**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jul 04 02:59:57 2009 Jul 04 03:09:03 How about ntop? Jul 04 03:12:47 is there anyonw working on a way to download files from webos? Jul 04 03:15:57 What do you mean? Jul 04 03:18:43 quick q.. how do i putty into emulator? Jul 04 03:19:08 destro_57: putty localhost 5522 Jul 04 03:19:19 damn your quick destinal :P Jul 04 03:19:29 heh Jul 04 03:19:33 nice.. thanks! Jul 04 03:19:49 you're welcome Jul 04 03:21:11 I'm just checking out goodfood Jul 04 03:21:13 coolass app Jul 04 03:21:26 login as root? and no password? Jul 04 03:21:33 Yeah, I've used it a few times, I prefer where though Jul 04 03:21:40 destro_57: yes Jul 04 03:21:46 haven't used that. Jul 04 03:22:12 ok cool i'm in thanks.. if i make changed to json files do i have to reboot for changes to make effect? Jul 04 03:22:18 destro_57: the #webos channel is for discussion of the SDK, this is for development discussion :) Jul 04 03:22:32 ah ok Jul 04 03:22:45 you can either do a reboot or force luna to reboot Jul 04 03:23:00 ok thanks.. Jul 04 03:23:00 is it a bad idea if I stay connected to my phone via evdo for hours and maintain the same ip throughout? I noticed in messing around that the evdo ip would change pretty frequently Jul 04 03:23:04 otherwise Jul 04 03:23:30 I don't think that would be problematic... Jul 04 03:24:21 * subhuman shrugs Jul 04 03:25:02 I guess it'd just be bad for battery Jul 04 03:25:06 if nothing else Jul 04 03:25:38 rather than the polling intervals where it connects, it's keeping it alive..using more power Jul 04 03:26:25 It dosen't heat up and catch fire? :P Jul 04 03:27:07 well, I've only been leaving the flashlight on fulltime @50 while on the touchstone Jul 04 03:27:28 ;) Jul 04 03:27:43 hehehe Jul 04 03:27:58 are those any good? Jul 04 03:28:20 yeah, it's cool to have a little stand for the phone with no obtrusive wires if placed well Jul 04 03:28:29 it can be a little quirky on the connection Jul 04 03:28:46 I'd prefer to have not paid $70 for it Jul 04 03:28:52 but I am satisfied, I guess Jul 04 03:28:55 i'm not real happy with the usb connector on the phone Jul 04 03:29:01 no. Jul 04 03:29:10 me either Jul 04 03:29:11 so if nothing else, it would let me avoid breaking that Jul 04 03:29:16 but the touchstone doesn't do usb Jul 04 03:29:18 or at least mine doesnt Jul 04 03:29:25 anybody else have a word on that? Jul 04 03:29:29 right, i'm just interested in charging Jul 04 03:29:35 ah, ok Jul 04 03:29:37 the vast majority of the time Jul 04 03:29:50 I am going to get one, once the production levels increase. Jul 04 03:30:00 it also doesn't charge over usb with the touchstone...only when connected to a power outlet Jul 04 03:30:15 ...at least mine. I haven't looked into it at all Jul 04 03:30:30 My Palm stock report made comments about how unbelievably short the touchstone supply was. Jul 04 03:30:53 crazy...both stores I went to today had several that I saw Jul 04 03:30:54 Your right subhuman, it needs AC power. Jul 04 03:31:09 no, the touchstone needs more than an ampere Jul 04 03:31:17 * subhuman nods Jul 04 03:31:27 When I got my Pre at the midnight launch party, they sold more TS's than Pre's Jul 04 03:31:39 haha Jul 04 03:31:50 well, did they sell out of the pres? Jul 04 03:31:57 But they did sell 160 Pre's Jul 04 03:32:07 More than the other 9 stores that night. Jul 04 03:32:20 haha Jul 04 03:32:22 I think it was 160, I don't remember Jul 04 03:32:32 they need to come out with some more apps :/ Jul 04 03:32:36 suppsedly they have been selling well around here (austin,tx area), but I have still yet to see anybody with one Jul 04 03:32:50 I almost didn't get mine, the rep refused to help me becuase their systems were "down" Jul 04 03:33:11 I just got mine on wednesday..when my sprint account cycled Jul 04 03:33:18 Lacutis: i'd be happy with SSH. tethering would be cool too, but A) that's already done and B) it's nt palm's fault Jul 04 03:33:36 called around...no sprint corp store had any. found non-corp store that had several Jul 04 03:33:44 I saw a guy in the movies with one :) We had a nice chat hehe, I just saw the crappy Pre ad on tv a second ago. Jul 04 03:33:47 avoided waiting lists Jul 04 03:34:18 loll Jul 04 03:34:46 The Sprint facebook ad and the Palm China ad make up the worst tv ads I have ever seen. Jul 04 03:34:56 they weren't thrilled when I exchanged my 'bricked' pre earlier Jul 04 03:34:57 Worst product placement ever. Jul 04 03:35:45 bbl Jul 04 03:42:56 hmm can you customize the bar at the bottom Jul 04 03:45:19 Yes Jul 04 03:45:34 Just drag out or drag in. Jul 04 03:46:21 yeah Jul 04 03:46:25 i just figured it out :/ Jul 04 03:46:26 lol Jul 04 03:46:28 thanks tho! Jul 04 03:47:28 It's a shame you can't take the launcher icon away. Jul 04 03:48:24 there would have to be some other way to get to it Jul 04 03:49:30 aye Jul 04 03:49:44 they need a better options menu Jul 04 03:51:21 I love the phone I hope they start ramping up dev support Jul 04 03:53:19 slightly ignorant question here, so far I've seen hombrew "web page" type apps, and Linux-based packages. Is there any way for the two to interract? Jul 04 03:53:44 Does Mojo provide the equivalent of a window manager and a fork() command? Jul 04 04:00:50 bzhou * r10415 optware/trunk/make/sqlite.mk: sqlite: 3.6.15 -> 3.6.16 Jul 04 04:02:12 is the latest webdoctor 1.0.3 or 1.0.4? Jul 04 04:02:34 SirWill: good question. I'll check Jul 04 04:07:39 latest Jul 04 04:07:42 ooh new rough cuts Jul 04 04:08:55 yeah, they probably only fixed the appendix a Jul 04 04:09:06 nothing new at the end Jul 04 04:09:13 SirWill: the latest webdoctor is stilll 1.0.3 Jul 04 04:09:30 makes sense, because 1.0.4 is tiny security changes Jul 04 04:09:38 fixes Jul 04 04:09:40 K Jul 04 04:21:55 It was more than that. Jul 04 04:22:09 Wrecked my battery life and made my screen wobble :P Jul 04 04:22:40 weird Jul 04 04:24:29 today.. i had 2 calendar appointments pop up.. an email came in and a phone call only a few seconds apart... phone ground to a halt.. had to reboot.. next time something like that happens are there any logs i can check? Jul 04 04:25:25 bzhou * r10416 optware/trunk/make/libogg.mk: libogg: 1.1.3 -> 1.1.4, updated template Jul 04 04:25:28 bzhou * r10417 optware/trunk/make/libvorbis.mk: libvorbis: 1.2.0 -> 1.2.2 Jul 04 05:01:50 sup all? Jul 04 05:10:52 hey all... just "rooted" the pre, and want to take a dd image... anyone know if i can do this to a tftp server? Jul 04 05:12:05 oops... SMB is just as good Jul 04 05:12:32 * branded is a happy glowing orb, not a penguin Jul 04 05:13:25 branded: i dont think there is a point, just back up the apps you patch and if you mess up you can just webOSdoctor it Jul 04 05:14:06 that's the image? Jul 04 05:14:31 branded: webOSdr just resets your pre to factory freshness, so, yeah, i guess Jul 04 05:14:39 okjay cool Jul 04 05:14:42 sounds good Jul 04 05:14:45 i feel safe Jul 04 05:14:53 thanks Jul 04 05:15:11 Feel free to wreck as much as you want :P Jul 04 05:15:34 sounds good! Jul 04 05:15:37 This may sound dumb -- or you guys may have heard the q a lot already -- but is the pre good as a *phone*? I'm champing at the bit for bell canada to get going, but I have to ask. Jul 04 05:15:46 well, just be careful, because webOSdr doesnt fix all partitions, at least i dont think Jul 04 05:16:07 then i should dd just to be sure? Jul 04 05:16:10 gemlog: it works pretty well as a phone Jul 04 05:16:17 gemlog: yes, it's good Jul 04 05:16:19 branded: just tred careful Jul 04 05:16:29 ly Jul 04 05:16:40 alright, i don't know linux very well... so i'll be careful Jul 04 05:16:43 :) Jul 04 05:16:44 thanks Jul 04 05:16:57 just don't type rm -rf / Jul 04 05:17:02 or you will be sorry :) Jul 04 05:17:02 branded: well, if you just apply patches from the wiki, or something like that, you should be fine Jul 04 05:17:24 Eguy: AHHHH shiny red button! Jul 04 05:17:28 It was the only downfall of my old Z that was not a phone. Well, that and no wifi etc. either :-) Jul 04 05:17:30 Eguy: well, he probably isnt logging in as room, in which case, at worst he will lose his home folder and maybe /media/internal Jul 04 05:17:50 Make sure that you don't type any typos :) Jul 04 05:18:04 Most problems I ran into while coding was from my stupid typos ;) Jul 04 05:18:04 copy and paste is your friend. :D Jul 04 05:18:33 Not if your coding from scratch :P Jul 04 05:18:37 typos waste hours for all of us. cp/paste is Good. Jul 04 05:18:39 lol, yeah Jul 04 05:19:35 gemlog: yea, i still do = instead of ==, i'm so inexperienced, it only takes me ehhh maybe two hours to figure out what the hell is going on Jul 04 05:19:46 that was to eguy Jul 04 05:19:49 gemlog: I like the Pre as a phone but it certainlly is not the BEST there is. I feel my Centro was a better phone because it has no lag while doing "phone stuff" Jul 04 05:20:09 branded: in JS you want ===. :D Jul 04 05:20:17 Ouch. :P Jul 04 05:20:27 gemlog: http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/186507-alright-guys-im-fence-convince-me-plz.html Jul 04 05:20:36 gemlog: and the conclusion: http://forums.precentral.net/1727921-post36.html Jul 04 05:20:43 +1 branded ^ Jul 04 05:20:51 Good linking there. Jul 04 05:21:02 branded: it never ends. just today I a) was editing a file of the same name, but in the wrong dir b) cp/pasted a function and missed changing one var name -- for an hour... Just how it is I think. Jul 04 05:21:40 bzhou * r10418 optware/trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): glib: 2.16.6 -> 2.20.4; gtk: 2.8.9 -> 2.16.3 Jul 04 05:21:54 hahahah the jokes 1.0a app is pretty cool, mapara has a good sense of humor. Jul 04 05:21:55 yea i hate it Jul 04 05:25:08 branded: thanks. by 'synergy' I guess you don't mean the x11/ms mouse/kb sharing app. Jul 04 05:25:33 hah, nope Jul 04 05:25:40 finance guy? Jul 04 05:25:41 ? synergy Jul 04 05:26:14 synergy is the palm google contact, facebook, blah blah contacts calendar centralization Jul 04 05:26:27 It works...sometimes :P Jul 04 05:26:40 it's the title for the strategy of linking all the info into their apps (contacts and calendar) Jul 04 05:26:56 Well actually, it works once and then doesn't update :P. Jul 04 05:27:03 seriously? Jul 04 05:27:05 ok, their sync app. was finance guy? q to me? no. hate books (but writing a custom version of openerp as we type... :-( Jul 04 05:27:25 no no, synergy is used in financial services for stock traders Jul 04 05:27:25 openerp's xml is killing me Jul 04 05:27:27 :D Jul 04 05:27:32 i work in finance Jul 04 05:27:37 oh, yet another 'synergy' :-) Jul 04 05:27:38 and we use synergy Jul 04 05:27:39 Yup Jul 04 05:27:48 nope, the reverse-kvm Jul 04 05:28:16 it's really common for traders... anyway... i digress... Jul 04 05:28:23 synergy kind of sucks Jul 04 05:28:42 http://synergy2.sourceforge.net/running.html this does not suck at all. Works great. Jul 04 05:29:02 for instance, if you link an account, ex: google, it will sync the entirety of your contact list Jul 04 05:29:06 not just specific ones, Jul 04 05:29:06 the palm pre named synergy may ttho Jul 04 05:29:23 and google adds every person you've ever sent an email to, automatically to your contacts list Jul 04 05:29:28 that's why I'm here, to learn all this stuff off you guys :-) Jul 04 05:29:34 so i added my google account and had 997 contacts Jul 04 05:29:52 I've read that zillion numbers of contacts problem in a review, yes. Jul 04 05:30:08 including hookers i've dealt with from craigslist, and my old professors (i kidd... i kidd) Jul 04 05:30:08 just s/w flaw tho. can be fixed. Jul 04 05:30:19 [about my professors, i never emailed the] Jul 04 05:30:25 :-) Jul 04 05:30:37 but, i mean, that's "just plain stupid" Jul 04 05:30:49 who wants that? let me select a "sub-folder" for christ's sake Jul 04 05:30:53 LOL hookers Jul 04 05:31:01 Yeah, but gmail and goog apps remembers one time typos that bounced too... Jul 04 05:31:31 yea exactly Jul 04 05:31:42 but, obviously, the "fault" lay with synergy Jul 04 05:31:49 How to teach it better? maybe a special palmpre label in google apps. Jul 04 05:32:02 Well who wouldn't want their hookers all organized in one place? Jul 04 05:32:05 if we could administer which contacts it synced, that'd be... you know... good. Jul 04 05:32:15 first run. It's like the first live beta in a way. Jul 04 05:33:04 labels would work. where is that code? in mojo or js? (not sure if I'm using the word mojo correctly here) Jul 04 05:33:10 Eguy: exactly... all of my hookers in "Erotic Services," all of my trannies in "Casual Encounters" Jul 04 05:33:12 perfect Jul 04 05:33:17 haha Jul 04 05:33:37 You know it. Jul 04 05:34:02 gemlog: destinal showed me a wiki page on setting up an SSL man-in-the-middle to capture out going network traffic Jul 04 05:34:07 i believe this is the best thing "to do" Jul 04 05:34:14 or part of it at least Jul 04 05:34:15 I mean, there's all the js accessible stuff and then the compiled stuff that has not (yet?) been released. which is synergy? Jul 04 05:34:35 synergy is like 3G or 4G Jul 04 05:34:48 Has anyone on here used workgroup manager on OS X Server? Jul 04 05:34:50 it's a title for a strategy Jul 04 05:34:52 no, the code. Jul 04 05:34:54 a branding if you will Jul 04 05:34:58 * branded is a self promoter Jul 04 05:35:25 and the strategy is linking info from a bunch of different places into one place Jul 04 05:35:36 like google contacts, and facebook friends, into contacts Jul 04 05:35:50 and google calendars and exchange calendars into calendars Jul 04 05:35:58 I am still waiting for shareport calendars... Jul 04 05:36:06 gemlog: you understand? Jul 04 05:36:08 sharepoint* Jul 04 05:36:44 I got the idea of synergy. what I'm asking is: suppose I wanted to introduce a filter that would only import certain google labels, Which file would I edit? Jul 04 05:37:04 oh... yea, let me know when you find out which one :D Jul 04 05:37:14 i have no idea Jul 04 05:37:28 Online google account. Jul 04 05:37:31 ok. There are lots of editable js files avail. Jul 04 05:37:59 but not all code is released as source as I understand it. Jul 04 05:38:04 i'm sure someone here who has more experience with the APIs can tell us where to start looking Jul 04 05:38:27 so, i'd sit on it until it's not just us losers sitting inside on a friday night Jul 04 05:38:34 http://predev.wikidot.com/ deals only with editable in-place js files for e.g. Jul 04 05:38:40 (that was self-deprecating, so it makes it okay) Jul 04 05:38:48 http://forums.precentral.net/general-webos-chat/189479-who-cares-about-multiple-apps-open.html Probably the best thread of the week Jul 04 05:39:18 I'm an old loser wondering if my son will bother to visit tonight since he's in town. no worries mate :-) Jul 04 05:39:54 Eguy: holyrunonsenteneces . Jul 04 05:40:07 I am waiting for my "Casual Encounter" of the night. Jul 04 05:40:12 ah hahaha Jul 04 05:40:28 Thought you might like that. Jul 04 05:41:31 put /var/opt in /var/opt right? Jul 04 05:41:35 anyhow, no one here has any kicks against the quality of the usability as a cell phone? Jul 04 05:41:44 i know that sounds stupid, but that's from the root dir? Jul 04 05:41:52 no it's great Jul 04 05:41:54 i like it alot Jul 04 05:42:04 I wrote my response above.. Jul 04 05:42:07 I'd almost sell a child just to get it to log into headless boxen I run into all day. Jul 04 05:42:09 yes Jul 04 05:42:26 anybody using the wallpaper switcher ? Jul 04 05:42:36 But I suggest you take a look at the forums instead. Jul 04 05:42:41 gemlog: headless oxen? Jul 04 05:42:50 JaSonx: nope. Jul 04 05:42:51 i think i saw that once... Jul 04 05:42:51 heh apparently pre owners aren't the only people with battery drain (according to article on engadget calling iPhone 'iDrain') Jul 04 05:42:52 in mexico Jul 04 05:43:02 hahah gemlog Jul 04 05:43:04 wish iDrain would have been more of "iPhone goes in toilet" though Jul 04 05:43:15 What's that comedians name? Jul 04 05:43:18 how do I reboot via SSH? Jul 04 05:43:29 err not engadget* Jul 04 05:43:31 branded: headless boxen -- servers, no monitor, kb or mouse. you usually only need to type a few words at them anyhow. Jul 04 05:43:33 bkuberek: reboot Jul 04 05:43:48 oh i get it boxen the plural of box... like that one Jul 04 05:43:48 says command not found Jul 04 05:44:16 Just press opt + sym + r Jul 04 05:44:16 I can do that via novaterm Jul 04 05:44:18 shutdown -r -t 0 now Jul 04 05:44:25 format c:\ Jul 04 05:44:27 cool thanks Jul 04 05:44:37 you don't need the -t 0 Jul 04 05:44:47 man, i was close Jul 04 05:44:49 Eguy: i'm not pc Jul 04 05:44:55 Damn... :( Jul 04 05:45:11 Even if I was, I know what thet mean Jul 04 05:45:18 Have you ever seen that IRC log where the guy actually did format c:\ Jul 04 05:45:18 :) Jul 04 05:45:38 no but I believe some people would Jul 04 05:45:39 It was great. Jul 04 05:45:45 I bet it was Jul 04 05:46:00 should be put online on a blog or something Jul 04 05:46:33 It erased the guys computer while he was still chatting hahaha Jul 04 05:46:58 shutdown -r now is just a normal linux command avail on any of a zillion web sites already tho. Jul 04 05:47:19 I always used reboot Jul 04 05:47:28 Does it work on the Pre? I know the Pre doesn't support a lot of the general Linux commands Jul 04 05:47:29 an alias for the other thing Jul 04 05:47:33 but for somereason some stuff is not available over ssh Jul 04 05:47:41 like ifconfig for example Jul 04 05:47:50 not in your path probably Jul 04 05:48:17 e.g. if you are a normal user, ifconfig is not in your path, but you can type: /sbin/ifconfig to run it. Jul 04 05:48:24 maybe if I su Jul 04 05:48:24 ? Jul 04 05:48:25 just need to specify path Jul 04 05:48:42 if you do su then do a 'which ifconfig' to find out the path... Jul 04 05:48:55 then you can use it as regular user Jul 04 05:49:03 @psykoz Yeah, the battery drain isn't the only problem with the iPhony 3GS...it already got recalled over overheating problems :D Jul 04 05:49:07 right on Jul 04 05:49:24 sbin Jul 04 05:49:28 or just add that to your $PATH environment variable in your bash profile or rc Jul 04 05:49:40 Anybody here seen the show Silent Library? Jul 04 05:49:45 that's where it usually lives. Jul 04 05:50:00 I did Jul 04 05:50:30 but there is a conditional that if I am a regular user it ads bin, if I su in, also ads sbin Jul 04 05:50:43 its fine Jul 04 05:51:15 if I need it a lot then I'l add it. otherwise I can just type sbin Jul 04 05:51:59 It's controlled by a file called (on a normal linux box, remember I don't own a pre yet, canadian) /home/username/.bashprofile and/or /home/username/.bashrc Jul 04 05:52:11 how come format C:\ does nopt require a password or confirmation? Jul 04 05:52:29 it does require a confirmation. Jul 04 05:52:37 format c:\ doesn't do anything on linux... Jul 04 05:52:41 I did it directly on profile.d Jul 04 05:52:54 that's for microsoft Jul 04 05:53:07 oh. on the pre. format c:\ isn't a linux command. It's like typing blachblach blah Jul 04 05:53:08 I could add a ~/.bashrc Jul 04 05:53:10 bkuberek: it's just like rm -rf doesn't need a password Jul 04 05:53:17 slashes that look like '/' are the way god intended them to slant :-) Jul 04 05:53:26 hahaha Jul 04 05:53:46 The -f part tells it not to ask. It means Force. Jul 04 05:53:57 Eguy: i actually once did chmod -R 777 / Jul 04 05:54:03 instead of ./ Jul 04 05:54:05 Ok, rm doesn't ask either Jul 04 05:54:21 rEmOVE rECURSIVELY fORCE Jul 04 05:54:33 and you COULD type format c: /y on some versions of dos to have it not ask. Jul 04 05:54:34 rm should ask unless it's been aliased Jul 04 05:54:43 right Jul 04 05:54:52 I am talking Pre here Jul 04 05:54:59 usually asks for a confirmation Jul 04 05:55:02 type 'alias' by itself to see what it has done Jul 04 05:55:41 don't play like this as the root user. you knew that. Jul 04 05:56:11 ctrl+d to get back to being a normal user if you su'd Jul 04 05:56:18 or type exit Jul 04 05:58:09 yeah Jul 04 05:58:30 If I shutdown the pre, how do I get it back on? Jul 04 05:58:42 Take out the battery Jul 04 05:59:09 Really? no other way? Like, I dunno, an on swx or something? :-) Jul 04 05:59:36 And then you have to type "Power On" on the keyboard and then put the battery in. Jul 04 05:59:53 Here's an example of an alias you might enter on one line in your .bashrc file: Jul 04 05:59:56 alias cf='./configure' Jul 04 06:00:26 it means, every time you type 'cf' and hit enter it will do what's on the other side of the = sign instead Jul 04 06:00:40 If you type sudo convert android the Pre turns into an Android phone!!!! Jul 04 06:00:54 Eguy: very funny Jul 04 06:01:19 'convert' is part of the imagemagick package anyhow :-) Jul 04 06:01:55 ^ that was not necessary.... Jul 04 06:02:02 Let the bad joke be :D Jul 04 06:02:20 oh, ok. Jul 04 06:02:24 I guess. Jul 04 06:02:26 :-) Jul 04 06:02:55 gemlog: Are you looking to get a Pre? Jul 04 06:03:12 Like 90% sure, yeah. Jul 04 06:03:28 Not avail in Canada yet anyhow. doing research with you guys. Jul 04 06:03:50 Or, rather, On you guys :-) Jul 04 06:04:32 Oh, your Canadian eh? Where abouts if you don't mind me asking? Jul 04 06:04:48 I would seriously LOVE to not have to always pack my eeepro around (which is a big step up from it predecessor anyhow) Jul 04 06:05:01 Terrace, BC. It's handy to Alaska. Jul 04 06:05:30 Oooohh I've been up there, its nice. Jul 04 06:05:42 That's why I live here :-) Jul 04 06:05:49 Where're you at? Jul 04 06:05:53 ish Jul 04 06:06:02 California Jul 04 06:06:10 south? Jul 04 06:06:16 Yup Jul 04 06:06:28 I don't think I could cope with that. Jul 04 06:06:34 hahaha Jul 04 06:06:48 I could think of many reason why, whats yours? Jul 04 06:06:49 seriously. Jul 04 06:07:02 I melt after about 20 deg. C Jul 04 06:07:17 lie in a little gemlog puddle on the floor whimpering and refuse to type Jul 04 06:08:04 hahahaa oh yeah, its 20 right now Jul 04 06:08:17 yeah, at 2300.. Jul 04 06:08:27 Been quite hot this week and next week it's going to be even hotter. Jul 04 06:08:28 It was nasty here today. 27. Jul 04 06:08:47 32 tomorrow :) Jul 04 06:08:48 doesn't happen for many days total though, so I live :-) Jul 04 06:09:07 we get 33 the odd time. Never seen worse than that here. Jul 04 06:09:25 It's usually livable (for me) heat-wise. Jul 04 06:09:57 I've never seen worse than -25 or so either. (C) Jul 04 06:10:12 i come from a 43 summer rarelly gets to 0 on winter Jul 04 06:10:30 43!!!??? Jul 04 06:10:40 I think I am going to go to the beach tomorrow. Jul 04 06:10:41 I would beg to be killed Jul 04 06:10:48 I used to be like a fried shrimp Jul 04 06:11:13 hahaha I was in Italy last summer and it was in the 40s every day, It was horrible. Jul 04 06:11:16 I believe it at 43. Wouldn't just getting a human-sized uwave be more convenient? Jul 04 06:11:35 its alittle hot Jul 04 06:11:40 I think aug is the worst for italy. when rome empties out. Jul 04 06:11:50 I've heard... Jul 04 06:11:53 That's when I was there. Jul 04 06:11:57 gets unconfortable if you don't have a river, or beach Jul 04 06:12:21 you guys are insane Jul 04 06:12:24 it was 42 here today. Jul 04 06:12:33 Why am I believing you about the palm pre? Jul 04 06:12:35 :-) Jul 04 06:12:48 I like the sun and heat though, I hate cloudy skies and rain but I love snow. Jul 04 06:12:48 see if you are n a river bank or waterfall, you like the 40's Jul 04 06:13:02 NO. No, I would not. Jul 04 06:13:05 I don't understand how people live with temps in the 40's. Jul 04 06:13:12 me either Jul 04 06:13:23 Some have no choice :) Jul 04 06:13:31 no thumbs? Jul 04 06:13:33 Where I come from, it rarely gets over 35. perhaps one day a year we approach 40, but not often. Jul 04 06:13:35 I like winter. I was born in the winter Jul 04 06:13:54 Bah, allergies in the winter! Jul 04 06:13:55 love snow Jul 04 06:13:56 but then, we will have a week in January when it dips to -40. and never gets above -10 in the daytime. Jul 04 06:14:04 snow == good Jul 04 06:14:37 i never been up in canada or alaska though. I may get a little frozen Jul 04 06:14:54 rick is in southern ontario? Jul 04 06:15:54 Kansas Jul 04 06:16:14 ooo right smack dab in the middle Jul 04 06:16:25 Do you have a corn field? Jul 04 06:16:38 Wow. You have other forms of extreme wx to worry about. Jul 04 06:16:42 yep. The north winds start at the pole and have nothing between there and us but flat. The south winds start in the gulf and ditto. Jul 04 06:16:55 They meet over our heads, and the tornado gods come calling. Jul 04 06:17:10 Kansas.... Kansas.... Jul 04 06:17:16 they seem to say :-) Jul 04 06:17:23 :-) No Eguy, I'm a city dweller, or as much of one as Kansas offers the opporutnity for. Jul 04 06:18:31 Yeah, have you had any run-ins with tornados? Jul 04 06:18:37 I'm on a linux forum with a woman from Kansas, so I'm pretty much done with the dorothy etc. jokes already. Jul 04 06:19:14 * ShadeS rolls in and clicks his heely's 3 times Jul 04 06:19:16 hey what's up guys? Jul 04 06:19:17 8 ) Jul 04 06:19:20 Women? Jul 04 06:19:42 Hey Shade Jul 04 06:19:51 my homeland has 8 women for each man Jul 04 06:20:02 A tornado totally pwned the highschool in this town several years back Jul 04 06:20:03 The sky is up along with the atmostphere and the ISS and then the galaxy :) Jul 04 06:20:08 tail end of the tornado alley Jul 04 06:20:15 tornados, yes, f-5's twice, f3 once, f1 twice. Not fun. Jul 04 06:20:36 * Eguy loves OpenPandora Jul 04 06:20:39 never seen tornado yet Jul 04 06:20:41 i'm totally death defying, I'd almost want to wind surf a tornado Jul 04 06:20:51 i'm sure i'd have 2nd thoughts after seeing one approach me in person though! Jul 04 06:20:53 Can I have your Pre? Jul 04 06:21:06 You know... if you don't make it. Jul 04 06:21:16 :P Jul 04 06:21:19 it's buried w/ me to the grave ;p Jul 04 06:21:33 it prob wont work either Jul 04 06:21:37 and the only organ that I have signed for donating is my anus ;p Jul 04 06:21:40 so you can have that 8 P Jul 04 06:21:58 barbeq that ring Jul 04 06:22:01 I'll pass :P Jul 04 06:23:00 I just used my Pre a little bit, Man I love webOS. If they get the lag down, even if it is not until 2.0 it is going to be a sweeet future. Jul 04 06:23:55 will the pre support camcorder? Jul 04 06:23:55 so, you're saying it doesn't feel very responsive? Jul 04 06:23:59 CPU scaling seems to be the trick, but it has problems Jul 04 06:24:04 is it hardware lacking? Jul 04 06:24:16 Palm is going to add video recording in the future Jul 04 06:24:27 It's not hardware, its software. Jul 04 06:24:33 awesokme Jul 04 06:24:41 The lag is there, it's not like you wouldn't notice it. Jul 04 06:24:51 thx Jul 04 06:24:53 i see the lag Jul 04 06:24:57 Usually 2-5 seconds. Jul 04 06:25:02 but its not too bad Jul 04 06:25:22 Yeah, it's not like "This is rediculous, I can't use this thing." Jul 04 06:25:23 that's running new apps right? not swxing Jul 04 06:25:32 Right. Jul 04 06:25:56 even with the lag it feels more responsive than an iphone, for certasin thinfgs Jul 04 06:26:23 maybe coz of where I live, I don't know a soul with an iphone. good to know. Jul 04 06:26:30 When you open the contacts app, it does take 5 seconds before you can start scrolling through names. Jul 04 06:26:51 remember, its a web page Jul 04 06:26:51 Lucky you :P Every teenager here has one lol. Jul 04 06:27:30 And IMO, it can all be optimized in time. I don't think we have to worry about it. Jul 04 06:27:35 I can't wait to see native apps running on tis thing Jul 04 06:27:36 for me, iphones only exist on engadget and /. Jul 04 06:27:41 The hardware is fine. Jul 04 06:27:43 and digg, of course Jul 04 06:27:45 bkuberek: how native? Jul 04 06:27:49 CPU is more than powerful enough. Jul 04 06:27:56 destinal :-) Jul 04 06:28:00 there's DOOM and MAME etc but they require you kill luna to go direct to the frame buffer Jul 04 06:28:05 linux apps Jul 04 06:28:18 not web apps Jul 04 06:28:32 if not fb, what will you display on. there is no x11... Jul 04 06:28:36 Correct me if I am wrong but you have to kill luna to use any sort of thing like that? Jul 04 06:28:39 Browser plugins to run native code are really the best way to go, and I'm hacking on that now Jul 04 06:29:01 I see Jul 04 06:29:04 That's beyond my realm of knowledge. Jul 04 06:29:22 well until yesterday beyond mine as well :) Jul 04 06:29:27 like ssh in a browser kind of thing? Jul 04 06:29:29 hehe :) Jul 04 06:29:42 hi Jul 04 06:29:53 hey Jul 04 06:29:59 I don't even have a degree in computer related stuff. Jul 04 06:30:07 there was a /. story today on x386 emu in a browser, but it wasn't well received Jul 04 06:30:14 well I thought about it because if you look at the app.json config files there is a parameter that tells the type of app, wheterh it is web, or native Jul 04 06:30:17 hi Jul 04 06:30:33 haha! /. I get it sorry, it just clicked. Jul 04 06:30:39 how native works, I don't know. But I thought it was native linux I could be wrong Jul 04 06:30:44 <-- needs a micro-a male to usb-a female adapter Jul 04 06:30:49 sorry. slashdot Jul 04 06:30:55 bkuberek: you know, I didn't even know about that. are there any marked native? Jul 04 06:31:13 seigex: www.monoprice.com , www.newegg.com Jul 04 06:31:32 not that I know of Jul 04 06:31:36 i don't think newegg had one.. it has to be micro-a (host cable) and most of them are micro-b Jul 04 06:31:47 i found one at digikey but not sure how long it takes them to ship Jul 04 06:31:50 if there were native apps, I'd expect classic to be one, but it's not Jul 04 06:31:59 right Jul 04 06:32:08 I wonder if it's reserved for future use Jul 04 06:32:11 I guess they have that for the future Jul 04 06:32:17 Oh host cable Jul 04 06:32:18 right Jul 04 06:32:25 hmm did you try ebay? Jul 04 06:33:00 Didn't Palm say there were no native apps in webOS thus web OS? Jul 04 06:33:05 yeah .. i got the drivers set up for my pre to connect usb devices for it but i need the cable Jul 04 06:33:11 http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/07/03/1248246/Emulated-PC-Enables-Linux-Desktop-In-Your-Browser?from=rss Jul 04 06:33:32 I read online that they said before launch but after launch they revealed that native apps were possible Jul 04 06:33:37 eguy, there are native-style pluggins that can connect to your uprograms Jul 04 06:33:54 seigex: the USB chipset on the pre supports host mode then? Jul 04 06:33:58 which is how the gps works Jul 04 06:34:03 destinal yeah ti twl4030 Jul 04 06:34:09 (texas instruments) Jul 04 06:34:10 native apps *have* to be possible. what is everything else running in?? :-) Jul 04 06:34:15 it does host / peripheral and otg Jul 04 06:34:17 I guess native apps are background applications that extend support to web apps Jul 04 06:34:17 otg is what i'm going for Jul 04 06:34:38 (on the go) Jul 04 06:34:43 where it all depends on the plug you put in Jul 04 06:34:51 so that way you can still plug it into the computer as a mass storage device Jul 04 06:35:11 It doesn't support memory cards I will tell you that ;) Jul 04 06:35:13 only difference in the cable is pin 4 is grounded making it a micro-a cable Jul 04 06:35:19 what doesn't? Jul 04 06:35:23 Well...not without modification :P Jul 04 06:35:27 The Pre. Jul 04 06:35:50 you can add a 32-in-1 card reader :) Jul 04 06:35:56 using my usb method once i get that Jul 04 06:36:34 I thot it was only a client. this is good info. Jul 04 06:36:39 if for say, native apps need to turn luna off, there should be a mechanism that enables the switch between native apps, luna just being one of them native apps Jul 04 06:37:17 Who here hates the iPhone? Read this :D http://www.telegraph.co.uk/scienceandtechnology/technology/apple/5730555/Overheating-iPhone-3GS-Apple-blames-the-weather.html Jul 04 06:37:28 it was just li'l ol' linux kernel underneath last time I read. Jul 04 06:37:29 so the pre doesn't always need to be a pre, if you know what I'm saying Jul 04 06:37:33 ti-twl4030 does on-the-go .. but without the cable i can't test it :( Jul 04 06:37:51 ppl will flash it, no doubt. Jul 04 06:37:54 i made myself a homebrew one but i didn't realize it was a micro-b cord :( Jul 04 06:38:31 well, micro-b is what fits the phone, right? Jul 04 06:38:39 no micro fits the phone Jul 04 06:38:43 difference between a and b is pin 4 Jul 04 06:38:47 a is grounded b is not Jul 04 06:38:47 ah Jul 04 06:38:48 yup Jul 04 06:38:54 what he said Jul 04 06:38:55 if a is grounded then OTG drivers switch it to host mode :) Jul 04 06:39:02 and then we get to plug whatever we want in Jul 04 06:39:07 (especially thumb drives) Jul 04 06:39:11 seigex: so there are public OTG drivers? Jul 04 06:39:17 its in the kernel Jul 04 06:39:19 modules Jul 04 06:39:20 this is a very cool conversation Jul 04 06:39:28 really? out of the box? Jul 04 06:39:29 nice Jul 04 06:39:32 i have my pre set up so i can compile modules right on it Jul 04 06:39:38 its in the 2.6 linux kernel :D Jul 04 06:39:41 You should plug in an external enclosure with a 1TB hard drive hahahahahahahah Jul 04 06:39:43 i'm pretty excited about it Jul 04 06:39:46 I am so going to buy one when they get here to my forgotten, backwoods country Jul 04 06:39:50 eguy hah nice Jul 04 06:39:53 ah, I see, in the tree but no modules shipped on the pre Jul 04 06:40:01 cool Jul 04 06:40:06 destinal.. ehre's what i did Jul 04 06:40:10 i did the lvm mod Jul 04 06:40:11 No iPhone has 1.8TB of storage ha ha ha ha ha Jul 04 06:40:20 took a gig to make the opt partition Jul 04 06:40:23 they released the kernel tree? Jul 04 06:40:30 download the kernel from the opensource.palm.com website Jul 04 06:40:33 thend ownload the patch Jul 04 06:40:36 patch the kernel Jul 04 06:40:42 cool Jul 04 06:40:45 copy /boot/config-whateverit is to Jul 04 06:40:51 ./.config (in the kernel directory) Jul 04 06:40:53 download gcc Jul 04 06:40:55 and ur good to go Jul 04 06:41:02 you can compile custom kernels and modules Jul 04 06:41:16 who here is linux right now btw Jul 04 06:41:17 ok. y'all can forget my other questions. I want one. Jul 04 06:41:24 That's sweet. Jul 04 06:41:27 gemlog, what questions? Jul 04 06:41:28 lol Jul 04 06:41:30 oh Jul 04 06:41:32 yup, pretty standard. wow, so no manually switching from host to guest Jul 04 06:41:33 me. but only since 1994. a newcomer. Jul 04 06:41:40 only thing Jul 04 06:41:42 destinal.. all cord specific with OTG Jul 04 06:41:47 Before you joined the chat room ;) Jul 04 06:41:51 oh .. Jul 04 06:41:55 they may not have provided power to their chipset's power output Jul 04 06:41:57 I was asking about the phone quality at first for start. Jul 04 06:41:58 <--- started in 94 also Jul 04 06:42:02 I have Linux in VM's Jul 04 06:42:05 slack? Jul 04 06:42:06 i remember slackware 95.. Jul 04 06:42:09 yup Jul 04 06:42:10 si Jul 04 06:42:12 so we *may* need power injectors Jul 04 06:42:13 me too Jul 04 06:42:22 I am not much a Linux user Jul 04 06:42:25 still have the cd's and they are readable Jul 04 06:42:32 gemlog, can u send me ncurses..h Jul 04 06:42:32 err Jul 04 06:42:34 ncurses.h Jul 04 06:42:42 from...?? Jul 04 06:42:43 easier than searching for it ;) Jul 04 06:42:45 ie even if the chip is USB OTG they may not be compliant due to wiring Jul 04 06:42:49 oh ur not booted into linux Jul 04 06:42:53 We had the Slackware 95 discussion this morning on here hahaha :) Jul 04 06:43:05 I don't have anything else, I thought you wanted a legacy one. Jul 04 06:43:18 destinal, yeah it should be ok as long as they have a micro-ab receptical Jul 04 06:43:21 I'm on pclos 2009.1 upgraded just now Jul 04 06:43:26 which they should Jul 04 06:44:11 Anyone on here have XBL? I am gonna go play a game. Jul 04 06:44:24 maria 03-0758 Download> locate ncurses.h Jul 04 06:44:24 /usr/include/ncurses.h Jul 04 06:44:24 /usr/include/ncurses/ncurses.h Jul 04 06:44:32 yeah can u send me one of those Jul 04 06:44:45 sure. how? where? Jul 04 06:44:49 dcc here Jul 04 06:44:57 or email to gschreiner@gmail.com Jul 04 06:45:05 ok Jul 04 06:45:17 thnx Jul 04 06:46:49 it's gone Jul 04 06:46:57 much appreciated Jul 04 06:47:01 how can you not have that file? Jul 04 06:47:09 no prob Jul 04 06:49:04 Well, seigex must be happily compiling something I guess ;-) Jul 04 06:49:30 I should be thinking of questions to ask you guys. Jul 04 06:49:56 oh, any handwriting recognition. would a stylus kill the screen? Jul 04 06:50:13 a soft capacitive stylus would be ok Jul 04 06:50:38 they make some for the iphone Jul 04 06:50:39 an orig palm stylus would not? (I don't know the kind you say) Jul 04 06:50:46 right, not a palm stylus Jul 04 06:51:01 ok. any hand-writing apps so far? Jul 04 06:51:08 Nope Jul 04 06:51:10 a palm stylus is probably too hard Jul 04 06:51:16 but worse, it's not capacitive Jul 04 06:51:19 could be ported from the zaurus or something. Jul 04 06:51:26 Palm styli just don't work. Jul 04 06:51:52 the screen measures your touch based on your finger being mildly conductive Jul 04 06:52:02 just 'heard' the word capacitive. gotcha. Jul 04 06:52:06 go to ebay, search for iphone stylus. They work fine. $3 for 2, $5 for 5, free shipping. Jul 04 06:52:19 thanks rick. Jul 04 06:52:36 My Dell Latitude XT's stylus does not work and it is capacitive. Jul 04 06:52:39 hmmm Jul 04 06:52:51 que sr fawlty? Jul 04 06:52:57 back Jul 04 06:53:12 gemlog, well i'm usin the ncurses.h to run make menuconfig Jul 04 06:53:18 ok Jul 04 06:53:18 the ncurses library is on the pre but not the headers Jul 04 06:53:24 oh Jul 04 06:53:33 sing out for anything else Jul 04 06:53:34 Eguy: the capacitance levels may be different Jul 04 06:53:46 as it comes up, as it surely will... Jul 04 06:53:48 the iphone is designed to work with touch so stylus there must be similar to skin Jul 04 06:53:58 same with the pre, so there you go, use iphone stylii Jul 04 06:54:10 can't you add a repo that has the headers? Jul 04 06:54:12 That's what I figured. Jul 04 06:54:13 gemlog, i'm not in linux otherwise i'd have it Jul 04 06:54:17 i'm in windows 7 right now :) Jul 04 06:54:23 oh Jul 04 06:54:33 well i'm goin to set up libcurses-devel Jul 04 06:54:35 I still can't believe how many people are using win 7 already. Jul 04 06:54:36 but just haven't had time Jul 04 06:54:50 Eguy: you also have selection bias in this channel :) Jul 04 06:55:02 ok. I don't own an ms lic. so I just don't even think of that. sorry dude. Jul 04 06:55:38 gemlog: they're giving away win 7 betas / release candidates aren't they? Jul 04 06:55:41 I guess they had a pretty good turnout for the Beta and RC Jul 04 06:55:44 yup Jul 04 06:55:55 destinal: yes they are. have been for a while. Jul 04 06:56:15 The beta just expired and you can't boot anymore Jul 04 06:56:20 or login. Jul 04 06:56:25 so those of you using it, how do you compare it to XP and Vista? Jul 04 06:56:26 destinal: oh, I see. No, it's not bucks -- I just don't want an ms o/s on any box ever. Jul 04 06:56:32 gemlog: fair enough Jul 04 06:56:39 on the wallpaper switcher how can i change it from 1 min to 5 min? Jul 04 06:57:02 gemlog, well unfortunately every time i bought a laptop or computer an ms license came with it :) but this is actually windows 7 rc1 Jul 04 06:57:03 destinal: I have to work on some. those that run certain, niche apps. I'm not unfamiliar. Jul 04 06:57:13 I think it is great, I have been testing microsoft OS's since 2000 though so I am impartial. Jul 04 06:57:31 Driver support is great Jul 04 06:57:52 Eguy: but if you had to choose between xp and vista, which? then if you had to choose between vista and 7, which. then xp and 7, etc? Jul 04 06:58:00 I don't wanna scrap. just here for palmpre goodness :-) Jul 04 06:58:02 Visually, it is impressive. Especially with touch. Jul 04 06:58:20 I would go 7, Vista, XP believe it or not. Jul 04 06:58:34 Vista isn't really as bad as the wrap it good. Jul 04 06:58:38 got* Jul 04 06:58:59 I'm one of the folks who almost always turns on classic modes on things, so I didn't like vista much Jul 04 06:59:03 well i fix computers so i don't have much of a choice to know what i'm talking about when it comes to microsoft os's Jul 04 06:59:05 :) Jul 04 06:59:11 however, linux is a personal fave Jul 04 06:59:13 me too Jul 04 06:59:15 I've never had a bsod in Vista Jul 04 07:00:02 I mean, I also make my money coding apps and doing networking with various, AND I also turn on 'classic mode' :-) Jul 04 07:01:03 It just cracked midnight for me here. If I don't mention later, i want to really thank you guys for convincing me that a palmpre would not make me sad. Jul 04 07:01:30 You know, because it's what I wanted to hear ;-) Jul 04 07:02:18 gemlog: :) it's a cool toy, and the hackers here are working to keep making it cooler. Jul 04 07:02:31 I mean, at work I use XP and Server 03, Vista is a disaster for domains but for home use and when I do private consulting, I maintain that VIsta is just fine. Jul 04 07:02:45 destinal: agreed, well said. Jul 04 07:02:49 oh, another q: is it hard to type some symbols like the pipe symbol (or others)? Jul 04 07:02:59 Nope Jul 04 07:03:13 cool Jul 04 07:03:14 Just hit the sym button and tap the symbol. Jul 04 07:03:24 Or use orange + the key Jul 04 07:03:38 a lot of them are orange + key (orange is like fn on some keyboards kind of) Jul 04 07:03:51 but it's fast once you get used to the thumb board Jul 04 07:03:51 I wanna go to bed, but I hate wasting all this knowledge... Jul 04 07:04:24 oh, gps apps for driving -- usable? existing? Jul 04 07:04:41 gemlog: it ships with a turn by turn gps, sprint navigation Jul 04 07:04:56 no sprint here in .ca tho Jul 04 07:05:03 maybe bell will do the same Jul 04 07:05:17 gemlog:they may. there's also google maps Jul 04 07:05:21 ok, no sprint near me, maybe in metro .ca Jul 04 07:05:23 but it's not voice tbt Jul 04 07:05:32 Isn't Bell going to have it? Jul 04 07:05:39 that's fine Jul 04 07:05:50 I believe bell is going to have it, yes. Jul 04 07:06:00 their site says so, but no dates or prices. Jul 04 07:06:20 IMO the Sprint Nav is such a POS, I use my Nuvi :) Jul 04 07:06:45 there's always an opportunity for an OSS project to take over there too Jul 04 07:06:51 but it'll take a while Jul 04 07:07:28 well. My previous aspiration was the moko. No signal here for it until last month (yay!) but their irc didn't have happy campers on it like this one does. Jul 04 07:07:44 where is alias commad located? Jul 04 07:07:50 gemlog: yeah, I watched the Neo 1973 and freerunner for a long time Jul 04 07:08:01 alias is a built-in in the bash shell (and others) Jul 04 07:08:14 destinal: me too :-( Jul 04 07:08:21 gemlog: it looks like palm has (without intending to necessarily) shipped a lot of what the openmoko users wanted Jul 04 07:08:29 it says alias: command not found Jul 04 07:08:33 maybe the whole platform isn't open, but it doesn't lock you out either Jul 04 07:08:40 Oh, I think they watched all right Jul 04 07:08:56 I suspect Palm did what they did because it was fast / easy /cheap Jul 04 07:09:00 sorry bkuberek, you may not be in a bash shell. anyone know? Jul 04 07:09:08 why spend money locking us out of our own phones, really? Jul 04 07:09:18 yes! really! Jul 04 07:09:21 amen Jul 04 07:09:32 controll Jul 04 07:09:43 see, palm doesn't seem to be control freaks. more power to them Jul 04 07:09:49 what shell defaults on the palmpre pls Jul 04 07:09:58 thx Jul 04 07:10:07 I bought a pre after finding out how easy it was to get a root shell and how much of a working distro there already was on the phone shipping Jul 04 07:10:17 plus multitouch and a good UI Jul 04 07:10:21 how can you go wrong? Jul 04 07:10:34 its a great phone Jul 04 07:10:53 gemlog: busybox Jul 04 07:10:54 what shell does it have by default when you root and ssh? Jul 04 07:11:04 bkuberek: if its just busybox (which it prolly is by default) you won't have all the bash goodness. sorry about that. never thought. Jul 04 07:11:16 you just have 'sh' then. Jul 04 07:11:16 you can install bash easily enough Jul 04 07:11:25 yay pullingj. Jul 04 07:11:27 just don't set your shell to bash before it is installed Jul 04 07:11:32 i used ipkg-opt to install busybox Jul 04 07:11:45 busybox is already installed Jul 04 07:11:52 the /bin/sh you are running is busybox Jul 04 07:12:00 you need to ipkg-opt install bash Jul 04 07:12:02 busybox is just sh Jul 04 07:12:09 ok Jul 04 07:12:20 chsh your user to /bin/bash and then test it in a new window Jul 04 07:12:34 after go and change /etc/passwd , find you and make it /bin/bash for login shell Jul 04 07:12:43 i'd ipkg-opt remove busybox (not ipkg remove) Jul 04 07:13:00 what? Jul 04 07:13:02 i'd recommend not changing root's shell incase you mess up and need back in Jul 04 07:13:22 don't remove any busybox anything anywhere Jul 04 07:13:27 i used ipkg-opt to install busybox Jul 04 07:13:29 oh Jul 04 07:13:31 yes. you can always just type /bin/bash in a shell to spawn a bash shell. Jul 04 07:13:35 yeah that's bad, missed that Jul 04 07:13:53 just installed bash Jul 04 07:13:55 then what pullingj said Jul 04 07:13:57 to test, before changing /etc/passwd Jul 04 07:14:00 how do I make it the default? Jul 04 07:14:17 you have to add /bin/sh and /opt/bin/bash to /etc/shells Jul 04 07:14:18 that would be in /etc/passwd, but test, test firrst Jul 04 07:14:25 ok Jul 04 07:14:31 chsh would be ideal if it is installed. if not edit /etc/passwd Jul 04 07:14:48 woohoo Jul 04 07:14:56 hello? Jul 04 07:15:01 it compiled? Jul 04 07:15:09 yeah but that ncurses didn't work Jul 04 07:15:13 so i found one made for arm Jul 04 07:15:17 libnucrses5-dev Jul 04 07:15:18 noob question - on ipkg-opt or apt-get type installs, can I specify multiple packages or do I have to do them all individually? Jul 04 07:15:23 and it worked perfect Jul 04 07:15:24 you didn't say... :-) Jul 04 07:15:28 sub, yes Jul 04 07:15:32 just seperated by space Jul 04 07:15:36 sweet Jul 04 07:15:37 thanks Jul 04 07:15:43 didn't say what? i said thnx like 2 times :) Jul 04 07:15:48 I don't have. I have an old tool chain for the zaurus somewhere tho that would. Jul 04 07:16:13 No, not thanks, that you needed arm. I'm too stoopid to think of that! Jul 04 07:17:35 now i have a menuconfig for the kernel .. awesome :D Jul 04 07:17:45 very! Jul 04 07:17:56 what are people finding to be a good size to play around with for debian chroot stuff? Jul 04 07:18:08 all the drivers for like the gps and motions are in the tree? Jul 04 07:18:15 seigex: http://blogs.forum.nokia.com/blog/kate-alholas-forum-nokia-blog/2008/01/21/usb-on-the-go Jul 04 07:18:37 see I did export SHELL=/bin/bash but there is no alias Jul 04 07:18:40 surgery on a microUSB cable, fun Jul 04 07:18:51 run /bin/bash Jul 04 07:19:17 I hit my head on switching to bash for about 20 minutes Jul 04 07:19:23 realized I specified bash as a directory Jul 04 07:19:27 make sure you didn't do that. Jul 04 07:19:38 si. don't put a slash after it. Jul 04 07:20:03 yeahh Jul 04 07:20:14 this phone is a good excuse to finally learn a lot of command line stuff I've never cared enough to Jul 04 07:20:16 Eguy: actually, rm -rf / is completely repairable by the doctor. Jul 04 07:20:46 but you need to run the doctor Jul 04 07:20:47 if bash is installed now, you should just be able to type 'bash' and be in a bash shell. Pop a new shell or log in and out to get new env vars. Jul 04 07:20:54 I messed up some js files who knows how to the extent that I couldn't repair with the doctor Jul 04 07:20:58 and sprint couldnt do anything Jul 04 07:21:25 could have cp'd originals on there Jul 04 07:21:32 so the file sys is ext2? Jul 04 07:22:47 ext3 Jul 04 07:22:48 you guys have put up some nice walkthroughs...good job Jul 04 07:23:06 Is it really Rod? Damn... no fun :( ;) Jul 04 07:23:07 same enough. just the only 'undeletable' ones Jul 04 07:24:12 destinal.. btw i just did surgery on one and it doesn't have a place where i can solder pin #4 Jul 04 07:24:15 only 1-3 and 5 Jul 04 07:24:23 I did reiserfs for years and left only because my world cup vids were too big for it too handle. It *did* coincide with him killing his wife tho... Jul 04 07:24:34 Now on xfs. Jul 04 07:24:37 yeah i did reiser until ext3 came out Jul 04 07:24:38 HAHA Jul 04 07:24:42 err..damned caps Jul 04 07:24:42 for journaling Jul 04 07:24:44 seigex: yeah, I notice the one in the article I sent had all the pins Jul 04 07:24:56 seigex: I wonder how common it is to just leave the pins off entirely Jul 04 07:25:01 reiser, xfs, jfs are all journalling tho Jul 04 07:25:17 it has aall the pins.. but the plastic doesn't have an opening to solder the other one.. sorta gay Jul 04 07:25:23 I tried jfs first, but it didn't like sudden power losses very much. Jul 04 07:25:30 and a waste of time and now my wife is bitching that i need to vacuum it up :) Jul 04 07:25:33 subhuman: I very much doubt that the doctor couldn't repair screwing with js files Jul 04 07:25:40 good link tho thnx Jul 04 07:25:43 seigex: well they cut it open to solder them, right? Jul 04 07:25:48 I was just after 20GB+ file sizes tho in the first place. Jul 04 07:25:49 what am I missing? Jul 04 07:26:03 it wouldnt pick up the phone on the usb connection screen Jul 04 07:26:08 yeah but i cut it open Jul 04 07:26:14 hahahaha Jul 04 07:26:17 subhuman: did you follow the volume up instructions exactly as on the wiki? Jul 04 07:26:18 down to the lowest part i could Jul 04 07:26:24 but it only has 4 pins exposed Jul 04 07:26:34 oh wait Jul 04 07:26:36 i see what they did Jul 04 07:26:37 nevermind Jul 04 07:26:39 thats a good idea Jul 04 07:26:39 now, I didn't follow any wiki instruction on the doctor. I figured it was a straight forward process Jul 04 07:26:48 whatever the case, sprint wasn't able to wipe it either Jul 04 07:26:52 thnx destinal.. u gave me a good idea Jul 04 07:27:16 subhuman: http://predev.wikidot.com/pre-not-booting-webos-doctor-how-to Jul 04 07:27:16 or someone elses good idea :) Jul 04 07:27:21 seigex: you're welcome :) Jul 04 07:27:23 subhuman: guarantee you could have got it back using that. Jul 04 07:27:28 no-one has failed yet. Jul 04 07:27:36 Crap, I was laughing so hard I nearly failed the song. Jul 04 07:27:44 interesting Jul 04 07:27:47 thanks Jul 04 07:28:04 The person in a Sprint store would have no idea. Jul 04 07:28:06 rwhitby: did you see? looks like seigex found USB OTG support in the kernel for the chipset we have and compiled the module and loaded it, we just need the right cable. Jul 04 07:28:12 I didn't assume so Jul 04 07:28:21 destinal: yep, I've been following seigex's work with interest. Jul 04 07:28:30 which is also why I was comfortable taking my self-'damaged' phone to them and saying 'wtf?!' Jul 04 07:29:15 subhuman: as long as they don't blame the return on webos-internals. that would be bad. Jul 04 07:29:37 it should be pretty clear that I am just retarded if anybody that knows what they're doing looks at it =/ Jul 04 07:29:45 haha Jul 04 07:29:57 seigex: you can buy some on digikey Jul 04 07:29:58 but yeah Jul 04 07:29:58 http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Cat=1573165&keywords=USB%20Hirose Jul 04 07:30:03 The person at the Sprint store dosen't even know what webOS is. Jul 04 07:30:04 I guess you're the gateway for this retard Jul 04 07:30:11 a little expensive Jul 04 07:30:14 Eguy it'll get sent back to palm, probably Jul 04 07:30:37 Well, Palm might know then :P Jul 04 07:30:43 ;) Jul 04 07:30:51 They placed a tracker bug and key logger in all the Pre's :P Jul 04 07:31:07 Nobody will look. They'll attempt to flash it and if that doesn't work, it will get binned. Jul 04 07:31:14 * subhuman nods Jul 04 07:31:19 just reimage the thing Jul 04 07:31:24 low level Jul 04 07:31:27 Palm already knows exactly how many Pre's have been rooted. The phone-home tells them every time. Jul 04 07:31:43 fancy Jul 04 07:31:46 rwhitby: ?? Jul 04 07:31:54 Have you tried walking into an Apple store? 50,000 volts Jul 04 07:32:00 gemlog: have a look at rxdx logs Jul 04 07:32:10 and the tarballs that get sent home to Palm Jul 04 07:32:11 Right from the usb door. Jul 04 07:32:20 rwhitby: point me pls? Jul 04 07:32:26 link? Jul 04 07:32:39 gemlog: search the channel logs for the last week. look for rxdx. Jul 04 07:32:43 Eguy that's what the 500mA setting is for the flash Jul 04 07:32:45 "flash" Jul 04 07:32:49 Oh, btw, I can't buy one yet. just got the idea of your post Jul 04 07:32:52 hahahaahah Jul 04 07:32:53 http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals/ Jul 04 07:33:05 nice subhuman. Jul 04 07:33:08 so, can't search my own (non-existant) phone Jul 04 07:33:27 they know all the serial numbers and phone numbers and stuff, they get a full ps -ef, and a full installed package list. Jul 04 07:33:35 You didn't expect turning "Developer Mode" didn't let Palm know? Jul 04 07:33:44 post a few lines? Jul 04 07:33:44 on* Jul 04 07:33:45 and they know exactly which wifi ssid's you've been close to. Jul 04 07:33:50 I just got pushed a system update on my Palm Pre. I assume this is 1.04, am I right? Jul 04 07:33:58 yes zodttd Jul 04 07:34:00 ok Jul 04 07:34:05 then they'll get a kick out of good ol baby jesus rimjob Jul 04 07:34:18 I should change my SSID :O Jul 04 07:34:31 no, that kind of bs just doesn't occur to me. not being sarcastic; i just don't think that way. Jul 04 07:34:42 It's set to **** Palm right now, you reckon I should change it? :P Jul 04 07:34:51 so palm is truing to take over the pre markets through a patchwork of compromised wireless networks Jul 04 07:34:53 trying. Jul 04 07:34:57 gemlog: webos-internals.20090630.txt:Jun 29 09:06:14 Jul 04 07:35:12 hey zodttd Jul 04 07:35:16 scary Jul 04 07:35:30 heya! Been so busy on my end of things Jul 04 07:35:49 zodttd use the update function and see if 1.0.4 is available Jul 04 07:35:56 zodttd: we're doing quilting for mods, and investigating plugins Jul 04 07:35:57 still Jul 04 07:36:15 probably not. Jul 04 07:36:20 zodttd: http://predev.wikidot.com/browser-plugins Jul 04 07:36:25 rwhitby: either xchat can't deal with that or I need you to tell me how to read it... Jul 04 07:36:25 rwhitby: I see the DSP bridge is available on the Pre Jul 04 07:36:36 rwhitby: This is something the Pandora lacks currently. Very cool Jul 04 07:37:18 Wait, should rdxd info be in the TOS when you accept the license agreement? Unless it is there... Jul 04 07:37:24 gemlog: go to the logs URL I posted. Look for the filename and date. Jul 04 07:37:52 It's pretty darn Big Brother ish Jul 04 07:37:53 zodttd: do you have details of how to use the dspbridge? Jul 04 07:38:01 rwhitby: Perhaps my friend Exophase does Jul 04 07:38:12 I can find out soon Jul 04 07:38:21 If not, I will ask the Pandora team for details Jul 04 07:38:32 zodttd: we're now looking to see how the Palm plugins do drawing out the back end. Jul 04 07:38:36 gotcha, thx Jul 04 07:38:37 I have OMAP3430 OGLES 2.0 SDK Jul 04 07:38:41 If thats of use Jul 04 07:38:43 once we've got that, we should be able to do a native terminal plugin. Jul 04 07:39:09 zodttd: redistributable, or under NDA? Jul 04 07:39:09 Ahhh! Jul 04 07:39:18 ::whistles:: Jul 04 07:39:20 :) Jul 04 07:39:27 :D Jul 04 07:39:34 shhh... :P Jul 04 07:39:47 zodttd: I won't ask for it, since this channel is logged. Jul 04 07:40:25 Yeah, I cant / wont give it out. Jul 04 07:40:36 No, you shouldn't... Jul 04 07:40:46 nod Jul 04 07:41:02 It's like an italian mafia in here right now Jul 04 07:41:16 rwhitby: that rdxd stuff is a bit of a bummer Jul 04 07:41:37 rwhitby: bloody heck. this old and I'm that naive yet. Jul 04 07:41:41 jdub: meh - google already knows all that stuff anyway. Palm and Sprint knowing it as well is no biggie. Jul 04 07:41:50 It's a bit invasive IMO. That's pretty tsk tsk of them. Jul 04 07:41:59 ^ True Jul 04 07:42:11 Bet you there is some fine print that you agreed to when you turned on the phone for the first time. Jul 04 07:42:14 rwhitby: process lists, device ids... Jul 04 07:42:22 Your unsafe everytime you click connect Jul 04 07:42:47 Prob right Rod. When you first activate the device at the very bottom of the TOS. Jul 04 07:42:50 rwhitby: no phone in .ca yet... Jul 04 07:43:03 gemlog: your safe! Jul 04 07:43:04 gemlog: no phone here in .au either ... Jul 04 07:43:13 :-) Jul 04 07:43:13 Run! Run as far as you can! Jul 04 07:43:19 Don't stop running! Jul 04 07:43:29 I.Want.That.H/W. Jul 04 07:43:34 I just do. Jul 04 07:43:39 Don't look back! Jul 04 07:43:48 gemlog: actually, I'm happy to wait until they fix the build quality. Jul 04 07:44:05 v2 won't be long in coming. Jul 04 07:44:19 I remember when I first watched the CES press demos, I was litterly banging my desk in anticipation for the new OS. Jul 04 07:44:20 tbh, all I read about is the slider tho. Jul 04 07:44:26 no, I want a mature v1. v2 1.0 build quality will be just as bad. Jul 04 07:44:31 Yeah, slider was not a good choice. Jul 04 07:44:44 ok, you know what I meant... Jul 04 07:45:10 I know and like 'a' slider from using the zaurus. Jul 04 07:45:15 I'm hoping they learn from the cdma hardware before they push the button on the gsm runs Jul 04 07:45:29 just read there were mech probs with the palmpre slider is all. Jul 04 07:45:56 I only JUST got gsm in my neck of the woods. all cdma else Jul 04 07:46:06 I think the GSM announcement is coming next week. Jul 04 07:46:11 I heard they only 150K out of the first 500K order. So you can imagine that a lot of those 150K were borderline acceptable. Jul 04 07:46:17 wonder how many bands Jul 04 07:46:40 I heard that from a little birdie who is now dead so you know it is reliable. Jul 04 07:46:40 Palm usually does quad band GSM, and hopefully this will be tri band UMTS too. Jul 04 07:46:42 who built them anyhow? Jul 04 07:46:49 Foxconn Jul 04 07:46:54 ah Jul 04 07:47:30 oh shoot. I've fallen behind again. have to look up umts now... Jul 04 07:47:47 it's gotta work in .au 850 umts, all 4 gsm freqs, and us, japan and .eu umts too. Jul 04 07:47:50 Its HSDPA Jul 04 07:48:01 slower than EVDO Jul 04 07:48:38 Except in Japan, everything is faster there. Jul 04 07:49:17 anything that needs new towers will take ages to hit me; not enough subs here to bother with Jul 04 07:51:34 the .au umts network peaks at 14.4Mbps. Jul 04 07:51:54 (well Telstra's Next-G supposedly does) Jul 04 07:52:20 ("Next-G" is their marketing speak for HSDPA/HSUPA) Jul 04 07:52:35 how fast is evdo? Jul 04 07:52:38 must say, I have *not* heard nice things about telstra. sound like my own telus tbh. Jul 04 07:52:56 I wonder if devices actually get that Jul 04 07:53:15 ok, first draft of othello game running on pre. Jul 04 07:53:18 Eguy: oh, you can guarantee no device gets that unless it's the only device in the cell and it's right next to the tower. Jul 04 07:53:22 and that's enough for tonight. Jul 04 07:53:29 Sprint's EV can get into the sevens Jul 04 07:54:00 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EV-DO Jul 04 07:54:13 gemlog: telstra is the entrenched old monopoly, with all the related practices that go with that. Jul 04 07:54:13 That is on the device not network peak Jul 04 07:54:15 My business partner lives 1.5 km from a sprint tower, flat line of site. Jul 04 07:54:26 rwhitby: yeah, I know. Jul 04 07:54:26 and it's rural. Jul 04 07:54:29 oooo gsmlog: telus is horrible Jul 04 07:54:46 She gets 5mbps -regularly- on her sprint card. Jul 04 07:54:54 telus is the devil. kill it with fire on sight. Jul 04 07:54:56 Verizon's EV is slow as hell Jul 04 07:55:04 anyway gnight all Jul 04 07:55:08 AT&T's EDGE/3G is pathetic Jul 04 07:55:11 'nite rick Jul 04 07:55:14 Cya Rick Jul 04 07:55:41 Oh yes, if you use a Sprint data card, the speeds are magical. Jul 04 07:56:31 how so? (sprint is just an old lady died blonde to me, no service here) Jul 04 07:57:21 (yawn) late in the states, time for bed. good night all Jul 04 07:57:25 Like Rick said, you can get constant 5mbps speeds Jul 04 07:57:26 crazy damned boot time on these phones Jul 04 07:57:30 'nite destinal Jul 04 07:57:36 hahaha yes subhuman Jul 04 07:57:45 cya destinal Jul 04 07:57:59 night destinal_sleepin Jul 04 07:58:19 Although the Pre's 1:30 pales in comparison to a BlackBerr's 3 year boot up time. Jul 04 07:58:27 zodttd: night Jul 04 07:58:31 Blackberry's* Jul 04 07:59:26 grrr. do not want to talk about bb. one of my clients bought two. telus demands at *least* you leave messages on their server for 30min to guarantee a push. how stupid is that? Jul 04 07:59:43 also telus only has 10mb total size mboxes... Jul 04 08:00:13 I should do like destinal and just go to bed I think :-) Jul 04 08:00:25 Anyone overclock past 600MHz on their Pre? Jul 04 08:00:41 later guys Jul 04 08:00:51 I've seen this SoC's CPU get to 900MHz in open air environments Jul 04 08:02:41 hello! i'm a noob stuck on "ValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '', when trying to root my pre. please help me out. thanks! Jul 04 08:03:42 hahah Jul 04 08:04:52 Come on, zodttd. You think somone is going to walk around with all the casing off the Pre and a fan blowing on the CPU powered by a 9v battery? :P Jul 04 08:05:57 Well you will need to up the voltage to get past 600MHz or so...So more heat. But these A8's OC really well Jul 04 08:06:56 the pre could boot even faster Jul 04 08:07:05 The last thing I need on my Pre is heat, it gets so freaking hot some times. Jul 04 08:08:37 I am sure if it ran at 900mhz and didn't melt the Pre would boot in 30 seconds or less :P Jul 04 08:09:33 I don't mean that Jul 04 08:10:03 I mean kernel and init could be optimized even more than they balready are Jul 04 08:14:39 Well...time for me to leave Jul 04 08:15:00 Enough webOS talk for one day for me :) Jul 04 08:15:49 anyone know how to manually write a prl file? Jul 04 08:16:17 I believe that's off topic here Jul 04 08:17:25 no idea if webos itself has a way to do it, wm does on htc devices oddly enough Jul 04 08:18:02