**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Oct 07 02:59:56 2010
Oct 07 03:31:42 <Bmyers> shhhh... trying to sleep
Oct 07 03:31:52 <halfhalo> lol
Oct 07 03:33:21 <renegaid> so palm is releasing another palm pre like device. who is excited about this?
Oct 07 03:33:38 <SineOt> if it comes to sprint: HOLY SHIT AWESOME
Oct 07 03:33:43 <SineOt> if it goes to Verizon: eh
Oct 07 03:34:19 <Bmyers> did i miss something?
Oct 07 03:34:25 <Bmyers> where is the rumors page?
Oct 07 03:34:29 <renegaid> it does not make much sense to me
Oct 07 03:35:08 <SineOt> Bmyers: FCC outed the label for the P102EUE or something
Oct 07 03:35:12 <SineOt> an EU GSM device
Oct 07 03:35:21 <SineOt> same shape as the current Pre/Pre+ label
Oct 07 03:35:44 <SineOt> testing documents mention that it's running at 1GHz, uses the same back as the current Pre/Pre+, and operates with the current touchstones
Oct 07 03:35:49 <SineOt> but other than that, nothing much
Oct 07 03:36:05 <SineOt> it's confidential until March 7th, 2011, so it will be launching at or before that date
Oct 07 03:36:14 <Bmyers> hmm
Oct 07 03:36:21 <Bmyers> whats the rush..
Oct 07 03:37:47 <SineOt> what do you mean?
Oct 07 03:38:39 <Bmyers> sarcasm
Oct 07 03:49:30 <dohtem> why March 7th, 2011?
Oct 07 03:49:38 <dohtem> CES?
Oct 07 03:49:42 <SineOt> dunno
Oct 07 03:49:55 <halfhalo> ces is in jan
Oct 07 03:49:55 <SineOt> they requested 180 days confidentiality and submitted it on September 8th
Oct 07 03:50:15 <dohtem> ah
Oct 07 03:50:15 <SineOt> so if they don't release by that date, then the FCC will post all the photos and user manual for it
Oct 07 03:50:16 <SineOt> :p
Oct 07 03:50:28 <radiofreejohn> luckily there are supposedly multiple devices, if it's just a faster palm pre, that is not super duper to me :P
Oct 07 03:50:51 <halfhalo> I want a landscape slider
Oct 07 03:50:53 <dohtem> they are making us wait this long... I'm sure it would kick ass
Oct 07 03:50:55 <halfhalo> I really do
Oct 07 03:50:57 <SineOt> yeah, given the HP VP saying "phones" and the mention of virtual keyboard in 2.0, I think there might be more than this
Oct 07 03:51:15 <SineOt> A Pre++, the rumored "Mansion" device, and then the tablet
Oct 07 03:51:53 <SineOt> Needs a Pixi++ c:
Oct 07 03:52:48 <radiofreejohn> if palm were apple i could see the wait being an anticipation thing but palm being palm, just bought by hp, the wait is more likely related to engineering and issues with the acquisition
Oct 07 03:52:58 <radiofreejohn> so i wouldn't count on it being a killer super killer phone :P
Oct 07 03:53:18 <SineOt> well, that's probably why the p102 is just a Pre++ :p
Oct 07 03:54:55 <dohtem> Pre++, now with moar gigs!
Oct 07 03:55:48 <SineOt> Pre++: now with 160GB 1.8" harddrive!
Oct 07 03:55:59 <Anivrom> no wai
Oct 07 03:56:06 <halfhalo> its got the gbs!
Oct 07 03:57:28 <SineOt> "The Pre just got Double Plus Good™"
Oct 07 03:58:34 <halfhalo> "The Pre plus plus.  Only on sprint.  SUCK IT VERIZION!"
Oct 07 03:58:48 <dohtem> how would the launcher swipe up if we get an onscreen keyboard?
Oct 07 03:59:19 <radiofreejohn> leave that to a UI designer :P
Oct 07 03:59:26 <Anivrom> Anyone know how to enable the arrows on the scroller widget?
Oct 07 03:59:46 <SineOt> dohtem: easy? have it pop up the onscreen keyboard when a text field was selected
Oct 07 04:00:00 <SineOt> (hint: that's probably why "just type" has a text field in the 2.0 betas)
Oct 07 04:00:24 <Anivrom> NDA?
Oct 07 04:00:49 <dohtem> SineOt: but isnt just type is supposed to let you just type... not hit the text field first
Oct 07 04:00:50 <dohtem> ?
Oct 07 04:01:14 <SineOt> Anivrom: I'm not under it, and the pictures have been posted on Engadget, etc :p
Oct 07 04:01:49 <SineOt> dohtem: if you have a physical keyboard, yeah, but that's really the only logistical reason I can think that they'd add the just type field
Oct 07 04:02:13 <SineOt> would be that the on screen keyboard will turn on when you enter a text field
Oct 07 04:02:32 <SineOt> (or press a hardware key which might be the other option, or tap a drawer icon)
Oct 07 04:02:49 <radiofreejohn> maybe it can tell when you are about to type and the virtual keyboard pops out using mind control
Oct 07 04:02:56 <dohtem> meh, the less hardware keys, the better
Oct 07 04:03:21 <dohtem> the launcher can have a permanent keyboard icon?
Oct 07 04:10:31 <SineOt> power, volume, and keyboard wouldn't be that bad
Oct 07 04:10:54 <SineOt> since you're getting rid of like, 34 of them by removing the keyboard :V
Oct 07 05:44:14 <pandora--> evenin
Oct 07 05:56:11 <swisstomcat> morning
Oct 07 06:57:17 <pandora--> what's a good way to make a page header "tappable"?
Oct 07 06:57:41 <pandora--> i know i can listen to the div, but, I also want to give UI feedback that it's been tapped (to popup a selection menu)
Oct 07 07:02:44 <pandora--> ah, found a good sample in stylematters
Oct 07 07:02:45 <pandora--> sweet
Oct 07 07:05:28 <swisstomcat> morning pandora
Oct 07 07:07:55 <hotdp> good morning
Oct 07 07:08:03 <torchie> eyo
Oct 07 07:08:16 <swisstomcat> morning hotdp and torchie
Oct 07 07:08:23 <torchie> hey hey
Oct 07 07:58:56 <pandora--> stupid json question
Oct 07 07:59:04 <pandora--> if I have {foo: 'bar'}
Oct 07 07:59:21 <pandora--> how can I append stuff: 'whatever' to that?
Oct 07 07:59:34 <pandora--> so that I would have {foo: 'bar', stuff: 'whatever'}
Oct 07 08:06:30 <pandora--> nnnnmmmm
Oct 07 08:06:52 <oil> yes
Oct 07 08:09:22 <pandora--> yeah that was pretty dumb
Oct 07 08:17:26 <hotdp> My pre is funky
Oct 07 08:17:35 <hotdp> i can see its off.. hmm i turns it back on
Oct 07 08:17:43 <hotdp> and the date is wrong with 270 days?
Oct 07 08:17:49 <hotdp> This is not the first time.-.
Oct 07 08:19:25 <swisstomcat> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f8PJQ6FCHq4
Oct 07 08:19:40 <hotdp> ohh yeer
Oct 07 08:27:11 <k-> swisscat: you funny, funny man..
Oct 07 10:02:24 <swisstomcat> rehi
Oct 07 10:03:04 <hotdp> welcome back swisstomcat
Oct 07 11:08:44 <swisstomcat> i'm testing the jo and unify mobile frameworks
Oct 07 11:11:17 <jettero> jo.vortex ?
Oct 07 11:11:38 <swisstomcat> joapp.com
Oct 07 11:18:00 <hotdp> swisstomcat i am looking at thoose framworks
Oct 07 11:18:07 <hotdp> what is your first thoughts?
Oct 07 11:18:28 <swisstomcat> just working on creating helloWorld with unify
Oct 07 11:18:53 <hotdp> oki, what do you think until now`?
Oct 07 11:19:06 <swisstomcat> haven't gotten that far yet
Oct 07 11:19:38 <hotdp> tell me when you are :D
Oct 07 11:21:40 <swisstomcat> yeah
Oct 07 12:10:03 <swisstomcat> yay
Oct 07 12:10:29 <swisstomcat> got helloWorld with unify to run on webOS
Oct 07 12:11:18 <hotdp> How what it?
Oct 07 12:15:06 <hotdp> was*
Oct 07 12:19:33 <swisstomcat> see tweet
Oct 07 12:20:31 <swisstomcat> http://yfrog.com/74l5kp
Oct 07 12:31:43 <Bmyers> nice swisstomcat
Oct 07 12:31:51 <Bmyers> system 1.3 ?
Oct 07 12:31:57 <Bmyers> time to update your emu
Oct 07 12:32:02 <hotdp> is that link unidied?
Oct 07 12:32:17 <Bmyers> that did not work on android when i tried it
Oct 07 12:32:18 <swisstomcat> bmyers: probably from the user agent string that says webOS/1.3
Oct 07 12:32:29 <Bmyers> broswer you mean?
Oct 07 12:32:33 <swisstomcat> i had to hack it a bit (browser detection)
Oct 07 12:35:57 <swisstomcat> http://yfrog.com/0mhirp
Oct 07 12:36:01 <swisstomcat> jo works well
Oct 07 12:36:02 <hotdp> swisstomcat can i see the source code?
Oct 07 12:36:03 <swisstomcat> without hacking
Oct 07 12:36:37 <swisstomcat> hotdp: of what?
Oct 07 12:37:12 <hotdp> Both :D
Oct 07 12:37:59 <hotdp> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMNsXCqbQHk <-- is that jo app ? :P
Oct 07 12:43:13 <teemu> Hi
Oct 07 12:47:53 <hotdp> hi teemu
Oct 07 13:04:06 <swisstomcat> hehe
Oct 07 13:04:21 <swisstomcat> hotdp: both projects are on github
Oct 07 13:07:37 <hotdp> do you a link?
Oct 07 13:07:58 <swisstomcat> joapp.com
Oct 07 13:08:01 <hotdp> And do you have any conclusion on using it for my "project" ?
Oct 07 13:08:12 <swisstomcat> not yet
Oct 07 13:08:25 <swisstomcat> i just tried the two included sample apps, nothing fancy
Oct 07 13:08:40 <hotdp> you will work som more on it? or both?
Oct 07 13:08:54 <swisstomcat> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOjfKA23Of8
Oct 07 13:09:03 <swisstomcat> a jo screencast with an app
Oct 07 13:09:11 <swisstomcat> i'll hack around in both
Oct 07 13:10:08 <Deihmos> Is it a good idea for palm to release another device with same form as the Pre
Oct 07 13:10:39 <swisstomcat> yeah
Oct 07 13:10:39 <hotdp> why?
Oct 07 13:10:52 <swisstomcat> deihmos: yeah, as a hold-over until 2011
Oct 07 13:11:00 <hotdp> Its good if they release more later. i need a larger screen in the long term
Oct 07 13:11:25 <Deihmos> More like a waste of money until 2011
Oct 07 13:11:41 <hotdp> hmm you have not seen it?
Oct 07 13:11:51 <hotdp> maybe larger resoltion?
Oct 07 13:12:25 <Deihmos> If it is really same form as pre that would be disappointing
Oct 07 13:12:43 <hotdp> relax
Oct 07 13:12:50 <hotdp> there will be other models
Oct 07 13:12:59 <hotdp> Maybe the first has same form..
Oct 07 13:13:29 <Deihmos> does webos 2.0 have gpu acceleration for the ui?
Oct 07 13:13:55 <swisstomcat> i think so
Oct 07 13:14:08 <swisstomcat> that's what they said at the dev days
Oct 07 13:14:17 <swisstomcat> hw animated css transistions too
Oct 07 13:17:13 <warpdesign__> hi there
Oct 07 13:17:28 <warpdesign__> just ready the history: what's "unify" ?
Oct 07 13:21:51 <hotdp> swisstomcat i am looking at the video, looking good!
Oct 07 13:22:21 <hotdp> but does it run on ipad`?
Oct 07 13:25:41 <swisstomcat> it should
Oct 07 13:25:47 <swisstomcat> you can use phonegap
Oct 07 13:26:04 <swisstomcat> warpdesign: http://github.com/unify/unify
Oct 07 13:31:37 <Deihmos> That's good to hear. So hopefully webos will b just as fast as ios and android
Oct 07 13:46:10 <hotdp> swisstomcat how complete do you fell jo is?
Oct 07 13:46:26 <swisstomcat> hard to tell, i'm working on unify at the moment
Oct 07 13:46:42 <swisstomcat> from what i've seen it looks very nice and clean
Oct 07 13:46:59 <swisstomcat> the creator of jo was a webos developer before he joined palm
Oct 07 13:51:29 <HattCzech_work> morning, all
Oct 07 13:56:51 <hotdp> morning
Oct 07 14:15:18 <swisstomcat> morning hattczech
Oct 07 14:19:46 <HattCzech_work> hey swisstomcat... random question...
Oct 07 14:19:52 <HattCzech_work> since you are in switzerland :)
Oct 07 14:19:53 <swisstomcat> random answer :)
Oct 07 14:20:08 <HattCzech_work> can you get victorinox knives cheaper there?
Oct 07 14:20:19 <swisstomcat> i can check for you
Oct 07 14:20:19 <HattCzech_work> i remember when i was there last they seemed to be cheaper than here
Oct 07 14:20:29 <swisstomcat> which one are you looking for?
Oct 07 14:20:40 <HattCzech_work> i'm looking for the manager pocket knife in sapphire
Oct 07 14:20:53 <hotdp> lol
Oct 07 14:21:55 <swisstomcat> CHF 27
Oct 07 14:22:18 <HattCzech_work> meh, about the same
Oct 07 14:22:22 <HattCzech_work> well, more :)
Oct 07 14:22:29 <HattCzech_work> amazon has it for $22
Oct 07 14:22:33 <swisstomcat> yeah, switzerland is expensive
Oct 07 14:22:53 <HattCzech_work> i figured since they were made there, it'd be cheaper
Oct 07 14:23:03 <HattCzech_work> the whole "buying local goods" thing
Oct 07 14:23:17 <swisstomcat> doesn't seem like it
Oct 07 14:23:24 <swisstomcat> unless they have like a factory store
Oct 07 14:24:47 <HattCzech_work> i must find that place the next time i visit ;)
Oct 07 14:26:53 <mfisch> My guess is that it will not be cheaper because the Swiss Franc has gone way up relative to other currencies
Oct 07 14:27:12 <HattCzech_work> valid point
Oct 07 14:28:04 <swisstomcat> there's a factory outlet in maienfeld
Oct 07 14:28:31 <Anivrom|pre> Grrrr none of my code changes in internalz are affecting my app. Its almost as if its not saving at all, yet it is cause when I exit and open the file again my changes are there.
Oct 07 14:34:56 <sugardave> woo, 5-star review (the only one) for Scan Do!...we'll see how long that lasts :D
Oct 07 14:35:42 <Anivrom|pre> Heh
Oct 07 14:36:35 * haeffb_pre dl's just to give a 0-star rating
Oct 07 14:36:53 <sugardave> I have your address
Oct 07 14:37:39 <Anivrom|pre> I'll give you a 0 but I'll append in my comment "will give 5 stars if it bakes cookies"
Oct 07 14:38:25 <sugardave> heh, I even got a request for Mind Master...totally forgot to go back and change the distribution options to worldwide
Oct 07 14:39:49 <swisstomcat> ruh, roh
Oct 07 14:40:08 <Anivrom|pre> This app I created yesterday refuses to accept my code changes in internalz....
Oct 07 14:43:10 <sugardave> I will hold off on the worldwide release of Yule Log until the next update (coming soon)
Oct 07 14:43:57 <hotdp> sugardave wht app ?
Oct 07 14:44:30 <sugardave> ummm...which one?
Oct 07 14:44:50 <sugardave> oh Yule Log?
Oct 07 14:45:07 <sugardave> the joke/experiment app....I've actually got a decent update planned for it soon
Oct 07 14:45:22 <sugardave> but it's US-only right now
Oct 07 14:45:34 <hotdp> dammit!
Oct 07 14:45:44 <sugardave> In a few weeks it will be worldwide :D
Oct 07 14:46:20 <sugardave> oh no
Oct 07 14:46:31 <sugardave> I think I have just messed up Mind Master
Oct 07 14:46:34 <sugardave> crap
Oct 07 14:46:49 <sugardave> I had an old rejection for 1.1.0, and my published 1.1.0
Oct 07 14:47:11 <sugardave> so I updated metadata on the published one, and now I have "Rejection pending" on the rejected one :S
Oct 07 14:47:48 <Anivrom|pre> That's ok sugardave no one will miss it
Oct 07 14:47:55 <sugardave> this European guy will
Oct 07 14:48:03 <Anivrom|pre> Lol.
Oct 07 14:48:05 <sugardave> he tracked down my precentral post to let me know he couldn't get it
Oct 07 14:48:13 <sugardave> that's dedication right there
Oct 07 14:48:22 <Anivrom|pre> He won't cause he's not using it as it is
Oct 07 14:48:25 <swisstomcat> yeah!
Oct 07 14:48:39 <swisstomcat> don't forget your european brothers and sisters
Oct 07 14:48:57 <sugardave> perhaps the magic of the improved portal will overcome this problem and I won't have to worry about it
Oct 07 14:49:08 <sugardave> swisstomcat: all my apps I make now go worldwide
Oct 07 14:49:15 <sugardave> I just don't do any translations :D
Oct 07 14:49:20 <swisstomcat> bah
Oct 07 14:49:38 <sugardave> though I HAVE started putting in $L() in the new stuff
Oct 07 14:49:43 <sugardave> to get ready
Oct 07 14:49:47 <swisstomcat> i'll go ahead and create some german apps with US-only
Oct 07 14:49:50 <Anivrom|pre> I'm creating a helper app for this tabletop game for myself and my wife wants me to publish it as a joke
Oct 07 14:49:54 <sugardave> heh
Oct 07 14:49:55 <swisstomcat> with german-swear-words
Oct 07 14:50:15 <sugardave> Anivrom|pre: people will download anything
Oct 07 14:50:24 <swisstomcat> heh ... http://twitter.com/html5douche
Oct 07 14:50:40 <swisstomcat> "CANVAS? THAT REMINDS ME OF MY DADS HUGE FAILING SAILBOAT."
Oct 07 14:50:41 <Anivrom|pre> Apparntly. How many dl's does yule log have?
Oct 07 14:50:52 <sugardave> 500+
Oct 07 14:51:12 <sugardave> swisstomcat: that's pretty funny
Oct 07 14:51:18 <Anivrom|pre> Dang. Ppl really DO download anything
Oct 07 14:51:38 <swisstomcat> "ME AND SVG HAVE HAD A THING FOR A WHILE NOW BRO. I DIDN'T TELL YOU BECAUSE I DIDN'T THINK YOU WOULD RENDER IT."
Oct 07 14:51:40 <Anivrom|pre> I actually know the developer of "this app does nothing"
Oct 07 14:52:13 <sugardave> oh actually
Oct 07 14:52:17 <sugardave> Yule Log is only at 261
Oct 07 14:52:33 <sugardave> still, for about 15 minutes worth of work and one update, not too bad :D
Oct 07 14:52:47 <Anivrom|pre> I really wish my app would update when I change the code. It makes no sense
Oct 07 14:54:12 <Anivrom|pre> Yea lol
Oct 07 14:57:31 <Anivrom|pre> Ok so is there any reason why my helper app won't update when I edit the source but my main game will update when I edit the source?
Oct 07 14:58:47 <sugardave> voodoo?
Oct 07 14:59:01 <Anivrom|pre> -_-
Oct 07 15:10:23 <Bmyers> that html5douche guy looks likes shnookie's boyfriend on jersey shore
Oct 07 15:15:32 <hotdp> Bmyers 100%
Oct 07 15:16:12 <HattCzech_work> Bmyers: html5douce?
Oct 07 15:16:15 <HattCzech_work> douche*
Oct 07 15:16:56 <Bmyers> oops..
Oct 07 15:16:59 <Bmyers> yeah him..
Oct 07 15:31:32 <warpdesign__> anyone ever played with database html5 ?
Oct 07 15:36:21 <HattCzech_work> i did for a bit
Oct 07 15:36:27 <HattCzech_work> but then i switch to depot
Oct 07 15:36:33 <HattCzech_work> switched*
Oct 07 15:37:54 <sugardave> warpdesign__: I might know a thing or two
Oct 07 15:38:06 <warpdesign__> ok
Oct 07 15:38:14 <warpdesign__> well, I had the same kind of problem with depot iirc
Oct 07 15:38:58 <warpdesign__> problem is whenever I specify a version, I get a DOM exception when opening the database
Oct 07 15:39:01 <sugardave> warpdesign__: have you already looked at the wiki entries for Mojo db?
Oct 07 15:39:39 <warpdesign__> this is on chrome/safari, but I had the same behaviour on webOS when using the depot iirc
Oct 07 15:39:50 <sugardave> oh, I don't know anything about depot
Oct 07 15:39:55 <sugardave> I just use straight sqlite
Oct 07 15:40:03 <sugardave> and only in webOS
Oct 07 15:40:11 <warpdesign__> ok
Oct 07 15:40:23 <warpdesign__> window.openDatabase('warpklondike', version, "WarpKlondike Database", 1024 * 10);
Oct 07 15:40:28 <warpdesign__> this works when version is undefined
Oct 07 15:40:42 <warpdesign__> and fails with a DOM exception whenever I specify a version
Oct 07 15:40:51 <sugardave> as an integer or as a string?
Oct 07 15:41:18 <warpdesign__> tried both
Oct 07 15:41:45 <sugardave> hmm, string should be the one, that's odd...how about if you don't specify displayName (it's unused by webOS as far as I know)
Oct 07 15:42:02 <sugardave> oh
Oct 07 15:42:03 <sugardave> also
Oct 07 15:42:18 <sugardave> looks like you are trying to specify a 10MB db..that won't work for the default location
Oct 07 15:42:22 <warpdesign__> I'm trying this on a web browser, so there's no displayName involved here
Oct 07 15:42:24 <sugardave> limited to 5MB, I think?
Oct 07 15:42:26 <sugardave> maybe 1 MB
Oct 07 15:42:31 <sugardave> oh
Oct 07 15:43:01 <warpdesign__> hugh.. maxSize is specified in bytes
Oct 07 15:43:08 <warpdesign__> so that would be 10kb max
Oct 07 15:43:09 <sugardave> well, openDatabase (name, version, displayName, size) is what your command looks like
Oct 07 15:43:16 <sugardave> ah, okay
Oct 07 15:43:33 <warpdesign__> oops, yes, you're right
Oct 07 15:43:46 <warpdesign__> so you suggest an empty or undefined displayName ?
Oct 07 15:44:09 <sugardave> here's how I do it in webOS: openDatabase(name, version)
Oct 07 15:44:11 <sugardave> that's all
Oct 07 15:44:31 <warpdesign__> DOM Exception 11: An attempt was made to use an object that is not, or is no longer, usable.
Oct 07 15:44:42 <warpdesign__> this is what i get in chrome, and what I got in webos as well iirc
Oct 07 15:44:57 <sugardave> weird...I have no idea how it should behave in a browser, hang on a second
Oct 07 15:45:34 <warpdesign__> you can use whatever you want as version, right ?
Oct 07 15:45:41 <sugardave> warpdesign__: here's what I wrote up a LONG time ago about it http://webos101.com/Mojo_Storage_Database
Oct 07 15:46:03 <sugardave> warpdesign__: I think so, I use strings like '0.1' etc.
Oct 07 15:46:34 <warpdesign__> I was trying 1.0..
Oct 07 15:46:45 <sugardave> shouldn't matter
Oct 07 15:46:52 <sugardave> if it doesn't exist, it should make one
Oct 07 15:47:07 <sugardave> and if it can't find your version, it should use the 'last' one
Oct 07 15:47:18 <sugardave> versioning is something I haven't looked into
Oct 07 15:47:26 <warpdesign__> openDatabase('WarpKlondike', '1.0', "WarpKlondike Database", 1024 * 10);
Oct 07 15:47:36 <warpdesign__> this fails with the exception mentionned above..
Oct 07 15:48:43 <warpdesign__> but that works: openDatabase('WarpKlondike', undefined, "WarpKlondike Database", 1024 * 10);
Oct 07 15:49:48 <sugardave> yeah, that's weird...it does the same thing in Mojo?
Oct 07 15:51:36 <warpdesign__> think so, does have the emulator launched here
Oct 07 15:51:53 <warpdesign__> it seems that the first call (when the db doesn't exists) works
Oct 07 15:52:15 <warpdesign__> so if I try to access DB 'foo', version '1.0' and 'foo' doesn't exist, it will work, and create it
Oct 07 15:52:28 <sugardave> warpdesign__: and it makes the db?  did you verify with sqlite3?
Oct 07 15:52:35 <warpdesign__> then, if I try to open the '1.0' version, it will work, but any other version will throw an exception
Oct 07 15:52:46 <sugardave> that I have seen, yes
Oct 07 15:52:58 <sugardave> which is one reason I haven't ever changed my db versions :D
Oct 07 15:53:06 <warpdesign__> ok
Oct 07 15:53:09 <warpdesign__> but this is weird, right ?
Oct 07 15:53:15 <warpdesign__> is it supposed to behave like this ?
Oct 07 15:53:34 <sugardave> yeah, if no db exists, it should not fail on the first attempt to open it at whatever version you specify
Oct 07 15:53:47 <sugardave> warpdesign__: no, it should not behave like that
Oct 07 15:54:09 <warpdesign__> I mean: if no db exists, it will work.. if a db exist but you try to open (/create) another version, it will fail
Oct 07 15:54:35 <sugardave> if no db exists, does it work if you specify a version number?
Oct 07 15:54:51 <sugardave> THAT'S the part that is important
Oct 07 15:55:55 <warpdesign__> if no db exists it works
Oct 07 15:56:10 <warpdesign__> weather I specify a version or not
Oct 07 15:56:13 <sugardave> yes
Oct 07 15:56:15 <sugardave> that is correct
Oct 07 15:56:40 <sugardave> I don't think you can create a new version with openDatabase if one already exists
Oct 07 15:56:55 <sugardave> you have to do some weird changeVersion on an existing one to rev it
Oct 07 15:57:05 <warpdesign__> ah, right
Oct 07 15:57:25 <warpdesign__> I thought openDatabase created it if it didn't exist...
Oct 07 15:57:36 <sugardave> yeah, I thought that, too...but only the first time it seems
Oct 07 15:57:50 <warpdesign__> problem is by using undefined (not specifying the version), it will try to create a new db with the version set to "undefined" (the String)
Oct 07 15:58:02 <sugardave> yeah, don't do that
Oct 07 15:58:04 <sugardave> :D
Oct 07 15:58:05 <warpdesign__> so how do I load the latest version ? maybe null would work ?
Oct 07 15:58:23 <sugardave> warpdesign__: well, what is it that you are trying to accomplish?
Oct 07 15:58:31 <sugardave> do you NEED to update your db versions?
Oct 07 15:58:41 <warpdesign__> what if I have an app that just wants to check weather an existing db is present, without creating a new one ?
Oct 07 15:58:47 <warpdesign__> I will need it
Oct 07 15:58:52 <warpdesign__> right now, no
Oct 07 15:58:58 <sugardave> here's how I think it works
Oct 07 15:59:02 <warpdesign__> cause my data structures will change in the future
Oct 07 15:59:17 <sugardave> if you speciy an existing version in openDatabase, you will get that version
Oct 07 15:59:30 <sugardave> if it doesn't exist, it will fail with the DOM error you're getting
Oct 07 15:59:36 <sugardave> OR
Oct 07 15:59:41 <sugardave> it will be made if no other dbs exist
Oct 07 15:59:55 <warpdesign__> yes, that's it
Oct 07 16:00:13 <warpdesign__> now how do you think I could try to open the most recent version
Oct 07 16:00:21 <warpdesign__> ?
Oct 07 16:00:26 <sugardave> so, you will have to try the open, catch the error, and then update the old version's structure, do changeCersion on it
Oct 07 16:00:41 <sugardave> changeVersion
Oct 07 16:01:05 <warpdesign__> well, no... I mean: to get the error, I have to specify a version... now let's imagine I don't have one.. I just wanna know if any version is present...
Oct 07 16:01:15 <warpdesign__> how would I do that ?
Oct 07 16:01:24 <sugardave> you should always know the first version that would exist
Oct 07 16:01:38 <warpdesign__> well, I don't..
Oct 07 16:01:44 <sugardave> sure you do, you made it :D
Oct 07 16:01:54 <warpdesign__> let's imagine I release a first version of my app, which works with version 1...
Oct 07 16:02:01 <sugardave> okay
Oct 07 16:02:07 <sugardave> that's the first version, 1
Oct 07 16:02:08 <warpdesign__> then, I release a new version which works on version 2
Oct 07 16:02:16 <sugardave> right
Oct 07 16:02:28 <warpdesign__> and then a third one with version 3
Oct 07 16:02:51 <warpdesign__> how do I know which DB the user has ? user may have version 1, 2, 3, or known...
Oct 07 16:02:53 <sugardave> so in v2 app (which is an update), you check for v2 db...if it fails, you open v1, alter structure, changeVersion to 2
Oct 07 16:03:14 <warpdesign__> and in v3, I check for v1 and v2 ? and so on ?
Oct 07 16:03:27 <sugardave> in v3 app, similar thing, start with opening v3 db, if it fails, open v2 db, if it fails, open 1
Oct 07 16:03:30 <sugardave> yeah, I think so
Oct 07 16:03:32 <warpdesign__> not very practical.. but this is a solution...
Oct 07 16:03:45 <sugardave> yeah, it's a little clunky
Oct 07 16:04:44 <sugardave> oh
Oct 07 16:04:55 <sugardave> warpdesign__: if you don't specify a version, openDatabase should get you the last one
Oct 07 16:05:09 <sugardave> actually, I think there's only one
Oct 07 16:05:20 <sugardave> and then you can check the version number with a select statement
Oct 07 16:05:22 <sugardave> hold
Oct 07 16:05:36 <warpdesign__> yes, that's what I was thinking..
Oct 07 16:06:12 <warpdesign__> thought you could have different versions.. but actually there's only one.. this explains why trying to open a different version fails with that message..
Oct 07 16:06:18 <sugardave> select * from __WebKitDatabaseInfoTable__;
Oct 07 16:06:47 <sugardave> or select WebKitDatabaseVersionKey
Oct 07 16:06:54 <sugardave> that's all that's in there
Oct 07 16:07:25 <warpdesign__> yeah
Oct 07 16:07:32 <warpdesign__> thanks, I think I got it now
Oct 07 16:07:35 <sugardave> cool
Oct 07 16:08:24 <warpdesign__> once you have opened the DB, how do you check for the version opened ?
Oct 07 16:08:34 <sugardave> with that select
Oct 07 16:08:55 <sugardave> select WebKitDatabaseVersionKey from __WebKitDatabaseInfoTable__;
Oct 07 16:11:47 <warpdesign__> ok, thanks !
Oct 07 16:12:03 <warpdesign__> now let's see how to delete this version "undefined" from webkit :)
Oct 07 16:12:26 <sugardave> haha
Oct 07 16:12:29 <sugardave> good luck :D
Oct 07 16:12:42 <sugardave> you can just delete it from the filesystem
Oct 07 16:13:55 <warpdesign__> sure
Oct 07 16:14:12 <sugardave> chuqui: ping
Oct 07 16:14:27 <chuqui> sugardave:  pong
Oct 07 16:14:42 <sugardave> hey, I have something scary going on in my dev portal...
Oct 07 16:15:53 <sugardave> I had an old app rejection request for one of my published apps.  I just got around to updating the metadata on the published one to set it loose in the rest of the world, but after making my update on the published one, it is showing 'Rejection Pending' in the 'submitted apps' section
Oct 07 16:17:46 <sugardave> chuqui: ^^^^ (in case you were napping :P)
Oct 07 16:18:20 <chuqui> send me an email with the details, so I can forward to the review team to look at
Oct 07 16:18:28 <sugardave> will do, thanks
Oct 07 16:22:23 <chuqui> got it. forwarded.
Oct 07 16:23:09 <halfhalo> So, apparently, my campus sells packages of generic vanilla creme cookies
Oct 07 16:23:14 <halfhalo> they are AMAZING
Oct 07 16:23:14 <halfhalo> '
Oct 07 16:25:01 <sugardave> chuqui: thanks!
Oct 07 17:08:41 <teemu> Evening
Oct 07 17:09:34 <sugardave> hi
Oct 07 17:22:02 <sugardave> so, anybody who has requested consideration for a developer device...about how long until you got a response to your initial email?
Oct 07 17:29:08 <haeffb_pre> week
Oct 07 17:34:29 <sugardave> thanks
Oct 07 17:39:48 <HattCzech_work> sugardave: a couple days
Oct 07 17:40:10 <HattCzech_work> within 3 business days, it was on it's way
Oct 07 17:40:22 <HattCzech_work> arrived in maybe a little over a week?
Oct 07 18:00:09 <sugardave> HattCzech_work: nice, I'm still waiting for email :D
Oct 07 18:00:36 <sugardave> but it's fifo and I was late, so...
Oct 07 18:00:39 <HattCzech_work> this was also like a month ago, and it was less known :)
Oct 07 18:02:55 <bricks> Can someone try to help me with a problem?
Oct 07 18:10:11 <swisstomcat> go ahead
Oct 07 18:10:36 <swisstomcat> morning chuqui
Oct 07 18:12:21 <bricks> I'm trying to follow along with the tutorial in the Palm WebOS book by Mitchel Allen
Oct 07 18:12:47 <bricks> I'm in chapter 2 and i get a problem when I try to run the code in Ares.
Oct 07 18:13:35 <bricks> It keeps on telling me that the feeds variable is not defined
Oct 07 18:14:44 <bricks> I know that I wrote a definition for it straight from the book. Do I need to put the declaration somewhere else besides in the model folder of the application?
Oct 07 18:16:56 <sugardave> was that book ever updated for ares?
Oct 07 18:17:54 <swisstomcat> yeah, good question
Oct 07 18:18:08 <swisstomcat> bricks: where exactly are you getting an error?
Oct 07 18:18:39 <bricks> This is the exact error message
Oct 07 18:19:24 <bricks> Uncaught ReferenceError: Feeds is not defined(app/assistants/stage-assistant.js:16)
Oct 07 18:19:52 <sugardave> sounds like you are missing the line in sources.json that loads the Feeds.js
Oct 07 18:19:57 <bricks> I defined feeds in (app/models/feeds.js)
Oct 07 18:20:07 <sugardave> did you edit sources.json?
Oct 07 18:20:56 <bricks> I tried adding the following code to sources.json and got the same error
Oct 07 18:21:00 <swisstomcat> yeah, sources.json should contain a reference to app/models/feeds.js
Oct 07 18:21:22 <bricks> "model":"app/models/feeds.js"
Oct 07 18:21:37 <sugardave> bricks: use http://webos.pastebin.com/ and paste your whole sources.json
Oct 07 18:22:07 <sugardave> it should be more like {"source": "app/models/feeds.js"}
Oct 07 18:22:09 <swisstomcat>    {"source": "app/models/dao.js"},
Oct 07 18:22:12 <swisstomcat> yeah
Oct 07 18:22:27 <swisstomcat> that should work
Oct 07 18:22:44 <bricks> I didn't type it that way when I tried, let me go try that. Thank you :-)
Oct 07 18:23:10 <sugardave> it needs to come before the stage assistant one
Oct 07 18:24:47 <bostonpartykid> hey guys, need some help here
Oct 07 18:24:56 <bostonpartykid> i dont have a paypal account, but plan to release free open source apps
Oct 07 18:24:59 <bostonpartykid> am I out of luck?
Oct 07 18:25:44 <bostonpartykid> I plan to use Ares
Oct 07 18:27:38 <bricks> that was the problem, thank you.
Oct 07 18:28:16 <sugardave> bricks: np
Oct 07 18:28:22 <sugardave> bostonpartykid: you need a paypal account
Oct 07 18:29:09 <bostonpartykid> ok
Oct 07 18:29:11 <bostonpartykid> is it worth it?
Oct 07 18:29:19 <bostonpartykid> i feel like less competition, more money with admob?
Oct 07 18:29:27 <bostonpartykid> but im thinking that maybe it's not a big market? not sure
Oct 07 18:30:03 <sugardave> I made next-to-nothing on ads, it's totally dependent on your app type and its popularity
Oct 07 18:30:17 <sugardave> I've made more on straight app sales
Oct 07 18:30:35 <bostonpartykid> hhhmm
Oct 07 18:30:51 <bostonpartykid> i dont want to give palm access to my paypal to pay for "fees"
Oct 07 18:30:57 <swisstomcat> yeah, i refuse to put ads into my free apps
Oct 07 18:30:59 <bostonpartykid> but, why do they need my social security?
Oct 07 18:31:05 <sugardave> taxes
Oct 07 18:31:09 <swisstomcat> there are not fees
Oct 07 18:31:12 <sugardave> tax reporting
Oct 07 18:31:13 <swisstomcat> anymore
Oct 07 18:31:14 <bostonpartykid> i wont have any pay for apps
Oct 07 18:31:18 <bostonpartykid> right
Oct 07 18:31:20 <HattCzech_work> my apps are donation-ware
Oct 07 18:31:21 <bostonpartykid> it's entirely fee...
Oct 07 18:31:29 <sugardave> bostonpartykid: it doesn't matter
Oct 07 18:31:36 <bostonpartykid> yea, it doesnt seem to matter
Oct 07 18:31:37 <keith> sugardave: what apps did you make?
Oct 07 18:31:53 <sugardave> keith: Scan Do! is my newest one
Oct 07 18:32:02 <sugardave> http://bit.ly/ScanDo
Oct 07 18:32:03 <sugardave> :D
Oct 07 18:32:10 <keith> ahh cool
Oct 07 18:32:19 <keith> i used to work for a voip radio interoperability company
Oct 07 18:32:43 <sugardave> cool, I am using the API from Radio Reference for this
Oct 07 18:32:46 <bostonpartykid> can i view apps online, like itunes?
Oct 07 18:32:49 <bostonpartykid> is there a webos online store?
Oct 07 18:32:59 <sugardave> so it's just streaming audio, really
Oct 07 18:33:11 <bostonpartykid> are you making money sugardave?
Oct 07 18:33:16 <bostonpartykid> like, a sale a day?
Oct 07 18:33:30 <bostonpartykid> also - how long does the approval process take?
Oct 07 18:33:33 <sugardave> it just went out last night, I won't see what the official totals are for 3-5 more days
Oct 07 18:33:43 <bostonpartykid> ok
Oct 07 18:33:44 <sugardave> but on my other apps I have made money
Oct 07 18:33:54 <sugardave> not huge amounts, mind you
Oct 07 18:34:04 <bostonpartykid> hhmm
Oct 07 18:34:10 <bostonpartykid> i was thinking of making ad supported apps that are free
Oct 07 18:34:14 <bostonpartykid> and with webos, placing the ad near the middle of the page
Oct 07 18:34:19 <sugardave> yeah, I have those as well
Oct 07 18:34:21 <bostonpartykid> since we can move it around
Oct 07 18:34:31 <keith> yea i see that
Oct 07 18:34:39 <bostonpartykid> do you get a lot of downloads, and how long is the approval process?
Oct 07 18:34:50 <sugardave> I have 2 ad-supported/pay-for apps: Yule Log and BOFH Excuse Generator
Oct 07 18:34:55 <sugardave> the ad version is on precentral
Oct 07 18:35:01 <sugardave> and the pay-fors in the catalog
Oct 07 18:35:27 <sugardave> and I have made jack shit on the ad versions
Oct 07 18:35:32 <bostonpartykid> lol
Oct 07 18:36:23 <swisstomcat> it takes 2-3 days for approval .. usually
Oct 07 18:36:38 <bricks> another question
Oct 07 18:37:19 <bostonpartykid> ok
Oct 07 18:37:22 <bostonpartykid> do you use admob?
Oct 07 18:37:26 <bostonpartykid> or some other ab provider?
Oct 07 18:37:34 <bostonpartykid> webos may be huge when hp releases tablets next year
Oct 07 18:37:52 <swisstomcat> yeah
Oct 07 18:37:53 <sugardave> I tested admob but used quattro wireless in the end...I'm not sure what the status of them is right now
Oct 07 18:37:55 <bricks> do you have to do anything special (not mentioned in the book to get the  .innerHTML property to work?
Oct 07 18:38:09 <swisstomcat> i thought it worked differently in ares
Oct 07 18:38:14 <bostonpartykid> quattro is closed
Oct 07 18:38:21 <sugardave> bostonpartykid: they're iAd now
Oct 07 18:38:24 <bostonpartykid> admob seems like the only choice... and perhaps greystripe
Oct 07 18:38:26 <bostonpartykid> right.
Oct 07 18:38:28 <sugardave> they sent me a check a couple of weeks ago
Oct 07 18:38:35 <bostonpartykid> because the sdks dont work
Oct 07 18:38:42 <sugardave> screw the sdk
Oct 07 18:38:46 <sugardave> roll your own
Oct 07 18:38:58 <sugardave> that's what me and doc did with admob in the beginning
Oct 07 18:39:06 <bricks> I don't know. In the book they don't use ares, I originally started in Eclipse, but then switched
Oct 07 18:39:15 <sugardave> bricks: go back to eclipse
Oct 07 18:39:18 <sugardave> go back
Oct 07 18:39:20 <sugardave> go back....
Oct 07 18:39:31 <Bmyers> sugardave do you do iad now?
Oct 07 18:39:56 <sugardave> Bmyers: I don't know :D  I haven't looked at the apps in a while...need to, though because it's time to update Yule Log :D
Oct 07 18:40:06 <Bmyers> i had a wuaatro acct too and not sure if i have to sign up as an IOS developer for $99 in order to make .00005 cents from iads
Oct 07 18:40:13 <sugardave> oh screw that
Oct 07 18:40:24 <Bmyers> i dunno
Oct 07 18:40:29 <Bmyers> if you do or not
Oct 07 18:40:38 <Bmyers> i got some paperwork from apple concerning iad
Oct 07 18:40:38 <HattCzech_work> i get maybe $20/month from admob
Oct 07 18:40:46 <sugardave> there was also adfonic, but I'm not sure if they're still around
Oct 07 18:40:47 <HattCzech_work> not horrible, but hey, i don't have to do anything :)
Oct 07 18:40:53 <Bmyers> but it was clear if i need to be an IOS devel'r
Oct 07 18:41:02 <Bmyers> is was NOT clear ^^
Oct 07 18:41:16 <sugardave> bostonpartykid: also, I need to mention that my ad-supported apps came out when we had no europeans or anyone outside of sprint to download our stuff
Oct 07 18:41:21 <sugardave> so my market was incredibly small
Oct 07 18:41:42 <Bmyers> yeah hey. i got my first bad german review the other day for my app
Oct 07 18:41:47 <sugardave> nice :D
Oct 07 18:41:53 <bricks> I switched to ares b/c I had trouble figuring out how to get the debugger to working eclipse. Using the debugger is simple in ares. How do you turn the eclipse debugger on?
Oct 07 18:41:56 <Bmyers> woo hoo! they are dl'ing my app in DE!!!
Oct 07 18:42:16 <swisstomcat> is it in german?
Oct 07 18:42:24 <Bmyers> i thought it was :)
Oct 07 18:42:25 <sugardave> bricks: there is no debugging in eclipse...you can write to the deivce log and put a tail on it :D  or use palm-log to see in real-time
Oct 07 18:42:38 <Bmyers> swisstomcat:  check out guyrules in the app catalog
Oct 07 18:42:53 <swisstomcat> seems english :)
Oct 07 18:42:57 <sugardave> My "worldwide" apps are in English :D
Oct 07 18:43:02 <bricks> that's why it wouldn't work.
Oct 07 18:43:04 <Bmyers> depends on your locale settings
Oct 07 18:43:12 <swisstomcat> worldwide!=english
Oct 07 18:43:21 <Bmyers> y ! ?
Oct 07 18:43:27 <bostonpartykid> hattczechL how many apps do you have>
Oct 07 18:43:29 <sugardave> Palm lets me do it that way
Oct 07 18:43:46 <bostonpartykid> Is the Ares file about the same size as a standard eclipse file?
Oct 07 18:43:51 <bostonpartykid> I used phonegap for android and iphone
Oct 07 18:44:08 <Bmyers> if my app detects your locale in something other than en_us it start the translation effort
Oct 07 18:44:29 <bostonpartykid> also, what's the rationale for making webos apps if you can make one for android?
Oct 07 18:44:30 <sugardave> that sounds fancy
Oct 07 18:44:38 <Bmyers> (heh, look at my poor enrish above ^^)
Oct 07 18:44:43 <sugardave> bostonpartykid: because I learned javascript not java
Oct 07 18:45:20 <Bmyers> swisstomcat:  can you have a look and tell me what you think?
Oct 07 18:45:34 <swisstomcat> it's free?
Oct 07 18:45:41 <Bmyers> yes
Oct 07 18:46:01 <Bmyers> sugardave:  can send it to you if you dont have a live palm like me..
Oct 07 18:46:06 <Bmyers> :)
Oct 07 18:46:19 <bostonpartykid> i dont want to get a paypal account
Oct 07 18:46:24 <bostonpartykid> thats pointless... just one more bug
Oct 07 18:47:09 <swisstomcat> wp consulting?
Oct 07 18:47:14 <Bmyers> yup
Oct 07 18:47:24 <Bmyers> dont get the beta app
Oct 07 18:47:42 <swisstomcat> yeah, i'm installing the app catalog version
Oct 07 18:47:44 <HattCzech_work> i have 1 app catalog app
Oct 07 18:47:49 <HattCzech_work> 1 in homebrew
Oct 07 18:47:50 <swisstomcat> funny stuff in the app description :)
Oct 07 18:48:02 <HattCzech_work> that i hope to bring to the catalog in 2.0 if i can work it right
Oct 07 18:48:21 <Bmyers> funny haha or funny like another stupid american is trying to port an app to german ?
Oct 07 18:48:40 <sugardave> haha
Oct 07 18:48:53 <swisstomcat> like another stupid american trying to port an app to german ;)
Oct 07 18:49:00 <bricks> Does switching make a differance? I have the same application open in Eclipse and ares and even when I run the application from eclipse I still see the log Viewer in ares working and it is still giving me the same error.
Oct 07 18:49:06 <HattCzech_work> swisstomcat: worldwide may not = english, but it's the closest we've got
Oct 07 18:49:09 <Bmyers> well no hiding that..
Oct 07 18:49:10 <HattCzech_work> next to chinese ;)
Oct 07 18:49:30 <swisstomcat> bmyers: i can help ... www.thinmachine.ch/en/service.html
Oct 07 18:49:41 <sugardave> bricks: apparently the ares log tool is awesome and it just reads from the emulator
Oct 07 18:49:51 <sugardave> so...if you dev in eclipse you can use the ares log tool
Oct 07 18:49:54 <bostonpartykid> anyway to get around paypal
Oct 07 18:49:58 <bostonpartykid> i have about 1000 android apps
Oct 07 18:50:02 <swisstomcat> bricks: yeah, the ares log tool connects to the emulator .. so does the ares debugger
Oct 07 18:50:04 <bostonpartykid> so yea, id love to port them to palm webos
Oct 07 18:50:12 <sugardave> but I can't because I have some weird things going on with my java and browsers
Oct 07 18:50:18 <bostonpartykid> sorry, 100
Oct 07 18:50:39 <sugardave> if you want to be in the official catalog, you need a paypal account
Oct 07 18:50:49 <bostonpartykid> hhmm
Oct 07 18:50:56 <bostonpartykid> i dont think it's worth it
Oct 07 18:51:14 <Bmyers> the overhead of a paypal account is too great?
Oct 07 18:51:15 <swisstomcat> depends on the apps
Oct 07 18:51:19 <bostonpartykid> I'm essentially giving palm "everything"
Oct 07 18:51:24 <sugardave> man, I had to PAY to get my dev account
Oct 07 18:51:26 <swisstomcat> bmyers: it's very funky german
Oct 07 18:51:35 <swisstomcat> yeah, me too .. 5 dollars!
Oct 07 18:51:37 <bostonpartykid> my social security number, address, and paypal
Oct 07 18:51:49 <bostonpartykid> even though i will only release free apps
Oct 07 18:51:54 <Bmyers> swisstomcat:  the backend of the cloud app runs my content thru google translation services
Oct 07 18:51:56 <sugardave> bostonpartykid: form a dba and give them that tax id
Oct 07 18:52:05 <sugardave> doesn't have to be your personal, just needs to be real
Oct 07 18:52:06 <bostonpartykid> not worth it
Oct 07 18:52:12 <bostonpartykid> i trust palm, it's not a small organization
Oct 07 18:52:39 <sugardave> these are the barriers to entry
Oct 07 18:52:41 <Bmyers> it is a little silly that to release an open source app that you dont want $ from that you need tax id's and paypal accounts tho..
Oct 07 18:53:10 <bostonpartykid> right.
Oct 07 18:53:12 <rwhitby> don't like that stuff, just put it in Preware
Oct 07 18:53:16 <bostonpartykid> and if webos was big, i'd do it
Oct 07 18:53:20 <bostonpartykid> but im not sure it's worth it...
Oct 07 18:53:34 <Bmyers> bostonpartykid:  preware is your answer then
Oct 07 18:53:47 <bostonpartykid> preware?
Oct 07 18:53:54 <Bmyers> they dont care where you have warrants for your arrest
Oct 07 18:54:17 <bricks> then since it is the same error, I have the same question as before, is there something else that I need to do to get the .innerHTML property to work?
Oct 07 18:54:52 <swisstomcat> what's the error?
Oct 07 18:55:15 <bostonpartykid> i signed up for the free account, and cant get past thepaypal barrier!
Oct 07 18:55:16 <bostonpartykid> oh well.
Oct 07 18:55:24 <Bmyers> swisstomcat:  didnt you look at my app previously and work with me on the navigation translation ?
Oct 07 18:55:30 <bostonpartykid> sometimes i wish i was in highschool and could dev a ton of apps... =/
Oct 07 18:55:47 <swisstomcat> i don't think so, bmyers?
Oct 07 18:56:02 <Bmyers> i'd be too busy looking at high school girls and not develop'n apps :)
Oct 07 18:56:12 <Bmyers> (if i was in high school)
Oct 07 18:56:21 <swisstomcat> bostonpartykid: those are the rules ... if you don't want to play along them then you won't have any apps in the catalog
Oct 07 18:56:37 <bostonpartykid> swisstomcat: is it worth it?
Oct 07 18:56:55 <bostonpartykid> aren't there 10K apps or something?
Oct 07 18:56:57 <rwhitby> bostonpartykid: depends what your motivation is
Oct 07 18:57:02 <swisstomcat> right now is the time to get into webos development
Oct 07 18:57:29 <swisstomcat> and also depens what your apps are .. public domain books app are already very well covered for example :)
Oct 07 18:57:32 <swisstomcat> depends
Oct 07 18:58:21 <bostonpartykid> lol
Oct 07 18:58:29 <bostonpartykid> yea, well, i would definitely take the low hanging fruit
Oct 07 18:58:32 <bostonpartykid> and put them onto webos
Oct 07 18:58:35 <bostonpartykid> but i dont know how many people
Oct 07 18:58:38 <sugardave> there are less than 10K apps in the catalog right now
Oct 07 18:58:40 <Bmyers> swisstomcat: is my app at least keying in on your locale and translation it into something other than english?
Oct 07 18:58:50 <bostonpartykid> can i get pretty much anything approved?
Oct 07 18:58:58 <sugardave> no adult content
Oct 07 18:59:00 <bostonpartykid> my android apps get 1000+ downloads within a day
Oct 07 18:59:07 <bostonpartykid> but tehre are a ton of android phones now
Oct 07 18:59:08 <Bmyers> no swearing either..
Oct 07 18:59:17 <bostonpartykid> iphone istoo tough... apple took 2.5 weeks to approve my stuff
Oct 07 18:59:19 <swisstomcat> bmyers: yeah, parts of it are in german
Oct 07 18:59:31 <bostonpartykid> and everyone is focused on iphone, so there's not much point anymore
Oct 07 18:59:38 <bostonpartykid> can i search the webos store online?
Oct 07 18:59:40 <swisstomcat> what kind of apps do you have, bostonpartykid?
Oct 07 18:59:43 <Bmyers> iphone is slipping to android
Oct 07 18:59:59 <Bmyers> why else would iphone setup to release on another carrier
Oct 07 19:00:00 <swisstomcat> bostonpartykid: myappbox.com .. cryket.com
Oct 07 19:00:09 <swisstomcat> cyrket.com even
Oct 07 19:01:19 <Bmyers> swisstomcat: well if you'd like to send me correction feel free. i dont charge for the app so i dont make alot of $$ from it
Oct 07 19:01:27 <Bmyers> even on volume
Oct 07 19:01:45 <swisstomcat> i can send you corrections of the navigation parts
Oct 07 19:01:49 <Bmyers> almost 40,000 downloads tho
Oct 07 19:01:54 <swisstomcat> nice
Oct 07 19:02:15 <Bmyers> swisstomcat: great! thanks.
Oct 07 19:02:30 <Bmyers> got my email address?
Oct 07 19:02:39 <bostonpartykid> holy shit
Oct 07 19:02:41 <bostonpartykid> cyrket.com..
Oct 07 19:02:45 <bostonpartykid> there's almost NO free apps
Oct 07 19:02:46 <bostonpartykid> O_O
Oct 07 19:03:04 <bostonpartykid> Bmyers: do you use ads?
Oct 07 19:03:20 <Bmyers> i try but they are moving targets
Oct 07 19:03:24 <Bmyers> horrible fills rates
Oct 07 19:03:31 <Bmyers> companies get bought out and close down
Oct 07 19:03:43 <Bmyers> even worse on click thru rates
Oct 07 19:03:53 <bostonpartykid> admob?
Oct 07 19:03:55 <Bmyers> lucky to clear 2 cents on a click thru
Oct 07 19:03:57 <bostonpartykid> admob has a pretty good fill rate
Oct 07 19:04:10 <Bmyers> admob, smaato, quaatro, millenimmedia
Oct 07 19:04:15 <bostonpartykid> admob is the best
Oct 07 19:04:17 <bostonpartykid> millennial blows
Oct 07 19:04:20 <bostonpartykid> i use phonegap
Oct 07 19:04:23 <bostonpartykid> so admob works well
Oct 07 19:04:27 <Bmyers> not that impressed with admob
Oct 07 19:04:35 <bostonpartykid> ok
Oct 07 19:04:40 <bostonpartykid> what is eCPM of smaato?
Oct 07 19:04:40 <Bmyers> anyone try adwhirl?
Oct 07 19:04:46 <bostonpartykid> i know with iads, eCPM is about $10 or $20
Oct 07 19:04:51 <bostonpartykid> pretty high
Oct 07 19:04:53 <bostonpartykid> admob is about $1
Oct 07 19:05:08 <Bmyers> does iads require that you are an IOS develper?
Oct 07 19:05:12 <bostonpartykid> yes
Oct 07 19:05:18 <bostonpartykid> iAds is iphone only and very easy to integrate
Oct 07 19:05:24 <bostonpartykid> iAds for iphone apps, no question
Oct 07 19:05:27 <Bmyers> so you have to pay the $99 to make .0005 cents per click?
Oct 07 19:05:41 <bostonpartykid> i think webos should do something similar, make it easy to integrate apps
Oct 07 19:05:44 <bostonpartykid> lol
Oct 07 19:05:45 <bostonpartykid> no
Oct 07 19:05:49 <bostonpartykid> i have a free iphone app
Oct 07 19:05:53 <bostonpartykid> gets like 25 cents per click
Oct 07 19:05:55 <bostonpartykid> it's an iAd
Oct 07 19:06:05 <bostonpartykid> i think $25 eCPM or something silly
Oct 07 19:06:15 <bostonpartykid> but apple has really cracked down; i make reference apps
Oct 07 19:06:19 <bostonpartykid> and they dont allow those really
Oct 07 19:06:27 <Bmyers> but if i have to pay $99 to run iads it'll take a long time to break even
Oct 07 19:07:01 <bostonpartykid> well i have 10 iphone apps all pay for
Oct 07 19:07:08 <bostonpartykid> how did you find out about cyrket?
Oct 07 19:07:08 <Bmyers> 4 million ads @ $25 eCPM ?
Oct 07 19:07:12 <bostonpartykid> it works really well!
Oct 07 19:07:21 <bostonpartykid> iAds has about a 50% fill rate
Oct 07 19:08:12 <swisstomcat> bmyers: not sure
Oct 07 19:08:25 <bostonpartykid> it's weird.. how can cyrket log into the google marketplace and then log in?
Oct 07 19:09:34 <Bmyers> so I'd have to run about 8 millions ads to break even after signing up with Iads?
Oct 07 19:10:10 <bostonpartykid> not sure
Oct 07 19:10:11 <bostonpartykid> no
Oct 07 19:10:12 <bostonpartykid> less than
Oct 07 19:10:15 <bostonpartykid> but you can sell apps
Oct 07 19:10:33 <bostonpartykid> making apps for android is harder than making an app for an iphone
Oct 07 19:10:35 <Bmyers> my iphone port is not complete and would be free anyway
Oct 07 19:10:37 <bostonpartykid> is webos easy?
Oct 07 19:10:54 <Bmyers> oh you have no idea how easy.
Oct 07 19:10:58 <Bmyers> taking candy from a baby
Oct 07 19:11:00 <bostonpartykid> :)
Oct 07 19:11:09 <bostonpartykid> is the size of an Ares file the size of a file produced from eclipse?
Oct 07 19:11:18 <bostonpartykid> or does the WYSIWYG interface add another dimension>
Oct 07 19:11:45 <bostonpartykid> i know with appinventor for android, it adds another 1 meg
Oct 07 19:11:50 <Bmyers> excellent support in the JS for camera and microphone hardware. lots of palm documentation that accurate an concise, it's a breeze devel'n for webos
Oct 07 19:12:03 <bostonpartykid> nice
Oct 07 19:12:08 <Bmyers> kidding ^^
Oct 07 19:12:13 <bostonpartykid> hehe
Oct 07 19:12:23 <Bmyers> no api support for cam or mic hardware
Oct 07 19:12:25 <bostonpartykid> I am jus wondering if webos is worth my time
Oct 07 19:12:27 <bostonpartykid> i don't know
Oct 07 19:12:37 <bostonpartykid> It seems there is almost no competition
Oct 07 19:12:40 <Bmyers> best sources of the api is on third party sites
Oct 07 19:13:23 <sugardave> there are some gems in the old palm docs
Oct 07 19:13:25 <bostonpartykid> got ya
Oct 07 19:13:30 <bostonpartykid> i think im going to hold off
Oct 07 19:13:38 <sugardave> dynamic widgets with javascript
Oct 07 19:13:39 <bostonpartykid> if i could make palm apps, id make hundreds
Oct 07 19:13:44 <bostonpartykid> there must be so much low hanging fruit
Oct 07 19:13:46 <Bmyers> get good with a framework
Oct 07 19:14:00 <Bmyers> if your app can lend itself to phonegap, etc
Oct 07 19:14:09 <bostonpartykid> i use phonegap :)
Oct 07 19:14:15 <bostonpartykid> its easy to port stuff
Oct 07 19:14:23 <torchie> maaaan
Oct 07 19:14:25 <torchie> phonegap
Oct 07 19:14:26 <torchie> maaaaaaaaaan
Oct 07 19:14:28 <torchie> phonegap
Oct 07 19:14:32 <torchie> I don't like it
Oct 07 19:14:35 <torchie> because everyone else likes it
Oct 07 19:14:42 <bostonpartykid> How does cyrket log into the webos store and grab data?
Oct 07 19:14:43 <swisstomcat> phonegap's cool
Oct 07 19:14:52 <bostonpartykid> phonegap blows for iphone and android though
Oct 07 19:14:58 <bostonpartykid> you want to use the native ide, really... the pure sdk
Oct 07 19:15:01 <swisstomcat> bostonpartykid: there's an official rss feed for the catalog data
Oct 07 19:15:05 <Bmyers> yeah right.
Oct 07 19:15:06 <Bmyers> write once, run many? what kind of idiot idea is that?
Oct 07 19:15:08 <bostonpartykid> really?
Oct 07 19:15:10 <bostonpartykid> wow
Oct 07 19:15:33 <swisstomcat> http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1844&Itemid=24
Oct 07 19:15:39 <swisstomcat> palm's pretty open about their stuff
Oct 07 19:16:12 <swisstomcat> bmyers: http://www.phonegap.com/apps
Oct 07 19:16:13 <bostonpartykid> http://developer.palm.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1844&Itemid=24 :)
Oct 07 19:16:36 <Bmyers> yeah i know..
Oct 07 19:16:51 <bostonpartykid> problem is...
Oct 07 19:16:59 <bostonpartykid> im in manhattan and i hung out at a verizon store on a saturday for an hour
Oct 07 19:17:01 <Bmyers> its called sarcasm swisstomcat ...
Oct 07 19:17:05 <bostonpartykid> i saw NO palm phones sell
Oct 07 19:17:11 <bostonpartykid> just android phones, and some feature phones (small amount)
Oct 07 19:17:16 <swisstomcat> bymers: i didn't see any sarcasm tags :)
Oct 07 19:17:16 <bostonpartykid> everyone was getting the galaxy fascinate
Oct 07 19:17:19 <Bmyers> radio shack stopped selling palm  months ago
Oct 07 19:17:28 <bostonpartykid> so its tough for me to justify webos, but i really think
Oct 07 19:17:33 <sugardave> Bmyers> = sarcasm tag
Oct 07 19:17:35 <bostonpartykid> if there's 1 million palm users
Oct 07 19:17:38 <bostonpartykid> there's still a big market
Oct 07 19:17:49 <swisstomcat> new phones are coming out, a tablet is coming out, printers will have webos
Oct 07 19:17:55 <swisstomcat> huge opportunity
Oct 07 19:17:58 <Bmyers> you can be a big fish in a little pond
Oct 07 19:18:00 <bostonpartykid> thats the thing..
Oct 07 19:18:00 <swisstomcat> approx. 2.6mio users
Oct 07 19:18:05 <bostonpartykid> Android won't be the ONLY winner
Oct 07 19:18:07 <bostonpartykid> you'll have..
Oct 07 19:18:23 <swisstomcat> most of the stuff you'll learn can be applied to cross-platform web apps (phonegap etc.)
Oct 07 19:18:36 <bostonpartykid> 15% iOS, 50% Android, 15% BlackBerry, 10% webos
Oct 07 19:18:37 <swisstomcat> you can even write services in node
Oct 07 19:18:40 <bostonpartykid> err
Oct 07 19:18:48 <bostonpartykid> and then another 10% random stuff... maybe nokia?
Oct 07 19:18:58 <swisstomcat> or port sdl/opengl apps to webos
Oct 07 19:19:05 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat: You have a pixi, yes?
Oct 07 19:19:06 <Bmyers> paper cups and string is 5% of the market..
Oct 07 19:19:14 <swisstomcat> roy-pre101: yeah, i do
Oct 07 19:19:14 <bostonpartykid> i've written for iOS, but got fed up with rejected apps and apps taking 2.5 weeks to get approved!
Oct 07 19:19:26 <bostonpartykid> you guys are a lot more chill
Oct 07 19:19:26 <swisstomcat> native or webapp?
Oct 07 19:19:34 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat: Can you access the App Catalog on it?
Oct 07 19:19:35 <bostonpartykid> the #iphonedev channel is really hardcore
Oct 07 19:19:36 <swisstomcat> we are the good guys
Oct 07 19:19:37 <Bmyers> well dont come to webos with a fear of rejection..
Oct 07 19:19:41 <bostonpartykid> :-)
Oct 07 19:19:44 <swisstomcat> roy-pre101: yeah
Oct 07 19:19:58 <swisstomcat> we rule
Oct 07 19:20:08 <Roy-Pre101> Can you download the latest Lopan and tell me how much memory it uses on the Pixi?  Apparently it exits often on the pixi even though I increased the memory limit.
Oct 07 19:20:10 <swisstomcat> we're hard, but nice
Oct 07 19:20:11 <Bmyers> we're #1 in modesty!!!
Oct 07 19:20:23 <Bmyers> :)
Oct 07 19:20:33 <swisstomcat> roy-pre101: aye .. how do you check mem usage?
Oct 07 19:20:42 <sugardave> palm-worm
Oct 07 19:20:46 <sugardave> jstop
Oct 07 19:20:48 <bostonpartykid> Do you guys all have a palm?
Oct 07 19:20:55 <sugardave> guessing...I never used jstop before
Oct 07 19:21:02 <swisstomcat> no, we don't have palms
Oct 07 19:21:09 <swisstomcat> why would we hang out here?
Oct 07 19:21:12 <Bmyers> there is that weirdo delvel key combo to that'll overlay the usage on the screen
Oct 07 19:21:13 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat: 'top' from the shell
Oct 07 19:21:24 <sugardave> my fingers are disembodiedly floating above my keyboard
Oct 07 19:21:27 <Roy-Pre101> Bmyers: This is a PDK app
Oct 07 19:21:31 <swisstomcat> have to chare my pixi first
Oct 07 19:21:34 <Bmyers> o
Oct 07 19:21:37 <Bmyers> top it is
Oct 07 19:22:10 * sugardave is still rocking the launch Pre.
Oct 07 19:22:27 <sugardave> and it's my actual phone, too!
Oct 07 19:22:44 <Bmyers> i use my palm pre to keep my touchstone warm..
Oct 07 19:22:53 <bostonpartykid> well
Oct 07 19:23:00 <bostonpartykid> It's enticing that they waive the $99 fee for a year
Oct 07 19:23:14 <sugardave> I had to pay $5.00
Oct 07 19:23:19 <sugardave> but I got that back
Oct 07 19:23:21 <sugardave> :D
Oct 07 19:23:23 * halfhalo didn't pay anything
Oct 07 19:23:27 <sugardave> Palm loves developers
Oct 07 19:23:51 <halfhalo> unlike SOME people!
Oct 07 19:24:21 <rwhitby> bostonpartykid: all fees are waived now, permanently
Oct 07 19:24:28 <bostonpartykid> Right
Oct 07 19:24:30 <swisstomcat> can.has("css-position-fixed").plz(function(icanhaz){ if(icanhaz){ awesomeNavBar(); }else{ FML(); });
Oct 07 19:24:42 <bostonpartykid> I guess I might as well take the plunge
Oct 07 19:24:58 <bostonpartykid> Does Android have an RSS feed?
Oct 07 19:25:02 <swisstomcat> dunno
Oct 07 19:25:05 <bostonpartykid> I wonder how appbrain and cyrket harvest that data
Oct 07 19:25:08 <swisstomcat> ask saurik here
Oct 07 19:25:25 <swisstomcat> he's the cyrket (and cydia btw) dev here
Oct 07 19:25:45 <rwhitby> easy - just fake out the access to the palm catalog using a known auth token from a device
Oct 07 19:26:15 <rwhitby> probably similar for android
Oct 07 19:26:36 <bostonpartykid> guess you're right
Oct 07 19:26:45 <bostonpartykid> but still have to grab that data
Oct 07 19:27:40 <rwhitby> if a device can get the data, then a scraper can too
Oct 07 19:28:30 <bostonpartykid> ok
Oct 07 19:28:34 <bostonpartykid> this is ridiculous
Oct 07 19:28:40 <bostonpartykid> there's so much low hanging fruit on webos
Oct 07 19:28:47 <swisstomcat> yeah, go for it
Oct 07 19:29:55 <sugardave> I think the market is saturated on tip calculators, too
Oct 07 19:30:12 <bostonpartykid> lol
Oct 07 19:31:24 <swisstomcat> so what kind of apps are you offering?
Oct 07 19:31:43 <rwhitby> oh, we need more fart apps, tip calculators and world clocks that don't understand 0:30 or 0:45 timezones
Oct 07 19:32:04 <sugardave> rwhitby: I thought you got KGF making that world clock app
Oct 07 19:32:16 <rwhitby> sugardave: nope, he gave up.
Oct 07 19:32:27 <sugardave> I guess I am not understanding why this is so hard to do
Oct 07 19:32:37 <hotdp> yer he said he would do a easyer app first
Oct 07 19:32:49 <sugardave> don't you just need the big list of timezones?
Oct 07 19:34:03 <rwhitby> 90% of people don't know what a timezone is, let alone know that there are :30 and :15 timezones, timezones with GMT+13:45 and that daylight savings happens at different times and goes in different directions in different parts of the world.
Oct 07 19:34:34 <sugardave> rwhitby: right, we've talked about it before...but technically, don't you just need all the offsets?
Oct 07 19:34:40 <sugardave> I mean, time is time
Oct 07 19:34:40 <rwhitby> yep
Oct 07 19:34:43 <rwhitby> yep
Oct 07 19:35:02 <sugardave> so I'm still missing why this is hard :D
Oct 07 19:35:11 <rwhitby> but when typing in a new time to schedule a meeting, you need to take all that into account
Oct 07 19:35:21 <sugardave> it is "this time here locally" that converts to "this time over there"
Oct 07 19:35:50 <rwhitby> e.g. if I want to schedule a global meeting, one city might be changing DST one direction, another might be changing in the other direction, and a third might not be changing at all
Oct 07 19:36:29 <rwhitby> the test of a world-clock app is whether it can get that right, including for GMT+13:45 timezones
Oct 07 19:36:39 <rwhitby> (most get the day wrong for that one)
Oct 07 19:36:46 <sugardave> ah, I see the problem now...keeping a lookup table of when the timezones switch
Oct 07 19:36:46 <torchie> man
Oct 07 19:36:48 <torchie> I kind of want a pixi
Oct 07 19:36:52 <torchie> just so I can have a sturdier phone
Oct 07 19:37:08 <sugardave> because there's no inherent method on Date to let me know that information, I think
Oct 07 19:37:31 <bostonpartykid> im going to wait for web OS 2
Oct 07 19:37:35 <swisstomcat> pixi is nice
Oct 07 19:37:39 <swisstomcat> but a bit too small
Oct 07 19:38:02 <bostonpartykid> i ultimately feel HP will close webos for Android
Oct 07 19:38:15 <sugardave> I think you are wrong
Oct 07 19:38:47 <rwhitby> bostonpartykid: you need to think outside of just phones to understand HP's strategy for webOS
Oct 07 19:38:55 <swisstomcat> exactly
Oct 07 19:38:58 <bostonpartykid> I have thought a lot about it
Oct 07 19:38:59 <swisstomcat> tablets,printers
Oct 07 19:39:13 <bostonpartykid> But, applications?
Oct 07 19:39:27 <sugardave> that's why we are here
Oct 07 19:39:27 <bostonpartykid> And, users?
Oct 07 19:39:33 <bostonpartykid> I don't know a single person using a Palm
Oct 07 19:39:35 <swisstomcat> roy-pre101: gah, app catalog error :(
Oct 07 19:39:38 <bostonpartykid> I want to believe I can make some serious money here
Oct 07 19:40:07 <sugardave> Rovio made some serious money with angry birds before they won the hot apps contest
Oct 07 19:40:11 <swisstomcat> you have the opportunity to earn some money .. right now is the right time to start webos development
Oct 07 19:40:14 <rwhitby> bostonpartykid: seriously, I think you shouldn't bother.  You're too uncertain about things to have any motivation, and will therefore just produce crap apps.
Oct 07 19:40:58 <sugardave> rwhitby: so how would you tackle the problem of not knowing when timezones change to daylight savings or standard time?
Oct 07 19:41:14 <rwhitby> sugardave: that information is in the database
Oct 07 19:41:21 * sugardave might write the app you said you'd pay $20 for.
Oct 07 19:41:23 <sugardave> :P
Oct 07 19:41:36 <rwhitby> sugardave: if you do, I'll pay $20
Oct 07 19:41:44 <sugardave> rwhitby: in an existing Palm db, or the database I make?
Oct 07 19:42:10 <rwhitby> sugardave: the timezone change information is in the linux TZ database, which is already on the device.
Oct 07 19:42:16 <sugardave> ah
Oct 07 19:42:17 <sugardave> k
Oct 07 19:42:26 <rwhitby> I'm not sure whether all of it is exposed through the webOS API though
Oct 07 19:42:35 <sugardave> doesn't matter, I am the king of copy/paste
Oct 07 19:42:56 <rwhitby> ah, you don't want to do that, cause the change times change each year for some countries
Oct 07 19:43:19 <bostonpartykid> This is like 1988 in desktop OSs... you have mac, os/2, and windows, and some others... right?
Oct 07 19:43:27 <bostonpartykid> I am 22, so I don't remember any of that...
Oct 07 19:43:30 <sugardave> ah, good point...so some way to read the linux TZ db...right now maybe beyond the scope of official Mojo
Oct 07 19:43:37 <bostonpartykid> It seems like it's very uncertain what becomes the dominant mobile platform
Oct 07 19:44:08 <sugardave> rwhitby: I'll be thinking about it
Oct 07 19:45:25 <swisstomcat> bostonpartykid: the dominant mobile platform might be just the web or webapps
Oct 07 19:45:37 <swisstomcat> and webos apps are webapps already
Oct 07 19:45:39 <swisstomcat> win
Oct 07 19:46:03 <rwhitby> some people might be able to make more money off the non-dominant platform
Oct 07 19:46:05 <swisstomcat> you get to play with all the cool web technologies .. html5,css3,javascript,node
Oct 07 19:46:35 <torchie> is that new p102 really gonna be so similar to the original pre
Oct 07 19:46:48 <rwhitby> but if you're not interested in the platform itself, you shouldn't bother.
Oct 07 19:46:56 <bostonpartykid> i am very interested
Oct 07 19:47:05 <swisstomcat> are you interested in web technologies, bostonpartykid?
Oct 07 19:47:14 <bostonpartykid> i feel like the iOS already has millions trying to compete, and most of the stuff has already been done
Oct 07 19:47:16 <bostonpartykid> yes
Oct 07 19:47:27 <bostonpartykid> at 16 i was programming for vbulletin in php and html
Oct 07 19:47:30 <bostonpartykid> so i am skilled at this
Oct 07 19:47:41 <sugardave> node is going to be super-killer when I get some time to mess with it
Oct 07 19:47:41 <swisstomcat> webos is the only platform that has webapps as first class citizens
Oct 07 19:47:41 <bostonpartykid> but, i use phonegap because i know html and javascript quite well
Oct 07 19:48:03 <swisstomcat> i use phonegap too
Oct 07 19:48:05 <torchie> I'm interested in the platform for its distribution methods + hardware-locked nature + underlying technology + simple interface
Oct 07 19:49:19 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat: There you go
Oct 07 19:49:36 <rwhitby> torchie: hardware-locked?
Oct 07 19:49:42 <swisstomcat> app store works on the pre tho
Oct 07 19:49:45 <swisstomcat> strange
Oct 07 19:51:06 <rwhitby> torchie: all we know is that the P102 can use the same touchstone back cover as the existing devices.
Oct 07 19:51:22 <bostonpartykid> iOS rejects a lot of phonegap apps
Oct 07 19:51:39 <bostonpartykid> Because the new guidelines want apps that are quite sophisticated now
Oct 07 19:52:07 <sugardave> rwhitby: are you talking about zoneinfo?
Oct 07 19:52:19 <rwhitby> sugardave: yeah
Oct 07 19:52:39 <sugardave> okay
Oct 07 19:52:40 <sugardave> cool
Oct 07 19:54:21 <torchie> it's not all one app store like iOS, but instead multiple repositories
Oct 07 19:54:30 <torchie> it's not whored out to every phone maker for the benefit of the manufacturer like android
Oct 07 19:55:13 <bostonpartykid> wow
Oct 07 19:55:13 <torchie> it's not like android's linux forking + non standard java virtual machine, but instead a closer-to-generic linux stack that's good for C and SDL development
Oct 07 19:55:15 <bostonpartykid> more acquisitions
Oct 07 19:55:17 <bostonpartykid> adobe might get bought
Oct 07 19:59:44 <torchie> and it's not a mess of widgets nor does it have an archaic notifications system
Oct 07 19:59:45 <torchie> also this community is cool peeps and cigar chomping badasses
Oct 07 20:01:21 <swisstomcat> yup
Oct 07 20:01:33 <swisstomcat> adobe might get bought? by whom?
Oct 07 20:02:25 <bostonpartykid> microsoft
Oct 07 20:02:30 <bostonpartykid> news.google.com
Oct 07 20:02:37 <swisstomcat> yikes
Oct 07 20:03:16 <swisstomcat> don't see it
Oct 07 20:08:10 <bostonpartykid> anywayz
Oct 07 20:08:17 <bostonpartykid> i wish the webos store didn't have a review process
Oct 07 20:08:19 <bostonpartykid> it's a shame
Oct 07 20:08:26 <bostonpartykid> im out.. peace all
Oct 07 20:09:33 <dawm> hey
Oct 07 20:09:43 <dawm> anyone know how to get around the no sim card on a pixi?
Oct 07 20:09:51 <dawm> got my free dev phone but its at&t
Oct 07 20:09:59 <rwhitby> meta-doctor
Oct 07 20:10:23 <rwhitby> or the palm activation bypass tool if you don't care about having a palm profile on it
Oct 07 20:12:12 <dawm> thanks
Oct 07 20:16:16 <torchie> wa
Oct 07 20:19:37 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat: I sent you an e-mail if I forgot to mention it.
Oct 07 20:20:08 <swisstomcat> where to?
Oct 07 20:20:15 <sugardave> rwhitby: wth was going on in saudia arabia between 1987 and 1989 that they have these solar times special and apart from everyone else?
Oct 07 20:21:16 <rwhitby> dunno, but DST times change at the whim of governments all the time.  Sydney changed DST timing just cause the Olympics was on.
Oct 07 20:22:01 <sugardave> and those changes got populated to the public domain tz data file?
Oct 07 20:22:06 <sugardave> "in time" ? :P
Oct 07 20:22:10 <swisstomcat> roy-pre101: got it
Oct 07 20:22:29 <rwhitby> yep
Oct 07 20:23:41 <swisstomcat> roy-pre101: 52412
Oct 07 20:23:57 <Roy-Pre101> Which column is that?
Oct 07 20:23:58 <sugardave> rwhitby: so, I can reasonably rely on the "official" tz download as my processor and make it where I download/refresh it on some interval and give the option for manual refresh
Oct 07 20:24:04 <swisstomcat> VIRT
Oct 07 20:24:12 <sugardave> would that work for you?
Oct 07 20:24:26 <swisstomcat> which one do you need, roy-pre101?
Oct 07 20:24:27 <Roy-Pre101> hang on a sec... Don't think that's the right one.
Oct 07 20:24:40 <Roy-Pre101> It's like 27M or similar.
Oct 07 20:24:45 <Roy-Pre101> I don't have my phone hooked up.
Oct 07 20:24:48 <swisstomcat> RES 25m
Oct 07 20:24:57 <swisstomcat> SHR 11m
Oct 07 20:25:04 <swisstomcat> %MEM 13.5
Oct 07 20:25:05 <rwhitby> sugardave: yeah.  that's even more than I was expecting.  Just working with the info that Palm has on the device is good enough.
Oct 07 20:25:30 <Roy-Pre101> Hum...
Oct 07 20:25:30 <sugardave> rwhitby: the problem is (and I haven't looked) getting to that data from Mojo...I don't do C and I want this to be a catalog app
Oct 07 20:25:48 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat: Odd, I have the cap set to 28... I wonder if I'm having memory issues.
Oct 07 20:25:55 <swisstomcat> like leaks?
Oct 07 20:25:57 <Roy-Pre101> null pointer or something.
Oct 07 20:26:07 <swisstomcat> oh, it just closed itself
Oct 07 20:26:08 <swisstomcat> :(
Oct 07 20:26:16 <Roy-Pre101> Pfft.
Oct 07 20:26:19 <swisstomcat> i didn't even play with it
Oct 07 20:26:20 <Roy-Pre101> Do you have internalz on there?
Oct 07 20:26:22 <halfhalo> sugardave: web service ftw
Oct 07 20:26:24 <swisstomcat> not yet
Oct 07 20:26:26 <swisstomcat> why?
Oct 07 20:26:42 <swisstomcat> sugardave: yeah, a server-side service should be easier
Oct 07 20:26:45 <Roy-Pre101> I was going to ask if you could increase the memory to a larger #.
Oct 07 20:27:02 <swisstomcat> need preware first :)
Oct 07 20:27:07 <rwhitby> sugardave: BTW, the app has to work offline.  Need to use it in airplane mode.
Oct 07 20:27:11 <sugardave> I think so...would be great to just grab it from the official site, but it's zipped...so I will end up hosting it
Oct 07 20:27:18 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat:  I'll send a new IPK
Oct 07 20:27:21 <swisstomcat> aye
Oct 07 20:27:26 <sugardave> rwhitby: not a problem, initial run will need a connection
Oct 07 20:27:30 <sugardave> to get the data
Oct 07 20:27:31 <swisstomcat> store the db in a depot
Oct 07 20:27:39 <halfhalo> make it a json, have it update bi-monthly
Oct 07 20:27:45 <swisstomcat> yeah
Oct 07 20:27:47 <sugardave> afterwards, only need a connection to refresh the data
Oct 07 20:27:52 <swisstomcat> i do that for my schedule apps
Oct 07 20:28:06 <swisstomcat> loads remote json and stores it in a depot
Oct 07 20:28:25 <sugardave> I already depotize my sqlite :D
Oct 07 20:28:50 <halfhalo> orm ftw
Oct 07 20:29:00 * halfhalo made a wrapper that he loves
Oct 07 20:29:10 <halfhalo> it had support for nested tables
Oct 07 20:29:17 <halfhalo> well, sorta kinda support
Oct 07 20:29:28 <sugardave> now, to decipher all this crap in these files :D
Oct 07 20:30:10 <halfhalo> you gave it a json object and a table name and it would make the table for you, and if there was an object in the json object it handled that as well
Oct 07 20:34:38 <swisstomcat> n8 everyone
Oct 07 20:35:25 <halfhalo> night
Oct 07 20:36:03 <Roy-Pre101> swisstomcat: Whoops, did I miss you?
Oct 07 20:36:55 <Tibfib> hmm, what's the easiest way to get music on the emu?
Oct 07 20:37:19 <swisstomcat> roy-pre101: why?
Oct 07 20:37:25 <halfhalo> sftp
Oct 07 20:37:49 <Tibfib> what's the emu's ip?
Oct 07 20:38:09 <halfhalo> localhost, and the port I don't recall off the top of my head
Oct 07 20:38:35 <Tibfib> rwhitby?
Oct 07 20:39:52 <Tibfib> it's 5522
Oct 07 20:39:55 <Tibfib> thanks haeffb
Oct 07 20:40:01 <Tibfib> and halfhalo.
Oct 07 20:40:50 <Tibfib> actually maybe not
Oct 07 20:41:14 <halfhalo> oh, wait, that won't work
Oct 07 20:41:43 <halfhalo> stupid thing doesn't like not having a password and blehches
Oct 07 20:41:47 <swisstomcat> 5522
Oct 07 20:41:56 <Tibfib> what's the log in?
Oct 07 20:42:03 <halfhalo> you have to use the luna thing
Oct 07 20:42:18 <swisstomcat> ssh localhost -l root -p 5522
Oct 07 20:42:25 <swisstomcat> empty pw
Oct 07 20:43:51 * Tibfib installs winscp
Oct 07 20:45:51 <Tibfib> webos101 ftw http://webos101.com/Emulator
Oct 07 20:46:24 <Bmyers> http://www.phonegap.com/apps
Oct 07 20:46:45 <Bmyers> alot of these apps are just on one platform
Oct 07 20:46:57 <Bmyers> wonder why
Oct 07 21:18:48 <oilsworkn> um
Oct 07 21:19:26 <halfhalo> no
Oct 07 21:20:02 <oilsworkn> shudup you!
Oct 07 21:20:14 <summatusmentis> my pre shipped!
Oct 07 21:20:30 <oilsworkn> yay!
Oct 07 21:20:52 <summatusmentis> I bought it in moderate condition from ebay >.>
Oct 07 21:21:31 <oilsworkn> which translates to: scratched to hell
Oct 07 21:21:43 <halfhalo> no, thats like new
Oct 07 21:21:56 <oilsworkn> and for your convenience: arrives in 2 useful pieces!
Oct 07 21:22:06 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 21:22:17 <halfhalo> really? mine came from ikea
Oct 07 21:22:32 <halfhalo> 30 pieces, but I ended up with an extra camera at the end
Oct 07 21:22:39 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 21:23:03 <summatusmentis> oilsworkn: definitely possible that it'll be all scratched to shit
Oct 07 21:23:20 <oilsworkn> did the listing include actual pictures of the device?
Oct 07 21:23:20 <summatusmentis> I'm hoping the screen is at least in reasonable condition
Oct 07 21:23:31 * oilsworkn is always concerned when ebaying used items without pictures of the actual device
Oct 07 21:23:35 <summatusmentis> no, but it had a pretty good descriptoin
Oct 07 21:23:42 <summatusmentis> description
Oct 07 21:23:54 * halfhalo thinks it will be a black shiny river rock
Oct 07 21:24:05 <summatusmentis> oilsworkn: yeah, I was a bit wary, but it was $42, so even if it's scratched, it's not a huge deal
Oct 07 21:24:23 <oilsworkn> yeah
Oct 07 21:24:24 <summatusmentis> and I mostly want it as a hold-over device
Oct 07 21:24:59 <summatusmentis> until this 1Ghz clocked "hold-over" device comes out :)
Oct 07 21:25:09 <oilsworkn> so
Oct 07 21:25:15 <oilsworkn> its a hold-over for the hold-over?
Oct 07 21:25:22 <oilsworkn> what could possibly go wrong?
Oct 07 21:25:34 <summatusmentis> I'll probably be ok with the "Pre2" or whatever
Oct 07 21:25:40 <summatusmentis> I don't want a touchscreen only phone
Oct 07 21:25:45 * oilsworkn either
Oct 07 21:25:53 <oilsworkn> touchscreen keyboards are the suck
Oct 07 21:25:56 <halfhalo> over the past few hours I have come to the realization I hate the pre form factor
Oct 07 21:26:01 <summatusmentis> so it's a hold-ver to the hold-over, that won't actually be a hold-over
Oct 07 21:26:06 <oilsworkn> shame on your halfhalo
Oct 07 21:26:08 <summatusmentis> halfhalo: how come?
Oct 07 21:26:15 <halfhalo> I dunno
Oct 07 21:26:17 <halfhalo> it just bugs me
Oct 07 21:26:25 * oilsworkn bets halfhalo wants "black slab of glass and plastic" device
Oct 07 21:26:30 <oilsworkn> like every other smartphone out there
Oct 07 21:26:37 <halfhalo> I really like phones like the G2, but more webosy
Oct 07 21:27:19 <summatusmentis> I don't think I'd like a horizontal keyboard
Oct 07 21:27:31 <halfhalo> I had one on my last phone, and it was great
Oct 07 21:27:32 <summatusmentis> I had an n810, and it was hard to use
Oct 07 21:27:36 <oilsworkn> physical keyboard in any direction > onscreen
Oct 07 21:27:39 <halfhalo> but the big screen is what I want
Oct 07 21:28:00 <summatusmentis> I don't actually care about a large screen size either. That's what I want a tablet for
Oct 07 21:28:06 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 21:28:40 <summatusmentis> I'd love for this new device to be comm-board compatible with the pre
Oct 07 21:28:52 <oilsworkn> i want the webos tablet to be more then "big pre"
Oct 07 21:28:53 <oilsworkn> thats for sure
Oct 07 21:28:57 <summatusmentis> right?
Oct 07 21:29:01 <summatusmentis> that's how I feel about it
Oct 07 21:29:14 <torchie> I kind of want 3.7 inch
Oct 07 21:29:41 <halfhalo> I'm this || close to getting an epic 4g and just switching between the pre and epic
Oct 07 21:29:43 <summatusmentis> if they streamlined the front face of the pre, they might be able to get 3.3-3.5" screens in there
Oct 07 21:29:46 <torchie> vertical keyboard's preferrable to horizontal for me, but no keyboard would be better
Oct 07 21:30:19 <torchie> I want some mil spec durability in this thing
Oct 07 21:30:25 <torchie> >:(
Oct 07 21:30:36 <summatusmentis> hah
Oct 07 21:30:44 <oilsworkn> the only thing horizontal keyboard has over vertical, is larger buttons for people with fat fingers
Oct 07 21:30:55 * oilsworkn has to "nail type" on his pre
Oct 07 21:31:16 <summatusmentis> oilsworkn: I don't have hugely fat fingers, but the centro keyboard was nice, and really small
Oct 07 21:32:26 <Bmyers> ov'n my evo
Oct 07 21:32:40 <torchie> I hate the travel distance on horizontals
Oct 07 21:32:53 <torchie> my favorite keyboard is still the pixi's lol
Oct 07 21:33:06 <summatusmentis> torchie: I agree, the travel distance is irritating
Oct 07 21:33:25 <Dr_EVOl> miss a real keyboard tho
Oct 07 21:33:36 <torchie> I always thought a super-thin horizontal slider of the ipod nano's dimensions would be cool
Oct 07 21:33:47 <halfhalo> I wouldn't mind an evo
Oct 07 21:33:48 <oilsworkn> just every time i clip my thumbnails, it takes a day or two before im able to type quickly on the pre
Oct 07 21:33:49 <radiofreejohn> too tiny
Oct 07 21:33:55 <torchie> the old iphone nano anyway
Oct 07 21:38:34 <oilsworkn> http://forums.precentral.net/web-os-development/264777-plea-preware-gurus-remember-mac-users-2.html#post2698116
Oct 07 21:38:37 * oilsworkn cracks himself up
Oct 07 21:39:18 <halfhalo> screw macs! oh, wait...
Oct 07 21:39:23 * halfhalo is on a mac
Oct 07 21:39:38 <radiofreejohn> ditto
Oct 07 21:39:50 <oilsworkn> well, he was talking about ppc macs
Oct 07 21:41:09 <Dr_EVOl> just switched to a macbook
Oct 07 21:41:09 <oilsworkn> apparently the required version of java was never released for it or something
Oct 07 21:41:12 <Loudergood> they really need to support win ME too
Oct 07 21:41:19 <oilsworkn> there is just a lot of crying in there, lol
Oct 07 21:41:20 <Dr_EVOl> i'm in all the wrong demographics ..
Oct 07 21:41:23 <oilsworkn> hey, a wircer
Oct 07 21:41:45 <halfhalo> BURN
Oct 07 21:41:48 <CTLAdvance-pre> yes sir
Oct 07 21:41:59 <CTLAdvance-pre> I blame oil
Oct 07 21:42:09 * halfhalo blames oil as well
Oct 07 21:42:29 * creationix wonders why oil get's all the blame
Oct 07 21:42:30 <oilsworkn> :/
Oct 07 21:42:38 <CTLAdvance-pre> hmm what's the best way to tether a sprint pre
Oct 07 21:42:48 <creationix> CTLAdvance-pre: duct-tape
Oct 07 21:42:49 <halfhalo> Its something i started waaaayyyy to long ago
Oct 07 21:43:02 <rwhitby> and have carried on waaayyyy too long
Oct 07 21:43:08 <oilsworkn> creationix: because im responsible for everything apparently
Oct 07 21:43:10 <CTLAdvance-pre> hmm, duct tape won't let it connect
Oct 07 21:43:19 <oilsworkn> from a bug in halfhalos code
Oct 07 21:43:24 <oilsworkn> to it raining on his day off
Oct 07 21:43:42 <creationix> I've been know to cause rain from time to time
Oct 07 21:43:43 * haeffb_pre blames oil for letting halfhalo start it
Oct 07 21:43:56 <oilsworkn> creationix: not that kind of rain, lol
Oct 07 21:44:00 <CTLAdvance-pre> what happened
Oct 07 21:44:28 * oilsworkn actually writes pretty bug-free code
Oct 07 21:44:41 <creationix> I asked in the node.js room, but what do you guys think about this diagram http://72.14.187.119:3000/object-graphs-2/classical.dot
Oct 07 21:45:13 <creationix> here's the code that goes with it http://72.14.187.119:3000/object-graphs-2/classical.js
Oct 07 21:45:19 <oilsworkn> i had to stop looking in the #webos backlog
Oct 07 21:45:30 <oilsworkn> because mentions of my name weren't someone actually trying to get ahold of me
Oct 07 21:45:53 <oilsworkn> just halfhalo and his minions being ridiculous
Oct 07 21:46:03 * halfhalo has minions?
Oct 07 21:46:37 <oilsworkn> apparently
Oct 07 21:47:09 * halfhalo orders his minions to bring him ice cold coca cola
Oct 07 21:47:20 <CTLAdvance-pre> can weeven tether this thing
Oct 07 21:48:53 <creationix> so no comments on the diagram?
Oct 07 21:49:03 <creationix> I'm trying to teach proper JavaScript to the masses
Oct 07 21:49:04 * oilsworkn didn't look
Oct 07 21:49:08 <creationix> it's part of my next article
Oct 07 21:49:24 <oilsworkn> next article?
Oct 07 21:49:44 <creationix> howtonode.org
Oct 07 21:49:44 <CTLAdvance-pre> I am blaming oil for no response on tethering
Oct 07 21:49:53 <CTLAdvance-pre> :)
Oct 07 21:50:00 <creationix> I'm telling you duct-tape will keep it super secure
Oct 07 21:50:03 <creationix> "tethered"
Oct 07 21:50:43 <oilsworkn> :/
Oct 07 21:50:49 <CTLAdvance-pre> ok can I connect my pc to the internet using my pre for the connection
Oct 07 21:51:04 * halfhalo gives oil a coke
Oct 07 21:51:12 <sugardave> oil and coke don't mix
Oct 07 21:51:20 <Roy-Pre101> Whoops, I was forgetting to free the surface I drew my fonts on to.
Oct 07 21:51:22 <CTLAdvance-pre> yes duct tape will fix the poor quality of the pre
Oct 07 21:51:27 <CTLAdvance-pre> oy
Oct 07 21:51:52 * Anivrom downs a dr.pepper
Oct 07 21:54:00 <CTLAdvance-pre> hmm
Oct 07 21:54:08 <CTLAdvance-pre> what happened to free tether
Oct 07 21:54:20 <halfhalo> no idea
Oct 07 21:54:31 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 21:54:37 <oilsworkn> freetether never happened in the first place
Oct 07 21:54:43 <creationix> I move my sim to a nexus one to tether
Oct 07 21:54:50 <haeffb> creationix: makes sense to me. what kind of feedback are you looking for?
Oct 07 21:55:07 <creationix> haeffb: just wondering what parts are unclear and what makes sense
Oct 07 21:55:07 <haeffb> HattCzech_work: your dev device is an AT&T pixi?
Oct 07 21:55:22 <CTLAdvance-pre> is there any way to tether a sprint pre?
Oct 07 21:55:34 <haeffb> drill a hole through the top and add a leather lanyard?
Oct 07 21:55:38 <HattCzech_work> pre
Oct 07 21:55:42 <oilsworkn> i dont believe sprint lets you get a tethering plan for your pre
Oct 07 21:55:52 <HattCzech_work> CTLAdvance-pre: yes
Oct 07 21:55:52 <haeffb> the free one?
Oct 07 21:56:06 <HattCzech_work> CTLAdvance-pre: you get a warning message, but it works
Oct 07 21:56:20 <CTLAdvance-pre> well sprint blackberries let you without an issue
Oct 07 21:56:29 <oilsworkn> i dont think #webos is the channel to talk about breaking your contract with sprint, haha
Oct 07 21:56:33 <CTLAdvance-pre> hattczech what's the process?
Oct 07 21:56:46 <oilsworkn> well, maybe it is
Oct 07 21:56:48 <HattCzech_work> is that breaking a contract? or ignoring a warning?
Oct 07 21:56:51 <oilsworkn> #webos has like 0 moderation
Oct 07 21:57:07 <HattCzech_work> freetetherd and mobile hotspot
Oct 07 21:57:24 <oilsworkn> HattCzech_work: he needs steps
Oct 07 21:57:42 * haeffb recalls a precentral thread...
Oct 07 21:57:51 <CTLAdvance-pre> I have preware available
Oct 07 21:58:05 <oilsworkn> well, you're not going to find mobile hotspot app in preware, thats for sure
Oct 07 21:58:46 <CTLAdvance-pre> yeah I figured.
Oct 07 21:58:49 <HattCzech_work> CTLAdvance-pre: somewhere in one of the feeds is freetether and freetetherd
Oct 07 21:59:02 <oilsworkn> and mobile hotspot is "on the internet"
Oct 07 21:59:03 <CTLAdvance-pre> ok I'll take a look
Oct 07 21:59:17 <HattCzech_work> yeah, oil phrased it nicely :)
Oct 07 21:59:22 <halfhalo> whats this internet?
Oct 07 21:59:23 <CTLAdvance-pre> can I do it without hotspot?
Oct 07 21:59:34 <oilsworkn> halfhalo: its a series of tubes
Oct 07 22:00:01 <halfhalo> orly
Oct 07 22:00:03 <HattCzech_work> CTLAdvance-pre: there's a paid app out there that is supposed to work, but i like the "more official" method of doing it
Oct 07 22:00:20 <HattCzech_work> it's called mytether
Oct 07 22:00:22 <CTLAdvance-pre> ah ok
Oct 07 22:00:36 <halfhalo> mytether still works?
Oct 07 22:00:38 <CTLAdvance-pre> let me see if I can find freetether first
Oct 07 22:00:40 * oilsworkn waves magic wand over ctladvance's pre and says "abracadabra"
Oct 07 22:00:42 <Roy-Pre101> halfhalo: It does
Oct 07 22:00:52 <halfhalo> news to me!
Oct 07 22:00:54 <Roy-Pre101> I never got it to work on my AT&T Pre but it works on my Sprint.
Oct 07 22:01:06 * oilsworkn never paid for it
Oct 07 22:01:14 <Roy-Pre101> Ohhh..
Oct 07 22:01:14 <halfhalo> neither did I
Oct 07 22:01:16 <oilsworkn> and by paid
Oct 07 22:01:17 <oilsworkn> i mean
Oct 07 22:01:17 <HattCzech_work> i'm not sure, i haven't used it probably since 1.0
Oct 07 22:01:19 <oilsworkn> donated for it
Oct 07 22:01:19 <Roy-Pre101> I meant Freetether.
Oct 07 22:01:19 <oilsworkn> lols
Oct 07 22:01:34 <Roy-Pre101> I only used mytether once when it was free and it caused headaches so I stopped
Oct 07 22:01:43 <HattCzech_work> yeah, same here, Roy-Pre101
Oct 07 22:01:46 <oilsworkn> it screwed up a lot of peoples pres
Oct 07 22:02:26 <HattCzech_work> mine might have been one of them... there are still some issues i have :)
Oct 07 22:02:38 <oilsworkn> doctor
Oct 07 22:02:55 <HattCzech_work> i did
Oct 07 22:03:00 <HattCzech_work> didn't fix all of the problems
Oct 07 22:03:24 <oilsworkn> sell it on ebay and buy a new one
Oct 07 22:03:27 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:03:51 <HattCzech_work> example: trying to delete an app... the icon area is boxed at 32x32, but the icons are 48x48, so i can't see a lot of the icons
Oct 07 22:03:53 * oilsworkn wishes devdays wasn't in NY
Oct 07 22:03:56 <HattCzech_work> only when deleting
Oct 07 22:03:59 * HattCzech_work too
Oct 07 22:04:13 * oilsworkn would have gone if it was in CA again
Oct 07 22:04:14 <HattCzech_work> i even looked into flights, but they are EXPENSIVE
Oct 07 22:04:15 <oilsworkn> er, would go
Oct 07 22:04:15 <BMyers> whats wrong w/NY?
Oct 07 22:04:23 <oilsworkn> its on the other side of the country!
Oct 07 22:04:31 <HattCzech_work> i can definitely get cheaper flights there
Oct 07 22:04:34 <BMyers> no it isnt
Oct 07 22:04:39 <oilsworkn> from me it is!
Oct 07 22:04:54 <BMyers> i can almost see it from here.. was gonna say...
Oct 07 22:04:56 * oilsworkn is going to have his own devdays
Oct 07 22:04:58 <HattCzech_work> i'm in the middle, but cali is closer
Oct 07 22:05:00 <oilsworkn> in my back yard
Oct 07 22:05:46 <CTLAdvance-pre> which version of free tether d
Oct 07 22:05:56 <HattCzech_work> there are versions?
Oct 07 22:05:57 <CTLAdvance-pre> 0.0.3
Oct 07 22:05:59 <HattCzech_work> 0.0.3?
Oct 07 22:06:12 <HattCzech_work> you'll need both, and it'll install both
Oct 07 22:06:23 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:06:30 <CTLAdvance-pre> do you have the feed I'm lookin on the web
Oct 07 22:06:30 <oilsworkn> idk
Oct 07 22:06:36 <HattCzech_work> there's the service and the app
Oct 07 22:06:37 <CTLAdvance-pre> it's not in preware
Oct 07 22:06:39 <oilsworkn> i dont think its been updated since we added dep support to preware, lol
Oct 07 22:06:49 <oilsworkn> if you see it on the web, you're looking at the feed
Oct 07 22:06:56 <HattCzech_work> it needs to be "hybridized"
Oct 07 22:07:05 <oilsworkn> idk if tethering can be done inside the jail
Oct 07 22:07:12 <oilsworkn> i think it needs c service to be outside the jail
Oct 07 22:07:27 <HattCzech_work> ohhh, okay
Oct 07 22:07:35 <CTLAdvance-pre> oh ok
Oct 07 22:07:43 <oilsworkn> what ever happened to the other devday-type thing?
Oct 07 22:07:44 * haeffb just got a shipment of roomba parts
Oct 07 22:07:46 <oilsworkn> devcamp?
Oct 07 22:07:49 <CTLAdvance-pre> yeah first result is ipkg.preware.org
Oct 07 22:07:52 <oilsworkn> is that still goin on?
Oct 07 22:08:02 <oilsworkn> ipkg.preware.org == the feeds
Oct 07 22:08:12 <CTLAdvance-pre> saweet
Oct 07 22:08:25 <oilsworkn> i guess?
Oct 07 22:08:35 <halfhalo> meh
Oct 07 22:08:41 <CTLAdvance-pre> now if only this had a 4.3 inch screen it would be easier to work with
Oct 07 22:08:44 <CTLAdvance-pre> :/
Oct 07 22:08:50 <oilsworkn> halfhalo needs to fix redmine
Oct 07 22:09:00 <halfhalo> what happened to it?
Oct 07 22:09:06 <oilsworkn> BROKEN!
Oct 07 22:09:17 <halfhalo> shocker!
Oct 07 22:09:21 <HattCzech_work> you'll need: freetether 0.0.1, freetetherd 0.0.3 (which will install automatically), and mobile hotspot 1.0.14
Oct 07 22:09:29 * halfhalo doesn't know what broke
Oct 07 22:09:37 <oilsworkn> http://redmine.webos-internals.org/projects/govnah/activity
Oct 07 22:09:45 <oilsworkn> doesn't show any commits after 10/3
Oct 07 22:09:59 <halfhalo> heh
Oct 07 22:10:06 <oilsworkn> heh != FIX
Oct 07 22:10:10 <HattCzech_work> redmine?
Oct 07 22:10:18 <oilsworkn> yeah
Oct 07 22:10:22 <halfhalo> the repo tab needs to be clicked to load in the new commits
Oct 07 22:10:29 <oilsworkn> apparently we switched to it instead of trac
Oct 07 22:10:47 <oilsworkn> halfhalo: make it automatic
Oct 07 22:11:02 * HattCzech_work in towelie voice: "i have no idea what's going on"
Oct 07 22:11:23 <halfhalo> uggg
Oct 07 22:12:38 <oilsworkn> !
Oct 07 22:13:23 <CTLAdvance-pre> ok I have freetetherd installed
Oct 07 22:13:34 <CTLAdvance-pre> looking for -d
Oct 07 22:13:38 <HattCzech_work> now you have to "find" mobile hotspot :)
Oct 07 22:13:59 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:14:01 <HattCzech_work> ohhh
Oct 07 22:14:09 <HattCzech_work> and freetether?
Oct 07 22:14:36 <oilsworkn> it should be made one package
Oct 07 22:14:58 <CTLAdvance-pre> yeah
Oct 07 22:15:00 <HattCzech_work> indeed
Oct 07 22:15:09 <HattCzech_work> webos internals feed
Oct 07 22:15:16 <HattCzech_work> just do list of everything and search for it
Oct 07 22:15:28 <CTLAdvance-pre> I wish we could quicy update and get in the feed
Oct 07 22:15:44 <CTLAdvance-pre> is this a default feed?
Oct 07 22:15:57 <HattCzech_work> hmmm...? maybe
Oct 07 22:16:04 * CTLAdvance-pre just finally caved to using preware 2 months ago
Oct 07 22:16:37 <HattCzech_work> what took you so long? :)
Oct 07 22:16:54 <oilsworkn> lolol
Oct 07 22:17:13 <sugardave> damn, a no-text review of less than 5 stars has tarnished my new app
Oct 07 22:17:15 <oilsworkn> oh, there goes a wircer
Oct 07 22:17:17 <sugardave> bastards
Oct 07 22:17:25 <oilsworkn> sugardave: :(
Oct 07 22:17:35 <sugardave> it's still at 4.5 or so
Oct 07 22:17:41 <oilsworkn> psh
Oct 07 22:17:49 <sugardave> only 3 ratings :P
Oct 07 22:17:50 <oilsworkn> "tarnished" it down to "well above other apps"
Oct 07 22:17:57 <HattCzech_work> CTLAdvance-pre: webos internals feed should have all and armv7 (i hope)
Oct 07 22:18:00 <sugardave> still plenty of time to bring it down to the muck level
Oct 07 22:18:06 <HattCzech_work> or v6 if you're pixi (i believe)
Oct 07 22:18:15 * oilsworkn reviews it with "Great App!" and 0 stars
Oct 07 22:18:19 <sugardave> haha
Oct 07 22:18:23 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:18:44 <CTLAdvance-pre> is it the testing feed?
Oct 07 22:18:44 <HattCzech_work> lol
Oct 07 22:18:51 <HattCzech_work> nope
Oct 07 22:19:01 <HattCzech_work> http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-internals/all/us.ryanhope.freetether_0.0.1_all.ipk
Oct 07 22:19:04 <HattCzech_work> there, direct link :)
Oct 07 22:19:36 <oilsworkn> jees, its really difficult to help CTLAdvance-pre
Oct 07 22:19:47 * CTLAdvance-pre thanks hattczech with an ebeer
Oct 07 22:19:51 <CTLAdvance-pre> lol
Oct 07 22:19:58 <halfhalo> almost as difficult as me!
Oct 07 22:19:59 <HattCzech_work> hahah
Oct 07 22:20:02 <oilsworkn> ebeer, just like real beer... in name only
Oct 07 22:20:08 <oilsworkn> other then that, its absolutely nothing
Oct 07 22:20:18 <HattCzech_work> like an iBeer (if this were an apple chat room)
Oct 07 22:20:26 <HattCzech_work> f'ing i in front of everything
Oct 07 22:20:32 <CTLAdvance-pre> oy
Oct 07 22:20:33 <oilsworkn> bringing ibeer to these parts will get you shot
Oct 07 22:20:33 <sugardave> iKnow right
Oct 07 22:20:41 <HattCzech_work> LOL
Oct 07 22:20:58 <oilsworkn> dont be flashin those colors in my hood
Oct 07 22:21:01 <CTLAdvance-pre> let me drink my stella to hattczech, maybe then ctladvance pre will be easier to help
Oct 07 22:21:55 <halfhalo> icop, that irobber just stole my iwallet!  I was in fear for my ilife!
Oct 07 22:21:58 <oilsworkn> is more intoxication going to help?
Oct 07 22:22:23 <halfhalo> it ALWAYS helps
Oct 07 22:24:44 <CTLAdvance-pre> what was that halfhalo?
Oct 07 22:24:57 <CTLAdvance-pre> you blame oil for making me drink stella?
Oct 07 22:25:00 <CTLAdvance-pre> oy
Oct 07 22:25:20 <oilsworkn> :/
Oct 07 22:25:37 <oilsworkn> if you're going to blame me for stuff, at least make sure its cool stuff
Oct 07 22:25:38 <oilsworkn> like
Oct 07 22:25:46 <oilsworkn> "hey, i just won $50k in hotapps"
Oct 07 22:25:48 <oilsworkn> that you can blame me for
Oct 07 22:25:52 * halfhalo blames oil for the unicorns
Oct 07 22:26:02 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:26:31 <CTLAdvance-pre> lol
Oct 07 22:32:55 <oilsworkn> way to kill the channel
Oct 07 22:33:45 <oilsworkn> i still got a half hour to kill at work
Oct 07 22:34:24 <HattCzech_work> me too
Oct 07 22:34:41 <oilsworkn> well then
Oct 07 22:35:36 <halfhalo> do... work?
Oct 07 22:35:42 <oilsworkn> lols
Oct 07 22:35:49 <oilsworkn> you crazy
Oct 07 22:35:59 <halfhalo> whats that got to do with anything
Oct 07 22:36:12 <oilsworkn> if i had work to do i wouldn't be here chatting
Oct 07 22:36:15 <oilsworkn> id be doing it
Oct 07 22:36:22 <halfhalo> lies
Oct 07 22:36:33 <oilsworkn> maybe a little
Oct 07 22:36:37 <oilsworkn> but really, i got nothing to do
Oct 07 22:36:38 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:36:49 <oilsworkn> my boss took off
Oct 07 22:36:53 <oilsworkn> and hes out all next week
Oct 07 22:37:02 <CTLAdvance-pre> now on to mobile hotspot
Oct 07 22:37:13 <halfhalo> hah
Oct 07 22:37:29 <halfhalo> i now have 3 kb's on my desktop right now...
Oct 07 22:40:12 <CTLAdvance-pre> hmm this is proving harder to find
Oct 07 22:40:25 <CTLAdvance-pre> I don't have time for this shit, I have ass to kick
Oct 07 22:44:14 <HattCzech_work> search harder
Oct 07 22:44:18 <HattCzech_work> and with more intensity
Oct 07 22:44:57 <CTLAdvance-pre> I'm working on it.... I'll relay the message to my phone
Oct 07 22:46:19 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:46:46 <oilsworkn> CTLAdvance-pre is only saying he can't find it so you will get him the .ipk url xD
Oct 07 22:46:50 <CTLAdvance-pre> wow
Oct 07 22:46:58 <CTLAdvance-pre> lol
Oct 07 22:47:01 <CTLAdvance-pre> oy
Oct 07 22:47:14 <oilsworkn> ha, hit hte nail on the head!
Oct 07 22:47:35 <CTLAdvance-pre> no I'm searchin, just need the right combo
Oct 07 22:47:40 <CTLAdvance-pre> :/
Oct 07 22:47:45 <CTLAdvance-pre> from my pre
Oct 07 22:48:05 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:48:16 * oilsworkn knows where this is headed
Oct 07 22:48:35 * oilsworkn has seen the future
Oct 07 22:49:22 <CTLAdvance-pre> nope I'm not gonna blame u
Oct 07 22:49:34 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:49:39 <CTLAdvance-pre> I was unprepared...
Oct 07 22:56:53 <dohtem> hello magnificent developers!
Oct 07 22:57:01 <oilsworkn> hello
Oct 07 22:57:14 * halfhalo giggles
Oct 07 22:57:25 <rwhitby> hello worthy subject
Oct 07 22:57:29 <oilsworkn> lol
Oct 07 22:57:48 <rwhitby> what of our bidding will you be doing today?
Oct 07 22:58:40 * oilsworkn requires refreshment!
Oct 07 22:58:44 * oilsworkn *claps*
Oct 07 22:59:42 <halfhalo> hah
Oct 07 23:00:15 * dohtem offers oil some fresh lemonade (with pee)
Oct 07 23:01:02 <oilsworkn> oh, thats messed up
Oct 07 23:01:42 * oilsworkn goes home
Oct 07 23:01:48 <HattCzech_work> lol
Oct 07 23:02:12 <dohtem> lol
Oct 07 23:02:38 * rwhitby was going to ask for chocolate cookies, but has second thoughts ...
Oct 07 23:03:16 <dohtem> brownies?
Oct 07 23:03:18 * Anivrom was craving brownies
Oct 07 23:03:27 <Anivrom> but not anymore
Oct 07 23:08:13 <dohtem> Anivrom: let's form a nonprofit.  Palm is giving phones to nonprofits.
Oct 07 23:09:14 <Anivrom> I should be getting a phone anyways.
Oct 07 23:17:38 <BMyers> i'm a palm developer. is that nonprofit?
Oct 07 23:24:51 <haeffb> rwhitby: good message to the bostonpartykid
Oct 07 23:28:43 <haeffb> september sales reports are in
Oct 07 23:29:55 <haeffb> totals are down about 30% from august
Oct 07 23:30:27 <haeffb> which was down abou 50% from july
Oct 07 23:30:39 * haeffb sees a need for new hardware/users
Oct 07 23:35:13 <rwhitby> haeffb: I get tired of people who are all "should I do this, or is Android better, oh iOS has more users, ..." - as if asking questions in a dedicated webOS channel is going to help you resolve questions like that ...
Oct 07 23:36:58 <haeffb> that, and webOS doesn't really need more "100 low hanging fruit" app developers
Oct 07 23:37:43 <sugardave> 1000s
Oct 07 23:38:14 <rwhitby> sugardave: he did correct himself to 100s, but neglected to mention even one of his apps
Oct 07 23:38:55 <sugardave> true, I figured he'd be shooting for the 1K low-hanging fruit mark, though
Oct 07 23:39:01 <haeffb> "reference apps"
Oct 07 23:39:29 <haeffb> difficult decision alert!
Oct 07 23:39:37 <sugardave> I'm sad...either my HDMI cable is out, or my PS3 is about to die
Oct 07 23:39:51 <haeffb> DVR wants to record Big Bang Theory
Oct 07 23:40:01 <haeffb> haeffb wants to watch KSU-NEB instead.
Oct 07 23:40:07 <sugardave> hmmm
Oct 07 23:40:14 <sugardave> can't watch one and record the other?
Oct 07 23:40:46 <haeffb> also recording Community, 30 Rock & The Office
Oct 07 23:40:53 <haeffb> two-tuner DVR
Oct 07 23:41:09 <sugardave> ah
Oct 07 23:41:23 <dohtem> the NBC shows will be on Hulu this weekend, you can catch up there
Oct 07 23:41:27 <haeffb> so, I'll watch the first 30 min of football and decide at that point... :)
Oct 07 23:41:34 * haeffb no hulu
Oct 07 23:41:50 <haeffb> but hey! I can now that I have an actual internet!
Oct 07 23:43:12 <haeffb> is hulu in HD?
Oct 07 23:43:16 <BMyers> what game?
Oct 07 23:43:26 <haeffb> KSU-NEB
Oct 07 23:43:39 <dohtem> haeffb: there are  "high quality" vids
Oct 07 23:43:55 <dohtem> not bad really.
Oct 07 23:44:24 <sugardave> I'm not sure if that's going to be a quality game...how is KSU this year?
Oct 07 23:45:08 <haeffb> They're one-dimensional.
Oct 07 23:45:13 <haeffb> But it's in Manhattan.
Oct 07 23:45:21 <sugardave> Nebraska will roll them, I bet
Oct 07 23:45:24 <haeffb> So...anything could happen...?
Oct 07 23:45:31 <sugardave> I guess so
Oct 07 23:45:38 <BMyers> thats why they play the game
Oct 07 23:45:43 <sugardave> that's true
Oct 07 23:45:58 <BMyers> not seeing it. what channel?
Oct 07 23:46:00 <haeffb> If NU is up 14-0 at 7pm, I'll let the DVR do what it wants
Oct 07 23:46:01 <haeffb> ESPN
Oct 07 23:46:18 <sugardave> maybe my PS3 is trying to tell me to write rod's clock app
Oct 07 23:46:22 <haeffb> Jenn Brown is hot
Oct 07 23:46:26 <sugardave> "Shut up, PS3!"
Oct 07 23:46:50 <BMyers> wanna be trophy wife
Oct 07 23:47:00 <halfhalo> lol
Oct 07 23:47:21 <haeffb> nah, she's a "Sports Reporter"
Oct 07 23:47:34 <dohtem> lol, why the quotes?
Oct 07 23:47:59 <BMyers> she does the hard stories..
Oct 07 23:48:16 <sugardave> the hardbody stories
Oct 07 23:48:27 <BMyers> ah, thats so wrong..
Oct 07 23:48:39 <haeffb> Thomas is a great RB
Oct 07 23:48:47 <BMyers> what was that other one with the jets problem?
Oct 07 23:49:23 <haeffb> Ines Sainz
Oct 07 23:49:47 * haeffb googled "Jets lockerroom reporter"
Oct 07 23:50:00 <dohtem> didnt know about her till that whole thing... whoa, she's hot
Oct 07 23:50:03 <BMyers> yeah. she wears hip hugger hot pants and a tank top
Oct 07 23:50:13 <BMyers> and she's all "ahh, why are they bothering me"
Oct 07 23:50:24 <BMyers> C"MON MAN!!!
Oct 07 23:50:28 <haeffb> why, indeed!
Oct 07 23:50:39 <haeffb> just trying to do my job!
Oct 07 23:50:46 <sugardave> careful, that sounds awfully close to "she deserved it"...you might get castrated for that
Oct 07 23:51:00 <BMyers> no, not deserved it
Oct 07 23:51:21 <BMyers> but not surprised in the least
Oct 07 23:51:48 <haeffb> dress "provocatively" and wonder why they're "provoked"
Oct 07 23:51:57 <BMyers> i already married w/children. essentially the same thing..
Oct 07 23:52:17 <sugardave> ha
Oct 07 23:52:38 <sugardave> KS is driving, not too shabby
Oct 07 23:52:38 <BMyers> older enough to be called "Sir" at mcdonalds drive thru's
Oct 07 23:52:48 <dohtem> heh
Oct 07 23:53:02 <sugardave> when I decided to shave my face, my wife calls me her jailbait
Oct 07 23:53:17 <BMyers> how old is your wife?
Oct 07 23:53:34 <sugardave> me + 5
Oct 07 23:53:49 <BMyers> was gonna say. you're like 50 -ish?
Oct 07 23:53:50 <dohtem> young'n
Oct 07 23:53:55 <sugardave> haha
Oct 07 23:53:59 <BMyers> 55?
Oct 07 23:53:59 <sugardave> I just turned 38
Oct 07 23:54:06 <sugardave> she hits 43 in May
Oct 07 23:54:17 <BMyers> started to get those AARP flyer's yet?
Oct 07 23:54:50 <sugardave> not those, but I get phone calls for "senior citizen" stuff all the time, they're pissing me off
Oct 07 23:55:09 <sugardave> I mean, can't your software add and subtract properly?
Oct 07 23:55:34 <rwhitby> sugardave: you're a young whipper snapper
Oct 07 23:55:51 <sugardave> rwhitby: thanks, I'll go with that :D
Oct 07 23:56:02 <BMyers> yeah
Oct 07 23:56:05 <BMyers> he's 38
Oct 07 23:56:13 <dohtem> sugardave: those senior citizen tubs where you take a bath sitting down have to be the best
Oct 07 23:56:14 <BMyers> all full of P n V
Oct 07 23:56:30 <sugardave> dohtem: actually, that thing does look pretty cool :D
Oct 07 23:56:54 <sugardave> like a hot tub without all the maintenance
Oct 07 23:57:05 <dohtem> IN THE BATHROOM!
Oct 07 23:57:10 <sugardave> win
Oct 07 23:59:02 <haeffb> short
Oct 07 23:59:07 <sugardave> indeed
Oct 08 00:00:42 * dohtem just got the free device program email back!
Oct 08 00:01:18 <haeffb> game over. Neb wins.
Oct 08 00:01:27 <haeffb> dohtem: Yay!
Oct 08 00:01:50 <BMyers> anyone heard if series 1 pre's might be upgradable to 2.x ?
Oct 08 00:02:00 <sugardave> now my DVR has taken over
Oct 08 00:02:01 <dohtem> Sprint's?
Oct 08 00:02:07 <BMyers> yes
Oct 08 00:02:26 <dohtem> I would think so.  But I don't think we have gotten anything concrete
Oct 08 00:02:33 <sugardave> there is no audio now....wth
Oct 08 00:05:17 <BMyers> 7 0 neb
Oct 08 00:06:33 <haeffb> really? my DVR already made the switch
Oct 08 00:06:47 <BMyers> yup
Oct 08 00:07:10 <sugardave> mine did, too, but mine picked community and it sounds like I was getting the audio feed from the time warner server room or something
Oct 08 00:07:20 <sugardave> so I just turned it off
Oct 08 00:08:17 <sugardave> BMyers: if I can't upgrade my Pre to 2.0 I will be pretty irritated, especially if there is no other device to go to
Oct 08 00:08:33 <BMyers> yeah. i would imagine
Oct 08 00:08:58 <BMyers> work for palm with no return tho.
Oct 08 00:09:17 <BMyers> they dont make a cent for sending us up to 2.0 on already paid for phones
Oct 08 00:09:36 <sugardave> not directly
Oct 08 00:09:57 <sugardave> new apps for people to want, etc.
Oct 08 00:10:14 <Amaranth> They'd be stupid to not offer it for pre and pixi
Oct 08 00:10:30 <Amaranth> Massive market split there
Oct 08 00:10:42 <Amaranth> 2.0 would be like starting over
Oct 08 00:11:00 <Amaranth> Or at least for pre
Oct 08 00:11:02 <BMyers> apple has never done it have they?
Oct 08 00:11:21 <dohtem> with 4.0 they did
Oct 08 00:11:23 <Amaranth> Apple only started not supporting older phones with 4.0
Oct 08 00:11:36 <dohtem> the 3G didnt get some features
Oct 08 00:11:38 <Amaranth> The original iPhone doesn't get it at all and the 3G doesn't get multitasking
Oct 08 00:11:48 <dohtem> what he said^
Oct 08 00:12:04 <BMyers> free upgrade?
Oct 08 00:12:08 <Amaranth> Yes
Oct 08 00:12:18 <Amaranth> Even the touch gets free upgrades now
Oct 08 00:12:24 <Amaranth> iphone always has
Oct 08 00:12:28 <BMyers> and a free hug..
Oct 08 00:12:39 <BMyers> ever been to an apple store? OMG WTF?
Oct 08 00:13:42 <dohtem> no one's ever hugged me
Oct 08 00:13:49 <dohtem> at the Apple store, i mean
Oct 08 00:15:11 <BMyers> when you make an appt with the genius bar there is a little checkbox for "hug", did you check that?
Oct 08 00:15:45 <dohtem> well I've never had to make an appointment.
Oct 08 00:16:02 * dohtem doesnt own any apple products
Oct 08 00:16:54 <BMyers> i scored a broken $400 macbook from craigslist list that was still under warranty for like, 5 more days.
Oct 08 00:17:03 <BMyers> brought it to the store and the fixed it..
Oct 08 00:17:12 <BMyers> twice..
Oct 08 00:18:22 <sugardave> rwhitby: do you remember the day you were telling KGF your feature list so I can hunt it down easier?
Oct 08 00:18:33 <sugardave> or approximate day
Oct 08 00:19:24 <sugardave> haha, this page is in slovak
Oct 08 00:20:11 <dohtem> BMyers: nice. Apple fixed it?
Oct 08 00:20:31 <rwhitby> sugardave: 2010-09-21 10:55am in my timezone
Oct 08 00:20:31 <BMyers> for free. AND replaced the worn out battery. also free
Oct 08 00:20:42 <Spanska> Is there any way I can create a small SQL database and then package that file with my app and use it that way with WebOS?
Oct 08 00:20:58 <sugardave> rwhitby: thanks :D
Oct 08 00:21:00 <pandora--> oh hey, this thing is still on
Oct 08 00:21:03 <pandora--> how about that.
Oct 08 00:21:04 <BMyers> 1st replaced was the LCD
Oct 08 00:21:18 <BMyers> 2nd time was because there were 2 bad pixels on that replacement screen
Oct 08 00:21:44 <BMyers> Spanska:  yes
Oct 08 00:22:18 <BMyers> first install the app and let it create the db
Oct 08 00:22:22 <dohtem> BMyers: the original owner had no idea?
Oct 08 00:22:40 <BMyers> the original owner sold it to someone who sold it to me
Oct 08 00:22:42 <Spanska> BMyers: so I have to embed the data in my app and then create a db with the app?
Oct 08 00:23:07 <BMyers> Spanska:  not exactly
Oct 08 00:23:28 <BMyers> you have to create the db with your app
Oct 08 00:23:44 <BMyers> it creates a randomly named file 00000002.db
Oct 08 00:23:51 <BMyers> or something like that
Oct 08 00:24:04 <BMyers> you replace that file it create with your loaded up one
Oct 08 00:24:16 <Spanska> BMyers: is that a good way to do things or should I rather put all my data in a js file and have my app create a db based on that data?
Oct 08 00:24:33 <BMyers> if it's for testing , thats fine
Oct 08 00:24:55 <BMyers> if its for production you'll have to get the data in there some other way
Oct 08 00:25:01 <BMyers> either hard coded in the js
Oct 08 00:25:03 <BMyers> or from the cloud
Oct 08 00:25:28 <Spanska> BMyers: ok, I'll hardcore it then, thanks:)
Oct 08 00:25:36 <Spanska> hardcode it, event hehe
Oct 08 00:25:41 <Spanska> even
Oct 08 00:25:47 <dohtem> lol
Oct 08 00:25:51 <BMyers> try that too. which works..
Oct 08 00:27:42 <pandora--> has anyone been able to get mobile hotspot working on a 1.4.5 sprint pre?
Oct 08 00:27:45 <pandora--> i fail
Oct 08 00:28:31 <BMyers>  mobile hotspot never worked for me
Oct 08 00:28:56 <BMyers> cause i refused to pay extra for it
Oct 08 00:29:12 <pandora--> no trouble getting devices to connect to my pre, but they never actually get any internets
Oct 08 00:29:37 <BMyers> you have a plus phone?
Oct 08 00:29:41 <pandora--> negative
Oct 08 00:29:51 <BMyers> pay extra for the service?
Oct 08 00:29:55 <pandora--> sprint Pre
Oct 08 00:29:59 <pandora--> erm... no
Oct 08 00:30:01 <pandora--> :)
Oct 08 00:30:08 <BMyers> i think we found the problem
Oct 08 00:30:15 <pandora--> well, not really
Oct 08 00:30:22 <pandora--> it's supposed to be able to work
Oct 08 00:30:31 <BMyers> if you pay xtra for the serive
Oct 08 00:30:33 <pandora--> and sprint can take it up with me if they want to
Oct 08 00:30:36 <BMyers> service
Oct 08 00:31:01 <BMyers> thats what it does if you havent paid for the service.
Oct 08 00:31:11 <BMyers> you can connect to the wifi but no internets..
Oct 08 00:31:52 <pandora--> well whats the point of all this hacking if i still have to pay for it?
Oct 08 00:32:01 <pandora--> forums seem to imply otherwise
Oct 08 00:32:21 <BMyers> i think you could have tethered and that might work
Oct 08 00:32:28 <BMyers> usb
Oct 08 00:32:38 <pandora--> hmm
Oct 08 00:32:42 <BMyers> dont quote me on that one tho
Oct 08 00:33:06 <BMyers> other unscrupulous folks installed another app called wireless tether?
Oct 08 00:33:31 <BMyers> that basically mucked with the linux forwarding on the system
Oct 08 00:33:49 <BMyers> and passed your packets quietly along
Oct 08 00:34:07 <BMyers> dont quote me on that one either
Oct 08 00:34:23 <BMyers> just basically repeat anything i said..
Oct 08 00:34:35 <BMyers> its out little secret here you and me... dont tell ANYONE
Oct 08 00:34:43 <pandora--> hehe
Oct 08 00:34:57 <rwhitby> especially not the MyTether authro
Oct 08 00:35:09 <BMyers> myther... that was it
Oct 08 00:35:16 <BMyers> mytether..
Oct 08 00:35:33 <rwhitby> (which will break for webOS 2.0, BTW, cause it uses a Java service)
Oct 08 00:35:47 <BMyers> was that right Rod. he did some low level packet forwarding?
Oct 08 00:36:14 <wxl> hey yall ever have problems with streaming m3u's with #EXTB info?
Oct 08 00:36:19 <pandora--> hey! found an easter egg in mobile hotspot!
Oct 08 00:36:34 * pandora-- removes the battery from unhappy Pre...
Oct 08 00:36:43 <BMyers> wow, it's not even halloween yet... easter eggs already.
Oct 08 00:37:10 <Amaranth> rwhitby: Have you guys figured out how you're going to do things in 2.0? Now that the services will have security lockdowns too, I mean
Oct 08 00:37:27 <wxl> s/B/#
Oct 08 00:37:44 <rwhitby> Amaranth: I can neither confirm nor deny that Preware, Save/Restore and Govnah work on webOS 2.0
Oct 08 00:37:54 <Amaranth> ha
Oct 08 00:37:58 <wxl> heh
Oct 08 00:38:07 <pandora--> heh
Oct 08 00:38:45 <rwhitby> Note that our C services have never been inside any jails ...
Oct 08 00:44:19 <haeffb> wait a minute
Oct 08 00:44:28 <haeffb> pandora-- === CtlAdvance ?
Oct 08 00:44:47 <pandora--> negative
Oct 08 00:44:51 <pandora--> why?
Oct 08 00:44:59 <sugardave> that's what I'd say
Oct 08 00:45:27 <sugardave> y'all are both trying to get tethering to work
Oct 08 00:45:55 <pandora--> oh
Oct 08 00:46:20 <Amaranth> I wonder when/if we'll be able to do C addons for nodejs
Oct 08 00:46:31 <Amaranth> I'm sure rwhitby is already doing it but I mean for the rest of us ;)
Oct 08 00:47:00 <haeffb> BMyers:  score?
Oct 08 00:52:27 <BMyers> 14 3 neb
Oct 08 00:52:38 <BMyers> 3:30 left in the 2nd
Oct 08 00:53:54 <dawm|laptop> ugh either my macbook is being slow today or installing all this crap just to run metadoctor on my new pixi really takes along time
Oct 08 00:54:43 <BMyers> updates prolly. itunes, safari, etc
Oct 08 00:57:48 <sugardave> rwhitby: one thing I didn't get from your feature list is how to set the 6 cities (first one can be picked out from local time, sure)
Oct 08 00:58:16 <rwhitby> sugardave: select from the same list of timezones that you get in the Date&Time app
Oct 08 00:58:42 <sugardave> sure, I mean on the first run, actually...you want my arbitrary list or should they all default to the local city
Oct 08 00:59:30 <rwhitby> sugardave: make it the weirdest timezones on the planet, to display your app's superiority
Oct 08 00:59:50 <sugardave> kick ass, great idea
Oct 08 01:00:12 <rwhitby> Adelaide, Chatham Islands, Kathmandu, ....
Oct 08 01:00:15 <oil> someone is finally making that for ya?
Oct 08 01:00:24 <sugardave> oil: I figured what the hell
Oct 08 01:00:28 <oil> lol
Oct 08 01:01:07 <rwhitby> oil: sugardave's going to put it in the catalog at $20, then I'll buy a copy, then he can put it on sale for a reasonable price
Oct 08 01:01:17 <oil> lol
Oct 08 01:01:29 <sugardave> after checking the logs, it was $10 :D
Oct 08 01:01:42 <oil> so, $50?
Oct 08 01:01:46 <sugardave> heh
Oct 08 01:03:12 <sugardave> actually, what I'll probably do is go with a reasonable price to begin with and rely on The Rod's excellent review and recommendation ;)
Oct 08 01:06:27 <BMyers> 17-3 huskers at the 1/2
Oct 08 01:31:18 <haeffb> that dude is fast
Oct 08 01:31:39 <BMyers> 23-3
Oct 08 01:31:41 <haeffb> and ksu
Oct 08 01:31:43 <haeffb> sucks
Oct 08 01:31:50 <BMyers> 24-3
Oct 08 01:32:29 <rwhitby> sugardave: if it's done right, it will become my poster app for how to provide perfect functionality with no distracting glitz
Oct 08 01:33:17 <rwhitby> sugardave: got a name for it yet?  "Global Time" is the first thing that comes into my head.
Oct 08 01:33:41 <BMyers> name it yule log
Oct 08 01:33:51 <BMyers> oh wait. thats been used already
Oct 08 01:37:52 <oil> "Time app that tells time and is an app"
Oct 08 01:38:13 <haeffb> "Benjamin"
Oct 08 01:38:40 <oil> "Now rwhitby will shut up about time apps"
Oct 08 01:38:43 <oil> haha
Oct 08 01:38:45 <oil> :)
Oct 08 01:39:09 <rwhitby> oil: yeah, that's a good name for it :)
Oct 08 01:40:02 <sugardave> rwhitby: Real Time
Oct 08 01:40:03 <rwhitby> Next will be a flight schedule app which understands that it is possible for a flight to land before it takes off.
Oct 08 01:40:41 <oil> lol
Oct 08 01:40:47 <rwhitby> (e.g. Leave Sydney at 1pm, arrive San Francisco 7am earlier on the same day)
Oct 08 01:41:58 <oil> you would think flight data would all be gmt or something
Oct 08 01:42:09 <oil> then adjusted for local timezones for display
Oct 08 01:42:13 <wxl> ahem.
Oct 08 01:42:20 <wxl> utc
Oct 08 01:42:26 <oil> er whatever
Oct 08 01:42:32 <wxl> heh :)
Oct 08 01:42:47 <oil> what im saying, is it shouldnt be a problem
Oct 08 01:42:58 <wxl> except it could be ±
Oct 08 01:43:13 <wxl> that'd be new and different
Oct 08 01:44:55 <haeffb> ksu still sucks
Oct 08 01:48:24 <BMyers> 31-3
Oct 08 01:49:44 <dawm|laptop> sometimes i catch the puppy watching tv.. i wonder what is going thru her mind
Oct 08 01:50:54 <haeffb> "why won't he change to Animal Planet!!!!"
Oct 08 01:52:57 <dawm|laptop> lol
Oct 08 01:52:57 <oil> "squirrel!"
Oct 08 01:53:56 <sugardave> so is that the deal, go with utc time all the time, utc has supplanted gmt?
Oct 08 01:56:44 <wxl> more or less.. it's not nation-centric
Oct 08 01:56:59 <rwhitby> well, the two are not allowed to get out of sync by more than 0.9 seconds
Oct 08 01:57:16 <rwhitby> but yes, UTC is strictly correct
Oct 08 01:57:16 <sugardave> I see, so they are essentially equal
Oct 08 01:57:25 <sugardave> but utc is politically correct?
Oct 08 01:58:28 <wxl> that's the way it seems to me but utc certainly is more common in my experience
Oct 08 01:58:59 <sugardave> rwhitby: I may have to bend the "no css" rule so I can keep some required styling out of the markup (for scroller height, for example)
Oct 08 01:59:10 <rwhitby> sure
Oct 08 01:59:26 <rwhitby> I'm not pedantic about it :)
Oct 08 01:59:45 <sugardave> heh, I figured....there will definitely be no spinning globes :)
Oct 08 02:01:20 <dawm|laptop> hrm.. i think i got a bunk battery with my free pixi, its been plugged in to the charger since i got it but it doesnt appear to be charging
Oct 08 02:01:32 <dawm|laptop> had to swap batteries from my pre to doctor the pixi
Oct 08 02:05:43 <BMyers> 38-6 husker
Oct 08 02:11:49 <haeffb> BMyers: yeah. I'd seen enough from the first series for both teams to know it wasn't going to be god.
Oct 08 02:11:52 <haeffb> good.
Oct 08 02:12:16 <BMyers> huskers are corn-hole'n em..
Oct 08 02:13:46 <dawm|laptop> i dislike the pixi usb port more than the pre's
Oct 08 02:27:19 <JenP> Hi all!
Oct 08 02:34:03 <dawm|laptop> wirc isnt in the feeds?
Oct 08 02:36:28 <dawm|laptop> oh nm, its cause the pixi is 1.4.3 .. grr
Oct 08 02:37:28 <oil> 032 doesnt work on 145 pixi anyways
Oct 08 02:37:33 <oil> you're stuck with 024
Oct 08 02:38:30 <dawm|laptop> im stuck with none unless theres old version ipks somewhere
Oct 08 02:38:32 <dawm|laptop> :P
Oct 08 02:38:35 <dawm|laptop> *wink
Oct 08 02:39:37 <haeffb> oil, why not on pixi?
Oct 08 02:39:48 <oil> hybrids be busted
Oct 08 02:39:57 <oil> the old ipk is in the feeds
Oct 08 02:39:59 <haeffb> pixi's be busted
Oct 08 02:40:20 <haeffb> hi JenP
Oct 08 02:40:21 <oil> http://ipkg.preware.org/feeds/webos-internals/armv6/org.webosinternals.wirc_0.2.4_arm.ipk
Oct 08 02:41:49 <haeffb> Done app still running about twice as many users as Done beta
Oct 08 02:52:52 <dawm|pixi> woot
Oct 08 02:55:01 <Deihmos> Someone should make a video player for webos that can play xvids
Oct 08 02:57:04 <haeffb> woot what?
Oct 08 02:57:28 <haeffb> woot wirc on pixi! nm
Oct 08 02:59:48 <dawm|laptop> now if i could get rid of the stupid 'Check SIM-SOS Only' carrier string id be good
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Fri Oct 08 02:59:57 2010