**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Nov 09 02:59:57 2011 Nov 09 03:43:12 patch question: if the offset is true on the original file but not on the version currently in use because a different patch has increased/decreased the file size, it will fail to install correct? Nov 09 03:43:25 no Nov 09 03:43:32 patch is smarter than that Nov 09 03:43:39 ok thanks Nov 09 03:43:43 (that's the reason for the three lines of context before and after) Nov 09 03:44:16 i figured, but seemed like the offset doesnt have a lot of use if it was true. thanks for confirmation Nov 09 03:45:25 submited custom browser gestures update, if anyone cares Nov 09 03:45:46 the update adds progressbar visibility when in fullscreen mode. Nov 09 03:46:13 ok another question, can one patch change part of a file that another patch looks at thus making the second patch uninstallable? or will it recognize the conflict before installing the second patch? Nov 09 03:47:04 um it'll recognize it Nov 09 03:48:21 i have issues with the alarm for the touchpad clock not going off. this has always been the case, but since the 3.0.4 upgrade, it is worse.... also since the upgrade, i no longer get taskbar notifications for voogleXL.... i also have a timer/stopwatch that since the upgrade usually does not ring when it is set to.... just trying to narrow down what the cause of this might be. using uberkernel with several patches Nov 09 03:48:58 @ 1.5GHz tcl Nov 09 03:49:35 probalby something killing the process that is running the timers for those apps.. Nov 09 03:51:17 are you tossing your cards away with the slingshot method? Nov 09 03:51:58 good day rwhitby Nov 09 03:52:55 moo: g'day Nov 09 03:54:25 nightburn: are you asking me? Nov 09 03:54:35 jmichaelx: yes Nov 09 03:54:59 nightburn: generally no. what bearing would that have? Nov 09 03:55:22 I think someone was able to show that the slingshot method leaks memory Nov 09 03:55:27 iirc Nov 09 03:55:30 ahh Nov 09 03:55:40 jmichaelx: if you toss your cards away with the slingshot method it completely kills the app and any associated timers. Nov 09 03:55:45 i'll definitely make a note of that Nov 09 03:56:02 i rarely use the slingshot method Nov 09 03:56:09 jmichaelx: unless the app has been added to some exclusion list Nov 09 03:56:28 jmichaelx: best to not use it all for now as a troubleshooting measure Nov 09 03:57:12 this issue with alarms not going off has been with the touchad all along, i have talked to others with the same problem... it is just worse now Nov 09 03:57:39 jmichaelx: yea i don't know about that one, i don't use my touchpad as an alarm. Nov 09 03:58:17 Although I've had the alarm fail on my Pre before Nov 09 03:58:31 also, now when the aloarm goes off, is plays through maybe twice and stops... it used to go on until it was stopped... i think the 3.0.4 upgrade changed this.... i am more and more tempted to roll back the OS, but it's probably not worth it Nov 09 03:58:33 i just decided to stop using it for that, not worth it . Nov 09 03:58:55 yea, i would not be surprised if this is just a webOS issue Nov 09 03:59:46 i am also aggravated stop pulseaudio; start pulseaudio no longer gets audio going again since the upgrade Nov 09 03:59:50 I guess it all depends on what you use your TP for. For me 3.0.4 has been great. Nov 09 03:59:53 freaking pulseaudio.... Nov 09 04:00:08 i dont have any issues with audio Nov 09 04:00:33 wrea: i have no idea whether or not that problem is universal, but i do know it is wide-spread Nov 09 04:01:16 i like webOS, but some aspects never got fully baked Nov 09 04:01:40 yup and for 3.x they literally started over . heh Nov 09 04:02:07 im working on getting more pulseaudio plugins working Nov 09 04:02:25 i would love to see pulseaudio just gone Nov 09 04:02:30 from everything Nov 09 04:03:22 alsa is not perfect, but alsa alone did not give me the high rate of issues that pulseaudio has Nov 09 04:03:25 i noticed the weird sound on my touchpad, nothing i did in pulseaudio fixed it even in debug mode Nov 09 04:03:31 I've never had any problems with pulseaudio ever Nov 09 04:03:51 A lot of issues are that pulse exposes problems with some drivers Nov 09 04:04:25 wrea: then you have been very lucky, to the extent that it's almost bizarre..... hatred for pulseaudio is also wide-spread Nov 09 04:04:44 wrea: yeah the nouse issues with the touchpad were replicated on usb too Nov 09 04:04:49 wrea: agreed, but i liked it better when some of those issues were not exposed Nov 09 04:05:18 rwhitby: are the admins too busy or too many patches to process? or delay in the mail system? Nov 09 04:05:19 jmichaelx, complain to the driver authors :P Nov 09 04:05:40 I have yet to experience the pulseaudio issue. Nov 09 04:05:42 I packaged it for Arch pretty early on and didnt even have an issue then Nov 09 04:05:59 Maybe I reboot my TP enough for it to never arise? Nov 09 04:06:38 wrea: i am quite sure that there would be more than a few arch users for whom that is not the case.... just look at the forums for any distro you can think of Nov 09 04:06:53 ive messed with pulseaudio alot recently, i didnt have any issues Nov 09 04:06:59 moo: I do patches in batches when I have free time. Nov 09 04:07:08 meh, dont really care about arch users anymore :P Nov 09 04:07:14 hewball: it all has to do with what hardware you have Nov 09 04:07:28 moo: at least once a week. You know that you can get people to test your patches in a PreCentral thread, right? Nov 09 04:07:45 wrea: what distro folks are using is probably irrelevant... though i have wondered at times Nov 09 04:08:01 rwhitby: how do admins test patch beyond patch --dry-run ? Nov 09 04:08:17 i have my patch files dry-run already :P Nov 09 04:08:19 moo: you can also use that to get recommendations for good patch names. "tmpfs log" is not an example of a good end-user-friendly patch name. Nov 09 04:08:47 you're right, that's too geek Nov 09 04:09:14 i have two machines that use the exact same motherboard (hence same audio), one at work, and one at home... the one at work runs kubuntu, and has had audio problems off and on... the machine at home runs gentoo, and has never had any audio issues, pulseaudio or otherwise Nov 09 04:19:18 jmichaelx: people have had issues with the webos clock since the 1.x days... from what I've hraed, it seems to vary with release Nov 09 04:26:55 ATTN: we are load testing a new ipkg feed server, if anyone has issues with preware updating, could you please /msg me directly Nov 09 04:30:30 ofc the people with the most problems are not the ones that hang out here, and won't see that message Nov 09 04:30:40 but I'm sure we'll try to pass the message on Nov 09 04:33:04 well, it is currently serving from the new mirror to test it, and everything appears to be working properly so far Nov 09 04:34:31 it's just so the people who are here know, in case someone comes asking. Nov 09 04:35:08 yep Nov 09 04:35:38 nobody should ever know or care that it was rolled to the mirror, just wanted to make sure that if something doesn't work, that the proper person (me) gets notified Nov 09 04:35:48 but I am watching it, so chances are I will know before they show up Nov 09 04:35:55 or rod, so he can change the cname Nov 09 04:36:08 ideally the mirror would get fixed Nov 09 04:36:15 but so far, it is running great Nov 09 04:36:17 sure Nov 09 04:36:25 rackspace vps? Nov 09 04:38:29 pretty much Nov 09 04:38:40 Slicehost Slice, but that is Rackspace now Nov 09 04:40:30 it's not an official Rackspace sponsored mirror or anything, it is on one of my employee servers Nov 09 04:41:37 Do debug symbols get stripped when using widk? Nov 09 04:43:36 That's usually more controlled by the software's build process Nov 09 04:43:53 more so than the compiler and cross-compiler setup Nov 09 04:59:17 so far so good... time to hit it with loadimpact and see what happens Nov 09 04:59:38 say goodnight Gracie Nov 09 05:00:10 nah, she can handle it ;) Nov 09 05:00:22 and funny story, my baby sisters name is Grace Nov 09 05:01:27 http://loadimpact.com/load-test/ipkg.preware.org-056fb5d577243facf5eeea1e17bedbd6 Nov 09 05:02:11 it will ramp up to 50 concurrent users Nov 09 05:02:25 this box should be able to handle 1000 easy though for the ipkg feeds Nov 09 05:07:33 all requests served between 80-100ms Nov 09 05:07:41 she passed with flying colors (as expected) Nov 09 05:11:44 rwhitby: do you know where the fstab file is, in the doctor package for 2.1.x? i can find it in 2.2.x+ not 2.1.x Nov 09 05:12:20 and found only 1 service directory under /usr/palm/services in 1.4.5 doctor Nov 09 05:12:39 1.4.5 does not have node.js Nov 09 05:12:48 where is the google account sync stuff? Nov 09 05:13:35 in 1.4.5 it's java Nov 09 05:14:54 ok Nov 09 05:15:01 how do i change voltages using tthe sysfs method ? Nov 09 05:15:37 "use govnah" ;) Nov 09 05:16:15 no, i must move on from that.. even with your recent adjustments it's still too much of a pain to adjust them Nov 09 05:16:51 ~utsl Nov 09 05:16:51 somebody said utsl was Use The Source, Luke (loose translation: you think this has *comments*, huh?). Real Men don't write documentation; if it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand. Nov 09 05:16:56 i get that govnah uses sysfs itself lol Nov 09 05:17:11 ls-monitor is your friend Nov 09 05:21:00 so much information is scrolling by in ls-monitor lol Nov 09 05:21:21 and it's not very readable Nov 09 05:21:55 guess i should be using something else other than novacom in a windows cmd prompt ? Nov 09 05:22:43 ls-monitor -f govnah Nov 09 05:22:50 and set the govnah polling to something large Nov 09 05:23:22 I'd use something other than windows, period. ;) Nov 09 05:24:03 well im dual booting :) Nov 09 05:24:15 but i prefer windows for my day job. im just used to it . Nov 09 05:24:44 vm! Nov 09 05:25:03 seperate hard drives! Nov 09 05:25:12 laptop ftw! Nov 09 05:31:11 alright now im using it novaterm and it's still an unreadable mess heh Nov 09 05:31:25 font problems.. uggh Nov 09 05:36:40 sshd is your friend Nov 09 05:51:00 "According to reports from the meeting, Whitman is leaning towards keeping webOS, telling the employees that she wouldn?t be telling them to stay if she were going to get rid of webOS, and even if that were the case they would ?find something to do with you.?" Nov 09 05:51:05 oh, that's encouraging. Nov 09 05:51:11 (not) Nov 09 05:53:52 lol Nov 09 06:01:13 i cannot decide which is the worst case scenario.... oracle buying webOS, or HP kepping it Nov 09 06:01:16 keeping* Nov 09 06:01:36 at least oracle pretends it cares about open source Nov 09 06:01:46 * jmichaelx would love to see both of those companies go up in roaring flames Nov 09 06:02:16 Indeed Nov 09 06:02:32 yes, oracle does at least pretend, when they're not out patent trolling Nov 09 06:04:01 the saddest thing is HP won't just finish it. There's nothing more tragic than dashed hopes. Nov 09 06:05:25 i would never have dreamt that such a massive corporation could be so profoundly ill-managed Nov 09 06:06:31 nor I Nov 09 06:06:43 it's gone way beyond comical Nov 09 06:06:59 past sad Nov 09 06:07:10 even past train-wreck Nov 09 06:24:34 Adobe ceases development on mobile browser Flash, refocuses efforts on HTML5 Nov 09 06:28:08 surprising. Nov 09 07:02:47 <|Jason8|> ... Nov 09 07:27:22 anyone around? Nov 09 07:35:34 yes? Nov 09 07:38:33 Freman, wanna do me a favor? just update your feeds in Preware and let me know if it seems like the portion where it is downloading the feeds seems faster Nov 09 07:42:57 patching framework files is tricky. *.js -> concatenated.js -> compressed js. itls for faster loading, i guess. the compressed one is hard to patch. updating *.js will abandon the compressed one so reduce loading time Nov 09 07:43:45 in fact, anyone in here that feels like testing it... update your feeds in preware and let me know if the "downloading feeds" portion seems quicker Nov 09 07:44:20 on the pre3, maybe. Nov 09 07:46:05 cryptk: I'm actually getting a bunch of errors when updating my feeds Nov 09 07:46:11 what errors? Nov 09 07:46:43 my pre2 seems to be hozed at the moment... but it's not a big deal, since the overall update time is dominated by scanning all my installed apps anyways Nov 09 07:46:57 (but yes, I know, you're trying to optimize the part you can) Nov 09 07:47:25 yeah, I am just trying to compare the difference between this ipkg feeder and the primary one Nov 09 07:47:38 and the download portion is the only part where it makes a difference Nov 09 07:47:52 phone restart time Nov 09 07:48:14 it's been a long 5d15h since the last one Nov 09 07:48:49 a lot of times, I won't notice anyways... I update on EDGE Nov 09 07:49:11 "update" -> do something else for a bit and come back to it later Nov 09 07:49:30 ahh, yeah, if you are updating on anything other than WIFI, you won't see any difference Nov 09 07:49:39 you are gonna be limited by your connection, not mine ;) Nov 09 07:51:00 aaand the pre2 decides it's not going to start back up again Nov 09 07:51:32 battery pull time Nov 09 07:56:39 feels faster on the pre2, but I got som eerrors... wget failures on webos-patches/2.1.0/Packages.gz, optware/testing/all/Packages.gz optware/testing/armv7/Packages.gz Nov 09 07:57:23 perahps more, it's scrolled off the top of the alert box Nov 09 07:59:19 dwc-, you are using the "old" testing feeds as well Nov 09 07:59:32 we don't use those testing feed URL's anymore, there are alpha and beta feeds now Nov 09 07:59:37 yeah, same errors as I got. go into "manage feeds" and uncheck the webos-internals-testing feed, and it should work better. Nov 09 07:59:51 yes, I know about the new testing stuff Nov 09 08:00:06 yep, you should actually remove the those testing feeds from your feeds list, we don't use or update them anymore Nov 09 08:00:11 but, iirc, the old feeds were not removed, just emptied and not updated Nov 09 08:00:21 but it wasn't erroring before Nov 09 08:00:28 and instead add the beta feed (which is the new equivalent to the old testing feed) Nov 09 08:00:41 you are right, it wasn't erroring before, because they were never emptied Nov 09 08:00:45 just not updated anymore Nov 09 08:00:55 and they still exist on the original 3 mirrors Nov 09 08:01:04 this is a new mirror, with only new packagess Nov 09 08:01:34 http://ipkg2.preware.org/feeds/webos-internals/testing/all/Packages Nov 09 08:01:39 yes Nov 09 08:01:43 nope, they were emptied Nov 09 08:01:44 I know it is there on ipkg2 Nov 09 08:02:12 http://ipkg2.preware.org/feeds/webos-internals/testing/all/ Nov 09 08:02:16 the packages are still there Nov 09 08:02:25 the Packages index was purged but left in place Nov 09 08:02:33 so... how do I go about removing the old testing feed? Nov 09 08:02:34 yes, but the feed urls on the old servers don't 404 Nov 09 08:02:37 on the new mirror there isn't even a testing folder Nov 09 08:02:39 manage feeds, swipe to delete Nov 09 08:02:40 (from the list in preware, that is) Nov 09 08:02:49 ah Nov 09 08:02:49 that's all I'm pointing out Nov 09 08:03:08 I guess this mirror is the time when it goes from being deprecated to being removed? Nov 09 08:03:26 it wasn't "removed" from the new mirror, it was just never there to begin with Nov 09 08:03:38 as far as people's clients are concerned, it is "removed" Nov 09 08:03:49 because those are pointing at the ipkg cname Nov 09 08:03:53 they will think that because they won't know the real deal Nov 09 08:04:41 we /should/ release an update to preware that checks if you are using the old testing feeds, and if so, either remove it, or change it to the beta feeds Nov 09 08:04:57 so basically, what this is meaning is that the users who haven't removed / migrated / updated in awhile will now get errors instead of the announcement Nov 09 08:05:26 the webos-testing feeds were off / removed awhile ago Nov 09 08:06:17 yeah, they were switched off, and the Packages index emptied (except for the "you need to migrate" package) Nov 09 08:07:15 I can add the announcement to this mirror Nov 09 08:08:18 which is fine if that's what you want to do... you'd just asked about the errors so I was reporting what some users will see breaking Nov 09 08:14:35 what permission do ipkg script have when installing with preware and/or wqi? Nov 09 08:16:23 root Nov 09 08:16:27 yep, root Nov 09 08:16:37 that is what makes it so that they can do "new cool stuffs" Nov 09 08:16:40 so be careful Nov 09 08:16:57 (with what you write, and with other people's packages) Nov 09 08:17:15 dwc-, I understand, it would probably be a good idea for me to put testing folders in place with the Packages index with the dummy "migrate" package in it Nov 09 08:17:18 working on doing that now Nov 09 10:05:19 { prop: "searchProperty", op: "?", val: filterString, collate: "primary" } <- what is that op "?", not explained in https://developer.palm.com/content/api/reference/data-types/db8.html#WhereClause Nov 09 10:06:16 cryptk|offline ah sure, I can now - hehe was on a train ebfore :D Nov 09 10:07:51 and searchProperty? Nov 09 10:08:07 don't seems a database field name Nov 09 15:05:44 hi Nov 09 15:09:24 I have a problem when I added url address in preware and I typed preware.is.awesome.com and it changed preware into predate and it messed up the whole thing I wanted to do is overclocking th HP touchpad Nov 09 15:09:54 does anybody know how to fix it Nov 09 15:34:08 can i read older pivot issues somehow? or is an issue only available for a month? Nov 09 15:59:14 can I ask a question - re partitions Nov 09 16:01:11 I used tailor (from preware alpha) to add an ext3 part Nov 09 16:01:36 want it to be visible to apps especially movie player Nov 09 16:02:02 the purpose of the ext3 part was to work around the FAT32 max filesize limitation of 4Gb Nov 09 16:02:35 is this actually possible, anyone care to give me a pointer please? Nov 09 16:32:26 Trying to uninstall "muffle system logging" patch and getting the error, "Unreversed patch detected" Can someone help me out? Nov 09 16:33:18 already applied? Nov 09 16:34:45 Think I may have found the solution... Nov 09 16:36:17 Hello. I am having issues with Mobile Hotspot on my Pre3, I have managed to solve it manually by enabling IP_FORWARDING and 3 iptables rules [from pre-central forums]. Unfortunately I am unable to make the setting stick on reboot, I have tried /etc/init.d scripts, event.d/upstart entries and even editing /etc/init.d/networking etc. None of these seem to work on a reboot.. any pointers ? Nov 09 16:36:35 Jd2k: what is the solution? someone else was having that issue yesterday Nov 09 16:37:08 or am I missing something basic like a chroot into the actual boot environment ? Nov 09 16:37:46 What does EPR stand for? It says if you uninstall patch with EPR and re-install it works? Nov 09 16:38:40 Emergency Patch R. Nov 09 16:38:59 search preware feeds for emergency Nov 09 16:39:03 Thanks. Nov 09 16:40:31 no one knows the answer to my question? Nov 09 16:46:23 Anyhelp ? Nov 09 16:46:57 YeahRight - http://tspxyz.com/portfolio/#hp-webos-pivot Nov 09 16:50:32 thanks Clark008 Nov 09 16:50:42 i cant read it anymore on the touchpad? Nov 09 16:51:06 no Nov 09 17:59:22 Clark008 : how weird Nov 09 18:01:31 would be nice though Nov 09 19:35:46 Clark008 : its beyond me why an already made and downloaded magazine cant be read anymore after the month is over..atm i'm still looking at the sports issue which is supposedley "coming soon" Nov 09 19:45:04 YeahRight, close the app cat, give it a few minutes, and when you reopen it (after the new issue downloads) you should get the sports issue Nov 09 19:45:46 YeahRight, and old issues are here http://tspxyz.com/portfolio/#hp-webos-pivot Nov 09 20:53:01 RagingMind : i'm in europe..US appsstore though.. Nov 09 20:59:43 YeahRight, so you're using the us app cat but you're in europe? Nov 09 21:28:56 hi guys. maybe dumb question. att pre plus, is there a way to get around having to have a sim card installed to register it with palm? Nov 09 21:30:43 EricBlade, I guess it'd be like what I did and use metadoctor Nov 09 21:31:09 wrea: yeah on the sprint one, i metadoctored, hooked up wifi, then ran first use Nov 09 21:32:09 my guess is that it probably wants the sim card id, much like the esn for a cdma phone Nov 09 21:34:11 Well, I can only speak for the veer Nov 09 21:41:49 EricBlade: Meta-Doctor Nov 09 21:42:49 rwhitby: yeah i already metadoctored and it has let me into the system, i have wifi on, but i haven't figured out how to get it logged into my palm account Nov 09 21:47:38 for pre+, hit the first use app. Nov 09 21:47:48 you may need a patch from Preware to make it visible Nov 09 21:48:05 first use is visible, but when i run it, it just gives me the "insert sim card" animation Nov 09 21:48:24 did you bypass activation in the meta-doctor? Nov 09 21:49:33 i have only BYPASS_FIRST_USE_APP and ENABLE_DEVELOPER_MODE Nov 09 21:51:07 then you missed the important one :) Nov 09 21:52:12 hmm. i didn't like the warning on BYPASS_ACTIVATION, "Only use this if you are never going to use cellular connectivity on this device." Nov 09 21:54:45 EricBlade, it's not permanent Nov 09 21:57:19 according to ATT my phone should have come with a sim Nov 09 21:58:33 ...and according to the manual, att should provide the sim Nov 09 22:03:02 there a store near you? Nov 09 22:06:37 yeah Nov 09 22:08:03 i'll just get a sim card, and hopefully it'll liven right up. it at least works as a WiFi phone now Nov 09 22:09:00 so, just need a sim card for the ATT one, and then to figure out why the Sprint model camera and GPS refuse to function Nov 09 22:10:15 so, has anyone seen any errors while updating preware feeds? Nov 09 22:10:32 EXCEPT for 404 errors because you are still using the old testing feeds and not the new alpha/beta feeds? Nov 09 22:12:01 cryptk, how recent are you thinking? Nov 09 22:13:46 within about 16 hours ish Nov 09 22:13:59 mine worked on all 3 devices a little while ago Nov 09 22:14:04 cool Nov 09 22:14:27 and if anyone is getting 404's and are using the old testing feeds, they should read testing.preware.org Nov 09 22:15:04 hp catalog seems to be wonky though Nov 09 22:15:25 it worked last night and if the cat wasn't pinning me to the chair I'd check again Nov 09 22:16:26 sadly, I don't control the HP catalog ;) Nov 09 22:17:06 I do control almost everything that has to do with WOSI though (not own, but have control over) Nov 09 22:17:25 so if you do run into any WOSI infra related issue, I am the guy to let know ;) Nov 09 22:23:32 anyone know if there is a way to dial standard sip addresses from linphone, rather than just numerics? Nov 09 22:23:50 it was in the todo list Nov 09 22:24:21 but that was a long time ago Nov 09 22:25:09 i'm going to absolutely have to get a build environment setup and see if we can get that whole thing working, and on touchpad too Nov 09 22:25:45 that would be super awesome. I played with linphone for a while, but without coding skills it's a bit more difficult to help Nov 09 22:27:21 gvoice + linphone + ipkall = wifi phone, woo Nov 09 22:28:00 you *can* receive calls from someone that's using a standard foo@bar.net sip address Nov 09 22:57:31 EricBlade: do you want to take over linphone development? Nov 10 00:26:19 Anyone know what, if any, function does mdns have in webos? Is it used for anything? **** ENDING LOGGING AT Thu Nov 10 02:59:58 2011