**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 01 02:59:57 2010
Apr 01 04:26:08 <swisstomcat> morning
Apr 01 04:26:32 <LoneStar99> morning swisstomcat
Apr 01 04:26:39 <swisstomcat> hey lonestar
Apr 01 04:44:03 <BigBiff_> check
Apr 01 04:44:09 <BigBiff_> good
Apr 01 04:44:33 <BigBiff_> whos ready to play answer simple questions for Biff?
Apr 01 04:44:37 <BigBiff_> YAY
Apr 01 04:44:51 <BigBiff_> its a fad sweeping the country
Apr 01 04:45:05 <Dave__> looks like it
Apr 01 04:45:48 <BigBiff_> heh
Apr 01 04:45:58 <BigBiff_> http://pastie.org/898389
Apr 01 04:46:05 <BigBiff_> basic js prototype
Apr 01 04:46:12 <BigBiff_> that i cant get my head around
Apr 01 04:46:39 <BigBiff_> questions are //
Apr 01 04:46:53 <BigBiff_> crap, the baby's awake
Apr 01 04:56:28 <LoneStar99> BigBiff_: why are you trying to reference the "setTimeout function" for?
Apr 01 05:00:47 <BigBiff_> in the cleartimeout
Apr 01 05:01:52 <LoneStar99> sorry to prompt something to the user?
Apr 01 05:04:04 <BigBiff_> no, i just see in rhe logs that the timeout remains active
Apr 01 05:04:40 <BigBiff_> hoping to kill it onsuccess
Apr 01 05:05:42 <BigBiff_> not that necessary, im just tryin to learn how
Apr 01 05:08:09 <BigBiff_> wow its hard to type while feeding a baby
Apr 01 05:08:52 <LoneStar99> sure it is
Apr 01 05:10:10 <BigBiff_> did u see my other questions? the diff in .hide() and mojo.stop()?
Apr 01 05:10:25 <BigBiff_> why () is necessary for one in a conditional, and not the other?
Apr 01 05:11:09 <BigBiff_> that has to be a dumb question, i can just feel it
Apr 01 05:11:21 <BigBiff_> the newbness surrounds me
Apr 01 05:13:03 <LoneStar99> let me see
Apr 01 05:15:01 <sugardave> hide() is a method, but start is a property, would be my guess
Apr 01 05:15:31 <LoneStar99> yeah hide() is part of prototype
Apr 01 05:15:33 <sugardave> but it should be mojo.start(), huh?
Apr 01 05:15:59 <LoneStar99> http://www.prototypejs.org/api/element/hide
Apr 01 05:18:40 <sugardave> BigBiff_: actually, line 19 is bad...you are checking the non-existence of a return value of a method call...it looks like you just want to see if that is hidden
Apr 01 05:18:45 <sugardave> or not
Apr 01 05:19:09 <sugardave> if (!$('results').hidden)  ....I think
Apr 01 05:19:15 <sugardave> or visible
Apr 01 05:25:40 <noaXess> good morning
Apr 01 05:25:48 <noaXess> hey sugardave.. still here?
Apr 01 05:29:55 <swisstomcat> morning noaXess
Apr 01 05:30:13 <sugardave> noaXess: for a minute or two...about to go to bed
Apr 01 05:30:26 <noaXess> hey swisstomcat
Apr 01 05:30:36 <swisstomcat> snowing like crazy here
Apr 01 05:30:46 <noaXess> yes.. here too.
Apr 01 05:30:51 <noaXess> sugardave: where are you from?
Apr 01 05:31:22 <sugardave> I live in Texas....it's not snowing here :D
Apr 01 05:31:31 <BigBiff_> sugardave:i was toggling that div
Apr 01 05:31:44 <sugardave> BigBiff_: ah, so that's on purpose
Apr 01 05:31:55 <BigBiff_> ya
Apr 01 05:31:58 <noaXess> sugardave: your luck.. :)
Apr 01 05:32:02 <sugardave> got it
Apr 01 05:33:16 <sugardave> noaXess: well, it NEVER snows here...would be nice to see it once in a while :D
Apr 01 05:33:19 <swisstomcat> hey ron_frown
Apr 01 05:33:22 <ron_frown> hola
Apr 01 05:33:23 <ron_frown> whats up
Apr 01 05:36:14 <BigBiff_> ok, so to clarify before i go to bed
Apr 01 05:36:45 <noaXess> sugardave: just come to switzerland from november to march.. then you will see/have snow.. visit us, swisstomcat and myself will be happy ;)
Apr 01 05:37:07 <BigBiff_> hide() is a _________, so () are necessary in a conditional
Apr 01 05:37:08 <swisstomcat> yeah, we can make a swiss developer day in the snow
Apr 01 05:37:38 <noaXess> you mean a swiss developer week, if sugardave visits us.. :)..
Apr 01 05:37:42 <BigBiff_> whereas mojo.start is a _________, so () are omitted in a conditional
Apr 01 05:38:00 <sugardave> noaXess: definitely if I come to Switzerland I will let y'all know :D
Apr 01 05:38:20 <sugardave> BigBiff_: need to verify that start one
Apr 01 05:38:30 <sugardave> it seems that should be a method, too?
Apr 01 05:38:35 <BigBiff_> well the script works
Apr 01 05:38:35 <sugardave> hang on a second
Apr 01 05:38:50 <BigBiff_> i trial and errored it 400 times in 400 different ways
Apr 01 05:39:01 <noaXess> .. can we talk here about early releases/prereleases of webos?
Apr 01 05:39:08 <BigBiff_> i just dont get why it works
Apr 01 05:39:13 <rwhitby> noaXess: nope
Apr 01 05:39:24 <noaXess> rwhitby: ok.. wher to give feedback?
Apr 01 05:39:35 <rwhitby> noaXess: in the early access forum on developer.palm.com
Apr 01 05:39:36 <noaXess> in the forum? or is there a special place?
Apr 01 05:39:41 <swisstomcat> hey rwhitby
Apr 01 05:39:43 <noaXess> oka rwhitby thanks.
Apr 01 05:39:59 <swisstomcat> rwhitby: still no paid apps for us swiss people :(
Apr 01 05:40:08 * rwhitby wasn't aware there was a new early access available now that 1.4.1 is released ...
Apr 01 05:41:09 <sugardave> BigBiff_: mojo.start() is indeed a method
Apr 01 05:41:45 <sugardave> if there is no start _property_ (that's without ()s), then it will always be undefined/false
Apr 01 05:44:32 <BigBiff_> so what's the correct way to say "if that there spinner thingy is spinnin, then stop it!"
Apr 01 05:45:09 <sugardave> BigBiff_: check the model property 'spinning'
Apr 01 05:45:27 <BigBiff_> hehe, i have
Apr 01 05:45:34 <sugardave> http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1931&Itemid=239
Apr 01 05:47:37 <sugardave> BigBiff_: it is also possible to change that string via attribute property
Apr 01 05:47:45 <chuqui> well, heck. I think that's a wrap for tonight.
Apr 01 05:47:45 <sugardave> did you do that?
Apr 01 05:47:52 <swisstomcat> hey chuq
Apr 01 05:48:05 <chuqui> started sometime about, oh, 5:30. I love launch days.
Apr 01 05:48:14 <sugardave> good job
Apr 01 05:48:19 <BigBiff__> sugardave: so the fact that my script works is just dumb luck then
Apr 01 05:48:31 <BigBiff__> hehe
Apr 01 05:48:50 <swisstomcat> good job and good night, chuq
Apr 01 05:49:08 <sugardave> BigBiff__: well, it means most of your code is good...that condition is always evaluating to false
Apr 01 05:49:08 <chuqui> I'll pass the word to the people who did the heavy lifting.
Apr 01 05:49:46 <swisstomcat> must have been a crazy day
Apr 01 05:49:53 <sugardave> BigBiff__: I'd be more interested in finding out why you're not getting the correct state of the spinning property
Apr 01 05:50:20 <BigBiff__> i know - i've tried it a dozen times now (why i keep disconnecting
Apr 01 05:50:28 <BigBiff__> spinner shuts off after 5 secs
Apr 01 05:50:45 <BigBiff__> without me defining and changing the model
Apr 01 05:50:50 <BigBiff__> i like it
Apr 01 05:50:55 <BigBiff__> heh
Apr 01 05:51:27 <swisstomcat> that's strange
Apr 01 05:51:33 <BigBiff__> the lazy/ignorant guide to writing code
Apr 01 05:51:36 <sugardave> yeah, I think spinner is automatic if you don't define the stuff
Apr 01 05:51:54 <sugardave> it's the only one/one of a couple
Apr 01 05:52:03 <BigBiff__> i have no atts or model
Apr 01 05:52:09 <sugardave> right
Apr 01 05:52:49 <BigBiff__> one thing to check
Apr 01 05:52:54 <sugardave> in that case, you should try to see what's in it: Object.toJSON(theSpinner); to some div
Apr 01 05:53:03 <sugardave> and see what 'spinning' says, if it exists
Apr 01 05:53:24 <BigBiff__> i've never done that
Apr 01 05:53:45 <sugardave> easy as pie
Apr 01 05:53:51 <BigBiff__> (4 more hours of research? :()
Apr 01 05:53:54 <BigBiff__> ok
Apr 01 05:54:23 <sugardave> put something like <div id='debug'></div> in your scene html
Apr 01 05:55:18 <sugardave> and then you can do:   $('debug').update(Object.toJSON(theSpinner));
Apr 01 05:56:03 <sugardave> it's hard to read on the screen, so you can also log it
Apr 01 06:04:06 <BigBiff__> hmm, i got nothin
Apr 01 06:06:29 <BigBiff__> a well im off to bed
Apr 01 06:42:10 <zefanjas> hello...anyone else have problems with strings.json since 1.4.1? My Apps won't start. "error: Uncaught SyntaxError: Badly formed JSON string".
Apr 01 07:36:36 <swisstomcat> zefanjas: had the same problem
Apr 01 07:36:55 <swisstomcat> there must be an error in your json somewhere
Apr 01 07:37:08 <swisstomcat> use this: http://www.jsonlint.com/ to find it
Apr 01 07:37:23 <zefanjas> swisstomcat, I check my strings.json and solved the problem: I missed one "," ;)
Apr 01 07:37:41 <swisstomcat> yeah, me too
Apr 01 07:37:54 <zefanjas> take this: http://json.parser.online.fr/
Apr 01 09:12:36 <loic_m> hello. someone could explain me what is exactly required when signup on dpc, when it is ask "Name on Tax Return" ?
Apr 01 09:13:49 <swisstomcat> if you don't have a company then it's your own name, loic
Apr 01 09:24:18 <loic_m> i have a company
Apr 01 09:25:55 <loic_m> it's the company name ?
Apr 01 10:13:09 <doohan> hmm
Apr 01 10:13:17 <doohan> THe app catalog needs visa or master card :(
Apr 01 10:13:28 <doohan> That's a bit poop
Apr 01 10:17:19 <swisstomcat> loic_m: in that case it must be the company name
Apr 01 11:33:01 <Toaster> -.-
Apr 01 11:33:15 <Toaster> wrong chan^^
Apr 01 13:56:54 <Kuraiou> nyarrrr.
Apr 01 16:04:57 <halfhalo_T400> ello everybody!
Apr 01 16:07:03 <halfhalo_T400> Sooo...  I think I want a pre plus on verizon
Apr 01 16:07:10 <halfhalo_T400> maybe to replace my dads curve
Apr 01 16:07:23 <gkatsev> free tethering now
Apr 01 16:07:31 <halfhalo_T400> thats why
Apr 01 16:07:47 <gkatsev> but no 1.4.1.1 for like at least a week? wtf with that?
Apr 01 16:08:04 <halfhalo_T400> Meh, Verizon has a poor update history
Apr 01 16:08:21 <Toaster> god damnd...i hope this update is just april fools... -.-
Apr 01 16:08:24 <gkatsev> they got 1.4 within like a day...
Apr 01 16:08:30 <halfhalo_T400> Not really
Apr 01 16:08:41 <sugardave> ?
Apr 01 16:08:42 <halfhalo_T400> I think the reason 1.4 was delayed so was due to verizon
Apr 01 16:09:01 <sugardave> what are you talking about Toaster?
Apr 01 16:10:21 <Toaster> todays update in germany, it really fucked my pre up...it said it's only updating the appcat, but none of my patches work, i can neither de- nor reinstall them, and additionally it reboots like every 30 minutes...
Apr 01 16:10:34 <sugardave> oh, lameness
Apr 01 16:10:45 <halfhalo_T400> yeah.... I think it got messed up
Apr 01 16:11:36 <Bmyers> sugardave: you do php?
Apr 01 16:11:46 * halfhalo_T400 likes php
Apr 01 16:12:01 <halfhalo_T400> phpinfo();
Apr 01 16:12:15 <sugardave> I do php to the extent that I can make sql queries and return JSON :D
Apr 01 16:12:17 <halfhalo_T400> now, if this was a php server, that would work
Apr 01 16:12:25 <Toaster> mh...i guess I'll use my old siemens s65 for a few days...
Apr 01 16:12:38 <Bmyers> yeah i am trying to return a json but just a scalar value, not an array
Apr 01 16:12:55 <halfhalo_T400> oh, oh, oh, I have a function that I use for that
Apr 01 16:13:01 <halfhalo_T400> works for everything
Apr 01 16:13:06 <sugardave> php 5.something has json_encode()
Apr 01 16:13:15 <halfhalo_T400> single values, arrays, multidimentional arrays....
Apr 01 16:13:26 <Bmyers> can u pastebin it or something?
Apr 01 16:13:28 <sugardave> but I think you have to do '(' . yourVar . ')' to make it work right
Apr 01 16:13:42 <halfhalo_T400> If the php page would load I would
Apr 01 16:14:35 <halfhalo_T400> Really computer... your going to make me hunt for the file....
Apr 01 16:16:12 <halfhalo_T400> hmmmmmm
Apr 01 16:16:28 <halfhalo_T400> loading... loading... loading...
Apr 01 16:16:41 <halfhalo_T400> http://pastie.org/899040
Apr 01 16:16:56 <sugardave> Bmyers: scratch that...I use json_encode on straight up PHP vars with no problem, but I'm usually dealing with arrays
Apr 01 16:17:03 <halfhalo_T400> All the white space is due to my editor
Apr 01 16:17:18 <Bmyers> thx, i'll check it out
Apr 01 16:17:21 <halfhalo_T400> likes to change newlines to carriage returns to newlines
Apr 01 16:17:50 <halfhalo_T400> It basically is a beefed up version of json_encode
Apr 01 16:18:07 <halfhalo_T400> and yes, it does work with single vars
Apr 01 16:18:14 <halfhalo_T400> sorta
Apr 01 16:18:37 <Bmyers> sounds solid..
Apr 01 16:18:42 <halfhalo_T400> I usually make a new array, then go $arr['value']="bleh" and use that
Apr 01 16:18:51 <halfhalo_T400> gives you the hash and the value
Apr 01 16:26:11 <sugardave> so what we're hearing from others is "don't update to 1.4.1.1 yet?"
Apr 01 16:30:03 <halfhalo_T400> no idea
Apr 01 16:30:12 <halfhalo_T400> but my internet is being slow again
Apr 01 16:34:31 <LoneStar99> hallo peeps
Apr 01 16:34:43 <halfhalo_T400> hola
Apr 01 16:39:48 <sugardave> erg, have to reboot
Apr 01 16:40:29 <halfhalo_T400> i should reboot to... buuuuttttt
Apr 01 16:43:17 <LoneStar99> my computer reboots for me
Apr 01 16:43:34 <halfhalo_T400> mine doesn't
Apr 01 16:43:36 <halfhalo_T400> I just close it
Apr 01 16:43:50 <halfhalo_T400> and after a month or so it slows down
Apr 01 16:47:07 <halfhalo_T400> I hate this wifi
Apr 01 16:51:24 <LoneStar99> i am assuming mine is set to install updates automatically
Apr 01 16:51:52 <halfhalo_T400> So is mine, but its usually asleep at 3am
Apr 01 16:52:05 <xota> hi! how can I activate landscape mode in my scene?
Apr 01 16:53:12 <LoneStar99> halfhalo_T400: does yours restart automatically? cuss i can have tons of stuff open, then i wake up and everything is gone
Apr 01 16:53:35 <halfhalo_T400> If its awake it does, but not when its asleep
Apr 01 16:53:57 <halfhalo_T400> Every month or so I just have it restart while I get a drink or a snack
Apr 01 16:54:23 <LoneStar99> oh perhaps, mine never goes into sleep mode - hence restarting itself...
Apr 01 16:54:32 <halfhalo_T400> yeah
Apr 01 16:57:10 <LoneStar99> so if i leave my laptop on without closing it, it will never go into sleep-mode?
Apr 01 16:58:01 <halfhalo_T400> It depends on power settings
Apr 01 16:58:16 <halfhalo_T400> I have a powerplan that doesn't go to sleep, along with some that doe
Apr 01 16:58:18 <halfhalo_T400> do
Apr 01 17:00:35 <LoneStar99> weird, my laptop is set to sleep after an hour, but still restarts itself....
Apr 01 17:02:32 <SimpsonCH> hi all ( again )
Apr 01 17:02:37 <LoneStar99> hwody
Apr 01 17:02:51 <SimpsonCH> is there any good reason why maps doesn't support KML files ?
Apr 01 17:11:02 <halfhalo_class> my god this computer is taking a long time to start
Apr 01 17:14:58 <LoneStar99> anyone know of any image analysis projects out their?
Apr 01 17:18:33 <halfhalo_class> no, but it would be kickass to have one built into webos for use in mojo
Apr 01 17:20:51 <LoneStar99> yeah
Apr 01 17:22:11 <halfhalo_class> Just be like "Mojo, what the hell be that."  and it goes "That be a dog"
Apr 01 17:22:45 <LoneStar99> lol
Apr 01 17:23:05 <halfhalo_class> OR, if we are being serious, two simple things would be facial recognizion in the camera/pic/video apps (which would be supercool by the way) and barcode crap
Apr 01 17:24:12 <LoneStar99> looking into developing some sort of image analysis tool
Apr 01 17:24:20 <halfhalo_class> using pdk?
Apr 01 17:24:51 <LoneStar99> well, for now it would be server-based
Apr 01 17:25:25 <LoneStar99> but since PDK runs on C/C++ it could probably be compatible
Apr 01 17:25:32 <LoneStar99> with some tweaking
Apr 01 17:26:17 <halfhalo_class> yeah
Apr 01 17:26:24 <SimpsonCH> is there a way/sample to show extra info on maps ??
Apr 01 17:27:06 <LoneStar99> SimpsonCH: what  map api?
Apr 01 17:27:26 <SimpsonCH> LoneStar99, yeah I have some data in KML I want to show
Apr 01 17:27:42 <SimpsonCH> but if needed I'll use a API
Apr 01 17:32:39 <LoneStar99> kml is google stuff right?
Apr 01 17:33:05 <SimpsonCH> yup, map layer
Apr 01 17:33:17 <SimpsonCH> works with standard googlemaps, but seems not to work with webos
Apr 01 17:34:37 <LoneStar99> trying to think who has worked with maps on webos...
Apr 01 17:41:47 <noradtux> hi
Apr 01 17:42:02 <noradtux> does someone know a way to play sound over a bluetooth handsfree-set in a car? and no, it does not understand a2dp ;)
Apr 01 18:17:03 <swisstomcat> rehi
Apr 01 18:18:11 * SimpsonCH can't believe there is no way to display extra data on maps !
Apr 01 18:19:42 <pandora--> there's not?
Apr 01 18:19:45 <lemketron-afk> SimpsonCH: Really? Check out Foursquare
Apr 01 18:19:55 <lemketron> It's open-source even.
Apr 01 18:20:02 <swisstomcat> hey lemketron
Apr 01 18:20:08 <lemketron> (uh-oh)
Apr 01 18:20:14 <swisstomcat> things quieting down again after the big day?
Apr 01 18:20:29 <lemketron> not really... usual next-day fallout
Apr 01 18:20:47 <lemketron> though it's better that we released on a Wednesday this time, since usually it's Friday which goofs up my weekend.
Apr 01 18:21:09 <swisstomcat> tell me something .. why this sudden rush with 1.4.1 suddenly .. i never heard that it was coming with the international app release?
Apr 01 18:21:18 <swisstomcat> friday is easter friday here
Apr 01 18:21:23 <swisstomcat> no work :)
Apr 01 18:21:52 <pandora--> swisstomcat: i bet i could pull that off, i work for an israeli company
Apr 01 18:22:04 <lemketron> sudden rush?  1.4.1 was in the early-access program for a few weeks
Apr 01 18:22:04 <swisstomcat> heh
Apr 01 18:22:46 <swisstomcat> lemketron: i mean the rush to release it. it was never mentioned that it has something to do with the international app release (that is was necessary for it)
Apr 01 18:23:18 <lemketron> where would you have expected it to have been "mentioned" since we don't typically pre-announce upcoming releases?
Apr 01 18:23:20 <swisstomcat> i thought 1.4.1 was just a bug-fix release of 1.4 and had nothing to do with the international app
Apr 01 18:23:55 <lemketron> Hmmm.  I dunno how that all worked out, really.  I suspect there were changes on the server side, and probably changes needed on the device too.
Apr 01 18:24:03 <swisstomcat> did the early access developers know that it was tied to the international apps release?
Apr 01 18:25:05 <swisstomcat> for me it looked like march 31st is international app release day. and then on march 31th rumours began to spring up about 1.4.1 coming out
Apr 01 18:26:53 <swisstomcat> probably needed changes on the device that was not foreseen
Apr 01 18:26:58 <doohan> I was going to try buy an app but the blasted thing won't take maestro :(
Apr 01 18:27:25 * SimpsonCH just updated the emulator to 1.4....
Apr 01 18:27:31 <SimpsonCH> now I need to start over again /
Apr 01 18:27:32 <SimpsonCH> ?
Apr 01 18:27:44 <swisstomcat> start over with what?
Apr 01 18:28:01 <lemketron> Just because rumors didn't appear until the 31st doesn't mean 1.4.1 was "rushed".  :-)
Apr 01 18:28:03 <SimpsonCH> installing the emulator, since a new version is out ;)
Apr 01 18:28:19 <SimpsonCH> anyway no phone yet anyway
Apr 01 18:28:37 <swisstomcat> lemketron: that's just the way it appeared to the outside with no other information ... i was just curious :)
Apr 01 18:29:52 <lemketron> I'm just saying, in general, ideally people don't know there's a new release coming until it appears.  That's why they call earlier information "rumors".  :-)
Apr 01 18:30:29 <lemketron> Developers in the early-access program often do know in advance, though they don't know when it will be released, and they're under NDA so they aren't supposed to talk about it except in a private forum.
Apr 01 18:30:39 <swisstomcat> true
Apr 01 18:30:48 * halfhalo_class feels better after his little rant
Apr 01 18:31:05 * lemketron scrolls back
Apr 01 18:31:20 <swisstomcat> must have been a silent rant :)
Apr 01 18:32:16 <swisstomcat> o2 germany startet tweeting about the upcoming release a few hours before it happened
Apr 01 18:32:29 <swisstomcat> precentral was going wild too just a few hours before
Apr 01 18:32:54 <Toaster> swisstomcat: is it useably for you?
Apr 01 18:32:57 <swisstomcat> with all that it seemed (to the outside) that it was rushed
Apr 01 18:33:04 <lemketron> halfhalo: error: rant not found
Apr 01 18:33:08 <halfhalo_class> it was a rant in internals
Apr 01 18:33:19 <swisstomcat> toaster: what is?
Apr 01 18:33:21 <lemketron> ah, channel mismatch error
Apr 01 18:33:26 <halfhalo_class> actually, it was more of a "what I think webos should have" rant
Apr 01 18:33:40 <halfhalo_class> and I am very specific in what I think it should have
Apr 01 18:34:07 <swisstomcat> (08:17:46 PM) halfhalo_class: Mojo filesystem support, two new notification types, mtp, device stage, and custom desktop app
Apr 01 18:34:07 <swisstomcat> (08:18:21 PM) halfhalo_class: oh, and usb host mode to go along with filesystem support, along with ftp, sshfs, smb
Apr 01 18:34:30 <Toaster> sorry, when i first asked no one replyed helpfull, you nick sounds like you're from europe, so i wanted to ask if the update works for you, because my pre really got fucked up...
Apr 01 18:34:32 <halfhalo_class> ^^ that, and then I sorta ranted on as to how I think they should be set up
Apr 01 18:34:58 <swisstomcat> toaster: the update worked for me .. but no paid apps .. that's another story tho :(
Apr 01 18:35:53 <Toaster> mhk...when i updated, all my patches didn't work anymore and i neither was able to deinstall them nor to reinstall, and additionally it reboots like every 30 minutes...
Apr 01 18:36:35 <halfhalo_class> Because seriously, its 2010.  EVERY device needs a windows 7 device stage
Apr 01 18:36:47 <swisstomcat> what for? :)
Apr 01 18:37:12 <LoneStar99> windows 7 device stage, what is that?
Apr 01 18:37:17 <halfhalo_class> Its just pretty.  AND it can tell Windows what formats it supports so wmp can convert it before syncing
Apr 01 18:37:37 <halfhalo_class> http://windowsteamblog.com/blogs/windowsexperience/archive/2009/01/08/device-stage-a-new-way-of-interacting-with-devices-in-windows-7.aspx
Apr 01 18:38:03 <halfhalo_class> and seriously, why no mtp support
Apr 01 18:38:20 <halfhalo_class> having to throw the pre into usb mode sucks epicly
Apr 01 18:38:35 <halfhalo_class> mtp would solve that and make it much more appealing
Apr 01 18:38:40 <swisstomcat> toaster: i've seen one random reboot so far
Apr 01 18:38:55 <halfhalo_class> nevermind every other newish smartphone os supports it or something like it
Apr 01 18:39:12 <Toaster> swisstomcat: mh, k...thx although
Apr 01 18:39:55 <swisstomcat> haven't used it enough too yet
Apr 01 18:40:01 <maik> it's still dumb they removed the webcam viewer
Apr 01 18:40:39 <swisstomcat> hmm, now i have a constantly light up center button .. that's new
Apr 01 18:40:53 <halfhalo_class> that happens sometimes to me
Apr 01 18:40:59 <lemketron> Hey, anyone tried the new host mode in the 1.4.1 emulator yet?
Apr 01 18:41:06 <halfhalo_class> nein
Apr 01 18:41:12 <lemketron> Or suspend/resume (which works now, but didn't get included in the release notes)
Apr 01 18:41:12 <swisstomcat> not yet but i want to try it out ... seems like a cool feature
Apr 01 18:41:24 <halfhalo_class> laptop is asleep in backpack right now
Apr 01 18:41:27 <halfhalo_class> using work mbp
Apr 01 18:42:00 * swisstomcat updates sdk
Apr 01 18:45:46 <halfhalo_class> actually, I have more crap to add to my webos wishlist
Apr 01 18:46:45 <halfhalo_class> Namely SIP integration into mojo
Apr 01 18:47:11 <swisstomcat> give us mic access first
Apr 01 18:47:21 <maik> true.
Apr 01 18:47:21 <swisstomcat> and camera while you're at it :)
Apr 01 18:47:23 <halfhalo_class> so you can use skype and whatnot in the phone app instead of the cell modem
Apr 01 18:47:44 <swisstomcat> lots of cool apps with mic access
Apr 01 18:47:49 <halfhalo_class> or give us PTT
Apr 01 18:47:56 <halfhalo_class> The berrys are getting it
Apr 01 18:47:58 <halfhalo_class> we should as well
Apr 01 18:50:16 <halfhalo_class> There is soooooo much webos could be doing to make it miles ahead of everyone else, but right now there are some parts that are just not there even to dumbphone standards
Apr 01 18:50:36 <haeffb_pre> and ice cream. give us ice cream...
Apr 01 18:50:49 <halfhalo_class> Thats a plus
Apr 01 18:51:16 <maik> my Pre is cracked and busted (still working).  i'm waiting for them to release the new "everything we should have included the first time" model
Apr 01 18:51:22 <maik> including a PTT button
Apr 01 18:51:24 * halfhalo_class is going to go crawl back into his corner with his fanciful ideals
Apr 01 18:51:29 <maik> and not shoddy workmanship
Apr 01 18:51:36 <halfhalo_class> hell, ptt can work as it is
Apr 01 18:51:59 * halfhalo_class back into my corner I go
Apr 01 18:57:50 <swisstomcat> lemketron: i just tried host-mode .. very cool
Apr 01 19:00:36 <haeffb_pre> what is host-mode?
Apr 01 19:01:05 <dawm> heh
Apr 01 19:01:06 <swisstomcat> haeffb: display apps in your browser
Apr 01 19:01:13 <dawm> yerp
Apr 01 19:01:18 <swisstomcat> lemketron: there's an error in the docs?
Apr 01 19:02:26 <swisstomcat> the docs say: http://localhost:5580/Apps for 3rd  party applications .. but it's 5581
Apr 01 19:03:01 * halfhalo_class pops his head up, looks around, pops back down
Apr 01 19:03:54 <lemketron> could be; we've had several versions as we've tried various methods of connectivity.
Apr 01 19:04:15 <lemketron> don't miss the big point of all this -- it's so you can run the  webkit "Inspector" on the app.  :-)
Apr 01 19:04:32 <swisstomcat> yeah, it's great!
Apr 01 19:04:41 <swisstomcat> yay for great web developer tools
Apr 01 19:05:25 <swisstomcat> as i said before i really applaud palm taking the web route .. and as we can see with the 800mhz patch, as soon as the hardware catches up it's really fast as well
Apr 01 19:07:47 <maik> there's an 800mhz patch?
Apr 01 19:08:04 <swisstomcat> and a 720mhz too
Apr 01 19:08:11 <maik> how "stable" are they?
Apr 01 19:08:11 <swisstomcat> makes the pre fly
Apr 01 19:08:23 <swisstomcat> surprisingly stable so far
Apr 01 19:08:45 <swisstomcat> apparently 720mhz/800mhz are "official" modes of the processor .. albeit overclocked
Apr 01 19:08:55 <maik> oh interesting...
Apr 01 19:09:04 <maik> are those patches available on preware?
Apr 01 19:09:10 <maik> /in
Apr 01 19:09:18 <swisstomcat> precentral
Apr 01 19:09:35 <swisstomcat> it's not really a patch, it replaces the kernel .. as far as i know
Apr 01 19:09:44 <maik> oh
Apr 01 19:09:58 <swisstomcat> i was using the 720mhz one for a while .. ran great and really fast
Apr 01 19:10:22 <maik> you're running 800 now?
Apr 01 19:10:28 <swisstomcat> back on 500
Apr 01 19:12:31 <maik> any reason?
Apr 01 19:12:56 <swisstomcat> had no time yet to install it again
Apr 01 19:12:57 <haeffb_pre> not yet supported on 1.4.1...?
Apr 01 19:13:04 <maik> ah
Apr 01 19:13:25 <swisstomcat> lemketron: fantastic .. chrome developer tools to poke around in my app
Apr 01 19:14:53 <lemketron> swisstomcat: you betcha!
Apr 01 19:14:56 <kmudrick> hey anyone know when palm usually sends out payment for app sales?
Apr 01 19:15:40 * halfhalo_class pops his head up, looks around, runs quickly to steal lemketron's cookie, and runs back into his cave
Apr 01 19:16:38 <lemketron> swisstomcat: the clock may be programmable to run that fast, but it does exceed the processor's rated max, which is why Palm doesn't (and won't) support it.
Apr 01 19:16:52 <halfhalo_class> as it shouldn't
Apr 01 19:17:02 <halfhalo_class> just like amd/intel don't support oc'ing there
Apr 01 19:17:09 <lemketron> exactly!
Apr 01 19:17:13 <swisstomcat> lemketron: i'm fine with that
Apr 01 19:17:24 <halfhalo_class> BUT locking it down so it is impossible is not the right path either
Apr 01 19:17:37 <lemketron> who said anything about locking it down?
Apr 01 19:17:50 <halfhalo_class> No-one, just throwing it out there
Apr 01 19:18:01 <swisstomcat> lemketron: it was interesting to see how fast webos is with more horsepower .. proving that palm is going the right direction
Apr 01 19:18:05 <halfhalo_class> Remember, I'm crazy
Apr 01 19:18:10 <lemketron> if you like devices that give you more flexibility to do as you wish, tell a friend (or ten) to buy one.  :-)  :-)
Apr 01 19:18:21 <halfhalo_class> I am, oh I am
Apr 01 19:19:03 <halfhalo_class> still want divx though.  If my car can play it my pre should as well
Apr 01 19:19:04 * halfhalo_class pops back into his cave
Apr 01 19:20:34 * halfhalo_class may or may not be in the batcave as well
Apr 01 19:22:28 <halfhalo_class> dunununununununununu BATMAN
Apr 01 19:27:18 <halfhalo_class> I think I killed it
Apr 01 19:27:21 <halfhalo_class> PARTY TIME
Apr 01 19:32:08 * sugardave is trying to figure out how to get mysql server to start on boot.  "Damn annoying, it is."
Apr 01 19:32:21 <halfhalo> what os
Apr 01 19:32:35 <sugardave> ubuntu 9.10, with wlan0 NOT on DHCP
Apr 01 19:32:59 <halfhalo> wait,  it should automagically
Apr 01 19:33:12 <sugardave> yeah, it should.....
Apr 01 19:33:14 <sugardave> bujt it isn't
Apr 01 19:33:16 <Kuraiou> ....
Apr 01 19:33:49 <sugardave> it may be because I removed bind address 127.0.0.1
Apr 01 19:33:58 <sugardave> and the wlan isn't ready yet
Apr 01 19:34:00 <Kuraiou> .... why?
Apr 01 19:34:00 <sugardave> hmm...
Apr 01 19:34:38 <sugardave> Kuraiou: I thought it would be better to listen on my external interface AND I didn't realize I could have more than on bind address listed
Apr 01 19:35:03 <sugardave> I've put it bak, but I don't feel like rebooting again right now :D
Apr 01 19:42:39 <Riekal> There is a way to install a IPK directly from the terminal on the Pre isn't there?
Apr 01 19:42:52 <swisstomcat> yes
Apr 01 19:42:55 <halfhalo> si
Apr 01 19:42:59 <swisstomcat> if you have the sdk installed
Apr 01 19:43:05 <swisstomcat> palm-install xxx.ipk
Apr 01 19:43:18 <swisstomcat> oh, sorry .. misread your question
Apr 01 19:43:57 <halfhalo> on the pre isn't it ipgk install xxx.ipk
Apr 01 19:44:20 <sugardave> dunno, never tried it
Apr 01 19:46:04 <Riekal> I'll try that
Apr 01 19:47:53 <Riekal> Also, is anyone else having issues with some of the feeds in Preware?
Apr 01 19:48:25 <Riekal> I think it's quite annoying that you have to disable each feed one by one to find the feed with the problem.
Apr 01 19:49:03 * sugardave crosses himself and starts downloading 1.4.1.1.
Apr 01 19:49:25 * swisstomcat is disappointed .. no paid apps for me :(
Apr 01 19:49:39 <sugardave> lame
Apr 01 19:50:02 <swisstomcat> oh well
Apr 01 19:50:07 <swisstomcat> what did i expect
Apr 01 19:50:19 <sugardave> saves money that way :D
Apr 01 19:50:36 <Riekal> I have no paid apps either.
Apr 01 19:50:45 <swisstomcat> which country?
Apr 01 19:51:00 <Riekal> Me? USA
Apr 01 19:51:13 <Riekal> I just don't have money haha
Apr 01 19:51:21 <swisstomcat> aha
Apr 01 19:51:30 <Riekal> I have tons available to me
Apr 01 19:51:42 <Riekal> >:( PREWARE!!! AHH
Apr 01 19:52:04 <Riekal> the one feed that I need right now...is down
Apr 01 19:52:16 <sugardave> shit, I can't remember if I have any patches installed
Apr 01 19:52:33 <sugardave> oh yeah I do...the gps radio one
Apr 01 19:52:33 <sugardave> oops
Apr 01 19:53:09 <LoneStar99> swisstomcat: why not paid apps for you?
Apr 01 19:53:19 <swisstomcat> lonestar: switzerland
Apr 01 19:53:34 <LoneStar99> you can't sell apps?
Apr 01 19:53:37 <sugardave> however, isn't the new Preware supposed to automagically update my patches?
Apr 01 19:53:38 <swisstomcat> is not one of the "official" countries
Apr 01 19:53:48 <swisstomcat> i can sell, but not buy
Apr 01 19:53:53 <LoneStar99> oh ok
Apr 01 19:54:30 <sugardave> surely Switzerland will get some app store love at some point....I guess?
Apr 01 19:54:43 <LoneStar99> yeah i am sure
Apr 01 19:54:56 <sugardave> hi dawm
Apr 01 19:55:10 <sugardave> bye dawm
Apr 01 19:55:36 <swisstomcat> sugardave: as soon as we get a carrier for the pre
Apr 01 19:55:42 <sugardave> oh crap, got to reboot anyway
Apr 01 19:55:46 <sugardave> bbl
Apr 01 19:55:53 <swisstomcat> unless palm decides to open up the app store world-wide
Apr 01 19:56:34 <Riekal> Anyone else having issues with the precentral feed?
Apr 01 19:56:55 <swisstomcat> i'd ask in #webos-internals
Apr 01 19:57:04 <Riekal> indeed
Apr 01 20:00:14 <swisstomcat> lonestar99: got some spanish for you .. app review ... Esta be...pero no mata(el so).
Apr 01 20:03:18 <swisstomcat> and everyone try my new beta of animalmemory: http://developer.palm.com/webChannel/index.php?packageid=com.inorbit.animalmemory.beta
Apr 01 20:04:18 <LoneStar99> swisstomcat: yeah email it to diegoATearthoid.com
Apr 01 20:12:27 <swisstomcat> lonestar: the app or the spanish text?
Apr 01 20:12:56 <haeffb_pre> my pre seems snappier with 1.4.1.1
Apr 01 20:14:52 <lemketron> good to hear!
Apr 01 20:15:06 <swisstomcat> i have not noticed :)
Apr 01 20:15:54 <swisstomcat> but i downclocked from 720mhz to 500mhz, that might be why
Apr 01 20:16:24 <halfhalo> Never had the superhighspeed patch, but it seems a little snappier
Apr 01 20:16:54 <LoneStar99> the text
Apr 01 20:17:38 <swisstomcat> lonestar99: it's just "Esta be...pero no mata(el so)."
Apr 01 20:19:52 <LoneStar99> does not make sense
Apr 01 20:20:05 <LoneStar99> what is the english text?
Apr 01 20:20:36 <swisstomcat> it's just that text in the app review
Apr 01 20:23:32 <LoneStar99> is that what someone wrote?
Apr 01 20:24:27 <swisstomcat> yeah
Apr 01 20:24:51 <swisstomcat> doesn't make sense? oh well
Apr 01 20:26:25 <LoneStar99> "Esta be...pero no mata(el so)."?? <-- Is broken makes no sense --> Here "be"... But it kills(the "so")
Apr 01 20:29:38 <LoneStar99> how would the following translate to switch -->  "if(srv == 1 || srv == 5){ } else { }"
Apr 01 20:29:49 <swisstomcat> lonestar99: strange .. maybe a joke review
Apr 01 20:30:11 <LoneStar99> what was the rating 5?
Apr 01 20:31:42 <LoneStar99> can a switch have an or argument?  like "case 4: || case 5:"?
Apr 01 20:32:07 <haeffb_pre> case 4:
Apr 01 20:32:16 <haeffb_pre> case 5:
Apr 01 20:32:23 <haeffb_pre> do stuff
Apr 01 20:32:26 <halfhalo> ^^ what he is saying
Apr 01 20:32:29 <haeffb_pre> break;
Apr 01 20:32:35 <haeffb_pre> default:
Apr 01 20:32:41 <haeffb_pre> do other stuff
Apr 01 20:38:04 <haeffb_pre> next webOS device MUST have autofocus camera.
Apr 01 20:38:21 <halfhalo> AND a bigger screen
Apr 01 20:38:29 <halfhalo> AND...... well, thats all I really want
Apr 01 20:38:53 <haeffb_pre> don't care about screen.
Apr 01 20:39:08 <halfhalo> actually, higher res as well
Apr 01 20:39:09 <haeffb_pre> pre screen is fine
Apr 01 20:39:13 <halfhalo> and let it play hd video
Apr 01 20:39:22 <halfhalo> the chipset is capable of it, so do it
Apr 01 20:39:47 <LoneStar99> so if I want "if(srv == 1 || srv == 5){"  there is not equivlent in switch ?
Apr 01 20:40:14 <sugardave> fall-through with no break...it's dangerous, be careful
Apr 01 20:40:23 <halfhalo> yeah
Apr 01 20:40:23 <LoneStar99> reason, do not want to have to rewrite the same logic in "case 1:" and "case:5"
Apr 01 20:40:46 <halfhalo> fall through case 1 into case 5 and break in there
Apr 01 20:40:46 <sugardave> you just write case 1:, then immediately follow with case 5:
Apr 01 20:41:50 <haeffb_pre> LoneStar99:  I wrote the code for you...
Apr 01 20:42:01 <LoneStar99> sugardave:  "case 1:, case 5: var abc = '123'; break;"
Apr 01 20:42:19 <sugardave> LoneStar99: I think so...not sure about the comma
Apr 01 20:42:30 <haeffb_pre> no comma
Apr 01 20:42:45 <LoneStar99> oh ok, cool let me test it out
Apr 01 20:42:46 <LoneStar99> brb
Apr 01 20:42:55 <halfhalo> DAMMIT
Apr 01 20:43:02 <halfhalo> even the htc desire has divx
Apr 01 20:43:05 * sugardave dams it.
Apr 01 20:43:08 <halfhalo> WHY DOES THE PRE NOT HAVE DIVX
Apr 01 20:43:11 <halfhalo> !!!!
Apr 01 20:43:40 <haeffb_pre> international trade agreements?
Apr 01 20:43:49 <halfhalo> Bull
Apr 01 20:43:53 <haeffb_pre> alien conspiracy?
Apr 01 20:43:58 <sugardave> ah, home alone, time for some more uninterrupted gaming
Apr 01 20:44:00 <sugardave> bbl
Apr 01 20:44:12 <haeffb_pre> mandate from the Gods of warpdesign ?
Apr 01 20:44:13 <halfhalo> semi acceptable excuse
Apr 01 20:44:45 <haeffb_pre> War
Apr 01 20:45:56 <LoneStar99> divx embargo...
Apr 01 20:46:06 <swisstomcat> good night everyone
Apr 01 20:46:11 <halfhalo> night
Apr 01 20:46:13 <LoneStar99> laters swisstomcat
Apr 01 20:46:25 <halfhalo> and if htc can do it, so can palm
Apr 01 20:46:31 <halfhalo> and if windows can do it, so can palm
Apr 01 20:46:40 <halfhalo> and if jvc car stereo's can do it, so can palm
Apr 01 20:47:10 <LoneStar99> yeah divx rules
Apr 01 20:47:18 <LoneStar99> so do mp3s
Apr 01 20:47:51 <halfhalo> heh, I have all my music in aac since my car plays that as well
Apr 01 20:47:55 <Tibfib> hahahaaha hulu http://www.hulu.com/internal/confidential/the-initiative-chapter-1
Apr 01 20:50:26 <LoneStar99> aac is what shoutcast uses right?
Apr 01 20:50:39 <halfhalo> no idea
Apr 01 20:51:01 <LoneStar99> i use the shoutcast api, but do not even know
Apr 01 20:51:04 <LoneStar99> let me see
Apr 01 20:51:44 <LoneStar99> yup shoutcast uses AAC
Apr 01 21:15:45 <dean1012yh> hello everyone. i'm having a problem. I'm new to palm pre development. I have a button. When I tap it, I want to change the value on a label I have. I have created this app using Ares and have used Ares to create the button tap event handler. I then use this.$.mylabel.value = "test"; but when i tap the button, nothing happens. Any ideas?
Apr 01 21:19:31 <LoneStar99> dean1012yh:  u are trying to change the label of what?
Apr 01 21:19:58 <dean1012yh> I have a label I named mylabel. I want to change it's text
Apr 01 21:19:59 <LoneStar99> have u tested on another div?
Apr 01 21:20:37 <dean1012yh> i've tried to change text on a button and this label and I have tried Mojo.Log but I can't seem to get anything to happen within the tap function. it is as if it isn't being called but Ares did the function for me so I assume it is ok
Apr 01 21:21:49 <LoneStar99> <div id="change_it">change this</div> --> "this.controller.get('change_it').innerHTML = 'testing new text';
Apr 01 21:22:12 <LoneStar99> try that
Apr 01 21:22:37 <dean1012yh> are Labels divs?
Apr 01 21:22:49 <dean1012yh> I'm using Ares and I don't see an option for an actual div
Apr 01 21:24:02 <dean1012yh> ok that worked actually
Apr 01 21:25:36 <LoneStar99> can u paste "widget" code the one you want to change the text on
Apr 01 21:27:04 <dean1012yh> ok, this.controller.get('mybutton').innerHTML = 'test'; changed it BUT it changed more than just the label, it also changed the style and everything
Apr 01 21:27:09 <dean1012yh> same thing with the label
Apr 01 21:27:14 <dean1012yh> is there a way just to set the label?
Apr 01 21:27:29 <dean1012yh> and i don't know how to view the actual widget code. it just shows me the visual look
Apr 01 21:28:20 <LoneStar99> what is the code in html that you want to change
Apr 01 21:29:01 <dean1012yh> i have no idea ^_^. Ares has a label attribute for it that I change and it shows up
Apr 01 21:29:14 <dean1012yh> According to the documentation, the attribute is named label
Apr 01 21:29:19 <dean1012yh> so i thought mybutton.label would work
Apr 01 21:29:21 <dean1012yh> but it does not
Apr 01 21:29:50 <LoneStar99> can you view the html source in ares?
Apr 01 21:30:35 <dean1012yh> i don't see a way to do it
Apr 01 21:30:54 <LoneStar99> what sort of widget is it?
Apr 01 21:31:00 <LoneStar99> button or text?
Apr 01 21:31:23 <dean1012yh> i have a button and label. the label has a value attribute and the button has a label attribute
Apr 01 21:32:51 <LoneStar99> does it look like the following: http://uoid.me/text1
Apr 01 21:33:31 <dean1012yh> no
Apr 01 21:33:53 <dean1012yh> its a label not a text input. and a button
Apr 01 21:34:03 <LoneStar99> k
Apr 01 21:35:44 <dean1012yh> sorry, trying to be helpful but Ares isn't exactly forthcoming with the GUI code
Apr 01 21:35:55 <LoneStar99> can u get a screenshot?
Apr 01 21:36:29 <LoneStar99> only used ares for 10 minutes when it was released, so not very sure how it works
Apr 01 21:37:00 <LoneStar99> an emulator screenshot of "label" you want changed
Apr 01 21:37:01 <dean1012yh> well ignore the ares part then. if you created a Widget.button how would you change the text on the button using code?
Apr 01 21:37:13 <dean1012yh> let's just take the button. the label oughta be the same essentially
Apr 01 21:37:54 <dean1012yh> If the button has an attribute, label, I would assume this.controller.get('myButton').label or this.controller.get('myButton').mojo.label would work but neither do
Apr 01 21:39:17 <LoneStar99> the button text is "label"?
Apr 01 21:40:23 <LoneStar99> if i am not mistaken attributes of widgets can not be modified - unless something has changed recently
Apr 01 21:41:41 <dean1012yh> ok, in the simplest of terms, button says "I'm a button" and when you press that button, I want it to say "Test Button" instead
Apr 01 21:41:44 <dean1012yh> for example
Apr 01 21:42:02 <dean1012yh> or in similar terms, a label says "I'm a label" and when a button is pressed, I want the label to say "Test Label" instead
Apr 01 21:42:03 <Tibfib> okay... put "label" in the model
Apr 01 21:42:06 <dean1012yh> there must be a way to do that
Apr 01 21:42:35 <dean1012yh> ok
Apr 01 21:42:42 <dean1012yh> in ares, i've put "Label" as "model"
Apr 01 21:43:02 <Tibfib> then for the onTap function do this.modelNAME.label = 'YOUR NEW TEXT';
Apr 01 21:43:02 <Tibfib>     this.controller.modelChanged(this.modelName);
Apr 01 21:43:20 <maik> can anyone confirm that the 800MHz patch in the 1.40 thread works for 1.4.1.1?
Apr 01 21:43:37 <Tibfib> tons of peeps on the forums have
Apr 01 21:44:07 <LoneStar99> button text "search" on tap "searching..." will not work, since it is an attribute, but Tibfib might be correct...
Apr 01 21:45:07 <maik> oh...hooray
Apr 01 21:45:24 <Tibfib> maik: I'm going to wait a little until the .ipk versions are released
Apr 01 21:45:47 <maik> ya, i might as well
Apr 01 21:48:44 <rwhitby> morning
Apr 01 21:49:26 <LoneStar99> morning
Apr 01 21:50:44 <Bmyers> u dont sleep much rwhitby
Apr 01 21:51:25 <rwhitby> Bmyers: I have kids
Apr 01 21:51:43 <Bmyers> really? i thought u were like 14 or something
Apr 01 21:51:54 <halfhalo> hahahahaha
Apr 01 21:52:12 <zsoc> ...
Apr 01 21:52:17 <zsoc> the most mature 14 year old ever D:
Apr 01 21:52:41 <zsoc> he would have started the ns2lu project when he was.... 4? lol
Apr 01 21:53:15 <rwhitby> Bmyers: if you reverse the digits, you're close
Apr 01 21:53:43 <Bmyers> well that explains alot
Apr 01 21:54:09 * rwhitby wonders what ...
Apr 01 21:54:23 <Bmyers> why u dont sleep much
Apr 01 21:58:49 <psi0r> hi
Apr 01 21:59:06 <psi0r> anyone wants to have his app translated to german?
Apr 01 21:59:39 <psi0r> if so, msg me...
Apr 01 22:04:49 <rwhitby> So, who won the HotApps contest?
Apr 01 22:06:47 <Roy-Pre101> rwhitby: http://www.webosroundup.com/2010/04/palms-need-for-speed-overclocking-patent/
Apr 01 22:07:12 <Roy-Pre101> rwhitby: 	Hot apps is still going on through May.
Apr 01 22:08:23 <rwhitby> Roy-Pre101: um, the referenced patent has nothing to do with overclocking.  And it's April 2nd here.
Apr 01 22:08:36 <Roy-Pre101> rwhitby: :P
Apr 01 22:09:15 <Roy-Pre101> I'd have posted sooner if I could have.
Apr 01 22:10:22 <LoneStar99> what english markets opened up? UK, Ireland and Canada?
Apr 01 22:10:31 <LoneStar99> for paid apps....
Apr 01 22:10:37 <Roy-Pre101> yep
Apr 01 22:11:07 <Roy-Pre101> rwhitby: You going to pop over for the developer day?
Apr 01 22:11:17 <LoneStar99> what about australia?
Apr 01 22:12:55 <rwhitby> LoneStar99: no paid apps in Australia
Apr 01 22:13:16 <rwhitby> No apps at all in Australia actually.  You need to convince palm you're in the UK or US.
Apr 01 22:13:39 <rwhitby> Roy-Pre101: At $3K for a ticket, unlikely.
Apr 01 22:13:56 <Roy-Pre101> ouch.
Apr 01 22:14:05 <halfhalo_T400> whas 3k a ticket?
Apr 01 22:14:14 <Tibfib> Roy-Pre101: http://twitter.com/webOSdev/status/11447135079
Apr 01 22:14:17 <Roy-Pre101> halfhalo_T400: The Palm event.
Apr 01 22:14:20 <halfhalo_T400> ah
Apr 01 22:14:21 <halfhalo_T400> yeah
Apr 01 22:14:43 <halfhalo_T400> its 350 for both me and my friend incl 3 night stay at marriott
Apr 01 22:15:19 <LoneStar99> rwhitby: =(
Apr 01 22:15:33 <halfhalo_T400> BTW, the grand hotel is waaaay more expensive than the santa clara marriott
Apr 01 22:15:56 <halfhalo_T400> as in, the grand hotel is 140 a night vs the marriotts 99 a night (89 with AAA)
Apr 01 22:17:16 <Roy-Pre101> halfhalo_T400: good deal.
Apr 01 22:17:24 <halfhalo_T400> yup
Apr 01 22:17:43 <Roy-Pre101> My tickets are looking to be ~$400 +/-
Apr 01 22:17:47 <Roy-Pre101> Not including stay.
Apr 01 22:18:05 <halfhalo_T400> see, if you stayed at the marriott you could carpool with my friend and I to palm
Apr 01 22:19:56 <halfhalo_T400> Since Its honestly the cheapest one around.  And also the only one that has the option of two twin beds instead of a single queen
Apr 01 22:20:22 <Roy-Pre101> I'll see what I can do.
Apr 01 22:20:45 <halfhalo_T400> Plus, gotta love AAA discount
Apr 01 22:21:49 <halfhalo_T400> although my timing for checking in is going to suck
Apr 01 22:22:00 <halfhalo_T400> Have to Leave LA thursday night at 5pm
Apr 01 22:22:58 <dean1012yh> Thanks for helping solve my earlier problem. is there a way to hide a button? The Ares GUI has a "showing" checkbox that hides it but the button doesn't have a showing property. I see some sample code online that says to do $('myButton').hide() but I am unable to get any variation of hide() to work either. Does anyone know how to do this as well?
Apr 01 22:23:47 <halfhalo> silly college classes....
Apr 01 22:24:50 <dean1012yh> halfhalo: I wasn't aware college taught palm pre programming ^_^ and for your information I was unfortunately forced to drop out of college and am still fighting to afford to go back :(
Apr 01 22:25:18 <dean1012yh> I was an iPhone developer and I am finding it hard to find information on palm pre sdk programming.
Apr 01 22:25:34 <dean1012yh> The only sample code i've found says to use hide() and I just cannot get hide to work.
Apr 01 22:25:48 <dean1012yh> I know I am referencing the correct object because I can do other actions to that object (like disable it)
Apr 01 22:25:51 <dean1012yh> I just cannot hide it.
Apr 01 22:26:23 <Tibfib> dean1012yh: yeah the documentation sucks.
Apr 01 22:26:38 <Tibfib> but, I recommend using the straight sdk instead of ares
Apr 01 22:26:45 <dean1012yh> I'm combing through the palm site, forums, and google to find these answers
Apr 01 22:27:04 <Tibfib> for javascript questions: w3schools.com is the best resource imo
Apr 01 22:27:06 <VincentLaw> I'm not 100% sure about prototype (which is what webos uses), but in jquery, $('myButton').hide() should be $('#myButton').hide() or $('.myButton').hide() using the ID or class name
Apr 01 22:27:27 <Tibfib> VincentLaw: I think his code is right for prototype
Apr 01 22:27:42 <dean1012yh> I'm not sure my question is a javascript or prototype question, realy.
Apr 01 22:27:56 <VincentLaw> it's a prototype question
Apr 01 22:27:58 <dean1012yh> the issue seems to be that hide() isn't recognized as a function. or at least that's how i'm interpreting the result
Apr 01 22:28:15 <Tibfib> I don't know if prototype is used in ares... hmmm
Apr 01 22:28:18 <dean1012yh> I'm referencing the button correctly because I can disable it and enable it
Apr 01 22:28:28 <dean1012yh> so it isn't a question of referencing it
Apr 01 22:28:41 <dean1012yh> it is a question of which method or property to use to hide the button
Apr 01 22:28:57 <Tibfib> heh, just kidding it is.
Apr 01 22:29:14 <VincentLaw> It'd help to see more of the source around your issue
Apr 01 22:29:22 <VincentLaw> can you pastebin the js file?
Apr 01 22:29:35 <dean1012yh> sure I can but it doesn't show much
Apr 01 22:29:43 <dean1012yh> give me a sec
Apr 01 22:31:41 <dean1012yh> http://pastebin.org/130794
Apr 01 22:31:44 <Tibfib> whoa, although looking at ares, it is quite nice
Apr 01 22:32:01 <dean1012yh> line 19 works
Apr 01 22:32:03 <dean1012yh> line 20 does not
Apr 01 22:32:09 <dean1012yh> if line 20 is uncommented, line 19 does not work either
Apr 01 22:32:41 <dean1012yh> line 20 still does not work even if i comment line 19
Apr 01 22:32:43 <Tibfib> what is the id of the button widget?
Apr 01 22:33:17 <Tibfib> $('buttonID').hide(); should work
Apr 01 22:33:17 <dean1012yh> name and modelName are both clearbutton
Apr 01 22:33:25 <dean1012yh> so i assume the id is clearbutton
Apr 01 22:33:26 <VincentLaw> that's not the same thing
Apr 01 22:33:37 <VincentLaw> you're attempting to hide a widget, not the button itself :p
Apr 01 22:33:39 <VincentLaw> which isn't possible
Apr 01 22:33:44 <VincentLaw> disable is a state of the widget
Apr 01 22:33:47 <VincentLaw> which is why that works
Apr 01 22:33:55 <dean1012yh> i see
Apr 01 22:34:01 <VincentLaw> hide() physically turns off the display of the button using CSS
Apr 01 22:34:06 <dean1012yh> that makes sense
Apr 01 22:34:19 <dean1012yh> so then the question is how to access teh button part of the widget
Apr 01 22:34:29 <dean1012yh> this.clearbutton.button.hide()?
Apr 01 22:34:43 <Tibfib> dean1012yh: nope
Apr 01 22:34:44 <VincentLaw> no, you'd need to get the button's ID and do $('buttonID').hide(); that
Apr 01 22:34:54 <dean1012yh> ahh ok
Apr 01 22:34:59 <Tibfib> like I said? lol
Apr 01 22:35:04 <VincentLaw> like tibfib said :p
Apr 01 22:35:10 <dean1012yh> so the question then becomes how to get the button's id... Ares doesn't have the ability to set or see the id that I see
Apr 01 22:35:27 <VincentLaw> it should be the "name" of the button I'd imagine
Apr 01 22:35:31 <dean1012yh> Ares is great for designing but isn't very forthcoming about the code behind the GUI itself
Apr 01 22:35:35 <Tibfib> hmmm maybe title?
Apr 01 22:35:37 * halfhalo missed alot just driving down the street and back
Apr 01 22:36:07 <Tibfib> that's why I recommend the sdk
Apr 01 22:36:15 <VincentLaw> yeah I don't like Ares
Apr 01 22:36:19 <VincentLaw> but to each their own
Apr 01 22:36:38 <halfhalo> Yeah... heres hoping theres something on ares at dev days
Apr 01 22:36:41 <Tibfib> It is really slick... I'd just rather be able to make my own code
Apr 01 22:36:58 <VincentLaw> I think it does just a bit too much automagic
Apr 01 22:36:59 <rwhitby> Ares is awesome, but no use when you want to develop in a place which has no network connection, like 90% of Australia.
Apr 01 22:37:17 <halfhalo> YOU HEAR ME PALM?!?!
Apr 01 22:37:44 <VincentLaw> rwhitby: you mean to say a web app doesnt work in the middle of the desert? crazy! :p
Apr 01 22:37:58 * halfhalo crawls back into his cave
Apr 01 22:41:19 <dean1012yh> still trying to find the button id
Apr 01 22:42:43 <psi0r> do i get full access to the device via ssh?
Apr 01 22:43:09 <psi0r> my idea is a complete backup of the device via ssh/rsync
Apr 01 22:44:36 <Tibfib> name at top? (under "common")
Apr 01 22:52:28 <VincentLaw> psi0r: yes, you have full access to /
Apr 01 22:52:41 <VincentLaw> assuming you log in as root
Apr 01 23:06:16 <psi0r> VincentLaw: ok, thanks
Apr 01 23:06:52 <psi0r> mhh, terminal crashes. can i run the sshkeygen procedure through novaterm (WOQI)?
Apr 01 23:09:11 <zsoc> psi0r: install terminus or xterm through preware
Apr 01 23:09:23 <psi0r> ok
Apr 01 23:16:51 <haeffb> is there an easy way to extract all $L(...) strings from a projects .js files?
Apr 01 23:17:08 <zsoc> haeffb: grep?
Apr 01 23:17:16 <haeffb> I'm assuming there's some linux-y majic that I don't know...
Apr 01 23:17:38 <zsoc> grep -r "$L" ./
Apr 01 23:17:44 <zsoc> assuming $ works in that syntax, i'm unsure, never tried it
Apr 01 23:17:52 <haeffb> speak windows, please...
Apr 01 23:17:52 <Mousey> grep -r "$L" *
Apr 01 23:18:00 <pandora--> bah. what's the key combo to screenshot again?
Apr 01 23:18:10 <haeffb> opt-sym-p
Apr 01 23:18:14 <psi0r> what is the default hostname of a pre?
Apr 01 23:18:29 <zsoc> Mousey: "$L" doesn't seem to work, I believe it treats $L as an env var
Apr 01 23:18:35 <psi0r> i want to import the keys with ssh -i id_rsa root@???
Apr 01 23:18:51 <pandora--> haeffb: thx
Apr 01 23:19:16 <haeffb> 'grep' is not recognized as an internal or external command
Apr 01 23:19:38 <haeffb> grep 'L(' might work, if I had a grep
Apr 01 23:20:07 <zsoc> haeffb: I can not assist you further without having you install linux
Apr 01 23:20:25 <Mousey> declare | grep L
Apr 01 23:20:26 <Mousey> ?
Apr 01 23:20:43 <haeffb> zsoc: you have linux... :)
Apr 01 23:20:54 <Mousey> haeffb: wbo doesn't anymore?
Apr 01 23:20:55 <zsoc> haeffb: you want me to grep a file for you?
Apr 01 23:21:01 <Mousey> s/wbo/who/
Apr 01 23:21:04 * haeffb raises hand
Apr 01 23:21:09 <zsoc> Mousey: nah, declare does the same, but like was said... just s/$L/L(
Apr 01 23:21:10 <haeffb> well, if you don't count webOS.
Apr 01 23:21:37 * Mousey sends haeffb a pirated copy of linux
Apr 01 23:22:08 * haeffb grabs a pirated copy of linux and says, "now what?"
Apr 01 23:22:26 <haeffb> Palm should provide a tool for this.
Apr 01 23:22:30 <Mousey> Just Install It
Apr 01 23:22:34 <zsoc> seriously
Apr 01 23:22:36 <haeffb> I'm talking to You, Palm!
Apr 01 23:22:45 <halfhalo> thats MY gig
Apr 01 23:23:06 * haeffb hides from union bosses
Apr 01 23:23:10 <zsoc> haeffb: your pre can use grep
Apr 01 23:23:14 <zsoc> haeffb: novacom in
Apr 01 23:23:17 <zsoc> er, novaTERM in
Apr 01 23:23:31 <haeffb> hmmm....
Apr 01 23:23:46 * haeffb will look into zsoc's suggestion.
Apr 01 23:24:02 <haeffb> soon as all the union thugs have departed
Apr 01 23:25:20 * haeffb mowed lawn for the first time this season. it was fun. next time will be fun, too. after that, not so much.
Apr 01 23:25:43 <pandora--> man i haven't mowed a lawn since i was like 7
Apr 01 23:26:29 <zsoc> i haven't _seen_ a lawn since i was 7
Apr 01 23:26:30 <pandora--> i don't like manual labor
Apr 01 23:27:18 <haeffb> var mowed_lawn = "rode on a lawn tractor for an hour";
Apr 01 23:28:08 <haeffb> by the sound of things, I shamed the neighbor into doing it as well.
Apr 01 23:37:38 <psi0r> in which directory does the pre store my contacts?
Apr 01 23:38:29 <zsoc> psi0r: i'd imagine they are stored in a sqlite3 database
Apr 01 23:38:45 <psi0r> k
Apr 01 23:39:56 <lemketron> haeffb: check out PyPalm:  http://github.com/grundprinzip/PyPalm#readme
Apr 01 23:40:27 <lemketron> "... Localize will scan all application source files and check for method calls with $L(...) it will extract the key and create an entrie in the language catalog..."
Apr 01 23:49:21 <lemketron> haeffb: isn't that what you were looking for?  I thought you'd be thrilled.  ;-)
Apr 01 23:49:36 <lemketron> oh well...  gotta run.
Apr 02 00:02:01 <haeffb> lemketron-afk: I AM thrilled! Just was away for a bit.
Apr 02 00:02:58 <Bmyers> he was really hurt haeffb
Apr 02 00:04:01 <haeffb> no, wait. I don't have git.
Apr 02 00:04:04 <haeffb> or pip.
Apr 02 00:04:52 <haeffb> lemketron-afk: I will never leave my keyboard again. I am truly sorry.
Apr 02 00:05:34 <zsoc> haeffb: 1.) download ub9.10 desktop image .iso 2.) make new vbox, mount .iso to virtual cdrom drive 3.) boot vbox
Apr 02 00:07:32 <Bmyers> isnt there a ubuntu vbox image out there?
Apr 02 00:07:50 <zsoc> prolly, but if you can't do those steps you probably shouldn't doing it
Apr 02 00:08:11 <haeffb> I prolly shouldn't be doing it.
Apr 02 00:08:47 <haeffb> I will simply refuse to support foreign languages. So there.
Apr 02 00:10:55 * haeffb ponders whether it's worth my time to learn unix-y stuff...
Apr 02 00:11:13 <Bmyers> at your age. just skip it..
Apr 02 00:11:26 <haeffb> lol
Apr 02 00:11:36 <Bmyers> its just another fad
Apr 02 00:12:03 * haeffb sitting on the deck, grilling brats, drinking beer. Linux can wait.
Apr 02 00:12:20 <Bmyers> linux has nothing over beer and brats
Apr 02 00:12:42 <haeffb> exactly!
Apr 02 00:13:57 <Bmyers> hoping to hit 2k dl's for GR sometime soon..
Apr 02 00:14:00 <haeffb> got some Classic Rewind from DishNetwork/Sirius playing over the outdoor speakers.
Apr 02 00:14:38 <zsoc> Why didn't anyone tell me the PS3 browser has a fullscreen option and can support flash websites?
Apr 02 00:15:03 <haeffb> it was supposed to be a secret. How'd you find out?
Apr 02 00:15:15 <Bmyers> lucky u. mostly all i hear are harleys going to the biker bar down the street. so glad i can have my windows open now..
Apr 02 00:15:41 * haeffb just far enough out of town that it's nice and peaceful.
Apr 02 00:16:16 <zsoc> hmm, well grooveshark doesn't work
Apr 02 00:16:35 <haeffb> gotta figure out how to handle syncing errors.
Apr 02 00:16:45 <haeffb> fail silently and try again later?
Apr 02 00:16:55 <haeffb> banner notification & try again later?
Apr 02 00:17:21 <haeffb> banner notification & tell the user to throw their phone into a ditch so Palm can sell more phones?
Apr 02 00:17:39 <zsoc> i like that one
Apr 02 00:18:02 <codeslaw> heyo
Apr 02 00:18:38 <zsoc> codeslaw: your name fills me with bemusement
Apr 02 00:19:12 <haeffb> his name reminds me that I want a pulled pork/coleslaw/ginger wasabi sauce sandwich.
Apr 02 00:19:20 <haeffb> or a brat.
Apr 02 00:19:30 <haeffb> oh, look. brats!
Apr 02 00:21:54 <haeffb> U2 Where the Streets Have No Name
Apr 02 00:22:13 <haeffb> you guys should all come hang out here. It's pretty awesome.
Apr 02 00:22:19 <xota> hi! what do you think about my new app? :) http://forums.precentral.net/homebrew-apps/239569-show-me.html
Apr 02 00:25:45 <haeffb> Mr. Xota, what you have just written is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever seen. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having seen it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
Apr 02 00:25:55 <haeffb> sorry, just kidding.
Apr 02 00:26:01 <haeffb> looks cool.
Apr 02 00:26:08 <xota> lol
Apr 02 00:26:26 <xota> really it's util for me... sufficient :p but I like experts rates :D
Apr 02 00:27:21 <haeffb> hey, that's my philosophy, too. Write what works for you.
Apr 02 00:28:11 <zsoc> xota: I think it's a good idea. I won't use it, but others might find it useful.
Apr 02 00:28:26 <xota> the good free (as libre) apps starts at this point: do some usefull for his developer
Apr 02 00:28:37 <xota> thanks zsoc  :)
Apr 02 00:28:46 <haeffb> .38 Special Rockin' Into the Night
Apr 02 00:29:30 <xota> I willn't use it all days, but to go home in vacations I have a 500kms travel, my mom and girlfriend are worried :D
Apr 02 00:30:22 <zsoc> well, they say you marry someone like your mom
Apr 02 00:31:27 <haeffb> your mom says that.
Apr 02 00:31:35 <Bmyers> before i drive that far i'd have to know what kind of beer
Apr 02 00:31:54 <haeffb> currently Sam Adam's Coastal Wheat.
Apr 02 00:32:09 <haeffb> Just finished the last Sam Adam's Winter Lager.
Apr 02 00:32:25 <haeffb> Plenty of Fat Tire
Apr 02 00:32:37 <haeffb> Couple of Boulevard Pale Ales, and a Pilsner
Apr 02 00:32:41 <Bmyers> the healthy stuff eh?
Apr 02 00:32:53 <haeffb> and a Sam Adam's seasonal sampler case in the garage.
Apr 02 00:33:08 <haeffb> life's too short to drink cheap beer.
Apr 02 00:33:17 <haeffb> time to turn the brats!
Apr 02 00:33:31 <haeffb> y'all need to remind me every five mins or so.
Apr 02 00:33:34 <Bmyers> u live off beer and brats and live is short? man there is a suprise..
Apr 02 00:34:00 <Bmyers> there's an app for that
Apr 02 00:34:39 <haeffb> hmmm. my other friends aren't so judgemental.
Apr 02 00:35:00 <haeffb> Bmyers can stay where he is. The rest of you can come over.
Apr 02 00:35:11 <Bmyers> lol
Apr 02 00:36:15 <Bmyers> i usually dont dont beer onshore anyway
Apr 02 00:36:24 <Bmyers> dont drink...
Apr 02 00:37:00 <haeffb> yeah. it's much more dangerous to drink it at sea.
Apr 02 00:38:00 <Bmyers> drop a hook. crack open a beer. it's pretty safe..
Apr 02 00:40:12 <haeffb> well, yes, if you stop at one.
Apr 02 00:43:16 <Bmyers> didnt stop at 1. i got 3 boats now..
Apr 02 00:43:32 <haeffb> awesome. when should I drop by?
Apr 02 00:43:57 <Bmyers> when its windy. they are sailboats
Apr 02 00:44:34 <codeslaw> did some lamb sausages last night on the grill
Apr 02 00:44:40 <codeslaw> brat style
Apr 02 00:44:56 <zsoc> Seriously, is it always like this in here?
Apr 02 00:45:07 <codeslaw> like what?
Apr 02 00:45:15 <haeffb> seriously. not always. sometimes it's serious.
Apr 02 00:45:23 <codeslaw> rarely
Apr 02 00:45:25 <halfhalo_T400_> HA
Apr 02 00:45:32 <codeslaw> rare as in steaks
Apr 02 00:45:49 <haeffb> then halfhalo comes along and ruins everything.
Apr 02 00:45:58 <halfhalo> Thats mah job
Apr 02 00:46:08 <codeslaw> no doubt
Apr 02 00:46:13 <halfhalo> yup
Apr 02 00:46:49 <haeffb> zsoc: if nobody's asking questions, we have to entertain ourselves until someone do.
Apr 02 00:47:08 <halfhalo> yeah... lets go with that
Apr 02 00:47:14 <haeffb> but the standard answer is: this.myModel.value = "new stuff"
Apr 02 00:47:26 <haeffb> this.controller.modelChanged(this.myModel);
Apr 02 00:47:39 <Tibfib> haha... yes. The MOST asked question by far
Apr 02 00:47:41 <haeffb> takes care of 90% of the questions in here.
Apr 02 00:48:30 <codeslaw> lol
Apr 02 00:48:32 <codeslaw> BUT
Apr 02 00:48:41 <Tibfib> palm needs better documentation
Apr 02 00:48:46 <codeslaw> how do i change the label on a spinner button?
Apr 02 00:49:04 <Tibfib> codeslaw: you don't.
Apr 02 00:49:12 <codeslaw> ><
Apr 02 00:50:05 <codeslaw> 1.4.1 totally un-screwed my app
Apr 02 00:50:07 <Tibfib> palm needs to convert the docs to a wiki.
Apr 02 00:50:18 <Tibfib> codeslaw: nice
Apr 02 00:50:28 <codeslaw> wiki would be cool
Apr 02 00:50:35 <codeslaw> we could all just contribute to webos101
Apr 02 00:50:49 <Tibfib> while that is a great site... It honestly needs to be palm-ran
Apr 02 00:50:58 <codeslaw> would drive a lot more traffic
Apr 02 00:51:08 <codeslaw> for sure
Apr 02 00:51:16 <Tibfib> So it is well managed and is always up to date with sdk improvements/changes
Apr 02 00:51:51 <Tibfib> I think I'm going to make a dedicated topic in the dev forums about it
Apr 02 00:53:26 <codeslaw> anyone have a good example on setting the wall paper?
Apr 02 01:04:51 <haeffb> nope
Apr 02 01:05:30 <LoneStar99> webos101 rocks
Apr 02 01:06:51 <Tibfib> LoneStar99: the code snippets sure do
Apr 02 01:07:07 <Tibfib> It just needs widget documentation but we are all too lazy to fix that
Apr 02 01:08:41 <LoneStar99> yeah i have added a few
Apr 02 01:09:09 <LoneStar99> need to add some localization stuff once i figure it our
Apr 02 01:09:11 <LoneStar99> out
Apr 02 01:10:19 <Tibfib> do it!
Apr 02 01:11:55 <xota> bye! good night :) Spain -> 03:11
Apr 02 01:15:58 <haeffb> localization stuff is easy.
Apr 02 01:16:02 <haeffb> if you have pip or git
Apr 02 01:19:43 <Tibfib> heh, just added modelChanged to the snippets page
Apr 02 01:26:18 <haeffb> dude. nobody will come here anymore.
Apr 02 01:27:47 <Tibfib> :/
Apr 02 01:41:07 <codeslaw> any spanish/german speakers around?
Apr 02 01:41:36 <haeffb> like, both? or either?
Apr 02 01:42:13 <Tibfib> hablo un poco espanol
Apr 02 01:42:32 <pandora--> eh.
Apr 02 01:42:37 <zsoc> mi espanola en malo :(
Apr 02 01:42:45 <codeslaw> no worries
Apr 02 01:43:03 <pandora--> it's bad when your pre just powers off huh?
Apr 02 01:43:10 <pandora--> bah
Apr 02 01:43:14 <Tibfib> dead battery?
Apr 02 01:44:11 <zsoc> codeslaw: our native german's are sleeping atm
Apr 02 01:44:17 <codeslaw> ya
Apr 02 01:44:53 <sugardave> dame una cerveza por favor y donde esta el bano?
Apr 02 01:45:01 <sugardave> (I can't do the tilde n)
Apr 02 01:45:53 <zsoc>  I once was in costa rica trying to say "beer me" to a girl (like The Office joke), but instead of cerverza, I said servicio
Apr 02 01:46:13 <sugardave> haha
Apr 02 01:46:23 <zsoc> yeah, i got a beer alright... /on me/
Apr 02 01:48:02 <Tibfib> howdy chuq
Apr 02 01:48:12 <zsoc> chuqui: speak of the devil
Apr 02 01:49:14 <haeffb> chuqui!
Apr 02 01:49:32 <pandora--> nope, didnt die with a dead battery, it was plugged in charging.  when i came back to it a few minutes later it was just powered off
Apr 02 01:49:33 <pandora--> weird
Apr 02 01:49:49 * Tibfib wonders who will be able to get chuq to talk... :D
Apr 02 01:50:15 <halfhalo> When?
Apr 02 01:50:16 <haeffb> birds!
Apr 02 01:50:22 <halfhalo> bees!
Apr 02 01:50:28 <halfhalo> Teenagers!
Apr 02 01:50:36 * haeffb trying to get chuqui to talk
Apr 02 01:50:49 <midtown0089> hi all..
Apr 02 01:50:53 <halfhalo> hi
Apr 02 01:50:57 <Tibfib> midtown0089: howdy
Apr 02 01:52:21 <Tibfib> oooh... we all lose.
Apr 02 01:52:46 <midtown0089> question: does any know the how precise the html5 audio objects currentTime property is??
Apr 02 01:53:33 <haeffb> chuqui: zero-star revies.
Apr 02 01:53:35 <haeffb> ws.
Apr 02 01:53:49 * haeffb resorts to talking work to get a response.
Apr 02 01:54:29 <Tibfib> chuqui: has their been internal discussion about turning the documenation into a wiki? If not, I'd like to suggest it.
Apr 02 01:54:37 * Tibfib will try as well
Apr 02 01:55:02 <midtown0089> In my test I am seeing that there is no difference btwn currentTime=.10 or .50 or .90., can anyone help me with this?
Apr 02 01:55:05 * halfhalo wants to fit in
Apr 02 01:55:09 * Tibfib likes talking in the third person.
Apr 02 01:55:13 <chuqui> yes, thre's been discussion of the wiki and similar things.
Apr 02 01:55:26 * halfhalo is going to bring the palm devs a bag of cookies for dev days
Apr 02 01:55:29 <Bmyers> +100 on wiki
Apr 02 01:55:34 <haeffb> Tibfib Wins!
Apr 02 01:55:37 <Tibfib> :D
Apr 02 01:56:05 <Bmyers> or just buy-out Roy
Apr 02 01:56:18 <Tibfib> chuqui: since your (palm) resources are limited, let us developers help out in documentation
Apr 02 01:57:32 <midtown0089> anyone?
Apr 02 01:57:48 <Tibfib> midtown0089: sorry, don't know!
Apr 02 01:58:21 <midtown0089> thanx.
Apr 02 01:59:29 <chuqui_> my network is funky tonight. and I keep rebooting my airport. grump
Apr 02 01:59:49 <halfhalo> WELCOME to my world
Apr 02 02:01:35 <Tibfib> soo chuq, getting an iPad?
Apr 02 02:01:56 <halfhalo> Joo-Joo+webos=GODLIKE
Apr 02 02:02:12 <chuqui> tibfib not right away.
Apr 02 02:02:22 <halfhalo> My office is getting 3
Apr 02 02:02:49 <chuqui> you can send one to me, if you like. I'll give it a chance to shake out and then look at it. I'm in no hurry.
Apr 02 02:03:08 <halfhalo> lolno
Apr 02 02:03:09 <chuqui> I definitely see having one. I just don't have any need to be first in line.
Apr 02 02:03:25 <halfhalo> Were going to see how well they work as mobile survey taking thingies
Apr 02 02:03:33 <Tibfib> The first thing that made me want it is the abc and netflix streaming apps... but i still don't see the need
Apr 02 02:03:40 <halfhalo> since right now its all done with pencil and paper
Apr 02 02:04:28 <Tibfib> any rumors on pricing on the joo joo?
Apr 02 02:04:31 <halfhalo> Honestly, I want the HP slate
Apr 02 02:04:38 <halfhalo> its shipping now
Apr 02 02:04:46 <halfhalo> joo-joo is, I mean
Apr 02 02:04:58 <Tibfib> ah, how much?
Apr 02 02:05:02 <haeffb> chuqui: I'm waiting for the Palm-pad.
Apr 02 02:05:08 <chuqui> I want to upgrade my laptop first. I'm still running on the one they gave me when I left Apple. It's a bit long in the tooth.
Apr 02 02:05:13 <Tibfib> oh 500
Apr 02 02:05:20 <halfhalo> Lenovo T410
Apr 02 02:05:22 <halfhalo> End
Apr 02 02:05:23 <halfhalo> Of
Apr 02 02:05:25 <halfhalo> Story
Apr 02 02:05:51 <haeffb> chuqui: zero-star reviews. seriously.
Apr 02 02:05:53 <chuqui> haeffb that's something I shouldn't even crack jokes about, because people tend to interpret stuff in ways I have to be careful about....
Apr 02 02:06:11 <Tibfib> it's april fools, you can say whatever you want
Apr 02 02:06:13 <chuqui> haeffb what about them?
Apr 02 02:06:27 <haeffb> Somebody should delete them.
Apr 02 02:06:37 <Tibfib> or just fix that stupid link >.<
Apr 02 02:07:27 <chuqui> I do delete them. I spent today working through that stuff. updates will go in soon.
Apr 02 02:07:36 <chuqui> and the underlying cause is scheduled for a fix, I believe.
Apr 02 02:08:03 <Tibfib> yay!
Apr 02 02:08:17 <haeffb> chuqui: that would be great.
Apr 02 02:08:35 <haeffb> we want you to be able to spend more time here BS'ing with us.
Apr 02 02:08:47 <Tibfib> whoa, joo joo is webOS grande-sized and not as pretty
Apr 02 02:10:41 <Chriswebos> how does one make their code quit working after a certain amount of time (e.g. for betas)?
Apr 02 02:11:19 <Tibfib> Chriswebos: there's a few ways
Apr 02 02:11:34 <chuqui> ah, goodie. my network is fratzing again.
Apr 02 02:11:50 <chuqui> and it's dinner time. I give up. See ya all later... gonna unplug for the nonce.
Apr 02 02:11:55 <halfhalo_T400> join the club
Apr 02 02:11:56 <Tibfib> you could call a javascript date object and check to see if it is X/X/X and if it is, don't execute some code.
Apr 02 02:12:17 <Tibfib> bye bye
Apr 02 02:12:46 <Chriswebos> I was kindof thinking of that...I guess I could do it in the stage assistant, huh?
Apr 02 02:13:18 <Chriswebos> if it's past April 15th, just push a scene that says "please buy full version" or something
Apr 02 02:13:27 <Tibfib> yep, that would be easiest
Apr 02 02:13:44 <Chriswebos> is there a way to have the code check for updates, so it would only stop working once i submit an update?
Apr 02 02:14:03 <zsoc> and obfuscate it
Apr 02 02:14:04 <Tibfib> if you have a server
Apr 02 02:14:29 <Chriswebos> hmmm...i think i'll do like u said...
Apr 02 02:14:30 <zsoc> or a computer and a free dyndns account
Apr 02 02:14:54 <Chriswebos> how does one obfuscate?
Apr 02 02:15:08 <Chriswebos> is it effective?
Apr 02 02:15:24 <zsoc> against lazy people
Apr 02 02:15:35 <Tibfib> no... it's not
Apr 02 02:15:57 <haeffb> really, obfuscate only protects you from the people who wouldn't know how to see your code anyway.
Apr 02 02:16:04 * zsoc is too lazy to deobfuscate js
Apr 02 02:16:13 <haeffb> and zsoc.
Apr 02 02:16:26 <halfhalo_T400> and me
Apr 02 02:16:33 <Tibfib> me three
Apr 02 02:16:39 <Chriswebos> so, what's the best way to protect code?
Apr 02 02:16:40 <halfhalo_T400> right clicking and uncompressing is to much effort
Apr 02 02:16:46 <halfhalo_T400> binary
Apr 02 02:17:02 <Chriswebos> binary?
Apr 02 02:17:08 <Tibfib> Chriswebos: pdk apps
Apr 02 02:17:15 <halfhalo_T400> code EVERYTHING in binary
Apr 02 02:17:20 <halfhalo_T400> NO ONE can read it
Apr 02 02:17:21 <Chriswebos> lol
Apr 02 02:17:22 <zsoc> Chriswebos: releasing them open source
Apr 02 02:17:24 <halfhalo_T400> not even the pre
Apr 02 02:17:36 <haeffb> Chriswebos: what zsoc said.
Apr 02 02:18:05 <haeffb> release it as open source, and it's not enough of a challenge.
Apr 02 02:18:05 <Chriswebos> but, but, but I wanna try to make money off it
Apr 02 02:18:15 <Tibfib> open source != free
Apr 02 02:19:20 <Chriswebos> well, how would it not mean free?
Apr 02 02:19:42 <Chriswebos> i mean, why pay if it's open?
Apr 02 02:19:46 <zsoc> Chriswebos: Think of it this way. I plan on releasing opensource applications, for pay apps in the catalog. It will work because the average individual will not have the know how or desire to compile/install it themselves. Even if I put it in preware thats <5% of Pre owners. In the same way, if you release a 'trial' app, very few people are going to bother 'patching the code' to extend a trial, and those same people wouldn't buy it anyway. Any method you use
Apr 02 02:19:46 <zsoc> to end a free trial will be fine.
Apr 02 02:21:40 <Chriswebos> so, i guess you're saying don't bother obfuscating because the only people it'll protect me against would get around it anyways?
Apr 02 02:21:47 <halfhalo_T400> yup
Apr 02 02:22:01 <halfhalo_T400> hell, I leave my comments in that say "this does this shit"
Apr 02 02:22:33 <Chriswebos> isn't open source one of the distribution channels?
Apr 02 02:22:58 <zsoc> I might consider releasing my app free and paid, and have the free version just nag the user and try to make them feel bad
Apr 02 02:23:03 <Tibfib> as in catalog, web, beta, open source?
Apr 02 02:23:05 <zsoc> "Cmon, I have to feed my children. Buy the full version"
Apr 02 02:23:13 <Chriswebos> yeah
Apr 02 02:23:17 <Tibfib> nope
Apr 02 02:23:47 <Tibfib> you just set up your account as open source, and then you won't have to pay to submit apps
Apr 02 02:24:09 <Chriswebos> but they won't be in app catalog if u do that will they?
Apr 02 02:24:16 <Tibfib> they will
Apr 02 02:24:19 <Tibfib> my appis
Apr 02 02:24:24 <Tibfib> app is*
Apr 02 02:24:31 <Chriswebos> u didn't have to pay to submit it?
Apr 02 02:24:35 <Tibfib> nope
Apr 02 02:24:58 <Chriswebos> hmmm...so, open source is basically the way it'd be submitted anyways, right?
Apr 02 02:25:07 <Chriswebos> with the $50 fee
Apr 02 02:25:29 <Tibfib> depends on how you look at it.
Apr 02 02:26:04 <Tibfib> Yes the code is easily viewable no matter what, but that doens't mean it is free to  use.
Apr 02 02:27:12 <zsoc> Tibfib: it sort of does, I didn't entirely read the agreement but they may limit it to apps being release GPL/LGPL or compatible
Apr 02 02:27:38 <Tibfib> oh really?
Apr 02 02:28:18 <Chriswebos> i just realized...someone could grab the code and put a link on a website and redistribute the code freely, right?
Apr 02 02:28:37 <Tibfib> zsoc: hmmm what about pdk apps?
Apr 02 02:28:39 <halfhalo_T400> there is a 0.01% chance of that happening
Apr 02 02:28:57 <Chriswebos> why is that?
Apr 02 02:29:04 <Tibfib> no one cares >.<
Apr 02 02:29:08 <halfhalo_T400> Because people are lazy
Apr 02 02:29:26 <Tibfib> How is posting an app's source code profitable?
Apr 02 02:29:41 <zsoc> Chriswebos: that's unlikely... what _could_ happen is someone could rerelease your app for free
Apr 02 02:29:49 <haeffb> Chriswebos: My app is open source and paid.
Apr 02 02:29:51 <zsoc> it would be pretty shameless tho
Apr 02 02:30:03 <Chriswebos> greedy too, though...just hope there's a way of signing apps or something...well, I could put up a site like: get these 5 apps for $4 or something
Apr 02 02:30:04 * zsoc resubmits haeffb's app for free
Apr 02 02:30:05 <halfhalo_T400> and chuq could come in and be like "Bitch NO"
Apr 02 02:30:06 <haeffb> If you want to DL it and release it as your own....you can.
Apr 02 02:30:28 <haeffb> but I will give you bad reviews in the app catalog.
Apr 02 02:30:46 <Kyusaku> 5 stars!
Apr 02 02:31:26 <Chriswebos> hmmm...i guess it's a pretty self policing system so far...if no one's done it for those $40 translation dictionaries, they won't do it at all
Apr 02 02:31:55 <Kyusaku> ugh those dictionaries
Apr 02 02:32:25 <Tibfib> I don't know if those dictionaries are open source
Apr 02 02:32:50 <Chriswebos> but one could download, deobfuscate, and re-release, right?
Apr 02 02:33:05 <Bmyers> haeffb is it true what you said about Palm is going to award the "Hot Apps" contest winners in equivelant $$ in Palm stock?
Apr 02 02:33:18 <zsoc> Chriswebos: if it's not opensource, that's just illegal
Apr 02 02:33:35 <Chriswebos> ohhhh...and they could sue me?
Apr 02 02:33:45 <zsoc> Chriswebos: criminal prosecution in america
Apr 02 02:33:52 <Chriswebos> be pretty easy to prove
Apr 02 02:34:31 <sugardave> now you guys have me all paranoid....somebody might be planning to rip off Yule Log
Apr 02 02:34:47 <zsoc> Chriswebos: Nah, just palm wouldn't accept it i'm sure
Apr 02 02:34:51 <Bmyers> i already did and released it in french..
Apr 02 02:34:58 <Tibfib> sugardave: submitting it to palm now
Apr 02 02:35:00 <sugardave> bastard!
Apr 02 02:35:17 <Chriswebos> wow...i did it in german
Apr 02 02:35:18 <Bmyers> but mine is called Yule' Log
Apr 02 02:35:28 <Chriswebos> mine's called Yule meister
Apr 02 02:35:41 <Tibfib> Mine is Fire Log
Apr 02 02:35:54 <Bmyers> try prosicuting me in Paris..
Apr 02 02:35:56 <Tibfib> err.. log on fire.
Apr 02 02:35:58 <Chriswebos> I just ripped your Fire Log and made FireDog
Apr 02 02:36:10 <Tibfib> noooooo
Apr 02 02:36:36 <Bmyers> get a good lawyer and a baguette..
Apr 02 02:36:51 <Bmyers> yule need it..
Apr 02 02:37:02 <halfhalo_T400> budumpsh
Apr 02 02:37:10 <Chriswebos> so, I guess I can feel safe that I could easily appeal to Palm to rip the rip-off from the palm store if their code is like mine?
Apr 02 02:37:30 <halfhalo_T400> yes
Apr 02 02:37:35 <Bmyers> we all stole our code from palm apps anyway..
Apr 02 02:37:44 <Tibfib> hahahahah!
Apr 02 02:37:48 <Chriswebos> DADGUMMIT!!! bye Firedog :(
Apr 02 02:37:50 <halfhalo_T400> I didn't
Apr 02 02:37:57 <halfhalo_T400> I stole it from Bmyers
Apr 02 02:38:14 <Chriswebos> Good artists copy...great artists steal
Apr 02 02:38:55 <sugardave> Yule need it....nice
Apr 02 02:39:08 * sugardave is distracted by other windows.
Apr 02 02:39:11 <Bmyers> was hoping u'd notice..
Apr 02 02:39:54 <sugardave> That's going in the next update somehow.
Apr 02 02:40:16 <Bmyers> But this app!! Yule need it
Apr 02 02:40:23 <Tibfib> hahaha
Apr 02 02:40:43 <Bmyers> Yule use it every Holiday Season..
Apr 02 02:40:56 <Bmyers> Yule wife will Love it?
Apr 02 02:41:15 <Bmyers> Yule donate .73 cents to my beer fund?
Apr 02 02:44:07 <Chriswebos> another question...i thought i saw somewhere that there were three payment models: free, paid, and advertising...is that correct or did i dream that?
Apr 02 02:45:16 <Tibfib> you don't declair to palm that it is ad-supported... To palm it is free or paid.
Apr 02 02:45:40 <Chriswebos> so, how does one make it ad-supported
Apr 02 02:45:41 <Bmyers> well, free or underpaid i think is more accurate..
Apr 02 02:45:58 <Bmyers> admod, smaato
Apr 02 02:46:03 <Bmyers> and others
Apr 02 02:46:33 <Chriswebos> hmmm...i guess it's easy to include code in the app to do this?
Apr 02 02:46:54 <Bmyers> failry..
Apr 02 02:47:05 <Bmyers> ajax calls, some css formatting
Apr 02 02:47:38 <Chriswebos> so, the payment isn't through palm? you set up your own?
Apr 02 02:47:53 <Bmyers> paypal is common
Apr 02 02:49:00 <Bmyers> depends on the app tho
Apr 02 02:49:23 <Bmyers> u need apps with "face time" to have effective ad support
Apr 02 02:50:03 <Bmyers> an app that the user open often an keeps open for long periods of time
Apr 02 02:51:00 <Bmyers> large user base apps that appeal to a wide variety of folks
Apr 02 02:53:12 <Chriswebos> what the pay rate? i'm on admob and can't seem to see it
Apr 02 02:53:19 <Tibfib> bad
Apr 02 02:57:47 <Chriswebos> what's the cpm rate one gets paid?
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Apr 02 02:59:56 2010