, nothing works?
Nov 20 00:35:33 <luke-jr> I get Linux kernel errors
Nov 20 00:35:43 <undrwater> ahh..
Nov 20 00:36:04 <undrwater> yeah...i'm not sure if you're charging either...but you can feasibly do this while plugged in 
Nov 20 00:36:23 <undrwater> do you have another phone that will accept microSD and mount as drive?
Nov 20 00:36:38 <luke-jr> N900 might, but I'd have to remove my permanent one
Nov 20 00:36:55 <undrwater> yep...that looks like a likely solution
Nov 20 00:37:04 <luke-jr> which happens to be an important rootfs for me :P
Nov 20 00:37:14 <undrwater> n900 should allow you to repartition too
Nov 20 00:37:17 <luke-jr> wait no
Nov 20 00:37:21 <luke-jr> it's only rootfs on my N810
Nov 20 00:37:29 <luke-jr> N900 uSD should be removable
Nov 20 00:37:48 <undrwater> OR...flash shr to NAND using dfu-util...use shr to help you partition your SD, then put the android on it
Nov 20 00:38:06 <luke-jr> hmm
Nov 20 00:38:09 <luke-jr> N900 might be easier XD
Nov 20 00:38:15 <undrwater> indeed :)
Nov 20 00:43:40 <luke-jr> undrwater: how big is rootfs partition?
Nov 20 00:58:42 <badcloud> ooh, N900 *drools*
Nov 20 00:58:47 <badcloud> me want
Nov 20 01:06:54 <luke-jr> badcloud: it's not open
Nov 20 01:07:19 <badcloud> luke-jr: crap
Nov 20 01:08:21 <luke-jr> the software side *mostly* can be
Nov 20 01:08:44 <luke-jr> I think except for 3D now
Nov 20 01:12:20 <badcloud> I just gotta have a builtin hw kbd for my next phone
Nov 20 01:12:35 <badcloud> hope they put something out there that's both open and good hw
Nov 20 01:12:35 <luke-jr> phones are lame
Nov 20 01:12:38 <luke-jr> N900 isn't a phone
Nov 20 01:12:41 <badcloud> luke-jr: true true
Nov 20 01:12:59 <luke-jr> I hope someone builds an open successor to the Zaurus clamshell line
Nov 20 01:13:11 <luke-jr> those had great kbs
Nov 20 01:13:22 <luke-jr> N900's is almost unusable
Nov 20 01:13:28 <luke-jr> N810's was a little better, but still pretty bad
Nov 20 01:14:13 <badcloud> luke-jr: looks bulky as all hell
Nov 20 01:14:16 <luke-jr> whoever makes an open successor to the Zaurus clamshell line up to modern specs gets $800 from me to buy it :P
Nov 20 01:14:28 <luke-jr> as long as it fits in my pocket, bulky is fine :P
Nov 20 01:14:34 <luke-jr> don't want to waste pocket space
Nov 20 01:15:08 <badcloud> no gsm modem in there?
Nov 20 01:17:34 <badcloud> luke-jr: /
Nov 20 01:17:36 <badcloud> ?
Nov 20 01:17:39 <luke-jr> yeah
Nov 20 01:17:46 <luke-jr> GSM/WCDMA
Nov 20 01:18:13 <badcloud> so I'm guessing you'd use a bt headset for calls
Nov 20 01:18:37 <badcloud> otherwise it would be like talking into a hardcover dictionary
Nov 20 01:19:01 <luke-jr> yeah
Nov 20 01:19:06 <luke-jr> wait, which device?
Nov 20 01:19:09 <luke-jr> Zaurus never had a modem
Nov 20 01:19:19 <badcloud> I was looking at Zaurus SL-C3000
Nov 20 01:19:36 <badcloud> but didn't say anything about any phone modem
Nov 20 01:19:38 <luke-jr> nor builtin wifi or bluetooth
Nov 20 01:19:50 <luke-jr> had a compactflash 802.11b
Nov 20 01:19:52 <luke-jr> for it
Nov 20 01:24:23 <badcloud> meh
Nov 20 01:26:01 <luke-jr> but would definitely want GSM/WCDMA/WiMax in a new model
Nov 20 01:26:07 <luke-jr> ideally CDMA2000 too
Nov 20 01:26:23 <SpeedEvil> DECT
Nov 20 01:26:24 <luke-jr> and ofc 802.11bgn
Nov 20 01:26:28 <luke-jr> wtf is DECT
Nov 20 01:26:51 <SpeedEvil> It's a cordless phone standard.
Nov 20 01:27:13 <luke-jr> O.o
Nov 20 01:27:27 <luke-jr> walkie-talkie frequencies would be neat
Nov 20 01:28:17 <badcloud> wow, the amount of stuff you can cram into a box of circuits...
Nov 20 01:28:24 <SpeedEvil> yeah
Nov 20 01:28:29 <SpeedEvil> I want zigbee too
Nov 20 01:28:31 <SpeedEvil> Ideally.
Nov 20 01:28:33 <kirun> That doesn't leave many wireless standards left... short the battery and do smoke signals?
Nov 20 01:28:58 <badcloud> kirun: haha
Nov 20 01:29:01 <SpeedEvil> Oh - and a compass, and gyro
Nov 20 01:29:25 <badcloud> and a French maid
Nov 20 01:31:26 <kirun> Mahoromatic?
Nov 20 01:32:39 <badcloud> Japanese scientists are busy at work as we speak
Nov 20 01:33:11 <badcloud> alongside magna artists and a mount-Everest-sized pile of blow
Nov 20 01:33:56 <kirun> The HRP-4C is pretty close, it can already cosplay: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVkuSGYPTcw
Nov 20 01:34:53 <badcloud> yikes
Nov 20 01:35:00 <badcloud> gonna have nightmares TOnight
Nov 20 01:35:14 <badcloud> g'night
Nov 20 02:26:12 <luke-jr> DocScrutinizer51: your thing is broken
Nov 20 02:27:03 <DocScrutinizer> luke-jr: WUT?
Nov 20 02:27:17 <luke-jr> flash-moko11-2.image
Nov 20 02:27:46 <DocScrutinizer> so who broke it? last time I looked at it it worked like a charm
Nov 20 02:27:54 <luke-jr> not for me
Nov 20 02:28:35 <luke-jr> I'm reflashing the uSD just to be sure
Nov 20 02:28:50 <luke-jr> this time I will sync instead of 'woops the battery just fell out'
Nov 20 02:28:59 <DocScrutinizer> haha
Nov 20 02:29:50 <DocScrutinizer> might actually help :-P
Nov 20 02:32:37 <luke-jr> looks like it
Nov 20 02:32:50 <luke-jr> is this thing charging? :x
Nov 20 02:33:34 <DocScrutinizer> you might not believe this, but yes
Nov 20 02:33:38 <luke-jr> cool
Nov 20 02:33:50 <luke-jr> DocScrutinizer: any idea where I read about an open GSM firmware for it?
Nov 20 02:33:58 <DocScrutinizer> sure
Nov 20 02:34:15 <SpeedEvil> http://openbsc.osmocom.org/
Nov 20 02:34:17 <luke-jr> btw,I'm getting bluetooth errors
Nov 20 02:34:28 <DocScrutinizer> http://bb.osmocom.org/trac/#SupportedPhonehardware
Nov 20 02:34:53 <SpeedEvil> err - no - wrong end
Nov 20 02:34:54 <SpeedEvil> yeah - that
Nov 20 02:37:02 <luke-jr> no details? :/
Nov 20 02:37:18 <SpeedEvil> there is no really functional stack yet
Nov 20 02:38:02 <luke-jr> gotta be better than DocScrutinizer's garbage
Nov 20 02:38:04 * luke-jr ducks
Nov 20 02:38:48 <luke-jr> j/k!
Nov 20 02:40:55 <SpeedEvil> TIs garbage. :)
Nov 20 02:41:27 <luke-jr> how do I login over SSH to the DONE flasher?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Nov 20 02:59:57 2010