**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Mon Feb 21 02:59:57 2011
Feb 21 03:29:23 <SineOt> doot doot doot
Feb 21 03:29:47 <CTLAdvance> boot boot boot
Feb 21 03:31:09 <geeksquadkid> loot loot loot
Feb 21 03:31:17 <SineOt> toot toot toot
Feb 21 03:31:26 * SineOt has become tugboat, destroyer of worlds
Feb 21 03:31:31 <geeksquadkid> shoot shoot shoot
Feb 21 03:31:46 * geeksquadkid has shot tugboat, destroyer of worlds
Feb 21 03:32:09 * SineOt sinks to the bottom :'c
Feb 21 03:57:14 <SineOt> I figure this is probably a good place to pimp it, since programmery types tend to be the ones who stereotypically stay up all hours of the night... http://stereopsis.com/flux/
Feb 21 03:57:56 <SineOt> F.lux matches your monitor's color profile to more closely match your indoor lighting after sunsight and before sunrise. Looks more like daylight during the day, warms up to more closely match a range of indoor lights at night.
Feb 21 03:58:18 <SineOt> And on that note: You all have calibrated your monitor's color profiles, riiiiiight? :I
Feb 21 04:01:02 <rwhitby> SineOt: is that your baby?
Feb 21 04:02:05 <SineOt> I wish it was
Feb 21 04:02:29 <summatusmentis> SineOt: I don't think I have calibrated my color profiles
Feb 21 04:02:34 <summatusmentis> I just took whatever apple gave me
Feb 21 04:02:43 <SineOt> I really recommend it
Feb 21 04:02:50 <summatusmentis> got a tutorial?
Feb 21 04:02:58 <SineOt> summatusmentis: I take it you're on OSX?
Feb 21 04:03:01 <summatusmentis> indeed
Feb 21 04:03:05 <SineOt> one sex
Feb 21 04:03:07 <SineOt> er, sec
Feb 21 04:03:16 <sugardave> there are two
Feb 21 04:03:20 <summatusmentis> I mean, either way :-P
Feb 21 04:03:39 <SineOt> System Preferences > Displays > Color, then press Calibrate
Feb 21 04:03:49 <SineOt> and there's a nice wizard that walks you through the entire process
Feb 21 04:04:04 <summatusmentis> hah, wait, really? cool
Feb 21 04:05:05 <SineOt> also when doing the adjustments it helps to either lean back or squint a little/defocus
Feb 21 04:05:26 <SineOt> makes it easier to see the actual color differences and not the lines and apple logo they use for the test target
Feb 21 04:05:46 <summatusmentis> they must have changed their wizard for 10.5
Feb 21 04:05:57 <summatusmentis> I didn't see an apple logo, or lines
Feb 21 04:06:11 <SineOt> I've always just done it on Advanced mode, so maybe it's different in there?
Feb 21 04:06:20 <summatusmentis> oh, yeah, that's it
Feb 21 04:07:04 <SineOt> advanced lets you adjust the individual color curves instead of just one generic (I think, hah)
Feb 21 04:08:45 <summatusmentis> I keep messing up the colors
Feb 21 04:12:13 <SineOt> summatusmentis: how so?
Feb 21 04:13:37 <summatusmentis> I didn't understand what the instructions were telling me to do
Feb 21 04:13:52 <summatusmentis> I might've accidentally given my monitor a blue tint
Feb 21 04:14:34 <SineOt> haha
Feb 21 04:15:05 <SineOt> well, with a lot of them your goal is to match the apple logo to the background it's set against, so that at a slight blur (hence why I said to lean back and squint a little) helps
Feb 21 04:16:12 <summatusmentis> right, I think I've got it now
Feb 21 04:16:26 <summatusmentis> I'm not sure if I notice the difference anymore :)
Feb 21 04:17:03 <summatusmentis> oh yeah, switching back and forth between default, and my new one is way better
Feb 21 04:17:07 <summatusmentis> cool, thanks
Feb 21 04:17:20 <SineOt> add in f.lux and make it even nicer~
Feb 21 04:17:29 <summatusmentis> hah, maybe I will :)
Feb 21 04:17:43 <SineOt> you never really realize how yellow tinted indoor lights are
Feb 21 04:18:04 <SineOt> f.lux makes the difference between your monitor and the room way more narrow so it's less harsh on your eyes
Feb 21 04:19:17 <summatusmentis> yeah, but it also makes the tinting weird
Feb 21 04:19:21 <summatusmentis> hrm
Feb 21 04:19:33 <summatusmentis> I bet I could get used to this though
Feb 21 04:19:49 <SineOt> you do get used to it yeah
Feb 21 04:20:06 <SineOt> I've been using it for a long time and I don't even realize it's on until I don't have it
Feb 21 04:20:07 <summatusmentis> any idea how it affects image editing?
Feb 21 04:20:16 <SineOt> then I curl up and die hissing
Feb 21 04:20:39 <SineOt> well, obviously it'll skew the colors a bit so what you'd get on a bog standard display would be WAY different
Feb 21 04:20:59 <SineOt> but it has an option in the menu bar thingy to disable it for an hour for color sensitive work
Feb 21 04:21:24 <summatusmentis> hrm
Feb 21 04:21:28 <summatusmentis> I'm intrigued
Feb 21 04:21:38 <summatusmentis> I'll maybe leave it on, and see if it irritates me too much
Feb 21 04:21:53 <SineOt> what kind of lights do you have, summatusmentis?
Feb 21 04:22:33 <summatusmentis> mixture of incandescent and flourescent
Feb 21 04:22:51 <summatusmentis> in my room, fluorescent
Feb 21 04:22:58 <summatusmentis> other parts of the house are incadescent though
Feb 21 04:23:08 <SineOt> ah
Feb 21 04:23:48 <summatusmentis> shoudl flux be making this tint my screen pink (slightly)?
Feb 21 04:23:58 <summatusmentis> or does that mean my monitor is calib'd wrong?
Feb 21 04:24:39 <SineOt> it shifts the white point to a warmer level, and it's often a more pinkish/yellow tint than the way cold blue that most monitors are set at
Feb 21 04:25:03 <summatusmentis> ok, so what I'm seeing is normal, and I should just suck it up
Feb 21 04:25:05 <summatusmentis> I can do that
Feb 21 04:25:12 <SineOt> yup
Feb 21 04:25:19 <SineOt> you reach a point where you don't notice it any more
Feb 21 04:25:33 <summatusmentis> interesting
Feb 21 04:25:36 <summatusmentis> thanks for the pointer
Feb 21 04:25:36 <SineOt> I used to run my monitor with the white point set to 9500K, and goooood lord
Feb 21 04:25:42 <SineOt> looking at it now it's awful
Feb 21 04:25:54 <SineOt> I've long since switched to 5400K
Feb 21 04:26:05 <SineOt> I think most monitors ship from the factory at like 7200K
Feb 21 04:26:45 <summatusmentis> I left my whitepoint at Apple default
Feb 21 04:27:37 <SineOt> I always bump it way low
Feb 21 04:27:46 <SineOt> because I'm used to
Feb 21 04:27:55 <summatusmentis> it looked gross that way
Feb 21 04:28:37 <SineOt> s'why you take baby steps to get down there :]
Feb 21 04:28:45 <summatusmentis> heh
Feb 21 04:28:54 <SineOt> it always looks gross when you first make the change because it's different than what your brain expects
Feb 21 04:29:13 <SineOt> but then after a few days you'll switch back and go "ugh how did I do this every day"
Feb 21 04:29:22 <summatusmentis> heh
Feb 21 04:30:00 <SineOt> like now, if I go back to a 7500K white point, it's just SO BRIGHT that it hurts.
Feb 21 04:31:26 <SineOt> I think 9500K would cause my eyes to melt out of their sockets
Feb 21 04:32:48 <summatusmentis> hah, I would believe that
Feb 21 04:43:47 <PatrickC_Pre> hay
Feb 21 04:48:31 <CTLAdvance> hi
Feb 21 04:48:45 <PatrickC_Pre> what's CTLAdvance
Feb 21 04:49:02 <PatrickC_Pre> man, the bberry channel is dead
Feb 21 04:49:42 <CTLAdvance> many channels are dead right now
Feb 21 04:49:55 <PatrickC_Pre> we aren't ;)
Feb 21 04:50:02 <PatrickC_Pre> and why is that?
Feb 21 04:51:13 <SineOt> because you're here saying it's not dead? P:
Feb 21 04:51:45 <Loudergood> because we're global ;)
Feb 21 04:51:48 <PatrickC_Pre> well, we have about 40-50 more people then the ##blackberry channel
Feb 21 04:51:51 <Loudergood> and/or neurotic
Feb 21 04:52:02 <PatrickC_Pre> lol
Feb 21 04:57:49 <PatrickC_Pre> back
Feb 21 04:59:27 <rwhitby> you went away for 6 minutes, and we need to know you're back? ;)
Feb 21 05:00:08 <PatrickC_Pre> well, wIRC stopped working :/ lol
Feb 21 05:00:18 <PatrickC_Pre> it has been stopping working a lot lately
Feb 21 05:00:47 <oil_pre> your connection sucks?
Feb 21 05:00:54 * halfhalo stays mum
Feb 21 05:01:01 <sugardave> heh
Feb 21 05:01:11 <PatrickC_Pre> full wifi
Feb 21 05:01:39 <PatrickC_Pre> but, this time it broke when trying to connect to a different service (mibbit)
Feb 21 05:04:41 <SineOt> wait
Feb 21 05:04:49 <SineOt> why are you trying to connect to Mibbit in wIRC
Feb 21 05:05:01 <PatrickC_Pre> isn't Mibbit like Freenode?
Feb 21 05:05:16 <oil_pre> I thought mibbit was a client?
Feb 21 05:05:26 <PatrickC_Pre> idk
Feb 21 05:05:36 <SineOt> no
Feb 21 05:05:44 <SineOt> Mibbit is a client to connect to other networks
Feb 21 05:05:48 <PatrickC_Pre> one of the blogs I write for has a channel on mibbit
Feb 21 05:05:52 <SineOt> and 5 seconds on the wiki confirms that
Feb 21 05:06:06 <halfhalo> miiiiiiiiiiiiibit
Feb 21 05:06:15 <SineOt> it's not on Mibbit, it's hosted on another IRC network. Mibbit just provides a simple way to connect to it
Feb 21 05:06:28 <halfhalo> no, they have their own
Feb 21 05:07:53 <SineOt> ah, found it: irc.us.mibbit.com?
Feb 21 05:08:40 <PatrickC_Pre> idk, checking it out now
Feb 21 05:09:05 <shinkamui> snes and vga emus don't seem to play nicely in webos 2.0x
Feb 21 05:10:03 <summatusmentis> I feel like mibbit also has an irc server
Feb 21 05:10:29 <PatrickC_Pre> I think they do too
Feb 21 05:10:29 <SineOt> pretty sure it's irc.us.mibbit.com
Feb 21 05:11:01 <PatrickC_Pre> or 04.chat.mibbit.com
Feb 21 05:11:02 * sugardave hands everyone a brick wall to repeatedly run into.
Feb 21 05:11:28 <SineOt> Nope. It's irc.mibbit.com
Feb 21 05:11:38 <SineOt> I just went and even connected to test it! :I
Feb 21 05:12:48 <SineOt> PatrickC_Pre, I'm really starting to wonder how much research you bother to do before asking questions :p
Feb 21 05:12:59 <PatrickC_Pre> I did look it up
Feb 21 05:13:18 <PatrickC_Pre> and found that they had a mobile site (and found out its only for iPhone)
Feb 21 05:13:29 <SineOt> did'cha check the Wiki?
Feb 21 05:13:38 <PatrickC_Pre> but, also couldn't get wIRC to connect to irc.mibbit.com
Feb 21 05:13:46 <PatrickC_Pre> yes I did check the wiki
Feb 21 05:16:05 <SineOt> Hm... Oddities with text fields abound!
Feb 21 05:16:34 <PatrickC_Pre> http://www.webdevelopersnotes.com/tips/html/random_text_display_using_javascript_1.php3
Feb 21 05:16:56 <PatrickC_Pre> I would use this to make a random sentence pop up in an app, right?
Feb 21 05:17:00 <SineOt> sugardave: you've played with CSS animations a bit in some of your stuff, yeah?
Feb 21 05:18:21 <SineOt> haha, I think having this text field fade in is causing all sorts of wonky behavior with it
Feb 21 05:18:43 <sugardave> SineOt: nah, just transitions
Feb 21 05:20:11 <SineOt> ah, hrm
Feb 21 05:20:23 <PatrickC_Pre> well, goodnight all
Feb 21 05:20:30 <PatrickC_Pre> school tomorrow :/
Feb 21 05:20:42 <SineOt> yeah, weird. Text field just up and disappears if it even bothers to show up at all
Feb 21 05:23:57 <sugardave> SineOt: are you just trying to do simple stuff like fade-in and fade-out?
Feb 21 05:24:31 <SineOt> Yeah. I've got it working (mostly) now, forgot that I had manually set some z-indexes
Feb 21 05:24:35 <SineOt> so it was hiding behind everything
Feb 21 05:25:01 <sugardave> ah, yeah, that will do it...I always have trouble with the text popping in instead of fading right
Feb 21 05:25:43 <SineOt> yeah, it's doing that too :/
Feb 21 05:25:56 <sugardave> I CAN FIX THAT ONE!
Feb 21 05:26:28 <sugardave> well, it's how I do it...use rgba font-color and the hidden state has 0.0 alpha and the viewing state has 1.0 alpha
Feb 21 05:27:14 <SineOt> Ah! Interesting way of dealing with it
Feb 21 05:28:24 * sugardave is a big ol' cheater.
Feb 21 06:02:10 * SineOt strangles CSS gradients
Feb 21 06:05:22 <halfhalo> bah css
Feb 21 06:22:41 <ianmoya> #webos-internals
Feb 21 06:30:18 <SineOt> it's always nice to see "/* these appear to be duped styles, investigate and remove */" in shipping code :p
Feb 21 06:40:21 <SineOt> sugardave: what's the CSS selector for a focussed textfield?
Feb 21 06:52:38 <SineOt> Heh. "there is a fairly basic version of this widget in the current SDK and it will like change substantively before SDK release."
Feb 21 06:52:52 <SineOt> I have a feeling some of the docs on Palm's site haven't been touched in over 2 years.
Feb 21 06:53:47 <sugardave> textfield makes a bunch of divs, and right now my ability to see the DOM is kind of blowed up
Feb 21 06:55:14 <SineOt> time to go delve into the bowls of the SDK
Feb 21 06:56:21 <oil_pre> like into a pool?
Feb 21 06:56:44 <SineOt> bowls? BOWELS. A bowl of SDK would be fine too
Feb 21 06:56:52 <SineOt> could just dig around in it with a spoon :B
Feb 21 06:56:58 <sugardave> supa dupa kind
Feb 21 06:57:35 <SineOt> anyways, found the source of the stupid!
Feb 21 07:00:19 <SineOt> at least I think I did
Feb 21 07:02:30 <SineOt> ahaha, ffs ;_;
Feb 21 07:09:20 <SineOt> Apparently textfield widgets have maybe -3- states?
Feb 21 07:09:44 <sugardave> there is unfocused, focused and disabled?
Feb 21 07:10:21 <SineOt> I'm seeing focused, unfocused, and first drawn... Because where ever the hell it's pulling this first drawn style from I have no clue, but it's totally different than the unfocused style that I have set.
Feb 21 07:10:45 <SineOt> Actually disregard that I should probably pay attention to my code
Feb 21 07:10:53 <SineOt> When the widget gets first drawn I auto focus it :I
Feb 21 07:11:08 * SineOt prances around like an idiot, ends up crashing into a tree
Feb 21 07:23:41 <swisstomcat> morning
Feb 21 07:36:38 <SineOt> morning swisstomcat
Feb 21 07:37:13 <swisstomcat> morning sineot
Feb 21 14:01:19 <PatrickC_Pre> hello
Feb 21 14:01:38 <swisstomcat> mornin
Feb 21 14:02:17 <PatrickC_Pre> congrats to rwhitby and whoever helped him in making the Sprint Pre2 a possibility!
Feb 21 14:02:25 <PatrickC_Pre> morning swisstomcat
Feb 21 14:03:05 <swisstomcat> cryptk
Feb 21 14:03:55 <PatrickC_Pre> thanks
Feb 21 14:17:36 * haeffb_ wants a Sprint Pre 2
Feb 21 14:17:47 <haeffb_> and "wants" is an understatement
Feb 21 14:17:57 <swisstomcat> go out and buy a pre2
Feb 21 14:18:10 <haeffb_> I have two pre 2's sitting next to me.
Feb 21 14:19:48 * Workenhaven steals them from haeffb_
Feb 21 14:21:41 * PatrickC_Pre steels the other from harffb_
Feb 21 14:21:43 <haeffb_> but I only have my primary phone as a Sprint Pre-
Feb 21 14:22:08 <haeffb_> and rwhitby frowns on my hosing my Sprint Pre- and then turning in a TEP claim.
Feb 21 14:22:24 * haeffb_ hates to make rwhitby frown...
Feb 21 14:22:55 <PatrickC_Pre> is trying to figure out the best way to get him a Sprint Pre2
Feb 21 14:23:54 <Workenhaven> lol
Feb 21 14:24:13 <PatrickC_Pre> and wants to make it outa pixi
Feb 21 14:27:15 <haeffb> this one *might* work: http://cgi.ebay.com/Palm-Pre-Sprint-8GB-3G-NO-Power-Parts-/290521742349?pt=Cell_Phones&hash=item43a471fc0d
Feb 21 14:28:55 <PatrickC_Pre> don't you have a sprint pre?
Feb 21 14:30:01 <haeffb> yes, but don't want to accidentally destroy my main phone...
Feb 21 14:30:13 <PatrickC_Pre> true that
Feb 21 14:30:15 <hotdp> haeffb: i belive you can do it
Feb 21 14:30:23 <hotdp> Peter destroyed hes :o
Feb 21 14:30:36 <haeffb> haha
Feb 21 14:30:49 <hotdp> but it was the "other one" so its fine
Feb 21 14:30:50 <haeffb> so you believe I can destroy mine, too?
Feb 21 14:30:52 <hotdp> not the board he should use
Feb 21 14:31:34 * PatrickC_Pre doesn't want to learn Java 1.3 :'(
Feb 21 14:36:54 <haeffb> buy it now for $99: http://cgi.ebay.com/SPRINT-Palm-Pre-TOUCH-SCREEN-GPS-WiFi-Smart-Phone-538-/390290496796?pt=Cell_Phones&hash=item5adf205d1c
Feb 21 14:42:37 <Loudergood> what a steal!
Feb 21 14:44:16 <bionicRobot> hm, is it normal the power button on the Pre doesn't work anymore?
Feb 21 14:44:22 <Loudergood> hmm...looks like there are some broken screen vzw ones for really cheap....
Feb 21 14:45:37 <Loudergood> I've heard of it happening before...
Feb 21 14:46:17 <hotdp> bionicRobot i have had that happen
Feb 21 14:46:20 <swisstomcat> yeah
Feb 21 14:46:24 <swisstomcat> other's had it happen
Feb 21 14:46:24 <hotdp> can you click or not click?
Feb 21 14:48:50 <bionicRobot> hotdp: clicking doesn't work. If I pop the button out I can press the contact down
Feb 21 14:49:06 <hotdp> ahh
Feb 21 14:49:12 <hotdp> then there is dirty in it
Feb 21 14:49:20 <hotdp> try move it from one side to another
Feb 21 14:49:28 <hotdp> that did it for me
Feb 21 14:49:42 <hotdp> but else you can take it apart and clean it if you do not have any warranty
Feb 21 14:49:58 <bionicRobot> doesn't appear dirty. its like the button is 1mm away from making contact with the board or something
Feb 21 14:50:49 <bionicRobot> considering that its secondhand, Sprint (i'm in France btw), and hacked I doubt there's any warranty left
Feb 21 15:00:01 <Loudergood> http://forums.palm.com/t5/webOS-Hardware/Pre-power-button/m-p/257899
Feb 21 15:05:19 <bionicRobot> cool. I'll try the folded paper trick
Feb 21 15:24:38 <roy-pre101> I used a small piece of rubber band.
Feb 21 15:24:52 <roy-pre101> Gives it a nice bounce.
Feb 21 15:25:05 <roy-pre101> Hit up http://webosanswers.com, we have that there. ;D
Feb 21 15:25:28 <roy-pre101> So… who's converting their Pre 2 to Sprint?
Feb 21 15:26:36 <Loudergood> I've considered converting mine to verizon...
Feb 21 15:27:03 <Loudergood> though perhaps converting it to sprint, selling it,  and buying a verizon one would be a better path
Feb 21 15:27:45 <roy-pre101> Wonder what that'd fetch on eBay?
Feb 21 15:32:57 <Loudergood> of course that means I'd need to get my hands on a sprint pre
Feb 21 15:34:23 <sugardave> good morning
Feb 21 15:34:36 <swisstomcat> morning sugardave
Feb 21 15:35:08 <sugardave> hi swisstomcat, how's tricks?
Feb 21 15:35:19 <swisstomcat> good, good
Feb 21 15:35:32 <swisstomcat> preparing to release my last mojo app
Feb 21 15:36:23 <sugardave> the end of an era
Feb 21 15:36:27 <swisstomcat> writing some stuff for webosroundup
Feb 21 15:36:31 <sugardave> what's the app do?
Feb 21 15:36:44 <swisstomcat> ConnectDots .. kids app
Feb 21 15:36:50 <sugardave> cool
Feb 21 15:36:56 <swisstomcat> not much mojo in it tho
Feb 21 15:37:01 <sugardave> hehe
Feb 21 15:37:04 <swisstomcat> more or less canvas stuff
Feb 21 15:39:43 <roy-pre101> rick-work: Workin' workin'
Feb 21 15:43:12 * halfhalo is debating going to class or staying in nice warm car
Feb 21 15:45:47 <halfhalo> car it is!
Feb 21 15:45:48 <roy-pre101> hah
Feb 21 15:46:03 <halfhalo> heated seats sealed the deal
Feb 21 15:46:06 <roy-pre101> So, anyone around to help with converting my Pre2 to Sprint?
Feb 21 15:47:06 <halfhalo> this xm radio is weird
Feb 21 15:47:33 <halfhalo> because it should not be working
Feb 21 16:14:25 <swisstomcat> bbl
Feb 21 17:08:13 * haeffb is an ebay loser
Feb 21 17:08:26 <hotdp> ?
Feb 21 17:08:43 <Workenhaven> lol
Feb 21 17:08:53 <Workenhaven> i refuse to use it
Feb 21 17:09:00 <Workenhaven> paypal is evil
Feb 21 17:09:46 <hotdp> paypal sucks
Feb 21 17:10:41 <halfhalo> lol
Feb 21 17:13:05 <summatusmentis> paypal is evil? how so?
Feb 21 17:13:26 <summatusmentis> I'm not saying I disagree, just curious
Feb 21 17:13:48 <hotdp> i have had a lot of problems
Feb 21 17:14:21 <haeffb> paypal hasn't been evil to me
Feb 21 17:14:28 <Loudergood> disputes are...not usually pretty
Feb 21 17:14:40 <halfhalo> never had a pp issue
Feb 21 17:15:04 <haeffb> it just...kinda...works
Feb 21 17:16:02 <hotdp> pp is perfect until you have problems
Feb 21 17:16:15 <hotdp> A had problems with a case where they should secure my payment
Feb 21 17:16:15 <Loudergood> most things are
Feb 21 17:16:28 <hotdp> i had like and i am serius 80+mails
Feb 21 17:16:43 <hotdp> they wanted me to call the police and make forms and stuff
Feb 21 17:16:47 <hotdp> it was MEGA lame
Feb 21 17:16:48 <sugardave> I would prefer to not use PayPal, but for now they are the "best" payment option
Feb 21 17:17:02 <hotdp> pp has to much power i think
Feb 21 17:17:09 <hotdp> they can shit on customers
Feb 21 17:17:27 <hotdp> http://www.paypalsucks.com/
Feb 21 17:17:58 <Josef_B> anyone tell you that i love my pre
Feb 21 17:17:59 <Josef_B> "D
Feb 21 17:18:11 <Josef_B> s/"D/:D
Feb 21 17:18:21 <Loudergood> good, now you're as broken as the rest of us :D
Feb 21 17:18:33 * haeffb is an ebay winner!!!!
Feb 21 17:18:39 <sugardave> woo!
Feb 21 17:18:54 <Loudergood> everytime I pick up another device it feels so awkward
Feb 21 17:19:02 <haeffb> shit. I won twice.
Feb 21 17:19:20 <hotdp> lol
Feb 21 17:19:24 <hotdp> what did you buy?
Feb 21 17:19:29 <hotdp> sprint pre-?
Feb 21 17:19:33 <haeffb> two used Sprint Pre-'s
Feb 21 17:19:42 <haeffb> one for $7.50 and one for $8.50
Feb 21 17:19:52 <haeffb> plus $8.99 shipping
Feb 21 17:20:05 <haeffb> anybody want a Sprint Pre? Only $50.
Feb 21 17:20:30 <haeffb> hey...wait. I have two Pre 2's and two extra Sprint Pre's....
Feb 21 17:20:39 <Josef_B> lol
Feb 21 17:20:48 <sugardave> hmmm
Feb 21 17:20:55 <hotdp> hehe
Feb 21 17:21:06 <haeffb> this might work out after all
Feb 21 17:21:07 <hotdp> haeffb take both and sell a sprint pre 2 :P
Feb 21 17:21:11 <hotdp> think you can get good price
Feb 21 17:22:10 <Loudergood> I bet that thing would be hot on ebay
Feb 21 17:22:14 <haeffb> $27.99 for both including shipping (from the same seller)
Feb 21 17:25:10 <haeffb> paypal worked for me again...just sayin'
Feb 21 17:28:19 <Loudergood> so far ;)
Feb 21 17:28:30 <Josef_B> haeffb why you sellin those pres so cheap ?
Feb 21 17:28:48 <haeffb> I bought them...not selling.
Feb 21 17:29:12 <Josef_B> aw
Feb 21 17:29:14 <Josef_B> testing pres ?
Feb 21 17:29:30 <haeffb> pre's to use for a Sprint Pre 2 conversion
Feb 21 17:30:05 <haeffb> according to the auction info, they have cosmetic damage (scratches, worn, etc) but function
Feb 21 17:30:36 <Loudergood> that's a steal then
Feb 21 17:36:39 <haeffb> looks like he has a bunch of them
Feb 21 17:36:46 <Loudergood> ok, sprint pres are ridiculously cheap on ebay right now
Feb 21 17:37:30 <Loudergood> there are 4 or 5 of them that are still under $5 ending in the next half hour
Feb 21 17:37:50 <haeffb> alltechwholesale
Feb 21 17:37:59 <haeffb> http://catalog.ebay.com/?_pid=72393301&_trksid=p3686.l1428
Feb 21 17:38:01 <Loudergood> yeah
Feb 21 17:38:28 <haeffb> I bid on two earlier, lost both that went for $15. Then won these two for $7.5 and $8.5
Feb 21 17:51:50 <aseem_> can we make 2 submenus simultaneously in SDK??
Feb 21 18:01:36 <haeffb> can you clarify the question? two submenus showing at the same time?
Feb 21 18:01:46 <haeffb> what's the link for ares debugger?
Feb 21 18:02:15 <hotdp> http://ares.palm.com/AresDebug/
Feb 21 18:03:22 <hotdp> do you need the log to?
Feb 21 18:07:02 <aseem_> i want 2 submenus at the same time in my scene....side by side
Feb 21 18:07:17 <aseem_> but out of them only the latter one is getting displayed
Feb 21 18:07:39 <aseem_> by latter one i mean whose code is written afterwards in the assisstant file
Feb 21 18:27:50 <aseem_> i want 2 submenus at the same time in my scene....side by side,,,,,but out of them only the latter one is getting displayed,,,,by latter one i mean whose code is written afterwards in the assisstant file
Feb 21 18:30:14 <haeffb> looks like you can't do it with popupSubmenu.
Feb 21 19:44:20 <PatrickC_Pre> hello
Feb 21 19:47:07 <haeffb> hello
Feb 21 19:47:13 <haeffb> I need lunch!
Feb 21 19:47:33 <PatrickC_Pre> I need a webOS toaster!
Feb 21 19:48:51 <pandora--> no problem, that's HP's new business plan
Feb 21 19:48:56 <pandora--> toasters > smartphones
Feb 21 19:49:09 <PatrickC_Pre> what about microwaves?
Feb 21 19:49:34 <MetaView> corkscrewer and bottle opener
Feb 21 19:50:08 <PatrickC_Pre> and a fridge, stove, and radio
Feb 21 19:50:11 <pandora--> PatrickC_Pre: yup!  all your home appliances will have webos 2.0+, just not your Pre.
Feb 21 19:50:25 <PatrickC_Pre> can't wait!
Feb 21 19:50:27 <joetweeply> did anybody mention beer?
Feb 21 19:50:52 <PatrickC_Pre> TV's, PC's, Shower, DVD/BD player, Satilite ect
Feb 21 19:51:09 <PatrickC_Pre> did anyone get an email about the Pre2 dev program?
Feb 21 19:54:19 <joetweeply> not yet, did you PatrickC_Pre?
Feb 21 19:56:53 <PatrickC_Pre> nope ;(
Feb 21 19:59:24 * haeffb having trouble encoding strings for API "POST" request
Feb 21 19:59:47 <pandora--> haeffb: why?
Feb 21 20:06:59 <pandora--> pihb
Feb 21 20:07:05 <RagingMind> HP TV that runs webos?  :)
Feb 21 20:07:43 <haeffb> pandora--: the API doesn't seem to like the results of encodeURIComponent
Feb 21 20:08:20 <haeffb> for instance, it barfs when i convert \n to %0A
Feb 21 20:09:34 <pandora--> hrm, weird
Feb 21 20:09:48 <pandora--> haeffb: prototype doesn't like it?
Feb 21 20:10:14 <haeffb> no, it's an API for a web service that I'm syncing to.
Feb 21 20:10:45 <MetaView> why should the POST request be html encoded?
Feb 21 20:10:46 <haeffb> their server doesn't like the resulting JSON object
Feb 21 20:11:02 <MetaView> or better URI encoded?
Feb 21 20:11:30 <pandora--> ah
Feb 21 20:11:34 <haeffb> MetaView: certain characters must be encoded... like &, +, ;, etc
Feb 21 20:11:44 <MetaView> not in the post
Feb 21 20:11:45 <pandora--> MetaView: it's part of the http spec
Feb 21 20:11:51 <MetaView> not in the post
Feb 21 20:11:58 <MetaView> you can send binary
Feb 21 20:12:04 <MetaView> it's not get
Feb 21 20:12:08 <pandora--> depends on the encoding of the post
Feb 21 20:12:29 <pandora--> if you post octal binary etc yeah
Feb 21 20:13:25 <MetaView> no, you can post multi-part and don't need to encode anything
Feb 21 20:13:45 <MetaView> it#s completely fine to send binary in the post request
Feb 21 20:14:10 <MetaView> that's the reason you can send files and images only with post requests, even if they would fint into 255 bytes...
Feb 21 20:37:17 <destinal> MetaView: yes but they have to match the content type you specify
Feb 21 20:37:30 <destinal> so if you specify url-encoded then they need to be url-encoded, etc
Feb 21 20:38:28 <destinal> and url-encoded is the most common for POST parameters to an API / web service etc
Feb 21 20:40:47 <destinal> MetaView: I'd expect a REST type service passing JSON objects would use Content-Type: application/jsonrequest or similar though
Feb 21 20:41:16 <destinal> or application/json
Feb 21 20:42:25 <destinal> haeffb: ^
Feb 21 20:42:29 <PatrickC_Pre> yo
Feb 21 20:46:34 <PatrickC_Pre> how do I make something stay at the bottom of the screen (using JS)
Feb 21 20:55:17 <haeffb> destinal: I am using the default contentType for AjaxRequest which is application/x-www-form-urlencoded
Feb 21 20:55:42 <haeffb> suppose I could change it to application/json ?
Feb 21 20:57:54 <kamui> wow, my first official work day with the pre 2
Feb 21 20:58:20 <kamui> I made it from 8am - 2:55pm and am down to 30%.  1 phone call, 5 text messages, 1 email
Feb 21 20:58:53 <kamui> probably gonna have to kill a lot of the background data apps, maybe set email to polling instead of as it arrives
Feb 21 20:58:54 <PatrickC_Pre> how long web surfing/IRC'ing?
Feb 21 20:58:59 <kamui> 0
Feb 21 20:59:03 <PatrickC_Pre> wow
Feb 21 20:59:13 <kamui> 3 exchange accounts, and rss feeds
Feb 21 20:59:14 <PatrickC_Pre> what does Dr. Battery say about the health?
Feb 21 20:59:22 <pandora--> kamui: hahahahah
Feb 21 20:59:23 <kamui> I don't have dr. batt, let me grab it
Feb 21 20:59:36 <PatrickC_Pre> I run like 5 gmail accounts and mine doesn't go that fast
Feb 21 20:59:50 <PatrickC_Pre> and I surf/irc/email all the time
Feb 21 20:59:55 <kamui> well, I don't know what to say, other than Ill be buying a 2400mah battery tonight
Feb 21 20:59:59 <PatrickC_Pre> and run it at 100% brightness
Feb 21 21:00:06 <kamui> pre2?
Feb 21 21:00:10 <PatrickC_Pre> VZW pre2?
Feb 21 21:00:13 <kamui> yea
Feb 21 21:00:18 <PatrickC_Pre> nope, pre+ and pixi-
Feb 21 21:00:22 <PatrickC_Pre> is what I have
Feb 21 21:00:26 <kamui> either with sprint?
Feb 21 21:00:31 <kamui> or both gsm models
Feb 21 21:00:31 <PatrickC_Pre> Pixi is
Feb 21 21:00:46 <PatrickC_Pre> sprint pixi/vzw pre+
Feb 21 21:01:17 <kamui> well, thats the big stinkerooni
Feb 21 21:01:29 <kamui> was hopin the pre2 would have better life
Feb 21 21:01:47 <PatrickC_Pre> what does dr. battery say?
Feb 21 21:02:00 <kamui> trying to install it now, preware has been getting stuck on me lately
Feb 21 21:02:11 <PatrickC_Pre> on what feed?
Feb 21 21:02:22 <PatrickC_Pre> palm catalog takes FOREVER to load...
Feb 21 21:02:49 <kamui> I can't tell, its stuck trying to install dr. battery
Feb 21 21:02:55 <PatrickC_Pre> and what version of preware are you running?
Feb 21 21:02:55 <kamui> no, not at the feed refresh
Feb 21 21:02:56 <nomad84> hi there
Feb 21 21:03:01 <kamui> it gets stuck installing stuff
Feb 21 21:03:07 <PatrickC_Pre> hi nomad84
Feb 21 21:03:15 <PatrickC_Pre> hmmm kamui
Feb 21 21:03:15 <kamui> 1.54
Feb 21 21:03:38 <PatrickC_Pre> have you does a full restart since putting preware on it?
Feb 21 21:04:33 <kamui> yea, its been a few days since I got this, and I've powercycled it at least a dozen times
Feb 21 21:04:50 <PatrickC_Pre> wow
Feb 21 21:04:50 <kamui> various things
Feb 21 21:04:55 <PatrickC_Pre> it shouldn't be hanging
Feb 21 21:05:04 <PatrickC_Pre> did it finally install?
Feb 21 21:05:11 <kamui> when I say hanging, I mean its just circling around like its still installing
Feb 21 21:05:14 <kamui> nope
Feb 21 21:05:25 <kamui> if it doesn't install in about 30 seconds, I generally know its not going to happen
Feb 21 21:05:31 <kamui> learned that lesson trying to install prevpnc
Feb 21 21:05:34 <PatrickC_Pre> hmm. go over to #webos-internals and ask
Feb 21 21:05:40 <kamui> let it run overnight friday night
Feb 21 21:05:44 <PatrickC_Pre> prevpnc?
Feb 21 21:05:46 <kamui> woke up to the circling installation screen
Feb 21 21:05:52 <kamui> pptp vpn support
Feb 21 21:05:58 <kamui> ironic I now
Feb 21 21:05:58 <kamui> know
Feb 21 21:06:22 <PatrickC_Pre> does 2.0 have VPN?
Feb 21 21:06:31 <kamui> yea, but only seems to support ipsec
Feb 21 21:06:40 <kamui> which we don't have at work
Feb 21 21:06:53 <PatrickC_Pre> I don't use VPN, so idk what any of it is :p
Feb 21 21:06:55 <kamui> prevpnc is supposed to add pptp support
Feb 21 21:07:16 <PatrickC_Pre> anyone in here play with enyo yet?
Feb 21 21:07:17 <kamui> no biggie, its about to finish rebooting, Ill try dr. battery again
Feb 21 21:07:22 <PatrickC_Pre> ok
Feb 21 21:07:33 <SineOt> how did you install Preware?
Feb 21 21:07:51 <kamui> palm-install'd the ipk off the preware website
Feb 21 21:08:05 <kamui> if I recall correctly
Feb 21 21:08:16 <kamui> I've pretty much installed everything that way that I didn't download directly in preware
Feb 21 21:08:41 <PatrickC_Pre> try webOS QI 4?
Feb 21 21:08:44 <SineOt> the only thing I can think of (and it's probably wrong!) is that palm-install might not have run some scripts properly
Feb 21 21:08:47 <SineOt> ugh no
Feb 21 21:08:56 <PatrickC_Pre> why not sine?
Feb 21 21:08:57 <SineOt> just nova-term and use the bit.ly bootstrap
Feb 21 21:09:05 <kamui> webos qi doesn't ever succed
Feb 21 21:09:06 <PatrickC_Pre> it has a nice new layout, and works.
Feb 21 21:09:08 <kamui> succeed for me
Feb 21 21:09:16 <PatrickC_Pre> webos qi4?
Feb 21 21:09:17 <kamui> queue up some stuff, they copy over and then install failed
Feb 21 21:09:23 <kamui> come tot hink of it, might be QI 3.5
Feb 21 21:09:37 <PatrickC_Pre> 4 is suppose to be a lot better
Feb 21 21:09:39 <SineOt> and it's another point of failure
Feb 21 21:09:44 <haeffb> destinal: changing to application/json seems to have solved the problem for most characters. + is still an issue & has to be encoded, but everything else seems to work.
Feb 21 21:09:55 <kamui> let me rdp home and just check to be sure
Feb 21 21:10:21 <destinal> haeffb: nice
Feb 21 21:10:24 <kamui> worked this time PatrickC_Pre
Feb 21 21:10:33 <PatrickC_Pre> yay
Feb 21 21:10:42 <PatrickC_Pre> do you use wIRC?
Feb 21 21:10:52 <kamui> health is 100%
Feb 21 21:10:57 <kamui> PatrickC_Pre, yea, I use wirc
Feb 21 21:10:57 <PatrickC_Pre> "Now you can IRC from th crapper"
Feb 21 21:11:05 <PatrickC_Pre> it gets me everytime! lol
Feb 21 21:11:08 <PatrickC_Pre> ok
Feb 21 21:11:20 <SineOt> haeffb: what API are you dealing with?
Feb 21 21:11:52 <kamui> PatrickC_Pre, whats your average discharge rate?
Feb 21 21:11:56 <kamui> mine seems unusually high
Feb 21 21:12:00 <PatrickC_Pre> lemme see
Feb 21 21:12:05 <kamui> -489.8 mA
Feb 21 21:12:21 <SineOt> my Pixi will hit that if it's busy doing things
Feb 21 21:12:25 <kamui> dropped to 170.0
Feb 21 21:12:33 <kamui> I was gonna say, man, this thing should last 4 hours at that rate
Feb 21 21:12:35 <PatrickC_Pre> 272.11 mA
Feb 21 21:12:47 <SineOt> if you have Govnah installed, you can check the load averages to see what those are-that will give you a better idea of just what it's going to be doing for the next little while
Feb 21 21:12:52 <kamui> must have been doing something at that moment
Feb 21 21:13:24 <PatrickC_Pre> probabl
Feb 21 21:13:29 <PatrickC_Pre> *probably*
Feb 21 21:13:55 <PatrickC_Pre> I can never get it low enough to use the calibration mode
Feb 21 21:14:38 <SineOt> I think a Pre2 should idle, doing nothing, at around like 90-110 or so? Not sure on the exacts
Feb 21 21:14:46 <SineOt> My Pixi will idle at around 60
Feb 21 21:14:53 <SineOt> but it's a lot lower powered hardware
Feb 21 21:17:11 <PatrickC_Pre> anyone here still use PS2 KB/Mouse's?
Feb 21 21:17:23 <SineOt> I haven't used one of those in probably 5 years
Feb 21 21:17:52 <PatrickC_Pre> I'm using one now :p
Feb 21 21:17:59 <haeffb> SineOt: Simplenote
Feb 21 21:18:26 <RagingMind> I still use PS2
Feb 21 21:19:00 <PatrickC_Pre> well, I only have 1 USB port on my laptop, and a spare PS2 KB laying around
Feb 21 21:23:13 * PatrickC_Pre is booting up his dinosaur laptop to try out some stuff
Feb 21 21:27:49 <PatrickC_Pre> anyone here remember windows Me? :)
Feb 21 21:28:01 <PatrickC_Pre> with tell pentium 3?
Feb 21 21:28:06 <PatrickC_Pre> *intell*
Feb 21 21:28:13 <destrudo> intel
Feb 21 21:28:23 <PatrickC_Pre> yep
Feb 21 21:28:24 <destrudo> I remember dos 6
Feb 21 21:28:31 <destrudo> I remember windows 3.0
Feb 21 21:29:19 <PatrickC_Pre> well, my laptop came with Me originally :) and only like 168 MB RAM
Feb 21 21:29:26 <destrudo> I remember acoustic couplers, mountain dew/pizza night
Feb 21 21:29:28 <destrudo> Haha
Feb 21 21:29:29 <destrudo> wow
Feb 21 21:29:33 <destrudo> 168MB
Feb 21 21:29:34 <PatrickC_Pre> yep
Feb 21 21:29:37 <destrudo> man that's a lot
Feb 21 21:29:42 <PatrickC_Pre> now running XP Pro
Feb 21 21:29:45 <rwhitby> haeffb: we're pretty close to a procedure you can use on your main phone now.
Feb 21 21:29:45 <PatrickC_Pre> I know!
Feb 21 21:29:46 <SineOt> yeah, lol
Feb 21 21:30:04 <PatrickC_Pre> those computers running 4-8GB are wimps!
Feb 21 21:30:13 <SineOt> the first home system we had was 66mhz with 16mb of RAM originally
Feb 21 21:30:18 <PatrickC_Pre> it takes a real computer to run off 168MB!
Feb 21 21:30:52 <SineOt> no, no it doesn't
Feb 21 21:31:02 <destrudo> it takes 16mhz
Feb 21 21:31:11 <destrudo> 8086
Feb 21 21:31:12 <rwhitby> 16MB! my first computer was 4MHz and 16KB!
Feb 21 21:31:13 <haeffb> rwhitby: too late, I just bought two new non-main phones... :)
Feb 21 21:31:23 <rwhitby> haeffb: even better
Feb 21 21:31:28 <destrudo> er
Feb 21 21:31:30 <destrudo> 10mhz
Feb 21 21:31:40 <destrudo> 16 bit, 10 mhz
Feb 21 21:31:49 <destrudo> I found one, one day
Feb 21 21:31:57 <destrudo> we tried to ressurect it like jesus
Feb 21 21:32:02 * halfhalo will use said procedure
Feb 21 21:32:09 <destrudo> but something was wrong... deep inside.
Feb 21 21:32:16 <haeffb> rwhitby: will it be possible for a non "makefile expert" or do I need to do some research... ?
Feb 21 21:32:18 <roy-pre101> 4MHZ!  Lucky!
Feb 21 21:32:33 <PatrickC_Pre> what did I start :p
Feb 21 21:32:35 <rwhitby> haeffb: it will be possible
Feb 21 21:32:51 <haeffb> sweet
Feb 21 21:32:52 <destrudo> shit rolls downhill now
Feb 21 21:33:07 * PatrickC_Pre has to downoad files to his phone and transfer it via USB to his computer :p
Feb 21 21:33:10 <roy-pre101> rwhitby: So, I was told I should probably wait a couple days before converting my Pre2.  I was ready to start!
Feb 21 21:33:13 <haeffb> you guys are rock stars!
Feb 21 21:33:20 <rwhitby> roy-pre101: you sir can start today
Feb 21 21:33:41 <roy-pre101> ooh, can I?
Feb 21 21:33:53 <roy-pre101> Do I need to pull a new meta doctor?
Feb 21 21:34:01 <rwhitby> sure, I know you know how to do the hardware and the meta doctor.
Feb 21 21:34:04 <roy-pre101> or will my old one work OK?
Feb 21 21:34:05 <rwhitby> yep
Feb 21 21:34:10 <rwhitby> new one
Feb 21 21:34:29 <PatrickC_Pre> rwhitby, are you guys going to post a youtube vid of how to do it?
Feb 21 21:34:53 <rwhitby> if you need a youtube video, you should get webosworld to do it instead.
Feb 21 21:35:24 <SineOt> well put, rwhitby
Feb 21 21:35:26 <roy-pre101> heh
Feb 21 21:35:28 <oil> lol, my mom got a verizon iphone
Feb 21 21:35:35 <PatrickC_Pre> well, the youtube vid would be helpful :)
Feb 21 21:35:53 <rwhitby> the youtube video would be of a command line running make commands.
Feb 21 21:36:06 <rwhitby> since that is the only new bit
Feb 21 21:36:13 <Tibfib> oil: heh, my dad got a iPhone on at&t a few weeks ago
Feb 21 21:36:36 <rwhitby> roy-pre101: research up in the thread, and practice making the doctors.  I'll be back in about 1.5h to help you.
Feb 21 21:36:52 <rwhitby> roy-pre101: make sure you have a test profile at 1.4.5 to start with.
Feb 21 21:37:12 <roy-pre101> OK.  Pulled fresh copy.
Feb 21 21:37:14 <Tibfib> So, I've got an idea. What if I make a "lite" version of Koto for the catalog in which the only restriction is you can have a max of 10 songs in your playlist
Feb 21 21:37:14 * rwhitby bbl
Feb 21 21:37:15 <Tibfib> ?
Feb 21 21:37:37 <PatrickC_Pre> sounds nice tibfib
Feb 21 21:38:05 <Tibfib> if I did a "timed" trial it would have to "phone home" no matter what, which I don't want to do
Feb 21 21:38:08 <SineOt> Tibfib: this review is going to be amazing by the way :p
Feb 21 21:38:16 <Tibfib> SineOt: :)
Feb 21 21:38:23 <Tibfib> I'll be sure to tweet it
Feb 21 21:39:09 <PatrickC_Pre> and add the amazing site that hosted it in the description ;)
Feb 21 21:39:28 <SineOt> hush PatrickC_Pre, or I'll post it on rudderSQUISH instead :p
Feb 21 21:39:38 <PatrickC_Pre> that'll work too lol
Feb 21 21:40:13 <dumbledore> is the ESN hardcoded onto the comm board on a pre?
Feb 21 21:40:15 <PatrickC_Pre> enyo /needs/ a webkit browser, doesn't it?
Feb 21 21:42:24 <pandora--> PatrickC_Pre: ja
Feb 21 21:42:33 <PatrickC_Pre> man
Feb 21 21:42:41 <PatrickC_Pre> now I have to download chrome :/
Feb 21 21:42:54 <SineOt> you should be using it anyways, firefox blows P:
Feb 21 21:42:59 <Tibfib> So anyone have a better idea for a lite version?
Feb 21 21:43:22 <PatrickC_Pre> FF4 is nice
Feb 21 21:43:34 <SineOt> it's still saddled with Gecko, which isn't
Feb 21 21:43:44 <RagingMind> Tibfib, a pause before it starts that has a page begging the user to upgrade to a full version?  *shrugs*
Feb 21 21:44:07 <RagingMind> and a kitten with sad eyes
Feb 21 21:44:08 <SineOt> Tibfib: I think 10 songs is the best lite restriction you could have come up with, really
Feb 21 21:44:28 <SineOt> no phone home and lets them do everything they please with it
Feb 21 21:44:52 <Tibfib> RagingMind: maybe an extra list item with "Upgrade" ?
Feb 21 21:45:01 <Tibfib> SineOt: sweet, thanks!
Feb 21 21:45:06 <RagingMind> every 10 songs it inserts it's own audio advertisement for the full version?
Feb 21 21:45:24 <oil> "Hello, tibfib here, how about buying this?"
Feb 21 21:45:25 <RagingMind> on a serious note, the 10 songs per playlist sounds better
Feb 21 21:45:37 <SineOt> an ad every 10 would be annoying but it's also something that people would just ignore and keep using the demo version
Feb 21 21:45:52 <RagingMind> is there an ad provider that supplies audio ad clips?
Feb 21 21:45:56 <Tibfib> hahaha
Feb 21 21:46:09 <SineOt> and 10 per playlist assumes every person uses playlists (I don't, so I'd never really be bothered by that limit!)
Feb 21 21:46:11 <RagingMind> every 10 songs would be about 1 ad every half hour
Feb 21 21:46:33 <RagingMind> I would not be annoyed by that, unless it was a terrible and repetitive ad
Feb 21 21:46:35 <Tibfib> SineOt: I was thinking 10 songs in the now playing at most
Feb 21 21:46:35 <sugardave> Tibfib: 10 songs in the playlist, x number of uses
Feb 21 21:46:45 <CTLAdvance> You should play a very light sounding But the full version of Koto today in the middle of every song
Feb 21 21:46:54 <CTLAdvance> just loud enough for them to hear it
Feb 21 21:46:55 <sugardave> I meant either or
Feb 21 21:47:03 <Tibfib> sugardave: oh, gotcha
Feb 21 21:47:19 <Tibfib> x number of uses requires the app to phone home
Feb 21 21:47:30 <CTLAdvance> why
Feb 21 21:47:34 <Tibfib> CTLAdvance: a possibility
Feb 21 21:47:37 <CTLAdvance> just track it in the db
Feb 21 21:47:41 <Tibfib> if you uninstall the app and reinstall it it's back
Feb 21 21:47:47 <CTLAdvance> ah yeah
Feb 21 21:47:48 <CTLAdvance> forgot
Feb 21 21:47:52 <SineOt> Tibfib: yeah, I know what you meant, just 10 songs is 10 songs
Feb 21 21:48:07 <sugardave> Tibfib: no phone home required, if Enyo prefs db works like mojo prefs db, those values persist past uninstall
Feb 21 21:48:13 <SineOt> which is what I think is the best option
Feb 21 21:48:20 <RagingMind> I was more thinking ad supported... so even the free version would supply revenue, but I don't know if there are any internet ad suppliers that do audio.  visual ones are super easy to ignore
Feb 21 21:48:31 * sugardave just implemented a credit system for a client's free apps.
Feb 21 21:48:36 <sugardave> no server system required
Feb 21 21:48:50 * Tibfib will go with 10 songs for now, may change later
Feb 21 21:49:15 <CTLAdvance> you could pull an ad mob ad and make them click view or ignore before they continue to the next song
Feb 21 21:49:22 <CTLAdvance> and a button to buy the full version
Feb 21 21:49:48 <SineOt> I think the entire point of a lite version is to let you test drive an app. You can test drive it just fine if it limits you to 10 songs, because you can do EVERYTHING with those 10.
Feb 21 21:49:57 <SineOt> You just can't play your entire 2000 track library with it.
Feb 21 21:50:04 <oil> the real koto question
Feb 21 21:50:07 <sugardave> 200 playlists
Feb 21 21:50:11 <sugardave> no problem
Feb 21 21:50:11 <oil> does space pause/resume?
Feb 21 21:50:12 <RagingMind> if it requires user interaction like that you might wanna make it more than 10 songs... like once a day or something
Feb 21 21:50:21 <SineOt> Perfect segue into the full version.
Feb 21 21:50:28 <Tibfib> oil: not atm.. do you really want it
Feb 21 21:50:29 <Tibfib> ?
Feb 21 21:50:34 <oil> yes
Feb 21 21:50:36 <Tibfib> I was going to have in app type to search
Feb 21 21:50:38 <SineOt> sugardave: when he's said 10 songs, I see it more as 10 songs is the entire size of the library
Feb 21 21:50:40 * Tibfib kinda does
Feb 21 21:50:41 <oil> :)
Feb 21 21:50:47 <Tibfib> oil: patch me bro
Feb 21 21:50:48 <oil> its great when you're in a car
Feb 21 21:50:51 <SineOt> If you've got 2000 tracks, you get a selection of 10 songs
Feb 21 21:50:52 <sugardave> SineOt: which 10 songs?
Feb 21 21:50:59 <PatrickC_Pre> I might have to use Safari :'(
Feb 21 21:51:04 <dumbledore> would anyone happen to know if the pixi comm board will fit in the pre?
Feb 21 21:51:05 <oil> space is easier to hit then, let me wake it up, touch the screen where the button may be
Feb 21 21:51:06 <SineOt> I assume either random or the first full album
Feb 21 21:51:16 <oil> i do it with drpodder all the time
Feb 21 21:51:16 <Tibfib> It will just take the first 10 songs
Feb 21 21:51:20 <oil> space+space = wake/pause
Feb 21 21:51:22 <sugardave> you can test drive 1st gear
Feb 21 21:51:24 <Tibfib> oil: alrighty, I'll do it
Feb 21 21:51:26 <oil> :)
Feb 21 21:51:35 <Tibfib> oil: if you buy it
Feb 21 21:51:35 <SineOt> oil: mode switcher driving mode on car charger, set it to never turn the screen off
Feb 21 21:51:38 <oil> remix doesnt have that :)
Feb 21 21:51:41 <SineOt> you don't have to deal with waking it up
Feb 21 21:51:53 <oil> like i'm rich enough for a car charger, lol
Feb 21 21:51:59 <sugardave> hahaha
Feb 21 21:52:09 <RagingMind> they are $12 on amazon :-P
Feb 21 21:52:27 <Tibfib> oil: I got one free with my $20 touchstone
Feb 21 21:52:34 <Tibfib> or was it $10?
Feb 21 21:52:34 <SineOt> get that Verizon TouchStone bundle that is probably still for sale
Feb 21 21:52:39 <Tibfib> ^that
Feb 21 21:52:43 <RagingMind> though I haven't actually used mine yet... it will be handy for the 20ish hours I"ll be in the car this weekend
Feb 21 21:52:45 <Tibfib> got two of those
Feb 21 21:52:57 <SineOt> I use mine all the time
Feb 21 21:53:10 <SineOt> Mode switcher goes into Driving mode with car charger + headphone jack
Feb 21 21:53:31 <SineOt> launches Slacker Radio, turns the brightness down, sets media volume to 50, turns off screen timeout :p
Feb 21 21:53:37 <RagingMind> it only takes me 3-5 minutes to get to work or the grocery store and I rarely go anywhere else.  not much point plugging it in for 5 minutes
Feb 21 21:53:43 <PatrickC_Pre> can't install Chrome without internet connection :(
Feb 21 21:55:09 <SineOt> heh, most of my commutes end up closer to 20 minutes
Feb 21 21:55:59 <PatrickC_Pre> lets try this with safari...
Feb 21 21:56:47 <PatrickC_Pre> if it will ever download :p
Feb 21 21:57:01 <halfhalo> REAL men wire the pre to the car battery directly
Feb 21 21:57:20 * PatrickC_Pre guesses halfhalo did that already
Feb 21 21:57:34 <SineOt> y'know, it's sad when a site designed to teach you about different strains of weed has a better API than other, more mundane and simple sites :I
Feb 21 21:57:36 <DoubleDubWSS> Anyone have a link to the verizon touchstone deal?
Feb 21 21:57:55 <Tibfib> DoubleDubWSS: check webosroundup.com
Feb 21 21:58:00 <DoubleDubWSS> thx
Feb 21 21:58:16 <DoubleDubWSS> been holding off as I'm cheap
Feb 21 21:58:27 <SineOt> this link work? http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/store/accessory?action=accessoryBundleDetails&bundleId=3633
Feb 21 21:58:49 <sugardave> SineOt: where is the weed API?
Feb 21 21:58:53 <SineOt> It's a pouch (eh) a touchstone and a car charger with a second USB port on it for 14, pretty sure it comes with free shipping too
Feb 21 21:58:53 <PatrickC_Pre> anyone know if enyo works on 1.4.5?
Feb 21 21:59:08 <SineOt> I can verify that the charger will charge 2 Pres at once too! :Q
Feb 21 21:59:11 <sugardave> PatrickC_Pre: that information is probably in the forum
Feb 21 21:59:16 <SineOt> sugardave: hah, here http://www.leafly.com/api/documentation
Feb 21 21:59:34 <sugardave> SineOt: sweet, thanks
Feb 21 21:59:41 <PatrickC_Pre> true :) its always the simplest things that answer my questions ;) lol
Feb 21 21:59:43 <DoubleDubWSS> Nice
Feb 21 21:59:49 <DoubleDubWSS> I have a usb car charger
Feb 21 21:59:54 <Loudergood> SineOt: that charger will power a pre on a touchstone and an iphone at the same time
Feb 21 21:59:55 <DoubleDubWSS> But with gps running the battery drains still
Feb 21 22:00:06 <SineOt> Loudergood: really? awesome
Feb 21 22:00:11 <dumbledore> how does one charge two pre's at once
Feb 21 22:00:17 <dumbledore> usb splitter?
Feb 21 22:00:20 <SineOt> it has a second USB port on it
Feb 21 22:00:24 <dumbledore> oh
Feb 21 22:00:26 <SineOt> you can plug in another USB cable to it
Feb 21 22:00:30 <dumbledore> awesome
Feb 21 22:00:35 <SineOt> so you could even say, run your dash GPS off it
Feb 21 22:00:45 <SineOt> I've charged my Nook before with it while charging my phone, etc
Feb 21 22:00:49 <SineOt> handy charger
Feb 21 22:00:54 <DoubleDubWSS> very cool
Feb 21 22:01:08 <SineOt> only complaint is that it glows bright fuckall red
Feb 21 22:01:09 <Loudergood> yeah we tried that when my brother was visiting, he was sad when the touchstone wouldn't work with his phone
Feb 21 22:01:13 <dumbledore> lol our names look almost alike DoubleDubWSS
Feb 21 22:01:20 <Loudergood> mine's not that bright...
Feb 21 22:01:47 <DoubleDubWSS> Hmm, link doesn't take me to the bundle
Feb 21 22:01:49 <DoubleDubWSS> I'll dig
Feb 21 22:02:12 <SineOt> try this link http://www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/store/accessory?action=refineBundlesByPhone&phoneId=5129
Feb 21 22:02:49 <SineOt> oh, and it's free overnight shipping too haha
Feb 21 22:03:12 <Josef_B> well
Feb 21 22:03:16 <DoubleDubWSS> Hmm...Maybe it's my location?  That shows me 0 results for Pre Plus accessories
Feb 21 22:03:42 <Josef_B> not everyone is switch carriers for a pre2 since palm won't go to legacy devices .. yes i know there is probably something and no i don't want anyone rushin 2.0 to pre - and pre + im just saying
Feb 21 22:03:43 <dumbledore> ugh evdo is so slow
Feb 21 22:03:50 <Josef_B> not ever webos use will jump ship
Feb 21 22:04:17 <SineOt> DoubleDubWSS: weird, works for me here
Feb 21 22:04:32 <DoubleDubWSS> Yeah, must be location for some reason.  What state are you selecting?
Feb 21 22:04:38 <SineOt> CA
Feb 21 22:04:48 <DoubleDubWSS> Thx
Feb 21 22:08:06 <DoubleDubWSS> I found it - thx!
Feb 21 22:08:52 * PatrickC_Pre has to use Safari :(
Feb 21 22:10:00 <halfhalo> boo safari
Feb 21 22:10:21 <dawm_> why not chrome?
Feb 21 22:11:38 <DoubleDubWSS> something about internet connectivity
Feb 21 22:11:48 <SineOt> sugardave: you going to be building an app? :p
Feb 21 22:12:18 <PatrickC_Pre> correct doubledubwss, I can't connect to internet, so no chrome
Feb 21 22:13:35 <PatrickC_Pre> palm-package isn't recognised as a command
Feb 21 22:13:51 <PatrickC_Pre> do I have to run the emu to use those commands?
Feb 21 22:14:04 <SineOt> no, but you need to have the SDK installed
Feb 21 22:14:06 <DoubleDubWSS> The SDK
Feb 21 22:14:10 <DoubleDubWSS> in sdk\bin
Feb 21 22:14:35 <PatrickC_Pre> oh yea, I havent installed the SDK on this computer :o
Feb 21 22:15:16 <DoubleDubWSS> I think there is a chrome offline installer.  I'll dig.
Feb 21 22:15:28 <PatrickC_Pre> ok
Feb 21 22:15:38 <PatrickC_Pre> I couldn't find one on my pre
Feb 21 22:16:42 <DoubleDubWSS> http://www.google.com/chrome/eula.html?standalone=1&hl=en
Feb 21 22:16:51 <DoubleDubWSS> Normal accept/install screen, but the download says "Standalone"
Feb 21 22:17:30 <PatrickC_Pre> thanks!
Feb 21 22:17:36 <PatrickC_Pre> switching to Pixi mode
Feb 21 22:17:55 <PatrickC_Pre> I have the SDK downloaded on the pre
Feb 21 22:18:31 <PatrickC_Pixi> hello people
Feb 21 22:18:56 <PatrickC_Pixi> and the pre is offline
Feb 21 22:19:39 <PatrickC_Pixi> it's nice having the SDK downloaded on the pre already ;)
Feb 21 22:20:21 <DoubleDubWSS> I do the same with the usbnet drivers so I don't have to find them each time.
Feb 21 22:20:49 <DoubleDubWSS> Anyone know if the pre2 storage write speed is any better than the Pre/Pixi?
Feb 21 22:21:26 <PatrickC_Pixi> well, my laptop is running SP2, so no usb tethering :'(
Feb 21 22:21:50 <DoubleDubWSS> Sp2? I didn't know that was an issue?
Feb 21 22:22:19 <sugardave> SineOt: maybe, they only allow non-commercial use of the API
Feb 21 22:22:21 <PatrickC_Pixi> yep
Feb 21 22:22:26 <sugardave> I have to decide how charitable I want to be :)
Feb 21 22:22:38 <SineOt> heh
Feb 21 22:22:45 <PatrickC_Pixi> usbnet won't work on it but it worked on my SP3 machine
Feb 21 22:22:51 <SineOt> well, if you don't want to be charitable, I was going to probably cook something up using it
Feb 21 22:22:59 <funkatron> THEMES PEOPLE
Feb 21 22:23:04 <sugardave> boo
Feb 21 22:23:09 <sugardave> to hard
Feb 21 22:23:11 <sugardave> too, too
Feb 21 22:23:22 <halfhalo> lol
Feb 21 22:38:40 * oil wonders what a theme with a blank css file will look like xD
Feb 21 22:39:34 <sugardave> ooogly
Feb 21 22:40:03 * halfhalo keeps mum
Feb 21 22:40:41 <pandora--> would look like netscape communicator 4.7
Feb 21 22:40:45 * pandora-- theory
Feb 21 22:40:45 <oil> lol
Feb 21 22:40:55 <pandora--> :D
Feb 21 22:50:15 <Tibfib> sweet. should have my "cut to 10 songs" code working
Feb 21 22:52:25 <Tibfib> almost.
Feb 21 22:55:51 <destinal> Tibfib: cut to 10 songs?
Feb 21 22:55:56 <joetweeply> yay, enyo demo vid on youtube
Feb 21 22:56:15 <Tibfib> for a "lite" version, all the features will be there except you can have a max of 10 songs in your now playing list
Feb 21 22:57:45 <PatrickC_Pixi> tibfib, now playing list? where does it grab the music from? the regular music library?
Feb 21 22:57:54 <Tibfib> yeah
Feb 21 22:58:11 <PatrickC_Pixi> ohh ok
Feb 21 22:58:14 <Tibfib> like if you want to play ALL your songs, it will add 10 to your playling list
Feb 21 22:58:31 <PatrickC_Pixi> ok, now I see how it works ;)
Feb 21 22:58:53 <PatrickC_Pixi> just type integration?
Feb 21 22:58:59 <PatrickC_Pixi> or exhibition mode?
Feb 21 22:59:04 <rwhitby> morning
Feb 21 22:59:17 <PatrickC_Pixi> morning rod
Feb 21 22:59:30 <Tibfib> PatrickC_Pixi: Just type is fully supported
Feb 21 22:59:34 <Tibfib> type a song and it shows up in just type :)
Feb 21 22:59:56 <PatrickC_Pixi> what about exhibition mode?
Feb 21 23:00:00 <Tibfib> or type an album/artist/favorite/
Feb 21 23:00:06 <Tibfib> PatrickC_Pixi: not atm..
Feb 21 23:00:20 <PatrickC_Pixi> coming down the pipe?
Feb 21 23:00:51 <Tibfib> I need to look at the api more
Feb 21 23:02:22 <PatrickC_Pixi> ok. I'll be the first one to download Koto lite :)
Feb 21 23:02:33 <Tibfib> 2.0 only still
Feb 21 23:03:09 <PatrickC_Pixi> I have a 2.0 device ;)
Feb 21 23:03:13 <Tibfib> sweet
Feb 21 23:03:35 <PatrickC_Pixi> yep ;)
Feb 21 23:11:52 <PatrickC_Pixi> webos 3 will still support Mojo, right?
Feb 21 23:12:33 <oil> i think they said it runs in a card with a back button
Feb 21 23:12:38 <Tibfib> yeah
Feb 21 23:13:10 <sugardave> back button
Feb 21 23:13:12 <sugardave> :(
Feb 21 23:13:21 <PatrickC_Pixi> ok
Feb 21 23:13:34 <PatrickC_Pixi> I don't /have/ to rebuild in enyo for it
Feb 21 23:13:41 <PatrickC_Pixi> phew
Feb 21 23:17:17 <NuttyBunny> But they say it'll eventually dissapear :S
Feb 21 23:17:37 <NuttyBunny> so, in the long run, yes, we'll all have to port everything to Enyo :(
Feb 21 23:18:56 <PatrickC_Pixi> I'm going to port to enyo, it's just not an emergency
Feb 21 23:20:31 * sugardave wonders why anyone would bother making a new app in Mojo.
Feb 21 23:20:54 <sugardave> unless it's going out tomorrow
Feb 21 23:22:20 * oil makes new app in mojo just to mess with sugardave
Feb 21 23:23:12 <sugardave> well, I know all I need to know about you from PreWare/wIRC, so
Feb 21 23:23:14 <sugardave> yeah
Feb 21 23:35:21 <rwhitby> sugardave: until there is a firm shipping date and list of carriers for the Veer and Pre 3, why would you even consider starting an app in Enyo if you want revenue from it in the next 12 months?
Feb 21 23:35:55 <rwhitby> since at the moment, the TAM for such an app is $0.
Feb 21 23:39:19 <destinal> rwhitby: also no promises of Enyo at veer or pre3 launch
Feb 21 23:39:30 <nemunaire> exit
Feb 21 23:40:18 <destinal> rwhitby: the way it sounded was they're going to make enyo available as an upgrade sometime after those devices launch, the only one that will ship with it is touchpad
Feb 21 23:40:26 <sugardave> rwhitby: I guess so...for me, I guess it is making more sense to play/learn with Enyo instead of making new apps in Mojo
Feb 21 23:40:31 <rwhitby> yep. "in the coming months" all over again.
Feb 21 23:42:25 <destinal> rwhitby: worse than that though, you'll want to develop concurrently in enyo and mojo for the foreseeable future just like you have to support 1.4.5 and 2.x for the conceivable future.  it really is the worst of both worlds
Feb 21 23:43:31 <destinal> I really want to have faith in HP... but...
Feb 21 23:43:36 <destinal> sigh
Feb 21 23:43:56 <Tibfib> yeah... someone isn't always making the best decisions..
Feb 21 23:44:12 <sugardave> Leo is supposed to be helping us...
Feb 21 23:45:03 <Orithma|web> I say we hijack the webOS division over as a channel and get the giant moving in the right direction :)
Feb 21 23:45:50 <rwhitby> heh, as if this channel could do any better :)
Feb 21 23:46:09 <Tibfib> lol
Feb 21 23:46:16 <sugardave> hahaha
Feb 21 23:48:48 <Tibfib> there. I think koto lite is ready
Feb 21 23:50:06 <destinal> Tibfib: I remember you mentioned koto lite a while back but I don't remember any details about it.  now I'm curious..  what are the differences?
Feb 21 23:50:36 <Tibfib> destinal: for the "lite" version all the features will be there except you can have a max of 10 songs in your now playing list
Feb 21 23:53:29 <Tibfib> anyone able to test the lite version for a sec or two?
Feb 22 00:12:18 <PatrickC_Pre> hay
Feb 22 00:14:12 <PatrickC_Pre> tibfib
Feb 22 00:14:26 <Tibfib> PatrickC_Pre: yeah?
Feb 22 00:46:36 * haeffb just ordered one of the Verizon touchstone bundles.
Feb 22 00:46:46 <haeffb> too bad it's not a Palm car charger, though.
Feb 22 00:47:14 <CTLAdvance> did the price of sprint pre 1's tank recently?
Feb 22 00:47:22 <CTLAdvance> I am seeing them for 5 dollars now
Feb 22 00:47:24 <CTLAdvance> or less
Feb 22 00:47:56 <haeffb> new? or used?
Feb 22 00:48:01 <CTLAdvance> used
Feb 22 00:48:10 <CTLAdvance> they were over 100 for a long time
Feb 22 00:48:12 <haeffb> I bought 2 this morning on ebay
Feb 22 00:48:17 <CTLAdvance> nice
Feb 22 00:48:24 <CTLAdvance> ~5 bucks?
Feb 22 00:48:30 <haeffb> for $28 total, including shipping
Feb 22 00:48:37 <CTLAdvance> thats not bad
Feb 22 00:48:39 <haeffb> $7.5 and $8.5 plus shipping
Feb 22 00:49:02 <haeffb> hope to use them to turn my Pre 2's into Sprint Pre 2's
Feb 22 00:49:25 <haeffb> with the news today, I'd have thought the prices would be going up... :)
Feb 22 00:49:57 <pandora--> hah
Feb 22 00:50:08 <pandora--> piece of poop pre
Feb 22 00:50:13 * pandora-- is on #5
Feb 22 00:50:18 <pandora--> haeffb: what news?
Feb 22 00:50:45 <haeffb> that you can now easily(*) swap the comms board and get a working Sprint Pre 2
Feb 22 00:51:02 <haeffb> (*) easily is a relative term
Feb 22 00:52:15 <CTLAdvance> eh no one except the die hards will really do it
Feb 22 00:52:20 <CTLAdvance> I dont plan on reflashing
Feb 22 00:52:50 <CTLAdvance> still using the att 2.0.1 I believe
Feb 22 00:52:51 <haeffb> if the Pre 3 was coming to Sprint in the next month, I wouldn't do it. But...
Feb 22 00:53:57 <CTLAdvance> my other question is, is the verizon pre2 doctor updating the sprint device firmware to work with 2.0
Feb 22 00:54:11 <CTLAdvance> otherwise its not gonna work for everyone without things that no longer exist
Feb 22 00:54:14 <Josef_B> sup CTLAdvance
Feb 22 00:54:28 <CTLAdvance> sup JoeB
Feb 22 00:54:55 <Josef_B> nm u
Feb 22 00:55:20 <CTLAdvance> nm
Feb 22 00:56:05 <CTLAdvance> actually is rwhitby still somewhere
Feb 22 00:56:36 <CTLAdvance> err... looking at the channel
Feb 22 00:57:14 <pandora--> haeffb: you mean buy a pre2 and put a pre1 comm board in it for cdma etc?
Feb 22 00:57:40 <PatrickC_Pre> anyone here use Metrix wanna help me?
Feb 22 00:57:51 <haeffb> pandora--: yes
Feb 22 00:58:10 <CTLAdvance> haeffb - did they fix the firmware yet?
Feb 22 00:58:19 <pandora--> gotcha
Feb 22 00:58:24 <SineOt> what's up, PatrickC_Pre
Feb 22 00:58:26 <CTLAdvance> does the vzw doctor update it?
Feb 22 00:58:29 <haeffb> I have 2 unlocked GSM Pre 2's sitting here and 2 used Sprint Pre-'s on the way
Feb 22 00:58:30 <pandora--> yay a slightly less inferior phone!
Feb 22 00:58:32 <haeffb> CTLAdvance: yes
Feb 22 00:58:38 <PatrickC_Pre> I can't get Metrix to work..
Feb 22 00:58:40 <CTLAdvance> oh
Feb 22 00:58:46 <CTLAdvance> thats interesting
Feb 22 00:58:58 <SineOt> did you follow the instructions to the letter? it's -really- not that hard
Feb 22 00:59:05 <CTLAdvance> Is the vzw comboard the same basically just in a pre2?
Feb 22 00:59:08 <PatrickC_Pre> well, yes I did
Feb 22 00:59:14 <SineOt> then it'd be working
Feb 22 00:59:18 <SineOt> so no, you didn't :p
Feb 22 00:59:41 <CTLAdvance> SineOT Prior to the vzw doctor which is when I did mine, the doctor did not update the cdma comboard for sprint, resulting in an epic fail
Feb 22 00:59:46 <PatrickC_Pre> but I can't figure out where to put the "WJBCApp.Metrix.postDeviceData();"
Feb 22 00:59:49 <CTLAdvance> I found a work around for it which you can no longer do
Feb 22 01:00:01 <SineOt> CTLAdvance: Oh, haha-I was talking to PatrickC_Pre
Feb 22 01:00:04 <CTLAdvance> ah yeah
Feb 22 01:00:08 <CTLAdvance> saw that :)
Feb 22 01:00:19 <SineOt> PatrickC_Pre: oh boy
Feb 22 01:00:45 <PatrickC_Pre> they don't say, and it doesn't work in the stage assistant setup function
Feb 22 01:00:50 <haeffb> CTLAdvance: http://forums.precentral.net/webos-internals/276069-using-verizon-pre-2-doctor-assist-sprint-pre-2-development.html
Feb 22 01:01:39 <SineOt> post your stage assistant in its entirety and I'll tell you what you've done wrong, despite my better judgement saying to weep for humanity
Feb 22 01:01:45 <rwhitby> CTLAdvance: the verizon Pre 2 doctor does indeed update the CDMA firmware on the Sprint comms board.
Feb 22 01:01:50 <CTLAdvance-nook> howdy
Feb 22 01:01:59 <CTLAdvance> oh very nice
Feb 22 01:02:11 <CTLAdvance-nook> nice indeed
Feb 22 01:02:19 <PatrickC_Pre> ok... I'll have to figure out how...
Feb 22 01:02:34 <PatrickC_Pre> the PC is not on the internet...
Feb 22 01:02:38 <PatrickC_Pre> hmmm
Feb 22 01:02:47 <PatrickC_Pre> can I email it to u?
Feb 22 01:02:51 <SineOt> sigh
Feb 22 01:02:53 <SineOt> hold on
Feb 22 01:02:58 <PatrickC_Pre> ok
Feb 22 01:03:16 <CTLAdvance> ok basically is it just like before, we clone the metadoctor, unpack update repack er... make and then doctor
Feb 22 01:04:02 <rwhitby> yep, with special sauce
Feb 22 01:04:21 <CTLAdvance> ah ok, very well, glad we dont need to do other things that no longer exist
Feb 22 01:04:40 <rwhitby> yep
Feb 22 01:04:42 <CTLAdvance> The question will be, can I get my regular profile to unlock
Feb 22 01:04:58 <SineOt> PatrickC_Pre: did you define WJBCApp as a global like the metrix instructions say to?
Feb 22 01:05:05 <CTLAdvance> or even better, can we get it to act as if it was 1.4.0 and then doctor again back to 1.4.5
Feb 22 01:05:07 <rwhitby> CTLAdvance: what's palm.com/palmprofile say for it now?
Feb 22 01:05:13 <sugardave> WJBC: Jesus Be Callin'!
Feb 22 01:05:15 <CTLAdvance> I havent done it yet
Feb 22 01:05:32 <rwhitby> CTLAdvance: what do you mean by "unlock" then?
Feb 22 01:05:36 <CTLAdvance> I wasnt going to do it... I think I may have just changed my mind though
Feb 22 01:05:40 <SineOt> OrithmaFelus, Orithma|web : ping?
Feb 22 01:05:41 <PatrickC_Pre> no, that's where I went wrong.. I think
Feb 22 01:05:53 <CTLAdvance> My main profile is locked at 9.9.9 and I cant sign into it anywhere
Feb 22 01:06:04 <Tibfib> that sucks
Feb 22 01:06:13 <rwhitby> CTLAdvance: right, that's why I was asking about palm.com/palmprofile
Feb 22 01:06:30 <SineOt> PatrickC_Pre: then don't say you followed the instructions :I
Feb 22 01:06:51 <rwhitby> CTLAdvance: if you log into that profile with a correct comms board and version combination, it sets it to the correct version
Feb 22 01:07:08 <rwhitby> CTLAdvance: let's move to #webos-internals for this
Feb 22 01:07:19 <CTLAdvance> sure
Feb 22 01:07:48 <PatrickC_Pre> where do I put that?
Feb 22 01:08:17 <sugardave> MyAwesomeGlobalNameSpace = {};
Feb 22 01:08:23 <sugardave> at the top of your stage assistant
Feb 22 01:08:32 <SineOt> The same place it is in the Metrix instructions!
Feb 22 01:08:34 <PatrickC_Pre> ok I'll try that
Feb 22 01:08:36 <sugardave> oh, you need var in front
Feb 22 01:08:39 <SineOt> The one you're supposed to be following
Feb 22 01:08:51 <sugardave> but he did follow the directions and they're not working
Feb 22 01:08:53 <SineOt> sugardave: you don't need a var
Feb 22 01:08:58 <sugardave> meh
Feb 22 01:09:11 <sugardave> with var, without var, it should work
Feb 22 01:09:12 <SineOt> sugardave: no he didn't, he never set up the global which is the first step in the instructions :p
Feb 22 01:09:21 <sugardave> but he said he read them
Feb 22 01:09:43 <SineOt> he says a lot of things :p
Feb 22 01:09:49 <PatrickC_Pre> the "my app" is suppose to be the app title? or the folder the app is in?
Feb 22 01:10:00 <sugardave> holy crap
Feb 22 01:10:01 <PatrickC_Pre> cause I have them as 2 different things
Feb 22 01:10:06 <PatrickC_Pre> what?
Feb 22 01:10:12 <SineOt> MyApp can be anything you want it to be, as long as you use the same thing everytime
Feb 22 01:10:12 <PatrickC_Pre> just trying to be clear
Feb 22 01:10:19 <PatrickC_Pre> oh ok
Feb 22 01:10:26 <PatrickC_Pre> thanks
Feb 22 01:10:49 <sugardave> my face hurts
Feb 22 01:10:52 <SineOt> You could do "PatrickCNeedsToLearnRemedialJavascript = {};" as long as you use that name everywhere
Feb 22 01:11:12 <sugardave> hehe
Feb 22 01:11:31 <PatrickC_Pre> lets try this again
Feb 22 01:11:51 <PatrickC_Pre> do I /have/ to provide a way for the people using it to turn it off?
Feb 22 01:12:13 <Tibfib> only if your conscience makes you
Feb 22 01:12:17 <sugardave> depends
Feb 22 01:12:26 <PatrickC_Pre> depends... how?
Feb 22 01:12:31 <sugardave> how wide is your distribution?
Feb 22 01:12:38 <PatrickC_Pre> app catalog
Feb 22 01:12:47 <sugardave> um
Feb 22 01:12:48 <PatrickC_Pre> it will be official app catalog
Feb 22 01:12:50 <sugardave> US
Feb 22 01:12:52 <sugardave> or worldwide?
Feb 22 01:13:01 <PatrickC_Pre> worldwide hopefully
Feb 22 01:13:10 <sugardave> Germans will be able to sue you for collecting information
Feb 22 01:13:22 <sugardave> if they were so inclined
Feb 22 01:13:34 <sugardave> and other EU nations have similar privacy laws, I think
Feb 22 01:14:11 <PatrickC_Pre> ok. I will count out those 2 till I get better, or just not use metrix at all till I can have the switch turn it off
Feb 22 01:14:29 <sugardave> no
Feb 22 01:14:37 <sugardave> EU isn't a "singleton" choice
Feb 22 01:14:45 <sugardave> it's a bunch of European countries
Feb 22 01:14:51 <PatrickC_Pre> it still isn't working...
Feb 22 01:15:01 <sugardave> no way
Feb 22 01:15:05 <PatrickC_Pre> well, I won't include metrix for a while then...
Feb 22 01:15:33 <SineOt> did you put Metrix's files in your sources.json?
Feb 22 01:15:48 <Tibfib> PatrickC_Pre: you should go through w3schools.com and learn javascript more
Feb 22 01:15:54 <Tibfib> it will make things easier.
Feb 22 01:16:03 <rwhitby> PatrickC_Pre: any collection of information must be opt-in at first run of the application *before* any data is sent
Feb 22 01:16:07 <PatrickC_Pre> no, I put the metrix things in my handelCommand instead of my setup :o
Feb 22 01:16:19 <SineOt> w3schools is kind of shitty, I wouldn't really wish that on anyone
Feb 22 01:16:27 <PatrickC_Pre> thanks rwhitby
Feb 22 01:16:31 <CTLAdvance> bbl
Feb 22 01:16:50 <SineOt> PatrickC_Pre: I swear to everything ever if you get a Pre2 through the dev marketing program and I don't I will throw myself off a bridge
Feb 22 01:17:01 <Tibfib> PatrickC_Pre: https://developer.mozilla.org/en/JavaScript/Guide
Feb 22 01:17:07 <Tibfib> there, SineOt, happy? :P
Feb 22 01:17:16 <SineOt> much better, Tibfib, much better
Feb 22 01:17:18 * sugardave will help SineOt throw himself off the bridge.
Feb 22 01:17:22 <haeffb> SineOt: what is better than w3schools ?
Feb 22 01:17:36 <sugardave> #webos!
Feb 22 01:17:46 <SineOt> Mozilla, for all the guff I toss their way, has a really decent Javascript stuff on their dev site
Feb 22 01:18:10 <SineOt> W3schools is just kind of this weird mix of out dated info, completely wrong info, and just generally stupid practices
Feb 22 01:18:31 <PatrickC_Pre> sineot, I am learning (obvously) and I want to make some apps that use 2.0/Enyo stuff. and a Pre2 is the best way to do that
Feb 22 01:18:34 <haeffb> bummer. That's where I learned everything I know.
Feb 22 01:18:39 <Tibfib> SineOt: it's not _that_ bad.
Feb 22 01:18:47 <sugardave> haeffb: YOU SUCK
Feb 22 01:18:51 * haeffb is full of outdated, wrong and stupid info... :)
Feb 22 01:18:55 <SineOt> it's not THAT bad no, but it's dumb when there's stuff that's so much better out there
Feb 22 01:19:02 <haeffb> but I'm willing to share with everyone!
Feb 22 01:19:06 <sugardave> haha
Feb 22 01:19:14 <Tibfib> SineOt: the w3schools formatting is pretty good imo
Feb 22 01:19:20 <Tibfib> at least I've gotten used to it
Feb 22 01:19:28 <sugardave> I got depressed again watching Matt's video today...all that Mojo learnin' for NOTHING
Feb 22 01:19:32 <SineOt> PatrickC_Pre: then please, please, go read and learn the basic stuff that you really obviously don't have a grasp on
Feb 22 01:20:09 <PatrickC_Pre> ok sineot
Feb 22 01:20:11 <PatrickC_Pre> I will
Feb 22 01:20:26 <PatrickC_Pre> its working
Feb 22 01:21:17 <SineOt> stuff like making a custom function, or how to set a global
Feb 22 01:21:58 <PatrickC_Pre> I got it working. and I'm on the mozilla site now
Feb 22 01:24:15 <SineOt> well yeah, it's working now... the thing that bothers me is that the readme you said you followed said exactly the same stuff that we all did
Feb 22 01:24:26 <SineOt> you had all the tools to get it working from the get go sitting right in front of
Feb 22 01:26:40 <PatrickC_Pre> well, I'm looking at (and following to the letter) the Mozilla tutorial
Feb 22 01:26:47 <PatrickC_Pre> that /should/ help me a lot
Feb 22 01:27:29 <SineOt> don't just follow, actively mull over it and ask yourself the "why" all the time
Feb 22 01:27:37 <SineOt> copying is one thing, understanding the "why" is another
Feb 22 01:28:36 <Loudergood> the best tutorials explain why...the poor ones are just code dumps
Feb 22 01:28:45 <PatrickC_Pre> well, I can't copy as the PC isn't on the internet, but I will constantly ask the "why"
Feb 22 01:29:02 <sugardave> some brains are more in tune with the whole understanding/questioning function of logic
Feb 22 01:29:33 <PatrickC_Pre> my brain, as we have seen, isn't :)
Feb 22 01:29:45 <Loudergood> you're young yet
Feb 22 01:29:51 <sugardave> yes, but a lot of that is choice
Feb 22 01:29:57 <PatrickC_Pre> that's true :)
Feb 22 01:29:59 <sugardave> you choose to be ignorant
Feb 22 01:31:00 <PatrickC_Pre> and that's when you prove how smart *you* are :)
Feb 22 01:31:10 <sugardave> nope
Feb 22 01:31:29 <sugardave> that's when I use the standard workflow of how to troubleshoot/research a problem
Feb 22 01:31:50 <Tibfib> ask #webos :)
Feb 22 01:31:51 <Loudergood> that's a really useful skill to develop
Feb 22 01:31:59 <sugardave> Loudergood: indeed
Feb 22 01:35:08 <PatrickC_Pre> javascript should be contained in an outside file and refered to? right
Feb 22 01:35:20 <sugardave> it can be
Feb 22 01:35:21 * oil puts all his javascript in index.html
Feb 22 01:35:59 <Loudergood> splitting things up is useful, but not necessary
Feb 22 01:36:24 <PatrickC_Pre> ok
Feb 22 01:36:26 <PatrickC_Pre> thanks
Feb 22 01:37:11 <Loudergood> just remember to comment your code a lot, it'll come in handy when you haven't looked at it in a few weeks/months
Feb 22 01:38:01 <PatrickC_Pre> will do loudergood
Feb 22 01:40:11 <oil> meh, comments
Feb 22 01:40:44 <halfhalo> unit testin ftw
Feb 22 01:42:41 <sugardave> this "test driven development
Feb 22 01:42:45 <sugardave> " thing eludes me
Feb 22 01:45:34 * haeffb comments a lot, then can't figure out what the comments mean in a few weeks/months
Feb 22 01:45:47 <haeffb> I need comments for my comments
Feb 22 01:47:04 <PatrickC_Pre> I need easy to understand javascript tutorials
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Tue Feb 22 02:59:57 2011