**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Aug 03 02:59:57 2011 Aug 03 03:02:30 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZ7-n930zJo&feature=share Aug 03 03:10:11 is this what they do instead of watching Murder She Wrote reruns? Aug 03 03:12:02 this is pretty sick tho Aug 03 03:21:19 Hmm. Is there a way to open a telnet connection in Enyo? Or would that necessitate a PDK hybrid? Aug 03 03:27:54 * haeffb debating whether to take advantage of the Developer Device Program for another TouchPad... Aug 03 03:28:37 do so. having two is very helpful when there is a early release OS to run. Aug 03 03:29:36 have two Aug 03 03:29:47 ha Aug 03 03:29:50 a third would be extravagant Aug 03 03:29:58 but it's cheaper... :) Aug 03 03:30:03 yay! my service finally works end-to-end Aug 03 03:30:06 it only took, forever Aug 03 03:30:18 nice. work on mine next... Aug 03 03:30:35 make them all into a big virutal desktop and setup the keyboard in front. Aug 03 03:30:50 let me rephrase, a single command on my service works end-to-end after spending all of yesterday and almost 2 hours today poking at it :P Aug 03 03:31:06 progress! Aug 03 03:31:33 Winning! Aug 03 03:33:41 * haeffb thinks waiting for a Pre3 or 7" tablet would be wiser... Aug 03 03:34:05 only if its an either/or decision Aug 03 03:34:21 now to figure out how to build a pretty list with enyo :) Aug 03 03:34:23 haeffb: get one of each Aug 03 03:34:30 pre3 seems like its just around the corner tho Aug 03 03:34:47 * rwhitby has two Pre 3's on pre-order Aug 03 03:35:12 * haeffb thinks waiting on a Pre3 AND a 7" tablet would be wiser Aug 03 03:35:12 * rwatkins does not believe current 'pre-orders'. Aug 03 03:35:14 it'd be nice if another pixi form-factor phone showed up Aug 03 03:35:24 rwatkins: one of the pre-orders is with Palm UK Aug 03 03:35:37 rwatkins: but I agree that a delivery date is unknonw Aug 03 03:35:43 ha, jokes on you. Palm was bought by HP a year a go... Aug 03 03:35:49 ha Aug 03 03:36:04 haeffb: Doh! I'd better stop posting on developer.palm.com then ... Aug 03 03:36:10 indeed Aug 03 03:36:25 has anyone yet demonstrated that people want a fun-size phone? Aug 03 03:36:48 "fun-sized"? Aug 03 03:36:52 haeffb: and that guy who invited me to speak in sydney emailed from a @palm.com email address - must be a hoax! Aug 03 03:36:54 wife LOVED her pixi Aug 03 03:36:55 I'm curious to know how much of that is based on actual demand, and how much of it is based on stubborn-ness Aug 03 03:37:19 fun size http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_gmPnOBaxFWk/Sgkmdua5iUI/AAAAAAAABLU/W0ILhnq8M24/s400/snickers+fun+size.jpg Aug 03 03:37:33 rwhitby: they're just hangers-on, like the stapler guy in Office Space. They haven't gotten word of the purchase yet. Aug 03 03:37:52 haeffb: as long as they keep paying for the flights, I'm good with them. Aug 03 03:38:04 oh, good point. Aug 03 03:38:12 the pixi was just on 1-sale-a-day yesterday Aug 03 03:38:17 $70 IIRC Aug 03 03:38:27 sprint version? Aug 03 03:38:33 alot of phone choice is fashion. fun size fits into that. Aug 03 03:38:35 at&t Aug 03 03:38:37 * haeffb would gobble up a couple of sprint pixi's Aug 03 03:38:52 hey, if it works, cool. Aug 03 03:39:08 I'm more curious than anything. I can't think of any other tiny smartphones Aug 03 03:39:40 the blackberry pearl was also in that segment. Aug 03 03:39:51 * PatrickC wanders in Aug 03 03:39:54 was that a thing that existed? Aug 03 03:40:00 actually I know it was Aug 03 03:40:00 nope Aug 03 03:40:08 it was massively successful for BB. Aug 03 03:40:13 * haeffb also debating whether to accept a blackberry from work or use my personal phone for bidness. Aug 03 03:40:16 indeed Aug 03 03:40:20 Michael Clayton had one Aug 03 03:40:47 the phone with half a keyboard Aug 03 03:40:52 CTO friend carried an ancient BB Pearl and an iPhone. one is the portal computer and the other is a functioning phone. Aug 03 03:40:58 * haeffb realizes he has a limited minutes plan from Sprint. Aug 03 03:41:02 oh yeah Aug 03 03:41:03 s/carried/carries/ Aug 03 03:41:15 I sorta was thinking about just having a dumb phone Aug 03 03:41:20 they always worked a lot better. Aug 03 03:41:30 the pearl was a nice combo phone Aug 03 03:41:33 my old sony ericcson (sp?) was awesome Aug 03 03:42:01 I only needed to charge it like once a week Aug 03 03:42:06 also in new york the iphone on at&t is pretty craptastic as an actual phone. Aug 03 03:42:10 funkatron: did you have the one that could BT tether to a Palm? Aug 03 03:42:24 oh yeah, when ever I've been in Brooklyn it's useless Aug 03 03:42:32 haeffb: I dunno! Aug 03 03:43:07 I used to tether an SE phone to a Palm Tungsten T2 or some such. Aug 03 03:43:17 must have gotten better as I have no issues with my iphone on ATT in or around the city Aug 03 03:43:19 :/ Aug 03 03:43:29 and BROWSE THE WEB from a palm device. Magical days Aug 03 03:43:42 CTLAdvance: you actually make calls for more than 3 minutes in downtown manhattan? Aug 03 03:44:04 Yes, I have taken 60 minute conf calls Aug 03 03:44:09 werid Aug 03 03:44:18 iphone 4, held in right hand or used with headset Aug 03 03:44:20 CTLAdvance has a parabolic antenna Aug 03 03:44:38 maybe Aug 03 03:45:16 Long Island is fine as well Aug 03 03:45:29 Though this is if I am not in the center of a building Aug 03 03:45:37 then nothing seems to get service Aug 03 03:46:13 like this http://gim.ie/lwT Aug 03 03:46:14 wallstreet is brutal w/ all the buildings. drop calls a ton, though has gotten a bit better. Aug 03 03:47:09 THE ECONOMY IS BRUTAL AMIRITE? Aug 03 03:48:48 twbbas, summatusmentis, NuttyBunny, fxspec06: check email Aug 03 03:48:59 The economy is going to get worse... AMIRITE? Aug 03 03:49:17 depends which economy you are speaking of Aug 03 03:49:34 they're all affected by our economy. Aug 03 03:49:36 1 australian dollar currently buys USD$1.10 Aug 03 03:49:54 (I am speaking the US) :) Aug 03 03:50:01 I dont speak for aust... Aug 03 03:50:42 I'd say China (if they wanted to) could have more of an effect on the US economy than the reverse. Aug 03 03:51:04 Is the SDK out supported for 3.0.2 or have they not released that yet Aug 03 03:51:18 unless we completely can't pay back the bonds they have been hoarding of ours Aug 03 03:51:19 they could, but in practice the world sways most to the US economy. Aug 03 03:52:00 yeah, one wonders how long that will last ... Aug 03 03:52:13 Rome couldnt last forever ... Aug 03 03:52:15 Regardless, the US will continue to tank unless we can figure out how to cust spending, and stop borrowing money to pay off money that we already barrowed Aug 03 03:52:25 Were doing this to ourselves Aug 03 03:52:44 not spending money is hard Aug 03 03:53:04 twbbas: I'm able to reproduce the bug Aug 03 03:53:04 spending money is what makes money. Aug 03 03:53:23 Yes, which is why I see us defaulting on our loans eventually anyways and then people will wake up... Aug 03 03:53:24 Ok thanks Aug 03 03:53:27 we all stop spending and it all comes to an end. Aug 03 03:53:31 cant keep barrowing forever Aug 03 03:53:41 you gotta play to win! Aug 03 03:53:44 twbbas: I wonder if it's the same bug that others have found in other areas Aug 03 03:53:46 lol Aug 03 03:54:20 I wish I could raise my own personal debt ceiling as easily as the US government did ... Aug 03 03:54:28 Summatusmentis: unwiredben said it had nothing to do with the SQL bug Aug 03 03:54:36 easy, fill out more of those credit card applications. Aug 03 03:54:50 rwhitby: I know right? Aug 03 03:54:55 Just go into credit card company website, login, request credit increase Aug 03 03:54:55 yea, I suppose you CAN Aug 03 03:55:01 and eventually they will cut you off Aug 03 03:55:08 Summatusmentis: I'm gonna reply to my dev forum post in the morning with more details Aug 03 03:56:30 twbbas: the sql bug is the one that's was causing, for example, the photos app to forget which albums to display en Exhibition mode? Aug 03 03:56:41 s/en/in/ Aug 03 03:59:03 so is the 3.0.2 sdk not public yet? Aug 03 04:00:40 yay and now i have a pretty list Aug 03 04:01:28 the biggest chunk of US debt is owned by... Aug 03 04:01:42 ...the Social Security Trust Fund Aug 03 04:02:02 so, yeah, contribute to your 401k early and often Aug 03 04:03:18 is window.setTimeout() an acceptable way to repeat an action in enyo? Aug 03 04:03:38 repeat? just .. call the function Aug 03 04:03:47 repeat-periodically Aug 03 04:03:52 like i want to poll a service Aug 03 04:03:55 setInterval Aug 03 04:04:24 assuming you only need to poll when your app is already running. Aug 03 04:04:33 yes Aug 03 04:04:53 otherwise i need a subscriable service? Aug 03 04:05:06 or an alarm depending on how often. Aug 03 04:05:08 DraX: as of webOS 3.0.2, setTimeout only works when you call it from an active window (or something close to that) Aug 03 04:05:38 setTimeout and setInterval Aug 03 04:05:53 i'm okish with that for now Aug 03 04:05:58 does appear to be called from the no-window root window as well, which saved my ass. Aug 03 04:06:03 Anyone here use your box.net setup? Aug 03 04:06:17 * PatrickC 's dad is trying to tell me that a TouchPad is a waste of money :/ Aug 03 04:07:02 s/setup/storage Aug 03 04:07:09 teenagers always buy stuff thats a waste of money. i know i did. Aug 03 04:07:10 is there a quick way to do setInterval where this is bound to the kind context Aug 03 04:07:12 actually, "the callback will be called, but only when your app is brought to the foreground" Aug 03 04:07:15 or do I need to fiddle with apply? Aug 03 04:07:36 enyo.bind(this, myFunction) ? Aug 03 04:07:52 bind is your friend. Aug 03 04:08:00 or your mortal enemy. sometimes I'm not sure. Aug 03 04:08:33 rwatkins: is a touchpad a waste of money? :) Aug 03 04:08:43 bind is just syntactic sugar for apply fiddling Aug 03 04:09:04 PatrickC: depends on what the other options are for what you can do with that money Aug 03 04:09:43 fiddle away! Aug 03 04:09:47 if its fosters a creativity and interest in programming that begins a career, its not. if its sits on the gadget pile in 2 weeks, it likely is. Aug 03 04:10:21 if you carry it with you throughout the work day, it's not Aug 03 04:10:34 the other option is a macbook.. and that's not likely Aug 03 04:11:34 he's like 12 - what work? Aug 03 04:12:11 15 tyvm lol Aug 03 04:12:20 and I'll probably be working at sprint soon Aug 03 04:12:51 anyone less than half my age is all lumped into one rough group. Aug 03 04:13:03 PatrickC: what worked for me around your age when I wanted to spend large amounts of money on technology was reasoned, calm discussion of the pros and cons of my intended purchase Aug 03 04:13:09 and of course having my own money to pay for it Aug 03 04:13:42 15 is "like 12" Aug 03 04:13:47 my parents were a lot less interested in supporting my gadget habit when I was angling to get them to help me pay for it :) Aug 03 04:14:07 to us grumpy old farts Aug 03 04:14:14 summatusmentis: I've got the money :) Aug 03 04:14:27 just need their cc.. I don't have one that palm accepts Aug 03 04:14:58 PatrickC: not to dissuade you, the other thing to consider is that college is really expensive Aug 03 04:15:12 I'm sure people are already telling you that, but it actually is :) Aug 03 04:15:13 I know. Aug 03 04:15:27 I'm not going to a big college either :) Aug 03 04:15:32 nor expensive Aug 03 04:15:41 which may be part of the "waste of money" thing coming from your parents Aug 03 04:16:00 PatrickC: at this point, if you're serious about developing apps, I would advise that a new computer would be a wiser purchase than a TouchPad Aug 03 04:16:09 that's also probably true Aug 03 04:16:15 agree Aug 03 04:16:21 haeffb: I'll probably get a macbook for Christmas Aug 03 04:16:58 I would rather pay 389 for a touchpad now, and wait for a new laptop, then buy a laptop now :) Aug 03 04:17:14 and a friend is giving me her old laptop that has a "bad" hdd Aug 03 04:17:21 what will you do with the TP? Aug 03 04:17:35 develop apps Aug 03 04:17:44 you can do that without one Aug 03 04:17:48 use for kindle/studing Aug 03 04:17:59 good Aug 03 04:17:59 taking notes, Bible, etc. Aug 03 04:18:20 yay works Aug 03 04:18:29 use PuffTheMagic's Tide ;) Aug 03 04:18:38 so how do you take screenshots? Aug 03 04:18:42 on the TP? Aug 03 04:18:45 yeah Aug 03 04:18:49 DraX: home+power Aug 03 04:18:49 power & home button at the same time Aug 03 04:19:12 Tide looks a lot like Sublime Text2 imho Aug 03 04:19:24 in that both are text editors? Aug 03 04:19:33 I think a TP is a much harder sell than a laptop, in terms of it's usability, because there's nothing it can do that a laptop can't, and laptops are more versatile Aug 03 04:19:53 and it goes into media/internal/screencaptures Aug 03 04:19:59 yes Aug 03 04:20:02 haeffb: in that they look very similar to me.. UI wise Aug 03 04:20:27 is there a way to install the app catalog on the emulator? Aug 03 04:20:38 for touchpad that is Aug 03 04:20:39 nohorse: I tried.. and failed Aug 03 04:20:58 well, you can always extract it from a device and palm-package palm-install Aug 03 04:21:16 summatusmentis: with Ubuntu and webOS, it seems much better then a laptop to me Aug 03 04:21:45 ubuntu is a compelling factor, that's true Aug 03 04:21:54 that is a bit beyond me at this point Aug 03 04:22:12 whether it's as usable as it would be on a laptop I guess remains to be seen (I haven't tried it yet) Aug 03 04:22:44 I haven't yet either (as I don't have a tp yet :) Aug 03 04:24:19 my loaner tp could be here soon Aug 03 04:24:24 PatrickC: I run ubuntu and webos on my laptop Aug 03 04:24:48 how the heck are you installing webOS on a laptoip? Aug 03 04:24:54 haeffb: emulator doesn't count :) Aug 03 04:25:16 nohorse: a real dual-boot has been done Aug 03 04:25:23 emulator and/or running enyo in a webkit browser Aug 03 04:25:33 http://t.co/vzA6TQ8 Aug 03 04:25:34 wooo Aug 03 04:25:39 woooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Aug 03 04:25:50 wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo Aug 03 04:26:09 140 points? Is that all? Aug 03 04:26:15 lol Aug 03 04:26:21 nothing to get so excited over :) Aug 03 04:26:38 i wasn't playing for very long Aug 03 04:26:43 you get ranks Aug 03 04:26:46 * haeffb just figured out why I don't get beeps on messages in xchat. Aug 03 04:26:47 and you have to rank up Aug 03 04:26:55 they get harder and harder and harder and harder Aug 03 04:27:01 * haeffb has no sound files Aug 03 04:27:05 lol Aug 03 04:27:13 when ur a 30 u need like 20k to rank up Aug 03 04:27:19 or something idk Aug 03 04:32:50 I'm off to bed Aug 03 04:32:52 night all Aug 03 04:34:43 had i known preware would be that easy to install i would have done it long ago Aug 03 04:34:46 kudos rwhitby Aug 03 04:35:02 scp on device solves _so_ many hassles Aug 03 04:43:13 gnite Aug 03 04:52:55 oh fun, download manager doesn't seem to get any of the browsers cookies when it tries to download something Aug 03 04:54:19 and mis handles non-standard complaint location headers (ie a relative instead of absolute url) Aug 03 04:57:32 https://developer.palm.com/distribution/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=16600 at least it's a known bug Aug 03 05:15:21 woot! since i can't handle downloaded files my app is feature complete \o/ Aug 03 05:25:15 whee Aug 03 07:10:43 morning Aug 03 07:10:59 morgning Aug 03 07:13:16 morning to you Euro devs :) Aug 03 12:49:31 weird... I'm using FreeTether on "The Pixi", and the communication stops (like everything gets stalled) whenever the screen goes off... after I turn it on all my pings come back to me :S Aug 03 12:55:19 great, first negative review in the catalog Aug 03 12:55:29 reason for negative review? app isnt free. Aug 03 12:55:46 LOL Aug 03 12:55:54 rwatkins: Awsome! Aug 03 12:56:10 make it free! Aug 03 12:56:39 the issue is that the app is free, but requires a subscription to an API thats not mine. Aug 03 12:57:37 so essentially "thanks for building a free app to someone elses paid platform, can you please make thier platform free too?" Aug 03 12:57:40 lusers. Aug 03 12:58:51 hehhee Aug 03 12:58:54 its funny Aug 03 12:58:55 sorry¨ Aug 03 12:59:24 ya, even spelled it out in the second line of the app desciption. but knew it was coming eventually. Aug 03 12:59:31 conclusion: people are stupid Aug 03 12:59:49 never bet against the stupidity of your users. Aug 03 13:30:44 good morning Aug 03 13:33:22 mornings fxspec06 Aug 03 13:34:52 what's up Aug 03 13:35:28 rwatkins got a aswome review on he's app Aug 03 13:35:34 *awsome Aug 03 13:35:43 orly? Aug 03 13:35:53 link Aug 03 13:35:54 ? Aug 03 13:36:09 [14:54:32s] great, first negative review in the catalog[14:54:42s] reason for negative review? app isnt free. Aug 03 13:36:18 oh lol Aug 03 13:36:31 http://t.co/vzA6TQ8 Aug 03 13:37:22 I want to see my app's reviews too :-( Aug 03 13:42:59 rwatkins: the subscription to the instapaper service is for the ability to get access to the API that allows reading out of instapaper? Aug 03 13:43:54 * summatusmentis ponders if letting a fat cat sit on the TP is a good idea Aug 03 13:45:50 summatusmentis: yes Aug 03 13:47:02 app is free, api requires subscription. second line of description of my apps is "Paper Mache requires a paid, $1/month subscription to the Instapaper service - does not work with a free Instapaper account." Aug 03 13:47:29 right, I considered the app at one point Aug 03 13:47:29 user downloads free app, writes first negative review, because the app requires ... a paid subscription. Aug 03 13:47:58 need to neg review kindle, because some of the books are not free. Aug 03 13:48:00 reviews are... weird Aug 03 13:48:24 summatusmentis: rwatkins: my favorite are the 0 star ratings that say "OMG THIS APP WONT DOWNLOAD" Aug 03 13:48:45 yep Aug 03 13:48:46 hate em Aug 03 13:48:54 ugh, users are dumb Aug 03 13:50:05 0 stars because i couldn't poop today Aug 03 13:50:19 "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein Aug 03 13:50:27 sawp Aug 03 13:50:57 what app got a negative review for not being free? Aug 03 13:51:07 paper mache Aug 03 13:51:08 Paper Mache - required paid subscription. $1/ month Aug 03 13:51:23 $1/mo paypal? Aug 03 13:51:33 or palm subscription Aug 03 13:51:35 yes. billed 3 mo at a time. Aug 03 13:51:39 paypal Aug 03 13:51:48 its not my api. api is written by iOS only dev. Aug 03 13:51:52 ahh Aug 03 13:51:57 what does it do? Aug 03 13:52:19 Instapaper for TouchPad - read saved web pages. Aug 03 13:52:24 ahh Aug 03 13:52:58 yeah, i wont pay for apps that require subscription either Aug 03 13:53:01 caches for offline, syncs in background, remembers reading position, text optimized view, etc. Aug 03 13:53:02 ever Aug 03 13:53:03 haha Aug 03 13:53:18 why not usage based billing? Aug 03 13:53:33 because I didnt write the API, and thus the billing rules? Aug 03 13:53:45 heh Aug 03 13:53:49 oh, the payments go to instapaper? Aug 03 13:53:59 not to you.. Aug 03 13:54:02 yes Aug 03 13:54:07 i get it now Aug 03 13:54:34 https://www.stephencovey.com/7habits/7habits-habit5.php Aug 03 13:54:45 hang on to your old vinyl records too - the entire world is moving to a subscription model for content. Aug 03 13:55:13 as a developer i feel like i can make the service myself Aug 03 13:55:13 soon robots will make everything Aug 03 13:55:13 lol Aug 03 13:55:21 matbee: you pay for cable tv? Aug 03 13:55:25 rwatkins, nosir Aug 03 13:55:34 I'm a pirate through and through Aug 03 13:55:37 there's a diff between "can" and "should" Aug 03 13:55:49 and also "not judging others' decisions" Aug 03 13:56:18 funkatron, I get it, imho it's more of a stubbornness that i won't pay Aug 03 13:56:37 Marco puts a bunch of effort into the server side, he should make a couple bucks off it. Aug 03 13:56:45 fair enough Aug 03 13:56:52 yeah, Marco seems like a good guy Aug 03 13:57:01 he's certainy not milking it Aug 03 13:57:28 right now i'm working on a webservice with nodejs, so I know how i'd feel if I didn't get paid for supplying the api to others Aug 03 13:57:35 ya. hes not exactly very responsive though. literally no communication back from him othe than the single tweet on launch day. Aug 03 14:00:21 heh, I supply some APIs to others for free. I think it's dependent on the person and the amount of time it takes to maintain it Aug 03 14:00:49 yeah? Aug 03 14:01:14 yeah, the spaz server-side APIs are totally open Aug 03 14:01:24 I'm going to make it with nowjs so I don't have to worry about updating functions on the client Aug 03 14:02:55 or I could override some prototype functions Aug 03 14:02:58 hmm Aug 03 14:03:37 oh yeah **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Aug 03 14:05:28 2011 Aug 03 14:06:00 more here: https://gist.github.com/891778 Aug 03 14:08:43 oh thats cool Aug 03 14:08:48 i like it Aug 03 14:08:56 all nodejs work? Aug 03 14:10:07 it's actually PHP using the FRAPI framework Aug 03 14:10:21 ahh Aug 03 14:10:59 but you could certainly write it with nodejs Aug 03 14:11:01 my /favorite/ framework is the MVC framework for ASP.NET Aug 03 14:11:08 it's hot Aug 03 14:11:08 I've heard good things about it Aug 03 14:11:30 makes for really quick and powerful webservices Aug 03 14:18:36 the webos deviceid isn't a guid is it? Aug 03 14:18:52 urgh Aug 03 14:21:25 fyi, i still have a few of the webOS developer decals (just found an envelope of em). would look nice on the back of the touchpad :P Aug 03 14:22:17 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v281/dawm/graphics/IMG_1409-1-1.jpg Aug 03 14:29:11 morning all Aug 03 14:30:19 hrm Aug 03 14:30:27 nexus S for free (contract extension) Aug 03 14:30:40 dawm: but its android?= Aug 03 14:30:43 id still rather have an evo 3D Aug 03 14:30:50 hotdp, and i have sprint Aug 03 14:30:55 * hotdp != Android Aug 03 14:30:57 I wish I could just buy a Nexus S off contract for less than $500 or so Aug 03 14:31:06 * Loudergood_ is not convinced by the 3d Aug 03 14:31:16 tired of sprint and hp's bullshit Aug 03 14:31:21 pre- owners got hosed Aug 03 14:31:41 Loudergood_: you will be once you use it Aug 03 14:32:11 nexus s is a very nice phone Aug 03 14:32:18 its free today only at bestbuy Aug 03 14:32:24 for contract extension/new customers Aug 03 14:32:47 I'm gonna wait and see if the iPhone5 goes to sprint Aug 03 14:33:10 as much as i hate droid, im starting to hate my slow pre- and im not gonna frankenpre unless ive got a backup phone Aug 03 14:33:26 probably my favorite form factor - I want the keyboardless "manta ray" to be a nexus S w/ a different OS. Aug 03 14:33:35 and ive been eligible for upgrade SINCE i got my pre- Aug 03 14:33:35 dawm: pre- sells for about $20 on ebay... Aug 03 14:33:50 PatrickC, this is free w/ free ship (or pickup at store) Aug 03 14:34:01 I'm talking about for a backup Aug 03 14:34:09 or are you getting the nexus as a backup? Aug 03 14:34:09 nexus s would be backup Aug 03 14:34:13 ah Aug 03 14:34:16 then id have a droid dev phone too Aug 03 14:34:17 I'm not sure why it's bullshit. It's what happens when you commit to a single company, I guess Aug 03 14:34:21 then go for it Aug 03 14:34:44 I need a droid dev phone and a iOS device Aug 03 14:35:51 today.. I take Eloquent.. no more dev'ing till I finish and understand Eloquent Aug 03 14:36:16 no keyboard tho.. hrm Aug 03 14:39:46 "Time Inc. says this will make it the first major U.S. magazine publisher to make its entire portfolio available on all leading tablet platforms ..." Aug 03 14:40:01 read it and ... they actually ment webOS too. crazy. Aug 03 14:40:11 wow Aug 03 14:40:58 lol Aug 03 14:41:17 although we knew that right? wasn't that part of the original announcement? Aug 03 14:41:59 likely but when an annoucemnts goes out about "all major platforms" that often doesnt mean webOS. Aug 03 14:42:27 like spotify cant even remember they wrote a webOS version. Aug 03 14:42:32 well, the touchpad is a different beast Aug 03 14:42:35 yes, that's true Aug 03 14:42:44 touchpad != pre Aug 03 14:43:20 the touchpad is f'n amazing on its own, unlike the playbook Aug 03 14:43:35 I wonder if the touchpad marketshare is any bigger than the pre/veers. i suspect not. Aug 03 14:43:48 i suspect it is, honestly Aug 03 14:43:52 the amount of ads i'm seeing Aug 03 14:44:30 I had a customer walk in today with a dying laptop, they asked me if they should get an ipad or "that hp tablet" Aug 03 14:44:41 I was stunned for a minute there Aug 03 14:44:44 haha Aug 03 14:44:52 it's actually getting grip Aug 03 14:45:00 my friends are looking at it like... so what's this webos? Aug 03 14:45:09 brand awareness sure, actual devices in market, my guess is still no. Aug 03 14:45:24 there was an article posted to twitter that I saw this morning that articulated why the "Touchpad is great for education" Aug 03 14:45:36 and one of the topics was "all devices can have one profile" Aug 03 14:45:48 I'm still waiting for the commercial where they show multiple people at their desks, and when they're done of something they just push it off the table Aug 03 14:45:53 like how we throw cards away Aug 03 14:45:54 which strikes me as exactly what enterprise wants, managed profiles, with multiple devices using it Aug 03 14:46:04 matbee: heh Aug 03 14:46:29 which then got me thinking about the unique position this puts HP in, compared to other devices Aug 03 14:47:07 eating breakfast at a restaurant --- done -- throw the plate off Aug 03 14:48:12 done of your test/homework, throw it off your desk in class Aug 03 14:48:17 lol Aug 03 14:48:21 it would amuse me Aug 03 14:48:26 the whole not needing to plug it in to a pc to set it up thing is nice too Aug 03 14:51:21 all tablets are still in sore of need of one thing before they are really useful Aug 03 14:51:21 Loudergood_: well right, it almost makes these devices multi-user. You could imagine a scheme where people in the field can check out a TP, login with their own profile, and already have everything they need Aug 03 14:51:36 and that thing is a sturdy, rubberized case that acts as a shock absorber Aug 03 14:51:42 or, all the tablets you check out come pre-loaded with a managed profile Aug 03 14:51:46 so i can treat it like i treat paper Aug 03 14:51:52 esser: I've seen something like that for the iPad Aug 03 14:52:00 I think Aug 03 14:52:22 summatusmentis: i would hesitate to rely on that unless the original system engineers had a had in it Aug 03 14:52:32 it's also about things like how the internal electronics are mounted, etc Aug 03 14:52:36 shock = bad, and all Aug 03 14:53:38 well, shock is significantly less of an issue given no HDD Aug 03 14:53:44 I'd be most worried about a screen Aug 03 14:54:41 iPad is also a little bit too large, i think Aug 03 14:56:13 not that i dont love mine, but it's love it more if it were 7 x 5 instead of 9.5 x 7.3 Aug 03 14:57:18 I generally feel that 7" is too small, but that's more about personal preference Aug 03 14:57:22 yeah, ssds are going to drive down laptop warranty repair a huge amount Aug 03 14:57:25 I want to be able to 10-finger type on mine Aug 03 14:57:49 i initially thought that that was going to be a big deal for me, too Aug 03 14:57:51 no, 10" does get kinda big in portrait mode and thumb-typing Aug 03 14:57:55 now* Aug 03 14:57:55 but as it turns out, i rarely type on my ipad Aug 03 14:58:01 i generally use it to view content, not generate it Aug 03 14:58:21 and it ends up frustrating me that i can't single-hand type on it Aug 03 14:58:44 I'm optimistic that I'll be able to use my TP mostly as a laptop replacement once some kinks get worked out with the xterm/ubuntu chroot stuff Aug 03 14:58:50 i will reserve further judgement until the side-aligned virtual keyboard on iOS 5 comes about Aug 03 14:59:04 which is an interesting approach Aug 03 14:59:11 the split vkb is supposed to be a nice way to work, I'm skeptical Aug 03 14:59:16 but allegedly it's really good Aug 03 15:00:07 just like a pre/2/veer Aug 03 15:00:46 what? Aug 03 15:02:09 one thumb on each side Aug 03 15:03:35 oh, yes Aug 03 15:04:46 or a blackberry.. Aug 03 15:05:06 or any hardware phone keyboard ever, for that matter Aug 03 15:05:09 yeah as much as blackberry needs to die a firey death, it's still the best email workflow under the sun Aug 03 15:05:13 actually, I'm an idiot...most phones period Aug 03 15:05:41 esser: what makes it so nice? I've never used on Aug 03 15:05:42 one* Aug 03 15:05:49 blackberry + hardware keyboard + rolling ball = packet of infinite win Aug 03 15:05:55 summatusmentis: it all just clicks into place Aug 03 15:05:58 i can't really describe it Aug 03 15:06:17 the pearl is nice for text selection Aug 03 15:06:19 so it's nothing about the software specifically, just the whole package Aug 03 15:06:27 summatusmentis: yeah. it all integrates really well Aug 03 15:06:32 and yes, the pearl is by far the best out of the bundle Aug 03 15:06:37 ah Aug 03 15:06:39 and the keyboard actually worked 100% of the time and was comfortable Aug 03 15:06:54 text selection on webOS 3.0 is unwieldy Aug 03 15:07:03 otherwise that phone was a pain in my butt to use Aug 03 15:07:54 and now rim is trying to save themselves with a phone with no pearl or hw keyboard.. Aug 03 15:07:55 my wet dream is something along the lines of an iphone or a fast android or webos platform, with a blackberry-style hardware keyboard and rollerball Aug 03 15:08:03 it would just vanquish anything under the sun Aug 03 15:08:16 in slider form Aug 03 15:09:07 bbl Aug 03 15:12:33 hey all... i know that media capture isnt supported in enyo as yet. is there any workaround for this? Aug 03 15:13:33 text selection on webos is hooorrriiibbbllleee Aug 03 15:13:46 ios has on-screen selection done right Aug 03 15:15:51 Loudergood_: i personally dont care about screen real estate so much, so i am fine with a bar Aug 03 15:15:54 but sure, slider, whatever Aug 03 15:15:57 as long as it's a sturdy slide Aug 03 15:16:28 keyboard is only annoying when there's full screen gaming going on Aug 03 15:16:48 matbee, but we had it first Aug 03 15:17:06 wha? Aug 03 15:17:14 webos had c&p before ios :P Aug 03 15:17:22 oh, who cares Aug 03 15:17:27 ios does it better Aug 03 15:17:32 the selection, that is Aug 03 15:17:36 if youre not first youre last Aug 03 15:17:53 and scrubbing through audio is superb on ios Aug 03 15:18:01 it's a hideous art on webos Aug 03 15:19:04 on a technicality, PalmOS has copy/paste Aug 03 15:19:17 as did the crappy dumbphone OSs on the RAZR Aug 03 15:19:36 s/has/had/ Aug 03 15:19:51 so that bestbuy deal isnt totally free Aug 03 15:19:59 $36 upgrade fee for them doing the work.. Aug 03 15:20:11 ill look on CL for a busted pre for less than that Aug 03 15:20:17 that's the Nexus S deal? Aug 03 15:20:30 its free today at bsetbuy for new customers/2yr upgrade customers Aug 03 15:20:36 right Aug 03 15:20:55 I briefly considered it Aug 03 15:21:20 I likes my pre though, and I want to be able to switch to a diff carrier if I can't hold out on the pre3 anymoer Aug 03 15:21:23 anymore* Aug 03 15:21:47 id rather keep my $40/m plan than jump ship for a phone Aug 03 15:22:07 i wonder how similar the pre3 will be to the pre2/pre Aug 03 15:22:15 would be rad if a radio board swap was all that was needed Aug 03 15:23:00 Hi, when build for webOS emulator what compiler should i use? Sourcery G++ Lite or Visual Studio compiler Aug 03 15:23:16 dawm: nope, they're completely incompatible Aug 03 15:23:18 neither Aug 03 15:23:27 pdk wont run on emulator (last i recall) Aug 03 15:24:02 dawm: any new phone I activate makes my $40/mo plan a $50/mo plan Aug 03 15:24:10 yeah i know Aug 03 15:24:40 at which point, I might as well go the 63/mo plan on AT&T w/ student discount Aug 03 15:25:04 destinal: ping Aug 03 15:25:05 PDK include libs for the emulator in "PDK\emulator\lib" aren't that for run in the emulator? Aug 03 15:26:29 summatusmentis: how much data do you use per month, roughly Aug 03 15:26:51 my peak usage has been 3.3GB Aug 03 15:26:54 oh yeah forgot to post the link Aug 03 15:26:59 but that's uncommon Aug 03 15:27:06 http://www.st1ck3rs.com/webos/ <- developer decals, only 20 left Aug 03 15:27:07 probably on average ~2 Aug 03 15:27:10 summatusmentis: ah ok, n/m then. different ballpark Aug 03 15:27:29 woot Aug 03 15:27:31 recently I've been using way less, because there's no EVDO where I live for the summer Aug 03 15:27:35 broke 6000 texts Aug 03 15:27:35 esser: why do you ask? Aug 03 15:28:01 summatusmentis: well. here's unlimited talk/text/mms + 250MB, on AT&T towers, for $50/mo https://www.h2owirelessnow.com/pageControl.php?page=plans Aug 03 15:28:31 what's the overage cost like? Aug 03 15:28:46 i have no idea, i think it just cuts you off Aug 03 15:28:57 i need unlim txt/data Aug 03 15:29:10 im at 6032 texts and i have 6 days left in the cycle Aug 03 15:29:33 lucky for me all my data usage is wifi Aug 03 15:29:34 unlim txt is really nice, that I agree with Aug 03 15:29:40 shockingly only 116mb usage Aug 03 15:29:45 but im wifi when at home Aug 03 15:29:59 I'm gonna be using way less txt thogh, since I won't be doing long-distance relationship stuff anymore Aug 03 15:30:03 yeah that's about how much I use per month Aug 03 15:30:05 i dont think a lot of people need unlimited data. i think most people just need a really good on/off button for wifi Aug 03 15:30:42 wifi doesn't seem to significantly affect my battery life Aug 03 15:30:55 quite frankly, I did a lot of streaming music when I hit my peak 3.3GB, but it's gonna end up being that I need data basically between my house and campus Aug 03 15:30:58 I think if affects mine Aug 03 15:31:07 or when I'm elsewhere, but I'll be a grad student Aug 03 15:31:11 there is no "going elsewhere" Aug 03 15:31:19 summatusmentis: hotspot for the touchpad :) Aug 03 15:31:30 yeah, I have wifi at home/work so I never really use data Aug 03 15:31:37 i plan on switching to that H2O plan soon, but I have a small problem Aug 03 15:31:47 hence the $30 a month pageplus for me Aug 03 15:31:55 bbl Aug 03 15:32:05 my austrian and swiss bank accounts both have my current cell # on file for sending TAC authorization codes Aug 03 15:32:10 and H2O wont let you port in Aug 03 15:32:14 being a prepaid provider and all Aug 03 15:32:24 so i need to actually fly to europe before i terminate my current contract Aug 03 15:32:26 as idiotic as that is Aug 03 15:32:31 esser, I ported my gf into page plus Aug 03 15:32:43 I thought it was mandatory that they allow it Aug 03 15:32:54 porting out is mandatory Aug 03 15:32:55 you have swiss bank accounts? Aug 03 15:32:55 porting in isn't Aug 03 15:32:57 6-10 yikes Aug 03 15:32:58 4-6 more like it Aug 03 15:33:04 what are you, some sort of mobster? Aug 03 15:33:12 MOBMOBMOB Aug 03 15:33:13 yes. i am with the mob. fear me. Aug 03 15:33:28 hah Aug 03 15:33:57 i have a swiss bank account, in francs, to make sure that my savings don't depreciate while the US and the EU try to sort out the mess they've made of their national debt Aug 03 15:34:05 i have an austrian bank account because i have a house there Aug 03 15:34:43 Looking at samples i see , PDK emulator builds use "i686-nptl-linux-gnu-gcc", but i don't see that compiler as part of Windows PDK, any ideas? Aug 03 15:34:48 "I also store all of my current savings on a private yacht I keep always fueled just inside of international waters" :-P Aug 03 15:35:04 I don't have that kind of money. Aug 03 15:35:51 I'm just giving you crap, having international bank accounts sounds so much more upper-class than it actually is Aug 03 15:36:06 * halfhalo-work hugs his OC'ed TP Aug 03 15:36:17 halfhalo-work: how fast? Aug 03 15:36:23 1.7 Aug 03 15:36:27 halfhalo-work: they let you OC work machines? or is that personal? Aug 03 15:36:51 lets go with... personal. Aug 03 15:36:59 hah Aug 03 15:37:11 I do win @ sunspider vs everyone else. Aug 03 15:37:50 HOW IS THAT POSSIBUL Aug 03 15:37:54 halfhalo-work: do the palm cmd line tools work in the chroot? like palm-package Aug 03 15:38:03 dunno Aug 03 15:38:19 but package is easy to make yourself. the rest are slightly harder. Aug 03 15:38:23 if they do, then ODD is done.. :) Aug 03 15:38:35 like palm-install? use preware :) Aug 03 15:39:03 PatrickC: I expect they don't, they're built for x86-based architecture Aug 03 15:39:16 unless they're just scripts Aug 03 15:39:17 and .deb Aug 03 15:39:21 summatusmentis: their java Aug 03 15:39:25 oh Aug 03 15:39:35 well, so, you'd need a java runtime at the very least Aug 03 15:39:43 PatrickC: being debian packages means _nothing_ in relation to arch Aug 03 15:39:46 must… resist… grammar… correction Aug 03 15:39:50 ah Aug 03 15:39:53 apt-get install openjdk6-jre ;) Aug 03 15:39:57 theirtheirtheir Aug 03 15:40:17 Loudergood_: openjdk broke the meta-doctor.. sun java all the way Aug 03 15:40:21 since I doubt there's sun java on that Aug 03 15:40:37 yeah, I'm 95% sure there's no sun java for arm Aug 03 15:40:47 halfhalo: when you were running ares, what java were you running? Aug 03 15:41:14 hell if I can remember Aug 03 15:41:46 PuffTheMagic should make a script and distribute it with Tide that does palm-generate and palm-package :) Aug 03 15:42:07 how about you make the script, and commit it to the Tide repo? Aug 03 15:42:13 yeah! Aug 03 15:42:21 because I don't know how (yet) Aug 03 15:42:34 well then Aug 03 15:42:35 learning experiene! Aug 03 15:42:38 DENIED Aug 03 15:42:43 experience* Aug 03 15:42:48 is tide FOSS? Aug 03 15:42:57 funkatron: yup Aug 03 15:43:03 there's a git repo for it, I think he said it was Aug 03 15:43:06 oh awesome, where's the repo? Aug 03 15:43:13 WOSI Aug 03 15:43:23 :stare: Aug 03 15:43:38 I think he's trying to keep in on the DL a bit, doesn't wanna be scooped Aug 03 15:43:51 CMON SON Aug 03 15:43:55 funkatron: where are all the webos-internals repos? Aug 03 15:44:06 gitorious, IIRC Aug 03 15:44:21 so.... Aug 03 15:44:47 I actually was not intimately familiar with what "WOSI" meant Aug 03 15:44:51 git.webos-internals.org doesn't show it Aug 03 15:44:52 oh, sorry Aug 03 15:45:01 webos internals :) Aug 03 15:45:05 I assumed that was accepted abbreviation Aug 03 15:45:19 could be, I just was not familiar with it Aug 03 15:45:30 I've seen it around enough, so I assumed you'd recognize it Aug 03 15:45:47 I'm not down with the kids' lingo today Aug 03 15:46:14 I wonder if he removed it from the git repo Aug 03 15:46:16 man we really need to get the damn pull to refresh in Spaz HD Aug 03 15:46:32 I'm like 90 sure he linked it yesterday Aug 03 15:46:36 once that's working we're pretty much good to go Aug 03 15:46:42 well I need to get a bite 8D Aug 03 15:46:44 it's under editah isn't it? Aug 03 15:46:46 bbiab Aug 03 15:47:59 oh yeah Aug 03 15:48:35 yeah, there it is Aug 03 15:48:42 I like to go there and list everything sorted by idle time Aug 03 15:48:49 interesting to see what's being worked on Aug 03 15:49:24 I really should work on building those packages for optware Aug 03 15:49:41 * summatusmentis wants OpenAFS access on webOS Aug 03 15:50:01 woooooo 1.782GHz of goodness! Aug 03 15:51:46 halfhalo-work: is the OC noticable at all? Aug 03 15:51:53 it is in sunspider Aug 03 15:52:05 that's some JS engine? Aug 03 15:52:24 webkit js benchmark Aug 03 15:53:11 ah Aug 03 15:54:15 Tide is definitely in our git repos Aug 03 15:54:32 just not called that Aug 03 15:54:43 1.2GHz sunspider is ~4200ms, 1.5GHz is ~3200, 1.7 is ~2800 Aug 03 15:54:48 PuffTheMagic: on the git.webos-internals.org ? Aug 03 15:56:39 ya Aug 03 15:56:39 its just under its old dame Aug 03 15:56:51 cause im not 100% set on a name and i didnt want to keep renaming it Aug 03 15:56:52 why you stalking my git? Aug 03 15:57:00 funkatron was curious Aug 03 15:58:05 * PatrickC clones the git repo and try to run it on his pre2 Aug 03 15:59:43 trying to work out some keyboard issues Aug 03 16:00:09 tab seems to not be working any more and i swore it did in the past Aug 03 16:01:34 nice icon :) Aug 03 16:03:37 it almost runs on the pre Aug 03 16:05:38 the nice thing is, it actually scales properly.. good job PuffTheMagic :) Aug 03 16:08:20 what'd u do puffy Aug 03 16:08:43 jus curious =) Aug 03 16:08:47 TIDE (TouchPad IDE) Aug 03 16:09:00 full text editor for the touchpad :) Aug 03 16:09:30 o i c Aug 03 16:09:47 it looks amazing, can't wait to use it on my touchpad :D Aug 03 16:11:32 I was curious Aug 03 16:12:01 funkatron: its already running here, you got it working? Aug 03 16:12:09 I haven't downloaded it Aug 03 16:12:14 ah Aug 03 16:12:34 I use git on my pre, so I cloned, moved to /media/cryptofs and did a luna-scan Aug 03 16:12:44 and it works Aug 03 16:12:48 amazing Aug 03 16:12:56 yep.. Aug 03 16:13:04 happy its open source, had to fix a bug. Aug 03 16:13:29 *on my side only Aug 03 16:48:41 hmm weird Aug 03 16:48:52 before, indent worked in TIde and outdent didnt Aug 03 16:48:57 now outdent works and indent does not :/ Aug 03 17:21:02 Adora or chuqui: Email I got from a user today: "Two weeks now and HP haven't approved TapNote for older devices (I keep checking daily)." Based on what you've said, it sounds like things are tied up in cross-departmental bureaucracy, but I wanted to check in and see if there's been any forward movement for another batch of fat app approvals Aug 03 17:21:33 loving the lingo Aug 03 17:21:38 "batch of fat app approvals" Aug 03 17:22:03 Heh, yeah; "fat apps" is an unfortunate term Aug 03 17:22:17 phat! Aug 03 17:22:20 But so sayeth the HP employees, so who am I to quibble ;-) Aug 03 17:22:54 apple could learn a thing or two Aug 03 17:23:02 one could rename it the "phat warez shop" Aug 03 17:23:08 ianbeck: was in a meeting where this came up yesterday. they still take manual intervention by engineering to make this stuff work. Adora was talking to them about making sure they go out. Aug 03 17:23:17 and it could merchandise the "latest gangstaliciouz tools for u foolz" Aug 03 17:23:37 chuqui: Thanks for the update! Aug 03 17:24:03 chuqui: I would REALLY appreciate it if you guys would pro-actively schedule more fat app approval dates for the upcoming Pre3, too Aug 03 17:24:47 chuqui: I'm definitely going to be pushing an update with some 1.5-optimized images, and I'd prefer not to miss the Pre3 release date because I got stuck in limbo waiting on engineering Aug 03 17:24:52 they're not fat; they're dimensionally challenged Aug 03 17:25:07 we actually prefer "multi-app", but... Aug 03 17:25:11 * PatrickC wonders where the documentation for fat-packing is :) Aug 03 17:25:27 PatrickC: https://developer.palm.com/distribution/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=15669 Aug 03 17:26:07 Yeah, I picked up the "fat app" terminology from the forums Aug 03 17:26:24 I called it "Creative Packaging" in my presentation Aug 03 17:26:26 how PC Aug 03 17:26:33 For some reason most of the HP folks I was corresponding with were using that term instead of "multi-app" or "universal app" (which was my original inclination, coming from iOS usage) Aug 03 17:26:43 chuqui is Da bomb Aug 03 17:27:02 so, can we call "fat apps" collectively, fatsos? Aug 03 17:27:05 ianbeck: yeah. because it's amusing. Aug 03 17:27:23 it's really pretty simple, make the index.html check which version of the OS you have and then load the appropriate app start .html Aug 03 17:27:24 chuqui: :-) Aug 03 17:27:46 this app has eaten too many cheeseburgers? Aug 03 17:28:16 Enyobesity Aug 03 17:28:18 i would glady pay you in the app store tomorrow, for a cheeseburger app today Aug 03 17:30:28 now I'm hungry :-| Aug 03 17:30:46 its not fat, its just big boned Aug 03 17:31:42 bbw === big boned webos? Aug 03 17:31:57 lol Aug 03 17:32:02 ok we're taking it a bit far i think Aug 03 17:32:10 no such thing Aug 03 17:32:22 chuqui: is the multi-app .zip really only 19K? Aug 03 17:32:37 the answer is yes Aug 03 17:32:47 ah Aug 03 17:33:02 webos doesn't like the .zip.. throws flags when trying to unzip it Aug 03 17:33:42 wasn't there some talk of the catalog triggering the "for touchpad" from the uirevision: 2 in appinfo? Aug 03 17:33:54 yep Aug 03 17:33:57 I believe so Aug 03 17:37:51 PatrickC: if you can't get it unzipped, pm me your email Aug 03 17:38:17 PM'd Aug 03 17:39:20 you've got mail Aug 03 17:39:36 or does he.... Aug 03 17:40:19 thx Aug 03 17:40:22 I'll try that one Aug 03 17:44:47 lol Aug 03 17:44:51 love the icon Aug 03 17:46:26 i have Enyo on my pre, and it shows mojo. so it gets the device info.. Aug 03 17:46:34 yes Aug 03 17:46:39 look at index.html Aug 03 17:46:55 ok Aug 03 17:46:55 it is checking for platform major revision Aug 03 17:47:08 so, you could change that logic to look for enyo instead Aug 03 17:47:24 but, since no phones have Enyo on them yet, it works as designed Aug 03 17:47:38 yep Aug 03 17:48:19 I will definitely be using this. thanks sugardave Aug 03 17:48:56 thank singmajesty next time you see him Aug 03 17:49:09 he hasn't been on in forever Aug 03 18:00:49 PatrickC: you needed to make a patch to get tide working on your phone? Aug 03 18:05:48 on my phone, yes Aug 03 18:05:53 my enyo dir is 0.10 Aug 03 18:06:01 your link was to 1.0 Aug 03 18:06:25 there are also some odd logs. I can show you Aug 03 18:08:41 you could just make a link from 0.10 to 1.0 Aug 03 18:09:02 or rename it Aug 03 18:09:52 I did Aug 03 18:10:03 I changed it from 1.0 to 0.10 Aug 03 18:10:17 it now launches fine. but it has some weird errors Aug 03 18:13:15 PuffTheMagic: http://pastebin.com/MaYppr27 Aug 03 18:29:35 PuffTheMagic: ping? Aug 03 18:33:57 PatrickC: ya im not sure if im supposed to be using 1.0 or 0.10 Aug 03 18:34:13 1.0 is official Aug 03 18:34:19 PatrickC: did you run 'make prepare' ? Aug 03 18:34:23 nope Aug 03 18:34:27 ran nothing Aug 03 18:34:39 lemme do that Aug 03 18:34:54 from the root app dir? Aug 03 18:36:35 error when running make prepare Aug 03 18:38:10 PuffTheMagic: error: can't cd into support/pilot Aug 03 19:01:19 I need someone with a TouchPad and a phone Aug 03 19:16:01 fxspec06: help Aug 03 19:23:02 PatrickC: sounds like you have an old setup... do this... Aug 03 19:23:14 rm -rf *; git reset --hard; git checkout -f Aug 03 19:23:16 then make prepare Aug 03 19:27:27 Hello everybody, a question about upgrading a pre minus GSM qwertz to 2.1.0 Aug 03 19:30:25 PuffTheMagic: where do I run that cmd? Aug 03 19:30:37 DBY: #webos-internals is better for that Aug 03 19:31:35 OK thanks, heading to #webos-internals! Aug 03 19:32:50 np Aug 03 19:33:44 * PatrickC cries Aug 03 19:33:53 'fat-apping' broke my app :/ Aug 03 19:35:16 ho hum Aug 03 19:35:26 chuqui broke my app Aug 03 19:35:45 yup. Aug 03 19:35:48 i suck Aug 03 19:36:23 'fat-app' broke it Aug 03 19:37:10 PatrickC: in your git repo Aug 03 19:37:57 the place where I cloned tide to? Aug 03 19:42:46 PatrickC: fat-apping broke it, or you broke trying to fat-app it? Aug 03 19:44:54 Tibfib: it broke after I fat-apped Aug 03 19:45:05 villo no longer works Aug 03 19:45:09 so you broke it Aug 03 19:45:10 but the rest of the app does Aug 03 19:46:45 So I created a WebOS subreddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/webos/ ... Aug 03 19:47:44 +frontpage :) Aug 03 19:53:43 Example: http://www.reddit.com/r/webos/comments/j81tb/overclocking_the_hp_touchpad_cranks_up_the_speed/ Aug 03 19:56:15 Anyone with good CSS skills want to help me moderate the subreddit? Aug 03 19:57:59 jacopino: ill do it Aug 03 20:00:20 Ideally the subreddit can look something like http://www.reddit.com/r/Android/ Aug 03 20:00:41 cwayne: looks good so far Aug 03 20:00:54 * jacoplane == jacopino Aug 03 20:05:00 Any channel operators around? Aug 03 20:05:53 we don't have any designated channel ops here Aug 03 20:06:03 we have people who take op if needed Aug 03 20:06:32 dieter's got a nice beard going Aug 03 20:06:34 http://1876.voxcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/timn-skype-ipad-61.jpg Aug 03 20:07:36 * oil usually pings dkirker when he needs an op, but he isnt here Aug 03 20:07:42 OK, I was wondering if the channel would be willing to add http://webos.reddit.com to the topic... If the IRC community jumps on it it could perhaps become a useful resource. Aug 03 20:08:06 rwhitby is also an op Aug 03 20:08:17 but he only ops up when he needs to kick people and so forth Aug 03 20:11:02 I just received mod status on the subreddit today: http://www.reddit.com/r/redditrequest/comments/j7lg9/rwebos_currently_says_forbidden_redditcom_could_i/ Aug 03 20:11:36 If there are any IRC regulars here who are also reddit users I can make them mods there as well. Aug 03 20:13:07 * oil only lurks Aug 03 20:14:18 luuuuurk Aug 03 20:17:15 halfhalo-work: hows palm? Aug 03 20:17:21 coo Aug 03 20:18:27 patching an old cms to work with mobile is hell Aug 03 20:18:45 * oil was hoping for a more in-depth answer haha Aug 03 20:18:58 :p Aug 03 20:19:12 Put it this way... if anyone will help me moderate the subreddit I'll bring an article of that person's choosing on Wikipedia to "Good article" status... Aug 03 20:20:20 Me on wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Jacoplane Aug 03 20:20:45 jacoplane: I can try to help Aug 03 20:21:12 someone here who have used https://www.odesk.com ? Aug 03 20:24:21 DANG YOU'RE A BIG WIKIPEDIA CAHUNA (sp?) Aug 03 20:24:40 i think it's kahuna Aug 03 20:24:41 can you write an article about me? Aug 03 20:24:57 feel free to embellish. Aug 03 20:25:04 Tibfib (looks like kevin from the office) Aug 03 20:25:18 jacoplane: i would volunteer, but i'm already way too busy as it is Aug 03 20:25:29 and i dont want to do a shit job of it Aug 03 20:26:09 its ok haha Aug 03 20:28:28 * Tibfib is waiting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tibfib Aug 03 20:29:13 * oil would put something like "there has been unconfirmed reports that tibfib smells like german cheese" Aug 03 20:29:27 hahaha Aug 03 20:29:33 what's wrong with german cheese? Aug 03 20:29:37 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil Aug 03 20:29:37 heh Aug 03 20:29:47 haha Aug 03 20:30:28 http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PatrickC :/ Aug 03 20:31:26 i really hate that this bastard stole all my thunder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esser Aug 03 20:32:15 what a jerk Aug 03 20:32:30 heh Aug 03 20:33:31 i know Aug 03 20:33:32 wanker. Aug 03 20:34:07 just gotta start your own wikipedia Aug 03 20:34:30 tibfibipedia Aug 03 20:34:34 wiki.esser.com Aug 03 20:34:59 wiki.therealesser.com Aug 03 20:34:59 webOS needs a good reddit app Aug 03 20:35:10 make it Aug 03 20:35:10 wikipedia needs a tibfib page. Aug 03 20:35:15 make it Aug 03 20:35:16 www.marcelesser.com Aug 03 20:35:16 see even twbbas agrees Aug 03 20:35:26 i basically fought a dutch bicyclist by the same name to the death for that Aug 03 20:35:39 we had satellite battles going on at at least 4 different registrars Aug 03 20:35:42 so, i take it he is dead? Aug 03 20:35:48 no, i spared him. Aug 03 20:35:57 PatrickC: http://i.reddit.com/ Aug 03 20:36:02 your website kind of sucks though Aug 03 20:36:03 so that he could tell his grandchildren what a pathetic wanker he was compared to me. Aug 03 20:36:04 just says "hi" Aug 03 20:36:18 yeah, kind of a disappointing website considering you fought to the death for that Aug 03 20:36:19 oil: well what more did you expect, really? Aug 03 20:36:30 you think i'm the sort of douche that writes a blog about how important he is? Aug 03 20:36:31 lots of flash Aug 03 20:36:31 iamareddit isn't bad Aug 03 20:36:34 nobody wants to hear what i have to say anyway Aug 03 20:36:57 blah blah software blah blah development blah blah unit tests. Aug 03 20:36:57 http://forums.precentral.net/webos-homebrew-apps/227975-preddit.html Aug 03 20:37:01 that's much like my website actually Aug 03 20:37:03 there, there's the sum of my knowledge Aug 03 20:37:46 well that and the occasional conference talk Aug 03 20:38:00 but nobody ever goes to those, and i end up talking to like 7 guys about chihuahas (sp) Aug 03 20:38:00 esser: you fought a dutch bicyclist and lived to tell the tale??? Aug 03 20:38:08 jacoplane: i'm a german engineer. Aug 03 20:38:50 i like the ajax-loading spinner on i.reddit.com Aug 03 20:38:52 it made me lol Aug 03 20:39:02 (scroll down) Aug 03 20:39:13 this layout is way better than www.red Aug 03 20:39:31 poor truck driver Aug 03 20:40:00 esser: Yeah, because Dutch bicyclists certainly have mercy on German engineers. Aug 03 20:40:19 Their least favourite roadkill Aug 03 20:40:34 someones gotta make the roads they ride on Aug 03 20:41:29 does the touchpad browser do webgl? Aug 03 20:43:11 DraX: i've never seen it mentioned Aug 03 20:43:16 but, i could be wrong Aug 03 20:44:36 it does not Aug 03 20:51:21 * haeffb needs some content to put on my website Aug 03 20:51:23 PuffTheMagic: ping Aug 03 20:52:53 http://webos.reddit.com <---- did some redesigning, anyone have any constructive criticism? BTW, is there anyone around who can edit the topic? Aug 03 21:03:54 anyone have a quick fixc for hp play stuck on mounting device Aug 03 21:04:00 * cwayne wants to be a /r/webos mod :/ Aug 03 21:04:10 i'm about to leavea and i wanna sync a playlsit.e.v..... Aug 03 21:04:16 and was that a mario sound i just heard? Aug 03 21:04:18 or pacman Aug 03 21:07:21 both Aug 03 21:09:15 hp play is stuck. Aug 03 21:09:19 fffffffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu Aug 03 21:12:36 ruh roh Aug 03 21:12:58 i think i managed to get it to sync Aug 03 21:13:08 kinda sorta maybe sorta kinda Aug 03 21:15:05 WOO got to work, somehow Aug 03 21:15:47 * fxspec06 shoves PatrickC into the wall Aug 03 21:15:57 FRESHMANNNNNNNNNNNNNNN Aug 03 21:16:04 PuffTheMagic: sorry. lost connection. still can't cd into support/pilot Aug 03 21:16:54 fxspec06: sophomore !! tyvm Aug 03 21:17:04 liar! Aug 03 21:17:24 look up 10th grade! you'll see! you'll all see! Aug 03 21:17:28 freshmen STINK Aug 03 21:17:34 yes they do! Aug 03 21:17:46 sophomore's don't! :) Aug 03 21:17:47 PatrickC is in highschool? Aug 03 21:17:58 yes.. surprisingly Aug 03 21:18:05 PatrickC hasn't taken trigonometry or physics yet Aug 03 21:18:10 oh, I thought Patrick was 25 Aug 03 21:18:11 nope Aug 03 21:18:17 Tibfib: hahahahaha Aug 03 21:19:03 fxspec06 broke my app... Aug 03 21:19:18 fxspec06 has his game workn on tp Aug 03 21:19:25 and bunch of other devices Aug 03 21:19:38 but he dont wanna submit coz itll break his submission RE: HP GET ON IT Aug 03 21:19:41 I tried to fat-app, and villo broke Aug 03 21:19:52 tell chuqui and Adora Aug 03 21:20:00 NO. YOU broke Villo, trying to fat-app Aug 03 21:20:14 Villo didn't *magically* break Aug 03 21:20:14 Tibfib: but HOW? Aug 03 21:20:19 yes it did Aug 03 21:20:23 villo is magical Aug 03 21:20:29 * Tibfib facepalms Aug 03 21:20:39 PatrickC Aug 03 21:20:40 you Aug 03 21:20:42 did it Aug 03 21:20:46 whatever it was Aug 03 21:20:50 it's not HP's fault Aug 03 21:20:54 it's not Villo's fault Aug 03 21:20:56 it's your fault Aug 03 21:21:03 its villo fault for being magical Aug 03 21:21:13 it throws no errors though.. Aug 03 21:21:15 * fxspec06 double facepalms Aug 03 21:21:22 it doesn't matter! Aug 03 21:21:25 it's still your fault Aug 03 21:21:27 PatrickC: sometimes things don't throw errors Aug 03 21:21:38 what's the cheapest a touchpad app can be? 99c? Aug 03 21:21:41 Tibfib: how do you fix said things then? Aug 03 21:21:46 99c yes akanster Aug 03 21:21:46 akanster: I believe so Aug 03 21:21:54 thanks Aug 03 21:22:01 my bud tried to set to .50 yesterday and wouldnt let him Aug 03 21:22:04 PatrickC: ... well first you need to have a basic understanding of javascript Aug 03 21:22:17 Tibfib: no coding was changed Aug 03 21:22:21 then you need to follow the different steps of the app and see exactly where things go wrong Aug 03 21:22:22 I banged out an exhibition mode app in a few hours :) Aug 03 21:22:26 bout to submit Aug 03 21:22:30 it was all straight copy from a *working app* Aug 03 21:22:54 PatrickC: doesn't matter! the code is wrong it is wrong Aug 03 21:23:05 * Tibfib slaps PatrickC around a bit with a large trout Aug 03 21:23:13 how can it be wrong if it wasn't changed? Aug 03 21:23:17 learn to code, learn to debug, learn to blame yourself Aug 03 21:23:18 that's where I'm lost Aug 03 21:23:23 easily Aug 03 21:23:24 because it was wrong BEFORE it was changed Aug 03 21:23:32 or you changed something Aug 03 21:23:32 I'm guessing villo doesn't get loaded properly once you fat-app Aug 03 21:23:36 fxspec06: it worked *BEFORE* it was changed Aug 03 21:23:44 yeah and you changed it and it doesn't work Aug 03 21:23:44 PatrickC: that DOES NOT matter Aug 03 21:23:44 Tibfib: that could be true Aug 03 21:23:49 WHAT MATTERS IS NOW Aug 03 21:23:51 which is why I sent it to villo Aug 03 21:23:59 it's not villo's fault Aug 03 21:24:00 ....................................... Aug 03 21:24:06 * Tibfib leaves Aug 03 21:24:09 my app broke when i did things to it Aug 03 21:24:12 it could be villo doesn't work in a fat-app Aug 03 21:24:21 no it works PatrickC Aug 03 21:24:30 fxspec06: you have proof? Aug 03 21:24:31 stop blaming other people when you don't understand it Aug 03 21:24:44 i have proof that it works in uirevision 2 Aug 03 21:24:52 but i don't need to give it to you Aug 03 21:24:54 that's not fat-app Aug 03 21:25:03 that is far from fat-app Aug 03 21:25:09 it's not villo problem patrick Aug 03 21:25:12 villo is a service Aug 03 21:25:15 the problem Aug 03 21:25:20 is somewhere in YOUR code Aug 03 21:25:33 villo.js is villo.js Aug 03 21:25:39 everything else is your code Aug 03 21:25:39 how do I find out where????? Aug 03 21:25:43 DEBUG IT Aug 03 21:25:48 how? Aug 03 21:25:49 learn how to code Aug 03 21:25:52 no errors! Aug 03 21:25:54 * Tibfib_ decides on better solution Aug 03 21:25:56 learn how to code PatrickC Aug 03 21:25:57 * Tibfib_ ignores PatrickC Aug 03 21:26:08 There. Aug 03 21:26:13 fxspec06: I've stopped development to take Eloquent Aug 03 21:26:19 so take it Aug 03 21:26:23 I am Aug 03 21:26:28 but don't bother jake and noah and jordan with questions Aug 03 21:26:33 but now fxspec06 is talking to himself. :/ Aug 03 21:26:33 they don't appreciate it Aug 03 21:26:39 but I threw the app into a fat-app state Aug 03 21:26:56 fat-app skinny-app puking-app it doesn't matter Aug 03 21:27:03 villo.js is villo.js anywhere you put it Aug 03 21:27:06 jake's a nice guy. noah too. Haven't seen jordan from a while Aug 03 21:27:15 s/from/for/ Aug 03 21:27:35 how did Tibfib change colors without changing his nick? Aug 03 21:27:57 i'm not trying to be mean Aug 03 21:28:03 I know Aug 03 21:28:12 I'm not trying to be a jerk either Aug 03 21:28:26 but how do you debug something without errors? Aug 03 21:28:28 but you can't keep bothering everyone with questions like that. someone's gonna get pissed eventually Aug 03 21:28:38 it's part of a learning process Aug 03 21:28:43 there's many ways Aug 03 21:28:51 comment stuff out until it works Aug 03 21:28:53 and the weird thing is, the app just acts like its logging in. there is no in-app error like before Aug 03 21:28:54 get rid of things Aug 03 21:28:58 * oil thinks Tibfib wants to help Aug 03 21:28:59 until it works Aug 03 21:29:11 narrow it down Aug 03 21:29:14 process of elimination Aug 03 21:29:16 oil: I have /ignored PatrickC. It's bliss. Aug 03 21:29:16 or just go back to a non-fat-app.. Aug 03 21:29:16 trial and error Aug 03 21:29:26 awwww Aug 03 21:29:26 it's not a fat app problem Aug 03 21:29:29 it's a fat head problem Aug 03 21:29:33 hahaahahahah Aug 03 21:29:34 ohh Aug 03 21:29:37 well, till I know more js it is Aug 03 21:29:54 its a fat-app problem till I know how to fix it Aug 03 21:31:15 * PatrickC goes to learn JS with Elowuent Aug 03 21:31:19 Eloquent* Aug 03 21:31:21 cya all Aug 03 21:35:18 someone tell Tibfib that the app q&a is done. Aug 03 21:38:13 bye ppl im ou Aug 03 21:38:15 out* Aug 03 21:39:11 hey NuttyBunny Aug 03 21:52:01 does anyone know the status of https://developer.palm.com/distribution/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=16675 Aug 03 21:52:12 ? Aug 03 21:52:57 chuqui would probably know Aug 03 21:53:46 the status? if you want touch events, don't use a webview or the browser, wrap your html in an .ipk and it will work Aug 03 21:54:23 yup Aug 03 21:54:48 is there any plan to make it actually work in the browser/ Aug 03 21:54:53 touch events in the browser, on the roadmap somewhere. he says, vaguely and without time commitments. Aug 03 21:55:03 the thread seems to imply there is Aug 03 21:55:04 ok Aug 03 21:55:38 you <==> touch events <==> cold death of the universe Aug 03 21:55:53 well maps.google.com/?ui=maps_mini almost entirely works aside from double-tap or pinch zoom Aug 03 21:55:55 haha Aug 03 21:56:25 iframes seem to work, too Aug 03 21:56:35 thank god Aug 03 21:57:02 * Tibfib puts iframes in all his apps Aug 03 21:57:11 there's at least one web page we're loading that has iscroll in it and working Aug 03 21:57:18 so, that's a plus Aug 03 21:58:01 so touch events inside an iframe inside a normal enyo app work? Aug 03 21:58:20 from what I'm seeing, yes Aug 03 21:58:49 i'll see how mapsmini handles that later on Aug 03 22:01:11 is "My Apps" loading for anyone else? Aug 03 22:06:06 Anyone? Aug 03 22:06:20 lemme see Aug 03 22:06:50 "failed" Aug 03 22:07:31 thanks. thought I was going nuts here Aug 03 22:10:44 maybe its being fixed Aug 03 22:18:05 that's cool Aug 03 22:18:27