**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Aug 08 02:59:58 2008 Aug 08 08:30:45 the qtopia-ficgta01-sdk-4.3.2.iso is the same for the Neo FreeRunner development as well? Aug 08 11:20:27 Can i create a vmware image for the Neo Qtopia Open Source SDK 4.3.2, instead of installing it on hard-disk? Aug 08 11:20:31 and use it? Aug 08 11:20:56 the qtopia sdk is a vmware image Aug 08 11:21:30 yes, the gta01 sdk is for the freerunner as well Aug 08 11:23:13 lpotter, thanks! Aug 08 11:29:25 * Sput tends to boot those images exactly once in order to get the toolchain and scripts out of'em :) Aug 08 11:30:34 Sput: you can mount the iso and get the qtopia.iso inside which contains the toolchain/binaries.. it even has a (untested) script to install them to you host Aug 08 11:31:20 The next update will include a download of only the qtopia.iso Aug 08 11:31:23 lpotter: oh, interesting Aug 08 11:51:23 lpotter, i see Aug 08 11:51:42 lpotter, how can I change the ring-tone of Qtopia on the Neo? Aug 08 11:52:30 lpotter, i am using it as a phone; it is really cool Aug 08 14:13:42 lpotter, so -- 2 days ago I filed that ticket for 'slow answer'. yesterday got email mentioining "assigned it the issue number #222337", but now I can't find it: http://trolltech.com/developer/task-tracker/index_html?id=222337&method=entry Aug 08 14:13:54 what am I doing wrong? :-) (what could I? ;-)) Aug 08 14:43:04 lpotter, ho ho -- I see fresh qtopia image... is only wifi handling was fixed-up or anything else? (if you could point may be to some log anywhere: OM's git? it would be great) Aug 08 19:13:48 Hmm... What's the triangle icon to the left of the bluetooth icon on the top bar in qtopia? Aug 08 19:18:16 wifi? Aug 08 19:19:25 Well, that was my guess as well, but... there's not much in the way of indications as to what it is :) Aug 08 19:30:17 triangle means roaming Aug 08 19:33:20 Aah, right :) Aug 08 19:45:05 It's been a while since the last freerunner image. Any news? Aug 08 19:45:27 Look on the page ;) Aug 08 19:45:31 080808 Aug 08 19:49:13 where can I find step-by-step documentation on how to use qtopia-ficgta01-sdk-4.3.2 with vmware? Aug 08 19:49:14 Sweet! Leiner Aug 08 19:49:17 didn't see it yet Aug 08 19:49:23 leinir Aug 08 19:49:24 sorry Aug 08 19:49:26 typo Aug 08 19:49:35 lpotter has released a new version? Aug 08 19:49:37 Great! Aug 08 19:49:50 ya kinda Aug 08 19:50:08 what are the changes? Aug 08 19:50:13 only a snapshot and system based on the recent OM release Aug 08 19:50:32 chouimat|work: really only to the wifi script Aug 08 19:50:41 besides whatever OM did Aug 08 19:50:48 to the system Aug 08 19:51:05 mbuf: instructions are in the iso Aug 08 19:51:25 well lpotter: I am going to try it tonight! the new image. Many thanks, hope wifi will work now :D Aug 08 19:51:45 well, it works a bit better Aug 08 19:51:49 cant say its perfect Aug 08 19:52:08 heh... every improvement is a good one lpotter. Aug 08 19:54:36 * mbuf reads the developer quick start guide Aug 08 20:04:47 lpotter: I think the update and the flash are the same file Aug 08 20:07:41 well nothing much has changed I guess except from the wifi part Aug 08 20:07:54 chouimat|work: ehhh.. hmm Aug 08 20:07:59 you might be correct. Aug 08 20:08:02 hang on Aug 08 20:08:05 ahh Aug 08 20:12:25 any chance there will be a build that I can download from qtopia? Aug 08 20:14:39 chouimat|work: http://www.qtopia.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=76 Aug 08 20:15:06 hmm. someone changed the config of that server Aug 08 20:15:09 grrr Aug 08 20:15:19 http://www.qtopia.net/modules/mydownloads/ Aug 08 20:15:24 updated the update :) Aug 08 20:15:29 :) Aug 08 20:16:33 I supposed I could make one big ipkg :) and out it on a feed Aug 08 20:16:35 put Aug 08 20:20:48 thanks Aug 08 20:20:51 going to download Aug 08 20:22:55 Thanks lpotter. Aug 08 20:23:07 Trying the upgrade thingy. Aug 08 20:23:42 What kernel should I run? Does it upgrade the kernel also? Would there be any problems with me running the latest kernel from openmoko daily? Aug 08 20:25:33 Ko_deZ: look here http://openmokoforums.eu/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=24&sid=43aa364b218c71a23621f82d7b572959 it is a manual Aug 08 20:25:41 it also explaines it also upgrades your kernel Aug 08 20:26:57 RXShorty: I know how, I just wonder how smart it is =) Aug 08 20:27:15 My kurrent kernel is from git19 I believe. Aug 08 20:27:20 ahh ok Aug 08 20:27:41 well the image file also includes the kernel Aug 08 20:27:59 But I don't know if it runs ong git19 Aug 08 20:29:01 I guess I will try flashing the kernel and modules from daily. See how that turns out. Aug 08 20:30:15 lpotter: Good stuff that upgrade script. Making me a happy man =) Aug 08 20:30:55 heh me too! because mine wouldn't work through the GUI Aug 08 20:30:58 that script is what I have been using for months Aug 08 20:33:34 lpotter, thanks for the script -- trying it now ;-) Aug 08 20:33:37 lpotter: Makes thing much more smooth. I love it! Aug 08 20:35:10 lpotter, in the full qtopia file system image -- what is the base of the system -- I mean what date snapshot of packages from OM's repositories? or it is a heterogeneous set? ;-) Aug 08 20:35:23 080808 is the latest Aug 08 20:36:10 thanks! (I saw that the kernel is such but wasn't sure about the rest) -- so it means it should be more or less safe for periodic 'opkg upgrade's ;-) Aug 08 20:36:24 yes. Aug 08 20:36:48 lpotter sorry to bug you with this silly question. But update script? Where to find it? Aug 08 20:37:07 in the binary update package at qtopia.net Aug 08 20:37:23 ah thanks Aug 08 20:37:53 RXShorty, http://www.qtopia.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=76 Aug 08 20:37:59 just a shortcut ;-) Aug 08 20:38:26 heh thanks yoh! Aug 08 20:39:22 lpotter, so -- what is up with me or BTS at trolltech? still don't see my bug report at http://trolltech.com/developer/task-tracker/index_html?id=222337&method=entry Aug 08 20:42:13 om seems to keep changing the feed location Aug 08 20:46:01 yoh: not sure Aug 08 20:46:31 ;-) I love the phrase "not sure" -- most popular in my language ;-) Have you guys seen "Idiocracy" movie? :-) Aug 08 20:46:40 no Aug 08 20:47:16 yes Aug 08 20:47:25 yoh that movie is crazy... Aug 08 20:47:30 quite nice one ;-) from the same guys who did 'office space' ;-) Aug 08 20:47:48 ironically americans still don't get the message -- imdb rating for idiocracy somewhere around 6.4 ;-) Aug 08 20:49:48 heh true true Aug 08 20:54:19 lpotter, btw -- very often phone is charging (according to apm and to red light) but qtopia's batter indication is still (not animated like during charge) -- feature or bug? Aug 08 20:54:37 unplug and plug it back in Aug 08 20:54:57 just dont start it up polugged in. :) fixed in 4.4 Aug 08 20:55:43 4.4 4.4 4.4 .... hear it a lot ;-) when are we to see the beast? :-) Aug 08 20:55:51 soon Aug 08 20:56:06 like in a week or so? Aug 08 20:56:19 few weeks Aug 08 20:56:20 * Ko_deZ is really waiting the web-browser Aug 08 20:56:22 people... it's done when it's done Aug 08 20:56:33 lpotter: If you need a beta tester... Aug 08 20:57:05 heh think we are all beta testers :P Aug 08 20:57:17 RXShorty: sure, but some kind of "we are hoping" date is good enough for me =) Aug 08 20:57:26 RXShorty, when you cook -- you know approx when the dish is done ;-) Aug 08 20:58:04 LOL true true... both of you... true :) Aug 08 20:58:22 I cant release images until we release the sources Aug 08 20:58:28 lpotter, are there previewes of 4.4 anywhere? I just want to see the beauty ;-) Aug 08 20:59:08 I meant just silly screenshots etc Aug 08 20:59:18 not yet Aug 08 21:08:18 lpotter, sorry for being pain in the ass... it seems that preview images are available for some phones: http://qtablet.laginen.net/doku.php?id=downloads Aug 08 21:08:30 sure thing for Nokias ;-) Aug 08 21:09:00 but I don't have N800 to even see the 'result' ;-) Aug 08 21:09:31 ah... there is video... Aug 08 21:10:40 ah -- that is something else I guess -- QTablet Aug 08 21:10:46 sorry for the noise -- I shut up Aug 08 21:11:10 yoh: what I understand of it, there won't be a new look Aug 08 21:11:21 just some extra applications Aug 08 21:11:56 ah... well -- more functionality is also great and apparently lots of fixes (According to "in 4.4" comments) Aug 08 21:12:15 true Aug 08 21:12:31 But if you want new looks, try your gimp skills on the icons etc :D Aug 08 21:13:55 just kidding ;) Aug 08 21:14:22 I am bad with graphics Aug 08 21:14:41 Same here I am afraid Aug 08 21:15:19 yoh: Maybe you are like me, graphically challenged. I can tell you if something looks good or not, but I can never come up with anything good looking myself. I believe it might be an engineer thing... Aug 08 21:15:34 yoh: thats not qtopia Aug 08 21:15:47 lpotter, yeah -- I got it -- sorry ;-) Aug 08 21:15:53 no worries :) Aug 08 21:16:08 btw -- in qtopia is there way to rotate the screen to landscape? (am I dumb or am I challenged ? :-)) Aug 08 21:16:51 4.4 Aug 08 21:16:55 hehehe Aug 08 21:17:00 BTW everyone, since I hang out here a bit -- bits about myself: You might know me from yoh@debian.org or if you like to check how far my hands in your boxes (if you run debian derived distro) -- http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=debian@onerussian.com Aug 08 21:17:30 also I do look 'inside the head' on a day to day basis Aug 08 21:18:02 doing brain imaging (fMRI and bits of EEG) Aug 08 21:18:13 good to know yoh Aug 08 21:18:14 about the only thing i do thats in debain is gutenbrowser Aug 08 21:18:23 :) Aug 08 21:18:35 lpotter, just saw your blog entry about it ;-) Aug 08 21:21:16 lpotter, is 4.4 in your experience more responsive or less than current 4.3 on freerunner? Aug 08 21:21:25 a bit Aug 08 21:21:28 faster Aug 08 21:21:36 still needs performance work Aug 08 21:21:46 niice ;-) Aug 08 21:21:58 Good to hear it is faster, then again I don't complain with the performance right now Aug 08 21:22:10 It is still faster as my motorola :P Aug 08 21:22:17 lpotter: out of curiosity, do you use the 2D features of the glamo? Aug 08 21:22:39 nope. smedia wanted $12,000 USD for the spec docs Aug 08 21:22:47 WOW Aug 08 21:22:51 bastards Aug 08 21:23:06 lpotter: For the scrolling and such, it could make a difference, but I don't know if it works in framebuffer. Aug 08 21:23:25 lpotter: The drivers for x could give you some hints maybe? Aug 08 21:23:37 ya, but other things are priority Aug 08 21:23:39 the price was a bit steep, yes. Aug 08 21:23:52 sure, just wondering =) Aug 08 21:24:46 lpotter, little fresh issue -- so I upgraded with the script, also did opkg upgrade after, now decided to reboot in qtopia GUI -- but it didn't shutdown but killed my Wifi connection to the phone... terminal doesnt' start... I guess the only exit is to remove battery Aug 08 21:25:10 hmm Aug 08 21:29:11 Something else, the sound quality when calling isn't that good. It beeps and disturbs on the other side of the line. Do more people have this? Aug 08 21:31:24 RXShorty: There are lots of audio issues it seems. Aug 08 21:31:29 RXShorty, well -- you must have heard about all GSM interference issues with freerunners... or did it steadily became worse with today's image? Aug 08 21:31:55 yoh, didn't update it yet. Aug 08 21:32:15 heh heh... so I upgraded the phone with the script and opkg upgrade... now it sits with blinking cursor on reboot... for quite a while now... Aug 08 21:32:35 something in opkg/feeds is borked Aug 08 21:32:42 It is charging right now, already had it ones that my battery was flat out when upgrading/flashing and my battery didn;t charge anymore Aug 08 21:32:48 probably wont work on OM as well Aug 08 21:33:31 interesting is that both ape and S98qpe are busy interleaving each other... Aug 08 21:34:36 o boy.. .there is that /tmp/restart-qtopia and S98qpe loops while it is still there... Aug 08 21:34:57 yes. qtpoia would be crashing Aug 08 21:35:09 if it keeps restarting Aug 08 21:35:19 /etc/init.d/qpe stop Aug 08 21:36:21 is there a nice way to start qpe with a bit more verbosity so we know WTF? Aug 08 21:36:57 qtopia has logging Aug 08 21:37:16 just cp /opt/Qtopia/etc/default/Trolltech/Log.conf ~/Settings/Trolltech Aug 08 21:37:33 and edit to turn on logging. OR set it up with the logging settings app Aug 08 21:38:06 ok -- THANKS. btw -- what is about all those 'no version information available' for the libraries -- are they safe? Aug 08 21:38:34 yes. Aug 08 21:39:01 need to supply the libstdc++ from the toolchain I use. Aug 08 21:40:09 Just a quick question, are there any more dutch users in here? Or is it just lonely me? Aug 08 21:41:52 Guess so :) Aug 08 21:42:27 ah -- and I see that evil Qtopia: qpe: symbol lookup error: /opt/Qtopia/lib/libqtopiapim.so.4: undefined symbol: _ZN11QListWidget9dropEventEP10QDropEvent Aug 08 21:45:26 so that Log.conf has pretty much everything enabled... where to look for the log? ~/log is just for init script, right? Aug 08 21:46:13 logread says nothing.. Aug 08 21:46:38 so just started qpe -- and it exited right after that undefined symbol Aug 08 21:47:31 that is the same issue as Aaron asked on the support mailing list Aug 08 21:48:00 ah -- and ticket 1754 within openmoko is there Aug 08 21:49:06 could anyone on working phone figure out from which library we supposed to get it? Aug 08 21:53:39 beautiful -- thought to isntall ldd -- thus started wifi and it also failed to work (not qtopia fault -- just doing conventional ifup but first ifdown usb0 thus now have no access to the phone...) Aug 08 21:55:06 odd Aug 08 21:57:45 I do get "not connected to network" or something like that popping up on my "desktop" from time to time. Maybe "searching for network". Don't remember. Are you guys experiencing the same? Aug 08 21:57:46 ok - on desktop that symbol provided seem by libQtGui Aug 08 21:57:56 4.4 btw ;-) Aug 08 22:03:15 on the phone you have 2 versions of hte library: 4.3.4 and 4.3.5 and only .4.3.4 seems to have that symbol Aug 08 22:03:38 and that libqtopiapim is linked against .4 which is symlinked against .4.3.5 Aug 08 22:03:56 so that is the reason... lets try dirty hack and change symlink Aug 08 22:05:08 correct I guess would to fix either versioning (API change but only 'age' is incremented from 4 to 5) Aug 08 22:06:03 or better clean up build environment so that there is only 1 version of the library ;-) Aug 08 22:07:25 after fixing that link I get a new missing symbol _ZN7QWidget8qwsEventEP8QWSEvent ... lets see Aug 08 22:08:26 and there are 2 versions of libinputmatch ufff Aug 08 22:09:12 of cause that missing symbol is from libqtgui.4.3.5, thus me fixing symlink doesn't help... Aug 08 22:10:19 yoh: is this on the phone? Aug 08 22:10:27 ;) where else ;-) Aug 08 22:10:41 so -- it seems that there is version paradise ;-) Aug 08 22:11:16 all libqtopoia* are present in 2 versions linked against 4.3.5 in the latest version and against 4.3.3 against previous Aug 08 22:11:46 I wonder if OM packages install anything under opt/QTopia Aug 08 22:13:25 yes Aug 08 22:13:33 wholy moly Aug 08 22:13:42 indeed they do... uff... that explains a lot ;-) Aug 08 22:13:55 so -- opkg upgrade is far from being safe operation! Aug 08 22:14:11 depends on your base image Aug 08 22:14:23 was qtopia pure one ;-) Aug 08 22:14:39 ran it like that till 2 days ago Aug 08 22:14:53 then opkg upgrade ... Aug 08 22:15:16 I guess it sucked it qtopia package -- does your image carry OM's qtopia packages -- my wild guess "NOT" Aug 08 22:15:49 depends on which one. someone them I simply deleted opt/Qtopia Aug 08 22:16:11 others I removed the packages. but may forgotten some om/qtopia ones Aug 08 22:16:13 ok - -trying to remove them all.... well -- but that is what makes it 'unsafe' Aug 08 22:16:45 since packages are installed -- they repopulate themselves if new version comes out -- thus fill up /opt/QTopia Aug 08 22:16:57 it would be much better imho to have smth like /opt/QTopia.vanilla Aug 08 22:17:01 or smth like that Aug 08 22:17:11 yes. well. the images from qtopia.net are for qtopia app development :) Aug 08 22:17:19 dont do opkg upgrade :) Aug 08 22:17:38 om should put qtopia in another place Aug 08 22:18:32 sad sad sad Aug 08 22:18:44 would you mind stating this on mailing list? Aug 08 22:18:53 so it clears up the minds of people? Aug 08 22:19:02 yeah, I saw this also. I managed to kill opkg before everything got messed up Aug 08 22:19:13 and you could mention that bug report http://docs.openmoko.org/trac/ticket/1756 Aug 08 22:19:22 which is pretty much solely due to this Aug 08 22:20:06 why would you want to upgrade the system anywy? Aug 08 22:21:09 "not sure" Aug 08 22:21:30 " I could previously run 'opkg upgrade' on Qtopia with no problems and I thought someone might know what had changed to cause this. " Aug 08 22:22:02 be right back Aug 08 22:22:37 it seems that just your and OM's versions of qt diverged by 1 version or so -- and hence the mess Aug 08 22:22:50 possibly Aug 08 22:24:11 lpotter, so would you mind to address this on the list -- would be better if it comes from you ;-) Aug 08 22:25:08 so -- I removed all qtopia packages ... now time to reinstall your image ;-) Aug 08 22:25:42 yoh: removed everything x11 as well? Aug 08 22:25:58 Ko_deZ, hm -- do they have roots in /opt/QTopia? Aug 08 22:26:14 that would be bad... just removed whatever listed on opkg list_installed | grep qtopia Aug 08 22:27:00 I don't know, but I am quite sure they are not needed. Aug 08 22:27:46 btw -- opkg search sucks... unless you provide full name for the file -- no results... Aug 08 22:27:58 YEAY -- qpe is running! Aug 08 22:28:13 this time transfer over usb was mcuh faster than previous... did they fix anything in recent kernel? :-) Aug 08 22:29:43 gy gy -- now I better remove that Logging facility since logread is quite busy now ;-) Aug 08 22:31:14 It seems to me as if the new kernel is also much better at resume. At least the resume is very fast now, with no garbage on screen at all when waking up. Aug 08 22:31:49 lpotter, but how much in your setup is linked to /opt/QTopia -- lots? or it is a matter of chaging /etc/init.d/qpe and 1 parameter in config.in ? Aug 08 22:33:57 config.in ? whats that? Aug 08 22:34:28 lpotter, ;-)) I didn't look into build structure of qtopia -- but I hope that you have some centralized configuration ;) Aug 08 22:35:18 yes configure :) Aug 08 22:35:42 changing the runtime directory is trivial Aug 08 22:35:56 but you have to change it at configure time Aug 08 22:36:10 since Qt needs to be in a known direcotry Aug 08 22:36:16 ok ... phone is running ... and me too -- need to get back to the family! Cheers and good luck (lpotter - please please email to the list on upgrade issues...) Aug 08 22:36:24 that is why I mentioned config.in ;-) Aug 08 22:36:26 bye Aug 08 22:38:24 lpotter: wireless works now without a problem! Thanks! Aug 08 22:38:44 good to hear! Aug 08 22:38:50 what kind of network? Aug 08 22:38:58 Well this is WEP based Aug 08 22:39:07 tomorrow I will try WPA Aug 08 22:39:29 that might be az different story Aug 08 22:39:38 I know Aug 08 22:39:44 But I am going to try Aug 08 22:39:56 if it doesn't work you want the log? Aug 08 22:40:50 You also put the server package manager as default Aug 08 22:40:52 great one :) Aug 08 22:42:16 na. we have several networks at work Aug 08 22:42:40 just need to convince the sysadmin they dont work Aug 08 22:42:47 ah ok Aug 08 22:42:53 then I can have him fix them and then fix wpa :) Aug 08 22:43:27 Well we have to wait for that then ;) Aug 08 22:43:58 after that wpa2 also will be possible? Aug 08 22:44:41 should be. Aug 08 22:44:49 sweet :) Aug 08 22:44:51 i might have to change my home network. should do that anyway Aug 08 22:45:13 Why I got the feeling the Qtopia is going much faster forward then OM? Aug 08 22:45:28 heh Aug 08 22:45:37 depends on what part Aug 08 22:45:59 we have more than one developer on the whole of qtopia :) Aug 08 22:46:10 that is true Aug 08 22:47:07 I didn't use OM for a while, don' want to flash and try and come to the conclusion it doesn't work that good... and go back to qtopia Aug 08 22:47:16 then again I need to do it for the article Aug 08 23:08:24 The voice notes are not working. Thought you should know. I get only 44 byte files from it, no matter what settings I use. Aug 08 23:14:15 Also, when deleting the recordings that does appear in the interface, nothing happens. Aug 09 00:16:57 Ko_deZ, yeah -- I had the same experience with voice notes Aug 09 00:17:04 are they supposed to work? :-) Aug 09 00:35:22 not tested on neo :) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Aug 09 02:59:56 2008