**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu May 06 02:59:56 2010
May 06 03:01:12 <sbromwich> rwhitby: if I set CROSS_COMPILE_armv7 in my Makefile after it includes kernel.mk will that override the setting from support.mk?
May 06 03:03:25 <rwhitby> sbromwich: yes, it should
May 06 03:03:37 <sbromwich> thanks, I'll give that a go
May 06 03:03:44 <FuMan> hrm
May 06 03:04:04 <FuMan> whtas it mean when you are manually adding a ipkg feed, and the dial just spins forever
May 06 03:04:21 <rwhitby> you broke it
May 06 03:04:41 <rwhitby> run "dbus-util --capture ipkgservice" to see what it's doing
May 06 03:06:07 <FuMan> error reading from signal pipe 35
May 06 03:08:13 <sbromwich> http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=preware/build.git;a=summary
May 06 03:08:18 * sbromwich crosses his fingers
May 06 03:08:31 <sbromwich> third time lucky?
May 06 03:10:42 <rwhitby> sbromwich: oh, that may not work on the autobuilder - cause it may not have that toolchain installed
May 06 03:10:51 <rwhitby> sbromwich: I thought you were asking about locally ...
May 06 03:11:09 <FuMan> sbromwich, am i looking for .20, or .21
May 06 03:11:15 <FuMan> just lemme know when a local run works, and ill test OTA
May 06 03:11:19 <sbromwich> hmmm... it's in the build tree, that's where I got it from
May 06 03:11:33 <sbromwich> FuMan: I'm guessing somewhere in the mid 30's at this rate ;-)
May 06 03:12:44 <FuMan> well, then ill get back to studies and check in later
May 06 03:12:57 <sbromwich> good idea ;-)
May 06 03:13:37 <sbromwich> rwhitby: any way to get toolchain/cs08q1armel built on the autobuilder?
May 06 03:13:48 <rwhitby> my new "broken" Pre is working nicely :)
May 06 03:13:55 <sbromwich> gotta love that kind of broken
May 06 03:14:08 <sbromwich> I have a "broken" LCD monitor that only does text in windows
May 06 03:14:20 <sbromwich> runs perfectly in linux connected to my netbook
May 06 03:14:29 <rwhitby> it's even got some new apps installed for me to try.
May 06 03:14:36 <sbromwich> *grin*
May 06 03:15:23 <rwhitby> but alas, I think I'll full erase it anway.
May 06 03:15:53 <rwhitby> hmm - it's still got the owner's phone number in it
May 06 03:16:03 <FuMan> least you could do is text him a thank you
May 06 03:16:12 <FuMan> although, that would probably cost you a hojillion kangaroos
May 06 03:16:58 <rwhitby> Secure Full Erase is the best choice at this point.  He was nice enough to send it to me, so the least I can do is erase any information he left on there.
May 06 03:17:13 <sbromwich> good call
May 06 03:19:45 <rwhitby> sbromwich: 08q1 just happens to be there actually
May 06 03:20:13 <sbromwich> all your base belong to us.
May 06 03:21:09 <sbromwich> time for a glass of the new whisky I picked up today then
May 06 03:21:12 <sbromwich> brb
May 06 03:21:49 * rwhitby bbl
May 06 03:38:29 <FuMan> sbromwich, much success?
May 06 03:38:45 <sbromwich> still waiting on the autobuilder
May 06 03:39:24 <FuMan> another beer then
May 06 03:39:26 <FuMan> brb
May 06 03:39:33 <sbromwich> *grin*
May 06 03:39:44 <sbromwich> compiling on mason in my ~ to see what happens
May 06 03:48:14 <sbromwich> well that built a uImage but complained with error: pathspec 'testing-kernels/sbromwich-kernel-pre/build/headlessapp/v0.1.0' did not match any file(s) known to git.
May 06 03:48:31 <sbromwich> and the ipk is 980 bytes
May 06 03:48:56 <sbromwich> sod
May 06 03:49:03 <sbromwich> time to hassle rwhitby again :-/
May 06 03:50:24 <sbromwich> mason~/build/testing-kernels/sbromwich-kernel-pre/build/headlessapp$ git checkout v0.1.0
May 06 03:50:26 <sbromwich> Note: moving to "v0.1.0" which isn't a local branch
May 06 03:50:28 <sbromwich> hmmmm
May 06 03:50:50 * sbromwich is lost again
May 06 03:51:29 <sbromwich> ah well... time for bed and a fresh set of eyes in the morning
May 06 03:51:30 <sbromwich> laters
May 06 03:51:56 <FuMan> disappointmentface.
May 06 03:51:58 <FuMan> :P
May 06 03:52:01 <FuMan> catch you tomorrow
May 06 04:16:46 <Robi_> new uberkernel?
May 06 04:37:27 <renegaide> is the uber kernel in preware?
May 06 04:41:25 <Robi_> it is
May 06 04:41:30 <Robi_> man every time I read Govnah I laugh
May 06 04:41:47 <Robi_> means something bad in Croatian
May 06 04:50:37 <FuMan> whats it mean
May 06 04:51:29 <sethron> the s word
May 06 04:52:02 <sethron> used translator on me Pre
May 06 04:57:33 * FuMan speaks croation
May 06 05:02:47 <Robi_> if you don't know, i'm not telling
May 06 05:03:06 <Robi_> ok so i think i like the ondemand governor best still
May 06 05:03:14 <Robi_> one of the settings made the ui sluggish
May 06 05:04:13 <FuMan> have i lost my mind
May 06 05:04:19 <FuMan> or did google just refresh
May 06 05:11:43 <Robi_> that's a consequence of their simplistic design, it never looks like it changes, even tho its often tweaked
May 06 05:12:08 <Robi_> maps has nice terrain features and more
May 06 05:15:08 <FuMan> well, this one is a hell of a tweak
May 06 05:15:14 <FuMan> and it looks retarded, especially with adblock
May 06 05:20:33 <ka6sox> evening preoccupied_wirc
May 06 05:21:13 <preoccupied_wirc> ka6sox-away: evening. How's it going?
May 06 05:21:25 <ka6sox> long days working.
May 06 05:22:04 <preoccupied_wirc> Ka6sox: IC. Yeah...im pretty busy as well.
May 06 05:22:22 <ka6sox> school winding down?
May 06 05:23:07 <preoccupied> ka6sox: not yet....i'm in one of those colleges that has a quarter system...so we don't finish till June
May 06 05:24:07 <ka6sox> preoccupied, ah...
May 06 05:24:59 <preoccupied> ka6sox: unfortunately, i was just running off to bed. I'll catch you later and discuss how the data collection is going. I have to admit I've let things slide a bit.
May 06 05:25:25 <ka6sox> don't worry, I'm working on gathering up data from more sources (widening the net).
May 06 05:25:32 <ka6sox> thanks for your help in setting things up!
May 06 05:26:07 <preoccupied> ka6sox: yeah, no prob. later!
May 06 05:26:13 <ka6sox> nite nite
May 06 05:53:24 <JesusMcCloud> does any of you guy know where the volume limit for the back speaker is set (i bought a used palm pre and the speaker seems borked, maybe removing hte limit helps) i#ll be off for univerity now - i'll read log when i get back
May 06 06:01:17 <ShadeS> i do'nt think that's setable
May 06 06:01:36 <ShadeS> it just goes from min to max.. i don't know if you can set max volume limit like on an ipod
May 06 06:02:07 <beelzabub> i love landing huge code rewrites w/ no reviews @ 11pm.  man i've developed some bad habits :)
May 06 06:03:06 <oil> rwhitby: you've opened pres right?
May 06 06:03:32 <oil> http://i40.tinypic.com/5377gw.jpg
May 06 06:03:43 <oil> any idea what these two metal pieces hanging out frmo below the screen are for?
May 06 06:05:30 <rwhitby> oil: that's the spring from the slider I expect
May 06 06:05:43 <oil> it still works
May 06 06:05:48 <oil> the little pieces swing back and forth
May 06 06:05:49 <oil> lol
May 06 06:06:09 <rwhitby> the picture is blurry - got a better one?
May 06 06:06:26 <oil> i used the dev pre to take a pic xD
May 06 06:06:44 <oil> i dont know where the other camera is :/
May 06 06:06:57 <oil> thats the better of the 3 i took
May 06 06:06:57 <oil> haha
May 06 06:07:33 <oil> oh now its not shutting
May 06 06:07:40 <rwhitby> there are two springs, each is two wires
May 06 06:08:06 <rwhitby> looks like one of yours has slipped off the post
May 06 06:08:12 <oil> well i was contemplating weather or not to take it in to get a replacement
May 06 06:08:15 <oil> but now it wont shut
May 06 06:08:24 <oil> so its definitely happening :/
May 06 06:11:33 <oil> oh i forced it, now its good again xD
May 06 06:13:42 <EvanDotPro> rwhitby: http://preware.org/new/webos/ had some time to get it a little bit further along
May 06 06:14:47 <rwhitby> EvanDotPro: need a better battery on that
May 06 06:14:54 <EvanDotPro> lol
May 06 06:15:10 <rwhitby> can't have the website shutting down on us
May 06 06:15:20 <oil> lol
May 06 06:15:21 <rwhitby> I like the fades
May 06 06:15:24 <oil> whats that for?
May 06 06:15:37 <EvanDotPro> i was thinking it'd be fun to have a little browser in there, but there's no way to zoom an iframe via css or JS :(
May 06 06:16:20 <EvanDotPro> oil: we're going to make it so you can browse Preware via a "simulator" of sorts.
May 06 06:16:39 <oil> it will look weird
May 06 06:16:55 <EvanDotPro> oil: why do you say that?
May 06 06:17:00 <oil> the font
May 06 06:17:53 <EvanDotPro> maybe a little, yeah.
May 06 06:18:01 <EvanDotPro> we can't exactly use prelude on there :-p
May 06 06:18:39 <EvanDotPro> but, it'll be close enough for it's purpose.
May 06 06:18:46 <oil> and thats why it will look weird :)
May 06 06:20:05 <EvanDotPro> i mean, we _could_ technically with sIFR, but A) that'd be really hacky, and B) not sure how palm / hp would feel.
May 06 06:44:38 <rwhitby> hmm - looks like there is some intermittent fault with this "broken" Pre
May 06 06:55:11 <EvanDotPro> heh, actually oil, rwhitby... it looks pretty awesome using sIFR with prelude/coconut :p
May 06 06:59:17 <EvanDotPro> sIFR even has support for text shadows and stuff so i can make it match exactly
May 06 07:01:49 <rwhitby> sweet
May 06 07:02:53 <jhoplus> ka6sox: ping?
May 06 07:03:46 <jhoplus> you should use goog docs for your govnah settings data collection. they have an option to publish a form
May 06 07:03:58 <rwhitby> jhoplus: good idea
May 06 07:04:22 <jhoplus> that way we can share in analyzing the data too
May 06 07:05:17 <hape> morning
May 06 10:34:43 <hape> dose the upstart service, that was used to start sdl apps before we find out how to do it via the appinfo.jason, is still exisiting?
May 06 10:34:57 <hape> I can not find it in the wiki or forum
May 06 10:45:18 <rwhitby> hape: yes, it still exists - all the webos-internals games use it
May 06 11:30:58 <hape> rwhitby: is there any docu avalable? Could it be used for this idea => http://forums.precentral.net/webos-patches/245265-patch-req-use-espeak-announce-name-incomming-caller.html
May 06 11:32:26 <RagingMind> is there a built in way to add more pages to launcher? or do I have to patch for that?
May 06 11:33:11 <RagingMind> uNiXpSyChO, good morning
May 06 11:33:18 <uNiXpSyChO> morning
May 06 11:39:13 <hape> RagingMind: This is a patch. It is included in more the one patches
May 06 15:53:20 <nt4cats> I have been on this channel for 3 hours and 3 minutes, and no one has said a word in that time.
May 06 15:53:47 <nt4cats> ~botsnack
May 06 15:53:47 <infobot> aw, gee, nt4cats
May 06 15:54:12 <nt4cats> ~git-tutorial
May 06 15:54:13 <infobot> well, git-tutorial is http://www.eecs.harvard.edu/~cduan/technical/git/
May 06 15:56:53 <nt4cats> infobot: precentral is http://www.precentral.com/
May 06 15:56:54 <infobot> ...but precentral is already something else...
May 06 15:57:12 <en0x> oh
May 06 15:57:16 <nt4cats> infobot: pre-news-site is http://www.precentral.com/
May 06 15:57:17 <infobot> nt4cats: okay
May 06 15:57:25 <en0x> sprint ftw+ they annouced new pre-paid plans
May 06 15:57:26 <nt4cats> ~pre-news-site
May 06 15:57:27 <infobot> it has been said that pre-news-site is http://www.precentral.com/
May 06 15:57:28 <en0x> Starting on May 12, three new Beyond Talk plans will include unlimited messaging, email, data, and web, as well as 300 minutes ($25), 1,200 minutes ($40), or unlimited minutes ($60) of talk time.
May 06 15:58:30 <nt4cats> infobot: forget pre-news-site
May 06 15:58:30 <infobot> nt4cats: i forgot pre-news-site
May 06 15:59:53 <Ron001> Hi everyone.  Is this the appropriate place to mention a glitch in the Govnah app?
May 06 16:00:04 <en0x> Ron001: yes
May 06 16:00:53 <Ron001> en0x: with Govnah open, and the app catalog open, the icons in the catalog flicker and scrolling is interupted with short pauses.
May 06 16:01:47 <Marajin> whee.. apparently removing an email account was enough to completely flumox webos..
May 06 16:01:55 <en0x> oil: ^ notice it
May 06 16:02:13 <en0x> i removed an email account once on my pre
May 06 16:02:16 <en0x> with 500 contacts
May 06 16:02:29 <en0x> it took 10 minutes to remove the contacts from palmdatabase.db3
May 06 16:02:29 <en0x> ;D
May 06 16:05:39 <Marajin> en0x: oh my device just completely puddled itself. It now shows a blank tab when I open email
May 06 16:05:49 <Marajin> I'm thinking it'll need doctoring
May 06 16:06:23 <en0x> Ron001: for sure some of the govnah app devs will se it or put it on the wiki talk page
May 06 16:06:47 <en0x> Marajin: i maybe doctored mine 3 times... mostly on the begining because I was crazy with it
May 06 16:07:48 <Marajin> en0x: I've only had to doctor.. twice I believe
May 06 16:08:04 <Marajin> and both times was because the US and EU releases were out of sync originally
May 06 16:08:16 <Marajin> so I was switching UK -> US then US -> UK
May 06 16:09:45 <en0x> i c
May 06 16:11:11 <Marajin> but yes.. this has really gone titsup
May 06 16:26:57 <karotte_exe> hi
May 06 16:27:11 <karotte_exe> i have a problem with my GPS
May 06 16:27:37 <karotte_exe> im using webOS 1.4.1.1 and GPS didn't work
May 06 16:28:10 <karotte_exe> sry, WebOS 1 .4.1
May 06 16:29:11 <en0x> verizon?
May 06 16:29:52 <karotte_exe> nope
May 06 16:30:00 <karotte_exe> O2 in europe
May 06 16:30:09 <karotte_exe> exactly germany
May 06 16:30:35 <hucksy> yeah i have problems too
May 06 16:30:53 <karotte_exe> needs it to be activated?
May 06 16:32:05 <hucksy> no, it works, but... mostly not
May 06 16:32:14 <hucksy> dont know why
May 06 16:32:54 <karotte_exe> hm... :( are you by O2 too?
May 06 16:33:01 <hucksy> yep
May 06 16:33:08 <karotte_exe> germany?
May 06 16:33:11 <hucksy> yep
May 06 16:33:34 <karotte_exe> hm... maby i have to phone the service ^^
May 06 16:34:22 <hucksy> hmm tell me if they say something that helps ;)
May 06 16:34:32 <karotte_exe> kk
May 06 16:34:36 <hucksy> tnx
May 06 16:41:26 <karotte_exe> hucksy: bin jetzt mal in der warteschleife xD
May 06 16:41:29 <karotte_exe> test
May 06 16:41:38 <hucksy> hehe k
May 06 16:41:52 <karotte_exe> hm... geht niemand dran :(
May 06 16:44:41 <Marajin> EvanDotPro: hah, I tried adding an account instead, it said that my account already exists and started listing all the accounts again
May 06 16:44:47 <Marajin> EvanDotPro: sorry, mischat
May 06 16:44:55 <EvanDotPro> lol no problem.
May 06 16:44:55 <Marajin> en0x: that was meant for you, damn autocomplete :p
May 06 17:11:13 <JesusMcCloud> i just saw debain runs on the pre (dont worry no noobish questions, i know my way around linux, i am just no tin the mood to read through all the foum posts) i would just like to have one term explained:
May 06 17:12:30 <Jordon> Could someone tell me exactly what preware is supposed to do? If i read it right im guessing its like cydia for the iphone?
May 06 17:13:43 <JesusMcCloud> how did you imagine installing debian packages using preware? i mean how would you launch them? because i think i have an idea (not sure though) would someone who is working on debian integration ping me when the read that, cause i'd like to spitball with someone involved for a few minutes
May 06 17:13:45 <FuMan> Jordon, essentially
May 06 17:14:29 <halfhalo_T400> But preware is BETTER!
May 06 17:14:44 <Jordon> ok. Also after I installed it i keep getting a message saying The Service is not running. First try restarting Preware, or reboot your phone and try again. And I've already rebooted my phone.
May 06 17:14:59 <halfhalo_T400> Did you install the package manager service?
May 06 17:15:27 <Jordon> I just followed the instructions in the webos quickinstall
May 06 17:16:25 <halfhalo_T400> I don't know how the wqsi procedure works... been to long
May 06 17:16:59 <Jordon> oh woops i think I did look over the package management thing
May 06 17:17:12 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, ping
May 06 17:18:59 <Jordonizblonde> hey it works now!!
May 06 17:26:12 <nt4cats> 'lo iSmite
May 06 17:41:18 <chrisa> greetings internet
May 06 17:41:24 <beelzabub> yo
May 06 17:47:48 <RagingMind> I wish there was a gui for openvpn
May 06 17:48:53 <nt4cats> RagingMind: are you trying to do something fancy with openvpn?
May 06 17:49:14 <nt4cats> RagingMind: ... because for simple remote access cases the config file is simple ...
May 06 17:49:33 <RagingMind> if by fancy you mean be able to set it up and make changes without typing stuff on a command line. yet
May 06 17:49:35 <RagingMind> *yes
May 06 17:49:55 <nt4cats> No that sounds like "lazy", not "fancy" ;)
May 06 17:50:19 <nt4cats> <-- and I am as lazy as they come, so that isn't a slam
May 06 17:50:39 <RagingMind> I don't like any of the terminal apps for the pre
May 06 17:51:24 <RagingMind> the one that has the better interface crashes my pre every time I use it and the other one is just uncomfortable to use
May 06 18:16:01 <sbromwich> for anyone who needs more unicorns: pls see http://browncardigan.com/imagesfarm/0Yutp41rROoX0cv.jpg
May 06 18:16:13 <halfhalo_class> MY EYES
May 06 18:16:16 <halfhalo_class> THEY BURN
May 06 18:16:43 <sbromwich> maybe http://www.thinkgeek.com/images/products/zoom/unicorn-chaser.jpg would help
May 06 18:16:56 <sbromwich> (possibly not)
May 06 18:20:36 <sbromwich> the full (possibly NSFW) version is at http://www.thinkgeek.com/images/products/zoom/unicorn-chaser.jpg
May 06 18:20:41 <sbromwich> no.
May 06 18:20:46 <sbromwich> http://erooups.com/2010/04/15/omg_and_wtf_of_the_day_11_pics.html
May 06 18:21:01 <sbromwich> that will melt off your face as well as your eyes.
May 06 18:21:03 <sbromwich> enjoy!
May 06 18:22:40 * uNiXpSyChO has a rusty fork in his eye
May 06 18:22:59 <halfhalo_class> I am NOT looking at any more links from now on
May 06 18:23:24 <halfhalo_class> Adora, Run before the unicorns get you!
May 06 18:23:32 <Adora> !
May 06 18:23:38 * uNiXpSyChO stuck a butter knife in the other eye
May 06 18:23:42 * Adora runs
May 06 18:23:50 <halfhalo_class> All I have are spoons!!!
May 06 18:24:04 <Adora> I cut my thumb in half with a butter knife once
May 06 18:24:05 <uNiXpSyChO> force it in there!!!
May 06 18:24:06 <Adora> true story
May 06 18:24:39 <halfhalo_class> I never cut myself with knife blades
May 06 18:24:51 <halfhalo_class> hilts are a different story
May 06 18:25:57 <en0x> w00t
May 06 18:26:02 <en0x> i just got 1.4.2 update
May 06 18:26:08 <halfhalo_class> ?
May 06 18:26:36 <en0x> halfhalo_class: wanna apple juice?
May 06 18:26:41 <halfhalo_class> yes
May 06 18:26:52 <en0x> then go to a store and get me a bottle
May 06 18:27:02 <halfhalo_class> Yeahno
May 06 18:27:08 <halfhalo_class> http://adweek.blogs.com/adfreak/epicads13.html
May 06 18:27:10 <en0x> buehehe
May 06 18:27:19 <en0x> infobot: seen atlant
May 06 18:27:20 <en0x> infobot: seen atlanta
May 06 18:27:21 <infobot> en0x: i haven't seen 'atlant'
May 06 18:27:22 <infobot> atlanta <~c6167a04@gateway/web/freenode/x-uxrugnxpbhfspyyh> was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 14d 50m 17s ago, saying: 'webf: added u on gtalk'.
May 06 18:28:20 <en0x> booring...
May 06 18:34:44 <RagingMind> sbromwich, LMAO (at the links)
May 06 18:39:21 <Marajin> en0x: Does it make coffee for you?
May 06 18:40:17 <en0x> it makes great espresso
May 06 18:43:09 <RagingMind> the verizon agps news makes me sad :(
May 06 18:48:30 <swisstomcat> heya
May 06 18:59:26 <en0x> good i don't have verizon
May 06 18:59:27 <en0x> :d
May 06 18:59:35 <halfhalo_class> yeah
May 06 18:59:49 <halfhalo_class> I be hungry like a hungry hippo
May 06 19:01:32 <en0x> lol
May 06 19:16:39 <RagingMind> anyone in here know about the pre bluetooth stack?
May 06 19:17:17 <jhojho__> its proprietary
May 06 19:17:27 <RagingMind> :(
May 06 19:26:51 <DrFunk> sup all
May 06 19:26:55 <RagingMind> hello
May 06 19:27:47 <DrFunk> anyone know if we have skype or something like it
May 06 19:27:55 <Ebag333> nope
May 06 19:28:07 <Ebag333> Google Voice is the closest
May 06 19:29:08 <Ebag333> anyone have a Verizon Pre that has been having GPS problems and is willing to do some testing? (And most likely break stuff. :D ).  I have an idea I want to test out, but unfortunately for me (or fortunately) I'm on Sprint....
May 06 19:29:08 <DrFunk> wow
May 06 19:30:08 <DrFunk> so Ebag333 were stuck with google that's it
May 06 19:30:09 <RagingMind> Ebag333, how badly break?
May 06 19:30:16 <RagingMind> cause I really want GPS to work
May 06 19:30:50 <Ebag333> it's only a patch, but who knows, you might need to doctor your phone
May 06 19:31:03 <RagingMind> wanna explain what it'd do?
May 06 19:31:04 <swisstomcat> ebag333: i can test .. it's a meta-doctored verizon pre plus tho
May 06 19:31:49 <Ebag333> I suspect I found some undocumented features for GPS location services that allow you to use a host/port for what appears to be Verizons aGPS server
May 06 19:32:06 <Ebag333> so the patch would add those undocumented parameters to several files
May 06 19:32:25 <Ebag333> the idea hopefully being mimicing how Verizon Navigator gets GPS info
May 06 19:32:26 <RagingMind> having to doctor my phone... doesn't sound too bad
May 06 19:32:42 <RagingMind> getting kicked off verizon all together... na...
May 06 19:32:57 <RagingMind> I really don't think they'd be happy
May 06 19:33:16 <Ebag333> the other problem is I'm working off an old verizon dump....so it might not be the same in 1.4.1....so it'd be best if I could get the current files in case they changed
May 06 19:33:37 <RagingMind> so far just opening the verizon nav app seems to help.  I have have to be careful that I don't accidentally hit the buy button
May 06 19:33:58 <Ebag333> well I don't know how they'd know.  Verizon Nav uses the same functions to get GPS as everything else, just adds the server/port to other programs
May 06 19:36:18 <RagingMind> my cat is mad at my laptop.  she wants me to move it so she can sit in my lap
May 06 19:37:02 <oil> well get it out of the way
May 06 19:37:08 <oil> or itl kill you while you sleep!
May 06 19:37:35 <RagingMind> that's one reason I like my pre. I can IRC, watch TV, and still have room for the kitty
May 06 19:38:15 <oil> http://www.catswhothrowupgrass.com/kill.php
May 06 19:43:21 <RagingMind> I wonder if they changed the vznavigator somehow... when I first got my phone (1.3.5) I could open it and it seemed like I could get a lock a lot faster
May 06 19:43:33 <RagingMind> now it doesn't seem to help anymore :(
May 06 19:48:28 <Ebag333> I bet they did
May 06 19:48:45 <Ebag333> the one I'm looking at (which is old), VZNav connects to the aGPS server when you open it
May 06 19:48:58 <Ebag333> which would allow you to run it, then close it, and have a aGPS fix
May 06 19:49:11 <Ebag333> No idea what the new one looks like
May 06 19:49:39 <RagingMind> without potentially getting me kicked off verizon I'm willing to look into at least that much on my 1.4.1
May 06 19:51:23 <RagingMind> brb
May 06 19:59:47 <RagingMind> oops. k I'm back
May 06 20:00:06 <Ebag333> so patch is ready....
May 06 20:00:14 <RagingMind> for 1.3.5?
May 06 20:00:34 <Ebag333> Probably, no idea if the files changed or not between then and now
May 06 20:00:54 <Ebag333> although...actually...they were the same between sprint and verizon, so I guess I should check my phone and see if they changed...
May 06 20:03:36 <RagingMind> I should install bash so that I can have 'ls --color'
May 06 20:09:03 <RagingMind> I do have a /usr/lib/vznavigator/VZNavigatorService process running on my phone
May 06 20:31:41 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: pong
May 06 20:32:49 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, <JesusMcCloud> how did you imagine installing debian packages using preware? i mean how would you launch them? because i think i have an idea (not sure though)
May 06 20:35:07 <Ebag333> so.....no other Verizon users in here?
May 06 20:36:56 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: I'm not sure that anyone went so far as actually spec'ing out an integration of the two. preware is a front-end to command-line stuff anyway, having it hit up a script to enter whatever debian environment we create, and interacting with apt-get shouldn't be too hard. I'd imagine work by other apt-get frontends (heck, cydia from iphone comes to mind) would be useful to look at
May 06 20:37:35 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: regarding launching them.. not sure. really depends on what solution we come up with for other pieces like the fs
May 06 20:38:11 <dtzWill> one thing is I'm not sure that we're necessarily even going the debian route.  might make sense to just install our own packages entirely, but that's a bit more time-consuming on our parts :)
May 06 20:38:58 <dtzWill> allll that said, what was your idea JesusMcCloud ?
May 06 20:39:05 <JesusMcCloud> (Was on the phone, reading now)
May 06 20:39:13 <JesusMcCloud> sec
May 06 20:39:14 <dtzWill> as you can see we have a bit of a idea-pot going here, feel free to throw another in :)
May 06 20:39:26 <dtzWill> (no worries, no hurry)
May 06 20:41:02 <JesusMcCloud> well since debian apps are not gonna look native anyways i figured sth like this: (beware i am not sure i understood correctly how xserver is implemented on the pre atm)
May 06 20:47:40 <RagingMind> dtzWill, isn't DSL debian based? maybe a place to start?
May 06 20:50:24 <zsoc_wirc> So I nee some input on beta release tonight for voice recorder / ringtone cutter
May 06 20:50:32 <zsoc_wirc> input as in, the name
May 06 20:50:48 <nt4cats> zsoc_wirc: DrewTone
May 06 20:51:02 <RagingMind> just don't include "pre" in the title
May 06 20:52:29 <nt4cats> zsoc_wirc: DrewCorder
May 06 20:52:43 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: that's why I'm changing it /away/ from precorder
May 06 20:52:55 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: you are always trustworthy for serious suggestions
May 06 20:53:20 * nt4cats puts on his serious hat (which doesn't get used very often)
May 06 20:53:37 * VincentLaw notes that the serious hat is a large sombrero
May 06 20:53:54 <nt4cats> ClipMaker
May 06 20:54:07 <nt4cats> ClipCorder
May 06 20:54:16 <dtzWill> RagingMind: idk about dsl. very well could be
May 06 20:54:23 <zsoc_wirc> RagingMind: somewhere along the lines of Trololo or Pcorder
May 06 20:54:31 <nt4cats> ToneGrabber
May 06 20:54:33 <RagingMind> dtzWill, at one point in time it was
May 06 20:54:45 <zsoc_wirc> Cliprasta
May 06 20:55:01 <Ebag333> DSL is still debian AFAIK
May 06 20:55:07 <zsoc_wirc> Clipwreaksta!
May 06 20:55:12 <Ebag333> "Transform into a Debian OS with a traditional hard drive install"
May 06 20:55:45 <nt4cats> I would say "Clip-oris", but i have the serious hat on ...
May 06 20:55:50 <zsoc_wirc> Clipreq/Clipwreak is actually rather clever
May 06 20:56:00 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: AHAHAHAHA
May 06 20:56:01 <RagingMind> DLS is nice and small, but semi full of features.  shouldn't be too hard to customize it
May 06 20:56:01 <nt4cats> Clipreq is good
May 06 20:56:33 <nt4cats> so far I like Clipreq
May 06 20:57:12 <RagingMind> ClipWreck? :)
May 06 20:57:26 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, my network disconnected
May 06 20:57:27 <RagingMind> if you're hacking sound bites into ringtones?
May 06 20:57:38 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: welcome back, and yeah noticed :(.
May 06 20:57:40 <nt4cats> soundbite
May 06 20:57:52 <VincentLaw> SoundBiter
May 06 20:58:13 <JesusMcCloud> want me to send you in private or here? its quite a bit for irc...
May 06 20:58:24 <RagingMind> Ebag333, I responded to your pvt
May 06 20:58:49 <nt4cats> ToneBiter
May 06 20:58:57 <nt4cats> (I like soundbiter better)
May 06 20:59:22 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, in general my approach is about integrating debian apps better into webos (without modification) but representing each app as one "card" in webOS
May 06 20:59:30 <VincentLaw> Noisemaker :P
May 06 20:59:38 <nt4cats> Noisemaker -- that's good
May 06 21:00:19 <VincentLaw> ThisAppRecordsStuff
May 06 21:00:21 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: yep, we're looking into that for sure. that would go a long way towards usability. each top-level window having it's own card would be wonderful
May 06 21:00:43 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: VincentLaw: RagingMind: it's primary function is just a voice recorder
May 06 21:00:55 <JesusMcCloud> (it is just an idea to bounce around with and i dunno what was discussed aleady):
May 06 21:00:56 <VincentLaw> then SoundBiter :P
May 06 21:00:58 <nt4cats> SottoVoce
May 06 21:01:03 <nt4cats> BonoVoce
May 06 21:01:09 <JesusMcCloud> 1. debain runs in background
May 06 21:01:10 <nt4cats> (quiet voice)
May 06 21:01:18 <nt4cats> (pretty voice)
May 06 21:01:23 <nt4cats> (check the spelling of my italian)
May 06 21:01:35 <VincentLaw> Voxcorder
May 06 21:01:47 <nt4cats> VoxGrabber
May 06 21:01:56 <nt4cats> clipvox
May 06 21:02:04 <nt4cats> grabbavox
May 06 21:02:04 <zsoc_wirc> voxlo
May 06 21:02:06 <zsoc_wirc> :D
May 06 21:02:08 <VincentLaw> VoxBiter :P
May 06 21:02:13 <JesusMcCloud> 2. debian apps are launcher icons in webos launcher calling scripts (debian is not visible at that point)
May 06 21:02:38 <JesusMcCloud> (now here comes the part i am not sure about, because i dunno how X (forwarding) is implemented in webos):
May 06 21:02:47 <nt4cats> WhoopieCorder (put on the bedside table after your wife has had a few glasses of wine)
May 06 21:03:18 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: re: 2. yeppers, have you seen xterm? it's not debian but that's the idea we're going for. although one concern is population of the menu with only applications that make sense/people want.. there are a LOT of details to get right :(
May 06 21:03:21 <nt4cats> (only needs 2 1/2 minute capacity for the WhoopieCorder function)
May 06 21:04:17 <VincentLaw> VoxMemory
May 06 21:04:33 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: did you take your hat off?
May 06 21:04:41 <nt4cats> other words for speaking/voice ...
May 06 21:04:45 <nt4cats> chat
May 06 21:04:50 <nt4cats> chatter
May 06 21:05:10 <JesusMcCloud> variant one: each app has its own xserver started so we have one cards per app (and maybe but only maye a minimalist wm to handle dialog windows etc...)
May 06 21:05:13 <VincentLaw> Phonographer
May 06 21:05:25 <nt4cats> zsoc_wirc: the wind blew it off momentarily
May 06 21:05:29 <zsoc_wirc> zsocorder
May 06 21:05:41 <nt4cats> chatgrabber
May 06 21:06:16 <VincentLaw> Vocoder lawl
May 06 21:06:26 <VincentLaw> or rather vocorder
May 06 21:06:53 <VincentLaw> TalkToThePalm
May 06 21:06:57 <nt4cats> nice!
May 06 21:06:59 <nt4cats> TTTP
May 06 21:07:02 <JesusMcCloud> variant 2: (wait a sec i have an idea about emnu population, will tell you afterwards) one xserver+minimalistic WM and a window-aware VNC so each application has its own card (not sure about that variant)
May 06 21:08:12 <nt4cats> I assume you've discarded the idea of something straightforward like "Voice Recorder"
May 06 21:08:33 <nt4cats> because an icon that says "voice recorder" under it would be pretty clear
May 06 21:08:37 <JesusMcCloud> menu population: using the "categories" section in the .desktop file like desktop environments do, and only if it matches certain categories we display it in the launcher
May 06 21:08:52 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, what do you think, is this stuff worth considering?
May 06 21:09:26 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: first idea would work (multiple x servers) but I fear it'd be too expensive.  that and managing all those would be a bit intense, but mostly just worried at the cost
May 06 21:09:47 <JesusMcCloud> i thought about that too
May 06 21:09:50 <VincentLaw> nt4cats: psh, forget plain names. It has to be amusing! TTTP ftw
May 06 21:10:10 <nt4cats> pillowtalk, babytalk, crosstalk, {word}talk
May 06 21:10:11 <dtzWill> variant 2 is close to what we're considering, although without the overhead of VNC. we're making X 'window-aware', and luckily there's already good work in the x tree for this (see multi-window X, or rootless X)
May 06 21:10:52 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: menu population sounds right on the money. i don't do much with that so i'm not sure how it works, but those are just text files containing path to binary and some metadata right? sounds good to me
May 06 21:10:57 <nt4cats> you use a voice recorder so that you can remember stuff ... so how about 'total recall'
May 06 21:11:21 <nt4cats> play it again sam
May 06 21:11:22 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: your solutoins are very practicle in the sense that they can be built entirely using tech/software we have right now.
May 06 21:11:27 <nt4cats> what did he say?
May 06 21:11:34 <nt4cats> [s]he
May 06 21:11:44 <VincentLaw> That's what she said
May 06 21:11:50 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: and to that end they might be what we end up doing if our crazy ideas don't pan out due to technical reasons/time.
May 06 21:11:52 <JesusMcCloud> (window aware vnc woudl require to write another webos app but i think there already exist vnc, though i have not checked)
May 06 21:11:56 <nt4cats> VincentLaw: want to borrow my hat?
May 06 21:12:21 <dtzWill> i'd very much like to avoid yet another layer of indirection like VNC, but it /would/ work.
May 06 21:12:23 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, i only know rootless X from xming, but is there actually a working opensource variant?
May 06 21:12:32 * nt4cats is the best person ever to call someone out for being silly ...
May 06 21:12:33 <VincentLaw> nt4cats: your hat is big enough for two to wear
May 06 21:13:36 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: bunch of the x code talks about rootless, have /not/ looked into it yet at all.
May 06 21:14:10 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: so...hopefully there is :)
May 06 21:14:22 <nt4cats> VincentLaw: did you know that in medieval literature the size of a woman's hat was often a symbol for the size of her pudenda (e.g. in the "Wife of Bath's tale" this image is clearly used)
May 06 21:14:44 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, i sure hope so, but i am afraid there is none :-/
May 06 21:15:00 <nt4cats> chatterbox
May 06 21:15:30 <VincentLaw> nt4cats: that's uhm, thanks for the info? :P
May 06 21:15:31 <zsoc_wirc> if it ever makes to app cat.. it's going to be called Ultimate Recorder, lol
May 06 21:15:41 <VincentLaw> Uber Recorder
May 06 21:15:54 <JesusMcCloud> and the vnc overhead is not that bad (133 Mhz pentium can do it... yes i know arm is totally different from x86 but the pre has a nice amount of ponies under the hood)
May 06 21:16:02 <zsoc_wirc> I was thinking that
May 06 21:16:39 <nt4cats> VincentLaw: you can't say that you didn't learn something today -- and the next time you're reading medieval literature you'll have something to watch out for.
May 06 21:17:08 <nt4cats> Supa Recorder
May 06 21:17:21 <nt4cats> Super 'corder
May 06 21:17:30 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: pudenda size is not really considered a factor anymore, unfortunately
May 06 21:17:36 <VincentLaw> SuperPreKorder
May 06 21:17:43 <zsoc_wirc> nt4cats: I find pelvis-to-pundenda ratio a make or break
May 06 21:17:55 <zsoc_wirc> VincentLaw: hahaha
May 06 21:19:09 <nt4cats> well the size of a woman's pudenda was used to symbolize the level of enthusiasm she brought to (and the frequency she 'practiced' with) carnal endeavors
May 06 21:19:27 <nt4cats> My train station is next, I'll be back on in a bit
May 06 21:30:24 * phil_bw sighs
May 06 21:30:40 <phil_bw> just another day of making the Pre doing things it was never intended to do...
May 06 21:30:41 <JesusMcCloud> dtzWill, x11vnc shoudl be available in debain armel aswell (see private chat for the magic option that makes singel-window vnc possible)
May 06 21:30:54 <JesusMcCloud> phil_bw, hells yeah!
May 06 21:31:02 * phil_bw just *printed* an office document from his Pre
May 06 21:31:09 <dtzWill> phil_bw: :D:D:D
May 06 21:31:36 <phil_bw> if you've got a network accessible hp printer it's incredibly simple
May 06 21:31:46 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: yeah x11vnc is in debian, use it from time to time :). you can also use it to vnc the device's framebuffer (luna goodness) which is cute
May 06 21:32:45 <phil_bw> dtzWill, you really should see where i've taken fvwm.  It is very simple to manage large windows that keep running away then snap right back to the "main" view
May 06 21:33:16 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: well you make a good point. i was particularly attached to using /x/ as the primary view so we could eventually have a bunch of nifty x things (glx, xrandr, etc). else there's not too much point to X at all--we would just use xvfb+vnc
May 06 21:33:32 <dtzWill> although i'm not sure what the status of a working vnc client is
May 06 21:34:02 <phil_bw> last I talked to zonyl he was working on an SDL based vnc client
May 06 21:34:28 <dtzWill> yeah i think he was the one, but idk if that's done/how far along it is.
May 06 21:34:50 <JesusMcCloud> hmm well at least vnc has been around for ages... and if were lucky we just need a stadard vnc client because x11vnc will manage singe window
May 06 21:34:56 <phil_bw> vnc works quite well from X
May 06 21:35:16 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: definitely worth looking into. next 2-3 weeks are busy as crap for me (but here I am on IRC) so I won't be able to investigate until later
May 06 21:35:23 <phil_bw> I use the gnome package that neatly packages VNC and RDP into a simple to use configuration/launcher
May 06 21:35:31 <dtzWill> phil_bw: he's suggesting dropping X, and using per-application vnc
May 06 21:35:55 <dtzWill> phil_bw: yeah that's nice. vino or something?
May 06 21:35:59 <phil_bw> dtzWill, that'd be ideal I agree
May 06 21:36:17 <dtzWill> i don't agree at all :(. i want multi-window x :(
May 06 21:36:25 <phil_bw> dtzWill, umm I think it's just "Gnome VNC somethinranother"
May 06 21:36:42 <phil_bw> same here, hence all of my time dumped into this window manager
May 06 21:36:57 <dtzWill> just running vnc to connect locally on TOP of x ... i mean there's already the x->sdl->luna->fb nonsense lol :/
May 06 21:37:11 <phil_bw> now if I could make the orange key sticky and perhaps get the alt key (maybe mapped to sym) I'd have a *lot* more power
May 06 21:37:30 <dtzWill> phil_bw: well sym presently is used to get us some keys you wouldn't have otherwise
May 06 21:37:47 <dtzWill> phil_bw: that seemed more important and an alt meta key, although i'm sure some combination/system could be figured out
May 06 21:38:00 <jwm> damn comcast
May 06 21:38:12 <jwm> uploading a large file and my connection magically slows down?
May 06 21:38:33 <phil_bw> dtzWill, what keys does sym get you while in X?  It won't pull up the usual symbol map
May 06 21:39:12 <dtzWill> phil_bw: of course it doesn't :). but it gets you... \, `, {, }, >, <
May 06 21:39:40 <dtzWill> although i have realized we're missing [] :(
May 06 21:40:00 <phil_bw> dtzWill, how does it get your those symbols?
May 06 21:40:07 <phil_bw> or should I have read some documentation that I didn't...
May 06 21:40:12 <dtzWill> phil_bw: http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Application:X :)
May 06 21:40:27 <dtzWill> phil_bw: no worries about not reading it, but linking that table for future reference/etc.
May 06 21:40:51 <phil_bw> oh look at taht
May 06 21:41:02 <phil_bw> the wiki has been updated (when I started on this project there was nothing there)
May 06 21:41:11 <dtzWill> phil_bw: yep :)
May 06 21:41:41 <phil_bw> see, the reason I want alt so bad is because of some of the other featuers of fvwm such as "strokes"
May 06 21:41:45 <phil_bw> which are basically gestures
May 06 21:41:58 <phil_bw> you can assign "Alt plus up/down stroke" to scrolling a doc
May 06 21:41:58 <JesusMcCloud> well since cant present any actual work, i'll focus on my university crap again
May 06 21:43:26 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: "present any actual work"?
May 06 21:44:36 <phil_bw> dtzWill, could you map say left gesture to control and right gesture to alt (dont know if that's even possible)
May 06 21:45:04 <dtzWill> phil_bw: that's not possible based on what SDL gives us, no. (do you know an app that can tell the difference?)
May 06 21:45:14 <dtzWill> phil_bw: we could always SWIPE left/right and have sticky modifiers for those xD
May 06 21:45:52 <phil_bw> dtzWill, didn't quake use different regions?  or was it swipe too...
May 06 21:45:58 <JesusMcCloud> my english is fubar today... i was just buoncing ideas... now that that's done (x11 vnc has all the features for singe window.. even menus that show outside the application) i will focus on university exams
May 06 21:46:31 <dtzWill> JesusMcCloud: good call. I'm doing the same :). thanks for your ideas and please/feel free to come back to further discuss/help make those ideas happen :)
May 06 21:46:40 <dtzWill> phil_bw: it was swipe as well
May 06 21:46:53 <phil_bw> ah
May 06 21:47:07 <JesusMcCloud> dont worry, i will, because i am like herpes: i keep coming back!
May 06 21:47:23 <phil_bw> or swipe left and gesture becomes control, swipe left and gesture becomes alt (if that's not what you already meant)
May 06 21:47:39 <dtzWill> phil_bw: that's not at all what i meant and that's loads better haha
May 06 21:47:41 <phil_bw> er swipe right for the second one
May 06 21:47:46 <dtzWill> phil_bw: right
May 06 21:48:04 <phil_bw> that way it'd be easy to quickly switch from gesture area to pan and gesture area to scroll
May 06 21:48:06 <dtzWill> phil_bw: we need to write these down somewhere, so we/i/somoene can actually do them, or review them later.
May 06 21:48:15 <dtzWill> phil_bw: well and more generally gets you both modifiers :)
May 06 21:48:23 <dtzWill> although we still have the gesture+{x,c,v} issue :(
May 06 21:48:24 <phil_bw> exactly
May 06 21:48:49 <phil_bw> yeah
May 06 21:49:12 <phil_bw> I ended up using Gesture + F for the "snap back" feature
May 06 21:49:36 <idontwan2know> The people in the VZW GPS threads kill me.
May 06 21:50:16 <idontwan2know> They act like it's totally inconceivable and wacko that Verizon might cripple features of a phone so that they can charge you to access them.
May 06 21:50:56 <chrisa> Dear internet, in case you weren't aware the carriers do not have your interests in mind
May 06 21:51:03 <chrisa> sincerely, me
May 06 21:51:10 <idontwan2know> indeed
May 06 21:51:25 <phil_bw> you win some you lose some
May 06 21:51:34 <chrisa> no, you win none with carriers
May 06 21:51:38 <phil_bw> Verizon users get tethering straight out of the box bot screwy GPS
May 06 21:52:04 <phil_bw> Sprint users have to hack tethering on there phones but get *better* GPS (not to be confused with *good* GPS)
May 06 21:52:10 <idontwan2know> it's especially hilarious since Verizon has a history of doing this with pretty much every smartphone they've ever sold
May 06 21:52:56 <idontwan2know> Even Droid they wanted to charge for exchange access, until the negative press threatened to spoil the launch.
May 06 21:59:34 <RagingMind> how can plain text sitting on a file system that is trivial to access and that's distributed with hundreds of thousands of phone be a trade secret?
May 06 22:01:42 <idontwan2know> cause somebody with better lawyers than you says so
May 06 22:05:14 <mumbles> anyone use the messaging plugins app on there pre?
May 06 22:14:32 <rwhitby> phil_bw: and ROW GSM users get tethering and GPS both without problems.
May 06 22:16:03 <phil_bw> rwhitby, yeah yeah
May 06 22:17:21 <phil_bw> Tibfib, how's the chat client coming?
May 06 22:19:29 * phil_bw sighs
May 06 22:19:44 <phil_bw> to do something productive or keep screwin with my Pre....
May 06 22:20:17 <PrimerFender> I'm about to screw with my Pre real big if I can figure out how
May 06 22:20:50 <phil_bw> PrimerFender, I'm sure this group would be more than happy to help you with that
May 06 22:21:48 <PrimerFender> I want to compile Apache2.2 and run it on my Pre, I have a working configuration on my Ubuntu netbook, but don't know how to go about compiling and packaging for webOS
May 06 22:22:31 <phil_bw> PrimerFender, any real reason for compiling apache to run natively on your pre?
May 06 22:22:32 <PrimerFender> I'm trying to read the info on the wiki, but there is too much I don't know that I'm having a hard time sinking me teeth into it
May 06 22:22:41 <rwhitby> PrimerFender: have you looked at the apache package in optware?
May 06 22:23:05 <PrimerFender> I want to use WebDAV to transfer files wireless with native WebDAV client in Windows/OS X/Linux
May 06 22:23:33 <PrimerFender> no, I have not seen that, only the Lighty lighttpd which I know is webdav incomplete
May 06 22:23:44 <rwhitby> PrimerFender: http://ipkg.nslu2-linux.org/feeds/optware/cs08q1armel/cross/unstable/
May 06 22:24:08 <rwhitby> PrimerFender: those can all be installed with the Optware Advanced Linux Command Line Installer (e.g. ipkg-opt) from Preware
May 06 22:24:37 <rwhitby> PrimerFender: and if useful and popular, can be repackaged easily for the Optware section in Preware itself
May 06 22:25:05 <PrimerFender> d'oh!
May 06 22:25:24 <PrimerFender> How do I find out more about the package itself, besides just installing it and trying?
May 06 22:26:04 <rwhitby> PrimerFender: http://trac.nslu2-linux.org/optware/browser/trunk/make
May 06 22:26:43 <rwhitby> PrimerFender: http://www.nslu2-linux.org/wiki/Optware/AddAPackageToOptware
May 06 22:27:50 <hmagoo> rwhitby, you are incorrect! (no, you're not just wanted to say that once)
May 06 22:31:25 <PrimerFender> wow
May 06 22:39:13 <PrimerFender> if I'm understanding this .mk file correctly, it has not been compiled with webdav support
May 06 22:39:35 <PrimerFender> and thus won't suit my needs/desire
May 06 22:49:13 <oc80z> whats good
May 06 22:49:21 <oc80z> hp slate + web os confirmed
May 06 22:49:31 * oc80z wakes up
May 06 22:49:36 <keith> where?
May 06 22:49:51 <keith> h ok
May 06 22:50:08 <rwhitby> I think today is Preware 1.0 testing release day
May 06 22:50:11 * rwhitby bbl
May 06 22:50:16 <oc80z> ;]
May 06 22:50:32 <oc80z> *** rwhitby is now known as the_webos_work_horse
May 06 22:53:13 <oc80z> dBsooner: i took a photo of your car http://i.imgur.com/SO7IV.jpg
May 06 22:58:06 <PrimerFender> lol
May 06 23:01:02 <zsoc> so I like zcorder.
May 06 23:01:07 <zsoc> unless someone cares to talk me out of it
May 06 23:03:10 <jhojho_> socorder?
May 06 23:04:28 <halfhalo> Give me moneycorder?
May 06 23:04:57 <oc80z> hmm?
May 06 23:05:00 <oc80z> Hey whats good zsoc
May 06 23:05:08 <zsoc> oc80z: nothing, everything is terrible
May 06 23:05:17 <zsoc> oc80z: i have an app to release tonight and no name
May 06 23:05:20 <oc80z> Well atleast you have work to do.
May 06 23:06:18 <Tibfib> Rahkoarduh...
May 06 23:06:28 <zsoc> ...
May 06 23:06:29 <oc80z> ;]
May 06 23:06:32 <zsoc> I have come to a conclusion today.
May 06 23:06:33 <oc80z> whats the app do?
May 06 23:06:36 <zsoc> People are terrible at naming things
May 06 23:06:42 <Tibfib> hah!
May 06 23:06:44 <oc80z> cmon i am a TLD vhost guru
May 06 23:06:49 <zsoc> oc80z: it records voice, as well as cuts ringtones, both into mp3
May 06 23:06:58 <Tibfib> RuhKoarDuh!
May 06 23:07:01 <oc80z> oh werd
May 06 23:07:04 <oc80z> i need that
May 06 23:07:08 <oc80z> ill pay for that
May 06 23:07:12 <zsoc> oc80z: right, it's free
May 06 23:07:14 <zsoc> oc80z: i just need a name
May 06 23:07:18 <oc80z> afk..
May 06 23:07:19 <BeeRad> Hey everybody.
May 06 23:07:23 <zsoc> oc80z: it's in the testing feed right now as Precorder :;p
May 06 23:08:31 <oc80z> ok
May 06 23:08:33 <oc80z> i have that
May 06 23:08:45 <zsoc> oc80z: well then you don't know how to use it lol
May 06 23:08:52 <zsoc> oc80z: or you haven't updated it to a version that works ;)
May 06 23:08:59 <oc80z> i used it to record my wife giggling
May 06 23:09:06 <zsoc> excellent
May 06 23:09:07 <oc80z> and then i played it back over the phone later on
May 06 23:09:20 <zsoc> oc80z: well the newest version works a bit better imo, as far as reliability etc
May 06 23:09:21 <oc80z> ...over the pots
May 06 23:09:26 <oc80z> ok:D
May 06 23:09:27 <zsoc> pots?
May 06 23:09:32 <oc80z> plain old telephone system
May 06 23:09:48 <zsoc> o
May 06 23:09:52 <oc80z> dunno
May 06 23:09:57 <oc80z> ahh naming
May 06 23:10:05 <zsoc> i'm just going to call it zcorder
May 06 23:10:20 <zsoc> plus it's easier to sed all the files that way, heh
May 06 23:10:36 <Mark_M> has anyone tried to get davfs2 running on the Pre?
May 06 23:10:45 <oc80z> that works
May 06 23:11:23 <oc80z> i was thinking, vote-naderecorder
May 06 23:11:35 <zsoc> Mark_M: why doesn't it work?
May 06 23:12:20 <Mark_M> zsoc, I have not tried it yet. I was just asking before I do
May 06 23:12:21 <zsoc> s/doesn't/wouldn't/
May 06 23:12:22 <infobot> zsoc meant: Mark_M: why wouldn't it work?
May 06 23:12:37 <zsoc> Mark_M: I don't believe it's been done, but it should be easy enough with a nice cross compile env
May 06 23:12:49 <zsoc> someone grep the logs for davfs2? :p
May 06 23:12:56 <oc80z> right
May 06 23:13:26 <Mark_M> I was thinking that would be a great way to access more storage.
May 06 23:13:56 <zsoc> Mark_M: reasonable
May 06 23:14:38 <PrimerFender> a nice cross compile env <- i need one of those
May 06 23:14:49 <zsoc> PrimerFender: widk
May 06 23:14:51 <zsoc> ~widk
May 06 23:14:53 <zsoc> bah
May 06 23:15:30 <PrimerFender> o_O
May 06 23:15:41 <Mark_M> zsoc, I haven't cross compiled anything in a while, but I think I'll give it a try on my Ubuntu box
May 06 23:16:46 <Mark_M> think about accessing music from dropbox
May 06 23:17:30 <Mark_M> or other WebDAV source
May 06 23:18:09 <zsoc> Mark_M: it depends on neon
May 06 23:20:11 <PrimerFender> That's what I want to do. I have Apache+webDav working on my ubuntu box, i just need to figure out how to compile and run it on my pre
May 06 23:20:31 <oc80z> whats that mark?
May 06 23:20:51 <oc80z> mark why not mount to fatfs
May 06 23:20:58 <oc80z> or you only doing dropbox?
May 06 23:21:43 <oc80z> Dropbox has agreed to abide by the DMCA
May 06 23:21:58 <oc80z> forget dropbox and that precentral.net sponsorded storage provider
May 06 23:22:03 <oc80z> i use SpiderOak
May 06 23:22:16 <zsoc> Mark_M: and neon depends on libxml2
May 06 23:22:18 <oc80z> strongest encryption -- admins have no access to anything.
May 06 23:22:38 <oc80z> Dropbox has reserved the right to delete or remove any file from users' accounts if it violates the DMCA
May 06 23:22:39 <Mark_M> locally I have no problem but I want to access my data in the cloud
May 06 23:22:44 <zsoc> I accidentally just started compiling davfs2
May 06 23:22:45 <oc80z> Dropbox also dissuades its users from uploading pornographic, racist, and defamatory content.[27]
May 06 23:22:48 <oc80z> bah
May 06 23:23:40 <Mark_M> I just used dropbox as an example oc80z
May 06 23:24:10 <oc80z> :)
May 06 23:24:10 <oc80z> SpiderOak uses encrypted cloud storage and client-side encryption key creation, so even employees of SpiderOak cannot access users' information, this is the 'zero-knowledge' data encryption.
May 06 23:24:23 <Mark_M> lets assume that the content is legal
May 06 23:25:10 <Mark_M> zsoc, guess I'll have to make sure I have the deps too
May 06 23:26:58 <oc80z> :P
May 06 23:27:06 <oc80z> its not a point of being legal
May 06 23:27:21 <oc80z> is the point of basic data privacy.
May 06 23:27:36 <zsoc> Mark_M: well, when this works, i'll just commit the makefiles.. then you just need to download/install the widk
May 06 23:27:53 <zsoc> infobot: widk is http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/WebOS_Internals_PDK
May 06 23:27:54 <infobot> zsoc: okay
May 06 23:28:08 <oc80z> off topic
May 06 23:29:14 <zsoc> oc80z: ... the widk is off .. topic?
May 06 23:29:31 <halfhalo> yes
May 06 23:29:34 <Mark_M> I'll give it a try over the next day and let you know zsoc
May 06 23:29:42 <zsoc> Mark_M: k
May 06 23:36:28 <PrimerFender> Is this what I would use to try my cross-compile apache experiment?
May 06 23:37:10 <zsoc> PrimerFender: widk? yes that's the best way imo
May 06 23:51:01 <phil_bw> man I just realized a hard truth
May 06 23:51:28 <phil_bw> it was *easier* for me to get my HP printer working on my Pre than it was on Win 7
May 06 23:52:28 <JesusMcCloud> ~lart mircosoft
May 06 23:52:29 * infobot dumps 42 tons of dirt, manure, and fish heads on mircosoft
May 06 23:52:42 <JesusMcCloud> (ouch, that was an evil one)
May 07 00:03:37 <phil_bw> I go back and forth with MS
May 07 00:03:55 <phil_bw> I do really like Win7 (short of setting up an HP printer on it)
May 07 00:07:25 <zsoc> phil_bw: W7 is the first os I've found 'usable' since win 2000 back in the day
May 07 00:08:17 <phil_bw> zsoc, same.  I got sick of Vista on my laptop so really went to 7 to get away from it and ended up really liking 7
May 07 00:09:33 <zsoc> phil_bw: Oh, I don't use it.. but I do general user support a lot. I've used linux as my primary os for a few years now
May 07 00:10:37 <phil_bw> zsoc, I've been all across the board (short of mac)  Win98 to Mandrake to Win XP to Mandriva to Gentoo (with a Debian playmate) to Vista to 7
May 07 00:11:08 <zsoc> phil_bw: Good then :) I am super impressed by increase of general usability of linux over the last 3 years.
May 07 00:11:24 <phil_bw> for the longest time I used linux as my primary with a second computer running win98 for development (had to have it for the tools I was using)
May 07 00:11:33 <zsoc> My wife started by nagging me to install it (when I insisted all of her problems were windows related). Then she started dual booting. Now she asked me to remove windows to free up space.
May 07 00:11:44 <zsoc> She's not a computer person :>
May 07 00:12:41 <phil_bw> I thoroughly enjoyed Gentoo when I used it but I needed to get down to one computer at at the time my dev tools required windows and I couldn't find a happy solution under wine so I just went to XP (though I held on to my Debian server for quite some time)
May 07 00:13:21 <zsoc> Am I glad I'm not in an industry where that is the case.
May 07 00:13:55 <zsoc> Although I will say I do find 7 usable... it's just not.. for me. It becomes "I wonder if I can do this?" instead of how it should be... "Let me find out how to do this."
May 07 00:13:56 <phil_bw> now come full circle and the webos dev tools are all linux friendly (if not preferred)
May 07 00:14:09 <zsoc> phil_bw: well, except the official pdk ;) hehe
May 07 00:14:23 <phil_bw> ah
May 07 00:15:14 <phil_bw> oh well, as I always say "if it works for you, use it"\
May 07 00:15:47 <zsoc> I agree.
May 07 00:16:06 <phil_bw> the fact of the matter too is that the world is becoming so web centric that in 5 - 10 years it truely wont matter which platform you use
May 07 00:16:08 <zsoc> I only argue when someone is using 1 thing, simply because they are undereducated about other options ;)
May 07 00:16:25 <rwhitby> phil_bw: yeah, then it will matter which internet you use
May 07 00:16:35 <zsoc> I agree with webcentricity, but /some/ will see to it they have a certain about of control
May 07 00:16:37 <zsoc> what rod said
May 07 00:16:37 <phil_bw> exactly
May 07 00:16:53 <phil_bw> for the consumer end I mean
May 07 00:17:16 <phil_bw> obviously mission criticual stuff will always be trusted to a *nix environment
May 07 00:17:58 <zsoc> Microsoft is a good example. A big company that uses windows, mac, and nix.
May 07 00:18:22 <phil_bw> oh really?
May 07 00:18:54 <zsoc> of course, how do you think they run? :)
May 07 00:19:26 <phil_bw> well I don't think a mac needs to be involved anywhere
May 07 00:21:04 <zsoc> I believe they are used for design mostly. But they use quite a few
May 07 00:21:07 <phil_bw> I got kind of a laugh then other day when I stumbled across an old gentoo wiki article I wrote about accessing an NFS network from a Windows system (now it's all native, but back then it was far from it)
May 07 00:21:13 <phil_bw> http://www.gentoo-wiki.info/Access_NFS_via_SFU
May 07 00:21:25 <phil_bw> there was as lot of work invovled back then...
May 07 00:22:26 <zsoc> phil_bw: http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2008/09/19/microsofts-im-a-pc-ads-created-on-macs/
May 07 00:22:35 <zsoc> phil_bw: ah yes, it's come a long way lol
May 07 00:23:26 <phil_bw> haha, I stand corrected about the mac comment
May 07 00:30:23 <oil> http://www.webos-internals.org/index.php?title=Application:Govnah&curid=2017&diff=9805&oldid=9804
May 07 00:30:35 <oil> when was that an inside joke about arnold schwarzenegger?
May 07 00:30:57 <zsoc> ha
May 07 00:31:11 <oil> cause i was there when we named it, and i don't remember that xD
May 07 00:31:12 <zsoc> that guy thinks so
May 07 00:31:21 * zsoc recalls being there too..
May 07 00:32:59 * oil changes its wording to "apparently people think its an inside joke, but it isn't"
May 07 00:33:16 <zsoc> ++
May 07 00:35:57 <oil> maybe ill just delete it with the comment "this never happened"
May 07 00:36:31 <BeeRad> Hey guys, if I have an idea for a patch, should I ask here or hit the precentral.net forums up?
May 07 00:37:41 <zsoc> BeeRad: You should make it
May 07 00:38:46 * BeeRad has no dev skills. 
May 07 00:38:50 <rwhitby> BeeRad: you should mention it to Jason ;)
May 07 00:39:06 <BeeRad> rwhitby: hey buddy!
May 07 00:39:10 <rwhitby> BeeRad: tell him that there's no chance that he would be able to do something like that - it's way too hard.
May 07 00:39:21 <BeeRad> haha.
May 07 00:39:30 <BeeRad> Hey Jason...do you REALLY want a challenge?
May 07 00:39:31 <BeeRad> lol
May 07 00:39:33 <rwhitby> that used to work on me 20 years ago too :)
May 07 00:39:54 <BeeRad> I want control of the LED light for notifs. ;)
May 07 00:40:52 <halfhalo> saying its to hard for you doesn't work on me
May 07 00:41:16 <halfhalo> but what DOES is an obsenly high hourly rate for being a consultant
May 07 00:43:07 <rwhitby> halfhalo: no, BeeRad shouldn't say it's too hard for BeeRad, he should say it's too hard for Jason
May 07 00:43:27 <rwhitby> (or maybe you were saying that, English is so ambiguous)
May 07 00:43:34 <halfhalo> yeah
May 07 00:51:56 * BeeRad is sad that rwhitby doesn't retweet his praises for @webosinternals on Twitter. lol 
May 07 00:52:09 <rwhitby> BeeRad: which one?
May 07 00:52:33 <BeeRad> I do it all the time. haha I think my Twitter is fracked somehow.
May 07 00:52:49 * nt4cats is downloading Lucid install CD so that he can bake his own "auto-novaterm" LiveCD
May 07 00:53:12 <BeeRad> my #palmcast hashtags never show up in the timeline for the Palmcast lightning round. I cant figure out why.
May 07 00:55:31 <zsoc> nt4cats: do it
May 07 00:55:37 <zsoc> "Preware Install CD"
May 07 00:55:37 <zsoc> ahahhaa
May 07 00:56:39 <nt4cats> the script is done(ish), it seems that with a 'base' LiveCD and "UCK" (Ubuntu Customization Kit) -- the CD seems like an easy(ish) thing.  I'll let you know once I run it.
May 07 00:57:15 <RagingMind> nt4cats, ubuntu that has all the development stuff installed on install?
May 07 00:57:52 * nt4cats learned this evening that Adora isn't a robot -- she's a real person.  She also runs Fedora and digs webOS.  These are all good things in my book (although I wouldn't mind if she were a robot ... that'd be cool, too)
May 07 00:58:25 <nt4cats> RagingMind: I don't run Ubuntu myself, so I'm not certain what you get by default out of the box.
May 07 00:59:15 <nt4cats> RagingMind: I'm taking a crack at making a LiveCD for easy novaterm access to webOS devices, so I haven't needed to think about development tools
May 07 01:00:16 <Adora> nt4cats: I'm actually a mac user, but I have lots of friends in the fedora community
May 07 01:00:34 <Adora> and I actually AM a robot
May 07 01:00:36 <Adora> ...
May 07 01:00:38 <Adora> everything else is true
May 07 01:00:50 <nt4cats> zsoc: Preware Install CD, hmmm, that's an idea.
May 07 01:03:06 <zsoc> nt4cats: /or/, just a default bin... like "preware install" :>
May 07 01:03:25 * rwhitby loves writing tweets that people will want to RT, but are too long to do so easily :)
May 07 01:03:41 <ka6sox-work> 139characters
May 07 01:05:25 <BeeRad> ohhhhhhhhh ;)
May 07 01:05:30 <BeeRad> Point taken.
May 07 01:05:45 <BeeRad> So much love to shrink down though.
May 07 01:05:58 <BeeRad> Lisa!
May 07 01:06:24 <rwhitby> morning Adora
May 07 01:06:51 <Adora> rwhitby:  dude, I haaaaaaaaaaate it when you do that
May 07 01:06:55 <Adora> you are rather notorious
May 07 01:07:43 <rwhitby> Adora: I'm just pure evil to the core - haven't you been following the eDrama lately?
May 07 01:08:12 <VincentLaw> WOH
May 07 01:08:15 <VincentLaw> PREWARE HITTING 1.0?!
May 07 01:08:23 <zsoc> VincentLaw: SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
May 07 01:08:26 <zsoc> goodness
May 07 01:08:33 <zsoc> VincentLaw: not yet it's not.
May 07 01:08:35 <VincentLaw> I thought it was going to be Google-style beta forever!
May 07 01:08:37 <rwhitby> VincentLaw: actually, it will be 0.9.99 for the release candidate :)
May 07 01:08:38 <nt4cats> I just noticed in the device info applet that it shows I have hardware revision A.  I don't recall seeing that before (maybe it was added to the display in 1.4.x?)  Are there Rev B,C, etc. on Sprint?
May 07 01:09:00 <VincentLaw> you should call it beta even after 1.0.0
May 07 01:09:22 <nt4cats> I'm going to make a patch that re-adds the beta tag to Preware after it goes GA
May 07 01:09:43 * zsoc forks Preware... Zware.
May 07 01:10:09 <VincentLaw> SuperPreWare
May 07 01:10:21 <nt4cats> zsoc: did you settle on a name, by the way?
May 07 01:10:26 <PrimerFender> make toolchain =D
May 07 01:10:38 * VincentLaw still votes for "Talk to the Palm"
May 07 01:10:48 <zsoc> nt4cats: settle is a funny word. it's done, so whether i settled or not is in the past lol
May 07 01:11:49 * rwhitby wonders when people will twig that the whole Uber-Kernel thing was just a way of getting people to install the testing feed in preparation for Preware 1.0 release candidate testing ...
May 07 01:11:53 <BeeRad> ok, whats going on? I mention Twitter issues in here and now Im getting follower after follower. *raises eyebrow*
May 07 01:15:57 <nt4cats> I need to go yell at my daughter, she's not in bed yet.
May 07 01:16:18 <PrimerFender> don't be mean. it's almost summer
May 07 01:17:18 <nt4cats> PrimerFender: how many kids do you have?
May 07 01:17:36 <PrimerFender> =D
May 07 01:17:46 <PrimerFender> none, that I know of...
May 07 01:17:53 * nt4cats thinks someone should be yelling at PrimerFender right now ...
May 07 01:18:34 <PrimerFender> haha
May 07 01:19:22 <VincentLaw> nothing's worse than a kid who doesn't get enough sleep. GRUMPY MCGRUMPMEISTERS
May 07 01:19:31 <nt4cats> I didn't *actually* yell.  I just spoke in my gravelly Clint Eastwood voice and gestured menacingly
May 07 01:19:38 <PrimerFender> nt4cats: what tims is it?
May 07 01:19:43 <PrimerFender> tiem*
May 07 01:19:46 <PrimerFender> time*
May 07 01:19:46 <VincentLaw> time for bed
May 07 01:19:47 <VincentLaw> obviously
May 07 01:19:51 <PrimerFender> LOL
May 07 01:20:06 <nt4cats> PrimerFender: I live in the suburbs very near Philadelphia, PA.  It is 9:20p here.
May 07 01:20:14 <nt4cats> (I work in downtown Philly)
May 07 01:20:24 <PrimerFender> i only wonder because it's still daylight out and I can remember being sent to bed in the summer when it was still daylight :-/
May 07 01:20:27 <nt4cats> (we call it "center city")
May 07 01:21:34 <PrimerFender> and I call it someplace I aint never been too
May 07 01:27:00 <zsoc> nt4cats: i wish i was your daughter
May 07 01:27:06 <zsoc> nt4cats: i immediately regret typing that
May 07 01:27:27 * nt4cats feels a little bit uncomfortable now
May 07 01:27:33 <rwhitby> oil is going to love this 0.9.99 version number
May 07 01:27:40 * nt4cats slowly backs away from zsoc
May 07 01:28:10 <zsoc> nt4cats: i meant, having a father with a sense of humor who has a clint eastwood voice and makes fervent gestures
May 07 01:28:12 * nt4cats suggests "I wish I could go to bed now -- your daughter is lucky!"
May 07 01:28:24 <nt4cats> or that
May 07 01:29:20 <nt4cats> at my age a 9:30p bedtime would be quite a treat.
May 07 01:31:58 <nt4cats> ka6sox-work: advanced age (compared to most here -- I'm not the oldest ever seen in these parts, but I'm part of the senior crowd on this channel)
May 07 01:32:39 <oil> 0.9.99?
May 07 01:32:57 <ka6sox-work> oil: that was for your benefit :D
May 07 01:33:21 <oil> just go 0.10.1
May 07 01:33:40 <rwhitby> oil: no, that will not force me to release 1.0.0
May 07 01:33:55 <oil> no
May 07 01:34:01 <oil> lol
May 07 01:34:04 <nt4cats> oil: if you take "0.9.99" and feed it into a kupier series fractal transformation for certain eigen values, the result translates to "oil is cool"
May 07 01:34:13 <oil> lol
May 07 01:34:18 <rwhitby> although I still have 0.9.99[9]+ left if needed ...
May 07 01:36:32 <rwhitby> oil: so, last chance to stop 0.9.99 going into the testing feed ...
May 07 01:37:03 <oil> whats 0.9.99 do?
May 07 01:37:08 <rwhitby> (it automatically installs the C service, and removes the Java service, and you can uninstall Preware Alpha or leave it installed afterwards without issue)
May 07 01:37:14 <rwhitby> oil: same as current Preware Alpha
May 07 01:37:39 <rwhitby> basically 0.9.99 is a test of the seamless transition from Preware Alpha to Preware
May 07 01:38:12 <rwhitby> all those in favour, say "Aye"
May 07 01:38:20 <zsoc> Howabout: GO!
May 07 01:38:24 <oc80z> hmmm
May 07 01:38:37 <oc80z> did that WebDav question get answered?
May 07 01:38:53 <nt4cats> Aye (Preware Alpha as it is today rocks)
May 07 01:39:53 <zsoc> oc80z: if it involved devfs2, the answer was "it will probably work if someone bothers to do it"
May 07 01:42:36 <VincentLaw> STOP!
May 07 01:42:39 <VincentLaw> Hammertime!
May 07 01:42:40 * VincentLaw dances
May 07 01:44:02 <ka6sox-work> Aye
May 07 01:44:42 <nt4cats> (2 "Ayes", 0 "Nays" -- the "Ayes" have it)
May 07 01:44:50 <VincentLaw> I WANT A RECOUNT
May 07 01:45:11 * rwhitby likes giving people the illusion that there is an sort of democracy in play here ...
May 07 01:45:22 <rwhitby> s/an/any/
May 07 01:45:29 <VincentLaw> rwhitby: are you, what some would say, a benevolent dictator? :P
May 07 01:46:22 <rwhitby> VincentLaw: well, it turns out that any one of about 20 or so people could go and release Preware 0.9.99 at any time
May 07 01:47:04 <ka6sox-work> my git-foo is somewhat lame.
May 07 01:47:16 <ka6sox-work> but I found a tutorial on how to do that!
May 07 01:47:51 <nt4cats> ~git-tutorial
May 07 01:47:52 <infobot> methinks git-tutorial is http://www.eecs.harvard.edu/~cduan/technical/git/
May 07 01:48:19 * oil releases 0.9.donkey
May 07 01:48:33 * ka6sox-work releases 0.9.turkey
May 07 01:48:36 <rwhitby> ok, could someone who is running Preware Classic with the testing feed enabled please test the upgrade to Preware 0.9.99
May 07 01:48:41 * nt4cats releases 0.9.krikey
May 07 01:48:42 <VincentLaw> oh no
May 07 01:48:44 <VincentLaw> the real question is
May 07 01:48:50 <VincentLaw> does 0.9.9999999999999999... = 1?
May 07 01:49:02 <oil> running... preware alpha, upgrade to preware, right?
May 07 01:49:12 <oil> didn't we need a timer or something on the service restart?
May 07 01:49:20 <oil> i thought that was in the way
May 07 01:49:22 <nt4cats> rwhitby: I have classic and alpha ... if I use classic does that count, or should I remove alpha and make sure I have the java service?
May 07 01:49:23 <rwhitby> oil: nah, I just punted
May 07 01:49:26 <oil> ok
May 07 01:49:34 <oil> what about rescan weirdness?
May 07 01:49:42 <rwhitby> nt4cats: run classic, and accept the update to classic
May 07 01:49:49 <rwhitby> oil: it will persist
May 07 01:50:15 * oil really wishes we could figure out what thats all about
May 07 01:50:37 <rwhitby> yeah, me too.  I expect that will be 1.1.0 :)
May 07 01:50:56 <nt4cats> it says preware 0.9.99 and package manager 0.9.46 are set to be updated
May 07 01:51:10 <nt4cats> (because 0.9.99 depends on pm *.46
May 07 01:51:18 <rwhitby> nt4cats: it shouldn't
May 07 01:51:30 <nt4cats> rwhitby: it does.  I haven't clicked anything yet
May 07 01:51:47 <rwhitby> ah, that's actually 0.9.38 which is depending.  0.9.99 doesn't
May 07 01:52:05 <nt4cats> it told me to update preware ... and then said it also needed to install a dependency
May 07 01:52:06 <rwhitby> we need to differentiate that somehow when merging records
May 07 01:52:21 <oil> lol
May 07 01:52:23 <nt4cats> (so it offered me one upgrade, and then warned me of a dependency)
May 07 01:52:31 <rwhitby> nt4cats: should still wokr
May 07 01:52:48 <nt4cats> okay, I'll click "update all"
May 07 01:52:54 <oil> so we're going 1.0?
May 07 01:52:54 <rwhitby> nt4cats: it will upgrade ipkgservice, then upgrade preware (which will remove ipkgservice), then restart java
May 07 01:52:59 <oil> then i can change a bunch of stuff?
May 07 01:53:00 <oil> xD
May 07 01:53:06 <rwhitby> oil: yep
May 07 01:53:21 <nt4cats> rwhitby: java is restarting ...
May 07 01:53:28 <rwhitby> oil: preware will be the stable branch, preware alpha will become even more alpha
May 07 01:53:52 <oil> cause i gotta go in and rip up parts of it to change how it works
May 07 01:53:52 <rwhitby> nt4cats: did it update preware before restarting java ?
May 07 01:54:26 <nt4cats> preware was updated, so I think the answer to your question must be 'yes'
May 07 01:54:30 <rwhitby> oil: and then there's preware next gen which reads XML feeds and doesn't store everything in memory
May 07 01:54:31 <oil> java restarts, and then it tries to rescan (which would kill preware) but it can't cause the service is dead
May 07 01:55:08 <oil> xml feeds, eww
May 07 01:55:30 <oil> json feed, yay
May 07 01:56:00 <nt4cats> it restarted java, then dropped back to the preware update panel, which then went away (presumably because preware was updating/updated).  I launched preware again and got the "first time you run a new version of preware" info
May 07 01:56:30 <oil> oh, well, thats ok
May 07 01:56:30 <nt4cats> hmmm, preware 0.9.99 says there are no packages available ... I can update my feeds, but I'm surprised I need to do that
May 07 01:56:34 <oil> im shocked preware went away
May 07 01:56:45 <nt4cats> oil: it did, honest.
May 07 01:56:57 <oil> no, i believe you
May 07 01:57:05 <oil> its just my experience thats never worked quite right xD
May 07 01:57:21 <nt4cats> do you want me to poke/look at anything before updating feeds?
May 07 01:57:38 <oil> look at what?
May 07 01:57:48 <oil> you could go to feed management and make sure its ok
May 07 01:58:22 <nt4cats> feed management looks okay
May 07 01:58:26 <nt4cats> I'm updating feeds
May 07 01:58:45 <nt4cats> now I have 1068 available packages (which seems right)
May 07 02:01:26 <jhojho_> preware alpha going live?
May 07 02:01:32 <jhojho_> aye
May 07 02:01:42 <oil> so im not sure i like the new google
May 07 02:02:27 <ka6sox-work> jhojho_, you weren't talking about surveys in google groups you meant googledocs right?
May 07 02:02:37 <jhojho_> yes
May 07 02:02:51 <rwhitby> nt4cats: installing a new package manager service version always clears the feed cache
May 07 02:03:12 <rwhitby> nt4cats: the reason why this happened to you is because you were not up to date on Preware Classic and Package Manager Service already
May 07 02:03:14 <jhojho_> oil: the new google is faceted/guided nav. been done for years in enterprise search
May 07 02:03:21 <rwhitby> nt4cats: the good news is that it's designed to work anyway
May 07 02:03:33 <jhojho_> personally, not really a fan.
May 07 02:03:37 <oil> jhojho_: doesn't mean that im sure if i like it or not
May 07 02:03:40 <oil> lol
May 07 02:04:48 <jhojho_> well, it's rather ironic given that google has been talking for a long time about how faceted nav is meh. and a search engine should just know when you say cardinal if you meant the bird, team or the guy with the funny hat.
May 07 02:05:06 <jhojho_> but whatever =)
May 07 02:05:46 <oil> yeah, its weird
May 07 02:06:46 <nt4cats> rwhitby: I was mildly surprised but not upset nor scared that the feeds were empty .... just wanted to let you know what I was seeing in case you wanted me to grab a log from somewhere, etc.
May 07 02:07:05 <rwhitby> nt4cats: no, thanks for reporting everything
May 07 02:07:42 <rwhitby> now, I just need someone who did have package manager service updated to 0.9.46 already to try the upgrade process
May 07 02:13:06 * nt4cats is sleepy ... going to bed.  bbt
May 07 02:28:38 <soc> I'm trying to root my pre but i have the following error on a mac....i'm logged in as root, but once i run a command, it states that novaterm ended prematurely
May 07 02:41:57 <geist> soc: any command, or a specific command?
May 07 02:43:27 <soc> well im new at this. i try one comand : mpt d userial
May 07 02:43:41 <halfhalo> And that does what?
May 07 02:44:20 <soc> then i get a error on the terminal that port closed prematurely
May 07 02:45:05 <soc> but i wanna do it from windows 7 but nova.py won't detect my pre
May 07 02:45:23 <soc> novaproxy.py*
May 07 02:46:08 <soc> i have webos 1.0.3 what i wanna do is be able to read the spc/msl nuber with qxdm
May 07 02:47:17 <rwhitby> soc: best to ask elsewhere about that.  try mobile-files.com
May 07 02:48:09 <soc>  i just want general directions on how to connect my pre to pc, get the drivers and have it connect it trough putty
May 07 02:48:53 <rwhitby> soc: 1) install Palm SDK according to Palm documentation.  2) run novaterm
May 07 02:49:51 <soc> oh ok. i ll try installing the SDK ;) thanks
May 07 02:56:40 <JackieRipper> rwhitby: the upgrade to preware 0.9.99 worked fine with the package manager service 0.9.46 already installed, with a bit of oddness
May 07 02:57:12 <rwhitby> JackieRipper: what was the oddness?
May 07 02:57:14 <JackieRipper> 1) it said that I needed to install the package manager service 0.9.46 (even though it was already installed)
May 07 02:59:02 <JackieRipper> 2) when I launched preware 0.9x, the package manager service was not listed in "Installed Packages" but rather in Available Other -> Services (as if it was not installed)
May 07 02:59:32 <JackieRipper> I tapped install, restarted java, and now all seems to be well
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri May 07 02:59:56 2010