**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Dec 01 02:59:57 2010
Dec 01 03:20:45 <rwhitby> http://fora.tv/live/churchill_club/Wireless_Platform_What_Next
Dec 01 04:51:04 <rbredow> Hey guys. I'm running the WebOS Repair Utility to see if it might find why my Pre is performing *super slowly*.
Dec 01 04:51:16 <rbredow> However, it looks like the checksums aren't matching on just about every file.
Dec 01 04:51:41 <rbredow> I would guess I must have pointed it at the wrong Dr or something, but I just double-checked and I think I got the right one (1.4.5 Sprint Dr)
Dec 01 04:53:03 <destinal> rbredow: has your pre ever been out of your sight recently?  are you an attractive espionage target for foreign governments?
Dec 01 04:53:21 * rbredow doesn't think so! 
Dec 01 04:53:41 <rbredow> Besides, I think they would have left the "png" images for the phone application alone!  :)
Dec 01 04:53:46 <destinal> lol
Dec 01 04:54:26 <rbredow> I'm feeling a Doctor coming on. :)
Dec 01 04:54:29 <destinal> rbredow: I wonder if some OTA didn't apply cleanly, I've never heard of it before though.  If it were me I'd probably doctor with 1.4.5
Dec 01 04:55:40 <rbredow> Anything I should be sure to do first in terms of backup? If I run Save/Restore do I need to grab a file off there to make sure it's backed up?
Dec 01 04:58:26 <rwhitby> rbredow: make sure you pull everything off the USB drive, including the saverestore directory
Dec 01 04:58:48 <rbredow> Will do. Appreciate the newbie help. :)
Dec 01 05:06:35 <SineOt> rbredow: I've seen that before, actually... Where for some reason it was failing on connecting and then pulling like 000 md5 sums and saying everything was screwed up
Dec 01 05:06:48 <SineOt> although in my case it was because of a FAT32 read bug in OSX
Dec 01 05:07:00 <rbredow> It actually had MD5 sums for every file, just none of the matched.
Dec 01 05:07:19 <rbredow> I am on OSX (10.6.5)
Dec 01 05:07:19 <jhowirc> if you have checksum errors
Dec 01 05:07:27 <jhowirc> then you need to doctor
Dec 01 05:07:45 <jhowirc> it means that the OTA failed
Dec 01 05:07:59 <jhowirc> even though it said it completed etc.
Dec 01 05:08:14 <jhowirc> got hit with that on both a pre and pixi
Dec 01 05:08:50 <rbredow> Hopefully this'll make the phone start acting like new again. It's been amazingly slow lately.
Dec 01 06:33:08 <rbredow> rwhitby: Thank you guys for the awesome Save/Restore app. I (stupidly) forgot to email myself my latest keyring updates before I doctored. Save/Restore saved my butt. Awesome.
Dec 01 06:40:52 <torchie> if I change my palm profile password
Dec 01 06:41:00 <torchie> w
Dec 01 06:41:09 <torchie> will the phone make me reset everything
Dec 01 06:47:02 <rbredow> torchie: Mine didn't.
Dec 01 06:47:38 <torchie> is there a way to completely get rid of every device on a palm profile
Dec 01 06:47:46 <torchie> because there's two devices listed on mine but one has no device options
Dec 01 06:54:58 <torchie> losing faith in the cloud
Dec 01 06:55:41 <torchie> and every electronic device ever
Dec 01 07:13:21 <swisstomcat> morning
Dec 01 07:25:48 <hape> morning swisstomcat
Dec 01 07:26:05 <swisstomcat> moin hape
Dec 01 08:33:03 <ice8lue2> morning =)
Dec 01 08:53:46 <hape> ice8lue: Morning, yes I'm from germany too. Frankfurt am Main
Dec 01 10:42:50 <kamthor> hi guys anyone got problems with connecting to the app catalog lately? I don't seem to  get any updates done. preware works ok though
Dec 01 16:13:54 <zsoc_web> Anyone know any semi-professional logo/brochure designers that could give me a decent deal?
Dec 01 16:21:05 <halfhalo> heh...   designers...
Dec 01 16:44:39 <createsoftware> Hi all!
Dec 01 16:44:55 <halfhalo> hi
Dec 01 16:45:47 <createsoftware>  have a quick question about moving from pre+ to pre2: I just activated my pre2 today, but I forgot to turn wifi off on my pre+, and therefore it detected that the palm account had been linked elsewhere, thus unactivating my pre+.
Dec 01 16:46:05 <createsoftware> Woops, I'm missing an "I" at the beginning of my question
Dec 01 16:46:25 <RMind> http://www.amazon.com/Palm-Pixi-Standard-Original-Battery/dp/B0030FNL8K/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1291221269&sr=8-2
Dec 01 16:46:31 <RMind> is that real? am I missing something?
Dec 01 16:46:35 <halfhalo> You could run metadoctor on it, or palms on bypass tool
Dec 01 16:46:53 <createsoftware> I'd like to save the data that's on it, especially PalmDatabase.db3
Dec 01 16:47:12 <createsoftware> But of course it won't let me boot it now, or even connect through usb
Dec 01 16:47:52 <createsoftware> So I was wondering: what if I simply boot it and create a new palm accout. Will it reset?
Dec 01 16:48:10 <halfhalo> It will wipe the palm profile but not the usb partition
Dec 01 16:48:21 <createsoftware> Or else, if I use the same account info, will it force me to redo the setup on my pre2?
Dec 01 16:48:56 <createsoftware> So it will delete the messages?
Dec 01 16:49:05 <halfhalo> no matter what, at this point the existing palm profile will be reset
Dec 01 16:49:07 <kamthor> @rmind: why not, on ebay you can find oem BP1s for 8 bucks a pair
Dec 01 16:49:15 <createsoftware> halfhalo: Woops
Dec 01 16:49:21 <halfhalo> yes, createsoftware, that will reset it
Dec 01 16:49:36 <bem> Can anyone tell me what kernel version webOS 2.0 uses? My google-fu is failing me.
Dec 01 16:49:40 <createsoftware> But then, there is /no/ way to retrieve the smss?
Dec 01 16:49:56 <halfhalo> Only thing I can think of is to boot into usb mode and use novaterm to get it
Dec 01 16:50:10 <createsoftware> Ok =)
Dec 01 16:50:13 <createsoftware> Let me try this
Dec 01 16:50:13 <RMind> bem, opensource.palm.com
Dec 01 16:51:08 <RMind> bem, more specifically http://opensource.palm.com/2.0.0/index.html lists 2.6.24 with patches
Dec 01 16:51:42 <bem> Thanks. That's a disappointment.
Dec 01 16:52:13 <createsoftware> halfhalo: So, volume up, battery in, USB connected
Dec 01 16:52:31 <createsoftware> Anyway to simply copy everything?
Dec 01 16:52:54 <halfhalo> Probly, I don't it off the top of my head though
Dec 01 16:53:04 <bem> Hopefully Palm will eventually update the kernel to something more modern.
Dec 01 16:53:37 <kamthor> guys I can no longer update apps nor access the app catalog online data.
Dec 01 16:54:09 <halfhalo> what is this, lets break our palm profile day?
Dec 01 16:54:30 <createsoftware> ?
Dec 01 16:55:23 <rsanchez> what does the palm profile back up? I thought it did SMS
Dec 01 16:55:31 <halfhalo> Nope
Dec 01 16:55:48 <kamthor> I get a message with unable to connect try agaain later
Dec 01 16:56:15 <rsanchez> it backs up contacts, apps purchased, and what?
Dec 01 16:56:21 <RMind> I haven't gotten any updates in a while from the app catalog
Dec 01 16:56:39 <createsoftware> halfhalo: novacom just won't connect, it seems...
Dec 01 16:56:49 * halfhalo is out of ideas
Dec 01 16:56:52 <kamthor> even the app catalog hangs
Dec 01 16:56:53 <createsoftware> novacom.exe -t open tty:// just vaits
Dec 01 16:57:00 <createsoftware> *waits
Dec 01 16:57:08 <createsoftware> and does nothing
Dec 01 16:57:26 <createsoftware> Nova-browser won't start (command window but nothing more)
Dec 01 16:58:02 <RMind> Dr Battery tells me my battery health is at 77%  :(
Dec 01 16:59:29 <createsoftware> much better: ls: command not found
Dec 01 16:59:48 <kamthor> rmind check out ebay. there is a guy that sells bundles with 2 3 bp1 (not chinese, oem from the states
Dec 01 17:04:08 <createsoftware> Well, nothing seems to work. Thanks for your help, halfhalo :/
Dec 01 17:04:19 <RMind> I was also looking at the Seidio Innocell 1350mAh
Dec 01 17:05:31 <RMind> considering how long it takes the phone to shutdown/boot a battery that lasts longer would be nicer than multiple batteries
Dec 01 17:07:14 <Kyusaku> I have my 1400mah battery in my Pre2
Dec 01 17:08:10 <destinal> createsoftware: you could always doctor and run palm's firstuse bypass or metadoctor to get your device up and running again
Dec 01 17:08:16 <destinal> oh he's gone
Dec 01 17:09:34 <Kyusaku> I was trying that novacom command on my friend's Windows Vista machine and it totally didn't work
Dec 01 17:09:49 <destinal> am i the only one who thinks a novacomfs filesystem driver for linux would be cool?
Dec 01 17:10:28 <destinal> I guess sshfs is easy to do already so not a huge benefit
Dec 01 17:10:34 <rsanchez> don't you have to put the phone in developer mode for novacom to work?
Dec 01 17:10:46 <Kyusaku> yes
Dec 01 17:10:56 <Kyusaku> well for the command line
Dec 01 17:11:38 <destinal> rsanchez: yeah novacom only runs on the device when dev mode is enabled
Dec 01 17:26:58 <destinal> egaudet_work: you should help us figure out hidd plugins -- we're going to need them soon I think..
Dec 01 17:27:21 <egaudet_work> how far have you guys gotten?
Dec 01 17:28:03 <destinal> http://www.webos-internals.org/wiki/Hidd  now has a sample plugin that loads and gets called.  I think bpadalino has more he hasn't posted yet that may or may not be working that tries to send events
Dec 01 17:29:01 <egaudet_work> oh cool
Dec 01 17:30:03 <egaudet_work> I'll start poking around this evening see if I can get up to speed
Dec 01 17:51:01 <msd18> hey distinal
Dec 01 17:51:15 <msd18> hey guys
Dec 01 17:52:19 <msd18> is it possible to install preware without a pc?
Dec 01 17:52:35 <msd18> or just copy the app files without running an app on the pc
Dec 01 17:55:06 <egaudet_work> if you have terminal
Dec 01 17:55:36 <msd18> i had to use doctor cuse when booting i got nothing but the palm logo and wouldnt boot
Dec 01 17:55:40 <msd18> and so i dont have net
Dec 01 17:55:54 <msd18> so my pc cant install preware or term
Dec 01 17:57:25 <msd18> all i can do on the pc at the library is copy files
Dec 01 17:57:32 <Kyusaku> if it ran the doctor it at least has novacomdon there
Dec 01 17:58:11 <msd18> ya but no net on my phone nore pc
Dec 01 17:58:23 <msd18> i wasnt able 2 pay for the wireless net on my fone this month
Dec 01 17:58:26 <Kyusaku> oh no net on the phone
Dec 01 17:58:34 <Kyusaku> not even wifi?
Dec 01 17:58:45 <msd18> not at my house where my pc is
Dec 01 17:58:56 <msd18> only library but library has program restrictions
Dec 01 17:59:26 <Kyusaku> right
Dec 01 17:59:33 <destinal> msd18: hmmmm.  you really need to run novacom to take advantage of dev mode to install preware
Dec 01 17:59:59 <msd18> is there a standalone installer for term?
Dec 01 18:00:10 <msd18> i can download it place it on my fone go home run it on my pc
Dec 01 18:00:19 <msd18> same with preware
Dec 01 18:00:25 <destinal> msd18: oh yeah, download the palm SDK
Dec 01 18:00:30 <msd18> o.o
Dec 01 18:00:30 <destinal> put it on a disk and run it at home
Dec 01 18:00:40 <msd18> ya cant do
Dec 01 18:00:55 <Kyusaku> but he can't get the bootstrap script
Dec 01 18:00:58 <msd18> my laptops screen is cracked i have a 2 inchs by 6 inchs viewing space
Dec 01 18:01:14 <msd18> so its hard enuff to see the installer
Dec 01 18:01:20 <msd18> more or less an entire folder
Dec 01 18:01:26 <torchie> diggity damn
Dec 01 18:01:38 <destinal> msd18: you can't get through the SDK installer?
Dec 01 18:01:38 <msd18> ya im working with shit T.T
Dec 01 18:01:52 <msd18> not at home and library resticts it
Dec 01 18:02:12 <Kyusaku> this is quite conundrum
Dec 01 18:02:18 <msd18> if u saw my laptop u would probaby say fuck and buy me a new one lol
Dec 01 18:02:26 <msd18> its that bad
Dec 01 18:02:34 <msd18> im lucky it works sometimes
Dec 01 18:02:47 <destinal> msd18: you should just put linux on your laptop and make yourself a terminal of some kind to connect to it :)
Dec 01 18:02:57 <msd18> lol i kno right
Dec 01 18:03:20 <msd18> but as i said my laptops screen is cracked badly i barely have any view space
Dec 01 18:03:31 <Kyusaku> destinal: I'd imagine instead of the SDK he can run that novaterm exe on the wiki instead of going through the whole SDK
Dec 01 18:03:44 <msd18> 6 inchs verticaly 2 inchs horiztaly
Dec 01 18:03:49 <destinal> msd18: wait, you ran a doctor on this box already?
Dec 01 18:03:57 <msd18> no at home
Dec 01 18:04:03 <destinal> yeah at home on crack laptop
Dec 01 18:04:08 <msd18> i have webos install and dotcor
Dec 01 18:04:10 <destinal> so you HAVE novacom drivers installed
Dec 01 18:04:15 <msd18> ya
Dec 01 18:04:18 <Kyusaku> yeah he has novacom
Dec 01 18:04:19 <destinal> msd18: you have webos quick install?
Dec 01 18:04:23 <destinal> just use that for preware
Dec 01 18:04:25 <msd18> ya but no net
Dec 01 18:04:34 <msd18> so cant grab preware off it :(
Dec 01 18:04:37 <destinal> WOSQI can install from ipk files on disk right?
Dec 01 18:04:41 <destinal> just grab the ipk at the lib
Dec 01 18:04:45 <Kyusaku> download the ipk and save it to a flash drive
Dec 01 18:04:58 <msd18> where may i grab the ipk at for term and preware
Dec 01 18:05:01 <destinal> http://get.preware.org/
Dec 01 18:05:15 <Kyusaku> preware IPK should be enough
Dec 01 18:05:21 <destinal> msd18: you have data service on your phone right?
Dec 01 18:05:27 <destinal> you can download terminal with preware
Dec 01 18:05:28 <Kyusaku> he says he doesn;t
Dec 01 18:05:37 <msd18> hell no i dont i just have wifi on my fone right now
Dec 01 18:05:45 <destinal> wow
Dec 01 18:05:48 <msd18> sorry $30 a month is alot
Dec 01 18:06:02 <msd18> its $96 a month total
Dec 01 18:06:11 <msd18> i only had 64 :(
Dec 01 18:06:18 <msd18> so had to drop net
Dec 01 18:06:53 <msd18> when can we expect to see webos 2.0 for pixi plus
Dec 01 18:07:07 <Kyusaku> "coming months" :P
Dec 01 18:07:16 <msd18> T.T me want wirc now tho
Dec 01 18:07:25 <destinal> msd18: this is a pixi?
Dec 01 18:07:35 <msd18> ya its a pixi
Dec 01 18:07:37 <SineOt> you can still use wIRC, you just get the old busted ass version lol
Dec 01 18:07:43 <msd18> o.o
Dec 01 18:07:48 <destinal> msd18: terminal IPK is here:   http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-internals/armv6/org.webosinternals.terminal_0.3.1_arm.ipk
Dec 01 18:08:35 <destinal> latest preware since you don't have data service is here:  http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-internals/armv6/org.webosinternals.preware_1.4.5_arm.ipk
Dec 01 18:08:35 <msd18> this is an epic fail :(
Dec 01 18:08:41 <msd18> cant right click ether to save wtf
Dec 01 18:09:16 <destinal> msd18: just browse ipkg.preware.org
Dec 01 18:09:17 <egaudet_work> I'm confused what has internet and what doesn't
Dec 01 18:09:34 <Kyusaku> egaudet: nothing except library PC
Dec 01 18:09:36 <destinal> go feeds, webos-internals  then armv6
Dec 01 18:09:45 <halfhalo> good times...
Dec 01 18:10:26 <msd18> ya not working
Dec 01 18:10:42 <msd18> i click terminal.ipk file and opens it as a txt file in the browser o.o
Dec 01 18:10:42 <destinal> ?
Dec 01 18:10:54 <msd18> holy fucking hell
Dec 01 18:11:08 <msd18> wow
Dec 01 18:11:16 <msd18> but some other ipk files open as a save diag
Dec 01 18:12:11 <msd18> god this is retarded
Dec 01 18:12:22 <msd18> preware and term open as txt files in a browser
Dec 01 18:12:31 <msd18> but other ipks open as a save as diag
Dec 01 18:13:07 <destinal> msd18: a gift of a zip file:  http://www.mediafire.com/?lu9s4xh3j4jtk2r
Dec 01 18:13:33 <msd18> ya to bad u cant do that with the terminal files huh
Dec 01 18:13:42 <msd18> unzip and copy them into the diskdrive
Dec 01 18:13:42 <msd18> xD
Dec 01 18:13:43 <destinal> that zip has preware and terminal
Dec 01 18:13:45 <destinal> made just for you
Dec 01 18:14:21 <msd18> thanks
Dec 01 18:14:50 <msd18> to bad its not possible 2 install the files copy the files to a zip and copy them into my device without need if install
Dec 01 18:14:55 <msd18> that would be alot better
Dec 01 18:14:57 <msd18> lol
Dec 01 18:15:36 <msd18> hey dis
Dec 01 18:15:37 <msd18> des
Dec 01 18:15:55 <msd18> will the ryanhope wirc 1.0 install on a web os 1.4.5 pixi
Dec 01 18:16:13 <msd18> or will the install exit with errors?
Dec 01 18:16:41 <destinal> msd18: pixi isn't getting new versions because the newest are hybrid apps
Dec 01 18:16:48 <destinal> pixi doesn't support hybrid yet
Dec 01 18:16:54 <msd18> o.o and why not
Dec 01 18:17:05 <destinal> in 2,0 I imagine it should
Dec 01 18:17:06 <SineOt> latest version of wIRC that runs on the Pixi is like 0.2.3 or something
Dec 01 18:17:17 <SineOt> so yes, it should install fine
Dec 01 18:17:24 <msd18> wow gayness
Dec 01 18:17:26 <SineOt> you just won't have the newest version
Dec 01 18:17:33 <msd18> when can we expect 2.0
Dec 01 18:17:33 <SineOt> since hybrids are broken on the Pixi
Dec 01 18:17:40 <SineOt> (although isn't Preware a hybrid too?)
Dec 01 18:18:56 <destinal> SineOt: Preware uses a service that it comes with in the same package
Dec 01 18:19:06 <destinal> not the same as the hybrid / pdk model
Dec 01 18:19:09 <SineOt> ah
Dec 01 18:19:25 <msd18> des when is webos 2.0 expected to come out
Dec 01 18:19:36 <SineOt> "coming months"
Dec 01 18:19:40 <SineOt> is all Palm has really said
Dec 01 18:19:51 <destinal> I thought I read on precentral that the first week of december one of the carriers would be doing an OTA
Dec 01 18:19:52 <msd18> lol dam i heard end of december
Dec 01 18:19:57 <destinal> for pre though, not pixi
Dec 01 18:20:08 <msd18> ya i see its already here for pre2
Dec 01 18:20:17 <SineOt> yeah, there might be a Pre/Pre+ version of 2.0 coming soon
Dec 01 18:20:23 <SineOt> but Pixi is still a ways off I imagine
Dec 01 18:20:26 <msd18> i hate webos 1.4.5
Dec 01 18:20:35 <SineOt> msd18: when did you get your pixi?
Dec 01 18:20:38 <msd18> my pixi keeps crashing and rebooting its dumbass with that update
Dec 01 18:20:41 <msd18> a month ago
Dec 01 18:20:47 <SineOt> I've had mine since launch
Dec 01 18:20:52 <msd18> lol
Dec 01 18:20:53 <SineOt> trust me, 1.4.5 is nice XD
Dec 01 18:20:57 <SineOt> 1.2.9 was terrible
Dec 01 18:20:57 <msd18> noooo its not
Dec 01 18:20:59 <en0x> [;
Dec 01 18:21:04 <msd18> omg ya i bet that was bad
Dec 01 18:21:05 <en0x> u should use 1.4.0
Dec 01 18:21:06 <en0x> ;]
Dec 01 18:21:09 <msd18> but im tired of tehe reboots
Dec 01 18:21:15 <msd18> the*
Dec 01 18:21:22 <SineOt> msd18 are you using any of the like, uberkernel or anything
Dec 01 18:21:29 <msd18> no
Dec 01 18:21:35 <SineOt> I use Warthog and don't have the same reboot issues I used to have
Dec 01 18:21:41 <SineOt> and no more too many cards errors either!
Dec 01 18:21:53 <msd18> well after the reboots i started using uberkern
Dec 01 18:21:58 <msd18> and then i was lagging like fuck
Dec 01 18:21:58 <msd18> xD
Dec 01 18:22:19 <SineOt> hm!
Dec 01 18:22:22 <en0x> get geyphone
Dec 01 18:22:23 <en0x> ;]
Dec 01 18:22:31 <en0x> gay*
Dec 01 18:22:36 <en0x> =
Dec 01 18:22:41 <en0x> iphone
Dec 01 18:22:49 <msd18> omg nooo
Dec 01 18:22:53 <msd18> iphones can kiss my ass
Dec 01 18:22:54 <SineOt> lol
Dec 01 18:23:02 <SineOt> I should port Grindr to the Pre/Pixi :U
Dec 01 18:23:10 <msd18> but wat i do wanna do is extract darwin from the iphone
Dec 01 18:23:35 <SineOt> nerd time but Hexley > Tux
Dec 01 18:24:29 <msd18> lol sine0t wat u should do is port linux os with gnone interface and phone utils so ppl can have a cell and home pc in one and do the overclock at 600mhz or higher if hackable
Dec 01 18:24:52 <SineOt> pft, like I know how to do that!
Dec 01 18:25:00 <msd18> rofl
Dec 01 18:25:10 <torchie> oh lawd
Dec 01 18:25:24 <msd18> i want backtrak linux ported to my fone i can use wep code cracking around the place :P
Dec 01 18:25:31 <SineOt> I mean hell I'm having trouble with if statements in Javascript :P
Dec 01 18:25:38 <msd18> o.o
Dec 01 18:25:43 <SineOt> it grabs an element fine if it's not in an if statement but breaks if it is!
Dec 01 18:25:51 * msd18 slaps sine0t
Dec 01 18:26:05 <SineOt> >:C
Dec 01 18:26:08 <msd18> lol
Dec 01 18:26:30 <msd18> nah wat we should do is make a botnet for webos
Dec 01 18:26:31 <msd18> xD
Dec 01 18:26:47 <msd18> omg image all the fones as a botnet o.o
Dec 01 18:27:03 <msd18> imagin*
Dec 01 18:27:38 <msd18> total pwnage and untrackable xD and undetectable
Dec 01 18:27:47 <msd18> lawl
Dec 01 18:28:11 <msd18> des wats ur input on thatx
Dec 01 18:28:13 <msd18> xD
Dec 01 18:28:32 <SineOt> the slowest, low bandwidth botnet ever
Dec 01 18:28:40 <msd18> ya but still
Dec 01 18:28:53 <msd18> xD
Dec 01 18:29:21 <msd18> with the botnet on there u basicly rooted a phone giving not only net access from it but file and contact access
Dec 01 18:29:54 <msd18> and without a antivirus for webos ppl wont see it
Dec 01 18:29:58 <msd18> :P
Dec 01 18:30:18 <msd18> omg that would be funny ppl taking nudes and u stealing them xD
Dec 01 18:30:34 <msd18> sorry but that would be epic
Dec 01 18:30:37 <SineOt> you're weird :p
Dec 01 18:30:45 <msd18> wat its funny
Dec 01 18:31:01 <msd18> rofl sin went poof
Dec 01 18:31:09 <msd18> des u there?
Dec 01 18:31:14 <msd18> i have 20 mins till i have to run
Dec 01 18:36:47 <msd18> well guys thanks for the help i g2g ttyl
Dec 01 20:07:24 <[d]> any word on getting an arm6 version of xorg?
Dec 01 20:19:41 <msd18> hey ppl
Dec 01 20:19:53 <en0x> u again? omg
Dec 01 20:20:09 <msd18> who -looks around-
Dec 01 20:25:30 <dtzWill> [d]: pixi is in the mail to me
Dec 01 20:25:50 <dtzWill> [d]: and when i get it, and get some time (hopefully will be soon over winter break), i'll be making that happen :)
Dec 01 20:26:06 <[d]> awsome! thanks for the update
Dec 01 20:26:16 <dtzWill> [d]: also i humorously, out of habit i suppose, tried to escape your nick before attempting to tab-complete it
Dec 01 20:26:21 <dtzWill> \[d<TAB>
Dec 01 20:26:26 <dtzWill> it didn't work :(
Dec 01 20:27:13 <dtzWill> [d]: np. feel free to bug me about it all you like :).  Might increase chances of it happening sooner rather than later hehe
Dec 01 20:28:39 <[d]> i was hoping i could install xorg on my deb chroot and some how to get it to run, but I think these special apps that are in the the arm7 version are needed.. it runs, but doesn't do anything.. doesn't error out either.. =)
Dec 01 20:29:33 <dtzWill> [d]: the biggest issue was getting xsdl to run and to work with in a card, etc.  Also did some gl stuff to make it slightly faster, but that's not significant.
Dec 01 20:29:46 <dtzWill> [d]: so if you found a xsdl binary for the armv6 version of deb that might work?
Dec 01 20:30:17 <dtzWill> [d]: a normal x server will not afaik because no ddx will work on the pre by default
Dec 01 20:30:31 <dtzWill> i think you can point it at the framebuffer too?
Dec 01 20:30:47 <dtzWill> anyway getting the existing xsdl port on a pixi shouldn't be that hard, mostly it just needs to be done and tested
Dec 01 20:30:58 <dtzWill> unlike other things i'm gonna be porting to the pixi, there's nothing really armv7-specific
Dec 01 20:33:26 <[d]> i will look around and see if there is an xsdl floating around for armv6 .. I haven't saw any yet
Dec 01 20:34:13 <dtzWill> [d]: oh that was the other thing--it was so broken it was removed from mainline :/.  so some of what i did was fix it/finish implementating what seemed to be partial updates to changes made in the rest of X
Dec 01 20:34:40 <dtzWill> anyway hopefully i'll have that going in a few weeks anyway :)
Dec 01 20:35:34 <[d]> thats fine.  I was anxious to try out xorg, but then realized I'm on an arm6 and well not much of anything cool is ported to that. lol
Dec 01 20:36:45 <dtzWill> [d]: well if you mean cool stuff from webos-internals we all just got pixis or will in the next week or so-- so while i can't promise anything (we're all on various schedules and with different priorities, etc), hopefully we'll see pixi getting more love soon :)
Dec 01 20:37:17 <dtzWill> but with pre2 and webos 2.0 just coming out there's.. a lot of exciting stuff to do O:)
Dec 01 20:43:22 <[d]> oh yeah... about 2.0 what is the anticipated arrival date for that for legacy phones?  I have saw mixed reports on when it would be released..
Dec 01 20:45:03 <oil> i dont believe a date has ever been said
Dec 01 20:45:12 <oil> only "soon"?
Dec 01 20:45:52 <[d]> a while back i heard something like Q1 i figured that was for the pre2..
Dec 01 20:48:02 <[d]> when you compile stuff for the pre do you run a pre environment with compiling tools or do you just do some sort of cross compile.  I've always been curious on how that is done.  I've never compiled something for another arch.
Dec 01 21:06:19 <Marajin> [d]: They use a cross compiler tool chain
Dec 01 21:10:05 <rwhitby> [d]: for some things we use a straight codesourcery cross-compiler.  for other things we use scratchbox2
Dec 01 22:34:21 <kamthor> Anyone has a fix for a messed up catalog app? I get a unable to connect try again later error when trying to update apps and the catalog app just shows a spinner. Preware worrks fine though. Ideas?
Dec 01 22:37:48 <msd18> guess whooo
Dec 01 22:37:48 <msd18> lol
Dec 01 22:37:59 <SineOt> hey msd18. you got wirc working? :D
Dec 01 22:38:46 <msd18> lol ya till my dataplan ends tonight :( then gotta use wifi
Dec 01 22:38:46 <msd18> lol
Dec 01 22:38:53 <rsanchez1> I used to get something like that a couple of weeks ago, but haven't gotten it for a while
Dec 01 22:39:00 <rsanchez1> kamthor: does a yellow triangle pop up?
Dec 01 22:39:30 <msd18> sin can you pm me
Dec 01 22:39:39 <SineOt> hey, at least you've got wifi
Dec 01 22:39:41 <kamthor> Rsanchez: nope
Dec 01 22:40:16 <rsanchez1> what version of webOS do you have?
Dec 01 22:40:37 <kamthor> A spinning circle for a couple minutes then the error message
Dec 01 22:40:46 <kamthor> 1.4.5
Dec 01 22:41:00 <kamthor> It was ok until yesterday
Dec 01 22:41:19 <kamthor> Installed some apps via ipk fetcher
Dec 01 22:41:45 <SineOt> ipk fetcher?
Dec 01 22:44:50 <kamthor> Yup a java program pc-side that lets you install apps not available in your country
Dec 01 22:45:14 <rsanchez1> I used ipk fetcher just to download an ipk, then installed it using palm-install
Dec 01 22:46:48 <kamthor> http://forums.precentral.net/gsm-pre/234260-ipk-fetcher.html
Dec 01 22:48:00 <kamthor> Basically It installs a dummy package that gets later updated by the updates app
Dec 01 22:48:06 <SineOt> ah
Dec 01 22:48:24 <SineOt> no use for me then, since my dev device can't get updates anyways! :I
Dec 01 22:48:56 <kamthor> You could  update via wifi
Dec 01 22:49:21 <SineOt> never been activated, so I don't think I can... Unless update app works differently than the app catalog
Dec 01 22:49:50 <rsanchez1> update app launches app catalog for apps
Dec 01 22:49:52 <kamthor> You can try
Dec 01 22:50:12 <SineOt> yeah, worth a shot. I want the time sync app since the clock on the Pre is -really- bad if it's not on network
Dec 01 22:51:38 <kamthor> Yeah that is really a shame. Space tech inside and you don't get a reliable clock
Dec 01 22:51:58 <rsanchez1> people 500 years ago could make more accurate clocks
Dec 01 22:52:08 <torchie> somethings wrong with the clock?
Dec 01 22:52:42 <kamthor> Lol
Dec 01 22:53:07 <kamthor> Try a reboot and watch the clock
Dec 01 22:53:16 <kamthor> It lags
Dec 01 22:53:35 <SineOt> torchie: without a network connection, the clock drifted about... 5 hours over the course of 2 days
Dec 01 22:53:49 <SineOt> which is like, abysmal to say the least
Dec 01 22:55:20 <torchie> jesus christ
Dec 01 22:55:22 <ashi_colocated> yup. I wish I could use it as a clock on a long flight.  W/o using Gogo.
Dec 01 22:55:35 <torchie> you really can't rely on anything for anything these days can you
Dec 01 22:56:00 <SineOt> I'm kind of surprised that 1) the clock is THAT bad, and 2) that it can't sync via ntp over wifi or something
Dec 01 22:56:21 <torchie> how much of a donk did they have to put on the pre at launch ;-;
Dec 01 22:56:53 <torchie> the mediasmart team better be kick ass donk fixers
Dec 01 22:57:12 <destinal> SineOt: you can, they just don't provide support for it.   it's a _phone_   :)
Dec 01 22:57:54 <destinal> but sure, ntp with cron or maybe we should make a service to do it
Dec 01 22:58:08 <SineOt> destinal: there's an ntp daemon for the Pre or somethin?
Dec 01 22:58:31 <SineOt> there's the Time Sync app on the app catalog, but it's kind of... Moot. Since a dev phone, unless you activate it, can't get to the app catalog anyways!
Dec 01 22:58:59 <SineOt> question: If I activate my Pre+ on T-mobile in the US, will I have the US app catalog?
Dec 01 22:59:26 <destinal> SineOt: it's linux. you can use the same daemon you'd use on a linux PC.  probably available in optware or just compile and install and set up in upstart
Dec 01 22:59:35 <SineOt> I've got two activated tmo sims, but no att ones...
Dec 01 23:01:54 <destinal> is it me or is the knight rider effect on pixi just awesome?
Dec 01 23:03:08 <SineOt> destinal: hah, you mean the light bar?
Dec 01 23:03:25 <destinal> yeah the way it slides the direction of the gesture
Dec 01 23:03:36 <SineOt> I'm not sure how to get it to do it
Dec 01 23:03:37 <destinal> looks like KITT or something
Dec 01 23:03:48 <SineOt> but there's this one gesture where it flashes the outside edges, then the center
Dec 01 23:03:51 <SineOt> that looks really awesome
Dec 01 23:03:56 <SineOt> but I have no idea how, or what, it's for
Dec 01 23:04:09 <SineOt> I only see it when the screen freaks out and thinks that I'm tapping who knows what
Dec 01 23:04:23 <SineOt> but it sure looks cool!
Dec 01 23:10:04 <destinal> rwhitby: ka6sox:  Okay, devicetool.jar officially rocks.
Dec 01 23:10:15 <shades> hey
Dec 01 23:10:20 <halfhalo> thats the palm one right?
Dec 01 23:10:25 <shades> i made a lame hello world application
Dec 01 23:10:37 <shades> where can I get a howto/tutorial on how to make less lame things?
Dec 01 23:10:42 <destinal> halfhalo: yeah, easiest devmode ever
Dec 01 23:10:55 * halfhalo made one of those as well... Called it "Steal your SSN" App
Dec 01 23:11:31 <destinal> hold volume up, java -jar devicetool.jar on pc, and all the rest just works
Dec 01 23:11:35 <halfhalo> yupyup
Dec 01 23:12:46 <shades> ??
Dec 01 23:14:53 <destinal> the cover on pre sucks but pixi's is really nice.. keyboard too.  now if they had only put a better CPU in one of these...
Dec 01 23:17:31 * rsanchez1 loves pixi keyboard
Dec 01 23:24:02 <SineOt> yeah the Pixi keyboard is amazing
Dec 01 23:24:32 * oil wants it on his pre
Dec 01 23:25:02 <rwhitby> Xacto knife ...
Dec 01 23:25:04 <shades> pixi keyboard is nice?
Dec 01 23:25:21 <shades> i thought the sidekickII had the best phone keyboard ever
Dec 01 23:28:04 <rsanchez1> haha, rwhitby, mcguiver a pixi keyboard on a pre
Dec 01 23:28:29 * oil thinks shades should have started that with "ill let you finish, but..."
Dec 01 23:28:46 <halfhalo> Its "imma" not "ill"
Dec 01 23:28:52 <oil> whatever
Dec 01 23:28:58 <halfhalo> psh
Dec 01 23:29:18 <destinal> it's a lot easier to type on anyway.   I definitely notice the screen being small though...
Dec 01 23:29:28 <oil> yeah
Dec 01 23:29:39 <oil> seems like its got a higher pixel density though
Dec 01 23:29:45 <oil> things seem sharper
Dec 01 23:29:53 <halfhalo> HUZZAH!
Dec 01 23:30:01 <shades> tbh I was kind of disappointed w/ the pre
Dec 01 23:30:04 * halfhalo got node to talk to couch
Dec 01 23:30:07 <shades> 8 /
Dec 01 23:30:15 <shades> I was hoping for a scrollball
Dec 01 23:30:19 <shades> instead of a button
Dec 01 23:30:19 <halfhalo> a nice leather couch to, with a fold out legrest
Dec 01 23:30:52 <oil> scrollball? psh
Dec 01 23:31:31 <rsanchez1> why scrollball when you can drag to scroll?
Dec 01 23:31:44 <PuffTheMagic> dpad!!!
Dec 01 23:31:57 <PuffTheMagic> and dualshock!
Dec 01 23:32:02 <shades> because dragging to scroll is glitchy and laggy
Dec 01 23:32:06 <shades> VERY laggy sometimes
Dec 01 23:32:11 <shades> somtimes locks up for several seconds to minutes
Dec 01 23:32:17 <shades> plus
Dec 01 23:32:23 * oil thinks shades pre is bunk
Dec 01 23:32:27 <shades> if a webpage has mouseOver functionality, wel then you're just fKed
Dec 01 23:32:34 <shades> you can't mouse over w/ a touchscreen
Dec 01 23:32:46 <shades> it'll just register as a click on the main link instead of dropping down the menu
Dec 01 23:32:47 <oil> so, a physical scrollball is the solution?
Dec 01 23:32:49 <shades> really really a pain in the ass
Dec 01 23:32:58 <shades> it's a solution
Dec 01 23:33:02 <shades> i didn't say it was THE solution
Dec 01 23:33:03 <oil> or should the webpage simply not use mouseover crap
Dec 01 23:33:12 <shades> mouseover stuff is not crap
Dec 01 23:33:17 <shades> and very useful on desktops to say the least
Dec 01 23:33:27 <oil> which has a different input mechanism
Dec 01 23:33:47 <rwhitby> Hmm - I can't find where TileStorm saves its progress data.
Dec 01 23:33:52 <shades> yeah wel I can't just not go to pages because those people refuse to offer something other than mouseover
Dec 01 23:33:54 <destinal> the web is supposed to be device agnostic
Dec 01 23:33:55 <shades> like work, for example
Dec 01 23:34:00 <shades> /suppose to/
Dec 01 23:34:03 <destinal> why even assume a mouse?
Dec 01 23:34:21 <rsanchez1> I thought you could mouseover if you hold down your finger on the touch screen
Dec 01 23:34:25 <shades> no
Dec 01 23:34:28 <shades> it clicks the link
Dec 01 23:34:35 <shades> does not drop down the mouse menu
Dec 01 23:34:36 <destinal> what about keyboards or voice commands for the disabled
Dec 01 23:34:39 <destinal> you insensitive clod..
Dec 01 23:34:41 <destinal> :)
Dec 01 23:34:41 <shades> because when you touch it registers as a click not a mouse over
Dec 01 23:34:44 <oil> lol
Dec 01 23:34:48 <rsanchez1> drop down the mouse menu? as in right-click?
Dec 01 23:34:53 <shades> no
Dec 01 23:34:56 <shades> as in no clicking
Dec 01 23:34:59 <shades> just mousing over the menu drops it down
Dec 01 23:35:02 <shades> this isn't windows
Dec 01 23:35:05 <rsanchez1> which menu?
Dec 01 23:35:09 <shades> any webmenu
Dec 01 23:35:13 <shades> that has a mouseOver
Dec 01 23:35:25 * oil hates mouseover menus
Dec 01 23:35:31 <oil> hiding navigation from the user is always a bad idea
Dec 01 23:35:32 <destinal> shades: someone relying on mouseover as more than just a optional cool effect (which IMO is still lame)  is wrong
Dec 01 23:36:05 <rsanchez1> didn't google try that and made a lot of people annoyed?
Dec 01 23:37:16 <shades> destinal: weather you think it's wrong or not doesn't change the fact it's an accepted webstandard that isn't going anyway because you plug your ears and yell falalalalalala
Dec 01 23:37:24 <rsanchez1> I guess it could be better said annoyed a lot of people
Dec 01 23:37:42 <rsanchez1> I've never heard of mouseover menus being a standard
Dec 01 23:37:48 <oil> shades: but that doesn't mean we need a stupid scrollball
Dec 01 23:37:50 <shades> all I can say is thank god blink got depricated
Dec 01 23:37:56 <shades> stupid?
Dec 01 23:38:00 <shades> scrollballs are VERY useful
Dec 01 23:38:04 <oil> yes, stupid :)
Dec 01 23:38:06 <shades> it wouldn't make the device any larger
Dec 01 23:38:10 <shades> offers more input
Dec 01 23:38:12 <rsanchez1> I don't see any smartphones with a scrollball
Dec 01 23:38:14 <oil> its a touchscreen device
Dec 01 23:38:22 <shades> so?
Dec 01 23:38:28 <rsanchez1> I don't count blackberry as smartphone
Dec 01 23:38:41 <oil> so what?
Dec 01 23:38:44 <shades> you run into a problem if you want to draw on an image that's larger than your screen
Dec 01 23:38:56 <shades> instead of dragging the image around with your finger, you could draw with your finger and use the ball to move the image around
Dec 01 23:39:00 <shades> currently, you can't do that
Dec 01 23:39:09 <shades> not having a trackball really makes me feel crippled on the phone
Dec 01 23:39:12 <oil> that can be solved with software
Dec 01 23:39:16 <shades> makes it a bitch to highlight and copy and paste
Dec 01 23:39:19 <rsanchez1> that would be really confusing though
Dec 01 23:39:24 <shades> no it wouldn't be confusing
Dec 01 23:39:27 <oil> you can tell the difference between a flick to move the canvas and a draw
Dec 01 23:39:27 <shades> oil: I don't think so
Dec 01 23:39:33 <rsanchez1> most people are used to dragging and scrolling when they touch the screen, not drawing
Dec 01 23:39:37 <oil> or hold the gesture for a "meta"
Dec 01 23:39:42 <shades> I can but can the software? I don't think it would run smoothly that way
Dec 01 23:39:43 <oil> that "now i wish to move the canvas"
Dec 01 23:39:56 <shades> I dislike having to hold things for a certain time to activate functions
Dec 01 23:39:59 <shades> I want immediate results
Dec 01 23:40:03 <shades> which is why I love keyboards
Dec 01 23:40:05 <rsanchez1> I use flick events to scroll a canvas
Dec 01 23:40:08 <shades> instant, no latency input
Dec 01 23:40:14 <oil> LOL
Dec 01 23:40:26 * oil forgot you can't change anyones mind on the internets
Dec 01 23:40:32 * oil goes back to doing something productive
Dec 01 23:40:35 <shades> uh well
Dec 01 23:40:39 <shades> having a ball makes me more productive
Dec 01 23:40:45 <oil> go get a blackberry
Dec 01 23:40:45 <shades> not having it makes me less productive
Dec 01 23:40:50 <shades> fuck blackberry
Dec 01 23:40:58 <shades> I need a touchscreen that doesn't suck
Dec 01 23:41:00 <rsanchez1> blackberry has a scrollball, wtf
Dec 01 23:41:02 <oil> :/
Dec 01 23:41:08 <shades> and it has a touchscreen that fails it
Dec 01 23:41:18 <oil> because they want you to use the scrollball
Dec 01 23:41:20 <oil> lol
Dec 01 23:41:36 <shades> look the point is you can have both, and you can have both WORK WELL and it's not going to cost a significant amount more
Dec 01 23:41:50 * oil wats for "shadePhone"
Dec 01 23:41:56 <oil> waits*
Dec 01 23:41:59 <shades> having both will make the device more useable, more productive, and more flexible on howyou decide to interface with it
Dec 01 23:42:00 <rsanchez1> get a blackberry torch then
Dec 01 23:42:02 <halfhalo> hah
Dec 01 23:42:16 <shades> i'll get an android before i get a black berry
Dec 01 23:42:23 <rsanchez1> you can search for moby dick then
Dec 01 23:44:21 <rsanchez1> probably draw a great white whale all over the screen while you scroll it
Dec 01 23:44:35 * oil doesnt draw with his smartphone
Dec 01 23:45:05 <shades> and neither should anyone else, right?
Dec 01 23:45:14 <shades> copy/paste would be easier
Dec 01 23:45:17 <oil> i dont care what you do with your phone
Dec 01 23:45:28 <shades> all I'm saying is it would be MORE USEFUL with a scrollball
Dec 01 23:45:39 <oil> and im saying i have no need or want for one
Dec 01 23:45:42 <shades> just because it's a multitouch screen doesn't mean a scrollball is superflous
Dec 01 23:45:55 <oil> lol
Dec 01 23:47:03 <rwhitby> aha, /var/palm/jail/com.jakl.tilestorm/...
Dec 01 23:47:07 * rsanchez1 wonders how the scrollball and touchscreen match in the BB Torch...
Dec 01 23:49:25 <Reef88> Can someone help me find a link to properly download novacom D
Dec 01 23:49:26 <Reef88> ?
Dec 01 23:49:33 <oil> Reef88: its in the sdk
Dec 01 23:49:50 <shades> but yeah
Dec 01 23:49:59 <shades> I totally wouldn't have gotten the pre if it didn't have a physical keyboard
Dec 01 23:50:09 <Reef88> i tried at least 4 times and the service removed keeps appearing
Dec 01 23:50:15 <Reef88> what is sdk?
Dec 01 23:50:23 <shades> software development kit
Dec 01 23:50:49 <Reef88> ok and where can I find that sorry ima noob
Dec 01 23:50:50 <Reef88> ?
Dec 01 23:51:03 <rwhitby> developer.palm.com
Dec 01 23:51:10 <rsanchez1> http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&layout=page&id=1788&Itemid=21
Dec 01 23:51:14 <oil> google.com search for "webos sdk"
Dec 01 23:53:17 <Reef88> once i download the sdk what do I do then to access the novacom D
Dec 01 23:53:19 <Reef88> ?
Dec 01 23:53:27 <oil> install it
Dec 01 23:54:07 * halfhalo would have eaten it
Dec 01 23:55:20 <Reef88> why does the novacom D show errors to begin with just wondering
Dec 01 23:55:20 <Reef88> ?
Dec 01 23:56:22 <Reef88> will i be able to use preware once I instal the sdk?
Dec 01 23:59:03 <rsanchez1> you can install preware using webOS quick install
Dec 02 00:00:09 <Reef88> i have pre ware on my phone but I cant use it properly because the novacom D wont install for me
Dec 02 00:00:17 <Reef88> I've been trying all day to no avail
Dec 02 00:00:22 <Reef88> cnat wait for my upgrade
Dec 02 00:08:44 <rwhitby> Reef88: grab the Preware Homebrew Documentation app from the Palm app catalog, and follow the instructions in that.
Dec 02 00:13:19 <Reef88> ok the download is done what do i install?
Dec 02 00:17:34 <rsanchez1> which download? did you follow the instructions in the Preware Homebrew Documentation app?
Dec 02 00:17:57 <Reef88> I just downloaded the SDK eventhough I dont think I needed it
Dec 02 00:23:15 <Reef88> @rsanchez its this novacomD file it continues to say service removed
Dec 02 00:24:36 <Reef88> Do I need the NovacomD ? for the preware to work
Dec 02 00:27:08 <Reef88> it still keeps saying service removed for this Novacom D so frustrating
Dec 02 00:27:54 <RMind> Reef88, what's your OS?
Dec 02 00:28:24 * rwhitby wonders whether Reef88 has read the instructions in the PHD app yet
Dec 02 00:28:45 <Reef88> I have I have
Dec 02 00:28:54 <Reef88> I'd done everything properly
Dec 02 00:29:07 <Reef88> the NovacomD once I downlad it says service removed everytime
Dec 02 00:29:13 <rwhitby> at which step does it fail - give me the page title and step number
Dec 02 00:29:54 <Reef88> palmwebOs 1.4.5 @RMind
Dec 02 00:30:59 <Reef88> when I attempt to NovacomD installation
Dec 02 00:31:13 <Tibfib> that's not a page number...
Dec 02 00:31:26 <Tibfib> ... page title, or step number :)
Dec 02 00:31:29 <RMind> Reef88, i was wondering about your computer
Dec 02 00:31:40 <rsanchez1> page title AND step number
Dec 02 00:31:57 <Reef88> oh im sorry @Rmind Windows XP
Dec 02 00:32:59 <Reef88> Step number 6 Attempt Novacom (reinstallation)
Dec 02 00:33:28 <mugen-> anyone have suggestions on debug methods for a mobile data connection not happening
Dec 02 00:33:29 <mugen-> ?
Dec 02 00:33:43 <mugen-> voice works.. no 3g symbol... no data
Dec 02 00:34:02 <mugen-> verizon says i'm SOL because the device isn't warrantied through them
Dec 02 00:34:14 <rsanchez1> ouch
Dec 02 00:34:36 <rsanchez1> I think I saw something for that before somewhere, try searching the P|C forums
Dec 02 00:34:50 <mugen-> done factory restores... done ##786 restores, ##3282 restores.. no go
Dec 02 00:35:10 * rwhitby still waits for page title and step number from Reef88 before continuing
Dec 02 00:35:57 <RMind> Reef88, not sure what would cause problems installing novacom specifically, but I know that a lot of antivirus programs can cause the installation of unrecognized services to fail in really weird ways
Dec 02 00:37:56 <Reef88_> ?
Dec 02 00:37:56 <Reef88_> @rsanchez1 any suggestions
Dec 02 00:38:18 <Tibfib> rwhitby: he posted it
Dec 02 00:39:08 <Tibfib> I thought.
Dec 02 00:39:29 <Reef88_> do you think i should uninstall everything then reinstall and try again
Dec 02 00:39:30 <Reef88_> ?
Dec 02 00:40:00 <rwhitby> Reef88_: have you read and/or posted in the forum thread as advised in step 6?
Dec 02 00:41:00 <Reef88_> yes I been at this for hours now doing the same thing over and over is there any other way i can get novacom D because its either this pc or something else going on
Dec 02 00:41:28 <RMind> Reef88_, not sure what would cause problems installing novacom specifically, but I know that a lot of antivirus and firewall programs can cause the installation of unrecognized services to fail in really weird ways
Dec 02 00:41:56 <Reef88_> hmmm so what do u suggest ?
Dec 02 00:43:09 <RMind> I don't really want to suggest too much without being more familiar with how the software installs on windows, but I just wanted to toss that out there because the kind of error you described reminded me of some other software
Dec 02 00:43:42 <rwhitby> Reef88_: what's the URL of your post in the forum with your full problem description and list of steps you took to get where you are now?
Dec 02 00:44:20 <Reef88_> so pretty much I cant use preware a tthis ponint
Dec 02 00:44:22 <Reef88_> point
Dec 02 00:44:49 <Reef88_> I just restarted my pc because someone suggested it
Dec 02 00:44:55 <Reef88_> so i dont recall the url post
Dec 02 00:45:06 <rwhitby> correct, without a working novacom you cannot install preware, unless you have a Linux or MacOS host and can compile a program from source code.
Dec 02 00:45:28 <RMind> Reef88_, i suggest another computer if you have one on hand
Dec 02 00:45:37 <Reef88_> ok that sounds like a plan
Dec 02 00:45:41 <Reef88_> thank you
Dec 02 00:45:45 <RMind> that's generally easier than tracking down installation issues on windows
Dec 02 00:46:55 <RMind> and trust me... I have a LOT of experience getting certain non-palm multimedia software to install on lots of different windows configurations
Dec 02 00:47:34 <Reef88_> i hope it works
Dec 02 00:49:00 <RMind> just gotta isolate or bypass whatever root issue was causing the trouble
Dec 02 00:53:42 * rwhitby adds TileStorm and Rock Band to Save/Restore
Dec 02 00:54:06 <halfhalo> noice
Dec 02 00:54:28 <rwhitby> moving from Pre to Pre 2, and adding Save/Restore support to anything I use which is not already there.
Dec 02 00:54:43 <halfhalo> hah
Dec 02 01:02:07 <SineOt> rwhitby: you ever seen video tearing issues with the Pre overclocks? *needs to get video of it, hard to explain*
Dec 02 01:03:02 <rwhitby> I have heard reports of it. Usually from underclocking or undervolting.  I've never heard a report of it happening with UberKernel predefined profiles.
Dec 02 01:04:25 <SineOt> Hmm... At least those are places to start looking. I've only seen it with stock voltages and higher than 600mhz. Everything else works fine. I'll try bumping the voltages by a step or two to see if it settles down.
Dec 02 01:07:40 <rwhitby> SineOt: you say you've seen it with a UberKernel predefined profile?
Dec 02 01:07:47 <SineOt> yes
Dec 02 01:08:00 <mugen-> well this may be the end of my relationship with palm :( same problem twice now in 3 weeks and now verizon can't help
Dec 02 01:08:01 <rwhitby> which profile, and what changes had you made to the profile?
Dec 02 01:08:40 <SineOt> rwhitby: let me check it out again, I don't remember off the top of my head
Dec 02 01:09:01 <mugen-> it's a little rediculous... i've never had these many issues with a device
Dec 02 01:09:24 <SineOt> mugen-: what's up?
Dec 02 01:09:42 <mugen-> were you around when i had that operator problem?
Dec 02 01:09:47 <mugen-> phone just stopped seeing verizon
Dec 02 01:10:14 <mugen-> woke up this morning to the same problem...
Dec 02 01:10:30 <mugen-> worked around it, vzw got the phone to authenticate for voice
Dec 02 01:10:35 <mugen-> but it doesn't conncet to the network
Dec 02 01:10:55 <mugen-> vzw won't do anything because it was a 3rd party purchase
Dec 02 01:11:07 <SineOt> I think that's probably more a VZW problem than a Palm one o_o
Dec 02 01:11:12 <SineOt> where'd you get it? Ebay?
Dec 02 01:11:17 <mugen-> but the phone was bought and activated @ vzw on the 31st of Oct
Dec 02 01:11:34 <SineOt> oh, but through a third party VZW store or something?
Dec 02 01:11:34 <mugen-> i was on the phone 3 levels up with vzw
Dec 02 01:11:43 <mugen-> on the phone with an engineer for 30 mins
Dec 02 01:11:50 <SineOt> Lame :/
Dec 02 01:11:53 <mugen-> no... craigslist
Dec 02 01:11:59 <mugen-> but we did the transaction in vzw
Dec 02 01:12:05 <mugen-> i wanted proof of when she bought the phone
Dec 02 01:12:34 <mugen-> ...i've done everything i can. and nothing is eleviating the problem
Dec 02 01:13:12 <SineOt> are you able to call the activation number at least? *228 I think...
Dec 02 01:13:18 <mugen-> yeah
Dec 02 01:13:28 <mugen-> i have tried updating automatically
Dec 02 01:13:34 <mugen-> i've tried programming manually
Dec 02 01:13:41 <mugen-> voice calls works perfect
Dec 02 01:13:47 <mugen-> just no data
Dec 02 01:14:10 <mugen-> is there anyway to diagnose a problem like this?
Dec 02 01:14:17 <mugen-> does /var/log hold any connect log info?
Dec 02 01:15:50 <rwhitby> mugen-: that's a verizon problem, not a Palm problem.
Dec 02 01:16:59 <SineOt> rwhitby: weird. I've restarted it a few times since I saw the issue, and never bothered to take it off the Palm Default. Trying it again, I can't get it to duplicate the tearing issue, even at Screenstate 500/1000
Dec 02 01:17:28 <SineOt> unless it's somehow related to the video file encoding... I don't have the original videos I was seeing issue with to check on again
Dec 02 01:17:37 <rwhitby> SineOt: if you see it on a predefined profile on UberKernel, let me know.
Dec 02 01:18:24 <SineOt> rwhitby: yeah, will do. If I get around to it I'll encode some videos with weird settings to see if it might be related to that too and to give me something 'standard' to try testing against
Dec 02 01:19:16 <rwhitby> ok
Dec 02 01:19:47 <SineOt> speaking of videos: is the Pre2 using a different video decoder chip? or is the same as the one in the Pre? (I assume it uses probably like a Broadcom H264 chip...)
Dec 02 01:20:09 <rwhitby> It's all done inside the OMAP
Dec 02 01:20:48 <SineOt> Oh, hm. Is it different between the OMAP3x in the Pre and the OMAP3x in the Pre2?
Dec 02 01:20:57 <SineOt> Mostly curious if the Pre2 supports b-frames and the like in H264.
Dec 02 01:21:03 <mugen-> rwhitby: any idea how I can convince them that it is?
Dec 02 01:21:32 <rwhitby> mugen-: nope.  threaten to cancel your service?
Dec 02 01:21:37 <mugen-> heh
Dec 02 01:21:48 <SineOt> mugen-: try contacting Palm so you can at least say that you've been in contact with the device manufacturer and that they're saying it's a VZW problem
Dec 02 01:22:07 <mugen-> yeah, i was going to give that a shot tomorrow morning
Dec 02 01:22:29 <mugen-> i really don't want to resort to my storm2
Dec 02 01:22:31 * mugen- shudders
Dec 02 01:24:41 <mugen-> is the doctor restore, the lowest level restore tool available?
Dec 02 01:26:15 <SineOt> rwhitby: is it possible to backport the ondemandtcl governor to the Pre, or are the differences between ondemand and ondemandtcl not that big of a deal?
Dec 02 01:28:13 <rwhitby> SineOt: we'll wait to see what the webOS 2.0 kernel on the Pre brings
Dec 02 01:28:34 <rwhitby> mugen-: the doctor does not touch the modem data programming
Dec 02 01:28:54 <b3ll> hey rwhitby what linux kernel does the pre2 use?
Dec 02 01:29:01 <rwhitby> 2.6.24
Dec 02 01:29:08 <b3ll> oh so same as the pre?
Dec 02 01:29:21 <rwhitby> yep, same base version.  different patch of course.
Dec 02 01:29:29 <b3ll> but we don't have that patch? :P
Dec 02 01:29:39 <rwhitby> sure we do.  opensource.palm.com
Dec 02 01:29:48 <mugen-> is there anyway to wipe the baseband back to factory?
Dec 02 01:29:57 <b3ll> then who's stopping us from making a franken-pre?
Dec 02 01:30:05 <rwhitby> mugen-: not using publicly available tools
Dec 02 01:30:16 <rwhitby> b3ll: what's your definition of such?
Dec 02 01:30:29 <b3ll> webos 2.0 on the pre
Dec 02 01:30:43 <rwhitby> proprietary binary kernel drivers and graphics libraries
Dec 02 01:30:48 <b3ll> gah
Dec 02 01:31:00 <b3ll> so anyways that meego plan failed miserably
Dec 02 01:31:06 <Loudergood> I saw somebody working on libertas, what other modules are holding us back from using a newer kernel?
Dec 02 01:31:21 <rwhitby> wifi and graphics
Dec 02 01:31:31 <b3ll> yea I figured the graphics as much
Dec 02 01:31:37 <Loudergood> right the pvr...
Dec 02 01:31:37 <b3ll> being hw accelerated now
Dec 02 01:31:45 <rwhitby> yep
Dec 02 01:31:57 <b3ll> so yea glib on the pre is 2.16, same as meego
Dec 02 01:31:58 <egaudet> has anyone tried to build the graphics drivers and use on a pre2?
Dec 02 01:32:15 <b3ll> which means the chroot has other requirements
Dec 02 01:33:05 <b3ll> unless it requires the exact same glib version
Dec 02 01:33:27 <rwhitby> there is a toolchain change between the Pre and Pre 2 kernels
Dec 02 01:33:52 <b3ll> how big
Dec 02 01:33:53 <b3ll> ?
Dec 02 01:34:24 <rwhitby> cs07q3 to cs09q1
Dec 02 01:34:35 <b3ll> huge :P
Dec 02 01:34:50 <b3ll> do you know who made the debian chroot?
Dec 02 01:34:52 <rwhitby> yup, enough to break stuff
Dec 02 01:35:14 <rwhitby> dtzWill was working on that
Dec 02 01:35:30 <b3ll> hmm okay, will bug him :P
Dec 02 01:35:41 <b3ll> this could be really interesting if it works
Dec 02 01:35:48 <rwhitby> hmm - I need rsync on the Pre 2
Dec 02 01:36:00 <b3ll> specially since they both share the qt framework
Dec 02 01:36:45 <b3ll> brb gonna switch to ubuntu
Dec 02 01:43:02 <decibell> there we go
Dec 02 01:50:00 <playya_> hi decibell
Dec 02 01:50:21 <playya_> how things are going with meego on the pre?
Dec 02 01:50:59 <decibell> hey playya_ working on it
Dec 02 01:51:03 <decibell> not fun at all :P
Dec 02 01:51:35 <playya_> the forget meego and use fso/shr
Dec 02 01:51:46 <decibell> no way
Dec 02 01:51:51 <decibell> meego is pretty
Dec 02 01:52:01 <decibell> and uses shared frameworks
Dec 02 01:52:40 <playya_> but many of them are pc frameworks and aren't a complete suite
Dec 02 01:54:09 <rwhitby> hey playya_
Dec 02 01:54:48 <decibell> true, mind you it is a REALLY nice os
Dec 02 01:54:52 <decibell> after I get meego going
Dec 02 01:54:59 <decibell> I may approach fso
Dec 02 01:55:05 <decibell> or even android
Dec 02 01:55:07 <decibell> that could be fun
Dec 02 02:04:59 <playya_> hi rwhitby
Dec 02 02:06:05 <playya_> btw. is it possible to get a pre from the dev program outside of GB?
Dec 02 02:08:36 <mugen-> what's everyone here use for development env in osx?
Dec 02 02:09:13 <SineOt> right now, Eclipse (hate it)
Dec 02 02:09:17 <SineOt> so I'm trying out Espresso
Dec 02 02:10:01 <playya_> no one is using osx *hides*
Dec 02 02:12:54 <cwgtex> Hello all.  This is my first time using irc, so feel free to point out etiquitte mistakes I make.
Dec 02 02:12:54 <rwhitby> mugen-: I use emacs -nw inside iTerm with the Palm PDK and WebOS Internals WIDK.
Dec 02 02:13:19 <cwgtex> I am here to discuss updating my novacom driver to access my pre 2.
Dec 02 02:13:40 <mugen-> do you come in peace?
Dec 02 02:13:52 <cwgtex> haha yes absolutely
Dec 02 02:13:53 <rwhitby> cwgtex: yep, unplug your device from the computer, then run the webOS Doctor. it will install the new drivers if you are on Windows or Mac
Dec 02 02:13:54 <mugen-> … thanks guys :)
Dec 02 02:14:19 <SineOt> yeah, what rwhitby said
Dec 02 02:14:25 <rwhitby> (unplug your device so you don't accidentally doctor it)
Dec 02 02:14:50 <SineOt> mugen-: it's funny, I emailed the folks behind CSSEdit about using it for webOS and how it needs support for a few things... Turns out one of the devs also writes webOS apps, hah.
Dec 02 02:15:12 <cwgtex> rwhitby, I'm running Ubuntu, and followed your directions from the dev day videos on youtube.  I ran the doctor up to the point before actually doctoring the device, but the drivers did not update.
Dec 02 02:15:17 <mugen-> hehe
Dec 02 02:15:26 <mugen-> sineout, how do you like espresso?
Dec 02 02:15:35 <mugen-> sineot too :P
Dec 02 02:15:36 <rwhitby> cwgtex: there are no new public novacom drivers for Linux - you will need to join the early access program to get them
Dec 02 02:15:43 <SineOt> mugen-: setting it up right now, so no idea! haha
Dec 02 02:15:48 <rwhitby> (doctor does not include linux drivers)
Dec 02 02:15:49 <SineOt> but it's bound to be better than Eclipse
Dec 02 02:15:56 <mugen-> well i'll be right behind you
Dec 02 02:15:59 <mugen-> d/l'ing now
Dec 02 02:16:14 <SineOt> mugen-: https://github.com/onecrayon/WebOS.sugar
Dec 02 02:16:34 <cwgtex> Oh i see.  Well, am just trying to doctor my new device to 2.0.1 before I use it, but the webosdoctor will not let me proceed, I am assuming for the lack of current drivers.
Dec 02 02:16:54 <rwhitby> that's correct
Dec 02 02:17:15 <cwgtex> without early access drivers, is there any way i can use the 2.0.1 doctor on my pre 2?
Dec 02 02:17:19 <rwhitby> no
Dec 02 02:17:21 <mugen-> sineot, i was just about to link that to you too :)
Dec 02 02:19:14 <cwgtex> I have just grown used to doctoring to apply updates rather than ota updates, old habit from before aupt
Dec 02 02:19:53 <SineOt> cwgtex: for 2.0.1, I think it'd be easiest to just OTA...
Dec 02 02:21:04 <cwgtex> sineot, i believe you are right.
Dec 02 02:21:11 <cwgtex> now if i go poking around inside my device and screw something up, how will i be able to doctor my device?
Dec 02 02:23:06 <rwhitby> cwgtex: join early access
Dec 02 02:23:45 <halfhalo> They let ANYONE in nowadays, even me!
Dec 02 02:24:07 <cwgtex> sounds like a plan
Dec 02 02:24:24 <rwhitby> cwgtex: when they release the 2.0 SDK publicly, it will probably have linux drivers in it
Dec 02 02:24:26 <cwgtex> rwhitby: yall have any luck getting your dev coupons?
Dec 02 02:24:30 <rwhitby> cwgtex: not yet
Dec 02 02:25:05 <decibell> hey rwhitby so it looks like I can't upgrade glibc with meego
Dec 02 02:25:12 <decibell> is there anyway to do it on the pre-side?
Dec 02 02:25:42 <rwhitby> dunno
Dec 02 02:25:56 <decibell> actually what I mean is, would it mess everything up? :P
Dec 02 02:26:36 <cwgtex> good luck rwhitby.  i donated with the latest precentrel telethon, hope yall get your coupons (and thus pre2s) very soon!
Dec 02 02:26:54 <decibell> I can provide a coupon if you'd like btw
Dec 02 02:27:12 <rwhitby> decibell: oh, you have one to spare?
Dec 02 02:28:07 <decibell> I can't afford another pre right now, so (eventhough I'd like one), I won't be getting one anytime soon :P
Dec 02 02:28:23 <rwhitby> decibell: you have an actual coupon ?
Dec 02 02:28:31 <decibell> no I can get one tho
Dec 02 02:28:57 <rwhitby> oh, we have lots of people who have put in requests.
Dec 02 02:29:28 <decibell> oh okay
Dec 02 02:30:53 <decibell> I'll file a request anyways
Dec 02 02:31:10 <decibell> since they already owe me a pre plus :P
Dec 02 02:31:38 <SineOt> decibell: did you apply for the dev device program and not get one?
Dec 02 02:31:56 <decibell> yea they're on backorder apparently
Dec 02 02:32:04 <decibell> I'm supposed to be getting one
Dec 02 02:32:07 <SineOt> oh, which one did you request? Verizon?
Dec 02 02:32:20 <decibell> Bell but it doesn't really matter
Dec 02 02:32:29 <SineOt> ah
Dec 02 02:32:38 <decibell> why? same thing for you?
Dec 02 02:33:02 <SineOt> nah, I got my dev ATT Pre+ last week
Dec 02 02:33:39 <SineOt> so I was like "wtf I got one and you didn't?"
Dec 02 02:33:51 <decibell> WTFFFFF
Dec 02 02:33:55 <decibell> this is bs
Dec 02 02:34:02 <decibell> I've been waiting a month now
Dec 02 02:34:24 * decibell installs glib, and pray's it doesn't fuck up his pre
Dec 02 02:34:25 <SineOt> decibell: did you ever get contacted by someone with like, a name.last@palm.com email?
Dec 02 02:34:32 <decibell> of course :P
Dec 02 02:34:34 <decibell> several emails
Dec 02 02:34:40 <SineOt> contact them and be like "wtf"
Dec 02 02:34:50 <decibell> I already have ;)
Dec 02 02:34:59 <halfhalo> Adora!
Dec 02 02:35:00 <SineOt> that's what it took for me... Was told it would ship that week... 3 weeks later, nothing.
Dec 02 02:35:12 <SineOt> So they shipped it next day air and it got here the day before thanksgiving.
Dec 02 02:35:13 <Adora> halfhalo:  shh, I'm not really here  =]
Dec 02 02:35:25 <SineOt> ... Then I got contacted again because they were going to ship me a second one :I
Dec 02 02:35:58 <halfhalo> hah
Dec 02 02:37:08 <SineOt> like, haha. She forwarded me the shipping info, then the next day, emailed again to say that she had put a request in with the shipping department to get it shipped. Even if it was a mistake, it was nice <3
Dec 02 02:37:12 <decibell> Sine0t : rawr : http://pastie.org/private/vdscxkslefjzad1lluwiq
Dec 02 02:37:25 <decibell> if they send you another one
Dec 02 02:37:28 <decibell> I'll take it ;)
Dec 02 02:37:38 <SineOt> Oh, no. I politely declined it. One is enough :p
Dec 02 02:38:08 <decibell> politely un-decline it plz
Dec 02 02:38:09 <decibell> :)
Dec 02 02:39:10 <PuffTheMagic> decibell, thought you had this figured out yesterday when u said you could rebuild glibc
Dec 02 02:40:29 <SineOt> decibell: it's probably because you requested a weird one like Bell ;P
Dec 02 02:40:56 <PuffTheMagic> someone should get me a nookColor so i can get webOS on it :D
Dec 02 02:41:20 <PuffTheMagic> that would be more cool than this hero bs
Dec 02 02:43:17 <decibell> PuffTheMagic haha yea it's a pain in the ass tho
Dec 02 02:43:28 <decibell> since I can't install an arm compiled version of glib on meego
Dec 02 02:44:43 <decibell> and Sine0t I requested "a" pre, actually we don't even have pre+'s here :P
Dec 02 02:45:11 <SineOt> oh... oh dear :( you poor thing
Dec 02 02:46:13 <decibell> ya
Dec 02 02:52:34 <basotl> I just got a Nook Color for my own Christmas present.
Dec 02 02:54:07 <cwgtex> rwhitby:  so without the linux novacom driver, how will i install preware on my new phone?  is my only option to install it under windows (since webosdoctor has the msi installers)?
Dec 02 02:54:52 <decibell> basotl try getting webos going on it :)
Dec 02 02:57:01 <SineOt> rwhitby: while you're here... US ATT Pre, activated with US Tmo sim = App catalog access?
Dec 02 02:58:37 <rwhitby> SineOt: dunno. I'd guess yes, but cannot guarantee.  Activate with ATT Sim, then use Tmo sim later is what I would do.
Dec 02 02:59:06 <rwhitby> cwgtex: you can use precom-progs from our git repo to get a novaterm command line. then use the preware bootstrap script
Dec 02 02:59:28 <SineOt> rwhitby: hm, okay. I ask since I have access to like 3 tmo sims, but no ATT sims that aren't microSIM
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Dec 02 02:59:58 2010