**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 29 02:59:56 2010 Apr 29 03:01:08 need to watch Breakout Apr 29 03:05:28 well, anyone who has held palm since just BEFORE the webos announcement did well. Apr 29 03:05:43 But people who bought palm at 15.... not so much Apr 29 03:05:45 rick-home: yeah Apr 29 03:06:11 bbl Apr 29 03:06:33 rick-home: i was ready to invest then, but had to wait till Feb 2009 so bought at 8.40 Apr 29 03:06:44 rick-home: whats up mr. rick Apr 29 03:06:45 hey rick .. what's your take on the palm/hp deal? isn't it strange we were just there and now they're being sold Apr 29 03:07:57 swisstomcat: eh, more like they are being... financed ;) Apr 29 03:08:40 zsoc: as long as they keep the palm brand Apr 29 03:08:53 LoneStar99: they will Apr 29 03:08:57 swisstomcat: being bought by HP is like the second coming Apr 29 03:09:05 HP?... but I can't be cheering for HP :( Apr 29 03:09:08 swisstomcat: and I don't even believe in the first coming Apr 29 03:09:10 compaq still has their brand, it's been years Apr 29 03:09:25 yeah, my hp laptop says compaq 6910p Apr 29 03:09:44 zsoc: that is HP's way of selling some stuff cheap Apr 29 03:11:08 it could have been a gold ole Shangai company... Apr 29 03:11:47 LoneStar99: HP was perfect. No significant investment in Android, no significant presence in smartphones, but deep pockets Apr 29 03:12:57 LoneStar99: not to mention significant hardware capabilities, and a need of a cheap OS to ship on tablets that won't cost them a windows 7 license Apr 29 03:13:18 could have been lenovo. I thought it was GOING to be lenovo. HP makes me happy Apr 29 03:13:56 I like Lenovo... not so fond of HP Apr 29 03:14:01 rick-home: lenovo would have been better than failure by a long shot Apr 29 03:14:17 lenovo would have been a VERY BAD FIT. Apr 29 03:14:29 Lenovo does not operate independent business units. HP does. Apr 29 03:14:40 i just rode by palo alto on the caltrain a few days ago :) Apr 29 03:14:45 rick-home: Yep. Unexpected, but briliant Apr 29 03:15:01 HP makes me happy also rick-home Apr 29 03:15:05 Palm is a quintessentially american company. Lenovo would have crushed them. Apr 29 03:15:11 not saying it'd be a great fit... but I love my lenovo hardware a lot more than any HP hardware i've had the misfortune of using Apr 29 03:15:16 HP is a major sponsor of many open source initiatives. Apr 29 03:15:17 rick-home: provided that palm busts out FULL java support at some point Apr 29 03:15:20 Lenono, not so much Apr 29 03:15:42 how come nobody considered HP during the rumor period? Apr 29 03:15:59 cphelps, in a release coming to palm very very soon, java is going to be utterly dumped from the machine, there will be no jvm. That's been public. Apr 29 03:16:00 dpivs: some did Apr 29 03:16:03 dpivs: That's the question of the day Apr 29 03:16:19 oh yeah, derek kessler, hahaha. i have to dig up that prediction. Apr 29 03:16:27 rick-home: You're not funny. Apr 29 03:16:32 Dieter predicted HP Apr 29 03:16:42 cphelps. I'm not joking. No jvm. Apr 29 03:16:44 DELL was "suppose to buy" Palm for a year according to "analysts" Apr 29 03:17:02 yes, no more jvm, i heard it too Apr 29 03:17:12 cphelps, that's why preware service and all other webos-internals services have been re-written in C. Apr 29 03:17:17 rick-home: uh, all the services are java, and they just said they were opening that up to non palm folks Apr 29 03:17:27 and all palm services are in the process of being ported to C or to javascript services. Apr 29 03:17:36 they new ones will be C, and have java/script/ middleware Apr 29 03:17:49 Not java, javascript services. See for reference NodeJS and commonJS Apr 29 03:17:53 it will make the phone 2893482384 times faster Apr 29 03:17:54 javascript. Not java. Apr 29 03:17:58 yup Apr 29 03:18:07 Wow. Where did I miss this? Apr 29 03:18:08 it's cool that Palm stays American, damn that's such a scrappy company. Apr 29 03:18:16 palm developer days keynote Apr 29 03:18:23 it's been around for a while cphelps. Apr 29 03:18:36 that's where it was announced Apr 29 03:18:40 rick-home: I have not been around for awhile, so that's an issue :-) Apr 29 03:18:40 and there was a very detailed presentation on nodeJS and javascript services at devdays. Apr 29 03:19:48 but I'm a java dev! That's the whole reason I've purchased myself an Android phone. Apr 29 03:19:54 how soon to webOS 2? will it include hardware accelerated theora? :D Apr 29 03:20:06 that's what I'm crossing my fingers for Apr 29 03:20:21 Hardware accelerated mojo. Apr 29 03:20:33 in a release by "fall" Apr 29 03:20:52 cphelps, java, as a language, sucks dead bunnies. :) Apr 29 03:21:36 rick-home: it's not so bad Apr 29 03:21:39 hardware accelerated css3 transitions Apr 29 03:21:41 rick-home: I've been developing java for 8 years, and have no complaints except the lack of unsigned integers Apr 29 03:21:41 then, there's the fact that it's almost never compiled, it's like visual basic, or foxpro, a semi-interpreted language... Apr 29 03:22:02 rick-home: that's called bytecode Apr 29 03:22:14 cphelps, call it what you will..... Apr 29 03:22:57 cphelps, and I can't take seriously a language which not just lacks, but for some philosophical reason which I not only don't understand but which strikes me as religious, lacks a case statement. :) Apr 29 03:23:30 rick-home: I wouldn't use one if they had one, so that's not a loss for me :-) Apr 29 03:23:36 basically tho, it just doesn't fit my brain. I've tried. I failed. Fortunately, there are other languages. :) Apr 29 03:23:49 rick-home: are you really in Corvallis? Apr 29 03:24:01 I'm in Topeka Kansas Apr 29 03:24:17 you mean Google, KS? Apr 29 03:24:21 rick-home: why does whois say Corvallis Or? Apr 29 03:24:28 I have no idea. Apr 29 03:24:36 yes, google kansas sorry. Apr 29 03:25:02 rick-home: lame, that's just your freenode server, my bad. I remembered you being midwestern Apr 29 03:26:02 Look, when I was making the transition from linear structured code to object oriented code, the languages I was working in did not distinguish between classes and objects. An object can have both properties AND methods. Properties can be public OR private. You can therefore, pass a function TO a function. When I encountered Javascript, my little heart went pitter pat because it was just like home. Apr 29 03:26:27 java just confuses me. Apr 29 03:26:52 java is horrible Apr 29 03:26:53 rick-home: horses for courses, and more importantly, to each his own Apr 29 03:27:12 exactly. And for me -- java -- Ick -- shudder. Apr 29 03:27:20 rick-home: however, blocking out a whole fat ton of pre-written software from running on a device is ill conceived Apr 29 03:27:24 I understand that this is not the case for others. Apr 29 03:27:25 rick-home: i won't even ask you about python ;) Apr 29 03:27:28 it wreaks of apple stupidity Apr 29 03:27:29 I like java based on case by case, otherwise I preffer c Apr 29 03:27:44 I hate having to know huge command strings Apr 29 03:28:02 cphelps: webos is not like other frameworks, supporting java is backwards and too far abstracted, it just doesn't make sense Apr 29 03:28:04 300 400 chars long, 10 or 15 parts ick Apr 29 03:28:09 CTLAdvance: C plus a nice toolkit like GTK is everything a person needs Apr 29 03:28:11 a jvm is too fat for an embedded device .. case in point: all the oom errors Apr 29 03:28:21 zsoc: as a phone I agree. As a tablet, I don't Apr 29 03:28:33 Python, -structurally- is a facinating language. Whomever decided to use syntatically meaninful white space in a language was an obsessive compulsive neatfreak who should have had his keyboard rubbed in dog doodoo until he understood the problem. Apr 29 03:28:34 Yeah C actually overtook Java now as top language Apr 29 03:29:05 cphelps: I agree with you there. However, by the time that manifests (a year?), HTML5/css3/canvas will be replacing flash/java Apr 29 03:29:16 oh, don't forget webGL :> Apr 29 03:29:28 with hardware accelerated WebGL Apr 29 03:29:41 and flying unicorns and rainbows Apr 29 03:30:10 i my opinion flash will be totally dead in 2 years Apr 29 03:30:12 I cant wait to get a HP WebOS Slate, should be easy to dual boot it to your productive os linux or windows Apr 29 03:30:21 and have webOS for everything else Apr 29 03:30:30 zsoc: you're still thinking a little too high level. I agree that those things need to exist for the less advanced user Apr 29 03:30:52 zsoc: but I like me a debugger with breakpoints and watches Apr 29 03:30:58 cphelps: I'm writing a service right now in C. Trust me, I hate abstraction as much as the next guy, but this is the way things are going. Apr 29 03:31:31 zsoc: They don't have to go any particular way. A JVM on snapdragon's 1GHz is plenty fast Apr 29 03:31:34 cphelps, are you aware that we not GOT a debugger with breakpoints and watches in Javascript on the palm? Apr 29 03:31:44 cphelps: and that's why Android exists :) Apr 29 03:31:55 rick-home: i didn't even know that? lol Apr 29 03:32:01 rick-home: not really Apr 29 03:32:05 Android exists until MS sues for pantent money Apr 29 03:32:10 which they will get Apr 29 03:32:14 rick-home: I haven't written any pre code since like november Apr 29 03:32:18 or earlier even Apr 29 03:32:28 ok it wont die Apr 29 03:32:29 zsoc, open an emulator. Bring up an app. Go to http://ares.palm.com/AresDebug Apr 29 03:32:36 yup, good stuff Apr 29 03:32:41 but MS will make a ton from google Apr 29 03:32:41 watch a full function emulator open which you can run against your app. Apr 29 03:33:03 very veyr cool, and in a "soon to be released" webos version, ditto against the real physical device Apr 29 03:33:18 rick-home: holy crap Apr 29 03:33:28 rick-home: why does one not know about this? Apr 29 03:33:32 rick-home: It's a nice honkey way to do stuff, but it's not really my preference Apr 29 03:33:40 and then there was Lemketron's revelation of Palm Host Mode, Mojo running IN YOUR WEBKIT BROWSER Apr 29 03:33:42 it was announced at the palm developer days too Apr 29 03:33:57 don't you guys read precentral .. eh .. hpcentral Apr 29 03:34:13 IDE's that require webaccess are not really my thing. Apr 29 03:34:18 don't you pay any attention at all to the liveblogging and twitters from Palm dev days? Apr 29 03:34:36 cphelps, As far as palm is concerned the web wins. Period. Apr 29 03:34:46 host mode has been around since 1.4.x i think Apr 29 03:34:54 the ares debugger is buggy Apr 29 03:34:59 swisstomcat it wasn't fully enabled. Apr 29 03:35:00 very cool to dabble around in your app with chrome developer tools Apr 29 03:35:03 rick-home: Palm isn't palm anymore Apr 29 03:35:05 it should improve over time Apr 29 03:35:06 how so CTLAdvance? Apr 29 03:35:20 Code runs differently for me in it then on the device Apr 29 03:35:32 rick-home: they may be making their own decisions now, but having a tablet that can't run any applications from any other platforms isn't what HP wants Apr 29 03:35:39 with the ares debugger you can even look at the palm apps Apr 29 03:35:41 the ares stand alone debugger is the result of an individual's 20% project. Apr 29 03:35:45 rick-home: and more importantly, it isn't what HP needs Apr 29 03:36:03 cphelps -- we shall see. Apr 29 03:36:03 Basically on the call, they will have an HP WebOS Slate, I listened to it live Apr 29 03:36:17 what does hp need, a slate running windows 7? Apr 29 03:36:19 so did I and that was my understanding as well. Apr 29 03:36:31 I would take a 7 slate Apr 29 03:36:34 windows mobile7 not full win7 Apr 29 03:36:40 rick-home: They aren't apple and they don't have 70,000 apps. A slate without an FTP client would be retarded Apr 29 03:36:44 no it would be full win 7 Apr 29 03:36:44 or at least, that was my understanding. Apr 29 03:36:56 kk Apr 29 03:37:13 they could call it the HP Foleo Slate Apr 29 03:37:13 did you read the reviews of those archos tablets running win 7? not pretty Apr 29 03:37:21 or Fooleo Apr 29 03:37:22 cphelps, an ftp client on webos would take about 3 hours of work once they allow me to write javascript services. Apr 29 03:37:44 rick-home: is javascript really going to be faster than bytecode java? Apr 29 03:37:49 no. Apr 29 03:37:51 The hp slate I saw at CES was sweet Apr 29 03:37:57 cphelps; Palm isn't palm anymore <-- this is very true. Apr 29 03:38:20 dpivs: it's just the truth. Palm was making a killer platform, but I think it will expand now Apr 29 03:38:22 cphelps, but it's going to have a substantially lower memory footprint than a JVM to run small services. Apr 29 03:38:46 rick-home: or ones that need to trigger real quick and then go chill out in the background again Apr 29 03:38:50 HP Needs to take there same win 7 slate, and make it as a webOS slate. it would be awesome. Maybe get rid of the HD and go with flash Apr 29 03:39:00 rick-home: I can see that. Lacking a compiler is my real problem, and one that I don't know how to fix. Maybe that is my problem though. Apr 29 03:39:01 javascript interpreted/compiled by the v8 javascript engine should be plenty fast Apr 29 03:39:10 cphelps: i see what you mean, i was thinking more along the lines of how nearly everyone that started w/ palm (dubinsky and hawkins) are now gone. Apr 29 03:39:27 Did anyone here actually listen to the conf call? Apr 29 03:39:33 I did Apr 29 03:39:49 um, hi Apr 29 03:39:52 uggggh Apr 29 03:40:01 hi2u Apr 29 03:40:11 hello Apr 29 03:40:26 hey nebula Apr 29 03:40:31 sup Apr 29 03:40:37 cphelps, that's my point, you didn't have a compiler. If you are in webos you HAVE v8 running. So there's no memory hit for v8. Jvm, not so much. If you can find a java compiler to native ARM code, then that's different, write the java apps, as long as their binaries, the pdk clearance routines don't care. Apr 29 03:40:39 Yeah the call explained alot... esp about the company, same players, same palm employees, just a better hardware division and more $$$ Apr 29 03:40:54 CTLAdvance: I did Apr 29 03:41:07 Also Java is a horrible memory pig, and is actually can be slower deppending on it usage compared to Java Apr 29 03:41:13 JS** Apr 29 03:41:15 and the statement that the current research funding going into webOS is "no where near enough and we will be substantially increasing that." Apr 29 03:41:28 Java is still interpreted on device, its not bytecode like c Apr 29 03:41:53 CTLAdvance: I think you are mistaken Apr 29 03:42:02 it gets compiled so the JVM can read it, then processed into machine code Apr 29 03:42:06 CTLAdvance: C NEVER being bytecode Apr 29 03:42:09 it's not native machine language like c, it IS bytecode running in the JVM. Apr 29 03:42:19 C is native machine language when compiled Apr 29 03:42:30 right Apr 29 03:42:49 well thats what I meant to say sorry I mis typed :D Apr 29 03:42:57 CTLAdvance: gotcha Apr 29 03:42:58 Java is run through the JVM Apr 29 03:43:01 but java gets fast when JIT compilers are used Apr 29 03:43:12 bpadalino: thank you Apr 29 03:43:13 which then turns certain portions of java into native code Apr 29 03:43:14 That' Apr 29 03:43:14 and that slows it down alot, especially when you have complex commands Apr 29 03:43:34 That is what has been missing on webos Apr 29 03:43:45 Yeah but its still slower and is a memory hog Apr 29 03:43:54 so, there's jnc and gcj that compiles java to native code Apr 29 03:43:57 CTLAdvance: if you ran an android phone with and without a JIT, you'd sing a different tune Apr 29 03:43:59 Have you ever use solaris for an extended period of time Apr 29 03:44:25 well obviously one is more hardware intensive then the other Apr 29 03:44:37 CTLAdvance: nope. I dev'd linux for 4 years, and the Windows the last 8 sadly Apr 29 03:45:07 woman says stop typing and start eating. I'll be back for some more abuse later folks Apr 29 03:45:08 Well I have used solaris for some time and its horrible slow, especially if its not run on a sweet sweet sparc machine Apr 29 03:46:02 I almost bought an ultra sparc machine a few years back. I am glad I didnt... Apr 29 03:47:07 I had an ultra 10... was free Apr 29 03:47:46 Wow, everytime I inquired about one they wanted between 5 - 10k based on my setup Apr 29 03:47:47 then I moved and had to give it and my PowerMac G3 beige tower :( Apr 29 03:47:52 I tried one, and sent it back Apr 29 03:48:09 it was very nice... ill have to look up what it was. Apr 29 03:49:11 that sucks Apr 29 03:52:23 ultra sparc 5 workstation on ebay for $23.75 Apr 29 03:53:11 I knew someone that had a beowulf cluster of ultra 10s in his closet Apr 29 03:53:27 ok, I've been thinking about this for a long time, and I have what I think is an organizing idea Apr 29 03:53:48 wow thats cheap Apr 29 03:53:58 are all of you old enough to remember the transition from green-screen programming and DOS to GUI event driven programming and mac/window/X ???? Apr 29 03:55:06 during the transition, there was a lot of code that sort of lived with feet in both worlds, it was really really dos software, but had a windows shell slapped over it for pretty, and writing it was a bitch, because the dos software wasn't event driven, and the windows stuff wasn't capable. Apr 29 03:55:12 ditto mac and x. Apr 29 03:55:16 i remember in dos i would type things to play games Apr 29 03:56:01 I remember playing duke nukem 1 and booting into dos when I was 4 Apr 29 03:56:16 and running some command to get it to start Apr 29 03:56:23 but then, in the 90's, visual studio, delphi, visual foxpro, eclipse, and other fully integrated GUI ide's with languages that were fully event driven and had full knowledge of the gui arose and software took off Apr 29 03:56:35 I miss borland Apr 29 03:56:46 and consultants made a lot of money for a decade writing stuff in those languages that small and medium sized businesses needed. Apr 29 03:57:09 During the 2000's, the web is undergoing the same transition. Old style web pages are the equivalent of dos. Apr 29 03:57:39 Hand-coded ajax pages without good widget based and UI and system based toolkits are the equivalent of those "feet in both worlds" apps. Apr 29 03:57:41 you mean with frames and thingys Apr 29 03:58:15 Ares, and Sproutcore, and nodeJS and jquery and dojo provide the "third level" for web turning web apps into first-class citizens Apr 29 03:58:49 ok guys, im sure this is just something simple/dumb, but what's wrong with this? http://pastie.org/940369 Apr 29 03:59:01 and giving devs like me the opportunity to write apps that provide needed custom services to our end users for amounts that are profitable for me, and reasonable for them, just like we could do in VB, or Delphi, or whatever on the desktop. Apr 29 04:00:04 BigBiff_ uh, lots of things. What is it you're trying to do? Is this a mojo app? Is the target a mojo button? Or is this in ares? Apr 29 04:00:25 (in either case, the code is entirely wrong, just wrong in a different way?) Apr 29 04:00:33 hehe, "lots of things" Apr 29 04:00:48 the problem is, its in a row template Apr 29 04:00:52 with no id Apr 29 04:00:55 ahhhh Apr 29 04:00:56 ahhhh Apr 29 04:01:03 so your listener is on the list? Apr 29 04:01:10 dont know how to reference it by "name" Apr 29 04:01:15 yes Apr 29 04:01:45 ok, and you understand that in addition to a class that your div can have a name="RedButton" and that unlike ID's names are not required to be unique.... Apr 29 04:01:57 yes Apr 29 04:02:10 so event.target.Name? Apr 29 04:02:12 and you chose not to use a name, but rather to attempt to use the class? Apr 29 04:02:25 i'd rather use name Apr 29 04:02:57 ok then. event.target.name lower case. Apr 29 04:04:05 but wait, there's more. Apr 29 04:04:20 free slapchop? Apr 29 04:04:33 i can agree on the hand-written ajax/js being replaced by ide's like ares and frameworks, rick Apr 29 04:04:47 omg - wondered why event.target.name wouldnt work - ive tried dozen times Apr 29 04:04:56 i didnt give it a name Apr 29 04:04:59 wow Apr 29 04:05:11 SLAPCHOP Apr 29 04:05:16 that would be a problem. :) Apr 29 04:05:36 wow Apr 29 04:06:26 * swisstomcat calls the ghost(geist)busters Apr 29 04:06:27 Thanks markus, Apr 29 04:06:43 you'll love my nuts Apr 29 04:06:48 I'm very very impressed with sproutcore. Apr 29 04:07:13 although i like hand-written ajax/js ... but using ide's and framworks is probably more productive Apr 29 04:07:26 frameworks Apr 29 04:07:27 and I'm starting to get a handle on what actually HAPPENS in ares. Apr 29 04:07:31 hark - name is nogo Apr 29 04:08:11 Is there a tutorial somewhere for making lists with itemsCallback? Apr 29 04:08:38 yes. Apr 29 04:08:56 geist: you weren't kidding when you said the gpu in the pixi was pretty good .. according to that slide from the dev days, it pretty much beats out the pre in most everything Apr 29 04:09:04 yep Apr 29 04:09:07 look, what you do is add a listener to the widget (button's) div listening for Mojo.Event.ListTap Apr 29 04:09:13 it's a good design Apr 29 04:09:49 then, what you have to do is chase the reference to the MODEL object or look at event.target to figure out WHICH list item was tapped. Apr 29 04:10:11 i've got that setup Apr 29 04:10:25 geist, yeah - so now i'm checking out used pixi plus' Apr 29 04:10:30 and i can log it to className Apr 29 04:10:39 but not name Apr 29 04:10:48 on which slides was that noted with the pixi gpu? Apr 29 04:11:00 rick-home: Do you know where it is? Apr 29 04:11:00 swisstomcat: http://www.slideshare.net/fpatton/tremblay-chris-optimizing-3d-with-hw-palm-dev-day slide 7 Apr 29 04:11:20 ah, didn't go to that presentation Apr 29 04:11:59 thanks Apr 29 04:12:01 np Apr 29 04:14:28 ok, so i gave up and used id in the template - bad thing? Apr 29 04:14:47 theres only one button in the list so... Apr 29 04:14:55 in this case i'm ok Apr 29 04:15:02 but if were to want more than one Apr 29 04:15:27 uh, have you looked at http://webos101.com/List_Widget_With_Checkbox_Example Apr 29 04:15:36 ya Apr 29 04:16:02 didnt quite fit my case, cause i dont want the widget in every row Apr 29 04:16:11 huh!?!?!??! Apr 29 04:16:16 you should have said that up front. Apr 29 04:16:21 oh Apr 29 04:16:21 Where is the widget then? Apr 29 04:16:22 hehe Apr 29 04:16:33 I mean, the complexity is that it's in every row. Apr 29 04:16:37 where is your button? Apr 29 04:17:12 it's in one row now [3] in the list Apr 29 04:17:57 if i could just figure out how to reference it by name, then im golden Apr 29 04:17:58 is there ever only going to be one? Apr 29 04:18:13 depends on the list Apr 29 04:18:26 then why not write the code to assume that there's one in every box? Apr 29 04:19:20 i dunno - i guess its unnecessary in this stage Apr 29 04:19:28 but but but Apr 29 04:19:35 in this stage of development i should say Apr 29 04:19:37 two is every bit as bad as 134 Apr 29 04:19:49 ya Apr 29 04:20:06 so write it write from the beginning and build your sample list to have >1 button Apr 29 04:21:26 i could as it stands now with some tweaking in the array Apr 29 04:21:30 but Apr 29 04:21:42 hehehehe Apr 29 04:21:52 I've SAID that but. It's _always_ wrong. Apr 29 04:22:04 i still am not able to reference the button isolated from the other area of the row Apr 29 04:22:09 1.4.1.1 vz just hit, all... Apr 29 04:22:23 well, follow the checkbox example. Apr 29 04:22:46 the checkbox doesnt say how to isolate the checkbox Apr 29 04:23:25 i need event.target.name to work Apr 29 04:23:36 and it aint workin for me Apr 29 04:24:31 so for now, while i only have one, im gonna give up and use id Apr 29 04:24:33 hehe Apr 29 04:32:58 took vzw long enough Apr 29 04:46:52 1.4.1.1 is downloading on my phone Apr 29 04:47:02 seems slow .... Apr 29 04:47:22 don't know if it will override the metadoctor so holding off Apr 29 04:52:27 good question Apr 29 04:55:57 guess i'll find out soon enough Apr 29 05:03:38 yeah, tell me if it does Apr 29 05:03:46 ill update if it is Apr 29 05:15:45 updating ... Apr 29 05:25:27 so far so good, halfhalo Apr 29 05:34:33 i'm off, good night Apr 29 05:35:19 ugh Apr 29 05:35:28 why will event.target.name not work? Apr 29 05:35:40 event.target.id- great Apr 29 05:35:49 event.target.className - works too Apr 29 05:35:56 event.target.name - suckage Apr 29 05:38:45 BigBiff_: why do you need "event.target.name"? Apr 29 05:39:07 to hit a button in a list row Apr 29 05:40:06 i cant use className because it doesnt like the space for multiple class selectors Apr 29 05:40:46 "name" is referring to what? Apr 29 05:41:00 name of button div Apr 29 05:41:12 cant use id in the row template Apr 29 05:41:51 what does the code look like for your "row template"? Apr 29 05:43:34 BigBiff_: why can't u use id? Apr 29 05:44:07 id has to be unique, and the rows are not unique Apr 29 05:44:18 at least, thats what all the docs say Apr 29 05:45:03 ive tried to look at the messaging app in the sample Apr 29 05:45:11 i didn't name was a normal attribute of div Apr 29 05:45:17 but that's like trying to decipher tax law Apr 29 05:45:37 what is it for, like a tap or something? Apr 29 05:45:43 sure, name works fine in most cases Apr 29 05:45:46 yes Apr 29 05:45:54 do rows look like "

row 1

row 2

?? Apr 29 05:45:59 a tap apart from the rest of the row it's on Apr 29 05:46:11 no, im using template Apr 29 05:46:20 apart from the row? Apr 29 05:46:30 http://pastie.org/940435 Apr 29 05:46:37 ya Apr 29 05:46:56 if i only have one row with the button, i can use id Apr 29 05:47:06 and event.target.id works great Apr 29 05:47:56 what is #moreMojo doing? Apr 29 05:48:11 BigBiff_: yeah id needs to be unique Apr 29 05:48:58 hehe, that's just to add tap-highlight junk Apr 29 05:49:09 well in quotes it wont do anything xD Apr 29 05:49:13 they'res a spot for that in my array Apr 29 05:49:13 anyways Apr 29 05:49:25 actually, it works Apr 29 05:49:25 what are you trying to determine by looking at the name? Apr 29 05:49:48 probably dont need the quotes though Apr 29 05:49:59 actually i did Apr 29 05:50:12 event.target.name Apr 29 05:50:35 to try and get whats on line 7? Apr 29 05:50:53 this is an experiment Apr 29 05:51:05 to get the button itself on the row Apr 29 05:51:15 and not the row title, etc Apr 29 05:52:01 so the button is on the side or something? Apr 29 05:52:56 ya Apr 29 05:53:05 custom button really Apr 29 05:53:22 no idea how else to do it Apr 29 05:53:34 ive seen it done on other apps, such as the messaging app Apr 29 05:53:46 so something like this: http://www.webos-internals.org/images/5/5a/Wirc.png Apr 29 05:54:14 hehe, yes Apr 29 05:54:32 how are the buttons targeted? Apr 29 05:54:41 you still listen to the listTap Apr 29 05:54:46 but you give the button a distinct class Apr 29 05:54:53 http://git.webos-internals.org/?p=applications/wIRC.git;a=blob;f=app/assistants/server-list-assistant.js;h=1ad969c4373464eb6c1d6513c77b0eae85b432ee;hb=HEAD#l139 Apr 29 05:55:02 line 139 is the listTap handler for that list Apr 29 05:55:20 it checks if the className for the original target includes what we're looking for Apr 29 05:55:23 ya Apr 29 05:55:25 and acts accordingly Apr 29 05:55:38 i used className before - but there's a space due to multiples Apr 29 05:55:45 its ok Apr 29 05:55:50 i guess "includes" fixes that? Apr 29 05:55:58 ise className.includes('classtofind') Apr 29 05:56:00 use* Apr 29 05:56:13 er, include Apr 29 05:56:14 also Apr 29 05:56:19 no s at the end Apr 29 05:56:19 ahhhhhh Apr 29 05:56:24 that was the missing element Apr 29 05:56:29 :) Apr 29 05:56:34