**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jun 26 02:59:57 2009 Jun 26 03:00:10 Rick__: so it seems the command execution method is in the same class as the torch flameOn and flameOff methods? Jun 26 03:00:22 we'll need to split that out, right? Jun 26 03:00:22 bpadalino, sf is good. ate at a seafood joint. rememberd yet again why I think whitefish is boring, cause it is. Jun 26 03:00:31 ha Jun 26 03:00:47 right Jun 26 03:00:52 it's in the same class Jun 26 03:00:56 and it's VERY VERY SHORT Jun 26 03:01:45 so having a runCmd method in a com.pregame.Prelease class is just historical then? Jun 26 03:01:57 yep Jun 26 03:02:16 what should the eventual class for such a thing be called? Jun 26 03:02:17 runCmd ought to be in org.webos.command Jun 26 03:02:34 we don't own webos.org Jun 26 03:02:36 gmta Jun 26 03:02:46 ok... what then? Jun 26 03:02:53 we own webosinternals.org Jun 26 03:03:04 that's a moutful Jun 26 03:03:05 ok, fine. org.webosinternals.command Jun 26 03:03:14 mdklein: it is Jun 26 03:03:34 anyone got an idea for a shorter domain we can use for java package names? Jun 26 03:03:39 hell, try www.sunflowerintergroupoa.org or www.classicalacupunctureofks.com -- webosinternals is nothing Jun 26 03:04:04 short domain names are so 1990's Jun 26 03:05:03 Rick__: so org.webosinternals.command should be the name? Jun 26 03:05:10 so running tcpdump reboots Luna FYI Jun 26 03:05:28 why would it not? it's self-documenting Jun 26 03:05:33 tharris: really, I thought people were running it no probs? Jun 26 03:05:47 Rick__: works for me - what do others think? Jun 26 03:05:57 not only does it crash my terminal each time, randomly it crashes Luna Jun 26 03:06:10 I had not seen that Jun 26 03:06:31 question for you all if you got a moment: anyone had any luck with the bypassing activation hack? Jun 26 03:06:36 tcpdump -i eth0 = blam Jun 26 03:06:41 hadn't tried it Jun 26 03:06:54 i was looking for help url Jun 26 03:07:47 well eth0 is wifi, I guess I hadn't tried sniffing that yet Jun 26 03:08:12 tharris: maybe the wifi driver doesn't like promiscuous? Jun 26 03:08:13 yeah Jun 26 03:08:21 rw ill try that Jun 26 03:09:55 nice call that was it Jun 26 03:10:16 rule #1 with tcpdump no promiscuous mode =p Jun 26 03:10:40 wifi driver is a prude, got it Jun 26 03:12:31 Kaerey, EvanDotPro: any objections to removing the top-level applications directory level in the applications repo on gitorious? it's a bit redundant? Jun 26 03:13:57 rwhitby: none at all.. it was like that when i committed the first time. Jun 26 03:14:08 done. Jun 26 03:17:22 * rwhitby starts the org.webosinternals.command directory, so we can all collaborate on the basic command service in there Jun 26 03:17:58 ok. Does anyone have a copy of ShinAli's java service, 'cause PreGame piggy backed on to that. so that would be the place to start. Jun 26 03:18:46 Rick_: ShinAli has the hello-service in the same repo Jun 26 03:19:00 right Jun 26 03:19:18 * rwhitby adds an AUTHORS file with PreGame listed in it Jun 26 03:19:41 so, the only thing that's unique is public void runCmd(ServiceMessage msg) Jun 26 03:20:04 Rick__: ShinAli specifically released his code as MIT so we could build upon it Jun 26 03:20:06 ''cause the rest of this is identical to hello... except for flameon and flameoff..... Jun 26 03:21:28 Rick__: http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/trees/master Jun 26 03:21:41 anyone else who wants to assist, grab a gitorious account and jump in there ... Jun 26 03:31:39 rwhitby, what's that for? Jun 26 03:31:48 source code repository Jun 26 03:32:12 oh nice Jun 26 03:32:19 so multiple people can work on a command execution dbus service, instead of it being part of a torch applications Jun 26 03:32:26 gitorious sounds sooooo dirty Jun 26 03:32:38 i feel dirty when i say it Jun 26 03:32:46 the good kinda dirty, or bad? Jun 26 03:32:54 not sure yet :-\ Jun 26 03:32:58 heh Jun 26 03:33:21 cool Jun 26 03:33:43 Rick_: did you guys get your answers on Pregame's work and posting it? Jun 26 03:33:50 PreGame: i thought the same thing until a coworker came in and pronounced it like "victorious" instead of how i was saying it in my head, lol. Jun 26 03:34:15 i know i thought it sounded like clitorous sp? Jun 26 03:34:28 lol Jun 26 03:34:32 heh - I hadn't even twigged to the other possible pronounciation. must be a us accent thing. Jun 26 03:34:47 PreGame: ditto Jun 26 03:34:51 or just the US and their dirty minds Jun 26 03:34:57 nah, I don't know where they got that, ius is clearly "eee us" Jun 26 03:35:18 destinal: I thought it might be another aluminium ... Jun 26 03:35:35 (since you guys leave the second 'i' out of that one) Jun 26 03:36:04 destinal u here Jun 26 03:36:21 tharris: yup Jun 26 03:36:56 for me it was just a visual thing... it's obviously pronounced like victorious... my brain just didn't see the second i or something at first. Jun 26 03:37:06 hmm Jun 26 03:37:17 nice + btw Jun 26 03:39:06 Geez Pre owners are the whiniest bunch of people ever Jun 26 03:39:10 tharris: so, I need to write up this updater MITM thing, want to be a victim / try it? Jun 26 03:39:20 "My phone doesn't have XYZ, THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE!" Jun 26 03:39:32 It's seriously ridiculous Jun 26 03:39:45 sure Jun 26 03:39:53 sam1am: I don't read most of the forums or blogs for that reason. Jun 26 03:39:54 ill be around all weekend Jun 26 03:40:00 same here Jun 26 03:40:07 i read healines and come here Jun 26 03:40:24 Yea I think I need to stay out of the non-dev forums - it's amazing what people expect and feel they are entitled to Jun 26 03:40:48 Rick__: so how should this org.webosinternals.command source area be structured? Jun 26 03:41:00 (or anyone else who is a Java guru) Jun 26 03:41:04 "Gmaps doesn't have walking directions, accusweather has ads, I can't delete videos from the device" and on and on. Jun 26 03:41:32 sam, this is my first 'bleeding edge' participation Jun 26 03:41:32 its a programmers paradise, not quite yet for users Jun 26 03:41:32 sam1am: yeah, they should complain in #webos where the Palm folks are ... Jun 26 03:41:53 i'd have to say it's WAY more constructive than just bitching in a forum Jun 26 03:41:55 rwhitby, you ought to ask cphelps tommorow... I am _not_ a java guru. I hate java. Jun 26 03:42:13 Given their expectations, they're probably not smart enough for IRC Jun 26 03:42:38 rwhitby, what's the java question? Jun 26 03:43:08 i was just going through the rooting procedure again to double check the instructions... Jun 26 03:43:10 http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jun 26 03:43:14 rwhitby wants to structure the source repository Jun 26 03:43:22 so it seems you can only 'Delete' via gui applications that are in the /var directory Jun 26 03:43:28 Rod, I just created my account (bclancy) on gitorious.org Jun 26 03:43:30 gaffo_laptop: we're creating an org.webosinternals.command source repository, for the command execution daemon stuff that PreGame and others have been working on (we want to extract just the command bit out of the torch app) Jun 26 03:43:46 kk Jun 26 03:43:48 Step 8 instructs to download a zip, when there is none at the URL... it's obvious what to do, just slightly misleading. Jun 26 03:44:03 I wondered whether there was some convention for structuring source repos for Java stuff Jun 26 03:44:14 rwhitby, there are a few Jun 26 03:44:17 yeah evan, i found that slightly confusing too Jun 26 03:44:20 EvanDotPro. I _love_ saying this. It's a wiki. Fix it. Jun 26 03:44:20 memo app shouldnt allow me to copy and paste 400,00 characters and freeze my pre =p Jun 26 03:44:20 one is the maven standard Jun 26 03:44:25 another is just Jun 26 03:44:33 src/lib/resource Jun 26 03:44:34 rwhitby: Are you guys trying to create another service? Jun 26 03:44:45 Rick_: i was going to fix it, lol.. i just mentioned it to see if there was a reason i should leave it, that's all :) Jun 26 03:44:50 as in 3 directories for sources, librares, and resources (config files on the classpath) Jun 26 03:44:52 no, we're trying to get the source for yours and put it into the repository. Jun 26 03:44:59 i was creating a service to have many different functions and methods that everyone can include in their mojo apps Jun 26 03:45:16 mine is copywrited :P Jun 26 03:45:27 atleast the one released so far Jun 26 03:45:28 rwhitby, http://maven.apache.org/guides/introduction/introduction-to-the-standard-directory-layout.html Jun 26 03:45:32 ok. Jun 26 03:45:33 PreGame: writed? Jun 26 03:45:39 PreGame: ok, what's the license that you've released it under? Jun 26 03:45:58 PreGame: (just joking with you) Jun 26 03:46:57 PreGame: licensing of what the group of people in this channel works on is very important. Jun 26 03:47:11 If what you're doing is not open source licensed, then we can't use it. Jun 26 03:47:24 Very true Jun 26 03:47:51 Cheers to the wiki. Jun 26 03:47:59 you can use it, i just haven't made it opensource till its finished. I don't want 1,000 different versions out there while i'm still working on it Jun 26 03:48:09 so? Jun 26 03:48:18 finished? Jun 26 03:48:22 Thats why you open source it. Jun 26 03:48:27 So others can work on it. Jun 26 03:48:31 paul__: +1 Jun 26 03:48:38 The whole "open" source. Jun 26 03:48:53 i don't want others working on it until i'm done with what i'm wanting to do Jun 26 03:48:54 could alwyas us emore heads "helping" Jun 26 03:48:59 You working on something yourself will take a while, we don't even have documentation Jun 26 03:48:59 plus, when is software ever "finished" Jun 26 03:49:07 PreGame: why? Jun 26 03:49:25 Anyone try to get a document scanner over the mojo sourcE? Jun 26 03:49:33 documentation* Jun 26 03:49:41 PreGame: seriously, that statement is pretty much at odds with the whole open source culture. Jun 26 03:49:46 rwhitby, those links / info make sense? Jun 26 03:49:59 PreGame: it's your right to take that stance if you choose. just interested why? Jun 26 03:49:59 rwhitby: You don't just throw code up somewhere and give people access to change w/e they want when they don't know what the "hopeful" outcome of the project is Jun 26 03:50:07 Lol Jun 26 03:50:11 You only got one phone Jun 26 03:50:24 Its not like your going to care. Jun 26 03:50:33 oh? Jun 26 03:50:37 One phone and two hands. Jun 26 03:50:46 We can do a lot more collaboratively. Jun 26 03:50:49 ask it another way....pregame is there any intentions you have ot make money off the code? Jun 26 03:50:57 That is the other thing. Jun 26 03:51:01 Money = closed. Jun 26 03:51:01 PreGame: actually, in open source projects you do throw code up somewhere and expect people to take it in directions you never thought of. Jun 26 03:51:08 Yup. Jun 26 03:51:20 Can we get a homebrew catalog app up? Jun 26 03:51:28 one idea is good 1000000 ideas are better =p Jun 26 03:51:29 That seems like a "first step". Jun 26 03:51:53 paul__: i've been putting that bug in people's ear for a while but everyone seems to think palm will make theirs pretty open, so there's not much of an effort. Jun 26 03:52:13 Pretty open = sdk? Jun 26 03:52:20 Thats "The end of summer" Jun 26 03:52:46 If theirs is "open" then so is ours. Jun 26 03:52:52 PreGame: so I think what you're saying is that your com.pregame.Prelease class is closed source at the moment (or at least has severe restrictions on derived works). Is that right? Jun 26 03:53:01 Do they get a monopoly on how you get your apps? Jun 26 03:53:23 Prelease? Jun 26 03:53:27 i do plan on making applications that will be a pay for app, at this time i do not know if prelease will be in that project or not. Right now i am releasing prelease as is for whoever wants to use it with their applications Jun 26 03:53:27 paul__: I'm all for making an open / homebrew catalog going. Jun 26 03:53:41 Nice. Jun 26 03:53:56 Can we piggy back off the email app hack? Jun 26 03:53:58 I will probably make it opensource i just don't want a bunch of people modifying what i am writing until i am done Jun 26 03:54:01 paul__: getting* rather than making. Jun 26 03:54:17 Lol Jun 26 03:54:21 Big diff. Jun 26 03:54:26 when i am done finishing my portion i will upload the code for others to add their input Jun 26 03:54:32 portion? Jun 26 03:54:34 paul__: i don't think that's a great idea since it's really a security hole, and likely to be patched in a future OTA update. Jun 26 03:54:46 Yeah. Jun 26 03:55:04 it hasnt been confirmed of a patch Jun 26 03:55:05 I hear that sentiment . Jun 26 03:55:15 paul__: obviously it would "work" for now.. but i don't see it as a solid "solution" to leverage on... Jun 26 03:55:19 How tight is the sandbox? Jun 26 03:55:23 PreGame: ok, so if you can't release the source for com.pregame.Prelease under an OSI-approved license now, then we're gonna need to do a fork that can be open source now, which doesn't use your currently-closed-source code. Jun 26 03:55:42 whitby+1 Jun 26 03:55:48 we can't work with "it will probably be open source" Jun 26 03:55:54 Like the sdk Jun 26 03:55:56 lol Jun 26 03:55:57 its a legal thing Jun 26 03:56:07 Isn't it always? Jun 26 03:56:11 lol yup Jun 26 03:56:14 yup Jun 26 03:56:26 So what ideas do people have for apps? Jun 26 03:56:42 paul, i may work on something like that Jun 26 03:56:49 Yeah? Jun 26 03:56:52 i pretty much suck at coding, so i wanna try to contribute in some way Jun 26 03:56:54 i do securty and then apps on side =p Jun 26 03:57:12 Well, we need to find out how to go from frontend to backend? Jun 26 03:57:15 so im finding bugs =p Jun 26 03:57:21 Without the email hack. Jun 26 03:57:32 for instance, i wanted to maybe have somethign for people to give each other ideas for projects, and maybe try to put them in some sort of order that makes sense Jun 26 03:58:08 ...hmm Jun 26 03:58:08 paul__: i have a GPS posting app that posts GPS data to a URL at intervals... I'm probably going to MIT it and put it on Gitorious soon. Jun 26 03:58:16 I saw that. Jun 26 03:58:21 In one of the screenshots. Jun 26 03:58:23 yeah i want that as well Jun 26 03:58:23 Thats nic. Jun 26 03:58:35 You should get that up somewhere. Jun 26 03:58:43 That would be a nifty tool. Jun 26 03:58:51 Theft prevention Jun 26 03:58:54 the gps poster? Jun 26 03:58:57 Yeah Jun 26 03:59:13 When someone jacks your phone, you can track it. Jun 26 03:59:14 it's a mojo app... not good for theft prevention since it is running in a card ;-) Jun 26 03:59:25 Well, then run it as a background? Jun 26 03:59:29 i use it for time tracking my hours at work based on proximity and stuff. Jun 26 03:59:48 It has applications in theft prevention. Jun 26 03:59:55 paul__: There is a page on the wiki for setting up background GPS tracking that can be triggered via sending a special message to the pre. Jun 26 04:00:03 Nice! Jun 26 04:00:08 that's very nice Jun 26 04:00:13 Where? Jun 26 04:00:14 you could call the GPSlogging app "Pre Ankle Braclet" or PreJack! Jun 26 04:00:15 my app has a different purpose though. Jun 26 04:00:22 We need a app catalog on the wiki Jun 26 04:00:30 Ah. Jun 26 04:00:57 paul__: http://predev.wikidot.com/tracking Jun 26 04:01:12 We got "Create your own app" "Modify Stock Apps", but no "App Catalog" on the left. Jun 26 04:01:39 Nice script. Jun 26 04:02:16 Also, might be good, is a dev script. Jun 26 04:02:27 paul__: the tracking script is not mine.. i believe Sargun wrote that one. But yes, it is nice. Jun 26 04:02:35 That triggers your app to be displayed. So you can test your app on the pre. Jun 26 04:02:59 Like the iphone sdk, where you launch the app on the phone itself. Jun 26 04:03:15 paul__: no, that tracking script and my app are unrelated... that tracking script is strictly background. Jun 26 04:03:25 I got that Jun 26 04:03:46 paul__: alright, just making sure. Jun 26 04:04:09 Np. Jun 26 04:04:21 Anyone try to document mojo at all? Jun 26 04:04:55 night all Jun 26 04:06:08 paul__: i plan on documenting it some on the wiki when i have time. Jun 26 04:06:30 Is there automated tools? Jun 26 04:07:03 paul__: basically i was just going to paraphrase the available documentation in mojo, as not to post any copyrighted code. Jun 26 04:07:18 Ok. Jun 26 04:09:42 hey guys Jun 26 04:10:14 i always forget to add comments to my wiki changes, is there a way to add comments post save click Jun 26 04:10:39 not without doing another edit. Jun 26 04:10:43 Hi all. Jun 26 04:10:55 burp Jun 26 04:11:01 stupid wiki software Jun 26 04:11:03 if you have the current version of flashlight, there is now a mojo command line runner available. Jun 26 04:11:07 =) Jun 26 04:11:17 www.vocshop.com/pre/com.app.commander.zip Jun 26 04:11:22 nice Jun 26 04:11:27 it's not pretty... it has formatting issues, but it works. Jun 26 04:11:39 it is dependent on your having flashlight installed and functional. Jun 26 04:11:48 ahh Jun 26 04:12:00 credit cphelps for an entire days work hacking at it. Jun 26 04:12:06 I did a tiny tiny bit tonight Jun 26 04:12:42 it still needs a license tag, an about scene and cleaning up the command scene, but it's fully functional. Jun 26 04:12:58 PLUS, if you're wanting to do some text-based pre stuff, it's nice code to look at Jun 26 04:13:13 com.app.commander? who owns 'app.com'? Jun 26 04:13:39 no one obviously. That's cphelps decision.... ask him. I wanted com.boatrights, since _I_ own that. Jun 26 04:13:48 or I own it with my son..... Jun 26 04:13:52 or com.vocshop. Jun 26 04:14:24 * rwhitby notes that http://opensource.palm.com/packages.html now has version 1.0.2 up, showing that Palm is serious about continuously complying with the GPL. Jun 26 04:14:27 we'll try to get that cleaned up tommorow rwhitby Jun 26 04:14:59 Rick__: you guys are welcome to use the gitorious area if it's gonna be MIT licensed. Jun 26 04:15:07 com.erehwon.xxxx Jun 26 04:15:20 Part of tommorow's work is to get Chris (cphelps) up on git Jun 26 04:15:35 * EvanDotPro saw that rwhitby complimented Palm on the GPL compliance in #webos. Jun 26 04:16:37 they're doing a lot better than most hardware manufacturers ... they of course could improve by having the source up *before* the OTA update, but the GPL doesn't require that. Jun 26 04:19:24 gaffo_laptop: thx for the link Jun 26 04:19:36 np Jun 26 04:20:13 rwhitby, luckly you're using git and hopefully (eclipse) so it'll be easy to rename / move things? and git add -u Jun 26 04:21:25 does the novacommand mis installer normally take a long time near the end (time remainin 0 seconds) or has it hung for me? Jun 26 04:22:12 when I plugged in the USB cable after reppoting into dev mode, my XP system wanted to install a driver, I said no - that was probably a mistake Jun 26 04:22:20 yes/ne? Jun 26 04:23:39 new version of webos book out Jun 26 04:24:04 Rick__, what'd they update? Jun 26 04:24:08 not the most useful chapter Jun 26 04:24:15 chapter 11 internationalization Jun 26 04:24:43 Chapter 11. Localization and Jun 26 04:24:45 Internationalization Jun 26 04:24:46 The Palm webOS platform was designed from the beginning to be a world-ready system Jun 26 04:24:48 from the choice of OS technologies through the UI design. While it may take some time to Jun 26 04:24:50 support all languages and regions, and to provide the application content to meet the needs Jun 26 04:24:52 of users in all locales, the framework has the basic support you need to build global Jun 26 04:24:53 applications. Jun 26 04:24:55 In this chapter, you will GET an overview of the framework's locale support and learn how Jun 26 04:24:56 to localize your application. We will localize the News application to Spanish and we will Jun 26 04:24:58 walk through each step of the localization process. In the last section, we'll cover some of Jun 26 04:25:00 the Internationalization APIs available in Mojo. Jun 26 04:25:05 kind of pointless during the sprint exclusivity period Jun 26 04:25:40 meh, I always put zip code fields just to piss off everyone else Jun 26 04:26:00 that and state dropdowns Jun 26 04:26:27 <-- pumpkin Jun 26 04:26:30 see you all tommorow Jun 26 04:27:57 gaffo_laptop: and only hour-based timezones, no half or quarter hours, or support for GMT+12:45/13:45 ? Jun 26 04:28:53 rwhitby, acutally I just put them on 10 before and 10 after. Jun 26 04:29:21 india can go to hell Jun 26 04:29:40 * rwhitby is GMT+9:30 Jun 26 04:29:48 and not in india Jun 26 04:30:33 I thought india was offset by 30 mins Jun 26 04:30:47 yeah, they are too Jun 26 04:30:56 rwhitby: does SCP work with Dropbear as-is, or do you need the extra functionality of OpenSSH for SCP to work? Jun 26 04:31:23 rwhitby, but you're in america junior junior, we just pat you on the head and simle at your silliness (that should piss you off :) ) Jun 26 04:31:44 gaffo_laptop: touche :-) Jun 26 04:32:10 EvanDotPro: scp should work as-is. add openssh-sftp-server for sftp. Jun 26 04:33:11 Yeah, need both programs Jun 26 04:46:26 you shouldn't need openssh Jun 26 04:46:55 just any straight scp client that doesn't need sftp (I don't think dropbear supports sftp) Jun 26 04:56:26 has anyone investigated the vBox emulator claims? Jun 26 05:00:25 have people been using the cpu/frequency scaling? how are you liking it? Jun 26 05:03:03 gkatsev: there's notes on the wiki Jun 26 05:03:31 Robi-: right, was looking for a few more voices, if there were any Jun 26 05:04:50 Anyone try to get around pandoras skip limit? Jun 26 05:14:46 wdup wdup Jun 26 05:16:35 trying vBox Jun 26 05:17:51 how do i install the patch for "downloading from the browser"? Jun 26 05:18:04 i wget the file then "path filename.patch"? Jun 26 05:18:53 s/path/patch? Jun 26 05:19:08 wiki should have the instructions Jun 26 05:19:21 i don't think it does Jun 26 05:19:30 it doesnt have instructions for using the patch Jun 26 05:19:33 to apply the patch file to the existing code Jun 26 05:19:35 it has instructions for the manua; Jun 26 05:19:52 which broke my browser till i updated the wiki =) Jun 26 05:20:35 but works great! Jun 26 05:20:36 oh good, that's what it's for Jun 26 05:21:31 so, hints for using the patch? Jun 26 05:21:49 not sure, i think you need a diff tool but i don't know how to do it on linux Jun 26 05:21:55 it's generic, so look up how to use the patch tool online Jun 26 05:22:01 * opie_ shrugs Jun 26 05:22:20 half the fun of doing it by hand is learning the browser code Jun 26 05:22:32 yeah, i guess Jun 26 05:34:01 anybody get sftp working with cyberduck on os x Jun 26 05:35:24 sftp doesn't work with dropbear, so if you've got dropbear rather than openssh on the pre that's probably the issue Jun 26 05:35:54 anything that can support scp should work though Jun 26 05:42:21 scp should work as-is. add openssh-sftp-server for sftp. Jun 26 05:42:46 oh k thanks Jun 26 05:43:47 ls Jun 26 05:51:43 Is there an IRC client yet? Or a compatible www site? Jun 26 05:51:56 just type web freenode into google Jun 26 05:52:22 there is one out there but i reset my phone to my bookmarks are gone :( Jun 26 05:52:48 perhaps mibbit.com will work for IRC? Jun 26 05:52:51 on the pre Jun 26 05:53:05 I used mibbit but it sucked especially hard Jun 26 05:53:36 jjore: you could open up ajaxphpterm and install irssi or something like that, :D Jun 26 05:53:56 i thought mibbit required flash... i think they use it for the socket connection. Jun 26 05:54:06 nope, no flash or java Jun 26 05:54:24 weird... i swear i went to mibbit on my pre and it bitched about flash. Jun 26 05:55:00 they say that its only js Jun 26 05:55:11 I recall trying to use webshell before but it barely worked and python took 100% of my CPU even when it was idle Jun 26 05:55:20 hmm how to delete an app from the launcher Jun 26 05:55:30 mibbit is banned from freenode i think Jun 26 05:55:35 jjore: i got ajaxPHPterm working just fine, though, cant ssh out from it... Jun 26 05:55:56 * EvanDotPro tries mibbit again Jun 26 05:56:54 oh right, and i couldn't click the connect button on mibbit. Jun 26 05:57:20 http://webchat.freenode.net/ Jun 26 05:57:34 and yes, looks like mibbit is banned from freenode Jun 26 05:58:59 yea that looks like the link Jun 26 05:59:48 Test Jun 26 05:59:50 not very comfortable to use tho... i mean it's /OKAY/ Jun 26 06:00:13 Ehh... It works... A bit of scrolling around. Jun 26 06:00:37 I suppose once the chat log gets lower, it is better. Jun 26 06:01:15 yea it is Jun 26 06:01:31 sideways is nice if you learn how to use the keyboard sideways with one hand Jun 26 06:01:42 bit much though. Jun 26 06:02:01 haha yeah... i dunno about the sideways typing thing yet. Jun 26 06:02:46 hm... i wonder why ajaxPHPterm stopped working Jun 26 06:04:53 guess dir has to be /.. Jun 26 06:07:58 http://predev.wikidot.com/decrypt-ssl-traffic Jun 26 06:09:59 I meant to post a trace of what I decrypted from the patch service with this method but I ran out of time Jun 26 06:11:21 good write-up... that'll be useful. Jun 26 06:11:33 thanks Jun 26 06:13:56 It could be made a lot easier with something like a dedicated java-based tool that just dynamically signs certs and forwards connections, I have some of the code to do that in another project I'm working on but it would need some work Jun 26 06:16:57 lol, im sshed into my phone and from there sshed into a server which is running irssi. so, im technically talking here from my phone Jun 26 06:17:15 cheater. Jun 26 06:17:18 lol Jun 26 06:17:34 yeah, unfortunately, ajaxPHPterm isnt letting me ssh out of it Jun 26 06:17:57 I just wanted to report that PreGame has released the source code for org.webosinternals.command under the MIT license in an email to me, and I'll be committing it to the git repository later today. Jun 26 06:18:11 Thanks PreGame! Jun 26 06:18:22 woot Jun 26 06:18:38 awesome Jun 26 06:18:38 wooohooo Jun 26 06:18:41 he give up? Jun 26 06:18:50 it wasn't a case of giving up. Jun 26 06:19:14 PreGame had some good reasons for not releasing the whole thing he was working on just yet. Jun 26 06:19:43 I made an argument that we needed to have the command bit asap. He did the work to split that out for us. Jun 26 06:19:56 i meant on continued development Jun 26 06:20:41 the command piece is MIT license in the webos-internals gitorious.org repo, with commit rights to the webos-internals-dev team there (of which PreGame is a member) Jun 26 06:21:34 PreGame didn't have time to do the git commit tonight, so he emailed it to me. He fully expects to work on it with the rest of the team in the future. Jun 26 06:22:22 good deal Jun 26 06:22:29 such diplomacy. Jun 26 06:22:31 * Robi- claps Jun 26 06:22:32 props to PreGame for sure. Jun 26 06:23:00 rwhitby: nice work on the smooth talk ;] Jun 26 06:23:32 no seriously, PreGame has put a lot of effort into this, so how it was released is his call. Jun 26 06:24:32 take it easy, I get it. Jun 26 06:24:44 Fight! Jun 26 06:24:47 it's going to make a huge difference to this community, i'm really excited. Jun 26 06:25:26 postinstall still needs work right? Jun 26 06:25:44 this community is still in the forming and storming phase. stuff like this is par for the course and everyone together works out what they want the norms for the community to be. Jun 26 06:26:04 s/and everyone/as everyone/ Jun 26 06:26:21 well said Jun 26 06:26:55 Robi-: we now have the bit that is additional to what ShinAli already released, so I think we have enough for a command line ipkg install of the service. Jun 26 06:27:18 The non-root problems are orthogonal. Jun 26 06:27:40 as long as ipkg can handle it Jun 26 06:28:26 and there's still work to be done for even the command-line install. but now everyone can help contribute that work since it's MIT licensed in a public repo with commit rights to a dev team Jun 26 06:28:28 dang, even with the screen dimming mod, the screen won't go nearly as dim as my treo did. Jun 26 06:31:34 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/commit/a95bd60e94491166375a90453c8ce316375d06a8 Jun 26 06:32:05 greetings folks Jun 26 06:35:54 rwhitby: nice. props to pregame for getting it working and getting it out there Jun 26 06:36:54 I'm more than a little nervous about a command line service but we'll see how it goes Jun 26 06:37:35 g'night, all Jun 26 06:37:41 Robi-: updated your QEMU section to its own page Jun 26 06:37:47 i think im going to iterrate over that Jun 26 06:39:38 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/commit/dd56e11b2fa7e386a95566f481a906a185caa56b Jun 26 06:41:13 I just rooted my pre as per the instructions - who should I discuss possible improvements to make to the instructions with? Jun 26 06:41:38 bclancy: discuss them here, and if there are no objections then edit the wiki pages directly. Jun 26 06:43:37 OK, the first area where I was confused was after between steps 5 and 6 on this page: http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jun 26 06:44:16 after saying "Just Charge", my windows XP laptop saw the h/w and wanted to install a driver ... Jun 26 06:44:39 bclancy: windows wont find a driver even if you tell it to anyway Jun 26 06:44:44 I figured I didn't need this because usb driver had been installed in normal mode Jun 26 06:44:47 i guess that should possible be added Jun 26 06:45:12 yep, just some clarification there would be good Jun 26 06:45:16 only thing to add would be to just ignore the message or hit cancel and continue installing novacom Jun 26 06:45:25 I got past it Jun 26 06:46:31 next thing was either my computer was slow or the msi program hung. It said "0 seconds" and I waited like more than 10 minutes, then I shutdown and started again Jun 26 06:47:05 2nd time, I just ignored the message about installing the driver, and let the msi do it's thing. Jun 26 06:47:14 * rwhitby wonders whether http://predev.wikidot.com/decrypt-ssl-traffic can be run on the Pre itself ... Jun 26 06:47:54 who here is working on QEMU ? Jun 26 06:48:06 so i might get caught up on things Jun 26 06:48:18 bclancy: did you get that wiki password I /msg'd you? Jun 26 06:48:42 Next area (where I'd like to improve the instructions a bit) was for installing python - I think adding more detail about what's being done and why (while a bit out of context) would be helpful/comforting to newbies. Jun 26 06:48:51 okay i better get to sleep. i was late to work this morning because i slept in. Jun 26 06:48:59 bclancy: absolutely Jun 26 06:49:08 or perhaps just linking to the python install how to Jun 26 06:49:16 definitely we want to tell them that python 2.6.2 is not "greater" than Python 2.6 Jun 26 06:49:22 it doesn't have stunnel natively Jun 26 06:49:27 man in the middle Jun 26 06:49:39 bclancy: what you're doing here is fantastic. We need people who can take what the pathfinders write down as notes, and make them precise, helpful, unambigious instructions for the masses. Jun 26 06:49:58 simplyflipflops: stunnel is in optware Jun 26 06:50:10 didn't see it Jun 26 06:50:15 rechecking Jun 26 06:50:27 I've used it on other devices from Optware. Jun 26 06:50:41 good, the rest of it, I might have had some clarifying thoughts but I did not write them down. I can probably add a bit of detail here and there, not too much though. Jun 26 06:50:48 the camera modifications page is a bit hard to understand how to do. especially since its basically the diff file and not a more detailed step-by-step way of what to edit Jun 26 06:50:55 there it is Jun 26 06:50:56 simplyflipflops: yep, it's there: http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/cs08q1armel/cross/unstable/stunnel_4.26-1_arm.ipk Jun 26 06:51:02 dont know why I missed it the first time Jun 26 06:51:06 bclancy: what rwhitby said.. sometimes when us devs write stuff, or follow instructions other devs write, we make assumptions that the general public won't or can't make... so any help clarifying the instructions is appreciated. Jun 26 06:51:07 I'll probably make the edits tomorrow to the wiki. Jun 26 06:51:26 bclancy: sweet. really appreciate that. Jun 26 06:51:39 I'm good at understanding what you write and adding in more detail needed for others. Jun 26 06:51:42 rwhitby: have you seen any folks talkin about getting qemu working? Jun 26 06:51:57 being quiet now Jun 26 06:51:58 rwhitby: a bit of talk early on, and roadblocks if I remember. Jun 26 06:52:19 im wondering what those are :) Jun 26 06:52:25 bclancy: that's a unique skill, and one that is often underappreciated in open source communities. Jun 26 06:52:38 (the adding in the detail, not the being quiet :-) Jun 26 06:52:44 i havent yet hit the roadblocks, but id like to know before i get there Jun 26 06:53:04 rulethirty: wget the logs and grep :-) Jun 26 06:54:17 fun Jun 26 06:57:56 why was port 222 chosen (wast that chosen by palm or by you guys?) Jun 26 06:58:19 optware uses 222 so that it doesn't collide if the vendor is using 22 Jun 26 06:58:28 ok, thx Jun 26 06:58:42 we've heard that the emulator actually has dropbear ssh running on port 22. Jun 26 06:59:46 it also means there's a slightly lower chance of being port-scanned by lazy script kiddies who only check some well known ports. Jun 26 06:59:53 222 is a low number, is it registered for optware? Jun 26 07:00:03 ah, good point. no it is not. Jun 26 07:00:17 should probably be 2222 or something. Jun 26 07:00:31 that's what I was thinking - ggod Jun 26 07:00:34 good Jun 26 07:01:34 that would be a script change so I'll let you make that change (unless you tell me otherwise) Jun 26 07:01:52 yeah, such a change would need to be managed, since it's already in the wild. Jun 26 07:02:03 so it's not likely to happen right now. Jun 26 07:02:11 fine Jun 26 07:03:37 one last thing: we should add some time estimates at the top level, so people know what they are getting into (timewise) Jun 26 07:03:50 great idea Jun 26 07:04:18 going to bed now Jun 26 07:04:38 have a good night Jun 26 07:04:50 have a good day! :-) Jun 26 07:16:45 I need to get my linux game face back on Jun 26 07:17:31 I just spent the last 5 minutes writing a shell script to claculate the number of lines total in a subset of dirs Jun 26 07:17:36 when all I need to do was Jun 26 07:17:38 wc /home/stats/stats.tiltshellz.org/logs/**/* Jun 26 07:17:40 -.- Jun 26 07:32:53 any Java gurus around? Jun 26 07:34:06 If I have a file with "package org.webosinternals.command;" as the first line, and it has a class inside it called "public class CommandService", should the filename conventionally be "command.java" or "CommandService.java" ? Jun 26 07:34:42 wb geist Jun 26 07:35:10 depends if the class is in a separate file of as part of an include Jun 26 07:35:56 s/of/or Jun 26 07:36:30 * Robi- ^Z Jun 26 07:36:39 it's the only class in that file, and I'm not sure whether there will be other classes in the package or not. Jun 26 07:36:55 grep baby Jun 26 07:54:59 Robi-: grep is no good here - I'm writing the file. Jun 26 07:55:19 I want to know what the normal Java convention is for naming such a file. Jun 26 08:37:53 rwhitby: CommandService.java Jun 26 08:38:09 filename should always match the public classname, including case Jun 26 08:38:47 the location of that file (directory structure) should match the package name Jun 26 08:39:08 so you want org/webosinternals/command/CommandService.java Jun 26 09:45:33 shaggy-h: is the directory structure important? Jun 26 09:45:35 (I changed the name) Jun 26 09:50:49 yes, it's important Jun 26 09:51:43 your classpath will point to the base directory, and the JVM's classloader will locate classes based on the package + classname Jun 26 09:52:20 there are ways around it, but it's a really bad idea, you'll be fighting things all the way Jun 26 10:00:22 Hey, anyone there this time of night? Jun 26 10:00:56 ParanoidAndroid: yep Jun 26 10:01:27 has anyone had any problems with the drivers? Jun 26 10:01:41 shaggy-h: thx - I'm a java newbie. If I'm on Ubuntu, and have the rootfs from the Doctor, how do I use javac to compile that file? Jun 26 10:01:50 i can get them to install correctly (im runnin x64), but when i connect my pre it cant seem to find them Jun 26 10:02:01 ParanoidAndroid: dunno - I don't have a Pre Jun 26 10:03:41 * rwhitby wonders whether jikes will run on the Pre, to enable compilation of java files on-target. Jun 26 10:04:16 Parnoid: Drivers for what? Jun 26 10:05:35 Are you rooting? Jun 26 10:07:14 rwhitby: work your way through the top sections in http://java.sun.com/docs/books/tutorial/reallybigindex.html Jun 26 10:08:05 if you're going to do a lot of java dev you might want to grab an IDE like eclipse or netbeans (both free), or IDEA (fantastic, but commercial) Jun 26 10:08:28 yes Jun 26 10:08:30 im rooting Jun 26 10:09:13 rwhitby: you probably could get a java compiler on the pre, but sounds painful - you'd be better off compiling and building a .jar file on your PC then just transferring the jar Jun 26 10:09:26 using a build tool like ant will let you do all that automatically Jun 26 10:09:40 even from the IDE Jun 26 10:11:16 well a status update for where i am in the rooting: Jun 26 10:11:25 shaggy-h: I'm thinking small service files and stuff on the Pre. Not for big things like apps. Jun 26 10:11:29 i have tried both the wifi and usb routes Jun 26 10:11:34 neither seem to work. Jun 26 10:11:40 it is correctly in dev mode Jun 26 10:11:42 rwhitby: once you create a build script and/or and IDE set up you'll never need to call javac directly. I haven't run javac from the command line for many many years Jun 26 10:12:02 and i have the correct drivers installed Jun 26 10:12:14 when i plug it in fresh to usb, it cant find drivers at all Jun 26 10:12:24 the drivers show up in add/remove programs though Jun 26 10:14:37 alright, well i'm going to go to bed and hopefully tomorrow there will be more success, thanks for those who have listened so far. Jun 26 10:21:13 shaggy-h: javac -cp /home/webos/rootfs/\ Jun 26 10:21:13 usr/lib/luna/java/json.jar:/home/webos/rootfs/usr/lib/luna/java/lunaservice.jar:/home/webos/roo\ Jun 26 10:21:13 tfs/usr/lib/luna/java/serviceframework.jar CommandService.java Jun 26 10:21:33 that was able to compile CommandService.java into a .class file. Jun 26 10:23:48 yes but as soon as you add another class file things will start getting messy because then the packages will start to matter Jun 26 10:24:04 best for you not to start out with really bad habits :) Jun 26 10:25:56 work through the 'Packages' section of that link I posted **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jun 26 10:29:06 2009 Jun 26 10:29:51 btw, love netbeans++ Jun 26 10:30:08 psykoz: have you tried IDEA? Jun 26 10:30:22 no, only commercial IDE I use is Visual Studio Jun 26 10:31:12 psykoz: with the resharper plugin? Jun 26 10:32:20 resharper's written by the same people that created IDEA Jun 26 10:32:35 nope, but reading up on it now Jun 26 10:32:45 give it a trial Jun 26 10:33:18 it only does a fraction of what IDEA does, but it's still a must if you want to stay sane with visual studio Jun 26 10:43:09 * rwhitby uses an IDE called ssh and emacs :-) Jun 26 10:44:25 oh, and make Jun 26 10:44:55 ok, so now I have a Makefile target to download the doctor, and extract out the luna jar files, ready for javac to use. Jun 26 11:02:13 wtf Jun 26 11:02:20 pre market for palm has it up almost $2 Jun 26 11:02:27 wow Jun 26 11:04:12 why i sold at 10 grr Jun 26 11:12:57 bla: has what? Jun 26 11:13:15 b1: Jun 26 11:14:26 ok, now I have a .class, time to make a .jar somehow ... Jun 26 11:21:34 make a manifest and use jartool Jun 26 11:22:01 or use something like ant Jun 26 11:23:27 ${PACKAGE}.jar: ${PACKAGEPATH}/${CLASS}.class Jun 26 11:23:28 jar -c -f $@ $< Jun 26 11:24:42 still need to tell it your Main class Jun 26 11:24:46 somehow Jun 26 11:40:36 tmzt: so I need a manifest file? Jun 26 11:43:20 hmm - my .jar doesn't seem any different from /usr/lib/luna/java/lunaservice.jar ... Jun 26 11:52:52 woooop I rule Jun 26 11:53:03 * blau-mikeDG finally got new contact shortcuts working Jun 26 12:08:12 blau-mikedg, I'm sure when we have a summer pullback in investments you won't be all that sad you got rid of your shares at $10/ea Jun 26 12:09:55 rhitby -- morning -- / evening... anything interesting happen overnight? Jun 26 12:11:45 any suggestions for other shortcuts to create besides New Contact Jun 26 12:14:23 Rick__: I just wrote a makefile to create an ipkg out of CommandService.java ... Jun 26 12:15:24 cool. did you neex me to swap com.app.commander to org.webosinternals.commander before it get committed to git? Jun 26 12:15:40 that would be nice, but not essential. Jun 26 12:18:44 Rick__: http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/commit/4c3d04f92aa36d2fc84b667327af5fc8ca575aaa Jun 26 12:19:04 rwhitby, it litterally is just one change to appinfo.json. no other references.... Jun 26 12:20:40 ok, so if we call commandService instead of Prelease, the runCmd is still the same.... Jun 26 12:22:27 if I post a zip to my web server, can you commit it this morning, and I'll install a git client later today? Jun 26 12:22:45 'cause I have those patches done. Jun 26 12:25:12 rwhitby? Jun 26 12:25:33 ok Jun 26 12:26:22 http://www.vocshop.com/pre/org.webosinternals.commander.zip Jun 26 12:26:41 and thanks. Jun 26 12:27:07 <-- shower, more coffee, off to work. see you from there if you're still up in an hour or so. Jun 26 12:27:52 do I need a user name at gitorious, or is it just a "sign up and you can use it"? Jun 26 12:28:38 Rick__: sign up, then tell me your username Jun 26 12:29:27 rboatright Jun 26 12:31:00 ok. bbl thanks rwhitby. Rod, I gotta say, you're a heck of a guy, if a little odd, to spend the time on this as a visionary/ambassedor for optware... :-) I'm super impressed. but it's wonderful having you here. Jun 26 12:31:28 any news on an ssh client for webos ? Jun 26 12:31:28 Rick__: this is all self-interest. I want a Pre that can replace my Treo 650. Jun 26 12:31:38 right. Jun 26 12:31:41 sure. Jun 26 12:31:44 :-) Jun 26 12:31:47 ;-) Jun 26 12:31:51 bbl really this time. Jun 26 12:33:51 Rick__: http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/trees/master/org.webosinternals.commander Jun 26 12:34:20 jerms: check the chat logs Jun 26 12:34:29 short answer is no Jun 26 12:34:48 alright thanks Jun 26 12:34:59 long answer is some people reckon pssh works in Classic Jun 26 12:35:05 ya thats what i used to use Jun 26 12:35:47 id be more than happy to pay for one if it were available, im sure many others too Jun 26 12:36:04 yep Jun 26 12:36:24 a port of pssh to webOS using the SDK would be better :-) Jun 26 12:36:39 u guys read that developers blog on the blackberry app that showed up on slashdot this week ? Jun 26 12:36:59 quite interesting, im not a developer by any stretch so for me it was like pulling back teh curtains on that process Jun 26 12:37:21 nope, didn't see that. Jun 26 12:37:27 I was under the impression we needed a terminal app...things like ssh are already on the pre? Jun 26 12:37:50 nemix: sure, a terminal app is a basis for many things. Jun 26 12:37:54 that would be perfect Jun 26 12:38:15 but it has to be a good enough terminal app to run emacs ... Jun 26 12:38:31 yep Jun 26 12:39:41 http://www.versatilemonkey.com/story.html Jun 26 13:44:49 Good morning! Jun 26 13:45:45 Just wanted to extend my gratitude to the team for everyone's hard work Jun 26 13:46:14 workin hard or hardly workin ? Jun 26 13:46:21 :-D Jun 26 13:46:58 I actually wanted to contribute if possible Jun 26 13:47:19 hey guys, after going through the steps of the "download from browser" section i'm not sure I understand how to download a file like a pdf (sounds like a dumb question, but idk lol) Jun 26 13:47:29 I wanted to wiki the steps to enable the "Personals" category of the mCraig app Jun 26 13:47:30 argh, I got my pre and right have it's pretty rough at the edges... lol. No kerio exchange sync... appears everyone at kerio's forum has the same issues Jun 26 13:48:04 r3compile, oh - you have a modification ? Jun 26 13:48:18 Yes, nothing too complicated but I didn't see on the Wiki yet Jun 26 13:49:40 emerge iptables Jun 26 13:49:54 crap wrong windows. Jun 26 13:50:13 if i type in a pdf file nothing happens Jun 26 13:50:41 r3compile: just /msg'd you the wiki pw Jun 26 13:50:55 Great, thanks all Jun 26 13:51:19 rwhitby, burning the midnight oil ? Jun 26 13:51:44 bpadalino|work: yep. working on org.webosinternals.command service Jun 26 13:51:54 oh, cool Jun 26 13:52:11 a master of all trades Jun 26 13:53:39 bpadalino|work: http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/trees/master/org.webosinternals.command Jun 26 13:54:23 wow, fancy Jun 26 13:57:31 where are you putting the jar/class ? Jun 26 13:58:09 ${LUNAPATH} ? Jun 26 14:09:16 bpadalino|work: yes Jun 26 14:12:29 makes sense Jun 26 14:20:04 rwhitby: status update - I'm currently installing cygwin git - will start the wiki edits we talked about soon Jun 26 14:20:19 bclancy: I found msysGit to work well Jun 26 14:21:01 I will install both then - I read in the oreilly book that the ms version does not work well with svn Jun 26 14:29:39 the git commandline still confuses me at times Jun 26 14:31:03 it seems like it might be philosophically a bit like Perl, TIMTOWTDI (There is more than one way to do it) Jun 26 14:31:45 ok, who can test an org.webosinternals.services ipkg for me? Jun 26 14:31:46 H hope its close to svn, cvs, and RCS Jun 26 14:32:17 I've rooted last night, maybe I'm ready to help Jun 26 14:33:11 ok, this is completely untested, so you need to be ready to completely reinstall with the Doctor if anything goes horribly wrong. Jun 26 14:33:29 (it shouldn't, but I need to warn of that worst case scenario) Jun 26 14:33:42 at least blue smoke isn't the worst case scenario Jun 26 14:33:43 that's life in the fast lane - OK Jun 26 14:34:16 some peoples first untested code is prett good, I'm hoping that will be the case here :-) Jun 26 14:34:34 ipkg-opt install http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/blobs/raw/9932248adbe812ef7499907fb200a2a4ebe38b6c/org.webosinternals.services/org.webosinternals.services-0.1_all.ipk Jun 26 14:35:24 bclancy: do that, then reboot the Pre Jun 26 14:35:27 so I just follow the pattern of the other packages that I installed while installing optware Jun 26 14:35:32 yep Jun 26 14:35:39 ok Jun 26 14:35:47 you need to be root to run ipkg-opt Jun 26 14:36:47 OK, maybe we can test with sudo later, but the first time I will use root Jun 26 14:36:59 after the reboot, what should I expect? Jun 26 14:37:08 nothing different Jun 26 14:37:21 get back in as root after the reboot, and run: Jun 26 14:37:53 luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.services.shell/runCmd '{"cmd":"echo Hello, World!"}' Jun 26 14:39:07 does anyone remember the luna send command to send a txt message in the background Jun 26 14:39:56 my cygwin install is stilll in progress, so I will use putty - is there a TERM that I can set to that recognizes arrow keys and either emacs or vi line mode? Jun 26 14:41:00 dunno Jun 26 14:41:10 the suspense is killing me Jun 26 14:43:07 Finished writing the mCraig Personals mod: http://predev.wikidot.com/stock-application-mods Jun 26 14:45:19 bclancy: status? Jun 26 14:45:37 r3compile, looks good Jun 26 14:46:08 I think I need to get novaproxy command running before I can ssh into by pre, right? Jun 26 14:47:42 Someone posted a "Roam Only" mod on PreCentral that I can confirm works, so I'll document that now too Jun 26 14:48:11 r3: nice! Jun 26 14:48:13 Good morning everyone Jun 26 14:48:50 bclancy, if you installed ssh - you should just be able to ssh in .. no novaproxy required Jun 26 14:51:57 rickb@castle:~$ luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.services.shell/runCmd '{"cmd":"echo Hello, World!"}' Jun 26 14:51:59 (process:1700): LunaService-CRITICAL **: Error in base.c:538 Jun 26 14:52:01 (process:1700): LunaService-CRITICAL **: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken. Jun 26 14:52:03 ** (process:1700): CRITICAL **: main: assertion `serviceInit' failed Jun 26 14:52:05 rickb@castle:~$ Jun 26 14:52:50 sorry rwhitby. Install ran fine. service failed. Jun 26 14:53:03 Rick_: did you reboot in-between? Jun 26 14:53:17 complete power off reboot, yes Jun 26 14:53:24 hmm Jun 26 14:53:40 Rick_: ipkg-opt remove org.webosinternals.services Jun 26 14:54:38 rick, run as root ? Jun 26 14:55:01 got a new version anyway Jun 26 14:55:06 more changes ? Jun 26 14:55:11 how can i scp stuff to my phone? i tried it last night but i kept saying permissions denied. i was using my user, not root since I dont know the password Jun 26 14:55:15 chris phelps Jun 26 14:55:36 btw, i think that message comes up when you run luna-send as non-root - hence the security policy warning Jun 26 14:55:40 ipkg-opt install http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/blobs/raw/6ea44a0e023056a2674aa0fe050318f79f0378ad/org.webosinternals.services/org.webosinternals.services-0.1_all.ipk Jun 26 14:55:46 and then use Jun 26 14:55:50 gkatsev, need to make sure your filesystem is mounted as rw Jun 26 14:55:55 luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.shell/runCmd '{"cmd":"echo Hello, World!"}' Jun 26 14:56:03 bpadalino|work: thats probably it Jun 26 14:56:14 thanks Jun 26 14:56:26 PreGame suggested that the service name doesn't need to be identical to the package name, so we can make it shorter Jun 26 14:56:32 now i will never have to connect it to my computer again, lol Jun 26 14:57:10 are there any good books out yet for the Pre coding? Jun 26 14:57:14 sudo luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.shell/runCmd '{"cmd":"echo Hello, World!"}' Jun 26 14:57:15 r3: where is the roaming thing? Jun 26 14:58:26 djk, there is a rough cuts book for webOS that describes the main ideas available through oreilly Jun 26 14:59:07 guess the rest will be coming around the sdk release Jun 26 14:59:16 I'm an idiot. I didn't run it as root after the reboot Jun 26 14:59:17 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":"Hello, World!\n"} Jun 26 14:59:25 sorry Jun 26 14:59:47 looks like it worked Jun 26 15:00:26 djk1,the O'Reilly book is worth the $. Jun 26 15:01:02 woohoo!!!! Jun 26 15:01:13 congrats rwhitby - your ipkg seems to do a good job Jun 26 15:01:22 ipk rather Jun 26 15:01:33 congrats to ShinAli and PreGame - I just wrote a Makefile and packaged it up. Jun 26 15:01:49 now I'll try to commit the changes to org.webosinternals.commander Jun 26 15:02:01 Rick_: I'm fixing that right now Jun 26 15:02:14 I'm not getting a longin prompt in my ssh session (just a single line saying "SSH-2.0-dropbear_0.52" Jun 26 15:02:40 bclancy, are you in ssh mode in putty or raw mode ? Jun 26 15:03:38 Rick_: the org.webosinternals.commander that in git right now should work Jun 26 15:05:14 pretty slick Jun 26 15:05:26 oh, geist was back in here Jun 26 15:05:29 did he say anything ? Jun 26 15:05:32 nope Jun 26 15:05:52 I clicked on telnet, then changed the bor, but I could have made a mistake, I'll try again and save it under a new name Jun 26 15:06:07 rwhitby, what is the git repository to open ? Jun 26 15:06:17 what a shame Jun 26 15:06:33 Rick_: git@gitorious.org:webos-internals/applications.git Jun 26 15:06:41 k here's Roam Only mod: http://predev.wikidot.com/roam-control Jun 26 15:07:14 r3compile: are you interested in making a patch file for that mod? Jun 26 15:07:46 I believe the author did already Jun 26 15:07:53 I was just documenting it Jun 26 15:07:54 r3compile: like those in http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/modifications/trees/master ? Jun 26 15:08:00 http://www.gadgettrail.com/pre/preflist-assistant.js.roam.patch Jun 26 15:08:41 r3compile: does he say what license his patch has? Jun 26 15:08:59 rwhitby, I've never tried to use git before. How do I open the remote repository and check out files to my local drive? Jun 26 15:09:09 This was the PreCentral post I found it on: http://forums.precentral.net/hardware-use-trouble-shooting/186071-pre-roam-only-hack.html Jun 26 15:09:50 Rick_: windows or Linux? Jun 26 15:09:59 windows. Jun 26 15:10:14 bash git or gui, installed both Jun 26 15:13:21 rwhitby&bpadalino: I got in - Jun 26 15:13:36 cphelps: commander is ready to test Jun 26 15:13:56 Rick_: use msysgit git gui Jun 26 15:14:07 rwhitby&bpadalino: so "telnet" is raw mode, I created new session with ssh, then changing port to 222 Jun 26 15:14:09 Rick_: use git@gitorious.org:webos-internals/applications.git for the source of the clone Jun 26 15:14:14 rwhitby: did PreGame get his shit working correctly? Jun 26 15:14:36 rwhitby&bpadalino: I had to login as by user and then I sudo to root (will try su - now) Jun 26 15:14:46 bclancy, congrats Jun 26 15:14:53 cphelps: I merged what PreGame released and what ShinAli had previously committed in his hello-service, got it working and packaged it in an ipkg. Jun 26 15:15:14 cphelps: it's all in the repo, ipkg included Jun 26 15:15:23 su - worked (so now I'm ready to test what you already know) Jun 26 15:15:27 (I haven't done the commander ipkg yet) Jun 26 15:15:31 rwhitby: I'll check it out, looking forward to it Jun 26 15:15:40 bclancy: sudo luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.shell/runCmd '{"cmd":"echo Hello, World!"}' Jun 26 15:15:52 rwhitby: forgot my charger tho, so I can't do much work Jun 26 15:16:05 bclancy: (assuming you reinstalled the package when I said) Jun 26 15:17:15 just did the ipkg thing, going to reboot now Jun 26 15:17:18 simplyflipflops: we've got a org.webosinternals.shell dbus service ipkg ready for testing ... Jun 26 15:18:11 do you guys reboot from the ssh session or hold down the power key and choose top menu item? (I did the latter) Jun 26 15:19:43 is pregame still in the game or is your work today a result of having to fork an redo his work? Jun 26 15:23:52 looks like rwhitby is not on right now - I guess I can look at the logs and figure out how things went down. Jun 26 15:24:37 bclancy: this work is a merge of PreGame's and ShinAli's work, plus a Makefile for packaging from me. Jun 26 15:24:49 bclancy: I just type reboot within SSH Jun 26 15:25:01 thx Jun 26 15:25:08 reboot tells me command not found Jun 26 15:25:43 probably a path issue, is that for root or for your username? Jun 26 15:25:49 root Jun 26 15:26:55 reboot is in /sbin Jun 26 15:26:58 Rick_: how about /sbin/reboot Jun 26 15:27:00 put it in your patha nd it should work Jun 26 15:27:12 non-root can't reboot Jun 26 15:27:40 sudo should work if you set it up Jun 26 15:28:01 bclancy84@castle:~$ sudo luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.shell/runCmd ' Jun 26 15:28:04 {"cmd":"echo Hello, World!"}' Jun 26 15:28:05 Password: Jun 26 15:28:06 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":"Hello, World!\n"} Jun 26 15:28:09 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 15:28:49 yay for working Jun 26 15:29:08 so it looks like your service worked for me (running sudo from my user) Jun 26 15:29:40 * rwhitby points to http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=1712449 Jun 26 15:29:56 what are the next steps (besides my updating the wiki(? - otherwise standing by for other tasks Jun 26 15:29:58 bclancy: thanks for testing Jun 26 15:30:04 np Jun 26 15:31:48 hrmmm Jun 26 15:32:11 morning Jun 26 15:32:38 morning tharris2 Jun 26 15:32:52 my cygwin updates are about half done (so I'm not sure I can install/test cphelps' and Rick's GUI app (ulness I can get tit wotout git) Jun 26 15:33:15 can you download zips from gitorious ? Jun 26 15:33:38 reading the page now, I hope so Jun 26 15:33:42 bpadalino|work: you can download .tar.gz's Jun 26 15:33:50 i see - for the whole repo .. Jun 26 15:33:52 interesting Jun 26 15:34:23 bpadalino|work: I'll probably work on a Makefile to package apps tomorrow. Jun 26 15:34:44 awesome Jun 26 15:34:45 I can probably download the repository and then integrate with Git once my git install finishes Jun 26 15:34:52 going to sleep finally ? Jun 26 15:35:08 great work everyone! Jun 26 15:35:11 bpadalino|work: "my work here is done" Jun 26 15:37:33 heh Jun 26 15:39:08 u guys been doing this all night? Jun 26 15:39:18 rwhitby has Jun 26 15:39:22 lol damn Jun 26 15:39:30 well nice work Jun 26 15:39:52 he's a dedicated person Jun 26 15:39:55 that's for sure Jun 26 15:41:39 7pm to 1am, with time out for dinner, playing Uno with the kids, and helping put them to bed. Jun 26 15:41:54 oh, and some Mario Kart too :-) Jun 26 15:42:02 fun Jun 26 15:42:33 progress is faster when the rest of the house is asleep Jun 26 15:42:40 very true Jun 26 15:43:13 *nod* Jun 26 15:44:04 some took my name =p Jun 26 15:44:20 ill have to register Jun 26 15:44:45 good morning Jun 26 15:44:53 morning Jun 26 15:45:21 bpadalino|work: someone has installed this ipk already? Jun 26 15:45:29 I'm trying to root my pre, and though all the steps leading up to it were successful, according to the guide I'm following, the telnet is tioming out Jun 26 15:45:30 http://predev.wikidot.com/update-service-trace Jun 26 15:45:50 nmap reveals that all the ports it checks are filtered Jun 26 15:46:02 I posted the trace I got of the pre's conversation with the update service with the method I posted last night Jun 26 15:46:55 I an at least one other have installed rwhitby's service - If you mean the commander app, I'm not sure Jun 26 15:47:20 cphelps, the commander one? yeah Jun 26 15:47:24 nice dest Jun 26 15:47:26 my MEID, email and some stuff masked as I don't want to publish it :) Jun 26 15:47:31 * tharris2 off to read destinals report Jun 26 15:47:46 bpadalino|work: Invalid magic for me Jun 26 15:49:12 did the latest webos update include measures that try to combat the ability to root the device? Jun 26 15:49:20 cphelps, which package ? Jun 26 15:49:38 bahua, no Jun 26 15:49:38 The service Jun 26 15:49:45 wow dest u got the whole list and urls for packages Jun 26 15:49:50 cphelps, interesting .. bad magic while installing ? Jun 26 15:50:00 yep Jun 26 15:50:18 can anyone account for the fact that telnet is timing out when I try to connect? Jun 26 15:50:29 does dev mode turn itself off after a while? Jun 26 15:50:43 cphelps, that sucks - i am sorry :( Jun 26 15:50:56 bahu did u reboot? Jun 26 15:50:57 bahua, telnet isn't enabled by default .. Jun 26 15:50:58 cphelps: ipkg-opt install http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/blobs/raw/9288c1f8767ad195be8a8d4d69df8b67016e8eea/org.webosinternals.services/org.webosinternals.services-0.1_all.ipk Jun 26 15:51:10 shaggy-h, you around? Jun 26 15:51:18 I rebooted the phone as prompted when I enabled dev mode, if that's what you mean Jun 26 15:51:42 bahua: are you plugged in ? Jun 26 15:51:59 I am plugged into my PC's USB port, and in "charge" mode Jun 26 15:52:04 psykoz: sorta Jun 26 15:52:16 bahua, windows or mac ? Jun 26 15:52:24 my phone and my router both agree on the IP address Jun 26 15:52:29 windows xp Jun 26 15:52:56 so you're up to the point where you need to run novaproxy ? Jun 26 15:53:01 shouldnt bahua be ssh'ing in? Jun 26 15:53:04 goto http://www.whatismyip.com/ just to verify IP Jun 26 15:53:06 shaggy-h, so have you ever used resharpen with a mixed code solution? we've apparently tried it here in our dev group before but it blows up when it hits our C and C++ code that we have for legacy codebase, we did like it for all managed C# apparently but we haven't completely backported into managed code yet Jun 26 15:53:50 the telnet location while using novaproxy should be localhost - not your pre's IP .. Jun 26 15:53:51 I ran the novacom installer that was in the webos image, and then i ran the python script and got all the got/expected messages with no errors Jun 26 15:54:11 but localhost is my windows machine Jun 26 15:54:12 oh .. if you ran talk.py - then that should have started telnetd Jun 26 15:54:30 psykoz: I haven't sorry. When did you last try it though? I'd imagine a bug like that would have been fixed pretty quickly. They're generally very responsive if you log a bugreport with them Jun 26 15:54:43 we've tried it apparently several times over the past 2 years Jun 26 15:54:49 yes, I ran talk.py Jun 26 15:54:49 d'oh :( Jun 26 15:55:01 I'm guessing they probably just really have designed it around managed code exclusively Jun 26 15:55:05 bahua, can you ping your pre ? Jun 26 15:55:06 try stopping the .py program and rerunning it Jun 26 15:55:15 oh well, here in a few months we'll be on all managed code ;> Jun 26 15:55:22 psykoz: make sure there's a bug filed with them, there's no way it should 'blow up' Jun 26 15:55:29 it isn't still running. it finishes less than a second after starting it Jun 26 15:55:30 haha ok, or wait until then :) Jun 26 15:55:33 bahua: what OS are you running Jun 26 15:55:40 windows xp Jun 26 15:56:08 Have you tried novaproxy Jun 26 15:56:14 bahua, yeah - that's normal to finish in less than a second .. Jun 26 15:56:21 I figured Jun 26 15:56:33 novaproxy will open a socket for you to connect to using raw mode .. try that Jun 26 15:56:53 where is novaproxy? Jun 26 15:57:00 this channel is the first i have heard of it Jun 26 15:57:13 http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jun 26 15:57:17 novaproxy is the python program Jun 26 15:57:39 ah, so try that instead of talk.py Jun 26 15:57:44 Yup Jun 26 15:57:49 rgr Jun 26 16:00:46 yes! Jun 26 16:00:52 root@castle:/# Jun 26 16:00:54 Rick__: so you got the textfield working with a scroller? Jun 26 16:00:57 you guys are the man Jun 26 16:01:31 the collective man Jun 26 16:01:43 we are the borg Jun 26 16:02:12 just ran: echo "webos-internals rocks my world" Jun 26 16:02:28 bahua: review that you accomplished the steps on: http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jun 26 16:02:33 ok Jun 26 16:02:56 then go to: http://predev.wikidot.com/next-steps-after-rooting Jun 26 16:03:12 steps 1-14 completed Jun 26 16:03:35 the comments on the first page just before the link tell you the things that you are going to do on the 2nd link Jun 26 16:04:21 I'm planning on updating those wiki pages a bit with a little more detail than what they have now Jun 26 16:05:43 The 2nd link is the one to go to next: Cutting and pasting all the commands to execute worked perfectly for me. Jun 26 16:06:09 I'm giggling uncontrollably at each step Jun 26 16:09:13 man these emails from Sprint, making sure you know how to use the pre are interesting.. Jun 26 16:09:52 i never got an email Jun 26 16:10:56 lockily, I don't get the emails either Jun 26 16:11:26 do they have useful information in them? Jun 26 16:12:58 i got a call from some guy at almost 7pm about going over my account and the use of my Pre Jun 26 16:15:16 I've been ignoring them Jun 26 16:16:05 Robi-: calls from Sprint? Jun 26 16:17:31 any idea why when I paste blocks of code it adds progressively more indents? Jun 26 16:17:56 sdk/qemu? Jun 26 16:19:06 yea, aparently they think the general populace will only use it as a dumb phone and are trying to make sure you know what else it can do. it does have a lot of somewhat hidden functionality and is harder to use than the ol' PalmOS Jun 26 16:20:32 luckily nobody called me yet or sent email from sprint Jun 26 16:23:01 For those wanting to use Git on Windows to access our repo, here is a great tutorial: Jun 26 16:23:02 http://nathanj.github.com/gitguide/tour.html Jun 26 16:23:11 Maybe the emails are going to our sprint email adress? (which I don't even read) Jun 26 16:28:32 there a way to make the browser open a new window upon clicking a link? Jun 26 16:29:26 http://predev.wikidot.com/qemu-webos-emulation Jun 26 16:29:32 is this the way running webos in qemu? Jun 26 16:31:44 d3sm0nd: I was just trying that myself. no idea how well it works at this point Jun 26 16:31:48 bpadalino|work: do you want to update that page with current status? Jun 26 16:35:01 http://www.jwz.org/xdaliclock/ Jun 26 16:35:06 New app built with the SDK Jun 26 16:35:25 I should say really, really old app, ported via the SDK Jun 26 16:35:57 I love qemu Jun 26 16:35:58 hehe Jun 26 16:36:02 and kvm Jun 26 16:36:12 are you guys allowed to be releasing ssdk stuff yet Jun 26 16:36:42 Palm is not letting people submit stuff to the app store Jun 26 16:36:47 even if they have the SDK Jun 26 16:37:00 right Jun 26 16:37:20 I realize that doesn't answer your question Jun 26 16:37:55 its ok :) Jun 26 16:37:58 But the only way to sideload apps right now is via a bug, which Palm obviously didn't foresee Jun 26 16:38:12 gotta love Jamie. he does good stuff. Jun 26 16:38:13 So probably didn't work it into their license Jun 26 16:39:17 * rwhitby bbt Jun 26 16:42:46 has anyone figure out how to uninstall an app, like classic now that the 'trial' ran out Jun 26 16:43:11 hold orange button and tap the app Jun 26 16:43:42 sweet Jun 26 16:49:01 how about removing included apps? ahem*nascar*ahem. Jun 26 16:49:20 there's a wiki entry on how to remove it or hide it Jun 26 16:49:22 dk0r: see wiki Jun 26 16:49:33 seems to be a popular choice for one to remove :P Jun 26 16:49:36 EvanDotPro thanks. Jun 26 16:59:07 Has anyone played around with the appMenu settings in either adding or removing fields? Jun 26 16:59:31 the edit/help menu on the top left of a program. Jun 26 17:00:56 I also removed the stupid Sprint launcher Jun 26 17:01:01 I don't need their bookmark on my launcher Jun 26 17:04:50 psykoz: how'd you do that? I tried setting it to removable and to not "visible" with no luck. Jun 26 17:05:19 there's a luna/launcher folder somewhere, maybe /usr/luna/launcher? Jun 26 17:05:32 anyway find the launcher folder and there's just one directory under it Jun 26 17:05:53 if you view the json file in there it'll reference sprints website as a bookmark (similar to how bookmarks you add to launcher look) Jun 26 17:06:03 set it to false for visible or just outright delete it Jun 26 17:07:05 already did that. Didn't work... Hmmm.. And it's at /usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.sprintportal/ Jun 26 17:07:27 'spose I could just delete it. Kept it as it isn't part of the doctor image Jun 26 17:08:58 ihateyourband, oh I assumed you did that one first (which is what I did) and found that it still appeared but without the sprint icon anymore, just a nighttime/crescent moon icon ;) Jun 26 17:15:15 hmm Jun 26 17:21:18 psykoz: lol I. CAN'T. KILL. IT! Altering it in both places has accomplioshed nothing. Guess I'll just delete. Thanks for the head's up on that launchpoints directory though Jun 26 17:22:10 well dali clock works, i just dislike the transitions, can be jerky Jun 26 17:25:33 dali clock ? Jun 26 17:30:29 it was posted here a bit ago Jun 26 17:30:33 xdaliclock Jun 26 17:31:12 http://www.jwz.org/xdaliclock/ right here Jun 26 17:31:49 now if i know how to search my window history in irssi, that'd be useful Jun 26 17:31:56 en0x: beat me to it Jun 26 17:33:27 ah, the guy who wrote the tip calculator Jun 26 17:33:29 gotcha Jun 26 17:34:07 jamie is awesome Jun 26 17:34:23 never met him - smart person ? Jun 26 17:34:29 quite Jun 26 17:34:33 he was at Netscape early on Jun 26 17:34:37 oh cool Jun 26 17:34:52 gotta admire those people who were there at the beginning Jun 26 17:34:57 yea Jun 26 17:35:04 he was there when people came to build a great company Jun 26 17:35:15 as opposed to people wanting to come to work at a great company Jun 26 17:35:25 very cool Jun 26 17:38:14 i really should learn more of this web stuff ... it's pretty useful Jun 26 17:39:52 Does anyone elses screen temporarily go black if you flick off an in progress call? Jun 26 17:40:54 dk0r: I think so, but the call app has been a bit weird for me in general Jun 26 17:41:52 I keep somehow ending calls while talking to them - Even without moving my head, occasionally I am talking and then I just hear the "call ended" beep and it goes back to the main screen. Jun 26 17:41:54 yeah, it appears intermitent (spelling) Jun 26 17:42:03 yep, Jun 26 17:42:06 same thing here. Jun 26 17:42:06 weird Jun 26 17:42:32 And the app itself is slow, luckily it doesn't seem to affect the actual call. I can answer a call and it connects right away, but the gui program can take a couple seconds to appear Jun 26 17:42:34 i find the phone app a bit slugish connecting and especially disconncting. Jun 26 17:42:41 yep. Jun 26 17:42:55 * dk0r lives with it. Jun 26 17:43:04 disconnecting is also sort of slow, yeah. Hopefully they will work on fixing that app in the next couple releases Jun 26 17:43:38 The other webos apps can be slowish without a major problem, but the phone app is real-time and its performance needs to be prioritized Jun 26 17:43:40 hopefully. used an iphone for the first time a couple days ago. things gui is super responsive Jun 26 17:44:24 dk0r: Yeah it's not really any faster (in fact unless its the 3GS its quite a bit slower) but they do things asynchronously, and use lots of tricks to make users feel like it's fast. Jun 26 17:44:33 all the apps run at the same priority afaik Jun 26 17:44:51 Apple knows that perception is really more important than actually _being_ fast Jun 26 17:45:13 seems true to me. Jun 26 17:45:32 yep like preloading the possible scroll areas so it doesn't jerk scrolling far Jun 26 17:46:10 well, hopefully palm applies polish where needed. Jun 26 17:46:38 phone sucks in wind also.. Jun 26 17:46:40 terrible :) Jun 26 17:47:10 anyways, thanks for maintaing dev wiki. im out. Jun 26 17:47:11 having a snapshot of the app's GUI to display while the actual GUI loads is so tricky, but the perception of how fast an app loads goes WAY positive Jun 26 18:01:45 nice, just crashed my pre for the first time! Jun 26 18:02:07 how di dyou do that ? Jun 26 18:02:40 btw, mrvc apparently got enough of the precomd stuff working to use linux to root his pre Jun 26 18:04:40 bpadalino|work, from notifications I launched tweed, messaging, email and alarms all at once Jun 26 18:05:03 bpadalino|work, I see your issue with libusb Jun 26 18:05:13 ?? Jun 26 18:06:03 in that it's configuring without me having it Jun 26 18:06:19 oh yes Jun 26 18:06:22 pretty weak :( Jun 26 18:06:38 the check fails, why isn't it failing the config :( Jun 26 18:06:51 i don't know autotools :( Jun 26 18:07:44 bpadalino|work, talking to myself :) Jun 26 18:08:06 ah Jun 26 18:08:07 :) Jun 26 18:10:07 Ok where's simplyflipflops! Jun 26 18:10:16 no here Jun 26 18:10:19 whats up? Jun 26 18:10:36 damn I needed him to package something for me. He got it working last time since my was messing shit up Jun 26 18:10:47 i can package Jun 26 18:11:10 or you can do it Jun 26 18:11:15 there is a tutorial on the wiki Jun 26 18:11:25 OH !! Awesome just a sec. I'll tar it up and post it for ya. No Mine was fucking with .js extensions for some reason Jun 26 18:11:37 it was renaming them to .js000000 when it unpacked on the phone Jun 26 18:11:45 but only a few files. Jun 26 18:11:47 it was weird Jun 26 18:12:17 that's a lot of zeros Jun 26 18:12:24 I know!! Jun 26 18:12:40 what were u using to pack? Jun 26 18:12:49 cygwin Jun 26 18:12:56 bpadalino|work, here was my issue, http://www.gnu.org/software/hello/manual/autoconf/Libraries.html, you have to tell it what to do if it succededs (like add to the LDFLAGS) or if it fails (like echo and exit) :) Jun 26 18:13:17 ah cool Jun 26 18:13:25 bpadalino|work: hey, what came of your novacomd hacking? Jun 26 18:13:32 haven't seen any gitosis updates... Jun 26 18:13:48 Oh Hi Geist! Happy Friday Jun 26 18:13:52 hurry and pack it Kaerey: I need to go to lunch Jun 26 18:13:58 ok. Jun 26 18:13:59 geist, oh - you should check out gitorious .. Jun 26 18:14:10 it's gitTastic Jun 26 18:14:20 geist, let me link you Jun 26 18:14:21 you moved it? Jun 26 18:14:33 geist, you'll get a kick out of my protocol documentation Jun 26 18:14:35 :P Jun 26 18:14:39 yeah, i saw that Jun 26 18:14:43 but it hasn't updated in a week or two Jun 26 18:14:58 last update june 18 Jun 26 18:15:09 i pushed stuff yesterday to gitorious ... i should have pushed to github too :( Jun 26 18:15:17 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/precomd Jun 26 18:15:19 geist, I just pushed a few minutes ago Jun 26 18:15:26 all the webos internals stuff goes to this gitorious repo .. Jun 26 18:15:31 bpadalino|work, what's the github for? Jun 26 18:15:39 bpadalino|work, just pushed the config fix Jun 26 18:15:39 gaffo, it was where i originally put it Jun 26 18:15:49 before rwhitby opened this gitorious one Jun 26 18:15:53 aah Jun 26 18:15:55 so i was keeping 2 remotes at home Jun 26 18:16:03 ah, you just haven't been updating the docs Jun 26 18:16:05 mmm, multiremoted development :) Jun 26 18:16:15 geist, gaffo is trying to get autotools going .. Jun 26 18:16:24 ewww Jun 26 18:16:34 geist, and i suppose we're going to try to make it more like a libnovacom so expose to the outside world .. Jun 26 18:16:44 i've never used autotools Jun 26 18:16:49 but it sure has a lot of "boilerplate" Jun 26 18:16:51 :\ Jun 26 18:16:59 it's super grody Jun 26 18:17:01 i hates it Jun 26 18:17:04 heh Jun 26 18:17:13 i was surprised how much it needs to work .. that's for sure Jun 26 18:17:19 especially since we just depend on libusb and that's it Jun 26 18:17:42 geist, hows work at palm ? Jun 26 18:17:46 not too bad Jun 26 18:17:50 busy little bees Jun 26 18:17:54 been pretty busy - i haven't seen you in the channel much Jun 26 18:18:14 it was too distracting so i shut it off for a week or so Jun 26 18:18:19 irc can do that Jun 26 18:18:30 oh hey, sorry if this is a bit spammy, but I wrote up a blog post talking about how we need folks to help out. http://short.ie/helpspazpre Feel free to spread around as you see fit Jun 26 18:18:45 i think this weekend i am going to do more with the novacom stuff Jun 26 18:19:00 i looked at the java webos jar for the java implementation to get a better understanding of the oob packets Jun 26 18:20:12 geist, how long did it take for you guys to come up with the protocol ? Jun 26 18:21:28 funkatron: I'm a little confused about the development of Spaz -do contributors have access to the Mojo SDK? Jun 26 18:22:04 i wrote most of it in a weekend Jun 26 18:22:10 bsiegel-work: no, but it helps, depending on what aspects you're working on. If you're contributing to SpazCore, it's not necessary Jun 26 18:22:11 we needed it monday, and it was friday... Jun 26 18:22:30 hahaha - wow Jun 26 18:22:38 if you can get homebrew running on your device, you should be fine though Jun 26 18:22:39 it went through a couple of revisions though, which is why the version number is 3 Jun 26 18:23:05 oh - the version looked like it was 1 to me .. :( damn, i must have missed that part Jun 26 18:23:18 still got some stuff coming when i get the chance. the throughput should be greatly increased by actually enabling the windowing feature Jun 26 18:23:34 right now the tx side has essentially a 1 packet window Jun 26 18:23:48 oh, you're adding windowing to your ack scheme ? Jun 26 18:23:50 fancy Jun 26 18:23:54 it's already in there Jun 26 18:24:05 it just always waits for the ack for the last one Jun 26 18:24:15 very interesting Jun 26 18:24:15 funkatron: Ah, yeah I was just confused. It seems like it would be hard to get contributors to an open source app written using an SDK that is under NDA. Jun 26 18:24:21 essentially the rx side already supports it, the tx side just needs to start spewing more than one packet before waiting for an ack Jun 26 18:24:39 i'll give that shot Jun 26 18:24:50 see how the pre reacts to it Jun 26 18:24:53 bpadalino|work: the 'mode' field is the version field Jun 26 18:25:00 ah! Jun 26 18:25:02 bsiegel-work: understandable, but yeah, you should be able to contribute in a lot coding ways (and plenty of non-coding ways) without the SDK Jun 26 18:25:07 so for the pmux stuff ? Jun 26 18:25:09 here's a little hint: virtually all protocols i design start with a 32bit magic and then a 32bit version Jun 26 18:26:05 gotcha Jun 26 18:26:39 bpadalino|work, that solves one of the things we were talking about, the buffering Jun 26 18:26:46 geist: do you know if we can submit not sdk built apps to someone to get them in the catalog? Jun 26 18:26:53 Kaerey: no idea at all Jun 26 18:27:01 i am but a lowly kernel engineer Jun 26 18:27:04 geist: do you know that I still think you're awesome. Jun 26 18:27:07 geist, the direction tho .. the mode is only a char size, isn't it ? Jun 26 18:27:08 they dont let me out of my cave that often Jun 26 18:27:20 since you have tx/rx as the next char .. Jun 26 18:27:24 bpadalino|work: i was looking at that, i think it's actually padding Jun 26 18:27:34 and i think i may have forgotten to initialize that part of the struct :) Jun 26 18:27:36 oh really?? Jun 26 18:27:39 interesting! Jun 26 18:27:46 they seem to flop back and forth with each other Jun 26 18:28:00 interesting result :) Jun 26 18:28:13 geist, yeah, I'm experimenting with autotools because I think we want it to support mac / linux, and have a .so for the lib as well as the daemon, so I figured it would make it eaiser. it sure is verbose though. I wish you could just toss all of that stuff into a directory instead of the root and hide the splok. Jun 26 18:28:18 both sides use the same buffer, and everything will line up the same way every time, so it may just be an uninitialized value Jun 26 18:28:40 yeah - i was going to do the same .. single buffer for all the transactions Jun 26 18:29:05 funkatron: It'd be nice to find a way to get twitpic working, but I suppose if someone did you couldn't include it, since there doesn't seem to be any official way to do that (as far as I know, given my limited knowledge of the sdk) Jun 26 18:29:42 bsiegel-work: the only way I can see to do it is to attach the photo to an email and let the user send it to an email gateway provided by Twitpic et al Jun 26 18:29:56 there isn't a service exposed to upload files Jun 26 18:30:06 geist, it seemed that whenever i was looking at char/uint16 values ... they ended up really being uint32's in the end .. which makes sense for alignment accesses, right ? Jun 26 18:30:26 however, you might be able to upload photos to a photo service defined in the photo-upload service API used by the photo app Jun 26 18:31:38 rwhitby: around ? Jun 26 18:31:49 bpadalino|work: right, especially on the arm which takes a performance hit when it's unaligned Jun 26 18:32:02 right Jun 26 18:33:34 where do i get "NOVACOM LINUX" DRIVERS???? Jun 26 18:34:39 NxlKing2304, unless you have the sdk, there aren't any at the moment. The are being worked on. Jun 26 18:35:01 well i connected my palm pre and it's asking for those drivers Jun 26 18:35:05 * zodttd says big Pre news to come...bbiab :) Jun 26 18:35:28 my palm pre has been connected to my pc and works fine. This new one is asking for new drivers Jun 26 18:35:39 zodttd -- what do you mean BIG NEWS? Jun 26 18:35:53 Oh, some cool software running on it Jun 26 18:36:04 any hints? Jun 26 18:36:18 games Jun 26 18:36:21 nice Jun 26 18:36:25 BIG TIME STUFF Jun 26 18:36:26 need for speed would be nice! Jun 26 18:36:27 lol Jun 26 18:36:31 FF7 ? Jun 26 18:36:53 FF7? Jun 26 18:36:58 Final Fantasy 7 Jun 26 18:37:22 that woul be cool Jun 26 18:37:26 most def :) Jun 26 18:37:46 NxlKing2304, I'm not sure that there will be drivers in the sense you're talking about. You should be able to just mount it as generic flash storage. Jun 26 18:37:55 psx on pre Jun 26 18:38:02 I've been waiting for a device similar to Pandora strength for the masses. I have my CodeSourcery toolchain ready to go Jun 26 18:38:05 Heya Optimo! Jun 26 18:38:15 heheh Jun 26 18:38:30 Optimo is everywhere :P Jun 26 18:38:38 including.. ? Jun 26 18:38:39 I do love samrtphonery Jun 26 18:38:49 heh Jun 26 18:39:23 Optimo: I may have OpenGL ES 2.0 up and going on the Pre soon Jun 26 18:39:40 so cool Jun 26 18:40:03 Saurik said Cydia for Pre too, which is even better knews Jun 26 18:40:22 too bad they didnt makea an ipod model pre Jun 26 18:40:29 that niche is covered Jun 26 18:40:41 heh yeah! Jun 26 18:41:17 right on. although I felt that a lot of Cydia was a ghetto of super-adware and 10,000 glitter skins Jun 26 18:41:43 thats the individual repos Jun 26 18:41:47 Yeah Jun 26 18:41:57 fo sho that Jun 26 18:42:06 funkatron: Has some cool emulators on it though ;) Jun 26 18:42:07 just use apt-get ;) Jun 26 18:42:13 oh yes, totally Jun 26 18:42:35 sombody has to have "novacom linux" drivers Jun 26 18:44:55 NxlKing2304, why do you need them, what are you trying to do? Jun 26 18:45:17 trying to root my pre. I turned on dev mode. and it asked me for those drivers Jun 26 18:45:41 Did you connect it in charge mode? Jun 26 18:45:48 yes Jun 26 18:45:55 charge only Jun 26 18:47:07 where would the regular drivers be located. like after i installed the.msi file Jun 26 18:47:25 bpadalino|work, I'm making the public / private headers like we talked about. it seems that PMUX_HEADER_VERSION is defined in 2 places. do you want it to be 1 or 0x00000001? Jun 26 18:47:39 NxlKing2304: They get copied to the driverstore where windows /should/ find them automatically Jun 26 18:47:48 gaffo, 1 is fine Jun 26 18:47:53 NxlKing2304 is on linux Jun 26 18:48:07 Oh. sorry should have read up further :p Jun 26 18:48:28 well, but he mentioned an .msi, so I assumed ... Jun 26 18:48:31 no, I am on Vista Jun 26 18:48:38 32 bit Jun 26 18:48:48 Oh, well in that case, if its not found automatically you can manually specify C:\Program Files\Palm, Inc\novacom\x86 Jun 26 18:48:53 the name of the device it's looking for drivers is "novacom linux" Jun 26 18:49:02 Oh, that's odd... Jun 26 18:49:08 yeah i know, lol Jun 26 18:49:10 Try pointing it there Jun 26 18:49:16 i've connected about five palms previous. brb Jun 26 18:49:25 And if that fails we can look up the VID/PID and see if its different Jun 26 18:49:48 Has anyone with a jiggly screen when the pre is closed, tried to tighten the 3 screws you can get to if you take the back of hte phone off? Jun 26 18:50:39 didn't work, still can't find drivers Jun 26 18:52:38 Okay, am I losing my mind, is there a way to forward text's? Jun 26 18:52:41 funkatron I have an idea of how to get photo "uploads" working Jun 26 18:52:55 all these wonderful Michael Jackson jokes, I need to do my share of spamming my friends ;-) Jun 26 18:53:03 USB/VID_0830&PID_8002&REV0216&MI_01 Jun 26 18:56:05 NxlKing2304: Those are identical to my functioning "Palm Novacom" entry Jun 26 18:57:06 Kaerey: we need a service to work with that will utilize curl or something similar Jun 26 18:57:12 there's no was to do it within JS itself Jun 26 18:57:30 Yeah but I thought of a round about way of doing it. Jun 26 18:58:37 In your program have a field that allows for entry of your "twitpic" email address, then from in the program you can call the file browser and auto create an email that gets sent to the twitpic address they set. Jun 26 19:01:05 can a jre unjar files (or is the Java SDK reoquired)? I ask because I want to update the rooting instructions with more detail - Jun 26 19:01:24 a jar is a zip file Jun 26 19:01:31 I know Jun 26 19:01:35 Its just a zip file Jun 26 19:01:40 you can use zipstream or something liket hat Jun 26 19:01:53 can use unjar Jun 26 19:02:02 er jartool Jun 26 19:02:07 unzip Jun 26 19:02:07 the current doc says this, but wikipedia says old versions of zip will rename the manifest file to lowercase Jun 26 19:02:10 winzip Jun 26 19:02:39 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JAR_(file_format)#Problems_with_the_JAR_format Jun 26 19:02:40 Are you trying to unjar in code? Jun 26 19:03:10 I've unjared it fine, I just want to make sure we have any possible problems covered in the doc Jun 26 19:03:32 at step 2 of: http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jun 26 19:04:35 most of the users snould be fine just renaming the jar and then unzipping (unless they have an old version of zip, and the wikipedia doesn't say how old it has to be not to work. Jun 26 19:04:53 i am trying to SCP something to my phone, however, it keeps telling my permission denied. i have enabled write access but still cant. any ideas? Jun 26 19:05:15 I can leave this step as is, if most people's experience is that it's not an issue - I was just asking in case someone knew Jun 26 19:06:00 gkatsev: just to be sure, you can ssh in but you can't scp Jun 26 19:06:26 bclancy: yep. Jun 26 19:07:00 im trying to use pscp and am using the -scp flag for it (to force scp) and it looks fine, asks me for my password but then says permission denied Jun 26 19:07:07 does the same or a different firewall rule cover both cases (I assume it's the same) Jun 26 19:08:13 on other linux, sometime there was something in an init file (somilar to how rcp used to be covered) - maybe it's something like that Jun 26 19:08:17 funkatron: do you know of anything special you have to do to make a button disappear? visibility = hidden on the model doesn't seem to work. Jun 26 19:08:38 I would use DOM stuff to hide it Jun 26 19:08:55 I used jQuery for all that stuff, but you can do it in Prototype as well Jun 26 19:08:58 bclancy: turning off firewall for my comp didnt help... Jun 26 19:09:01 funkatron: isn't that what modifying the model does? Jun 26 19:09:17 cphelps: maybe? I never tried it that way Jun 26 19:09:24 funkatron: thanks. Jun 26 19:09:36 I'm going to scp in to my pre and look around (to see if I can remembe what I was thinking of) Jun 26 19:09:42 I didn't think "visibility" was typically something for the model. maybe the widget attributes Jun 26 19:09:51 I saw some talk around the internets that someone has gotten webos up in an emulator for experimenting? Are there steps to get this working? Jun 26 19:10:49 bclancy: thatll be great, mean while, ill try some other scp program for windows, see if it helps, though, perhaps its time for me to restart into linux... Jun 26 19:11:23 has anyone but samba on pre yet? it should be simple to do Jun 26 19:11:39 tmzt: i believe there is something about it on the wiki Jun 26 19:11:57 will that work for you? Jun 26 19:11:59 gkatsev: just checking whether you are using root or a regular user name? Jun 26 19:12:20 bclancy: was using regular username, dont know root password, is there even one? Jun 26 19:12:35 just wante to be sure - OK Jun 26 19:14:14 winSCP just gave me this: "command 'groups' \n failed with return code 127 and error message" Jun 26 19:15:53 sorry guys just got back, I had two customers. Jun 26 19:15:53 anyway, what do you think could be the problem??? Jun 26 19:20:02 gkatsev, it worked fine for me. Are you remembering the poirt? (Here's the output for me from cygwin) Jun 26 19:20:09 PANASONIC@panasoni-279508 /cygdrive/c/webos-internals-applications/org.webosinternals.commander Jun 26 19:20:10 $ scp -P 222 bclancy84@192.168.1.71:/tmp/resolv.conf /tmp/foo Jun 26 19:20:12 bclancy84@192.168.1.71's password: Jun 26 19:20:14 resolv.conf 100% 131 0.1KB/s 00:01 Jun 26 19:20:15 PANASONIC@panasoni-279508 /cygdrive/c/webos-internals-applications/org.webosinternals.commander Jun 26 19:20:17 $ scp -P 222 /tmp/foo bclancy84@192.168.1.71:/tmp/foo Jun 26 19:20:19 bclancy84@192.168.1.71's password: Jun 26 19:20:21 foo 100% 131 0.1KB/s 00:00 Jun 26 19:20:23 PANASONIC@panasoni-279508 /cygdrive/c/webos-internals-applications/org.webosinternals.commander Jun 26 19:20:24 $ Jun 26 19:21:28 bclancy: yes, i remembered the port, at first it wouldnt even give me a message, but then remembered to add -P 222 to it and it asks me for the password Jun 26 19:21:42 I'll try pscp.exe next Jun 26 19:22:09 thanks Jun 26 19:22:49 presumably you entered the valid password that worked for putty.exe, and got permission denied (or something similar)? Jun 26 19:23:12 yeah Jun 26 19:26:38 let me try logging into linux, maybe itll help... Jun 26 19:27:32 ANYBODY???? Jun 26 19:28:23 what's wrong nxl ? Jun 26 19:28:44 when fara foscett died and went to heaven God granted her 1 wish. She wished that all the children would be safe, so God killed Michael Jackson. Jun 26 19:29:13 Due to the fact that Michael Jackson is 99% plastic, he will be melted down into lego blocks so all the kids can play with him for a change Jun 26 19:29:15 gkatsev: I got a different error (when trying to use pscp from cygwin): Jun 26 19:29:21 PANASONIC@panasoni-279508 /cygdrive/c/putty Jun 26 19:29:23 $ /cygdrive/c/putty/pscp.exe -P 222 bclancy84@192.168.1.71:/tmp/foo /tmp/foo Jun 26 19:29:25 bclancy84@192.168.1.71's password: Jun 26 19:29:27 sh: /opt/libexec/sftp-server: not found Jun 26 19:29:29 unable to initialise SFTP: could not connect Jun 26 19:29:30 PANASONIC@panasoni-279508 /cygdrive/c/putty Jun 26 19:29:32 $ Jun 26 19:30:25 bclancy: in pscp use the -scp flag in addition to -P to force it to only use scp Jun 26 19:30:36 but seems that scp from linux isnt working for me either... Jun 26 19:30:48 but at the moment, file system is ro... Jun 26 19:31:10 HAve you tried to restart hte phone Jun 26 19:31:10 let me make it rw Jun 26 19:31:14 I had an issue last night where I couldn't connect Jun 26 19:31:26 Well, actually i didn't restart, but i disabled and renabled wifi Jun 26 19:31:27 ventralnet: i can ssh into the phone, i just cant scp stuff into it Jun 26 19:31:28 and it worked Jun 26 19:31:34 gkatsev: well at lest it looks like I've recreated your problem: Jun 26 19:31:40 PANASONIC@panasoni-279508 /cygdrive/c/putty Jun 26 19:31:42 $ /cygdrive/c/putty/pscp.exe -P 222 -scp bclancy84@192.168.1.71:/tmp/foo /tmp/foo Jun 26 19:31:44 bclancy84@192.168.1.71's password: Jun 26 19:31:46 scp: /tmp/foo: Cannot create file Jun 26 19:31:47 PANASONIC@panasoni-279508 /cygdrive/c/putty Jun 26 19:31:49 $ Jun 26 19:31:50 I used WinSCP, it throws you an error when your first connect, but it still works Jun 26 19:32:40 bclancy: yeah, i guess its the same thing (though, i was doing it from cmd) Jun 26 19:33:11 still get permission denied... Jun 26 19:35:01 i guess for small files i can scp them to my server and then wget them from the phone... buts that an extra step... Jun 26 19:37:22 which is what im going to do with the text replacement file right now Jun 26 19:38:53 grr.. twitter is teasing me with all these people saying they got the SDK. Jun 26 19:39:35 Kaerey: haha, i really wish palm will release at least some beta (i really want a terminal) Jun 26 19:40:14 speaking of terminal, i believe someone is working on one, and i can volunteer some time to helping out. dont know much about writing terminal emulators, but know a bit of js Jun 26 19:42:37 did you try ssh from linux (just as a control)? Jun 26 19:42:46 gkatsev: we have a command prompt Jun 26 19:42:54 gkatsev: that logs output Jun 26 19:43:26 bclancy: yeah, still not working, but i think i know why i cant. Jun 26 19:43:36 when i try to wget something via ssh i have to sudo it Jun 26 19:43:41 i am guessing thats why i cant scp stuff over Jun 26 19:43:48 at least, as user Jun 26 19:43:48 you can try the -v flag for scp or pscp - mine fell back to scp1 in all cases Jun 26 19:45:20 blah I hate cygwin! it won't install. keeps hanging at 13% Jun 26 19:51:09 bclancy: says it uses SSH2.0 Jun 26 19:52:10 cygwin took forever for me to update (just adding git) to day, it hung at a low percentage like yours but eventually it finished. Jun 26 19:52:48 I feel spoiled - in my last contract - the client gave me a macbook to use, so I didn't have to mess with cygwin Jun 26 19:53:04 I gave them the computer back earlier this week. Jun 26 19:53:23 bclancy: but it must be something related to how i can only wget with sudo. Jun 26 19:53:29 there is also minGW Jun 26 19:53:46 gkatsev: I tried "-2" and it didn't help. Jun 26 19:54:25 so, i guess, now the question is, how can i wget in user (not root) without needing sudo at the very least, in /media/internal/* Jun 26 19:54:27 I guess you should keep asking - If I think of anything, hopefully you'll be around if/when it comes to me Jun 26 19:54:28 ? Jun 26 19:55:35 i don't think I know enough to help gkatsev - can anyone else step in? Jun 26 19:56:11 there was a wiki article about changing fstab to mount with uid=1001 and gid=1001 Jun 26 19:56:20 to mount media/internal Jun 26 19:57:31 where can I keep up with news and updates about enabling browser downloading? Jun 26 20:03:10 d3x0r: thanks! the uid trick helped. Jun 26 20:04:25 time to restart pre. Jun 26 20:07:27 crap Jun 26 20:07:34 my phone app is coming up blank Jun 26 20:07:50 and i need to find the last number that just called Jun 26 20:08:01 but its all blank! Jun 26 20:09:58 there is no number Jun 26 20:10:15 i have to call it back damnit Jun 26 20:10:26 *69? Jun 26 20:10:56 hm... the text replacement doesnt replace words that that with , for me... Jun 26 20:12:31 in fact, it doesnt do replacements any replacements with , Jun 26 20:12:33 weird Jun 26 20:15:02 i'm back, so can anybody help me with connecting my phone to my vista laptop? My computer is looking for "NOVACOM LINUX" drivers. Any help would be appreciated! Jun 26 20:15:40 install the msi from the jar Jun 26 20:15:46 and by "the jar" i mean the web doctor jar Jun 26 20:28:49 so I was curios if anyone here has been accepted to the early access program for Palm's SDK? Just trying to get a feel for how many people have been accepted and yes I realize that this is not the most scientific approach Jun 26 20:30:02 #webos Jun 26 20:30:52 hey guys Jun 26 20:30:58 NxlKing2304: On XP, we were able to say "Cancel" to the prompt that came up shortly upon running the MSI installer. Did you try to see whether things might work just by saying cancel? (In other words, I think the regular USB drivers that were installed when you installed your Pre might be "good enough") Jun 26 20:31:12 has anyone noticed a dramatic increase in battery life after the update last friday??? Jun 26 20:31:21 mine has jumped in performance by almost 30% Jun 26 20:31:35 Tydog: in all likelyhood, that's just the batt breaking in Jun 26 20:32:25 I added a comment after step 5 on http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jun 26 20:32:57 Let us know if cancel works for Vista or not. Jun 26 20:33:50 yes to seeing better battery life (but I can't quantify it) Jun 26 20:34:12 bclancy: it does. (i rooted my phone on vista) Jun 26 20:34:18 so did i Jun 26 20:34:25 almost typed rotted, lol Jun 26 20:34:46 so you are looking for the drivers for future reasons then? Jun 26 20:34:54 haha Jun 26 20:35:22 making bread, brb Jun 26 20:40:34 Has there been any more homebrew apps released? Jun 26 20:44:25 uh forgot my usb cable at home, can't fix the dialer Jun 26 20:45:17 : I have the SDK Jun 26 20:46:02 deesugar: Thanks Jun 26 20:46:50 all: I made some minor edits to the wiki page on http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jun 26 20:47:29 can you look them over to make sure I didn't accidentally mispeak on anything? -- thx, Bob Jun 26 20:52:05 what's up today, guys? Jun 26 20:52:37 bclancy: 2 hours + 1 hour breathing room? Jun 26 20:53:00 bclancy: you might scare people off. for me it took 10 mins or less, for non-unixy people maybe an hour Jun 26 20:53:07 Do you think that's way too ling Jun 26 20:53:17 I'll remove it for now. Jun 26 20:53:35 mayby my old laptop is just slow Jun 26 20:53:47 besides installing the doctor and python it's pretty much copy / paste Jun 26 20:54:13 yes, it is especially toward the end Jun 26 20:55:24 Technobabble: not much. there's services stuff between PreGame and midnightcommander and stuff, and I posted traces of the updater protocol / format Jun 26 20:56:37 Technobabble: I want qemu, it seems like it should be possible -- the CPU is supported. Unfortunately I know almost nothing about getting an image working on qemu, so I'm having to learn from the ground up Jun 26 20:57:22 destinal: I was a little worried about scaring people - thanks for the feedback - I took that part back out. Jun 26 20:57:25 i couldn't get the maemo omap3 branch of qemu to work with any omap3 based image Jun 26 20:58:24 bpadalino: any reason to think the latest svn wouldn't work? and the dd offsets on the wiki, were those 1.0.2? Jun 26 20:58:27 The doctor part seemed to hang for me - maybe I waited longer than I needed to before rebooting my laptop and trying again. Jun 26 20:58:38 OK seriously, who can help me with packaging in cygwin, everytime I do it, the program installs, but it chagnes the file extension of two files from .js to .js0000000 (yes 7 zeros) Jun 26 20:58:39 Hi, i need some mad help... Jun 26 20:59:00 The python part was slow, but painless. I might want to add a link to what to download though (for Python) Jun 26 20:59:16 I am trying to root my palm pre, actually did that but can't go pass http://irc.netsplit.de/channels/details.php?room=%23webos-internals&net=freenode Jun 26 20:59:38 eh? Jun 26 20:59:41 It will not download just gives me an error http1.1 404 Jun 26 20:59:54 did you try googling (I can do that if you haven't) Jun 26 21:00:02 Saiks: uh, that's like an IRC channel detail page or something Jun 26 21:00:19 destinal, the offsets were for 1.0.2 .. but it should be easy enough to figure out the new ones Jun 26 21:00:26 Oh sorry... Jun 26 21:01:00 destinal, i don't know if the current svn snap of qemu supports the cortex processor .. Jun 26 21:01:00 my comment asking about googling was for Kaerey Jun 26 21:01:08 i meant wget http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/cs08q1armel/cross/stable/ipkg-opt_0.99.163-10_arm.ipk Jun 26 21:01:12 bpadalino|work: it does Jun 26 21:01:20 then i guess you could try that Jun 26 21:01:31 i have been stuck here for ova 5 hrs Jun 26 21:01:34 bpadalino|work: do you have a command line to run it all? Jun 26 21:01:55 destinal, to run .. qemu ? Jun 26 21:01:56 to make it ? Jun 26 21:02:01 bclancy: no I haven't yet. but it's done this to me on two different machines now using cygwin Jun 26 21:02:30 destinal, you should be able to just tell it the kernel and the initial ramdisk image Jun 26 21:02:37 and it should boot up like the example does Jun 26 21:02:40 to run it, don't you need a -kernel something -cpu, -ifname -usbdevice and things? Jun 26 21:02:44 bclancy: The article is fine, except that as of recently, novaproxy is set up to work well from a GUI launch (double click the .py script), which is probably easier for windows users Jun 26 21:02:44 yes i have all that.. Created the dir too Jun 26 21:03:08 destinal, yeah - just the kernel, the cpu and the ramdisk Jun 26 21:03:25 ah, ok, that's easier than I expected Jun 26 21:03:27 destinal, but any time i would run it - it would get stuck somewhere Jun 26 21:03:35 and i never put the time into debugging it Jun 26 21:03:56 bclancy: Also, the line about "securing the network" is unnecessary. I would have edited this page a while ago (I am assisting asadeno with maintaining novaproxy) but I don't have access to edit the wiki Jun 26 21:03:57 I did double click the by script, but I didn't get a GUI - maybe you can update the wiki with the details that you know? Jun 26 21:04:47 RARW Jun 26 21:04:57 heya guys Jun 26 21:05:24 anyone around? Jun 26 21:05:27 kind of Jun 26 21:05:29 we're all shy Jun 26 21:05:36 i'm at work too Jun 26 21:05:38 bsiegel-work: I haven't studied that part (securing the network) in detail yet. If you give me a replacement wording, I'll put it on the wiki for you. Jun 26 21:05:42 I had a though... Jun 26 21:05:55 http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/185716-php.html Jun 26 21:06:06 that says that php is installed. Jun 26 21:06:07 have anybody rooted their palm pre Jun 26 21:06:22 bclancy: It doesn't launch a GUI, but its console output is aware that it can be running in a GUI (it waits for a keypress before quitting if there is an error, for example) and the error messages are much more friendly now since I handled most common exceptions Jun 26 21:06:33 no need to root the pre - it comes pre rooted Jun 26 21:06:41 haha Jun 26 21:06:55 just need to connect it up Jun 26 21:07:05 reddozen, i have not seen php installed on the pre Jun 26 21:07:09 my question would be has anyone thought of using php-cli and ajax with a standard app to execute linux commands through php... Jun 26 21:07:28 reddozen: it's already on the wiki Jun 26 21:07:40 nice.. i must have missed that this morrning Jun 26 21:07:43 >_< Jun 26 21:07:48 bsiegel-work>: OK, I know what you mean now - I can update that Jun 26 21:07:52 i miss anything fun this afternoon Jun 26 21:08:04 I am trying t use the wifi for my labtop Jun 26 21:08:19 *appears* Jun 26 21:08:20 * reddozen goes to the wiki to dig / look Jun 26 21:09:16 there are linux novacom drivers. were you guys aware? Jun 26 21:09:51 timboy, not officially released i thought Jun 26 21:09:57 unless that changed with the 1.0.3 web doctor Jun 26 21:10:10 Saiks: if your wget over wireless is failing, try it over EVDO Jun 26 21:10:20 bpadalino|work, oh i see. ok Jun 26 21:10:32 man i was kinda hoping for an update this week Jun 26 21:10:54 cphelps, from what I can see that wiki page explains creating a webserver. PHP-cli shouldnt require a webserver to be used. Jun 26 21:11:00 timboy, but yes - there are drivers for osx, linux and windows .. just not windows 7 yet Jun 26 21:11:19 http://www.php-cli.com/ Jun 26 21:11:31 would it be of interest to add a hook to Spaz for posting to Twitter from another app? Jun 26 21:11:32 bpadalino|work, I just found out as I got sdk access today WOOT Jun 26 21:11:44 ah, congrats Jun 26 21:11:44 reddozen: I see. How are you going to get that piped into a window? Jun 26 21:11:57 timboy: congrats Jun 26 21:11:58 not sure just yet.. Jun 26 21:11:59 timboy, hows the documentation ? Jun 26 21:12:09 i'll have to poke around a bit Jun 26 21:12:10 it probably wouldn't be completely automated, since that would be ripe for abuse Jun 26 21:12:20 plan on cracking it open this weekend... just got my pre Jun 26 21:12:32 reddozen: seems like a waste. We've already build a command line that pipes the outout to a text area Jun 26 21:12:38 bpadalino|work: so how do you find the offsets for the ramdisk, etc? I STFW to no avail Jun 26 21:13:07 destinal, let me do a hexdump -C on the original file and check out the offsets .. Jun 26 21:13:14 there is a gzip or tar header somewhere Jun 26 21:13:18 and you basically look for that Jun 26 21:13:37 anybody help plz Jun 26 21:13:57 my idea was to be able to launch other non webOS programs with a linux call from the web application page Jun 26 21:14:26 reddozen, PreGame wrote a command execution service that would be mojo callable .. Jun 26 21:14:34 ahh ok Jun 26 21:14:41 fair enough Jun 26 21:14:49 but there's always more than 1 way to skin a cat Jun 26 21:14:50 also known as, fear. :) Jun 26 21:14:50 go nuts Jun 26 21:15:13 i'll look into it, but no need to redo something that's done Jun 26 21:15:28 Is there any guru to help me to access my pre's wifi on my laptop? Jun 26 21:15:32 how does the pre react to leaving webos active and tring to call something like the nintendo emulator Jun 26 21:16:34 Saiks: you want to use your pre for its wifi interface? why not just use wifi on your laptop? Jun 26 21:17:01 destinal, 0x1f8b is the magic for gzip .. Jun 26 21:17:12 if you do a hexdump around where the kernel starts .. Jun 26 21:17:26 so was looking for some help with trying to connect to my pre that won't boot Jun 26 21:17:27 there is a string "kernel" Jun 26 21:17:31 then you see the gzip Jun 26 21:18:02 twolaver, hold the volume-up button and plug the USB in .. a USB image should show up on the screen, and you can use web doctor to restore Jun 26 21:18:31 OMG!!!! THANK YOU Jun 26 21:19:00 let me know if that works for you Jun 26 21:19:02 I have been trying for hours to get something to work!!! Jun 26 21:19:17 and yes, that appears to have worked Jun 26 21:19:21 ah cool Jun 26 21:19:24 enjoy Jun 26 21:19:37 if u were close i'd buy u a case of beer haha Jun 26 21:19:41 ha Jun 26 21:19:46 where are you? Jun 26 21:19:47 whats up everyonE? Jun 26 21:19:49 denver Jun 26 21:19:51 i'll take it if i'm close Jun 26 21:19:53 damn Jun 26 21:19:55 another satisfied custmer :D Jun 26 21:20:18 not here to ask about the whole 14% thing...got that figured out haha Jun 26 21:20:29 lol Jun 26 21:20:35 what 14% thing? Jun 26 21:20:38 anyone know where to enter data/mms settings on the pre? Jun 26 21:20:51 i think if you go into the phone Jun 26 21:20:59 then type ##data# Jun 26 21:21:01 well the last two days I have been in here asking if anyone knew how to fix the problem of the web doctor getting stuck at 14% Jun 26 21:21:03 fixed that Jun 26 21:21:17 it will bring up a new screen, but u have to have the specific msl code for your phone Jun 26 21:21:20 how did you fix it cpuguy ? Jun 26 21:21:39 i was extracting the original jar file incorrectly Jun 26 21:21:46 and i have the msl for my phone :-) Jun 26 21:21:47 ah Jun 26 21:21:53 congrats Jun 26 21:22:21 what was wrong, in case someone else asks Jun 26 21:22:40 he said he wasn't extracting the original jar correctly Jun 26 21:22:53 hey, has anyone had problems getting TuSSH installed in Classic? i put the .prc in the right location, it got copied into /var/lib/palmos/slot0/PALM/Launcher/, but still doesn't show up in the ui Jun 26 21:22:59 right, but how did he extract a file wrong Jun 26 21:23:04 me can calculate msl codes... Jun 26 21:23:09 we* Jun 26 21:23:19 I was using windows xp to extract the har file Jun 26 21:23:22 *jar Jun 26 21:23:34 oh, we can calculate the msl codes ? Jun 26 21:23:44 i didn't know that Jun 26 21:23:54 yep, sortta a keygen for them Jun 26 21:24:06 check out mobile-files.com... I have the gen if you can't find it Jun 26 21:24:13 so yeah thats where u can get in to change the mms settings for ur pre Jun 26 21:24:13 :D Jun 26 21:24:16 among other things Jun 26 21:25:17 ##data# is? Jun 26 21:25:30 spell it out on the phone Jun 26 21:25:37 i know Jun 26 21:25:50 cant change mmsc url Jun 26 21:26:19 can click on it... Jun 26 21:26:22 ohi see .. you click it and it doesn't come up Jun 26 21:26:23 heh Jun 26 21:26:24 but it doesnt allow me to change Jun 26 21:26:31 probably a database edit then Jun 26 21:26:37 carrier settings somewhere Jun 26 21:27:01 any idea where? Jun 26 21:27:13 somewhere in /var in a .db or .db3 file Jun 26 21:27:27 sql lite or cleartext dbs? Jun 26 21:27:40 sqlite3 Jun 26 21:28:46 ok Jun 26 21:28:52 you know that for sure? or just stipulating? Jun 26 21:29:38 um yeah i didn't know u couldn't change it, i was messing around w/ that that other day w/ the cpu scaling boot script killed my evdo Jun 26 21:29:47 and thought it was something else, but i never got into that stuff Jun 26 21:30:15 sorry my bad Jun 26 21:30:42 its cool Jun 26 21:30:49 bpadalino|work, does the pre's application development support full HTML? or is it known yet? Jun 26 21:30:56 html5 Jun 26 21:31:03 cool Jun 26 21:31:21 yes, it's webkit under neath .. Jun 26 21:31:28 and the javascript processing is done using v8 Jun 26 21:31:39 Saiks & bsiegel-work: bsiegel-work says 'the line about "securing the network" is unnecessary.' - Near the bottom of the http://predev.wikidot.com/next-steps-after-rooting page, there is a link to http://predev.wikidot.com/dropbear-install and on that page (in step 3), the network is automatically protected. Is this what you meant? Jun 26 21:31:49 So has anyone created an app that can play a sound in the background? I can play systems sounds with the system sound service and open the music player with the application manager but would like to figure out how to play a sound in my app that isn't one of the system sounds.? Jun 26 21:31:59 well, i'm going home to "play"... this should be fun... Jun 26 21:32:34 I should also note that when I ssh to my Pre, I need to have the USB cable plugged in (and if I remove it, I loose the ssh session) Jun 26 21:32:59 I think this is what Saiks might be running into also. Jun 26 21:33:28 ssh will be lost if you unplug the phone and it goes into deep sleep mode Jun 26 21:33:32 because it turns off the wifi Jun 26 21:34:02 hay guys Jun 26 21:34:07 i made a simple countdown timer app Jun 26 21:34:07 so that's why the comment was made about running pandora or somethig Jun 26 21:34:09 I can go pass where i download the files using wget http:... i kept having error 404 Jun 26 21:34:09 got it Jun 26 21:34:13 http://webonastick.com/webos/timer/ Jun 26 21:34:32 I meant i can't go pass that Jun 26 21:34:51 dsevil, awesome Jun 26 21:34:56 most likely an error in the url you typed int Saiks Jun 26 21:35:13 that happened to me ALL the time haha, so i just started copy and paste Jun 26 21:35:14 i'd love some feedback. preferably via email because i idle in this cahnnel most of the time. Jun 26 21:36:20 I'll proxy for rwhitby and ask if this is something you're willing to open source with an MIT license? Jun 26 21:36:35 mit-style licensed Jun 26 21:37:14 He would want you to consider hosting on gitorious (sp?) Jun 26 21:37:38 Let me look at your web page and see if I can install and test for you. Jun 26 21:39:25 I have my own svn repos. Jun 26 21:39:53 yay svn! :) Jun 26 21:39:56 dsevil: just sent several suggestions Jun 26 21:40:01 does it set off an alarm when the count down ends? Jun 26 21:40:02 nice app Jun 26 21:40:09 SirWill: it actually does! Jun 26 21:40:18 It's surprising so many core apps don't support rotation... it's so easy to include it.... Jun 26 21:40:33 I guess I'll try installing it. Jun 26 21:40:50 zule: svn is Good Enough. Jun 26 21:40:56 i prefer it Jun 26 21:41:04 zule: over, say, cvs or git? Jun 26 21:41:06 I run svn for all my projects as well Jun 26 21:41:08 yea Jun 26 21:41:14 but then again it's what I learned Jun 26 21:41:19 thus I like it Jun 26 21:41:20 i need to learn git one of these days. Jun 26 21:41:26 git is kind of neat with the whole distributed aspect Jun 26 21:41:34 yeah. Jun 26 21:41:42 I like svn and I'm reading about Git Jun 26 21:41:46 thanks for your help guys...i gotta run, trip to the airport has my name written all over it Jun 26 21:41:46 using the git bundle for textmate made my life amazingly easy with git Jun 26 21:42:06 bromius: i greylist so it'll take a while before i receive the email, but thanks. Jun 26 21:42:21 git is really incredible once you get used to it... i would never go back to svn or anything centralized. Jun 26 21:42:46 dsevil: did the same when I ran our email server, so no problem. Just several suggestions that would make the timer userful for a CrossFit gym (www.crossfit.com) Jun 26 21:42:58 countdown started Jun 26 21:44:18 do do dooo dooo Jun 26 21:44:24 do do doo doo doooo Jun 26 21:45:15 dsevil It's the standard noti sound. Would be interesting to see options for that. ;) But yeah, cool app. first homebrew I installed.... I am rooted but first .ipk I should say Jun 26 21:46:10 right. right now it's the absolute simplest possible working app Jun 26 21:47:39 oh, it's a great first step that is for sure.... dont' get me wrong at all Jun 26 21:48:14 i tripled check the url... but still same problem Jun 26 21:49:40 Can people please email themselves this link http://carrytheone.org/webOS/mynotification/webosinternals.kaerey.mynotification.0-0-2.ipk and test it for me. Jun 26 21:53:36 Kaerey: Seems to work just fine Jun 26 21:53:48 awesome thanks Jun 26 21:55:23 installed fine. Need to find appropriate sounds for it first Jun 26 21:55:36 before I dare change them... don't want an mp3 that goes on for 3 minutes Jun 26 21:55:40 ok updated the precentral post. time to get some real work done. Jun 26 21:55:47 No you don't! Jun 26 21:56:01 I linked my two favorite sounds on the first post Jun 26 21:56:15 i want my treo sounds in the pre Jun 26 21:56:35 OH yeah I should get my 800w and 650 back out and get those sounds out Jun 26 21:56:47 didn't see the reset option until I saw your post ;) Jun 26 21:57:00 The 300/650 ringtone was iconic for palm freaks Jun 26 21:57:04 I will be playing with it when I get home. Only so much I can do from work. Jun 26 21:57:12 600 too Jun 26 21:57:27 man... i'd love treo soudns on the pre as well Jun 26 21:57:35 i'd also love a monophonic nokia tune ;) Jun 26 21:57:38 anyone throw mp3 ringtones on the pre yet? Jun 26 21:57:43 Yeah Jun 26 21:57:51 my wife uses "red neck woman" Jun 26 21:57:53 hookup to usb and just copy them in Jun 26 22:00:09 tris, i had tussh working. the app thing in palmOS shows only 'main' by default, did you press home repeatedly to get to the unclassified page? Jun 26 22:00:30 yeah, could've sworn I went through all paegs Jun 26 22:00:32 i'll try again Jun 26 22:00:36 cool, where to copy them to? Jun 26 22:00:38 on the pre Jun 26 22:00:46 I also have a sort of solution for IRCing on the pre without classic Jun 26 22:00:56 involves a website with an iframe and qwebIRC Jun 26 22:01:10 cpuguy06: there should be a "ringtones" directory on the usb drive Jun 26 22:01:36 did classic expire on you yet? Jun 26 22:01:43 for me yeah Jun 26 22:01:47 * Rubin too Jun 26 22:01:54 only reason I would get it is for the calculator Jun 26 22:02:04 LOVEd the conversions on it Jun 26 22:02:07 i decided i cant stand the UI enough to use it even for useful apps Jun 26 22:02:08 cal Jun 26 22:03:21 I think I'm going to add a field for changing the wallpaper in the next version of my app. Jun 26 22:03:38 ajaxterm works in the pre, except that when you type it thinks your trying to search. need to focus an input box and it'll be golden Jun 26 22:03:54 damn, even re-installing classic doesn't reset the eval Jun 26 22:05:16 Robi- the eval is stored in a database. Jun 26 22:05:46 Rubin, you have ajaxterm running as a MOJO APP!????!!! Jun 26 22:05:49 ??? Jun 26 22:05:51 no Jun 26 22:05:54 oh Jun 26 22:05:55 ya obviously.. ;-/ Jun 26 22:05:56 you just https:// to it Jun 26 22:05:56 darn Jun 26 22:06:04 oh Jun 26 22:06:06 naaaa Jun 26 22:06:07 gotta find the value and keep resetting it ;] Jun 26 22:06:10 though honestly, its not that far from possible Jun 26 22:06:11 want it to be in launcher. Jun 26 22:06:23 it ought to be totally do-able Jun 26 22:06:25 you can add urls to launcher Jun 26 22:06:34 hmmmmm Jun 26 22:06:36 true Jun 26 22:06:53 good point Jun 26 22:08:00 someone needs to port this to mojo http://www.motionnet.com/calculator/ Jun 26 22:08:40 anyone use mac to novaterm into their pre? Jun 26 22:10:07 i think i'm'a write an rpn calculator for the pre someday Jun 26 22:10:57 HP will, they're planning to sell their apps on the iphone and other mobile devices and PCs Jun 26 22:11:44 yeah, I saw that HP was selling for the iPhone and what not.... However it was spendy from what I read. Jun 26 22:12:05 yep not something most of us would buy Jun 26 22:13:15 I'm sure we will see a good decent one soon. Jun 26 22:13:53 I'd like to find a way to take a web site url, crawl all sub links, bundle it up and run it directly from the pre. (for use when no coverage) Jun 26 22:42:01 Hmmm SirWill left, but there's a program called "Webcow" that crawls links like that. Jun 26 22:44:49 wtf Jun 26 22:44:50 sudo luna-send -n 1 palm:// com.palm.applicationManager/rescan {} Jun 26 22:44:50 (process:6449): LunaService-CRITICAL **: Error in callmap.c:284 Jun 26 22:44:50 (process:6449): LunaService-CRITICAL **: _UriParse: Not a valid uri palm:// Jun 26 22:44:53 ** (process:6449): CRITICAL **: main: assertion `retVal' failed Jun 26 22:45:32 it's a space Jun 26 22:45:40 you need to remove space between palm:// and com Jun 26 22:45:48 i'm blind Jun 26 22:46:14 I recognized that so fast because I did it myself, I think I copied it from the wiki somewhere Jun 26 22:46:15 my phone app is still broken, hm Jun 26 22:46:37 ya fixing that now, it was the first searhc result Jun 26 22:47:18 search screwed it up aparently Jun 26 22:47:49 its probabyl to prevent url fishing from search Jun 26 22:47:57 feature! Jun 26 22:49:35 damn those broadcast messages Jun 26 22:49:38 bclancy: ping Jun 26 22:50:00 hello Jun 26 22:53:50 Robi-: your not the only one lol i didn't even see the space Jun 26 22:54:03 ;] Jun 26 22:54:07 i'll have to kill luna Jun 26 22:54:33 /usr/bin/luna-prefs-service Jun 26 22:56:31 wtf else can i do Jun 26 22:56:39 nothing seems to fix the phone app Jun 26 22:57:15 anybody know if there's a way to change the default apps that are linked on the screen when nothing is open. The default appears to be, from left to right, phone, contacts, email, calendar, and a button for everything else Jun 26 22:57:41 I use messaging and web far more than the calendar or the email, and would like, if it's possible, to switch them out Jun 26 22:57:42 bahua: press and hold them till they get a halo, then drag them away Jun 26 22:57:50 !! Jun 26 22:57:53 excellent Jun 26 22:57:59 * bahua is an idiot Jun 26 22:58:01 the only one i havent been able to move was the launcher Jun 26 22:58:10 perhaps there is a hack to make is moveable Jun 26 22:58:13 ? Jun 26 22:58:35 i think im gonna look at it when i get back Jun 26 22:58:37 perhaps Jun 26 22:58:54 i made some awesome breakthroughs in universal search usability Jun 26 22:59:37 blau-mikedg: cool, online somewhere yet? Jun 26 22:59:49 not yet Jun 26 22:59:55 still tweaking Jun 26 23:01:04 eugh Jun 26 23:01:12 sorry, wrong window Jun 26 23:01:31 pkill -1 LunaSysMgr Jun 26 23:02:59 i fear the 1.0.3 update screwed my phone app Jun 26 23:03:07 all i did was change the background Jun 26 23:03:09 i thnik Jun 26 23:03:22 how about having more than five icons on that screen? Jun 26 23:03:26 oh, that sucks, man Jun 26 23:03:42 4 Jun 26 23:03:47 the 1 is mandatory Jun 26 23:03:53 sure Jun 26 23:04:21 you know what I mean. I don't mind having one of the icons devoted to "everything else" Jun 26 23:04:37 but this thing obviously has the graphical capability to display more than the four it does Jun 26 23:05:34 bahua: only if you make the icons smaller Jun 26 23:06:31 well, it scales them up when you drag them. it would follow that it's capable of scaling them down too Jun 26 23:06:35 but apparently not Jun 26 23:06:47 anyway, i brb Jun 26 23:06:48 if that part of the UI is html/css like a lot of the rest of it, it wouldn't be a difficult change to get them different sizes...but I have no idea how that part of the UI is rendered Jun 26 23:07:58 and possibly it's a var somewhere we can bump up Jun 26 23:08:54 1.0.3 replaced all images Jun 26 23:08:56 i think Jun 26 23:08:59 i had a ton changed Jun 26 23:09:02 and they all got blasted Jun 26 23:09:15 well mine's still black for the phone app Jun 26 23:09:24 and that's all i get when i launch it Jun 26 23:09:48 so i cant dial numbers.. i can get incoming calls but that's it Jun 26 23:10:09 you can't dial at all? not even with the keys? Jun 26 23:10:33 no Jun 26 23:10:50 sounds like you broke the js file Jun 26 23:11:33 I hosed my Photos app while playing with it...would just show a white screen...just replaced it with a backup from the webosdoctor archive :P Jun 26 23:11:34 i can dial from the contacts Jun 26 23:12:00 that's the thing tho, i didn't touch the phone app .js other than replace the images Jun 26 23:13:31 did you change size? Jun 26 23:15:12 bclancy: can we go through that test one more time here in channel? Jun 26 23:15:23 sure Jun 26 23:15:56 here i will run you through it Jun 26 23:16:05 bclancy: follow PreGame please Jun 26 23:16:07 are you in root? Jun 26 23:16:13 PreGame: are we sure he didn't get a startup script somehow? Jun 26 23:16:39 I'm in my user, running the command under sudo Jun 26 23:16:48 hrm Jun 26 23:16:52 ok do sudo reboot Jun 26 23:17:15 no change in size, in fact i downloaded the working theme from the wiki Jun 26 23:17:22 cphelps: there was no pasting of a startup script in the channel, and I got an ls of /etc/event.d Jun 26 23:17:45 bclancy84@castle:~$ date Jun 26 23:17:47 Fri Jun 26 19:17:06 EDT 2009 Jun 26 23:17:49 bclancy84@castle:~$ uptime Jun 26 23:17:50 19:17:08 up 17 min, 2 users, load average: 0.56, 0.65, 0.70 Jun 26 23:17:52 bclancy84@castle:~$ sudo luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.shell/runCmd '{"cmd":"ls"}' Jun 26 23:17:54 Password: Jun 26 23:17:55 Sorry, try again. Jun 26 23:17:57 Password: Jun 26 23:17:58 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":"Apps\nCarrierNetworkSettings.db3\nattachments\nbrowser\ndbdata\ndownloa Jun 26 23:18:00 tory.db\nemails\nextractfs\nim-avatars\nmediadb.db3\npalm-carriernetworksettings-info\nperfdata.txt\nslidercount\ntemp_html_emai Jun 26 23:18:02 } Jun 26 23:18:03 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 23:18:05 bout to reboot Jun 26 23:18:22 bclancy: do the uptime command again after reboot Jun 26 23:18:39 dang my load is 5 Jun 26 23:19:13 bclancy84@castle:~$ sudo reboot Jun 26 23:19:16 sudo: reboot: command not found Jun 26 23:19:17 bclancy84@castle:~$ sudo /bin/sh Jun 26 23:19:19 root@castle:/var/home/bclancy84# reboot Jun 26 23:19:21 /bin/sh: reboot: not found Jun 26 23:19:22 root@castle:/var/home/bclancy84# su - Jun 26 23:19:23 root@castle:/var/home/root# reboot Jun 26 23:19:25 Broadcast message from bclancy84@castle Jun 26 23:19:27 (/dev/pts/0) at 19:18 ... Jun 26 23:19:28 The system is going down for reboot NOW! Jun 26 23:19:30 root@castle:/var/home/root# Jun 26 23:20:00 i think the load is high buz i'm ssh'd in from evdo and powerd keeps waking up Jun 26 23:20:43 1133 root 20 0 85292 36m 4976 S 8.4 15.3 16:17.21 java 7824 root 18 -2 149m 61m 13m S 3.6 25.7 1:37.69 LunaSysMgr 1021 root 20 0 3076 1588 656 S 3.2 0.6 1:54.52 dbus-daemon Jun 26 23:20:55 java stuck at 9%cpu ? Jun 26 23:21:01 that can't be right Jun 26 23:21:07 someone verify their top plz Jun 26 23:21:14 coming back up now, pingable, no gui yet Jun 26 23:23:14 $ ssh -p 222 bclancy84@192.168.1.71 Jun 26 23:23:15 bclancy84@192.168.1.71's password: Jun 26 23:23:17 bclancy84@castle:~$ date Jun 26 23:23:18 Fri Jun 26 19:22:20 EDT 2009 Jun 26 23:23:20 bclancy84@castle:~$ uptime Jun 26 23:23:21 19:22:22 up 2 min, 2 users, load average: 5.85, 2.62, 0.99 Jun 26 23:23:23 bclancy84@castle:~$ sudo luna-send -n 1 palm://org.webosinternals.shell/runCmd '{"cmd":"ls"}' Jun 26 23:23:24 ** Message: serviceResponse Handling: 2, {"returnValue":"Apps\nCarrierNetworkSettings.db3\nattachments\nbrowser\ndbdata\ndownloa Jun 26 23:23:26 tory.db\nemails\nextractfs\nim-avatars\nmediadb.db3\npalm-carriernetworksettings-info\nperfdata.txt\nslidercount\ntemp_html_emai Jun 26 23:23:27 } Jun 26 23:23:29 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 23:23:31 DAMNIT Jun 26 23:23:43 reboot and wait for directions Jun 26 23:23:44 So PreGame, what does that mean? Jun 26 23:24:10 type sudo reboot again Jun 26 23:24:13 when it comes up DO NOTHING Jun 26 23:24:22 there is more on the ls than is showing - I think the line lenght here might be cutting part of it up Jun 26 23:24:50 bclancy Jun 26 23:24:56 luna send STARTS THE SERVICE Jun 26 23:25:03 ^^^ Jun 26 23:25:03 what we want to do is -not- do a luna send. Jun 26 23:25:07 don't type that. Jun 26 23:25:10 ok? Jun 26 23:25:14 please Jun 26 23:25:23 OK, I'll do the reboot and wit, sorry Jun 26 23:25:26 sup again everyone Jun 26 23:26:16 so would you like me to do a ps afterwards? Jun 26 23:26:19 we/re in the last throws of debugging testing the commandline app Jun 26 23:26:51 bclancy being the designated victom Jun 26 23:26:57 does anyone have any of the images that were in the wiki for universal search add-ons? they've disappeared. i need a deviant art one of anyone has it Jun 26 23:27:21 anyone seens bpadalino recently? Jun 26 23:27:25 NP; I have a tough skin with devs, I'm used to it, sorry I didn't understand what you wanted Jun 26 23:27:32 about 30-45 minutes ago Jun 26 23:27:51 it's on its way back, getting pings Jun 26 23:28:05 can anyone tell me how to register my irc nickname and auto-identify? Jun 26 23:28:16 pipe it to less Jun 26 23:28:43 the gui s back Jun 26 23:28:56 hi Jun 26 23:29:25 I'm back at my user prompt, I can "sudo su -" if you want Jun 26 23:29:27 the account got suspended holding the images, probably due to too much bandwidth Jun 26 23:29:34 ready for next instructions Jun 26 23:29:37 hey Jun 26 23:29:44 Rick__: the service install thru root enabled mode only? Jun 26 23:29:55 load average: 24.86, 9.30, 6.14 Jun 26 23:30:06 you have to do /NickServ register Jun 26 23:30:22 bah fugu sucks Jun 26 23:30:25 load of 30 wow Jun 26 23:30:30 any good visual scp for osx? Jun 26 23:30:31 must be powerd Jun 26 23:30:33 bclancy Jun 26 23:30:42 PreGame, is there something in ps I sluld be looking for Jun 26 23:30:45 do you have commander installed? Jun 26 23:30:45 go ahea Jun 26 23:30:46 blau-mikedg: fetch? Jun 26 23:30:54 I did Jun 26 23:31:00 er superfetch? Jun 26 23:31:01 did but don't? Jun 26 23:31:11 free :/ Jun 26 23:31:13 t know how to install it without an ipkg, but I have the tarball Jun 26 23:31:16 ill try fetch tho Jun 26 23:31:55 thanks Rick_ Jun 26 23:32:14 ok do ps -ef Jun 26 23:32:20 is there a luna-helper? Jun 26 23:32:29 thanks Robi- Jun 26 23:32:49 bclancy84@castle:~$ ps -efwwww | grep luna Jun 26 23:32:51 root 1036 1 0 19:26 ? 00:00:00 /usr/bin/luna-prefs-service Jun 26 23:32:52 root 1138 1 6 19:26 ? 00:00:23 /usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java -Xexact -m 10M -Djava.library.path=/usr/lib/jvm Jun 26 23:32:54 java-1.5-palm/bin:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/bin:/usr/lib -Dvm.boot.library.path=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/bin -bootclassp Jun 26 23:32:55 th /usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/lib/rt.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/luni.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/n Jun 26 23:32:57 o.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/nio_char.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/security.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1 Jun 26 23:32:59 5-palm/jre/lib/boot/archive.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/logging.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/text.ja Jun 26 23:33:01 :/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/icu4j_3.8/icu4j-3_8.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/icu4j_3.8/icu4j-charsets-3 Jun 26 23:33:03 8.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/sql.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/regex.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/ Jun 26 23:33:04 re/lib/boot/math.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/auth.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/crypto.jar:/usr/lib/j Jun 26 23:33:07 m/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/x-net.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/boot/annotation.jar:/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/ex Jun 26 23:33:07 np Jun 26 23:33:10 /bcprov.jar -Djava.home=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre -Djava.security.properties=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/jre/lib/security/java. Jun 26 23:33:13 ecurity -Xmx10M -classpath /usr/lib/luna/java/Async.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/CarrierNetworkSettings.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/Customizat Jun 26 23:33:16 on.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/DefaultDatabaseBuilder.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/Fnmbl-ClientApi.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/Fnmbl-ClientFramewor Jun 26 23:33:19 .jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/InterfaceRegistry.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/MediaEvents.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/Photos.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/U Jun 26 23:33:22 ils.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/accounts.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/accountservices.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/activerecord.jar:/usr/lib/luna/ja Jun 26 23:33:25 a/backup.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/calendar.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/contacts.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/dataimport.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/d Jun 26 23:33:28 tamigration.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/deviceprofile.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/devicewipe.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/findapps.jar:/usr/lib/lun Jun 26 23:33:31 /java/gdata.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/jWAP.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/joda-time-1.5.2.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/json.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/k Jun 26 23:33:34 oap2-j2se-full-2.1.1.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/libmatthew-java-0.7.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/location.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/lunaservice. Jun 26 23:33:37 ar:/usr/lib/luna/java/mail.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/messaging.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/messagingrouter.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/minidbus- Jun 26 23:33:40 ava-2.4.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/notes.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/org.webosinternals.services.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/packageinfo.jar:/usr Jun 26 23:33:43 lib/luna/java/palmipc.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/pim.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/pimsync.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/rfc2445.jar:/usr/lib/luna/ja Jun 26 23:33:46 a/scheduler.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/serviceboot.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/serviceframework.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/sqlitejdbc-v053.jar:/ Jun 26 23:33:49 sr/lib/luna/java/superlog.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/tasks.jar:/usr/lib/luna/java/telephony.jar -DtimeZoneId=EDT -Djava.util.logging.co Jun 26 23:33:51 anyone know how to check which prl is on the pre? Jun 26 23:33:52 fig.file=/etc/logging.properties -verbose:gc -Xwebconsole -Xoomexit -Xoomreport=/var/javaoom/oom.1138.txt com.palm.serviceboot.Serv Jun 26 23:33:55 ceBoot start Jun 26 23:33:57 root 1157 1 0 19:26 ? 00:00:00 /usr/bin/extractfs -f /var/luna/data/extractfs Jun 26 23:33:59 1002 1681 1653 0 19:31 pts/0 00:00:00 grep luna Jun 26 23:34:01 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 23:34:03 No, see the following Jun 26 23:34:05 bclancy84@castle:~$ ps -efwwww | grep -i luna | grep -i helper Jun 26 23:34:07 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 23:34:28 sorry Jun 26 23:34:29 back Jun 26 23:34:40 bclancy: thanks - we've determined what's happening now Jun 26 23:34:43 Pre/Rick, no luna helper after reboot Jun 26 23:34:46 ok, you have the tar file for commander. Jun 26 23:34:57 OK, I can look in init scriots if you want more Jun 26 23:35:00 after a reboot, luna-send will work, but commander directly after a reboot without doing a luna-send first will not work Jun 26 23:35:02 bclancy: type dbus-util --list Jun 26 23:35:13 right - that's the one I forgot Jun 26 23:35:26 I have a tar frob gitorious that I extracted, it has the commander as part of it. Jun 26 23:35:28 look for org.webosinternals.shell Jun 26 23:35:48 rwhitby, bclancy -- unless we get a restart script in there. :-) Jun 26 23:36:00 i already made an upstart script Jun 26 23:36:01 bclancy84@castle:~$ dbus-util --list Jun 26 23:36:03 Could not obtain the public bus: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a repl Jun 26 23:36:05 message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.bclancy84@cast Jun 26 23:36:06 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 23:36:08 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 23:36:12 ??? Jun 26 23:36:14 oh Jun 26 23:36:19 do sudo dbus-util --list Jun 26 23:36:24 sudo dbus-util --list Jun 26 23:36:34 gmta Jun 26 23:36:36 oes upstart call the linux init scripts? Jun 26 23:36:39 does Jun 26 23:36:45 event.d Jun 26 23:37:26 here it comes: Jun 26 23:37:35 bclancy84@castle:~$ sudo dbus-util --list Jun 26 23:37:37 Password: Jun 26 23:37:39 =========================================== Jun 26 23:37:40 Public bus: Jun 26 23:37:42 :1.0 (busname=com.palm.preferences pid=1036 procname=/usr/bin/luna-prefs-service) Jun 26 23:37:43 :1.1 (busname=com.palm.storage pid=1060 procname=/usr/sbin/storaged) Jun 26 23:37:45 OH GOD Jun 26 23:37:45 :1.10 (busname=com.palm.telephony pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:37:47 STOP Jun 26 23:37:47 :1.11 (busname=com.palm.messagingrouter pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:37:48 :1.12 (busname=com.palm.accounts pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:37:50 :1.13 (busname=com.palm.vmstatus pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:37:52 :1.14 (busname=com.palm.luna pid=1175 procname=/usr/bin/LunaSysMgr) Jun 26 23:37:53 bclancy, seriously Jun 26 23:37:53 :1.15 (busname=com.palm.messaging pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:37:55 :1.16 (busname=com.palm.data.carriernetworksettings pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:37:57 :1.17 (busname=com.palm.mail pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:37:58 :1.18 (busname=com.palm.contacts pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:38:00 :1.19 (busname=com.palm.deviceprofile pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:38:00 don't you know that pasting all this shit in the chan is bad for you? Jun 26 23:38:01 :1.2 (busname=com.palm.audio pid=1088 procname=/usr/sbin/audiod) Jun 26 23:38:03 :1.20 (busname=com.palm.calendar pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:38:04 :1.21 (busname=com.palm.pimsync pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:38:06 :1.22 (busname=com.palm.backup pid=1138 procname=/usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5-palm/bin/java) Jun 26 23:38:16 stop Jun 26 23:38:20 its going to be LONG Jun 26 23:38:35 bclancy: webos.pastebin.com for long things thanks. Jun 26 23:38:43 :1.13 (busname=com.palm.hidavrcp pid=1053 procname=/usr/bin/hidd) Jun 26 23:38:45 :1.14 (busname=com.palm.audio pid=1088 procname=/usr/sbin/audiod) Jun 26 23:38:46 causes testicular cancer Jun 26 23:39:00 ahaha Technobabble, thats a nice note to moderate on Jun 26 23:39:37 bclancy: you may need to quit IRC and log back in Jun 26 23:39:43 bclancy: i will unban you in a min when the spam is done Jun 26 23:39:53 wow Jun 26 23:40:04 guys, let me help you with that Jun 26 23:40:49 go to http://etherpad.com/webos-internals and see live text from each user Jun 26 23:41:19 Robi-: we specifically wanted this debugging to happen in channel, but I forgot to advise bclancy how to pastebin Jun 26 23:42:01 so I'll take the blame for this one. Jun 26 23:42:06 np, etherpad is a great sharing tool Jun 26 23:42:18 notes/coding/etc Jun 26 23:42:22 rwhitby, sorry to hear about your nuts. Jun 26 23:42:54 ok Jun 26 23:43:23 sorry about that: Jun 26 23:44:30 bclancy - webos.pastbin.com Jun 26 23:44:32 I'm now on http://webos.pastebin.com/ Jun 26 23:44:40 good-oh Jun 26 23:44:44 should I do a temp or perm post? Jun 26 23:44:51 temp is fine Jun 26 23:46:11 so no etherpad eh? Jun 26 23:46:32 sent, (I just did the command again to capture it) Jun 26 23:46:46 now, paste back the url Jun 26 23:46:54 ok Jun 26 23:47:16 http://webos.pastebin.com/d7e6dea1a Jun 26 23:48:04 yep, that's long Jun 26 23:48:12 and looky!! no webosinternals. Jun 26 23:48:49 bclancy84@castle:~$ sudo dbus-util --list | grep -i webos Jun 26 23:48:52 bclancy84@castle:~$ Jun 26 23:49:41 sudo let me leave work early Jun 26 23:49:52 access denied Jun 26 23:49:57 Damn. Jun 26 23:50:02 dbus is not mentioned in the oreilly book Jun 26 23:50:13 leaving work soon Jun 26 23:50:31 The clock keeps going slower here. Jun 26 23:51:09 the oreilly book doesn't mention a lot of things Jun 26 23:51:52 the o'reilly book does not menution that native services are used for a lot of things.... Jun 26 23:52:12 neither does the entry-level sdk. Jun 26 23:52:18 we're several layers beyond that now. Jun 26 23:52:34 I just hopingly did a search - thx Jun 26 23:52:55 I suppose I can search these logs to learn more? Jun 26 23:53:32 The logs are an excellent reference... it's worth the time to read/skim through them.. searching them for things is good too Jun 26 23:53:34 yeah, and you could read the code for ShinAli's hello service and for PreGame's cmdRun service and you would learn a lot Jun 26 23:55:54 I'm pretty new with js, is it obvious where to start the program flow, - does the oreilly book help describe such higher level concepts? or should I just grep and learn? Jun 26 23:56:11 you should be familiar wth css and js before reading the oreilly webos book Jun 26 23:56:57 yek, but OK (another bullet for me to bite) - looks like I'll be a tester here for a good while then :-) Jun 26 23:57:40 are there parts I can skip when learning js - and what's a good book to start with Jun 26 23:57:57 w3schools has some JS stuff, it's free Jun 26 23:58:05 not sure if any of the guys recommend it though Jun 26 23:58:42 I have a safari.oreliiy.com subscription Jun 26 23:59:02 I was wondering if there are parts of normal js learning that don't apply Jun 26 23:59:19 I understand the concept of css but never studied it in any detail Jun 26 23:59:21 over Jun 27 00:00:07 JS by itself has syntax like many other languages... if you program elsewhere, syntax won't be an issue. It's the Palm-specific structure/library/format/etc. stuff that you'll have to learn. And DOM stuff for interacting with the HTML and CSS Jun 27 00:01:05 syntax looks a lot like java, its just how and whe its called that I sort of find confusing (when just looking at code and web pages) Jun 27 00:01:46 I did a bit with dom4j is my last gig, so I have a little start there (conceptually) Jun 27 00:02:14 I'll try and be quiet now ... Jun 27 00:02:33 Yeah...use as many resources as you need, but there are no grand surprises in Javascript... if you think something looks similar to something else you now, you're probably right. Javascript isn't an oddball language..it's no Python or Perl heh Jun 27 00:03:37 sup Jun 27 00:03:58 I like Perl (and I'm warming up to Python, but hate not having curly braces) Jun 27 00:04:05 perl is my friend =p Jun 27 00:04:13 i write everything in perl Jun 27 00:04:19 I use plain old shell, awk and sed, a lot Jun 27 00:04:52 so maybe learning the upstart stuff might be more helpful here immediately Jun 27 00:07:02 PreGame/Rick_/rwhitby, why can't we just make the call I did on the command line in the network level init scipts? Jun 27 00:08:17 bclancy: we're doing that right now Jun 27 00:08:43 OK. I'll read about upstart in the meantime ... ETA? Jun 27 00:09:16 minutes Jun 27 00:09:23 look for a 0.2 version very soon. PreGame wrote the scripts and I'm updating the ipkg Jun 27 00:11:15 anything on the confirmation dialog to ensure malicious javascript doesn't own our phones? Jun 27 00:11:47 wait, is there a new version? if so how does it work? Jun 27 00:11:52 Kaerey: ping Jun 27 00:11:58 huh? Jun 27 00:12:00 tharris: not yet Jun 27 00:12:09 what are u updating Jun 27 00:12:12 Kaerey: your commit in git didn't have your name and email set in the client Jun 27 00:12:15 in the commander' Jun 27 00:12:22 nothing in the commander. Jun 27 00:12:24 I think I fixed that problem Jun 27 00:12:33 upstart and postinst in the service Jun 27 00:12:36 and I'll be updating to the new version tonight Jun 27 00:12:45 Kaerey: thx Jun 27 00:12:46 does postinst work in ipk? Jun 27 00:12:53 palms Jun 27 00:12:54 hey guys! Jun 27 00:12:56 just bought my pre Jun 27 00:12:57 tharris: it does in ipkg-opt Jun 27 00:13:01 k Jun 27 00:13:02 dunno about palm's. Jun 27 00:13:18 don't want to use palm's anyway, otherwise you mess with their ipkg database Jun 27 00:13:48 MTW: congrats. Jun 27 00:13:53 thanks Jun 27 00:13:58 iphone 3g died, killed my att line Jun 27 00:14:05 went into the nearest sprint store since bestbuy had none Jun 27 00:14:07 now i has a pre Jun 27 00:14:13 welcome =p Jun 27 00:14:17 so someone on the forum said that everyone who had signed up for the SDK got it today - is that the case? Jun 27 00:14:19 yeah Jun 27 00:14:24 i did not Jun 27 00:14:25 i'm not in the party Jun 27 00:14:29 I also did not Jun 27 00:14:47 ok, so that statement is false. thanks. Jun 27 00:14:49 MTW; are you here to hep with reverse engineering and building infrastructure and writing apps? Jun 27 00:15:05 something like that Jun 27 00:15:13 i didn't buy the phone just to use ;) Jun 27 00:15:38 awesome; I'm the dummy here, but learning - mostly expect to be a tester Jun 27 00:16:11 finding out about the pre in time to cancel my iphone 3gs order: priceless. :) Jun 27 00:16:12 rwhitby: if you need any help holler Jun 27 00:20:13 if i update to 1.0.3 can is till root it later Jun 27 00:20:17 its not rooted yet Jun 27 00:20:19 Yep Jun 27 00:20:22 yes Jun 27 00:20:27 cool Jun 27 00:21:16 im quite shocked we didnt see a new update today Jun 27 00:22:47 has it been basically an update every friday? Jun 27 00:23:37 sounds like they might be doing weekly agile sprints from a prioitized backlog? Jun 27 00:29:40 interesting article about upstart (so far): http://www.linux.com/archive/articles/57213 Jun 27 00:35:24 what are the terms now? Jun 27 00:37:30 tmzt: funny, I just read this line in the above URL when your message came in: "The term we adopted for this design was an event-based init daemon. " Jun 27 00:37:43 They -did- say that this week the sdk group would expand from hundreds to thousands. Jun 27 00:37:45 so there's the term now Jun 27 00:37:48 Saddly, I wasn't in those thousands. Jun 27 00:37:52 sdk terms Jun 27 00:38:08 I wasnt either :( Jun 27 00:40:01 Kaerey: I started testing your MyNotifications app - initially didn't find any bugs, but I' like it if you can give a little background on what it add to the pre,etc? Jun 27 00:40:24 (I didn't care much about notifications before trying to test your app) Jun 27 00:40:40 waiting for it to charge to 31% lol Jun 27 00:41:08 there Jun 27 00:41:11 now installing updates Jun 27 00:41:29 ok it's going to be more than minutes.... Jun 27 00:41:35 we're running into repository issues. Jun 27 00:43:53 hey guys... http://pdnblog.palm.com/ Jun 27 00:44:01 check it out. News. Jun 27 00:44:15 Kaerey, do you have time to talk or are you doing other work? (Ping me with an eta/time that we can discuss what your app is about - thx Jun 27 00:45:00 i didnt get mine, i know that =p Jun 27 00:47:53 on the other hand -- RE applying just in case it got lost isn't a bad idea... Jun 27 00:48:09 but double this week, double again next week. That's good news. Jun 27 00:54:25 anone found what the preference "allowEditVoicemail" refers to? Jun 27 00:58:24 2**n? Jun 27 00:58:35 soon there bwill be trillions Jun 27 00:59:47 woot i can change the screen off timers Jun 27 01:00:06 where/how? Document it in the wiki or we will come beat you up. Jun 27 01:00:19 lol let me keep testing Jun 27 01:00:21 We know large men with sticks. Jun 27 01:11:49 well i can do it, but since i set my threshold too low it wont let me change it =p Jun 27 01:12:01 nice easy hack Jun 27 01:13:33 Rick u here Jun 27 01:15:55 the pre is pretty cool Jun 27 01:16:06 just got it 2 hours ago or so Jun 27 01:16:09 messing with it Jun 27 01:16:10 it is nice Jun 27 01:16:30 It's even more fun getting inside it =) Jun 27 01:16:36 ;) Jun 27 01:16:43 i'm going to learn how to use it before i root it Jun 27 01:16:55 Good idea Jun 27 01:17:07 this owns Jun 27 01:17:07 hard Jun 27 01:17:13 Haha. Jun 27 01:17:23 You get the wiggle yet ;-) Jun 27 01:17:31 p0wns when rooted Jun 27 01:17:38 wiggle? Jun 27 01:17:43 Lol Jun 27 01:18:08 Give it a bit. Jun 27 01:18:12 I like the wiggle Jun 27 01:18:24 mine has a gentle "clap" sound when i lightly squeeze the phone Jun 27 01:18:27 from front to back. Jun 27 01:18:39 ah Jun 27 01:18:47 what the fuck is the wiggle? Jun 27 01:19:08 The two sections wiggle Jun 27 01:19:13 At the joint Jun 27 01:19:20 not getting that Jun 27 01:19:24 but this unit is a new unit Jun 27 01:19:27 You will Jun 27 01:19:30 running 1.02 out of the box Jun 27 01:19:30 What other mods should I do to the software? I've enabled cpu throttling, turned off the button dialing noises.. Jun 27 01:19:37 upgrade Jun 27 01:19:43 OTA Jun 27 01:19:49 i already did Jun 27 01:19:51 mind does not willgle (bout on day 1) Jun 27 01:20:10 i've had mine since release date, too Jun 27 01:21:04 mine phone twists slightly clockwise Jun 27 01:21:13 oh right it expires Jun 27 01:21:24 and scrollback locks Jun 27 01:21:30 nothing Jun 27 01:21:36 how do you take off the back Jun 27 01:22:11 carefully Jun 27 01:22:17 there's two clips bout middle on sides Jun 27 01:22:23 then push/slide it up Jun 27 01:22:33 the small rectangle at bottom push in a little to release bottom Jun 27 01:23:17 thanks Jun 27 01:23:22 i like to slide my fingernail up the sides to lift it out so i don't snap those side hooks Jun 27 01:23:29 I saw the sales guy change my back Jun 27 01:23:31 yeah Jun 27 01:26:50 anyone wanna try my new hack to change the time off feature? Jun 27 01:26:55 needs a rooted pre Jun 27 01:27:20 time off feature? Jun 27 01:27:31 i'll give it a shot Jun 27 01:29:37 I'll test as apps as I can (as long as they are open source) :-) Jun 27 01:30:33 only thing for closed source to me is vulnerabilities Jun 27 01:31:20 anyone + here to let me edit wiki Jun 27 01:31:32 are you suggesting closed source is more or less vulnerable? Jun 27 01:31:44 i thought this was an open source chan Jun 27 01:31:51 i like the pre's box Jun 27 01:31:53 how it sits Jun 27 01:32:27 the box is a cool piece of art - too bad it gets forgotten so soon! Jun 27 01:32:34 what i am saying is that an hacks/mods i write are open source, and vulnerabilities i find are closed =p Jun 27 01:32:42 needs a slick oled upgrade replacement Jun 27 01:32:53 so tharris, did you need us to test this ap? Jun 27 01:32:54 a layer of glass less too Jun 27 01:33:19 it needs to be done from command line right now but i think i can use email trick to install it Jun 27 01:33:23 good, if you were suggesting otherwise, I might have had to persuade your mind to think differently :-) Jun 27 01:34:14 tharris: command line is OK with me (but you'll have to point me to instructions on how that's done) Jun 27 01:34:17 what's the word on the command line? Jun 27 01:34:30 last night pregame was talking about not releaseing it yet Jun 27 01:35:02 rwhitby ported his stuff into his repository ... Jun 27 01:35:24 so how do we use it? i've been waiting for a good CLI Jun 27 01:35:42 is there a way to install an unsigned mojo app .ipk, or does it have to be (self-)signed? Jun 27 01:35:48 he was talking about writing a makefile as a next task when eh signed off ... Jun 27 01:35:59 i ran "ipkg-opt install blahblah.ipk" and it worked but i don't see the app in the launcher Jun 27 01:36:09 that was before they discovered that the command service is not persistent across reboots Jun 27 01:36:27 I think he's probably helping wit that right now. Jun 27 01:36:50 This is new so use at own risk Jun 27 01:36:57 http://webos.pastebin.com/d44b3a642 Jun 27 01:37:51 isn't that already on predev.wikidot tharris? Jun 27 01:39:44 dunno i mentioned it to someone they said know Jun 27 01:39:46 no* Jun 27 01:41:47 not that i see, just something on teh same file to do with brightness Jun 27 01:43:50 anyone else see it there? Jun 27 01:50:52 tharris, what you should do is create a new file so people don't have to do all the edits themselves and risk doing it wrong Jun 27 01:51:02 have them mv the old file to rename it, then wget it Jun 27 01:57:05 hi Jun 27 01:57:32 is anyone else annoyed by how enter sends a txt, rather than just making a newline? Jun 27 02:01:04 yeah but then they cant add their own times Jun 27 02:01:41 yeah.. Jun 27 02:02:00 Technobabble: does shift enter work for new line? Jun 27 02:02:59 no, does it for you? Jun 27 02:03:27 I hadn't tried but that is how you do it with Pidgin Jun 27 02:03:35 yeah, i tried them both Jun 27 02:03:45 shift enter doesn't do anything that i can tell, orange enter sends it Jun 27 02:06:09 Techno, did it work for u as explained? Jun 27 02:07:28 Question... I'm connected and ssh'd in via usbnet. I'm trying to copy a file that I copied to the root of the usb drive mode. wouldn't that be /media/internal? when I look there via ssh it shows no files. what am I missing? Jun 27 02:08:20 if you are in USB Drive mode it wont show files Jun 27 02:08:32 you need to disconnect the drive then re connect it Jun 27 02:08:59 K, I removed safely from vista but apparently it still thinks I am connected on the palm. I'll disconnect and then reconnect. Jun 27 02:09:21 yes you have to unplug the usb Jun 27 02:10:31 that did the trick. Tonight is my firstime using usbnet... like it. Jun 27 02:10:48 nice @ pregame Jun 27 02:11:32 SirWill: agree, I use usbnet all the time Jun 27 02:19:26 tharris, can i do this via ssh? Jun 27 02:19:42 yeah Jun 27 02:19:43 do what? Jun 27 02:20:00 i found a hack to change the idle timeout feature Jun 27 02:20:07 i need to sudo rootfs_open -w first, right? Jun 27 02:20:14 ah, cool Jun 27 02:20:19 javascript? Jun 27 02:20:22 it needs testing though Jun 27 02:20:23 http://predev.wikidot.com/changing-the-turn-off-after-x-time-in-the-palm-pre Jun 27 02:22:05 i now have timeouts of 30 sec,1m, 2m, 3m, 5m, 10m Jun 27 02:22:25 in a dropdown menu Jun 27 02:22:38 and never? Jun 27 02:22:51 sudo: rootfs_open: command not found Jun 27 02:23:03 works from nova, not from ssh Jun 27 02:24:26 mount -o remount, rw / to read/write in ssh Jun 27 02:24:48 mount -o remount, ro / to read only in ssh Jun 27 02:24:55 thanks Jun 27 02:26:10 no problem. Jun 27 02:27:17 Techno let me know if there are any issues Jun 27 02:28:15 i cna prolly make an ipk that does it too Jun 27 02:28:47 how do you save in vi again? Jun 27 02:28:52 :w Jun 27 02:28:55 :q to quit Jun 27 02:28:59 : Jun 27 02:29:00 er Jun 27 02:29:03 wq! to save and quit Jun 27 02:29:13 ZZ also works Jun 27 02:29:14 [ESC] then type :wq Jun 27 02:29:19 usually hit ESC, then ":" then wq! Jun 27 02:29:20 lol Jun 27 02:29:51 if anyone wants to check it out and let me know if there are issues: http://predev.wikidot.com/changing-the-turn-off-after-x-time-in-the-palm-pre Jun 27 02:30:25 looking at it now Jun 27 02:30:59 Looks ok Jun 27 02:31:34 Set it to one sec. :-) Jun 27 02:31:55 i did Jun 27 02:32:02 as i said in the article =p Jun 27 02:32:38 1 sec makes it hard lol 15 should be ok, just dont wait to do anything Jun 27 02:32:47 I want the center LED behind the button to snore when I have a alert Jun 27 02:34:09 sudo mount -o remount, rw -> mount: can't find rw in /proc/mounts Jun 27 02:34:24 rw / Jun 27 02:34:34 You need to do it on / Jun 27 02:35:02 oh duh Jun 27 02:35:08 Yeah. Jun 27 02:35:26 Prereq = Linux Jun 27 02:37:41 well I now have 5 and 10 minute options, set it to 5 and testing Jun 27 02:37:50 i did 10 and it worked Jun 27 02:37:51 git rid of the ' ' Jun 27 02:37:55 followed your directions completely. Jun 27 02:38:02 no issues then? Jun 27 02:38:06 sudo mount -o remount,rw ... Jun 27 02:39:17 can we install nano on this thing okay? Jun 27 02:39:20 i hate vi\ Jun 27 02:41:00 vi isa god among men Jun 27 02:41:13 lol Jun 27 02:43:29 ed is there (if you don't like vi) :-) Jun 27 02:43:37 lol Jun 27 02:43:41 just install nano Jun 27 02:43:43 nano installs fine Jun 27 02:43:53 from optware Jun 27 02:45:48 i really like vi - it's a good editor Jun 27 02:45:59 wow u cant change the network time source i dont think Jun 27 02:46:16 you get the time from the tower Jun 27 02:46:27 yeah i wanted to change my time source =p Jun 27 02:46:43 the tower is pretty accurate Jun 27 02:46:45 tharris, yeah the 5 minute screen timeout worked. Jun 27 02:46:56 excellent new hack works =p its posted Jun 27 02:47:16 any changes needed on the wiki? Jun 27 02:47:23 for the idle timeout? Jun 27 02:47:42 I would add the rw / at the begging and the ro at the end, for those that don't know squat. ;) Jun 27 02:48:21 roger Jun 27 02:49:12 bpadalino: you may get time from the tower, but interestingly, you also get it via NTP from pool.ntp.org Jun 27 02:49:38 where did you find the pool.ntp.org setup? Jun 27 02:49:40 another thing I saw in my packet captures Jun 27 02:49:46 ahh Jun 27 02:49:47 yeah, i see that in the /etc scripts Jun 27 02:49:54 there is even a comment about working without a radio board Jun 27 02:50:14 sure, seems likely Jun 27 02:50:17 yeah, I'm sure it's very handy for our bypassed friends with no EVDO Jun 27 02:50:35 Well and gsm systems don't set the time I don't think. Jun 27 02:50:53 actually I believe they do Jun 27 02:51:01 it's a network service Jun 27 02:51:12 you can slave off it, but it's not intrinsic to things working Jun 27 02:52:50 i wanted to be able to change it in mojo was what i was getting at.... Jun 27 02:53:06 but it just calls get system time basically Jun 27 02:53:30 over AT commands? Jun 27 02:54:00 all digital cell phone systems need a good time source to work Jun 27 02:54:05 cdma is useless without it Jun 27 02:55:10 a good real time clock available to the baseband for timeslices and such but I don't think anything requires it be the right time in the real world. Jun 27 02:55:15 I could be wrong though Jun 27 02:55:37 it's miller time... for example? Jun 27 02:55:51 simplyflipflops: hey, you just invented an app! Jun 27 02:55:59 SirWill i made those changes Jun 27 02:56:03 alarm when it's miller time ? Jun 27 02:56:05 cdma modems should report time though AT commands Jun 27 02:56:12 unsols Jun 27 02:56:24 these qualcomm chips dont use at commands i guess - some proprietary protocol Jun 27 02:56:39 the snoozer button is "open a beer" Jun 27 02:56:55 didn't find ATD#777 anywhere in the tar? Jun 27 02:57:10 looks good tharris Jun 27 02:57:11 bpadalino: I think I read somewhere they can switch between AT and the proprietary one Jun 27 02:57:16 excellent Jun 27 02:57:43 http://predev.wikidot.com/changing-the-turn-off-after-x-time-in-the-palm-pre should be all set now and confirmed working =p **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Jun 27 02:59:56 2009