**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jan 13 02:59:58 2011
Jan 13 04:35:40 * halfhalo is amazed at zsh right nwo
Jan 13 04:35:41 <halfhalo> now
Jan 13 06:22:10 <mikey__> I am trying to find a touch screen keybored for my palm pre and I don't know where to go and how to get it
Jan 13 06:22:26 <SineOt> preware: virtual keyboard
Jan 13 06:23:01 <mikey__> I try it and it don't do shit or says error can't open it
Jan 13 06:24:26 <mikey__> so you got any tips
Jan 13 06:25:16 <halfhalo> Be more descriptive with the errors
Jan 13 06:25:37 <SineOt> if it don't work, restart until it does! :U
Jan 13 06:26:14 <mikey__> it says it can't open
Jan 13 06:26:19 <mikey__> that's it's
Jan 13 06:27:12 <rwhitby> ~smart-questions
Jan 13 06:27:12 <infobot> extra, extra, read all about it, smart-questions is http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
Jan 13 06:28:01 <rwhitby> see especially the section entitled "Be precise and informative about your problem"
Jan 13 06:40:29 <mugen-> rwhitby: I like the Q&A about configuring a shell prompt...
Jan 13 06:41:01 <mugen-> ...or maybe the statement of windows machine not working.
Jan 13 08:17:28 <nuomi> anybody here?
Jan 13 08:17:47 <oil> yes
Jan 13 13:12:09 <NuttyBunny-zzzzz> mornin'
Jan 13 18:46:25 <sega02> hey everyone
Jan 13 18:46:39 <MetaView> hi sega
Jan 13 18:47:19 <sega02> just got a pre and cryptk set it up for me.
Jan 13 18:47:57 <MetaView> cool
Jan 13 18:48:07 <MetaView> now you port a sega emulator
Jan 13 18:48:19 <sega02> it's really awesome. my mytouch4g seems pathetic now
Jan 13 18:48:21 <sega02> haha
Jan 13 18:49:11 <sega02> i've actually never done much    with sega consoles vefore
Jan 13 18:49:32 <sega02> wirc is a nice client
Jan 13 18:53:28 <sega02> interestingly, my wifi settings sort of locked up earlier. a reboot helped, though
Jan 13 18:55:37 <sega02> my battery has also gone di
Jan 13 18:56:20 <sega02> *down 13% in 20 minutes of active use
Jan 13 18:57:21 <sega02> it was on uberkernel default. I switched it to screen state 500/1000. I guess it'll get worse?
Jan 13 19:31:15 <sega01> any idea of why the palm pre's take so long to reboot?
Jan 13 19:31:49 <jhowirc> lunasysmgr slow
Jan 13 19:31:52 <sega01> hmm, i guess that was a bit about a minute
Jan 13 19:31:59 <sega01> seemed faster, maybe
Jan 13 19:32:14 * halfhalo remembers the 5min boot times of the past
Jan 13 19:32:29 <sega01> when you do the shutdown/swap battery and it flashes the palm logo at you, is that the time to swap the battery or do i need to wait for a blank creen?
Jan 13 19:32:31 <sega01> *screen
Jan 13 19:33:03 <sega01> got a battery % in the top bar and phone disable mod. very nice
Jan 13 19:33:10 <sega01> what does airplane mode do? disable wifi and phone?
Jan 13 19:35:43 <sega01> is it fine to run other things at the same time as the battery calibration? looks like it has to drain down by about 0.4V
Jan 13 19:40:42 <MetaView> sega: I adjusted the voltage in Govnah, I have the feeling it helps quite a lot
Jan 13 19:42:54 <sega01> on the CPU? i see
Jan 13 19:43:05 <sega01> super tux isn't working with tilt. is that normal?
Jan 13 19:43:21 <MetaView> don't know
Jan 13 19:43:45 <sega01> does the first pre have an accelerometer?
Jan 13 19:44:04 <MetaView> yes
Jan 13 19:44:54 <sega01> hmm, ok
Jan 13 19:45:00 <sega01> the app's description says it should work
Jan 13 19:45:22 <sega01> no extra information on the wiki for it
Jan 13 19:45:24 <sega01> sound also isn't on
Jan 13 19:45:30 <sega01> but still very cool
Jan 13 19:49:46 <sega01> accellerometer seems to work because shaking in mybpm works
Jan 13 19:49:48 <sega01> interesting
Jan 13 19:50:03 <sega01> this phone isn't in the best of shape, so i wasn't sure if that might be it
Jan 13 20:00:23 <sega01> argh
Jan 13 20:00:35 <sega01> terminal is stuck in a horizontal view mode, even if i close it and reopen it
Jan 13 20:06:32 <sega01> i see nothing of disabling landscape or enabling it in the code
Jan 13 20:06:44 <MetaView> terminal?
Jan 13 20:06:45 <sega01> i think i'll give xterm a try
Jan 13 20:06:46 <sega01> yeah
Jan 13 20:06:53 <MetaView> I guess it's something special
Jan 13 20:07:20 <sega01> doesn't make sense to give it that rotate view, unless perhaps you need to see something horizontally for a second
Jan 13 20:07:49 <sega01> eek, xterm needs X. i guess htat makes sense
Jan 13 20:08:07 <sega01> what do you use for a terminal?
Jan 13 20:12:05 <MetaView> terminal on the device
Jan 13 20:12:14 <MetaView> it portrait here
Jan 13 20:12:19 <MetaView> it is
Jan 13 20:12:52 <destinal> sega01: webos app called "terminal", it's an npapi based terminal that runs on the pre as a plugin to its browser
Jan 13 20:13:12 <destinal> it works like any other webos app, ie you just click its icon
Jan 13 20:16:04 <sega01> right, i think that's what i've been using
Jan 13 20:16:06 <sega01> the one in preware
Jan 13 20:16:10 <sega01> just called terminal
Jan 13 20:16:17 <sega01> except it gets stuck in landscape mode
Jan 13 20:16:40 <sega01> just tried the video recorder. so awesome that it can truncate video like that
Jan 13 20:18:00 <sega01> is there any simple way to remove sprint's apps?
Jan 13 20:18:20 <scooter314> there are patchs for that on preware
Jan 13 20:18:32 <sega01> great, thanks
Jan 13 20:18:43 <sega01> preware is really cool
Jan 13 20:19:06 <sega01> so it sounds like there are no HSPA+ com boards for the pre's yet?
Jan 13 20:19:11 <scooter314> sure is,  makes palm devices that much better.
Jan 13 20:20:56 <sega01> is that sprint patch you mentioned the "hide sprint navigation app" one?
Jan 13 20:20:59 <sega01> or is it something else?
Jan 13 20:21:53 <scooter314> there is that one and you can also remove amazon, nascar.  they all say "hide" in front of them.
Jan 13 20:22:58 <sega01> ah, i see
Jan 13 20:23:03 <sega01> so there's no way to just remove the apps, easily?
Jan 13 20:23:05 <rwhitby> just use the advanced launcher patch, and hide what you want
Jan 13 20:23:29 <rwhitby> they're in a partition you can't easily use for other things anyway
Jan 13 20:24:05 <scooter314> listen to whitby, knows what he talking about.
Jan 13 20:24:50 <sega01> great, thanks
Jan 13 20:25:46 <sega01> is restart luna different than a full restart?
Jan 13 20:26:01 <sega01> i notice that app installs tend to fail that require luna restarts if you already have one in queue
Jan 13 20:27:10 <sega01> hmm, terminus doesn't work at all
Jan 13 20:30:16 <sega01> advanced launcher seems to conflict with the 5x5 app board
Jan 13 20:30:44 <rwhitby> advanced launcher supercedes and obsoletes about 50 other patches
Jan 13 20:31:31 <scooter314> quick question, any other good webos/palm channels that I can take a look at?
Jan 13 20:32:11 <scooter314> or just good channels?
Jan 13 20:32:32 <sega01> #reddit :-D
Jan 13 20:32:37 <sega01> well, it's not all that awesome
Jan 13 20:32:42 <sega01> ##cars is cool
Jan 13 20:33:30 <scooter314> thanks, you figure out  advanced launcher?
Jan 13 20:35:11 <sega01> just restarting luna now after removing the conflicting one
Jan 13 20:35:16 <sega01> even after removing it, i still couldn't install it
Jan 13 20:35:31 <sega01> i think QR code integration would be really sweet
Jan 13 20:36:55 <sega01> sweet, there's an app for that
Jan 13 20:38:02 <rwhitby> sega01: FYI, if you get the feeling that people aren't answering some of your questions, it's cause they are FAQs that are answered pretty well on the wiki or the PreCentral forums.
Jan 13 20:38:41 <sega01> ok, sorry. i'll take a look there
Jan 13 20:42:46 <sega01> there are a lot of different launcher configuration apps. Advanced Configuration for App Launcher wouldn't install, but advanced options in launcher did. it doesn't seem to support hiding, though
Jan 13 20:43:50 <sega01> Advanced Configuration for App Launcher fails on appinfo.json.rej. hmm
Jan 13 20:45:48 <rwhitby> remove all patches, then start in the Advanced category first.
Jan 13 20:46:43 <sega01> even battery % and radio disable? those were the only ones. i'll give that a try
Jan 13 20:48:36 <rwhitby> there's also a thread for the ACAL patch
Jan 13 20:48:40 <semprance> rwhitby: is it possible that the sms backup could be extend to the other databases? Impostah seems to have no problem writing to com.palm kinds
Jan 13 20:48:57 <semprance> *not other databases, other kinds
Jan 13 20:49:07 <rwhitby> semprance: yep, the intention is that save/restore will have scripts for all those things
Jan 13 20:49:10 <sega01> Advanced Configuration for App Launcher failed to install after removing all patches. do i need to restart luna before trying it?
Jan 13 20:49:31 <rwhitby> sega01: best thing now is to visit the forum thread
Jan 13 20:50:04 <rwhitby> if it's a meta-doctored or activation-bypassed phone, there may be a conflict on the first-use app
Jan 13 20:50:58 <sega01> it is. i'm reading the wiki now
Jan 13 20:52:36 <sega01> that seems to probably be the cause. i think i'll just put smaller patches onto it
Jan 13 20:53:23 <rwhitby> no, you want to resolve the conflict and use ACAL. believe me.
Jan 13 20:57:22 <sega01> so i need to re meta-doctor and activtaion bypass it, then install ACAL, then first use?
Jan 13 20:58:11 <rwhitby> no, just edit the appinfo.json to revert what meta-doctor did
Jan 13 20:58:31 <sega01> ok, i see
Jan 13 20:58:46 <sega01> i'm sorry for being slow. it's literally my first day using the phone and i didn't do the meta-doctoring myself
Jan 13 20:59:00 <rwhitby> I really need to get sconix to make ACAL compatible with meta-doctored devices
Jan 13 21:00:09 <sega01> a lot of people in the thread say that it makes the menu more sluggish. is that still true?
Jan 13 21:00:33 <sega01> also, what document should i start with for changing the file? i don't get the rootfs mounting it as a usb drive
Jan 13 21:04:15 <rwhitby> sega01: install the SDK and use novaterm to access the device.  or install OpenSSH from Preware and set up some keys for ssh access.
Jan 13 21:13:26 <sega01> i'll try openssh. thanks :-)
Jan 13 21:27:41 <sega01> :-O
Jan 13 21:27:42 <sega01> i got in
Jan 13 21:27:43 <sega01> sweet
Jan 13 21:32:51 <semprance> rwhitby: backing up and restoring immediately works, but if I delete a message in the messaging app and then try to restore I get a 'revision mismatch' error
Jan 13 21:35:08 <sega01> so if i move firstuse's appinfo.json to appinfo.json.bak, i get the exact same error
Jan 13 21:35:12 <sega01> doesn't really make any sense
Jan 13 21:37:57 <rwhitby> semprance: change visible:true to visible:false in it
Jan 13 21:42:02 <semprance> flags.visible?
Jan 13 21:43:06 <semprance> still getting: db: revision mismatch - expected 1169, got 593
Jan 13 21:43:27 <semprance> numbers change every time
Jan 13 21:45:03 <sega01> :-D
Jan 13 21:45:08 <sega01> i got ACAL to install
Jan 13 21:46:41 <destinal> ACAL?
Jan 13 21:47:28 <sega01> advanced configuration app launcher
Jan 13 21:48:18 <destinal> ah
Jan 13 21:58:59 <rwhitby> semprance: yes, when putting an object back into db8, don't set the revision
Jan 13 21:59:24 <semprance> I tried that but it said 'require _rev'
Jan 13 21:59:34 <semprance> I'll try again in a moment
Jan 13 22:00:31 <semprance> actually I tried setting it to undefined, this time I'll try deleting it
Jan 13 22:00:35 <semprance> maybe the _id too
Jan 13 22:02:18 <semprance> emptying the database before the insert might be necessary, although a bit risky...
Jan 13 22:07:26 <semprance> backup says there's one message, and the restore succeeds but no messages show up...
Jan 13 22:07:33 <semprance> Might have to doctor and start again >_M
Jan 13 22:07:40 <semprance> whoops, >_<
Jan 13 22:07:53 <sega01> what is the serial usb passthrough mode about?
Jan 13 22:08:07 <sega01> would be really sweet if it could emulate a USB serial device and get into the console that way
Jan 13 22:09:14 <destinal> sega01: we could do that with a usb gadget
Jan 13 22:14:32 <semprance> rhwitby: I think the reason it's not showing up is that when I delete a message in the messages app, it deletes the thread from chatthread:1 too
Jan 13 22:14:46 <rwhitby> yep, that makes sense
Jan 13 22:14:50 <semprance> So presumably I'll need to back them up as well
Jan 13 22:15:18 <semprance> Also what is the difference between message:1 and smsmessage:1 ?
Jan 13 22:15:22 <semprance> If anything
Jan 13 22:16:49 <semprance> I've been assuming that message:1 is smsmessage:1, mmsmessage:1, etc. combined but now I'm not so sure
Jan 13 22:18:44 <rwhitby> I believe it's an inheritance thing
Jan 13 22:20:50 <semprance> hmm, so will changing an message:1 entry update the same entry in smsmessage:1, or vice versa?
Jan 13 22:21:15 <rwhitby> I don't expect so
Jan 13 22:22:06 <semprance> oh :-(
Jan 13 22:22:12 <semprance> multiple updates then I guess
Jan 13 22:22:18 <semprance> better study the json some more..
Jan 13 23:47:08 <osahum> Unscramble: EHT TAIWGIN SI HET STRADHE TARP
Jan 13 23:48:28 <fahhem> waiting for what?
Jan 13 23:49:48 <SineOt> The scramble before it: February 9th
Jan 13 23:53:00 <osahum> :)
Jan 13 23:54:48 <osahum> the new F105 is out!!!
Jan 13 23:54:51 <osahum> yes!!!
Jan 13 23:54:55 <osahum> sweet
Jan 13 23:55:26 <osahum> if unixpsycho was a god.. i would be kneeing for him now!!
Jan 13 23:55:52 <osahum> maybe he is god?
Jan 13 23:55:59 <SineOt> don't you mean kneeling? :p
Jan 13 23:56:08 <osahum> yes
Jan 13 23:56:31 <osahum> kneeling before him
Jan 14 00:03:53 <bpadalino> http://linux.slashdot.org/story/11/01/13/2248207/Embedded-Linux-1-Second-Cold-Boot-To-QT - very interesting .. original pre is 500MHz.. and new luna is a QT application
Jan 14 00:04:00 <bpadalino> Qt rather
Jan 14 00:28:34 <Techiatry> Greetings all
Jan 14 00:29:52 <Techiatry> I was hoping I might bug someone for a few minutes about a problem I've run into.
Jan 14 00:30:10 <rwhitby> ~ask
Jan 14 00:30:10 <infobot> Questions in the channel should be specific, informative, complete, concise, and on-topic.  Don't ask if you can ask a question first.  Don't ask if a person is there; just ask what you intended to ask them.  Better questions more frequently yield better answers.  We are all here voluntarily or against our will.
Jan 14 00:30:58 <Techiatry> oh hi rwhitby! It's a tangle to yesterday's accidently running MetaDR on my Sprint Pre
Jan 14 00:31:21 <Techiatry> In summary, I used metadr to build a sprint pre plus and it worked wonderfully
Jan 14 00:31:24 <Techiatry> then the phone was stolen.
Jan 14 00:31:38 <Techiatry> fast forward a few months, and I was running into crashiness with my replacement Sprint Pre
Jan 14 00:31:43 <Techiatry> and decided to DR. it
Jan 14 00:31:53 <rwhitby> Techiatry: have you unpacked the doctor you used to see what the castle.xml file had in it?
Jan 14 00:33:01 <Techiatry> I'm certain the Dr. was the one I made through metadr, but I haven't unpacked it, no.
Jan 14 00:33:41 <Techiatry> The odd thing is everything works...except the app catalog is missing about 1000 apps.
Jan 14 00:34:24 <rwhitby> Techiatry: go to palm.com/palmprofile and check the version that it thinks you are running
Jan 14 00:40:59 <Techiatry2> ugh, sorry. Yes, it says v. 9.9.9.9
Jan 14 00:44:42 <Techiatry2> well, 9.9.9
Jan 14 00:46:24 <Techiatry2> I was wondering if I ran an earlier Dr, like 1.4.1, then tried to update OTA, if that would correct whatever the disconnect is.
Jan 14 00:47:32 <rwhitby> Techiatry2: that is the procedure to fix the 9.9.9, yes.
Jan 14 00:47:53 <Techiatry2> really?
Jan 14 00:48:20 <rwhitby> yep
Jan 14 00:48:40 <Techiatry2> phew.
Jan 14 00:49:01 <Techiatry2> Thanks so much rhwitby. I'll d/l it and give it a shot.
Jan 14 00:50:12 <Techiatry2> Have a good rest of your day
Jan 14 01:23:52 <semprance> rwhitby: worked it out - make backups, delete all chatthread:1 and smsmessage:1 entries, get backup and delete _rev for all entries, insert backups back into db
Jan 14 01:24:26 <rwhitby> semprance: now, the question is whether anything else is referencing them by _id, since that will change, right?
Jan 14 01:25:18 <semprance> indeed. i believe mms appear in conversations. So deleting such a conversation creates a loose end for that db entry
Jan 14 01:26:20 <rwhitby> semprance: have you looked for higher-level APIs to do these things in the node.js service code?
Jan 14 01:27:00 <semprance> no, I assumed the jail would prevent any access to the db
Jan 14 01:27:05 <semprance> or at least write access
Jan 14 01:28:47 <rwhitby> semprance: that's where impostah comes in
Jan 14 01:29:07 <semprance> ?
Jan 14 01:29:34 <rwhitby> to be able to call higher-level ls2 API calls in other node.js services rather than dealing with the db8 directly
Jan 14 01:30:44 <semprance> I'm not sure I understand :-S
Jan 14 01:31:37 <rwhitby> look in the app code to see what service calls it is making, and impersonate those service calls to access the data via the high-level API rather than directly in the db8 databae.
Jan 14 01:32:30 <semprance> Ah OK, I guess the way that the messaging app does things will give me more of a clue as to how the different kinds tie together as well
Jan 14 01:37:38 <semprance> oh, do you mean the source for Impostah?
Jan 14 01:42:52 <semprance> ..or messaging?
Jan 14 01:43:00 <rwhitby> messaging
Jan 14 01:45:49 <semprance> Think I'll have to dig through the framework, it makes requests in an odd way
Jan 14 02:38:17 <rick-nook> Asked she who must be obeyed re sf...  "no"
Jan 14 02:38:29 <halfhalo> awwww
Jan 14 02:39:25 <rick-nook> Then "are you nuts? "
Jan 14 02:40:04 <Clipper87> hey guy is there any way to make my pre do landscape on the pre 2 in say the email or messaging apps?
Jan 14 02:40:20 <rick-nook> Apparently flying 1500 miles for a 2 hr reception is irrational
Jan 14 02:40:40 * halfhalo would
Jan 14 02:41:02 * halfhalo is also crazy
Jan 14 02:41:08 <rick-nook> halfhalo. You married?
Jan 14 02:41:11 <halfhalo> no
Jan 14 02:41:19 <rick-nook> Ah
Jan 14 02:41:32 * rick-nook is
Jan 14 02:41:38 <rick-nook> Very
Jan 14 02:41:53 <rick-nook> 34 years
Jan 14 02:41:55 <Clipper87> hey guy is there any way to make my pre do landscape on the pre 2 in say the email or messaging apps?
Jan 14 02:42:12 <rick-nook> Clipper87 yes
Jan 14 02:42:18 <Clipper87> how?
Jan 14 02:42:35 <SineOt> "hey guy?" really :C
Jan 14 02:42:42 <Clipper87> lol sorry
Jan 14 02:42:44 <destinal> rick-nook: ah well. for me, SF one week all week, home on the weekend, Kansas City all week the week after
Jan 14 02:42:45 <Clipper87> guys*
Jan 14 02:43:11 <rick-nook> Clipper87. Don't know.  No one has ported those patches yet to 2.0
Jan 14 02:43:11 <destinal> fortunately I don't usually have to travel a lot and this time I did ended up being fortuitious
Jan 14 02:43:22 <Clipper87> crap ok
Jan 14 02:44:16 <rick-nook> destinal we'll figure out dinner while you're in kc
Jan 14 02:44:40 <destinal> yup, that would be cool.  I only wish I could be at SCALE that month too
Jan 14 02:44:44 <rick-nook> Clipper87 but it's utterly possible.
Jan 14 02:45:15 <Clipper87> ya
Jan 14 02:45:27 <rick-nook> Swmbo says bbq or chinese?
Jan 14 02:48:22 <rwhitby> rick-nook: 1500miles for 2 hr is indeed worse than 8500miles for 2 days
Jan 14 02:49:17 <destinal> rick-nook: hard choice.  you have good chinese there?  I tend to do BBQ every time I'm in KC since it's awesome but I expect to do that for lunch anyhow.
Jan 14 02:50:26 <destinal> rick-nook: chinese sounds like a good plan
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Jan 14 02:59:58 2011