**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Apr 17 02:59:56 2010 Apr 17 03:00:12 nt4cats: ah, well really "cross compiling" is just a fancy build environment. So if you're familiar/comfortable with silly build environments, you should be good. Also, it helps in the widk that sb2 does /everything/ for you Apr 17 03:00:13 zsoc: I don't think it'll be that hard ... it is just a question of time Apr 17 03:00:18 yeah i gotcha Apr 17 03:00:56 nt4cats: did you have a specific goal for the libs? i wouldn't mind getting them together and getting them staged, if you had some software in mind that would depend on them Apr 17 03:01:07 i'm quite interested in PyGame myself Apr 17 03:02:33 zsoc: I just noticed that optware's python installed a bunch of optware-compiled libraries that I am pretty sure there are already palm versions for (e.g. sqlite, openssl). That's what made me think that I should just compile my own python Apr 17 03:03:00 (and I have compiled python a bunch of times already to get a specific version on a platform that didn't provide it) Apr 17 03:03:02 yeah it should be pretty straight forward Apr 17 03:03:12 nt4cats: how did you end up in these parts again? Apr 17 03:03:19 these parts being webos-internals Apr 17 03:03:59 I came here when I wanted to get ssh access to my pre back in August-ish. I liked the folks here and wish I had time to contribute as a dev, so I've kinda hung out. Apr 17 03:04:37 got it :) Apr 17 03:04:40 Apr 17 03:05:28 My biggest contributions so far are a several lines of changes to make some webos-internals-hosted script compatible with fair-dinkum ... and I've updated the wiki periodically Apr 17 03:06:01 we love wiki updaters :D Apr 17 03:06:10 ugh I just realized that the toolchain maker for build.git Apr 17 03:06:11 i know of a few articles that are literally 6 months useless lol Apr 17 03:06:30 does the same thing as the crosscompile.git toolchain maker Apr 17 03:06:41 ah here we go Apr 17 03:06:52 Lumiere: yeah, we are trying to get them merged Apr 17 03:07:04 Lumiere: can't get sb2 to run on mason tho Apr 17 03:07:23 zsoc: I am hoping to find a way to integrate buildbot Apr 17 03:07:42 what would it do? Apr 17 03:07:43 with some of this Apr 17 03:07:48 automated builds Apr 17 03:07:57 ... er.. what's wrong with mason? Apr 17 03:07:57 and visualizations Apr 17 03:08:09 and it's log file? lol Apr 17 03:08:30 is mason the name of the server? Apr 17 03:08:31 ;) Apr 17 03:09:09 yes Apr 17 03:09:19 buildbot would run on mason :) Apr 17 03:09:27 oh, sounds fun Apr 17 03:10:02 it's a python package that does build automation and allows building on multiple slaves :) Apr 17 03:10:29 http://buildbot.net/trac Apr 17 03:11:04 interesting Apr 17 03:11:35 zsoc: http://www.python.org/dev/buildbot/stable/ is python's waterfall Apr 17 03:12:42 my thought was that buildbot could run whatever tests existed on commit/merge to HEAD Apr 17 03:12:52 and build the ipkg on tagging a release Apr 17 03:15:46 zsoc: just wish there were more tests ;) Apr 17 03:16:08 I can at least run Make to ensure they compile Apr 17 03:19:13 oh god Apr 17 03:21:15 zsoc|away: lol? Apr 17 03:36:27 sbromwich, for what its worth, after sitting for 20 minutes Apr 17 03:36:38 my phone was unresponsive, requiring a battery pull Apr 17 03:36:46 not a huge fan of that particular kernel Apr 17 03:38:11 annnnnnnnnd my usb door just officially broke, lame Apr 17 03:42:19 FuMan: I'm about 1/32nd of an inch of plastic from the same thing (usb door almost broken) Apr 17 03:44:08 its been bad for a couple weeks Apr 17 03:44:13 but, it done broked. Apr 17 03:44:47 swizz :-( Apr 17 03:45:29 I pulled the volume tabs off mine and just use the microswitches Apr 17 03:45:36 people seem to find that odd for some reason Apr 17 03:46:20 can't for the life of me understand why Apr 17 03:48:06 the volume tabs on there were irritating Apr 17 03:48:23 the way I hold the phone the volume kept going up... and up... and up... Apr 17 03:49:44 Linux palm-webos-device 2.6.24-palm-joplin-3430 #7 PREEMPT Sat Apr 17 03:42:31 UTC 2010 armv7l unknown Apr 17 03:49:50 trying that no Apr 17 03:49:51 e Apr 17 03:49:54 w Apr 17 03:50:04 3d++ Apr 17 03:50:12 cam++ Apr 17 03:51:05 youtube++ Apr 17 03:51:53 www.fop.ns.ca/pre/uImage_141-6.7 Apr 17 03:51:58 if anyone wants to try it Apr 17 03:52:07 sbromwich, also, that eye trick glimmer of easy countdown Apr 17 03:52:17 oh yeah Apr 17 03:52:18 exists on stock, and caj kernel Apr 17 03:52:33 or, maybe im just making myself see it at this point :> Apr 17 03:52:34 still does it Apr 17 03:52:50 my depth perception is screwed and just looking at it not moving I'm having difficulty Apr 17 03:53:05 caj doesnt have a kernel Apr 17 03:53:39 whatever, caj's ipk Apr 17 03:53:47 which, if im not mistaken, you don't wanna claim ownership of. Apr 17 03:54:32 cuz its old kernel build and not my ipk. Apr 17 03:54:33 * sbromwich lends uNiXpSyChO a bargepole Apr 17 03:54:41 although that is something i've wondered... as you've distanced yourself from his biz, and his forum spreading has increased... are you seeing a portion of those kickbacks? Apr 17 03:55:15 i see nothing from the kickbacks. i work for free. Apr 17 03:55:21 ditto Apr 17 03:55:30 well... I work to get a faster phone for myself. Apr 17 03:55:34 hrm, being the middle man is probably working out well for him Apr 17 03:56:08 sbromwich, ill have to wait a couple days before I decide... but I can see differences in little areas that are improvements over the caj ipk Apr 17 03:56:11 i have alot of other words for it... Apr 17 03:56:41 no doubt. Apr 17 03:56:43 FuMan: you should be getting better intra-thread performance and better battery life Apr 17 03:56:56 im really curious how itll handle battery life in roam Apr 17 03:57:01 the pre is awfultastic in roam to begin with Apr 17 03:57:10 but dropping the 800ipk in there, was brutalface. Apr 17 03:57:15 the only issues you might have is voice or wan connectivity, which I'd be interested in Apr 17 03:57:17 yeah Apr 17 03:57:24 and I roam in class and at work, 70 percent of my day Apr 17 03:57:28 there's a problem with the USBHOST timer which I *might* have fixes Apr 17 03:57:34 s/s$/d$/ Apr 17 03:57:51 do you get a lot of dropouts? Apr 17 03:58:00 as in dropped calls? Apr 17 03:58:04 or does it just disconnect? Apr 17 03:58:31 well, either it'll powersave when it shouldn't and you'll get audio drops, or the carrier signal will fail and you'll get a dropped call Apr 17 03:58:37 that's my theory Apr 17 03:58:58 I can't seem to replicate the problem though... but the resume from suspend is better Apr 17 03:59:48 have you seen that one FuMan when you turn the phone on from suspend and it hangs or restarts luna? Apr 17 03:59:59 since your kernel, no Apr 17 04:00:04 prior, 4-5 daily Apr 17 04:00:19 ok, sounds like the extra udelay is helping Apr 17 04:00:48 and i havent really made many calls on your kernel, so im not sure about the dropouts, only been at it this afternoon, and its been a day of study :> Apr 17 04:01:26 ok, I'll be interested in how that pans out Apr 17 04:02:05 I was told WAN and voice would be the major concern as (if I understand aright) the clock signal would not stay in sync with the provider's clock signal but would drift and cause lost packets Apr 17 04:02:25 and therefore sufficient lost packets = dropoutss, enough lost packets = lost call Apr 17 04:03:22 you can also increate the signal gain in the radio firmware Apr 17 04:03:30 increase Apr 17 04:04:17 by changing the frequency of the OMAP they think you're gong to lose packets due to frequency offset ? Apr 17 04:04:17 hmmm... not sure if that would make a difference but it might be worth a go Apr 17 04:05:46 bpadalino: I'm not convinced I understand the base reason but from what I understand the ondemand freq scaling changing the system clock somehow has a knock-on effect to the USB, which then causes problems for timing for packets going to the provider Apr 17 04:06:51 sounds a little silly .. i would imagine that is more interrupt driven than worrying about clock ticks Apr 17 04:08:29 did you see that april fool's joke patent that was posted that said palm had come up with some new overclocking method? Apr 17 04:08:43 i did not .. have you got a link ? Apr 17 04:09:07 it's on precentral somewhere... let me see if I can find it Apr 17 04:09:12 ok Apr 17 04:11:14 bugger... I can't find it Apr 17 04:11:23 it was a sod to find when I talked to uNiXpSyChO about it Apr 17 04:12:00 essentially they're powersaving by piggybacking whatever they can on one antenna instead of two, and idling the chipsets in turn Apr 17 04:12:06 (again, as I understand it) Apr 17 04:12:13 neat Apr 17 04:12:54 so the idea is that, say, wifi and WAN can be run off one antenna one at a time while the other antenna is idle and saving power Apr 17 04:12:58 I *think* Apr 17 04:13:22 it's kinda like single duplex taken to a whole new level Apr 17 04:13:34 sorry, half duplex Apr 17 04:13:42 that slows things down. Apr 17 04:13:57 saves power, though Apr 17 04:14:03 indeed.... Apr 17 04:14:27 and I think it has the option of deciding if the CPU is busy doing stuff and if there's genuinely stuff going on will turn on both antennae Apr 17 04:14:38 to troubleshoot this temp sensor I need a logging app. Apr 17 04:14:54 wonder what shell is on there... Apr 17 04:15:02 ash i thought Apr 17 04:15:35 bash is available too from ipkg-opt Apr 17 04:15:44 also true Apr 17 04:16:16 okay...bash script it is. Apr 17 04:16:34 anyone here on a macbook? Apr 17 04:16:45 yes Apr 17 04:16:52 ka6sox, cup your balls Apr 17 04:17:02 and then option+shift +volume change Apr 17 04:17:30 o_O Apr 17 04:17:35 * FuMan learned something today Apr 17 04:18:23 5. After the system is suspended, the resume operation does not Apr 17 04:18:25 succeed from the keypad and touchscreen. Apr 17 04:18:27 6. Once the system enters OFF state, resume event from the keypad Apr 17 04:18:29 does not wake-up the system. Apr 17 04:18:31 7. Resume event from the touchscreen does not wakeup the system. Apr 17 04:18:33 8. When OFF mode is enabled and system is allowed to stay idle for Apr 17 04:18:35 long, virtual paging error is observed on the console. Sometimes, Apr 17 04:18:37 the system may not recover from this exception. Apr 17 04:18:39 OMAP35x EVM Linux PSP - Release Notes Apr 17 04:18:43 how coincidental. Apr 17 04:19:11 neat, quarter steps in volume change Apr 17 04:19:11 SDOCM00055519 USB RNDIS-NFS retries observed on insmod of Apr 17 04:19:12 USB RNDIS driver module Apr 17 04:19:14 SDOCM00055520 USB CDC/RNDIS- The EVM does not sense the Apr 17 04:19:16 cable disconnect Apr 17 04:19:18 even more so Apr 17 04:19:57 bpadalino, yeah... the most braindead sorostitute on the planet showed me that today Apr 17 04:20:18 neato Apr 17 04:20:40 this looks amazingly similar to the pre hardware. Apr 17 04:20:56 SDOCM00055260: In loopback sample application, the video Apr 17 04:20:58 displayed on the LCD has interlacing artifacts when viewing fast Apr 17 04:21:00 moving objects. This is because the input video is in interlaced mode Apr 17 04:21:02 @ 30 FPS while the LCD works in progressive mode @ 60 FPS. The Apr 17 04:21:04 frame rate conversion and de-interlacing is not done in the current Apr 17 04:21:06 sample application. Apr 17 04:21:08 =flicker. Apr 17 04:21:38 bed time for me .. night Apr 17 04:21:49 nite Apr 17 04:21:57 laters, bpadalino Apr 17 04:22:21 wasn't someone complaining about the camera not being open source? Apr 17 04:23:03 http://gitorious.org/omap3camera Apr 17 04:24:17 the Pre has diff hardware than the EVM board. somewhat Apr 17 04:25:42 but it seems to have many of the same problems Apr 17 04:25:47 EHCI driver doesn't leverage the power saving features supported Apr 17 04:25:48 by the silicon as it doesn't enable/ disable usbhost clocks effectively Apr 17 04:25:50 while doing data transfer. Apr 17 04:25:52 for eg. Apr 17 04:26:14 USB audio/video stress failure obsereved when both audio and video Apr 17 04:26:15 are run in parallel for one full day. Apr 17 04:26:32 ie someone watched youporn videos for 24 hours straight. Apr 17 04:26:42 * FuMan guilty Apr 17 04:26:47 yep... cuz the core SoC has most of that built in. Apr 17 04:27:52 yeah, but they seem to have used the same code base Apr 17 04:28:12 I'm just wondering if there's anything in there I can nick to stuff in to my kernel Apr 17 04:28:36 you can always code snippet from TI's kernels Apr 17 04:28:41 they're old tho Apr 17 04:30:02 sep 2009 Apr 17 04:30:08 must be something newer than that Apr 17 04:30:21 thier kernels? Apr 17 04:30:39 sbromwich, its mainline I think in .28 Apr 17 04:31:25 yeah, there must be a repo somewhere they're using that has public access Apr 17 04:31:33 ka6sox: of course it is. Apr 17 04:31:44 * sbromwich mutter imprecations under his breath Apr 17 04:31:46 http://linux.omap.com/pub/kernel/3530evm/ Apr 17 04:32:03 I wonder when a newer version might come out on the pre. Apr 17 04:32:12 thanks uNiXpSyChO for being my lazyweb Apr 17 04:32:13 oh... Apr 17 04:32:29 2008? Apr 17 04:33:04 yep, old. but may be useful stuff in there. i havent dug through it enough Apr 17 04:33:36 ahhh Apr 17 04:34:45 ah-hah, the dsp must be overclocked as well Apr 17 04:35:00 it sure is Apr 17 04:35:40 * uNiXpSyChO wonders if he just put his foot in his mouth Apr 17 04:37:29 bbs Apr 17 04:38:14 oh fuck Apr 17 04:38:21 tms320 Apr 17 04:38:33 I thought I'd seen the last of that crap when I left USR :-/ Apr 17 04:45:13 Powering OMAPTM3 With TPS65950: Apr 17 04:45:15 Design-In Guide Apr 17 04:45:20 I think this might be closer Apr 17 04:49:01 ah-hah, so *this* is what DVFS is all about Apr 17 05:10:23 www.fop.ns.ca/pre/uImage.1.4.1-6.9 Apr 17 05:10:28 tinkering with power savings Apr 17 05:10:43 so I think I shall head off to bed and leave my phone off charge and see what happens Apr 17 05:10:46 night :-) Apr 17 05:10:59 later Apr 17 05:14:22 one last comment, whoever's on 108-97-241-98.pools.spcsdns.net appears to be infected with funwebproducts spyware Apr 17 05:14:24 laters Apr 17 06:40:32 anyone got a spare irssi logfile they care to share? Apr 17 09:28:05 infobot: log Apr 17 09:28:06 log is, like, http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/openmoko-cdevel/ for #openmoko-cdevel only. Maybe you meant "~logs" ? Apr 17 09:28:18 MiX-MaN: see last line Apr 17 09:28:34 ~logs Apr 17 09:28:35 All conversations are logged to http://ibot.rikers.org/channel, where "channel" is replaced by the URL-encoded channel name, such as %23freenode for #freenode. Lines starting with spaces are not logged. logs are updated daily Apr 17 09:31:54 thx :) Apr 17 09:32:51 * oil usually uses http://logs.nslu2-linux.org/livelogs/webos-internals/ Apr 17 09:38:56 sbromwich: are you saying that the udelay changes fixes the restart luna on resume bug? Apr 17 09:50:55 rwhitby: re preware post: it should prefer whichever feed has the highest version Apr 17 09:51:22 then most recent release Apr 17 09:53:52 oil: agreed. I think it does that, but I stuffed up when trying to keep as much information as possible for the saved package list Apr 17 09:54:45 so I think the appcat flag is being retained when it should not be Apr 17 13:02:36 hi! Apr 17 13:05:19 anyone know why the WOSQI doesnt recognizw that there is a device already connected and behaves as if there was none? Apr 17 13:20:05 http://news.slashdot.org/story/10/04/17/1144220/Hardware-Accelerated-Ogg-Theora-For-Firefox-Mobile - for people interested Apr 17 13:34:28 bpadalino: interesting except that OGG is pretty much dead for HTML5 Apr 17 14:29:36 rwhitby: I believe so, I've ramped it up to comparably excessive levels and I haven't had it hang yet Apr 17 14:34:43 rwhitby: could you check I'm doing commits right on mason when you get a chance? Apr 17 15:05:45 * uNiXpSyChO|Zzzzz is away Apr 17 15:25:58 i have some problem with the messaging plugin ... Apr 17 15:26:05 after the 1.4 update .. i have some problem .. now i tried to update the message plugin Apr 17 15:26:10 but now all my account don't work Apr 17 15:26:17 i used gtalk and jabber and no one work ... some one can help ? and i cant remove the patch .... Apr 17 15:33:37 I just got a decal girl sticker for my pre case. I can't tell for sure, but I think it's going to be awesome Apr 17 15:41:07 what is a "decal girl"? Apr 17 15:41:50 http://www.decalgirl.com/category.view/Palm-Pre-Skins Apr 17 15:41:52 got it Apr 17 15:43:40 I had an awful feeling it was going to be one of those "look at the semi naked girlie!" apps but it actually looks rather neat Apr 17 15:44:14 I had the opposite reaction Apr 17 15:44:39 *grin* Apr 17 15:44:52 there seem to be an awful lot of those sort of apps on the palm catalogue, for some reason Apr 17 15:45:14 jettero: does it come with the matching wallpaper? Apr 17 15:46:00 I'm quite impressed at how this power saving is panning out... 3D kills the battery but other than that using for "normal" use (interweebs, facebook, youtube, etc) doesn't seem to drain an awful lot more than in suspend Apr 17 15:46:41 runtime 10h 26m, remaining life 26.86h (?) Apr 17 15:46:58 I guess 26h ~50m Apr 17 17:08:06 can i get some assistance removing custom feeds from Preware? i have a Sprint Pre w/ 1.4.1.1, Preware 0.9.36, Preware Alpha 0.9.61, and Save/Restore 0.6.7 Apr 17 17:09:34 sethron: do you not know how to do it, or are you getting an error message when you try? Apr 17 17:10:36 i am switching them on, swiping to delete, but they stay in Preware. They are for the testing feeds, but one has the wrong URL. Apr 17 17:11:29 sethron: what version of preware are you using? Apr 17 17:11:41 i have a Sprint Pre w/ 1.4.1.1, Preware 0.9.36, Preware Alpha 0.9.61, and Save/Restore 0.6.7 Apr 17 17:12:32 sethron: okay, one variable I'm going to have to look into is where the alpha stores its feeds vs where the non-alpha does. If they share a common feed list that could be a complicating factor Apr 17 17:13:19 sethron: I've added / changed / removed feeds from Preware by editing the feed files on disk before -- but i don't want to break the alpha by doing this Apr 17 17:13:26 sethron: ... checking ... Apr 17 17:15:48 www.fop.ns.ca/pre/uImage.1.4.1-6.9.ricer Apr 17 17:15:52 ph33r. Apr 17 17:15:53 hmm, if i orange tap to remove Preware Alpha, then attempt to remove feeds from Preware, would that really remove them? Also, it seems the package manager service was unistalled. Apr 17 17:16:29 new kernel with gcc optimisations and experimental use of Thumb code Apr 17 17:16:38 sethron: I believe that Preware >= 0.9.35 uses the c-language service (that's 'believe', not 'guarantee') Apr 17 17:17:05 sethron: ... and I believe the c-language service is included in the preware package (not separately like the Java service is/was) Apr 17 17:17:27 ricer... lol... Apr 17 17:17:46 does what it says on the tin ;-) Apr 17 17:17:50 hmm, one shouldn't use 'lol' Apr 17 17:18:00 nt4cats if true then version 0.9.36 of Preware would probably remove the package manager service, then Apr 17 17:18:07 i just read what i wrote, it reads... stoopid Apr 17 17:18:34 well, back to trying to brick the pre Apr 17 17:18:47 always fun. Apr 17 17:19:00 damn hard, it takes a lot of punishment Apr 17 17:19:09 I haven't managed it yet Apr 17 17:19:24 then again, I'm a little careful not to break it, it's actually my phone too :) Apr 17 17:19:35 ditto ;-) Apr 17 17:20:15 which reminds me, is there a good way to make a complete image of the internal memory and just play that back if i break stuff? Apr 17 17:20:26 sethron: just to confirm -- you're trying to remove custom feeds (that you added), right? Apr 17 17:20:29 i thought i read something on precentral, but i cannot find it anymore Apr 17 17:20:42 nt4cats: correct Apr 17 17:20:44 sethron: do you have shell access to your Pre? (ssh preferred)? Apr 17 17:21:19 i could do that/ switching in to DEV mode... Apr 17 17:22:35 oi, my ma just called as i was going to switch.... Apr 17 17:23:18 forgot to tap ignore :) Apr 17 17:23:35 don't ignore your ma Apr 17 17:23:52 or, could I use Terminal or Terminus? Apr 17 17:24:45 sethron: you could use terminal/terminus, but it'll be less frustrating to use a nice big window with copy/paste, scrollback, etc. Apr 17 17:25:27 sethron: if you'd have to install a lot of stuff to get a 'real' window, go ahead and use termin[al|us]. If it isn't any more painful than booting into dev mode and using novaterm, I'd prefer that if you don't mind. Apr 17 17:26:07 just have to get novacom in ubuntu karmic set up Apr 17 17:27:17 I'm not going to tell you what to do with your phone / PC, but if you wouldn't mind using novaterm for now (and it will be helpful in future times that you want easy shell access to your phone) that'd be nice Apr 17 17:27:56 jettero: let me know if it works with the touchstone Apr 17 17:28:21 I don't see any of the Preware dev's active here right now ... they might want to collect debug info from you if any of them show up Apr 17 17:28:26 am willing, just have to take this phone call, afterall, the Pre is a phone :) Apr 17 17:28:32 :) Apr 17 17:28:56 * nt4cats is pro-Mom, so I'll gladly wait while you talk to her Apr 17 17:29:29 sbromwich: what thumb code are you using? Apr 17 17:29:47 nt4cats: isn't everyone pro mom? Apr 17 17:30:10 I mean, that would be like people being anti-god Apr 17 17:30:13 oh, wait... Apr 17 17:30:16 exactly Apr 17 17:30:53 I have a question, with an app is it possible to get stereo and no mono sound? Apr 17 17:31:18 all my apps seem to be mono Apr 17 17:31:22 caj2008: please enumerate your description of stereo vs mono Apr 17 17:31:24 jhojho: just enabling it in gcc to see if it makes a speed difference Apr 17 17:31:38 caj2008: I don't understand your question ... I get stereo audio out of my phone in all apps Apr 17 17:31:39 ah Apr 17 17:31:46 caj2008: mediaserver forces 2 channel audio, from what I've seen Apr 17 17:31:49 i can put the phone down for 10 minutes, pick it back up again, say, uh huh, and it would be as if i was always on the phone, don't know about your ma. Apr 17 17:32:00 sbromwich: does it? Apr 17 17:32:05 caj2008: you could have a problem with your headset jack or with your headphones Apr 17 17:32:37 My music player gives me stereo but apps give me sound that is mono only Apr 17 17:32:39 caj2008: your pre does not have stereo speakers, however ... so if you're not using a headset I guess your audio output is mono Apr 17 17:32:42 jhojho: seems to so far, I'm trying to figure out how usable it is now ;-) Apr 17 17:32:53 makes sense Apr 17 17:33:06 small or big speedup? Apr 17 17:33:25 small, I'd say Apr 17 17:33:51 sethron: my mother, unlike most women, is anti-talking. My phone conversations with her rarely go more than 2 minutes. Apr 17 17:34:07 well, bless you Apr 17 17:34:22 nt4cats: mediaserver dumps the 2 channel into pcm_output, so it's stereo audio, just out of 1 speaker Apr 17 17:34:49 nt4cats: I just checked and it seems that the package manager service is still installed for preware 0.9.36 Apr 17 17:34:56 sbromowich: iphone is beat in all cpu.bus performance tests by Pre but incredible fluidity of OS in iphone makes is appear WebOS is more clunky Apr 17 17:35:22 caj2008: is that with or without syslog disabled on the pre? Apr 17 17:35:34 tried both as you suggested Apr 17 17:36:05 and the /etc/fstab change? Apr 17 17:36:14 WebOS has had less time to develop. Apr 17 17:36:24 NTW-tried your kernel Apr 17 17:36:46 worked ok Apr 17 17:36:48 zsoc_wirc: "stereo audio out of 1 speaker" is an interesting concept ;) I guess it is different from strictly mono because it you hear both channels, just not separated left/right. Apr 17 17:37:02 intersting Apr 17 17:37:04 jhoho: thanks for checking that -- that's interesting to know Apr 17 17:37:07 sbromwich: have you played with ##LOGS# Apr 17 17:37:09 ? Apr 17 17:37:11 I can only say that the iphone I tried was incredibly slow and laggy Apr 17 17:37:22 jhojho: I usually just watch dmesg Apr 17 17:37:24 depends on what is on phone I guess Apr 17 17:37:41 wife is calling me...will be back later Apr 17 17:38:11 I am trying it now to see how well it doesn't work, jhojho ;-) Apr 17 17:38:21 nt4cats: okay, Pre in dev mode just charging, connect to rig Apr 17 17:38:53 i only heard about it from palm who is trying to track down the missing calls issue Apr 17 17:39:01 sethron: for the normal preware (not alpha) the feeds are stored in /media/cryptofs/apps/etc/ipkg/ Apr 17 17:39:07 I get random missed calls now since 1.4.0 Apr 17 17:39:35 sethron: I haven't grabbed the alpha ipkg yet to see where it stores its feeds (kids + lunch distracted me) -- grabbing it now Apr 17 17:40:06 jhojho: do the calls get missed with power off? Apr 17 17:40:23 and the log creation just gave me a blowfish encrypted file :-/ Apr 17 17:40:36 power is on. screen is not. Apr 17 17:40:53 yeah, that's the udelay thing, I think Apr 17 17:40:55 I just get told that the call went straight to vm later Apr 17 17:41:34 phone can't wake up the display and returns fail so the telco side of the phone does the next best thing and sends the call to vm Apr 17 17:41:46 at a guess, anyway Apr 17 17:41:54 nt4cats: i see them Apr 17 17:42:48 my guess is that Preware and Preware Alpha share them from that location Apr 17 17:43:16 what is udelay set to right now by palm? Apr 17 17:43:18 jhojho: do you have a PIN set on your phone? Apr 17 17:43:20 10 Apr 17 17:43:25 no pin set Apr 17 17:43:29 for the specific bit I'm thinking of Apr 17 17:43:52 jhojho: if it's not too much hassle I'd be interested to know if you get intermittent hangs at the PIN entry screen as well Apr 17 17:43:53 sethron: I've manually unpacked the alpha .ipkg and am checking Apr 17 17:44:23 sbromwich: describe scenario pls. Apr 17 17:44:40 does it just pause when/after entering pin? Apr 17 17:44:59 sethron: yep, the postinst script of this package sets up its feeds in the same directory Apr 17 17:45:29 jhojho: in a hang scenario: turn phone on, get bluesky logo, sometimes get the pin entry option, phone just sits there and does not let you enter a number, after a seemingly arbitrary # of seconds (usually <10) luna restarts Apr 17 17:45:57 sethron: you should be able to disable feeds by renaming them to {feed}.disabled, and if you remove the feed files that should delete them. Apr 17 17:46:02 if it gets as far as letting you enter the pin I don't recall getting a crash after Apr 17 17:46:07 weird Apr 17 17:46:12 I get a different issue. Apr 17 17:46:13 nt4cats: so, do i just rm feedname.conf.disabled ? Apr 17 17:46:35 yeah... it's all related to prcm_pwr.c and coming out of suspend, I think Apr 17 17:46:41 sethron: if you want to be paranoid, create a subdirectory there called 'archive' and mv the feed files there Apr 17 17:46:48 * nt4cats tends to be paranoid Apr 17 17:46:51 sometimes when I try to unlock. I dont get the wallpaper and the lock Apr 17 17:46:54 nt4cats: they are disabled i want to remove the one with the incorrect URL Apr 17 17:46:58 the most common scenario is pressing the button and nada, then either the phone locks up, reboots or restarts luna Apr 17 17:47:02 I get whatever the active card is and the lock Apr 17 17:47:22 inserting/removing the usb cable in particular makes it stroppy Apr 17 17:48:17 what I did was replace udelay(10) with 3 * udelay(50) and put a udelay(1) in between each device wakeup Apr 17 17:48:40 I think I might have to use udelay(2) or 4 * udelay(50) as it's still not perfect, but it's a lot better Apr 17 17:48:54 sbromwich, that ricer config still need the same bias blah blah from the melt thread? Apr 17 17:49:01 yeah Apr 17 17:49:28 well... tweak powersave_bias and up_threshold to your personal phone, but the rest of it should be pretty generic Apr 17 17:50:08 nt4cats: now there is a Feed named archive Apr 17 17:50:21 depending on how lucky your are you might be able to get away with powersave_bias=0 and up_threshold ridiculously low, like 20 Apr 17 17:51:19 okay, mv archive /media/internal/ Apr 17 17:51:34 jhojho: there's also an issue with overclocked phones and USBHOST causing DVFS issues which might explain your problem Apr 17 17:51:46 (shut down preware before you move the directory) Apr 17 17:51:59 how can subsequent 'make stage' calls result in sometimes getting a working build and sometimes not? shouldn't whis stuff be a little deterministic or something? Apr 17 17:52:02 my phone was displaying such behavior even when clocked normally Apr 17 17:52:18 jhojho: probably not the USBHOST issue then Apr 17 17:52:38 asmw: are you using make -j? Apr 17 17:52:48 sbromwich: no Apr 17 17:53:04 asmw: then my suggestion would have been incorrect :-) Apr 17 17:53:10 sbromwich: I'm trying to set up a fresh WIDK in a new VM Apr 17 17:53:11 nt4cats: super groovy tyvm Apr 17 17:53:43 sethron: if I see any of the preware dev's here today I'll let them know about your problem Apr 17 17:53:43 sbromwich: I just wanted to make stage libsdl, which deps to glib first which failed Apr 17 17:53:54 sbromwich: make stage again, now it works Apr 17 17:54:08 asmw: did glib fail with an assembler error? Apr 17 17:54:37 nt4cats: also, it does seem strange that I no longer have the package manager service, but that does not seems to affect my situation. Apr 17 17:56:07 sethron: yes, that's strange -- my Pre still shows the package manager service installed (v0.9.45) Apr 17 17:56:42 nt4cats: do you have Preware Alpha on your Pre? Apr 17 17:57:26 sethron: nope -- not yet at least Apr 17 17:57:39 hrm Apr 17 17:58:59 sbromwich: no, during configure while checking the size of pthread_mutex_t or somesuch Apr 17 17:59:25 sbromwich: strange place to error anyway, it succeded testing other sizes before that Apr 17 18:00:15 asmw: not the error I was thinking of either than... feel free to ask if you want incorrect answers though! ;-) Apr 17 18:01:21 sbromwich: I'll see if it happens again, I'm not keen on reproducing the error as long as it works :) Apr 17 18:08:47 to remove bad ffed from Preware : http://webos.pastebin.com/07KGaaVJ Apr 17 18:11:29 sethron: that was nice of you to do. I'll turn that into a page on the webos-internals.org wiki Apr 17 18:12:16 nt4cats: cool: peace out. Apr 17 18:12:27 nice work sethron Apr 17 18:12:46 sbromwich: tyvm Apr 17 18:24:46 it would appear that appending "ricer" to a kernel name makes many, many PC users download it. Apr 17 18:25:02 http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Manually_Remove_Preware_Feeds Apr 17 18:25:06 I would guess around 5% of them actually manage to boot it. Apr 17 18:25:43 sbromwich: try appending 'boobies' and see how that does Apr 17 18:26:09 looks good, nt4cats Apr 17 18:26:10 heh Apr 17 18:26:20 perhaps that'll be the next one then Apr 17 18:29:25 made your english even betterer, nt4cats Apr 17 18:30:11 nt4cats: tyvm Apr 17 18:30:53 sbromwich: impossible, I live in the country that invented English. Apr 17 18:31:56 documentation should be written in the passive voice Apr 17 18:32:11 * sbromwich has written faaaar too much docco in the past Apr 17 18:33:21 oh, I know, I'll call a kernel ".booby" because I "think" there may be a boobytrap in there Apr 17 18:33:25 that should make it popular Apr 17 18:34:00 * nt4cats points out to sbromwich that I live in suburban Philadelphia, which some people would consider incompatible with the "... country that invented ..." claim Apr 17 18:34:41 * sbromwich refrains from mentioning anything about colonialists ;-) Apr 17 18:34:46 "booby" is less likely to get thousands of geeks all excited when compared to "boobies" Apr 17 18:34:58 boobies trap? Apr 17 18:35:15 IIRC booby is a type of bird too Apr 17 18:35:42 * nt4cats saw a pic on reddit that would be perfect for "boobies trap", but is nsfw Apr 17 18:35:56 * sbromwich is not at work Apr 17 18:37:34 sbromwich: are you offended by pictures of the bare chestal regions of nubile women aged (approximately) 19-25? Apr 17 18:38:16 not excessively, but I might insert a reference to said pic in my next kernel Apr 17 18:41:14 mmmmm boobies Apr 17 18:45:09 in quantity, no less Apr 17 18:45:24 more than 2? Apr 17 18:45:30 mmm Apr 17 18:46:08 sbromwich: saw it on reddit last week Apr 17 18:46:56 can anyone help with installing themes in Preware, i am able to download but the installation keeps failing Apr 17 18:46:59 zsoc_wirc: I clearly identified it as "saw a pic on reddit ..." Apr 17 18:47:22 nt4cats: ah, sorry, I'm working.. not paying so much attention Apr 17 18:48:37 installing preware now, looking forward to it. Apr 17 18:48:45 Goal is to get ssh working Apr 17 18:49:27 * sbromwich recommends openssh Apr 17 18:50:56 just make sure your ssh keys are set up right Apr 17 18:51:51 can anyone help with installing themes in Preware, i am able to download but the installation keeps failing Apr 17 18:52:35 i have tried over 10 themes and the same thing happens it download and install but fails Apr 17 18:52:50 anyone got this issue before Apr 17 18:56:36 * sethron is hungry and stepped way to feed Apr 17 18:57:53 thanks sbromwich Apr 17 18:58:40 Unfortunately my OSX 10.5.8 java cannot launch WebOSQuickInstall.jar or PrewareInstaller Apr 17 18:58:43 [0x0-0x5a15a1].com.apple.JarLauncher[11908]: Exception in thread "AWT-EventQueue-0" java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: javax/swing/GroupLayout$Grou Apr 17 19:00:26 Guest23587: beats me, I've never used either, sorry Apr 17 19:01:42 no problem, thanks Apr 17 19:02:00 Seems like my Java version is incompatible, looking further Apr 17 19:03:19 if you've got novaterm I got the bitly shell script thing working when I did it, if it helps Apr 17 19:03:24 10.5.8 is java 1.5, right ? Apr 17 19:04:39 I'm off to get stuff ready for the boy coming home, laters Apr 17 19:04:43 Fixed: needed to move SE 6.0 to the top of the list in Java Preferences app Apr 17 19:04:48 as described here http://forums.precentral.net/canuck-software/206905-webos-quick-install-v2-96-a.html Apr 17 19:53:37 Love this preware, its software engineering done right. Apr 17 19:53:47 Long live the pre (I just hope that happens) Apr 17 19:54:07 (How do you change your nickname?) Apr 17 19:54:12 \Nick: fds Apr 17 19:54:21 \nick fds Apr 17 20:00:16 wrong slash .. Apr 17 20:03:20 er, /nick newnick Apr 17 20:41:10 Guest23587: use WOSQI 3.1 for a start, 2.96 will not work on the latest webOS version Apr 17 22:24:46 hm... /srv/preware/build/staging/armv7/usr/include/ should be /usr/local/include in the widk, right? Apr 17 22:25:08 or is it /usr/local/usr/include ? Apr 17 23:21:45 anyone knows where this function is define: NApp_ReadEvents Apr 17 23:22:05 i imagine somewhere in libnapp Apr 17 23:23:07 properitary lib by palm? Apr 17 23:23:47 yes Apr 17 23:23:50 i think it's around tho Apr 17 23:23:54 or i may be thinking of libpdl Apr 17 23:23:55 so maybe not Apr 17 23:30:56 playya__: we don't have any source for libnapp Apr 17 23:31:10 zsoc: /usr/local/include Apr 17 23:31:47 and I'm not a native ASM speaker :/ Apr 17 23:35:11 playya__: i'm not so sure that library is terribly relevant anymore. I could be wrong, but I think it's really for the current native apps. The future ones will be based on libpdl Apr 17 23:35:21 unless libpdl also references libnapp, which is possible Apr 17 23:36:07 it is important if you want to have no palm libs Apr 17 23:37:27 oh.. you mean like fspo stuff? Apr 17 23:37:33 yes Apr 17 23:38:37 i see :) i'm trying to think.. i believe mdklein got the farthest in RE'ing libnapp Apr 17 23:40:58 good to know Apr 17 23:41:17 is he in here from time to time? Apr 17 23:41:53 playya__: yes Apr 17 23:43:36 ok. i'll try to catch him Apr 17 23:43:58 my code only shows some undefined values :/ Apr 17 23:44:56 and they don't change if i touch the screen Apr 18 00:26:14 can i discuss a contact/sms problem? Apr 18 00:27:28 preuser18282: You can discuss whatever you want. Apr 18 00:27:30 i just had a sprint store move contacts from a blackberry to a pre, now i am unable to send or recieve text messages to my other pe Apr 18 00:27:58 Though, that sounds more like a general #webos question, or possibly even a sprint question. Apr 18 00:28:08 not all contacts just one contact Apr 18 00:29:11 for instance i was on a contact info card of my other phone number whch is also on a pre, and i tap the sms balloon and it will not open the card for conversation Apr 18 00:29:40 but if i tap the sms balloon for my sister or cousin it will open the conversation card Apr 18 00:29:54 are there any odd characters in the name or number? Apr 18 00:29:55 i deleted the contact Apr 18 00:30:27 tried to send an sms to the number with out it being saved as a contact, like from the call list balloon Apr 18 00:30:39 it still wouldnt open the conversation card Apr 18 00:30:53 that's... odd. Apr 18 00:30:58 it just seems to be with that number only Apr 18 00:31:32 the only thing that comes to mind is to do a full reboot, as there's some cleanup scripts that run during boot Apr 18 00:31:39 i searched and deleted any referencee i could find stored in the phone for that number and even from the call log pulled the battery too, nothing i have tried seems to work Apr 18 00:31:56 there is a button combo you can use, I usually just pull the battery but you risk data loss doing that Apr 18 00:32:00 well i just doctored the phone today before taking it to sprint Apr 18 00:32:15 have you done a power cycle since? Apr 18 00:32:22 well there is no data on the phone yet that i am worried about losing Apr 18 00:32:29 several Apr 18 00:32:49 not just a luna or java restart, but a full reboot? Apr 18 00:32:59 could there be some hidden reference to that number in the phone somewhere that i cant find? Apr 18 00:33:12 i took the battery out Apr 18 00:33:27 i have used the o sym r Apr 18 00:33:35 can't argue with that as a reboot method then :-) Apr 18 00:33:56 there certainly could be, but I'm not sure quite where Apr 18 00:34:17 my other phone when i send a text to the problemed phone the texts do not arrive Apr 18 00:34:30 terminal or terminus? Apr 18 00:34:53 it sounds like you might have come upon a fairly deep and interesting bug and have done everything right to validate... I would recommend waiting till Monday and ask during the day then and see if you can acquire the attention of someone at palm Apr 18 00:35:10 when i try sending text to my older pre the chat baloons do not appear on screen and the text never aron other side either Apr 18 00:35:39 i have preware on the phone and terminal Apr 18 00:35:57 can you send an email to the phone's sms email address? I don't know if you can do that with sprint Apr 18 00:35:59 i am not concerned with losing any data if anyone has any ideas Apr 18 00:36:45 i have not set up the email on this phone yet, it is for my uncle to use and we are currently doing the forgot password waiting game with gmail. Apr 18 00:37:08 I don't know, that's a really weird error Apr 18 00:38:12 is there an email address for the phone # itself through sprint? Apr 18 00:38:29 the terminal app keeps crashing my pre... luna I think Apr 18 00:38:29 eg here in canada it's something like 1234567890@belltxt.ca Apr 18 00:39:11 these phones are on the same account, my phone 434 and my uncles is 964 prefix , same area code , so i have no problem trying to send a text from the 434 to the 964 the texts never arrives tho Apr 18 00:39:56 yes there is an email for the account, but 964 # phone is a sub Apr 18 00:40:20 try sending an email to the phone and see if (a) it arrives or (b) it bounces back Apr 18 00:41:13 i have a spare gmail i will set up on the phone for now Apr 18 00:42:10 I meant send an email to the phone's sms email address Apr 18 00:42:44 how would that look? Apr 18 00:42:54 phonenumber@? Apr 18 00:43:59 something of that order, yeah Apr 18 00:44:12 I don't know what the exact address would be for sprint though... anyone? Apr 18 00:44:54 how do i decide what device i want to palm-install to? Apr 18 00:48:33 for sprint Apr 18 00:48:43 it is phonenu@messaging.sprint.com Apr 18 00:48:44 iirc Apr 18 00:48:51 Lumiere: ta :-) Apr 18 00:49:05 there you go preuser18282... try sending an email to that Apr 18 00:49:30 http://www.tech-recipes.com/rx/939/sms_email_cingular_nextel_sprint_tmobile_verizon_virgin/ Apr 18 00:49:35 sprintpcs.com Apr 18 00:49:37 not sprint.com Apr 18 00:50:01 danke Apr 18 00:50:37 o trying Apr 18 00:51:16 ok i was able to recieve an sms from my email Apr 18 00:52:17 but not when you send to it direct from your other phone? Apr 18 00:52:58 ok i have a contact info card open Apr 18 00:54:00 it has the phone number i want to send sms to, which is my 434 # on the right side is the lil blue sms balloon Apr 18 00:54:17 so you're getting a bit further? Apr 18 00:54:18 its listed as mobile Apr 18 00:54:40 when i tap that sms baloon nothing happens Apr 18 00:56:02 can you get someone locally in your area to try sending you an sms to see if you can reply to it? Apr 18 00:56:03 if i use a different contact, and i tap that sms balloon it opens the conversation card Apr 18 00:56:14 hmmmm Apr 18 00:56:25 oh hang on... did you say these are on the same account? Apr 18 00:56:44 yes my sister, and it worked, anelse whth a dif area code and it worked Apr 18 00:57:04 they use the same nai email Apr 18 00:57:11 hmmmm Apr 18 00:57:23 can you make a phone call on both phones at the same time? Apr 18 00:57:46 this worked before the sprint store moed the contacts from a blackberry Apr 18 00:58:06 i sent m the 434 to the 964 Apr 18 00:58:08 sent a pic Apr 18 00:58:11 yeah, I'm starting to wonder if the sprint bod screwed up doing the transfer Apr 18 00:58:29 but i would have thought that deleting the contact would fix this Apr 18 00:58:35 see if you can make an outbound call to a different number on each phone Apr 18 00:58:52 im going to do a full restore and load the contacts from the cloud Apr 18 00:58:56 well, this is a guess, but the... ESN, I think it is? might have got duplicated on both phones Apr 18 00:59:12 calls work fine Apr 18 00:59:14 that could certainly be worth a try to make sure you're clean, good idea Apr 18 00:59:24 both phones calling out simultaneously? Apr 18 00:59:36 ya that works fine Apr 18 00:59:44 ok, I guess that's not it either than Apr 18 00:59:58 the only problem is the 964 phone wontt open a conversation card with the 434 phone Apr 18 01:00:24 the 434 opens t and tries to send sms to the 964 phone , its just the 964 doesnt get it Apr 18 01:01:13 I think you might need to take it back to sprint and get them to double check everything is OK at the phone level Apr 18 01:01:28 i had problems today getting the data working too Apr 18 01:01:33 something definitely sounds screwy there, and them being on the same account makes me suspect sprint cocked up something Apr 18 01:01:49 hmmmm Apr 18 01:01:51 a lady tried to telin to the palm profile to get the data to wor to speak with someone else Apr 18 01:01:58 that's not a good sign either Apr 18 01:02:14 i think my keyboards batterysw a re dying Apr 18 01:02:19 *grin* Apr 18 01:02:23 I was wondering ;-) Apr 18 01:02:36 im not making sense lol Apr 18 01:03:17 I wonder if your palm profiles are somehow mixed up together on the two phones... I don't know anything about the back end to know how that works though Apr 18 01:03:26 * sbromwich is kernel not user side ;-) Apr 18 01:04:09 when i called sprint for the data not working, this woman told me i needed to sign in to the palm profile to get data to work Apr 18 01:04:33 no they are seperate palm profiles Apr 18 01:05:19 I don't know, I'm afraid... I think it's something sprint are going to have to look into to trace what's happening Apr 18 01:06:51 now it is unable to sign me into plam profile lol Apr 18 01:07:17 yeah, something sounds really screwy there Apr 18 01:10:38 im gona chat @ palm and see what they think Apr 18 01:11:05 good idea :-) Apr 18 01:11:19 * Lumiere suggests getting a gmail account asap and moving data out of palm profile Apr 18 01:11:22 :) Apr 18 01:12:09 i have gmail accounts, but my uncle forgot his gmail password, so we have to wait 24 hours to recover it Apr 18 01:50:22 any volunteers to test out a new kernel? Apr 18 01:50:34 www.fop.ns.ca/pre/uImage.1.4.1-6.10.prcmhack Apr 18 01:52:00 http://blog.mjg.im/2010/04/16/theora-on-n900.html Apr 18 01:52:07 more theora yay! Apr 18 01:52:36 RagingMind: everything in that article is accurate Apr 18 01:55:29 sbromwich: i have fixed it Apr 18 01:55:51 what was it? Apr 18 01:56:14 removing and replacing the battery fixed the palm profile login issue, then once the restore finished i was able to text from 964 to 434 Apr 18 01:56:36 that's a weird one Apr 18 01:56:46 something got really screwed up at the system level, I think Apr 18 01:56:49 doing the full erase Apr 18 01:56:55 good idea ;-) Apr 18 01:57:24 well my uncle took the phone to sprint to move contacts, when he got back i looked and there were none, so we went back. Apr 18 01:57:44 i think it was just something with that contact transfer at sprint Apr 18 01:57:48 sounds like someone screwed up originally and the fixer did something the wrong way round Apr 18 01:57:56 I would agree with your analysis :-) Apr 18 01:57:57 because once the contacts loaded from the cloud it seems fine Apr 18 01:59:17 *nod* Apr 18 01:59:22 sounds reasonable Apr 18 02:00:18 thanks for your help Apr 18 02:19:46 maybe I should be linking all the arm-theora happiness when palm people are hanging around Apr 18 02:38:46 www.fop.ns.ca/pre/uImage.1.4.1-6.10.prcmhack with www.fop.ns.ca/pre/uImage.1.4.1-6.10.prcmhack.cpufreq.txt settings seems quite good, if anyone wants to try? Apr 18 02:38:53 I'm off for the night... laters :-) Apr 18 02:38:57 night **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sun Apr 18 02:59:57 2010