**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Oct 21 02:59:59 2009 Oct 21 03:01:10 I can't wait for wIRC Oct 21 03:02:22 Templarian1: When I saw large patch I laugh, it was a great idea. The icon before the large patch did not match at all. Oct 21 03:04:02 (not sure never saw the old one, I just made the vector for the small 16x16 large) Oct 21 03:04:11 Templarian1: we need an icon for top-bar patches ... Oct 21 03:04:16 * zsoc loves himself a vector Oct 21 03:05:11 rwhitby: top bar being where the title and battery and all that sits? Oct 21 03:05:16 Templarian1: yep Oct 21 03:05:34 I HATE this guy: http://jwz.livejournal.com/1108212.html Oct 21 03:05:53 Templarian1: I just did a patch for showing wifi ssid instead of carrier name, and it needs a nice top-bar icon :-) Oct 21 03:05:53 kesne: we know we discussed it an hour ago in detail read up. Oct 21 03:06:01 kesne: don't hate. Oct 21 03:06:06 Adora: hi! Oct 21 03:06:18 rwhitby: I'd love to not hate, but this guy is an asshole. Oct 21 03:06:21 what up, yo Oct 21 03:06:33 (darkness...) Oct 21 03:06:43 Adora: just bought a GSM Pre from Germany - shipment pending ... Oct 21 03:06:50 \o/ Oct 21 03:06:52 kesne, he's also an accomplished coder (according to wikipedia atleast :P) Oct 21 03:07:05 Whats his name? Oct 21 03:07:05 * zsoc wonders who Adora is Oct 21 03:07:15 Adora: and going to do a Pre keyboard transplant when it arrives ... Oct 21 03:07:26 Adora == lisa Oct 21 03:07:42 kesne: do you use firefox at all? Oct 21 03:07:49 rwhitby: the transplant will be difficult .. have you seen the pre teardowns ? Oct 21 03:07:57 rwhitby: 100% of the time Oct 21 03:08:07 bpadalino: I have - it looks like some screws and a connector Oct 21 03:08:19 I like that patch rwhitby, using it now :D Oct 21 03:08:53 never felt the need to change the carrier string until this patch Oct 21 03:08:55 kesne: you can thank jwz for writing/porting the ancestral code of firefox, before you were born. Oct 21 03:09:27 zsoc: I was one of the global organizers for predevcamp, and just started working at palm a week or so ago Oct 21 03:09:34 rwhitby: but honestly, an asshole in an asshole, just because he did something good, doesnt mean he isnt an asshole. Oct 21 03:09:41 Adora, Oh :) Halo then :) Oct 21 03:10:23 kesne: remember you're viewing someone through the thin lens of a blog ... I'm not making excuses or justifications for anyone. Oct 21 03:11:01 rwhitby: I know, and his contributions are good, BUT honestly, I want him to leave. Oct 21 03:11:20 kesne, not everything is about what you want :) This is a community. Oct 21 03:11:39 robust differing opinions is healthy. Oct 21 03:11:42 zsoc: true, just expressing my hate about it Oct 21 03:11:52 rwhitby: remind me when you go to bed (aka when I sluggishly get into work) to do that icon. Gnite guys Oct 21 03:12:02 kesne, I accept your hate, and raise you some 'chill-out mang' :> Oct 21 03:12:08 too much hate over something which is just a tool to use to achieve things which are much more important in life Oct 21 03:12:14 zsoc: I hate you! Oct 21 03:12:22 thatdude, chill-out mang! Oct 21 03:12:34 zsoc: I am stuck reading jwz rant! Oct 21 03:12:43 zsoc: I am being sarcastic Oct 21 03:12:53 thatdude, of course i know that ;) Oct 21 03:13:13 zsoc: I'm pretty chill right now, not worked up, I just dislike the guy, pissed off, but feeling better Oct 21 03:13:33 kesne, cool beans :) Oct 21 03:14:06 I think I should write myself a wikipedia page Oct 21 03:15:44 now THAT's a _super_ speedy deletion ;) Does keen studios have a page? Oct 21 03:16:03 zsoc: not yet Oct 21 03:16:08 Waiting for the LLC to process Oct 21 03:16:53 ah Oct 21 03:20:17 Adora is here? Oct 21 03:20:21 I miss the interesting people Oct 21 03:21:26 Oh wait, she's still here. Oct 21 03:26:27 freakout: so are you going to wear the short shorts in your PreCentral Live guest appearance next week? Oct 21 03:26:49 rwhitby: lol Oct 21 03:26:57 rwhitby: I still haven't received my invitation.... Oct 21 03:27:38 rwhitby: wait, they read my question? Oct 21 03:28:30 freakout: yep, on the podcast Oct 21 03:29:10 Derek (I think) said: We'll have him on as soon as he does something newsworthy ;-) I kacked myself. Oct 21 03:30:13 :O Oct 21 03:31:24 Best line of the show, in my opinion ;-) Oct 21 03:31:24 rwhitby: Okay, fine. just *wait* till they get a load of my crazy QWERTZ-to-QWERTY paintjob Oct 21 03:31:46 rwhitby: see, they could use me to set them up with those kind of openings Oct 21 03:32:12 freakout: Technobabble is sending me a broken Pre, which I'm going to use as a teardown practice device and maybe use the parts for the qwerty keyboard transplant organ. Oct 21 03:33:38 We need to get rasterman into this community. Oct 21 03:34:21 rwhitby, want me to take it apart and try to check under the keyboard for water before any more time goes by? Oct 21 03:34:32 Technobabble: yes please Oct 21 03:34:44 Technobabble: and undo the keyboard connecter so that can dry Oct 21 03:34:54 rwhitby: An Australian-German person could write to Palm Germany for me, too and ask 'em what heck is up with the carrier settings ;) Oct 21 03:35:24 Technobabble: sad for your broken Pre Oct 21 03:35:31 it's okay Oct 21 03:35:35 i insurred it Oct 21 03:35:35 Technobabble: but good for us modifiers :) Oct 21 03:35:38 lsot some pics though Oct 21 03:36:15 Technobabble: I took some pictures on my holiday a couple of weeks ago on the Pre, and forgot to take them off before doing a doctor on it .. Oct 21 03:36:16 lost, rather Oct 21 03:36:24 yikes Oct 21 03:36:35 MIGHT be able to get mine back, yours are a gonner for sure Oct 21 03:36:37 rwhitby: lol Oct 21 03:36:47 howdy! Oct 21 03:36:49 rwhitby: I supose it's a good thing you don't have a digicam that runs Linux Oct 21 03:36:52 ^^ sinceim in texas Oct 21 03:36:56 * freakout waves to PuffTheMagic_ Oct 21 03:37:02 *that's* why I need separate real and development Pre's Oct 21 03:37:08 Are you wearing a cowboy hat PuffTheMagic_ ? Oct 21 03:37:19 naaa Oct 21 03:37:19 PuffTheCowboy is here! Oct 21 03:37:23 thought about getting one Oct 21 03:37:52 PuffTheMagic_, Howdy partner. Oct 21 03:38:00 Did you guys know that there is a sheep station in Australia owned by one family which is the size of Texas? Oct 21 03:38:03 i miss anything the past 2 days? Oct 21 03:38:25 rwhitby: lol i didnt Oct 21 03:38:25 PuffTheMagic_, texas? I bet it's pert near ninety down there! Oct 21 03:38:40 rwhitby, not a fair comparison, Australia is a continent :P Oct 21 03:38:43 ehh, today was in the 80's Oct 21 03:39:20 rwhitby: I hear when you add up the IQ of the sheep it bests the combined IQ of Texas too :p Oct 21 03:40:26 a family is the size of texas? Oct 21 03:40:36 freakout, amazingly enough, I don't think that offends anyone here :P Oct 21 03:42:11 have i missed anything Oct 21 03:42:21 damn afternoon naps, they seem like such a good idea at first :/ Oct 21 03:42:31 I exaggerated a bit, it's only 6 million acres. Oct 21 03:42:32 oil: they are always bad Oct 21 03:42:34 * Technobabble puts on his head lamp Oct 21 03:42:38 okay, i'm goin in Oct 21 03:42:39 sometimes they're not Oct 21 03:42:44 no always Oct 21 03:42:50 lol Oct 21 03:42:51 oil: so, Package Configurations ... Oct 21 03:42:54 i end up sleeping for many hours more than i want Oct 21 03:43:13 oil: u get my message today... i tried using irssi on terminal to send it Oct 21 03:43:16 idk if u got it or not Oct 21 03:43:26 do you guys know of a take apart instruction for the pre Oct 21 03:43:38 rod's brain Oct 21 03:43:39 no Oct 21 03:43:43 Technobabble: to rearrange keys? Oct 21 03:43:57 oil: install mediafly if u dont already have it Oct 21 03:44:06 no, just to take the thing apart as far as possible Oct 21 03:44:09 preware needs a watermark/logo Oct 21 03:44:11 Technobabble: ifixit Oct 21 03:44:11 like ithas Oct 21 03:44:15 in the background Oct 21 03:44:15 k Oct 21 03:44:32 Technobabble: you trying to break it or something? Oct 21 03:44:34 oil: they're HORRIBLE. just leave you feeling like ratcrap when you finally wake up again Oct 21 03:44:47 PuffTheMagic_: already broken, he's sending it to me Oct 21 03:44:50 stfu! Oct 21 03:44:55 afternoon naps FOREVER! Oct 21 03:44:55 lol Oct 21 03:44:57 i'm trying to take it appart and NOT break it Oct 21 03:45:00 Wow, I never met so many people that hate naps. I finally feel normal. Oct 21 03:45:02 rwhitby: how lucky Oct 21 03:45:08 rwhitby: for u at least Oct 21 03:45:17 i take back all the times i didn't want to nap as a child Oct 21 03:45:24 haha Oct 21 03:45:26 i wanna take it apart so i can be sure there's no water corroding it Oct 21 03:45:28 * freakout is confused by oil, but that's nothing different Oct 21 03:45:39 oil: i started to learn to like after dinner naps when i was in highschool Oct 21 03:45:48 i haven't eaten dinner yet Oct 21 03:45:52 any nap more than 45 minutes is counter productive Oct 21 03:46:04 but now when i take a nap its cause im under the infuence of some substance Oct 21 03:46:10 lol Oct 21 03:46:13 and i end up sleeping for lots of hours Oct 21 03:46:16 instaead of 1 Oct 21 03:46:17 ahh yes, i'm seeing it here Oct 21 03:46:20 so i just avoid them now Oct 21 03:46:22 30 minute naps Oct 21 03:46:34 i just meditate now Oct 21 03:46:39 lol Oct 21 03:46:42 started doing that like 4 years ago Oct 21 03:46:47 when i got into buddhism Oct 21 03:46:49 from lay down to get up can't be more than 45 minutes otherwise you are screwed, you hit that REM sleep and it's over Oct 21 03:47:34 egaudet: 90 min cycle Oct 21 03:47:34 its best Oct 21 03:47:34 45 min is a tease Oct 21 03:47:34 nope Oct 21 03:47:36 get 1 rem stage in Oct 21 03:47:39 it's actually proven Oct 21 03:47:41 at least get some enjoyment Oct 21 03:47:48 so what would the watermark be? Oct 21 03:47:50 45 minutes is limit, anything more hurts you more than helps Oct 21 03:48:03 a picture of freakout in his short ass shorts? Oct 21 03:48:10 egaudet: no way....15 min is the only true nap Oct 21 03:48:16 ol Oct 21 03:48:20 30 mins :P Oct 21 03:48:23 who wears short shorts Oct 21 03:48:29 freakout does Oct 21 03:48:30 * rwhitby thinks watermarks just make the thing in front harder to read Oct 21 03:48:45 rwhitby: thats why its a watermark Oct 21 03:48:50 it should be very subtle Oct 21 03:48:50 lol Oct 21 03:49:02 its not a full blow logo Oct 21 03:49:05 rwhitby, it's an obfuscation technique. You're forgetting, we're clearly conspirators Oct 21 03:49:09 it should just visible Oct 21 03:49:26 it should be "just visible" Oct 21 03:49:30 so they're not sure if they're seeing someone in really short shorts or not Oct 21 03:49:39 like 60,60,60 rgb Oct 21 03:49:43 lol Oct 21 03:49:44 even that might be too light Oct 21 03:49:56 "'It's not a full blow logo, it should just visible!' -- PuffTheMagic" Oct 21 03:50:06 * rwhitby wonders whether the people importing GSM Pre's into the US realise that it's only dual-band UMTS, and it's the wrong bands for the US ... Oct 21 03:50:07 lol Oct 21 03:50:19 rwhitby: probably not Oct 21 03:50:43 rwhitby: have you installed mediafly Oct 21 03:50:43 AT&T supports UMTS... er.. well certain parts of their network Oct 21 03:51:03 zsoc: what freqs? 850/1900? Oct 21 03:51:15 rwhitby: the water mark they use does not get in the way with the visibility of the buttons or anything else Oct 21 03:51:16 rwhitby, that _sounds_ right, I know the 850 for sure. Oct 21 03:51:46 zsoc: german umts is 900/2100 Oct 21 03:52:01 Well would you look at that Oct 21 03:52:06 (same as Australia, Asia, and most of the rest of the word) Oct 21 03:52:32 So it will work on EDGE, but not 3G. Oct 21 03:52:39 why to andriod phones say "with Google (tm)" Oct 21 03:52:43 its so lame Oct 21 03:52:54 PuffTheMagic_: you don't have to install it, the screenshots show it Oct 21 03:52:54 every phone has a browser Oct 21 03:53:03 rwhitby, are people outside of america honestly tired of american standards always having to be different? it would piss me off Oct 21 03:53:06 oil: install what? Oct 21 03:53:13 mediafly Oct 21 03:53:24 rwhitby, also, umts networks in america offer very poor coverage anyway. Oct 21 03:53:26 oil: mine didnt Oct 21 03:53:31 okay, back cover's off Oct 21 03:53:32 zsoc: people outside of america don't think that america is the centre of the universe, so they don't care too much ;-) Oct 21 03:53:36 good night Oct 21 03:53:47 rwhitby, i wish america would realize that sometimes Oct 21 03:54:01 Technobabble: did you find the ifixit teardown guide? Oct 21 03:54:14 zsoc: but we are ;) Oct 21 03:54:23 * PuffTheMagic_ hides from rwhitby Oct 21 03:54:24 Technobabble: I'd like to run through it with you as you go ... Oct 21 03:54:31 argh, i missed the short shorts refrain Oct 21 03:54:49 * freakout wonders if he's mentioned that he hates work today.... Oct 21 03:55:07 * PuffTheMagic_ wonders what he missed int he 2 days about short shorts Oct 21 03:55:17 any why that was a topic of discussion Oct 21 03:55:20 and how it came up Oct 21 03:55:44 someone must have been looking that that Tim Carol photo again Oct 21 03:56:50 yeah Oct 21 03:56:53 i got through... Oct 21 03:56:54 PuffTheMagic_: the photo was discussed on the PalmCast Live today, and a link was given ... Oct 21 03:56:57 step 14 Oct 21 03:57:04 just got the PCB off Oct 21 03:57:04 rwhitby: haha Oct 21 03:57:25 it was? Oct 21 03:57:25 haha Oct 21 03:57:42 freakout: did you listen to the PalmCast Live today? Oct 21 03:57:58 rwhitby: is there ever anything useful on those or is it just bs about precentral and random palm sales info.... and other useless crap? Oct 21 03:58:54 PuffTheMagic_: freakout sent in a Twitter question about why he hasn't been invited onto the show. Derek made a comment about they'll invite him when he does something newsworthy, and then I gave them the link to the photo. Everyone had a good laugh, and the best bit is that it's all recorded and will be available online in a couple of days ... Oct 21 03:58:59 rwhitby: also, I have some serious issues i need to bring up with palm... 2 usability issues and 1 general annoyance with the e-mail app Oct 21 03:59:25 lol Oct 21 03:59:26 PuffTheMagic_ wants the email address of someone up top in palm Oct 21 03:59:29 to let them know about it Oct 21 03:59:33 what photo ? Oct 21 03:59:43 oil: there's a thread on Precentral about that isn't there? Oct 21 03:59:44 oil: sure do Oct 21 03:59:52 (how to get an email to the top of palm) Oct 21 03:59:58 i know Oct 21 04:00:02 its what i was referencing Oct 21 04:00:03 rwhitby: lol Oct 21 04:00:05 cause it was so hilarious Oct 21 04:00:30 Why is it there doesn't seem to be much organization to the Pre dev community outside of webos-internals? Oct 21 04:00:50 http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/209887-anyone-have-email-would-get-me-top-palm.html Oct 21 04:00:55 1) back and forward gestures should work to toggle between pages when the app launcher is up... you shouldnt need to use the touchscreen area to do that Oct 21 04:00:59 zsoc: cause they lack a benevolent dictator? Oct 21 04:01:23 rwhitby: you really linked that picture??!! Oct 21 04:01:36 rwhitby: I don't get to join in to the PalmCast anymore because I am at work when it's on Oct 21 04:01:37 2) they should just do away with pages and have an infinite area, when you move to the left or right it should move 1 column at a time Oct 21 04:02:21 * freakout has Jon Rubinstein's email Oct 21 04:02:32 * freakout has the director of Product PR, who never tells you ANYTHIGN Oct 21 04:03:02 i am still a little clueless about the photo :( Oct 21 04:03:05 lol Oct 21 04:03:09 freakout: did you have a better picture I should have linked instead? Oct 21 04:03:10 trust me, you're better off Oct 21 04:03:13 okie dokie Oct 21 04:03:47 bpadalino: I've only just regained sight in one eye over the last 24 hours ... Oct 21 04:03:59 lol Oct 21 04:04:00 good to know you've spared the rest of us Oct 21 04:04:01 thank you Oct 21 04:04:02 :) Oct 21 04:04:10 lol Oct 21 04:04:25 bpadalino: its oils' wallpaper Oct 21 04:04:32 lol Oct 21 04:04:33 no Oct 21 04:04:37 Technobabble: so any hassles on any of the steps? or is it all straight-forward? Oct 21 04:04:47 my wallpaper is the iss Oct 21 04:05:03 someone should submit it to that "hunky guys" theme author ... Oct 21 04:05:13 rwhitby: you gonna take apart your gsm qwertz and re-arrange the keys? Oct 21 04:05:30 PuffTheMagic_: nope, swap the keyboard assembly with a CDMA pre Oct 21 04:05:31 brb, food Oct 21 04:05:45 rwhitby: is that really easier? Oct 21 04:05:45 rwhitby, it's pretty straight forward Oct 21 04:05:52 did you want me to keep going? Oct 21 04:05:54 i stopped at 14 Oct 21 04:06:56 Technobabble: you could take it completely apart and leave it as a jigsaw puzzle for me ;-) Oct 21 04:06:58 rwhitby: i had a TI-92 graphing calculator... which i remapped the keys on so I could use it on the SAT's when I was in HS... the SAT's prohibit the use of calculators with qwerty keyboards ;) Oct 21 04:07:11 i'm not sure if that'd be a good idea to send that way Oct 21 04:07:21 Technobabble: yeah, you're probably right. Oct 21 04:07:21 i'm pretty sure if it's all together nothing'll break off Oct 21 04:07:26 i think they have since changed the rules to ban TI-92's explicitly Oct 21 04:07:31 but there's no water inside it so far Oct 21 04:07:35 Technobabble: which step was the keyboard connector? Oct 21 04:07:41 i'm on 14, so i'm not sure Oct 21 04:07:57 14 of 1231231 Oct 21 04:08:09 keyboard 42564 Oct 21 04:08:12 Who is 14? Oct 21 04:09:15 Technobabble: but you undid the keyboard connector? Oct 21 04:09:28 kesne, not taking about age :P Oct 21 04:09:33 i'm not sure which one the keyboard connector is Oct 21 04:09:43 of XD Oct 21 04:09:55 Perhaps I should focus on the text more Oct 21 04:11:09 rwhitby: I have *so* many pictures.... Oct 21 04:11:29 rwhitby: but fortunately for you all, Facebook is blocked at work so I can't dig up the links xD Oct 21 04:11:30 Technobabble: did you see the water damage sensor on step 16? Oct 21 04:12:08 freakout: more tim carol photos? Oct 21 04:12:15 not there yet Oct 21 04:12:33 PuffTheMagic_: Facebook wouldn't let me link anybody else's publically ;) Oct 21 04:12:46 freakout: you need to friend them first Oct 21 04:12:55 freakout: or are you on a stalking ban list Oct 21 04:13:25 so why its the browser gui such a piece of shit on the Pre Oct 21 04:13:44 who though preventing browsing of local files was a good idea Oct 21 04:14:04 i have this CD of like 1000 pdfs from the conference im at with html index file for them Oct 21 04:14:12 and i cant view it on the pre Oct 21 04:14:21 and the pdfs dont have useful file names Oct 21 04:14:27 PuffTheMagic_: if someone has set their photos as private you cannot link them publically Oct 21 04:14:38 oh right Oct 21 04:14:44 so no way to find the pdf i want Oct 21 04:14:45 also Oct 21 04:14:48 PuffTheMagic_: Hence, i can only link my own hot, sexy pics Oct 21 04:14:55 global search dont search text files Oct 21 04:15:01 so i cant look in the abstracts Oct 21 04:17:25 yeah, it's pink Oct 21 04:18:36 Guiness bottles are loud after the last sip. Oct 21 04:18:46 this thing actually looks to be in pretty good shape Oct 21 04:18:52 i dried it out rather well Oct 21 04:19:46 there's still water spots on the inside though Oct 21 04:21:21 Technobabble: drop it in the toilet while looking at Tim Carol photo huh Oct 21 04:22:01 lmao Oct 21 04:22:02 i have no idea what you're talking about Oct 21 04:22:10 Technobabble wouldn't be the first PuffTheMagic_ Oct 21 04:22:20 haha Oct 21 04:24:51 has anyone looked at the logic in the kernel for deciding what current_mA to set the charging rate too? Oct 21 04:25:15 like my usb batter charger that i made charges at 500ma Oct 21 04:25:26 but couldnt I set it to 1000ma Oct 21 04:25:40 PuffTheMagic_, I'm curious at that myself. Oct 21 04:26:27 what ever it uses to detect a host... so that it can prompt for usb storage mode Oct 21 04:26:37 is probably how it knows to set 500ma Oct 21 04:26:45 but for touchstone or wall Oct 21 04:26:52 there has to be some different logic Oct 21 04:27:06 and my homemade charger dont trigger usb storage mode Oct 21 04:27:12 and it still goes to 500 Oct 21 04:27:15 so idk Oct 21 04:27:25 maybe it does a draw test Oct 21 04:27:30 or looks at the resistance Oct 21 04:27:31 idk Oct 21 04:27:35 PuffTheMagic_, how do you verify what it's drawing? Oct 21 04:27:36 lots of idk Oct 21 04:28:35 idk if i'm gonna be able to get this back together Oct 21 04:28:36 lol Oct 21 04:29:16 Technobabble: heh - can you get better access to compressed air inside the keyboard from there? Oct 21 04:29:59 if you look at the picture, the keyboard doesn't really come apart much more than that Oct 21 04:30:03 zsoc: castle ~ # cat /sys/devices/platform/usb_gadget/current_mA Oct 21 04:30:03 500 Oct 21 04:30:17 castle ~ # cat /sys/devices/platform/usb_gadget/source Oct 21 04:30:17 bus Oct 21 04:30:18 http://s2.guide-images.ifixit.com/igi/mIEZEJqLvW2BeXJR.large Oct 21 04:30:43 * PuffTheMagic_ is afraid to look at any photos posted on this site now Oct 21 04:31:17 TC scared my retinas Oct 21 04:31:37 gotcha, ty Oct 21 04:33:03 well im going to bed... gotta get up early tomorrow for more talks Oct 21 04:33:29 PuffTheMagic_: sleep tight Oct 21 04:33:47 PuffTheMagic_: I can send you some pics if you like Oct 21 04:34:12 and by more talks, you mean, bang out the irc service? Oct 21 04:34:13 xD Oct 21 04:38:14 Technobabble: are they undoing the keyboard connector in that photo? Oct 21 04:40:29 well the keyboard connector is pretty easy Oct 21 04:40:42 it's behind the buttons i'd be worried about Oct 21 04:42:06 PuffTheMagic_: what oil said Oct 21 04:42:09 * freakout cracks whip Oct 21 04:45:09 Technobabble: yeah, the contacts for the individual keys Oct 21 04:46:07 want me to alcohol it? Oct 21 04:46:12 it's all pretty dry right now Oct 21 04:46:14 Technobabble: which is why this might end up just being the take-down practice unit in preparation for swapping the keyboard from the real CDMA unit to the German Pre - maybe do a three-way shuffle so the development Pre gets the drowned keyboard intstead of the qwertz keyboard Oct 21 04:46:40 Technobabble: don't go out of your way to do anything Oct 21 04:46:43 okay Oct 21 04:47:14 it's going back together now Oct 21 04:47:15 having an already-apart device makes taking apart a new device *much* easier to do Oct 21 04:47:23 you can see where all the tabs and slots are :-) Oct 21 04:47:34 yeah Oct 21 05:00:37 Technobabble: any bits left over ;-) Oct 21 05:01:48 heh, kinda Oct 21 05:04:02 lol Oct 21 05:25:38 hey all Oct 21 05:26:00 where does palms webos doctor downloader download the webos doctor .jar file? Oct 21 05:31:16 PuffTheMagic_: comment out on line of browser app , you could browse local html files Oct 21 05:39:54 okay, this thing is all back together Oct 21 05:39:58 that only took me a couple hours Oct 21 05:40:07 whatdya do? Oct 21 05:40:19 took apart a pre and put it back togethetr Oct 21 05:40:52 Technobabble: no bits left over this time? Oct 21 05:42:21 hey im mitch Oct 21 05:42:38 i have a question about downloading a virtual keyboard Oct 21 05:42:43 from preware Oct 21 05:42:48 it gives me an error message Oct 21 05:43:24 Guest95169: what are the messages from ipkg log - just paraphrase them, no need to copy them exactly just yet Oct 21 05:43:37 ignore the offline root message, tell us about messages from patch Oct 21 05:44:38 ok Oct 21 05:44:39 hold on Oct 21 05:45:37 sometimes, i just don't understand what palm was ever thinking... Oct 21 05:46:01 not being able to have two sliders with different min/max Oct 21 05:46:09 not being able to change a widgets attributes after its setup Oct 21 05:47:03 (offline root mode: not running org.webosinternals.patch.add-onscreen-keyboard.postinst) Oct 21 05:47:10 Guest95169: that is not an error Oct 21 05:47:45 what are the messages from patch Oct 21 05:48:07 Failure dring 'postinst' operation Oct 21 05:48:51 Guest95169: did you not see my directions to ignore the offline root message? Oct 21 05:49:00 cant find file to patch at input line 4 perhaps you used the wrong -p or --strip option? Oct 21 05:49:05 yes but im not sure what you mean Oct 21 05:49:10 what do you want to see? Oct 21 05:49:45 Guest95169: can you take a screenshot of the messages? Oct 21 05:50:00 not sure how Oct 21 05:50:05 so im afraid not Oct 21 05:50:12 is there something i can type to you? Oct 21 05:51:48 it files patches Oct 21 05:51:52 then skips patch Oct 21 05:52:16 then shows a bunch of things that look like patching file usr/palm/frameworks/... etc Oct 21 05:52:19 14 times Oct 21 05:54:32 Failed errorgenericmethodexception Oct 21 05:56:58 is there anywhere where it says that it cannot apply the patch, or chunk rejected, or something like that? Oct 21 05:57:52 screenshot is Orange,Sym,P together. images end up on the USB Oct 21 05:58:14 post them in the onscreen keyboard forum thread on PreCentral Oct 21 05:58:55 it says hunk ignored Oct 21 05:59:32 ok, that means that the files it was trying to patch are not in a pristine state. Oct 21 05:59:44 ok Oct 21 05:59:48 so is it possible to fix Oct 21 06:00:00 you need to use the webos repair utility or the webos doctor to put those files back into the pristine webOS version state. Oct 21 06:00:18 how do i do that Oct 21 06:01:53 ... Oct 21 06:02:50 you do a search for "webos repair utility" and then read the documentation associated with it. Oct 21 06:03:05 on like google? Oct 21 06:05:32 rwhitby, it's all back together Oct 21 06:05:39 ok found it Oct 21 06:05:43 then what Oct 21 06:05:47 after i download it Oct 21 06:05:53 run it? Oct 21 06:05:54 follow the directions Oct 21 06:06:14 ok Oct 21 06:06:21 should i have it repair or ignore Oct 21 06:06:36 restore* Oct 21 06:07:26 well are you trying to fix it, or did you download it and run it to ignore everything it wants to fix? Oct 21 06:07:57 i dont know Oct 21 06:08:01 im new Oct 21 06:08:21 Guest95169: seriously, if you're not prepared to read up on the tools you are about to use, you should just webOS Doctor your phone and start from scratch. Oct 21 06:08:48 i am Oct 21 06:08:52 but im still learning Oct 21 06:08:55 and asking for help Oct 21 06:09:38 if you are prepared to read up on the tools before asking for help with the harder questions, then we're here to help. How many pages of the webOS Repair Utility thread have you read so far? Oct 21 06:09:48 none Oct 21 06:09:52 which URL are you reading? Oct 21 06:09:54 because i didnt know what te problem was Oct 21 06:09:55 lol Oct 21 06:10:03 http://forums.precentral.net/canuck-software/204495-webos-repair-utility.html Oct 21 06:10:48 Guest95169: in the ipkg log from when the keyboard was being installed, you will see filenames that were not able to be patched successfully. Restore those files. Oct 21 06:11:12 ok Oct 21 06:11:20 may i ask how i would go about doing that Oct 21 06:12:55 whats good Oct 21 06:16:26 oh and rwhirby Oct 21 06:16:28 if this work Oct 21 06:16:30 s Oct 21 06:16:40 can i gt your paypal acct to donate into Oct 21 06:19:12 it is in his signature on precentral Oct 21 06:33:00 i ran the repair Oct 21 06:33:06 and still got the same error mesage Oct 21 06:33:09 Guest95169: in the ipkg log, you will see some filenames /usr/palm/frameworks/... Oct 21 06:33:15 did it repair those files? Oct 21 06:33:31 how? Oct 21 06:33:45 nd it said anything dadmaged was repiard Oct 21 06:34:11 i ran the program Oct 21 06:36:41 ... Oct 21 06:38:03 whatever Oct 21 06:38:09 i guess ill continue this tomorrow Oct 21 06:38:12 goodnight Oct 21 06:47:51 has anyone seen these pictures taken with the N900? pretty impressive i must say http://www.tigert.com/2009/10/18/photojourney-with-n900/ Oct 21 06:51:28 they are pretty Oct 21 07:16:28 anyone see this? http://img.netcarshow.com/Lexus-LFA_2011_1600x1200_wallpaper_09.jpg that is pretty impressive too :P Oct 21 07:19:38 not really Oct 21 07:21:48 I'm reading about Sodium Alginate and Calcium Chloride for making fake caviar - http://luxirare.com/parfait/ Oct 21 07:21:54 Much more impressive ;) Oct 21 07:23:58 I'm looking at mimicking this process to encapsulate cilantro oil to add to my texas sashimi Oct 21 07:29:43 whenever i change a file and send it back to the phone with webos qi, nothing changes. why won't it overwrite? Oct 21 07:30:31 did you restart luna? Oct 21 07:30:44 yes Oct 21 07:30:55 then i dont know Oct 21 07:31:49 do i need to restart the phone completely or just restart luna after editing launcher-assistant.js? Oct 21 07:32:08 i really don't know Oct 21 07:32:18 but a luna restart should do it Oct 21 07:34:20 ok, one more question. i sent it to usr/lib/luna/system/luna-applauncher/app/controllers/ Oct 21 07:34:41 do i need a "/" before usr? Oct 21 07:37:49 yes Oct 21 11:02:32 what does preware mean with "offline root mode..." when faing to install a patch? Oct 21 11:11:56 ignore that line. it is not an error. Oct 21 11:15:38 ok, so the script failed somewhere else? Oct 21 11:16:25 I wastrying to install this multi browser patch. do I need anything special to use it? Oct 21 11:22:39 sorry for the typos, I'm writing from the pre and have a small font in terminal :) Oct 21 11:54:06 sepi: for every typo, you have to create a new homebrew hack. Them's the rules here ;) Oct 21 11:54:36 * freakout currently owes the group 6,782,439 hacks at last count Oct 21 12:03:42 I'm currently working on an arcade game similar to the old sfcave Oct 21 12:05:45 I guess that could fix some of my typos ;) Oct 21 12:08:51 sepi: cool! Oct 21 12:11:40 I'll publish it in two weeks or so Oct 21 12:12:16 Good timing, my German Pre should arrive by then :) Oct 21 12:13:06 not sure where to publish it though Oct 21 12:13:33 sepi: If payment is no concern, PreCentral Oct 21 12:13:52 sepi: if it is and the game is decent? flog it for a buck or two in the app catalog... Oct 21 12:16:15 sepi: see Oct 21 12:16:19 "How to submit apps" Oct 21 12:16:20 http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1796 Oct 21 12:16:24 I'm thinking of selling it in the catalog but it's not possible yet as european Oct 21 12:17:41 sfcave was cool Oct 21 12:18:35 I'm not sure if I yhould keep it as simple as the original or add a little more graphics and stuff Oct 21 12:19:00 I might ship both in the same app Oct 21 12:55:22 sepi -- as a european you can still sell your app, it's just that you have to sell in the US for now. Oct 21 12:55:39 but if you live in a countrywhere you can accept paypal payments, you can sell. Oct 21 12:57:41 Rick_work: really? thats cool. I wonderhow they handle taxes and stuff Oct 21 12:58:10 sepi -- they don't that's entirely your problem Oct 21 12:58:33 ok Oct 21 12:58:49 go to developer.palm.com and sign up. Oct 21 12:59:03 You will have to have a VERIFIED paypal account. -- is that meaningful to you? Oct 21 12:59:12 but currently the submission process is only manual, is it? Oct 21 12:59:16 Palm pays _only_ to verified paypal accounts. Oct 21 12:59:33 sepi - no, again, go to developer.palm.com and sign up and read what it says. Oct 21 12:59:41 ok Oct 21 12:59:45 there's a LOT to read Oct 21 13:00:00 well, first O have to finish the app Oct 21 13:00:14 but basically short version, sign up, provide a validated paypal account, and certify that your app meets the UI contraints. Oct 21 13:00:20 what are you writing? Oct 21 13:00:25 and get ny friend to make the artwork Oct 21 13:00:43 an sfcave clone Oct 21 13:00:52 a little extended Oct 21 13:01:12 ok Oct 21 13:01:27 you are aware of the requirements for app catalog ? Oct 21 13:01:59 I'm currently having strange hangs every 20 s or so. but only on the phone Oct 21 13:02:11 do they last about 1/3 second? Oct 21 13:02:19 Rick_work: not really Oct 21 13:02:32 Rick_work: yes Oct 21 13:02:50 sepi are you doing animations? Oct 21 13:03:05 Rick_work: yes using canvas Oct 21 13:03:25 sepi -- it's garbage collection. Oct 21 13:03:30 I havn't tried to optimize it yet though Oct 21 13:03:38 and it's a MASSIVE problem right now. Oct 21 13:03:57 to minimize it, you're going to have to do a difficult restructuring of your program... Oct 21 13:04:11 Rick_work: aha_ I guess I need to find out what creates all those objects then Oct 21 13:04:41 Rick_work: what did you do? Oct 21 13:05:18 nodnod. You need to pre-create all your objects at the front, and minimize the use of strings, and roll the ENTIRE game loop into a single function if you can, do not discard variables, do not un-instantiate functions. Oct 21 13:06:06 hmm, the entire loop in one function Oct 21 13:06:07 game programming, in every language, requires tossing out a lot of the "computer science" type stuff, and writing tight as hell loops that are very focused. Oct 21 13:06:17 is sfcave the snake-jump game? Oct 21 13:06:34 well, without the jump Oct 21 13:07:13 I currently focussed on a nice oop design. I might need to go back to a more procedural style Oct 21 13:07:54 Is there a way to do memory profiling on the pre? Oct 21 13:08:25 not much but some palm sdk 1.2 came with a memory monitor that will follow what your doing. Oct 21 13:08:41 but an OOP design is absolutely going to eat your lunch with GC Oct 21 13:09:00 game engines need to be _tight_ Oct 21 13:09:27 no extra characters. No functions that can be coded in line. Re-use variables. Oct 21 13:10:30 to the extent possible use global variables, and re-use them over and over rather than local variables that have to be discarded and then re-instantiated when a function is called. Oct 21 13:10:59 can't v8 optimize this away Oct 21 13:11:13 nope Oct 21 13:11:32 specifically, it's variable discards that are the issue. Oct 21 13:11:37 from lisp coding I know that local variables arefaster Oct 21 13:11:53 oh yeah , they're faster, EXECPT FOR THE GC Oct 21 13:12:15 but the gc on the pre is currently 300ms _no matter what_ Oct 21 13:12:19 it's a 300 ms pause. Oct 21 13:12:34 and local variables are -discarded- by v8 and end up on the garbage heap Oct 21 13:12:44 and there is no way with the v8 compiler to hand-trigger a gc Oct 21 13:13:04 so you can't do a "small" gc at pause times, so you get the 300 ms gc at random intervals. Oct 21 13:13:39 so, to avoid it, you simply have to avoid releasing a varialble, basically -ever- Oct 21 13:13:41 ok. so isit feasible to get it running smoothly? Oct 21 13:14:20 you'll get pauses. They're inevvitable. Air Hockey int he app catalog is aboutas good as you can get and they are getting a gc about ever 10 seconds. Oct 21 13:14:33 sorry Oct 21 13:14:35 30 seconds Oct 21 13:15:14 try an experiment...... Oct 21 13:15:26 write a tiny tiny app that bounces a ball around the screen. Oct 21 13:15:53 Do two versions. one with all globals and in-line collision detection, the other with locals and calling a collision detection function. Oct 21 13:15:58 time the gc's. Oct 21 13:16:10 see if you think the benefit is worth it. Oct 21 13:16:24 this ought to take 20 or 30 minutes and it's a good experiment to make Oct 21 13:18:26 mm. where is that hockey app? Oct 21 13:18:36 paid app in the us app store Oct 21 13:18:42 can't find it on the app catalog Oct 21 13:19:01 gahh Oct 21 13:19:05 irssi Oct 21 13:19:46 test Oct 21 13:20:07 sepi -- go find a desktop Oct 21 13:20:34 irssi and the pre keyboard ?? Wow, you're fast, you'll end up with gamers-thumb repetative stress injury you keep this up Oct 21 13:21:12 the keyboard is ni Oct 21 13:21:35 ot that bad :) Oct 21 13:21:35 no pun intended Oct 21 13:23:43 I gotta customer in 5 minutes. Gotta go work now Oct 21 13:24:11 s that air hockey app a paid app? Oct 21 13:24:20 ok Oct 21 13:24:32 bye and thanls a lot for your tips Oct 21 13:29:33 Hi Oct 21 13:29:40 hi Oct 21 13:30:25 is it possible to built in voip functionality into the dialer ? Oct 21 13:30:37 not at this time. Oct 21 13:30:56 no one has successfullly done audio capture yet. Oct 21 13:31:03 ahh, on my laptop now :) Oct 21 13:31:21 hmm k Oct 21 13:31:25 is webos using pulseaudio ? Oct 21 13:31:32 yes Oct 21 13:31:48 opensource.palm.com Oct 21 13:32:02 and the webos-internals wiki for details Oct 21 13:45:15 Rick_work, how does the audio testing app record and playback audio? it could probably be used as an example Oct 21 14:04:33 I Need help - someone here know how to change the physical keyboard layout? I want to change the letters. I alredy add hebrew fonts and translate most of the apps and add hebrew char to the virtual keyboard. the only thing left is the physical keyboard Oct 21 14:06:02 hu Oct 21 14:06:57 testing on pre. Anyone here? Oct 21 14:07:08 yes Oct 21 14:07:15 cool! Oct 21 14:07:56 not the most beautiful client but I guess it works Oct 21 14:08:21 You're on an IRC client? Oct 21 14:08:42 webchat.freenode.net Oct 21 14:09:10 ahh Oct 21 14:10:28 suprised no one has developed anything yet Oct 21 14:10:31 for webos Oct 21 14:12:04 anything in the works? Oct 21 14:13:07 Yep, there are a few I believe. Oct 21 14:13:32 very cool Oct 21 14:13:49 (of course they would have to run through a service to handle the whole socket thing so will be a Preware/QI only thing) Oct 21 14:14:32 ah Oct 21 14:14:39 @Templarian what's the beautifier thing for Komodo? Oct 21 14:14:54 something to organize code? I was setting up a new system and saw it for download Oct 21 14:15:04 AnOutsider: formats the JS tab that is opened. Oct 21 14:15:35 I comes with the IDE and a few Komodo Edit people wanted the same thing to format their JS. Oct 21 14:16:01 ah ok Oct 21 14:19:22 Is there any way to change the physical keyboard language? Oct 21 14:20:32 ateamtip: I'm told the virtual keyboard is the best option since it takes a lot of work. Oct 21 14:21:44 I alredy changed the virtual keyboard - but now I want to change the physical keyboard Oct 21 14:22:28 Since they figured out how to change they keys for the german QWERTZ so the Y and Z are flipped back for those needing GSM it is probably possible to follow similar steps. Oct 21 14:23:06 (pretend that made sense) Oct 21 14:23:17 anyone know how I can write my own "server" and call it with serverRequest -- how the JSON string are passed in and returned? Oct 21 14:23:43 haha made sense to me temp... made sense to me Oct 21 14:26:35 +Templarian - Thanks I will check it Oct 21 14:27:52 cocosjungle_: do you by chance mean "service" Oct 21 14:29:02 when you make a controller.serviceRequest("...", jsonObject) call it's processed by a C or Java module Oct 21 14:29:43 those "service" modules have access to the linux os Oct 21 14:32:30 cocosjungle_: that is correct... (I think there is a tutorial on the wiki about this) Oct 21 14:35:46 I have just written up the instructions on how to use a different pulseaudio server on the Pre. Feel free to try out and give feedback: Oct 21 14:35:47 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Tutorials_Linux_Pulseaudio_redirect Oct 21 15:10:13 alphaone: thanks, i'll look at that right now Oct 21 15:19:59 woo Oct 21 15:20:04 got my touchstones now :) Oct 21 15:24:04 congrats Oct 21 15:24:20 isnt it awesome(ly overpriced)? Oct 21 15:25:28 I'm considering applying the iPhone user-agent patch documented here (http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/200656-how-make-all-mobile-websites-display-perfectly.html). Anyone have any opinions on this? Oct 21 15:26:10 i want to give it a try and see if the webgmail will turn up any better Oct 21 15:54:40 gkatsev: nope.. not if you're good at shouting at the carrier Oct 21 15:59:37 the sprint guy i was getting the pre from gave me a 20% discount, which was nice Oct 21 16:25:38 sorry to repeat -- but I'm going to try my question one more time in case someone who is online now has an opinion ... Oct 21 16:25:51 I'm considering applying the iPhone user-agent patch documented here (http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/200656-how-make-all-mobile-websites-display-perfectly.html). Anyone have any opinions on this? Oct 21 16:26:33 needs more cowbell Oct 21 16:26:51 * nt4cats throws a cowbell at Mousey Oct 21 16:26:53 ow Oct 21 16:27:32 so a user-agent patch? Oct 21 16:27:37 I APPROVE!! Oct 21 16:27:42 more kicking apple in the balls! Oct 21 16:27:44 w00t! Oct 21 16:28:21 can you do user-agent: iPhone O=) Oct 21 16:28:32 Mousey: that's what that patch does (makes your pre identify itself as an iPhone) Oct 21 16:29:06 i know what the PRE's gonna be for halloween! ^_^ Oct 21 16:30:31 will EPR remove it? Oct 21 16:36:06 Mousey: I don't think so -- this 'patch' doesn't use the official patch mechanism. I'm downloading it now so I can inspect it, but from reading the description I think it hot-patches one of the browser binaries. I'm not sure, though -- that's why I'm looking Oct 21 16:43:37 it is a binary patch Oct 21 16:45:05 egaudet: yep, I just pulled it apart Oct 21 16:46:34 It patches /usr/lib/libWebKitLuna.so Oct 21 16:50:00 ... and by "patches" I mean "replaces" Oct 21 16:50:45 man i'm a chatty threader Oct 21 16:51:08 * Mousey nods Oct 21 16:51:50 * Mousey fills up ampachpre thread with posts Oct 21 17:13:35 Mousey: you're a chatty ircer too ;) Oct 21 17:13:44 = Oct 21 17:13:49 s/=/=P/ Oct 21 17:13:50 Mousey meant: =P Oct 21 17:13:56 heh Oct 21 17:14:19 i <3 my phone Oct 21 17:16:53 ping dBsooner Oct 21 17:40:55 Mousey: hey, careful, that's illegal in 17 states! Oct 21 17:41:30 * Mousey pees on the sanctity of marriage Oct 21 17:42:15 mousey youre using amapachepre and not ampachemobile? why? Oct 21 17:42:29 because it crashes Oct 21 17:42:45 ive never had it crash. Oct 21 17:42:56 i've had it not output cuz i switched tracks too fast Oct 21 17:43:01 i know, the author doesn't seem to get it either. Oct 21 17:43:19 but as soon as it loads it starts lunasysmgr starts hoarking up all memory Oct 21 17:43:39 and the only way out (even if i manage to kill ampache mobile) is to respawn lunasysmgr somehow Oct 21 17:43:54 ampachpre is faster too Oct 21 17:44:02 and works with my wild ass setup Oct 21 17:44:04 for the most part Oct 21 17:44:42 youre pre is fucked Oct 21 17:44:49 mine doesnt have any of those issues Oct 21 17:44:54 and i use amapachepre like 8h a day Oct 21 17:44:57 streaming over bt Oct 21 17:44:58 everything else works great Oct 21 17:45:05 streaming over bt even works Oct 21 17:45:12 from music player, or shoutcast* Oct 21 17:45:49 i use ampachemobile to bt headphones or a2dp deck for like 8h/day Oct 21 17:45:59 works great. Oct 21 17:46:09 one day, i will say the same >_< Oct 21 17:49:28 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agagVYWTXHo Oct 21 17:49:32 heres my car mounted touchstone Oct 21 17:50:04 i just uploaded it so itll get better quality Oct 21 17:50:05 not that it matters Oct 21 17:51:57 http://www.flickr.com/photos/56721019@N00/ Oct 21 18:15:18 egaudet ping Oct 21 18:18:19 rwhitby: ping Oct 21 18:19:03 rwhitby is probably still asleep Oct 21 18:19:50 dBsooner, I think we need a system for patches to get turned into ipk Oct 21 18:19:51 dBsooner: thanks. lazy south side people. ;) Oct 21 18:20:12 egaudet: meaning? Oct 21 18:20:40 Browsing the forums it seems most people will create a .patch Oct 21 18:21:01 but don't want to submit them to us? Oct 21 18:21:15 and then tell people to use QI drag/drop and be done with it, they don't seem to have incentive, desire or know-how to get it rolling into the feed Oct 21 18:21:16 it's easy, I have told them if they will just email me, I'll create the ipk Oct 21 18:21:35 * dBsooner hates QI. Oct 21 18:21:42 No offense to Jason. Oct 21 18:22:07 It is sooo much easy to tap preware, tap patch, done. Oct 21 18:22:20 Tell you what.. Oct 21 18:22:31 I don't want to get into that :P Oct 21 18:22:34 but Oct 21 18:22:44 You write a "READ THIS FIRST" post, and I'll post it and sticky/lock it. Oct 21 18:23:25 I think we at least need a STICKY that tells people to submit patches to you, along with a format to follow, e.g. what metadata Oct 21 18:23:55 I have to contact Jason and find out how the drag/drop handles the ipk data Oct 21 18:24:15 It could say, "If you want to get your patch into the webOS-Patches feed (Used by Preware, QI, and others), please send an email to dBsooner@dbtrunk.com with a link to your thread. Please make sure the OP has all information including the most updated patch." Oct 21 18:24:36 I THINK currently, he does some manual packing metadata ipkg insertion stuff, and at a minimum I would request he adds Type: Patch to the control metadata Oct 21 18:24:43 but I would rather not put my email address in the post. Oct 21 18:24:48 dBsooner, forget link to the thread Oct 21 18:24:52 lol Oct 21 18:24:57 with the patch itself Oct 21 18:25:05 and all necessary metadata Oct 21 18:25:11 I got it! Oct 21 18:25:14 have them submit to you a nice formatted item, e.g. attach patch and supply folowing info Oct 21 18:25:16 I can make a form! Oct 21 18:25:19 .php form! Oct 21 18:25:19 Maintainer: Icons: etc... Oct 21 18:25:37 the fill out the form, it emails me all the stuff Oct 21 18:25:37 there ya go, and they can leave anything blank and we'll use default Oct 21 18:25:43 yeah Oct 21 18:25:48 i'll make it when I get home Oct 21 18:25:55 sick Oct 21 18:25:55 I gotta run to pay a bill really quick Oct 21 18:26:00 k Oct 21 18:26:23 Think you can get rwhitby to get me access to an ftp directory on webos-internals? Oct 21 18:26:34 and possibly a sendmail address? Oct 21 18:26:57 sedmail -f webos-patches-noreply@webos-internals.org Oct 21 18:27:05 so spam blocker on my exchange server won't block it. Oct 21 18:27:21 Anyway.. Think it through what it needs and type it up.. I'll create the form when I get home. Oct 21 18:27:24 Shouldn't take me but a minute. Oct 21 18:27:44 I'll be back in an hour Oct 21 18:28:06 oh shoot.. doctor for meds too.. make it closer to 2 hours.. but I doubt that long. Oct 21 18:28:51 I'll be off and on Oct 21 18:31:37 hm I'm not liking this whole in-your-face purple theme that all the music apps seem to be taking on Oct 21 18:47:26 ok - i'll see if they can make it in-your-face-hotPink Oct 21 18:51:27 Haha sweet Oct 21 18:53:15 Am I the only one who thinks they're a little too pink? In particular i'm talking about all of accuradio, net2streams icon, and music (remix) loading screen Oct 21 18:58:29 any1 get flash on their phone yet? Oct 21 19:00:31 AZero: is that possible? or you mean with adobe's beta of it? Oct 21 19:04:23 adobe's Oct 21 19:07:02 * oil hopes when they do release it, that there is the option to disable it Oct 21 19:07:07 I don't want flash on my phone Oct 21 19:07:19 i want to watch hulu =) Oct 21 19:07:30 don't watch anything else really Oct 21 19:08:03 imho, the screen is too small and awkward to watch video on Oct 21 19:08:38 i watch dvd rips on mine Oct 21 19:08:41 its better than hauling a laptop around an airport looking for a wall outlet Oct 21 19:08:43 its ok.. Oct 21 19:08:52 about the same as my ipod touch tbh Oct 21 19:08:52 not to mention having the screen on for that long will kill your battery Oct 21 19:09:01 so you'll have to find an outlet anyways, to charge your phone Oct 21 19:09:08 anything to pass the time Oct 21 19:10:02 anybody here used bluetooth tethering on the pre? Oct 21 19:10:13 nah sorry Oct 21 19:10:15 i was thinking about trying it between my ipod touch and my pre Oct 21 19:10:35 that way watching videos is draining my ipod battery more than my pre Oct 21 19:10:46 or doing pandora Oct 21 19:10:51 not sure if ipod touch has wifi, but you can tether the pre Oct 21 19:10:55 with wifi Oct 21 19:10:57 plus from what i hear they're about to disable wifi adhoc in the driver Oct 21 19:11:00 cause the radio isn't a battery hog or anything? Oct 21 19:11:08 eww Oct 21 19:11:24 oil: not nearly as much as playing video Oct 21 19:11:31 i get 2.5-3 hours of video out of my ipod Oct 21 19:11:34 i only get 2 out of the pre Oct 21 19:12:22 plus Oct 21 19:12:25 i hate to say this Oct 21 19:12:26 but Oct 21 19:12:36 pandora and mp3 audio is just better on the ipod Oct 21 19:12:44 lol Oct 21 19:14:02 it is... sadly Oct 21 19:14:13 not saying i dont believe you Oct 21 19:14:23 my hearing isn't nearly good enough to be able to tell the difference Oct 21 19:14:41 well plus my ~2 year old ipod touch has 16gigs of nand Oct 21 19:14:46 and obviously the pre only has 8 Oct 21 19:14:50 but if you're really talking audio quality Oct 21 19:14:54 you're better off with a cd player Oct 21 19:14:55 then mp3s Oct 21 19:15:14 whats the point if i already have an ipod that does good quality pandora/mp3 output? Oct 21 19:15:17 the only thing is Oct 21 19:15:33 the ipod obviously needs wifi or bluetooth pairing to do pandora Oct 21 19:16:00 sounds like you just want an iphone Oct 21 19:16:07 lol Oct 21 19:16:09 hell no Oct 21 19:16:18 i just want to use my ipod touch that i already have for media Oct 21 19:16:28 and use my pre for everything else Oct 21 19:16:29 :P Oct 21 19:32:52 If I have an idea for a patch, should I just add it to the list of ideas at http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:Patches_to_webOS ? Oct 21 19:40:13 oo Oct 21 19:40:14 whats ur idea Oct 21 19:40:34 to turn on the gpu xD Oct 21 19:41:12 I think someone should write an application that allows you to install/update applications, themes, and patches. Oct 21 19:44:12 misterikkit, also you can post it in precentral patches forum as well Oct 21 19:44:15 http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/ Oct 21 19:45:54 tlz: the idea is to turn on speakerphone by pressing spacebar while on a call. Oct 21 19:46:25 that'd be kinda cool actually Oct 21 19:47:09 i tell you whats not cool though, the fact that i now have to go to work for a 3 hour meeting on my day off.. Oct 21 19:47:18 why would anyone pay $20 for the x-to-y dictionaries when you get google translate for free Oct 21 19:48:49 gkatsev: it doesn't depend on your cell/wifi reception I guess Oct 21 19:50:12 i guess, but still, $20? Oct 21 19:51:31 the apps are being rediculously expensive Oct 21 19:53:21 There are some neat apps I have that will expire on Nov 1, that I don't know if I'd pay $2 for Oct 21 19:54:27 Oh ya, the 20 dollar dictionaries? Oct 21 19:54:41 Id be surprised if anyone bought those Oct 21 19:54:43 preware hasnt been updated in 10 days :| new record. Oct 21 19:55:38 Decimation: do patches count? Oct 21 19:55:41 Anyone know where the "drag up to unlock" image/text/reference is? Oct 21 19:55:50 No misterikkit Oct 21 19:56:18 misterikkit: no, im saying the actually preware app hasnt been updated. Oct 21 19:56:27 ah Oct 21 19:58:41 Anyone have a answer to my question? Oct 21 19:58:45 I cant find it Oct 21 20:10:21 grep? Oct 21 20:10:37 i looked into that and it didnt work lol. I dont fully understand grep Oct 21 20:11:59 anyone have issues with preware hanging on checking version Oct 21 20:12:03 nope Oct 21 20:12:08 I just used it about... 10 minutes ago Oct 21 20:13:34 hung on checking version = reboot your pre Oct 21 20:14:12 Im trying to find a way to make a patch or .ipk that would delete the ripple .pngs in the sysmgr folder Oct 21 20:17:57 hmmm that might be a bad idea Oct 21 20:20:11 what are the typical reasons for novaproxy.py not recognizing the developer-enabled and usb-connedted (loading) palm pre? Oct 21 20:21:16 Holy crap... do not delete the ripple .pngs Oct 21 20:21:24 I just bricked the thing Oct 21 20:22:08 Abyssul: you bricked a pre? nice Oct 21 20:22:32 Well its not "technically" bricked, but you get the concept Oct 21 20:22:34 Abyssul: what about changing it to a transparant png? Oct 21 20:22:41 I just thought of that gkatsev Oct 21 20:22:44 after I did the deed Oct 21 20:22:48 lol Oct 21 20:22:55 Hmm.. Oct 21 20:23:03 Phone doesnt even get past the Palm screen Oct 21 20:23:13 webos recovery tool thingy Oct 21 20:23:19 doctor? Oct 21 20:23:32 no, the thing to compliment the wqi Oct 21 20:23:53 meh, if the recovery tool can communicate with my Pre, then I should be able to Oct 21 20:24:01 i hate you pre Oct 21 20:24:09 Abyssul: do you have the png? Oct 21 20:24:10 i removed/reinstalled preware and now it won't install Oct 21 20:24:19 error? Oct 21 20:24:26 none to report Oct 21 20:25:21 i'm just gonna reset my pre it has a bunch of hacks i played with Oct 21 20:26:17 Well I have a SFTP connection so its not too bad Oct 21 20:28:31 Abyssul: http://forums.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/204495-webos-repair-utility.html Oct 21 20:29:36 novaproxy.py fails to start ... but the device is setup, plugged etc - any ideas? Oct 21 20:30:11 wow, think there is enough translators in the catalog now? Oct 21 20:30:13 Vince42: why you using novaproxy.py? Oct 21 20:30:32 oil: and for $20, wtf?! Oct 21 20:30:36 I use novaproxy to setup SFTP Oct 21 20:30:38 yeah Oct 21 20:30:40 idk Oct 21 20:30:44 Vince42 -- novaproxy.py is very very depricated. Oct 21 20:30:50 i could see paying that much if it was on-pre translations Oct 21 20:30:53 I <3 novaproxy.py Oct 21 20:30:56 Abyssul: optware-bootstrap.sh Oct 21 20:31:00 but at 90-some-k its using hte internet Oct 21 20:31:07 I know what that is gkatsev.. :p Oct 21 20:31:40 gkatsev: i followed the instructions from a site - no clue why i use it :) Oct 21 20:32:05 Rick_work: i finally got feedback from reviewers for blocked Oct 21 20:32:08 Vince42: which site? Oct 21 20:32:08 got an up-to-date instruction link for me? Oct 21 20:32:16 german one ... Oct 21 20:32:28 http://mobilewebexperience.com/systeme/palm-pre-root-zugang/ Oct 21 20:32:33 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Portal:Accessing_Linux Oct 21 20:32:47 Vince42: what Rick_work said Oct 21 20:32:58 the ONLY thing in it, is requiring me to add all the non-functional and completely useless edit menus to every scene Oct 21 20:33:13 oil. I know I know I know Oct 21 20:33:21 i mean, nothing but that Oct 21 20:33:22 it was the only thing Oct 21 20:33:24 like Oct 21 20:33:28 ah, okay, i'll follow those instructions instead - thx so far! Oct 21 20:33:31 "it looks good, tell h im he needs edit menues" Oct 21 20:33:37 lol Oct 21 20:34:00 oil, Did I show you the reply I sent to the reviewer about that? Oct 21 20:34:22 lol Oct 21 20:34:23 yeah Oct 21 20:34:36 its so retarded Oct 21 20:34:40 the one that said "This app has no text fields. There is nothing to edit. The edit menus detract from the experiance. " Oct 21 20:36:23 oh 1x i hate you why can't sprint launch evdo already Oct 21 20:36:29 "by the end of this month" FFFFFFFFUUUUUU Oct 21 20:37:09 rick_home: im not going to fight it, im just going to be very passive aggressive in my "notes to reviewers" when i re-submit it Oct 21 20:38:07 oil: they gotta tote that copy & paste Oct 21 20:38:18 oil: tell them you also heard from the Mind Master dev and he REALLY wants them to delete that submission Oct 21 20:38:21 now let's see if i found a new security exploit in the appstore Oct 21 20:38:21 like yesterday Oct 21 20:38:56 its not toting any copy/paste Oct 21 20:38:56 there was a security exploit in the appstore yesterday? Oct 21 20:39:02 no Oct 21 20:39:07 they will all be grayed out in my app Oct 21 20:39:21 i think i found a new exploit though... maybe palm will finally give me a shout out Oct 21 20:39:37 heh Oct 21 20:39:38 gl Oct 21 20:40:17 i already gave them 3 i wonder how many they require >:[ Oct 21 20:41:54 just for clarification: would putty suffice to connect to the pre? what does the sdk install that enables putty to connect to it? is my pre probably already accessible via putty but i am just missing the correct settings? Oct 21 20:42:15 Vince42: you can connect to the Pre via Putty Oct 21 20:42:18 sampson: Oct 21 20:42:20 bah Oct 21 20:42:27 hi Oct 21 20:42:36 sampson: If Palm ain't giving you any love, I know a great blog you could tip off.... ;) Oct 21 20:42:44 lol Oct 21 20:42:59 when paid apps came out i found a way to get any app for free through a 1 line change in the client Oct 21 20:43:07 samspon Oct 21 20:43:10 good god! Oct 21 20:43:21 i mean, sampson: i know, i credited you for it ;) Oct 21 20:43:27 even gave them an extremely secure method they could use to track purchases but they didn't implement it Oct 21 20:43:29 sugardave: which port? raw? Oct 21 20:43:47 nah, ssh port 222, I think Oct 21 20:43:50 Vince42: read the wiki under next steps and such. Oct 21 20:43:50 let me check my settings Oct 21 20:43:53 sampson: thre is another bug too that is pretty severe, although not as easily exploited. Oct 21 20:43:58 create tokens signed with a certificate + serial of each pre that are stored in cookies.db and backed up to your profile Oct 21 20:44:06 sampson: still waiting for pam to do something about that Oct 21 20:44:27 fun times Oct 21 20:44:32 Anyone have a solution to this? http://tinyurl.com/yz4eyqo Oct 21 20:46:51 baaah now webos quick install is being a bastard Oct 21 20:51:38 why the fuck do you hang on updating preware arrg Oct 21 20:56:31 is friendsflow from precentral working? Oct 21 20:58:20 I guess no one has any ideas about my error? http://tinyurl.com/yz4eyqo Oct 21 20:59:05 * oil knows nothing about patches Oct 21 20:59:12 except that they mostly just cause problems Oct 21 20:59:53 cause problems? I haven't encountered issues with them Oct 21 21:00:08 Abyssul: nope, sorry Oct 21 21:00:21 Ill ask Jason if he gets on Oct 21 21:02:43 Aw, come on. Patches just tweak the Javascript on the Pre. That's not likely to cause any serious problems for the Pre overall -- although a bad patch could cause an app to break. Oct 21 21:03:15 With good comes bad Oct 21 21:03:32 yes it does. Oct 21 21:03:44 and there exists at least one binary patch. Oct 21 21:03:47 hmmm, therefore "great power" = good, and "responsibility" = bad Oct 21 21:03:53 I like the way you think! Oct 21 21:04:08 we are attempting to be SUPER careful about what patches we allow on the feed. Oct 21 21:04:27 and so every patch has to have a designated maintainer. And if they dissapear, so do their patches. Oct 21 21:04:39 So, ifyou have a problem with some patch, contact the maintainer. Oct 21 21:04:50 if i have tep and took my pre to the sprint store would they replace it in-store? some piece of plastic broke off the data port and now its loose as all hell Oct 21 21:06:12 go from store to store till you find some sucker who will. Oct 21 21:06:58 there's only one here heh Oct 21 21:07:10 i had to get my centro replaced in august due to the touch screen not working... i wonder if they'll charge me Oct 21 21:09:22 Abyssul, what is that error from Oct 21 21:09:30 installing a patch into QI Oct 21 21:09:38 (with QI, not into) Oct 21 21:09:59 try not using spaces in file name Oct 21 21:10:12 alright Oct 21 21:10:41 Hmm it worked Oct 21 21:10:48 and since you are doing this, could you let me know where it shows up in preware? Oct 21 21:10:55 Weird.. I had spaces in a patch before and it worked Oct 21 21:11:09 Where's the patch that changes the User Agent to Mobile Safari? I need that..... Oct 21 21:11:09 Where my custom patch shows up Oct 21 21:11:15 (thats a question lol) Oct 21 21:11:27 elight, that is a tweak on QI Oct 21 21:11:52 QI? Oct 21 21:11:57 WebOS Quick Install Oct 21 21:12:02 oooh Oct 21 21:12:08 Abyssul, in preware installed packages Oct 21 21:12:13 Alright Oct 21 21:12:22 is it under Unknown? Oct 21 21:12:37 its loading Oct 21 21:13:21 Until/if more websites make apps to support the Pre, theMobileSafari hack is key Oct 21 21:13:37 Yep, as well as my theme patches Oct 21 21:13:47 how annoying Oct 21 21:13:54 I have 2 touchstones now and one of them is defective Oct 21 21:14:03 fix it? Oct 21 21:14:10 the pre will connect and disconnect repeatedly, sometimes stablise for a coupla minutes and then shit itself again Oct 21 21:14:14 the other one is perfect Oct 21 21:14:17 Abyssul, what does it show for id Oct 21 21:14:21 my touchstone makes a humming noise Oct 21 21:14:21 Category Oct 21 21:14:23 it's really annoying Oct 21 21:14:24 ? Oct 21 21:14:28 Abyssul:Where in QI is the MobileSafari patch? Oct 21 21:14:38 Tweaks Oct 21 21:14:44 iPhone spoof Oct 21 21:14:52 Ooooh Oct 21 21:14:58 One sec egaudet lol Oct 21 21:14:59 And here I was looking for a more technical description Oct 21 21:15:20 also Abyssul would you be able to pastebin me the control file from the pre Oct 21 21:15:33 gkatsev: it's brand new, I may as well RTB it Oct 21 21:15:41 "org.webosinternals.patches.Swipetodelete" Oct 21 21:15:42 yeah, i guess Oct 21 21:16:10 Category is "WebOS Quick Install" Oct 21 21:16:13 gkatsev: put it this way, if I manually fix it I'd void any warranty, if I rtb it since I have 2 wall chargers and a touchstone to keep me going in the meantime.. Oct 21 21:16:24 How do I get the control file? Oct 21 21:16:52 Type: ? Oct 21 21:16:57 seriously preware why do you just hang on updating Oct 21 21:17:00 * sampson throws fit Oct 21 21:17:01 Unknown Oct 21 21:17:06 Marajin: right. i need to get a second touchstone and wall charger for work... but its soo expensive and i am a poor college student Oct 21 21:17:14 control file should be at /var/usr/lib/ipkg/info/org.webosinternals.patches.Swipetodelete.control Oct 21 21:17:15 gkatsev: heh :) Oct 21 21:17:25 gkatsev: do you have an extra ac adpater? Oct 21 21:17:25 oil ping Oct 21 21:17:31 you could just take the touchstone block with you Oct 21 21:17:33 gkatsev: they are evil.. it's like 100 bucks for the extra ac adaptor and a touchstone right? Oct 21 21:17:56 sampson: the touchstone is the big cost, just a touchstone alone is like 45-50 bucks I think Oct 21 21:18:01 Marajin: yeah, even from precentral itll be expensive. Oct 21 21:18:06 sampson: nope... only 1 Oct 21 21:18:11 sucks Oct 21 21:18:35 my phone came with a touchstone & 2 wall chargers so i use the touchstone in the office and the wall charger in the bedroom Oct 21 21:18:38 i did end up getting the seidio 1350mAh battery which is kind of nice cuz now i have the palm battery as a spare Oct 21 21:18:43 gkatsev: cheat, any old usb wall charger will work if you have a usb -> microb cable :) Oct 21 21:18:54 gkatsev: Tested it with 2 other wall -> usb adaptors I have Oct 21 21:19:09 Marajin: right, but i want a touchstone as well... Oct 21 21:19:12 touchstone by itself is $35 Oct 21 21:19:15 from amazon Oct 21 21:19:23 gkatsev: yeah but it saves you cost :P Oct 21 21:19:30 yeah, i guess Oct 21 21:19:40 gkatsev: cause they will only sell you an "international" official charger and they're like 30 bucks Oct 21 21:19:44 and i might be getting a microusb cable soon Oct 21 21:19:52 AC adapter is $14 on amazon Oct 21 21:19:57 I seriously need to doctor my pre, but I dont wanna lose my text messages lol Oct 21 21:20:06 whereas you can get a bog standard ac -> usb adapter for like 3 bucks Oct 21 21:20:18 brb Oct 21 21:20:22 really? hm... i guess ill add that to my cart when i finally buy my aftermark cpu heatsink Oct 21 21:20:31 s/aftermark/aftermarket/ Oct 21 21:20:31 gkatsev meant: really? hm... i guess ill add that to my cart when i finally buy my aftermarket cpu heatsink Oct 21 21:21:15 on precentral touchstone is 40 and wallcharger is 30 Oct 21 21:21:30 egaudet: http://pastebin.com/m59a54e2b Oct 21 21:23:53 thank you Abyssul Oct 21 21:24:16 no problem Oct 21 21:24:40 oh, precentral now has a touchstone kit (touchstone+wallcharger) for $65, still cheaper on amazon... Oct 21 21:26:00 This is weird... when I install my own patches with QI, they create empty folders in root... Oct 21 21:27:06 ? Oct 21 21:27:27 In root i have folders named "Populated, Swipe, Delete, Emergency, and History" Oct 21 21:27:40 I wonder if its because I put spaces in the title of my patches Oct 21 21:29:31 possibly Oct 21 21:29:45 those are in / Oct 21 21:29:49 yea Oct 21 21:30:11 I need to run the doctor but I dont wanna lose my text messages :( Oct 21 21:30:13 probably a mkdir command Oct 21 21:30:26 mkdir /var/usr/..../Swipe Delete Emergency History Oct 21 21:31:34 I think I should run EPR and then Repair Utility Oct 21 21:31:41 report it to Jason, should be some check or \ escaping of spaces there Oct 21 21:31:54 of course Oct 21 21:31:57 EPR won't do anything for that bug creating those dirs Oct 21 21:32:06 No Oct 21 21:32:10 and dont' use spaces in filenames :P Oct 21 21:32:12 I just talking about wiping out my pre in general Oct 21 21:32:21 oh ok Oct 21 21:32:23 kind've two topics : Oct 21 21:32:27 wipe all the patches Oct 21 21:32:54 repair utility needed for any manual changes Oct 21 21:33:03 EPR should fix any patch changes Oct 21 21:33:06 Like my theme... Oct 21 21:34:20 ok well I'm gonna head home Oct 21 21:34:21 bbl Oct 21 21:34:31 Cya later Oct 21 21:38:16 Yo? Oct 21 21:39:09 egaudet: he should put the name in quotes, that'll fix it Oct 21 21:39:50 i followed the "Accessing Linux Portal" steps, but novacom says "unable to find device" - any ideas? Oct 21 21:40:03 Heh, my 2nd touchstone works if I use the other wall supply Oct 21 21:40:11 Vince42, is it in dev-mode? Oct 21 21:40:15 Random Oct 21 21:40:19 yes Oct 21 21:40:24 and it's "charging" Oct 21 21:40:54 and the novacom service is running Oct 21 21:41:38 i give up preware will not work on this damn phone Oct 21 21:41:52 it gets past checking for version and just sits at updating Oct 21 21:42:46 preware's package service i think is a little wonky .. Oct 21 21:43:28 bbl Oct 21 21:43:31 could disabling and reenabling dev mode help? Oct 21 21:45:42 any help is highly appreciated ... i am quite lost ... Oct 21 21:46:38 gosh - different usb port and now it works :( Oct 21 21:46:52 hey Oct 21 21:46:53 You know, it would be _1,000_ times easier to make a decent media pipeline if Palm's camera driver wasn't so buggy. I mean seriously, it doesn't keep duration, only timestamp. What the heck is that about? Oct 21 21:47:08 can someone help me with my palm ore Oct 21 21:47:09 more Oct 21 21:47:13 pre* Oct 21 21:47:52 i want to get a virtual keyboard from preware Oct 21 21:48:00 and everytime i download it Oct 21 21:48:01 it gives me an error message Oct 21 21:48:45 Guest89771, and? Oct 21 21:49:12 can someone help me Oct 21 21:49:20 so it downloads...? Oct 21 21:49:33 how? Oct 21 21:49:56 Guest89771 what error? Oct 21 21:50:37 idk Oct 21 21:50:38 how do i tell? Oct 21 21:50:51 What exactly does it say when it fails? Exactly. Oct 21 21:51:06 rick_home, sorry, maybe my "please give us an error" sarcasm was a little too vague :< Oct 21 21:51:16 Error installing: see IPKG Log Oct 21 21:51:49 'cant find file to patch at input line 4' Oct 21 21:52:09 is the quilt setup recommended? Oct 21 21:52:12 Guest89771, are you on 1.2? Oct 21 21:52:52 Vince42 not any more no. Oct 21 21:53:01 We quit using quilt about a month ago. Oct 21 21:53:19 Rick_work: thx Oct 21 21:53:34 Guest89771 Are you in the US, or in europe? Oct 21 21:53:48 I live in the Arctic Oct 21 21:54:13 Abyssul it matters because the Version of webos matters. Oct 21 21:54:21 I know that Oct 21 21:54:35 if he's downloading a 1.2 patch, then his framework file will notbe 200. Oct 21 21:54:39 wasn't there a trick to get the Developer Mode Icon into the menu somehow? In case enabling should be necessary again ... Oct 21 21:54:46 yep Oct 21 21:54:56 Fail^ Oct 21 21:54:58 I wouldn't disable it if it was me. Oct 21 21:55:09 why would you --ever-- turn it off ????? Oct 21 21:55:13 (dev mode) Oct 21 21:55:16 dunno :) Oct 21 21:55:31 that's why i'm asking the pros :) Oct 21 21:55:42 if you ever want to download or write somthing using the sdk, if you ever want to get on using novaterm, it has to be on Oct 21 21:55:44 leave it on Oct 21 21:55:56 Pros = access linux, cons = none Oct 21 21:56:07 but wasn't there some trick to get that icon onto the menues somehow? Oct 21 21:56:12 Yes Oct 21 21:57:02 yes, you can edit the entry to get it visible. Oct 21 21:57:50 ah ... kk Oct 21 21:58:31 hello everyone. Oct 21 21:59:55 putty gives me a timeout connecting via ssh ... the host (pre) is alive and pinging ... what went wrong? :) Oct 21 22:02:00 the installation of optware should suffice to enable ssh, right? or do i have to take further steps? Oct 21 22:02:18 vince port 222? Oct 21 22:02:45 yep Oct 21 22:02:51 local ip, port 222, ssh Oct 21 22:03:03 Vince42: ip of your pre? Oct 21 22:03:08 yes Oct 21 22:03:23 the script ran fine without errors? Oct 21 22:03:37 absolutely - i can pastebin it, if it helps Oct 21 22:03:43 weird... Oct 21 22:03:54 how can I replace images with a patch or .ipk? Oct 21 22:05:54 that's the installation log: http://paste2.org/p/478813 Oct 21 22:07:29 and ifconfig tells me the right ip ... do i have to disconnect the usb cable in order to enable some login via WLAN? ... should i log out from novaterm? should ps -aux show the sshd? Oct 21 22:08:15 Vince42, according to that log, you have no dropbear/openssh Oct 21 22:09:08 how do i install those? Oct 21 22:09:13 and no, you can connect over wlan regardless of usb connection Oct 21 22:09:19 Vince42, you run the script without it failing Oct 21 22:09:30 it ran without fails, yes Oct 21 22:09:40 oh Oct 21 22:09:51 Failed to update the local Optware package database - you mean that? :) Oct 21 22:10:13 Alternatively, you can follow the instructions right below it, "Please paste the contents of /tmp/optware-bootstrap.sh.log to http://webos.pastebin.com/" Oct 21 22:10:14 can i simply rerun that script? Oct 21 22:10:42 I'm curious why it failed first, probably a connection thing, but I'd like to see that log Oct 21 22:11:55 it also didn't set up a user... i'd be curious who you were trying to connect as O.O Oct 21 22:12:04 this is the log: http://paste2.org/p/478820 Oct 21 22:13:21 hm, odd, i just connected to that server and that file seems to download fine. Oct 21 22:13:28 is it safe to re-run that script? Oct 21 22:13:37 were you doing anything with your pre at the time? Oct 21 22:13:43 nope Oct 21 22:14:24 knowing who wrote the script, yes, it should be very safe to run again Oct 21 22:14:34 will do so :) Oct 21 22:14:38 keep fingers crossed ... Oct 21 22:16:49 it failed again Oct 21 22:17:54 * Abyssul runs. Oct 21 22:19:21 Vince42 do you have terminal access to the pre via novaterm? Oct 21 22:20:29 yes - now it works - seems that the running developer enabler hindered the script from working ... odd ... Oct 21 22:20:37 that IS odd Oct 21 22:20:53 i just quit it - and now it works Oct 21 22:20:53 because you were failing to run a simple wget. Oct 21 22:21:05 ye Oct 21 22:22:23 feel free to add that to the faq :P Oct 21 22:23:52 Feel free to edit the wiki page. Oct 21 22:23:52 hmm, anyone else have slow camera response like jwz is complaining about? Oct 21 22:24:03 on a pre? Oct 21 22:24:08 I thought he ditched his pre? Oct 21 22:24:29 The camera is one of the best things about the phone for me. Pretty responsive, flash, and great pics. Tapping to see a pic after ive taken it does take a few seconds, but nothing like the 40 seconds he's moaning about Oct 21 22:24:41 good god. Oct 21 22:24:42 no Oct 21 22:24:47 yeah apparently he did, but he also listed out reasons why. The camera taking 20 seconds being one of them Oct 21 22:28:08 our iphones were slow as hell towards the end too, (we didnt have the 3GS) so not sure if he's gonna hit greener pastures. Better UI sure, but speed-wise, not always Oct 21 22:31:32 anyone has an idea where the APNs for the providers reside? Oct 21 22:33:55 Is anyone familiar with MediaServer or FileIndexer? I'm at a super critical point and I need to find out information about how MediaServer and FileIndexer decide what content to "load" into the Music Player, the Video Player, and the Photo Roll. Oct 21 22:34:08 I thought originally it was formate and framerate, but it's not. There's something else to it Oct 21 22:38:56 ello all :) I'm poking around the wiki, but can't seem to find the info I'm looking for: is there a resource which spells out what directories are used for what purpose? ie: /var/opt/ contains apps, /var/palm/ contains core files... etc? Oct 21 22:39:40 flare576, it's very similar in nature to a general debian install... as far as palm specific stuff.. not sure, I suppose you could ask specifically about what you're looking for? Oct 21 22:40:04 trying to clean out /var before I take the plunge into resizing it to 2GB Oct 21 22:41:52 flare576, /var is going to have a lot of _stuff_ in it. it will contain any libraries that are changed during use, as well as a ton of logs and mutex stuff Oct 21 22:42:05 just back the whole thing up somewhere before you resize? Oct 21 22:42:36 morning Oct 21 22:42:39 zsoc: yeah, I was going to do that regardless, but it doesn't feel like I should have filled 150MB already :/ Oct 21 22:43:17 flare576, have you installed _anything_ from the optware repos? Oct 21 22:43:21 rwhitby: mornin sunshine. Oct 21 22:43:33 ~seen ajames Oct 21 22:43:36 ajames was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 20d 20h 30m 41s ago, saying: 'but not just eliminating them'. Oct 21 22:43:50 zsoc: oh yeah, added, uninstalled, re-installed... Oct 21 22:44:20 rwhitby, ajames has seemed to disapear... do you know anything else that has extensive MediaServer / file indexer Pre knowledge? Oct 21 22:44:35 zsoc: nope Oct 21 22:44:49 flare576, that could be it.. certain library dependencies for certain programs you'd get from optware (see: irssi) are very large :) Oct 21 22:45:12 s/anything/anyone Oct 21 22:45:50 hrm.. good call... I guess I'll just skip the cleanup and go to the backup/resize :) Oct 21 22:47:38 I hadn't seend irssi, now I'm interested.. Oct 21 22:48:58 * freakout has been looking for ajames too, zsoc Oct 21 22:49:06 that "life" thing must have gotten to him. Oct 21 22:49:38 that's crap, i need to figure out why the file indexer isn't picking up my PERFECTLY ENCODED, SCALED, AND MUXED VIDEOS :< :< :< Oct 21 22:49:43 but i'm not bitter about it Oct 21 22:50:39 zsoc, even palm knows the file indexer sucks Oct 21 22:50:54 zsoc: chuq says it's going away for something better, but no timeframe yet Oct 21 22:51:09 freakout, option 1.) an opensource fileindexer :D Oct 21 22:51:30 freakout, honestly, the real reason I'm upset is my videos are IDENTICAL to videos that DO get indexed.. i can't figure it out Oct 21 22:52:08 is there also some kind of app for installing optware packages or are they intended to be installed via ssh? Oct 21 22:53:39 freakout, well i shouldn't say _exactly_, I mean, there's no audio muxed into these tests.. but still.. i mean what the heck? it can't index videos without audio? that would be silly Oct 21 22:54:10 Vince42, they are being packaged individually into a feed for preware Oct 21 22:54:20 Vince42, but only after it's verified they work ok :> Oct 21 22:54:41 so i should install preware then, right? Oct 21 22:54:51 * zsoc blinks Oct 21 22:54:55 you don't have preware installed? Oct 21 22:55:03 hahaha Oct 21 22:55:23 rod shoudl change the channel topic to include preware usage as a prerequisite ;) Oct 21 22:56:22 it's my first day on my pre - bare with me :) Oct 21 22:56:25 zsoc: that would be silly Oct 21 22:56:39 just busting your ball man Oct 21 22:56:45 zsoc: maybe you need to build in a secret handshake? Oct 21 22:56:58 Vince42, ah ok then I guess ;) Preware is a super silly sexy opensource application installer for the Pre :) Oct 21 22:57:03 easiest way in my opinion is to go to http://get.preware.org/ , download the .exe version if you're on windows Oct 21 22:57:14 might have to click tools->install drivers for the novacom drivers Oct 21 22:57:22 AnOutsider, i think he has putty working Oct 21 22:57:29 then hit install preware. Make sure your phone is connected to the PC Oct 21 22:57:43 still might be easiest to install that way no? Oct 21 22:57:56 that's how I telle veryone to grab it. easiest for me ;) Oct 21 22:58:48 the quick installer doesn't provide webosdoctor for my german provider ... what should i do now? Oct 21 22:59:48 to install preware? You try what I mentioned above? Oct 21 23:01:11 yes, i want to install preware - and it says that i need webosquickinstall.jar - and that needs webosdoctor ... Oct 21 23:01:32 no, no download the .exe version if you're on windows Oct 21 23:01:38 http://get.preware.org/PrewareInstaller-0.9.4.exe Oct 21 23:01:47 thx :) Oct 21 23:03:42 that was simple :P Oct 21 23:04:33 AnOutsider, i probably agree with your suggestion :> Oct 21 23:06:01 i tapped on "Package Manager" and he warned me and wants to remove that icons (blabla) - wtfox? :) Oct 21 23:06:41 i thought it had to update that one first ... argh ... Oct 21 23:06:46 Vince42, yeah, ignore that. Oct 21 23:06:51 just restart luna, it'll be gone anyway Oct 21 23:06:56 ignored - done :) Oct 21 23:08:41 installer FTW Oct 21 23:09:25 okay, now he's obviously updating preware ... guess that will take a while ... well, i am offski for tonight - will check my pre tomorrow whether he finished in sleep mode :P Oct 21 23:10:44 heh, shouldnt take long Oct 21 23:10:48 I think it's updating the feeds Oct 21 23:11:09 ye - maybe my line is slow ... but he's doing the updating for minutes now ... Oct 21 23:11:51 try closing preware and reopening it Oct 21 23:11:54 sometimes it gets stuck Oct 21 23:12:05 okidoki :) Oct 21 23:12:06 Vince42, make sure the window stays in focus during the first update, thats kinda important Oct 21 23:12:19 ah yeah, i forgot about that too Oct 21 23:12:39 zsoc: you know why that is? im a heavy multitasker and while preware updates im usually launching email or something else too Oct 21 23:12:41 kinda annoying Oct 21 23:12:58 restarted ... now he's checking version ... but that takes very long too :) Oct 21 23:13:33 i keep him from going into sleep mode by tapping and tapping ... still checking version ... Oct 21 23:13:46 ah, updating again ... Oct 21 23:14:05 loading precentral!!! Oct 21 23:14:07 AnOutsider, Loading != Updating Oct 21 23:14:12 egaudet: ping Oct 21 23:14:24 DONE! :))) Oct 21 23:14:38 AnOutsider, updating should only take 3-5 seconds on EVDO. During the _loading_ afterwards you are free to multitask :> Oct 21 23:15:01 okay, now i am really excited - so much stuff to install :P Oct 21 23:15:07 any recommendations? Oct 21 23:15:17 some must-haves there? Oct 21 23:15:55 Vince42, in my opinion, 4x4 version 3 patch should be the first thing anyone installs :P Oct 21 23:16:50 in which category is that patch? Oct 21 23:16:59 or should i install all patches? :P Oct 21 23:17:13 ah, found it Oct 21 23:17:18 Vince42, all patches, or "show everything", also you can search by just starting to type Oct 21 23:17:45 Also, there's a patch to show Battery AND Percent, which I prefer, on the top bar, but that's a preference thing. Oct 21 23:17:47 rwhitby: ping Oct 21 23:17:59 Others will have many things to say about what's what, too :P so go try things. Oct 21 23:18:30 dBsooner, pong Oct 21 23:18:31 oil ping Oct 21 23:18:33 dBsooner: syn\ack Oct 21 23:18:48 will do, will do - guys: this is seriously the most advanced phone atm (allthough the battery life is still little bit poor) :) Oct 21 23:19:23 Vince42, turn your screen brightness down. It's unnecessary unless you're in direct sunlight and it destroys your battery (in my experience) Oct 21 23:19:48 ah - what's your average battery life time on your pre? Oct 21 23:19:49 rwhitby: I don't know how much egaudet might have talked with you, but we want to setup a php form to allow devs to submit their patches. The form will just email me the information with the patch file. Oct 21 23:19:52 I don't know about it being "the most advanced phone", but I like the homebrew community ;) Oct 21 23:20:17 rwhitby: I am going to write it which will only take me a couple mins. Can we put it on webos-internals.org? If yes, can php have sendmail access? Oct 21 23:20:36 dBsooner: let me think about the security implications of that ... Oct 21 23:20:46 boohoohooo ... the patch failed! 3 out of 4 hunks failed :( Oct 21 23:20:55 Vince42: are you running 1.1.3 ? Oct 21 23:21:10 Vince42, oh god. I realized you _just_ got the phone today. I probably should have suggested you update first :/ Oct 21 23:21:10 rwhitby: which part? The form in general? or being on webos-internals? Oct 21 23:21:25 dBsooner: a php form on webos-internals Oct 21 23:21:33 I am a genious for security Oct 21 23:21:52 1.1.3, yes Oct 21 23:22:02 I was going to log the form submital's ip address and not allow any given ip to submit the form more than once every 5 mins Oct 21 23:22:59 On top of that, I am going to require an email address, and my script verifies it is a true valid email by connecting to the @domain.com MX server and checking RCPT TO. Oct 21 23:23:09 that... and i have no idea what patches are compatible with the EU pre D: Oct 21 23:23:18 rwhitby: When it comes to php, I am a guru. Oct 21 23:23:19 Vince42: do you have command line access to the Pre, and can you run vi ? Oct 21 23:23:34 yes, i can - but it went late Oct 21 23:23:36 okay, i will annoy you more tomorrow - stay tuned :P it's time for hitting the sack here ... esp when you have to go up early :P Oct 21 23:23:54 Ah yes, must be Thursday over there :> Oct 21 23:23:59 Vince42: you need to edit /var/etc/ipkg/webos-patches.conf and replace the 'all' at the end of the URL with 1.1.3 Oct 21 23:23:59 on november the european version will be aligned to the us, afaik Oct 21 23:24:05 it's 1:30 Oct 21 23:24:36 rwhitby: will do that tomoz - thx guys, you were really, really helpful! Oct 21 23:24:48 have a good one Oct 21 23:25:04 rwhitby: so when it comes to form abuse, it would be very minimal if any at all. I log everything. and the form will only send the email to my email address, a constant variable in the script. Oct 21 23:25:38 rwhitby: planning a packaged version of preware for the german ones? One that comes with 1.1.3 enabled for the feed? Oct 21 23:25:55 rwhitby: we just want a way to get the user from "I can create the .patch, all you have to do is copy/paste it into QI and be done" to, "I create the patch and submit it on this form so it can be included in webOS-Patches feed" Oct 21 23:26:07 AnOutsider: planning for ipkservice to do that on boot Oct 21 23:26:47 gotcha Oct 21 23:26:55 just a quick check on something Oct 21 23:27:10 can someone do a ##DATA# and see what their MMSC URL is for me? Oct 21 23:27:45 its under menu Oct 21 23:28:01 http://mms.sprintpcs.com Oct 21 23:28:12 thanks Oct 21 23:28:45 dB: I'd imagine rod would want to check out any possible exploits that could happen with people uploading files Oct 21 23:28:55 you could always set up a dropbox or something too Oct 21 23:29:52 I know of at least 10 patches that are currently made, but not imported into Preware Oct 21 23:30:11 AnOutsider: there isn't any exploits Oct 21 23:30:16 AnOutsider: the file isn't "uploaded" Oct 21 23:30:46 I thought it did Oct 21 23:30:47 [19:19] <+dBsooner> rwhitby: I don't know how much egaudet might have talked with you, but we want to setup a php form to allow devs to submit their patches. The form will just email me the information with the patch file. Oct 21 23:30:49 AnOutsider: the file is simply in /tmp during the php submit then gets put into an email (sendmaiL) to my email address then destroyed. Oct 21 23:31:08 AnOutsider: The form will just email me the information with the patch file. Oct 21 23:31:21 lol I know how the upload process works, just commenting on what he MAY have meant by it Oct 21 23:31:23 The file is never 'stored' on the server in any way. Oct 21 23:31:29 maybe he meant something else *shrug* Oct 21 23:31:34 yeah, maybe. Oct 21 23:31:39 lol Oct 21 23:31:45 Believe me, this is not automated at all. Oct 21 23:31:54 It's just an EASY way for users to submit a patch to my email Oct 21 23:32:09 It's either that or to tell people to create an email to me, but I don't want to post my email in a thread on pc.net Oct 21 23:32:11 * AnOutsider backs out and remembers not to interject in the future Oct 21 23:32:28 You wont win AnOutsider :p Oct 21 23:32:45 lol I wasn't even trying to, was just offering up a suggestion since rod was quiet Oct 21 23:32:45 Not unless I can be shown how it could be exploited. ;) Oct 21 23:33:10 lol I never said it could be exploited, rod said he had to examine the possibilities, I "interpreted" Oct 21 23:33:16 * rwhitby is at work, so is multi-tasking Oct 21 23:33:26 moving along, why not just create a form anywhere on the web? Oct 21 23:33:36 or a dropbox if they're creating patch files Oct 21 23:34:14 AnOutsider: Which is another option. But since it's technically going to end up in webos-internal's webos-patches feed, it looks more official being hosted on the internals website. Oct 21 23:34:29 true true Oct 21 23:34:42 But yes, I have thought about a dropbox as well. Oct 21 23:35:17 But having the form emailed with a valid email gets that all important "MAINTAINER" part included automatically. ;) Oct 21 23:35:44 Unless specifically stated in the form that "I am not the maintainer of this patch". Oct 21 23:36:21 well, I'm all for easier development and submission of patches. So *passes the buck to rod* ;) Oct 21 23:36:55 AnOutsider: I was hoping you'd create prepatches.com ;-) Oct 21 23:36:56 LOL.. I am about "I want to get this as easy as possible to get the patch submitted to me so I can build the package" Oct 21 23:37:23 wha, that one dictionary app is $50 Oct 21 23:37:30 insane Oct 21 23:37:35 ROFL Oct 21 23:37:53 $50 are you f'in serious? Oct 21 23:38:15 haha lots of overpriced apps Oct 21 23:38:16 I can't believe the price of the $20 dictionaries too Oct 21 23:38:28 rwhitby: :( Oct 21 23:38:30 this is the french-english medical dictionary Oct 21 23:38:32 No one is gonna buy them lol Oct 21 23:38:34 thats $50 Oct 21 23:38:56 oil: But you know people are buying it. Oct 21 23:38:57 meanwhile, blocked got rejected Oct 21 23:39:12 too leet? Oct 21 23:39:12 because i didn't include a bunch of extra and non-functional edit menu items Oct 21 23:39:38 lol.. yeah, like most the apps have Oct 21 23:39:46 its completely retarded Oct 21 23:39:48 oil: does blocked generate any revenue for Palm? Oct 21 23:40:04 i put it up for $1.99 Oct 21 23:40:28 where do you find the available (not necessarily documented) methods of a system service, such as com.palm.audio? Oct 21 23:40:32 so, 30% of that, ytes Oct 21 23:40:33 ok, no worries. I figure that free apps now will be low priority, cause they don't generate any Palm revenue. Oct 21 23:40:56 so they wanted stub menu options? Oct 21 23:41:04 I suppose for UI consistency across apps? Oct 21 23:41:14 but dotgame doesn't have any edit menues Oct 21 23:41:18 it all depends on who reviews Oct 21 23:41:31 it was literally the only thin in the review Oct 21 23:41:39 dot game's review had more suggestions and required changes Oct 21 23:41:45 hey everyone Oct 21 23:41:45 haha. I wonder if thye just hire a bunch of content monkeys Oct 21 23:41:51 the only thing that kept blocked from the catalog, was the lack of useless crap Oct 21 23:41:57 and thats what it comes down to Oct 21 23:41:58 give em a script and tell them to stick to it Oct 21 23:42:06 it didn;t have enough useless crap in it Oct 21 23:42:09 so they rejected it Oct 21 23:42:12 rwhitby: do you want to see the source code of the script before you make a decision? Oct 21 23:42:14 well, at least it's an easy change. make the change and resubmit it Oct 21 23:42:21 i already have Oct 21 23:42:27 or.. you can totally cruch your pre and get an iphone Oct 21 23:42:29 and was very passive-aggressive in my changelog Oct 21 23:42:30 i'm going to be installing a custom kernel on my pre soon with this guide: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Custom_Kernels. Has anyone tried the latest kernel yet to try out usb3? Oct 21 23:42:31 and blog it :) Oct 21 23:42:34 dBsooner: the decision does not depend on the source code of the script Oct 21 23:42:37 i dont have a blog Oct 21 23:42:38 nobody cares Oct 21 23:42:40 rwhitby: oh Oct 21 23:42:54 :p just messing with ya (and jwz) Oct 21 23:43:05 yeah, im not a horses ass though Oct 21 23:43:41 anyone else use their pre's tether capability as their main source of internets? :p Oct 21 23:44:01 no, you're not, that would be what jon is staring fondly at here: http://www.celebrity-gossip.net/images/thumbnails/jon-gosselin-10179-8.jpg :) Oct 21 23:44:13 ice-11: not I, I did use it on vacation though Oct 21 23:44:30 rwhitby: so there is really nothing I can do to assure safety. It's all about your considerations? I'll go ahead and write up the script and host it on my server cluster for now then. Oct 21 23:44:39 I'd iamgine using it as your MAIN internet might be abusing things a bit, but it doesn't seem like Sprint's service is under as much strain as ATTs Oct 21 23:44:47 rwhitby: just to get it into a testing phase. Oct 21 23:45:10 dBsooner: please do that for the moment. Oct 21 23:45:12 AnOutsider: it's pretty quick and useful where I live :D. I have no need to actually get real internet now hehe Oct 21 23:45:46 heh, I was getting DSL speeds down in Orlando Oct 21 23:46:18 I pretty much always get DSL speeds in London, ON. =) Oct 21 23:46:37 during the night... torrenting becomes more possible. Oct 21 23:46:50 .. just watched the latest episode of Heroes on globaltv's website Oct 21 23:46:57 torrenting is definitely abuse of the network Oct 21 23:46:59 ugh... don't torrent with the Tether... Oct 21 23:47:17 Gonna make Sprint attack Oct 21 23:47:19 besides, you're not supposed to talk about tethering on sprints network in here Oct 21 23:47:22 haha no worries. it was just a POC Oct 21 23:47:25 read /topic Oct 21 23:47:32 i'm not on Sprint's network ;) Oct 21 23:47:50 then its probably ok to talk about it Oct 21 23:47:54 Lol Oct 21 23:47:57 lol Oct 21 23:48:00 <3 loopholes Oct 21 23:48:03 :p Oct 21 23:48:19 I'm a Canadian silly. Bell's the one who'll try to rape me in bills Oct 21 23:48:31 They probably will. Oct 21 23:48:38 i was just pointing out the rules of the channel Oct 21 23:48:50 no worries:) Oct 21 23:48:58 Anyone look at the unthrottled download speed patch? Oct 21 23:49:09 still though, not to be a spoilsport, but that's not cool Oct 21 23:49:24 one thing to just cheap out and use it for main internet, but to go all download-warrior on it... Oct 21 23:49:24 unthrottled download speed patch? Not yet. I didn't know the pre throttled downloads Oct 21 23:49:45 It even increases speed for tethering too Oct 21 23:49:48 LoL that'd get me noticed real fast. and i'm sure the user agreement would change even faster Oct 21 23:50:07 Abyssul: is it accessible via preware? Oct 21 23:50:14 Not currently... Oct 21 23:50:20 ah... Oct 21 23:50:21 they're definitely going to eat your first born Oct 21 23:50:28 lol Oct 21 23:50:34 They'd have to go through my pants first Oct 21 23:50:42 hahaha same Oct 21 23:50:45 they Oct 21 23:50:55 they'd* be eating my potential first borns... Oct 21 23:51:42 Abyssul: where's the patch located? Oct 21 23:51:55 http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/210774-patch-unthrottle-download-manager.html Oct 21 23:52:54 Abyssul: cool. thanks Oct 21 23:53:41 I was really happy to see optware including libstdc++ :). The fact that the palm pre runs Linux makes... all my dreams come true Oct 21 23:54:47 even that one dream... from band camp? Oct 21 23:55:24 hahahaha Oct 21 23:55:35 tethering pron? Oct 21 23:55:35 jk Oct 21 23:55:53 Abyssul: Sweet, I think the main difference is: +MaxRecvSpeed=-1 Oct 21 23:56:12 i wonder what the max speed is normally... checking Oct 21 23:56:49 Reports of faster downloads across the board, but that could be a placebo effect Oct 21 23:57:28 that file doesn't even exist on my palm pre Oct 21 23:57:33 /etc/palm/download.conf Oct 21 23:57:40 does it exist on a sprint pre? Oct 21 23:57:56 Nope Oct 21 23:57:58 Read the OP Oct 21 23:58:56 I dont see anything about that file there? Oct 21 23:59:14 hmm Oct 21 23:59:17 "+++ /etc/palm/download.conf" Oct 21 23:59:17 http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/210774-patch-unthrottle-download-manager.html#post1990443 Oct 21 23:59:23 i guess the file is created Oct 21 23:59:43 Yep Oct 22 00:00:19 oh haha. i read the post Anoutsider linked... i didn't read that far down before :p Oct 22 00:00:22 hmm, def going to have to install this Oct 22 00:00:24 AnOutsider* Oct 22 00:00:27 indeed. Oct 22 00:00:49 we could just.. create the file. hrmm what's the equivalent patch command? Oct 22 00:00:49 actually, I'll wait for dBsooner to add it to the patches feed :) Oct 22 00:00:53 anyone try this patch and notice real noticable differences? Oct 22 00:01:05 has to be emailed to me for me to do it Oct 22 00:01:06 ;) Oct 22 00:01:12 which means the script has to be setup Oct 22 00:01:13 ;) Oct 22 00:01:44 heh, can't you contact him and just ask him? pain in the butt I know Oct 22 00:02:03 How would you like us to submit patches to you? Oct 22 00:02:11 Email the patch only? No info? Oct 22 00:02:23 it needs info Oct 22 00:02:25 send them in a briefcase padded with money Oct 22 00:02:31 for the patch's safety of course Oct 22 00:02:32 Haha Oct 22 00:02:37 dBsooner: Is your pre rooted? Just make the file and add all the lines with a + sign in front of them Oct 22 00:02:39 and I asked this before, but is it me or is EPR just gone Oct 22 00:02:45 lol Oct 22 00:02:56 It was there 30 minutes ago AnOutsider Oct 22 00:02:59 title, descript, homepage, versions of webos it works with, maintainer, patch file itself, etc Oct 22 00:03:12 I have a few... Oct 22 00:03:15 (patches) Oct 22 00:03:22 Ill spread the news :p Oct 22 00:03:30 nooooo Oct 22 00:03:39 i am creating a submital script as we speak Oct 22 00:03:45 Aww :( ok Oct 22 00:03:47 just hang tight Oct 22 00:03:55 Submital... haha Oct 22 00:04:08 egaudet: ping Oct 22 00:04:09 lol Oct 22 00:04:38 hi Oct 22 00:04:53 read your pm's egaudet.. sheesh Oct 22 00:05:11 heh Oct 22 00:05:27 That another thing, I keep seeing these patches floating around randomly on the precentral forums that just never seem to make it to preware. Is there a single place to access all these by chance? Generally I trust a preware installation more than my own even though there isn't much difference Oct 22 00:05:37 time for some teeeveee, see ya guys later Oct 22 00:06:01 Flashpass, there isn't any different... Oct 22 00:06:12 Two methods, same function Oct 22 00:08:03 where's the patch for the App Catalog lag? Oct 22 00:08:05 Well there are differences in usability. If I install something from quick install it doens't show up in preware does it, and I won't know if there are updates. Having everything in one place is nice and more organized. Not to mention, I usually am playing with these patches on the go, not while i'm sitting at home connected to my pc Oct 22 00:08:31 If it bothers you that much, then its best to wait. Oct 22 00:08:38 They should be submitted in the next day or two Oct 22 00:08:58 brb Oct 22 00:09:01 I gotta restart gnome Oct 22 00:09:04 it's being mooding Oct 22 00:09:07 lame Oct 22 00:09:10 Yeah, its not a huge annoyance, but I see patches posted in the forum and such that never seem to make it to preware and get lost in the threads Oct 22 00:09:13 gnome can get annoying... Oct 22 00:10:38 installed with QI should show in preware and vice versa Oct 22 00:10:38 yes Oct 22 00:10:52 It only shows up under Unknown egaudet Oct 22 00:11:07 cause they don't have any feed information Oct 22 00:11:12 dBsooner is working on a method to allow easier patch submissions so a lot of the patches floating around can get into preware quicker Oct 22 00:11:18 and Abyssul yea what oil said Oct 22 00:11:34 but they still show up in Preware :P Oct 22 00:11:38 I guess Oct 22 00:11:59 Based on posts and chats, I will say that it seems there are a good amount of people that seem to wait for preware releases too, as a lot of forum patches seem to go through iterations as well Oct 22 00:12:07 egaudet: thats good to hear! Oct 22 00:12:18 You could also say that the patches in the forums are beta tested... Oct 22 00:14:36 I assumed that the path patches usually take are thread posting, some iterations and positive posts, and eventually on preware...so the preware versions are pretty solid it seems. Either that, or some others in here with some experience tested it out and gave a thumbs up Oct 22 00:15:21 someone has to take the patch file and push it to git Oct 22 00:15:35 so the autobuilder can package it as an ipk for the feed Oct 22 00:15:55 * Abyssul bows Oct 22 00:16:56 Not complaining at all btw, just want patches to not get lost, and to be organized and accessible to more people Oct 22 00:17:19 Flashpass: it's not our job to hunt down the patches to put into the feed Oct 22 00:17:27 * ice-11 show's respect and bows aswell Oct 22 00:17:37 Flashpass: if someone wants it in Preware, they will find a way to get it into the webOS-Patches feed. Oct 22 00:17:50 dBsooner, i thought it was? aren't you the "patch miester" after all Oct 22 00:18:17 If I took the time to keep up with all the patches and where they are and if they are up to date in the patches feed, i would have to quit my job. Oct 22 00:18:41 sounds like you've already got a plan to stay on top of the load then Oct 22 00:18:44 oil: Aye. I make sure things get done. But I seriously don't have to time to go through all the patches and keep them up to date. Oct 22 00:18:45 xD Oct 22 00:19:07 This is why I want to make this script.. to make it easier for someone to "submit" it to me. Oct 22 00:19:22 instead of me having to go thread by thread and verify yes or now. Oct 22 00:19:23 +dBsooner: I agree its not your job, in the same way its not an app stores job to go find apps. My point was simply it would be nice to have, as some good patches might get passed up Oct 22 00:19:36 s/now/no/ Oct 22 00:19:36 dBsooner meant: instead of me having to go thread by thread and verify yes or no. Oct 22 00:20:38 Flashpass: I agree completely. This is why I am trying to find an easier way to bridge the gap between the patch maintainer and webOS-Patches. Oct 22 00:20:46 +dBsooner: awesome :) Oct 22 00:20:49 dBsooner: I'd make a quick webapp to do what you want... if I wasn't slammed by projects and mid-term exams right now :p. After :) Oct 22 00:21:08 speaking of which... i really better study soon lol Oct 22 00:21:30 Which reminds me, did anyone try those patches posted regarding the fstat/swap changes which supposedly improved performance across the pre? Oct 22 00:21:51 I am writing a php script right now Oct 22 00:23:32 ah cool. well if you'd like help later on, like in a week or so, let me know Oct 22 00:25:49 btw if anyone was wondering, iw as referring to the patches described in this thread: http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/209492-possible-resolution-too-many-cards-error.html Oct 22 00:27:47 lol Oct 22 00:28:40 just registered as ice-11 on precentral. can't believe i haven't gotten an account yet :p Oct 22 00:30:50 something you don't get until you see a file you want or have a problem worth signing up and posting for lol Oct 22 00:33:10 lol nope! Oct 22 00:33:23 i saw a file I wanted so i went to bothermenot Oct 22 00:33:27 or bugmenot? Oct 22 00:33:40 either way i was able to login as "nologin" :p Oct 22 00:35:25 oh huh, haven't head of that Oct 22 00:35:36 thanks for the info Oct 22 00:38:07 Flashpasss: http://www.bugmenot.com/ Oct 22 00:38:26 no biggie, it has been around for awhile... Oct 22 00:42:33 does anybody else's app catalog freeze when you try to install an app? Oct 22 00:42:39 it comes back for me though... Oct 22 00:42:55 wasn't this just asked? lol Oct 22 00:43:14 shall i read up? lol. i asked it but didn't get an answer (mabe 30 minago) Oct 22 00:44:04 ice-11: install Fair Dinkum Oct 22 00:44:19 yup, solves all your problems Oct 22 00:44:24 well..maybe 1 or 2 of them Oct 22 00:44:54 rwhitby, Flashpass: thanks. I'll give that a try Oct 22 00:47:10 rwhitby: ahh, you submitted Fair Dinkum :) Oct 22 00:47:13 gj Oct 22 00:47:27 * Abyssul bows to rwhitby. Oct 22 00:47:41 * rwhitby does a couple of things around this place ... Oct 22 00:47:46 * ice-11 high fives rwhitby Oct 22 00:48:21 Glad he said the name because, I can never remember it haha Oct 22 00:49:04 "Yes, that’s right. A call to queryInstallCapacity spawns a new program (”du”) once for each package returned by “ipkg -o /var list” Oct 22 00:49:05 omfg lol Oct 22 00:49:12 *that* makes sense Oct 22 00:49:19 nice job ferreting that out Oct 22 00:50:38 hmm removes the limit? so new apps are stored on the /media partition? Oct 22 00:50:54 actually ignore that. I'll stop being a tard and look at the script Oct 22 00:51:46 brb. gotta stop tetherin for a sec. Oct 22 00:55:08 ice-11: you need MvApp to move stuff to /media/internal Oct 22 00:55:46 odd, now I can't install any apps from the app catalog Oct 22 00:57:07 Haha Oct 22 00:58:01 and he just dropped $50 on that translator, too Oct 22 00:59:52 hahah Oct 22 01:00:04 is there really one for 50 buckws Oct 22 01:02:45 Are you serious? Someone bought that thing for 50 bucks? Oct 22 01:02:59 I'm going to go cry in my corner... Oct 22 01:05:10 * sugardave feels he is missing out on the initial wave of stupid. Oct 22 01:05:27 if someone bought it, they haven't reviewed it yet Oct 22 01:11:04 yep Oct 22 01:16:03 any of you program in Lisp? Oct 22 01:16:39 rwhitby loves emacs Oct 22 01:17:13 Does this sound reasonable for the Updating screen in Preware: Oct 22 01:17:14 I knew there was something wrong with that guy... Oct 22 01:17:30 'Updating
This should only take a couple of minutes even on a slow connection.
If it takes longer than that, first check your network connection, then try disabling feeds until you find the one which is not responding.' Oct 22 01:19:52 What are the other common reasons for a long Updating screen? Oct 22 01:20:13 i really don't think it will solve anything Oct 22 01:20:14 lol Oct 22 01:21:09 * PuffTheMagic_ thinks development energy should be shifted to the C service :D Oct 22 01:22:25 PuffTheMagic_: when you've got it building for both armv7 and i686, and able to use the same API that Preware currently has, then it can. Oct 22 01:22:34 i may have discovered how to actually remove the quick launch bar but keep the wave working. but i need the help of someone who knows the files better than me. Oct 22 01:22:35 Otherwise, there are things to fix in the existing implementation. Oct 22 01:23:23 rwhitby: the current API i think should be improved Oct 22 01:23:48 PuffTheMagic_: that's irrelevant to fixing problems *now* Oct 22 01:23:52 and i need that uniform devel env like i mentioned to you Oct 22 01:24:03 We all need lots of things ... Oct 22 01:24:39 ok nm.... guess its gonna go nowhere Oct 22 01:24:56 oh sheesh. Oct 22 01:25:00 this may be the wrong place for my topic. where should i go? Oct 22 01:25:32 PuffTheMagic_: do you really have no concept of support an existing product while doing a rearchitecture in the background? Oct 22 01:25:59 PuffTheMagic_: what's your estimate of the effort required for a Preware API re-architecture? Oct 22 01:26:24 If it's more than 2 hours, then adjusting these messages to reduce the dumb support questions is worth it. Oct 22 01:27:26 rwhitby: well actually, my last commits removed one of the breaks in the API that I made Oct 22 01:27:50 rwhitby: so it probably isnt hard at all to implement the last of the missing features Oct 22 01:28:05 which is really just adding confirmation support to everything that needs it Oct 22 01:28:28 Nothing is hard. Everything takes time and effort. Everyone is busy. Oct 22 01:28:56 If you have 4 hours of uninterrupted time to do something, go for it. I do not. Oct 22 01:29:20 I have 10 minutes here and there to make small changes that will stop hundreds of people having problems with Preware. Oct 22 01:30:43 i probably dont need much time to make it compatable with the API, but i have no idea how i am going to get it to build within the autobuilder framework Oct 22 01:31:25 i need glibc, mjson, and libipkg built Oct 22 01:31:30 mjson is tiny Oct 22 01:31:37 and i could build that in tree Oct 22 01:31:44 and libipkg is custom Oct 22 01:31:46 could also build that intree Oct 22 01:32:02 s/glibc/glib/ Oct 22 01:32:12 glib doesnt need to be tweaked Oct 22 01:32:20 and i guess we could use emu and device .so's Oct 22 01:32:28 but then i have put all the headers in the local tree Oct 22 01:33:05 i really hoped we could creat an environment where we didnt have to duplicate all the headers and .so's in every project Oct 22 01:33:35 if you could work on that in your free time then i will take care of getting the service api-compat Oct 22 01:33:39 It's called OpenEmbedded. Oct 22 01:33:49 Palm uses it to build the rootfs. Oct 22 01:34:15 The Freesmarthone.org guys are using to it replace the whole OS. Oct 22 01:34:32 It runs on Gentoo and Debian, largely host OS independent. Oct 22 01:34:48 (It runs on many other host OS types as well) Oct 22 01:35:02 Plenty of doco on the web, including a user manual. Oct 22 01:35:55 Has the submital script been released? Oct 22 01:36:29 rwhitby: yes you have mentioned that, but we need it on our git server or wiki so that every dev that wants to start a service can just do a git pull and have the same env Oct 22 01:36:45 agreed Oct 22 01:37:48 minus liblunaservice ;) Oct 22 01:37:53 rwhitby: oh that reminds me Oct 22 01:38:13 rwhitby: do you think this transition to a C service would be a goog time to link to opkg instead of ipkg? Oct 22 01:39:47 PuffTheMagic_: yes, I do, including signed package required for anything with install scripts. Oct 22 01:40:16 well you should start outlining a spec of that stuff so i know what I need to do Oct 22 01:40:26 if there is extra work int he service for that support Oct 22 01:40:46 PuffTheMagic_: as long as we are compatible on the package format front (which opkg is) and the ipkg database files front (which I think opkg also is) then we don't even need to use Palm's libipkg at all Oct 22 01:41:06 right Oct 22 01:41:11 well i already am not using it Oct 22 01:41:17 cause of that 8k buffer issue Oct 22 01:41:30 and i also found another function i want to modify in it Oct 22 01:41:46 one of the call backs in the lib has no support for passing user data to it Oct 22 01:41:56 which would be needed to pass around the message object Oct 22 01:41:58 right - we need to make sure that whatever version we use, it writes database files that are fully compatible with Palm's ipkg version. Oct 22 01:42:05 which would be needed for api compat Oct 22 01:42:29 well that sounds like a quick 10 min task for you ;) Oct 22 01:43:09 ;-) Oct 22 01:43:28 speaking of c services............. Oct 22 01:43:38 oil: im still in Texas Oct 22 01:43:40 lol Oct 22 01:43:54 PuffTheMagic_: where in Tx? Oct 22 01:44:00 oil: have we ever seen any problems on the Loading screen? Oct 22 01:44:01 bougyman: San Antonio Oct 22 01:44:08 oh. Oct 22 01:44:10 oil: i have some ideas for the irc gui Oct 22 01:44:13 dfw here Oct 22 01:44:13 bougyman: why? Oct 22 01:44:18 oil: if you get to Loading you're pretty much going to complete, right? Oct 22 01:44:26 for the most part Oct 22 01:44:27 PuffTheMagic_: lunch if you were in the metroplex. Oct 22 01:44:30 bougyman: dalas/fort worth? Oct 22 01:44:36 yeah. Oct 22 01:44:38 ahh Oct 22 01:44:54 bougyman: im at a conference at the Hyatt Grand Oct 22 01:45:04 oh, just visiting? Oct 22 01:45:15 yeah... HFES conference Oct 22 01:45:56 oil: so about the gui... know how you showed me the 2 formats for the main channel view, i have a 3rd and possibly a 4th to suggest Oct 22 01:46:23 oil: i think you need to get those mockups on the wiki too so we can get some feedback... maybe a poll or something Oct 22 01:46:55 well the option for left and fixed are arleady there Oct 22 01:47:04 so a poll isn't really needed, its both Oct 22 01:47:28 Can someone specifically describe to me what the "@@ -5,2 +5 @@" means? What number means what? Oct 22 01:47:35 In a patch Oct 22 01:47:41 oil: i was thinking that it would probably look nicer if you did a line return after showing nick, then started the message of the text all the way on the left Oct 22 01:48:04 yeah, that could be a 3rd option Oct 22 01:48:07 oil: sorta how the messaging app looks with timestamps enabled Oct 22 01:48:10 or really a sub option of left-aligned Oct 22 01:48:12 but the name would be bold Oct 22 01:48:26 or something Oct 22 01:48:26 idk Oct 22 01:48:38 oil: my other idea was sorta an extension of that idea Oct 22 01:48:55 and it was to use lists like in the messaging app Oct 22 01:49:03 so there is a faint line to delimit messages Oct 22 01:49:11 its already using a list widget Oct 22 01:49:20 well is the line hidden? Oct 22 01:49:27 make that enableable Oct 22 01:49:27 there just isn't one Oct 22 01:49:29 lol Oct 22 01:49:37 :D Oct 22 01:52:32 rwhitby: do you have a recommendation for which CL i should use.... there is this cognitive modeling tool called ACT-R that I want to start learning and idk which one to use Oct 22 01:52:52 CL? Oct 22 01:53:16 common lisp Oct 22 01:53:51 openmcl, sbcl ...? Oct 22 01:54:03 it need to be ANSI... thats all i know Oct 22 01:54:05 dunno anything about common lisp, sorry. Oct 22 01:54:12 ohhh Oct 22 01:54:28 i thought bpadalino implied you were a lisper cause of your love for emacs Oct 22 01:56:04 I have written some emacs lisp about 15 years ago ... Oct 22 01:56:42 I tend not to love or hate tools or languages or operating systems, but just use which ever is suitable for the task at hand ... Oct 22 02:01:12 rwhitby: im a complete lisp noob Oct 22 02:01:24 so idk where to start Oct 22 02:01:29 well Oct 22 02:01:32 i know where to start Oct 22 02:01:40 i just dont know which implementation to pick Oct 22 02:03:49 i gues sbcl is what im gonna try Oct 22 02:07:59 rwhitby is an equal-opportunity coder Oct 22 02:11:19 http://pastebin.com/m1173f8cc, can anyone find out why the hunks in this is failing? Oct 22 02:11:31 very simple patch... Oct 22 02:14:43 it makes no sense Oct 22 02:18:41 Abyssul: what tool did you use to create that patch? Oct 22 02:20:30 PuffTheMagic_: do you want to browser local html? Oct 22 02:20:45 ameng: yeah i did Oct 22 02:20:52 still do sorta Oct 22 02:21:06 PuffTheMagic_: comment out on line of browser app , you could browse local html files Oct 22 02:21:17 one Oct 22 02:21:26 nice Oct 22 02:21:34 got a reference to which line? Oct 22 02:21:45 wait, checking Oct 22 02:21:47 mvapp worked great:) thanks again... Oct 22 02:21:52 you use 1.2.1? Oct 22 02:22:17 rwhitby: http://www.dbtrunk.com/webospatchupload.php Oct 22 02:22:34 form is made, now to deal with it. Oct 22 02:22:40 Which is the easy part. Oct 22 02:22:40 ameng: yes Oct 22 02:25:59 PuffTheMagic_: /usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.browser/app/controllers/page-assistant.js:445 Oct 22 02:26:44 then you can use the file:// protocol Oct 22 02:26:50 thanks Oct 22 02:27:19 rwhitby: Unified Diff Maker by Jason Oct 22 02:27:45 * rwhitby sighs Oct 22 02:28:05 What? Oct 22 02:28:14 ameng: i really dont get why palm does this.... add features but comment them out... Oct 22 02:28:25 Abyssul: probably at the custom diff tool Oct 22 02:28:29 instead of using gnu patch Oct 22 02:28:51 rwhitby: Did you see the link? Oct 22 02:29:13 I used my own patch creating method and Jasons and neither work Oct 22 02:29:34 ameng: do you know what function it is... i dont see anything commened out on 445 Oct 22 02:30:04 Abyssul: that is a malformed patch file. You will notice there are 5 lines in the file, but (5-2)+1 = 4. Oct 22 02:30:07 PuffTheMagic_: I meen comment this line Oct 22 02:30:13 mean Oct 22 02:30:13 ameng: yeah i just realized that ;) Oct 22 02:30:14 thanks Oct 22 02:30:15 There are 6 lines in the file Oct 22 02:30:29 Abyssul: 5 lines listed in the patch file Oct 22 02:30:40 lines 4 to 8 in your pastebin Oct 22 02:30:47 does that looks like this._webView.mojo.addUrlRedirect('^file:', true, '', 0);? Oct 22 02:31:06 yeah Oct 22 02:31:16 ok Oct 22 02:31:16 im surprised thats not a patch yet Oct 22 02:31:18 Abyssul: it should say -2,6 +2,4 on line 3 of your pastebin Oct 22 02:31:33 Abyssul: make that -2,6 +2,5 on line 3 of your pastebin Oct 22 02:31:59 Abyssul: what was your own patch creating method? Oct 22 02:32:34 WinMerge Oct 22 02:32:36 why are people reinventing the wheel? Oct 22 02:32:44 PuffTheMagic_: I even want to browser local file without internet connections, but i am lazy to look at the code Oct 22 02:33:14 ameng: this definately needs to get added to autopatch Oct 22 02:33:23 PuffTheMagic_: Forgive them for they know not what they do ... Oct 22 02:33:55 only comment this line , you still need internet connnections now Oct 22 02:35:26 ameng: im getting a unable to load file error Oct 22 02:36:56 did you use the full file path? Oct 22 02:37:17 umm i have a folder in /media/internal called hfes2009 Oct 22 02:37:18 and i types Oct 22 02:37:27 file://hfes2009/start.htm Oct 22 02:37:33 did i needthe /media/internal part? Oct 22 02:38:06 ahh yes Oct 22 02:38:08 it works Oct 22 02:38:12 wrong , should be file:///media/internal/path/to/*.html Oct 22 02:38:55 ;-) Oct 22 02:39:45 aww bummer Oct 22 02:39:51 it dont do what i wanted Oct 22 02:40:06 this html file has a table of contents of all the papers at this conference Oct 22 02:40:09 with links to the pdf Oct 22 02:40:26 so i was hoping i could click on the pdf link and have it launch the pdf viewer Oct 22 02:40:50 what does the browser say? Oct 22 02:40:53 but no.... it dont work Oct 22 02:41:06 it does not say anything Oct 22 02:41:25 check the pdf link in the html Oct 22 02:41:29 when i click on the link it brings me to the previous page basically and the probgress bar stops loading Oct 22 02:41:38 what does it look like? Oct 22 02:58:28 ameng: its really worth all this effort for me at the moment Oct 22 02:58:54 i tried dumping the proceesings cd on my pre thinking i could view the presentation pdfs before going to the talks Oct 22 02:59:01 and there is only 1.5 days left Oct 22 02:59:09 and i can always read them on my lappy Oct 22 02:59:13 the night before **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Oct 22 02:59:56 2009