**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Sep 30 02:59:57 2011 Sep 30 03:00:08 http://documentcloud.github.com/underscore/#zip Sep 30 03:18:34 seretogis: what about the FeedReader tut? Sep 30 03:32:41 akanster: it seems that the webView portion of it is busted on the Pre 3 but works fine on a TouchPad. Sep 30 03:33:15 https://developer.palm.com/content/api/dev-guide/enyo/tutorial/tutorial5.html -- that bit, the viewed feed url doesn't render properly on a Pre 3 but works fine on a TouchPad Sep 30 03:37:03 hmm Sep 30 03:37:33 well the emulator image at least Sep 30 03:39:04 webkit in enyo on 2.2 is hosed Sep 30 03:40:02 https://developer.palm.com/distribution/viewtopic.php?f=109&t=18455 Sep 30 03:46:56 I am so glad that I kept everything in Mojo. Sep 30 03:48:45 that's kind of depressing. Sep 30 03:49:30 well i assume the plan was that enyo wouldnt really be supported fully till it was in a 3.x OS. Sep 30 03:49:34 but that plan kinda blew up. Sep 30 03:50:20 now I wonder if I should even bother developing for webos :P Sep 30 03:51:20 depends on your market. I doubt there will be a huge number of 2.2 devices out there. Sep 30 03:52:03 I guess I could do only tablet stuff Sep 30 03:52:08 I'm doing Enyo for 2.2 because I personally have a Pre3 and really dont wanna go program in Mojo Sep 30 03:52:24 there are at least around a mil tablets out there :P Sep 30 03:52:35 yeah same here rwatkins Sep 30 03:53:02 I'd want to do mojo, just because the stuff I want to do I want to work on my phone :( Sep 30 03:53:23 dwc-, buy my pre3? ;p Sep 30 03:53:58 what kind, how much? Sep 30 03:54:10 ya, I considered writing both mojo and enyo depending on teh release timeframe, but after writing Enyo, just dont really wanna go back. Sep 30 03:54:14 UK unlocked, about 300ish Sep 30 03:54:43 unlikely to pass... looks like I can find an AT&T one locally unlocked for under 250 Sep 30 03:55:11 Does anyone have the instructions or the link on how to use free tether to get the touchpad to pair with another phone Sep 30 03:55:24 turn on freetether Sep 30 03:55:28 turn wifi on Sep 30 03:55:40 connect to that ssid on the touchpad Sep 30 03:55:45 Sorry Sep 30 03:55:47 over bt Sep 30 03:56:11 PatrickC_Away had told me that you could pair it this way Sep 30 03:56:16 to get calls etc Sep 30 03:57:09 dwc-: yeah, unlocked AT&T Pre 3 for $250 is a good price Sep 30 03:57:54 rwhitby: just out of curiousity, bugginess of the pre3/2.2.3 compared to the others... better/worse/about the same? Sep 30 03:58:32 I had to fix 3 major bugs to meet my useability for a daily phone. Sep 30 03:58:47 rwhitby: which bugs are those? Sep 30 03:59:43 TMC cards error, google maps protocol handler errors, and inability to dial 1300... and 1800... numbers with Australian regional settings in place Sep 30 04:00:16 so the TMC is the same as before, but just exacerbated by the lower free memory by default? Sep 30 04:00:26 yep Sep 30 04:01:02 and the .au bug, well, that's just americans giving you the shaft again, so nothing I need to worry about... Sep 30 04:01:08 i would agree that $250 is a nice price point Sep 30 04:02:16 but i haven't even used a pre 3 =| Sep 30 04:03:01 they are pretty nice Sep 30 04:03:24 * halfhalo wants one Sep 30 04:03:42 * NuttyBunny is still waiting for his expensive one Sep 30 04:03:44 you mean to tell me you don't have one already? Sep 30 04:03:47 * rwhitby is not giving up any of his Sep 30 04:03:50 gmaps... is that in the browser? Sep 30 04:03:54 dwc-: yeah Sep 30 04:04:11 browse to maps.google.com and you get error dialog boxes. I wrote a patch to fix that. Sep 30 04:04:12 the maps app on the pre3 is bing, right? Sep 30 04:04:20 I'm still trying to get rid of my unlocked UK one that I paid $500 for two weeks ago ;p Sep 30 04:04:28 dwc-: yep, and is pretty useless as a result Sep 30 04:04:53 ^ Sep 30 04:04:54 maybe i will get lucky and a flying unicorn will come through my window at sunrise with a pre 3 tied to a string on one of it's hooves Sep 30 04:13:37 fxspec06: I'm hoping dkirker and adora bring a couple boxfulls and hand them out like party favor candy at the next webos meetup, but I think you've got a better shot Sep 30 04:15:12 i'd just like a battery Sep 30 04:15:19 i'd go to the meetup for an extra pre3 battery :p Sep 30 04:15:55 no batteries for it showing up on ebay yet? Sep 30 04:17:04 I'd go to the meetup for the price of airfare and accommodation ;) Sep 30 04:17:24 we need a Seattle area webOS meetup :P Sep 30 04:17:47 hmm Sep 30 04:18:11 brisbane plz Sep 30 04:18:30 LA ftw Sep 30 04:18:52 why is LA ftw Sep 30 04:19:23 I've never been to LA but I've been told that I don't want to go Sep 30 04:19:26 San Fran was nice enough Sep 30 04:19:34 lol Sep 30 04:19:52 lived in all three - LA, SF and Seattle. Sep 30 04:19:56 yeah airfare and accomodation Sep 30 04:20:15 I half-live in Vancouver BC and it is fantastically fantastical Sep 30 04:20:22 no brisbane tho Sep 30 04:20:29 I lived in the east bay Sep 30 04:20:35 i'm too young and poor though =( i can't wait til i'm 30 and only marginally better off than i am right now Sep 30 04:20:41 someone else lives in vancouver... keeps talking about their commute Sep 30 04:20:45 I'm not big on Australia's gov't Sep 30 04:20:48 eighthree Sep 30 04:20:50 he's my bf ;D Sep 30 04:20:55 he's why I half-live there Sep 30 04:21:20 ahh Sep 30 04:21:41 [09:14 PM] no batteries for it showing up on ebay yet? << hmm, i should look Sep 30 04:22:01 Xuzz: I'll sell you a battery for $300 ;p Sep 30 04:22:08 Xuzz: and it comes with a phone Sep 30 04:22:10 lol Sep 30 04:23:41 rwhitby: what's the limiting factor for the pre3 on sprint's network? was it something about the radio firmware? Sep 30 04:24:00 (the fact that sprint doesn't have anything webos-related with that hardware) Sep 30 04:24:25 HattCzech: it's a GSM phone, Sprint is a CDMA network Sep 30 04:24:33 the radio is physically wrong to talk to the network Sep 30 04:24:45 Xuzz: there's a verizon pre3 with gsm/cdma Sep 30 04:25:05 "world" phone Sep 30 04:25:24 HattCzech: I know nothing of US CDMA network provisioning hurdles. Sep 30 04:25:48 HattCzech: I assume you have to convince someone at Sprint to add the MEID to their database before the phone will be recognised by the network. Sep 30 04:26:26 HattCzech: maybe, but I do not believe phones can simply be transfered from Verizon to Sprint, even if you did get one of the very, very few Verizon Pre 3s Sep 30 04:26:48 Xuzz: you can do that with a comm board swap Sep 30 04:26:53 i'm guessing they have checks for the MEIDs? because i can technically change mine online Sep 30 04:26:55 fxspec06: not on a pre 3 Sep 30 04:27:04 where are you going to get a pre3-compatible sprint comms board Sep 30 04:27:09 hmm Sep 30 04:27:31 <|Jason8|> lol Sep 30 04:27:33 HattCzech: Switching a phone between CDMA carriers is not generally a supported or possible action. If you want a Pre 3, you're just going to have to switch to T-Mobile or AT&T (or get one of the maybe 10 Verizon Pre 3 floating around). Sep 30 04:27:35 fxspec06: no Sprint Pre3 comms board with which to swap Sep 30 04:27:40 you might be able to Make One, but it Probably Wouldn't Be Legal (tm) Sep 30 04:27:46 rwhitby: i thought you knew a good amount based on the meta-doctoring and all of that jazz Sep 30 04:27:52 <|Jason8|> Apparently the vzw Pre3s can't be activated? Sep 30 04:28:07 i've also heard they are not being activated Sep 30 04:28:26 Xuzz: do you know the reason switching is not supported? Sep 30 04:28:42 i haven't spoken to anyone personally who has one, who has successfully or unsuccessfully activated Sep 30 04:28:43 I suspect that those who are able to get them activated are not talking about it, since they don't officially have the device to begin with. Sep 30 04:28:48 HattCzech: Why would any carrier want to let you leave their network? How does that benefit them? Why is this something you are asking me and not their carrier? Sep 30 04:28:48 I heard (so this is really hearsay) an employee say they wouldn't get to continue using their verizon ones even Sep 30 04:29:40 I think it's more of a "gentleman's agreement" more than anything else Sep 30 04:29:42 dwc-: i find that odd, considering my google friend can still use his verizon nexus one Sep 30 04:29:55 and that was a pretty messy breakup Sep 30 04:30:01 it's not about verizon letting you leave Sep 30 04:30:05 ah, the ole "gentleman's agreement" Sep 30 04:30:07 it's whether sprint will enter it into their system Sep 30 04:30:15 dwc-: no i mean about pre 3's and verizon Sep 30 04:30:20 and an employee not being allowed to use it Sep 30 04:30:23 Xuzz: but they don't own the phone... granted they don't want you to leave their network... but why wouldn't a carrier LET YOU join theirs if you already had a phone? Sep 30 04:30:27 <|Jason8|> not to mention configuring the Pre3 to work with Sprint's data systems, etc Sep 30 04:30:38 |Jason8|: yeah i think they use diff freqs Sep 30 04:30:45 <|Jason8|> they do, but they're compatible Sep 30 04:30:46 HattCzech: go to your local Sprint store and ask them, i'm not your carrier's policy statement Sep 30 04:30:53 so you might be able to use 1xRTTomgwtfbbq Sep 30 04:30:59 or whatever those ridiculous letters are in CDMA Sep 30 04:30:59 <|Jason8|> both are 850/1900 or whatever Sep 30 04:31:01 Tommy: as I said, that's what I heard. it was a guy in a line outside the palm store, with a vzw pre3 in hand and an hpalm badge. Sep 30 04:31:08 HattCzech: seriously, no-one understands the motivations of US carriers. Sep 30 04:31:19 heheheh, good point, rwhitby Sep 30 04:31:21 |Jason8|: for 3G? Sep 30 04:31:26 <|Jason8|> Tommy: yeah. Sep 30 04:31:32 <|Jason8|> there are two CDMA bands in the US Sep 30 04:31:34 or, maybe just a non-vzw pre3 that'd been hacked to say 'verizon' in the upper left corner Sep 30 04:31:36 i just hope the at&t-mob merger doesn't go through Sep 30 04:31:37 <|Jason8|> all CDMA carriers use them Sep 30 04:31:41 rwhitby: money is their only motivation Sep 30 04:31:42 HattCzech+++++++ Sep 30 04:31:56 |Jason8|: well there are only 3 carriers in the country that use their own CDMA towers Sep 30 04:32:09 i think the rest are piggybacks Sep 30 04:32:13 three? who's the third? Sep 30 04:32:17 metroPCS Sep 30 04:32:20 <|Jason8|> Tommy: There are actually quite a few. Sprint, Verizon, US Cellular, Cricket, MetroPCS Sep 30 04:32:21 okay Sep 30 04:32:24 <|Jason8|> all have their own towers Sep 30 04:32:27 <|Jason8|> There are others, too Sep 30 04:32:28 cricket = sprint Sep 30 04:32:32 i don't know that they have their own CDMA, but i know they have their own LTE Sep 30 04:32:33 <|Jason8|> Cricket has their own network Sep 30 04:32:41 if you say so Sep 30 04:32:42 <|Jason8|> for nationwide coverage, they have an agreement with Sprint Sep 30 04:32:49 <|Jason8|> That deal just got ink'd Sep 30 04:32:58 i thought cricket was owned by sprint? Sep 30 04:33:00 where did LTE come into this? none of the devices under discussion are LTE, afaik Sep 30 04:33:00 <|Jason8|> Cellcom also has their own network Sep 30 04:33:23 <|Jason8|> dwc-: MetroPCS has a 1xRTT CDMA network and an LTE network.... :v Sep 30 04:34:32 dwc-: yeah i was saying i don't know about metroPCS' CDMA service, could all be on another network's towers, but i know they have their own LTE towers Sep 30 04:34:38 i was unaware of all of those others Sep 30 04:34:40 because they were the first ones to deploy LTE in the US Sep 30 04:34:52 and metroPCS LTE is sick, it gets like 900kbps! Sep 30 04:34:59 -_- Sep 30 04:35:25 my bad, sprint owns boost Sep 30 04:35:37 <|Jason8|> HattCzech: Yeah, most regional carriers are all CDMA. There are a few that run GSM, like Cincinatti Bell (iirc, they're AWS like T-Mobile) Sep 30 04:36:07 i just don't like that all of the gsm carriers are basically gone Sep 30 04:36:24 <|Jason8|> They aren't gone at all. Sep 30 04:36:32 split off from ma bell, to be gobbled up by at&t (ma bell) Sep 30 04:36:34 <|Jason8|> They've just been assimilated into the big blue DEATH STAR Sep 30 04:36:41 exactly :) Sep 30 04:36:53 <|Jason8|> eh, it's half and half. Sep 30 04:36:58 <|Jason8|> I love the flexibility of GSM Sep 30 04:37:02 <|Jason8|> voice quality is pure shit, though. Sep 30 04:37:17 <|Jason8|> Who talks on the phone anymore? :v Sep 30 04:38:33 heheh, true Sep 30 04:38:58 <|Jason8|> AT&T finally deployed 3G here. Sep 30 04:39:12 i just don't want to switch to an evil company just because i like my phone :/ Sep 30 04:39:21 <|Jason8|> it's HSPA+ *without* advanced backhaul Sep 30 04:39:50 if only we had choices... :) Sep 30 04:40:15 <|Jason8|> Currently on Sprint with an EVO 3D Sep 30 04:40:41 i'm on sprint with my frankenpre2 Sep 30 04:40:51 just upgraded this weekend Sep 30 04:41:06 <|Jason8|> Got an iPhone 3GS on AT&T GoPhone for data only Sep 30 04:41:08 <|Jason8|> just as a toy Sep 30 04:41:45 <|Jason8|> It's so tempting to pick up a pre3 to use with the sim I have. Sep 30 04:41:47 how much do prepaid sim cards cost? haven't gotten one in a long time (and i was in germany at the time) Sep 30 04:42:06 <|Jason8|> if you go to a corporate AT&T store and say pretty please, they'll give one to you Sep 30 04:42:10 <|Jason8|> $25 otherwise Sep 30 04:42:39 hmmm, i might be able to pull the corporate thing (i've been working on mobile stuff for work) Sep 30 04:43:00 how many minutes/mbs does that get you? Sep 30 04:43:12 <|Jason8|> What was it, $15 for 500mb? Sep 30 04:43:14 <|Jason8|> 10c/min Sep 30 04:43:32 hey, that's pretty good Sep 30 04:43:39 well, relatively anyways Sep 30 04:43:46 (based on my usage) Sep 30 04:43:54 that might work for my testing purposes Sep 30 04:44:02 <|Jason8|> oh Sep 30 04:44:09 <|Jason8|> $25 for 500MB Sep 30 04:44:14 <|Jason8|> $15 for 100MB Sep 30 04:45:07 good enough Sep 30 04:45:32 cool, thanks Sep 30 04:45:33 <|Jason8|> jailbroke the iphone so I can tether. :P Sep 30 04:45:49 that's what i use the pre2 (and my old pre-) for Sep 30 04:45:54 <|Jason8|> also, AT&T's 3G is ridiculously fast. >_> Sep 30 04:46:02 <|Jason8|> at least here, where it's unsaturated Sep 30 04:46:07 <|Jason8|> I get one bar of service if lucky Sep 30 04:46:08 where's here? Sep 30 04:46:17 <|Jason8|> Wisconsin Sep 30 04:46:19 I was going to say... "well, I know what metropolitan areas |Jason8| is NOT in" Sep 30 04:46:24 hahahaah Sep 30 04:46:25 <|Jason8|> yup Sep 30 04:46:25 <|Jason8|> XD Sep 30 04:46:34 <|Jason8|> Pulling a meg down on one bar Sep 30 04:46:40 <|Jason8|> i've had two down before Sep 30 04:46:41 very nice Sep 30 04:46:52 <|Jason8|> going somewhere with full signal yields 4-5mbps Sep 30 04:47:03 alrighty, time for bed Sep 30 04:47:05 thanks all Sep 30 04:47:08 <|Jason8|> later, yo Sep 30 08:12:41 amazon going to raise webos? Sep 30 08:15:33 what? Sep 30 08:17:11 wow Sep 30 08:17:14 just read it. Sep 30 08:17:38 so you think amazon would switch everything on their kindles/appstores over to webos from android if they did that? Sep 30 08:19:04 source? Sep 30 08:20:33 of the amazon story? Sep 30 08:20:38 yep Sep 30 08:20:40 http://venturebeat.com/2011/09/29/amazon-buy-palm/ Sep 30 08:20:44 tnx Sep 30 08:32:02 woah Sep 30 08:32:02 what's going on Sep 30 08:32:02 ahh!!! everyone's leaving Sep 30 08:32:06 lol Sep 30 08:32:12 hi wrea ^_^ Sep 30 08:32:14 what just happened ;( Sep 30 08:32:15 hey Sep 30 08:32:21 netsplit Sep 30 08:32:42 I wish I knew people at hp Sep 30 08:33:43 I want a $75 Pre 3 Sep 30 08:34:55 for $75 i could use them around the house as mini picture frames ;) Sep 30 08:35:08 Hell yeah Sep 30 08:37:38 for $75 we could bulk replace the company n900's Sep 30 08:38:03 I only ever had a n770 Sep 30 12:20:54 hi everyone i just imported a veer into europe from us, how do i change the store/ local of the phone i still haven't put the phone on Sep 30 15:08:04 anyone a good idea how to debug a hybrid plugin startup? stracing the jailer doesn't work Sep 30 15:21:46 * halfhalo yawns for profit Sep 30 15:33:53 http://www.everythingpre.com/hps-richard-kerris-all-but-confirms-potential-amazon-deal/2011/09/30/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter Sep 30 15:34:41 what do you guys think? amazon good or bad? potential or no chance? Sep 30 15:35:26 meh Sep 30 15:35:42 I think it would have been good if the fire didn't already exist Sep 30 15:35:54 also, that's not an "all but confirm" Sep 30 15:35:58 that's reporting on tech news Sep 30 15:36:01 I think it should be a hardware manufactorer Sep 30 15:36:34 I'd be worried they'd want too much control, and remove part of what I like about webOS so much Sep 30 15:36:45 they lock down their kindle's pretty tightly Sep 30 15:36:56 yeah that article is rubbish Sep 30 15:37:05 odd, but that isn't "all but confirm"ing Sep 30 15:37:19 yeah the article is not very good Sep 30 15:37:51 if amazon was willing to provide hardware, but keep webOS/palm DNA/vision, I'd be ok with it Sep 30 15:38:05 but I'd be worried amazon would exert too much control Sep 30 15:38:21 also, the "cloud driven browsing" thing weirds me out a bit Sep 30 15:40:31 do you guys think HP would even sell it? Sep 30 15:40:52 how else do you expect them to recoup their cost? Sep 30 15:40:52 i think they are trying to fond someone to buy it Sep 30 15:40:57 find Sep 30 15:41:11 all thats left is who will buy it Sep 30 15:41:16 they spent a lot of money, then proceeded to shut down everything Sep 30 15:41:34 at this point, I don't see a monetizatin strategy outside of selling Sep 30 15:42:05 they may also very well buy for Enyo and Patents, not webOS. Sep 30 15:42:19 which would bite Sep 30 15:43:03 prefer webOS to Android, but would be nice to dev in something PhoneGap++ ish with a souped up Enyp. Sep 30 15:43:06 Enyo Sep 30 15:43:27 coming from a non-dev perspective, I want webOS to survive Sep 30 15:43:35 that's mostly what I care about Sep 30 15:43:37 that option is better than the current non-option Sep 30 16:03:05 fxspec06: yeah that's just rkerris being excited about another mobile device, only some fevered blogger imagination would think that means it has anything to do with HP Sep 30 16:05:57 amazon is doing just fine on android Sep 30 16:06:55 Amazon will not switch to webOS Sep 30 16:07:05 they have a large investment in Android Sep 30 16:07:35 amazon would be a great home for webos Sep 30 16:07:55 I disagree - look at what they did to Android, it is barely recognizable. Sep 30 16:08:17 i don't think they'd do that to webos Sep 30 16:08:55 seretogis: and thats a good thing. love that they just took googles code and gave them the big middle finger about the licensed apps part. Sep 30 16:08:57 they would totally do that to webOS. their flavor of Android is locked down to only support their content - their app store, their videos, their music services Sep 30 16:08:57 i hope my app gets approved today. heh. Sep 30 16:09:09 well its hard to say what they'd do Sep 30 16:09:36 well, Amazon is a retailer. they have zero motivation to keep open avenues to non-Amazon content. Sep 30 16:10:05 i mean what would they do given that they have tablets, O/S's, already Sep 30 16:10:08 Apple stores do not stock Windows 7 Sep 30 16:10:52 http://www.amazon.com/Kindle-Color-Multi-touch-Display-Wi-Fi/dp/B0051VVOB2 Sep 30 16:11:02 Content Formats Supported Sep 30 16:11:10 Kindle (AZW), TXT, PDF, unprotected MOBI, PRC natively, Audible (Audible Enhanced (AA, AAX)), DOC, DOCX, JPEG, GIF, PNG, BMP, non-DRM AAC, MP3, MIDI, OGG, WAV, MP4, VP8. Sep 30 16:11:18 webOS also has a pretty sad app selection, and it is scattered amongst several devices, some apps work on a Pre but not a Pre 3, some on the Pixi/Veer but not on TouchPad.. Sep 30 16:12:14 rwatkins: I wonder if/how users will be able to get that content on their Kindle devices Sep 30 16:12:27 it would be nice if touchpad found a home and they continued the line and the webos software. Sep 30 16:12:36 via the USB connetion? Sep 30 16:13:14 via the 3rd party app that loads it over the Wifi? Sep 30 16:13:56 Apple made a bundle on iTunes while all those iPods were loaded up with bazillions of mp3s. Sep 30 16:14:02 hey, my first dev blog post is up: http://bit.ly/oCjfgm Sep 30 16:14:17 sugardave: read it this morning - nice thing to feature! Sep 30 16:14:25 yeah, it is handy :D Sep 30 16:14:26 yeah, but they made way more money on the hardware itself rwatkins. Sep 30 16:14:36 showoff Sep 30 16:14:39 :p Sep 30 16:14:40 rawr Sep 30 16:15:52 I hope Pivot never goes away. it's pretty awesome, and unique. Sep 30 16:16:19 what is pivot Sep 30 16:16:40 looking forward to the next one -- hopefully features Paper Mache Sep 30 16:16:59 Amazon is taking a loss on their tablet hardware, so I would imagine they would make more efforts than Apple to force users into only using their content. After loading their mp3s onto Amazon CloudDrive that is. Sep 30 16:17:01 Pivot is the app catalog "magazine" Sep 30 16:17:11 oh right Sep 30 16:17:15 rwatkins: did you make that? Sep 30 16:17:23 riskish: ya Sep 30 16:17:35 i have it downloaded Sep 30 16:17:52 don't have a paid instapaper account though ;p Sep 30 16:18:05 ya, you and 90% of the other people that downloaded it. :) Sep 30 16:18:41 try it out - only $3 and if you dont like it I'm sure Marco will refund you Sep 30 16:18:47 ZERO STARS, requires paid account!!111! Sep 30 16:19:05 aargh. Sep 30 16:19:11 lol ;D Sep 30 16:20:26 ZERO STARS, Instapaper client doesnt do ReadItLater instead! Sep 30 16:33:55 http://gizmodo.com/5845380/exiting-hp-ceo-to-get-10-million-severance - Leo is stacking paper! Sep 30 16:51:48 the photoshop on the front page of webosroundup with a printer running webos is lolsy Sep 30 16:52:32 i don't think there will be much use for apps on printers, though. Sep 30 16:57:12 EricBlade: some people decided printers should run apps to print out airline passes and movie tickets and so on but honestly that's far less practical than just printing to a printer from your phone Sep 30 17:02:30 Angry Birds, only on the HP DeskJet 8490 Sep 30 17:05:10 heh, PC Load Letter or Too Many Cards Sep 30 17:05:28 heh Sep 30 17:06:02 speaking of load - what is the deal with the load average on the Pre 3 and TouchPad? my coworker's Pre- is consistently < 1 but my Pre 3 and TP hover at 10 Sep 30 17:07:23 my touchpad is sitting at a 2.01,1.99,2.00 with absolutely nothing happening Sep 30 17:07:38 my Pre 3 has nothing going on and is at 8+ Sep 30 17:07:47 let me fetch my TP quick <_< Sep 30 17:08:19 according to top, pulseaudio is sucking all the cpu Sep 30 17:08:48 followed by soundplug_plugin Sep 30 17:09:18 my TP is around 3 with nothing going on Sep 30 17:09:19 i'm not sure why sound would be taking up 26% cpu time (with nothing happening). that seems weird. but this is the first time i've ever looked at it Sep 30 17:10:10 yeah, from my linux background I would imagine it would be < 1 most of the time, and was startled to see otherwise. Sep 30 17:10:16 my loadavg is down to about 1.5 Sep 30 17:10:21 pulseaudio is poop Sep 30 17:14:24 8.25 load average and 40 degrees on my pre3 :[ Sep 30 17:14:39 with nothing but govnah up and running Sep 30 17:16:33 runinng govnah uses up a non-negligible amount of cpu power though :) Sep 30 17:16:42 just because it's an app that keeps updating the screen Sep 30 17:18:13 right, but probably not enough to be boosting load avg above 8..? Sep 30 17:18:30 maybe not... can't tell really Sep 30 17:18:34 8? Madness and/or Sparta. Sep 30 17:18:38 you'd be better off running top from an ssh connection Sep 30 17:18:45 with no app running and screen off Sep 30 17:19:02 unless you run a screenstate governor I guess Sep 30 17:19:07 then screen on :) Sep 30 17:28:48 hmm. setting pulse to use shared memory seems to make quite a dent. or perhaps it's just because i did a reboot Sep 30 17:29:29 EricBlade: i wonder if pulse is what could be causing the tp to lag Sep 30 17:32:14 i should've rebooted, noted memory and cpu usage, made the change, then rebooted again. but rebooting takes -so long- :| Sep 30 17:34:17 * EricBlade applauds HP's new CEO's salary . . . she went for the $1 + stock options, doesn't get the options unless stock goes up 120% Sep 30 17:35:10 hopefully the stock doesn't go up with merely "cost cutting" measures, but by building value which includes webOS :P Sep 30 17:35:20 not a bad bet after the stock has just tanked Sep 30 17:35:56 i hope they mean increase by 120% not "go up 120%" Sep 30 17:36:27 22.98 * 120% = 27.58 Sep 30 17:36:58 or not "120% of current value" as it states Sep 30 17:38:02 yeah, here's hoping she finds a way to cancel the Autonomy nonsense and put some of that saved money toward webOS development ;p Sep 30 17:38:54 for those of you that have been around a while, it must've been nice when hp bought everything, thinking that palm would finally have the backing it needed. i'm sort of under the impression that palm would've been better off elsewhere though Sep 30 17:39:10 indeed Sep 30 17:39:16 of course, that's hindsight now Sep 30 17:39:43 i'm actually doing stuff on the touchpad, and my loadavg is down below 1.0 now Sep 30 17:40:15 what have you done? Sep 30 17:40:32 once i start playing with the email program, though, it all goes crazy Sep 30 17:40:59 i removed the disable-shm line in /etc/pulse/daemon.conf Sep 30 17:41:14 whats shm? Sep 30 17:41:31 off to work I go Sep 30 17:41:33 shared memory usage Sep 30 17:41:44 ahh got ya Sep 30 17:42:00 so what does that do Sep 30 17:42:43 i suspect that with disable-shm, it decreases the amount of memory used for audio at the expense of cpu Sep 30 17:43:05 sounds good to me Sep 30 17:43:17 does the touchpad seem to run better? Sep 30 17:43:36 with shm enabled, i would expect that, if that part of pulse works here, that it uses more memory and less cpu Sep 30 17:44:05 it seems to, but it may just have been total fluke, and that i hadn't rebooted since early yesterday, that pulse was running so high earlier Sep 30 17:44:51 i guess you might be able to tell better once its been running for a while Sep 30 17:51:53 hi eighthree Sep 30 17:52:14 the taptoshare thing does use a non-negligible amount of resources as well .. wonder if that could be disabled Sep 30 17:52:40 or if that does anything else useful, like touchstone recognition or something Sep 30 17:53:29 autonomy isn't a terrible company, analysts just think hp overpaid. and since it's a cash deal, well, it's probably not going to be undone Sep 30 17:54:06 EricBlade: re: load avg, doing stuff might actually keep the cpu active enough to clear its work queue Sep 30 17:54:32 which is all the load average is measuring Sep 30 18:03:59 new firefox is awful Sep 30 18:04:12 more crashes than i've ever had since i've ever used firefox, in the last week alone Sep 30 18:04:22 hi wrea Sep 30 18:04:24 on your comp? Sep 30 18:04:31 or on an android device fxspec06 Sep 30 18:04:58 computer. Sep 30 18:05:05 im using it now Sep 30 18:05:09 hasnt crashed on me Sep 30 18:05:30 well, it's crashed five times since yesterday Sep 30 18:05:36 and i'm not doing anything that i don't normally do. Sep 30 18:05:59 windows? linux? Sep 30 18:06:03 windows Sep 30 18:06:09 im on linux Sep 30 18:06:12 hasnt crashed Sep 30 18:06:14 not sure man Sep 30 19:07:40 still not sure wtf a venturebeat dot com is. Sep 30 19:09:13 Though someone's likely dropped the article in here previously about Amazon Sep 30 19:12:52 beat as in 'area/subject of coverage' Sep 30 19:12:58 venture as in 'venture capital' Sep 30 19:13:39 Ah. Sep 30 19:13:49 hey Sep 30 19:36:52 uh.. how do i pinch/unzoom in emulator? Sep 30 19:59:13 hmm, getting a error when trying to load cfg80211 Sep 30 20:01:49 LOL Sep 30 20:02:09 our phone plan broke 20gig this month Sep 30 20:02:15 dude Sep 30 20:02:36 wtf were you doing? Sep 30 20:02:54 there are 4 people on the family plan who all tether frequently Sep 30 20:03:20 oh Sep 30 20:03:33 split among 4 people is more reasonable Sep 30 20:03:45 still crazy though Sep 30 20:03:57 PuffTheMagic: oh, so, I was convinced to switch to mendeley by the bigger free storage amount Sep 30 20:04:07 :D Sep 30 20:04:14 i need to get back to that at some point Sep 30 20:04:34 also, you know, the semi-functional TP client :) Sep 30 20:04:42 thats what i mean Sep 30 20:04:56 but i've been working on a all node js/term lately Sep 30 20:05:13 which i will release as standalone but also use as a basis for building projects in Tide Sep 30 20:05:24 then i need to add multi file support to tide Sep 30 20:05:31 then i can either work on mendeley or wirc Sep 30 20:05:39 my vote is mendeley Sep 30 20:05:45 summatusmentis, if you want to start playing on the with the code you can Sep 30 20:05:57 did u ever send me a ssh pub key so i can add you to the repo, i forgot Sep 30 20:06:06 I thought I did Sep 30 20:06:16 I'm a first year PhD student, I don't really have time Sep 30 20:06:20 but if I magically get time, I might Sep 30 20:06:45 im only a 1.5 year phd student ;) Sep 30 20:06:52 well 1.6 now :D Sep 30 20:07:16 I think this means I'm a 2/12th year PhD student Sep 30 20:07:20 so, you know Sep 30 20:07:32 no, schools only been in session for amonth Sep 30 20:07:37 this is gonna be a long 6 years Sep 30 20:08:05 ahh Sep 30 20:08:19 i already did a master degree so im not required to take any classes really Sep 30 20:08:26 oh, not me Sep 30 20:08:27 so its just do research, write papers, etc Sep 30 20:08:32 coming straight from undergrad Sep 30 20:08:33 so i have a little more free time Sep 30 20:38:20 PuffTheMagic: what do you use for node development? ubuntu? Sep 30 20:38:29 (or some other linux flavor) Sep 30 20:39:30 i've used Gentoo exclusively since '02 Sep 30 20:39:58 on my "main boxes" Sep 30 20:40:12 i have ubuntu on a ppc mac mini that i use as a server Sep 30 20:40:16 what's the procedure for getting a node package running as a hybrid plugin? i had node.js and npm working on ubuntu (and i need to get them up again), but i never built it for webos Sep 30 20:40:18 only cause i dont feel like compiling on it Sep 30 20:40:52 compiling on an appletv is so fun Sep 30 20:41:31 for a node plugin you need to make bindings to libpdl and then compile node with your plugin code and then launch it like a C hybrid Sep 30 20:42:00 there is no "official" node hybrid lib "yet" Sep 30 20:42:24 i might be able to point you to an unofficial one Sep 30 20:42:28 but im using services right now Sep 30 20:42:36 since i need my services to be unjailed Sep 30 20:42:40 well i'll play with it a little more first, then talk to you again Sep 30 20:42:46 and C plugins of any flavor crash when unjailed in 3.x Sep 30 20:42:55 that's not good Sep 30 20:43:15 jailed means no palm services, right? Sep 30 20:43:23 no Sep 30 20:43:31 it means jailed Sep 30 20:43:34 no direct fs access Sep 30 20:43:39 self-contained Sep 30 20:43:41 okay Sep 30 20:43:41 ya Sep 30 20:43:57 can you access palm services using those? Sep 30 20:45:10 with services sure Sep 30 20:45:17 i know there are restrictions on all of those... i'd love to have a contact scroller like the contacts app Sep 30 20:45:24 by default you have access to some of them Sep 30 20:45:28 because peoplePicker = suck Sep 30 20:45:41 but if u are doing a homebrew app you can modify the default set to be * or specific ones Sep 30 20:45:59 i'd like this to be in the catalog Sep 30 20:46:16 which pretty much restricts everything :) Sep 30 20:47:28 well if its an "optional" feature you could always have a hb patch to extend functionality Sep 30 20:47:39 i imagine such a think for them term im making Sep 30 20:47:53 put in catalog as a legit jailed app Sep 30 20:48:01 but then point to a hb patch that unjails it :D Sep 30 20:48:09 hehehe, interesting idea Sep 30 20:48:48 i wonder if i can make some self-modifying code :) haha Sep 30 20:49:25 i would just like a more versatile peoplePicker and i'd be happy Sep 30 21:01:12 HattCzech_work: saw today an app from you in the catalog Sep 30 21:01:58 so we cannot access contacts created by the Contacts app with our own app, correct? Sep 30 21:07:39 hmm. is there a difference between the Audio and Sound enyo kinds, other than Audio appears to support running under PhoneGap? and are either of them known to work? Sep 30 21:08:47 does this link work @ you? http://robertkowalski.github.com/jqPong/ Sep 30 21:08:50 or timeout? Sep 30 21:10:12 timeout Sep 30 21:10:35 thx Sep 30 21:10:55 downforustoonotjustyou.com Sep 30 21:11:43 timeout Sep 30 21:11:52 audio appears to be an internal component to sound. weird. Sep 30 21:32:35 leiru: which app? :/ Sep 30 21:33:56 HattCzech_work: something with short messages Sep 30 21:35:27 TXT Group is the only one i have in the catalog Sep 30 21:41:22 yes, that was is, HattCzech_work Sep 30 21:41:33 something wit sms/ short message Sep 30 21:42:20 Really can't read the latest webOS dev newsletter without thinking it was written by someone at HP going "I don't care, lie to them!" Sep 30 21:48:00 I'm more just waiting for them to go "hey, if you want to dev here's a few touch pads you can buy instead of fighting with a few thousand others to try to find the dwindling stock" Sep 30 21:51:46 "Or you can try your luck with the s selling them on ebay" Sep 30 21:52:07 OnSale Sep 30 21:52:12 Nothing like paying 225 for something they bought for 99 :'3 Sep 30 21:52:23 I hope nobody buys them off ebay. I hope nobody is that stupid. Sep 30 21:52:34 I want those people to suffer a severe financial loss. Sep 30 21:52:36 ka6sox: they were only handing those out to people who had cancelled orders from August 21st, I thought Sep 30 21:53:09 SineOt, yup...thats what I heard. Sep 30 21:53:21 Sadly, I don't have a cancelled order :/ Sep 30 21:53:52 me neither. Sep 30 21:53:53 bbl Sep 30 22:14:47 magic Sep 30 22:17:13 From: HP webOS Developer Newsletter Sep 30 22:17:20 Subject: Increase in TouchPad Sales Boosts App Downloads Sep 30 22:17:29 really, HP? there's a shock Sep 30 22:17:36 yeah Sep 30 22:18:05 "Glow Hockey HD sold more after the big sale campaign. All our free versions got massive downloads—about 5 to 10 times over normal."" Sep 30 22:19:01 probably should mention that "sale campaign" was a result of HP killing webOS hardware and liquidating it. Sep 30 22:19:14 details, details... Sep 30 22:20:39 on a side note, it always freaks me out when I register for a service and find out I already made one Sep 30 22:23:06 lol Sep 30 22:30:50 The best press release you will read today - http://www.oracle.com/us/corporate/press/503333 Sep 30 22:31:02 Woo, my phone was finally shipped back to me apparently Sep 30 22:31:15 http://www.precentral.net/prevent-device-wipe-when-activating-another-phone-homebrew#comments <<<< i love step 9 Sep 30 22:31:50 fxspec06: lol nice Sep 30 22:32:22 the wording of step 9 is incredible Sep 30 22:33:15 rofl Sep 30 22:34:34 recommended twitter app for mac? Sep 30 22:36:26 the official client? Sep 30 22:36:31 used to be tweetie Sep 30 22:36:41 not a huge fan of it Sep 30 22:37:56 adium! no clue if it does twitter though Sep 30 22:38:07 most likely not Sep 30 22:38:47 using adium for irc Sep 30 22:39:03 oh dang it does have twitter Sep 30 22:39:06 lets try that out Sep 30 22:40:04 * rwhitby has used Adium for a couple of years now Sep 30 22:41:24 hmm adium for twitter will take some getting used to Sep 30 22:41:27 but it may work perfectly Sep 30 22:42:42 rwhitby: can you change the theme for specific accounts? Sep 30 22:44:39 * rwhitby uses stuff as it comes generally Sep 30 22:44:49 ah Sep 30 22:45:01 I'm very picky when it comes to themes typically Sep 30 22:46:42 $155 for a 5.1 Home Theater Receiver seems like a good deal... Sep 30 22:46:57 Sep 30 22:47:04 What make? Sep 30 22:47:05 Hello #webos! Sep 30 22:47:08 Pioneer Sep 30 22:47:13 from woot.com Sep 30 22:47:21 haeffb! Sep 30 22:47:40 $229 on amazon, so, yeah, $80 off Sep 30 22:47:52 Tibfib_: how's mac life? Sep 30 22:47:58 good! Sep 30 22:48:03 have yet to be productive Sep 30 22:48:06 but I'm getting there Sep 30 22:48:11 ready to get your sprint iPhone next week? Sep 30 22:48:19 at&t unfortunately Sep 30 22:49:22 I really want good spotify support on my phone… so I'm pumped for an iPhone Sep 30 22:52:10 Tibfib_: BLASPHEMY! Sep 30 22:52:24 * HattCzech_work point Tibfib_ to the door Sep 30 22:52:26 heheh Sep 30 22:52:53 I'm ready for a new phone and HP doesn't want it to be a pre3 Sep 30 22:53:06 valid point Sep 30 22:55:01 * haeffb wants a new webOS phone. But there isn't one. Sep 30 22:55:21 so, will be going Android or iPhone next month. Sep 30 22:57:25 which carrier? Sep 30 22:57:49 sprint Sep 30 22:58:14 frankenpre2? :) Sep 30 22:58:23 i just upgraded mine, so i'm happy for now Sep 30 22:58:26 for about 7 months Sep 30 22:58:47 yeah, i shoulda done mine that long ago... oh well, i'm slow like that Sep 30 22:58:52 the frankenpre2 is nice, but... I've been eligible on Sprint for almost a year Sep 30 22:58:52 been on a pre2 for nearly a year Sep 30 22:58:53 * akanster is also waiting for the new iPhone announcement Sep 30 22:59:58 i like my plan pricing... $50 a month, so i don't want to change anything until that changes Sep 30 23:00:07 * haeffb wonders if the Palm engineers might have "broken" the app sales numbers again, but in the wrong direction. Sep 30 23:00:27 i.e. "wrong" for HP, good for devs Sep 30 23:00:41 sales of my *phone-only* app are going up. Sep 30 23:00:52 strange Sep 30 23:02:25 what the heck Sep 30 23:02:25 79 sales in September for an app that had about 200 sales in the first 5 months Sep 30 23:03:11 Tibfib_: you should get a pre3 Sep 30 23:03:19 rwhitby: how do you add chats? for example, I have a twitter account added. how do I open the timeline chat? Sep 30 23:03:33 It's too obvious or something and I can't find it in the chat Sep 30 23:03:40 dwc-: doesn't fulfill my spotify requirement Sep 30 23:04:02 s/the chat/the help docs/ Oct 01 00:07:55 rwhitby: is it normal to see load averages like at 8 or 16 on pre3!? Oct 01 02:01:30 Hello people! When i save drafts on my TouchPad, i cannot find them. Where did they go? Oct 01 02:01:53 (for email) Oct 01 02:36:57 is nearly midnight, where's my Pivot, bitches! Oct 01 02:39:01 don't be silly, it's only 7:36 PM on Friday evening Oct 01 02:39:26 LABcrab: your drafts folder, whatever that is set up to be for that particular account in the prefs Oct 01 02:39:30 10:37, but then thats up for debate Oct 01 02:39:49 well HPalm is PST based right? Oct 01 02:40:46 I think they exercise the fact they are an "international" company and try and squeeze it out by time in Guam Oct 01 02:42:41 "squeeze it out" perhaps being inappropriate wording ;D Oct 01 02:43:16 you trying to say you dont like the quality of Pivot? Oct 01 02:43:30 no, that's why I said inappropriate Oct 01 02:43:43 I looooove Pivot, but "squeezing out" sounds like something one would do on a toilet Oct 01 02:43:44 ah Oct 01 02:50:43 WinMo needs to improve so that I can consider it as an alternative to Android :P Oct 01 02:52:02 winmo is our best option at this point Oct 01 02:52:15 that's what it seems like Oct 01 02:52:26 all gunho for programming in Silverlight, eh? Oct 01 02:52:28 though I'm not a huge fan of the walled garden approach to apps Oct 01 02:52:44 anything but java :P Oct 01 02:53:05 silverlight is going away Oct 01 02:53:06 Honestly, after digging through the more "open" Android Market… There's some value to walled garden approaches to the official app stores. So. Much. Crap. Oct 01 02:53:23 well I mean moreso in side-loading apps, or having access to other non-official app stores Oct 01 02:53:26 bradmeister1: I hope so. web model is the way of the future. Oct 01 02:53:55 at least with WM7 you pay like, what is it, 4$? And unlock it for side loading etc Oct 01 02:54:18 pay who? Oct 01 02:54:37 pardon my ignorance Oct 01 02:57:17 Microsoft. They made the Chevron unlocker like… An official sanctioned thing. **** ENDING LOGGING AT Sat Oct 01 02:59:56 2011