**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue May 29 02:59:58 2012 May 29 03:01:36 rasberry is ARMv5 May 29 03:01:59 jackh: It's v6. May 29 03:02:11 twb: you mean ubunbu willl support that pi? May 29 03:02:13 twb: Hrm, wiki/ARM seems pretty out of date in general. May 29 03:02:27 infinity: ok, thanks for correct me May 29 03:02:28 jackh: We're making no such commitment. May 29 03:02:47 jackh: If we don't kill the armel port entirely, it might end up supporting the Pi, but that's still up in the air. May 29 03:04:13 infinity: seems lot of work of packaging, testing, fixing? May 29 03:06:21 jackh: Right now, we're just doing an organic/lazy rebuild. But, like I said, we may still drop the port entirely, so no promises. May 29 03:06:54 infinity: seems not many devices and dev-boards are supported by ubuntu now May 29 03:07:16 infinity: i plan to do some work to support some of them May 29 03:07:24 omap, omap4, mx53, ac100, plus all the boards that Linaro ships kernels for... May 29 03:07:56 We have no real interest in building 50 images for every possible target. May 29 03:08:04 jackh: what about N900? May 29 03:08:06 infinity: as you know they are too expensive, not suitable for young guys to buy May 29 03:08:36 infinity: i am try to do some on A8 systems, which is very cheap here May 29 03:08:59 jackh: 200 USD is "expensive"? My, how times have changed. May 29 03:09:36 infinity: Pi is 25bugs, you know that May 29 03:09:56 Yes, but it's also not something you want to run a general prupose OS on. May 29 03:10:08 An Ubuntu desktop wouldn't actually boot on it even if we were v6. May 29 03:10:25 infinity: also hdmi is not pop here, i dont think they have hdmi tv May 29 03:12:04 infinity: so i will do the things from the minimal rootfs and adds things on, if i meet any problem, i will disturb you:) May 29 03:16:17 infinity: these plans/changes will be set in stone as at the next release? May 29 03:17:07 twb: It's more about if someone wants to sponsor the port. Canonical's not really keen on doing armel for free. May 29 03:18:05 Nod. May 29 03:18:42 I was just confused because I thought it had already been decided (like, two releases ago) that Ubuntu's armel was gonna be v7 and HF and the only arm port Ubuntu had May 29 03:19:00 ..? May 29 03:19:04 armel was never going to be HF. May 29 03:19:11 Hence armhf. May 29 03:19:14 I guess I was misinformed May 29 03:19:24 Or rather, I misunderstood May 29 03:19:52 I guess twb is confusing hf with softfloat abi vs hf abi May 29 03:19:54 I'll STFU now... May 29 03:20:18 it is confusing, no need to feel shame :P May 29 03:21:14 hmm, infinity: suihkulokki: hf is hard floating, abi uses some mix of soft and hard floating, right? May 29 03:21:15 In my head "hf" means you must have a hardware FPU May 29 03:22:14 Yeah, that's not what it means. May 29 03:22:50 Has someone written this stuff down somewhere? If so I'll just go read that May 29 03:22:50 soft is software FP, softfp is hardware FP, but soft's calling conventions, hard is hardware FP, and using a new calling convention that uses the VFP registers. May 29 03:23:12 soft ansd softfp are ABI-compatible, hard isn't. May 29 03:24:01 IOW softfp will work on either, and can use a hardware FPU, but will have minor overheads compared to hard? Whereas soft will simply ignore any hardware FPU? May 29 03:24:50 Or does "hard" actually work without a hardware FPU? May 29 03:26:02 twb: iow, hf seems like a small intruction set May 29 03:26:53 twb: the instructions will ask for and get result from some hardware units May 29 03:28:10 only softfloat works if you do not have VFP May 29 03:28:36 OK May 29 03:29:13 I guess all I really care about is making sure I pick the best build for whatever hardware is in front of me May 29 03:30:01 (Where "best" balances performance and effort - e.g. maybe it is worth recompiling the kernel, but not the entire distro, for my specific unit.) May 29 03:31:16 twb: sorry, i still dont get what you want to do May 29 03:31:31 jackh: buy a computer, then make it go SUPER FAST May 29 03:31:48 Don't worry about it, I'm just talking shit May 29 03:31:50 twb: i got it May 29 03:32:29 twb: but that's x86 stuff, nothing to do with this channel May 29 03:32:36 Er, not on arm boxes May 29 03:33:01 Although my tf101 is still running oneiric and android's crappy kernel because I am actually too lazy to do anyhting but talk May 29 05:25:04 anyone know how to get Xfbdev to load fonts? My embedded device needs something nicer than the fixed font :D May 29 05:48:59 There are broadly two font subsystems; the "x font system", which deals with bitmap fonts, and xft, which deals with outline fonts. May 29 05:49:32 GTK2/3 and Qt3/4 are xft-based; almost everything is. xterm uses xft if you say e.g. "xterm -fa monospace" May 29 05:50:14 MOST apps that use xft, use a second library "fontconfig" to turn a logical font name like "Sans 12" into the path to a font file. May 29 05:50:48 Anyway, if it's an xft app I wouldn't expect anything special to be needed on the X server side, it's all X app side May 29 05:52:11 ohh cool May 29 05:52:14 thanks two, this is good info May 29 05:52:34 er twb, stupid spellcorrect ;) May 29 05:54:36 Sigh. May 29 05:55:00 You're about the fifth person in the last month to do that; it seems that everyone decided to turn on spell-checking at the same time... May 29 05:55:13 It's probably a new "feature" in pidgin or whatever the hell is popular these days... May 29 05:56:21 stupid question. I am working on desktop ubuntu with libavcodec-52, but when I installed libavcodec on my arm device I got -53. Is there any way to install -52 + dev? May 29 05:56:32 I'm using Textual, it's disabled now :D May 29 05:57:17 furan: if both boxes are running the same release, they should have the same version May 29 05:58:33 they apparently aren't May 29 05:58:38 maybe ont the desktop box there's medibuntu or such. May 29 05:59:54 furan: back- or forward-porting is not something you should attempt unless you are an experienced packager May 29 06:00:12 And that goes double for installing stuff directly (i.e. "make; make install" rather than "apt-get install") May 29 06:00:15 desktop:Linux version 2.6.32-41-generic (buildd@vernadsky) (gcc version 4.4.3 (Ubuntu 4.4.3-4ubuntu5.1) ) #89-Ubuntu SMP Fri Apr 27 22:22:09 UTC 2012 May 29 06:00:37 Linux version 3.2.0-psp7 (root@panda-a1-1gb) (gcc version 4.6.3 (Ubuntu/Linaro 4.6.3-1ubuntu4) ) #1 Fri Apr 13 04:55:05 UTC 2012 May 29 06:00:41 and that's the device May 29 06:00:46 furan: use lsb_release -a to check the relases, and look at "apt-cache policy" output to see if they have rogue package sources May 29 06:00:56 That sounds like lucid vs. precise May 29 06:01:11 hah, I guess I installed lucid instead of precise on my vmware instance May 29 06:01:13 thanks May 29 06:01:25 ugh now i've gotta change all my libavcodec stuff May 29 06:01:46 oh well May 29 06:01:58 it's better in the long run iMO May 29 06:08:21 infinity, good to know you're on ghc then :) May 29 06:08:35 also good to hear we try an armv5 armel flavour even if just experimenting May 29 11:26:12 hmpf, i guess that got swallowed by my reconnect May 29 11:26:12 janimo, any news about the new ac100 kernel ? May 29 11:26:48 (would be nice to have something for A1 the binary drivers work with ... which means at least 3.1) May 29 11:27:48 ogra_, I will have a look, would be nice indeed. I did no check marvin24's tree in almost a month I think May 29 11:28:29 well, i'm using a self rolled 3.1 since the new binary driver came out May 29 11:29:17 despite the driver bugs it seems ot work just fine May 29 11:33:04 ogra_, I still hope all tegra2 stuff gets mainlined for 3.6 and maybe catches 12.10 :) May 29 11:33:11 but you wanted to switch to 3.2 you said in the past, that will require somce signficant changes (devicetree) May 29 11:33:16 3.6 would be nice but i wouldnt count on it May 29 11:37:41 I wanted to switch to whichever kernel is least hassle to maitain :) May 29 11:38:49 if possible as new as possible to be in line with ubuntu May 29 11:38:49 sure May 29 11:38:49 ogra_: you don't have any issues with 3.1 May 29 11:38:49 it would be nice to have working images for the quantal milestones though, since we have a policy that images have to work nowadays May 29 11:38:49 i dont, no May 29 11:38:54 I still can't figure out what is causing my hang May 29 11:38:54 seems as stable as 3.0 was May 29 11:38:54 as long as I break it is fine May 29 11:38:54 lilstevie, try removing plymouth May 29 11:38:54 (by removing the plymouth hooks and scripts from /usr/share/initramfs-tools and rebuilding the initrd) May 29 11:38:55 when I ask it to remove plymouth it wants to remove everything May 29 11:38:55 ah May 29 11:38:55 yeah, mountall needs libplymouth iirc May 29 11:38:55 well waiting for bonnie++ to finish then I will try without plymouth May 29 11:38:56 also gpower is being a little trigger happy with the dual battery May 29 11:43:22 ogra_, btw IIRC you packaged the tegra armhf drivers right? May 29 11:43:33 http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/nvidia-tegra/ May 29 11:43:46 waiting for a newer kernel before i upload to the archive May 29 11:44:04 ogra_, ah they completely fail with old kernel, ok May 29 11:44:15 both armel and armhf in there? May 29 11:44:27 nope, only armhf May 29 11:44:29 or we drop armel completely for quantal May 29 11:45:05 still waiting for mgmt decision ... as it seems we will keep it around in teh oinfrastructure but not touch it at all May 29 11:45:23 lilstevie, do you know what the status of mainlining tegra2 support is? May 29 11:46:04 janimo: not good afaik May 29 11:53:05 ogra_: removed the plymouth hook altogether from initramfs and it is still doing it May 29 11:53:51 try also disabling the upstart plymouth jobs in /etc/init May 29 11:54:33 ok May 29 11:55:09 or make plymouth non executable or move it to .orig and macke /usr/bin/plymouth a link to /bin/true May 29 11:56:14 oh, and indeed, drop "splash" from the cmdline :) May 29 11:56:57 I don't have splash on the cmdline May 29 12:05:35 ogra_: symlinking plymouth and plymouthd with /bin/true worked May 29 12:06:03 must be some issue with tegrafb or so May 29 12:06:19 probably May 29 12:06:26 i saw that too, but only on tegra devices with 3.1 and newer kernels May 29 12:06:54 this is with 3.1 May 29 12:07:04 ah, yeah May 29 12:07:13 i was told 3.2 would be better with that May 29 12:07:24 hm May 29 15:54:36 lilstevie, do you know if android and ubuntu can dual-boot on a tf101? May 29 15:55:07 adn whether there are other than 3g hw differences between tf101 and tf101g? May 29 22:33:48 janimo: depends how you mean by dual-boot May 29 22:34:13 janimo: I do it at the cost of recovery, but we have recently started getting kexec and kexecboot working May 29 22:47:35 janimo: as for the difference between the tf101 and tf101g; they are simple, 3G modem attached to mini pci-e port, and different sbk set in the cpu, the rest of the hardware is 100% identical **** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed May 30 02:59:58 2012