**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Feb 20 02:59:57 2011 Feb 20 04:46:10 hello Feb 20 05:17:02 hay Feb 20 05:38:03 do my eyes decieve me ? Feb 20 05:38:29 yes? Feb 20 05:38:59 You see the unicorn as well?!? Feb 20 05:39:23 aw nvm Feb 20 05:39:32 rod answed the question Feb 20 05:39:54 it wss a twitter post in regards to webos on pre + and pre - Feb 20 05:40:02 s/wss/was Feb 20 06:20:26 I'm trying to attach photos to an email on my pre ... hard or easy ? Feb 20 10:26:55 Hi Feb 20 10:27:05 hola Feb 20 10:27:48 Any chance that I can join Alp0hatesting of LinPhone? Feb 20 10:30:59 hehe asking the wrong person... hum..... i forget who is working on that... I differ to others Feb 20 10:31:32 cryptk, ^ any insight? Feb 20 10:32:22 not sure who is working linphone Feb 20 10:32:42 Ok, thanks, I'll get a name Feb 20 10:34:21 Dick99999, i dont think he is always here either he comes and goes... i bet if you search the logs you can find some insight Feb 20 10:37:00 I'll do that and search for Thibaud and rwhitby Feb 20 10:38:04 Dick99999, why not search for LinPhone? Feb 20 10:39:07 Because those persons will/can send the DL link if I would qualify fro Alpha testing Feb 20 11:08:47 hi Feb 20 11:08:52 hi everyone Feb 20 11:09:04 i'm going to receive a palm pre 2 soon Feb 20 11:09:17 wanted to know about qt on palm pre Feb 20 11:09:48 i cannot find any info on he wiki Feb 20 11:10:44 Hi Thibaud, Is joining alphatesting LinPhone still open? Feb 20 11:12:07 Dick99999: yep! :) what is your device and sip provider? Feb 20 11:13:07 Pre 1, Pre 2. SipNL.nl (Paid, HQ) and Voipbuster (free). Both Landline and mobile (HP 514) Feb 20 11:14:19 Dick99999: good, you'll probably find Pre1 to be more stable than Pre2, but it's worth the try^H^Hest on both ;) Feb 20 11:14:25 see /msg & please report failure(s) & success in the P|C alpha thread (http://forums.precentral.net/webos-internals/274615-linphone-alpha-testing.html). PM if privacy is needed Feb 20 11:15:25 Dick99999: have fun Feb 20 11:15:39 Sorry never used IRC what is /msg? Feb 20 11:16:24 Dick99999: private message (1-to-1 chat), new window with dl info for your eyes only Feb 20 11:18:07 Dick99999: did you get it? Feb 20 11:18:37 need to go, bbl Feb 20 11:19:49 Yes I did, Thanks and I'll report on P|C Feb 20 13:52:02 i rad about tethering on the wiki Feb 20 13:52:18 but now there IS an unlocked version Feb 20 15:53:34 do my eyes deceve me ? Feb 20 15:53:42 http://www.webosbuzz.com/content/178-webos-2-0-leaked-sprint-t-get-now.html Feb 20 15:54:07 there is a doctor ? Feb 20 15:55:43 rwhitby: oil anyone ? Feb 20 16:01:45 hi there can anyone help me? im trying to get or make a meta doctor for my sprint pixi for webos 2.01? Feb 20 16:02:00 anyone have a custom doctor or kno how to make one? Feb 20 16:02:32 =[ Feb 20 16:04:17 ?? Feb 20 16:04:21 =[ Feb 20 16:04:44 email me if anyone sees this? mysticjp@att.net ty =] Feb 20 19:02:55 hay Feb 20 19:05:32 anybody hear back from devmarketing@palm.com ? Feb 20 19:32:42 yes, got an excel today to fill in Feb 20 20:20:54 hay Feb 20 20:26:00 PatrickC_Pre: Ho Feb 20 20:26:13 hay Feb 20 22:26:11 bpadalino: hmm, has anyone documented what ports novacomd opens on the device when running? I wonder if a flash application running on a webos device could open a socket to the device it's running on (localhost) Feb 20 22:26:28 after all, there are flash telnet clients and so on Feb 20 22:27:17 there are some in the 5000's somewhere i thought .. 5888 or something? they are used for novacomd heartbeat messages and whatnot .. not sure what you're getting at, tho Feb 20 22:27:41 bpadalino: non-tethered application install from the web with devmode enabled Feb 20 22:27:58 via flash app Feb 20 22:28:20 ah, so open something up via localhost and go nuts ? Feb 20 22:29:09 yeah, depending on how much of the tcp novacom stuff runs on a webos device by default (not sure the difference between device and emulator in terms of the ports available by default) Feb 20 22:30:56 but in theory the simplest solution would be to just send shell commands to grab and run a bootstrap script, for instance Feb 20 22:31:29 I know that Ares is able to interact without Novacom being installed to package and run apps Feb 20 22:31:39 (at least I'm fairly certain you don't need Novacom to be installed) Feb 20 22:31:54 SineOt: you do need them installed Feb 20 22:32:15 SineOt: it accesses the TCP port opened by local novacom drivers Feb 20 22:32:25 ah Feb 20 22:32:50 i've spent most of my afternoon writing this magstripe reader thing .. Feb 20 22:32:55 this would be the same approach, but on the device instead, depending on what ports are available Feb 20 22:33:15 and would require flash on the device which would mean 2.0+ Feb 20 22:33:44 so you'd be able to install malicious things from visiting a website that had flash that could run ? Feb 20 22:33:48 bpadalino: like the square reader and its iphone app? Feb 20 22:33:52 yeah Feb 20 22:33:56 i signed up for a square reader Feb 20 22:33:59 took some samples Feb 20 22:34:16 and now i am doing the decoder part assuming i have access to PCM data .. i used arecord to grab some input Feb 20 22:34:58 if it ends up working, it could be a homebrew app for people who want to take payments Feb 20 22:35:38 so far i am up to the point of recognizing the swipe, and figuring out if it's a forward or backward swipe .. Feb 20 22:35:39 bpadalino: harass Square about it. if an indy dev can get it working then it's stupid to not have them support it officially Feb 20 22:36:05 SineOt: they have a web API for doing transactions Feb 20 22:36:35 SineOt: I expect for webos we're going to have to DIY some things that companies don't think they have good market benefits in doing Feb 20 22:36:48 now to fill in my decoding table .. Feb 20 22:37:01 and make sure my bit-time tracking loop works and is stable for my test data Feb 20 22:37:46 bpadalino: so, hybrid app, then? Feb 20 22:38:36 yeah .. but it can't be jailed since it needs access to the mic and/or alsa libs Feb 20 22:40:37 bpadalino: I take it then the parasitic power approach they use works just as well on a pre as it does on an iphone? do you have to turn up the volume to provide it enough power? Feb 20 22:41:23 so i was wrong before on my assessment due to 2 factors - 1) i wasn't sampling high enough and 2) i was using a low bit-depth .. Feb 20 22:41:30 optimal sampling is 48kHz and 16-bit samples Feb 20 22:41:42 once i did that, you can easily see the transitions Feb 20 22:41:57 i don't have an iphone samples to compare with, but these look VERY good .. no distortion and almost ideal Feb 20 23:06:22 hi - how to register to gert the alpha version of linphone? Feb 20 23:07:48 as00270: hi :) what is your device and sip provider? Feb 20 23:08:49 plam pre minus - webos 2.0.1 - actionvoip Feb 20 23:09:44 as00270: are you sure 2.x on Pre- is running stable? Feb 20 23:10:12 since, you know, its not out yet officially Feb 20 23:10:48 and never will be :p Feb 20 23:10:52 HAHA Feb 20 23:10:59 i am using it now for 7 days - i didn't have any problem with Feb 20 23:10:59 Overclocked it to 600 - more is unfortunately not possible Feb 20 23:11:00 oh Feb 20 23:11:12 am very satisfied Feb 20 23:11:17 lol Feb 20 23:11:44 i do have the german version on it Feb 20 23:11:57 as i have a german keyboard Feb 20 23:12:54 as00270: so you got 2.x on a Pre- *with* an O/C kernel? Feb 20 23:13:33 no - with classic kernel - but the pre minus is underclocked Feb 20 23:14:35 ps : is someone interested in - i have mc (midnight commander running on my palm :) Feb 20 23:14:53 not really, from my understanding the Pre will run 550 normally, 600 in PDK apps... so it's not really an overclock at all Feb 20 23:15:26 as00270: I'm guessing you're not actually running 2.0.1 but rather a leaked beta of a later-than-2.0.1 version? Feb 20 23:17:11 as00270: let's put it straight: I guess we're happy with anyone willing to alpha test linphone, but your configuration is somewhat ... unexpected! Feb 20 23:17:22 no - the pre is normally always running at 500mhz -on getting it to run always on 600 mhz is ... 20% more than standart Feb 20 23:17:23 Of course its the 2.0.1 codename ... wait i have to see - the only one i found on a russian site (had to search quite a time :) Feb 20 23:18:06 better it is : a now configuration can give U new results Feb 20 23:18:21 just so you know, as00270: what you're running was illegally leaked and will never be supported by Palm in any way shape or form Feb 20 23:19:31 as00270: considering linphone is not stable yet, the question is what will be the value of an alpha-test on an unofficial configuration we will never run into for now Feb 20 23:19:47 i know -but there was no problem with activation neither with downloads - so i do not care if it is illegal or not Feb 20 23:19:47 Palm promised the update for everyone - that was the moment i bought my pre second-hand Feb 20 23:20:26 and on the 9th they said that the Pre- and Pixi and Pixi+ will not be seeing the update Feb 20 23:20:28 as00270: I suspect you will find you are marked as 9.9.9 in palm.com/palmprofile, and will not be able to purchase apps that require 1.4.5 or later Feb 20 23:21:11 ok webos 2.0.1 is illegal - but if you look on preccentral how many people are discussing webos 2 on pre minus - and how many people do have pre 2 on their minus ... Feb 20 23:21:57 webOS 2.0.1 itself is not illegal. the act of redistributing it is. Feb 20 23:22:15 you have received "stolen goods" Feb 20 23:22:15 i downloaded 2 games (free version) and xbmc lite and boxee lite Feb 20 23:22:16 as00270: also, we're working here to provide legal versions of 2.x for the older devices, so there are better / legal options for recourse to HP / palm's broken promise Feb 20 23:23:10 i would be very glad to get a LEGAL version of webos 2 - i would 100 x prefer Feb 20 23:23:29 when you do, we'll be happy to discuss alpha testing on it Feb 20 23:24:25 since, for true alpha testing (as opposed to someone who just wants to get software early to use), we need to be able to reproduce any problems you report. Feb 20 23:26:16 i am willing to send here any error message i get _ so please be so kind - i have actually verivox running on it - it also works Feb 20 23:26:16 I did not have yet any problem with webos 2 - the only thing i had to do is to install the patch for bookmarks Feb 20 23:26:57 error messages mean nothing if they can't be independently reproduced Feb 20 23:27:16 as00270: we hope you understand our position. Thx for being transparent on your config, we hope you'll enjoy linphone as soon as it gets a wider distribution Feb 20 23:27:25 i really do not understand why HP does not publish this version - maybe as testing version Feb 20 23:27:53 if it gets published, you've got to then support it Feb 20 23:28:09 the decision on whether to publish a webOS doctor for a carrier-subsidised phone is the carrier's not HP's. Feb 20 23:28:16 halfhalo: not necessarily true Feb 20 23:28:29 HP can only make the decision for unlocked phones (such as the unlocked Pre 2) Feb 20 23:28:34 please be kind - if necessary i will flash my phone back to 1.4.5 - because i really miss most is a sip client Feb 20 23:29:11 my phone was always unlocked - in Germany aand Luxembourg they are always unlocked Feb 20 23:29:36 but sold through O2, no? Feb 20 23:29:46 not direct from HP/Palm Feb 20 23:30:11 therefore support costs are borne by O2, therefore they have the decision on whether to release updates. Feb 20 23:30:25 i bought it on ebay - no watermark - nothing - no branding - i think it was bought from HP Feb 20 23:30:56 then you have no support obligations from HP, since you bought it on ebay. Feb 20 23:31:15 rwhitby: I tend to disagree with that last Feb 20 23:31:40 destinal: why? Feb 20 23:31:55 i know - i do not care about an official support - although i have the purchase ticket and 6 months left of warranty Feb 20 23:31:58 If I sell something to person A, and they then sell it to person B, am I required to support person B ? Feb 20 23:32:05 or Feb 20 23:32:10 or C or D or E or F ? Feb 20 23:32:52 please be kind - if necessary i will flash my phone back to 1.4.5 - because really what i miss most is a sip client Feb 20 23:32:58 rwhitby: in practice a manufacturer supports a product they sell on the open market and don't stop supporting it just because it was resold Feb 20 23:33:01 as00270: I bought a german O2 Pre- on ebay, no branding either, but a true O2 product that came with the box and the associated markings (S/N & IMEI) Feb 20 23:33:14 destinal: warranty is one thing, upgrades are another. Feb 20 23:33:38 we're not talking about something which is not living up to the contract of sale here Feb 20 23:33:53 rwhitby: I guess you could make the argument, apple was selling iphone OS updates for the ipod touch for a while Feb 20 23:33:53 anyway i live in Luxembourg - and there is no O2 here Feb 20 23:34:40 as00270: please return when you have flashed back to 1.4.5 Feb 20 23:35:24 That's in 40 min if necessary Feb 20 23:35:29 rwhitby: one question is one of security updates. I suppose manufacturers aren't obligated to fix those either but can you imagine the results of a society where they did not? Feb 20 23:35:57 destinal: agreed. those are considered defects against the original contract of sale in my opinion Feb 20 23:40:47 if you insist - i will flash now my phone back - but oi hope you will give me afterwards access to the pource code (or is it already an ipk package?) Feb 20 23:40:47 Although - please do not take it bad - i think it is quite "ridicolous" to ask me to do that Feb 20 23:40:47 I have more than 12 years of linux experience, compiling and error tracking - debugging is something i really know to do - as i said i managed to compile mc (and transmission ) for my pre . Even if i do flash now my phone back - i could flash it aferwards again to 2.0.1 - and i could test it. Feb 20 23:40:47 I see being honest has only disadvantages .... Feb 20 23:41:26 as00270: you are taking an individual view Feb 20 23:41:52 what do you have to loose if i try it on 2.0.1 ? Feb 20 23:42:05 where do you think WebOS Internals would be today if we took an individual view and used stolen goods when it was convenient for us? Feb 20 23:42:39 that's a good argument - i have to admit. Feb 20 23:42:57 what you do in the privacy of your own home is of no concern to us. but what you discuss publicly in the publicly logged channel of ours, is. Feb 20 23:43:57 as00270: BTW, the full source code for linphone is in the webos-internals git repositories Feb 20 23:44:12 you can build it there yourself if you desire Feb 20 23:44:39 I do not know in which relation you are with precentral - but at that moment all discussion aboutr 2.01 on pre should be prohibeted - other thing you are right - if this is an open irc , it is wrong to discusss about - i apologize Feb 20 23:45:21 precentral has their own policies about discussion of stolen good Feb 20 23:45:34 s Feb 20 23:46:28 as00270: it is not only an open IRC, it is publicly logged, and we invite Palm employees to participate. Feb 20 23:47:53 i think i would never publish the link to the download - i know what i did - i bought my phone on the promise of hp - that differentely to android, all updates would be available to all models . I was waiting 3 months on the promiodes update (see their interview from oct. 14 ). And now - on Feb 11 they tell existing pre owners that the update will not be published Feb 20 23:49:15 i would relly like to read the comments of palm employees - concverning their interview from october 14 - and what they are doing now Feb 20 23:50:29 as00270: if you think palm employees in this channel are going to comment on that issue publicly, you are dreaming. Feb 20 23:50:44 the people who hang out here probably had nothing to do with the decision anyways Feb 20 23:50:48 * RMind just wants bug fixes and stacked cards... then he'd be happy Feb 20 23:53:14 probably they won't - or they are looking for a new employee Feb 20 23:53:14 10 min more and my phone is again a 1.4 Feb 20 23:53:14 What did you make me do? Feb 20 23:53:14 :( Feb 20 23:53:14 :) Feb 20 23:54:03 ? Feb 20 23:54:21 ps: what is the best terminal program for pre? Feb 20 23:54:36 you have to pick Feb 20 23:54:38 there all good Feb 20 23:55:15 what is great is that you published bash Feb 21 00:05:02 Dear Members of webos-internals - As you asked me , i flashed my palm pre minux back to 1.4 - i am just syncing it with my palm account. Would you now be so kind to send me a link for the alpha version of linphone? - I promise to send you any error message i should get. I i con help in any way in optimizing this product , please give me sign - i thing i have quite good linux skills that might help - thank you in advance Feb 21 00:06:13 oil: any reason why the new swipe to delete feature in lumberjack only works on the follow scene? Feb 21 00:06:21 I want it on the "retrieve log" scene, too Feb 21 00:07:55 oTHER QUESTION. IS ANYONE WORKING IN PORTING Dreambox Remote TO WEBOS? Feb 21 00:09:02 * Thibaud thinks as00270 is talking a bit louder than what one would expect... Feb 21 00:09:19 as00270: 1.4 works, you might want to switch to 1.4.5 though Feb 21 00:09:43 as00270: see /msg & please report failure(s) & success in the P|C alpha thread (http://forums.precentral.net/webos-internals/274615-linphone-alpha-testing.html). PM if privacy is needed Feb 21 00:10:20 looking at Dreambox remotes, a lot of them are really, really ugly :B Feb 21 00:19:50 Adora: because thats the only spot i put it Feb 21 00:20:07 its more complicated in the retrieve scene because of the searching Feb 21 00:20:10 but i can get it in there, too Feb 21 00:20:55 I suppose I can do the same thing by following, performing my action, turning off, then troubleshooting Feb 21 00:21:06 most of the time I'm using it to troubleshoot app catalog download issues Feb 21 00:21:12 so it's easy for me to repeat Feb 21 00:21:13 lol Feb 21 00:21:56 there's probably a good use case for the other scene, too Feb 21 00:22:04 yeah Feb 21 00:22:05 but damn...can't beat this kind of turnaround Feb 21 00:22:16 haha Feb 21 00:23:02 I'm creating a "native" music player remix theme right now Feb 21 00:23:12 this app makes me wish my playlists weren't all locked away in grooveshark Feb 21 00:23:37 nice native /me gets ready to chuck pandora Feb 21 00:24:14 Slacker Radio supremacy Feb 21 00:26:14 SineOt is it better then pandora ? Feb 21 00:26:37 tons Feb 21 00:26:46 hmm Feb 21 00:26:52 i have mass playlist in pandora Feb 21 00:26:54 gives you a lot more fine tuned control over stations than Pandora does Feb 21 00:26:58 destinal: http://forums.precentral.net/2877109-post112.html Feb 21 00:27:02 eric clapton / rod steward / phill colins Feb 21 00:27:06 shall i go on :P Feb 21 00:28:15 rwhitby: very interesting. why doesn't he come to the channel, I wonder. Feb 21 00:29:43 Josef_B: it has outright ban abilities for tracks + artists, then on the site gives you finer controls to determine how often a favorite song will play and how adventurous it will get in introducing new 'related' artists to your station Feb 21 00:30:31 oo Feb 21 00:31:43 you could, theoretically at least, make a station that played ONLY favorite tracks and nothing else, or one that took the tracks you favorited and rarely if ever play them and instead use them to branch out into new artists etc Feb 21 00:33:18 heh, no "don't play this for one month," it's "don't play this ever again" and the option of "banish this artist to never grace this station again so long as it exists" Feb 21 00:34:00 ~seen mrvc Feb 21 00:34:03 mrvc <~vaughn@c-67-191-184-192.hsd1.ga.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #webos-internals, 10d 19h 57m 56s ago, saying: 'destinal-work: would be great if they could focus more on streamlining the OS, but I know that's not the way of things'. Feb 21 00:37:51 oh wow SineOt this slacker raido is on the good foot already Feb 21 00:37:53 top stations Feb 21 00:37:59 and i can make list from there im assuming Feb 21 00:39:09 yup Feb 21 00:39:24 I have a few fully custom ones and then I've tweaked the top stations for a few other genres Feb 21 00:52:20 Adora: http://i55.tinypic.com/315ka68.png Feb 21 01:11:28 oil: heh, "just for Lisa, but everyone else can use it too." Feb 21 01:11:33 lol Feb 21 01:12:19 wow .. if i could program/code i would overhaul google maps on webos Feb 21 01:13:00 anyone have some alternatives / patches for google maps to show more / do more / become more lively Feb 21 01:13:03 sheesh Feb 21 01:13:11 If I could program i would do lots of stuff... I just fake it for now Feb 21 01:13:19 lol Feb 21 01:13:21 faker! Feb 21 01:14:21 google maps on webos isn't worse than google maps on other non-android platforms Feb 21 01:14:40 true Feb 21 01:15:10 ATT wants me to pay to navigate the streets Feb 21 01:15:12 pfft Feb 21 01:15:41 hey there's always navit Feb 21 01:16:19 * Loudergood wonders why it's so hard to go backwards in linux.... Feb 21 01:16:37 I'm trying to write an init script to start novacomd in debian Feb 21 01:16:54 what do you mean backwards? Feb 21 01:17:43 rather than the initscript being there Feb 21 01:17:45 I think Feb 21 01:17:49 well, debian made the jump from init to upstart Feb 21 01:18:00 and palm made the package for debian Feb 21 01:18:06 wow Feb 21 01:18:12 ignore that Feb 21 01:18:25 ubuntu made the jump from init to upstart Feb 21 01:18:27 debian hasn't Feb 21 01:18:32 true Feb 21 01:18:46 so the package doesn't know about upstart? Feb 21 01:19:08 palm made the package for ubuntu Feb 21 01:19:21 so it has all the stuff it needs for upstart Feb 21 01:19:33 oh, but not init Feb 21 01:19:36 the internet is full of stuff on converting init scripts to upstart Feb 21 01:19:40 but not the opposite Feb 21 01:20:07 well, time to go pickup takeout bbl Feb 21 01:21:57 isn't there a navigation thing for webos ? Feb 21 01:22:00 starts with a N Feb 21 01:22:05 navit Feb 21 01:22:28 is it decent ? Feb 21 01:22:38 uh o Feb 21 01:22:42 I dunno, never used it Feb 21 01:22:44 its on #webos-internals must be good Feb 21 01:23:37 hey all. Feb 21 01:23:39 whats good. Feb 21 01:23:51 oc80z: preware rewrite in enyo Feb 21 01:24:08 epicness on a stick! Feb 21 01:24:19 its on a stick? Feb 21 01:24:29 could be Feb 21 01:31:24 Josef_B, navit kinda depends on what country you are in and the maps you use Feb 21 01:31:53 but in general the UI is aweful Feb 21 01:32:13 I still love it and play with it all the time Feb 21 01:54:48 so Feb 21 01:54:52 what is a alt to google maps Feb 21 02:09:24 rwhitby: enyo? Feb 21 02:09:35 :D Feb 21 02:09:45 at first i read vala. Feb 21 02:27:57 hey rwhitby Feb 21 02:28:04 yes Feb 21 02:28:31 wow, phil mckinney travels 30 weeks per year, down from 43 a few years ago. Feb 21 02:28:52 i have patched dnsmasq to cache A records for a minimum of 24 hours Feb 21 02:29:40 would this be somthing nslu2/optware could use? Feb 21 02:30:24 i know it breaks rfc, but it makes sense over cellular. Feb 21 02:49:53 oc80z, could cause issues though because you are altering the 'expected' behavior Feb 21 02:50:05 I see the merit behind it, but in reality, DNS queries are quick Feb 21 02:50:27 and small Feb 21 02:50:36 a caching proxy would make more sense Feb 21 02:50:44 anyone install squid yet? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Mon Feb 21 02:59:57 2011