**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue Jul 09 03:00:00 2013
Jul 09 05:04:28 <morphis> morning
Jul 09 08:02:22 <morphis> Tofe|Away: ping
Jul 09 10:45:48 <morphis> JaMa: we need to find a way to introduce XDG_RUNTIME_DIR (http://standards.freedesktop.org/basedir-spec/basedir-spec-latest.html)
Jul 09 10:53:21 <JaMa> I was thinking about adding it in profile from base-files, but I'm not too happy about such solution
Jul 09 11:36:11 <Tofe> morphis: pong
Jul 09 11:36:13 <Tofe> morning
Jul 09 11:40:57 <morphis> Tofe: I think we should move the window model from QML/JS to C++
Jul 09 11:41:21 <morphis> as I would like to make the shell replacable
Jul 09 11:42:08 <Tofe> morphis: yes, I always thought we would need to do that one day
Jul 09 11:42:26 <morphis> lipstick did that quite nice
Jul 09 11:42:53 <Tofe> but you mean, the compositor ? or just the window ?
Jul 09 11:44:34 <morphis> the window and a model to collect all windows
Jul 09 11:44:53 <morphis> and maybe a little bit more
Jul 09 11:47:40 <morphis> Tofe: but atm we should try to get the windows rendered into the cards first
Jul 09 11:47:46 <morphis> then we can start to refactor those things
Jul 09 11:50:00 <Tofe> ok, yes
Jul 09 11:51:15 <morphis> I am mostly done with integration in our images
Jul 09 11:51:22 <morphis> only some small things need to be solved
Jul 09 11:51:28 <Tofe> That shouldn't be so much of a problem: we "just" need to replace DummyWindow by the component that is given to windowAdded
Jul 09 11:51:35 <morphis> JaMa: me too
Jul 09 11:52:01 <morphis> Tofe: ok
Jul 09 11:52:18 <morphis> Tofe: I am writing currently a small web app launcher
Jul 09 11:53:19 <Tofe> morphis: I'll try to get more things working. I have the delete working in tofe/work, but I need to connect it to the compositor's logic
Jul 09 11:53:33 <morphis> ok
Jul 09 11:54:30 <morphis> maybe we can get those things working at the end of this week
Jul 09 11:54:35 <Tofe> tonight I'll work more on the QML/Compositor binding, for Add and Delete
Jul 09 11:55:28 <morphis> also on bringing one app into the foreground?
Jul 09 11:57:30 <Tofe> well, why not, it doesn't seem so difficult
Jul 09 11:57:54 <morphis> that would be great
Jul 09 11:59:01 <Tofe> one quick way to do it is to enlarge the active delegate until we get fullscreen. I'll have to make so that the cards keep the window aspect ratio.
Jul 09 12:02:04 <Tofe> Also I'll be on vacation a bit from 11th to 16th, but I should be able to keep working on the QML side here and there :)
Jul 09 12:05:39 <morphis> Tofe: ok
Jul 09 16:44:16 <morphis> JaMa: can you ping me once you have qt 5.1 in meta-qt5?
Jul 09 19:33:17 <Tofe> morphis: I realize that in the end, I will remove 90% of the Compositor content
Jul 09 19:34:20 <morphis> Tofe: you mean of the example code we imported?
Jul 09 19:34:34 <Tofe> yes
Jul 09 19:35:11 <Tofe> I'll just try to keep the window list, and even that I'm not sure :) But it will be handy to have an example of a window container
Jul 09 19:36:29 <morphis> Tofe: no problem for me :)
Jul 09 19:37:48 <morphis> and even the window list we will move to C++ later
Jul 09 19:39:02 <Tofe> Yes, currently I'm just creating a little "Compositor" component, which isn't a graphical element, to regroup the window list management
Jul 09 19:39:15 <Tofe> It will be trivial to port it to C++
Jul 09 19:46:00 <morphis> Tofe: so you're not reusing the existing Compositor.js?
Jul 09 19:48:40 <morphis> Tofe: btw. if you want to build for a device with wayland+luna-next just pull my morphis/work branch for meta-wop
Jul 09 19:50:34 <morphis> qt4 stuff is already dropped and will not be build with a webos-ports-dev-image
Jul 09 19:52:57 <Tofe> morphis: well, compositor.js is mainly here to provide some twm-like window manager, if we just keep the window list it's getting a bit ridiculous :)
Jul 09 19:53:10 <Tofe> morphis: ok, I take note for the device build
Jul 09 19:57:16 <Herrie> Just for my curiosity: Morphis & Jama: You guys were both(?) working on SHR, is WOP now your new "pet project" or these go in parallel?
Jul 09 20:07:50 <morphis> Herrie: yes, you're right we work both on SHR
Jul 09 20:08:02 <morphis> SHR is mostly "death"
Jul 09 20:08:31 <Herrie> Got some other questions as well: Allowing QML apps on WOP, would that mean we could use some of the Maemo apps? Was also wondering if you guys have looked at the recent Ubuntu developments with Android via XLC. Any plans for this on WOP? http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=90631
Jul 09 20:08:54 <morphis> XLC?
Jul 09 20:09:42 <morphis> Herrie: you mean lxc, right?
Jul 09 20:09:49 <Herrie> Ehm yes ;)
Jul 09 20:10:00 <Herrie> Just wondering if that's on your wish list or to-do list?
Jul 09 20:10:05 <morphis> Herrie: there are mostly two ways to utilize libhybris
Jul 09 20:10:13 <morphis> one way is using a container for android
Jul 09 20:10:20 <morphis> thats what Ubuntu is doing
Jul 09 20:10:40 <morphis> wop and Mer (Jolla) are having the android things next to each other in the same rootfs
Jul 09 20:11:03 <morphis> we have this already for quite long
Jul 09 20:11:04 <Herrie> OK
Jul 09 20:11:21 <morphis> it's just a technical decision if you go the lxc or the same-rootfs way
Jul 09 20:11:35 <Herrie> Would it then be possible to run Android apps somehow sometime from within WOP?
Jul 09 20:11:48 <morphis> possible is everything :)
Jul 09 20:12:03 <Herrie> Yeha I know, enough time, money and resources ;)
Jul 09 20:12:06 <morphis> theoretically, yes
Jul 09 20:12:33 <Herrie> You believe Mer or Ubuntu will have anything that could be used?
Jul 09 20:12:41 <morphis> but the android environment we and Ubuntu are using isn't shipping any java binaries
Jul 09 20:12:52 <morphis> Herrie: for running Android apps?
Jul 09 20:13:41 <morphis> Herrie: we're code sharing with Ubuntu/Mer for quite some time now
Jul 09 20:13:59 <Herrie> Yes for running Android apps. I don't like Android one bit but I doubt all apps would ever come to WOP, so some would be good to have. And I don't care about games, just simple "apps" with little to no fancy graphics ;)
Jul 09 20:14:06 <morphis> for example all three of us are using the same code for ofono to utilize the android telephony daemon
Jul 09 20:14:32 <morphis> Herrie: for Ubuntu I don't know if they plan anything to ship in this direction but Jolla will
Jul 09 20:15:19 <morphis> Herrie: Jolla is using http://www.myriadgroup.com/device-solutions/device-software/myriad%20alien%20dalvik.aspx for this
Jul 09 20:15:28 <Herrie> Understood that for Jolla but it won't be an open source solution from what I read?
Jul 09 20:15:32 <morphis> yes
Jul 09 20:15:36 <morphis> it's commercial only
Jul 09 20:15:43 <morphis> and works without libhybris etc.
Jul 09 20:16:06 <morphis> there is also http://thp.io/2012/apkenv/ which is a libhybris based solution to run android native games
Jul 09 20:17:17 <morphis> Herrie: but we're working on getting QML apps working next to the webos ones in wop
Jul 09 20:17:50 <morphis> we wont provide the same API than for example Ubuntu but will share everything which is brought to the Qt framework
Jul 09 20:18:00 <morphis> s/to/through/
Jul 09 20:18:50 <morphis> Herrie: the most important point for me with all this is, that we can easily move on to what ever android device we want
Jul 09 20:19:01 <morphis> with just some small amount of work
Jul 09 20:19:20 <morphis> which is a message we didn't clearly delivered in the past
Jul 09 20:20:06 <morphis> Herrie|1982: so atleast through QML we will be able to reuse apps written for Mer/Salifish or Ubuntu Touch
Jul 09 20:38:27 <Herrie|1982> Great on QML re-use. Enyo is great as well :)
Jul 09 20:38:57 <Herrie|1982> Might be useful for the other platforms as well. Enyo2 is a lot quicker compared to 1
Jul 09 20:39:10 <morphis> Herrie|1982: yes
Jul 09 20:39:17 <morphis> primary focus will be web apps
Jul 09 20:40:00 <JaMa> morphis: sure, will ping you with 5.1.
Jul 09 20:40:38 <morphis> JaMa: great
Jul 09 20:42:06 <morphis> Herrie|1982: but all this needs more helpful hands
Jul 09 20:42:33 <Herrie|1982> I'm very crappy programmer, can help with Wiki, but it's been a long time since I created anything good code wise :(
Jul 09 20:43:03 <morphis> Herrie|1982: wiki is completely fine and is really important!
Jul 09 20:43:06 <Herrie|1982> Even struggling with Enyo apps and all new bits, last time I did HTML, JS, CSS was with Firefox 3 and IE6 somewhere 6 or so years ago ;)
Jul 09 20:43:10 <morphis> as we need to group the community
Jul 09 20:43:18 <morphis> :)
Jul 09 20:43:27 <morphis> Herrie|1982: how far are you with the wiki?
Jul 09 20:43:30 <Herrie|1982> Wife will be gone for 2 weeks soon so I'll have time to work on it hopefully
Jul 09 20:43:41 <Herrie|1982> Been away for a month in the meanwhile, didn't help...
Jul 09 20:43:56 <Herrie|1982> And last couple of weeks work was very busy, but should get better from the weekend onwards :)
Jul 09 20:44:37 <Herrie|1982> Need to get rid of a lot of CM specific stuff, add some images, tweaks bits here and there etc
Jul 09 20:45:04 <Herrie|1982> Pretty much clones the whole CM device stuff they have going on including filter etc, looks nice, just need to make it WOP specific
Jul 09 20:45:11 <Herrie|1982> And organize the pages a bit more
Jul 09 20:45:22 <morphis> ok
Jul 09 20:45:41 <Herrie|1982> http://webos-ports.org/wiki/New_Page
Jul 09 20:45:47 <Herrie|1982> Have this as a starter page
Jul 09 20:45:52 <Herrie|1982> And will link lots from there
Jul 09 20:46:23 <Herrie|1982> Still too much CM stuff in there but wanted to get it working first before modifying
Jul 09 20:51:06 <morphis> Herrie|1982: looks quite nice
Jul 09 20:52:34 <Herrie|1982> YEah but needs lots of work still
Jul 09 20:52:55 <Herrie|1982> See what we need from CM bits, I'm sure lots is useful, customize it, add custom bits we need for device templates etc
Jul 09 20:53:05 <Herrie|1982> But I liked their device dropdown, it's nice :)
Jul 09 20:53:45 <Herrie|1982> Anyway off now, till later ;)
Jul 09 21:04:03 <morphis> Herrie|1982: bye
Jul 09 23:21:02 <LarrySteeze> Herrie|1982: ping!
Jul 09 23:28:17 <Darakian> pong
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed Jul 10 02:59:59 2013