**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 24 02:59:56 2009 Oct 24 03:00:03 and that is what i did lol Oct 24 03:00:07 i made my own gentoo livecd Oct 24 03:00:37 or even better.. Arch Linux where basically NOTHING gets installed during "installation" Oct 24 03:00:49 not even xorg Oct 24 03:01:05 debian net install is great for new people, gentoo not soo much =p Oct 24 03:01:10 So many choices Oct 24 03:01:15 Its like choose candy at a store Oct 24 03:01:22 Abyssul: you have no idea Oct 24 03:01:26 nah.. if you're going to start.. might as well go balls out.. gentoo! Oct 24 03:01:33 Lol Oct 24 03:01:40 There are so many distro's it is like mexicans in LA Oct 24 03:01:41 Or in your case, no balls :) Oct 24 03:01:42 lol Oct 24 03:01:47 I remember when linux was 3 flavor's Oct 24 03:01:48 do debian Oct 24 03:01:56 i have redhat 5.2 Oct 24 03:02:01 Slackware, Red Hat, FreeBSD (which is BSDi really) Oct 24 03:02:01 had* Oct 24 03:02:06 slackware lol Oct 24 03:02:37 slackware was what I started with Oct 24 03:03:42 i installed slackware when it came on 14 floppy disks Oct 24 03:06:40 ahhhh floppy disks Oct 24 03:08:08 Holy crap, is this OS 5 dvd's long? Oct 24 03:08:26 I still have a 5 1/4" drive Oct 24 03:08:27 Which one? Oct 24 03:08:30 Debian Oct 24 03:08:38 get the net install Oct 24 03:08:42 I dont wanna use the internet method lol Oct 24 03:08:54 Get ubuntu instead :P Oct 24 03:09:07 ubuntu is 1 dvd.. it's livedvd Oct 24 03:09:25 Yeah, but you can install it as well Oct 24 03:09:40 u could try mint too ;o if u want something easier Oct 24 03:09:49 is flash working well in newest ubuntu? Oct 24 03:10:23 mint is kinda....meh Oct 24 03:10:27 which image file do I get? Oct 24 03:10:30 Thers like 12 lol Oct 24 03:10:55 http://mirror.uoregon.edu/ubuntu/releases/jaunty/ubuntu-9.04-desktop-i386.iso Oct 24 03:12:24 aha! upstart in 9.10...that is good Oct 24 03:13:14 6 days Oct 24 03:15:38 hi! Oct 24 03:16:33 Does anyone know how mojo drawers work? Oct 24 03:16:53 You click on them and they open/close Oct 24 03:17:02 nice Oct 24 03:20:03 crud. I hate when new ubuntu comes out. Oct 24 03:20:42 I know I should just leave well enough alone because I have everything working like a dream at the moment, but I'll be installing it the minute it comes out anyway. It's like a sickness Oct 24 03:21:19 lol Oct 24 03:28:24 ok i need sleep Oct 24 03:28:39 later Oct 24 03:31:56 Emoney...you around? Oct 24 03:32:26 it's possible Oct 24 03:32:42 change nick to precentral name? Oct 24 03:32:52 Not sure how to do that Oct 24 03:32:59 it's cdadams1223 Oct 24 03:33:00 type /nick name Oct 24 03:33:03 lol Oct 24 03:33:11 thanks Oct 24 03:33:14 np Oct 24 03:33:25 what's up Oct 24 03:33:34 I asked you a question earlier today but had to go stretch a Pt.'s shoulder Oct 24 03:34:03 it was re: removing my patches prior to updating Preware/Package manager Oct 24 03:34:11 As well as removing my theme Oct 24 03:34:31 oh yea no Oct 24 03:34:31 is that vecessary? Oct 24 03:34:31 ok Oct 24 03:34:31 only for webos updates Oct 24 03:34:31 Ah Oct 24 03:34:31 That's a good thing Oct 24 03:34:42 yup just run EPR immediately before or after a webos update and all should be fine Oct 24 03:34:44 Okay then...off to update some stuff Oct 24 03:34:48 ok Oct 24 03:34:56 enjoy... make sure to update package manager first Oct 24 03:34:58 before preware Oct 24 03:35:31 (and minimize cards and wait for carrier string to reappear after restarting java to know it's back up) Oct 24 03:35:35 thanks again...you webos folks are incredible! I think I'll stick with the human body...this computer stuff is a bit OVERWHELMING at times. Oct 24 03:35:44 ok Oct 24 03:36:00 as if the human body isn't overwhelming :P Oct 24 03:36:11 Nah...it's a piece of cake ;) Oct 24 03:36:26 To each his ow...right? Oct 24 03:36:28 own* Oct 24 03:36:58 Alright...I'm outta here. G'night :p Oct 24 03:37:05 yup, ok g'night Oct 24 03:49:50 Yay Oct 24 03:49:55 Got my member status changed :) Oct 24 03:51:15 to what? Oct 24 03:53:21 dBsooner: whassup? Oct 24 03:54:26 entity-: this channel is on freenode cause all the other channels I frequent are also on freenode ;-) Oct 24 03:55:20 oil: webOS Enthusiast :) Oct 24 03:55:27 lol Oct 24 03:55:32 * oil is fine being a member Oct 24 03:55:41 especially if the installer guy is a "Homebrew Developer" Oct 24 03:56:45 my pre is locked up Oct 24 03:56:56 frozen Oct 24 03:57:03 entity-: at least you have one :( Oct 24 03:57:15 oh i love my pre Oct 24 03:57:21 I hate you :P Oct 24 03:57:23 <3333 Oct 24 03:57:57 i had to alt crtl del Oct 24 03:58:14 it locked up in the app catalog Oct 24 03:58:20 the palm app catalog Oct 24 03:58:34 install fairdinkum Oct 24 03:58:43 ohh Oct 24 03:58:47 am i full Oct 24 03:58:48 ? Oct 24 03:59:00 has anyone run the top command in terminal on the pre Oct 24 03:59:16 no Oct 24 03:59:17 oily can i do that from preware? Oct 24 03:59:25 but it locks if you have the package manager Oct 24 03:59:31 palm did some stupid stuff Oct 24 03:59:38 and fairdinkum fixes those mistakes Oct 24 03:59:41 yeah, its in preware Oct 24 03:59:45 what really? Oct 24 03:59:47 go to the list of everything and type fair Oct 24 03:59:53 i'm not sure how linux works but it says I'm using 30% cpu and have only 3 mb of memory free when only running the terminal Oct 24 03:59:56 its called fair dink kum ? Oct 24 04:00:07 fair dinkum Oct 24 04:00:07 fair dinkum app limit Oct 24 04:00:54 oil: opal coba has stopped development on his homebrew app store (as opposed to his recent entry into homebrew installer development) Oct 24 04:00:55 ok just going to jump on my wifi Oct 24 04:01:15 rwhitby: he didn't develop it though Oct 24 04:01:17 so, no real problem Oct 24 04:01:26 you see https://opalcoba.sourcerepo.com/opalcoba/Installer/Source%20Code/ Oct 24 04:01:34 its missing the app folder now Oct 24 04:01:38 the folder with... all the code in it Oct 24 04:01:54 yep Oct 24 04:02:06 but he's not distributing the binary any more, so there's no issue. Oct 24 04:02:21 installing Oct 24 04:02:22 didn't say he put it back in the catalog? Oct 24 04:02:27 i see it sitting there waiting for moderator review Oct 24 04:02:34 i can always reformat right? Oct 24 04:02:37 re-read the first post rwhitby Oct 24 04:02:42 oil: at least he has the most important version-compare.* files still there Oct 24 04:02:50 lol Oct 24 04:02:59 hehe Oct 24 04:03:26 i want to instal hang man Oct 24 04:04:15 oil: http://www.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/installer - taken down Oct 24 04:04:55 look at the "internal app listing" Oct 24 04:05:00 its awaiting moderator review Oct 24 04:05:37 lol Oct 24 04:05:42 now it says i have no room Oct 24 04:06:00 then you're at hte 100mb free limit Oct 24 04:06:13 oil: and the moderators were woken early in the morning yesterday regarding the app, so I doubt they will be in a hurry to approve it ... Oct 24 04:06:30 lol Oct 24 04:06:43 im going to uninstall some crap Oct 24 04:08:38 oil: http://forums.precentral.net/showthread.php?p=1995810 Oct 24 04:10:29 aww Oct 24 04:10:33 he replied Oct 24 04:10:34 i was looking forward to trying Installer Oct 24 04:10:47 I was going to fork it Oct 24 04:11:34 * rwhitby bbl Oct 24 04:11:38 lol Oct 24 04:11:39 fork the fork Oct 24 04:11:43 lol yep Oct 24 04:12:03 Was thinking of calling it "WePrare Oct 24 04:12:15 freakout: call it "Better Installer" Oct 24 04:12:24 lmao Oct 24 04:12:35 or "We Did It Again" Oct 24 04:12:46 again, again Oct 24 04:12:58 ok, I'm gone for some hours. Oct 24 04:13:01 * rwhitby bbl Oct 24 04:13:06 id love to read when you reply Oct 24 04:13:10 er, what you reply Oct 24 04:13:14 when you reply Oct 24 04:14:30 and how! Oct 24 04:15:14 honestly Oct 24 04:15:28 ....actually, no, I won't. Oct 24 04:15:33 * freakout was going to bitch Oct 24 04:15:40 heya Tim :) Oct 24 04:15:46 * freakout waves Oct 24 04:15:52 rut roh.. bitching about what now ;) Oct 24 04:16:49 well, I was going to make some pointed comments about how the Pre being used in a TV show does not really qualify as "news" Oct 24 04:17:07 ah yes... "sightings" Oct 24 04:17:16 its NOT? Oct 24 04:17:26 And certain blogs *cough*PreCentral*cough* are pretty much just re-advertising an advertisement Oct 24 04:17:33 I concur, but at the same time, it is a successful form of subliminal advertising... Oct 24 04:17:58 I dunno - Jack Bauer used a Treo 700p, and look how succesful that was :p Oct 24 04:18:07 Much like how every, single, Hollywood movie has some muppet there with his well-known, silver laptop with that famous logo on the back of it Oct 24 04:18:34 oil: lol. well, maybe if you're just looking to find *anything* to post about... Oct 24 04:18:49 lingfish: yes. Oct 24 04:19:01 when fictional characters use the same phone as me, it makes me feel more cool Oct 24 04:19:28 Dr. Weir in Stargate Atlantis used a Treo. made me think I could run an alien expedition too Oct 24 04:19:37 oil: agree there... but hey, that's apparently most of the market... so if it props Palm up and sells more, I'm all for it Oct 24 04:19:57 We're just the leet few ;) Oct 24 04:20:05 oil: and you do need all the help you can get Oct 24 04:20:12 xD Oct 24 04:20:47 psh Oct 24 04:21:09 posh. Oct 24 04:21:42 Okay, I'm out too. bbt, where the 't' may equal 'tonight' or 'tomorrow' Oct 24 04:21:56 So you will all be deprived the benefit of my great wisdom Oct 24 04:22:06 I will understand if homebrew grinds to a halt. Oct 24 04:22:14 heh. Oct 24 04:22:59 meh, I can't remember what Rod said was the workaround for wiki searches Oct 24 05:02:13 lingfish: what are you wanting to search? Oct 24 05:02:40 the simplest is simply to do a google advanced search for your subject with the domain restricted to webos-internals.org Oct 24 05:02:49 "sms" for example. I'm going to fix mediawiki for him, just don't hvae the access Oct 24 05:02:55 ah ok, site:blah... done. Oct 24 05:02:58 ta :) Oct 24 05:03:35 lingfish: you don't NEED to be given access, if you sign up with a username, you have edit rights Oct 24 05:03:37 no checking Oct 24 05:03:43 we're very trusting at this point Oct 24 05:03:46 Nah... it'll be a backend issue Oct 24 05:03:52 ahhhh Oct 24 05:03:57 it'll be in the MW config/code. Oct 24 05:04:00 shell ;) Oct 24 05:04:15 well, backend I can't help you with. For that Rod has to give you ssh access. Oct 24 05:04:56 heh, I just tried Preware... very nice. Oct 24 05:05:15 thanks Oct 24 05:05:22 we're pretty darned proud of it. Oct 24 05:05:22 you think preware is nice??? you should try "Installer" its 50x better Oct 24 05:05:29 HAHAhahahahah Oct 24 05:05:35 'cause the color is different Oct 24 05:05:43 I like that it pulls all the different sites cats in Oct 24 05:05:46 and by different, you mean the same Oct 24 05:05:49 and because it says "We did it again" at the top Oct 24 05:05:50 I'm really tempted to call his parents. Oct 24 05:05:57 lol Oct 24 05:06:03 no, seriously. Oct 24 05:06:05 I'm totally missing this joke.... Oct 24 05:06:08 tracking him wasn't that hard. Oct 24 05:06:09 did someone rip someone else off? Oct 24 05:06:17 basically Oct 24 05:06:26 someone get him the link to the forums Oct 24 05:06:29 A 14 year old "forked" preware last night. and posted it on Precentral calling it "installer" and claiming to have improved it Oct 24 05:06:39 oh god. Oct 24 05:06:42 except he didn't actually CHANGE anything Oct 24 05:06:44 yet nothing was different except the title Oct 24 05:06:56 Go back to your iPhone, child. Oct 24 05:06:58 he didn't even replace everywhere it says preware Oct 24 05:07:06 right Oct 24 05:07:11 if you don't have the package manager instaled, itl tell you to try restarting preware Oct 24 05:07:15 he needs to learn how to use find and replace Oct 24 05:07:19 now, I will absolutely defend his right to DO that. Oct 24 05:07:36 But it's horrifically IMPOLITE to release it until he has actually made at least SOME change. Oct 24 05:07:49 well he claims to have made a change Oct 24 05:07:55 oh? Oct 24 05:07:55 http://forums.precentral.net/1994523-post114.html Oct 24 05:07:58 but he didn't Oct 24 05:08:03 but i looked in the code, and didn't see anything like that Oct 24 05:08:14 but i was like "why is there an extra comma in that string?" Oct 24 05:08:18 and removed it from preware Oct 24 05:08:19 lol Oct 24 05:09:05 That's just stupidly sad. Oct 24 05:10:56 he doesn't know how to change the background color so all he could do was change text Oct 24 05:11:49 Is there an eqiv of "show tables" in sqlite3/ Oct 24 05:12:12 .tables isn't giving me much. Oct 24 05:12:34 select from the structure table? Oct 24 05:12:59 And no "use" I assume either? Oct 24 05:13:09 idk Oct 24 05:13:42 ah... use would be specifying the db on the cmdline. Oct 24 05:21:18 lingfish: open database blahblah -- select bleh from .... Oct 24 05:21:46 yep, clued in now. Oct 24 05:42:21 Anyone konw if the Pre can store/read SMS from the SIM? Oct 24 05:43:53 my pre doesn't have a simcard Oct 24 05:44:11 wtf? CDMA? Oct 24 05:44:18 sprint Oct 24 05:44:29 Man you guys have bizarre phone networks :P Oct 24 05:45:07 YO Oct 24 05:45:16 i deleted a bunch of apps Oct 24 05:45:36 but still keep getting over the limit error in app catalog Oct 24 05:45:43 shouldz i rebootz? Oct 24 05:45:53 idk Oct 24 05:46:01 rwhitby is the one who did all th research on that Oct 24 05:46:03 lingfish: to answer your question, no, the API's have support for sending only, so no controls over that stuff. If you mean it differently (non-programmactically), then I have no idea. Oct 24 05:46:05 ive never hit hte limit Oct 24 05:46:18 oil: I paid for blocked finally Oct 24 05:46:30 lol Oct 24 05:46:41 I figured I owed you Oct 24 05:46:46 lol Oct 24 05:46:48 kesne: classicly, you can "transfer" SMSs between phones with this archaic method... copy to SIM, restore from SIM... Oct 24 05:46:56 for pointing you to google xD Oct 24 05:46:57 Wondering if that was gonna be an option for me Oct 24 05:47:05 oil: hehe Oct 24 05:47:19 and maybe sim apis are in 1.1.3 Oct 24 05:47:27 and whatever version is to bring them together Oct 24 05:48:05 rwhitby: pal do you know? Oct 24 05:48:21 lingfish: well, I have no idea if the german pres can do that. If palm was really really cool, they'd store it on your palm profile (but one-way sync only, no danger situation here) Oct 24 05:48:23 im rebooting Oct 24 05:48:31 * oil waits for kesnes fork of preware which does installs in dashboard stages xD Oct 24 05:48:46 oil: it isnt coming Oct 24 05:48:50 lol Oct 24 05:48:54 If anything, I'd rewrite it Oct 24 05:48:56 kesne: yeah, can't say I'm a huge fan of the cloud stuff, after the recent Hiptop blowup Oct 24 05:48:58 but I'm much to busy Oct 24 05:49:17 hows precentral app coming? Oct 24 05:49:22 lingfish: I'm a strong supporter of it, but I always write one-way with two-way optional. Oct 24 05:49:46 I want to like it, but yeah. Oct 24 05:51:10 I recently contributed pretty heavily to a linux distro, it used something that I came up with called Contant Sync, which is really how it SHOULD work Oct 24 05:52:24 im fucked i can't update or download anything Oct 24 05:53:45 entity-: uninstall Fair Dankium, will change ur life Oct 24 05:55:31 Has anybody ever figured out why Fair Dinkum works directly for most people (like me) but some folks it works after Fair Dinkum has been uninstalled? Oct 24 05:55:37 i installed it already Oct 24 05:55:46 at least i can install with preware Oct 24 05:55:57 no Oct 24 05:56:01 UNinstall it! Oct 24 05:56:31 entity-: listen to kesne. Uninstall Fair Dinkum. Oct 24 05:57:06 k daWG im done uninstalling Oct 24 05:57:09 testing Oct 24 05:58:06 nope phone locked up Oct 24 05:58:24 entity: wait 30 seconds please Oct 24 05:58:33 opps Oct 24 05:58:40 i alt crtl del Oct 24 05:59:12 :O Oct 24 05:59:26 lol Oct 24 05:59:26 its rebooting Oct 24 05:59:38 PreWare causes a "locked up" phone appearance sometimes when installing via app catalog Oct 24 06:00:01 oh why? Oct 24 06:00:32 As rwhitby Oct 24 06:00:39 s/as/ask Oct 24 06:00:49 something to do with palm checking installed app size Oct 24 06:00:54 using ipkg list Oct 24 06:00:57 instead of list installed Oct 24 06:01:04 with package manager installed, the list is ginormous Oct 24 06:01:11 and it runs a du for each package Oct 24 06:01:19 at the same time Oct 24 06:01:23 yeah Oct 24 06:01:25 what he said Oct 24 06:01:44 okay cool Oct 24 06:01:48 im trying again Oct 24 06:02:05 ipkg list and ipkg list_installed do the same thing Oct 24 06:02:11 how are you supposed to legitmatly unistall apps? Oct 24 06:02:29 orange+tap? Oct 24 06:02:56 im still out of space Oct 24 06:03:07 this hang man is huge Oct 24 06:03:10 i guess Oct 24 06:03:17 2446K Oct 24 06:03:56 Psh Oct 24 06:03:59 what do you mean legitimately uninstall apps? Oct 24 06:04:03 Look at WWTBAM Oct 24 06:04:57 no tried a smaller one and im still ouut of space Oct 24 06:05:33 Try trowing your pre at a wall, that helps me 9 out of 10 times Oct 24 06:05:46 wanna fight about it? Oct 24 06:06:16 hmm? no? Oct 24 06:06:38 * kesne tilts his head to suggest confution Oct 24 06:06:46 * kesne cannot spell at this hour Oct 24 06:06:46 i only have roughly 2mb free memory Oct 24 06:06:49 with no apps open Oct 24 06:06:51 is this normal? Oct 24 06:06:53 D; Oct 24 06:07:05 how did u check? Oct 24 06:07:10 how can i see how much space is used up Oct 24 06:07:13 top command in terminal? Oct 24 06:07:17 cat proc/meminfo Oct 24 06:07:35 Yea I have 3 mb free with no apps running except terminal Oct 24 06:07:49 kk, so i guess its about normal Oct 24 06:07:51 thanks:) Oct 24 06:08:48 is this some kind of lame joke Oct 24 06:08:57 i have like 15 apps Oct 24 06:09:00 does linux cache RAM for applications? Oct 24 06:09:21 yes, in a way. Oct 24 06:09:55 i know vista/7 do it in a way with superfetch but I have no experience with linux Oct 24 06:10:28 Unix has for a long time. It's not so much prefetching... more like buffers Oct 24 06:39:28 precentral podcast was really hating on the pre's performance this past week ;O Oct 24 07:00:20 whats the reason for the pre's poor performance? Oct 24 07:05:39 it depends on which poor performance you're talking about. Oct 24 07:05:57 much of it isn't poor at all Oct 24 07:06:00 some is. Oct 24 07:07:28 scrolling through lists, switching between applications. it just doesn't feel as responsive as say an iphone 3gs which uses the same hardware Oct 24 07:08:52 launching applications too. I also get this weird glitch where after swipe up a card it will come back down for half a second then disappear Oct 24 07:10:25 the come back down then disappear thing is the programmer putting too much in the cleanup Oct 24 07:12:02 it happens on the dialer and messenging app also Oct 24 07:25:09 Their big complaint was the calendar app it seems Oct 24 07:25:31 something i never use on my pre Oct 24 07:26:08 its still early tho ;o Oct 24 07:26:19 well that's where their hate got really interesting Oct 24 07:26:41 they literally said "we don't see WebOS getting any more optimised without a huge overhaul on all of the code." (adlib) Oct 24 07:26:58 they were really ragging on it Oct 24 07:27:39 well if they'd actually run the processor @ 600mhz Oct 24 07:27:47 and enable smartreflex/scaling & make it stable Oct 24 07:37:07 the processor clock/voltage isn't dynamic right now? Oct 24 07:39:12 is palm using the v8 engine for javascript just now? Oct 24 07:41:08 i dont think it is by default :/ Oct 24 07:41:30 theres a patch for smart reflex & one for scaling Oct 24 07:42:17 whats it called Oct 24 07:43:11 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Patch_webOS_CPU_Frequency_or_Voltage_Scaling Oct 24 07:43:39 "Note that these 2 methods CANNOT be used together" Oct 24 07:43:44 for now... ;/ Oct 24 08:09:39 anyone in the patch area of webos-internals online right now? Oct 24 08:11:48 doesn't look like it Oct 24 08:12:47 lol Oct 24 08:12:59 just trying to make sense of their versioning Oct 24 08:13:23 lol, it seems oddly thought out Oct 24 08:14:46 i think its webosversion-patchversion Oct 24 08:15:06 so, 1.2.1-1 would be the first release of a patch for 1.2.1 Oct 24 08:15:13 - seems a bit strange given some patches work multiple updates (eg 1.2.0 and 1.2.1) and patch version is single digit Oct 24 08:15:57 right Oct 24 08:16:26 i had nothing to do with it Oct 24 08:16:33 that just what it is xD Oct 24 08:16:33 if they are putting webos version # in for programmable reasons, you'd want a range of compatible versions not just the latest compatible version, heh Oct 24 08:16:37 lol Oct 24 08:16:42 right Oct 24 08:16:47 and several are 1.2.1-7, lol Oct 24 08:16:50 but being that palm forces upgrades eventually Oct 24 08:16:54 what happens after 9 Oct 24 08:16:55 lol Oct 24 08:17:00 it seems pointless to support lesser versions Oct 24 08:17:10 after 9 it goes to 10 Oct 24 08:17:18 see ipkgservice version 0.9.10 Oct 24 08:17:22 but then why not 01, 02, etc. Oct 24 08:17:38 idk Oct 24 08:17:42 unneeded 0? Oct 24 08:17:45 for alphabetic organizin, heh Oct 24 08:17:59 especiatelly when it's not x.x.x format Oct 24 08:18:07 its x.x.x-x Oct 24 08:18:19 I mean for the patch itself Oct 24 08:18:40 cause with x.x.x format, your ipkg service is build 10, not 0.10, big difference Oct 24 08:19:59 but yea, I gotta ask then about that, once they get online Oct 24 08:20:52 oil: have you noticed the ripoff of your game? Oct 24 08:20:57 lol Oct 24 08:20:58 yeah Oct 24 08:21:04 a dollar more, and 100 less puzzles Oct 24 08:21:10 idiot Oct 24 08:21:24 Why are there so many duplicate apps Oct 24 08:21:25 i was gonna download it to see if he janked my code from homebrew Oct 24 08:21:35 That was my first thought Oct 24 08:22:03 url? Oct 24 08:22:12 App catalog :P Oct 24 08:22:15 or is it an app catalog app? Oct 24 08:22:16 lol Oct 24 08:22:19 Get a Pre Jason Oct 24 08:22:23 well, I'm useless again, lol Oct 24 08:22:25 ;) Oct 24 08:22:37 Positive reviews for oil's blocked app Oct 24 08:22:59 I can't even buy it to download it to leave a 1 star review :( Oct 24 08:24:15 lol, apparently the improved autocorrect dictionary autocorrects tape to rape, lol Oct 24 08:24:27 nice Oct 24 08:25:12 Not for me... Oct 24 08:25:46 you talk about tape often on your pre? Oct 24 08:26:07 Every day Oct 24 08:28:49 lol, wouldn't that be akward if you sent out a text message without changing back Oct 24 08:29:22 "So I hear you secretly taped the babysitter" Oct 24 08:29:24 lol Oct 24 08:29:49 lol Oct 24 08:29:59 the cops would totally show up Oct 24 08:30:04 lol Oct 24 08:34:38 JayCanuck: You the same person as Jason Rastosomething on the forums? (sorry, terrible with names) Oct 24 08:34:51 Jason Robitaille yea Oct 24 08:34:59 cool. Oct 24 08:35:05 I have an easy question. Oct 24 08:35:08 from now on when i refer to you its as jason rastosomething Oct 24 08:35:12 lol Oct 24 08:35:29 yes, me too Oct 24 08:35:44 that is excellent Oct 24 08:35:52 The two patches that you and I came up with based on diomark's idea to fix the too many cards error. I made a new single patch that does both. Do you have any objection to me submitting that for the preware feeds? Oct 24 08:36:47 actually, I recieved a warning from both rod and a friend @ palm about the fstab one Oct 24 08:36:54 really? Oct 24 08:36:59 care to share? Oct 24 08:37:04 apparently it's risky cutting tmp in half Oct 24 08:37:11 ah. Oct 24 08:37:23 well, I can easily edit the patch to skip that line. Oct 24 08:37:30 see if it still works well for people. Oct 24 08:37:38 did he say why it would cause a problem? Oct 24 08:38:49 nah, nothing specific other than saying it's a bad idea cutting tmp memory space in half. try contacting rod before submitting it, he might wanna see it (he was quite interested in it earlier) Oct 24 08:39:03 oh, and I've submitted the luna.conf patch Oct 24 08:39:35 I think we just need to wait for an OS update to fix those issues (HA HA HA) Oct 24 08:39:39 oh, well then there's not much point in submitting the new one. I'll just talk to rod and clean up my /etc/fstab patch if needed. Oct 24 08:39:48 lol, eguy Oct 24 08:41:03 The next update should fix the memory issue with the catalog apparently but god knows when that is going to be Oct 24 08:41:21 nah, we're not talking about that Oct 24 08:41:31 we're talking about people who get the "too many cards" error all the time Oct 24 08:41:31 I know Oct 24 08:41:33 ah Oct 24 08:41:47 but eventually that issue will be fixed as well I am guessing Oct 24 08:41:56 or needs to be at least Oct 24 08:42:47 Lucky for me, I have only seen it about 5 times since I got my Pre in June Oct 24 08:43:04 I've never see it :op Oct 24 08:43:05 i find i usually get that when/after using the browser Oct 24 08:43:32 Yeah, the browser uses a lot of temporary memory cache Oct 24 08:43:53 webOS has worse memory management than Vista pre SP1 Oct 24 08:44:01 lol Oct 24 08:44:42 So this weekend I'm releasing a major v2.0 update to Theme Builder, v2.83 WOSQI and v1.7 Repair Utility Oct 24 08:45:04 Anything exciting in QI? Oct 24 08:45:27 nah, just just fixes mostly Oct 24 08:45:49 * oil heard a little bird talking about 3.0 Oct 24 08:46:03 a bird named kense? Oct 24 08:46:05 lol Oct 24 08:46:08 3.0 will be $50 Oct 24 08:46:11 lol Oct 24 08:46:19 like the dictionary Oct 24 08:46:23 3.0 won't be out for several months Oct 24 08:46:32 lol Oct 24 08:46:42 gotta get me that dictionary app Oct 24 08:46:48 any reviews on it yet? Oct 24 08:46:53 lol Oct 24 08:46:55 I ought to check Oct 24 08:46:57 i haven't looked yet today Oct 24 08:47:04 * Eguy goes to look Oct 24 08:47:05 i doubt there are any on it, or the dudes other $20 apps Oct 24 08:47:07 and its just an online interface, lol Oct 24 08:47:12 if you go to recent Oct 24 08:47:21 and click the price button twice Oct 24 08:47:24 itl go most to least Oct 24 08:47:28 and all his are at the top Oct 24 08:47:29 JayCanuck: btw, when you say Rod, are you referring to rwhitby? Oct 24 08:47:34 yea Oct 24 08:47:37 Trapster is back Oct 24 08:47:42 too bad I can't install it Oct 24 08:47:43 lol Oct 24 08:47:48 i downloaded it and started it up while i was in my house Oct 24 08:47:55 apparently there is a spot cops like to hide down the road Oct 24 08:47:58 and someone felt hte need to post it Oct 24 08:47:59 lol Oct 24 08:48:06 another tip calc? wtf!!! Oct 24 08:48:14 Instead of fart apps we get tip calcs Oct 24 08:48:18 lol Oct 24 08:48:19 lots of tip calculating going on Oct 24 08:48:35 all those poor waitresses haven't been getting their fair share Oct 24 08:49:02 after these weekend releases, just a quick MetaDoctorX release (java cross platform version port of rod's script), then I can slowly get back to actual on-device development as I've been wanting to for a while, lol Oct 24 08:49:20 what ya makin? Oct 24 08:49:31 I can't Ieven imagine using a tip calculator. If you can't figure out a tip in your head, you're probably too stupid to order a meal. Oct 24 08:49:33 more like what I want to make Oct 24 08:49:36 Oooooo at least 10 suckers bought the english one Oct 24 08:49:58 Some retard gave it 5 stars Oct 24 08:50:37 I wanna finall get back to Internals, get my archive manager done, get my comic reader done, etc. Oct 24 08:50:37 lol Oct 24 08:50:48 I sooooo wanna make a port of my PalmOS CourseNotes app, as well Oct 24 08:50:53 Holy crap! Some guy wrote at least a 2-3 paragraph review on the english dictionary app Oct 24 08:51:00 lol Oct 24 08:51:13 it's basically google with a nice gui Oct 24 08:51:22 Mostly complaints and he still gave it 3 stars! Oct 24 08:51:26 What an idiot! Oct 24 08:51:27 lol Oct 24 08:51:46 * oil has been waiting for a review on the app like blocked that points out the price being more for less puzzles Oct 24 08:52:01 lol Oct 24 08:52:23 ouch shot at oil on one of the reviews Oct 24 08:52:37 "it is not sluggish like the other one" Oct 24 08:52:42 lol Oct 24 08:53:16 I gotta get developing shareware Oct 24 08:53:22 to be fair, he does have an awesome name if that is his name: Den Zebra Oct 24 08:53:27 lol Oct 24 08:53:33 * oil changes name Oct 24 08:53:46 to "Jason Rastosomething" Oct 24 08:53:49 lol Oct 24 08:53:54 yes Oct 24 08:53:57 lol Oct 24 08:53:58 genius Oct 24 08:54:00 hmm, does the app catalog even support international developers or is it only american developers currently? Oct 24 08:54:12 * oil has no clue Oct 24 08:54:14 International Oct 24 08:54:22 because it has international apps Oct 24 08:54:49 * oil thinks jason just needs to import a unlocked gsm qwertz from germany Oct 24 08:55:19 qwertz is where it is at Oct 24 08:55:20 if I import one, I know the second I get it I'll have oreo effect or screen bleeding, etc. Oct 24 08:55:40 lol Oct 24 08:55:40 its not that bad D; Oct 24 08:55:40 dont jinx yourself! Oct 24 08:55:50 My oreo comes and goes Oct 24 08:55:52 is it sad that one of my main selling points is the ability to return it for swap easily? Oct 24 08:56:15 cause at this point, everyone I know has exchanged at least once Oct 24 08:56:28 not me Oct 24 08:56:31 nor me Oct 24 08:56:33 so, not everyone you know Oct 24 08:56:35 in fact 4 ppl I know have had to exchange at least 4 times (one guy 6 times) Oct 24 08:56:37 point fair Oct 24 08:56:42 ive had 3 Oct 24 08:56:42 :/ Oct 24 08:56:45 s/fair/fail Oct 24 08:56:46 that guy is just way too hard on his pre Oct 24 08:56:58 now correction fail Oct 24 08:57:03 "when i throw it against the wall, it stops working, send me another one" Oct 24 08:57:07 lol Oct 24 08:57:15 that or he really wants that super perfect pre Oct 24 08:57:21 and turns them in for minor problems Oct 24 08:57:27 that anyone else would deal with Oct 24 08:57:36 well, anyone else who isn't a jerk anyways Oct 24 08:57:42 If I want a Pre, it's a 3-year commitment in Canada Oct 24 08:57:50 ouch Oct 24 08:57:54 its only 2 here Oct 24 08:58:06 3-year contracts ftl Oct 24 08:58:09 well, my app has 6 reviews sofar Oct 24 08:58:15 so i know at least that many people ahve bought it Oct 24 08:58:15 Some days my Pre is so wobbly it is unusable right now it is very firm Oct 24 08:58:24 making me a total of $8.36 sofar Oct 24 08:58:24 xD Oct 24 08:58:33 * oil can get a footlong at subway Oct 24 08:58:39 now you can move out of that box! Oct 24 08:58:42 no soda or chips though Oct 24 08:58:43 lol, I wonder how the Pre would handle in my city, winnipeg Oct 24 08:59:09 -40*c in winter, +30*C in summer avg Oct 24 08:59:25 ah, itl be fine Oct 24 08:59:28 lol Oct 24 08:59:33 2 seasons here Oct 24 08:59:40 winter and construction Oct 24 08:59:43 its not like you're going to leave your pre exposed outside for that long Oct 24 08:59:51 Here it is 1000000 F all 4 seasons Oct 24 08:59:53 and im sure you got heating in car/house/work/etc Oct 24 09:00:20 true, but hubs now have heating, thankfully Oct 24 09:00:26 and if it seems like its getting too cold Oct 24 09:00:32 just launch a bunch of apps Oct 24 09:00:35 althought it is nice tonight, I have the windows open about 17 C Oct 24 09:00:37 and warm that sucker up Oct 24 09:00:37 use pre as handwarmer, lol Oct 24 09:00:41 seriously Oct 24 09:00:51 there was some webos-internals wordace going on last night Oct 24 09:00:56 my pre was on fire in my hand Oct 24 09:01:02 lol Oct 24 09:01:06 oh yeah, fire up the web browser and your hands will be heated in milliseconds Oct 24 09:01:14 dude, wordace is a burner Oct 24 09:01:20 and it ate through my battery Oct 24 09:01:24 had to charge er up Oct 24 09:01:29 I gotta ask you americans something Oct 24 09:01:29 everything eats the battery Oct 24 09:01:33 on tv Oct 24 09:01:34 yes canadian? Oct 24 09:01:36 LOL Oct 24 09:01:45 what's the question eh? Oct 24 09:01:49 lol Oct 24 09:02:11 seems like this is going to be a long one... Oct 24 09:02:16 must be Oct 24 09:02:18 that or he forgot what he was going to ask Oct 24 09:02:19 around 2am to 6am, are there many many networks airing Magic Bullet infomercials? or is it just our canadian stations, lol Oct 24 09:02:31 No, we have the shamwow Oct 24 09:02:32 i dont watch tv :/ Oct 24 09:02:36 lol Oct 24 09:02:40 i download all the shows i watch Oct 24 09:02:51 well i have like a 36 inch tube behind me Oct 24 09:02:51 legally of course AHEM Oct 24 09:02:55 but its got no cable Oct 24 09:03:02 and no converter for the digital shit that was switched Oct 24 09:03:05 so its practically useless Oct 24 09:03:20 yes, legal asin, i haven't been sued or anything for it yet Oct 24 09:03:36 seriously, flipping through the channels right now I've seen 5xMagic Bullets and one Magic Express Oct 24 09:03:43 what is a magic bullet? Oct 24 09:03:51 can it shoot around corners or something? Oct 24 09:03:52 Please, enlighten us Oct 24 09:03:54 * oil googles Oct 24 09:04:01 the most poorly acted tv infomercial ever Oct 24 09:04:05 I know what Magic Mouse is Oct 24 09:04:06 its a blender?> Oct 24 09:04:09 a+ marketing right now Oct 24 09:04:10 sooooo entertaining when you're drunk Oct 24 09:04:10 http://www.buythebullet.com/ Oct 24 09:04:19 it's a bender, a chopper, and a grater Oct 24 09:04:21 lol Oct 24 09:04:24 the infomercial is on their website Oct 24 09:04:29 i can just leave that up all night Oct 24 09:04:30 What a crappy name for a blender Oct 24 09:04:35 and feel like im in canada Oct 24 09:04:40 lol Oct 24 09:04:42 if i was going to buy a blender right now Oct 24 09:04:46 i would get the blendtech blender Oct 24 09:04:50 it has to be a blendtech Oct 24 09:04:51 ONLY because the videos are awesome Oct 24 09:04:52 ha! Oct 24 09:04:59 I gotta find a youtube vid to show how bad it is Oct 24 09:05:09 He never blended a Pre Oct 24 09:05:14 seriously, it's like there're new to acting school Oct 24 09:05:27 and everyone's a stereotype, literally Oct 24 09:05:38 the pre is unblendable Oct 24 09:05:39 the canadians say aboot and eh? Oct 24 09:05:40 thats why Oct 24 09:05:59 actually, the most you hear that is when its americans making fun of canadians Oct 24 09:06:06 fat guy who loves nachos, sexy chick who eats health, old lady who harasses things were better in the olden days Oct 24 09:06:10 when i was in canada i only heard a few 'eh's Oct 24 09:06:22 Yeah they don't say eh that much Oct 24 09:06:28 I have canadian family Oct 24 09:06:28 lol, we hid it when we see you americans Oct 24 09:06:33 to mess with ur mind :p Oct 24 09:06:35 lolol Oct 24 09:06:53 the best one is that canada was originally named with just 3 letters Oct 24 09:06:58 c eh? Oct 24 09:07:00 n eh? Oct 24 09:07:02 d eh? Oct 24 09:07:37 i guess its not so good Oct 24 09:08:02 so i added some more features to installer tonight Oct 24 09:08:11 anyone see ballmer on the endgadet show? Oct 24 09:08:13 cause i know as soon as we release it he will grab the new code Oct 24 09:08:23 and change the name, but nothing else Oct 24 09:08:37 then claim to have made changes that i don't see in his repo Oct 24 09:08:37 lol http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtpKjgwi4Sc Oct 24 09:09:52 shits awesome Oct 24 09:09:54 lol, Hazel! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfFqh33GXtM Oct 24 09:10:00 i wish youtube had a repeat feature Oct 24 09:10:19 who is hazel? Oct 24 09:10:29 that guy is totally brittish Oct 24 09:10:30 watch the 2nd link Oct 24 09:10:32 lol Oct 24 09:10:41 or do canadians say banana like that too? Oct 24 09:10:49 seriously epicly bad acting Oct 24 09:11:11 and it airs on MANY networks nightly Oct 24 09:11:17 wow, webosinternals got really off topic pretty fast Oct 24 09:11:23 and I thought our tv was bad Oct 24 09:11:29 lol, i've seen it on on 2 networks right now Oct 24 09:11:41 *see Oct 24 09:11:57 there is the watercooler channel but that has less activity than a star trek convention Oct 24 09:12:13 lol Oct 24 09:12:32 sad thing is, I know ppl who bought the magic bullet Oct 24 09:12:59 seriously Oct 24 09:13:04 i bought a couple snuggies Oct 24 09:13:07 I am starting to want one Oct 24 09:13:18 it's not bad, but not that good, and is pretty loud Oct 24 09:13:24 oil: NO! you didn't!!! Oh god those things are so stupid Oct 24 09:13:27 omg snuggie! Oct 24 09:13:27 LOL Oct 24 09:13:34 the first time i saw it Oct 24 09:13:35 lol Oct 24 09:13:39 was at my sisters house with my parents Oct 24 09:13:52 and we were laughing hysterically at it Oct 24 09:14:01 who needs a blanket with all its folds when you can get a snuggie :p Oct 24 09:14:01 and my mom was like "why are you laughing, it looks cool" Oct 24 09:14:09 and i was like "thats it, im getting you one for christmas" Oct 24 09:14:13 rofl Oct 24 09:14:22 and it was like buy one get one free Oct 24 09:14:26 so i gave the free one to my sister Oct 24 09:14:27 haha Oct 24 09:14:38 lol Oct 24 09:15:39 ok Oct 24 09:15:40 seriously Oct 24 09:15:43 im closing this video now Oct 24 09:16:00 i realized i was actually sitting here watching the infomertial Oct 24 09:16:06 I can't believe you were still watching it Oct 24 09:16:10 lol Oct 24 09:16:15 it was hypnotic Oct 24 09:16:20 I can only imagine Rod facepalming right now Oct 24 09:16:25 how quickly they made breakfast lunch and dinner Oct 24 09:16:26 lol, the bullet? Oct 24 09:16:33 and hte old lady with the cigarette Oct 24 09:16:48 it's so oddyly made it is oddly entising Oct 24 09:17:07 i wonder if i can use the magic bullet while wearing a snuggie Oct 24 09:17:19 lol Oct 24 09:17:21 the snuggie i cleaned with oxyclean Oct 24 09:17:31 and after im done using the magic bullet, id clean up with a shamwow Oct 24 09:17:38 lmao Oct 24 09:18:00 seriously though Oct 24 09:18:04 when i called to order the snuggie Oct 24 09:18:08 Billy Mays here for oxyclean Oct 24 09:18:12 i was on the phone for like an hour Oct 24 09:18:19 they try to sell you EVERYTHING Oct 24 09:18:19 no slapchop? Oct 24 09:18:27 and you have to listen through it to get to the actual ordering Oct 24 09:18:31 and after you say what you want Oct 24 09:18:42 its more "For only $15.00 you can add this to your order" Oct 24 09:18:43 etc Oct 24 09:18:47 "press 1 to hear more" Oct 24 09:18:50 long pause Oct 24 09:18:53 how did we get to discussing infomercials Oct 24 09:18:56 "or 2 to continue" Oct 24 09:19:07 and you're like "finally!" Oct 24 09:19:11 then another ad starts Oct 24 09:19:39 brb Oct 24 09:19:58 sleepy time for me Oct 24 09:20:01 lol Oct 24 09:23:51 seriously Oct 24 09:28:12 lol, a remix from the Magic Bullet Express (the company's second product) infomercial Oct 24 09:28:14 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=emRJ-ywVqTU Oct 24 09:28:38 I like Hazel better than the new old broad they replaced her with Oct 24 09:29:05 * oil resists urge to watch infomercial Oct 24 09:29:10 * oil goes to sleep instead Oct 24 09:29:18 lol Oct 24 09:32:15 Hi, I have weird problem - I have gms palm pre (from germany) with webos 1.2.1 (sprint) version Oct 24 09:36:29 JayCanuck: patches that are compatible with multiple webos versions get their own separate versions in each versions-specific feed - i.e. they are duplicated in each versioned feed with the appropriate version number. Oct 24 09:36:36 see the 1.1.3 feed for examples Oct 24 09:37:24 k, now I like that, but is versioning like 1.2.1-7 necessary? Oct 24 09:37:37 or at the very least, why not 1.2.1-07? Oct 24 09:37:57 cause 1.2.1-7 is the standard for ipkgs Oct 24 09:38:21 1.2.1 is the upstream (webOS or upstream linux package) version, and the bit after the hypen is the packaging version. Oct 24 09:38:57 the 0 in 07 is superfluous. ipkg sorting is not simply alphabetic. Oct 24 09:39:11 I gotta say, you're the first person to actually give me a valid answer, lol Oct 24 09:39:16 much appreciated Oct 24 09:39:57 See http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=applications/preware.git;a=blob;f=version-compare.c for the intricacies of ipkg versioning Oct 24 09:40:22 ([0-9]+:)?([^0-9]*[0-9]*)*([.-]([^0-9]*[0-9]*)*)* is the regexp for an ipkg version number. Oct 24 09:40:41 that from the c ipkg service? Oct 24 09:40:44 yep Oct 24 09:40:49 nice Oct 24 09:40:53 preware supports a subset of that Oct 24 09:41:08 we support N:X.Y.Z-N Oct 24 09:43:21 rwhitby: just who I wanted to see. Jason said you had concerns about editing /etc/fstab to shrink /tmp to 32MB. What problems are you concerned with? Oct 24 09:44:30 VeeDubb65-Steve: the amount of stuff that's already in /tmp, plus I think it's used as a temporary area when installing large ipkgs. I have no proof that it will be a problem, but I wouldn't mess with it without a lot of testing with installing very big ipkgs. Oct 24 09:45:30 well, I guess my initial instinct to not put that patch in the feeds was probably a good one. I didn't put it up initially because I wasn't sure what else in the system might get grumpy about a smaller /tmp Oct 24 09:50:18 VeeDubb65-Steve: changing the size of a tmpfs mount doesn't change memory consumption Oct 24 09:51:22 either /tmp has never more than 32MB used and the change is useless Oct 24 09:52:49 or temporarily more than 32MB are used then the change will introduce errors Oct 24 09:53:43 Well, as I said in the forum thread on it, all I did was turn somebody else's hack into a proper patch. All this is why I havn't submitted it for the feeds yet. I had my doubts about what else it could effect. Oct 24 09:54:09 is it fine if i delete all my packages I get from the app catalog with preware? I did root@castle:/var/usr/palm/applications# ls and it outputted some stuff that has been uninstalled Oct 24 09:56:45 VeeDubb65-Steve: I've seen the thread. the change is in the best case useless and creates problems in all other cases Oct 24 10:07:42 Hi, I have weird problem - I have gsm palm pre (from germany) with webos 1.2.1 (sprint) version. the app catlog and sprint apps not working becuase network errror - but I can access the net with the browser Oct 24 10:09:17 chill: are they just empty directories, or do they have files left in them? Oct 24 10:09:49 chill: it should be fine to delete packages that way, but it is possible that empty directories might be left over. Oct 24 10:10:08 Confusing me! My name is Jason too, and my irssi hilights were popping up :P Oct 24 10:10:46 and yes, I should import a German Pre oil, and will be ;) Oct 24 10:11:03 ateamtip1: I'll tell you whether I get the same in 10 or so days. Oct 24 10:11:39 ateamtip1: are you in Australia? Oct 24 10:12:01 whats good Oct 24 10:12:12 how much euro is the .de pre Oct 24 10:12:19 VeeDubb65-Steve: I concur with janneg. If it was the old-style ram fs, then it could make a difference cause it reserved the chunk from ram, but since it's tmpfs, it should only use the ram as it needs it. Oct 24 10:12:20 w/o contract.. Oct 24 10:12:30 oc80z: eur481 Oct 24 10:12:39 what would it sell in the states? Oct 24 10:12:39 VeeDubb65-Steve: I to agree with that. Oct 24 10:12:49 as much as a storm unlocked? Oct 24 10:13:03 oc80z: eur481 plus shipping Oct 24 10:13:08 Ohh Oct 24 10:13:10 :P Oct 24 10:13:32 or if you go through ebay or something, plus the extra scalping fee ;-) Oct 24 10:13:34 didnt know if they were going to be like $1200 like the storm Oct 24 10:13:37 yeah yea Oct 24 10:13:47 oc80z: mine turned out to be about AUD$800 Oct 24 10:13:50 friends from karlsruhe coming over Oct 24 10:14:06 ill put it on my charge Oct 24 10:14:13 ooh wow oc Oct 24 10:14:17 congrats, btw :) Oct 24 10:14:29 oc80z: they should just be able to buy one for eur481 and then bring it. get them to check it in the shop like stefan kindly did for me. Oct 24 10:15:00 mine should arrive in 10 days or so. Oct 24 10:15:09 cant wait for you to get it Oct 24 10:15:14 same! Oct 24 10:15:28 * rwhitby bbl Oct 24 10:15:30 Rod is my no/no go for launch ;) Oct 24 10:15:46 lingfish: freakout-away should be able to tell you earlier Oct 24 10:15:57 yuh I know.. hopefully next week :) Oct 24 10:16:15 Then I just pray it doesn't break for > 1 year :/ Oct 24 10:19:48 Dinner time. Oct 24 10:20:03 lingfish: freakout-away is my guinea pig ;-) Oct 24 10:20:22 I'll get him to do all the stuff I'm not 100% sure of, before I get my Pre ... Oct 24 10:20:24 I was gonna use that term, but was being polite heh Oct 24 10:20:55 If all goes well, I get one... then lock it away in a solid 6" thick "handy" carry case. Oct 24 10:22:08 * lingfish wil bbl Oct 24 10:27:44 * rwhitby notices that destinal has made his first post on PreCentral ... Oct 24 10:28:25 lingfish: i am from israel Oct 24 10:52:08 * rwhitby bbt Oct 24 13:10:41 how do I access the pre via usb with novacom.exe again? I forgot the arguments I have to use Oct 24 13:11:12 open -t tty:// Oct 24 13:11:53 thy Oct 24 13:35:41 I installed dropbear via preware.. where do I put the authorized_keys file? I put it in ~/.ssh but it won't work :( Oct 24 14:06:10 is there a way to turn off dropbear so it doesn't always run? Oct 24 14:07:21 ah okay via killall dropbear and then when I need it again I can type dropbear.. Oct 24 14:38:56 * freakout-away arrives home incredibly drunk, notices people have been talking about him. Oct 24 14:39:34 * freakout-away is, however, not sober enough to scrollback. nor to understand anything he might discover were he to do so. Oct 24 14:39:37 not I Oct 24 14:40:17 AnOutsider: my sympathies. being this smashed hs its advantages Oct 24 14:41:02 AnOutsider: for instance, explaing to your sisteir tomro w why you didnt crash like you promised but insteazd found tyour way home Oct 24 14:41:15 * freakout-away goes to sleep Oct 24 14:41:33 alhthough perhaps "cma" is more corrected Oct 24 14:42:25 haha im not a drinker. however... if I weeeere a drinker, I wouldnt hop on IRC after :) Oct 24 14:43:08 AnOutsider, oyur sust a pussy Oct 24 14:43:18 indeed Oct 24 14:43:26 * freakout-away away's last sladh-,e message was a lie Oct 24 14:43:31 but this one isnt' Oct 24 14:43:38 * freakout-away goes to sleep for real Oct 24 14:54:11 g'day Oct 24 14:55:09 AnOutsider: heh heh heh, the art of the poor geek wot can't hold his booze getting on IRC/IM/Some form of instant internet communication Oct 24 14:56:12 AnOutsider: pity he didn't say anything truly embarrassing to remind him of in the morning Oct 24 14:58:10 haha Oct 24 14:58:24 it always kills me when people do that on forums. The infamous "drunken thread" Oct 24 15:19:07 AnOutsider: heh :) I'm fortunate, typing is so base in my mind that even when I lose the ability to walk I still type acceptably Oct 24 15:19:14 and hey Templarian Oct 24 15:27:50 heh Oct 24 16:03:30 round and round the preware loading circle goes Oct 24 16:03:38 when it'll stop.... who the eff knows Oct 24 16:07:51 AnOutsider: planning on having a charlie and the preware factory halloween party? :P Oct 24 16:08:11 haha Oct 24 16:08:33 I hate halloween -.- Oct 24 16:08:51 * Marajin hides under the desk, turns all the lights out and types away on his laptop going, "Bah! Humbug!" Oct 24 16:11:41 anyone here? Oct 24 16:12:04 i have a question regarding preware theme feed Oct 24 16:12:47 Going to ask said question? Oct 24 16:13:34 sorry watching football, got distracted... umm i have a theme on precentral (neon-theme) and it is not showing up on preware Oct 24 16:13:58 When did you upload it? (I think it only refreshes on an interval). Oct 24 16:14:13 probably two weeks ago now Oct 24 16:14:15 preware updates every load Oct 24 16:14:17 ;/ Oct 24 16:14:19 on default Oct 24 16:14:34 my other theme is showing up (wvu-theme) just not this one Oct 24 16:14:45 i contacted precentral and they said come here Oct 24 16:14:50 no, he means the feed may not be generated Oct 24 16:15:09 the webos internals team generates ipks from the zips uploaded to preware. This is likely done on a cron and not instantly Oct 24 16:15:54 any idea how i can fix this problem? im getting a lot of demand for it to be available on preware Oct 24 16:16:10 Guest78374: there are a lot of neon themes. Oct 24 16:16:19 im aware of that Oct 24 16:16:27 it's not a "problem". wait for it to be added to the feed if it was only uploaded recently Oct 24 16:16:31 What's the exact name. Oct 24 16:16:39 neon-theme Oct 24 16:16:46 but outsider Oct 24 16:17:06 hes been blowin up recently due to the demand for his theme! Oct 24 16:17:07 D; Oct 24 16:17:35 Maybe you can't use a "-" I don't see any themes with a hyphen. Oct 24 16:17:46 i'm not blowing up just having people ask for it so im trying to make them happy Oct 24 16:18:06 guest Oct 24 16:18:10 u could start ur own feed Oct 24 16:18:14 and have them add it to preware Oct 24 16:18:15 :D Oct 24 16:18:18 ;o Oct 24 16:18:26 Temp: anser's probably no, but any thought to creating plugins for dreamweaver like you did komodo? Oct 24 16:18:56 AnOutsider: dreamweaver sucks, that would only end horribly with 2 users. Oct 24 16:19:06 haha Oct 24 16:19:19 DW's code coloring, formatting and completion > komodo IMO Oct 24 16:19:25 but eh well Oct 24 16:19:35 do u hate eclipse? Oct 24 16:19:38 You can change the colors yourself... I use to have some themes. Oct 24 16:19:47 I don't hate eclipse no Oct 24 16:20:08 There might actually be a dreamweaver theme for colours. Oct 24 16:21:14 eh, it's still not the same. little things like right-clicking and jumping to a function within a field etc Oct 24 16:21:35 I'll just continue as i am now. doing pre-specific functions in komodo, and doing html/css editing in DW Oct 24 16:21:50 I don't even know if Dreamweaver has plugins. Oct 24 16:21:59 im going to change the name of my theme now to remove the '-' in it... Oct 24 16:22:51 hmm, rwhitby: openssh and such should be updated to depend on optware bootstrap no? would make it easier to install it all in one go Oct 24 16:24:01 AnOutsider is there anything else i should do to other then wait to get my theme into the feed? Oct 24 16:24:07 ah I think it's not required if the user did them manually Oct 24 16:24:21 I don't control the feed adam Oct 24 16:24:36 shamless plug, but you could also upload it to prethemer. It'll be in the feeds within 5 mins Oct 24 16:24:52 i thought of doing that Oct 24 16:25:03 Pretheme is pretty quick and adds the icon. Oct 24 16:25:07 has anyone gotten any further with cron? Oct 24 16:25:24 havent seen anything on webos-internals in awhile :( Oct 24 16:26:06 does it have to be formatted any differently for prethemer... right now i just have everything in a zip with the xml file... i dont exactly have it organized cleanly? Oct 24 16:27:03 prethemer accepts zips with theme.xml files included Oct 24 16:27:12 as long as your xml file is properly formatted then you should be fine Oct 24 16:27:53 ok thanks for your help... i started an account last night in case in went that route Oct 24 16:29:38 hey Temp: you know how to get the openssh server to just allow username/pass logins instead of keys? Oct 24 16:29:42 Always hated setting up keys Oct 24 16:32:04 No, not sure never really tried. Oct 24 16:54:06 no biggie, i got it Oct 24 18:06:06 Heyho, come from germany and have a little question, anybody know how i can setting my sms central number manually on pre, the pre cant read it from my card? Oct 24 18:18:52 ageftw: it worked fine with mine? Oct 24 18:18:57 ageftw: <-- UK pre user Oct 24 18:21:07 hm.. Oct 24 18:21:15 it worked fine with all other sim cards i have Oct 24 18:21:20 but not with this one i need :) Oct 24 18:26:16 ageftw: I'm not sure then.. I think WebOS needs to open up a serious amount of configuration settings to the typical user yet. Oct 24 18:33:49 Ok... to start fiddling with stuff to get the patches on my pre or not.. Oct 24 19:08:38 oh wonderbar.. looks like stuff didn't work quite right :P Oct 24 19:27:15 aha! it lives Oct 24 19:36:01 man I hope preware comprehends the 1.1.3 UK model with patches.. Oct 24 19:37:26 doesn't it already? Oct 24 19:37:42 well I dunno cause it's showing me patches that can't possibly be relevant Oct 24 19:37:50 'remove sprinttv icon' ? srsly? Oct 24 19:38:01 do you have hte 1.1.3 feed? Oct 24 19:38:07 there is two feeds Oct 24 19:38:24 idk if rwhitby got around to enabling the right one Oct 24 19:38:28 well I've not explicitly added it Oct 24 19:39:05 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-patches/1.1.3/ Oct 24 19:40:52 echo "src/gz webos-patches-113 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-patches/1.1.3/" > /var/etc/ipkg/webos-patches-113.conf Oct 24 19:41:22 or wait, no trailing slash after 1.1.3 Oct 24 19:42:19 Is someone available for a bit of help? Oct 24 19:42:36 depends on what you need help with Oct 24 19:43:05 I backed up and reset my phone with the doctor, now my photos wont display in the photo roll. Oct 24 19:43:18 1.2.1 Oct 24 19:43:28 well if yo doctored your phone without manually backing up your photos over usb Oct 24 19:43:34 I did Oct 24 19:43:44 and you copied them back? Oct 24 19:43:47 and then placed them back in /media/internal/DCIM/100PALM Oct 24 19:44:08 Photos that Ive taken since will display, but not the old ones Oct 24 19:44:13 hm Oct 24 19:44:15 and the default wallpapers are missing also Oct 24 19:44:18 yeah, i dont know about that one Oct 24 19:44:31 have you tried making a new folder and putting them in there? Oct 24 19:44:32 like Oct 24 19:45:00 any of you guys ever make a webpage scrapper? Oct 24 19:45:43 * oil has, many of times Oct 24 19:45:55 Im copying them back to my desktop and then moving them up a dir into DCIM Oct 24 19:45:58 to see if that helps Oct 24 19:46:54 PuffTheMagic_: its all about regular expressions Oct 24 19:48:15 PuffTheMagic_: so, vacation is over now? time for wircd? Oct 24 19:48:56 oil, could you check which directory your photos are in real quick? Oct 24 19:49:12 I accidentally deleted the folder under DCIM and I dont remember it's name Oct 24 19:49:34 oil: webpage scrapper is a little more complicated than that Oct 24 19:49:54 'scrapper' or 'scraper'? Oct 24 19:50:13 google says it doesnt know what a web page scrapper is Oct 24 19:50:18 a scraper, however Oct 24 19:50:55 if you're talking about a program that reads the html from another website and gets the info you want Oct 24 19:51:22 then it really is, mostly regular expressions Oct 24 19:52:05 yeah to match shit Oct 24 19:52:11 but its more complex Oct 24 19:52:23 i have access to all these electronic journal databases Oct 24 19:52:29 and i want to rape them of their pdf's Oct 24 19:52:31 :D Oct 24 19:52:36 programetically Oct 24 19:52:41 instead of doing this manually Oct 24 19:52:47 lol Oct 24 19:52:59 each journal has like 4 vol's a year and like 30 years of shit Oct 24 19:53:08 i've done 2 years in like an hour Oct 24 19:53:23 and in like another hour you could automate the process Oct 24 19:53:38 except i have no idea where to start Oct 24 19:53:49 with a program that downloads the html Oct 24 19:53:57 assuming there is some sort of login interface? Oct 24 19:54:01 you have to get around that Oct 24 19:54:26 yeah which i dont know how Oct 24 19:54:31 since i log into my schools site Oct 24 19:54:40 and that passes some pw onto the journal site Oct 24 19:54:43 yeah, logging in is a pita Oct 24 19:54:49 you have to do it in your browser Oct 24 19:54:54 and see what your browser is sending Oct 24 19:55:00 weather its a cookie, or a session variable Oct 24 19:55:02 or what Oct 24 19:55:21 yeah see that is gonna take "me" forever Oct 24 19:55:34 yeah, and i dont have access to your schools site Oct 24 19:55:43 ah well, time to work on wircd xD Oct 24 19:55:53 lol Oct 24 19:56:03 * oil takes shower and goes to get lunch Oct 24 19:56:05 brb Oct 24 20:06:53 Hi, jon here, need help with optware, can't seem to log in using SSH....today is my 30th day with the phone and wanted to take it in for replacement, but before I did that wanted to backup some files/directories, containing sms and call logs.....can someone help me with why i cannot connect to ssh? Thanks Oct 24 20:07:25 I already followed instructions on installing optware, all went fine Oct 24 20:08:24 added user, when i added password it didnt want to take it, said weak, someone just told me it still takes it...butwhen i entered phons IP, port 222, and my password, it keeps asking for my password.....anyone? Oct 24 20:18:50 anyone? Oct 24 20:18:53 any help? Oct 24 20:22:11 so I've been curious for quite some time, is the usb port on the Pre capable of being used for other devices (such as a flash drive)? Oct 24 20:23:00 being someone that used linux quite a bit in the past I had to directly access the usb port a lot, I was wondering if someone plugged a flash drive in via an adapter if it'd be accessible from the shell Oct 24 20:23:33 interesting... try it Oct 24 20:26:38 just thought other people might have tried Oct 24 20:27:15 didn't really want to buy an adapter if it's not possible in the first place Oct 24 20:45:25 oil, rwhitby ping Oct 24 20:47:49 aye? Oct 24 20:48:36 I have a patch not showing up Oct 24 20:48:45 ok? Oct 24 20:48:47 It's built, its in the repo Oct 24 20:48:51 its int he packages list Oct 24 20:48:53 but preware doesn't show it Oct 24 20:49:14 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-patches/1.2.1/Packages Oct 24 20:49:17 it's in that page. Oct 24 20:49:21 and in the .gz Oct 24 20:49:30 whats it called? Oct 24 20:49:38 Package: org.webosinternals.patches.screen-lock-move-pin-pad-to-top Oct 24 20:50:54 dbeames@castle:~$ sudo ipkg -o /var list | grep pin-pad Oct 24 20:50:54 org.webosinternals.patches.screen-lock-move-pin-pad-to-top - 1.2.1-7 - Move PIN Pad to Top Oct 24 20:50:58 my first thought Oct 24 20:51:04 its in ipkg -o /var Oct 24 20:51:14 would be Oct 24 20:51:16 "Emergency Call" Oct 24 20:51:18 you don't have 1.2.1 in your conf file Oct 24 20:51:19 you have all Oct 24 20:51:22 needs escaping on its "s Oct 24 20:51:29 cat /var/etc/ipkg/webos-patches.conf Oct 24 20:51:46 i have all Oct 24 20:51:53 shouldn't tha tbe updated? Oct 24 20:51:58 yea and you said it's in /1.2.1/Packages Oct 24 20:51:59 shouldn't the ipkg service update that? Oct 24 20:52:14 ? Oct 24 20:52:29 I don't think the ipkgservice does the webos version checks yet? I don't know Oct 24 20:52:33 nope Oct 24 20:52:33 but I gotta run, be back tomorrow Oct 24 20:52:34 its in all too Oct 24 20:52:36 wait Oct 24 20:52:41 its in all Oct 24 20:52:53 http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-patches/all/org.webosinternals.patches.screen-lock-move-pin-pad-to-top_1.2.1-7_all.ipk Oct 24 20:53:08 ahh.. I see that oil Oct 24 20:53:58 that or just use 's Oct 24 20:54:00 but I have escaping Oct 24 20:54:06 DESCRIPTION = Ever accidentally placed an emergency call while trying to unlock your phone? This patch moves the PIN pad away from the \"Emergency Call\" button. Oct 24 20:54:15 that's the Makefile Oct 24 20:54:28 it wouldn't build properly if it weren't escaped right Oct 24 20:54:31 weird Oct 24 20:54:51 just replace it with &quit; Oct 24 20:54:53 quot* Oct 24 20:55:28 wow Oct 24 20:55:31 I see that Oct 24 20:55:41 the packages.gz has an unescaped quote Oct 24 20:55:58 but its escaped in the Makefile Oct 24 20:55:58 how come sometimes when starting preware it loads in a infinite loop and I have to close the application and reload it to work? is this known? Oct 24 20:56:01 so yeah, if you use " it won't matter Oct 24 20:56:05 as its only viewed where its html Oct 24 20:56:17 i'll just use ' Oct 24 20:56:21 lol Oct 24 21:05:42 well how bout that Oct 24 21:06:12 so it's an issue with the build script not parsing quotes Oct 24 21:06:28 in other words, when the build script makes the packages file, it stripping the escaped quotes out Oct 24 21:06:39 but just stripping the escape Oct 24 21:06:50 rwhitby ---- ^^^ Oct 24 21:06:51 rwhitby ---- ^^^ Oct 24 21:07:10 egaudet: you still gone? Oct 24 21:10:44 man i want my Astra back!!! Oct 24 21:26:00 hi Oct 24 21:29:41 hello Oct 24 21:30:43 hello Oct 24 21:31:48 i fixed some padding in the terminal app for clarity Oct 24 21:32:03 who is in charge of terminal ? Oct 24 21:42:05 does anyone know of a media server package (for streaming internet media) that works with the pre Oct 24 21:49:53 a2ny1: really it's a community project. oil and rwhitby are the main devs. Oct 24 21:50:04 tric: not i. Oct 24 21:54:30 a2ny1: destinal is the lead developer. oil and I have some involvement as well, but destinal, mrvc and Zuchmir2 were the main developers. Oct 24 21:55:18 a2ny1: Please send a patch to the webos-internals mailing list (at google groups) Oct 24 22:00:16 * oil actually has some changes to terminal and is waiting for destinal to appear and give him the go ahead to push them Oct 24 22:00:57 jtorres_: if you install ssh from preware, it requires keys as specified in the description of the package. Oct 24 22:02:58 well it looks like my preware applied patches and apps all work fine so yay Oct 24 22:19:51 dBsooner: so your package is showing up now? Oct 24 22:20:07 Marajin: nice - these are the ones from the 1.1.3 feed? Oct 24 22:20:13 * rwhitby posts http://www.precentral.net/what-causes-those-recurring-webos-updates-and-how-fix-it#comment-36710 Oct 24 22:20:22 oil: yes Oct 24 22:21:02 rwhitby: whatever preware defaults to actually heh :p Oct 24 22:21:05 rwhitby: did you get my info a ittle over an hour ago? Oct 24 22:21:55 btw.. rwhitby Did egaudet tell you about the problem with the "diff creator" tool? Oct 24 22:28:49 dBsooner: Makefiles need quotes to be quoted in strings. Oct 24 22:28:57 Marajin: what version of webOS are you running? Oct 24 22:29:13 huh? Oct 24 22:29:25 dBsooner: there's no problem with the diff creator tool - the problem is users who give the wrong input to the tool and then don't test the output before submitting. Oct 24 22:29:44 rwhitby: so I would have to do: DESCRIPTION = "this is an example of \"what I need\" to do" Oct 24 22:29:45 ? Oct 24 22:29:53 dBsooner: yes Oct 24 22:30:05 because DESCRIPTION = this does \"not\" work Oct 24 22:30:46 who's familiar with dpkg/ Oct 24 22:30:50 * oil waits for dbsooner to make a patch to make the clock app open to the alarms scene by default Oct 24 22:31:02 yeah.. that would be cool oil Oct 24 22:31:17 *yawn* morning :) Oct 24 22:32:24 its seriously one line of code Oct 24 22:32:45 but its not worth it to get the repo all setup and all that just to do it Oct 24 22:33:25 50% of the patches are one line Oct 24 22:33:26 ;) Oct 24 22:33:34 give me the one line and I'll make it real quick Oct 24 22:34:03 oil: you make that help scene for terminal yet? Oct 24 22:34:36 http://i38.tinypic.com/rsc3uc.png Oct 24 22:34:39 is waiting to be pushed Oct 24 22:34:47 destinal has been mia though Oct 24 22:34:50 you kick arse Oct 24 22:35:16 is that a scrolling list? Oct 24 22:35:30 every scene scrolls by default... Oct 24 22:35:41 right, just making sure it has things like pipe, etc. Oct 24 22:35:46 rwhitby: 1.1.3 Oct 24 22:36:03 it does Oct 24 22:36:10 it has everything thats on the list in the wiki Oct 24 22:36:18 wooghoo Oct 24 22:36:19 Marajin: and all the 1.2.1 patches are working for you? or just the ones which are unchanged between 1.1.3 and 1.2.1 / Oct 24 22:36:28 what's that one line for open to alarms? Oct 24 22:37:36 idk Oct 24 22:37:42 i decided to test it, but it didn't work Oct 24 22:37:43 lol Oct 24 22:37:52 So how are you guys staying in touch/coordinating on the coding? Just watching git commits or is there a bugzilla.... ? Oct 24 22:38:07 apps I mean Oct 24 22:38:12 the clock assistant is doing some setup type stuff that hte alarms assistant doesnt Oct 24 22:41:08 wierd Oct 24 22:42:32 so Oct 24 22:42:34 its more then one line Oct 24 22:42:36 lol Oct 24 22:43:39 ill mess with it later Oct 24 22:43:44 right right Oct 24 22:43:47 lingfish: mainly git commits and talking here. there is a developers mailing list too Oct 24 22:43:54 What I want is for email to notify on subfolder Oct 24 22:43:56 lingfish: no bug tracking set up yet Oct 24 22:44:27 k Oct 24 22:44:37 and im right in the middle of giving preware a first-launch scene Oct 24 22:45:21 rwhitby: that installer guy claimed to have added that 4 type selection scene Oct 24 22:45:22 Why? Installer is just going to steal it. ;) Oct 24 22:45:26 i found no such thing in it Oct 24 22:45:38 at least, not in the code he uploaded Oct 24 22:45:56 dBsooner: just because he is going to rebrand all my code Oct 24 22:46:03 doesn't mean i don't want to make changes to preware anymore Oct 24 22:46:18 lol Oct 24 22:46:27 The joys of GPL Oct 24 22:46:47 dBsooner: reusing GPL code is not stealing it. Oct 24 22:46:51 anyone here ever ran web os doctor...how long does it take? Oct 24 22:46:54 its not even forking it in the way i would think of a fork Oct 24 22:47:01 its not like he is actually doing anything to it Oct 24 22:47:10 all ive seen is changing some text Oct 24 22:47:13 and an icon Oct 24 22:47:29 I know. Oct 24 22:47:37 rwhitby: ^ Oct 24 22:47:39 I was kidding. Oct 24 22:47:46 he claimed to have added some menu Oct 24 22:47:47 http://forums.precentral.net/1994523-post114.html Oct 24 22:47:54 but i looked in the code and saw nothing Oct 24 22:48:09 so why don't you post asking where the menu is in the code? Oct 24 22:48:23 cause im refraining from posting in his thread Oct 24 22:48:41 oil: I'll post that question if you like? Oct 24 22:48:46 and others are more then happy to point out things i bring up Oct 24 22:48:47 see Oct 24 22:48:49 lol Oct 24 22:49:10 you can if you want rwhitby Oct 24 22:49:36 and reading his post, its definitely saying its already there Oct 24 22:49:41 that the new version has it Oct 24 22:50:05 anyone? Oct 24 22:50:22 ive never ran it, i dont know how long it takes Oct 24 22:50:37 rwhitby could probably give you an estimate, i think he's probably ran the doctor more then anyone else Oct 24 22:51:09 Im doing it right now before i take the phone back, but it's been a while and no sign of movement Oct 24 22:53:13 jtorres_: haven't timed it, but somewhere between 10 and 30 minutes? Oct 24 22:53:31 oh i been well over 30 minutes, let me ask you this Oct 24 22:53:42 jtorres_: the recovery page on our wiki says the percentages at which it does things. Oct 24 22:53:46 oil: posted Oct 24 22:53:54 yeah, i saw Oct 24 22:54:14 i launch it, it asks what language. then asks to accept agreement, then goes thru this thing that says checking system....right? Oct 24 22:54:29 yeh it'll sit there awhile sometimes Oct 24 22:54:39 then from there it says plug in phone to usb and do not use it Oct 24 22:54:49 yes. Oct 24 22:55:00 however the phone was obviously plugged in during the previous step when it was checking system Oct 24 22:55:17 if you see the progress bar at least start you're on your way Oct 24 22:55:22 but in any case i unplug, plug back in and leave it, but the NEXt button is still not lit up Oct 24 22:55:52 where is the progress bar, never saw one, and i've restarted it twice now wasting a whole hour Oct 24 22:56:08 I seem to have to put mine in that odd usb mode, with the huge usb symbol to get mine to be detected. But I'm in Linux. Oct 24 22:56:53 well i've wasted an hour trying it ut twice, but i dont see any progress bar Oct 24 22:57:44 this is what works for me: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/How_To_Recover Oct 24 22:58:11 but look specifically at this part: "If your PC does not recognize your Pre and you cannot go past step 3 above" Oct 24 22:58:35 those are the steps I have to do before webosdoctor "sees" my phone. Oct 24 22:59:14 gonna try it out see if it works Oct 24 23:00:10 i'll be dang, now we're cooking with gas Oct 24 23:00:17 man i just burned a whole hour Oct 24 23:00:20 nice! Oct 24 23:00:31 well about the cooking with gas part ;-) Oct 24 23:00:45 i would have been back home with my new pre updating and re installing Oct 24 23:01:23 lol Oct 24 23:01:23 like anyone ever spends less then an hour at a sprint store Oct 24 23:01:25 last time i was in there the line was almost out hte door Oct 24 23:01:39 and it was taking so long, the store closed Oct 24 23:01:45 so they locked the door so more people couldnt go in Oct 24 23:01:47 ok other thing I found is in my area - the welcome screen seems to take a minute to find the data service in my area the first time, watch for the evdo icon to come up if you have problems with the palm profile part. Oct 24 23:01:53 im actually going to radio shack, thats where i got mine....im just returning it bcus i dropped it a couople times and got some scratches Oct 24 23:02:03 oh, radio shack is always empty Oct 24 23:02:03 lol Oct 24 23:02:23 mmm radioshack Oct 24 23:02:23 i hate radio shack they outright lied to me about when they were getting the pre Oct 24 23:02:26 ive never seen more then 4 people in a radioshack Oct 24 23:02:29 including employees Oct 24 23:02:39 oil: There are a few shops in the world like that Oct 24 23:02:46 oil: I've seen PC Worlds like that too Oct 24 23:02:48 lol Oct 24 23:02:53 i only got it there bcus you dont have to wait for the $100 rebate Oct 24 23:03:08 luckily I'd been driving my sorint store nuts about this phone so the lady saw me and let me in the store just as they were closing on the VIP night Oct 24 23:03:10 our shack and bestbuys here aren't sprint stores also Oct 24 23:03:13 so my only choice was the sprint store Oct 24 23:03:16 *sprint Oct 24 23:03:16 and i can take it back for exchange during 1st 30 days no questions asked Oct 24 23:03:20 but amazingly i got an instant rebate instead of mail-in Oct 24 23:03:21 yep Oct 24 23:03:23 from the sprint store Oct 24 23:03:26 nice Oct 24 23:03:29 oil: I used to live in scotland right, and I lived in a place called Scone which is right outside a town called Perth, now perth has a population of like 10k at the max.. and they built a huge PC World store there Oct 24 23:03:33 wtf for? Oct 24 23:03:37 srsly there was nobody in there Oct 24 23:03:41 lol Oct 24 23:03:43 you kinda got the whole store to yourself Oct 24 23:03:48 and they kept doing insane deals Oct 24 23:03:54 awesome Oct 24 23:04:13 remember the thingy.. what was it called.. palm os based gaming rig, had two sd card slots.. Oct 24 23:04:14 has anyone succesfully ever backed up and restored sms Oct 24 23:04:15 jeez, there is over 500 themes in preware? Oct 24 23:04:20 jtorres_: easiest way to put the Pre in recovery mode is to type "tellbootie recover" in the Terminal Oct 24 23:04:23 yeah 506 or something Oct 24 23:04:28 crazy Oct 24 23:04:31 Morning Oct 24 23:04:41 oil: tapwave zodiac! remember that? Oct 24 23:04:49 no Oct 24 23:04:51 oil: they did BOGOF on zodiacs :P Oct 24 23:04:52 thanks rwhitby Oct 24 23:05:18 rwhitby, thanks Oct 24 23:05:37 hopefully i can restore the file containing all my texts/call logs on the new pre Oct 24 23:05:44 oil http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tapwave_Zodiac <-- 2 of those for like.. 140 bucks they were selling Oct 24 23:05:45 I try to keep notes of stuff I learn here Oct 24 23:05:52 the 128mb model Oct 24 23:06:12 i found this http://forums.precentral.net/palm-pre/187145-how-back-up-text-messages-when-exchanging-phones.html Oct 24 23:06:13 seems like its a hit or miss Oct 24 23:08:44 anyone had to do that before? Oct 24 23:09:14 jtorres_: unfortunately, I can't get text messages on my Pre yet, so dunno. Oct 24 23:09:36 no text? Oct 24 23:09:58 no CDMA in Australia, and GSM Pre shipping from Germany is 10 days away Oct 24 23:10:10 oh Oct 24 23:10:34 well i hope this works Oct 24 23:10:41 Austrailia = home of developers Oct 24 23:10:54 damn I spelled it wrong lol Oct 24 23:12:39 Abyssul: where's the new screenshot? Oct 24 23:12:49 What SS? Oct 24 23:12:55 when does the keyboard backlight turn on on the pre Oct 24 23:12:59 its never on on my pre Oct 24 23:13:19 rwhitby: do you dislike the precentral fork of preware? Oct 24 23:13:37 kesne: there is no precentral fork of preware Oct 24 23:13:38 ahh i need brightness unlinked Oct 24 23:13:49 Abyssul: the SS of your patch without the theme Oct 24 23:13:59 rwhitby: precentral as in the one there, installer i believe its called Oct 24 23:14:03 And with the actual lock screen in the display. ;) Oct 24 23:14:55 rwhitby: no I don't see it, mind filling me in? Oct 24 23:15:39 kesne: there is an independent developer who has changed some strings and preference defaults in Preware (as they are fully enabled to do under the GPL) and have released it as "Installer". It has no functional differences from Preware (although it is based on an old version, so has some missing new features). Oct 24 23:16:14 rwhitby: your opinion on it? Oct 24 23:16:32 kesne: I believe he (or she, I'm not sure from the facebook page) has pulled it voluntarily from the app gallery Oct 24 23:17:09 kesne: well, the functionality of the program is suberb, because it's Preware ;-) Oct 24 23:17:13 rwhitby: I mean with forks in general Oct 24 23:17:28 kesne: have you read the PreCentral thread on it? Oct 24 23:18:28 forks are an important part of open source, but are never usually taken lightly. this one seems to have been taken lightly. Oct 24 23:18:41 rwhitby: alright Oct 24 23:18:53 I was thinking of a fork that does dashboard installs xD Oct 24 23:18:56 Just kidding Oct 24 23:19:32 kesne: such a fork would be fine. but an approach more fitting with open source development would be to contribute a patch. Oct 24 23:20:02 rwhitby: yeah Oct 24 23:20:10 rwhitby: though I'm too lazy Oct 24 23:20:11 * oil waits for kesne patch Oct 24 23:20:25 oil: hehe, not happening Oct 24 23:20:31 * oil continues waiting Oct 24 23:20:38 * kesne slaps oil Oct 24 23:21:20 heh Oct 24 23:21:38 don't slap oil, you'll get grease stains on your clothes Oct 24 23:21:55 * kesne frantically goes to wash his hands Oct 24 23:23:01 you'll never get it out Oct 24 23:23:23 http://media.2news.tv/images/071109_oil_bird.jpg Oct 24 23:23:29 Installer is still in the internal listing Oct 24 23:23:47 It's waiting for a mod to allow the update Oct 24 23:23:56 yeah Oct 24 23:24:26 oil: made millions from blocked yet? Oct 24 23:24:32 idk Oct 24 23:24:38 i think there is 6 reviews? Oct 24 23:24:44 so, a total of like $8 Oct 24 23:24:53 ill go get me a footlong fro subway on them Oct 24 23:25:17 oil: this is why a free version helps Oct 24 23:25:26 does it? Oct 24 23:25:28 you can use download/review ratios to estimate Oct 24 23:25:29 kesne: considering the mod got woken up by his staff way too early in the morning yesterday to deal with the Installer thread, I doubt they will be hurrying that approval ... Oct 24 23:25:35 its been free forever in homebrew Oct 24 23:25:36 still is Oct 24 23:26:01 oil: yes, but you can't use the ratio Oct 24 23:26:08 rwhitby: really? Oct 24 23:26:13 kesne: really. Oct 24 23:26:44 rwhitby: you know this how? Oct 24 23:27:14 kesne: cause he pinged me immediately after he was woken up (luckily, that's a nice convenient time in my timezone) Oct 24 23:27:38 oil: buy us all subways if you make 1000 dollars! Oct 24 23:27:40 note that I had nothing to do with him being woken up ;-) Oct 24 23:27:41 who is this mod? Oct 24 23:27:48 kesne: dieter Oct 24 23:27:55 rwhitby: Oh, okay Oct 24 23:28:21 oil: I'll take a footlong chicken tikka on cheese 'n herb everything but tomatos, chili sauce, extra cheese Oct 24 23:28:47 hey, i only have enough for one Oct 24 23:28:48 * rwhitby bbl Oct 24 23:28:49 no chips Oct 24 23:28:51 no soda Oct 24 23:29:08 why would you want chips with a subway? Oct 24 23:29:16 oh you mean crisps don't you, merkin and all Oct 24 23:29:37 it doesn't help that the same day my app went up, another app with the same function also went up Oct 24 23:29:48 granted, it has 100 less puzzles, and costs a dollar more Oct 24 23:30:05 but it was still kind of disappointing Oct 24 23:30:15 if the apple app store proved anything it's that if you want to make money then do an accelerometer based fart or beer app Oct 24 23:30:33 oil: how many reviews does his have? Oct 24 23:31:15 6? Oct 24 23:31:56 are there like 12 people who buy apps for the pre right now or what? :P Oct 24 23:32:13 im still waiting for one that points out being more expensive with less puzzles Oct 24 23:32:15 its yet to happen Oct 24 23:32:54 had anyone taken a look at that brightness unlinked program? Oct 24 23:33:00 I'd do it but I haven't got a purchaseable app enabled app catalog yet :p Oct 24 23:33:09 PuffTheMagic_: what about it? Oct 24 23:33:42 well i just hate how it only works if the app is running Oct 24 23:33:55 and instead of being headless it has to keep an icon in the dashboard Oct 24 23:33:59 i hate shit in the dashboard Oct 24 23:34:03 heh Oct 24 23:34:03 PuffTheMagic_ i think its because the crap resets Oct 24 23:34:04 i dont want to waste 24px Oct 24 23:34:07 so the app sites tehre resetting it Oct 24 23:34:38 oil: so i guess im gonna have to make a override service that blocks it like i block ip_forward Oct 24 23:36:23 we need to port this app: http://science.slashdot.org/story/09/10/24/1446252/NASA-Releases-Cool-Free-iPhone-App?from=rss Oct 24 23:36:37 hopefully after there is a somewhat working wircd xD Oct 24 23:39:03 POLL: Oct 24 23:39:24 "Move PIN pad to TOP of Lock-Screen" would that be a "Phone" or "Screen Lock" patch? Oct 24 23:43:09 uh, screen lock? Oct 24 23:43:15 considering its to move something on the lock screen? Oct 24 23:46:31 My Pre locks up when downloading apps for the app catalog, does anyone know what is causing this Oct 24 23:46:51 from* Oct 24 23:47:05 install fair dinkum Oct 24 23:49:53 is it because I don't have enough space for apps? I don't think I hit the 64 MB limit. Oct 24 23:50:00 oil: im gonna be starting on wircd i promise but while i was at the HFES conference i got hooked into presenting my theses at this little conference in Toronto in 2 weeks so im gonna be a little busy getting ready for that too Oct 24 23:50:28 chill_: its because of how palm does things Oct 24 23:50:31 and fair dinkum fixes it Oct 24 23:50:51 ok Oct 24 23:51:04 that or you could remove the package manager service that preware uses Oct 24 23:52:07 oil: I agree Oct 24 23:52:30 oil: but the dev that submitted it is arguing with me that it should be a "phone" patch because he "modified a phone app file" Oct 24 23:53:09 only because hte pin pad is from the phone, right? Oct 24 23:53:43 oil yes Oct 24 23:53:50 But its a lock screen.. it's staying where I have it. Oct 24 23:53:50 :D Oct 24 23:54:56 He's wrong lol Oct 24 23:55:07 That's what I thought too. Oct 25 00:00:55 odd.. my phone just rebooted for no apparent reason Oct 25 00:02:08 (mission accomplished) Oct 25 00:04:11 lol Oct 25 00:05:05 is fair dinkum not on preware anymore Oct 25 00:06:15 nvm... mvapp Oct 25 00:08:43 chill_: no those are diff Oct 25 00:08:49 FairDinkum is the wrapper program Oct 25 00:08:56 mvapp moves apps to /media/internal/ Oct 25 00:09:02 and they are both in PreWare Oct 25 00:09:11 mvapp you have to list all avail Oct 25 00:11:24 I can't find FairDinkum (at least when doing a search) Oct 25 00:11:54 FairDinkum is there too Oct 25 00:11:59 space it out Oct 25 00:12:03 Fair Dinkum Oct 25 00:13:31 ahh i had it to not show all package types Oct 25 00:15:26 What's the patch that allows 4 apps per row in launcher Oct 25 00:57:04 can apps view log info ? Oct 25 01:14:40 me phone is out of space Oct 25 01:14:42 what do i do Oct 25 01:15:10 delete something ? Oct 25 01:15:36 already tried that Oct 25 01:16:09 i'm out of ideas Oct 25 01:16:31 lol Oct 25 01:19:20 doctor a larger var partition Oct 25 01:21:06 solder in a 16GB flash chip! Oct 25 01:22:18 evening Oct 25 01:25:43 Does anyone know how to copy a directory from your computer to the pre (for example: /usr/palm/applications/com.palm.app.pdfviewer) Oct 25 01:31:50 rwhitby: oil: so.... im not "against" the new warning message in preware necessarily Oct 25 01:31:54 but i think its ugly Oct 25 01:32:09 text needs to be centered or something Oct 25 01:32:21 and/or surrounded by a box Oct 25 01:32:38 of some of some sort Oct 25 01:32:45 yeah Oct 25 01:32:48 i also thought it was ugly Oct 25 01:33:01 i made it so it will only appear when due time has passed Oct 25 01:33:21 so it will only be seen if its already taken too long Oct 25 01:33:44 greg_roll: where you been Oct 25 01:33:54 get your libpurple code changes in git Oct 25 01:34:02 make sure your first commit is plain libpurple though Oct 25 01:34:22 so that we can see the changes that are on top of the original Oct 25 01:34:50 PuffTheMagic: hey Oct 25 01:34:53 sorry been sick Oct 25 01:35:02 I plan to upload in the next few days Oct 25 01:35:07 just finishing off Oct 25 01:35:10 whats the wait Oct 25 01:35:14 lol Oct 25 01:35:15 so I guess someone updated the multi mod patch, and now I'm getting all sorts of reports on brokeness, I hope they're also emailing the other guy Oct 25 01:35:15 it can be a work in progress Oct 25 01:35:28 greg_roll: just make a tag when you have a "good" version Oct 25 01:35:33 thats the whole point of git Oct 25 01:35:37 commit often Oct 25 01:35:39 little changes Oct 25 01:35:41 apparently patch maintainers is a little broken in preware Oct 25 01:35:48 yeah true! Oct 25 01:36:04 well your good at compiling yeah? Oct 25 01:36:16 greg_roll: yeah sure Oct 25 01:36:40 greg_roll: seriously though, the mailing list has lots of people interested in libpurple shit we need to get it on the git repo so other people can contrib and not waste effort Oct 25 01:37:07 everything cross compiles nicely for me except pidgin-sipe plugin. It compiles nicely on i686 but not csxxx Oct 25 01:37:09 I get Oct 25 01:37:12 make[2]: *** [libsipe_la-sipmsg.lo] Error 1 Oct 25 01:37:12 make[2]: Leaving directory `/root/optware/cs08q1armel/builds/pidgin-sipe-1.6.3/src' Oct 25 01:37:12 make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1 Oct 25 01:37:12 make[1]: Leaving directory `/root/optware/cs08q1armel/builds/pidgin-sipe-1.6.3' Oct 25 01:37:12 make: *** [/root/optware/cs08q1armel/builds/pidgin-sipe-1.6.3/.built] Error 2 Oct 25 01:37:18 ill setup git now :) Oct 25 01:37:33 greg_roll: i will definitely help with building Oct 25 01:37:44 greg_roll: i dont like the cs08g1armel toolchain Oct 25 01:37:53 the use of rpath and what not make shit a pain in the ass Oct 25 01:38:10 and u didnt really post the error Oct 25 01:38:18 so i cant really tell what the problem was Oct 25 01:38:43 extract the libpurple plugin code into a git repo, commit it Oct 25 01:38:49 then copy your code over it Oct 25 01:38:50 commit it Oct 25 01:38:52 then push Oct 25 01:38:58 and i can try and build it Oct 25 01:39:09 with my gentoo toolchain Oct 25 01:39:41 oil: im sure im gonna butcher this description Oct 25 01:39:46 believe it or not thats all the errors I get lol Oct 25 01:39:57 greg_roll: yes i dont believe it Oct 25 01:40:01 thats the errors from make Oct 25 01:40:04 what description? Oct 25 01:40:33 not the errors from gcc Oct 25 01:40:46 oil: you know how with various graphics toolkits you can make boxs/borders around content Oct 25 01:40:50 and sometimes Oct 25 01:40:57 the box is just like an etched line Oct 25 01:41:04 right Oct 25 01:41:19 other times it makes the content looked convex "poped out" Oct 25 01:41:29 and other times its looks concave "recessed" Oct 25 01:41:39 i get what you're saying Oct 25 01:42:05 well i think if you put that warning in a recessed box it would look better Oct 25 01:42:08 like the feeds button has in the palm-default theme Oct 25 01:42:21 has the etched-type line Oct 25 01:42:45 i agree more could be done to the messages to make them prettier Oct 25 01:42:56 but as it is right now, it will only be seen when its already taken too long Oct 25 01:43:00 well Oct 25 01:43:13 right now, as in, whats been comitted, not whats been released Oct 25 01:43:17 oil: its not some much "prettier" as 1st and 2nd order importance Oct 25 01:43:54 stuff that looks closer will have a higher importance value attributed to it Oct 25 01:44:03 which is the primary info we want to convey Oct 25 01:44:07 like that shit is updating Oct 25 01:44:16 the secondary info is the warning Oct 25 01:44:16 ... Oct 25 01:44:22 "this make take a while" Oct 25 01:45:19 im not disagreeing with you Oct 25 01:45:21 im simply saying Oct 25 01:45:31 nobody is going to see those messages right now unless there is actually a problem Oct 25 01:46:10 well how are you quantifying a "problem"? Oct 25 01:46:41 is there such thing as a javascript compiler that will make it run as fast as C code? Oct 25 01:46:50 if it takes longer then 2 seconds to check for internet or check the package version Oct 25 01:46:55 it shows the message Oct 25 01:47:05 if it takes longer then 2 minutes to download feed updates Oct 25 01:47:07 it shows the message Oct 25 01:47:24 Damn its not liking my public key :( Oct 25 01:47:44 greg_roll: pm your pub key and i can make sure its correct or update it Oct 25 01:48:15 oil: i have a quote for you "I love the smell of my pee after eating asparagus" Oct 25 01:48:26 ohh Oct 25 01:50:02 :D Oct 25 01:52:30 so right now, the big problem with themes Oct 25 01:52:33 is that there is two of each Oct 25 01:52:41 i didnt notice Oct 25 01:52:42 cause people upload their theme to both places Oct 25 01:52:52 i have have them disabled Oct 25 01:52:58 and its not out problem Oct 25 01:53:08 tell them to remove their theme from duplicate sites Oct 25 01:53:19 lol Oct 25 01:53:47 oil: really, there is no way we can fix this in preware Oct 25 01:53:51 unless Oct 25 01:53:54 right Oct 25 01:53:58 im not suggesting a change to preware Oct 25 01:53:59 lol Oct 25 01:54:04 we create an option for preference hierarchy Oct 25 01:54:08 im suggesting they change some crap Oct 25 01:54:08 so basically Oct 25 01:54:12 so they have hte same package id Oct 25 01:54:14 when its the same thing Oct 25 01:54:20 oil: you know the arch.conf file Oct 25 01:54:28 that has the weights for each arch Oct 25 01:54:35 all, armv7 etc. Oct 25 01:54:55 we could add support for something like that Oct 25 01:54:57 ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh Oct 25 01:54:57 wait Oct 25 01:55:04 this is probably because you are not using ipkg Oct 25 01:55:20 this is prob cause you are parsing the feed files directly Oct 25 01:55:21 ;) Oct 25 01:56:03 i think its because one is com.prethemer.themes.(somehash) and the other is net.precentral.themes.(nameoftheme) Oct 25 01:56:18 if they were the same, preware would combine them on its own Oct 25 02:01:54 oil: yes that is 1/2 of the issue Oct 25 02:02:05 oil: how does it determine what feed is used though Oct 25 02:02:27 if there are 2 pacakges with the same id in 2 different feeds with same package version but different md5 sums Oct 25 02:02:30 what happens then? Oct 25 02:03:44 idk Oct 25 02:03:46 obviously there are not the exact same package Oct 25 02:03:49 i just tell it to install the package Oct 25 02:03:55 i dont know what ipkg does Oct 25 02:04:04 you should abort Oct 25 02:04:11 and not install anything Oct 25 02:04:16 and tell the user to contact the dev Oct 25 02:04:19 and resolve the issue Oct 25 02:04:31 ^^ thats how i would handle it Oct 25 02:05:15 lol Oct 25 02:11:23 oil: im serious, its not our issue, and there isnt anything we can do, this is a stupid dev issue, we should be frank and tell the user exactly that Oct 25 02:11:57 i just felt it was dirty to have 2 of every theme in there Oct 25 02:12:07 it is Oct 25 02:12:09 as far as the same package in two feeds Oct 25 02:12:15 i think ipkg automatically installs the newest one Oct 25 02:12:15 so we could remove a default theme feed Oct 25 02:12:18 the one with the highest version Oct 25 02:12:22 which is what preware narrows down to Oct 25 02:12:32 right,,, but Oct 25 02:12:44 you said 1) packages have different id's with the same title Oct 25 02:12:52 right, thats the themes Oct 25 02:12:57 i dont think any others are like that Oct 25 02:13:10 i use id as the unique value among packages Oct 25 02:13:24 there is some that are in two feeds with the same id Oct 25 02:13:27 like internalz Oct 25 02:13:28 and there is still the case that we could have multiple duplicate package ids with equal version but different md5 sums Oct 25 02:13:34 is in the canuck feed and the preware feed Oct 25 02:13:47 i dont think im ever given md5sums Oct 25 02:14:03 i mean, canuck feed and precentral feed* Oct 25 02:14:06 i should be part of the feed info you get w/ ipkg info Oct 25 02:14:16 well then we should remove canuck feed Oct 25 02:14:16 ive never seen it Oct 25 02:14:21 till he fixes it Oct 25 02:14:23 lol Oct 25 02:14:28 either remove shit from precentral Oct 25 02:14:35 or remove it from canuck feed Oct 25 02:14:50 its not really an issue though Oct 25 02:14:52 its been going fine sofar Oct 25 02:14:53 HIS problem is becoming our problem Oct 25 02:15:21 the only problem i brought up was the duplicate themes Oct 25 02:15:56 and i really think if we remove one, it should be the precentral feed Oct 25 02:16:01 none of their packages have icons Oct 25 02:16:59 there is no problem with two packages with the same id in two feeds. either they have different versions, or one or the other gets installed. no problem. Oct 25 02:17:14 rwhitby: you missed part of my statement Oct 25 02:17:19 PuffTheMagic_: I read it all Oct 25 02:17:26 i said same id, same version, DIFFERENT md5 sume Oct 25 02:17:27 sum Oct 25 02:17:35 doesn't matter - one will be installed. Oct 25 02:17:42 no shit Oct 25 02:17:50 if you don't want that one, disable that feed Oct 25 02:17:52 but that is not a great scenario Oct 25 02:18:12 how is a user supposed to know which one is correct, more correct, really the latest, etc Oct 25 02:18:16 it's a perfectly fine scenario Oct 25 02:18:21 which one is ipkg gonna pick? Oct 25 02:18:37 i am for once thinking about aunt minnie Oct 25 02:18:43 the user get's the latest version. if the author has the latest version in two feeds with different md5sums, then it's the author's problem, not ours. Oct 25 02:18:43 and rwhitby is taking my normal position Oct 25 02:18:44 lol Oct 25 02:19:09 evening everyone (except Rod) Oct 25 02:19:10 * freakout-away dies of shock Oct 25 02:19:19 no, aunt minnie gets one package, and it works, and she doesn't care. if she has a problem, she contacts the maintainer (which is the same in both packages) Oct 25 02:19:44 aunt minnie certainly doesn't know what an md5sum is, and doesn't care Oct 25 02:20:04 rwhitby: i think preware should "try" and identify this 1/2 assed developer issues Oct 25 02:20:09 I'm getting contacted a lot about a broken patch that someone else updated yesterday... Oct 25 02:20:33 mdklein: yes, Preware only shows the first maintainer listed at the moment. we're going to fix that. Oct 25 02:20:48 is there a way users can choose an older version of a patch/package on preware? Oct 25 02:20:50 mdklein: you can identify who did the update from the git logs Oct 25 02:21:01 mdklein: no Oct 25 02:21:13 rick_home: so idk if you got my message the other day, my battery pack thing charges at 500ma, do you have any idea how it determines what rate to charge at and is there any reason i couldnt charge at 1000ma Oct 25 02:22:05 PuffTheMagic_: there was discussion on that some time ago on this channel. something about shorting the data lines I think Oct 25 02:22:14 the rate is determined by two factors, the internal resistance of your batteries, and the difference between the voltage supplied by your batteries and the voltage EXPECTED by the palm. Oct 25 02:22:20 there is a new usb spec for sensing 1A support. Oct 25 02:22:37 The palm is expecting 5 volts Oct 25 02:22:37 you handed it uh, 4.8 right? Oct 25 02:22:57 yes Oct 25 02:22:59 so, you got less current because of the lower voltage, and whatever the internal resistance of the batteries were. Oct 25 02:23:11 rick_home: thanks Oct 25 02:23:24 additionally, in order to get "high current charging" your cable has to short two pins that the pre uses to KNOW that high current is available Oct 25 02:23:43 palm's cables have that. Others do not Oct 25 02:23:43 rwhitby: on a side note, can you make sure patches/messaging-plugins.git is deleted off the git repo and make sure services/libpurple-adapter is visible on gitweb Oct 25 02:23:43 see rwhitby 's comment a moment ago Oct 25 02:24:31 rick_home: so if i tie the data pins to ground it "might" set the charging rate to 1000ma? Oct 25 02:24:58 might Oct 25 02:25:02 I'm trying to find the spec Oct 25 02:25:22 the usb2 spec says that a usb hub _has- to provide 100 ma which is "one unit load" for usb Oct 25 02:25:42 and that it -can- supply up to 5 unit loads, or 500 ma at 5V +/- 0.25 Oct 25 02:25:52 so at 4.8 you're inside spec on voltage Oct 25 02:26:01 and at 500 ma, you are exactly on spec for current. Oct 25 02:26:09 so, it HAS to be the sensing pins. Oct 25 02:26:25 PuffTheMagic_: I see no libpurple-adapter in gitosis.conf Oct 25 02:26:33 pull then Oct 25 02:26:37 oops Oct 25 02:26:37 PuffTheMagic_: I just did Oct 25 02:26:39 i didnt push ;_) Oct 25 02:26:49 pull again Oct 25 02:26:54 k Oct 25 02:26:57 thanks Oct 25 02:27:49 rwhitby: i knew what you were getting at with the "patches" idea but the stuff greg_roll is working on is really a service and i think "patches" should only refer to the mojo app junk Oct 25 02:28:10 rwhitby: im trying to get him to give me a snapshot of his work so i can see the repo Oct 25 02:28:24 You talking about his messenger plugins? Oct 25 02:28:28 cause im not sure how to explain how to create a new branch with git Oct 25 02:28:32 VeeDubb65-Steve: yeah Oct 25 02:28:39 PuffTheMagic_: fair enough. Will it need to be removed the installed on an update (like Type:Patch) or can it update without being removed first (like Type: Service)? Oct 25 02:28:53 excellent. He's done some amazing work, but I'd love to see a little more polish on it, and see it in Preware. Oct 25 02:29:10 rwhitby: i didnt really follow that question Oct 25 02:29:36 The messaging plugins update without removing firts. Oct 25 02:29:47 PuffTheMagic_: at the moment, Patches are removed then installed on update. Services are simply re-installed over the top on update. Which will this need? I assumed the former. Oct 25 02:30:09 rwhitby: the latter actually Oct 25 02:30:22 PuffTheMagic_: so it doesn't actually patch any files? Oct 25 02:30:26 rwhitby: he is working on binaries/libaries Oct 25 02:30:28 rwhitby: right Oct 25 02:30:32 ok, cool. Oct 25 02:30:43 he is modifying the libpurple-adapter source code Oct 25 02:30:46 rwhitby: Puff is correct. I did a whole lot of very detailed testing for him. updating works by installing right over the older version Oct 25 02:31:02 rwhitby: so we would install a new binary preferrably Oct 25 02:31:07 rwhitby: or us a binary diff Oct 25 02:31:09 which im against Oct 25 02:31:16 PuffTheMagic_: to clue the pre that it can pull more than 500 ma, SHORT the two data cables, do not take them to ground, take them to EACH OTHER. Oct 25 02:31:18 PuffTheMagic_: did you intend to leave libpurple out of the writeable list for group developers? Oct 25 02:31:18 if it is a plugin i would imagine that is how it works Oct 25 02:31:48 ummmm no Oct 25 02:31:59 i thought the way you had it everyhing was default writable by everything Oct 25 02:31:59 thought overwriting the old libpurple with new libpurple could add interesting issues Oct 25 02:32:21 tharris-: especially on webOS update, cause we tell people that Patches have to be removed but Services don't Oct 25 02:32:22 rwhitby: i just renamed the repo basically Oct 25 02:32:39 you cant remove unless u back up and replace Oct 25 02:33:10 PuffTheMagic_: so will we need to now tell people that Services also have to be removed before a webOS update, and what will be the EPR equivalent for services? Oct 25 02:33:17 not to mention i am curious on the code that has been added/removed and how best secure programming practices have been followed Oct 25 02:33:29 rwhitby: well.... Oct 25 02:33:37 we dont want preware adding vulnerabilities Oct 25 02:33:51 rwhitby: he/we are not making a release yet Oct 25 02:33:59 maybe we can add a new feed entry Oct 25 02:34:09 tharris-: the code is in a public repo, and we will welcome security review of the changes Oct 25 02:34:11 that indicated a webos update will overwrite it Oct 25 02:34:36 rwhitby: or we can make a new category for things that overwrite palm stuff Oct 25 02:34:39 PuffTheMagic_: so we need to start a whole new education campaign, or we just call Type:Patch ? Oct 25 02:34:47 hehe hope he commented his changes, auditing libpuprle is no small task Oct 25 02:34:52 rwhitby: patch is a big misnomer Oct 25 02:34:55 cause its not plain text Oct 25 02:34:57 tharris-: git diff Oct 25 02:35:07 PuffTheMagic_: no-one said Patch implied plain text Oct 25 02:35:08 rwhitby: i think new education is in order Oct 25 02:35:31 rwhitby: in the unix world patches typicalyt imply plain text Oct 25 02:35:42 binary diffs/patches are tiny hardly used exception Oct 25 02:35:57 and complete binary/.so is a whole new ball game Oct 25 02:36:04 some education will be required here Oct 25 02:36:09 PuffTheMagic_: so, are you going to lead this new education campaign? Oct 25 02:36:21 i guess if I have to Oct 25 02:36:31 rwhitby: but we are not close to a real release yet Oct 25 02:36:39 so we have time to discuss things Oct 25 02:36:46 Cause it sounds like a lot of work just to not have to call a Patch a Patch because it's not a plain text Patch ... Oct 25 02:36:55 lol Oct 25 02:37:26 PuffTheMagic_: agreed we have plenty of time and this is just a discussion ahead of time. Oct 25 02:37:35 rwhitby: but the distributatble is not a patch in any way shape or form Oct 25 02:37:46 calling it a patch is jsut wrong Oct 25 02:37:48 PuffTheMagic_: just giving you the background rationale on why I originally suggested to greg_roll that it be classified as a patch Oct 25 02:37:57 It patches the OS Oct 25 02:38:02 just cause webos updates will overwrite it is not cause enough to call it a patch Oct 25 02:38:09 rwhitby: no it does not patch the os Oct 25 02:38:15 sure it does. Oct 25 02:38:18 it overwrites a whole file Oct 25 02:38:20 it replaces a Palm file Oct 25 02:38:22 that is NOT a patch Oct 25 02:38:26 that's Patching the OS Oct 25 02:38:31 replacing and patching are not even close Oct 25 02:38:32 it's not patching a file, it's patching the OS Oct 25 02:38:39 the OS is linux Oct 25 02:38:40 can you guys clue me in (since you are developers) on why palm used html/css/js approach rather than native code approach. i mean isn't native code faster and better for battery life Oct 25 02:38:43 and we are not patching that either Oct 25 02:38:56 webOS is a api/ collection of apps Oct 25 02:38:58 aunt minnie doesn't care about files. she's running webOS, not libpurple Oct 25 02:39:00 webos ~= gnuy Oct 25 02:39:02 gnuy Oct 25 02:39:05 gnu Oct 25 02:39:06 lol Oct 25 02:39:14 webOS ~= BSD either. Oct 25 02:39:18 No fucking way. The music player does NOTHING with parameters passed to the AppAssistant? Fuck me! Oct 25 02:39:31 rwhitby: i need to go for a bit Oct 25 02:39:37 sryan: trying to leverage a new developer base and make app development faster and easier Oct 25 02:39:44 if you are around in a few hours we can talk more about this Oct 25 02:39:44 don't you mean !=, rather than ~= Oct 25 02:39:47 or another dayh Oct 25 02:39:48 but someone other than the upstream or original author making a change to a package in a distribution (and webOS *is* a distribution) is a third-party patch Oct 25 02:40:35 If Palm is not releasing it, and it changes a Palm file, then it's a Patch, pure and simple. Oct 25 02:40:43 palms file is /usr/bin/LibpurpleAdapter Oct 25 02:40:53 I create a new file callec /usr/bin/LibpurpleAdapterExt Oct 25 02:40:58 it may be a binary or text or sed or other type of patch, but it's still a patch to the OS Oct 25 02:41:03 in order to not get broken during an update Oct 25 02:41:10 hope thats helps Oct 25 02:41:16 greg_roll: so no Palm files are changed in any way Oct 25 02:41:18 ? Oct 25 02:41:55 greg_roll: I thought a registry file had to be patched ... Oct 25 02:42:15 so thats the service I duplicate Oct 25 02:42:22 i then install a new version of libpurple Oct 25 02:42:30 I patch 3 files in the messaging app Oct 25 02:42:38 and I add entries to the PalmDatabase.db3 Oct 25 02:42:48 so really its a new service and a patch Oct 25 02:43:00 greg_roll: yep, that's what it sounds like to me tool. Oct 25 02:43:09 s/tool/too./ Oct 25 02:43:09 rwhitby meant: greg_roll: yep, that's what it sounds like to me too.. Oct 25 02:43:40 slash hack! Oct 25 02:43:44 s/test//g Oct 25 02:44:04 greg_roll: so git repo is for the service bit, and there will be another thing for the actual patch which makes webOS use that new service instead of the Palm service ? Oct 25 02:44:17 once I get my next version out I plan on starting a campain to have Palm include the new plugins out of the box Oct 25 02:44:17 my test is fun Oct 25 02:44:17 s/test//g Oct 25 02:44:17 tharris- meant: my is fun Oct 25 02:44:53 the first test was harder than the second test which was harder than the thrid test Oct 25 02:44:55 s/test//g Oct 25 02:44:56 tharris- meant: the first was harder than the second which was harder than the thrid Oct 25 02:44:59 rwhiby: yep I can do that. I can put libpurple-adapterext in the existing repo and the installer etc in a new one Oct 25 02:45:05 awesome globals Oct 25 02:46:05 rwhitby: (and other Aussies) did you see http://www.expansys.com.au/d.aspx?i=189373 ? Oct 25 02:46:17 freakout: http://www.expansys.com.au/d.aspx?i=189373 Oct 25 02:46:22 greg_roll: yep. more expensive than what I paid. Oct 25 02:46:43 rwhitby: true, I do like the idea of some warrantee though Oct 25 02:46:57 greg_roll: so should we rename the git repo to services/libpurple-adapter-ext ? Oct 25 02:47:29 rwhitby: umm if you leave that one ill put the installer there Oct 25 02:47:38 and create a new one with that name about Oct 25 02:47:48 greg_roll: is libpurple-adapter accessed over dbus, or is it a dynamic library that is loaded by something? Oct 25 02:48:18 im pretty certain its a dbus service Oct 25 02:49:26 greg_roll: so libpurple-adapter-ext runs as a service (C service I presume) and can be accessed by luna-send ? Oct 25 02:50:45 rwhitby: yep thats correct Oct 25 02:51:40 greg_roll: will the installer be EPR compatible? Oct 25 02:51:59 rwhitby: EPR? Oct 25 02:52:18 greg_roll: I saw that (expansys Pre). but i find the price a bit outrageous Oct 25 02:52:31 greg_roll: I'm gonna live dangerously ;) Oct 25 02:52:37 freakout: ETA on Pre? Oct 25 02:52:41 * rwhitby has spare parts ... Oct 25 02:52:42 freakout: yeah it is high Oct 25 02:53:15 rwhitby: Parcel nr. Original IDC: 214846475927 ( CL656853672DE ) was sent 23. Octobre 2009 from Frankfurt Airport to Sydney ! Oct 25 02:53:45 so maybe Tuesday then Oct 25 02:54:19 rwhitby: hope so. Sooner the better Oct 25 02:54:26 i will harrass Aus Post on monday Oct 25 02:54:39 and scold them for frightening me on Friday... Oct 25 02:56:37 hey guys, my phone tripped out and reinstalled 1.2.1 over the air over all my patches, I ran emergency patch recovery and successfully put everything back except now my phone thinks virtual keyboard is installed when it isnt... Oct 25 02:57:38 hckyplayer024: what does IPKG Log screen say? Oct 25 02:57:55 it says that all the files are still there Oct 25 02:58:21 one sec. ill tell you exactly what it says **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Oct 25 02:59:56 2009