**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Nov 12 02:59:57 2010 Nov 12 05:24:58 my preware is having problem updating feeds after upgrading to ver. 1.4.2 Nov 12 05:25:26 anyone knows why? Nov 12 05:27:32 hello~~ Nov 12 05:33:16 Haven't had that problem from any of the other beta testers. Nov 12 05:35:30 * phil_bw wanders by Nov 12 05:35:45 hey you webos-internals types might know how possible my idea is... Nov 12 05:35:46 hey phil_bw Nov 12 05:35:53 evenin' rod Nov 12 05:36:11 so I get crap reception in my new apartment... Nov 12 05:36:23 I use the roam only patch to force roaming on when I need to make calls here Nov 12 05:36:45 how hard would it be to make a location based app and/or patch that would enable roaming whenever I'm at my apartment? Nov 12 05:37:03 wouldn't modeswitcher do that? Nov 12 05:37:11 modeswitcher? Nov 12 05:37:22 yeah, mode switcher is what you want. Nov 12 05:37:30 I need to try it, because I always have to force roaming at work Nov 12 05:37:37 it's even featured in the Preware Homebrew Documentation app in the app catalog ;) Nov 12 05:37:48 * phil_bw fires up Preware Nov 12 05:37:58 apparently it has a learning curve tho :-\ Nov 12 05:38:10 webOSroundup had a very long and detailed article on it Nov 12 05:38:33 yep, it's in my to-read queue ... currently I'm up to 2004 Nov 12 05:38:44 ah, so it'll probably be overkill for this then? Nov 12 05:38:54 it's easy to start simple with it. Just set it up to turn off the screen and notifications on the touchstone between 11pm and 7am Nov 12 05:39:08 phil_bw: no, it's perfect Nov 12 05:39:21 wow, I need that too! Nov 12 05:39:38 yeah, apps like that are usefull Nov 12 05:39:43 I always take my phone off the touchstone at night because I don't want/need a nightlight Nov 12 05:39:46 I use one like it for my epic Nov 12 05:40:56 jacques: yep, makes it go dark, and turn off everything except phone calls and alarms Nov 12 05:40:57 * jacques doenloads it right now. Nov 12 05:41:07 downloads even Nov 12 05:41:12 it has a good user manual too Nov 12 05:41:30 oh nice, could just set it to the wifi ssid Nov 12 05:41:33 instead of gps Nov 12 05:41:47 I'll have to install it after I get my Pre replaced Nov 12 05:42:05 yeah, you'll save power with wifi vs gps Nov 12 05:42:11 now that Sprint changed their TEP policies mine is eligible for free replacement Nov 12 05:42:25 so going to hold off installing anything new for the time being Nov 12 05:43:20 I'm currently in the applications directory moving the various "unauthorized" apps out of the directory so that when Sprint goes to replicate my keyboard issue they don't try to flag me for other stuff... Nov 12 06:01:37 Hello Nov 12 06:02:00 Anyone here? Nov 12 06:02:18 depends on how much money you have :P Nov 12 06:02:32 lol Nov 12 06:04:50 I was wondering if someone could point me in the right direction. I gave a project for my c++/Unix class and we are to pick a opensource existing program/project and analyze it; and seeing how I love my Pre and it was the first Linux computer I started learning, I figured i'd do my project about WebOS Nov 12 06:05:17 I was wondering where to start. Like, how to start looking at the c/c++ code for WebOS Nov 12 06:05:19 I think that's a fantastic idea Nov 12 06:05:27 Can I just unzip WebOS Doctor? Nov 12 06:05:47 is all the code in there? Nov 12 06:05:52 well I don't believe it's quite that easy Nov 12 06:05:58 Ilol, it never is Nov 12 06:06:34 now I've never really poked around the doctor but as far as I understand the open-source part of WebOS is all HTML/JavaScript/CSS Nov 12 06:06:50 I've unzipped alot of stuff from WebOS Doctor and found a few things but I don't think it is what i'm looking for Nov 12 06:07:23 webos isn't opensource Nov 12 06:07:30 That's what I thought. I know it runs on Linux but I thought there was a "WebOS Core" that was C/C++ Nov 12 06:07:45 hello Nov 12 06:07:52 you are correct, it was written in C/C++ then compiled to binary Nov 12 06:08:02 well, it doesn't necessarily have to be opensource, as long as it isn't illegal Nov 12 06:08:08 could someone help me ssh into my phone?? Nov 12 06:08:11 oh Nov 12 06:08:29 and I guess they aren't releasing the source code Nov 12 06:08:32 i have se i am stuck at connecting Nov 12 06:08:48 I'd say you're probably better of analyzing an open source package designed for webos created by someone else Nov 12 06:08:59 once i do this from my linux machine nothing else happens ssh usernam@hostname -p 343 Nov 12 06:09:11 it asks for my password it takes it Nov 12 06:09:16 but never does anything els Nov 12 06:09:22 its like frozen there Nov 12 06:09:47 phil_bw: You have one particular in mind? Like, somthing like ipkg? Nov 12 06:10:01 I don't know Nov 12 06:10:42 i'm just starting out in Linux still so I haven't got the whole jist of what's what and how everything interconnects, so forgive me if I mistake things for something they're not Nov 12 06:10:45 rwhitby might have some suggestions Nov 12 06:11:09 phil do u know how to ssh into a pre? Nov 12 06:11:25 i am stuck trying it on my phone. I would appreaciate it if u could give me a hadn Nov 12 06:11:34 Colombia, I've always had hit or miss results with it so I'm not going to be much help Nov 12 06:11:47 I generally do everything from onboard the Pre itself Nov 12 06:11:59 is there anyway i could check the status of ssh Nov 12 06:12:01 Colombia: try running that command with the -vv option and see what the debug output says Nov 12 06:12:08 like a parameter to have it display more Nov 12 06:12:09 ohhh Nov 12 06:12:15 just what i was about to ask Nov 12 06:12:16 brb Nov 12 06:13:17 HebrewzHammer: there is no C/C++ source code in the doctor Nov 12 06:13:32 rwhitby: HEY Nov 12 06:13:40 rwhitby: I was just about to PM on precentral Nov 12 06:13:58 i get the followin Nov 12 06:14:02 all the Linux C/C++ source code from Palm is on opensource.palm.com Nov 12 06:14:07 debug2: channel 0: output drain -> closed Nov 12 06:14:09 rwhitby: Is there somthing closely related/important to WebOS that is written in C/C++ that I could use? Nov 12 06:14:20 HebrewzHammer: the Linux kernel? Nov 12 06:14:52 The node.js javascript run-time ? Nov 12 06:15:01 rwhitby: lol, well I guess that definitely is an option Nov 12 06:15:24 the backend services for Preware are written in C aren't they ;) Nov 12 06:15:30 yep. Nov 12 06:15:42 philbw i get this on the screen and just stays there debug2: channel 0: output drain -> closed Nov 12 06:15:42 that's a pretty important piece of WebOS Nov 12 06:15:44 HebrewzHammer: how big a chunk of code do you want, and what do you want to do with it? Nov 12 06:16:59 rwhitby: Size isn't really an issue, i'm just suppossed to analyze the project as a whole so I don't have to go really deep into everything Nov 12 06:18:40 rwhitby: Srry, even though i've gotten root access to my Pre and been patching since the day I got it; i'm still kinda of ignorant when it comes to the arhitecture of WebOS. What is the node.js jacascript runtime? Nov 12 06:19:34 Btw, still on my first Pre that I got on launch day, and i've never had to WebOS Doctor it (too afraid, but still don't need to)! Nov 12 06:21:08 rwhitby: Do u have any idea when i try to ssh to my pre even from within it it will freeze. using the -vv parameter shows the following : debug2: channel 0: rcvd eof debug2: channel 0: output open -> drain debug2: channel 0: obuf empty debug2: channel 0: close_write debug2: channel 0: output drain -> closed Nov 12 06:30:57 Colombia: no idea Nov 12 06:32:55 now it gives me an exit status 1 Nov 12 06:33:10 rwhitby: Hmmm, after searching around it looks like doing my project on the Linux kernel would be the closest C/C++ project/program to WebOS Nov 12 06:34:16 could it be that the phone is going to sleep and thus disconnects? Nov 12 08:39:53 <[AD]Turbo> yo all Nov 12 13:58:59 Heyho @ all Nov 12 14:16:30 has anyone done a patch to print to internet connected printers? Nov 12 14:45:38 djk: as far as i know, this will be possible with webOS 2.0 Nov 12 14:57:12 look forward to that just don't know I'll see it being on Sprint. I hope Sprint will bring new hardware an not just HP/palm Nov 12 16:40:41 anyone know if the new camera on the pre2 is auto-focusing? It would be nice to be able to read barcodes with it, for instance. Nov 12 16:48:53 * rsanchez1 just got his pre back from palm repair Nov 12 16:48:59 destinal: no autofocus Nov 12 16:50:28 pre looks good as new Nov 12 16:50:31 so nice Nov 12 16:51:28 funny thing is they put a little plaque below where the battery goes telling you the correct way of inserting the battery Nov 12 16:57:40 en0x: :( Nov 12 16:58:25 ;] Nov 12 17:01:08 en0x: I wonder how small a camera you could mount on the pre to do barcode scanning. link it up with usb whenever we figure out usb host mode, or bluetooth serial, or even the headset jack Nov 12 17:02:52 pretty much all the android phones I've seen and of course the iphones have autofocus. sucks to be the one left out of cool hacking possibilities Nov 12 17:03:39 nah I think we have a lot more cool hacking possibilities Nov 12 17:03:47 seeing how webOS is such an open platforms Nov 12 17:04:31 although hacking an iPhone to run android is pretty nice... Nov 12 17:04:34 rsanchez1: eh, kind of. it's linux with a real userland which is nice, and we've figured out services and plugins, but I do wish the bluetooth stack and the big userland pieces like Luna were open source Nov 12 17:05:16 well it just means you have to work harder to hack them up Nov 12 17:05:17 being able to read all the built-in javascript is nice Nov 12 17:05:27 and patch at whim Nov 12 17:06:15 I'm really, really happy with the open-ness of WebOS Nov 12 17:06:24 but maybe that's because it feels like "real linux" Nov 12 17:06:32 whereas android didn't in the same way Nov 12 17:06:36 man I think the best feature of webOS is the palm profil Nov 12 17:06:48 all my apps, contacts, emails, getting restored with little effort Nov 12 17:06:55 it's less open than android but more twiddly bits, immediate gratification for hacking to change things Nov 12 17:07:09 so more hacker-friendly I guess you could say, at least in some ways Nov 12 17:07:11 I wish I could sync my palm profile with a server of my choice, instead of Palm's cloud Nov 12 17:07:26 meh, it's all the same to me Nov 12 17:07:29 destinal: I think the "userspace linux" aspect is what I like Nov 12 17:07:32 as long as I can get to it I'm good Nov 12 17:08:13 yeah, more, connect up and get a root shell than android by far Nov 12 17:09:13 and it's a full-featured root shell. I wrote an outline for a class in vi on the cli on my pre in a different class yesterday >.> Nov 12 17:09:52 I do that all the time Nov 12 17:10:08 ssh into my school's servers to do assignments while in a different class Nov 12 17:10:23 android doesn't make that as easy Nov 12 17:10:25 all that's missing is a bluetooth keyboard Nov 12 17:10:44 for a while it was frustrating to actually get a root shell without killijng Luna, we had to figure out how to make an NPAPI plugin and embed it into an app (fortunately classic provided a great example) -- these days we could redo terminal as a hybrid app or straight SDL game type app but that's a pretty new development Nov 12 17:11:26 yeah, a PDK app should be pretty easy right? Nov 12 17:11:33 you have to redo it since java services won't be supported right? Nov 12 17:11:43 rsanchez1: terminal doesn't use any java Nov 12 17:11:57 oh that's internalz Nov 12 17:11:59 nvm Nov 12 17:12:43 like classic, a plugin (.so lib) written in C implementing NPAPI (browser plugin API) that is loaded and called by luna when embedded in a mojo app. Nov 12 17:12:55 well, would redoing it as a hybrid or straight SDL have any advantages? Nov 12 17:13:09 seems pretty snappy to me as it is Nov 12 17:13:16 <[1]nadav> Hi all. I've removed a program using webOSQuickInstall, but for some reason the icon was left on the launcher. Do you know where the shortcuts are defined so I can remove it myself? Nov 12 17:14:10 restart luna Nov 12 17:14:24 rsanchez1: I'd like it to be a mojo / js UI, it would make it a lot easier to interact with native things like highlight, copy and paste. would be able to use built in fonts and other graphical layout stuff as well. and we could get it into the catalog as a hybrid app I imagine Nov 12 17:15:11 getting it into the catalog would definitely be a plus Nov 12 17:15:40 also being an NPAPI plugin has some technical drawbacks, we become part of the lunasysmgr process and if we crash, down comes the GUI Nov 12 17:16:21 I see Nov 12 17:16:47 also it's been tricky when they change the version of webkit, sometimes terminal stops working until we figure out what we didn't quite implement right (no API docs from palm after all, just standard NPAPI notes on the web and source code to webkit and their patches to look at) Nov 12 17:38:57 (looking back at my old list of crazy webos plans) -- we still need USB host mode, bluetooth joysticks (may be possible to do using the new bt serial support) -- I still need a VNC server and have to get back into reverse engineering / documenting hidd. we need multitouch / TUIO server and client support (for example this would let us use external multitouch pads into the emulator) -- for that matter it would be cool to emulate the Nov 12 17:39:41 anyone have any big items they'd like to see? making lists is easy ;) Nov 12 17:42:24 an IR remote control would be cool. could use the audio jack for I/O and to mount it, like they did with that iphone IR remote thing. Nov 12 17:52:37 I guess first of all I need frankendoctor but I'm pissed at lunasysmgr for not working right ;) (it's all it's fault, of course) Nov 12 18:06:22 could the bluetooth serial stuff be used to connect to a gps device? Nov 12 18:09:29 * ashi_todd already ordered a bluetooth keyboard Nov 12 18:09:34 hmmm crazy stuff eh? Nov 12 18:11:36 ashi_todd: yeah, my list used to be more crazy, for a while last year I wanted to make bluetooth keyboards work with a custom bt stack. Nov 12 18:12:00 I ran into some challenges talking to the chipset since I have no experience with bt Nov 12 18:18:17 ashi_todd: a magnetic strip reader like square's would be cool too. Nov 12 18:19:23 destinal: Agreed, a MSR would be, useful. Nov 12 18:20:50 hmm besides reading your hotel key and doing real point of sale stuff, you could carry around an encryption key on a card and do poor-man's two factor authentication Nov 12 18:29:53 destinal: I remember reading about bt stack replacement in the webos-internals wiki. :) Nov 12 18:30:39 ashi_todd: yeah, we kind of started out looking into it but it didn't get the level of time / effort really needed Nov 12 18:30:48 * ashi_todd nods Nov 12 18:31:06 may have to revisit it since even in 2.0 it looks like palm is still using proprietary stack Nov 12 18:31:56 How about vnc server in webOS? Nov 12 18:37:43 And a better video player... *posts in Core Player's forums again* Nov 12 18:39:14 the precentral nuTsie post made me really excited, I didn't realize how cool nuTsie actually is Nov 12 18:41:55 ashi_todd: yeah, vnc server is on my list, to do it right in a device independent way probably requires hidd hacking Nov 12 18:42:28 cool Nov 12 18:42:29 another closed source piece but it looks pretty easy to reverse Nov 12 18:42:33 (hidd that is) Nov 12 18:42:47 if only I had any software RE skills to speak of.. ;) Nov 12 18:45:08 ashi_todd: better video player strikes me as seriously non-trivial re interfacing with the DSP Nov 12 18:45:59 destinal: so one of the crazy ideas for now, eh? Nov 12 18:47:42 yeah. I'm most excited about doing peripherals at the moment, games would be sweet using something like a nunchuk for instance. I also would like to make a device that plugs into an ipod dock and talks to the pre over bluetooth Nov 12 18:48:17 so you can use off the shelf ipod stuff. i guess maybe it would need a passthrough 3.5mm jack too for the audio piece Nov 12 18:48:49 ooh. Nov 12 18:49:27 often I find myself travelling and the hotel's alarm clock has an ipod dock and it got me thinking. Nov 12 19:15:48 oh my pre got another crack Nov 12 19:15:49 :S Nov 12 19:15:58 PAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM!!! Nov 12 19:26:59 :) Nov 12 19:34:56 ashi_todd: do you think others would be interested in this ipod dock compatible adapter thingy? Nov 12 19:38:53 have a couple of questions on xterm for pre Nov 12 19:39:12 is x forwarding over ssh possible with xterm? Nov 12 19:39:40 and how do I get shift/sym characters to type in the xterm? Nov 12 19:40:19 there is no X server on the pre Nov 12 19:40:34 but you could install one right? Nov 12 19:41:19 theoretically, perhaps. In practice, I think there's a fair amount of stuff that would make that difficult Nov 12 19:41:31 I thought you sort of had to have an x server for xterm Nov 12 19:43:08 I could download something called an x window system server off preware Nov 12 19:43:11 is that not the same thing? Nov 12 19:43:35 is this the place to get help with Govnah settings? Nov 12 19:43:52 yeah we can help you here Nov 12 19:44:32 i just updated to 0.7.4. now, even though i have selected 500/1ghz screenstate mode, the freq seems to be stuck at 500, even with the screen active. Nov 12 19:45:43 rsanchez1: I don't know anything about th x window system server in preware, I just remember reading that it wouldn't work... I don't really know Nov 12 19:45:50 but the terminal app doesn't require an x server Nov 12 19:45:57 from what I know Nov 12 19:46:14 oh, just realized something. it was plugged in to charge. if i unplug it, it switches back to 1 ghz. is that normal? Nov 12 19:46:15 yeah I know, regular terminal never requires an x server Nov 12 19:46:22 I just thought that xterm might require it Nov 12 19:46:31 I meant the terminal app Nov 12 19:46:41 yeah it always clocks at 500Hz when you're charging it Nov 12 19:46:41 which xterm are you talking about? Nov 12 19:46:53 xterm, you can get off preware testing feeds Nov 12 19:47:05 ok, thats fine. I hadn't realized that. Nov 12 19:47:09 emileb420: that's done that way to keep your pre from overheating, iirc Nov 12 19:47:17 rsanchez1: then I apparently have no idea what I'm talking about Nov 12 19:47:23 ya, makes sense. Nov 12 19:47:34 oh Nov 12 19:47:52 last I knew there was no way to run X on the pre Nov 12 19:47:59 but if there's stuff in the feeds, maybe I'm wrong Nov 12 19:48:42 under the testing feeds they're called "XTerm Binaries", "X Window System Server Binaries", etc. Nov 12 19:49:47 odd thing is that xterm won't launch from launcher icon, only if I launch it from regular Terminal app Nov 12 19:50:46 there's a long thread in the precentral forums about X Nov 12 20:03:33 looks like it's not recognizing the shift/caps/sym keys from a few errors on launch Nov 12 20:03:46 Warning: Attempt to alias to non-existent key Ignored Nov 12 20:13:55 i got a quick question. I'm not super familiar with irc, but have to use it as staff member for a game. it requires me to put in a command line under "perform" so that I got a plus sign in front of my name like some of you have. However I can't find that in wirc. can someone point me in the right direcction? Nov 12 20:15:57 Oh geez, and after all my searching through preferences, I just found it in the advanced settings Nov 12 20:16:05 * Ava_ drops her head in shame Nov 12 20:16:13 Hi Ava_. What is the command you enter normally? I usually do something like /msg nickserv identify passwordhere Nov 12 20:16:17 ah Nov 12 20:16:35 that's pretty much it Nov 12 20:16:41 and I just foun dit Nov 12 20:16:48 I was "certain" it had to be in preferences lol Nov 12 20:16:57 :) Nov 12 20:17:11 wirc ftw Nov 12 20:17:56 it is in preferences Nov 12 20:18:29 actually, I found it in advanced in my server settings Nov 12 20:19:02 it worked! Nov 12 20:19:04 yay Nov 12 20:19:08 * Ava_ does a happy dance Nov 12 20:19:18 yay. Nov 12 20:20:30 thanks guys Nov 12 20:20:34 hehe Nov 12 20:26:04 destinal: I would purchase an ipod dock compatible adapter thingy. Nov 12 20:28:41 i have probably the most epic collection of "temp" music for game dev ever Nov 12 20:41:07 I don't think you need an x server to be running to display to a remote display but you may need the appropriate x libraries and such Nov 12 20:41:36 but I don't see much point in running x apps on the pre to display to another system Nov 12 21:04:22 ashi_todd: hmm, the first version would be DIY but maybe if I can get this working I should make a kit / product out of it Nov 12 21:04:51 destinal: nice. Nov 12 21:09:03 ipod dock kit? Nov 12 21:10:40 rsanchez1: yeah, that's what I'm contemplating Nov 12 21:11:30 maybe sell it as a webos internals product, all proceeds going to webos internals? Nov 12 21:15:08 rsanchez1: I doubt we want to get into products, sales, etc as webos-internals. but this would be an open hardware project, with schematics etc available for download, again, if I even do anything like this Nov 12 21:16:36 first we have to see what webos 2.0's bluetooth support is like and then whether it's even feasible but I plan on making all the information public even if it means that china will be selling them cheaper than I can in 5 months. ;) Nov 12 21:18:43 also I've never done anything like this re building a kit, so it should be fun, if it's reasonably possible Nov 12 22:13:37 rsanchez1: 'ello :) Nov 12 22:14:02 rsanchez1: xterm in preware uses the x server from preware, and is automatically installed when you install xterm Nov 12 22:14:22 x-forwarding is *definitely* possible and is how i tested the x server before i got all the x client stuff working :) Nov 12 22:14:49 i haven't updated the x stuff for 1.4.5, which is why it won't launch. Mostly it does thing the jailing doesn't like, so just need to restructure that. Nov 12 22:15:04 thanks for reporting the keybinding errors, those _used_ to all work. Nov 12 22:15:09 on 1.4.1 or w/e i mean. Nov 12 22:16:27 yeah the keybinding errors are sort of a dealbreaker Nov 12 22:16:42 any chance it's just a quick fix I can do on my end? Nov 12 22:17:54 rsanchez1: probably, although offhand I don't know what would have changed to cause those issues. Nov 12 22:18:35 rsanchez1: you're just invoking it with the script, right? Nov 12 22:19:41 yep ./star.sh Nov 12 22:19:47 ./start.sh Nov 12 22:25:43 well my only guess is they changed the way that works in 1.4.5 but i can't say offhand, sorry. looks like i might need to update the way that's handled in the x server as well, not just the keyboard config :/ Nov 12 22:30:17 darn Nov 12 22:31:06 I could get around it using aliases though, just have to get them set up locally and on the remote machine Nov 12 22:31:39 but I'll have to change my remote password to use only lowercase letters... Nov 12 22:31:49 nah it wouldn't be much use anyway Nov 12 22:32:18 lol sorry Nov 12 22:32:20 it all worked before Nov 12 22:32:24 just downgrade to 1.4.1 Nov 12 22:32:24 :D Nov 12 22:32:51 lol yeah! Nov 12 22:33:02 lol Nov 12 22:33:07 now where is the downgrades app... Nov 12 22:33:20 wait i was kidding Nov 12 22:33:20 lol Nov 12 22:33:25 and you'd just use a 1.4.1 doctor Nov 12 22:33:26 lol yeah Nov 12 22:33:41 really i wanna fix it, i miss having xterm and a working x server Nov 12 22:33:43 that's still too much trouble just to use xterm Nov 12 22:33:45 just been too busy lately :( Nov 12 22:34:00 well, how much work would it take just for the keybindings? Nov 12 22:34:24 well that itself probably less so. i would start by building a version that logs what happens with the keys so i can see where it's going wrong Nov 12 22:34:32 morning Nov 12 22:34:40 morning Nov 12 22:34:45 and then.. fix it. could be any number of things, like changed values or something. Nov 12 22:35:08 but if i was doing that i'd probably wanna properly fix it for 1.4.5 as well :) Nov 12 22:35:28 and hope that i don't have to do it all again for 2.0 x.x hehe Nov 12 22:36:14 also, for the not launching from launcher, you mentioned it does something the jailing doesn't like Nov 12 22:36:47 I could launch it from Terminal, so is that one just changing the start.sh script, or is it something else? Nov 12 22:38:29 rsanchez1: i had the 'good' idea of breaking up the x-server, x-term, and the scripts that ran them, all into separtae packages Nov 12 22:38:39 so things like x client libraries is a package.... Nov 12 22:38:46 the idea was i'd be porting over a bunch more x stuff Nov 12 22:39:00 so you could just preware-install all the things you wanted (or metapackages) and have a sweet x environment. Nov 12 22:39:16 (i already got xchat, pidgin, various window managers...working..just not packaged..) Nov 12 22:39:24 without having copies of the shared data in each package Nov 12 22:39:29 or a separate x server binary in each package Nov 12 22:39:35 so that worked great before jailing Nov 12 22:39:42 now jailing says you can only access stuff in YOUR package Nov 12 22:39:59 so an xterm package will need to have it's own copy of the x server and all the associated libraries and resources Nov 12 22:39:59 oh so that's the problem Nov 12 22:40:02 which is obnoxious Nov 12 22:40:11 and part of the reason i haven't done it b/c i resent having to do that at all Nov 12 22:40:14 :P Nov 12 22:40:59 (and there was talk of setting up a special jailing for X, etc, that sounded cool but never found motivation to solve that properly) Nov 12 22:41:06 would it be possible for preware to just install all x related packages in the same directory? Nov 12 22:41:19 rsanchez1: yeah. i just wanted to keep it minimal Nov 12 22:41:29 preware doesn't care about directories Nov 12 22:41:31 that's probably where i'll go. also the problem is a package gets 1 launcher icon Nov 12 22:41:35 so what should it do? Nov 12 22:41:42 run the x server? run xserver and the xterm in it? Nov 12 22:41:49 launch a second launcher? Nov 12 22:41:52 run xserver and some window manager (which one?) Nov 12 22:41:55 with x apps Nov 12 22:41:59 * oilsworkn thought "so what should it do?" Nov 12 22:42:09 was going to lead to a commercial-spoof Nov 12 22:42:39 maybe it can come with a default window manager, and then patches could be released for different window managers Nov 12 22:42:57 run an x server with a launcher/window manager thing? matchbox or something? Nov 12 22:43:01 * rsanchez1 doesn't know the process of adding these things, just speculating Nov 12 22:43:09 RagingMind: yeah we already HAVE matchbox in the WIDK, etc, iirc Nov 12 22:43:20 i guess the project just lost steam :/ Nov 12 22:43:28 I still haven't gotten around to trying it out Nov 12 22:43:43 yeah it has matchbox, it has pidgin, it has rdesktop Nov 12 22:44:15 pidgin is a big deal b/c it requires a _bunch_ of libraries like gtk and whatnot Nov 12 22:44:24 xchat on the x server actually works surprisingly well :) Nov 12 22:44:29 how useful is pidgin on the small screen? Nov 12 22:44:59 RagingMind: with an appropriate wm it's decent. i'm not really sure why you'd use it instead of built-in messaging Nov 12 22:45:08 guess misc other protocols Nov 12 22:45:17 because the built in one doesn't do Yahoo Nov 12 22:45:26 ah, well i don't either O:) Nov 12 22:45:37 and I pretty much only use Yahoo and IRC Nov 12 22:45:52 anyway i guess i/we/someone should fix up the pieces that need some love and package this all up Nov 12 22:54:18 dtzWill: a package can install multiple launchpoints (icons) Nov 12 23:35:34 rwhitby: no kidding! didn't know that. :) Nov 12 23:40:25 hello Nov 12 23:41:12 has anyone experience problems with thier camera app? mine is just loading a black screen for the first time it is loaded since reboot and if i press the shutter button it stays tehre for 2 minutes and then says unable to take photo Nov 12 23:41:40 after closing it and reopen the app wont' reload and the grey image will stay on otp Nov 13 02:24:14 howdy! Nov 13 02:26:34 was wondering if anyone knows what starts the palm:// service handler? mines not running.. Nov 13 02:34:50 hello! how many people here are able to u se openssh to ssh into their pre from anywhere in the world using evdo? Nov 13 02:35:35 Colombia: it can be done but requires a modification to the firewall settings in the openssh start script IIRC Nov 13 02:35:49 ohhh is it too hard? Nov 13 02:36:26 Colombia: not very hard if you're comfortable with editing unix scripts, I think the info is on the wiki Nov 13 02:36:35 i was trying to follow these steps butit didn't work. http://palmpre-hacks.com/palm-pre-hacks/how-to-ssh-into-your-palm-pre/ Nov 13 02:36:46 I don't think it's too hard. an iptables entry iirc but actually I don't remember if I got it to work myself! Nov 13 02:37:09 following that links instruction Nov 13 02:37:16 * DarkdowN gahs that he can't open links anymore.. Nov 13 02:37:36 i was able to get to the point where i could connect. it asked for my password. it connected but then immediatly disconnected Nov 13 02:38:22 and it seems like those instructions messed something up or maybe i did by changing the root password. I was am not able to play any type of video/music/ or launch the camera Nov 13 02:38:42 i am doctoring as we speak. . . . WebOS Doctor is a angel sent from heaven Nov 13 02:39:18 heh. def! Nov 13 02:39:54 either palm knew how easy it would be to Screw up webos or they were really smart when creating the doctor Nov 13 02:39:57 immediately disconnected after asking for pass? hmm.. that sounds like something I've encountered too but can't remember why. Nov 13 02:40:12 it would disconnect once Nov 13 02:40:27 then everyother attemp to connect will hang Nov 13 02:40:52 seems like you've got the firewall handled, so it's onto step 2.. maybe lookin at the ssh logs would clarify Nov 13 02:40:58 hmm.. Nov 13 02:40:59 the debug said something about "debug2: channel 0: output drain -> closed" Nov 13 02:41:45 does that help? Nov 13 02:42:08 Colombia: not the output drain! how fast can you run? Nov 13 02:42:23 what do u mean? Nov 13 02:42:46 the hanging throws my guesses off. I'd look at logs in /var/log maybe you need to change a param in sshd_config Nov 13 02:42:46 i can run 40 yards in 10 seconds. . hahaha Nov 13 02:43:25 Colombia: well if the output drain is closed the buildup of electronics could result in a catastrophic explosion. Nov 13 02:43:40 s/onics/ons/ Nov 13 02:43:40 destinal meant: Colombia: well if the output drain is closed the buildup of electrons could result in a catastrophic explosion. Nov 13 02:43:58 Colombia: or I'm just making that up. one or the other. Nov 13 02:44:00 hahahahhahaha Nov 13 02:44:00 that sounds kinda slow. you might not survive Nov 13 02:44:22 :) Nov 13 02:44:52 if it start overheating i will just throw the pre one way and run the other way :D Nov 13 02:46:59 Colombia: I'm not actually sure what that error message means wrt openssh though I have heard of it before. Nov 13 02:47:16 i am doctoring so i could start from scratch Nov 13 02:47:22 what do u suggest i do? Nov 13 02:47:47 Colombia: have you tried ssh'ing in with keys? Nov 13 02:48:03 Colombia: the default configuration we ship doesn't allow password based root login Nov 13 02:48:13 i basically want to be able to ssh and then install this http://palmpre-hacks.com/palm-pre-hacks/how-to-set-up-google-gps-tracking-on-your-palm-pre/ Nov 13 02:49:10 with the default configuraron will i be able to ssh using evdo and not wifi? Nov 13 02:49:29 ugh, setting up a web server on your phone isn't a great way to do tracking IMO Nov 13 02:49:43 did you try lookin in varlog? yeah I think it's an sshd config issue Nov 13 02:50:08 no i forgot to look into that since after that my music/videos/camera stopped working Nov 13 02:50:33 what would be he best way to do tracking? Nov 13 02:50:38 didn't someone come up with Google Latitude support for the palm pre? does it need an app running or is there a service? Nov 13 02:51:12 i think it just made google maps think it was another device and not a webos device Nov 13 02:51:17 would running the shutdown cmd from cmd line power off the phone? Nov 13 02:51:46 not it will jsut stay there. .. . even when trying to ssh from within the phone Nov 13 02:53:11 destinal: I want to set up the webserver because it is an easier interface. i thought i would just be able to have it turned off and whenever i ened to use it i could ssh into the pre and start up the server **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Nov 13 02:59:57 2010