**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jul 18 02:59:56 2009 Jul 18 03:00:01 i should charge people by the minute on the flashlight app. Once the switch is on i start getting paid until they flick the switch off Jul 18 03:00:07 PreGame: lol Jul 18 03:00:15 i could retire Jul 18 03:01:46 anyone know how to use showAlertDialog() outside of the controller? Jul 18 03:01:55 the thing is to my mind, donations are like patronage Jul 18 03:02:17 telling the author you want to see more from them and giving them a reason to do that and not other paid work for clients or whatever Jul 18 03:02:26 i'm a little upset the pre doesn't have IR Jul 18 03:02:38 much better than closed source proprietary purchases. Jul 18 03:03:13 PreGame: you could probably do IR with an IR LED and the headphone jack Jul 18 03:03:13 destinal_: nslu2-linux stuff was all MIT and GPL, and got over USD$10K in donations, all of which was spent on hardware for the community resources Jul 18 03:03:24 rwhitby: infra is another great use Jul 18 03:04:11 http://uiremote.wordpress.com/ Jul 18 03:04:46 err infrastructure is another great use not to be confused with infrared remotes via sound output that I just posted Jul 18 03:06:10 destinal_: the servers we're setting up for this community were paid for by the nslu2-linux and nas-central communities :-) Jul 18 03:06:33 rwhitby: thanks, communities! Jul 18 03:06:34 one would hope that this community will then donate forward to help set up the next big thing in open source Jul 18 03:06:34 :) Jul 18 03:07:05 rwhitby: yeah, gives people a choice to contribute their time or their money and either is valuable to keep things going Jul 18 03:08:15 destinal_: absolutely Jul 18 03:13:36 fack, Mojo.Controller.showAlertDialog doesn't work :( Jul 18 03:16:51 Anyone know if there is an "always on" option for the idle timeout" Jul 18 03:17:24 the "AvailableTimers" in securityconfig-assistant.js Jul 18 03:17:52 goatslacker: try this.controller.showAlertDialog Jul 18 03:22:44 destinal_, i'm not in the assistant so i can't use this Jul 18 03:23:11 oh, I don't know how to do it not in the assistant Jul 18 03:24:08 i think it's supposed to be using Mojo.Controller.showAlertDialog Jul 18 03:24:20 just noting how the existing apps do it Jul 18 03:24:31 i also tried MyAssistant.Controller.showAlertDialog Jul 18 03:29:13 i think i'm gonna purchase a domain so that I can get donations as well Jul 18 03:33:05 DeCiBeL: dunno, looking into it, it's in the same as luna-send -n 1 palm://com.palm.display/control/setProperty '{"timeout":0}' (not sure zero actually works) Jul 18 03:34:09 unfortunately :1.6 (busname=com.palm.display pid=1049 procname=/usr/bin/LunaSysMgr) Jul 18 03:34:16 so it's in Luna itself Jul 18 03:34:43 for some reason getpropery isn't working or I don't know how to use it Jul 18 03:47:54 what command are you sending? Jul 18 03:51:06 is there a way to have luna spit out an entire tree or forest of settings/values? Jul 18 03:53:35 whats up whats up Jul 18 03:54:51 oc80z: mytether.net installs a proof-of-concept ipkg and opens lots of pre owners up to simple trojan installation ... Jul 18 03:55:27 lol Jul 18 03:59:43 rwhitby: it sounds sweet, im a predev noob Jul 18 04:00:20 PuffTheMagic: yeah, trojans are sweet. The interwebz be serious bizniz Jul 18 04:00:44 what jar is com.palm.display? Jul 18 04:00:44 ? Jul 18 04:01:28 has any one managed to put a terminal window on the pre itself yet? Jul 18 04:01:45 there's a few different ways to go about doing it Jul 18 04:01:59 none just run as a program yet though, if i'm not mistaken Jul 18 04:02:06 there is an application called commander which is like a shell Jul 18 04:02:06 ok Jul 18 04:02:22 lets you run commands on it Jul 18 04:02:28 pre, where's that? Jul 18 04:02:36 its on git Jul 18 04:02:44 ~git Jul 18 04:02:48 shit, i'm a git retard Jul 18 04:02:49 ~repo Jul 18 04:02:50 The webos-internals source code repositories are hosted at http://gitorious.org/webos-internals and http://gitorious.org/webos-applications Jul 18 04:03:52 do we have a git basics tut somewhere? Jul 18 04:03:53 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/trees/master/org.webosinternals.commander Jul 18 04:04:03 yea google.com Jul 18 04:04:28 it's not any different on the pre? Jul 18 04:04:51 ? Jul 18 04:05:18 Technobabble: google has some Jul 18 04:05:25 Technobabble: it's git. git is git. Jul 18 04:11:25 installing git... Jul 18 04:12:44 git out Jul 18 04:12:57 Noahbody: destinal is working on a plugin Jul 18 04:15:08 does the camera work on the emulator? Jul 18 04:15:53 no Jul 18 04:16:16 and the debugger doesnt work on the pre? Jul 18 04:17:07 so is it git checkout? Jul 18 04:17:43 wait, git clone? Jul 18 04:17:59 git clone url Jul 18 04:18:24 checkout == svn Jul 18 04:18:26 clone == git Jul 18 04:18:55 yeah, i'm seeing that here Jul 18 04:18:57 i'm used to svn Jul 18 04:19:14 so do i have to make a directory for this to go in, like i would with svn? Jul 18 04:19:31 it makes one Jul 18 04:21:15 fatal: http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/trees/master/org.webosinternals.commander/info/refs not found: did you run git update-server-info on the server? Jul 18 04:21:41 pointing it at the wrong place? Jul 18 04:44:05 destinal_: ping Jul 18 04:44:06 $ nm -C ~/libPiranha.so | grep "PColor32::PColor32" Jul 18 04:44:06 000aa310 T PColor32::PColor32(unsigned int, unsigned int, unsigned int, unsigned int) Jul 18 04:44:15 when i use unsigned int in my header Jul 18 04:44:21 Luna segfaults Jul 18 04:44:24 if i use int Jul 18 04:44:28 i get random colors Jul 18 04:45:25 win Jul 18 04:51:25 bzhou * r10463 optware/trunk/make/rxtx.mk: rxtx: updated template Jul 18 04:51:35 bzhou * r10464 optware/trunk/ (10 files in 2 dirs): rxtx: java native serial lib. Added & promoted, does not build on mips or powerpc Jul 18 04:54:21 PuffTheMagic: pong Jul 18 04:54:46 destinal_: see above Jul 18 04:59:16 PuffTheMagic: but color is 32 by definition, how can those be ints? they have to be bytes Jul 18 04:59:27 R G B A Jul 18 04:59:29 one byte each Jul 18 04:59:38 32 bits Jul 18 04:59:59 egrep -r PColor32 WebCore Jul 18 05:00:07 all the refereces I get use int Jul 18 05:00:15 and once I think i saw 0x0 Jul 18 05:00:27 good Jul 18 05:00:55 tmzt: elaborate please? :P Jul 18 05:00:59 you mean per color is int? Jul 18 05:01:17 I thought he meant he fond that PColor32 was long Jul 18 05:01:48 where is PColor32 used? Jul 18 05:02:33 in what context? Jul 18 05:03:10 most of the platform/graphics/pg/*.cpp files use it at some point Jul 18 05:03:22 to set fill and stroke colors Jul 18 05:03:25 but how? Jul 18 05:03:42 only for that reason? Jul 18 05:03:46 m_data->context->setFillColor(PColor32(0, 0, 0, 0)); Jul 18 05:03:50 that is an example Jul 18 05:04:11 tmzt: im sure the other browser plugins use it too Jul 18 05:04:16 but i cant see the source for them Jul 18 05:04:19 so idk how they use it Jul 18 05:04:32 but never as a framebuffer or pixmap? Jul 18 05:04:52 this makes sense, keeps the math simple, avoids overflows, etc. Jul 18 05:04:52 no this is more higher level Jul 18 05:05:15 this is for the 2D primitive stuff in the pirahna lib Jul 18 05:05:32 only BrowserAdapter.c seems to use it out of all Jul 18 05:05:34 yeah Jul 18 05:05:58 how is this a problem then? Jul 18 05:06:00 destinal_: where is that? Jul 18 05:07:08 we don't have the source code and it would probably end in cpp if we did :) I don't know, crossed mental circuitry Jul 18 05:07:17 BrowserAdapter uses it though Jul 18 05:07:28 Technobabble: use git:// not http:// Jul 18 05:07:39 rwhitby, i tried that too Jul 18 05:07:53 Technobabble: you dont have the right url Jul 18 05:07:56 Technobabble: exactly what git URL are you using? Jul 18 05:08:07 that's what i was asking for Jul 18 05:08:33 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/trees/master/org.webosinternals.commander is the link i was given Jul 18 05:08:41 destinal_: how do you know BrowserAdapter uses it then? Jul 18 05:08:48 but i'm supposed to be using a repo that ends in .git, i'm assuming Jul 18 05:08:56 Technobabble: look on http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/applications/ for correct clone instructions. don't just guess. Jul 18 05:09:37 tmzt: symbol table Jul 18 05:10:08 Technobabble: given by whom? Jul 18 05:11:03 Technobabble: PreGame gave you a URL for the online source browser, not the git clone URL. Jul 18 05:12:07 ah Jul 18 05:12:14 right, c++ will do that Jul 18 05:12:19 * rwhitby bbl Jul 18 05:12:25 bai Jul 18 05:12:37 rwhitby, yeah, that's what i wasn't understanding Jul 18 05:14:30 anyone tried installing the SDK on a win7 machine? it doesnt work for me, it always almost finished but then rolls back changes Jul 18 05:26:35 PuffTheMagic: do you think make-generated-sources.sh has to do with the headers you thought were generated? Jul 18 05:27:14 yeah Jul 18 05:27:21 i sorta had that feeling Jul 18 05:27:42 I apt-get install bison gperf and still it fails Jul 18 05:27:51 Can't locate object method "WK_ucfirst" via package "CodeGenerator" at Jul 18 05:29:32 I get inconsistent results re: pcolor Jul 18 05:29:35 ./platform/graphics/pg/GradientPG.cpp: c->setFillColor(PColor32(g->r, g->g, g->b, g->a)); Jul 18 05:29:35 ./platform/graphics/pg/PGContext.cpp: strokeColor = PColor32(0, 0, 0); Jul 18 05:29:35 ./platform/graphics/pg/PGContext.cpp: fillColor = PColor32(0xFF, 0xFF, 0xFF); Jul 18 05:30:03 in some cases it's clearly three bytes (RGB) in others it's RGBA Jul 18 05:30:03 yeah... but in libPirahna.so Jul 18 05:30:18 its def (unsigned int, unsigned in, unsigned int, unsigned in) Jul 18 05:30:28 idk where all this other stuff is coming from Jul 18 05:30:56 c++ allows overloading Jul 18 05:31:02 right Jul 18 05:31:03 tmzt: ah, right Jul 18 05:31:05 overloading Jul 18 05:31:06 but its not in the .so file Jul 18 05:31:18 we can assume it inits alpha, either to 0 1L Jul 18 05:31:25 1U Jul 18 05:31:25 wouldnt the overloaded functions still show up in the symbol dump Jul 18 05:31:43 not if they're static Jul 18 05:31:46 I think Jul 18 05:31:58 or constructors? Jul 18 05:32:51 static inline PColor32 colorToPColor(const Color& col) { Jul 18 05:32:51 return PColor32(col.red(), col.green(), col.blue(), col.alpha()); Jul 18 05:32:51 } Jul 18 05:32:56 platform/graphics/pg/GraphicsContextPG.cpp Jul 18 05:33:53 color is in Jul 18 05:33:59 platform/graphics/Color.cpp Jul 18 05:34:08 platform/graphics/Color.h Jul 18 05:34:21 and that needs more missing headers Jul 18 05:34:25 yup ints Jul 18 05:34:59 i tried doing PColor32(0,0,255) Jul 18 05:35:05 i get random colors with that too Jul 18 05:36:05 and PColor32(255) Jul 18 05:36:10 which i know is wrong Jul 18 05:36:14 gives random colors Jul 18 05:36:22 so it's broken Jul 18 05:36:26 yeah Jul 18 05:36:29 well Jul 18 05:36:32 the prototype is wrong Jul 18 05:36:35 the way we're using it anyway Jul 18 05:36:38 but Jul 18 05:36:42 when i do unsigned int Jul 18 05:36:49 it segfaults Jul 18 05:36:53 yeah it should be ints it appears Jul 18 05:36:56 it converts them Jul 18 05:36:56 which might be a step in the right direction Jul 18 05:37:25 what converts them Jul 18 05:37:39 colorToPColor is something else Jul 18 05:37:44 oh nm Jul 18 05:37:46 thats not part of the PColor32 class Jul 18 05:38:05 this is gonna be a pita Jul 18 05:38:45 err Jul 18 05:38:47 already is Jul 18 05:38:48 ;) Jul 18 05:41:31 destinal: when run objdump -CRd on the BrowserAdapter.so Jul 18 05:41:45 i get Jul 18 05:41:55 so everything points to it being unsigned int Jul 18 05:42:21 so maybe its my .cpp that is breaking it not the header Jul 18 05:42:48 well they're the same size Jul 18 05:42:53 so that shouldn't really matter Jul 18 05:43:13 our values might be wrong but they would be consistent at least and 0 signed is 0 unsigned Jul 18 05:43:45 liesssss Jul 18 05:44:29 or, no? is 0 signed 32768 unsigned? Jul 18 05:45:12 PuffTheMagic: in that case maybe you're right. size same but values matter Jul 18 05:45:48 but it could be crashing also because it's getting fed 32768 where it expects 1-2555 Jul 18 05:45:49 255 Jul 18 05:46:05 because it should be declared as signed and isn't Jul 18 05:46:31 what do you think? Jul 18 05:46:41 destinal: no Jul 18 05:46:48 i think you confused me, the header is unsigned int Jul 18 05:46:50 I was pulling your leg Jul 18 05:47:01 and i am putting in a int Jul 18 05:47:05 which is signed default Jul 18 05:47:17 PhrkOnLsh: I think you're right actually the first bit is the +/- bit in a signed value Jul 18 05:47:33 cuts its effective values in half but it also means we may be +1 MSB more than I thought Jul 18 05:47:36 * PhrkOnLsh shrugs and disappears into the night. Jul 18 05:47:41 :) Jul 18 05:49:58 uh, this is c++, abi is important Jul 18 05:50:11 I don't remember whether - or + gets +1 MSB Jul 18 05:50:24 wther that causes the segfault or not I don't know though Jul 18 05:51:38 it could depending on what it does with the number Jul 18 05:52:31 yeah Jul 18 05:54:09 tmzt: are you joining the ranks of the sdk or staying safely out of it? Jul 18 05:54:45 not sure yet? what's in it? Jul 18 05:54:57 no native stuff right? Jul 18 05:55:12 eclipse plugin for palm development, the tools to push stuff, the emulator image Jul 18 05:55:39 no native stuff yet Jul 18 05:55:55 if you got it you could hack on this stuff though.. wouldn't _that_ be fun? :) Jul 18 05:56:06 on x86? Jul 18 05:56:09 yeah Jul 18 05:56:49 maybe Jul 18 05:56:55 x86 is great for getting us to a working plugin, then we can cross compile later and get it running on real pre's Jul 18 05:58:22 in like a year Jul 18 05:58:25 when we figure this out Jul 18 05:58:29 PuffTheMagic: lol Jul 18 05:58:31 nah Jul 18 05:58:47 the higher, the fewer. or uh, I mean, the more the merrier Jul 18 05:59:48 PuffTheMagic: it may be worth while to just send pixmaps Jul 18 05:59:58 we don't need all of this to work for now Jul 18 06:00:20 just enough to get us something to layer on with a sane gfx library we understand Jul 18 06:00:39 well we dont even need this to make the terminal Jul 18 06:00:51 fonts would be nice Jul 18 06:01:01 we can use css/html/js Jul 18 06:01:07 yeah that's true Jul 18 06:01:08 we just need plugin events Jul 18 06:01:16 to get the pty stuff Jul 18 06:01:28 well we need events + scripting extensions to expose methods Jul 18 06:01:49 but all of that's pretty standard Jul 18 06:02:08 I think pretty much straight npapi Jul 18 06:06:52 regardless-- I'll attack it in the morning. too tired to keep it straight in my head right now Jul 18 06:07:03 night all Jul 18 06:08:05 night Jul 18 06:21:18 howdy Jul 18 06:35:38 yup Jul 18 06:49:09 wow, someones gotta make that myavatar mod a patch Jul 18 06:49:14 cause its intense O_o Jul 18 06:59:02 bzhou * r10465 optware/trunk/make/rxtx.mk: rxtx: fixed build for slugos{be,le}, syno-x07 Jul 18 09:20:31 hrm Jul 18 09:20:41 i agree FuMan Jul 18 09:20:58 not only that, but the gChat message Jul 18 09:21:10 "u shre you want to send user is offline" Jul 18 09:21:19 ...and obv the Global Addon Search Jul 18 09:23:51 Which should DEFINITLY include Global Address Search (exchange servers) Jul 18 09:24:13 u know, gimmie that contact asap! Jul 18 10:06:11 I have rooted the pre and am able to log in with putty, but when I try to edit /etc/dnsmasq.palm.conf it tells me permission denied Jul 18 10:06:22 is there something else I need to do besides getting root access to be able to edit files? Jul 18 10:09:16 not in that case Jul 18 10:09:31 but it needs ro be read/write also Jul 18 10:09:46 yeah, I tried to chmod it but it said it was a read only filesystem Jul 18 10:10:16 guess I should follow the "next steps after rooting." I wish I knew what I was doing :p Jul 18 10:11:48 just havin a lot of trouble getting the usbnet up and running. alright, off to follow the after rooting steps, I'm sure I'll be back before too long. Jul 18 11:56:55 I can't get usbnet or dropbear to work for the life of me Jul 18 12:04:03 okay, so when I was doing step 7 under "enable optware package" I made a mistake, and typed a "." instead of a ">" on the first line of echo code Jul 18 12:04:28 I went ahead and redid it, how can I undo the mistake though? Or would it just ignore it? Jul 18 12:05:29 and if it did accept that input, might that explain why I'm not able to ssh over usb? Jul 18 12:12:38 heh, guess the "you give up hope of anyone helping you" wasn't an exageration Jul 18 12:32:37 morning :)\ Jul 18 13:02:38 morning Jul 18 13:02:45 2 hours till i get me pre Jul 18 13:02:51 * PuffTheMagic feels like its xmas Jul 18 13:11:08 morning puff, my husband actually dropped my phone off for me at work because I was so excited. Jul 18 13:23:41 ok this timed capture camera patch will be going into git as soon as I get the images from my friend Jul 18 13:23:50 props to whomever created the code on the wiki page Jul 18 13:47:28 hey Jul 18 13:47:31 rwhitby Jul 18 13:47:48 we have some issues Jul 18 13:47:48 with teh script JackieRipper Jul 18 13:47:58 oc80z: whassup? Jul 18 13:48:04 Sjpeterman_: what did you get a new pre :D Jul 18 13:48:28 ugk Jul 18 13:48:34 my bad, was a typo on 2nd look Jul 18 13:49:20 can i add to the script? Jul 18 13:50:15 add my stuff here too http://predev.wikidot.com/profile-d Jul 18 13:50:25 no? Jul 18 13:53:32 oc80z: what is that adhoc stuff in your script? Jul 18 13:53:49 old, from old predev wiki discovery Jul 18 13:56:52 oc80z: feel free to add a new file in the /etc/profile.d/ directory in the bootstrap repo, but please don't put extra profile stuff in the default script. Jul 18 13:57:21 oc80z: then you can just advise people to wget that file into /etc/profile.d if they want it Jul 18 13:57:39 yeah, sorry. Got the pre on release day. I was so excited. My old phone wasn't a smartphone, was the lg shine. Couldn't do too much of anything on that phone other than take nice photos Jul 18 14:01:30 ok rw Jul 18 14:01:47 can u add me a keypair or w/e? i need authentication right Jul 18 14:02:09 i cannot log in via ssh over wifi Jul 18 14:02:21 authentication issue w/ nonroot, suid account Jul 18 14:02:29 trying to find solution.. Jul 18 14:05:16 has that been an issue? Jul 18 14:05:26 w/ anyone else? after running the boostrap script? Jul 18 14:06:33 oc80z: you need to create your own ssh keypair, then upload your public key to gitorious. Jul 18 14:06:50 oc80z: then you tell me your gitorious username, and I add you to the developer team. Jul 18 14:07:08 oc80z: check the applying-patches page on the wiki Jul 18 14:07:08 sounds good i looks like there is a permisions conflict on my part Jul 18 14:07:28 i thought iwas a keypair, heh. Jul 18 14:07:52 oc80z: if you want to do agent forwarding, you'll need to ssh into the pre as root, by setting a root password (which is not used) and then using ssh with keys to log in directly as root. Jul 18 14:08:11 (since agent forwarding does not traverse well over su or sudo) Jul 18 14:08:46 where are apps from the app catelog installed to? Jul 18 14:08:58 i do not see them in /usr/palm/applications Jul 18 14:09:02 jcrawford: /var/usr/palm I believe Jul 18 14:09:19 thanks :) Jul 18 14:09:38 evidently i cant use /opt/bin/bash for a user:1001:1001 in /etc/passwd Jul 18 14:09:57 oc80z: /etc/shells? Jul 18 14:10:29 yea thats where im at now Jul 18 14:10:33 i dont see that or /etc/shadow Jul 18 14:10:33 he Jul 18 14:10:51 I think you'll need /etc/shells with /opt/bin/bash in it Jul 18 14:10:57 yet i can still 'bash' when logged in Jul 18 14:11:45 that is the fix. Jul 18 14:12:07 cat "/opt/bin/bash" >> /etc/shells Jul 18 14:12:15 no sweat Jul 18 14:36:33 is there a precompiled binary of vim for the pre? Jul 18 14:39:32 jcrawford: once i build my toolchain i will build that for you Jul 18 14:43:27 cool :) Jul 18 14:43:36 i tried to do it but there is no gcc or anything on the pre :( Jul 18 14:44:22 ehh u wouldnt want to compile on the pre... best bet would be to get a gentoo arm stage2 Jul 18 14:44:27 and then build the stuff you want Jul 18 14:45:01 jcrawford: have you looked in optware? Jul 18 14:45:15 PuffTheMagic: optware has 1300+ such packages already compiled for the Pre Jul 18 14:45:19 rwhitby: optware is for stuff ON the pre right? Jul 18 14:45:50 PuffTheMagic: optware is a set of packages already cross-compiled for armel for running on the Pre. Jul 18 14:46:14 e.g. the precompiled binary of vim that jcrawford was asking for Jul 18 14:46:17 rwhitby: no i have not Jul 18 14:46:30 jcrawford: try "ipkg-opt install vim" Jul 18 14:46:34 how do i list the packages in optware? Jul 18 14:46:39 trying Jul 18 14:46:41 "ipkg-opt list" Jul 18 14:47:15 sick Jul 18 14:47:17 it's there :D Jul 18 14:47:24 thanks Jul 18 14:47:54 surprised there is no dev tools on there such as gcc, make, etc Jul 18 14:47:59 the answer to "is it in optware" is usually yes, and if the answer is no then it's usually yes in a couple of days. Jul 18 14:48:07 jcrawford: they're all in optware Jul 18 14:48:16 rwhitby: sick Jul 18 14:48:19 jcrawford: there is no gcc cause uyou have to be crazy to compile things on the Pre itself Jul 18 14:48:31 compile on your desktop in a chroot and the send it to the pre Jul 18 14:48:43 PuffTheMagic: yes but i am on a mac and the pre is different distro Jul 18 14:48:50 PuffTheMagic: the Pre will compile Linux faster than the machine that Linus used for Linux 1.0 Jul 18 14:48:54 thought you had to compile binaries on the devices itself Jul 18 14:49:00 no Jul 18 14:49:07 u just need a toolchain for the device Jul 18 14:49:15 lol rwhitby yea not bad having 256mb ram Jul 18 14:49:23 thought i would have loved to see 512 :D Jul 18 14:50:19 jcrawford: to compile for the pre, look at http://predev.wikidot.com/optware-cross-compilation Jul 18 14:51:27 to install a native toolchain *on* the Pre, type "ipkg-opt install optware-devel", but be prepared for your flash to fill. Jul 18 14:52:50 ok so one question i just installed sftp server on my pre, the wiki said to add this line to my visudo Jul 18 14:52:52 myusername ALL=NOPASSWD: /opt/libexec/sftp-server Jul 18 14:53:13 then it says in winSCP to enter that line. Transmit (my client) does not have an option for that, is it necessary? Jul 18 14:53:14 Optware has been around for over 4 years, and there is an autobuilder that runs 24x7 which compiles the complete optware package suite for over 20 different targets (including the Pre and the Pre Emulator) Jul 18 14:53:15 rwhitby: do you have the toolchain installed? Jul 18 14:53:21 can you tell me what the gcc tuple is? Jul 18 14:53:25 PuffTheMagic: I don't have a Pre Jul 18 14:53:41 rwhitby: how can you know so much and not have a pre lol Jul 18 14:54:04 jcrawford: I had access to the rootfs from the Doctor, and now the emulator. Jul 18 14:54:12 ah Jul 18 14:54:33 I also worked with OpenEmbedded (the build system with which Palm builds the Pre rootfs) for over 4 years on other open source projects. Jul 18 14:54:55 jcrawford: do you have virtualbox Jul 18 14:54:56 NSLU2-Linux, OpenWRT, OpenMoko, Freesmartphone, ... Jul 18 14:54:58 so you are just linux knowledable all around then :D Jul 18 14:55:04 now i know who to pester haha Jul 18 14:55:20 PuffTheMagic: yes i have the emulator installed Jul 18 14:55:36 jcrawford: boot any linux livecd or real linux install Jul 18 14:55:46 really? Jul 18 14:55:48 then extract this Jul 18 14:55:49 http://gentoo.mirrors.hoobly.com/experimental/arm/stages/arm/stage2-arm-2008.0.tar.bz2 Jul 18 14:55:58 and chroot into it Jul 18 14:56:02 and you wil have a arm toolchain Jul 18 14:56:04 i was going to try to dual boot this system with fedora or ubuntu but havent had the urge Jul 18 14:56:08 and can start building what ever you want Jul 18 14:56:23 PuffTheMagic: what gcc and glibc versions does that use? Jul 18 14:56:42 cause you need to match the ones on the Pre unless you're intending to run your binaries in a chroot on the Pre Jul 18 14:56:42 rwhitby: i will let you know later today once I get it set up for my self Jul 18 14:57:14 well gcc shouldnt matter to much... but glib and all the other will have to match Jul 18 14:57:23 other libs i mean Jul 18 14:57:29 what is this global search stuff? Jul 18 14:57:44 i will have my Pre in less than 1 hour :D Jul 18 14:57:54 ahh i see Jul 18 14:57:58 PuffTheMagic: just look at http://trac.nslu2-linux.org/optware/browser/trunk/platforms/toolchain-cs08q1armel.mk Jul 18 14:58:17 that toolchain works. Jul 18 14:58:27 ahh 4.2.3 Jul 18 14:58:34 you can install that once in the gentoo chroot Jul 18 14:58:40 if its not already default Jul 18 14:58:55 and binutils 2.19 is standard for the most part Jul 18 14:59:04 how come more of the modifications on the wiki have not made it to patches? Jul 18 14:59:20 * rwhitby realises PuffTheMagic is one of those Gentoo-type people, so will not use any pre-compiled binaries from anywhere else ... Jul 18 14:59:33 :D Jul 18 14:59:46 rwhitby: naa i will use optware to get bash and some other things going Jul 18 14:59:57 but i still want my toolchain for normal devel Jul 18 15:00:08 jcrawford: cause you haven't created the patches yet ... ;-) Jul 18 15:00:39 rwhitby: i am working on the camera capture timer one Jul 18 15:00:46 waiting on images then it will be a patch Jul 18 15:01:00 however the wiki does not state who created the code so I do not know who to give credit to lol Jul 18 15:01:12 i added a readme.txt to the patch for credits Jul 18 15:01:12 jcrawford: excellent. let me know your gitorious username when you're ready to commit and push Jul 18 15:01:20 jcrawford: check the wiki history Jul 18 15:01:32 rwhitby: how do i check the history? Jul 18 15:01:37 username is jcrawford i think hehe Jul 18 15:01:46 click the history button at the bottom of the page Jul 18 15:02:29 jcrawford: you're now part of the team on gitorious Jul 18 15:02:42 http://gitorious.org/+webos-internals-developers/memberships Jul 18 15:02:44 thanks rwhitby Jul 18 15:03:01 don't thank me, you're the one doing the work ;-) Jul 18 15:03:10 lol Jul 18 15:04:41 Please help , I could not root my pre via wifi on xp . I exactly followed the instructons on wiki, and always get the error: ValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '' Jul 18 15:05:13 ameng1: use the novaproxy method instead via usb Jul 18 15:05:45 i can not get the file novaproxy.py Jul 18 15:05:53 please give me a link Jul 18 15:06:09 ameng1: which wiki page are you following? Jul 18 15:06:16 (complete url please) Jul 18 15:06:23 predev.wikidot.com Jul 18 15:06:33 (complete url please) Jul 18 15:07:01 I can not give you the full url ,because I visit by a proxy Jul 18 15:07:21 In my country I can not visit it directly Jul 18 15:07:34 understood, but you must be able to tell which wiki page you are visiting Jul 18 15:07:55 there are over 200 pages on predev.wikidot.com Jul 18 15:08:01 http://daili.bz/browse.php?u=Oi8vcHJlZGV2Lndpa2lkb3QuY29tL3dpZmktcm9vdGluZy1wcm9j&b=13 Jul 18 15:08:23 http://predev.wikidot.com/wifi-rooting-proc Jul 18 15:08:32 ameng1: look at the top of the page and you see that url Jul 18 15:08:55 yeah , it is Jul 18 15:09:16 i followed http://predev.wikidot.com/wifi-rooting-proc Jul 18 15:09:18 ameng1: use http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy instead Jul 18 15:09:50 bzhou * r10466 optware/trunk/ (10 files in 2 dirs): rxtx: fixed build on mipsel and powerpc targets Jul 18 15:10:53 rwhitby, i can get the file of step 8 in http://predev.wikidot.com/using-novaproxy Jul 18 15:11:07 can you give me a link of that file Jul 18 15:11:15 http://github.com/asedeno/novaproxy/raw/master/novaproxy.py Jul 18 15:11:24 thanks Jul 18 15:11:34 I'll try Jul 18 15:11:39 np, it must be difficult to do everything through a proxy Jul 18 15:12:11 why do you have to use a proxy? Jul 18 15:12:16 jcrawford: he is in china Jul 18 15:12:26 so china cannot access the rest of the internet? Jul 18 15:12:28 right Jul 18 15:12:48 you're kidding right? Jul 18 15:12:48 jcrawford: that is the case. internet access in china is highly regulated and censored. Jul 18 15:12:55 OMFG Jul 18 15:12:57 i never knew that Jul 18 15:13:05 * jcrawford makes note to never go to china lol Jul 18 15:13:12 jcrawford: you're from the US, right? ;-) Jul 18 15:13:16 wow Jul 18 15:13:17 rwhitby: yes Jul 18 15:13:24 "the great firewall of china" Jul 18 15:13:51 you would think with as technologically advanced as they are they wouldnt be doing something like regulating the internet Jul 18 15:13:58 hmm Jul 18 15:14:01 hehe , sometimes I just feel like in a LAN in China Jul 18 15:14:16 you'd think with as technologically advanced as they are, they wouldn't oppress their people and censor the internet Jul 18 15:14:46 now, they've created a law that all new computers must ship with a internet filtering software installed Jul 18 15:14:51 I doubt that technology and ideology have much influence on each other ... Jul 18 15:14:51 wow ameng1 i feel for ya. it really must be a pain using a proxy for everything as rwhitby said Jul 18 15:15:18 they say to protect against their citizens from porn, violence Jul 18 15:15:38 hmm so giving him files/urls is that aiding & abiding? Jul 18 15:15:42 raeb: funny, that's what some western governments say too ... Jul 18 15:15:51 true Jul 18 15:15:59 however Jul 18 15:16:03 ...... Jul 18 15:16:05 china censors websites about tibet liberation Jul 18 15:16:13 anything that their govt doesn't agree with Jul 18 15:16:22 watch our rwhitby china's coming for you, you gave ameng1 a python file :) Jul 18 15:16:39 rofl if china tried to prosecute a US citizen Jul 18 15:16:45 while not in the US Jul 18 15:16:46 er Jul 18 15:16:48 not in china Jul 18 15:17:06 that would be funny Jul 18 15:17:08 raeb: the US does reasonably frequently ... Jul 18 15:17:26 durring the olympics, the chinese govt arrested several people, some of which who are american, for displaying some pro-tibet banners Jul 18 15:17:51 wouldn't release them nor tell the us govt their status Jul 18 15:17:53 for like a week Jul 18 15:18:13 anyway, this conversation is better held in #webos-watercooler Jul 18 15:18:19 lol Jul 18 15:18:50 Got the file , return to XP, root my pre now Jul 18 15:19:05 ameng1: good luck Jul 18 15:19:30 Hope so, Thanks Jul 18 15:28:30 * rwhitby bbt Jul 18 15:50:05 I'm trying to build the basicplugin. I've installed the debian chroot on the device. I'm trying to install the extra required packages, like libx11-dev, but i'm getting this error: Jul 18 15:50:10 Err http://http.us.debian.org stable/main x11-common 1:7.3+18 Jul 18 15:50:12 404 Not Found [IP: 149.20.20.135 80] Jul 18 15:50:30 what am I missing? Jul 18 15:51:13 hmmmmm Jul 18 15:51:30 i wonder if the deb line in your apt sources is incorrect Jul 18 15:51:57 I have Jul 18 15:52:00 deb http://http.us.debian.org/debian stable main contrib non-free Jul 18 15:52:02 deb http://security.debian.org stable/updates main contrib non-free Jul 18 15:53:51 looks ok 2 me Jul 18 15:56:55 wwhitby: it is still not work . any suggestions? Jul 18 15:58:25 I see the pre recognized as usb mass storage device by xp Jul 18 16:09:45 although it doesn't state it explicitly, I'm assuming that you have to build the basicplugin inside the debian chroot so that it is built for the right architecture Jul 18 16:10:46 mrvc: you have to compile it somehow if you want to run it on a pre Jul 18 16:10:52 with a cross compiler Jul 18 16:11:02 or natively on the pre, or something Jul 18 16:11:19 how are you doing it destinal? Jul 18 16:11:22 but it will work on the emulator without that Jul 18 16:11:24 emulator Jul 18 16:12:07 ah, interesting Jul 18 16:12:44 it's way easier to develop and test with emulator because in experimentation it's likely to crash luna which on the phone would take a while to recover from. most modern desktop CPU's are way faster than the pre's Jul 18 16:13:29 I was assuming that the emulator was emulating the arm processor, but it is actually emulating an x86 build of webos? Jul 18 16:13:44 yes, the latter Jul 18 16:14:04 ok, well that explains why it is so freakin fast! :) Jul 18 16:14:45 should be possible to run it on bare metal also with some tweaks, in case anyone wants a webos netbook lol Jul 18 16:15:02 have you been able to run the plugin directly on your pre though? Jul 18 16:15:20 mrvc: I'm not that interested in that yet. until it works, there's no point having it on a pre Jul 18 16:15:34 ie does more than basic drawing Jul 18 16:15:55 basicplugin is intended as an example so we can get people up to speed and also as the basis of a terminal client Jul 18 16:16:13 sure, just seems like it would be nice to know if it the theory is sound Jul 18 16:16:16 that will be a seperate project directory though so basicplugin will continue to be an example Jul 18 16:16:50 mrvc: the theory is sound. it's the same OS and the stock plugins are the same on both (just compiled for the right arch) Jul 18 16:17:21 yeah, I guess I'm just not that trusting... :) Jul 18 16:17:24 you're welcome to try it but I'm focused on getting it working on the emu and confident it'll work fine on the pre at that point Jul 18 16:18:13 I'm sure since PuffTheMagic is out getting his new pre today and has an x-compile toolchain he'll probably test that too Jul 18 16:19:16 since we're still having pain with graphics I'm working on getting a scriptable plugin and event support so we can do the terminal rendering in javascript for now Jul 18 16:19:27 since things like anyterm have proved the concept Jul 18 16:20:18 yep, ok Jul 18 16:32:00 so someone is developing a terminal client? Jul 18 16:32:16 that will make my boss happy as that is the only thing it doesn't have that he wants Jul 18 16:34:39 I NOW HAVE A PRE! Jul 18 16:34:40 :D Jul 18 16:34:51 grats Jul 18 16:37:07 PuffTheMagic: congratulations Jul 18 16:37:16 jcrawford: that's what we're talking about :) Jul 18 16:43:19 woot Jul 18 16:43:27 feels nice dudn't it Jul 18 16:43:41 i keep mine in the microsuede bag Jul 18 16:43:44 hee hee Jul 18 16:58:15 microsuede ftw Jul 18 17:10:59 bzhou * r10467 optware/trunk/make/aria2.mk: aria2: 1.4.1 -> 1.5.0 Jul 18 17:13:09 bzhou * r10468 optware/trunk/make/py-trac.mk: py-trac: 0.11.4 -> 0.11.5 Jul 18 17:13:55 anyone else making good general app progress now that we have some half decent documentaion? Jul 18 17:14:33 binartech-g1: not really....I did, however, get my app to work again Jul 18 17:14:41 well, the parts I've done so far Jul 18 17:19:19 So good to see so many apps at Precentral :) Jul 18 17:35:24 i made a adult soundboard but dont know if i can post it lol. if anyone remembers the old final word cursing device from early 90's its based on those sounds.....just for novelty Jul 18 17:35:36 LOL Jul 18 17:36:16 Hopefully you guys don't mind I'm converting the front page into a template so that it's easier to edit in the future. Jul 18 17:40:12 does anyone know if the pre has any vcard homebrew support Jul 18 17:40:34 Not right now Jul 18 17:40:55 that is so lame that a cell phone can be released with out obex and vcard support Jul 18 17:41:10 I know Jul 18 17:41:27 I have a feeling they had a bit more on their mind but that still does not excuse it Jul 18 17:43:10 PuffTheMagic: or three :) Jul 18 17:43:22 three? Jul 18 17:43:23 PuffTheMagic: try obex, make javascript bindings Jul 18 17:43:44 except you have to replace the bt stack with bluez, expect sco/a2dp to break Jul 18 17:43:57 iPhone OS 2, Android before 1.5, and now Pre Jul 18 17:44:11 bluez sucks Jul 18 17:44:14 there is a new stack Jul 18 17:44:15 obexd Jul 18 17:44:18 that supports opp Jul 18 17:44:20 and dbus Jul 18 17:44:24 which pre already supports Jul 18 17:44:26 yes, but over bluez Jul 18 17:44:33 pre doesn't use bluez at all I think Jul 18 17:44:46 :) I got invited to Google Voice :D Jul 18 17:53:00 hi, i'm running widows xp and keep getting the message to come here because novacom isn't working right, i've reinstalled it two or three times, which usually fixes the problem for the next two, maybe three times i try to use novaproxy.py and putty to access my pre, does anyone have a fix? Jul 18 17:55:07 hmmm, is anyone else even in here? or did i mess up and not make it to the channel? Jul 18 17:56:42 you're in the right channel Jul 18 17:56:50 if someone has the answer they will try to help Jul 18 17:57:09 usually the service is not running Jul 18 17:57:14 services.msc should tell you Jul 18 17:58:07 thnx Jul 18 17:58:22 I have PmModemFactory, tilipctest, etc Jul 18 17:58:41 they were pulled from 1.0.4 but i grabbed em from 1.0.3 if anyone needs em Jul 18 18:02:06 Hello all :) I'm trying (again) to get my Vista Ultimate64 to play nice with the Pre, and I think I'm close. Novacom is running (verified in Services, I can check other stuff if need be), but it can't se my Pre. Thoughts? Jul 18 18:02:26 found it tmzt, thnx, services.msc had it listed as palm novacmd Jul 18 18:02:54 oh, sounds like you're doing the same thing, carelthos, I'll stfu and listen :) Jul 18 18:03:22 nope, my problem is where novacmd just wouldn't start... not that it couldn't see the pre... you's is diff Jul 18 18:03:57 crap lol, why can't all problems be the same and have the same resolution... "Kick it" doesn't work as often as it should. Jul 18 18:04:46 check the following, :pre in dev mode, pre connected 'charge only', and reboot the pre, while it's booting, it "should" iirc, have windows trying to install some drivers Jul 18 18:05:12 also, did you install the right set of drivers from the webos download? Jul 18 18:06:10 yup, I've installed both version of the drivers at various times, ripping them out a lot.... Jul 18 18:06:31 Pre is in dev, has restarted, installed a bunch of stuff between... Jul 18 18:06:56 I'm wondering if there's a setting that didn't get the right value or something... Jul 18 18:07:15 got the right version of python? Jul 18 18:07:26 Ugh, you know what, this isn't worth it... :: scrounges around for his WinXP laptop:: I've rooted once with this thing, might as well do it again :/ Jul 18 18:08:16 be back in a week Jul 18 18:08:50 2.6 for 64-bit Jul 18 18:09:06 if you want to be technical, 2.6.2 Jul 18 18:10:03 and you ran the novaproxy.py file and got what, the usual "come here for help"? Jul 18 18:10:54 yup, I've been here before for this same issue, did the same thing and broke down and just used the xp box 'cause vista is a giant pain. Jul 18 18:12:00 is it saying it can't see it, or that novacomd isn't running? Jul 18 18:12:25 This time I even tried installing a virtual machine and loading xp on it to see if maybe, just maybe, I could get something going from my main box... no love. Jul 18 18:12:31 can't see it Jul 18 18:13:35 try ending the novacomd service, load up services.msc (iirc, tmzt told me the name earlier) and look for either novacomd or palmnvacomd and start whichever you find... mine's the palm novacomd Jul 18 18:14:02 "novacomd couldn't find your Pre. Ensure it is plugged in and in Developer Mode and try again. If you suck, find people who don't" Jul 18 18:14:51 huh... i get that, but i connect to my pre remotely over my network... could always give it a try in putty to see if it lets you in anyway Jul 18 18:15:02 you can also press CTrl-alt-del, start Task Manager, and then go to the services tab in VIsta Jul 18 18:16:02 fergot about that tab... Jul 18 18:16:17 destinal1: interesting: http://blogs.gnome.org/hughsie/2009/07/14/firefox-plugin-woes/ Jul 18 18:17:41 Man, I thought for sure stopping/starting the service would illicit SOME sort of change.... nop :( Jul 18 18:18:13 hmm Jul 18 18:18:23 i'm outa ideas then Jul 18 18:18:33 destinal! Jul 18 18:18:44 Yeah, no problem. I blame Microsoft. Jul 18 18:18:55 is your stuff working yet? Jul 18 18:19:00 When in doubt, blame Microsoft :P Jul 18 18:19:12 mine, so far, just having issues with installing homebrews Jul 18 18:19:30 Eguy: When up a creek without a C:\ prompt, same principle :) Jul 18 18:19:49 carelthos: hmm, never got that far with vista, so I'm not going to be much help :( Jul 18 18:20:03 on xp Jul 18 18:20:31 ORLY? What doesn't seem to be working, and what guide did you follow so far? Jul 18 18:21:42 actually, for the most part, guy i work with did it, and he's got his working perfectly, but i got the the part where you drag and drop an ipk file onto the 'palm-install.bat' and it sometimes throws the numbers and such, and sometimes it flashes a single line and closes.. Jul 18 18:21:58 i'm tempted to create a copy of that bat with a 'wait' or whatever at the end Jul 18 18:22:22 Eguy: hey Jul 18 18:22:44 I know this is trivial, but have you unplugged the Pre and restarted the computer to let everything settle down a bit? Jul 18 18:23:06 yeah, just tried it now, and my pre was rooted thursday Jul 18 18:23:14 I hate that I can't force signoff the destinal I left signed in from workj Jul 18 18:23:36 haha yeah I have that problem sometimes Jul 18 18:24:49 This may not work, and may break stuff because of dual install, but what you might want to try is this: http://predev.wikidot.com/installing-apps-on-a-stock-pre-post-1-04-update Jul 18 18:25:07 i'll take a look Jul 18 18:25:17 I used that on my wife's machine after installing a few other pieces, and it ran like a dream Jul 18 18:25:44 She's good with computers, but by no means a wiz, and she came to me 30 minutes later saying "Looket all the apps I got? Jul 18 18:25:50 er, "got!" Jul 18 18:26:45 flare576: she was able to download and install pre apps? Jul 18 18:27:23 yup, she basically scanned through precentral's listing and grabbed 10-20 Jul 18 18:27:24 meh, i'm about to go to the vista machine just cus it's actually got some power, i think my pre has more cpu and ram than this old beast Jul 18 18:27:38 flare576: awesome Jul 18 18:28:00 all I could think is "great, now I'm going to have to get her this mod http://predev.wikidot.com/add-delete-pages-in-the-launcher. Jul 18 18:28:05 you still have to root your pre to use the above method though, there is no method of installing without using the konami code IICR Jul 18 18:28:25 Eguy: the thing I linked does require Konami code Jul 18 18:28:29 no rooting, though Jul 18 18:29:07 enabling dev mode is rooting flare576 Jul 18 18:29:16 add-delete pages really isn't that bad, did it about 4 times with my 'unpriviledged' account efore i remembered the "sudo" part is required unless you're root Jul 18 18:29:47 gotta delete all of 8 characters in one file... easy Jul 18 18:29:58 oh, sorry, yes, the linkk about adding pages to the launcher DOES require root, but the "installing apps on a stock pre post 4.0 update" does not. Jul 18 18:30:30 and enabling dev mode "Konami code" is NOT rooting Jul 18 18:31:02 O RLY? it unblocks the firewall and allows a connection via Terminal...that is rooting Jul 18 18:31:05 well I keep telling people that it's not exactly rooting to type novaterm Jul 18 18:31:08 carelthos: god speed with the Vista Jul 18 18:31:21 Eguy: turning on Dev mode does not mean that you have to root dude. Jul 18 18:31:29 rooting to me implies adding access where it wasn't designed Jul 18 18:31:33 or supported Jul 18 18:31:40 turning on dev mode simply means the PC will respond to it via Novacom Jul 18 18:31:44 You get root access through dev mode Jul 18 18:31:51 very good, but you don't need to Jul 18 18:31:53 that is why it says root@castle Jul 18 18:32:05 yeah, if you actually proceed on that route Jul 18 18:32:13 right, but if you get an ubuntu box and run sudo -s Jul 18 18:32:19 if you install the first link I sent, all it does is let you intall packages. Jul 18 18:32:20 you don't call it "rooting"\ Jul 18 18:32:26 That to me is rooting Jul 18 18:32:39 destinal__: good call :) Jul 18 18:32:39 Anytime you are able to login as root Jul 18 18:33:11 unlike the iphone, this is designed out of the box to do this, you just flip a switch and novaterm in Jul 18 18:33:22 Eguy: There are 2 concepts on the pre. Dev mode and Rooting. Rooting does require dev mode, but just because someone can put their Pre in dev mode does NOT mean they intend or have rooted. Jul 18 18:33:33 I think we have the tendancy to make this way too complicated Jul 18 18:33:41 yup Jul 18 18:34:20 just because some of us like having optware and a billion packages and sudo and dropbear, doesn't mean we should push it as the default way to do things Jul 18 18:34:29 having 3 flavors of windows to worry about with idiosyncrasies doesn't help :/ Jul 18 18:34:52 lol Jul 18 18:35:06 destinal__: totally agree: wife only has "Drag the homebrew apps to this icon and they'll go on your device" access, and she's happy as a clam. Jul 18 18:35:11 Can't wait for 7 in Oct Jul 18 18:35:17 flare576: it's just as root as anything else Jul 18 18:35:23 flare576: just less useless complexity Jul 18 18:35:43 It's on msdn but I am waiting for the boxed rtm version :) Jul 18 18:36:12 I didn't have to "root" her phone: meaning I never telnet'd, installed sudo, installed optware, dropbear, etc. Jul 18 18:36:40 to me rooting is what you do to get a shell, and again it's so easy and out of the box it's not "rooting" Jul 18 18:36:48 I'd like to get an app that lets your choose the ipk and hit an install button Jul 18 18:37:02 Or get obex and BT the ipk over to install Jul 18 18:37:03 Eguy: I want an app on the phone like cydia Jul 18 18:37:06 all she does is turn on dev mode, restart, drag and drop, and done. I understand that the installer runs as root, but that's under-the-covers. Jul 18 18:37:35 flare576: so she doesn't need a shell but if she did she also wouldn't need optware, dropbear, etc etc Jul 18 18:37:43 only a certain subset cares about having all this junk Jul 18 18:38:16 destinal__: 100% right, I think we're saying the same thing in different ways... so I'm going to go back to trying to root MY phone with my xp box... stupid vista64. Jul 18 18:38:16 and that subset is smaller still than those who want a root shell Jul 18 18:38:42 hmm Jul 18 18:38:50 why do so many people use Vista x64 Jul 18 18:38:54 but we're having people follow directions that are way more complex to do things they don't actually need Jul 18 18:39:02 but they're in the directions, so they'll follow them Jul 18 18:39:14 so it creates the perception of complexity where there need be none Jul 18 18:39:19 IMO not worth the headache Jul 18 18:40:16 Eguy, it was easier to find than XP64? Jul 18 18:40:25 to me, dropbear only matters if you don't have a novacom client somewhere you might be Jul 18 18:40:32 and since I'm running on >4GB of RAM, i need a 64bit OS Jul 18 18:40:47 and sudo is a waste of time Jul 18 18:40:55 But still, you need 64 bit drivers and programs blah blah...way to much effort IMO Jul 18 18:41:40 and optware's really handy if you find yourself wanting more unix commands, but again most of our people don't find themselves in that position Jul 18 18:41:41 Eguy: 32-bit OS can only see 4GB worth of address space, including video card RAM and other devices. You toss 8GB of RAM at a 32bit OS, and you'll see 3.5 or less of it and the system won't even know the rest exists. Jul 18 18:41:58 I know, I have 4GB in thi smachine Jul 18 18:42:11 I get 3069MB Jul 18 18:42:33 Lucky for me, I only have 2.1GB used :P Jul 18 18:42:40 lol Jul 18 18:42:58 my Q9300 does the rest Jul 18 18:43:04 oops Q9400* Jul 18 18:43:10 but, yeah, that's why people get 64-bit OS's... and get to live with a cluster F*** of drivers and apps. Jul 18 18:43:12 I need some help, after doing the global search addon thing, my phone isn't working right Jul 18 18:43:25 is there a limit to how many addons you can add? Jul 18 18:43:38 commandercup: be sure you follow the syntax of the existing searches Jul 18 18:43:48 pay attention to the semi-colons Jul 18 18:43:59 I think I did, but I'll check again Jul 18 18:43:59 ah yes.. and spacing Jul 18 18:44:01 and commas Jul 18 18:44:03 when I reboot the phone, it works fine Jul 18 18:44:08 and I can search and it shows all the options Jul 18 18:44:14 but then afterwards, I can't open the launcher Jul 18 18:44:15 or start searching Jul 18 18:44:34 You should still be able to open the launcher reguardless... Jul 18 18:44:42 Did you make backup files? Jul 18 18:44:45 yeah Jul 18 18:45:02 Yeah, the global search Shouldn't touch the launcher. Jul 18 18:45:07 flare576: or use one that works :) Jul 18 18:45:08 Well that is is a good thing Jul 18 18:45:26 My suggestion would be to restore the backups, then add one or two searches, restart and see how it works Jul 18 18:45:31 * Templarian might of started converting everything to templates on the new wiki, and also may have redone the front page. Jul 18 18:45:34 ok Jul 18 18:45:37 I'll try that Jul 18 18:45:57 And remember to comment out amazon at the bottom if your adding that Jul 18 18:45:57 make sure you keep a copy of the backups clean, no matter what ;) lol Jul 18 18:46:14 lol yeah Jul 18 18:46:29 Eguy: is there a problem with just deleting it all together? Jul 18 18:46:33 Oh yeah! also, always leave twitter as the last entry (unless someone figured out how to fix that?) Jul 18 18:46:36 I added too many, I have to scroll through the searches lol Jul 18 18:46:56 No, you can delete the whole amazon code. That is fine Jul 18 18:46:59 ok Jul 18 18:47:00 thanks Jul 18 18:47:50 well all, thanks for the help and the discussion, but I'm gonna head out and re-root and configure my Pre.... had to swap my phone out 'cause of a hardware glitch :( Jul 18 18:48:10 I need to go to the post office Jul 18 19:15:08 Templarian NICE WORK!!!! Jul 18 19:22:23 is there supposed to be a comma after the twitter code for the global search addons? Jul 18 19:22:42 the wiki says: "Be sure to note the comma at the end of the line beginning with 'twitter'" Jul 18 19:26:45 Templarian: I don't think mojodev is meant to be a list of homebrew Jul 18 19:27:01 though there should be a page like that Jul 18 19:27:25 looks good overall though Jul 18 19:28:21 "the new wiki?" Jul 18 19:28:27 have I missed something? Jul 18 19:29:23 sugardave: its not ready yet Jul 18 19:29:39 ah, right on Jul 18 19:30:06 Templarian: nevermind that was someone else who did that I should have checked the rev history Jul 18 19:34:10 I've just been trying to shift stuff over, rwhitby, needs to install the syntax extension. Jul 18 19:34:53 Mostly just editing in templates for formatting. Jul 18 19:35:34 Any of you guys know off-hand if the Pre's warranty stands if you buy a new unit off of eBay or something? Jul 18 19:38:27 tlp: I haven't heard but manufacturer's warranties should stand even if the device is sold to someone else Jul 18 19:38:52 the only question is whether palm has any outlet besides sprint to handle them Jul 18 19:39:22 Cool. I really want a Pre, but I'm already tied into a contract and am worried about defects some people have had trouble with. Maybe I'll contact Palm. Jul 18 19:43:26 tlp: if you buy it on ebay and take it to sprint you can supposedly get total equipment protection if it is either a clean ESN or activated within the last 30 days, according to people on this thread Jul 18 19:43:27 http://forums.precentral.net/cdma-north-america/191288-tep-palm-pre-purchased-off-ebay.html Jul 18 19:44:02 which is probably better than your average warranty service if the several dollars a month is acceptable and you were planning on using sprint Jul 18 19:44:29 Templarian -- still, its' good work. Jul 18 19:44:44 sugardave - you can look at it if you want to, and you could help with porting pages to it. Jul 18 19:44:47 Templarian: the low saturation colors are easy on the eye Jul 18 19:45:56 Templarian what have you been making templates _for_ -- any we could look at? Jul 18 19:46:11 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Template:Page-main Jul 18 19:46:36 I just got done with that one for right now. I'm working on the portals right now. Jul 18 19:47:28 nice. Jul 18 19:47:53 Just finished moving over windows obtain-access. Jul 18 19:48:38 Did bpalindino and group finish code review on the post-access script? Jul 18 19:51:21 and does anyone have the url for it? Jul 18 19:53:15 We need to move that list on the wiki and seriously reorganize it with templates. Anyone object to making a portal called "applications" Jul 18 19:53:32 Currently they have it under mojodev. Jul 18 20:01:54 Templarian the list was an attempt at an automated cross port. Jul 18 20:01:59 It failed. :-( Jul 18 20:02:04 go for a templateing solution Jul 18 20:05:53 Templarian I search everywhere under webos-internals and webos and I don't find it. Nor do I find anyhting called mojodev. Jul 18 20:05:56 You got a url? Jul 18 20:07:29 how do I enable dev mode Jul 18 20:09:42 Rick__: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:MojoDev Jul 18 20:09:42 upupdowndownleftrightleftrightbastart Jul 18 20:10:03 Type what rick said into the universal search. Jul 18 20:10:17 when trying to clone the webos-internals mod repository I keep getting a fatal: unable to connect a socket erro Jul 18 20:10:20 error* Jul 18 20:10:47 nm Jul 18 20:10:54 i found it before i saw this Jul 18 20:10:57 that is hilarious though Jul 18 20:11:28 Templarian that's the url for the mojo apps page, yes. Jul 18 20:11:41 I was hoping for a url for the "set up my pre after linux access" script. Jul 18 20:11:49 Which I'm not finding on git anywhere.... Jul 18 20:12:23 the mojo apps list already needs catagories.... Jul 18 20:12:32 since there's now 45 on precentral as of this afternoon. Jul 18 20:13:31 Yep, reorganizing is fun. :) Jul 18 20:13:48 how long does this damn thing take to reboot Jul 18 20:13:53 nm Jul 18 20:13:55 there we go Jul 18 20:13:59 that took a while Jul 18 20:14:14 Yea... but normal people don't have to reboot it. lol. Jul 18 20:15:06 any clue as to why I'm timing out when trying to clone the mod repository? Jul 18 20:16:11 does dev mode disable the phone part Jul 18 20:16:21 Puff, no Jul 18 20:20:01 PuffTheMagic: it enables novacomd. You could say the emulator is in a constant "dev mode" Jul 18 20:20:11 and turning it on gets the pre into a similar state Jul 18 20:20:52 it also adjusts iptables IIRC Jul 18 20:20:54 grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr Jul 18 20:21:02 i have no signal now that i enabled dev mode Jul 18 20:21:15 PuffTheMagic: never heard of that _ever_ Jul 18 20:21:35 PuffTheMagic: maybe it was just the rebooting did it Jul 18 20:21:47 im just saying Jul 18 20:22:15 how do i restart it manually? Jul 18 20:22:23 nm Jul 18 20:22:46 do i have to enable dev mode every time Jul 18 20:22:50 or is it always in dev mode now Jul 18 20:22:59 always in dev mode until you turn it off Jul 18 20:23:06 turn off dev mode I mean Jul 18 20:23:10 k Jul 18 20:24:41 ok got signal back Jul 18 20:24:42 :D Jul 18 20:26:02 so if I have wifi enabled.... can I ssh into over the lan Jul 18 20:26:07 or do i need to use the usb still Jul 18 20:26:28 you can ssh over wifi Jul 18 20:26:36 pre will go to sleep though unless its plugged in Jul 18 20:26:37 this is so awesome Jul 18 20:31:26 PuffTheMagic: yeah you can ssh over wifi though i prefer to enable usbnet and just leave the pre connected to my dev workstation over usb Jul 18 20:31:50 rawdr: it will still "sleep" even if plugged in...you need to do something to keep it alive...play Pandora, ping it constantly, kill powerd, etc. Jul 18 20:31:57 also I'd rather not have an sshd listening on wifi for security reasons and I wanted to change the port to 22 and ssh / scp in directly as root Jul 18 20:32:09 sugardave: if plugged into usb, I don't think so Jul 18 20:32:24 the screen may turn off but the device is running Jul 18 20:32:26 maybe that's new? mine would drop my ssh connections shortly after the screen blanks Jul 18 20:32:29 it def turns off Jul 18 20:32:35 when connected to usb Jul 18 20:32:37 well sleeps Jul 18 20:32:43 the screen does but ssh sessions stay up Jul 18 20:32:53 your mileage is varying from mine, then Jul 18 20:32:56 *shrug* Jul 18 20:33:11 I have usbnet, maybe it's that? Jul 18 20:33:23 yeah, that's probably it, I wasn't able to get that working Jul 18 20:33:36 Its suppose to stay up regardless... I have found sometimes it lags heavily and will take a second to respond Jul 18 20:33:49 Mine stayed up with screen off before I ever did usbnet Jul 18 20:33:58 When powered. Jul 18 20:34:03 rawdr: ok we have the same experience then Jul 18 20:34:04 weird...haven't tried it since 1.0.4 came out, though Jul 18 20:34:31 sugardave: maybe your system isn't providing power over usb because you lack the drivers? Jul 18 20:34:31 I always just launched another cygwin and did 'ping -n -1 [ip]' and never worried about it again :D Jul 18 20:34:49 destinal__: hmmm, that's a possibility Jul 18 20:34:57 with linux it just works Jul 18 20:35:14 and with windows and novacom drivers probably would also Jul 18 20:35:21 i cant seem to ssh over wifi here Jul 18 20:35:30 i rechecked dev mode and it says on Jul 18 20:35:39 dev mode doesn't need to be on for ssh.... Jul 18 20:35:49 did you open the port for wifi? Jul 18 20:35:51 PuffTheMagic: I found usbnet ssh to be way more responsive Jul 18 20:36:19 its part of the service script, you can uncomment one of the iptables lines to open the wifi port Jul 18 20:36:27 I would just change eth0 to usb0 in the optware-dropbear script Jul 18 20:36:34 and usbnet enable Jul 18 20:36:38 its the principle though Jul 18 20:36:43 "usbnet enable" at a prompt Jul 18 20:37:05 you can make it accept ssh over wifi or evdo, I just don't prefer it Jul 18 20:37:27 I think the -i eth0 will allow only over wifi actually Jul 18 20:37:34 and that's the default in the script Jul 18 20:37:49 yeah you're right Jul 18 20:37:52 the "uncomment this line" was for evdo Jul 18 20:38:15 you're trying on port 222, puff? Jul 18 20:39:23 PuffTheMagic: I'd open up novaterm again and check to make sure dropbear's running, listening on the right port, etc Jul 18 20:39:57 yeah im trying on 222 Jul 18 20:41:14 where do I get me novaterm Jul 18 20:41:19 i know i saw it somewhere Jul 18 20:41:41 he's saying just open up whatever you used before for a terminal Jul 18 20:41:44 novaproxy? Jul 18 20:42:42 i havent used anything yet Jul 18 20:43:03 im just using my normal linux terminal to ssh from Jul 18 20:43:16 how did you originally root it over usb? Jul 18 20:44:25 i havent Jul 18 20:44:28 i never said I did Jul 18 20:44:32 all i did was enabled dev mode Jul 18 20:44:39 i am "trying" to root it Jul 18 20:44:46 PuffTheMagic: ahg Jul 18 20:44:57 PuffTheMagic: you're linux, right? just run novaterm Jul 18 20:45:04 no parameters needed Jul 18 20:45:13 it needs to be plugged in via usb Jul 18 20:45:16 novaterm? that was mac and windows only I thought Jul 18 20:45:28 to root it I had to use a windows virtual machine Jul 18 20:45:29 rawdr: nope, part of the linux sdk also Jul 18 20:45:40 so this is recent? Jul 18 20:45:51 the linux sdk was never leaked, only just officially released Jul 18 20:45:52 and where is navacom Jul 18 20:45:52 so yes Jul 18 20:45:54 err Jul 18 20:45:55 novaterm Jul 18 20:45:59 was that part of the sdk? Jul 18 20:46:03 yes Jul 18 20:46:04 sdk Jul 18 20:46:07 OOOOOOOOOOOOh Jul 18 20:46:58 darkstar:~$ ls -al `type -path novaterm` Jul 18 20:46:58 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 26 2009-07-12 11:24 /usr/local/bin/novaterm -> /opt/Palm/novacom/novaterm Jul 18 20:47:12 its in my path Jul 18 20:47:15 i found it Jul 18 20:47:19 anyway Jul 18 20:47:28 do i have to be in usb storage mode or some other usb mode Jul 18 20:47:33 other than "charging" Jul 18 20:47:37 I just use "Just Charge" Jul 18 20:48:21 but now i need these usb net drivers huh Jul 18 20:48:39 rawdr: back in the day you could have used the OSS "novacom" precomd in linux thanks to bpadalino and others Jul 18 20:48:59 they reverse engineered it and made a novaterm-like program Jul 18 20:49:08 (reverse engineered usb protocol) Jul 18 20:49:27 * PuffTheMagic builds usb net drivers for kernel Jul 18 20:49:36 'back in the day' he was just beginning to write it.. had to use a VM Jul 18 20:49:47 rawdr_: ah, that too :) Jul 18 20:49:52 never knew he finished it, but didn't follow it Jul 18 20:50:15 o/ Hey again. Quick question about CRON configuration: if I recall correctly, I followed these steps: http://predev.wikidot.com/random-wallpaper-switching on my first pre, but when I upgraded WebOS versions, it deleted my changes. Jul 18 20:50:38 if I just make a separate file (say, crond_startup), will it still run on startup and be ignored by the update script? Jul 18 20:52:34 good question.... Jul 18 20:53:14 destinal__: do i need cdc_subset Jul 18 20:53:17 or just usbnet Jul 18 20:53:21 yeah maybe flare576 Jul 18 20:53:46 PuffTheMagic: cdc_subset? Jul 18 20:53:47 only problem may be if Palm starts using crond, then there will be two trying to run Jul 18 20:53:50 not positive Jul 18 20:53:56 rawdr_: Not entirely confident? lol, I'll try it and find out. I remember someone in here a few weeks ago telling me to do *Something* like that, but I can't remember Jul 18 20:54:07 rawdr_: ahhh, hadn't thought about that.... Jul 18 20:54:11 so trigger acron from cron or something? Jul 18 20:54:18 ask rwhitby Jul 18 20:54:37 I'm sure something like this has come up with optware Jul 18 20:54:42 PuffTheMagic: I'm on ubuntu so for me it was all just there Jul 18 20:54:52 PuffTheMagic: so I don't know what the dependencies are for sure Jul 18 20:54:54 run lsmod Jul 18 20:55:00 see what is using usbnet module Jul 18 20:55:05 rawdr_: two crons running is not a problem Jul 18 20:55:21 you can use optware cron and it won't conflict with any future palm cron Jul 18 20:55:36 rwhitby: so I should be ok creating a separate file to avoid over-write during patch time Jul 18 20:55:45 * ? Jul 18 20:55:51 PuffTheMagic: you don't need usbnet for novater Jul 18 20:55:54 novaterm Jul 18 20:55:56 flare576: yeah, just create a new cron script in /opt/etc/cron.d/ Jul 18 20:56:03 PuffTheMagic: I have this Jul 18 20:56:04 flare576: and install optware cron Jul 18 20:56:09 so how do I use novaterm then Jul 18 20:56:13 usbnet 23944 3 rndis_wlan,rndis_host,cdc_ether Jul 18 20:56:20 but only because I enabled usbnet on the pre Jul 18 20:56:29 it's not needed in any stock dev mode situation Jul 18 20:56:54 PuffTheMagic: just connect your pre to your linux box with a usb cable and run "novaterm" for me Jul 18 20:57:01 was all Jul 18 20:57:11 i get "failed to connect to server" Jul 18 20:57:18 rwhitby: ...I'm sorry if I sound stupid (I am), but why install optware cron if a version of cron is already running on the Pre, just disabled? Jul 18 20:57:21 oh Jul 18 20:57:21 waity Jul 18 20:57:28 you need novacomd running as well Jul 18 20:57:34 on the linux box Jul 18 20:58:05 I assumed you had it because you were running the emulator and it pops a warning when you start if you don't have it Jul 18 20:58:14 ahh Jul 18 20:58:16 there we go Jul 18 20:58:19 yeah but i restarted Jul 18 20:58:23 and forgot to restart novacomd Jul 18 20:58:32 cause i havent made an init script for gentoo for it yet Jul 18 20:58:36 ah Jul 18 20:58:42 cool Jul 18 20:59:59 thanks again Jul 18 21:00:49 don't talk to destinal__ he is an imposter Jul 18 21:01:13 heh, the +v is a dead giveaway to imposterdom :) Jul 18 21:01:47 Everyone: don't listen to the lies, he has hacked the real destinal's account Jul 18 21:01:51 :P Jul 18 21:02:05 * destinal__ smacks Eguy around with a wet trout. Jul 18 21:02:12 hahaha Jul 18 21:02:44 ~action Jul 18 21:02:45 * infobot forgets what action did. Jul 18 21:03:57 PuffTheMagic: so the wiki has all the stuff on installing optware and then installing dropbear etc if you want ssh Jul 18 21:04:36 i will check that out later, i need to go to a 30th anniversary party for some friends parents Jul 18 21:13:44 what is +v anyway, other than voice? it seems to follow random people here Jul 18 21:18:03 Rick__: I'm going to move the MojoDev page to "WebOS_Applications", and "LinuxApps" to "Linux_Applications". Do you see anything going wrong if I do this? Jul 18 21:43:10 so are there any hints at being able to do things that cannot be done in javascript? such as ssl, or traceroute? Jul 18 21:47:48 btw, just tried to register at the new wiki and the mailer confirmation failed Jul 18 21:48:26 tmzt: if the channel op decides to moderate the channel, only voiced people can chat Jul 18 21:51:22 sugardave: yea, there must be a glitch, you can still edit. Jul 18 21:54:30 Is it ok to talk about the SDK now that it is public? Jul 18 21:55:23 jtokash: yep. Jul 18 21:55:45 Cool. Has anyone tried to copy the webos 1.1 files from the emu to the phone? Jul 18 21:56:12 I'm particularly interested in the email application. Jul 18 22:05:00 Templarian: cool, trying to clean up that database page, but looks like something is wrong with "syntaxhighlight" Jul 18 22:05:35 sugardave: were putting that in right now Jul 18 22:06:11 ah, cool Jul 18 22:06:28 I tried to drop it back to the "old" source tag, but it hates that, too :) Jul 18 22:16:31 sugardave: source tag is the only thing thats enabled right now. Jul 18 22:16:56 Freel free to do the needed edits now though. Jul 18 22:20:09 okay, I fixed the bolds and such, will try source again Jul 18 23:25:47 woot, headers for ppirahana Jul 18 23:30:38 raeb: where from? Jul 18 23:31:33 palm sent em to destinal Jul 18 23:31:41 nice Jul 18 23:31:52 where have we put them? Jul 18 23:32:04 he said he's out, but when he's back he'll share Jul 18 23:32:41 pirahana? Jul 18 23:33:05 referenced by webcore Jul 18 23:33:17 ah Jul 18 23:33:20 Carnivorous Fish. Jul 18 23:34:46 Rick__: mind if I PM you? Jul 18 23:41:27 raeb: btw, about the question earlier, turns out I just needed to do an apt-get update Jul 18 23:42:32 back Jul 18 23:42:47 imposter! Jul 18 23:43:20 :P Jul 18 23:43:59 heh Jul 18 23:44:44 After an article is converted over anyone mind us editing a header in that reads something along the lines of Don't edit this, and links to the new wiki? Jul 18 23:45:24 there is a new wiki? Jul 18 23:45:41 FuMan: not released yet? Jul 18 23:45:49 /s/?// Jul 18 23:48:10 Templarian: use the redirect module Jul 18 23:48:21 Templarian: directions are on the new wiki on how to do that Jul 18 23:48:36 oh, will do. Jul 18 23:49:44 Works good. Jul 18 23:53:08 Templarian: we need to do that external links to the old wiki end up at the right place Jul 18 23:54:03 rwhitby: you you repeat that? Jul 18 23:54:17 can you repeat that? Jul 18 23:54:22 Templarian: we need to do that *so* external links to the old wiki end up at the right place Jul 18 23:55:10 I still can't delete pages rwhitby. Jul 18 23:55:40 There are two names linked to the same page after I move it. Jul 19 00:09:36 anyone know how to see stdout/stderr produced by an app? Jul 19 00:19:20 mrvc: yes Jul 19 00:19:54 mrvc: oh, you want to know? :P initctl stop LunaSysMgr; LunaSysMgr Jul 19 00:20:12 ah, ok Jul 19 00:20:14 thanks! Jul 19 00:20:29 btw: I built the plugin on the device, and it worked fine -- as you suspected Jul 19 00:20:44 mrvc: excellent Jul 19 00:21:01 I've got proper headers now so I'm going to fix up some ugly hacks I did to work around the lack of them Jul 19 00:21:08 and it may help quite a bit Jul 19 00:21:36 nice Jul 19 00:21:39 I was wondering how you got what you had Jul 19 00:22:50 hmmmm Jul 19 00:22:59 if i novaterm with both emulator running and devmode device plugged in Jul 19 00:23:02 to which will i go Jul 19 00:23:53 raeb: good question, but you can specify Jul 19 00:23:58 oo Jul 19 00:24:00 good to know Jul 19 00:24:03 novaterm localhost Jul 19 00:24:06 or novaterm usb Jul 19 00:24:07 or. Jul 19 00:30:16 * rwhitby is working on a homebrew app catalog called "PreWare", which will work on both the real device *and* the emulator. Jul 19 00:30:30 java im guessing? Jul 19 00:30:54 * Eguy is not really paying attention to anything right now Jul 19 00:31:03 raeb: command line only at the moment. integration with GUI to come later, after infrastructure is in place. Jul 19 00:31:13 DVR is full of crap to watch Jul 19 00:31:28 command line only does that mean native code Jul 19 00:31:28 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/preware/all/ is the initial ipkg feed Jul 19 00:31:50 that feed can be used with either ipkg-opt or the built-in ipkg. Jul 19 00:31:52 or shell script Jul 19 00:32:01 on the real device *or* the emulator Jul 19 00:32:23 We should add the rest of the ipks on P|C to the ipkg repo Jul 19 00:32:41 Eguy: working through those which are explicitly licensed to allow redistribution Jul 19 00:33:03 From Precentral? Jul 19 00:33:07 we need to educate folks to license their apps with open source licenses so we can put them in PreWare Jul 19 00:33:11 Eguy: yes Jul 19 00:33:27 if they don't state anything about the license, then we can't include it without permission Jul 19 00:33:41 Aren't they distributable since they are public on a discussion board? Jul 19 00:34:00 absolutely not Jul 19 00:34:22 They also need to learn to put their apps in /var/usr/palm/applications Jul 19 00:34:23 the author has chosen to distribute there. I cannot redistribute without explicit permission either in the license or from the author. Jul 19 00:34:36 Ah, I see Jul 19 00:34:44 Eguy: we can repackage if necessary Jul 19 00:36:04 Oh, I got a noob question... can I tar the whole /var/usr/palm/applications folder to keep as a backup tar file? Jul 19 00:36:10 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/preware/ is the packaging repo Jul 19 00:36:30 Better yet, zip the folder? Jul 19 00:36:50 any app authors here who want to get their apps in early? Jul 19 00:37:04 (must be open source license) Jul 19 00:37:27 anyone know how to set data provition to true Jul 19 00:38:54 i am trying to set up data on a diffrent provider and would like to knwo if there is a place for evdo settings Jul 19 00:41:53 a2dp edit? Jul 19 00:41:57 what what Jul 19 00:42:25 nebula: probably putting the redirect in. Jul 19 00:42:38 ah Jul 19 00:42:47 nice Jul 19 00:42:57 Going down the list moving each one over. Surgardave is on a roll. Jul 19 00:43:01 iTunes 8.2.1 iTunes 8.2.1 provides a number of important bug fixes and addresses an issue with verification of Apple devices. hmmmmm Jul 19 00:43:05 sure is Jul 19 00:43:11 my phone is beepin off the hizzy Jul 19 00:43:34 anyone ever edit evdo on the pre??? Jul 19 00:43:36 Eguy: yeah it's called apple tightening its death grip Jul 19 00:43:43 wchriseg: edit? Jul 19 00:43:59 Or Apple being Apple? Ie: retarded Jul 19 00:44:02 yes Jul 19 00:44:23 i am trying to edit the evdo setting within the phone to make data work form a diffrent provider Jul 19 00:44:28 Eguy: watercooler please unless it's technical discussion about usb ids :-) Jul 19 00:45:06 wchriseg: you might want to try the forum site listed in the policy page for this channel Jul 19 00:45:39 all the unlockers hang out there Jul 19 00:46:54 rwhitby: very funny :) Jul 19 00:55:37 rwhitby - I want to get my apps into the repository, but can't figure out what to do. Jul 19 00:56:23 Rick__: is the ipkg available at a public URL? Jul 19 00:58:34 on the wiki, should we be attempting to categorize the pages a la the "tags" at the old wiki? Jul 19 00:59:27 of course, now that I redirected 2 I don't remember what they were :) Jul 19 01:00:10 sugardave: look at the mod redirect doco on wikidot and it tells you how to disable the redirect through a url suffix Jul 19 01:00:27 cool Jul 19 01:08:34 Rick__: are your apps just in the precentral thread, or hosted elsewhere? Jul 19 01:14:34 ok, so this is weird Jul 19 01:14:53 at least on the emulator, if I try to run LunaSysMgr, it segfaults Jul 19 01:15:09 terminate called after throwing an instance of 'std::logic_error' Jul 19 01:15:10 what(): basic_string::_S_construct NULL not valid Jul 19 01:15:12 Segmentation fault Jul 19 01:18:12 rwhitby they're all current'y in the precentral thread Jul 19 01:18:29 esxcept the unfinished one that is requiring me to write my own freaking file-browser. Jul 19 01:19:58 Rick__: were you going to put the source in gitorious.org/webos-applications ? Jul 19 01:20:22 I had to export HOME=/var/home/root Jul 19 01:23:45 hello everyone Jul 19 01:23:57 sorry to ask again but is anyone here any good with graphics Jul 19 01:24:34 Sort of Jul 19 01:25:09 would you like to do me a favor so i can submit this patch heh Jul 19 01:26:22 i need an icon for this purple image in this image http://josephcrawford.com/pics/xcamera_2009-17-07_164650.jpg Jul 19 01:26:34 setup like this http://josephcrawford.com/pics/menu-capture.png Jul 19 01:26:54 and the bezel to accomodate 2 round icons in the middle rather than the original http://josephcrawford.com/pics/menu-bezel.png Jul 19 01:27:18 rwhitby I would like to put the source there, but I have failed utterly each time I have tried to put things in git. Jul 19 01:27:20 not sure if anyone is up for it :) Jul 19 01:28:00 mrvc: eh? Jul 19 01:28:15 mrvc: did you kill LunaSysMgr first? Jul 19 01:28:18 yep Jul 19 01:28:21 initctl stop LunaSysMgr Jul 19 01:28:26 I run that in emu all the time Jul 19 01:28:36 is $HOME set to something? Jul 19 01:28:48 echo $HOME to see.... Jul 19 01:29:01 on mine /home/root Jul 19 01:29:13 HOME wasn't set on mine Jul 19 01:29:25 did you install bash or something? Jul 19 01:29:26 once I set it, it worked Jul 19 01:29:29 I'm using out of the box sutff Jul 19 01:29:43 no, nothing special Jul 19 01:29:55 weird Jul 19 01:30:08 any takers on that imagery? Jul 19 01:30:27 I just noticed in /etc/event.d/LunasysMgr, it was setting HOME before running LunaSysMgr Jul 19 01:30:33 so, I tried it and it worked Jul 19 01:31:40 desintal__: So, I see the key press and tap events aren't getting through Jul 19 01:32:32 but I do see penmove Jul 19 01:34:00 has there been any progress on handling keyboard and tap events? Jul 19 01:35:26 mrvc: I got distracted, sorry. Jul 19 01:35:48 mrvc: it looks like palm has a standard library to make this way easier for them btw but it's statically compiled in Jul 19 01:36:07 so we can't just use it Jul 19 01:36:41 is the .a on the device? Jul 19 01:37:08 mrvc: hahaha Jul 19 01:37:10 no Jul 19 01:37:20 that would be too easy Jul 19 01:37:38 but there's clearly a standard thing they give plugin devs Jul 19 01:37:38 of course Jul 19 01:37:51 how did you find it? Jul 19 01:38:21 actually someone else who may be joining us tipped me off Jul 19 01:38:30 ah ok Jul 19 01:38:38 he's been reverse engineering the plugin so's Jul 19 01:38:48 nice Jul 19 01:39:30 is there not a way for the pre to notice a remote ssh session? Jul 19 01:40:00 I suppose we could still route events through javascript for now? Jul 19 01:40:05 if a remote ssh session is started i want it to execute a command, every time an ssh session ends I would want to check for any open session, if there is not one, then I would want a command executed Jul 19 01:42:30 mrvc: uh Jul 19 01:42:38 mrvc: you _have_ to route events through javascript anyway Jul 19 01:42:44 see classic Jul 19 01:42:52 I have no idea why but so it seems Jul 19 01:43:08 ok, will do Jul 19 01:43:41 it explains why we don't key key / tap events, because we need to send them from the mojo app Jul 19 01:43:52 which seems really strange, but there you go Jul 19 01:44:00 right Jul 19 01:44:11 has anyone tried to get a key event through to the plugin yet? Jul 19 01:44:56 mrvc: no, should be easy if you want to though, just change classic so that it has a 320x480 drawing window (to avoid collisions) and change its mime type to basicplugin's mime type Jul 19 01:45:08 then classic will launch us instead Jul 19 01:45:17 and do all its event passing magic Jul 19 01:45:25 right Jul 19 01:46:05 or fix basicplugin to draw with the proper dimensions Jul 19 01:46:27 should be easier than taking the extra DOM stuff out of classic Jul 19 01:46:37 or just comment out the blue screen line Jul 19 01:46:45 since you care about events right now not drawing Jul 19 01:50:30 I've got to read up more on writing plugins. Jul 19 02:04:47 mrvc: have you checked out the mozilla documentation on the NPAPI? Jul 19 02:05:09 I've been skimming it Jul 19 02:05:40 but I don't know much yet Jul 19 02:06:08 like, how to call a function of the plugin from javascript Jul 19 02:11:29 Hi room. Jul 19 02:11:40 I have a quick question for the brains here, if anyone's listening. Jul 19 02:11:51 I'm here, I may not be of any use Jul 19 02:12:33 The recent issue cited by Craig Hunter with the webOS accelerometer? ( http://hunter.pairsite.com/blogs/20090717/ ) Jul 19 02:12:46 I was wondering whether or not that's a software or hardware problem Jul 19 02:13:08 As in, could you increase the frequency of the accelerometer polling in software? Jul 19 02:17:06 4hz polling? Jul 19 02:17:14 it does seem a little slow for gaming. Jul 19 02:18:00 Yeah, it is. But is it because the accelerometer itself is slow? Jul 19 02:18:08 Or because it's been set up that way in the OS? Jul 19 02:18:34 Since you folks have been trawling through webOS's innards, I figured someone here might know. Jul 19 02:18:48 mrvc: that's hard, and what I've been looking at Jul 19 02:19:25 is this relevant? http://www.mozilla.org/projects/plugins/bi-directional-plugin-scripting.html Jul 19 02:19:27 mrvc: not terribly hard and we have examples in the firefox code but there's a lot of stuff on exposing methods Jul 19 02:20:03 hmm, that might be Jul 19 02:21:00 I was more thinking of this info in the mdc Jul 19 02:21:00 https://developer.mozilla.org/en/Gecko_Plugin_API_Reference/Scripting_plugins Jul 19 02:21:44 Traveler8 no one has mentioned it in the logs... Jul 19 02:21:45 sorry. Jul 19 02:22:20 did you do a search in the webosDr sources to look for mentions of the accelerometer to see if it's in modifiable code? Jul 19 02:23:12 bzhou * r10469 optware/trunk/ (Makefile make/aria2.mk): aria2: stay at 1.4.1 if gcc 3 Jul 19 02:24:38 Rick: that was gonna be my next step. :) thanks, I'm gonna go do that now. Jul 19 02:25:06 good luck sir. And if you find something, come back and let us know. Jul 19 02:25:09 please pretty please. Jul 19 02:26:20 sure, why not? :P Jul 19 02:26:33 Quick question, i'm trying to get my HW pics off my pre. how do i copy those to my laptop? Jul 19 02:26:42 scp Jul 19 02:26:44 using Putty and there are actually 2 there Jul 19 02:26:56 cashen: pscp Jul 19 02:27:52 Please help , I could not root my pre via wifi on xp . I exactly followed the instructons on wiki, and always get the error: ValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '' Jul 19 02:28:30 cashen , you could copy them to /media/internal and then take them off as a usb device, or you could use something else. Me, I like simple techniques... Jul 19 02:29:02 ameng1 when did that error come up? At what step? Jul 19 02:29:41 cashen@castle:/var/log/hwtest/ted$ pscp pics/*.* c:\ Jul 19 02:29:43 ? Jul 19 02:30:05 cashen: no pscp is something that runs on your windows box not the pre Jul 19 02:30:11 shit Jul 19 02:30:16 I agree just cp pics/* /media/internal Jul 19 02:30:24 see why I like the easy way? Jul 19 02:30:31 cp pics/* /media/internal Jul 19 02:30:36 It seems XP does not recognize my pre , need the pre's rom version match NovacomInstaller_x86_msi 's version? Jul 19 02:30:41 then turn on usb mode on the pre, and just copy them off. Jul 19 02:31:13 Which step ameng1? What are you typing that is generating the error? Jul 19 02:31:15 Rick__: i followed the predev wiki Jul 19 02:31:25 got you. But there are a LOT of steps.... Jul 19 02:31:33 which one's breaking? Jul 19 02:31:34 i run talk.py Jul 19 02:31:38 nodnod Jul 19 02:31:51 and _that_ is what's breaking? Jul 19 02:33:30 ugh, i have to get my usb cable now Jul 19 02:33:34 BS Jul 19 02:33:50 thanks, think i got it Jul 19 02:35:33 actually, once i copied it there, they showed up in my photo app Jul 19 02:36:03 damnit, no hot chic Jul 19 02:36:59 nodnod Jul 19 02:37:05 that's the way it works Jul 19 02:37:14 the photo app looks at /media/internal... Jul 19 02:37:40 now, you can post them to facebook and show JUST what a geek you are... ;-P Jul 19 02:38:06 Rick__: on predev.wikidot.com: 1) Windows XP via wifi , blocked at step 10. 2) Windows XP or Windows Vista via USB cable (novaproxy) , blocked at step 9 Jul 19 02:38:09 what happens if you dont "mount -o remount,ro /" Jul 19 02:38:22 ameng1 -- I have a suggestion for you... Jul 19 02:38:51 ok Jul 19 02:39:15 what Jul 19 02:39:40 what operating system are you on? Jul 19 02:39:51 XP sp2 Jul 19 02:40:08 need sp3? Jul 19 02:40:11 noe Jul 19 02:40:24 and you ran the x86 msi file???? Jul 19 02:40:48 yes , I ran the x86 msi Jul 19 02:40:52 ok Jul 19 02:41:15 do you know how to bring up device manager? Jul 19 02:41:39 cashen: Don't think anything happens.. it's reset to ro when it's rebooted. Jul 19 02:41:51 I know little about xp, I have been using linux :) Jul 19 02:42:30 no problem Jul 19 02:42:38 right click my computer -- choose manage Jul 19 02:42:46 from the left pane menu choose device manager Jul 19 02:43:01 in the right pane, choose PALM NOVACOMM MODULES. Jul 19 02:43:21 does Palm Novacomm show? and does it have a yellow exclamation point on it? Jul 19 02:44:38 wow, I remember I saw nothing about PALM NOVACOMM MODULES on the right pane Jul 19 02:45:58 does that mean the driver did not installed successfully? Jul 19 02:46:42 a sec, I'll take a look Jul 19 02:47:34 ameng1: so why not just get root access via linux? Jul 19 02:48:01 if anything it's easier Jul 19 02:49:08 you tried via linux? Jul 19 02:49:15 yeah Jul 19 02:49:21 novaterm for the win Jul 19 02:49:54 desintal__: Do you know if they suppot NPRuntime? Jul 19 02:51:06 ameng1: just download https://cdn.downloads.palm.com/sdkdownloads/1.1/sdkBinaries/palm-novacom_0.3-svn177284-hud9_i386.deb and install it Jul 19 02:51:11 then sudo novaterm Jul 19 02:52:08 destinal__: I have the amd64 machine Jul 19 02:52:26 oh, then you could use the debian ia32libs Jul 19 02:52:38 destinal__: oops misspelled your nick Jul 19 02:52:52 or you could compile the oss novaterm that the community has developed Jul 19 02:53:28 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/precomd/commits/master Jul 19 02:53:39 err Jul 19 02:53:39 http://gitorious.org/webos-internals/precomd/archive-tarball/master Jul 19 02:55:05 then just sudo ./novacom in that dir, and you're off to the races Jul 19 02:55:19 wish there was a windows novaterm. Jul 19 02:55:42 destinal__: ok , i'll try. After i install it , should i turn on pre's dev mod and connect it to my pc and excute sudo novaterm? Jul 19 02:55:52 ameng1: exactly Jul 19 02:55:53 yes Jul 19 02:56:09 since you're x64 I'd say compile the one I just linked Jul 19 02:56:09 ameng1 once you have root access, I strongly suggest that you then run a script to set up a user and enable the community repository. Jul 19 02:56:14 then sudo ./novacom Jul 19 02:56:14 We have a new version of that.... Jul 19 02:56:20 ok Jul 19 02:56:37 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Next_steps Jul 19 02:56:44 it's been VERY carefully tested. Jul 19 02:56:52 but we would appriciate your feedback. Jul 19 02:57:05 OK Jul 19 02:57:21 ((and since it's scripted, it's way easier than the old way.)) **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Jul 19 02:59:57 2009